I even want him to start car reviews. He can point out minute details like AC effectiveness and sound isolation of the car cabin etc in numerical terms which no one else states.
To be fair I'd need to rob a bank or something to actually look into some of the things I'm curious about because of cost restraints. This definitely is one of them. 267$ for a gallon of paint my brain can't even fathom. I'd be applying it with a toothpick making sure I didn't waste a dot
We all know his wife is the real mvp of the channel. Imagine having such an amazing person who is equally into your hobby as you are. What a lucky man!
Rob, I'm continually impressed with how well you quantify what truly are qualitative and subjective data. Also, major kudos for doing the tests fully blind and unbiased, and even going as far as having your wife do the painting. Your experience as a science teacher serves you well here! That said, I'm more of a TV guy than a projector guy, but your insight is always interesting, insightful, and informative (bonus points for alliteration). Thanks for doing what you do 👍
Wife assist for the blind review. Just when I thought there wasn’t any water left in the review rock you’re squeezing... Head and shoulders thee best reviewer on YT and it isn’t very close. Hats off!
Fantastic comparison review Rob! Thanks! awkwardly, I do not have a projector, nor do I foresee buying one, but watched this anyway because of the quality of your work!
Wow. So much effort... When I wanted to paint a wall for projection, I simply went to Home Depot, got a color chart of whites, brought it home, and projected against them. Then I got samples of the best three paints, and two extra of one so as to have eggshell, flat, and semi gloss examples. I picked the best looking paint, got a gallon, and that was that.
Before even seeing this video, it reminds me of the wayyy overprized Monster speaker cable scam that cost 30 times the price than plain lamp cable that you get from The Home Despot. Even the so-called "audiophiles" couldn't tell lamp wire from the fancy Monster speaker cable. But the Monster cable had very nice plastic covering.
It's probably safe to say that some of these paint formulas were intended to be sprayed on and not roller applied to avoid the streaking. If those that showed streaking can be applied by spraying and retested without the streaks?
Spraying indoors in a finished room is a pretty difficult task. I have no doubt that every paint would look better sprayed, but I don't think it's a realistic ask in most cases.
Great video! I only have the $70 Happrun projector (from your recommendation) so spending money on the expensive paints would not make sense for me, but this video still helped me. I'm projecting onto a regular white wall, and the section where you mentioned reflected light from adjacent walls washing out the picture made me realize that I can probably improve my picture by finding some cheap way to cover my adjacent white walls with something black
Would have really liked you to add your unpainted actual screen in there with the test as a benchmark reference for how good the paints are against each other, but also against their purpose built competition. Very good content though! You are out there doing Gods work! Keep it up and thank your wife for being a peach and being your handy helper!!!!
Yeah, Goo Systems is who i went with for my basement. I just posed the question as a standalone comment as to why their product wasn't included in this review. Seems like an obvious omission. It's price is not out of line with the other products tested. And Robert hasn't shied away in the past from expensive items in his comparos.
Honestly, out of all the test paints considering the price I’d probably go with the Behr anyway. To the layman it just looks better in all the side by side. And if you really cared that much about image quality I would just pay for an 85”+ tv and still come out ahead.
True, if you're not at all concerned with black levels and contrast the Behr is a great option. As far as the 85" TV, you'd be surprised how much larger a 120" screen is than 85", let alone 150".
Stay away from "E- Black Series Edition Imperior Black Widow". He isn't selling that screen paint anymore and his new screen paint is not worth the money. Feel free to watch me for more info.
The Behr i300 looking mighty good here. Black out your room from reflections. Calibrate it so the slightly higher red gains not being as high. And muah.
For sure, if white is what you are after then screen specific paint doesn't make much sense. At lower gains it seems like the real screen paints are better though.
Good job and great review, greatly appreciated. Proof is in the pudding. They just need to accept and take the L. Now let's see if they still keep the "advertised" .8-.85 gain.
Amazing idea of testing and great work, congratulation. For my setup, i just buy a cheap mate white paint. It work perfectly and i saved a lot of money. But i know i should be an heretic for some people 😄
I was hoping this would include the use of a clear reflective paint, which could be used for something like house projection mapping without affecting the appearance of the house. The base surface would obviously make a difference though. Very informative video though as always!
Generally speaking the more reflective a paint is the more issues you'll have with hotspotting and laser speckle, matte screens are usually better for uniformity.
Not much on UA-cam concerning the ultra high contrast s1 no.7 screen paint ...would be nice to see a video dedicated to this paint. It seems that it works great (obviously not in broad ass daylight or spotlights ,lol) but other than that it seems great.
Great and interesting review. But the Imperial paint by black series edition is an outdated product since he changes every 2 months or so the name of his paint. I personally don't recommend black series edition because of how he treats his unhappy buyers. Black series is also staging most of his videos to make the samples look bad.
I don't know anything about the guy or his business practices other than the fact that his website is an abomination. I just bought all the paints and reviewed them blind.
