I don't work in the automotive service/repair industry, but I hear so many coworkers and family blame the mechanics when they had a CV joint replaced and 2 weeks later their fuel pump goes out on their 2002 car with 232,765 miles and guess who they blame, yes the mechanic that put in the CV joint. People wrongfully blame the mechanics all the time.
Sort of like how your car is in the shop so you borrow someone's car just to go to the store for a gallon of milk, and as you're driving, the ABS light comes on and they say that you must have done something because it wasn't on before.
You can use sarcasm all you want, here in South Florida there's a serious trust issue with finding a trustworthy mechanic. Either their shop looks like a night time chop shop, their attitude is messy and rude, or they flat out lie to my face because I don't look like I know car stuff (or anything). So unless standards change and chain shops go away, the industry might as well die
All mechanics have dealt with scam artists like that. There are tons of examples I could give you after 30 years in the biz, and. I'm just one dude. In my opinion, as well as experience, if someone you know is prone to this kind of scam, then it's only a small matter of time before they go sideways on you or anyone else. Do not trust these fools, even if they are in your family.
Pretty funny I hope you pointed out to your family member or friend that the fuel pump has absolutely nothing to do with the CV joint. One of the reasons why they are fuel pump may have gone out is that they let their gas tank get so low as to make the fuel pump work very hard as well as not have enough fuel to help keep it cool since as I'm sure you know the fuel in your gas tank helps to keep the fuel pump cool.
The problems in Automotive industry have a lot in common with the restaurant industry. I have a chefs ticket and a transmission rebuilders ticket. Both employers want fully qualified trained people to work for minimum wage. So there is a large turnover or a bunch of the unskilled producing mediocre or less work. All while the owner puts in a pool at home and the employees are trying to find their next meal.
The auto manufacturers would LOVE to see techs go away completely. They would much rather sell you a new car any time your old one breaks down, but they aren't smart enough to realize because of some of the dirty shit they've done, people don't have enough money to buy new. It's just not an option.
Buying new cars is horribly wasteful and awful waste of money. There are so many cars taken off the road that are readily repairable and usable it boggles my mind. There are people that make 1/3 of what I make, complain they don't have any money, but drive around in brand new cars, at some $500.00 a month!
I was a mechanic for 3.5 years, came in as a lube tech at a ford dealer while in school and the was promoted to general line (Main shop) technician doing recalls and such once i graduated. Was only a main shop tech for about half that time and up until last month I have left the industry. Ford has decided to cut most of their decent paying recalls down by almost half. Such as Door latches ex.(2.9 hours ---> 1.3 hours) and so on. Most of the recalls that Ford has put out are due to simple neglect of torque specs, proper testing and cheap Chinese parts...ex.( f150,explorer seat frame bolts improperly torqued)(foucs, fusion, escape,fiesta etc. door latches breaking and replacement)(escape side curtain air bag replacement due to improper deployment)(expedition seat track measurement and torque)(f150 transmission selector cable clip verification)(MT82 mustang transmission shift forks breaking) and mind you most of these recalls dont pay anything! .2 (12 min) to .7 (42 min) at most.. so by the time you grab the keys, find the car, pull it into your bay, grab parts form parts department, perform recall, return warranty parts and write up tech notes and thenand then park the car, you are WELLLLLL over the alotted 12-42 minutes they give you to perform the recall..BS!.. Worked with technicians who have been their 20+ years and they are becoming very discouraged at what the industry is becoming. Because im young (22), ive chosen to leave the industry and go onto bigger and better things. As the auto industry becomes more advanced in technology, pretty soon the mechanics who get paid to DIAGNOSE vehicles with their equipment will soon become PARTS RE-PLACERS as the computer will tell them what is wrong and what to replace, meaning most technicians who have gone to school and acquired all this knowledge in those 20+ years, will be forced from the industry as they will be replaced by dealers for cheaper workers with a vast knowledge gap. A huge disservice to the industry. Glad to be out of the business... Since my leave from the dealership, 4 other technicians have done the same....student technicians beware!
That's a real shame. Why are dealerships allowing the mfgs. to dictate how long a particular job is supposed to take? How can they expect that any job is going to take 12 minutes. I learned a long, long time ago that there is no such thing as a 10 minute job. If enough techs leave the dealerships then they are going to be forced to raise the wages and fix these stupid time allotments or forgo the work and let the independents handle it.
the computer tells them what's wrong, well they tried that at AT&T the computer tests your tel line and reads out a code, that way anyone could then tell the customer what's wrong and dispatch a tech to fix it. In the old days you sat on a test board with dials and switches and actually tested the line and had to have some knowledge.
Look at the way companies treat their workers today, talked with my dr. yesterday she's fighting to get worker's comp benefits for one of her patients a truck driver that was let go after 27 yr. He was working 16-17 hr. a day which is illegal and when his heath gave out they let me go and now he has to fight for worker's comp & disability benefits from social security.
warranty times = labor theft. I told Volvo reps all the time they are stealing my labor and the dealership is not paying me if Volvo wont pay them. They're all crooked and make money off our blood and sweat.
Low manufacturer's warranty hours, low management respect and high cost of living and operation. I left because i was unappreciated and unmotivated. The lack of my motivation was seeing and hearing all of my senior techs talking about how theyre treated. The industry management, in my area, seems to not value loyalty and hard workers and will just as quickly kick a tech thats been with them for 20 years to the curb as they will the new guy. Its hard to want to make the dealer all their money and support their business when they treat you as disposable. And hoping it gets better doesn't work when your senior techs are getting the same treatment.
i hear you all i hear about from the other techs in my shop is how shitty warranty work pays...for instance a strut on a dodge journey is like 0.2hrs wich is nuts,,,,its so spurratic that some jobs youll get paid like 3hrs but only takes 1.5....ive worked on domestic all my life n makes me wonder in import warranty pays this bad?
@@Scypher0th it really depends. Some subaru payouts were fine. Some you were basically working for free. Which is why i personally don't like flat rate. Its one of the only careers where youre continuously asked to work for free. Or help out the owner with a used car by taking bs hours for the work it needs so the millionaire can make some more money off you. And dont get me started on healthcare through the company
I agree. The Service department brings in the serious money for a Dealership (Ford in my case) much more than the small percentage made on overall new car profit margins, and yet Technicians/Mechanics are treated like shop equipment at best. I have never been a "fast" technician, but I always did the 100% repair, whereas I would see other "Good" techs (read "fast") that cut so many corners, that morally I could not compete. Though by far my worst experience with flat-rate was working for Firestone. A new manager was hired that had his eye on a district manager position, and needed to get the shops "numbers" up, and thus forced techs to perform tons of free work. Cleaning your workspace is one thing, if you spill oil on the floor while repairing a car, it is your responsibility, but cleaning the entire building and doing "busy" work...? The previous manager would itemize this under "non-productive" time, so we still got paid. The new manager would have us organizing tire racks, scrubbing the exterior of the building, cleaning the parking lot, inventories, shop equipment repairs/maintainence, and demanded we not "flag" any hours to do so, in order to get the shop profits up. I refused to work for free, was called a cancer and was let go. Left a bad taste in my mouth for flat rate.
@@nerhu59 this is the same mentality i had and why i had an issue with flat rate. Im someone who takes pride in my work but i am not a fast tech. I take pride in doing it the right way the first time tho. If this takes alittle extra time then so be it, which makes flat rate a disadvantage.
I agree, the warranty times get shorter and shorter. Sometimes the dispatcher will throw you a good 30-60-90k service job to hopefully bring your time back up. Then again sometimes that doesn’t always happen. My Father worked for 30+ years as a tech and back then the times were a whole lot better than today. But he also said if you do one particular warranty job enough times, you’ll do the job more quickly. I myself was in used car reconditioning where the work was more plentiful, especially during certain times of the year.
As a UTI alumni and former technician for Audi, I will say working for a corporate dealership wasn't for me... even the industry wasn't. First the amount of debt you incur in order to go to UTI is outrageous and one can learn the same fundamentals at a local tech school. Second, you have to invest a ton of time in order to make decent money. I'm talking 8 to 10 years, which isn't ridiculous if u are young and starting off in the industry. Forget being older and learning the flat rate system. Jobs are handed down by team leaders and their friends are handed gravy work while you get shafted with diagnosis work. In the end, it just wasn't putting food on the table so I left the industry and went into another field. Take aways: company makes a ton for service repairs, techs make very little
good points. Yes the debt is a problem and UTI has made agreements that essentially keep other school graduates out of jobs. Take Mercedes-Benz, their dealer only hire UTI graduates- as if other schools don't teach students anything. Been there done that. My story is similar but I didn't go to UTI.
@@Mn09lfV6f I will say this, UTI does offer advanced training... well they partner with certain manufacturers and they charge you a good penny in order to attend their training. You come out at a higher level and in some cases very to pick the location you would like to work. However, it isn't cheap and your admittance into the program depends on GPA and other factors. Still you are able to very a head start on the competition. I believe they have ties with Ford, BMW, Fiat and maybe a couple more, it's been a while so I can't remember them all. I will say German engineering is very advanced and some dealers don't give a darn about how many ASE certifications you have. They want you to learn the systems of their vehicles and move up the tracks according to their tier levels.
I went to my local community college for a year, full time, for automotive tech in 2018. It cost me about $5,500, I think. Spent about another $1200 at Harbor Freight and I'm pretty well equiped. (To work on my own cars anyway)
Everyone has a bad mechanic story... :( There is a lot of things that can and need to change at ALL levels to push the industry in the right direction. I know I have a much more optimistic view than most, but I have also seen a TON of good in my career. Way more good than bad.
