South Florida condo bubble poised to burst
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- Опубліковано 3 жов 2024
- The asking price for condos 30 years and older have already dropped 20 percent since the beginning of the year. But without legislative action, those condos are not a good deal, warned experts.
Repainting the Tennis Courts is WAAAAY more important than keeping the roof and building in good repair. 😂
That was just to satisfy the owners. HOA wanted to show they were doing something
It is funny…who do you think the HOA is? It is all the owners together. So..just like the tower that feel…year after year vote to not praise the fees to pay for maintenance…geez…guess what happens. The HOA does what the majority vote.
I'm sure the dogpark is nice.
Turn it into pickle ball courts and there will be a lot more people using it.
@@deborahschumann8286HOA are now being turn over and run by management company's. New HOA are run by the same homebuilding contractors.
let it go bust. Prices are too high anyway
exactly let it all go, banks loans cc, the whole system is built to f us over, taxes on taxes, that we paid taxes on. enough is enough. HOA are a scam and need to be prosecuted.
don't forget oct 1 student loans are being called and reported to credit companies, if you are buying hold and wait for the crash.
Burst*
@Clickbait540 not burst. Bust. I meant they would run out of money
I agree. There is no happy ending to this anyway.
A condo has a lot in common with a trailer park, except with a trailer park when your neighbor's pipes burst you don't end up with their sewage dripping through your ceiling.
Truth!
I think it is ridiculous to complain about the Association….the association is all the owners. All the owners voted to not pay their bills….geez. What could go wrong. The bad thing was that Florida law let all these owners for all these years get away with it..until buildings started to fall down.
This. Majority of them probably voted against "raising" HOA fee and defer all of these maintenance.
That is what happens when you have republicans in charge 25 years…they complain in Fl about the laws in NY and California but they protect you ..
Same with voters complaining about their democracy.
Huh?
@@happyhappycatus don't worry man, it is complicated. You would have to understand what an association really is.
Sad but a result of deferred maintenance.
I sold my condo in Ft.Lauderdale a couple of years ago ( thank god ) I talked with a former neighbor this afternoon. He said he should have sold his place when I sold mine, now he's looking at somewhere close to $20k in repairs and updates like the other people in the building. He also got an idea what his unit is worth today Sept 2024, he said it's now worth around $185k ... he paid $225k for the place a few months before I bought mine back in 2019.
It’s a win for you. Sry for your former neighbors
Any building near the ocean will deteriorate quickly.
So spooky. You're basically buying shares in a corporation that could fail when you own a condo. You could buy a single unit, but the rest of the units could go under. You could do everything right, and it could still fail.
No. Like any property…don’t do maintenance for decades..and it will fall down around you. So, people were allowed to vote on NOT paying for maintenance…..duh…did condo owners think it would be the maintenance fairy that would pay for it?
It’s the same anywhere..NY ILLINOIS.not a FL issue only
10k is nothing if you own a house. People don't want to pay to fix anything. Maintenance is generally 1% of value, 4k a year on a 400k assessed value.
Exactly!
Finally a person with common sense in these comments..I have owned condos and homes..you spent the money either way..
$17,000 for a new roof was my most recent upgrade. Half a decade ago it was my share of replacing the water line from the main to the house. After buying it was a new electrical panel. Two years ago it was repointing the stone block foundation (100 year old house). And every year RE Taxes (but get service in return trash, road maintenance, snow removal, … & location, location, location). And no HOA!
Agreed! Being a condo owner is still being a homeowner except paying someone else to take care of the maintenance. Pay up!
Prices are still too high, 2x-3x from 3yrs ago. These buildings are long overdue for maintenance
I have been maintaining my 1971 home in Florida for the past 30 years. I don’t see anyone bailing me out for work that needs to be done! Suck it up or move
In defense of the current condo owners, if you moved into one of these condos five years ago, you're not responsible for the 30 years of underfunding that happened before you got there.
You keep delaying that needed oil change on your car long enough, at some point, your car will DIE. Same concept here.
Old condos falling apart, new condos overpriced 🤣
Sad isn’t it?!
