Caer is cognate with the English "chester", "caster", "cester" etc and comes from the Latin "castra" and place names with "caer" in them almost always have some Roman connection. The most obvious example is "Caer" itself which, of course, is "Chester".
Brecon sits at the point where the River Honddu joins the Usk. The river comes down from the north of Brecon joining the Usk just south of the Cathedral. So Brecon sits on the mouth of the River Honddu.
@@mrwelshmun Basically the Honddu is a tributary of the Usk. I can't think of any other examples of Aber used in this way but there may be some. I'm from Abertawe and my good lady is from Rhydaman. These days (and for many years) we live in Caerdydd. Unfortunately my family language is English but do have a basic knowledge of Welsh. It was a pleasure to find your channel and have hit the subscribe button.
@@markjlewis Aber is used a lot at the mouth of smaller rivers where they join larger rivers, particularly around where I am in South east Wales - Aberdare (Aberdâr) where the river Dâr emerges into the river Cynon, Aberaman, where the river Aman emerges into the Cynon, Abercynon, where the Cynon emerges into the Taff, a bit further out Abergavenny, where the Gavenny meets the Usk. I would also guess Aberfan, Abertysswg, Aberbargoed, Abersychan, Abertillery, Abercarn, Aberdulais, Abertridwr, Aberthin...
It is nice hearing Welsh people having a good chat in Welsh language, I kind of know what certain prefixes meant from years of holidays in Wales, like Aber, Llan and so on, plus a few words. Though it is a very hard language to speak.
@@Jimatkins3271 glad to hear you're enjoying the content. Welsh is mostly phonetic so it's mostly pronounced as it's written. But yeah when you get into the word order and mutations it can be difficult
I was told as a kid that 'llan' means the fenced/enclosed area *around* a church, typically including the graveyard. Basically the full sanctified bit, the holy ground vampires can't walk on. A subtle distinction from 'church', but I like it because I don't think I've seen the same thing done in any other language!
@@mrwelshmun And I read, somerwhere, that it meant a field, specifically a cow field. The Celtic languages are very old, which explains why the Irish and Scots Gaelics are so different from Welsh and Breton.
Great video, another one is, Coed ( in English Wood ) as in Betws-y-Coed ( Conwy ) Coed Talon ( Flintshire ) or Coedpoeth ( Wrexham ) there is Rhos ( in English moorland ) Llandrillo-yn-Rhos ( Conwy ) or Rhosllanerchrugog ( Wrexham ) Dinas=Fort , Denbigh = Ddinbych ( in English small fort ) Some places don't translate , in the county of Wrexham there is Bangor-is-y-Coed but in English it's called Bangor on Dee, no connection anther one on the coast there is Llandrillo-yn-Rhos but in English its Rhos on Sea does not translate. Enjoyed this video, take care. Shaun in Wrecsam or Wrexham
You got me thinking. And you're right, officially at least, toponymical names are rare in Welsh. But colloquially, traditionally, they are normal. This still happens where I live (Ceredigion). For example, "Jones Tan-Y-Coed" (as opposed to "Jones Hafod" or "Jones Arfryn"). This could equally be used with first names ("Dai TanChwarel", "Dai Glaslyn" etc). This often uses house names, which in turn are frequently descriptive of the location. It's strange how these rarely made it into surnames in Welsh, rather the patronymical system was used (Jones - son of John; Davies, son of David) - which is rarely used colloquially. Yep, there's a reason for my UA-cam user name; it's toponymical, even if my actual surname isn't.
'Welsh place names - Unzipped' by Brian Davis is a great little handbook to keep in the door pocket of you car of in a backpack. No connection, just found it very handy for my non-Welsh-speaking Welsh wife - I'm the family Welsh-speaker!
Can't aber also mean a confluence of rivers or streams? I used to work in Abertridwr. Nowhere near the sea, but three streams joined there.... tri dwr.
First place I thought of when he said “Aber” was Abertridwr….I was told Aber can mean ‘mouth of, estuary of, or confluence of’ water. Im assuming there must be hundreds of smaller tributaries of the river Usk and Aberhonddu refers to one of these….🤷🏼♂️
@@johnjay5895I used to live in a village called Abertridwr and I was told it was the confluence of three streams and yes it was nowhere near the sea. ❤
Aber can also mean confluence - where two (or more) rivers meet. See also "Y Llyfr Enwau - Enwau'r Wlad" by D. Gerant Lewis - a bilingual reference of Welsh place names.
Pont likely comes from Pontis in Latin, which means bridge (cognate to "ponte" in modern Portuguese and "puente" in Spanish). There's a river in North-East England called the River Pont, but this comes from another Brittonic word, "pant", meaning valley bottom, also seen in Welsh place names like Pant, Panteg, Pant Glas, Pant Eidal, Pantmawr.
The Celtic word briva- was used in Europe but the modern Celtic languages don't use this word. Brythonic uses the Latin pont and Goidelic uses a word that means wheel path - presumably named for the long 'bridges' that allowed wheeled vehicles to pass through all that boggy land in early Ireland. Perhaps Ireland like Britain only had ferries at fords for getting across rivers.
Aberhonddu - where the rivers Honddu and Usk meet. (It doesn't need to be a coastal estuary - see also Aberbanc, Abermagwr, Aberllefenni, Abersychan for other inland examples.)
There is a village on the Wrexham/Flintshire border called Abermorddu it lies between Wrexham and Mold just less than a mile on the Flintshire sid of the border and where the Afon Cegidog flows in to the Afon Alyn that forms the border with Wrexham and Flintshire
Aber works if you think of it as being “where waters meet” so it could be 2 or more rivers meeting or where a river meets the sea i.e. an estuary. Hwyl, Jinxy
Remember that there are quite a lot of similar place names in the Bretagne region, even though they are absorbed into French. Quite a few common terms exist in modern English as well, e.g. Avon is used as a specific river (Afan) name for at least two of them - The River Avon that ends up at Avonmouth via Bristol, and the River Avon that feeds into the River Severn at Tewksbury. 2 Afan Avons, if you like. Then there is “Pont” as in Pontefract (in Yorkshire), and probably loads more.
@@johnkeepin7527 I actually intend on making a video about it in the future. But the subject has been covered by a few others so not sure how to go at it.
@@ieuanwaters7767 that makes sense! To be fair other people have also pointed out that it's a confluence. I just didn't realise Brecon was on a confluence with the Usk
@@Beliefisthedeathofintellect not sure. I just googled it, Google says church of St. Eirw. Translate just says a church. It's probably church of St. Eirw. Small or little is bach or Fach
@@mrwelshmun Thinking about it now, there's something similar in England...Fordingbridge. A friend of mine used to live there. Curiously, Fordingbridge is on one of the tautologically named rivers called the River Avon, this one south of Salisbury so nowhere near Wales. I just had a look at the Wikipedia page, and in 1066, before the bridge was built, the town was just called Forde.
Our SIX Celtic nations are Alba, Bretagne, Cymru, Éireann, Kernow, and Mennin. All parts of PRYTTYNN. The land the Anglo-Saxon illegal immigrants stole from us.
I very much enjoyed this video. The teachers who taught me Welsh taught me that "aber" means estuary or confluence, and that "cwm" means a valley pretty much closed at its high end. A valley open at both ends is a "bwlch", equivalent to the English pass. Do you have an opinion on the subject? Do any of the words you describe have different pronunciations in the north, particularly on Anglesey?
@@petertromans5599 thank you! I'm happy that you enjoyed the video. I honestly don't know enough about the Gogledd Cymraeg to comment sorry. I really do need to get out of South and West Wales more often. I do have some big ideas for some videos, but I'm self employed so it's difficult to find time off work.
