Hey everyone! The themes in the comments this time are: 1) Why no pickle? Because it isn’t necessary. It serves no purpose between annealings, and cleaning the plates up at the end took less time than a 10 min pickle would, with no rinsing and drying required. I use pickling when needed, but it isn’t here. 2) “Grrrr this is spinning, not roll forming!” Take a deep breath and remember that the world is a big place with lots of people who have different names for things than you do. Nomenclature is less rigorously standardized in this world than you might think. Nobody’s experience is universal, so keep an open mind. 3) “Why not put the torch right on the lathe?” It takes an immense amount of heat to get the copper to annealing temperature. The hearth is critical to the efficiency of this. Doing it in open air, with the mandrel and chuck there as giant heat sinks would not work unless you had a torch so big that you couldn’t survive standing next to it.
My immediate thought was it looked like spinning, and this is the first time I've seen the process called roll-forming, but I love the fact that this beautiful mongrel of a language we share with the world is living and evolving and often has many names because of the sharing and evolution.
One of the side benefits of my nearly two year obsession with home machine shop YT videos is the names for tools that denizens of different countries use! One of my favorites is the UK and Aussie term “Spanner”. For all of my 61 years in the states, they’ve been either open end wrenches or adjustable wrenches, but it’s all the same “piece of kit” (thanks again UK!). Now I’ve got to go sort through my scraps, excuse me, “bits & bobs”! Ha! Too many folks overthink this stuff!
@@tomt9543 an Aussie here. Gotta love a good spanner, unless it's been thrown in the works. But we also have wrenches. Such as a plumbers wrench. We also have sockets, or more formally socket drivers (which I believe Yanks call ratchets).
Don't let anyone mess with your bandsaw, mine came to me in the eighties, and still runs fine, even "rebuilt several times, new bearings, new blade guides" as age demands. I built my engine a decade ago, but never built a boiler, I believe I will build one, just because yours works so well, thanks for sharing!
I don't want to know the make/model but your camera is good enough for a video displayed on a 21" monitor. I'm a woodworker and metalworker wishI'dbe who can't afford it but get a lot of vicarious enjoyment from you. Thanks for your efforts.
Hi Quinn. You machine work is really great. Your solutions to challenges are always interesting. As you mention, not every solution will work for everyone. Your humor is really awesome. Best regards.
Those long aluminum chips can be used as chaff to confuse radars or dropped on power distribution wires to short out the power grid. Just a thought for Quinn's next bombing raid ... over chattertown.
I am not a machinist but I find watching it very satisfying. I am a woodworker and I always hear that the incremental measurement differences are like night and day. I watch several machinists on youtube and I am constantly hearing, "this dimension is not critical" or "this dimension does not matter". I think I'm becoming disillusioned. Is it possible to get to Mars with woodworking dimensions? Dan
Brilliant video. Such a lesson in machining planning and preparation. Unfolded like a game of chess. I'll say it again, this is one of the top education channels on UA-cam. And yes, the yahtsee caused much happiness to break out here.
I have no idea what you are making, but I enjoyed watching you make things! I find on my lathes I get better results with larger carbide tool holders, but they are larger lathes. My Rockwell 14x40 is a dream to run, if you can get your hands on a 5hp lathe you will find that mandrel can be done in minutes. You impress me with your detailed work and quality. You make beautiful things!
Your articulation and diction made this video a great listen, also shows you know what your are talking about. You are the Grace Slick of metal working instructionals.
Well done, very nice job. To answer your question I'd suggest that the actual forming is about equal in time to hammering however there is probably a bit more time invested in the tooling you require for the method you have shown. Its a nice way to do it though judging by your results.
You can replace the fuse socket in those mini lathes with a fuse breaker of the same specs. So when you blow it, it's just a button click and you're back to work!
Obviously, blowing the fuse is a 1 time thing... 2 time thing... 3 time thing... won't happen again. No reason to spend the money on a breaker for something that only happens if I screw up. I won't keep screwing up.
The one thing with breakers, is they are thermo-magnetic, so they will trip due to overload and also trip due to heat build up. If it trips and you reset it and start machining again, the second trip will be at a lower amperage draw than the first. The third less than the second, etc. At some point, you end up having to let it cool down.