The infrastructure is aging out. Welcome to the Florida rust belt...
The only thing propping up the Florida Real Estate Market is the massive numbers of people moving there .
Apparently those people haven't heard the news.
@@joewoodchuck3824I am reminded of the Margin Call scene where John Tuld and his employees are talking about the music slowing or stopping.
A lot of the inventory is so old. Stuff built 30, 40 even 50 years ago! The south Florida climate rusts and rots everything. A lot of stuff hasn't been maintained over the decades and now people have to pay the price for that.
some of them have paid with their lives already... zero trust in that system and that trust is needed if buyers are going to come in and bid up properties
It's crazy how bad the construction is in the US. Here in across the sea I'm moving into a 70 year old building that's structurally as good as new
@@SouthPeter98that’s American mentality. Build cheap and fast, and nothing meant to last generations
@@SouthPeter98 The U.S. is the most deadly serious capitalistic country in the world, build it as cheap as possible, and hopefully no complaints. Lots of 6-7 story wooden apt. buildings in the U.S. today. In Latin America it's concrete all the way!
Meanwhile in London you see many two hundred year old houses!
Condo associations are the worst. They are power trippers more worried about small code violations than actually take care of the property.
In game of Florida Condo Musical Chairs, when the "defer HOA fees sufficient to maintain the building" music stops, it is those sitting in the seats who are the ones who lose.
The right choice of an investment has always been a big problem for me I know picking a wrong investment will leave a big scar in the future.
Absolutely! Profits are possible, especially now, but complex transactions should be handled by experienced market professionals.
Some persons think inves'tin is all about buying stocks; I think going into the stock market without a good experience is a big risk, that's why I'm lucky to have seen someone like mr Brian C Nelson.
Finding yourself a good broker is as same as finding a good wife, which you go less stress, you get just enough with so much little effort at things
Brian demonstrates an excellent understanding of market trends, making well informed decisions that leads to consistent profit
I'm surprised that you just mentioned and recommend Mr Brian Nelson. I met him at a conference in 2018 and we have been working together ever since.
I saw that some condos are being assessed $100,000 to 300,000 per unit for repairs etc since the Surfside collapse. Owners. Are leaving in droves.
If the cost of repair is more that the condo worth then the building needs to come down.
You realize if people walk away from their units, then the condo can resell the unit
@@neilkurzman4907at this stage, only an idiot would buy it
Salt Life... figure it out.
Privatize the gains, socialize the losses.
@@gmil2573 only applies to the banks. Private owners get shafted every time.
I lived in a 50 yr old building and the reinforced concrete began to show extensive "spalling". At some point the repair cost may exceed value. I moved out, the future seemed too costly an investment...
Wise move, just in time.
Miami is a literal house of cards.
The entire tri-county area, actually. 😮💨🥴
Cheap NY Democrats trying to make a quick buck! lol
Well said.
Entire city of greed
@@francismarion6400no, capitalism.
The laws were made to save lives! Condo owners are responsible for upkeep and if they lose value it’s on them.
The laws were made to create an illusion. Very few laws and regulations in the last century actually do anything but create compliance costs and more government. If you take all the compliance costs, insurance costs, and taxes out of the equation, it’s not that expensive to fix those buildings. Likely about a third. We have WAY too many people getting paid to sit in offices and effectively “manage” work with little to know responsibility for failure.
@user-ns8sj7gn4v What?
@user-ns8sj7gn4v Why should other people chip in for someone else's problems?
Yes and no. I was on a condo board and I can tell you with certainty that most of the owners are oblivious to what is actually going on. They don't even want to know.
Every where else it has been law that condo assoc MUST fund both reserve and overlay funds EVERY MONTH. Meaning, these maintenance issues are paid for monthly. In Florida…no one paid for this for years! What do you think happens when no maintenance is done for years? Instead of funding these costs every month…suddenly decades of costs are hitting owners all at once. Keep voting to not fund, BUT, be sure you sell BEFORE the sh*t hits.
Actually, it was also the law in Florida. But the law in Florida allowed the unit owners to vote not to keep reserves. Which many did.