@@TheHookUp ye he treats his customers terrible runs to youtube with hrs on end of slandering videos if u dont like his paint stages everything threatens to sue u just because you dont like his paint it looked awful on my benq 700sti everyone is best staying clear of black series edition
@@TheHookUp No worries about that. I think you did a great job with the review. He does have another site to order some paint but I know what you mean about his site. He ripped off a lot of customers and you could be happy that the paint you received was working. I saw some other stuff when it came to him.
Great video! Question though - is it worth painting or just buying an inexpensive gray screen? Is there anything special about the paint - or is it just the color? I had a projector since 2005, and build and painted a screen at the time with some fancy paint, and later replaced it with just a cheap white screen that was larger - and I really didn't notice much of a difference. The cheap screen didn't reflect as much light, for sure, but also the black levels were slightly better (although the projectors then were pretty dim so black levels were less of an issue). Anyways, if you happen to see this and have any thoughts on that, I'd love to hear them.
I think a decent screen ($300-500 silver ticket) would accomplish something similar. Cheaper screens tend to be pretty garbage unless you're just looking for 1.1gain white.
Spectacular video. Now I'm wondering if an N8-N9 paint by Shewrin Williams (like the Duration line) may behave like the Paint on Screen ultimate contast. It seems, after all, it's just a neutral gray. Also - I wonder about the Black Widow Open source mix (4 parts neutral gray, 1 part Wicked Colors Aluminum Fine W355). I'd have loved to see it in this video, since I wonder if it will cause speckle with a triple laser projector, and also it'd be interesting to see if it could deliver better blacks with more pop on the whites and the colors.
Thanks so much for all of your amazingly detailed videos. This will sound stupid but how functional (or insane) would it be to buy a drop down screen to just paint? Will the result just be a complete mess? Or could someone hope ot get a budget (though not the same) ALR screen with something like the S1 or Black Widow?
I put the black widow on my outdoor roll up screen: x.com/TheHookUp1/status/1811827444715847684 It is holding up well so far, I'll post on twitter if and when it sticks/falls apart/flakes. The FL heat is pretty brutal on everything.
I would stay away from the "Black Widow" paint. Sometimes it works but mostly it doesn't when the buyer isn't happy he lies and treats the unhappy buyer with lawsuits and all kind of other stuff.
ua-cam.com/video/-6NWDqqGQJY/v-deo.htmlsi=s88nAz2l4Z3Xf9bV I did a pull down on the black series paint I am using a Panasonic VMZ40 laser projector and it looks great
This is a deep comparison. Not sure this is because I'm watching on a TV, but the Behr i300 looked pretty good for the price point (and availability in Canada). I'm just not sure I can get my wall to be that smooth. How did you do your PVC screen?
Hi, In the description you have stated that you are using Dangbei DBOX02 (Mars Pro 2) for testing. Can you do a review of that model compared to Formovie X5, please. I am thinking about choosing one of them but I am not sure. I suspect that Mars 2 has more useful options and X5 has better image and brightness. I hope you will manage to make this video, thank you.
@@TheHookUp Thank you for your reply. For me, 2 months is a bit too long to wait and I'll have to choose something myself. I'm tempted by the 3D support option in Mars 2 but the image quality, brightness and contrast in X5 is probably a much better choice. In any case, I'll definitely watch your comparison once you publish it, thanks.
Hey, Rob. Here's a question I've always wondered about, but never heard addressed. Is a painted surface in any way an improvement over a store bought screen that warrants the time and money for the paint. And if it is, would the best thing be to paint the screen rather than trying to paint sheet rock or plywood? I watched this video last night very tired, so while I know you picked the best picture of the different paints, I'm not sure if you did mention whether they were better than just a standard store bought screen.
No, I can't think of any improvement of a painted surface over a fixed frame screen other than price. The problem with painting sheet rock or plywood is that you're limited by the 4ft height of sheet goods.
@@TheHookUp Agreed and getting a perfectly flat outcome with no noticeable mudding between the sheets is difficult unless you are a professional sheetrocker.
If I could had made a suggestion, it would be to do the overhead flashlight test against a true ALR screen and the paints that are claiming to be ALR to show that there is no way a paint can reject overhead light.
These would definitely not perform like a CLR lenticular screen does, but there are other types of ALR that would be theoretically possible in paints using reflective solids. Using crystalline solids that reflect light on the same axis the light is received is how most long throw ALR screens work (like the Vividstorm Obsidian Long Throw ALR for instance). The issue with using reflective solids is that it creates issues with hotspotting, "sparkling", and more recently we're learning that it greatly exacerbates laser speckle.
@@TheHookUp I saw in comments that you scheduled that for 11th of October and I just can't wait to see it. Thanks! But... I don't think I'll resist with the Mars 2 in the Amazon cart so long 🙏. God help me! 😅
I've been waiting for you to perform a comparison of screen paint. What was the reason for not including Goo Systems products? In my completely light-controlled basement theater, I've been very happy with their recommended Screen Goo Acrylic Premier Primer and Goo 2.0 Reference White.
Thank you for the great an thorough review. Being new to the projector "game" I find the reviews a bit overwhelming though, I did not find an answer to my question. What projector do you recommend for a normal white living room (projection on white wall?Maybe no projector at all.. And do you have any affiliate links to Amazon France or Belgium? Nonetheless I would like to point out your great work, you really stand out of other channels. Greetings from belgium.