@@ardemus It is not a "screw up". It is pushing your machine tool to its limit. A tripping breaker sets the safe limit just as well as a fuse. You just don't need to replace the breaker. Think about it. Now, if you replace the fuse with a .22 bullet, well.....That would be screwing up. Sickle has it right. (I capped the "S", sickle, because I was starting the sentence with "sickle". Great idea. I concur.) :-)
I remember seeing that and I suppose that the brass alloy that they use for that purpose is chosen specifically because it doesn't work harden like pure copper does, because I think I saw them do it all in one operation with no reheating. Maybe a high lead content in the alloy? If so I hope they use a different formulation for the mouthpiece.
Really nice work! Thank you for demoing this technique. I've seen it done before, but your step by step breakdown makes this seem much more possible for a newbie to try. Really appreciate your selective use of different levels of precision, depending on the requirement of the feature.
Thank you for letting me know about annealing during the process. That will sure save me on my next project! The stretching of material also was great info. I did not know it would pull that much!
Hi Quinn. You machine work is really great. Your solutions to challenges are always interesting. As you mention, not every solution will work for everyone. Your humor is really awesome. Best regards.
Hammer forming is faster, Although your fixture allowed multiple operations afterwards and all with greater precision. So, your way is more betterer! :) This was an awesome video, and somewhat mesmerizing. Thankyou!
If you ever need to machine some copper in the future, my research turned up C14500 alloy as specifically designed to make copper as easy to machine as possible, while still retaining over 90% of the original electrical conductivity. Love the channel, I am learning a lot here.
Your most elegant part and process yet. You made it look easy. I know it is not. Years ago I made a spinning tool for a CNC lathe. It was a bearing mounted steel wheel about 4 in diameter and 1/2 inch thick with full rounded corners. Hardened and polished it for good part surface finish. Had to spin a bunch of 6 inch aluminum discs much like your part but not quite a 90 degree bend. Tool required several gradual forming passes but no annealing. Made some scrap and noise at first. Ultimately used to stabilize a cone behind a jet at Mach .8.
Wow, this was amazing. How much problem solving and creative thinking can you fit into a 25 min video? Ask Quinn, she's setting records on the reg... As usual, i learned more in this single video than my brain is capable of processing so now i need to take a nap.
I've hammer formed end caps and the time it took is comparable to this method. However my buck and support plate were just clamped in a vice so it was a bit quicker to get the copper out for annealing. Your method gives a superior finish.
having seen professional roll formed pots and pans made ... I wonder what the proper tools and practice would allow ... faster speed ... better work more precision ...
If you come in from the front, you can make things round without pre-cutting. Like a parting cut through the front of the sheet. That only works as long as you need to go all the way through or can use a parting tool to cut it off.
Kinda wish you did your center-finding of the device with your coaxial indicator, but only because they are super cool :D This is a fun project, it makes me want to try roll forming!
Very nice job! When I did my Lion Tube Plates I'd reckon 20 to 30 minutes each to hammer form depending upon how many anneals, it goes pretty quick once you get some practice and confidence. Less time making a former. But who's counting, it's a hobby, you try things out, you learn and you enjoy it.
This is like metal spinning on a lathe. If you turn up the speed a bit, you can actually do it all in 1 operation by loosening the compound rotation and rotating it as you move in (obviously several passes). You can also avoid drilling holes in the work piece by using a disk to clamp it from the front and back. You can look at metal spinning videos to help understand what I mean. It looks more like wood turning with a skateboard wheel shaped roller on a stick.
Really great work. Inspiring how you can make such a variety of projects on hobby machinery such as this. And the mix of comedic commeNtary is a great addition to the content.
The most interesting video I’ve seen in a long time! Beautiful work! Thanks for tripling the amount of work involved by taking us along! Looking forward to the next one!
Hi Quinn. I have been aggravated by this fuse problem on my Mini-lathe for , I think 20 years. Then I decided I had supported the fuse manufacturer long enough and I installed a circuit breaker instead of the fuse. End of problem. You just need to pick the correct type and rate for your circumstances.
