The 4.2l i6 is such an underrated motor. Everyone looks for the V8 and everything. Nobody on here is doing anything with the 4200. The Atlas motor has ALOT of potential. It just needs time an more eyes on it. There an amazing engine. Thank you for being one of a VERY few ppl pushing the limit of this motor
If I get my machine shop again (purchased one before the paradise fires and by the time I made space, the cops wouldn't let me up to clean out the warehouse where they were sitting) I'll be doing a lloott of work on these atlas motors. Hopefully I can get another 5 axis manual mill and cnc so I can prototype AND test internals. Goal it to start producing my own "ameri-barra" set that would include anything needed to get to 1000hp reliably or 1500 as a strip hero with meticulous maintenance. Kind of like J.P. racing did with the 1gz-fe v12 toyota and 1fz-fe 4.0 2j derivative.
Was about to go buy a vette to build a newer drift car. Cause already has an ls1. Now I wanna Frankenstein another pickup or wagon with one of these and between 4 and 500hp on 2 tunes. 1 for skidracin 1 for highway pulls
I agree I have the 04 version and it pulls very hard especially once you get to 3500 and above feels like a little boost kicks in but it’s just the vvt working.
I'm sitting here having upgraded from a 2004 Envoy to a super clean and well optioned 2007 Trailblazer not knowing the potential of the 4200 at the time, but wanting to turbo it in the future just to find the amazing work you and others have already done. Nice
What’s funny about this engine is that it seems to be a hybrid between the ls and jz (probably the 2 most modded engines in the world other than the k series) and I’ve never seen anybody swap these before (which I find even funnier because all people do is swap the ls and jz lmao).
“HotRod Garage” did a supercharger (or maybe it was a turbo) build on one of these engines. It’s been a while since I watched the episode. (From an 04 I believe)
A worked with a guy who's nephew put a 4.2 in his 37 Chevy Coupe. At Cars n Coffe people would ask why not an LS or SBC. His reply was any idiot can put an LS in. He just wanted to be different. Theres a 32 Ford Highboy up in Canada that has a Jag 4.2 in it. Just to be different.
The engine coolant temp sensors are also in different locations. On 02-05 engines its in the block and on 06-later engines its in the head. So if you put a early head on a later block you won't have a place to put a temp sensor. I drilled and taped the upper coolant elbow to house one. Also coming from the repair side of the industry the biggest failure mode we see on these engines is broken valve springs/valve keepers not staying in place, causing bent valves in heads and misfires. This is on stock engines, I'm not sure why it happens but I've seen a trend of them failing this way. The only other failure I've seen is run out of oil causing rod knock.
Why would you put up an older head on a newer block? Maaan. You have to do the opposite. I own a 04 trailblazer with the P10. Got a complete 2008 engine. Im gonna swap the crank of 2004 to the 2008 engine and rewire a P12 PCM to get the best ever vortec. I confirm 2007 head works well on 2005 block.
I have a 93 t100 on 35’s, sr5. The 3.0 is severely lacking in aftermarket support. I was leaning towards a 1uz, or a 2jz, or even a 4.0 from a newer taco since they are making S/C for them. But now, I’m thinking of picking up a 4.2 for a quarter of the price, and boosting the hell out of it lol
I'm glad I found your channel. I bought a 2004 TB with 65k miles in 2008. I still have it and it now has 178k miles. I'm picking it up today from the transmission shop. They rebuilt the tranny because the tc blew up. It's a great suv less the bad mpg. It has never fail an emission test.
Hi from Australia. Could you confirm the trigger teeth pattern for me? Is the 7 tooth 6 even teeth plus 1? and what is the 4 teeth on cam even on the 06-08? Thanks.
Hey guys. It's an honor. It's 6+1 on 02-07 engines. 08-09 had 58x identical to an LS. The cam is a weird 6 tooth pattern from 02-07. In 08-09 they went to 4x identical to an LS. The cam sprockets interchange across all the years.
I just scored a 04 atlas 4.2 with 106k miles for $300 bucks. Ran great in a rust bucket. My mint 03 envoy just hit 270k miles and finally started making the worn valve seat diesel sound.
@@rattyratstuff7125 That's a shoehorn! I'm back on my old bullshit, straight power train "swap" into an 80s hearse. It will be mine, oh yes, it will be mine
So in a nut shell its pretty much like the ls engine world.. Use the later model pistons rods, and cylinder head on a earlier model block/crank.. because of ecu options(in this case a stronger crank) I guess there was no changes made to the block between years?
My mom has a old 2003 trailblazer with a 4200. 120,000 miles, beat up a little but in decent condition. Transmission is like 20,000 miles cause it died at 100,000 (I don't know why, mom had to get it replaced). Going to dust it off, has been outside sitting for the past year, get it inspected and add maybe the ss body kit to it and some bigger tires, and do e85 swap with some boost and it will be prime.
Would be nice in a 5 series. I had a 530i with a Garrett GT40 and it was awesome until a guard rail bit me and caused frame damage. Just a slight dinger on the highway but it was enough.
