Carlos Alvarez is a great baritone. At 60 he is just as fresh as ever. He sang Il tritico with ease very recently when I heard him. His voice is large, beautifull and man can he act. He knows how to sing very, very,very well!!!
All I can hear is that in older recordings they sound like having much more forward placement of the tone. I think the modern singers use more of the space created by the soft pallet and older singers used to sing from the larinx more thus having that speechlike timbre.
Foward placement of the tone in reality makes very little sense, sound is sound there is no place to be placed. You can only resonate and the main resonator is the pharynx. I understand where this come from but I have the moral obligation to tell you with certitude it is nonesense.
@@1UShawn I assume that you have sung opera before. If you did you must have felt that you can easily change the position of the sound. Ex. Position of tounge, how low your larynx goes, how much space you create in pharynx also constrictors of your nostrils. But i agree that old recordings sound better in certain parts mainly legato phrases. Soft and sensual singing with more pp I prefer in modern singers.
It's sad that singers these days won't have as good technique on average as singers back then. That doesn't mean that modern day opera singers have no talent, they're often decent singers, just not amazing most of the time.
Very cool video, with a good range of examples! I might disagree with your description of the guys like Granforte and Danise who sing the high F# with, as you put it, “a dark ‘A’ with some ‘ooo’ in it”. I would describe that sound as just a balanced high note, with top, middle and bottom in it. Or, as my coach here describes it, “Open in the cover.”
0:56 "Completely open A" Really? My musical ears tell me it is a F sharp..........0:08 "There is this Kaufmann-like quality...." Kaufmann has been the leading tenor worldwide for years now......is it wise to go against his singing style? By doing so, you let all of the conductors, theater directors and audiences of the biggest opera houses, who have booked and went to see him over the years know, that they are clueless individuals and you know better than them... smart move?
As for your latter questions, yes, the answer is yes, but you don't need to make it that dramatic. Current trends in both singing and appreciation of music deviate from the operatic tradition as it was before the middle of 20th century. Videos like this attempt to illuminate the viewer on what that tradition was, and why it was better.
@@FueganTV No. Your answer is yes. Think outside the box. Videos like that are for the uneducated mass. Artistic directors, conductors and the likes on a professional level know very well how singers from the past sounded. And obviously the decision makers opted for Kaufmann to be the leading contemporary tenor. Despite the fact that there are voices around resembling old school singing. How come?
La mayoría de los que no cubren en tu ejemplo suenan mejor. Tiene que ver con la calidad de la voz y la emisión. Por ejemplo ni Cappuccilli ni Zancannaro necesitan cubrir. Es una cuestión de apoyo y técnica.
@@1UShawn i hope you do make a video or explain it in the future. I have long sought after the Sound that Basses and Baritones of The 20th century had in Classical and Musical Theatre. That sound is so pleasing. While i can do the Open Chest i can't seem to find the Covered Sound. So fingers crossed a video will appear
Opera Lover I think he is truly a baritone with zero voice development; one who sings baritone and is just a lazy tenor would be Thompson. Cheers from Canada!
Shawn Uplaznik thanks for the response :) . Can you reccomend any good lieder singers, I used to listen to dieskau but i can not stand his voice anymore. Best regards!
@@operalover3966 Gérard Souzay is better than Dieskau, he has more chest in the voice and falsetto coordination (it's a real develop voice). Tom Lomonaco did some lieder and it's pretty amazing. Eula Beal did the same thing, she was a very fine contralto.
@@operalover3966 Karl Erb (tenor), Heinrich Schlusnus (baritone), Sigrid Onegin (mezzo) and Ernestine Schumann-Heink (contralto) from generations before DFD were vocally superior and were serious singers of opera and Lieder. A fair amount of their recordings of that literature can be found here on UA-cam.
Each to their own tastes, until you hear it live without the aid of microphones. Covering allows the voice to release more sound in that the lower harmonics, whilst singing with as much squill, becomes fuller. For the audience, it will sound less 'strained and strangled' For the singer, they will be able to sustain their higher chest notes
It all depends on what you mean by thick. Thickness is usually a bad thing. Joseph Metenich, I just listen to his di provenza, it is flat but if anything he doesn't cover enough. It has anything to do with thickness. Can you please tell me a example of what would be balance and free?? We can't agree with terms but maybe we agree with the sound. If not, there is no point in discussion.
@@1UShawn yeah right :) one of the greatest singers of the last century was suboptimal. you have no idea. come on lets hear it than sing me some lindorno and we will see who is suboptimal
I don't understand your question, if you mean do they all need to cover at around the place, yes! Now some heavier bariton cover lower, some lighter higher, it depends on their voice. Now, as they properly cover they will have different timber because of the specific shaping of their vocal tract, that's what a singer's timber is, every voice is different.
Carlos Alvarez is a great baritone. At 60 he is just as fresh as ever. He sang Il tritico with ease very recently when I heard him. His voice is large, beautifull and man can he act. He knows how to sing very, very,very well!!!
All I can hear is that in older recordings they sound like having much more forward placement of the tone. I think the modern singers use more of the space created by the soft pallet and older singers used to sing from the larinx more thus having that speechlike timbre.
Foward placement of the tone in reality makes very little sense, sound is sound there is no place to be placed. You can only resonate and the main resonator is the pharynx. I understand where this come from but I have the moral obligation to tell you with certitude it is nonesense.