HumbleMechanic I wish I could break into the automotive industry. Theres a lot of apprentice programs here in Bahrain but I can't qualify without a highschool diploma. Instead Im working for my dad in the hospitality business .. pay is good but I'd rather be wrenching..
@Andrew H. All mechanics? So you, who never met me before, believe I am a fraud and do people wrong? Maybe you need to look at your sad, pathetic life and figure out how to remove your head out of your ass
Wsup humble mechanic! At age 35 married with kids i can't afford to switch carreers. I'd be earning a starting salary thats 3x less and with an annual increase of 5% max by law it really bites.. so instead I enjoy watching your videos after work!
My opinion it bias based on many years of seeing amazing customer service and techs going out of there way to do what is right. Do people get screwed on car repair? YEP!!! and that is not okay, those techs/shops should be called out for it.
I was in the industry in California from 1988 to 2008, 20 years. Grew up around people working on cars, and had a pretty sound background when I got my my first job at a Jeep Eagle dealer as an apprentice. I went to a VW/Audi independent for a few years, and then to a dealer. When I started in the 80's, flat rate was $20 an hour around here for a mechanic. When I left, I was an ASE mater tech(those tests are a joke), L1, had my California smog license (we did smog checks at the dealer I worked at, and they bumped me up a dollar for it, a friggin dollar.) and was an Audi master tech. I was at $28 flat rate. I could actually do diagnosis, so I was often bogged down with electrical and drivability problems no one else could seem to fix, and the subsequent fighting with the warranty administrator to get paid for diagnostic time. The pen is mightier than the wrench, and anyone who has worked at a dealer knows you are going to have to write a slew of lies to get paid for your time. Ever adjusted (downward) warranty times, shop politics, nowhere to promote to, being completely unappreciated, wear and tear on your body, bad knees, bad back, shops hiring too many techs for the workload, shops giving all the gravy work to low paid trainees, the list goes on. The pay has not kept up with inflation. That $20 in 1988 would be $44 now, and the amount of know how and training increased exponentially. Despite that, the lowlife grease monkey stereotype lingers. My last year I made 60 grand. I made that in 1990. I literally drove my truck into the shop with no notice, packed up my tools and box(an easy 25 to 30 grand worth at that point), and left. While I was packing, the service manager asked me what it would take for me to stay, I said $55 an hour, he actually laughed. I still do side jobs once in a while, and the last one I did, I made 90 bucks an hour, and the person was happy to pay it. That is how undervalued you are as a technician working for a shop. While I taught my sons to fix things from day one, I steered them towards college also. Screw that whole industry. If they paid what techs are worth, they would have techs. If you are smart enough to be a competent tech on todays cars, you are smart enough to do something else. DO SOMETHING ELSE!
I briefly considered it, after starting on DIY auto repair and helping a few other people out. But wouldn't want to work in this field because: -working under excessive time pressure -dirty and unhealthy job -modest pay compared to the health risks
It's only a dirty job if you don't wear gloves. As a DIY mechanic I realised that it's far easier to stop yourself getting dirty with disposable gloves than it is to get car dirt off you afterwards.
Good points, but I'll be devils advocate. Being a mechanic has also given me other skills that I've found useful and profitable. Problem solving for one. Welding, time management, and I've also used my skills to branch out into plumbing, electrical wiring, tile, carpentry, as well as a few other trades. Not to mention entrepreneurship. In essence, your skills don't have to end at the garage. You can move beyond it. It's really about self reliance if you think about it.
Eric, the industry,aka the older guys like us, need to help these young techs coming up in this industry, take the kids under our wings and help the grow as technicians. The industry is always changing, many rear brake jobs now require a scan tool, to retract the parking brake/piston.
Maybe others are in the same boat as me. I'm 22 love working on my cars and friends cars. There's not a bolt I haven't touched on my 90 supra. But I'd never want to do it as a job. I'd rather work at costco making close to 60k a year in an air conditioned warehouse and do car stuff on my own personal time. Yes I would like to have a job working on cars but I see way to many people who literally work themselves into the grave in the auto industry. Not that that's always the case but in my area it happens alot.
Not that you can't make really good money in the auto industry but it just didn't seem inviting/a good route to take for me right out of high school. Believe it or not I actually worked with a guy at costco for awhile who was a master tech that was in and out of jobs trying to make a living hes at Firestone now until he can get back on at a dealer
That's a good point, and it's not a good idea to make your 'hobby' your 'job', because after it's a 'job', it stays a job. But if you love what you do, you never work a day in your life.
I've worked for a few new car dealers and some private shops and the biggest thing I've learned is the service writer is usually your worst enemy and makes more than the tech actually doing the work and gets bonuses based on surveys from the customer about my work. The manufacturer's warranty times are absolutely ridiculous there's no way techs can do things in the allotted time they give you and when you don't your losing money. The service industry is in the shape it's in because of it's self. Tech's all deserve a raise and flat rate needs to go, all flat rate is designed for is to make hard working people work for free. For example I was the only one in my shop that could r and r a Kia Sportage transmission in 8 hours, warranty pays 4. If anyone can do it faster I'd like to see it
I know you said usually is the enemy, but, I am a service writer. At my shop after 4 years I make pretty much what a new apprentice would, and I get yelled at by customers all day. I don't get any bonuses in any shape or form. I think that is one thing technicians forget is that we handle the customer relations, because that is what keeps the work coming in the door. Not saying that one job is any better than the other. I would really like to become a tech eventually, but I can't afford the tools or schooling right now. Just keeping a roof over my head and my truck on the road is enough.
^ This , I'm also from Pa. and left the industry for exactly this reason . We Techs were treated like dirt at the Dealership . It got so bad Customers would call and ask to talk to Tech and avoided the Manager at all cost . It became extremely toxic . The Gas industry came to the area and I quit the Dealership ...bye bye
I mainly associate that moniker with quick-oil-change shops, which are the most common target of sting ops to reveal scams in the industry ua-cam.com/video/-avpx8UTakI/v-deo.html Some small shops are bad about that too though. One of my friends took his pickup to a couple shops in town, cause the rear end was making a clacking noise as he drove and he was sure the diff was going out. Here's how that played out: *Shop 1* Friend took it in to em, told em to fix it. Gets it back a day later, they tell him it was just fine and charge him for the inspection. He gets a quarter mile down the road and it makes the exact same noise. *Shop 2* Friend tells them about the issue, and about what the other shop did. They open it up and within the half hour mark they call him in to show him something Mechanic: "Check this out; Does this look 'Fine' to you?" (digs into puddle of diff fluid and pulls up a handful of gear bits) Friend: "F##K!" Mechanic: "What shop did you say you took it to?" Friend: "------ a few miles down the road" Mechanic: "Thought so. You got an invoice?" Then the mechanic called up the other shop and chews them a new one, and after some "negotiating", gets them to refund my friend his inspection fee. He also got my friend's diff fixed within a day and all was well after that. This anecdote pretty much sums up the industry, there are good righteous shops out there providing a good reasonable service, and then there are those just trying to make the quickest buck for the least work possible. The problem is, until you have an experience like this, it's hard to find a shop that you can be sure won't screw you.
Before I retired and had no issues walking, I did. So my advice to anyone who thinks their mechanics are ripping them off is to get a second or even third opinion. Might turn out they were legit, or it might turn out that sandy vag is from being screwed raw.
It's mostly a rip off. If you spent the money on tools and equipment to do it yourself, you not only have the tools for life but also learn new skills and live with the satisfaction of an accomplishment.
Flat rate tech for 10+ years, in the industry for 14 years. I think the talent pool is suffering because shop owners aren't making an effort to attract. A journeyman electrician will make 50-60k per year, get better insurance for cheaper, get union support with a pension, get more vacation and time off. But a tech has to fight 4 other guys to flag 50+ hours per week to make 50-60k per year. No union, no pension, no (or minimal) 401k match (max 2% if I give 6%), and they barely contribute anything to pay insurance ($800+ per month for fam). And that's before we spend $30,000-$40,000 on tools. I've worked in 4 shops and interviewed at several others along the way, and they haven't varied much.
I could probably make my own response video to this explaining how much darker the automotive industry has gotten over the last 30 years, and/or how they seem to be trying to engineer the weekend home mechanic out of repairing their own cars. But I'll basically say this. Once a vehicle leaves the factory the manufacture doesn't really care about it anymore. If you can't repair it, and it costs too much to keep it on the road, then you'll buy another POS from them. So it's a bonus for them to engineer you out of the picture. You only have to look back to the late 80's to now and ask yourself why you rarely see cars from those eras anymore, yet you still see cars from as far back as the 50's. It ended for me when I realized on some cars you have to remove the intake manifold in order to change 3 out of your 6 spark plugs. Garbage engineering seems to be running rampant in the automotive industry these days, and it's a wonder why anyone wants to deal with it.
Thanks for your input. You might not see American vehicles from that age because they were ugly and didn't work very well. Emissions was just starting to be a thing and we were way behind when that came about. However, the Asian vehicles from that era are still around today and beloved by many. I guess what I'm trying to say is that it's about perspective. Sure, the manufacturer wants to make money. Thats why they're in business after all, but I think the 'problem' is a bit more complicated than you allude to. Not saying you're wrong, just I think there is a lot more to it than that. Thank you for your input.