Generations more advanced of a design. What would you expect. The 4.0 is a great engine that will tun forever. Provided it is taken care of. But it was an old design. The initial production of the design was in 1964 but in concept it is very similiar to any other inline OHV six. Post 2000 there was some preliminary work done on adapting it to 24 valves. Either OHV or a head similiar to the Chrysler 3.5/4.0 V-6. The 3.5 is a little weird. 4 valves per cylinder with two intake lobes and one exhaust.
@@mpetersen6 yes i had a 4.0 litre in a 1993 cherokee 2 door. It had 340,00 k on it when i sold it. Was running perfect as was trans. It seemed bullet proof.
@@TC-hs5wy Remember when GM was building that Cyclone S-10. Spent a bunch of money taking a specially prepped one out to the Salt Flats and set some records. A year or two later an engineer in Jeep powertrain on his own prepped a Commanche with a 4.0. Turbo etc. Took it to Bonneville and crushed the records that GM set. Pushed that Commanche up to close to 200.
Thanks for this video. I got a chance to pick up a RUNNING 280k mile 04 motor for scrap value. I think i may have to do it. If for nothing but to see how it looks at nearly 300k.
Can you go more in depth on using the stock ecu for boost? Also I want very badly to use this motor for my next drift car build. I know you’re a drag guy but if you (or any one else) had any input on how a 4200 might perform in a drift car, I’d love to hear it. I’ve also been binging all of your 4200 videos, great information and awesome builds!
Doing a drift build is totally doable. As with any drift car, the key is oil control. There is a guy in Sweden that has a really sick Volvo Drift car with a 4200. Check this out for more information. sites.google.com/view/vortec4200wiki/home
First!!!! I've been sooooo waiting for this. Thank you veeeeeeeery much man! Posting this to all TB Groups. Thank you for responding to my request. Keep making this engines go BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRR!!!!!!!
Nice piece of education Calvin. A lot of misconception out in the forums where people claim that using a 06 and later cylinder head on a 05 block is a way to increase HP. Clearly none of them actually tried what they claim otherwise they would have discovered the bolt pattern variation.
Great video on the differences between the years, could you do a video on the blocks themselves though? I'm pretty sure they're then same but no one talks about them
On modern engines without rocker arms they are internationally known as "valve cover" but are sometimes referred to as a "cam cover" or "timing cover" if they also cover the timing gear(s) and belt or chain.
@@Calvin-Nelson I just copied and pasted that - I had never even heard of either term before - thanks for the great vids! I'm tooling around in my TB 04 - wondering if some MMO will clog up my oil pan filter since the whole drive train would have to be taken apart if that happens! haha. I used some MMO before and had the classic dirty exhaust smoke clean out. So I guess I got lucky. Also I put in boron Nitride. ... At 267K so far so good - the third valve did not burn out as happens on those engines. haha. thanks again.
Thank you I look forward to turbocharger my 09 trail.blazer just as a daily kinda sleeper. Not trying to run crazy numbers just double maybe so around 500
For the life of me I do not understand why GM gave up on this engine platform. Perhaps limited use is one reason but to be this would have been an ideal base engine in the Chevrolet pickup. Or in commercial vehicles. In reference to the dyno results versus the 5.3L LS. Maybe the reason the the 4.2 made more power at the same boost level is the cam timing. The bigger cam in the LS with more valve overlap might have been allowing more fuel air mixture to blow thru the cylinder during the overlap period. At the height of piston aero engine development in the 1940s high output aero engines did not have extreme cam profiles. Remember these engines often had two stage, two speed supercharging systems. The second stage was not to provide more boost st lower altitudes but to maintain power output at higher ones.
But I thought that all cams are turbo cams! In all seriousness. You're probably onto something there. We adjusted the cam timing on the 4.2 and picked up probably 45hp on the last pull.
@@Calvin-Nelson One does need to remember that automotive and aero engines are different ball games in a lot of ways. Aero engines are not high rpm. But given their overall size and long stroke they reach some pretty impressive peak piston speeds. Plus there is the need to be extremely reliable. The Allison for instance was pushed up to around 65 inches of boost at the squadron level during the war.
With these engines can you do a hot cam swap. Put 2 intake cams or exhaust cam’s depending on size. In the KA24de you can put 2 exhaust cams in and it keeps the motor breathing with larger lift at high rpm
After watching this I want to put an 06-08 head and pcm on my 02 envoy. The kids love when I red light race ricers. It sounds pretty nasty through a 40 series flowmaster at 6500 rpm also.
@@kipholder8577 I have found that gen 3 LS head bolts are just about the perfect length and thread. You want the long ones. The Vortec 4200 head bolts don't snap going together. They snap trying to remove them.
EPIC video! Thanks for the wealth of information!!! How's the height compare to a LS with a truck manifold? Any forged piston or rods out there? ARP head, main, or rod bolts? I'm just starting to research this. I was going to do a LS and a remote mount turbo on my Astro van but this looks like an interesting option. Thanks for helping out Holdener. I'm interested to see his upcoming tests too.