HOAs, age and ocean air, insane insurance premiums. game over.
It's not just condos. I saw a huge sign in front of a subdivision, selling homes starting at $300,000, that read, "Prices are Dropping". Never thought I would see that in a residential area. Everything down here is grossly over-priced. I think folks are finally realizing that. It's going to bust sooner or later but a bust is coming.
A 40yo condo is worthless. No one should expect otherwise.
I would be terrified to live in an old condo in that area…. They will crumble to ground in no time due to the salt water erosion 😢
the bubble is ridiculous bro every single house used to get sold literally the first day it went on the market
When they say real estate is a good investment they dont mean Florida condos 😂😂😂😂. Because there will be more buyers looking for single family homes and single family townhomes this will drive up those prices. Only a fool would buy a condo in a building. Im surprised banks are still goving mortgages on condos.
I'd gladly buy a condo if 1) the price was ridiculously good and 2) the building appeared to be in generally good structural condition (as examined by a structural engineer). I get that sellers are not yet ready to sell at a rock bottom price but maybe next year?
Not all condo buildings have negligent owners.
What a stupid thing to say. Just because some condos are not properly maintained, they should not exist? Yeah, let's just sprawl out townhomes and houses and have the exact same thing happened in 20 years when you need to pay for road and utilities maintenance, which would be just as neglected as condos are, but at least you get to enjoy extra traffic and gas prices in the meantime!
if you don't own dirt, you don't own real estate. The association owns you.
@@GungaLaGunga okay buddy, go buy some gold and pretend that's an investment too 🤦♂
Half of them are empty no buyers and the other half are owned by over seas investment companies
Why would you think these venture capitalist companies are OVER SEAS? The vast majority of these investment companies are held by retirement funds right here. Retirement funds…grandma, your great aunt, some day you too will own stock in companies for your retirement.
Don’t buy none of that shat. Florida is falling apart
Boards and people don't want to pay to maintain their property. This is all ok the owners
It’s like a tsunami of catastrophes crashing in all at once. I feel for the innocent people who didn’t have any idea about this stuff. There are a lot of them.
Meatball lured magots to move to Florida, steals their retirement savings, Now can sell their homes to his rich Buddy's cheap 😂
Innocent? They voted to NOT pay for maintenance. The only bad thing was that Florida condo law allowed these owners to vote to NOT PAY for critical infrastructure maintenance. Now the Florida law is the same as every other state….overlay and reserve funds MUST be funded every month….meanwhile..all those years of unpaid costs are all coming due this year.
The Florida Condo situation is a complete disaster. No one is going to escape. All the buildings will have to pay out for expensive inspections, and enormously expensive special assessments, and giant repair costs...and those newer condos with 100% reserves, still will be faced with huge insurance costs as insurance companies spread out the pain for having to cover the buildings that are going under.
20 % lower is nothing. They need to get at least 100 % lower
If rents come down as much as they need to, they'll start being rented out instead of vacant month after month, because the asking rent is too high.
Even for the waterfront rentals, NO ONE BEDROOM should be renting with a rent starting ANY higher than a "1."
EXACTLY!!! THE RENTS ARE WAY TOO HIGH.
These are condos you buy them you don’t rent them. You’re thinking of apartment buildings.
@@neilkurzman4907 No, I'm thinking of condos, since a good percentage of them are not owner-occupied, but instead purchased as investment properties and rented, often by owners who do not even reside in the U.S.A.
@@OakIslandMorkie
I can’t speak speak about a good portion of the condos in Florida.
I know we might development most of them are owner occupied.
However, if the foreign owners voted not to properly maintain their property. Then I guess they can either throw a few hundred thousand in to do the maintenance now or take a loss on their investment.
@@neilkurzman4907 Whenever someone buys a condo, they have to look at the "bird." Budget, Reserve, Delinquency. Associations with a HIGH BUDGET and RESERVE and LOW delinquency rate is the right type of building. LOW BUDGET, LOW OR NO RESERVE and HIGH delinquency rate, is the WRONG type of building to look to buy into.
20% discount is nowhere near enough. Smart sellers who understand the concept of sink cost.
