I understand where the WHM in Copperbell is coming from. No oGCD heals, no Holy, and no Regen makes the tank taking one or two well-timed crits and dying during big pulls is something I was afraid of for the longest time, even after I'd leveled past ARR.
I've been in only 80 instances lately as whm, for example nier to farm glam and the brain fritz when I got down synced to 34 for longstop was rough. Better to heal too much than not enough at low levels
@drake713 oh definitely, it is always better to heal too much than not enough. My observations about healers being a bit extra on the heals is more an observation and a tip, rather than meant as a complaint! 😅 Low enough levels you could even argue that if you spam healing enables the tank to pull a bit more aggressively, then the tank gets more aoe damage, and healers just don't have any aoe anyway when you go low enough! 😂
@NatiiixLP in most other FF games, DRK is the "liftsteal" job, stealing the blood/energy of others to sustain itself. This time they gave the lifestyle to WAR instead
@@phoenixpandemic Well, I haven't played another FF beside XIV in the past 20 years or so, so... Makes more sense for WAR to me, though. Even in WoW, it's kinda like that. With DRK being more like WoW's Demon Hunter. I suppose both of them have that character design, just with different lore reasons. DRK is the edgelord from before RPR was added, while WAR is just "axe go swoosh-swoosh" and "let's drink the blood of our enemies".
3:50 "circle followed by a donut". yep, that is what i thought first time i did this one and jumped in the hole right after it was created xD but yes i fully agree on the weirdly shaped arenas part! even though this one killed me :p it is nice to see something other then circle or rectangle to fight on!
Heck, even floor restrictions like O9 (Chaos) or even The Dark Lord in Jeuno: The First Walk make for more interesting dodging situations. Though it is funny how both generic dark overlords do shape the field from a square to slightly more unique shapes.
It makes you wonder if the tank is a refugee from another mmo or just a returner from the older days where stance dancing actually mattered for damage. Regardless, mf was in the most recent expert dungeon and would have had to do the entire expansion to realize that stance is set it and forget it.
@drake713 this is correct! I actually talk about this in a video from a bit back: ua-cam.com/video/2EwnmsHIamI/v-deo.htmlsi=BmrDLD6uCn9ryGzs The short version being that all tanks had a tank stance making them take and do less damage but generate more enmity. And a damage stance that... Basically made them do more damage. In the case of drk, they just turned off the tank stance for the same result 😅 All other jobs in turn had abilities to reduce their enmity generation!
@14:37 this just goes to show you that progression can vary wildly at all levels. It's important to remember that as a Mentor who takes their role seriously and has practiced, and more specifically you who has a UA-cam channel with extensive guides on every job in the game across several expansions, you are the top 1% of players. Even with just the former you'd still be in the top 5% of players. Most people who play this game are playing with the mindset of just getting through the day, enjoying some dungeons, finding challenge for the skill level they're at, and most often find critique like this to be more nitpicky than anything. That's not to say you shouldn't be making these critiques, as for the few of us who are looking at that stuff find value, improvement and progress is really valuable. But I think it unintentionally sets expectations for the broader community to be better when the majority of them don't care too much about it. More like the attitude towards players, and the people who watch these videos take that as a justification to treat people who aren't playing as well poorly? Or just kick them from the group for not playing optimally. Which happens more often than people think(though still not that often).
I do agree.😊 The thing is, I hope and pray that the fact that I approach most of these situations in a relatively balanced manner, gives enough of an indication that it is simply an observation, and not a justification for discrimination or anything like that. That's also why I emphasized my observation that it felt like they were terrified of failure rather than suggesting they are "bad" for playing that way. I also know others have mentioned getting synced down to 50 as whm and having zero ogcds can be scary!
Vengeance/Damnation actually DOES work on magic auto attacks, or at least where I've used it in M4S during Electrope Edge 1 to avoid needing any healing, normally I was using Bloodwhetting there but I mixed it up because I don't need the 40% for more than enough time for it to come off of cd and she autos all through that segment until she casts the cleave. The retaliation damage even crit once hilariously enough.
@@CaetsuChaijiCh Actually, this needs to be tested further, I realized on reclear that it's likely just my auto attack timing that made me think there were multiple hits in. Makes it something worth testing though when I get the chance.
You may have come to this conclusion already @noyou6212 but I'm pretty certain Vengeance's effect doesn't work on magic damage at all . The tooltip says "delivers an attack with a potency of 55 every time you suffer physical damage", and the good folks on the Balance warrior forums also mentioned when I asked a while back if it would work on the autos in the first Dawntrail extreme (which are also magic). (It does work in the other fights, it's good during Mouser, and of course you get a lot of value out of it in M3S as well - even if you invuln the tankbuster you can put Damnation up for the free damage unless you needed it for something else.)