I just found your channel, and so far I'm loving every single video of yours I've watched and I've learned quite a bit! As a thank you, one trick I have learned when working with copper is that you can generally use a spring loaded punch a few times to get a part fixtured for brazing. Also, I haven't seen any video of you actually brazing so forgive me if I'm off on this one, but I would strongly recommend picking up an oxy-acetylene torch for doing silver solder brazing, it will greatly reduce the amount of time needed to heat parts and also reduce the total amount of heat you put into a part. It also works out to be a lot cheaper to use O/A or even air/acetylene than a mapp gas torch, mapp starts getting expensive fast with how long you need to run the torch compared to acetylene
Hi Quinn, You can remove the oxide from copper using a mixture of salt and vinegar. Just soak the blackened copper and the oxide will scrub off easily with a Scotchbrite pad. Sulphuric acid is better but the salt/vinegar is safer. Regards, Preso.
Liked and subscribed! Ran into this by accident. I watched a video where this old Tony made some attempts at roll forming. You do AMAZING work along with excellent narration and humor. Keep up the great work!!
I've used spun tanks a lot in liquid rockets, in aluminum and stainless. Really interesting to see it done at the home shop scale! I've wondered about doing it to make copper liners for small rocket engines and this increases my confidence that it could actually work without being too big of a hassle.
I think I recall Adam using that technique. Works great! Works a treat (?). Who even says that? Must be the English. Wait, I'M ENGLISH!! (Twilight Zone Theme). :-0 You are awesome, Quinn!!
Hey everyone! The themes in the comments this time are:
1) Why no pickle? Because it isn’t necessary. It serves no purpose between annealings, and cleaning the plates up at the end took less time than a 10 min pickle would, with no rinsing and drying required. I use pickling when needed, but it isn’t here.
2) “Grrrr this is spinning, not roll forming!” Take a deep breath and remember that the world is a big place with lots of people who have different names for things than you do. Nomenclature is less rigorously standardized in this world than you might think. Nobody’s experience is universal, so keep an open mind.
3) “Why not put the torch right on the lathe?” It takes an immense amount of heat to get the copper to annealing temperature. The hearth is critical to the efficiency of this. Doing it in open air, with the mandrel and chuck there as giant heat sinks would not work unless you had a torch so big that you couldn’t survive standing next to it.
My immediate thought was it looked like spinning, and this is the first time I've seen the process called roll-forming, but I love the fact that this beautiful mongrel of a language we share with the world is living and evolving and often has many names because of the sharing and evolution.
One of the side benefits of my nearly two year obsession with home machine shop YT videos is the names for tools that denizens of different countries use! One of my favorites is the UK and Aussie term “Spanner”. For all of my 61 years in the states, they’ve been either open end wrenches or adjustable wrenches, but it’s all the same “piece of kit” (thanks again UK!). Now I’ve got to go sort through my scraps, excuse me, “bits & bobs”! Ha! Too many folks overthink this stuff!
@@tomt9543 an Aussie here. Gotta love a good spanner, unless it's been thrown in the works.
But we also have wrenches. Such as a plumbers wrench.
We also have sockets, or more formally socket drivers (which I believe Yanks call ratchets).
@@35manning Or as doubleboost says “Bastad ratchet!” Ha! At the end of the day, we’re all in this together, right? It’s all about the journey!
Just like dividers or straight calipers, they still have a couple of pointy bits and measure and scribe things. Great work on the roll forming.
Top marks for safety and demonstrating safety, no messing about here.
Don't let anyone mess with your bandsaw, mine came to me in the eighties, and still runs fine, even "rebuilt several times, new bearings, new blade guides" as age demands. I built my engine a decade ago, but never built a boiler, I believe I will build one, just because yours works so well, thanks for sharing!
I always have to watch a new Blondihacks video, as is tradition :)
Well done, uh, internet!! ;-)
As one of the maligned workers in cellulose in a lignin matrix, I find myself fascinated and educated by your approach. Thanks.
hers wont work without yours ... charcoal works as well to make steam ;)
I don't want to know the make/model but your camera is good enough for a video displayed on a 21" monitor. I'm a woodworker and metalworker wishI'dbe who can't afford it but get a lot of vicarious enjoyment from you. Thanks for your efforts.
It is a real pleasure to watch your videos. Thanks
Not only are your machinist skills top shelf but also are your editing and voice over skills. I wish more Tubers would do the same.
brilliant video and no awful music in the background which is always too loud.
Hi Quinn. You machine work is really great. Your solutions to challenges are always interesting. As you mention, not every solution will work for everyone. Your humor is really awesome. Best regards.