And your absolutely correct. There is much more to it. That's why I could have made my own response video on the subject. I just don't have the editing software to do it anymore. Even some of the Asian cars are not engineered as well as they could have been. I've watched the HVAC video on your Honda. But even then, Asian cars are in their own ballgame. They are beloved because they are built to last longer. But even then, when something does go up in them, it's costly. And I haven't even started on automotive design these days. You only need to look at silhouettes of any mid sized car or SUV built these days to see that most look the same. Automotive engineering has just gotten lazy, and I can't see where they put any thought into the guy who loves to work on his own stuff anymore. But at the risk of writing out a script for a video reply I'll cut it there. Thanks for the reply, and keep the great videos comming.
I think they key point that you are correct about is that; After the car leaves the plant, the manufacturer really does not give a shit about it at all. It is a liability at that point, and you are exactly right about, they would rather just put them up in a new vehicle again, as opposed to repairing the car under warranty. Technicians are an EXPENSE to the corporate mfg company, NOT an ASSET. Buisness 101: minimize expenses, invest in assets. To top it off, now COVID is a thing, and the economy is in deep shit from a massive government mandated shut down, and 1/2 of parts are on intergalactic backorder. Now customers really can't afford to fix their vehicle. Lots of warranty work. But remember, if you're doing warranty work, you're just an expense. Expect to be treated as such. Minimize.
The general love for cars have grown cold amongst teens and young adults. I have noticed that grand parents are really involved in raising their grandkids now. because of that, the love for trains, cars, trucks and heavy equipment seems to be pretty significant in the hearts and minds of todays children. There's still hope. In the mean time, missing a few meals when I was young never hurt. It only served to help adjust my way of thinking. The fear of having nowhere to sleep at night helped me to arrive to work on time on many occasions.
The same is true of a lot of industries these days. If you want good staff you have to provide an environment that's far more welcoming than the one we started off in 20+ years ago
This industry needs fixing so awfully badly. I'll continue on UA-cam, but I'm dealing with school and work full time to get out. I essentially had work and school full time to get into this field for a couple years even though I used my own cars, tools, and UA-cam rather than an unaffordable school. This time I'm doing a very expensive school to get into network engineering. Thanks to the ETCG1 community I realized that techs move between these two fields successfully and enjoyably and I have to go where I'll be allowed to get old and get paid twice as much to start and twice as much to progress in the field.
I was in the Automotive mechanic field for 10 years. I got out for a few reasons. One being the flat rate system, bad system that needs to go or give tech option of straight hourly wage. Second the wage as compared to other trades, Automotive repair is highly technical and deserves a much higher wage. Less complicated trades pay more or at least equal to the automotive trade. Third lack of respect from employer and customers. Why put up with the bs from them? Forth the investment in tools is crazy as compared to other trades. I would never advise anyone to get into the Automotive trade. Fixing vehicles is a great hobby, which is what I do now, but a bad job/career in my honest opinion. Hopefully with less people getting into the Automotive trade and from what i see more techs getting out of the trade, shops will realize things have to change and make the changes to the things i mentioned. Cheers
BuzzerAuto every shop I’ve been to across state to states, 90 % in it are dirtiest man can be, when slow Co workers rip off each other tools or anything their fingers can grab that includes front office to people behind ceo off the company
Kevin n go into I T, many cars owners nowadays drive their almost down to ground or up to 100k miles then trade in for new car, there’s too many so money isn’t much to make and if you like to work with your hands heating and ac is ok.
@Kevin nAfter 10 years as Auto Tech I was a Heavy Duty Technician for 10 years specializing in aerial equipment like boomlifts, scissor lifts, telehandlers and forklifts. Had an few nagging injuries from turning wrenches for 20 years and now I'm a Parts Person at HD shop. If I was to do it over again I would get into HVAC, Electrician or Elevator trades. I got my nephew into HVAC and it pays well and he likes the trade. Your skills will transfer over to any type mechanical trade. If you are starting over don't waste your money on these expensive private colleges. Look into a community college or just try and apply directly into a starting job position. A lot of employers will recognize your experience and train you at New job. Good luck
Also, if manufacturers are going to provide us these high end electronics in all of our cars, they need ways to test each component no matter how old those components get. I had a short circuit in my car and took it into the Chrysler service department, but no conventional methods were used to find the short circuit. They plugged in their machines to my car and just looked at the computer monitor for the results. They came back stating it might be the wireless receiver, but no guarantee. After replacing the wireless receiver, it did not fix the problem. There was still a short circuit and my car wouldn't run. Cars are made too complex these days that even experienced mechanics are having more and more difficulty locating problems in cars these days.
I admit that with some intermittent electrical issues you have to guess, but I would say that what you experienced might have more to do with the skill of the people using the equipment over the vehicle being too complicated. However, I wasn't there so I really can't say for sure.
Please do a podcast! Also, from a young technician who is in the final days of his Auto degree, I've worked the pit for longer than I'm proud to admit because the dealership I worked for didn't see me as enough of an asset to try to move me into the main shop to do work. That seems to be standard practice in my area, unfortunately. Another is that nobody wants to give a young technician a true shot at work. I left the dealership to work for an independent shop where I was essentially put on the same jobs as the dealership for several months (8+), despite my love for electronics and diagnosis. My employer knew, he just didn't want me to mess anything up, which I understand but how do I get any "professional experience" when my employer wont give me a shot? Most young technicians, like myself, are largely looked over because many shops want at least 3 years of experience, where lube doesn't really count. This has largely discouraged me and many of my friends because we're treated like kids who have never touched a wrench before. So while I work for this guy changing oil and rotating tires, I'm doing my own thing on the side because nobody knows how to deal with electrical issues anymore. I can't realistically use my "shade-tree" experience on a resume, but I'm making more working a few hours a week for myself than I do changing oil for a professional shop for 40 hours, and my customers love me!
Use your shade tree experience on your resume - I would also suggest you strike out on your own and set yourself up as an independent mobile specialist tech for electronics and electrical issues. Get one or two techs to act as a reference for you and visit a bunch of shops offering to do flat-rate diagnostics for them when they are stuck, leave your business card....
The reason the dealership looks over lube techs is because they don't want to pay them like mechanics, but they want to work them like mechanics. In short, they take advantage of your ambition. Realistically it takes about 3 years to catch your stride in the industry, sometimes 5. Even then you'll probably still be trying to prove yourself. That said, keep at your side work. If you're smart, you might start your own business of being 'the guy' when it comes to electrical and performance diagnosis. I'm seeing more shops and dealerships farm out this work to business that specialize in this work. It could be a real money maker for you someday. Just be sure to have your business set up right when the time comes. That's where most technicians fail when it comes to running their own business. They can fix things all day long, but they can't balance the books or promote the business properly and fail as a result. No matter what I wish you luck. Thanks for weighing in.
Personally I believe the flat rate system needs to go away. It encourages lying to customers and is a major stress on families. For example I was at the dealership when the economy tanked, nobody was buying anything and my wife was pregnant with our first kid. I made the decision to move across the state for a job that was hourly. 7 years later I make a great living with the same fleet and earning a paycheck isn’t a stressful thing. Hourly is the only way to go
Nick Steinmetz at that time I worked at the only Ford dealer around. We were starving. Many indy shops in town had to close doors. It was the worst I’ve ever seen. Now with my hourly fleet job I make $90k a year and it’s relaxed more than any job I’ve ever had. I’m not saying you’re wrong so please don’t take it as such. I’m saying my experiences differ is all
But the idea of fleet sounds so yucky. We get fleet cars in everynow and then, all it is is oil changes and tire rotations, getting them to buy anything big is like pulling teeth, how do you make 90k a year on hourly? Do u make $50 AN hr?
srv3fender I will not get into detail about exactly how much I make but let’s just say I get paid very well and sometimes o/t is allowed. As for quality of work. At my company we are held to a high standard, if it’s broken fix it no questions asked. We primarily use OEM products and have access to OEM manuals to make sure the job is done correctly. The only time we send something out is when we get backed up and can not afford to have the asset down any longer.
Let me comment on the Australian system. Australia runs a system of trade schools in each state whom are empowered to train, test and certify apprenticeships, a system of both theory and hands on training supported by industry. This system of training has been industry standard for decades and produced excellent tradesman but has began to deteriorate due to multiple failures, due to becoming irrelevant, loss of certification and ISO standards,escalating costs and industry bring training inhouse and becoming more product specific. I work in the Australian mining industry as a Mechanical Engineer, but started my career as a diesel mechanic. The normal apprenticeship term in Australia is four years, but are now being shortened by up to 2 years under the guise of 'accelerated learning'. Unfortunately, this is producing ' technicians ' whom lack mechanical knowledge, life skills, incentive, common sense and industry knowledge. A very real problem that has no real resolution. I spent 6 years competing my apprenticeship, working under highly skilled tradesmen and senior mentors, in conditions that are now considered extreme. But the knowledge and skills my seniors ' bestowed and passed ownership onto me ', I'm forever grateful for. Thanks for starting the conversation Eric. 👍👍
I came into AT&T when the company had it's own schools and excellent training. After they broke up the Bell System that all changed. And I was taught by a senior man with 30 years experience. I read the BSP's, Bell System Practices that showed you the correct way to do things.