I used to live in Blaengwynfi, i was told that blaen was 'below' and 'aber' was above, so above and below the gwynfi river, which made sense when you look at them. i'm english btw, this is what i was told by a local.
@@sparkyprojects Heya, blaen is more like "in front of" and since uploading this video a lot of people have pointed out that Aber also means confluence. Are there two rivers that come together up that way?
@@mrwelshmun Wow, i just looked at the map, there's the Afan, but there's also multiple streams feeding into it, one looks like it feeds in 2 places, you should take a look btw, i live in Caerau now, you said that Caer is fort, so what are the AU at the end ?
@sparkyprojects the AU at the end makes it plural. So Caer is one Fort. Caerau would be Forts. Yeah that makes sense in that case that it would be Aber.
I was born in Glyncorrwg,I left at the age of 15, for work,went to Cymmer comp, loved every minute ,I miss my home town,I am 72 now , I still long for my village.🏴🏴🏴
How does Welsh language show us where Leylines are please? In English place names leylines can usually be identified by LEY included in the place name, Leyland, Bewdley and so on. It would be interesting to know if leyline indicators are available in Welsh language
@mrwelshmun thank you, that's what l thought. Question now is why? Why would an advanced spiritual language have lost the word? Does it seems probable that there must be an indicator some where in the old Welsh language to show where leylines ran?
Ley is just about the most common OE/saxon suffix in place names. It means wood, or clearing. It meant nothing else, and calling it a leyline (nonsense in them selves) indicator is ridiculous. Don't invent the past please.
I am not Welsh. Many apologies if this drifts from the focus of geographical features more towards Welsh in general. 2:00 Did 'modern' Welsh take on the Latin for fort _castrum_ , which in Welsh perhaps evolved to become _caer_ and in English _caster/chester_ - hence Caer/Chester ? 2:25 I thought _llan_ was a physical enclosure, usually around a church, rather than an abstract parish. e.g. Llanelwy (aka St Asaph) and Llandudno (I believe it's called a mutation when the _t_ of _Tudno_ becames a _d_ ) . 3:09 I assume that _bont_ is a mutation of _pont_ (a Latin word), but I haven't worked out when the _p_ mutates to _b_ as the mutation takes place after a consonent in _Llandudno_ , but after a vowel in _Tal-y-bont_ - I can understand the former as adjacent consonants often distort one of them, but rarely when a vowel is followed by a consonant. 3:41 _Brynaman_ I understood that it was the ultimate _y_ in a word that was pronounced as _i_ or _ee_ , and that in other syllables it was pronounced more like a _schwa_ (ə) (4:34 _Ystrad_ and _Dyffryn_ 5:37 _Aberystwyth_ - it's a long climb to the University and library) . So, _Dylan_ is pronounced _Dəllan_ . From the place names you give (although I note Cwm Idwal does not fit in with my hypothesis), and your accent, I sense that you are South Walian, so is this a N-S difference? 3:58 Why does _Glyn Tarell_ not have the _ll_ pronunciation I would expect - as in _Llandudno_ ? Is the second _ll_ in _Llewellyn_ simlarly affected? Aber: This is relatively common in lowland Scotland, with places such as Aberlady - at the mouth of the Peffer (prevoiusly a name clower to lady). That area was (I'm open to correction) Brythonic. I'd like an opinion of those who speak Welsh on the name of the mountain that the English know as _Snowdon_ , and by the Welsh as _Yr Wyddfa_ : how _should_ it be pronounced? I read an article by an academic at Bangor University, and he argued that _y_ is used before a consonant and _yr_ before a vowel sound, so the _Wy_ whould be the _Oy_ sound, as is the _wy_ in Myfanwy (as traditionally pronounced in the song). By that argument the mountain pronunciation should approximate to _ər Oithva_ .
Caer may well have come from Caster, as the original word Dinas is very different. I personally think that it could have been a dialectal word that caught on. I say this because in Welsh (as other languages) You can have distinctly different words to mean the same thing depending on dialect. For example; Fox = Cadno (South Wales) Llwynog (West Wales) Madyn (North Wales) or Tree = Coed (Standard Welsh, North Welsh and West Welsh) Wydden (South Wales) I think Llan does mean both, but I think the enclosure only refers to the enclosure of the church yard. Yeah so Dylan, I would pronounce as Dull-Ann. Yeah I am South Walian, but I'm complicated. All my family are from South Wales, I grew up in West Wales, where I learned Welsh. But I'm back living in South Wales and My accent has totally changed from 10 years ago. You raise a very good point about the double L in Llewellyn and Tarell. The truth is I'm not sure. What I can tell you about Llewellyn is that there are spelling variations and the pronunciation may reflect that. So it can be spelled Llewellyn, Llewelyn and occasionally I've seen it spelled Llywelyn. Yeah, your comment about Wyddfa/Myfanwy. That's the correct way to say it. Although it's worth pointing out that Myfanwy is pronounced as Muvanwee in South Wales not Muvanooy. (It's not wrong just different) The same can be said for our word for Egg = Wy. Some pronounce it as Ooy. Some pronounce it as Wee. Neither are wrong, just regional differences. I personally would say Ooy.
@@mrwelshmun Wy for egg pronounced ooy seems cognate with the Middle English _ey_ (Dutch ei), and cockney - cock's egg). I am fascinated by the intermingling of Welsh and Latin/French, with such words as eglwys = église. Are there any resources that show timelines of the entanglement of the various parts of the Welsh language with others, as some bits of Welsh have been incorporated into later languages, and vice versa?
@@frogandspanner yeah. Another one I found from watching an Eddie Izzard documentary on Anglo Saxons. Boccan in Anglo Saxon means hefer or cow. And in Welsh is Buwch (bewe-ch) I couldn't find anything similar to it. There's definitely some influence there even if its small. I read somewhere ( I don't remember where) that the way we pronounce Rh, Ll nd Ch only evolved into its current form after contact with Norman French.
@@frogandspanner it's a very interesting topic to me. I don't know of any resources unfortunately. If I find out about any ill definitely be using them for videos
My material uncle used work in hotels in Llandrindod Wells, my family used to the town or near two villages . My parental Grandmother was front Welshpool and called me Dyfed. The Cymraen, the Bretons and Cornish are celtic cousins which language are near to them The Irish, Scottish and Manxs are celtic cousins have Gaelic languages. Some places of Scotland have still Cymraen names because Cymraen used kingdoms which is South Scotland not the Picts or Irish,
And recall that Cumbria in Welsh is Hen Cymru - Old Wales. Some claim that the Picts spoke a P-Celtic or Brittonic language, and there are some Welsh form placenames in Scotland. For example, Aberdeen - the mouth of the river Don.
In powys there is a village called Crossgates, but for some bizarre reason they have put the name ycross 🤔 my Welsh is 0 but locals say its the wrong Welsh, because originally the cross roads had gates hence cross gates 🧐
The actual name of the community is Llanbadarn Fawr. The post office changed the name in Victorian times because they kept getting it mixed up with the place of the same name near Aberystwyth. So, it really doesn't matter whether they've put y Groes on the signs or not, because it's wrong anyway.
@@YDysgwrAraf I did live in Llandrindodwells as I SA it was locals who said the new Welsh name was wrong, my brother actually owned that post office your taking about,😂
Gate is the Viking term for a road. If you head to the the north and east of England, lots of streets have gate in their name instead of road or street. Maybe somebody decided that the English name needed this variation.
@@egbront1506 Nope. It's from the fact that it was a crossing of toll roads, so there were gates in all directions. That was the name of the junction. But the Victorian post office organisation decided to apply the name of the junction to the entire settlement, eschewing the original name. Later on, when Powys decided to put bilingual signs up, they translated Crossgates to y Groes (the Cross) rather than using the original name that was there staring them in the face. This, like the misspelling of Llandegle just up the road, is an act of cultural vandalism that will one day be corrected.