The duty 3 situation sounds crazy. If that ACTUALLY happened how they described it I feel like it's the easiest report in the world? Actively griefing your partners despite knowing what you're doing is wrong and being toxic about it sounds 100% bannable?
Considering it sounds like there's evidence in the chat log, I think they could absolutely report for that yes. 🤔 Not that the chat log evidence is needed, but it is sometimes what makes the decisive evidence between a player that is legitimately not knowing what to do, and one who is actually being a jerk deliberately!
Back in days, you needed even one dps to take turn on spiny as it took longer to kill the ads. But those were times of tank stances, would be difficult today.
Could also be that that healer in Duty 9 bought leveling skip in DT so is 90 and is doing the relic for glam. I have a friend I often play with who absolutely refuses to play healer but wants everything leveled and bought the skips in EW and leveled them to 90 with PVP XD So you absolutely can have a job on max and have no idea what to do with it
For the pokemon types, i'd say ground/fighting with rock and fire coverage. Mostly because rock/fighting, while a solid offensive typing, is TERRIBLE defensively. (weaknesses to water, ground, steel, psychic, and fairy: four of the worst types to be weak to for a bulky mon) Ground/fire is definitely better (x4 weak to water and x2 to ground) but ground/fighting is currently the type of one the cornerstones of gen 9 singles (and i think warriors would have a lot of Great Tusk's other pluses)
I honestly don't get why some people insist on splitting the adds during a8n, I know one in the second set (swindler i think?) is supposed to get a buff if its near the others so logically pulling them to the corners or cardinals would make sense... if it literally ever mattered, the much more common occurrence in my experience is that a new tank gets popped like a balloon by double blaster because nobody stacks with them and they don't mitigate enough (or at all) and the other tank is across the entire room and cant easily take the add and if you don't get the tank back up before swindler spawns then it doesn't matter anyway since one tank has to take them both at least to start with. Meanwhile if you just stack them then its super easy for the second tank to step in and split the stack making it easily survivable even without proper mitigation from either tank making it effectively just rocket punch 2. Not to say splitting them is wrong (it is probably the dev intended solution after all) it just seems like the more awkward way to do it with ho hard we out-stat it these days.
Personally I split them because I can never remember if they need to be split or not! And if you stack them when they need to be split, it can often be a disaster! But good to know they can be stacked! 😁
Duty 3: I may or may not have had successful uses of gap closers when most of the arena is gone against the third boss. I'm sure you know what I mean. Bonus points when it happens right before the tank buster and I am the tank. I think I need to start recording all my dumb deaths and someday submit a compilation for clip review or something.
Haha, I also have to be careful to not be too trigger happy with the gap closer in that phase, it really is baiting you to do it with how much you have to run around! 🤣
@@CaetsuChaijiCh Weird thing is, I was more or less right next to the boss. Must've hit a bad angle or something that pulled me into the pit. Wouldn't use it from far away. That would be a dumb death as well, but very much expected. Although I'm still a bit salty that our Scion friends can teleport across gaps and we can't. Actually didn't pay attention if they do it here or not when I did it in duty support, which is what I always do the first time for the additional dialogue.
Awkward levels is a good topic. I'm only level 50-80 on my jobs because I haven't been playing for very long, and I'm a healer main but here are my 2 cents; 30-34 for whm because regen is so good, any level for ast before they have their cards - at those levels they have like 3 skills but are so good because their super strong ogcd is available at like level 12. Pld feels very awkward in 4x because stone vigil is inflated difficulty with monsters critting so much and they do not have anything to survive with, i.e. war got heals and invuln already. Drg feels so awkward at level 50 because their squad buff is level 52 and their only aoe is a skimpy little thing when the ogcd aoe is on a really long cooldown
You got to wonder why people play tank when they don't want to manage aggro even slightly. I'm also now realizing how good SCH has it at low levels since fairy healing leaves so much room for DPS. At least it ends quickly then?