It's not a difficult math formula. Divide the repair costs by the number of units then that will be the discount. If the repairs cost more than the building worth then 100% discount. Also factor in unmet reserves.
@@bubbajones4522 It's more complicated than that if you down own the whole building and land
Sunk cost
@@KK-pm7ud Not really, buy a majority of units at a reduced value since the owners can't afford to pay the repair bills then vote your own board in. Pass a resolution to dissolve the association and sell the building. It's called a forced buyout.
Audit every single HOA.
trump 2024
Audit the tax collector and they calculate taxable valuations. Then audit where there money goes. Then Audit how much everything they pay for costs
And what are a lot of them gonna find? That the OWNERS cheaped out, didn't engage with their HOA, didn't pay attention to the books, didn't set money aside like they should have. Yeah- audit and send them brochures on condo ownership.
Taxpayers aren't paying for that.
Meanwhile, their Governor is fighting with Mickey Mouse and the local libraries.
Yes. That must be the explanation for the mass exodus from communist utopias like yours to places like here, Texas, Idaho & Tennessee.
Centrist here, hate both sides. Lets not pretend though that DeSantis didnt ask the legislature to fix the issue and people like Lauren Book said "no, we'll figure it out later" and went on vacation instead. Not playing sides here, fire DeSantis, along with everyone else, both sides of the aisle.
@@mercfromhome7082
Not that deSantos is a genius. But by the time he became governor, this issue had been going on for decades, and it was already too late for him to fix it.
@@neilkurzman4907 While I am more than happy to give humans leniency for being human and not all powerful and immortal beings, the current leadership showed it's hand when it moved SO quickly to fight culture wars (with constitutionally questionable reasoning) in order to serve a presidential campaign. They should move just as strongly on stuff like this instead of trying to revert back to the normal pace of things.
@@thzene4967
Yeah, this has nothing to do with culture wars. It has to do with deferred maintenance for decades, along with a law that allowed buildings not to keep reserves for those expensive repairs.
When the expensive repairs came up buildings like Surfside tried to defer it even more because they were extremely expensive and they didn’t have any money put away for it.
Now many of those buildings are in danger of collapse also.
The best the state can do is allow the buildings additional time to collect reserves. But as far as all that deferred maintenance, there’s nothing the state can do about that. The buildings have to be sound.
Rule #1: Never buy anything you don't have 100% control over.
So what you’re saying is never buy anything.
Who the hell wants to live in that swamp anyway 😂
More people than live in crime infested blue states. Could you imagine not being able to buy toothpaste without an armed guard unlocking the shelf for you?
@@francismarion6400 still better than swap floriduh and nexas.
@@francismarion6400oh stop. Red states are just as crime infested. Florida is in its own damn category of crime with all those pedos you all have running around.
So lemme get this straight, the homeowners KICKED THE CAN down the Road for as long as they could aka **DEFERRED Maintenance** until NOW they’re faced with the COST of whats known as “special Assessments” 🤷🏽♀️
I bought a condo (not in Florida) in favor of a single family home in 2019 after a two year home search. My reasoning was that any maintenance that needed to happen is shared among the collective, so I felt more secure. Little did I know that our reserves were *dangerously* low, and eventually we would face dramatic dues increases and special assessment after special assessment in order to address ongoing deferred maintenance issues.
Have you ever heard of condos appreciating at nearly the same amount as a sfr?
@@RGforLife22 they don’t appreciate at the same rate as single family detached homes, if that’s what you mean. The rate at which it appreciates also depends on the type of condo unit you purchase. For instance, the condo I purchased is a 2-story townhome style with 3 beds, 2.5 baths, and an attached 2-bay garage. The home came with HVAC, and all the attributes (including size) needed to make it attractive to families. So naturally, it has appreciated reasonably in value. Whereas an apartment-style (flat) condo is less desirable for purchase, as it only attracts a smaller portion of the market.
@@RGforLife22 yes some condos appreciate quite rapidly others don’t but it also depends on where it is and when it is.
That also assumes that you’re buying it as an investment and not as a home
Did you not read the disclosures with low funds?