@@egbront1506 all I know is what locals told me it used to be a gated crossing, with four gates one for each road, probably to stop sheep going where they not supposed to 😂
@@brendaprice342 that's an interesting name. Did some looking for you, so a Cwm is a more Deepcut glacial valley and a Dyffryn is a longer more extensive valley. So I can only guess that your home is in a large deep valley?
@@mrwelshmun Well, not really! It's sort a little hollow to the side of common land, or 'the hill' as it's locally known. I wouldn't say it was spectacular in the way some Welsh valleys are. Maybe it was just a fanciful name. But thanks for looking into it. 🙂 Now I've gone over the deeds again, I find that sometimes it is called 'The Dyffryn'. On another page it is 'Dyffrun Cwn', which is maybe dog valley (?) but I think that was a typo. Also, Dyffryn Clwm. I'm beginning to wonder if it is a legal document, with all these typos and variations. lol!
I don't think that you mentioned "Ynys". A common prefix for place names but doesn't always mean island as most dictionaries would tell you. It is a water meadow or a flood plain as in Ynyshir, a long meadow alongside a river, prone to flooding. Just think of Ynyshir (between Porth and Wattstown) without the houses. There are some odd names though that I don't get. Nant Y Caws. I'm sure it's not a stream of cheese😁 Nant Y Glo. I'm sure that isn't a stream of coal.😁 Maybe Pant and not Nant originally. Makes a bit more sense. Porthcawl. I'm sure that isn't a place for exporting soup/ stew. It was a busy coal port in the late 19th century Ystrad and Pont are probably due to Latin influence. Strata and Pont. Strata Florida in Carmarthenshire. Valley of flowers. Strathclyde, Clyde valley. What have the Romans ever done for us?😄 Thanks for that. Excellent video. Thought provoking
I'm not Welsh and don't know much Welsh at all, but I remember that "aber" can mean the confluence of one river with another, and not just the mouth of a river where it enters the sea. This might explain any inland abers like Aberfan. After writing the above, I've just found on my bookshelf a slim volume "Welsh Place Names: Their Meanings Explained" by E M Davies, revised edition, 1979, published by Emeralda, Cardiff. This says for "aber": "this denotes the mouth of a river, a small stream, or the confluence of a river".
@@jerry2357 :( I was the same age as the kids in the school. It was the only time I remember my parents watching the Welsh tv channels - we lived a few miles over the hills from the Moel-y-Parc transmitter, so reception was terrible - snowy picture and noise on the sound channel. We normally watched BBC1 from Leeds on the Holme Moss transmitter, and ITV Granada from Manchester on the Winter Hill transmitter, so I grew up knowing a lot more about what was happening in Lancashire and Yorkshire than in Wales.
And don't forget that SW.Scotalnd and NW England all have Welsh names from the Kingdom of Allt.Clud... So Glasgow comes from the Welsh Blue field (Glas cae),Edinburgh was Caer Edin.etc.Even Aberdeen has the Welsh 'Aber'.which proves that the Picts, too, were Brythonic speakers.
There is a Llanynys in Denbighshire mid way between Ruthin and Denbigh and the is a few villages around Porthmadog with the name Ynys this was about 200 years ago before the cob was built between Penrhyndeudraeth and Porthmadog before the sea water was drained there was little islands ( Ynys ) the cob is a dam to keep the sea out as this land was at sea level
@@slwrabbits most likely! I've also since found out that most place names in the West of England that include "read" is an anglicisation of Welsh "Rhyd" as mentioned in the video
in dan yr ogof on the speakers where a version of the areas history is played. They state that it was the most important strategic point to attain and defend in the country.....personally I think it's an underground city of some kind :) The only caves we get to see are walled up and caked in cement. I think based on minerals I find and cave structures that there is something vast underground. I can't imagine why else the Romans would be ordered to defend dan yr ogof at all costs!
@@ladyflibblesworth I'm not sure, I haven't heard anything about that. Definitely worth looking into. I mean, it's not far from Coelbren where there is a Roman Fort and Legion camp. Lost of iron age silures archaeology in the area too. So maybe
@@mrwelshmun I think it has to be the North one tbh, South Welsh is more BBC Cymru whereas North is the old Welsh..... I think, I was born in Sherwood! 😄😅👍🏴
There are a couple of suggestions of where the name came from. Splott - meaning moorland ( not sure about that one) Or like you said (although I've heard it was being Bishop's plot and over time was shortened to Splott). There is upper and lower Splottlands.
I'd like to know if everybody pronounces Llandarcy properly? It has a double Ll so it is Welsh, but everybody says Llandarsee, and not Llandarki as I'd expect, as the soft "C" doesn't happen in Welsh!
@@Shaman_Ray gotta be honest. I do pronounce it as Llandarsee. But that's only because I read its named after a Norman Lord I think. So Darsee as far as I'm aware is the correct way to say it. But yes you're right, in Welsh there's only a hard c
@@mrwelshmun The Wikipedia entry on Llandarcy says that the village was built by BP to house the workers at the oil refinery, and was named after William Knox D'Arcy, a director of the Anglo-Persian Oil Company, the forerunner of BP. The village isn't listed in the Welsh place names book that I referenced in my other comment. I was interested in this because as a student I worked a couple of months at BP Chemicals Baglan Bay, and we got some of our feedstock from the nearby Llandarcy refinery.
Llandarcy isn’t an original Welsh name. It’s an artificial name whereby the man who had it built for his workers (William d’Arcy) just shoved his own name after the prefix ‘llan’ to make the place sound more legit. It has never been pronounced with a hard ‘c’
Aberhonddu because Brecon is where the Honddu flows into the Usk. Likewise Abergavenny is where the Gavenny flows into the Usk. Not sure why you say toponimic names aren't common in Wales. They're literally everywhere.
Im not a wesh speaker but my sons are and proud of it. Welsh is the language of wales and should always come first . If you dont like it the go elsewhere in my opinion
Far less than 20% of Welsh people speak Welsh, and despite its efforts, no sign of that figure increasing. Why should it be first. Wales seems to do everything it can to make itself less welcoming to tourists. Time to abolish the Welsh assembly.
@@deankirby7237I can't speak to what it's like in Britain, but in the US we have tons and tons of Native American place names, for example Missouri, which roughly means "dugout canoe." Missouri's native population is about 0.4%, yet I don't think Missourians are scrambling to change their state name to "Dugout Canoe" anytime soon. I don't think there's anything wrong with honoring the cultures that existed there before you.
Vanity project. When driving (. Even at your 20 mph limits ) impossible to read directions etc in both English and Welsh. A huge compromise to safety. Will I be back ?
@@kentonnur I think a comprise to safety is a bit of an extreme accusation. Also, as ive said to 4 other people, what does it have to do with the subject of my video?
As an Englishman who's visited Wales several times, how is it impossible to just read the English part of the road signs? Maybe as I am also interested in languages you also soon pick up the meaning of the Welsh signs too!
@@mrwelshmun Having a basic knowledge of Gaelic pronunciation, I've found that in Ireland the Gaelic spelling lets me know how to pronounce a placename, which might not be obvious from the Anglicised version. The same is true of some places in the Scottish Highlands, where I live. I've not been in Wales for a few years, but I do like seeing the placenames in Welsh. I noticed you pronounced Aberystwyth the way I'm used to. On my last visit to Wales I picked up a leaflet about how to pronounce Welsh words, which led me to think that Aberystwyth should sound Aber-ist-oo-ith, but I've never heard it said like that. What do you think of that? Maybe I wasn't reading the leaflet correctly?