I have a shop but I’m focusing on Hybrid and electric vehicles. Mainly servicing or upgrading battery packs. Its easy money compared to regular automotive service. All these aging EV and hybrid need battery pack service more than ever. They only last 7-10 years. That’s why Tesla warranty the battery pack for 100k miles that’s about 7 years. Price comparison on servicing vs buying a new battery pack is significant. Repaired battery usually last couple of years but much cheaper. Customers do not tend to look into the future, all they want is to get their car running now
Eric I graduated from UTI, did the ford fact program and bmw Step, worked for bmw of sf for 10 years, now I run my own little one man shop repairing rolls Royce, Bentley and other exotics. The schooling itself was not easy and do not recommend to anyone unless you can commit to the program. If you can make through it. You can become a very wealthy person being an honest technician these days.
Very interesting topic of discussion. For a start, makes me realise there are huge differences to the US and the UK where I am. Over there, it seems to be that most technicians are forced to work flat rate. If you wanna make a decent living, you need to be good at what you do. That is a huge incentive to always better yourself, and ultimately that means better service for your customers. Over here, you show up to work and you get paid. That's regardless of how busy the shop is, how good your work is, and that right there means there is no incentive to want to better yourself. Only the rare technicians that actually have some integrity and pride will go on to make great money, but my point is you don't need to be good to make a living, unlike over there. Personally, I have been a professional for over 16 years now, and made a damn good living from it. I have pride in my work, and treat everybody's vehicle the same way I always did. As for new people coming into the trade, I don't feel like the integrity is there and people are just looking for a job rather than a career. All that means is they will do the bare minimum, and the end result is crap customer service.
'people are just looking for a job rather than a career' Outside of certain specialisms, many (perhaps most) people entering the jobs market now have no expectation of a job for life and little expectation of a career. They've grown up watching industries being run down by economic and technological changes (Amazon killing the High Street, Uber killing taxi firms etc.) so they enter the market expecting to be exploited and then dumped the moment they're not needed, which is exactly the kind of work environment I've experienced just a decade ahead of them.
Flat rate has good things, but also bad. I have seen master techs with 25 years of experience work 9 hours for one hours pay because they got a bad ticket. The shop favorite gets the gravy and the person the dispatcher dislikes get shat on. When you start off with out the experience and tools you go broke while you need to buy more tools. Most new people find a better job before they even have a chance to get the tools and experience to make a living.
Thank you for your perspective. Unfortunately, flat rate doesn't inspire getting better at what you do so much as cutting corners to make more money. That's not true for everyone, but it is for enough to mention it.
I've been employed as a dealership tech in Ireland (pretty much the same as the UK, paid hourly) and in Alberta, Canada (pretty much the same as the US, flat-rate pay). Neither is good! Paid hourly you just don't get paid for all the amount of your knowledge and skills that you are trying to develop - and therefore it just doesn't make sense to get better, to put all the time, effort and money in self-education and tools. No stress and I liked the job, but I wasn't happy with what it paid. On a flat rate, you won't get paid for that skill and knowledge either as you'll make way more money just changing brake pads and doing PDIs than applying yourself to electrical and driveability diagnostics! You are, in fact, rewarded for doing the bad job, cutting as many corners as possible, and punished for doing your best. I admit the pay was OK (although only while the shop was busy!), but the work was extremely (!) stressful. Basically, I was as naive as you are thinking that flat-rate provides an incentive for good work and self-development - it doesn't. Instead, three years working in flat-rate dealerships were the worst time in my entire career (25 years and counting)
It's hard to respect the auto industry in general. Cars are too expensive for most people and millennials HATE buying brand new, dealerships pay abhorrent rates to their technicians, independent shops hate letting people use their own parts and it's hard to find good, affordable mechanics in general, and there's no more "go work with Dad and then be absolved into the company" scenarios. Overall the field is on the down trend. Diesel is the only profitable sub category of automotive repair, in my opinion. Again, just my opinion. Not many young people, especially millennials and Gen Z, want to pay $5000 for their own tools that they have to provide in order to work in a non air-conditioned and stressful environment making $13 an hour when they can get a job at a call center making $15 and up.
I started at 13 an hour flag rate which was a lot less than that lacking experience. The only reason I put up with it was that I could no longer work in a cubicle environment. It was brutal and while it never really got easier, at least in a few years I was making twice as much. Right now they know I'll fix anything which is awful because they won't pay me right working on old cars. 2 to 3 times as broken as what they're willing to sell it for AND they want me to fix it? Shops everywhere cheat their techs. With my immense technical skills doing diag and such....sigh. The industry needs fixing so bad.
I can make more than $20/hour delivering pizzas and washing dishes... Usually about ~$15/hour with tips, but busy nights can double my paycheck in tips.
Exactly, guys. I started at 14.50/H flat rate. The tech I was being trained by started at 15 an hour in the 80's! Not to mention, his education and tools were cheaper than mine were.
@@willberham i made 10 bucks/ hr the top tech made 400 week take home before snapon bill. I know guys that make money but its a sucky line of work in NY
They need to do away with the flat rate system. It’s hard to make a decent living on the flat rate system with all of the warranty work. Honda offers you a maintenance plan when you buy a new car so all service is free up until like 36000 miles. Also warranty through Honda that lasts until 120000 or 9 years. I’m putting axle seals or wheel bearings in cars that are 8 years old with 100k on them. Also under that maintenance plan, what’s considered a B123 is a brake service, oil change, tire rotation, filters, and trans fluid. That exact service use to be 3 hours time for a flat rate tech. Also known as a 60k service. Now? It’s 2. We get 2 hours for the same service. Oh, and if it’s under the maintenance contract, it pays .9. And changing trans fluid in these new cvts isn’t just dumping in 3 quarts. Our new 9 speed pilot we have to put into “maintainence mode” and run it through 4 gears, let it idle, then check the fluid by pulling out check plug on trans. For .4 hours CUSTOMER PAY. The flat rate system needs to go. We don’t get enough non warranty work to get 40 hours a week. Just a couple of years ago I was averaging 50-55. Now I’m averaging 45 and dropping.
Its the fault of the car makers. They put in many useless features that can go bad and make diagnosis more complicated. I would pay top dollar for a new Accord or Civic made exactly the same way as they were built two decades ago.
Ad Mirer Maybe that is part of the reason so many people buy trucks. I still have the ‘96 Suburban I bought new, and traded my ‘03 Chevy pickup for a new ‘14 crew cab GMC Denali. It seems highly rated new cars sit so low they scrape the sidewalk as they enter driveway. I will keep buying rear wheel drive trucks, with no turbos, and engines that aren’t turned sideways.
sexiewasd 👍🏻 If my “Burb” engine ever goes I may put a new crate engine in it. I already put a new crate transmission in it. It was cheaper brand new from factory than rebuild. I don’t care about mpg, it’s my 2nd vehicle, has 185,000 miles. Excellent visibility in all directions is one of many reasons I like it. Wife got rear ended in accident. We had to get new bumper. Car that hit ours was totaled. Enjoy your Burb!
There was a time that things like air conditioning, power steering, power windows were considered useless. Problem is makers build cars to be built not repaired. They dont consider what it takes to repair a vehicle.
Rather than blame the car repair industry. I blame the car industry in general. They are making cars that requires multiple discipline to repair. It used to be mechanical, then mechanical and electrical, and now its mechanical, electrical and software. And without something like the OBD2 standard for the software portion, its hard for car technicians to keep up.
I've long been one of the guys who would pop the hood and investigate what might be wrong with my car. So watching channels like yours and other car diagnosing & repair tips and tricks is FASCINATING! Your approach is like a detective following the evidence and like a scientist confirming your findings for a successful fix. I'm sure like myself that there are millions of kids out there considering a field of endeavor who are contemplating their careers by watching successful car repair channels like yours. UA-cam content is a WIN-WIN for humanity. I believe channels like yours are helping people in ways you cannot even imagine. And the way I think that auto content like yours can help is by talking about how you got into the industry and the paths you had to cross. Because that information helps the guy who wants to decide now. And it answers the very 1st question on a career path minded person is "how do I start". Oh and thanks for all you do!
As technology gets more complicated you have to be more skilled and knowledgeable about it. I see them as a car doctors since is a huge responsibility and liability since people can get hurt or die while driving their cars due to a misdiagnosed or incorrectly installed parts. The sad part is that they work hard, slowly hurt their bodies while working under unsafe and unhealthy conditions, get paid little and are sometimes underappreciated by the public, the employer and others. Hope this abuse change one day, and business owners invest and care more for their people.
My Dad was a mechanic at a dealership and at home.One rule He always had.If you were putting in a bolt or a nut on a stud never let a phone call stop you from tightening it up before you take the call.Most people will not remember to get that one as they were distracted.He was very structured and analogical about all His work because it means life or death on the road
F R As a pro mechanic, I want to thank you for your understanding of what it's like for us and also for having enough respect to call us doctors. Iv'e always said if a mechanic has 10 or more years experience then he or she is now a doctor of machines. If we're not then who is ??? Unfortunately we're not treated that way....
Hi Eric, I'm a 22 year old parts store manager, I have quite a few friends around my age in the automotive repair industry. I started learning about cars in my second year at a STEM school, I grew up loving industrial design and really enjoyed the artistic part of it. I started learning how to work on cars and within three years I went from barely being able to jump start a car to having the tools and knowledge to rebuild the engine in my car, which I had to do a few months ago. As for my friends who went through an ASE program at the local college, I've found my knowledge surpasses theirs and I have a deeper understanding of how a vehicles inner workings come together and how to diagnose problems. In the technical schools, they teach you what might be the problem but not how to diagnose it properly. My friends are lube techs and part swappers working in a dealership with more or less than $5000 of debt after going on the tool trucks for the first time, it's unfortunate. It just goes to show that in order to work on something you have to have a true drive, motivation, and passion for it.