So it's much like a LS, they all will GO, only you may want a aftermarket ecm, do the later model heads fit the early engin? Great video, I appreciate the knowledge!!
If what you are asking is do the LT heads fit on the LS, then yes the bolt holes line up. They changed the dowel locations, and again you have to come up with a solution for the valve order.
So,I want a 2002 crank,06 up head,06 to 08 ecu,06 up rods and pistons. Also wondering if a 06 up intake cam would improve performance on a pre 06 engine.
You do not want a 2002 crank. They are unique. You want a 2003-2005 crank. I'm actually in the process of seeing if an 06+ cam will improve my 04 engine.
Possibly emissions or SAE rating requirements. Having driven and worked on all of them, the 08-09 engines are the smoothest, most power etc. in factory form.
Have you ever checked the gaskets with an ls to see if they line up? i aim to build a 16 v v8 using different heads off a 4 cylinder or 6. Cutting is an option. Syclones and Typhoons did it with the v6. Thanks so much for this information, you have saved all of us quite a few headaches with this video!
Did any of them get a forged crank? In some of the 3500v6 (non vvt) GM put a forged crank in them, and others got a cast, but they all got the PM rods.
So friend has an 07 2x2 with bad engine / rod knock till it warms up after short time drive comes back. He got a deal on an 04 4x4 thats clean. Seems the crank and cam teeth count are the same. Only issue maybe the vvt on the cam as they changed 06/up ? If that isn't an issue should work fine since change rails or what minor things over. Don't thing oil pan isissue. Yard was saying they should interchange according to Hollander. Thanks
yes i need know this as the wiki said a redesign happened thank you ill be using this with manual transmission may want to use in a 4x4 also any suggestions just subscribed .be blessed man
Great video and thanks for all the content. I plan on building one of these in the future for sure! Can you use the older crank in the newer blocks? If so, what is needed to change, upgrade or use to do it?
My usual tuner cannot flash '06-'07 computers. Any idea why? To add: These engines are very sensitive to oil change intervals and quality of oil. IIRC a full dressed engine is roughly 550lbs. About the same as an iron headed SBC. Theyre not light weights.
Joining the Vortec 4200 club and going to do a frame swap with a '65 IH pickup. I'm wanting to do some work with the P12 ECU. What software are you using to do your programming. I'm just looking to delete a few sensors that won't be needed for my build and perhaps setup, if possible, a 2 or 3 driving mode system. Thanks for turning me on to this platform. I built a Spit6 back in the day and that was a ripper little I6.
Definitely have to shim the lifters to essentially make then solid. Another hot ticket is to use Ecotech followers. They are stronger, and interchange. Not sure what to recommend on valve springs. I found a set of 2JZ valve springs that will work, I just don't know if it will work at 10,000 RPM. These engines have very bad harmonics at around 6,500 RPM. Guys that are taking them to 10,000 RPM run like 7,000 stall converters. Basically they just get through the bad harmonics as quickly as possible. I would probably be wise to put cams in it so that it will make power at that RPM. Billet cams are expensive, but you probably can get away with a regrind. In my opinion the stock cams are pretty decent and you can do a lot with them. Not sure if they'll support power at 10,000 rpm.
@@Calvin-Nelson so if the later rods and piston fit on the 12 counterweight crank would the rotating assembly be unbalanced or does it not matter? Also Thanks for all the great information you share. It’s awesome
Hi, I've got a quick question. I have an 05 trailblazer ls 4.2 but I think I've got an 06 engine. I recently had the exhaust manifold replaced. If the shop put on an 05 manifold instead of an 06, would it make a difference. I checked and they are 2 different part numbers. Thanks
I have an 07' 4200 that spun a rod bearing, and its too far gone for the crankshaft and rod cap to be machined! I found an 02' 4200 what do i need to do to make it work for my 07'? Can i use the 02' lower( block, crank,) and use the 07' head, oil pan, n timing gears, or will it not work that way?
Hello budy one question, i saw that you have a lot of experience how can install on these engine a t5 transmmission, is there an adapter for this transmission?? Any idea??
I realize this is an older video and apologize if the question is off topic: If you were looking for an Trailblazer/Envoy for an everyday driver am I correct to assume the 06-09 model years are going to be the better way to go? I Better lubrication to the piston, stronger connecting rods( at least at the wrist pin) and I'm guessing with the larger exhaust ports and higher compression ratio better power/efficiency? I'm not a mechanic so I ask dumb questions. Thanks!!