I live in South Wales and the roads are nothing but pot holes. I would rather see them fixed then see signs in Welsh warning me about them. Complete waste of money in hte South.
Alternatively, remove all the English signs and fix the potholes. Makes as much sense as the alternative. Having lived in Spain for several years I must have missed the thousands of English speaking expats and tourists who were unable to find thier way to and from the airport because the road signs were in Spanish.
@@geraintlewis8194 Except I lived a summer in Abertawe in the early 1980s, and Welsh just wasn't used: everybody spoke English, and called the place "Swansea". If you look at the most recent census data, only 17.8% of people in Wales are able to speak Welsh.
Perhaps they're all Welsh for "sh!"thole"? A Welsh friend of mine from Pontypridd was vehemently against the Welsh language being forced on the young people of Wales, and this was in the 1970s. Preserving is one thing, wasting money on dual language signs is just that. Interesting video, thanks for that.
I respectfully ask that you keep your personal and political opinion about Wales out of it. My channel is aimed to promote Wales in a fun way to people far afield who don't know much about the country. I would like to add that your friend who is opposed to the Welsh language being promoted, probably grew up in an area and time where the use of Welsh language was discouraged in school and society. And so would have grown up with a stigma around speaking Welsh (please refer to an older video I made "why does Wales speak English". Either way, the views of the 1970s do not reflect the modern views. I myself am proud to be Welsh and to speak Welsh. I am self employed and encourage the use of Welsh in my workplace and I'm always met with positivity, even by those who can't speak it because i'm in a position to put the language into context for them. That being said, you are fully entitled to your own opinion.
Had to drive over the bridge last week. Horrible experience. 20mph zones, terrible roads incomprehensible signage. In English you can speed read a sign because your familiar with it, so it's just a quick glance needed. In Welsh it's totally unfamiliar so by the time you start to comprehend what it might say, your past it.
Terrible roads you have got to be kidding, I know when I cross the border into Wales, my suspension on my car thinks it has gone on holiday, no crater sized potholes, unlike Herefordshire and Shropshire.
Fix the roads, put the train service back as it was before ‘upgrading’ it continuously and remove the sadistic, nonsensical and dangerous 20mph speed limit! Displaying long place names where hardly anyone ever spoke the Welsh language as hardly anyone lived in the valleys before 1850, is not a priority. What’s the point in paying the council tax when most services are useless?! As it’s always the case, Wales is just a land to exploit and Westminster and Cardiff treat the people even worse than that!
@@ComeJesusChrist yet another person. What does your rant have to do with the subject of my video? My video is about interpreting place names. Another thing, I don't work for the government or local authorities so I don't know what you're trying to achieve by complaining in the comment section on my video. I appreciate your viewership but you keep please keep your political/personal opinions out of it. Especially as they have absolutely nothing to do with the video
Thank you for being here, I hope you enjoy, please keep the comment section light hearted
Subscribed. Always nice to see Welsh UA-camrs promoting our language and culture. 🏴
@@welshed awh Cheers! I'm trying my best 😂
@@welshed That's lovely Bach, but "Croeso a Loeger"?
I mean really. Do you want me to go back to Denmark?
@@RussellGeorge67 Croeso y Lloegyr
@Dave_Cymru My bad.
Caer is cognate with the English "chester", "caster", "cester" etc and comes from the Latin "castra" and place names with "caer" in them almost always have some Roman connection. The most obvious example is "Caer" itself which, of course, is "Chester".
Brecon sits at the point where the River Honddu joins the Usk. The river comes down from the north of Brecon joining the Usk just south of the Cathedral. So Brecon sits on the mouth of the River Honddu.
@@markjlewis so it's on a kind of junction?
@@mrwelshmun Basically the Honddu is a tributary of the Usk. I can't think of any other examples of Aber used in this way but there may be some. I'm from Abertawe and my good lady is from Rhydaman. These days (and for many years) we live in Caerdydd. Unfortunately my family language is English but do have a basic knowledge of Welsh. It was a pleasure to find your channel and have hit the subscribe button.
@@markjlewis I actually grew up in Rhydaman too haha. Don't live there any more though. Thank you so much I appreciate that
@@markjlewis Aber is used a lot at the mouth of smaller rivers where they join larger rivers, particularly around where I am in South east Wales - Aberdare (Aberdâr) where the river Dâr emerges into the river Cynon, Aberaman, where the river Aman emerges into the Cynon, Abercynon, where the Cynon emerges into the Taff, a bit further out Abergavenny, where the Gavenny meets the Usk. I would also guess Aberfan, Abertysswg, Aberbargoed, Abersychan, Abertillery, Abercarn, Aberdulais, Abertridwr, Aberthin...
And since Dan yr Ogof was mentioned below, Abercraf...
It is nice hearing Welsh people having a good chat in Welsh language, I kind of know what certain prefixes meant from years of holidays in Wales, like Aber, Llan and so on, plus a few words. Though it is a very hard language to speak.
@@Jimatkins3271 glad to hear you're enjoying the content. Welsh is mostly phonetic so it's mostly pronounced as it's written. But yeah when you get into the word order and mutations it can be difficult
It's not that hard once you get into it.
@@diarmuidkuhle8181Its the pronunciation. Unless you are living there its hard to pick up.I love Welsh.
Many thanks for this. As somebody who was born on the ‘wrong’ side of Offa’s Dyke I find the bilingual life in Wales adds interest.
@@johnbristow8099 glad you enjoyed 😁
I was told as a kid that 'llan' means the fenced/enclosed area *around* a church, typically including the graveyard.
Basically the full sanctified bit, the holy ground vampires can't walk on.
A subtle distinction from 'church', but I like it because I don't think I've seen the same thing done in any other language!
@@killfalcon yeah someone else said that. I was always told it was Parish. But it makes sense, what you said.
@@mrwelshmun And I read, somerwhere, that it meant a field, specifically a cow field. The Celtic languages are very old, which explains why the Irish and Scots Gaelics are so different from Welsh and Breton.
@BillDavies-ej6ye that's interesting, I've never heard of that
Thank you. That is a briliant lesson in Welsh towns name. 👍
Great video, another one is, Coed ( in English Wood ) as in Betws-y-Coed ( Conwy )
Coed Talon ( Flintshire ) or Coedpoeth ( Wrexham ) there is Rhos ( in English moorland ) Llandrillo-yn-Rhos ( Conwy ) or Rhosllanerchrugog ( Wrexham )
Dinas=Fort , Denbigh = Ddinbych ( in English small fort )
Some places don't translate , in the county of Wrexham there is Bangor-is-y-Coed but in English it's called Bangor on Dee, no connection anther one on the coast there is
Llandrillo-yn-Rhos but in English its Rhos on Sea does not translate.
Enjoyed this video, take care.
Shaun in Wrecsam or Wrexham
@@shaun30-3-mg9zs diolch Shaun! Rhos is a good one! There's a few around here too. I considered doing Maen too but decided that there wasn't enough
Gorslas, Gorsddu, Gorsgoch. Gors meansing Scrubland
@@Shaman_Ray Gors is a good one, Gorsedd near Holywell, Flintshire
@@mrwelshmun Can't wait, thanks, Maentwrog in Gwynedd
@@Shaman_Ray Scrubland? As in covered in gorse bushes? Got me thinking now!
Informative, thanks.
You got me thinking. And you're right, officially at least, toponymical names are rare in Welsh. But colloquially, traditionally, they are normal. This still happens where I live (Ceredigion). For example, "Jones Tan-Y-Coed" (as opposed to "Jones Hafod" or "Jones Arfryn"). This could equally be used with first names ("Dai TanChwarel", "Dai Glaslyn" etc). This often uses house names, which in turn are frequently descriptive of the location. It's strange how these rarely made it into surnames in Welsh, rather the patronymical system was used (Jones - son of John; Davies, son of David) - which is rarely used colloquially.