You need better friends. The truth is experience is what counts in this industry. However, a good education can give you the foundation you need to become a great technician. Just because you rebuilt an engine, doesn't mean you'd be a good technician. Don't get me wrong, your achievements are significant, but compared to someone that does it every day, you're just a weekend warrior that got lucky. It's a lot different when you get up in the morning and go to work in a repair shop, trust me on that. You're not a technician until you've failed miserably and you feel like you never want to do it again. I'm not saying that to be mean, I'm saying that because you have those days as well as the days where you solve the unsolvable. THAT is what makes you a real technician, the failures you overcome, not the achievements you gloat about. Thank you for your input.
Flat rate days are coming to an end. These younger people dont have the same opportunity to turn as much time as in the past. At the european dealer i work at, the amount of customer pay work is 3/4 less than it used to be. They cut all of our cp service times to warranty, large portion of cars are cpo warranty until 100k, and they all have service packages from day 1.There's not enough cp work to make up for getting 9 hrs to replace piston rings. They raise the rate and cut the times often. It was 80 an hr 11 yrs ago and is now 160.
In 1983 the local honda dealership's labor rate was $22. Techs made $11. and you were fired quickly if you couldn't cut it. Today labor rate is $115. Top flat rate tech prob making $22-25. And piston rings on a honda odyssey is like 7.8 hrs for cyl.s #1-3 and .8 for cyl #4...crazy
If all the techs save money to cover their expense's for a couple of weeks, you all could walk out and bring them to their knees, then negotiate higher wages!
What you speak about is so true. I’m retired now but was an electronic tech for over 50 years. Started with vacuum tubes and left off with flat screen tv. And computersof all types. , I adapted , and that’s what you have to do to stay a float. Thanks Eric. Going to add this video linked to Facebook.
Thanks Eric, I am 38 years old and am retraining in this field. You are right about the younger generation as I am at school with them. We all have our own way of doing and learning things. But for me being somewhere in the middle age makes it a bit of a challenge, I am also a solo dad so trying to learn new skills and juggle life. But I am really enjoying it, Apprenticeship next year can’t wait. Cheers!
Big part of it is the flate rate. Dealers make a mistake and make the mechanics pay for there mistake by under cutting the times. Recalls have cut back so much that you will loose on time. 90 percent of work done at dealers are warranty work. Dealers cut back so much that they don't pay to diagnose cars anymore just plug in the scan tool and replace whatever it tells you too. Just parts changer at dealer now. Didn't change part don't get payed. Need to clock in and clock out per line and run time, test drive car at least 2 miles and tag and bag your part you changed all for not even a half an hour for many warranty items. The other problem is these money hungry schools like UTI. After you get out you still start as entry level making $15 hr and these schools are pumping these kids out that they are replaceable because there's another student that finished every day. I am a UTI graduate and a Mercedes Elite graduate. Was a good run back when i went in year 2000 and the pay was still good. In my opinion being a mechanic is not worth it anymore. Last time i check UTI was close to 40k after evething said and done that's ridiculous. I wouldn't recommend to anyone.
Entry level position: 5 years experience required. This is the catch. Need a job to get experience, but lowest rung positions are experience required. Good luck.
Walk into a shop in person and tell them you want to work, don't just hand in a resume, talk to the owner. Every shop I've ever been to is looking for a guy. Literally stumbling over mechanic jobs everywhere. If you're serious they will hire you. You don't need to have experience. No decent boss on the planet is going to fire you if you learn fast, work hard, and do what needs to get done. You will be at the bottom doing shitty work. When there's no more tires and oil changes for a bit, and the shops clean, just go and pull in a car and start working on it. Don't ask. Take initiative and if they don't let you work move shops. All the information/knowledge you need is on the internet. You will make min wage, so what? That's exactly what I did. I started at $7 and hour 2 years later I was making over $30, doing advanced diagnostics(CAN bus)/engine swaps and whatever came my way, I fixed it. From nothing. Worked 80 hours a week and studied everyday on top. Meanwhile there's guys there my age with double and triple my "experience" and they can only do brake and suspension jobs. Don't expect to get anywhere working 8 hours a day and leaving right on the dot when it's "home time" either. OR, you can sit around complaining. Take your pick.
I give you credit for doing that. But why would you want to sell your soul to a Job? I am a very hard worker I've been told. 40 hours a week is enough on the regular basis. I work about a 100 hours of overtime a year. My Wife and the dogs are more important than a job.
Be the first one to work, work hard, and be the last one to leave when your shift is over. I think that is the point that rsx123 was trying to make about working 80 hours a week.
My plan was to eventually go part-time at a decent wage and go to college, and I didn't want to go to college at 30 so I did what I had to. It burned me out badly. But it taught me so much and it was temporary. I now work 45 hours a week max, Saturdays off. I am not worried about having work because shops talk about who works where and so do the tool truck guys. The tool truck guys know hundreds of shops and they know who can do what and who needs workers. I have a list of shops I can work at so it doesn't own my soul. It pays off.
Hmm..I dunno...The amount of money a good auto tech makes doesn't sound like much of a payoff compared to the amount of time, effort, and skills needed to become one.
From experience starting out in the modern industry the pay wage needs to be higher and training needs to be more forgiving. Starting out new techs need to buy a lot of tools and spend a lot of money. Either a higher wage or a pay stiffen every pay should be given to go towards tools so young techs can live and build easier. I ran into you are shown once before you do a new job but aren’t given any hands on practice before you are handed the job on your own. They expect the first try to be perfect. I don’t know anyone who can do a job perfect the first time they try. The industry should also hire old techs to simply train new techs and not have to worry about themselves getting jobs done. Basically bring is guys to be teachers and mentors. I loved the master tech I was under and learned a lot but he didn’t have time to help unless we where slow or he needed extra hands to do a job. I do agree with mostly everything you said though it was a good video with a lot of good points.
I left the field because no respect or good pay to support a family. I did what etcg said. I showed up applied my self and worked hard. For what a dollar or two over minimum wage. I make more now as I entered the education field, and cleaning toilets at the same time. Sadly bit truly.
sometimes techs get careless, took my SRT8 Jeep for an oil change, usually do it myself but was in there buying some speed parts at the dealership so what the hell.... came home and the next day under my Jeep was a medium sized puddle of oil, the oil pan bolt wasn't tightened properly...went under there and tightened it myself and all was well ...but I did call the shop and tell the manager who I knew for a couple of years about this minor incident and that he needs to have a little chat with his guys...had that bolt fallen off as I was driving home and dumped all that oil out I could've seriously damaged my engine, if not blown it totally, he was doing his version of huge mia culpa and I appreciated it and told me that will never happen again, straight up dude, and he even offered me a free change next time, which was cool since synthetic oil is expensive, twice as much as regular oil... so...shit happens hence why I do what I can on my cars myself...the only person I truly trust anyway!
If you take your vehicle to a national chain store chances are you will be upsold and spend more. I know of one chain whose practice is that no matter the work needed they will look the entire car over and have a minimum estimate of $1000. Find a decent independent local technician. Ask friends family coworkers where they take their cars. When you find one stick with them. Also the younger generation coming up are different and shops are going to need to adjust.
Nick Steinmetz These are the same shops who will tell people that by law they can’t let them leave their shop because their car is to unsafe. Yes it has happened I’ve had it tried on me and know at least 3 women who were told that bullshit. I deal with shops who will fix the problem at hand and give me honest advice about future work needed. I will never trust a National chain. Their business model is sell sell sell.
I work for a national chain, and we do inspections on almost every single car that comes in, but we tailor each inspection depending on the job. For example, if we are doing a simple tire patch, we wont look under the hood. Or if we do a oil change we don't look at the brakes. Mostly because, hey, we have the car in the air, check ball joints, check the tie rods, cv boots. Maybe we can make a few bucks, but it also prevents the customer coming back in 2 weeks and saying "hey, ever since you did an oil change on my car, the front end clunks..." or something like that. Bare minimum we check all of the exterior lights and the tire tread and pressures. Not as a scam, more of piece of mind. We tell each customer that we check the cars over, and if they don't want us to, we don't.
I was a telecom technician (retired 11 years now). Yup, we had numerous slackers protected by the union. Advances in technology actually made my job prehistoric after I retired. The crew I worked in was disbanded. I think I was a pretty good hobbyist gear head wrench turner but knew my limits. Now that I'm REALLY old, many times I take my vehicles to shops. I've quit going to dealers as I found that was a giant waste of time. I've tried many local mechanics and finally found one that is about 10 miles away from home but is worth the drive. These guys actually repair and build hot rods so I figured why not. So far they haven't disappointed me. I dread the time when they close. My friend who owned a transmission shop retired this year. I hope my transmissions hold up till I can't drive anymore.
I've been in the fields now for 14 years. Started at an independent shop when i was 17. 31 at the time of this post. Currently working for a dealership. My biggest thing is that I have gaps in my knowledge and finding a good way to fill them has been difficult. For example I was an ASE certified tech in brakes and steering and suspension when I was 19.Then at my last job that seemed good enough for my boss and I was never pushed to grow and encouraged to grow. So I think its very easy to develop a certain skill level then get stuck at that level in this industry. I'm currently studying to take 3 re certification test and try and push myself to grow. On a separate note I try to help out everyone in the shop if I can. Showing people different ways(hopefully better) to do things or approach a problem should help them learn and grow which is what everyone should be doing. If I know something that can help someone and I don't show them when they ask me for help I feel like I'm doing a disservice to the entire shop and that tech. Sure we all work for our own pay check but if one person loses a customer because an error that could have been prevented then their won't be a next time for the customer to come back which in the end loses business.