@@mytravls it was my very first home purchase. Nobody made me aware there was even a reserve fund to begin with. Honestly, I didn’t even have a look at the reserve spreadsheet until a year after buying in and I was elected board chair.
That building sorry people.its a tear down and rebuild
Agreed. I wouldn't want to park in front of it let alone move in.
It's not only the unknown costs of these special assessments, but also you have to take into consideration how many owners will just walk away, especially if the assessments are very high. The more that walk away then the higher the maintenance fee will be for the remaining unit owners. This is an unknown and the total carrying costs for some of these units could be just not worth it for practically anyone. In 2009/2010 it was the same thing but for a different reason. Some condos were selling for some really great prices, but the greatly elevated monthly fees were the catch.
how about we dont allow tall buildings to be built without 100 year ratings...? im sure we can do it.
I don't know if stainless steel building construction is feasible.
First girl lives in Florida, thankfully has those large floatation devices
she thick like butter too.
Something tells me that she’d let you drown…
@ashleyconnor8891 boom! Nice one
Sounds like a lot of property built on sand…
FL....where all problems go
😂
Condos are like hot potatoes. Trade and sell them but don't get caught owning one when huge maintenance and assessments come due!
I'd get out of my condo in Florida even if I had to take a loss. A loss is better then zero value.
Dear Miami, You're the first to go.. Disappearing under melting snow...
20% is not enough. 50 to 75% at most .
Loans are worthless
Greed is catching up to the tyrants
Its a 50 year old building on the coast. What do you expect?
What worries me is if the state is exercising oversight of the insurance companies. The state made it easy for the insurance companies to charge exorbitant increases; but are they making sure the insurance companies NEED the amount of increases or are they profiteering off the backs of property owners? Where is all this money going and who is benefitting from it that most? ANSWER THOSE QUESTIONS!!!!
Get ready for high rent for those new buildings. Miami will be unlivable.
Already unlivable for a large percentage of the people living here. Some are hanging on for now, but have no long term future here.
You mean to suggest that the HOA didn’t do the right thing? How can this be? :)
Here’s how this works the owners elect the Condo board. If the Condo board says hey, we need to do some expensive repairs. The condo owners can just select somebody who won’t do them. In fact, many condo owners vote for candidates who claim that they’re going to keep common charges low.
Voting stupidly doesn’t make you smart
Let’s get some popcorn 🍿.
Hater😡
I've iived in Florida, but never in Miami, or any condo whatsover. They are just a ticking bomb, with lower prices to catch the people tha don't know, or people that wold rather say they live in a condo in Miami. Big deal.
Why would anyone buy a condo in Florida now? It’s a minefield of hidden costs and assessments. Move somewhere else!
Building code needs to be changed to require corrosion resident building products. Even newer buildings could be a future money pit of assessments.
What a mess
I live in a 100 year old building, it's a question of maintenance and good construction. "50 years!* As the journalist gasps is not old for good building
Yes, but things near the ocean just don't hold up as well.
And I'd bet that the companies doing the inspections and work are gouging. And where is the legislature and governor to stop this process. Florida is one big cesspool
If I had a condo with all these fee's I'd feel like a sitting 🦆
Keep up the good work, Ron. Keep taking donations from insurance companies and private equity.
DeSantis is a miracle worker for the Florida economy.
Only for hugely pregnant Venezuelan women.
Never Ever Buy Real Estate in Florida
Why aren’t the monthly homeowners association fees paying for these repairs?
They didn't collect enough for maintenance in the past. Kicked the can down the road too long. Now needing to do serious repairs when materials and labor are 200% inflated from when the Covid LOCKDOWNS occurred.
Some buildings have reserves in the common charges. Those buildings are not going to suffer greatly except for insurance from the badly manage buildings.
It's pretty obvious that the association used all the money on themselves and now are quitting to avoid responsibilities.
Another housing market collapse. That would be a world wide tragedy. Assessments but no major repairs being done.
It's funny that the basement office that they did the interview in has decor and actual WALLPAPER from the 60s lol.
What bubble that's poised to burst? The market has already gone bust.