Every 4200 owner/builder is looking for this video. May it never get lost in the youtube algorithm.
i think i just fell more in love with cars cause of this inline beauty
The 4.2l i6 is such an underrated motor. Everyone looks for the V8 and everything. Nobody on here is doing anything with the 4200. The Atlas motor has ALOT of potential. It just needs time an more eyes on it. There an amazing engine. Thank you for being one of a VERY few ppl pushing the limit of this motor
If I get my machine shop again (purchased one before the paradise fires and by the time I made space, the cops wouldn't let me up to clean out the warehouse where they were sitting)
I'll be doing a lloott of work on these atlas motors. Hopefully I can get another 5 axis manual mill and cnc so I can prototype AND test internals. Goal it to start producing my own "ameri-barra" set that would include anything needed to get to 1000hp reliably or 1500 as a strip hero with meticulous maintenance. Kind of like J.P. racing did with the 1gz-fe v12 toyota and 1fz-fe 4.0 2j derivative.
Just towed 8500 lbs with my 04 rainier lol
I never understood why GM DC'd this engine. Such a fantastic and silky smooth powerhouse engine.
Thanks For shedding light on a good thing👀👍😎
And I been a longtime member of Inliners International
thanks once again for doing something different than LS in the GM world. Really good stuff here for those wanting to head in this direction.
Was about to go buy a vette to build a newer drift car. Cause already has an ls1. Now I wanna Frankenstein another pickup or wagon with one of these and between 4 and 500hp on 2 tunes. 1 for skidracin 1 for highway pulls
Thank you I think you are the only person who breaks down this motors the correct way. Thanks again
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I have an 06 Trailblazer with the 4200 and I love it. The best inline 6 I ever drove. Pulls very strong for its displacement.
I agree I have the 04 version and it pulls very hard especially once you get to 3500 and above feels like a little boost kicks in but it’s just the vvt working.
@@Thumper68 I’ve got an 02 with 440k on it and running strong it burns a little oil but what can you expect
Mopar Slant 6 from the 60s!!! Bullet proof, and zero electronics...
@@ucsasinkings8296holy shit man!
I'm sitting here having upgraded from a 2004 Envoy to a super clean and well optioned 2007 Trailblazer not knowing the potential of the 4200 at the time, but wanting to turbo it in the future just to find the amazing work you and others have already done. Nice
I need one of these ASAP... before they start getting expensive
You can find them at any junkyard/pull apart. I've seen quite a lot.
my local mechanics keep trying to get me to trash my TB even though the engine works fine. Makes me suspicious. haha
@@carnage50x why am I just now realizing you commented on this lol small world😂
@@zerohourdrift it's been 84 years...
What’s funny about this engine is that it seems to be a hybrid between the ls and jz (probably the 2 most modded engines in the world other than the k series) and I’ve never seen anybody swap these before (which I find even funnier because all people do is swap the ls and jz lmao).
There are some older videos of MK3 Supras with 4200's floating around.
“HotRod Garage” did a supercharger (or maybe it was a turbo) build on one of these engines. It’s been a while since I watched the episode. (From an 04 I believe)
I have a 06 trailblazer and a 3rd gen camaro just looking for a trans
A worked with a guy who's nephew put a 4.2 in his 37 Chevy Coupe. At Cars n Coffe people would ask why not an LS or SBC. His reply was any idiot can put an LS in. He just wanted to be different. Theres a 32 Ford Highboy up in Canada that has a Jag 4.2 in it. Just to be different.
I've always liked this engine and knew it had potential. I wish gm put it in more vehicles as well as a stronger aftermarket Field.
Same
The engine coolant temp sensors are also in different locations. On 02-05 engines its in the block and on 06-later engines its in the head. So if you put a early head on a later block you won't have a place to put a temp sensor. I drilled and taped the upper coolant elbow to house one. Also coming from the repair side of the industry the biggest failure mode we see on these engines is broken valve springs/valve keepers not staying in place, causing bent valves in heads and misfires. This is on stock engines, I'm not sure why it happens but I've seen a trend of them failing this way. The only other failure I've seen is run out of oil causing rod knock.
Yep. Good catch.
Why would you put up an older head on a newer block? Maaan. You have to do the opposite.
I own a 04 trailblazer with the P10. Got a complete 2008 engine. Im gonna swap the crank of 2004 to the 2008 engine and rewire a P12 PCM to get the best ever vortec.
I confirm 2007 head works well on 2005 block.
02 trailblazer had rod knock, had a free 07 engine with a bad head. Cheap is why.
I have a 93 t100 on 35’s, sr5. The 3.0 is severely lacking in aftermarket support. I was leaning towards a 1uz, or a 2jz, or even a 4.0 from a newer taco since they are making S/C for them. But now, I’m thinking of picking up a 4.2 for a quarter of the price, and boosting the hell out of it lol
Thumbs up even before vid started playing!!!!
Thank you for all the info man we appreciate it 4200s they starting to be more and more appealing everytime you go faster with them
A man who truly knows his craft. I'd wager you over the GM engineers on some of that info
I'm glad I found your channel. I bought a 2004 TB with 65k miles in 2008. I still have it and it now has 178k miles. I'm picking it up today from the transmission shop. They rebuilt the tranny because the tc blew up. It's a great suv less the bad mpg. It has never fail an emission test.