Yep, there's a reason for my UA-cam user name; it's toponymical, even if my actual surname isn't.
@@angharadhafod yeah it's strange. I'd never thought about it until I'd heard that saying..
'Welsh place names - Unzipped' by Brian Davis is a great little handbook to keep in the door pocket of you car of in a backpack. No connection, just found it very handy for my non-Welsh-speaking Welsh wife - I'm the family Welsh-speaker!
I'll have a look for that. Diolch!
Can't aber also mean a confluence of rivers or streams? I used to work in Abertridwr. Nowhere near the sea, but three streams joined there.... tri dwr.
First place I thought of when he said “Aber” was Abertridwr….I was told Aber can mean ‘mouth of, estuary of, or confluence of’ water. Im assuming there must be hundreds of smaller tributaries of the river Usk and Aberhonddu refers to one of these….🤷🏼♂️
@@johnjay5895I used to live in a village called Abertridwr and I was told it was the confluence of three streams and yes it was nowhere near the sea. ❤
Aber can also mean confluence - where two (or more) rivers meet.
See also "Y Llyfr Enwau - Enwau'r Wlad" by D. Gerant Lewis - a bilingual reference of Welsh place names.
@@clivebradley2633 yeah, other people have pointed that out too. Had no idea before. But it totally makes sense.
I thought that the word confluence translated was Cymer or Cymerau 🤔
@@cymro6537 I'll look into that
I think the Afon Honddu opens into the River Usk at Aberhonndu/Brecon?
@@davidchurch3472 yeah you're correct. Some people have pointed out to me it also means confluence
Pont likely comes from Pontis in Latin, which means bridge (cognate to "ponte" in modern Portuguese and "puente" in Spanish). There's a river in North-East England called the River Pont, but this comes from another Brittonic word, "pant", meaning valley bottom, also seen in Welsh place names like Pant, Panteg, Pant Glas, Pant Eidal, Pantmawr.
The Celtic word briva- was used in Europe but the modern Celtic languages don't use this word. Brythonic uses the Latin pont and Goidelic uses a word that means wheel path - presumably named for the long 'bridges' that allowed wheeled vehicles to pass through all that boggy land in early Ireland. Perhaps Ireland like Britain only had ferries at fords for getting across rivers.
Aberhonddu - where the rivers Honddu and Usk meet. (It doesn't need to be a coastal estuary - see also Aberbanc, Abermagwr, Aberllefenni, Abersychan for other inland examples.)
Yes. ‘Aber’ in Welsh mean both ‘estuary’ and ‘confluence.’
There is a village on the Wrexham/Flintshire border called Abermorddu it lies between Wrexham and Mold just less than a mile on the Flintshire sid of the border and where the Afon Cegidog flows in to the Afon Alyn that forms the border with Wrexham and Flintshire
Aber works if you think of it as being “where waters meet” so it could be 2 or more rivers meeting or where a river meets the sea i.e. an estuary. Hwyl, Jinxy
Remember that there are quite a lot of similar place names in the Bretagne region, even though they are absorbed into French. Quite a few common terms exist in modern English as well, e.g. Avon is used as a specific river (Afan) name for at least two of them - The River Avon that ends up at Avonmouth via Bristol, and the River Avon that feeds into the River Severn at Tewksbury. 2 Afan Avons, if you like. Then there is “Pont” as in Pontefract (in Yorkshire), and probably loads more.
@@johnkeepin7527 yeah there are quite a lot of Welsh/ Celtic names in the marches (Shropshire, Herefordshire, Gloucestershire)
@@johnkeepin7527 I actually intend on making a video about it in the future. But the subject has been covered by a few others so not sure how to go at it.
There is also the “Hampshire” Avon, rises in Wiltshire, flows through Salisbury, the New Forest before entering the sea at Christchurch, Dorset
@@machendave River Afon = River River...............
Pontus. Latin for a bridge
Not strictly a place name sign but my favourite sign for some reason is "Dim cwn"
And I do like dogs.
I think Aber is more generally a place where two bodies of water meet. There are many inland 'aber' towns like Abertillery, Abercynon etc
@@ieuanwaters7767 that makes sense! To be fair other people have also pointed out that it's a confluence. I just didn't realise Brecon was on a confluence with the Usk
Aber tri dwr.
I went to school in eglwyswrw aha. I still struggle to say that name. 😂
I love that name
@@mrwelshmun small church if I remember.
@@Beliefisthedeathofintellect not sure. I just googled it, Google says church of St. Eirw. Translate just says a church. It's probably church of St. Eirw. Small or little is bach or Fach
@mrwelshmun 👍🏻 cool I was only there for 3 years and moved to Cardiff at the age of 8. So didn't have any further Welsh lessons.
Six Hundred always made me chuckle 😁😄😅🏴❤️
Chwech cant?
@@mrwelshmun all depends on how you say it bt 😄😅👍
What about the famous village with the ridiculously long name?
@@emilywyatt9340 Llanfairpwllgyngeroddwyndro etc etc 😅😆I can say it, but I can't spell it lol
There's a place near me in Bath called Combe Down.
That's valley in Welsh and hill in English. No wonder they couldn't get on.
Cwm is a specific type of vally. carved by glacial erosion rather than a river usualy a closed vally. i think coombe is simular
So, Pontrhydyfen - they've got the crossing of that river sorted then?
@@paulsengupta971 😂 they definitely have lmao
@@mrwelshmun Thinking about it now, there's something similar in England...Fordingbridge. A friend of mine used to live there. Curiously, Fordingbridge is on one of the tautologically named rivers called the River Avon, this one south of Salisbury so nowhere near Wales. I just had a look at the Wikipedia page, and in 1066, before the bridge was built, the town was just called Forde.
Good video as them tha do now 😉👍😄❤️
Our SIX Celtic nations are Alba, Bretagne, Cymru, Éireann, Kernow, and Mennin. All parts of PRYTTYNN. The land the Anglo-Saxon illegal immigrants stole from us.
Rydw I'm Cytuno!
You missed one though. Lloegr. England used to be solely inhabited by celts.
@@mrwelshmun I named the 6 on my flag. The fifth flag of PRYTTYNN. I also used to work up in yr Wyddfa, residing in Cwm Pennant.
I very much enjoyed this video. The teachers who taught me Welsh taught me that "aber" means estuary or confluence, and that "cwm" means a valley pretty much closed at its high end. A valley open at both ends is a "bwlch", equivalent to the English pass. Do you have an opinion on the subject? Do any of the words you describe have different pronunciations in the north, particularly on Anglesey?
@@petertromans5599 thank you! I'm happy that you enjoyed the video. I honestly don't know enough about the Gogledd Cymraeg to comment sorry. I really do need to get out of South and West Wales more often. I do have some big ideas for some videos, but I'm self employed so it's difficult to find time off work.
Abertridwr, Mouth of the three waters.
My given name is also a Welsh place name, meaning "The White Ridge." The Anglicised version would be Kevin White.
I used to live in Blaengwynfi, i was told that blaen was 'below' and 'aber' was above, so above and below the gwynfi river, which made sense when you look at them.
i'm english btw, this is what i was told by a local.
@@sparkyprojects Heya, blaen is more like "in front of" and since uploading this video a lot of people have pointed out that Aber also means confluence. Are there two rivers that come together up that way?
@@mrwelshmun Wow, i just looked at the map, there's the Afan, but there's also multiple streams feeding into it, one looks like it feeds in 2 places, you should take a look
btw, i live in Caerau now, you said that Caer is fort, so what are the AU at the end ?