Mostly because those are not marketed as screen paints, but also because I ran out of screen real estate. I figure there are hundreds of different combos I could have tested so I had to stop somewhere.
If you go deeper into Silver Fire you'll see that it was developed without much weight into technical aspects. According to people more knowledgeable than the designer, it hotspots and it's very color imbalanced. Most of them would agree you'd be better off with a simple, neutral gray screen instead.
Great video , I wanted to ask , where would you rate a half decent paint job on a bare wall against the screens out there? As good as a mid range screen ? Or only just as good as a budget screen?
A good paint job (thinned paint, prepped wall, 15+ coats), is as good as any screen. A decent/mediocre paint job is probably equivalent to a budget screen.
Straight to the point : Can you test under $5000 projectors on a screen with gain of 0.8 or 0.6. Many of these projectors are high lumens (3000+ lumens) and can hit 108nits required for HDR projection with the low gain screen.. Doing so improves low light performance and might be compatible with a JVC which peaks at 2300 lumens.
I got the Dolby HDR target (108nits) information from "Dolby Vision Cinema Targets & Trims - FAQs". I was surprised too. This could be the reason the Xgimi projector with sub 3000 lumen got Dolby Vision certification. I've gone through quite a few white papers. SMPTE and ISO specify 48+/-10.2 nits for cinema and 48 +/-3.5 for review rooms for SDR. For cinemas, HDR is specified at 299.6 nits with min black level of 0.005 nits. (Ref. High dynamic range D-cinema addendum, v1.1, DCI, March 2023) Projection has tolerance of +/- 18 &30 for review room and cinema respectively. Cheers
Can you do used projectors vs new projector video? The topic is board but maybe old projectors like Benq HT2050/Epson 1060/80 and Benq W1070 deserve another look 😁
Unfortunately, that video would be nearly worthless. When buying used it's all about luck and depends entirely on how well the projector was treated in its past life.
Would love to see you review a Black Diamond screen from Screen Innovations. What do you think is the minimum amount of lumens you’d need if you’re using a low gain grey or black screen?
@@gx12 the issue is that a 5000L projector will be expensive and have a generally poor black floor whereas you could get a less expensive 2500L projector with a lower native black floor and end up with the same outcome.
I appreciate your time and honest review. I am curious why you chose the darkest coating we make to put up against competitors lighter coatings. I would also question why you would choose the lightest paint LLC sells when he "specializes" in black. And lastly, it sounds like this could have been queued up by Robbie 😊
I basically went to the respective youtube channels, found what seemed like the most recent video with what was supposed to be the "new best formula" and then purchased that formula through the website. These paints were purchased in early May.
@@TheHookUp Very good review, I was on the hunt a while ago for someone to do this review with proper tools to put an end to all these made up claims by the sellers, like their made up gain, which is false advertising and straight up lies.
@@TheHookUp They just wrote a number down that looks good. They don't have the tools or equipment to properly spec their product. Just a local home depot and some paint supplies.
This video is incredibly useful for anyone considering projector screen paints. By testing 8 different paints, it provides a clear comparison between high-cost projector screen paints and regular paint options. The findings help viewers make informed decisions on whether the extra expense is justified. Highly recommended for those looking to optimize their home theater setup without overspending!
how about the same test but with the motorized Floor Rising screens (ALR and not ALR)? Keep in mind that most rooms have white ceiling and no way to do anything to combat those reflected lights from the ceiling. My main use case is JMGO N1 Ultra.
JMGO N1 Ultra doesn't pair well with ALR screens in my experience. I've used it on the Vividstorm Obsidian Long Throw ALR and the laser speckle made it unwatchable.
Hi Rob, thanks for the great comparison! What confuses me is, Paint on Screen S1 Ultimate Contrast (Paint C) is advertised on the linked manufacturer website with a gain of 2.0. Which doesn't correlate to your measurement of 0.69 and to the fact that this paint is grey, which should lead to a gain < 1. Do you have an explanation for this?
My explanation is that their gain values are totally incorrect and I'm not sure how they calculated them. They list their "black screen" at 1.4 gain, which would mean it appears 1.4x brighter than a white Lambertian screen, which makes no sense at all.
Arguably the UST also shouldn't be used with a non-ALR screen at all, due to the angle it hits the screen with. If you don't have ALR, it bounces insane quantities of light into the ceiling. Very interesting comparo, not that relevant for me at this time but still quite interesting and well done.
Saw this video and was interested to know what the results were. Got excited when you mentioned triple lasers and saw a JMGO projector like mine. However you did not even use it. Now what do I compare that to with your results?
Pretty favorably. I think if you have a non-textured wall then projector screen paint is a 100% viable alternative to a fixed frame screen for standard throw projectors. There aren't many screens out there with gain lower than 0.4, so if you want one of the ones like E-H paint is pretty much your only option.
It has higher peak brightness but the same black floor. If you like googleTV it might be worth getting over the original mars pro, but I would much rather use a streaming stick like the firetv max.