You are very good at explaining what you are doing and why in a consise way.
This worked out much better then that Roll Forming that This Old Tony did a while back :)
Calling the poor guy out, I see.
@@mathewritchie sounds likely. That’s something the best sorts would do. :)
Thank you for saving me the hassle of making the same comment :)
The difference was the annealing
Isn't THAT the truth!
How have I never seen this channel? THis is excellent!
Quintessential knowlege for the machinist. Great video.!!!
I really enjoyed watching your video. You explain what you are doing and that makes it very interesting. Thanx
Geez, you're good! Your voiceover instructional content is outstanding!
Those long aluminum chips can be used as chaff to confuse radars or dropped on power distribution wires to short out the power grid. Just a thought for Quinn's next bombing raid ... over chattertown.
I heard that if you put them under your hubcaps, you'll be invisible to police radar!
@@DavidKutzler Negatory Ghost Rider
Throw them out the window when you speed past a speed camera 😉😂
Place them long chips in your marital bed. You partner will be amazed! :-)
I am not a machinist but I find watching it very satisfying. I am a woodworker and I always hear that the incremental measurement differences are like night and day. I watch several machinists on youtube and I am constantly hearing, "this dimension is not critical" or "this dimension does not matter". I think I'm becoming disillusioned. Is it possible to get to Mars with woodworking dimensions? Dan
First time I found your videos. I learned a thing or two. So cool. I had to subscribe right away.
Glad to see in the last video of this series, you incorporated picking.
I always pickle when silver soldering. It isn’t necessary when forming.
content-free comment to boost engagement numbers for my favorite channels.
Brilliant video. Such a lesson in machining planning and preparation. Unfolded like a game of chess. I'll say it again, this is one of the top education channels on UA-cam. And yes, the yahtsee caused much happiness to break out here.
Nice trick with that radiused cutter to turn the edge. Really nice finish.
I have no idea what you are making, but I enjoyed watching you make things! I find on my lathes I get better results with larger carbide tool holders, but they are larger lathes. My Rockwell 14x40 is a dream to run, if you can get your hands on a 5hp lathe you will find that mandrel can be done in minutes. You impress me with your detailed work and quality. You make beautiful things!
Miniature boiler.. Now you've got my attention.
Congratulations from Brazil. PARABÉNS!!! GREAT WORK!!!
👏👏👏👏👏👏
Those turned out great! Pun intended.
I'm struggling to FORM an opinion.....😋
Your articulation and diction made this video a great listen, also shows you know what your are talking about. You are the Grace Slick of metal working instructionals.
When you think Quinn has reached the max level of awesomeness, she comes out with a more awesome video. Thanks for sharing your journeys!!
I literally was scanning the comments to find out if Quinn is male or female. Thanks!
@@yeeeehaaawbuddy Quinn is male, but she is trans, I believe.
Stunning, just stunning! Those plates are beautiful. Really enjoying this boiler build series.
Oh my goodness that final assembly made me unreasonably happy, it is so nice!!!!
This is definitely one of my favorite videos of yours!
After a long day of hobby machining, I find myself unwinding by watching... more machining? No complaints though 😂
Loving the zen moments of your voice and machining
I made heat exchangers for 20 years. I am glad to have found your channel.
A good example of setup and planning/prep being 80% of machining. Love the videos.
“when I want to generate negative comm… ahh engagement“ 😂
I always feel this disappointment when the video ends, I want more!
I think they call this addiction
@@VoidedWarranty and the comment section is therapy :)
Well done, very nice job. To answer your question I'd suggest that the actual forming is about equal in time to hammering however there is probably a bit more time invested in the tooling you require for the method you have shown. Its a nice way to do it though judging by your results.
Thank you! Love your channel. 😁
@@Blondihacks Thanks, If only I could manage to post as regularly as you do!
You can replace the fuse socket in those mini lathes with a fuse breaker of the same specs. So when you blow it, it's just a button click and you're back to work!
Obviously, blowing the fuse is a 1 time thing... 2 time thing... 3 time thing... won't happen again. No reason to spend the money on a breaker for something that only happens if I screw up. I won't keep screwing up.
I did that on my bench top mill. It provides me with confidence that I won't be dead in the water if I blow a fuse in the middle if the night.
Yes, that's a great idea!