@@1UShawn I assume that you have sung opera before. If you did you must have felt that you can easily change the position of the sound. Ex. Position of tounge, how low your larynx goes, how much space you create in pharynx also constrictors of your nostrils. But i agree that old recordings sound better in certain parts mainly legato phrases. Soft and sensual singing with more pp I prefer in modern singers.
Gobbi sounds exquisite
It's sad that singers these days won't have as good technique on average as singers back then. That doesn't mean that modern day opera singers have no talent, they're often decent singers, just not amazing most of the time.
They do have talent, they just lack the esthetic and the proper training.
Very cool video, with a good range of examples! I might disagree with your description of the guys like Granforte and Danise who sing the high F# with, as you put it, “a dark ‘A’ with some ‘ooo’ in it”. I would describe that sound as just a balanced high note, with top, middle and bottom in it. Or, as my coach here describes it, “Open in the cover.”
I will agree with that, the OO quality is kind of the cover, it's not always a distinct OO some did some really did sang full AH vowel.
Danise or Tito gobbi?
@@jackbigbug You mean, which do I prefer?
0:56 "Completely open A" Really? My musical ears tell me it is a F sharp..........0:08 "There is this Kaufmann-like quality...." Kaufmann has been the leading tenor worldwide for years now......is it wise to go against his singing style? By doing so, you let all of the conductors, theater directors and audiences of the biggest opera houses, who have booked and went to see him over the years know, that they are clueless individuals and you know better than them... smart move?
1) ...as in vowel "ah".
2) Yes.
@@АлексеевМаксим-р2ь 1) okay. 2) No.
As for your latter questions, yes, the answer is yes, but you don't need to make it that dramatic. Current trends in both singing and appreciation of music deviate from the operatic tradition as it was before the middle of 20th century. Videos like this attempt to illuminate the viewer on what that tradition was, and why it was better.
@@FueganTV No. Your answer is yes. Think outside the box. Videos like that are for the uneducated mass. Artistic directors, conductors and the likes on a professional level know very well how singers from the past sounded. And obviously the decision makers opted for Kaufmann to be the leading contemporary tenor. Despite the fact that there are voices around resembling old school singing. How come?
La mayoría de los que no cubren en tu ejemplo suenan mejor. Tiene que ver con la calidad de la voz y la emisión. Por ejemplo ni Cappuccilli ni Zancannaro necesitan cubrir. Es una cuestión de apoyo y técnica.
Hello, Shawn. How did you know about who singing with amplification and who no?
Any exercises to experience or help acieve this "Covered" sound
I might try to explain soon, it is a process so it is a little bit hard to explain without knowing where you are.
@@1UShawn i hope you do make a video or explain it in the future. I have long sought after the Sound that Basses and Baritones of The 20th century had in Classical and Musical Theatre. That sound is so pleasing. While i can do the Open Chest i can't seem to find the Covered Sound. So fingers crossed a video will appear
@@DiontaeBlack You can always contact me of facebook in the mean time, I have the same name.
Love the video... i have one question do you think dieskau should have become a tenor because he certainly does not have a baritone quality
Opera Lover I think he is truly a baritone with zero voice development; one who sings baritone and is just a lazy tenor would be Thompson. Cheers from Canada!
Shawn Uplaznik thanks for the response :) . Can you reccomend any good lieder singers, I used to listen to dieskau but i can not stand his voice anymore. Best regards!
@@operalover3966 Gérard Souzay is better than Dieskau, he has more chest in the voice and falsetto coordination (it's a real develop voice). Tom Lomonaco did some lieder and it's pretty amazing. Eula Beal did the same thing, she was a very fine contralto.
Shawn Uplaznik thanks a lot 😄 again
@@operalover3966 Karl Erb (tenor), Heinrich Schlusnus (baritone), Sigrid Onegin (mezzo) and Ernestine Schumann-Heink (contralto) from generations before DFD were vocally superior and were serious singers of opera and Lieder. A fair amount of their recordings of that literature can be found here on UA-cam.
For some reason I thought the uncovered sounded nicer sometimes? is that bad?
Each to their own tastes, until you hear it live without the aid of microphones.
Covering allows the voice to release more sound in that the lower harmonics, whilst singing with as much squill, becomes fuller.
For the audience, it will sound less 'strained and strangled'
For the singer, they will be able to sustain their higher chest notes
This is your view , the thicker U behind is not a garanty of balance and freedom . Check Joseph Meternich .
It all depends on what you mean by thick. Thickness is usually a bad thing. Joseph Metenich, I just listen to his di provenza, it is flat but if anything he doesn't cover enough. It has anything to do with thickness. Can you please tell me a example of what would be balance and free?? We can't agree with terms but maybe we agree with the sound. If not, there is no point in discussion.
Imagine being so delusional to think you can say Thatcher Dietrich-Fischer-Dieskau was a Bad Singer.
He was a suboptimal vocalist compare to what is humanly possible. There is nothinf delusional about that.
@@1UShawn yeah right :) one of the greatest singers of the last century was suboptimal. you have no idea. come on lets hear it than sing me some lindorno and we will see who is suboptimal
I hate how Gobbi sounds after an Eb
me too, i much prefer Bastianini shame he isnt shown there
Do all baritone voices have to sound alike !?
I don't understand your question, if you mean do they all need to cover at around the place, yes! Now some heavier bariton cover lower, some lighter higher, it depends on their voice. Now, as they properly cover they will have different timber because of the specific shaping of their vocal tract, that's what a singer's timber is, every voice is different.