@@TheHookUp thx for response. How much higher peak brightness? I have already Google chromcast 4k. So thats why i asking :) Does keystone functions Works the same and the picture quality is not much different? (Beside higher brightness) It is price difference about 500$ in my country :/
We’re looking to make a projector video wall at my church. This application will have the lights on, but zero ambient light. With a 6,000 lumen projector would you go with C or H?
@@TheHookUp They're not going to do anything. Every since you did this video, Crow 1176 is now done with screen paints and ParTay has been MIA. Right before you did this video, ParTay did a video saying he has a "lot to talk about" and will be doing a video in a few days, four months later and still no video and he still has his gain at .8 on his site. You should get a refund from him for false advertisement. I'm glad you did this video and exposed them and their lies.
Hi quick question, I'm going to install a golf impact screen is it worth putting either a white or black fabric behind the screen to improve the display. Thanks Mickey
@TheHookUp Just wondering do you know of a company that sells a fresnel wall paper? I’m projecting on my wall right now at around 300” and instead of a screen I want it to be the entire wall surface.
Hey thanks for this video. Have you any idea what it's like to use these paints on a bare wall instead of a pvc screen ? Is it an entirely different animal?
Thanks, I've been told some crazy stuff like it'd take 10 hours of work to get a wall painted as you'd have to sand between each of 36 coatings , have you heard any of that talk?
@@FetterMuncher666 As with any finish work, you get what you put in. If you're looking for a professional quality result I could see 10 hours and 10-20 thinly sprayed coats being necessary, but most people won't do that.
This guy makes videos about stuff I’ve wondered about, but does all the hard work! Thank you for all your effort 👏🏻
Yepp I admire him so much. I want him to be the head of highest Govt. statistical department.
I even want him to start car reviews. He can point out minute details like AC effectiveness and sound isolation of the car cabin etc in numerical terms which no one else states.
@@green_life7 😅😂💯👍
To be fair I'd need to rob a bank or something to actually look into some of the things I'm curious about because of cost restraints. This definitely is one of them. 267$ for a gallon of paint my brain can't even fathom. I'd be applying it with a toothpick making sure I didn't waste a dot
We all know his wife is the real mvp of the channel. Imagine having such an amazing person who is equally into your hobby as you are. What a lucky man!
This 💯
Rob, I'm continually impressed with how well you quantify what truly are qualitative and subjective data. Also, major kudos for doing the tests fully blind and unbiased, and even going as far as having your wife do the painting. Your experience as a science teacher serves you well here!
That said, I'm more of a TV guy than a projector guy, but your insight is always interesting, insightful, and informative (bonus points for alliteration).
Thanks for doing what you do 👍
Thanks!
In terms of reviews, the duo of The Hook Up and Project Farm is unstoppable!! Thanks!
This is the kind of content that keeps me coming back!
Great review!
Wife assist for the blind review. Just when I thought there wasn’t any water left in the review rock you’re squeezing...
Head and shoulders thee best reviewer on YT and it isn’t very close. Hats off!
I love your testing methods.
Thank you for your detailed reviews
absolutely amazing Rob, really appreciate your work
I got hooked up!
Really appreciate the effort you put in your videos.Thanks
Ive been looking forward to seeing a legit comparison of this! So well done! Love this channel
Please extend our appreciation to your wife for the amazing help with painting the screen.
Fantastic comparison review Rob! Thanks! awkwardly, I do not have a projector, nor do I foresee buying one, but watched this anyway because of the quality of your work!
Thank you and great review 👍
Incredibly thorough testing. Kudos to you and your wife for this work!
thanks! I've been waiting for a while for a review on this!
Excellent video. Best video on this topic that I have watched so far.
Appreciate the amount of effort it took to make this video, great review as always
What an awesome, comprehensive comparison. HATS OFF, SIR ! :)
Hero is back with a bang... Great content.. good explanation..
Amazing work as always.
Your (and your wife!) efforts are greatly appreciated!
Good lord the amount of work to make such a video. Bravo and thank you !
Wow. So much effort... When I wanted to paint a wall for projection, I simply went to Home Depot, got a color chart of whites, brought it home, and projected against them. Then I got samples of the best three paints, and two extra of one so as to have eggshell, flat, and semi gloss examples. I picked the best looking paint, got a gallon, and that was that.
What did you end up choosing and why?
Would also be interested in what paint colour you chose.
Great professional review.
Impeccable timing. Just bought a projector on Prime Day and was just looking into this.
Thank god. I’ve been waiting for a definitive answer on this for so long!
Before even seeing this video, it reminds me of the wayyy overprized Monster speaker cable scam that cost 30 times the price than plain lamp cable that you get from The Home Despot. Even the so-called "audiophiles" couldn't tell lamp wire from the fancy Monster speaker cable. But the Monster cable had very nice plastic covering.
I was surprised by the results. White paint is white, but the lower gain screens benefitted from a projector specific formula.
I saw a test where they used audiophile cable vrs a metal coat hanger.......same results hahahaha
@@TheHookUp I wonder how a slightly grey/silver non projector specific formula would have worked
Great video! Gonna get the PAint on Screen S1ultra contrast for my home theater and keep black widow in mind for any outdoor screens in the future.