The one thing with breakers, is they are thermo-magnetic, so they will trip due to overload and also trip due to heat build up. If it trips and you reset it and start machining again, the second trip will be at a lower amperage draw than the first. The third less than the second, etc. At some point, you end up having to let it cool down.
@@ardemus It is not a "screw up". It is pushing your machine tool to its limit. A tripping breaker sets the safe limit just as well as a fuse. You just don't need to replace the breaker. Think about it. Now, if you replace the fuse with a .22 bullet, well.....That would be screwing up. Sickle has it right. (I capped the "S", sickle, because I was starting the sentence with "sickle". Great idea. I concur.) :-)
Great video Quinn. I enjoy your sense of humor and showing the bloopers, too. We all make 'em - or you're not making much, eh?
How have I not seen your videos before, your banter is fantastic (and so is the rest of the content)!
All this marking out in a copper-like material is giving me real Clickspring vibes.
Enjoyed…great discussion/demonstration/build
I have to say this is easily one of my most favourite channels! You produce fantastic videos and instruction!
Very nice video. I saw this roll forming before. Its how bells for brass instruments are made. (Trumpets etc).
I remember seeing that and I suppose that the brass alloy that they use for that purpose is chosen specifically because it doesn't work harden like pure copper does, because I think I saw them do it all in one operation with no reheating. Maybe a high lead content in the alloy? If so I hope they use a different formulation for the mouthpiece.
_Anything sheet metal with compound curvature is an absolute delight!_ 😃
Really nice work! Thank you for demoing this technique. I've seen it done before, but your step by step breakdown makes this seem much more possible for a newbie to try. Really appreciate your selective use of different levels of precision, depending on the requirement of the feature.
What a beautiful job
You are indeed "The Mighty Quinn" ! Nicely done.
hello from venezuela nice step by step explanation machining job👍
Looks like someone knows exactly what they are doing 👍
The threaded studs idea was a charm.
Bloody hell. I'm in awe ...
Enjoyed the video.... Good Job.
Russ
Thank you for letting me know about annealing during the process. That will sure save me on my next project! The stretching of material also was great info. I did not know it would pull that much!
Hi Quinn. You machine work is really great. Your solutions to challenges are always interesting. As you mention, not every solution will work for everyone. Your humor is really awesome. Best regards.
Really cool project. Thanks for the great vid.
Quinn busting out the quarter round endmill to use as a form tool:
“I’m going to do what’s called a pro-gamer move”
Woo! 100k subs!
THANK YOU for mentioning that annealing copper can be done with either quench or air cooling. Have had to step in to way too many arguments over this.
Hammer forming is faster, Although your fixture allowed multiple operations afterwards and all with greater precision. So, your way is more betterer! :) This was an awesome video, and somewhat mesmerizing. Thankyou!
If you ever need to machine some copper in the future, my research turned up C14500 alloy as specifically designed to make copper as easy to machine as possible, while still retaining over 90% of the original electrical conductivity. Love the channel, I am learning a lot here.
The free machining coppers are super expensive though, even for copper
Very nice work. Tutorial on your channel is great. Thanks.
You taught this old dog a few tricks about copper forming and that I’ve been told is a very difficult task for anyone to achieve.
That facing was perfection!!
Your most elegant part and process yet. You made it look easy. I know it is not.
Years ago I made a spinning tool for a CNC lathe. It was a bearing mounted steel wheel about 4 in diameter and 1/2 inch thick with full rounded corners. Hardened and polished it for good part surface finish. Had to spin a bunch of 6 inch aluminum discs much like your part but not quite a 90 degree bend. Tool required several gradual forming passes but no annealing. Made some scrap and noise at first. Ultimately used to stabilize a cone behind a jet at Mach .8.
Wow, this was amazing. How much problem solving and creative thinking can you fit into a 25 min video? Ask Quinn, she's setting records on the reg... As usual, i learned more in this single video than my brain is capable of processing so now i need to take a nap.
Quinn you do such nice work ( and you have the patience of a saint )
I’m a metal fabricator not a machinist. I love your videos, keep it up.
I've hammer formed end caps and the time it took is comparable to this method. However my buck and support plate were just clamped in a vice so it was a bit quicker to get the copper out for annealing. Your method gives a superior finish.
having seen professional roll formed pots and pans made ... I wonder what the proper tools and practice would allow ... faster speed ... better work more precision ...