I own a shop and techs are more flaky and less reliable than they have ever been, its very sad. Cant show up on time, calling in sick, unwilling to study and learn and I pay very well. The industry is loaded with alcoholics, drug users, techs who are uninsurable due to SR22's or Dui's. The techs you finally do hire have seem to have baby mama drama, garnishments, child support payments and live pay check to paycheck with no savings and constantly need draws. Another thing I notice looking at resumes is constant job hopping, never the same job for more than a year or two.
Valid discussion, Eric, but it's unlikely things will change for the better anytime soon. Charles has pointed out in one of his videos that vehicles need a lot less maintenance than they did 15-20 years ago, so there's that. Dealership service depts. usually operate with one or two master / senior techs, and a bunch of oil change and tire work monkeys. Most flat rate techs are struggling, fighting an uphill battle against getting short-changed by warranty time, starved out by shady service writers (has happened to me more than once), or chasing non-existent complaints by flakey fruitcake customers. Customers, on average, don't seem to give a damn about maintaining their vehicles (doesn't make sense to slack on that, a car represents an investment second only to a house), and often will play the blame game or whatever else it takes to get repair / service work for free.
I always have thought that you do not have to choose what you want to be based on what is more trending or not. You have to choose your profession based on what you are good in, because you will be good in what you like to do and you feel comfortable. This is the only way to enjoy with your job and not to be frustrated when you grow older and look behind what you have done. A good mechanic is that person that feels good when he smells fuel or grease and enjoys with the sound of a V8. I am a telecommunications engineer who has been working in an office for more than 20 years but I envy my son because he is going to be what he always has wanted. I am sure he will be a good mechanic and a happy man. Eric, thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Well, around here where I live I see a bunch of people that dont wanna work, lol. Lets face it, a career in automotive is hard work. Most of the kids around here just dont wanna do hard work. I see it in the aluminum plant 8 work at too. I got out of the field because I seen the places of business I was working take advantage of customers more than help them. But that was just my experience. It's funny to me though cause there are times the youth makes me feel like a genius when one of them sees me di something and asks me how I did it. When you offer to show them the interest seems to instantly walk away
I've seen it the other way too. I've seen young kids work their butt off 12-15/hours a day and eager to learn from everyone. I've seen old farts that just want to cruise (refuse to learn any electrical diag) and do the prepaid gravy and get to work late 20 mins late and leave 30 mins early every day and call out sick every few weeks. Stop blaming the dumb kids. It's the individual.
I was both a certified auto and motorcycle mechanic in my younger days, worked at dealerships and my own shops, quickly learned that it was not for me, because the lack of returns both monetary and personal(dealing with people), most of same reasons previously posted. One the issues is that the car repair industry is poorly regulated, ie, licensing, training,etc. There's a lot of part changers, no a lot troubleshooting. I was fortunate to hold an A+P certificate and had a very successful aviation career, was not perfect, but is a higly regulated field, with lots of training, quality control and personal growth/satisfaction. Also much less dirt and grease all over you. BTW you are personally liable when you work on aircraft, you could get up to jailtime for wrongdoing !! That said is not for everyone !!
5:30 don't sell yourself short. There's a lot we can learn from you. It's hard to motivate people to work for it if they're constantly being told they'll never make money, slave away for nothing... that attitude is causing a problem too
I learned fractions and numbers by passing wrenches to my pop, as a very young child (3-4 yrs old). By the time I got into school I knew how to count, do some math and read/write, which eventually got me bumped up to 1st grade after two weeks in Kindergarten. Perseverance is the key to success for anyone. If you don't try, you don't know.
Community Colleges need to continue to offer training for trade jobs (mechanic, plumber, electrician, carpenter, etc). Those jobs are not going away but they do require training. Those wanting to work in those jobs need to find ways to motivate themselves to become qualified to fill trade jobs. Those willing to work hard and excel will succeed. Glad UTI is still going strong and also willing to sponsor your video. Excellent and timely video - thanks for posting!
My community college does teach trades, they have a great automotive tech program, but idk about those others you mentioned. I went into programming at my local cc, and unlike the university that delves into heavy math and code theory, they teach the basics of coding and the different coding environments then teach common practices in the industry (in addition to the soft skills in said formal environment)
Johnathon Van Durme True! Most shops I have worked for call those technicians "Paper Techs", because they look great on their paper application, but do not know how to perform repairs in reality. Certifications and diplomas look great on the showroom wall, but do not mean the technicians know what they are doing.
Eric, this is happening not just on the automotive industry, I work in a factory and I'm a maintenance technician and I see it there too.. the younger generation does not have the drive that I was brought up.. it's really wierd.. but I agree with you totally! I really hope that it gets better.. but we will adapted to any changes that come in the future just like we do now.. Keep up the good work!!
I have a lovely 10k bill since I wanted to pursue my passion. Job after job, no pay. Left the field to do Uber and I immediately made more money doing that. Also in the HVAC field now. It totally sucked and killed my passion.
A friend of mine got bent over really good by the Matco guy. long story short he payed off his snap-on bill to give him 1 big bill and add that all onto his matco "tab" and into just Matco tools. At a retarded interest rate and well over 18k in debt when he only makes 25-30k a year. He was just out of high school and didn't know better and is still paying the price 4 years later and he dosnt even have a job that needs those tools anymore. He just sprays bed liners
I was an up and coming tech at 19 years old. Showed up for work every day and watched the old dogs work as I did oil changes and tires. I proved my worth to the company and showed my loyalty for 2 years and really stepped up the expectation. I asked for a raise because I was only making 9 bucks an hour. So they paid me my hourly wage plus whatever the job paid. I'd get 30 mins per oil change, an hour for rotate/balance plus oil. I worked so hard that I could squeeze in 5-6 cars an hour alone. I was 1 step shy of running all day. On my down time I'd clean up after the guys. I'd observe and help out with anything, watched engine rebuilds, trans replacements, doing diagnostic. Eventually I started doing recalls and warrantee work. I was excited because I felt I was making progress. Then the dealership owner wants to cut costs. Hires a shop supervisor that sees me, a grease monkey, making almost 2700 a month changing oil and doing minor repairs. 3 months in, he tells me on a Friday at 5 after everyone's gone, after I cleaned 7 bays. That it was my final day, that they have a guy starting Monday. No warning, no "hey we're worried we're paying too much and can't afford you. Maybe we can shuffle things around" I proceeded to do things I regret, because I truly loved working there. I flung my chair in rage, I shouted at the new supervisor who replaced me with a minimum wage burnout with no drive, I called the boss, I told him his pos supervisor is making the workplace hell and that firing me was a mistake. How loyal I was and how much I enjoyed working with everyone. He proceeded to tell me with a smile, he trusts his supervisors decision. People were scared of me because how verbally aggressive I was. I worked for pennies on the dollar for nearly 3 years, just to get canned to intentionally hire some loser who didn't even make it 3 months at my pace. What's funny is soon after 3 other people from the shop left and they were stuck with more repairs than they could handle. Since then I've decided working on my own cars for enjoyment is better, and have bounced around since. I'm 26 now and it still makes me wonder where my life would be if it wasn't for people trying to save a buck
simple, ditch the flat rate system. this system rewards poor practices. instead, make the system pay more for better performance skills, such as complete, proper diagnosis, and complete repairs that fix the problem the first time. pay more for your improved electronic/electric system diagnostic repairs. you cannot flat rate a adaptive cruise control failure to determine vehicle distance, (just a example). High Skill and competency level should be rewarded, not how fast you can cut corners and make high money profit. that will go a long way fixing our image.
Wow Eric you hit this one out of the park. This is a topic that hits close to home for me. I just spent a year working in a body shop. I was hoping to catch on as a helper and learn body work or painting. I am 47 and jumped in on the ground floor as a porter. I found some of the guys were willing to share there knowledge others were not. I am not afraid to put in a hard days work. I leave my area clean and walk way from a job. Proud of the work i have done. I find as am currently looking for a new job. No one wants to give anyone a chance to learn. Everyone seems to want experience, but they are not willing to pay anyone with experience. So i ask how is someone going to get experience? If shops are not willing to hire without experience? I am gifted to be able to fix stuff with my hands. I am looking to start a new career at my age. I would love to hear from anyone on any suggestion of how to get started. Erik
I had the same problem with tv repair years ago, it's a cut throat business, the guy down the street will talk bad about you and never offer any help. we did make friends with a few shops and sent work back and forth, but most techs didn't want to teach me anything.
Thats exactly how the auto industry is. The "experienced" ones keep everything to themselves because they dont want you to catch on and do their job as well as them. Its a very miserable industry and i dont even recommend trying to learn it from the ground up at your age to be honest.
I think it's because being cheap and that's customer-wise. A friend of mine took his car to one of the cheapest mechanics in the area. He came back without *interior side lamps* . This scam could happen, because this *shed* was known for lowest prices and that's it. I often hear about cars that breaks after a month of daily usage. I think it's because of cheapest parts replaced by people who have cheapest stakes for a reason. Another example: my dad put his van to cheapest guy who even didn't do cars daily. He was to replace an axle with a bearings (it was FWD, though). After he did so, we took the car but something did rumble. Turns out he failed to insert the axle properly, so he applied excessive force and speaking of bearing: no grease whatsoever. It had to be taken care of again. I do take my car to one of the most expensive mechanics, because I do have guarantee he can't afford to lose his prestigious name so he won't do anything wrong and I know my ride is ready to go anywhere.