Man....this is exactly the video i needed. Thanks man.
Amazing! Thank you so much! =)
Incredible video, non stop pertinent data just flying right at you.
I'm going with the Behr Dead Flat lol!
What a review! I am amazed!😮
Great review I completely agree with this video keep up the good work sir.
😂
It's probably safe to say that some of these paint formulas were intended to be sprayed on and not roller applied to avoid the streaking. If those that showed streaking can be applied by spraying and retested without the streaks?
Spraying indoors in a finished room is a pretty difficult task. I have no doubt that every paint would look better sprayed, but I don't think it's a realistic ask in most cases.
Great video! I only have the $70 Happrun projector (from your recommendation) so spending money on the expensive paints would not make sense for me, but this video still helped me. I'm projecting onto a regular white wall, and the section where you mentioned reflected light from adjacent walls washing out the picture made me realize that I can probably improve my picture by finding some cheap way to cover my adjacent white walls with something black
Super useful video, many thanks. I retain that projectors for quality home cinema only make sense if the room is treated as such, non reflective, etc
The hook up is the best💪 keep it up
Fantastic! Just what I needed!! Thanks!
Would have really liked you to add your unpainted actual screen in there with the test as a benchmark reference for how good the paints are against each other, but also against their purpose built competition. Very good content though! You are out there doing Gods work! Keep it up and thank your wife for being a peach and being your handy helper!!!!
I've been using Screen Goo for the last 20years or so. Film, TV, concerts, airport & museum exhibits. Wouldn't think of another brand!
Yeah, Goo Systems is who i went with for my basement. I just posed the question as a standalone comment as to why their product wasn't included in this review. Seems like an obvious omission. It's price is not out of line with the other products tested. And Robert hasn't shied away in the past from expensive items in his comparos.
But how's Screen Goo's black depth and peak white compare to regular matte white? Have you compared?
Honestly, out of all the test paints considering the price I’d probably go with the Behr anyway. To the layman it just looks better in all the side by side. And if you really cared that much about image quality I would just pay for an 85”+ tv and still come out ahead.
True, if you're not at all concerned with black levels and contrast the Behr is a great option. As far as the 85" TV, you'd be surprised how much larger a 120" screen is than 85", let alone 150".
great review! So C or E depending on budget and ambient light!
Stay away from "E- Black Series Edition Imperior Black Widow". He isn't selling that screen paint anymore and his new screen paint is not worth the money. Feel free to watch me for more info.
The Behr i300 looking mighty good here. Black out your room from reflections. Calibrate it so the slightly higher red gains not being as high. And muah.
For sure, if white is what you are after then screen specific paint doesn't make much sense. At lower gains it seems like the real screen paints are better though.
Did in mention that Your reviews are extremely well done and helpful?
They are.
Thanks!
Wau, excellent comparison. Only way to go. Thank you.
Clever getting your wife to do the grunt work! :)
Thanks for this tip. "I" will be testing what paint is best for my house this weekend. ;)
Good job and great review, greatly appreciated. Proof is in the pudding. They just need to accept and take the L. Now let's see if they still keep the "advertised" .8-.85 gain.
Fantastic stuff! Thanks so much for your hard work! Now, all I need is a review of the Vidda C2 Ultra…
As soon as it gets a global release I’m on it.
@@TheHookUp You're the best!
I used rust-oleum ultra cover metallic silver. It was super cheap and I was very happy with the results vs price.
Amazing idea of testing and great work, congratulation. For my setup, i just buy a cheap mate white paint. It work perfectly and i saved a lot of money. But i know i should be an heretic for some people 😄
I was hoping this would include the use of a clear reflective paint, which could be used for something like house projection mapping without affecting the appearance of the house. The base surface would obviously make a difference though.
Very informative video though as always!
Generally speaking the more reflective a paint is the more issues you'll have with hotspotting and laser speckle, matte screens are usually better for uniformity.
would be intersting to see the high performing paint vs expensive alr screens?
Not much on UA-cam concerning the ultra high contrast s1 no.7 screen paint ...would be nice to see a video dedicated to this paint. It seems that it works great (obviously not in broad ass daylight or spotlights ,lol) but other than that it seems great.
Great and interesting review. But the Imperial paint by black series edition is an outdated product since he changes every 2 months or so the name of his paint. I personally don't recommend black series edition because of how he treats his unhappy buyers. Black series is also staging most of his videos to make the samples look bad.
I don't know anything about the guy or his business practices other than the fact that his website is an abomination. I just bought all the paints and reviewed them blind.
@@TheHookUp ye he treats his customers terrible runs to youtube with hrs on end of slandering videos if u dont like his paint stages everything threatens to sue u just because you dont like his paint it looked awful on my benq 700sti everyone is best staying clear of black series edition
@@TheHookUp No worries about that. I think you did a great job with the review. He does have another site to order some paint but I know what you mean about his site. He ripped off a lot of customers and you could be happy that the paint you received was working. I saw some other stuff when it came to him.
😂
@@TheHookUp Please check my email I sent you and plan your next steps carefully. Thanks.