My best guess is that, that tank was a bit drunk on power and just wanted to be inconvenient because they "have the power", which is a weird thing to run into. But I do very much agree that it is weird when people play tanks and don't even want to tank anything 😂
Oof, I can relate to wondering how incomprehensibly bad players can even get to the later parts of the game. Yesterday I was doing Mentor Roulette in The Skydeep Cenote as a 7m replacement and had a WAR who was using AOE rotation on single target because “2 spells vs 3 to get to the buff faster”, a RPR who was only using single target and refreshing debuff every other GCD, and a BLM who only casted HF2 and HB2, alternating. And only when they felt like it, they were still dropping Enochian because they were standing there for over 15 seconds. Of course both the dps kept dying to the final boss, and when everyone but me got punched off, both the DPS returned to the start instead of waiting for the raise so we had to wall or else it would take even longer. I tried to give advice but they just weren’t saying anything. It took 50 minutes in total to clear that. Still traumatized.
I wouldn't blame you for not rezzing them because "My Holy does more damage than you". Probably not even a meme with these two DPS. Not that they wanted to be rezzed, seeing how they left instantly when they died.
You know, out of that nightmare composition, I can see the logic in the aoe for buff faster argument. The only reason you and I think "that's dumb" is because we know it is more damage overall to not do that! 😅 Yikes for the rest though! Fifty minutes 😰
Is it sad that I want the days of enmity management and positionals and actual complicated AST back? TP can stay gone because dashing is so fundamental.
I understand where the WHM in Copperbell is coming from. No oGCD heals, no Holy, and no Regen makes the tank taking one or two well-timed crits and dying during big pulls is something I was afraid of for the longest time, even after I'd leveled past ARR.
Very true! In a weird way, white mage at super low level is a lot harder just because of having no backup plan!
I've been in only 80 instances lately as whm, for example nier to farm glam and the brain fritz when I got down synced to 34 for longstop was rough. Better to heal too much than not enough at low levels
@drake713 oh definitely, it is always better to heal too much than not enough. My observations about healers being a bit extra on the heals is more an observation and a tip, rather than meant as a complaint! 😅
Low enough levels you could even argue that if you spam healing enables the tank to pull a bit more aggressively, then the tank gets more aoe damage, and healers just don't have any aoe anyway when you go low enough! 😂
Low level white is hell. If I'm going to do 16-59 dungeons for some reason, I go sch
I LOVE these videos, idk why, they're so soothing. I want to be the kind of mentor you are, patient and a good teacher.
Thank you so much! I'm glad to hear that! 😄
WAR being able to solo, or at least carry, most duties is probably the most lore-accurate gameplay, perfectly matching the job fantasy.
Its more thematic for Dark Knight imo
@@v8046 Is it? I always think of DRK as "in the grave", whereas WAR has the "too angry to die" vibes going.
@NatiiixLP in most other FF games, DRK is the "liftsteal" job, stealing the blood/energy of others to sustain itself. This time they gave the lifestyle to WAR instead
@@phoenixpandemic Well, I haven't played another FF beside XIV in the past 20 years or so, so... Makes more sense for WAR to me, though. Even in WoW, it's kinda like that. With DRK being more like WoW's Demon Hunter. I suppose both of them have that character design, just with different lore reasons. DRK is the edgelord from before RPR was added, while WAR is just "axe go swoosh-swoosh" and "let's drink the blood of our enemies".
3:50 "circle followed by a donut". yep, that is what i thought first time i did this one and jumped in the hole right after it was created xD
but yes i fully agree on the weirdly shaped arenas part! even though this one killed me :p it is nice to see something other then circle or rectangle to fight on!
Next time we will be better prepared for it! 😁
Heck, even floor restrictions like O9 (Chaos) or even The Dark Lord in Jeuno: The First Walk make for more interesting dodging situations. Though it is funny how both generic dark overlords do shape the field from a square to slightly more unique shapes.
"yumi thats in front" made me laugh xD
It makes you wonder if the tank is a refugee from another mmo or just a returner from the older days where stance dancing actually mattered for damage. Regardless, mf was in the most recent expert dungeon and would have had to do the entire expansion to realize that stance is set it and forget it.
Indeed, it just seems unlikely they had a good reason to be doing what they did! 😅
8:22 with both MCH actively trying to kill themselves with reflect damage all throughout the duty, I can see why someone might have left
That is well spotted. Yikes I didn't even notice! 😰 Amazing the healers managed at all!
15:30 always remember, 2 arms = stack. 1 arm = tankbuster
14:45 When i see a lvl 90 that looks like it is playing the job for the first time i usually assume it was someone who bought a level skip
Good Lord I applaud those DPS in field station for putting up with that BS. Surprised they didn’t try to vote the tank out earlier.