Cheap customers go to cheap ghetto mechanics and get what they pay for. They can cry all they want, I have zero sympathy for cheapskate toxic customers. I also have zero sympathy for the ghetto mechanics that give the good techs a bad name when the customers sues them or brings about payback. Let these two scumbags types of ppl wallow in misery.
Eric I couldn’t agree more with what you are saying.... I’m a tech in Ireland just turned 30 started my apprenticeship when I was 16 and learned my trade from an old school mechanic but kept my new school mentality which has benefited me massively as the years went by. New guys I see coming into the trade now are way behind in both knowledge and skill compared to 8 or 10 years ago and there are very few guys or girls entering the trade here in Ireland. Good mechanics are very very hard to find but yet we still don’t get paid near as much as a plumber or electrician which drives me nuts.... Honestly in Ireland I don’t ever see this changing and in my eyes it is down to one thing and that is the customer and their overall lack of understanding of how their car works and how it needs constant maintenance and yes sometimes repair. Rather than try and be educated by actual professional mechanics/technicians they just jump on google reviews telling everyone how much of a scammer you are cause you replaced a timing belt 3 months ago and now they need an EGR valve and clearly that’s the techs fault 🙄Anyway rant over love the channel dude keep up the good work 👍🏻
Interesting. Sorry to hear about your difficulties, but it's nice to know we're not alone. Hang in there. I wish you the best and thank you for your input.
It's amazing how all seasoned mechanics think alike all over the world we are battling the same problems. I just type similar comparison to plumbers and electricians earlier.
Eric, I came back into the automotive industry after the military in 05 and it was a much different game than it was in the 90s. I worked on a draw for a dealer and it was nuts. Fast forward and I have my shop in Columbus (not too far from you lol) and I've decided to stop doing open drive up work. Now Im a personal contract tech for multiple people and their families. Helps build a great set of trust. I mentioned that because, like doctors, our insurance is insane. However, we don't make as much. I believe the industry is collapsing from the inside out. I worry about hiring young people. Most aren't willing to put in the extra hours afterwards to learn or those that are don't understand why I want them to understand the fundamentals of a clean shop; meaning they are too good to clean tools and floors. Crap, I was paying a kid $20/hr under the table and I still couldn't get him to pay attention or regurgitate an operation. Sometimes he'd show up and others he wouldn't. I also don't think younger kids even think about being a tech as a "real job". Often enough you don't even see techs working on your cars anymore. Your car goes into a dealership broken, the waiting room is nice, and poof car is fixed. I had a younger guy argue with me at AutoZone that the expensive obd scanners fixed all the problems too and as a mechanic I should know that. ::facepalm::. When a child can't see that person making "magic" to a car due to insurance or management not letting customers watch or see techs work, kids can't dream of that job and that job doesn't exist to them. I think I'm the only person on Earth who gets out of their car at Valvoline to talk with the kids everyone else has blinders (hey I go when I'm too lazy to do something myself). Add to all that, cars becoming more disposable, and people don't associate a big work force with the maintenance of disposable products.
Lemme explain my "disposable car" comment. Cars last so much longer now. we're seeing them in the multi-hundreds of thousands of miles before catastrophic failure. However, when they do go, they usually aren't worth fixing thus people just go buy a new one.
Hi neighbor. Thanks for the input. You make a lot of good points, but you also proved another one. You can't keep a good technician down. You saw the writing on the wall and changed your business plan. Good on you for that.
Awesome video Eric. I can not agree more. I only been in this field since February as a service writer and it is so hard to see people come in and not work. I work in a flat rate shop and it blows my mind how slow and rude and inconsiderate these techs can be. Some think they Gods blessing on the shop and with out them that the shop work suffer. I just wish people would have so motivation to work hard and long. It is so dame hard to find good work ethic in this field of industry.
And a lot of younger techs do not want to get their hands dirty, only wanting to work with the computer systems of the car, and see undercar repairs as beneath their dignity.
Eric im a long time fan and subscriber i would like to thank you for inspiring me to become interested in the automotive field i am currently attending a motoring institute and looking forward to one day being a master tech just gotta stay motivated and stay dirty 👌🏼
Great message Eric, the field presents many opportunities for a self motivated young person. We repaired hybrid vehicles in my shop often. Not difficult, just different.
Do not do the auto repair industry a disservice advertising TV shows like all girls garage. That is nothing more than a moneymaking propaganda by the velocity channel. It is nothing more than an infomercial for one product or another with very little to know how to actually included. The show has taken a drastic turn for the worst over the years. Not just picking on that one show, it’s all the shows on the velocity channel these days. Much more can be learned by watching UA-cam videos such as yours, then anything produced by velocity. I understand the women all girls garage have to make a living, but it does very little to help the industry other than tell me where to buy one part or another which also I can see by simply watching the commercials.
Rick I totally understand your point of view on commercialized TV programs. Yes those types of TV shows offer little to no knowledge or insight when it comes to A viewer that wants A show that will teach such viewer something. I will say that those who can make a pay check by doing such shows should be supported, because we are all car family. If you don't like such shows, like myself, then such person can ignore said item. At the end of the day if I were to think about any of the TV shows that you or I dislike and the people associated with such show, I also remember that I my skill set is and forever will be much greater then said TV show people. That being said I don't really care, because I do car stuff for me
Dan Bertholf I remember old shows like the shade tree mechanic from the late 80s early 90s which actually contain automotive how to. Shows in our days only contain installing parts and information on where to buy said part. Very annoying when watching something put out by someone like Eric, you will see mistakes. Yes, Eric has made some mistakes and show them on camera he didn’t cut and retake and bases videos on a script. This is real how to. I just find the commercialized television programs for automotive how to be a complete waste of time and nothing more than an infomercial. If I want to buy a Harley fuel injection system, I already know where to get it. I am fully aware that Cornwell Matco Mac and snap on make tools. I don’t need to be told that in every show. Also, why not show how to remove an engine from a vehicle with nothing more than a floor jack jack stands and a cherry picker and hand tools. Show people how to do things the way they word be likely to do it in their own garage. This is why I don’t watch those shows anymore, and I stick more with UA-cam videos. I know I have been a little bit hard on Eric at times with some content, but his videos are far superior than anything on television these days.
@@rickgaine3476 I never had those shows growing up, and I didn't find Eric's channel Intel after I was a serious technician that had my own mindstate on how I fix automobiles. I watch his stuff cause its enjoyable. I learned how to work on cars because iI had to, so maybe we should make a show together that really shows people something realistic. Im not the best tech in the world, but I do know that all the all nighters i have spend figuring it out has taught me. In modern times there is two kinds on people that watch car stuff, those who just want to see car stuff and those who understand car stuff that need real programming.
Dan Bertholf I remember watching one of Eric‘s old videos years ago when you put an engine in the Dodge pick up only to find out that the engine was pleased. Rather than destroying footage, Eric decided to show the video with the mistake in it which I really appreciate it, because it was a learning experience for everybody. That’s not something you will see on a television show. Eric can be appreciated for that, and for his honest approach at automobile how to repair is. Like I said, I may not have always agreed of them, and truthfully, I have probably been a bit unfair to him in other comments, but his videos really are top notch. And Eric, I do apologize for the snippy things I’ve sent you another comments in the past. Past. I also apologize for the mistakes in his comment due to auto correct on the iPhone.
Great advice, work ethics is very important. Totally agree that now a days it’s important to have sofware and hardware skills to be a good technitian and young people are great candidates to achive this. Just took my BMW, E90 to a nephews friend that is starting his business in his garage and he was very professional, on time, clean and got the job done properly and UA-cam has a lot to do with that, thanks to people like Erick showing how to properly repair cars helps a lot THANKS FOR HELPING THE COMMUNITY.
Etcg1 i work as a tech currently and my gripes with the industry don’t necessarily have to be there but, they are. You made a good point about the flat rate system. Many young guys including myself have been discouraged from being techs because of it. We all have to pay bills and it’s not easy as a beginner. You get around it but it seems like there is a high amount of pressure now in this age to get cars in and out faster. Not to down play on older techs that have been in the industry for 20-30 years but it seems when the older techs started the technology wasn’t so advanced. Now it seems like the younger techs are expected to dive in head first into deep side and be expected to know many things of the vehicle or brand in a short amount of time while getting used to the flat rate system. With that being said and again not taking anything away from old timers in the business but they have grown with the product and have been educated with the technology in the product gradually as it has been introduced over the years. I’d like your input to this and if I’m wrong let me know too. I do understand that at some point people had to learn about technology way back but systems were less complex 20-30 years ago. Thank you.
Personally I don't think new techs should work flat rate. I think they should be paid hourly and work under a more experienced technician who can show them the way. This way we can 'grow' new talent instead of throwing them into the deep end expecting them to swim. Thank you for your comment and good luck in your career.
Every field you have to pay your "dues"! Plumber's, electricians, they call them apprenticeships...us old techs didn't know everything right out of the gate, it takes time. I'm 53 and still wrench'n with my two man shop and making a good living but, again,IT TAKES TIME. Even if you go to college to become a doctor, it will take time to build a clientele to were you make enough to pay for your overhead. IMO your generation wants everything NOW!! Sorry pal doesn't work that way. Sooner you realize this the better off you'll be.