I've seen some of your vids. You are always missing with the tranny and the tcm,, so what happened? Why did it blew up?!
@@marlo0oty213 I guess because I install a Corvette servo a long time ago. It was shifting to 2nd. too hard for a long time.
@@blackericdenice still you had a chance for a manual tb or some other gear to try other than the 4l60
@@marlo0oty213 I would like to install a 6L80.
@@blackericdenice I can’t wait to see that. Good luck but I guess the trans housing is different you may have to make a custom adapter plate!
Hi from Australia. Could you confirm the trigger teeth pattern for me? Is the 7 tooth 6 even teeth plus 1? and what is the 4 teeth on cam even on the 06-08? Thanks.
Hey guys. It's an honor. It's 6+1 on 02-07 engines. 08-09 had 58x identical to an LS. The cam is a weird 6 tooth pattern from 02-07. In 08-09 they went to 4x identical to an LS. The cam sprockets interchange across all the years.
No sh**! Imagine having the SF lads hit you up!
I just scored a 04 atlas 4.2 with 106k miles for $300 bucks. Ran great in a rust bucket. My mint 03 envoy just hit 270k miles and finally started making the worn valve seat diesel sound.
You can expand virtual VE in HP Tuners for the e67 and 4200 into 3 bar while still utilizing the MAF for NA conditions.
Can you confirm that? You're speaking from experience?
I've had my eye on a Trailblazer as a second vehicle. The specific one is a 2006. So thankfully the upgraded head. Thanks for putting this video out.
Dude, so obvious you want the refresh model! Great breakdown, excellent detail, got the 4200 in my mind for a project. Def an '06 to start 😎
Have an sr20de sentra here at the shop rn. Really want that motor. Also have an 06 trail blazer at the shop. Really want that motor too haha
@@rattyratstuff7125 That's a shoehorn! I'm back on my old bullshit, straight power train "swap" into an 80s hearse. It will be mine, oh yes, it will be mine
So in a nut shell its pretty much like the ls engine world..
Use the later model pistons rods, and cylinder head on a earlier model block/crank.. because of ecu options(in this case a stronger crank)
I guess there was no changes made to the block between years?
I think they did very minor things. They're all pretty good.
My mom has a old 2003 trailblazer with a 4200. 120,000 miles, beat up a little but in decent condition. Transmission is like 20,000 miles cause it died at 100,000 (I don't know why, mom had to get it replaced). Going to dust it off, has been outside sitting for the past year, get it inspected and add maybe the ss body kit to it and some bigger tires, and do e85 swap with some boost and it will be prime.
Good info! After watching your videos, I want to stuff a 4200 into my BMW.
Would be nice in a 5 series. I had a 530i with a Garrett GT40 and it was awesome until a guard rail bit me and caused frame damage. Just a slight dinger on the highway but it was enough.
Likely hood interfearance
I want one in my 77 impala since sime came with an inline 6. Im looking for a doner truck at the moment.
The 4200 God over here. Thank you!
Great video. I have watched this video many time studying and learning about the 4200. Thanks
Sounds like 06-07 is the golden year.
Yeah. The early motors are very capable too.
Those 06+ heads!! Ports are still a little lower/smaller than one might like to see but otherwise look like they're down to flow!
Great video 👌🏼, 4200 vortec i6 are great motors, change oil every 3000 miles, it's good threw
Love these inline sixes. One of wards ten best engines. More powerful and torquey than the 4.0 in the Jeep.
Generations more advanced of a design. What would you expect. The 4.0 is a great engine that will tun forever. Provided it is taken care of. But it was an old design. The initial production of the design was in 1964 but in concept it is very similiar to any other inline OHV six. Post 2000 there was some preliminary work done on adapting it to 24 valves. Either OHV or a head similiar to the Chrysler 3.5/4.0 V-6. The 3.5 is a little weird. 4 valves per cylinder with two intake lobes and one exhaust.
@@mpetersen6 yes i had a 4.0 litre in a 1993 cherokee 2 door. It had 340,00 k on it when i sold it. Was running perfect as was trans. It seemed bullet proof.
@@TC-hs5wy
Remember when GM was building that Cyclone S-10. Spent a bunch of money taking a specially prepped one out to the Salt Flats and set some records. A year or two later an engineer in Jeep powertrain on his own prepped a Commanche with a 4.0. Turbo etc. Took it to Bonneville and crushed the records that GM set. Pushed that Commanche up to close to 200.
Thank you for showing the coil differences. I had a hunch the coils were similar to ls coils but couldnt tell for sure.
Thanks for this video. I got a chance to pick up a RUNNING 280k mile 04 motor for scrap value. I think i may have to do it. If for nothing but to see how it looks at nearly 300k.
Can you go more in depth on using the stock ecu for boost? Also I want very badly to use this motor for my next drift car build. I know you’re a drag guy but if you (or any one else) had any input on how a 4200 might perform in a drift car, I’d love to hear it. I’ve also been binging all of your 4200 videos, great information and awesome builds!