@sparkyprojects the AU at the end makes it plural. So Caer is one Fort. Caerau would be Forts. Yeah that makes sense in that case that it would be Aber.
I was born in Glyncorrwg,I left at the age of 15, for work,went to Cymmer comp, loved every minute ,I miss my home town,I am 72 now , I still long for my village.🏴🏴🏴
How does Welsh language show us where Leylines are please? In English place names leylines can usually be identified by LEY included in the place name, Leyland, Bewdley and so on. It would be interesting to know if leyline indicators are available in Welsh language
I'm not 100% sure but I don't think there are any indicators. I couldn't find any translation for you
@mrwelshmun thank you, that's what l thought. Question now is why? Why would an advanced spiritual language have lost the word? Does it seems probable that there must be an indicator some where in the old Welsh language to show where leylines ran?
Ley is just about the most common OE/saxon suffix in place names. It means wood, or clearing. It meant nothing else, and calling it a leyline (nonsense in them selves) indicator is ridiculous. Don't invent the past please.
I am not Welsh. Many apologies if this drifts from the focus of geographical features more towards Welsh in general.
2:00 Did 'modern' Welsh take on the Latin for fort _castrum_ , which in Welsh perhaps evolved to become _caer_ and in English _caster/chester_ - hence Caer/Chester ?
2:25 I thought _llan_ was a physical enclosure, usually around a church, rather than an abstract parish. e.g. Llanelwy (aka St Asaph) and Llandudno (I believe it's called a mutation when the _t_ of _Tudno_ becames a _d_ ) .
3:09 I assume that _bont_ is a mutation of _pont_ (a Latin word), but I haven't worked out when the _p_ mutates to _b_ as the mutation takes place after a consonent in _Llandudno_ , but after a vowel in _Tal-y-bont_ - I can understand the former as adjacent consonants often distort one of them, but rarely when a vowel is followed by a consonant.
3:41 _Brynaman_ I understood that it was the ultimate _y_ in a word that was pronounced as _i_ or _ee_ , and that in other syllables it was pronounced more like a _schwa_ (ə) (4:34 _Ystrad_ and _Dyffryn_ 5:37 _Aberystwyth_ - it's a long climb to the University and library) . So, _Dylan_ is pronounced _Dəllan_ . From the place names you give (although I note Cwm Idwal does not fit in with my hypothesis), and your accent, I sense that you are South Walian, so is this a N-S difference?
3:58 Why does _Glyn Tarell_ not have the _ll_ pronunciation I would expect - as in _Llandudno_ ? Is the second _ll_ in _Llewellyn_ simlarly affected?
Aber: This is relatively common in lowland Scotland, with places such as Aberlady - at the mouth of the Peffer (prevoiusly a name clower to lady). That area was (I'm open to correction) Brythonic.
I'd like an opinion of those who speak Welsh on the name of the mountain that the English know as _Snowdon_ , and by the Welsh as _Yr Wyddfa_ : how _should_ it be pronounced? I read an article by an academic at Bangor University, and he argued that _y_ is used before a consonant and _yr_ before a vowel sound, so the _Wy_ whould be the _Oy_ sound, as is the _wy_ in Myfanwy (as traditionally pronounced in the song). By that argument the mountain pronunciation should approximate to _ər Oithva_ .
Caer may well have come from Caster, as the original word Dinas is very different. I personally think that it could have been a dialectal word that caught on. I say this because in Welsh (as other languages) You can have distinctly different words to mean the same thing depending on dialect. For example; Fox = Cadno (South Wales) Llwynog (West Wales) Madyn (North Wales) or Tree = Coed (Standard Welsh, North Welsh and West Welsh) Wydden (South Wales)
I think Llan does mean both, but I think the enclosure only refers to the enclosure of the church yard.
Yeah so Dylan, I would pronounce as Dull-Ann. Yeah I am South Walian, but I'm complicated. All my family are from South Wales, I grew up in West Wales, where I learned Welsh. But I'm back living in South Wales and My accent has totally changed from 10 years ago.
You raise a very good point about the double L in Llewellyn and Tarell. The truth is I'm not sure. What I can tell you about Llewellyn is that there are spelling variations and the pronunciation may reflect that. So it can be spelled Llewellyn, Llewelyn and occasionally I've seen it spelled Llywelyn.
Yeah, your comment about Wyddfa/Myfanwy. That's the correct way to say it. Although it's worth pointing out that Myfanwy is pronounced as Muvanwee in South Wales not Muvanooy. (It's not wrong just different)
The same can be said for our word for Egg = Wy. Some pronounce it as Ooy. Some pronounce it as Wee. Neither are wrong, just regional differences. I personally would say Ooy.
@@mrwelshmun Wy for egg pronounced ooy seems cognate with the Middle English _ey_ (Dutch ei), and cockney - cock's egg).
I am fascinated by the intermingling of Welsh and Latin/French, with such words as eglwys = église. Are there any resources that show timelines of the entanglement of the various parts of the Welsh language with others, as some bits of Welsh have been incorporated into later languages, and vice versa?
@@frogandspanner yeah. Another one I found from watching an Eddie Izzard documentary on Anglo Saxons. Boccan in Anglo Saxon means hefer or cow. And in Welsh is Buwch (bewe-ch) I couldn't find anything similar to it.
There's definitely some influence there even if its small.
I read somewhere ( I don't remember where) that the way we pronounce Rh, Ll nd Ch only evolved into its current form after contact with Norman French.
@@frogandspanner it's a very interesting topic to me. I don't know of any resources unfortunately. If I find out about any ill definitely be using them for videos
@@mrwelshmun I've subscribed so I don't miss out.
Aberystwyth sits on the River Rheidol; the River Ystwyth is south of the town.
Strange that it's called Aberystwyth then
My material uncle used work in hotels in Llandrindod Wells, my family used to the town or near two villages . My parental Grandmother was front Welshpool and called me Dyfed. The Cymraen, the Bretons and Cornish are celtic cousins which language are near to them The Irish, Scottish and Manxs are celtic cousins have Gaelic languages. Some places of Scotland have still Cymraen names because Cymraen used kingdoms which is South Scotland not the Picts or Irish,
And recall that Cumbria in Welsh is Hen Cymru - Old Wales. Some claim that the Picts spoke a P-Celtic or Brittonic language, and there are some Welsh form placenames in Scotland. For example, Aberdeen - the mouth of the river Don.
🙏 Great video thank you
@@southerncomfortuk diolch!!
In powys there is a village called Crossgates, but for some bizarre reason they have put the name ycross 🤔 my Welsh is 0 but locals say its the wrong Welsh, because originally the cross roads had gates hence cross gates 🧐
The actual name of the community is Llanbadarn Fawr. The post office changed the name in Victorian times because they kept getting it mixed up with the place of the same name near Aberystwyth. So, it really doesn't matter whether they've put y Groes on the signs or not, because it's wrong anyway.
@@YDysgwrAraf I did live in Llandrindodwells as I SA it was locals who said the new Welsh name was wrong, my brother actually owned that post office your taking about,😂
Gate is the Viking term for a road. If you head to the the north and east of England, lots of streets have gate in their name instead of road or street. Maybe somebody decided that the English name needed this variation.
@@egbront1506 Nope. It's from the fact that it was a crossing of toll roads, so there were gates in all directions. That was the name of the junction. But the Victorian post office organisation decided to apply the name of the junction to the entire settlement, eschewing the original name. Later on, when Powys decided to put bilingual signs up, they translated Crossgates to y Groes (the Cross) rather than using the original name that was there staring them in the face. This, like the misspelling of Llandegle just up the road, is an act of cultural vandalism that will one day be corrected.