Great video! Question though - is it worth painting or just buying an inexpensive gray screen? Is there anything special about the paint - or is it just the color? I had a projector since 2005, and build and painted a screen at the time with some fancy paint, and later replaced it with just a cheap white screen that was larger - and I really didn't notice much of a difference. The cheap screen didn't reflect as much light, for sure, but also the black levels were slightly better (although the projectors then were pretty dim so black levels were less of an issue). Anyways, if you happen to see this and have any thoughts on that, I'd love to hear them.
I think a decent screen ($300-500 silver ticket) would accomplish something similar. Cheaper screens tend to be pretty garbage unless you're just looking for 1.1gain white.
@@TheHookUp Thank you! That's exactly what I was wondering about.
I've used Roscoe TV White, which is a low cost .6 gain gray paint formulated for video use. It works well.
Hello Robe! Thank you for this thorough and clear work. Have you experimented with projector paint on glass while preserving its transparency?
I have not.
@@TheHookUp Thanks :)
Would be great if there were more cheap options. A single off the shelf option from home depot isn't very representative.
Spectacular video.
Now I'm wondering if an N8-N9 paint by Shewrin Williams (like the Duration line) may behave like the Paint on Screen ultimate contast. It seems, after all, it's just a neutral gray.
Also - I wonder about the Black Widow Open source mix (4 parts neutral gray, 1 part Wicked Colors Aluminum Fine W355). I'd have loved to see it in this video, since I wonder if it will cause speckle with a triple laser projector, and also it'd be interesting to see if it could deliver better blacks with more pop on the whites and the colors.
Thanks Rob.
Me and my mate get SO hyped every time a new projector video from THU drops. Would you recommend any of these paints over a proper screen (non ALR)
Thanks so much for all of your amazingly detailed videos.
This will sound stupid but how functional (or insane) would it be to buy a drop down screen to just paint? Will the result just be a complete mess? Or could someone hope ot get a budget (though not the same) ALR screen with something like the S1 or Black Widow?
I put the black widow on my outdoor roll up screen: x.com/TheHookUp1/status/1811827444715847684
It is holding up well so far, I'll post on twitter if and when it sticks/falls apart/flakes. The FL heat is pretty brutal on everything.
I would stay away from the "Black Widow" paint. Sometimes it works but mostly it doesn't when the buyer isn't happy he lies and treats the unhappy buyer with lawsuits and all kind of other stuff.
ua-cam.com/video/-6NWDqqGQJY/v-deo.htmlsi=s88nAz2l4Z3Xf9bV I did a pull down on the black series paint I am using a Panasonic VMZ40 laser projector and it looks great
This is a deep comparison. Not sure this is because I'm watching on a TV, but the Behr i300 looked pretty good for the price point (and availability in Canada). I'm just not sure I can get my wall to be that smooth. How did you do your PVC screen?
Hi,
In the description you have stated that you are using Dangbei DBOX02 (Mars Pro 2) for testing.
Can you do a review of that model compared to Formovie X5, please.
I am thinking about choosing one of them but I am not sure. I suspect that Mars 2 has more useful options and X5 has better image and brightness. I hope you will manage to make this video, thank you.
That video is scheduled for October 11th and will have all the latest lifestyle projectors.
@@TheHookUp Thank you for your reply. For me, 2 months is a bit too long to wait and I'll have to choose something myself. I'm tempted by the 3D support option in Mars 2 but the image quality, brightness and contrast in X5 is probably a much better choice. In any case, I'll definitely watch your comparison once you publish it, thanks.
Hi, when will you publish the video that was supposed to be on October 11th, please?
Hey, Rob. Here's a question I've always wondered about, but never heard addressed. Is a painted surface in any way an improvement over a store bought screen that warrants the time and money for the paint. And if it is, would the best thing be to paint the screen rather than trying to paint sheet rock or plywood? I watched this video last night very tired, so while I know you picked the best picture of the different paints, I'm not sure if you did mention whether they were better than just a standard store bought screen.
No, I can't think of any improvement of a painted surface over a fixed frame screen other than price.
The problem with painting sheet rock or plywood is that you're limited by the 4ft height of sheet goods.
@@TheHookUp Agreed and getting a perfectly flat outcome with no noticeable mudding between the sheets is difficult unless you are a professional sheetrocker.
If I could had made a suggestion, it would be to do the overhead flashlight test against a true ALR screen and the paints that are claiming to be ALR to show that there is no way a paint can reject overhead light.
These would definitely not perform like a CLR lenticular screen does, but there are other types of ALR that would be theoretically possible in paints using reflective solids. Using crystalline solids that reflect light on the same axis the light is received is how most long throw ALR screens work (like the Vividstorm Obsidian Long Throw ALR for instance). The issue with using reflective solids is that it creates issues with hotspotting, "sparkling", and more recently we're learning that it greatly exacerbates laser speckle.
Thank you for this video, Rob. What about a Dangbei Mars 2 review? I saw you have it, but you didn't made any review. Thanks again
Yes, I have it. Waiting for the rest of the lifestyle projectors for 2024 to be released.