Yeah I was thinking the same. I also wonder how they got that far with the group as it were! 😂
In the distant past I heard tank stance made you deal less damage, and squadron shoes dps with skills to lower enmity 😆
@drake713 this is correct! I actually talk about this in a video from a bit back: ua-cam.com/video/2EwnmsHIamI/v-deo.htmlsi=BmrDLD6uCn9ryGzs
The short version being that all tanks had a tank stance making them take and do less damage but generate more enmity. And a damage stance that... Basically made them do more damage. In the case of drk, they just turned off the tank stance for the same result 😅
All other jobs in turn had abilities to reduce their enmity generation!
@14:37 this just goes to show you that progression can vary wildly at all levels. It's important to remember that as a Mentor who takes their role seriously and has practiced, and more specifically you who has a UA-cam channel with extensive guides on every job in the game across several expansions, you are the top 1% of players. Even with just the former you'd still be in the top 5% of players.
Most people who play this game are playing with the mindset of just getting through the day, enjoying some dungeons, finding challenge for the skill level they're at, and most often find critique like this to be more nitpicky than anything. That's not to say you shouldn't be making these critiques, as for the few of us who are looking at that stuff find value, improvement and progress is really valuable.
But I think it unintentionally sets expectations for the broader community to be better when the majority of them don't care too much about it. More like the attitude towards players, and the people who watch these videos take that as a justification to treat people who aren't playing as well poorly? Or just kick them from the group for not playing optimally. Which happens more often than people think(though still not that often).
I do agree.😊
The thing is, I hope and pray that the fact that I approach most of these situations in a relatively balanced manner, gives enough of an indication that it is simply an observation, and not a justification for discrimination or anything like that.
That's also why I emphasized my observation that it felt like they were terrified of failure rather than suggesting they are "bad" for playing that way. I also know others have mentioned getting synced down to 50 as whm and having zero ogcds can be scary!
Oh boy... duties in a Cae video I haven't seen. Pretty sure this is the first time! I should really get around to playing that 7.1 dungeon lol
It is a very interesting dungeon so I am sure you would enjoy it!
Vengeance/Damnation actually DOES work on magic auto attacks, or at least where I've used it in M4S during Electrope Edge 1 to avoid needing any healing, normally I was using Bloodwhetting there but I mixed it up because I don't need the 40% for more than enough time for it to come off of cd and she autos all through that segment until she casts the cleave. The retaliation damage even crit once hilariously enough.
Oh that is good to know! Thank you! 😄
@@CaetsuChaijiCh Actually, this needs to be tested further, I realized on reclear that it's likely just my auto attack timing that made me think there were multiple hits in. Makes it something worth testing though when I get the chance.
You may have come to this conclusion already @noyou6212 but I'm pretty certain Vengeance's effect doesn't work on magic damage at all . The tooltip says "delivers an attack with a potency of 55 every time you suffer physical damage", and the good folks on the Balance warrior forums also mentioned when I asked a while back if it would work on the autos in the first Dawntrail extreme (which are also magic).
(It does work in the other fights, it's good during Mouser, and of course you get a lot of value out of it in M3S as well - even if you invuln the tankbuster you can put Damnation up for the free damage unless you needed it for something else.)
The duty 3 situation sounds crazy.
If that ACTUALLY happened how they described it I feel like it's the easiest report in the world? Actively griefing your partners despite knowing what you're doing is wrong and being toxic about it sounds 100% bannable?
Considering it sounds like there's evidence in the chat log, I think they could absolutely report for that yes. 🤔
Not that the chat log evidence is needed, but it is sometimes what makes the decisive evidence between a player that is legitimately not knowing what to do, and one who is actually being a jerk deliberately!
Back in days, you needed even one dps to take turn on spiny as it took longer to kill the ads.
But those were times of tank stances, would be difficult today.
omg fascinating ty for sharing
Could also be that that healer in Duty 9 bought leveling skip in DT so is 90 and is doing the relic for glam.
I have a friend I often play with who absolutely refuses to play healer but wants everything leveled and bought the skips in EW and leveled them to 90 with PVP XD
So you absolutely can have a job on max and have no idea what to do with it
Absolutely a possibility! It still seems a bit strange when you see them though! 😁
For the pokemon types, i'd say ground/fighting with rock and fire coverage.