Doing a drift build is totally doable. As with any drift car, the key is oil control. There is a guy in Sweden that has a really sick Volvo Drift car with a 4200.
Check this out for more information. sites.google.com/view/vortec4200wiki/home
Great Video thanks for putting a lot questions and plenty of arguments to rest.
So early bottom end, retro a 58x reluctor on the crank, 06+ head, and swap the 08+ 4x cam wheel on. got it.
Yep. You will have to attach the 58x wheel to the damper, because the internal trigger wheel is not removable.
@@Calvin-Nelson oh BEANS. I'd want to use a Holley efi as that's what I'm familiar with.
Thanks so much looking to get a 2007 now...WOW lots of improvements !
I cant believe the earlier cranks only have a 7 tooth pattern. No wonder people have a hard time diagnosing misfires on these things.
Your Knowledge is AMAZING!! Thanks for making this video.
Keep up the work, and I'll keep following!
Richard Holdener sent me here.Great to meet your acquaintance. Cool engine.
Thanks bud! Thanks for checking it out too l!
*Have you done a build using all of the premium parts of all the engines with a detailed description of the parts, if not, are you....*
Following
First!!!! I've been sooooo waiting for this. Thank you veeeeeeeery much man! Posting this to all TB Groups.
Thank you for responding to my request. Keep making this engines go BUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRR!!!!!!!
No problem. Thanks for the idea!
Nice piece of education Calvin. A lot of misconception out in the forums where people claim that using a 06 and later cylinder head on a 05 block is a way to increase HP. Clearly none of them actually tried what they claim otherwise they would have discovered the bolt pattern variation.
Great video on the differences between the years, could you do a video on the blocks themselves though? I'm pretty sure they're then same but no one talks about them
They're pretty much the same, but there are some non visible differences, like the sleeves in the later ones are apparently stronger.
On modern engines without rocker arms they are internationally known as "valve cover" but are sometimes referred to as a "cam cover" or "timing cover" if they also cover the timing gear(s) and belt or chain.
Good to know. I'll still screw it up.
@@Calvin-Nelson I just copied and pasted that - I had never even heard of either term before - thanks for the great vids! I'm tooling around in my TB 04 - wondering if some MMO will clog up my oil pan filter since the whole drive train would have to be taken apart if that happens! haha. I used some MMO before and had the classic dirty exhaust smoke clean out. So I guess I got lucky. Also I put in boron Nitride. ... At 267K so far so good - the third valve did not burn out as happens on those engines. haha. thanks again.
Thank you I look forward to turbocharger my 09 trail.blazer just as a daily kinda sleeper. Not trying to run crazy numbers just double maybe so around 500
another great vid thanks, Calvin.
Im swapping 08 4200 in a 91 s10 and this video made me a subscriber
Damn glad i watched this vid im in the process of building an 07 motor and i was wondering what years they was the same as.
holy crap the exhaust ports on the 06 are like 30% larger than the 05
The project I have in mind is taking the atlas and putting it in a z31 300zx frame and making a very fun car out of it
Nice! Do it!!
For the life of me I do not understand why GM gave up on this engine platform. Perhaps limited use is one reason but to be this would have been an ideal base engine in the Chevrolet pickup. Or in commercial vehicles.
In reference to the dyno results versus the 5.3L LS. Maybe the reason the the 4.2 made more power at the same boost level is the cam timing. The bigger cam in the LS with more valve overlap might have been allowing more fuel air mixture to blow thru the cylinder during the overlap period. At the height of piston aero engine development in the 1940s high output aero engines did not have extreme cam profiles. Remember these engines often had two stage, two speed supercharging systems. The second stage was not to provide more boost st lower altitudes but to maintain power output at higher ones.
But I thought that all cams are turbo cams!
In all seriousness. You're probably onto something there. We adjusted the cam timing on the 4.2 and picked up probably 45hp on the last pull.
@@Calvin-Nelson
One does need to remember that automotive and aero engines are different ball games in a lot of ways. Aero engines are not high rpm. But given their overall size and long stroke they reach some pretty impressive peak piston speeds. Plus there is the need to be extremely reliable. The Allison for instance was pushed up to around 65 inches of boost at the squadron level during the war.
With these engines can you do a hot cam swap.
Put 2 intake cams or exhaust cam’s depending on size.
In the KA24de you can put 2 exhaust cams in and it keeps the motor breathing with larger lift at high rpm
No. The cams are different. Exhaust has VVT stuff in the cam, so won't interchange.
After watching this I want to put an 06-08 head and pcm on my 02 envoy. The kids love when I red light race ricers. It sounds pretty nasty through a 40 series flowmaster at 6500 rpm also.
Careful. Headbolts like to snap.
@@Calvin-Nelson duly noted. I assume you're talking about disassembly. I would definitely go back together with new ones. Thanks for the info.
@@jessesims4654 yes. Disassembly.