@@TheHookUp I saw in comments that you scheduled that for 11th of October and I just can't wait to see it. Thanks! But... I don't think I'll resist with the Mars 2 in the Amazon cart so long 🙏. God help me! 😅
I've been waiting for you to perform a comparison of screen paint. What was the reason for not including Goo Systems products? In my completely light-controlled basement theater, I've been very happy with their recommended Screen Goo Acrylic Premier Primer and Goo 2.0 Reference White.
I wish this had been done on drywall and not vinyl. I think that would be how most would use these for a projector wall.
Very good thank you
Dope as always. But what’s up with that 6000 lumen Epson? Any reviews on that one? Interested in input lag, motion, and contrast.
I bought it off ebay for my upcoming video on golf simulator projectors.
Thank you for the great an thorough review. Being new to the projector "game" I find the reviews a bit overwhelming though, I did not find an answer to my question. What projector do you recommend for a normal white living room (projection on white wall?Maybe no projector at all..
And do you have any affiliate links to Amazon France or Belgium?
Nonetheless I would like to point out your great work, you really stand out of other channels.
Greetings from belgium.
Im like two minutes in and I cant wait to see how the $250 deli container paints do.
Why was there not a $22 a gal gray or black from bear to compare to?
Mostly because those are not marketed as screen paints, but also because I ran out of screen real estate. I figure there are hundreds of different combos I could have tested so I had to stop somewhere.
A shame you could not get a hold of some Silver Fire paint for this comparison. That one seems to be the king when it comes to screen paint.
Yep, definitely an error on my part. Sucks.
@@TheHookUp Could do a future follow up video or just add an updated comment to this video.
We'll see how this video performs.
If you go deeper into Silver Fire you'll see that it was developed without much weight into technical aspects. According to people more knowledgeable than the designer, it hotspots and it's very color imbalanced. Most of them would agree you'd be better off with a simple, neutral gray screen instead.
Great video , I wanted to ask , where would you rate a half decent paint job on a bare wall against the screens out there? As good as a mid range screen ? Or only just as good as a budget screen?
A good paint job (thinned paint, prepped wall, 15+ coats), is as good as any screen. A decent/mediocre paint job is probably equivalent to a budget screen.
Straight to the point : Can you test under $5000 projectors on a screen with gain of 0.8 or 0.6. Many of these projectors are high lumens (3000+ lumens) and can hit 108nits required for HDR projection with the low gain screen.. Doing so improves low light performance and might be compatible with a JVC which peaks at 2300 lumens.
100nits is the threshold for SDR, not HDR.
I got the Dolby HDR target (108nits) information from "Dolby Vision Cinema Targets & Trims - FAQs". I was surprised too. This could be the reason the Xgimi projector with sub 3000 lumen got Dolby Vision certification. I've gone through quite a few white papers. SMPTE and ISO specify 48+/-10.2 nits for cinema and 48 +/-3.5 for review rooms for SDR. For cinemas, HDR is specified at 299.6 nits with min black level of 0.005 nits. (Ref. High dynamic range D-cinema addendum, v1.1, DCI, March 2023) Projection has tolerance of +/- 18 &30 for review room and cinema respectively. Cheers
Can you do used projectors vs new projector video? The topic is board but maybe old projectors like Benq HT2050/Epson 1060/80 and Benq W1070 deserve another look 😁
Unfortunately, that video would be nearly worthless. When buying used it's all about luck and depends entirely on how well the projector was treated in its past life.
Would love to see you review a Black Diamond screen from Screen Innovations.
What do you think is the minimum amount of lumens you’d need if you’re using a low gain grey or black screen?
That’s a super loaded question. How many lumens do you need for a dark room? Ambient light? Sdr? Hdr? 3d? Screen size?
@@TheHookUp Let’s say 100 inches, HDR and 3D, no ambient light.
I'd say 4000-5000L, but I wouldn't recommend an ultra low gain black screen in a room with no ambient light.
@@TheHookUp The lowered black floor isn’t worth trading the colour accuracy or brightness?
@@gx12 the issue is that a 5000L projector will be expensive and have a generally poor black floor whereas you could get a less expensive 2500L projector with a lower native black floor and end up with the same outcome.
I appreciate your time and honest review. I am curious why you chose the darkest coating we make to put up against competitors lighter coatings. I would also question why you would choose the lightest paint LLC sells when he "specializes" in black. And lastly, it sounds like this could have been queued up by Robbie 😊
I basically went to the respective youtube channels, found what seemed like the most recent video with what was supposed to be the "new best formula" and then purchased that formula through the website. These paints were purchased in early May.
@@TheHookUp Very good review, I was on the hunt a while ago for someone to do this review with proper tools to put an end to all these made up claims by the sellers, like their made up gain, which is false advertising and straight up lies.
The listed gains were really confusing to me, not sure how they came up with them.
@@TheHookUp They just wrote a number down that looks good. They don't have the tools or equipment to properly spec their product. Just a local home depot and some paint supplies.
Why do B & C look almost identical, given the significant difference in gain & peak brightness as shown at 4:50 ?
In person and when viewing content they are not that similar. B is a white screen while C is gray.
@@TheHookUp Ok. So how much deeper is the black level on C? Say 10% ?
Is paint different than paint?