I assume you mean Fla.
Not enough $$$$ was collected for maintenance fees over the course of 30 years! Here in NYC a condo or a CO-OP has had a $700-$1500 per unit per month maintenance fees. This is going back 20 years ago that fees were so expensive, and these units I’m talking about out are up to 70 years old. Not 40 or 50. And maintenance includes NOTHING!! Electricity is NOT included and AC is NOT central so AC is paid by the occupants! Laundry is NOT free either.
No, but the new roof is paid for. The driveway and snow plowing is paid for. Maintenance is NOT your monthly living costs…it is for repairs and replacements.
@@deborahschumann8286 it snows maybe ONCE A YEAR for the past 15 years btw….
@@stavroslask1292 guess I was clear I was referring to condos assoc responsibilities in general…clean up after a storm..snow or downed trees.
The point being that the condo association or HOA..or whatever is not some entity separate from the owners…it is the owners.
Thank GOD I bought a non-HOA Single family home back in 2017. Bought 300k now worth 700k...😎
Wow. Hope the buildings dont collapse.
Perhaps instead of sending money out our country for endless wars we could use that money to patch things up here.
Florida: from popping daisy dukes to popping condo bubbles.
What does DeSantis want more federal relief!
Forced to sell my condo before the assessments come in January. Sad because now I have to live in a little room with a family member. 😢
I think the only way older buildings are going to get bought is by developers at a steep discount. Who will probably need to put a lot of work or demo the building and start from scratch.
Prices will dtop at least 50%.
The correct pricing is the post 2008 housing crash pricing. I moved to Miami in 2008 and was way better then.
And we already had too many people here.
The definition of "correct" pricing is what the market will bear. If any certain property sells in a reasonable amount of time, the price was correct. People are still buying in Fla., so those sales prices reflect actual value.
@@jasonallman696 if you arent a Seminole Indian, you aren’t local
@@joewoodchuck3824 Incorrect. Current value is inflated value and starting to drop . It will all come crashing down like it did in 2008 and I will be there buying your Miami condos again for 60% off!
DeSantis has no good answers.
I could be wrong but the new milestone inspection law doesn't seem to apply to apartment buildings. Does renter safety not matter?
I can’t imagine any insurance company would luck an apartment building being in worse condition than some of these condominiums are.
But either way they fall under a different set of laws
@@neilkurzman4907 So we need to wait for an apartment building to fall down?
@@steven4315
I’m not familiar with the regulations of apartment buildings in Florida.
@@neilkurzman4907 Neither am I but I can't find a thing about these new inspection laws affecting apartment buildings. Florida is extremely business friendly, so I'm thinking apartment buildings will not be an issue till something happens, Could be wrong.
Looks like the move to Miami going up in flames?
What a mess
Have you asked your "governor" for help or relief? What did he say? Declined to answer?
Most of the cities on this planet are near the ocean, including most huge metropolises, and yet you don't here of these building problems at all. Hong Kong, Shanghai, Tokyo, Seoul, Sydney, London, Barcelona, Rome, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Istanbul, Mumbai, Cape Town, Hamburg, New York, Boston, Seattle, Vancouver, Rio de Janeiro, Buenos Aires... only in FLORIDA do these buildings seem to just "go bad".
its just an excuse so that walstreet can come and buy everything for cheap
50yr old building is too old to maintain
Personally, she didn't want to go to prison.
Happening all over the country smdh
Is the realtor then advising buyers to make an offer in which the Seller pays them to take the unit?
This is what happens when there's no regulation!!!!!
A lot of these condos are in great locations, with water views. If repairs would be too expensive, the owners could sell to a developer who would do a tear-down. However it shakes out, most owners will be fine, with an improved building.
Developers may just leave it as rentals.
@@vintagejaki751
That’s called an apartment building not a condominium. But yes, I suppose they could build one of those instead.
If the building is sold to the developer, then the owners get paid out and don’t get a unit in the new building unless they want to buy it.
HOAs are mini-democracies, the constituents vote on taxation(fees) that pays for maintenance. You have to live with the consequences or move on.