Do they make better head bolts for the 4.2 that will resist snapping like ARP bolts??
@@kipholder8577 I have found that gen 3 LS head bolts are just about the perfect length and thread. You want the long ones.
The Vortec 4200 head bolts don't snap going together. They snap trying to remove them.
EPIC video! Thanks for the wealth of information!!! How's the height compare to a LS with a truck manifold? Any forged piston or rods out there? ARP head, main, or rod bolts? I'm just starting to research this. I was going to do a LS and a remote mount turbo on my Astro van but this looks like an interesting option. Thanks for helping out Holdener. I'm interested to see his upcoming tests too.
This should answer the majority of your questions. sites.google.com/view/vortec4200wiki/home
@@Calvin-Nelson You rock! Thanks!
What a great site. Well done 👍🏻
*Is the aftermarket getting involved...*
Not really. Not enough demand.
The engine is no longer produced
@@shadowopsairman1583 Neither is a 2JZ and they have plenty of aftermarket.
if only....at keast one can dream
@@shadowopsairman1583
*A 1957 Chevrolet or 69 Camaro isn't either, hence the name "aftermarket"*
I’m surprised atlas 4200 didn’t replace the 4.3 vortec I’m glad they started putting LS parts on it makes things easier
Engine packaging. Same reason Chrysler dropped the 4.0.
@@mpetersen6 but in trucks? That isn’t much of an issue
@@lasthopelost9090
When they redesigned the vehicles using the 4.2 the motor would not fit anymore.
Wow. Such an informative video! Thank you! So is the '02 to '05 the 4.2l/254 and the later engines the 4.2l/256?
Nah. They're all 254s
So it's much like a LS, they all will GO, only you may want a aftermarket ecm, do the later model heads fit the early engin? Great video, I appreciate the knowledge!!
If what you are asking is do the LT heads fit on the LS, then yes the bolt holes line up. They changed the dowel locations, and again you have to come up with a solution for the valve order.
So,I want a 2002 crank,06 up head,06 to 08 ecu,06 up rods and pistons. Also wondering if a 06 up intake cam would improve performance on a pre 06 engine.
You do not want a 2002 crank. They are unique. You want a 2003-2005 crank.
I'm actually in the process of seeing if an 06+ cam will improve my 04 engine.
if im understanding that you just want all the best parts then you want an 06/07 complete truck and swap a 03/05 12 weight crank into your block.
Thank you, thank you verry much.
Why the decrease in power on the last two years of the 4.2's production life?
Possibly emissions or SAE rating requirements. Having driven and worked on all of them, the 08-09 engines are the smoothest, most power etc. in factory form.
Have you ever checked the gaskets with an ls to see if they line up? i aim to build a 16 v v8 using different heads off a 4 cylinder or 6. Cutting is an option. Syclones and Typhoons did it with the v6. Thanks so much for this information, you have saved all of us quite a few headaches with this video!
I have not. Unfortunately, they are a very different bore spacing. LS is 4.400", Atlas is 4.055"
Looks to me I’m glad I got an 06 LT trailblazer
Did any of them get a forged crank? In some of the 3500v6 (non vvt) GM put a forged crank in them, and others got a cast, but they all got the PM rods.
I don't think so.
So friend has an 07 2x2 with bad engine / rod knock till it warms up after short time drive comes back. He got a deal on an 04 4x4 thats clean. Seems the crank and cam teeth count are the same. Only issue maybe the vvt on the cam as they changed 06/up ? If that isn't an issue should work fine since change rails or what minor things over. Don't thing oil pan isissue. Yard was saying they should interchange according to Hollander. Thanks
Yeah. Should interchange. Like you said the VVT is the only question mark.
What about the block itself and the main caps. Also, what does it take to get an 08 block up and running, I mean what aftermarket ECU? MS Squirt?
Awesome video Calvin. Seriously valuable info here. One question. How much does the long block weigh?
A bare long block weighs about 320pounds.
Thank you. That is much lighter than I expected. Some day I will get one and thanks to you will not have to learn the hard way.
Does anyone know if there’s a video about swapping the newer parts to the older engine? I have a 03 trail blazer
yes i need know this as the wiki said a redesign happened thank you ill be using this with manual transmission may want to use in a 4x4 also any suggestions just subscribed .be blessed man
Awesome video! Thank you.
Great video and thanks for all the content. I plan on building one of these in the future for sure! Can you use the older crank in the newer blocks? If so, what is needed to change, upgrade or use to do it?
Thanks. Yes. Only thing you really need to do that is tools. That and I'd get some new main bolts.
Thank you so much for your videos. You are awesome.
Is it possible to put an 06 engine in an 08? If so what needs to change? ECU? and Harness?
I am planning to put the inline 5 or 6 if it works my goals are 400 to 500 hp on a na miata.
That would be nasty dude
My usual tuner cannot flash '06-'07 computers. Any idea why?
To add: These engines are very sensitive to oil change intervals and quality of oil.