Mostly because rock/fighting, while a solid offensive typing, is TERRIBLE defensively. (weaknesses to water, ground, steel, psychic, and fairy: four of the worst types to be weak to for a bulky mon)
Ground/fire is definitely better (x4 weak to water and x2 to ground) but ground/fighting is currently the type of one the cornerstones of gen 9 singles (and i think warriors would have a lot of Great Tusk's other pluses)
You know the comparison to great tusk works very well! 😁
I honestly don't get why some people insist on splitting the adds during a8n, I know one in the second set (swindler i think?) is supposed to get a buff if its near the others so logically pulling them to the corners or cardinals would make sense... if it literally ever mattered, the much more common occurrence in my experience is that a new tank gets popped like a balloon by double blaster because nobody stacks with them and they don't mitigate enough (or at all) and the other tank is across the entire room and cant easily take the add and if you don't get the tank back up before swindler spawns then it doesn't matter anyway since one tank has to take them both at least to start with. Meanwhile if you just stack them then its super easy for the second tank to step in and split the stack making it easily survivable even without proper mitigation from either tank making it effectively just rocket punch 2. Not to say splitting them is wrong (it is probably the dev intended solution after all) it just seems like the more awkward way to do it with ho hard we out-stat it these days.
Personally I split them because I can never remember if they need to be split or not! And if you stack them when they need to be split, it can often be a disaster! But good to know they can be stacked! 😁
Duty 3: I may or may not have had successful uses of gap closers when most of the arena is gone against the third boss. I'm sure you know what I mean. Bonus points when it happens right before the tank buster and I am the tank. I think I need to start recording all my dumb deaths and someday submit a compilation for clip review or something.
Haha, I also have to be careful to not be too trigger happy with the gap closer in that phase, it really is baiting you to do it with how much you have to run around! 🤣
@@CaetsuChaijiCh Weird thing is, I was more or less right next to the boss. Must've hit a bad angle or something that pulled me into the pit.
Wouldn't use it from far away. That would be a dumb death as well, but very much expected. Although I'm still a bit salty that our Scion friends can teleport across gaps and we can't. Actually didn't pay attention if they do it here or not when I did it in duty support, which is what I always do the first time for the additional dialogue.
Awkward levels is a good topic. I'm only level 50-80 on my jobs because I haven't been playing for very long, and I'm a healer main but here are my 2 cents; 30-34 for whm because regen is so good, any level for ast before they have their cards - at those levels they have like 3 skills but are so good because their super strong ogcd is available at like level 12. Pld feels very awkward in 4x because stone vigil is inflated difficulty with monsters critting so much and they do not have anything to survive with, i.e. war got heals and invuln already. Drg feels so awkward at level 50 because their squad buff is level 52 and their only aoe is a skimpy little thing when the ogcd aoe is on a really long cooldown
You got to wonder why people play tank when they don't want to manage aggro even slightly. I'm also now realizing how good SCH has it at low levels since fairy healing leaves so much room for DPS. At least it ends quickly then?
My best guess is that, that tank was a bit drunk on power and just wanted to be inconvenient because they "have the power", which is a weird thing to run into. But I do very much agree that it is weird when people play tanks and don't even want to tank anything 😂
I had no idea you could get filled into an active run on a dungeon you've never done before
Oof, I can relate to wondering how incomprehensibly bad players can even get to the later parts of the game. Yesterday I was doing Mentor Roulette in The Skydeep Cenote as a 7m replacement and had a WAR who was using AOE rotation on single target because “2 spells vs 3 to get to the buff faster”, a RPR who was only using single target and refreshing debuff every other GCD, and a BLM who only casted HF2 and HB2, alternating. And only when they felt like it, they were still dropping Enochian because they were standing there for over 15 seconds. Of course both the dps kept dying to the final boss, and when everyone but me got punched off, both the DPS returned to the start instead of waiting for the raise so we had to wall or else it would take even longer. I tried to give advice but they just weren’t saying anything. It took 50 minutes in total to clear that. Still traumatized.
I wouldn't blame you for not rezzing them because "My Holy does more damage than you". Probably not even a meme with these two DPS. Not that they wanted to be rezzed, seeing how they left instantly when they died.
You know, out of that nightmare composition, I can see the logic in the aoe for buff faster argument. The only reason you and I think "that's dumb" is because we know it is more damage overall to not do that! 😅
Yikes for the rest though! Fifty minutes 😰
I feel like WAR would have Endure as their ability. I mean, that’s literally what Holmgang does.
Is it sad that I want the days of enmity management and positionals and actual complicated AST back? TP can stay gone because dashing is so fundamental.
do you play on aether?
I play on chaos in EU 😊
feed the pit :D
That new dungeon is misleading. Ran in i gnb with some fc mates. Fine until the 2nd boss then everything just hurt so much more
It is quite tough! We also wiped the first time we ran it, specifically to the second boss too!
@CaetsuChaijiCh i however love the dungeon design for dt
Waiting on the inevitable future video of random player with 6 subs bragging about how tanks dont need tank stance watch i have proof
Lmao 😂