Next week, is water as wet as water?
This video is incredibly useful for anyone considering projector screen paints. By testing 8 different paints, it provides a clear comparison between high-cost projector screen paints and regular paint options. The findings help viewers make informed decisions on whether the extra expense is justified. Highly recommended for those looking to optimize their home theater setup without overspending!
Hi, great video , how this paints compare with ALR screens? Thanks for your great work.
why didnt you test radiant white and digital theater by paint on screen
These were the paints that were suggested to me by Paint on Screen when I asked them.
how about the same test but with the motorized Floor Rising screens (ALR and not ALR)? Keep in mind that most rooms have white ceiling and no way to do anything to combat those reflected lights from the ceiling. My main use case is JMGO N1 Ultra.
JMGO N1 Ultra doesn't pair well with ALR screens in my experience. I've used it on the Vividstorm Obsidian Long Throw ALR and the laser speckle made it unwatchable.
Hi Rob, thanks for the great comparison!
What confuses me is, Paint on Screen S1 Ultimate Contrast (Paint C) is advertised on the linked manufacturer website with a gain of 2.0.
Which doesn't correlate to your measurement of 0.69 and to the fact that this paint is grey, which should lead to a gain < 1.
Do you have an explanation for this?
My explanation is that their gain values are totally incorrect and I'm not sure how they calculated them. They list their "black screen" at 1.4 gain, which would mean it appears 1.4x brighter than a white Lambertian screen, which makes no sense at all.
@@TheHookUp thanks for the fast reply!
Arguably the UST also shouldn't be used with a non-ALR screen at all, due to the angle it hits the screen with. If you don't have ALR, it bounces insane quantities of light into the ceiling. Very interesting comparo, not that relevant for me at this time but still quite interesting and well done.
Yep, I think I hammered that point home more than a few times in the video.
Saw this video and was interested to know what the results were. Got excited when you mentioned triple lasers and saw a JMGO projector like mine. However you did not even use it. Now what do I compare that to with your results?
? I used the JMGO to check laser speckle, near the end of the video.
How did these compare to screens?
Pretty favorably. I think if you have a non-textured wall then projector screen paint is a 100% viable alternative to a fixed frame screen for standard throw projectors. There aren't many screens out there with gain lower than 0.4, so if you want one of the ones like E-H paint is pretty much your only option.
Also have to think about the time, labour, and cost for both types.
Partay Sirius C is black screen paint it look great and for the price even better.
Hi. Some test of mars pro 2? Or its the same projector that FIRST Mars pro? Maybe beter choice is to buy cheeper older and chromecast 4k?
It has higher peak brightness but the same black floor. If you like googleTV it might be worth getting over the original mars pro, but I would much rather use a streaming stick like the firetv max.
@@TheHookUp thx for response.
How much higher peak brightness?
I have already Google chromcast 4k.
So thats why i asking :)
Does keystone functions Works the same and the picture quality is not much different? (Beside higher brightness)
It is price difference about 500$ in my country :/
We’re looking to make a projector video wall at my church. This application will have the lights on, but zero ambient light. With a 6,000 lumen projector would you go with C or H?
C, black levels are not going to be particularly important in a church application.
@@TheHookUp awesome. Thank you so much for such a helpful video!
Kenneth Byrd with Black Series Edition LLC finally saw this video. He's saying he is going to send lawyers to your door and will be suing you.
ua-cam.com/video/YIJEAyNFYhA/v-deo.html
So did Partay, it's (one of) the reasons why everyone thinks the screen paint community is a joke.
@@TheHookUp They're not going to do anything. Every since you did this video, Crow 1176 is now done with screen paints and ParTay has been MIA. Right before you did this video, ParTay did a video saying he has a "lot to talk about" and will be doing a video in a few days, four months later and still no video and he still has his gain at .8 on his site. You should get a refund from him for false advertisement. I'm glad you did this video and exposed them and their lies.
@@TheHookUp Interesting to know.
So what's better, white or gray paint in general?? Pls answer. I'll apply it in my room for my projector
Hi quick question, I'm going to install a golf impact screen is it worth putting either a white or black fabric behind the screen to improve the display. Thanks Mickey
@TheHookUp Just wondering do you know of a company that sells a fresnel wall paper? I’m projecting on my wall right now at around 300” and instead of a screen I want it to be the entire wall surface.
I don't think that's possible. The entire fresnel structure needs to be stamped out at once, so you couldn't apply it in strips like wallpaper.
Hey thanks for this video. Have you any idea what it's like to use these paints on a bare wall instead of a pvc screen ? Is it an entirely different animal?
Very similar with the one caveat being that the wall is likely not going to be as flat/perfect as a tensioned PVC screen.
Thanks, I've been told some crazy stuff like it'd take 10 hours of work to get a wall painted as you'd have to sand between each of 36 coatings , have you heard any of that talk?
@@FetterMuncher666 As with any finish work, you get what you put in. If you're looking for a professional quality result I could see 10 hours and 10-20 thinly sprayed coats being necessary, but most people won't do that.
is painting roll up fabric a bad idea
What is the video clip you use on your projectors please.
"LG's The Black"