IIRC a full dressed engine is roughly 550lbs. About the same as an iron headed SBC. Theyre not light weights.
No idea. I've never tried to flash one, so not sure.
No they are way lighter than that. A bare long block is 320 pounds.
Told my mechanic neighbor about this and he was impressed with the HP potential but says they’re world famous for blowing.
GM sold a lot of them. Chances are some were bound to not be maintained.
More problems with the 4 and 5 cyl versions than the 4200. Most of which were addressed for '07+
Looks like I’m 06 the chamber volume may have been reduced I see in the video on the exhaust side more aluminum in the chamber
They do have higher compression.
Good Stuff!!!
Joining the Vortec 4200 club and going to do a frame swap with a '65 IH pickup. I'm wanting to do some work with the P12 ECU. What software are you using to do your programming. I'm just looking to delete a few sensors that won't be needed for my build and perhaps setup, if possible, a 2 or 3 driving mode system. Thanks for turning me on to this platform. I built a Spit6 back in the day and that was a ripper little I6.
HP tuners is what I would use.
Ouch $500 bucks, looks top of the line though.@@Calvin-Nelson
Really cool video man! Thank you!
This video is great information.
Im thinking about a high rpm build. You spoke of these 4200's revving to 10,200 rpm. What valvetrain and rotating assembly would they be using?
Definitely have to shim the lifters to essentially make then solid. Another hot ticket is to use Ecotech followers. They are stronger, and interchange. Not sure what to recommend on valve springs. I found a set of 2JZ valve springs that will work, I just don't know if it will work at 10,000 RPM. These engines have very bad harmonics at around 6,500 RPM. Guys that are taking them to 10,000 RPM run like 7,000 stall converters. Basically they just get through the bad harmonics as quickly as possible.
I would probably be wise to put cams in it so that it will make power at that RPM. Billet cams are expensive, but you probably can get away with a regrind. In my opinion the stock cams are pretty decent and you can do a lot with them. Not sure if they'll support power at 10,000 rpm.
GREAT INFO" THANX FROM IDAHO!
So cool !
I have a ls trailblazer that sucker has 258,000 miles keeps on ticking !
Really good engines ! Very impressive information!!
My 2002 LS TB is right around that 258,000 range and running great.
@@David-rx5eo just braking in! Ha!!
Thanks for this very informative video
Isn't that an awful lot of compression to be adding a turbo to? We were always told use a low compression motor if you're adding boost
And on the 5th day God created alcohol, and everyone made more power, and it was good.
You can get it from the pump these days. It's pretty sweet
So can the 06 up head and cams be installed on the 05 down block? Or can the 05 down crank go in the 06 up block?
Yes, and yes
@@Calvin-Nelson outstanding. Thank you.
@@Calvin-Nelson so if the later rods and piston fit on the 12 counterweight crank would the rotating assembly be unbalanced or does it not matter?
Also Thanks for all the great information you share. It’s awesome
Hi, I've got a quick question. I have an 05 trailblazer ls 4.2 but I think I've got an 06 engine. I recently had the exhaust manifold replaced. If the shop put on an 05 manifold instead of an 06, would it make a difference. I checked and they are 2 different part numbers. Thanks
It may have a very tiny effect on power, but I doubt it. The 05 manifold has smaller ports and runners on the manifold.
one question I have is, will a 06+ cylinder head work on an 02-05 block?
thanks for showing, now I know why 2006 heads (larger port holes) prior to previous years(smaller port holes).
Could you run an 04 motor in an 07 would the phasers mess up it running correctly
so what's the rod upgrades as knocking 4200 seems everywhere
Great idea, thanks for the video.
I’m assuming you can put a 06+ head onto a 02-05 4200 if you have a complete dressed 06 head setup?
Yes
I have an 07' 4200 that spun a rod bearing, and its too far gone for the crankshaft and rod cap to be machined! I found an 02' 4200 what do i need to do to make it work for my 07'? Can i use the 02' lower( block, crank,) and use the 07' head, oil pan, n timing gears, or will it not work that way?
Thank you for this comparison, any chance you can let me know what the bore spacing or cylinder head stud spacing between the bores?
103mm
Hello budy one question, i saw that you have a lot of experience how can install on these engine a t5 transmmission, is there an adapter for this transmission?? Any idea??
Very informative thank you. My question is in a stock application how difficult is it to use an 06 head on an 03 engine that is in a trailblazer.
Very easy. Bolts on.
I realize this is an older video and apologize if the question is off topic: If you were looking for an Trailblazer/Envoy for an everyday driver am I correct to assume the 06-09 model years are going to be the better way to go? I Better lubrication to the piston, stronger connecting rods( at least at the wrist pin) and I'm guessing with the larger exhaust ports and higher compression ratio better power/efficiency? I'm not a mechanic so I ask dumb questions.
Thanks!!
Yes. It would definitely be better. The piston lubrication is the big thing.
Thank you for responding!!!
What about the built-in pcv valve system maintenance?
Very informative