@@egbront1506 all I know is what locals told me it used to be a gated crossing, with four gates one for each road, probably to stop sheep going where they not supposed to 😂
Dyffryn Cwm - what do you make of that (place name) please, Mr Welshmun? Many thanks.
@@brendaprice342 Dyffryn Cwm? Is that a real place?
@@mrwelshmun Yes, it's a cottage I've lived in since 1990. The deeds call it Duffryn Cwm but the council refer to it as Dyffryn Cwm.
@@brendaprice342 that's an interesting name. Did some looking for you, so a Cwm is a more Deepcut glacial valley and a Dyffryn is a longer more extensive valley. So I can only guess that your home is in a large deep valley?
@@mrwelshmun Well, not really! It's sort a little hollow to the side of common land, or 'the hill' as it's locally known. I wouldn't say it was spectacular in the way some Welsh valleys are. Maybe it was just a fanciful name. But thanks for looking into it. 🙂 Now I've gone over the deeds again, I find that sometimes it is called 'The Dyffryn'. On another page it is 'Dyffrun Cwn', which is maybe dog valley (?) but I think that was a typo. Also, Dyffryn Clwm. I'm beginning to wonder if it is a legal document, with all these typos and variations. lol!
@@brendaprice342 cwn would make more sense. Cwn is dogs
I don't think that you mentioned "Ynys". A common prefix for place names but doesn't always mean island as most dictionaries would tell you. It is a water meadow or a flood plain as in Ynyshir, a long meadow alongside a river, prone to flooding. Just think of Ynyshir (between Porth and Wattstown) without the houses.
There are some odd names though that I don't get.
Nant Y Caws. I'm sure it's not a stream of cheese😁
Nant Y Glo. I'm sure that isn't a stream of coal.😁
Maybe Pant and not Nant originally. Makes a bit more sense.
Porthcawl. I'm sure that isn't a place for exporting soup/ stew. It was a busy coal port in the late 19th century
Ystrad and Pont are probably due to Latin influence. Strata and Pont.
Strata Florida in Carmarthenshire. Valley of flowers.
Strathclyde, Clyde valley.
What have the Romans ever done for us?😄
Thanks for that. Excellent video. Thought provoking
International singing star Shirley Bassey was born in SPLOT!.
Aber = a confluence of waters which can occur as rivers join as well as where river joins sea
@@cadileigh9948 yeah, thank you! A few other people have updated me too 😂 my fault for being ail iaith
@@mrwelshmun well dw'i'n ail iath eto ond dechrau dysgu efo mapiau amser maith yn ol
@@cadileigh9948 chwarae teg I chi! Dal ati!
You missed tir as in tir John or tir canol👍
@@markmelon23mlf18 ill include it in the next one :) like tir-y-berth, tir phil, brithdir
They had no Welsh word for Sully so after consultation with nobody they called it Sili... Nuts.
@@Beliefisthedeathofintellect what a silly idea
I'm not Welsh and don't know much Welsh at all, but I remember that "aber" can mean the confluence of one river with another, and not just the mouth of a river where it enters the sea. This might explain any inland abers like Aberfan.
After writing the above, I've just found on my bookshelf a slim volume "Welsh Place Names: Their Meanings Explained" by E M Davies, revised edition, 1979, published by Emeralda, Cardiff. This says for "aber": "this denotes the mouth of a river, a small stream, or the confluence of a river".
@@jerry2357 that's interesting. It seems I forgot a few inland ones. Like Aberfan, Abercraf and Abergavenny
@@mrwelshmun Anyone who saw the news in 1966 cannot forget Aberfan. I was very young at the time, and this was the first news story I really remember.
@@jerry2357 :( I was the same age as the kids in the school. It was the only time I remember my parents watching the Welsh tv channels - we lived a few miles over the hills from the Moel-y-Parc transmitter, so reception was terrible - snowy picture and noise on the sound channel. We normally watched BBC1 from Leeds on the Holme Moss transmitter, and ITV Granada from Manchester on the Winter Hill transmitter, so I grew up knowing a lot more about what was happening in Lancashire and Yorkshire than in Wales.
Aber = confluence (of a river and the sea, or of 2 rivers)
Welsh place names are ancient, and describe the topography,so you sort of know what to look out for when your walking there…
Very true. Often the place names are older than the modern place
As in a town has built up around it, if you get me?
And don't forget that SW.Scotalnd and NW England all have Welsh names from the Kingdom of Allt.Clud... So Glasgow comes from the Welsh Blue field (Glas cae),Edinburgh was Caer Edin.etc.Even Aberdeen has the Welsh 'Aber'.which proves that the Picts, too, were Brythonic speakers.
Cet is also Chester
Mae eich ffrâm drych yn berffaith mewn ffocws
😂
Ynys too. Ynyswen, Ynishir.
@@iantobanter9546 good shout, there's a lot of Ynys' around. More in South than North apparently
Yes and ‘Ynys’ in this sense means ‘river meadow’ rather than ‘island.’
There is a Llanynys in Denbighshire mid way between Ruthin and Denbigh and the is a few villages around Porthmadog with the name Ynys this was about 200 years ago before the cob was built between Penrhyndeudraeth and Porthmadog before the sea water was drained there was little islands ( Ynys ) the cob is a dam to keep the sea out as this land was at sea level
Topological names are uncommon in Wales? Pen y Fan? Abertawe, Aberystwyth, Pwllheli, Pencader, there's lots of Pwll's (such as near Llantrisant).
@@nigelsheppard625 toponymical surnames..
Aha! So that's what the coombe in Coombe Tracey means.
@@slwrabbits most likely! I've also since found out that most place names in the West of England that include "read" is an anglicisation of Welsh "Rhyd" as mentioned in the video
in dan yr ogof on the speakers where a version of the areas history is played. They state that it was the most important strategic point to attain and defend in the country.....personally I think it's an underground city of some kind :) The only caves we get to see are walled up and caked in cement. I think based on minerals I find and cave structures that there is something vast underground. I can't imagine why else the Romans would be ordered to defend dan yr ogof at all costs!
@@ladyflibblesworth I'm not sure, I haven't heard anything about that. Definitely worth looking into. I mean, it's not far from Coelbren where there is a Roman Fort and Legion camp. Lost of iron age silures archaeology in the area too. So maybe
Always amazed at " Nawr" & "Rwan" 😅
The real question is what came first? Rwan or Nawr? lol
@@mrwelshmun I think it has to be the North one tbh, South Welsh is more BBC Cymru whereas North is the old Welsh..... I think, I was born in Sherwood! 😄😅👍🏴
@@patrickrose1221 a see now I'm a Hwntw so I'd say South was first 😂
@@mrwelshmun 😆🤣😂👍
AberHonddu is the Mouth of the Honddu The River Honddu is in the Honddu Valley
As soon as you said "rhyd" meant "ford" I remembered Rhydychen was Oxford.
Splot ! derived from the Irish navies being buried at the Catholic Church site there ! god’s plot
There are a couple of suggestions of where the name came from.
Splott - meaning moorland ( not sure about that one)
Or like you said (although I've heard it was being Bishop's plot and over time was shortened to Splott). There is upper and lower Splottlands.
Cil is another -Cilfynydd, Ciliau-Aeron.
I'd like to know if everybody pronounces Llandarcy properly? It has a double Ll so it is Welsh, but everybody says Llandarsee, and not Llandarki as I'd expect, as the soft "C" doesn't happen in Welsh!