As always a fantastic job.
Quinn thanks, that was a Masterclass.
Learned hammer forming in High School Air Frame shop class using aluminum alloy.
Nicely done.
I'm always fascinated by machining copper. It seems so buttery and also sticky, and yet after being all cleaned up it looks really cool. Thanks!
Very informative video and cool to watch.
If you come in from the front, you can make things round without pre-cutting. Like a parting cut through the front of the sheet. That only works as long as you need to go all the way through or can use a parting tool to cut it off.
I did a whole video on trepanning, in fact. I would never attempt it on copper, though
"ahhh, crapnuts" - spoken like a true machinest.
Kinda wish you did your center-finding of the device with your coaxial indicator, but only because they are super cool :D This is a fun project, it makes me want to try roll forming!
when softening the copper, just put a couple lines on it with black marker - when the heat makes the lines go away, temp is perfect :)
Man what a tidy job you made of that! Just gorgeous! Thanks for sharing this.
Very nice work.
As soon as I heard "as is tradition", I paused the video and pushed the Like button. Somehow I forgot to do it right away when starting it...
Very nice job! When I did my Lion Tube Plates I'd reckon 20 to 30 minutes each to hammer form depending upon how many anneals, it goes pretty quick once you get some practice and confidence. Less time making a former. But who's counting, it's a hobby, you try things out, you learn and you enjoy it.
This is like metal spinning on a lathe. If you turn up the speed a bit, you can actually do it all in 1 operation by loosening the compound rotation and rotating it as you move in (obviously several passes). You can also avoid drilling holes in the work piece by using a disk to clamp it from the front and back. You can look at metal spinning videos to help understand what I mean. It looks more like wood turning with a skateboard wheel shaped roller on a stick.
Really great work. Inspiring how you can make such a variety of projects on hobby machinery such as this. And the mix of comedic commeNtary is a great addition to the content.
You did a great job on the boiler. One of the few videos I have seen on roll forming.
The most interesting video I’ve seen in a long time! Beautiful work! Thanks for tripling the amount of work involved by taking us along! Looking forward to the next one!
Hi Quinn. I have been aggravated by this fuse problem on my Mini-lathe for , I think 20 years. Then I decided I had supported the fuse manufacturer long enough and I installed a circuit breaker instead of the fuse. End of problem. You just need to pick the correct type and rate for your circumstances.
Damn, you never fail to impress the crap out of me.
Nice work
I just found your channel, and so far I'm loving every single video of yours I've watched and I've learned quite a bit! As a thank you, one trick I have learned when working with copper is that you can generally use a spring loaded punch a few times to get a part fixtured for brazing. Also, I haven't seen any video of you actually brazing so forgive me if I'm off on this one, but I would strongly recommend picking up an oxy-acetylene torch for doing silver solder brazing, it will greatly reduce the amount of time needed to heat parts and also reduce the total amount of heat you put into a part.
It also works out to be a lot cheaper to use O/A or even air/acetylene than a mapp gas torch, mapp starts getting expensive fast with how long you need to run the torch compared to acetylene
Hi Quinn,
You can remove the oxide from copper using a mixture of salt and vinegar. Just soak the blackened copper and the oxide will scrub off easily with a Scotchbrite pad. Sulphuric acid is better but the salt/vinegar is safer.
Regards,
Preso.
I use citric acid.
Wow that is looking great! Thanks for the tip on leveling the corner rounding em in the lathe. Almost always learn something new here!
Your getting a beautiful finish with that insert.
That’s impressive. I just learned a ton of valuable information. Thanks
So many things to like and only one like button..
Liked and subscribed! Ran into this by accident. I watched a video where this old Tony made some attempts at roll forming. You do AMAZING work along with excellent narration and humor. Keep up the great work!!
Thanks for the video.
Wow, very impressive! Enjoyed watching and listening to your commentary.
I've used spun tanks a lot in liquid rockets, in aluminum and stainless. Really interesting to see it done at the home shop scale! I've wondered about doing it to make copper liners for small rocket engines and this increases my confidence that it could actually work without being too big of a hassle.
I think I recall Adam using that technique. Works great! Works a treat (?). Who even says that? Must be the English. Wait, I'M ENGLISH!! (Twilight Zone Theme). :-0
You are awesome, Quinn!!