@@Shaman_Ray gotta be honest. I do pronounce it as Llandarsee. But that's only because I read its named after a Norman Lord I think. So Darsee as far as I'm aware is the correct way to say it. But yes you're right, in Welsh there's only a hard c
@@mrwelshmun The Wikipedia entry on Llandarcy says that the village was built by BP to house the workers at the oil refinery, and was named after William Knox D'Arcy, a director of the Anglo-Persian Oil Company, the forerunner of BP. The village isn't listed in the Welsh place names book that I referenced in my other comment.
I was interested in this because as a student I worked a couple of months at BP Chemicals Baglan Bay, and we got some of our feedstock from the nearby Llandarcy refinery.
Llandarcy isn’t an original Welsh name. It’s an artificial name whereby the man who had it built for his workers (William d’Arcy) just shoved his own name after the prefix ‘llan’ to make the place sound more legit.
It has never been pronounced with a hard ‘c’
Aberhonddu because Brecon is where the Honddu flows into the Usk. Likewise Abergavenny is where the Gavenny flows into the Usk. Not sure why you say toponimic names aren't common in Wales. They're literally everywhere.
@@gte1961 toponymic surnames aren't common at all.
@@gte1961 give me an example of a toponymic Welsh surname
Surnames aren't toponimical, I agree. But you're talking about place names.
@@gte1961 they are in Cornwall. Which is why I mentioned Tre, Pol and Pen as a transition into everything I talked about
why abergvenny called Y fENNI in welsh?
Cil - Cilfynydd, Ciliau Aeron.
@@iantobanter9546 cil was one I considered doing. Maybe I'll include it in the next video
Din Eidin is the original name of Edinburgh.
@@melysmelys2622 yeah, like Dun Edin in New Zealand
Im not a wesh speaker but my sons are and proud of it. Welsh is the language of wales and should always come first . If you dont like it the go elsewhere in my opinion
Nasty.
Far less than 20% of Welsh people speak Welsh, and despite its efforts, no sign of that figure increasing. Why should it be first. Wales seems to do everything it can to make itself less welcoming to tourists. Time to abolish the Welsh assembly.
Mae o leia treian o'r bobl a annwyd yng Nghymru yn siarad yr iaith ac mae'r canran o Gymry gyda sgiliau Cymraeg yn codi'n gyson.
@@pinwyrdd Da iawn.
All Welsh place names should be in Welsh. They are not English places for God’s sake. English place names belong in England
@@NigelOwen-s8o cytuno!
@@deankirby7237 : As a Welsh speaker I find English place names in Wales both distracting and disrespectful!
@@deankirby7237 : Perhaps you have misread what I wrote - I find English translations of Welsh place names distracting - i.e. I don't want them!!
@@deankirby7237I can't speak to what it's like in Britain, but in the US we have tons and tons of Native American place names, for example Missouri, which roughly means "dugout canoe." Missouri's native population is about 0.4%, yet I don't think Missourians are scrambling to change their state name to "Dugout Canoe" anytime soon. I don't think there's anything wrong with honoring the cultures that existed there before you.
@@deankirby7237 They don't do this in France or Spain or Germany so why Wales.......just my opinion
Gwrach not grach
@@rolandbevan7088 yeah, living in South Wales has made my pronunciation lazy 😂
Vanity project. When driving (. Even at your 20 mph limits ) impossible to read directions etc in both English and Welsh. A huge compromise to safety. Will I be back ?
@@kentonnur I think a comprise to safety is a bit of an extreme accusation. Also, as ive said to 4 other people, what does it have to do with the subject of my video?
Another one who had better not drive abroad then. The French, for example don't even have the decency to include an English translation
As an Englishman who's visited Wales several times, how is it impossible to just read the English part of the road signs? Maybe as I am also interested in languages you also soon pick up the meaning of the Welsh signs too!
@@robertyoung9611 thank you for your common sense Robert. Nice to see you taking an interest :)
@@mrwelshmun Having a basic knowledge of Gaelic pronunciation, I've found that in Ireland the Gaelic spelling lets me know how to pronounce a placename, which might not be obvious from the Anglicised version. The same is true of some places in the Scottish Highlands, where I live.
I've not been in Wales for a few years, but I do like seeing the placenames in Welsh. I noticed you pronounced Aberystwyth the way I'm used to. On my last visit to Wales I picked up a leaflet about how to pronounce Welsh words, which led me to think that Aberystwyth should sound Aber-ist-oo-ith, but I've never heard it said like that. What do you think of that? Maybe I wasn't reading the leaflet correctly?
I live in South Wales and the roads are nothing but pot holes. I would rather see them fixed then see signs in Welsh warning me about them. Complete waste of money in hte South.
@@paulmorris5166 what does that have to do with the subject of my video?
Genius. Remove all the existing Welsh and English signs... And replace them with English only to solve the pot hole problem.
WTF are you on about?
Alternatively, remove all the English signs and fix the potholes. Makes as much sense as the alternative. Having lived in Spain for several years I must have missed the thousands of English speaking expats and tourists who were unable to find thier way to and from the airport because the road signs were in Spanish.
@@geraintlewis8194
Except I lived a summer in Abertawe in the early 1980s, and Welsh just wasn't used: everybody spoke English, and called the place "Swansea".
If you look at the most recent census data, only 17.8% of people in Wales are able to speak Welsh.
@@jerry2357people would soon learn if they weren’t given the choice
Perhaps they're all Welsh for "sh!"thole"? A Welsh friend of mine from Pontypridd was vehemently against the Welsh language being forced on the young people of Wales, and this was in the 1970s. Preserving is one thing, wasting money on dual language signs is just that.
Interesting video, thanks for that.
I respectfully ask that you keep your personal and political opinion about Wales out of it. My channel is aimed to promote Wales in a fun way to people far afield who don't know much about the country. I would like to add that your friend who is opposed to the Welsh language being promoted, probably grew up in an area and time where the use of Welsh language was discouraged in school and society. And so would have grown up with a stigma around speaking Welsh (please refer to an older video I made "why does Wales speak English". Either way, the views of the 1970s do not reflect the modern views. I myself am proud to be Welsh and to speak Welsh. I am self employed and encourage the use of Welsh in my workplace and I'm always met with positivity, even by those who can't speak it because i'm in a position to put the language into context for them.
That being said, you are fully entitled to your own opinion.
Spending money to try preserving and promoting an ancient culture and language is not a waste.
Had to drive over the bridge last week.
Horrible experience. 20mph zones, terrible roads incomprehensible signage.
In English you can speed read a sign because your familiar with it, so it's just a quick glance needed.
In Welsh it's totally unfamiliar so by the time you start to comprehend what it might say, your past it.
@@gar6446 what does it have to do with the topic of my video?
@@mrwelshmun dunno didn't watch it, got bored
@@gar6446 I see, so you decided to use it as a platform to winge and moan instead?
Good job you don't have that problem in France, for example. Twpsyn
Terrible roads you have got to be kidding, I know when I cross the border into Wales, my suspension on my car thinks it has gone on holiday, no crater sized potholes, unlike Herefordshire and Shropshire.
Fix the roads, put the train service back as it was before ‘upgrading’ it continuously and remove the sadistic, nonsensical and dangerous 20mph speed limit! Displaying long place names where hardly anyone ever spoke the Welsh language as hardly anyone lived in the valleys before 1850, is not a priority. What’s the point in paying the council tax when most services are useless?! As it’s always the case, Wales is just a land to exploit and Westminster and Cardiff treat the people even worse than that!
@@ComeJesusChrist yet another person. What does your rant have to do with the subject of my video? My video is about interpreting place names. Another thing, I don't work for the government or local authorities so I don't know what you're trying to achieve by complaining in the comment section on my video. I appreciate your viewership but you keep please keep your political/personal opinions out of it. Especially as they have absolutely nothing to do with the video
Labour waste to bring out double names now it cost millions again to change maybe single Welsh only, mad bad labour.