I think that dealerships and bad repair shops really don't help with there attitude of 'profit is god', Rip off the 'Cash cow' or customer if you can. (Honesty is a problem) Who would want to work in such a immoral environment? No one needs or wants more stress in there life, it is destructive. i've been there, no thanks :-( Feeling that you have done a good honest job is the best, not just how much money you get. Just my Opinion, Sorry for waffling.
No worries, I love waffles. That said, there is another side to this. Operating a repair shop is very expensive. Workmans comp alone will set you back big time. Not to mention insurance and equipment cost. Unfortunately if technicians are going to get paid more, the cost of auto repair will have to come up accordingly. As always, thanks for your input.
I think it's in a lot of industries but it's easy to single out the auto industry. I've seen the rip off the cash cow in the medical industry a lot more but no one questions them that much. The medical industry upsells lots of tests, exploratory procedures and experimental therapies that are used to make their clinic or medical group more money. Also, the prescribe a lot of pills and alot of other pills to counter the side effects of the first 5 set of pills.
Eric I believe you made some good points in this video! As a former VW mechanic and ironically a former UTI student, there's a lot of hope built up into new recruits! What these tech colleges DON'T mention is the low side of the flat rate system, or "guarantee" rate! I left the automotive field for just that reason! A lot of people that go into the field aren't aware of the shop hierarchy or pecking order! My twin brother and I were 2 of the highest skilled techs, but we got most of the "grunt" work! Our pay was mostly guarantee rate! My brother was the only master tech in the shop! I took great pride in the work I did, but simply didnt go anywhere! In the shop there was two different techs! You had actual technicians, and you had the garden variety hacks! In a 5 year stretch, I had ZERO comebacks! I took the time and actually diagnosed the problem! The "hacks" would simply change the part they thought was bad and move on! By the time the problem resurfaced, they had already been paid! If they were busy working on something else, then that comeback would get handed off to the next lowest person in the pecking order! The only problem with that is that the comeback DOES NOT get charged to the customer! If it goes to the original tech, then he gets paid nothing! If it goes to another person then it gets charged to internal! I could go on a lot longer about this! I think your videos are great! I've watched everyone of them! The information you give is probably the best I've seen! I simply have a problem with the internal workings of dealerships, and how they accept new techs! Do they have to prove themselves, YES! It's just very hard for new techs to prove themselves, if the service managers or advisors simply won't give them the chance to because someone else is quicker!
UTI is a great sponsor to have. UTI is very respectable I almost went there but I went to Hobart Institute of Welding Technology instead. I work on cars out of my own shop and cars are changing fast and you must keep reinvesting in your equipment and education or you will be left in the past. Eric makes so many valid points and speaks only the truth about both sides of the fence. Eric is a good technician that is great at making videos and public speaking.
The lack of people coming into the field is a product of two things. Democrats pushing government dependence and socialism, killing the want for people to earn their own way. Second the declining wages for automotive technicians vs the rising costs of tools and training.
T Web I drove through New Jersey last week and even in the "Nice" areas 3/5 houses are abandoned or on sale for really low prices do to over taxation. I drove past a 5 bedroom house that had a sign for 39k.......the property taxes would be close to 3grand a month
@@lovemym16 Here in NJ we are held prisoner by the NJEA or better known as the New Jersey Education Association or a more fitting name is the New Jersey Extortion Association, the school administrators and there are several for each district make ridiculous salaries then there is the busted pension funds now the gas tax is going up 4 % on top of the 23 % a couple of years ago our new Democrat governor as with all Democrats never met a tax he didn't like it's complete madness.
Great topic. You hit the nail on the head. It's about work ethic and pride in what you do. Millenials need to step up (for those who haven't yet) and make a living through an honest days work. Wether it's wrenching on cars, banging on a keyboard or flipping a burger...get the job and take pride in it. Own it. 34 years ago I started sacking groceries for a local chain of grocery stores. Now I manage a drug store for one of the largest chains of drug stores. And I make damn good money doing it. And I love what I do. I grew up wrenching on cars. I have passed that knowledge and love of doing it on to both of my son's. All three of of my daughter's have helped me in the garage through the years and still do at times. They don't always know exactly what I'm doing but they'll turn a wrench or hold a flashlight for me if I ask. I know have a grandson that I am passing my knowledge on to. Maybe he will be the one to go on and become a service tech. You never know. Through the years of working on cars with my younger son (who is 24 now) one of his friends would come over and watch us, fetch tools for us, etc... his father and grandfather are/were brick masons. He went to college and got a business degree in accounting and planned to take over the family business one day...then one day his plans changed. He says he was inspired by what we made look so easy and he loves BIG trucks. So moved to Cleveland, enrolled in a tech college, did his time there and is now a diesel tech here in Michigan. He loves what he does. So there is always hope for MORE people to find their way to auto tech careers.
My niece once had a boyfriend who is looking to get into the industry and I told him about UTI. I told him if he gets into the automotive repair industry he will never be for want of work. I do some minor Automotive repairs myself stuff that I can handle stuff that I have the equipment to handle. I tried to get my nephew interested in doing the basic of Automotive repairs but he had no interest. I told my niece's boyfriend about this and that my nephew is one of the reasons why you will always have work. I then proceeded to ask my nephew if his school had shop class, he told me they did. I then asked him, why not take one? You know what his reply was, I don't want to get dirty. I just hung my head in disappointment. Kids today they don't want to do physical labor. While I am not that old that is where I've gained most of all of my skills, that and also by watching people who do physical labor and repair things. My neighbor who lived across the alley was constantly tinkering around in his garage primarily repairing lawn mowers that were thrown out by people that he picked up from his sons salvage yard, this is where I learned how to repair things. Sorry for the long comment if anyone has taken their time to read it thank you.
M W S spot on brother. My brother and I been working on our own motocross bikes since we were 6. No adult help either. "Here's the tools and the manual and figure it out" along with vitamins, homework and EFD discipline. (Read 70's old school no-BS) Kids since then (even) been raised Soft and Spoiled. My bro and I still fix everything we can, automotive to carpentry and plumbing, he was also an electrician for many years. Kids these days, a lot, just worthless GAMERS. And parents too lazy and stupid to not beat them senseless. I played video games as a kid too, but also chopped wood until midnight with frozen fingers by flashlight or floodlights. Yeah we chopped enough wood to supply the US army, haha, anyway, f*** these lazy kids I forgot my point. Ahhhh f*** 'em all !!!!!!! 😄
I’m a younger guy trying to work my way up, and I can honestly say I love having the older guys around they have so much knowledge, tips, and tricks that help tremendously! Us younger guys just need to listen and come ready to bust some ass everyday.
I was leaving the business, but I decided to get out of the dealership network instead. It really helped me grow as a tech. I'm better off making salary instead of flat rate but there has to be some sort of profit sharing built in as well. Finding something wrong with a car in the shop and reporting it to the customer starts/ begins with the tech, so he should get something for it if a sale is made. The flat rate system in my opinion is messing up the industry, and doesn't give an average tech enough time to learn everything new coming out and also make a real living wage (at least 75K per. year).
I've seen the work of a specialist electric vehicle/hybrid shop in a big city spend months on a customers electric vehicle, then bill them $4500 for the honor of still having a non running vehicle. Seriously. So the customer got a hold of me years after I stopped repairing/modifying electric vehicles. In 6 hours I had it running. I'm 58 years old. I drew my own schematics of the 3 phase electric vehicles I use to service from customers world wide. This was before Tesla, Nissan, etc had their hardware on the road. There is nobody for me to pass my knowledge down to. After market repair services are becoming mandatory for electric vehicles as they get past their warranty periods. All over Craigslist there are people claiming to refurb battery packs with used parts. It's easy work. But it's not very technical. The demand is getting higher each year. Yet nobody that I can see is being trained for that market. Eric, you have the perfect mindset and skills to be one of those EV techs. In just over a year, Tesla's will start to fall out of warranty for example. Entertainment value aside, the only tech-ish person I've seen on UA-cam is Rich Rebuilds. His knowledge of Tesla is expanding rapidly. I'd like to see you as a serious wrench, collaborate with someone like Rich to broaden your already wide skill set. I don't know him. But I know what I see as his EV skills being valuable, just like your skills.
love what we do, i think this will bring us far ahead instead of focusing which industry will make u earn more money. I like to repair stuffs, from IT to automotive, i like to learn and keep improving. Especially watching your ericthecarguy video which enable me to do some repairs on my own car.
By trade I'm a retail manager, but it's truly a art form to have the knowledge to understand and diagnose a vehicle. I've seen people not taking the time to fully find out what a vehicle needs and then just throwing parts at a car and then complaining that the noise didn't go away. Taking the time to fix the root of a issue is extremely important. That's why I work on my own stuff, but I will own it...I have a tire guy and he's amazing.
Unfortunately as a first year Tech, I find myself battling the industry for an opportunity to learn. I can read, I can watch videos. However, experience as I'm sure you know comes from the practical side of things. So an instance where I'm focusing on a brake job, the gravy work as we all call it. I'm shoved aside eating the bullet because the licensed tech can A) Do it faster and B) Wants that pay check. So my opportunity to learn and gain a skill set is tossed aside for that quick dollar. I'm not going to say it's like this everywhere but as I've worked at a Honda Dealership, an Independent Shop and now a larger private chain, its easy to say that our learning is on the back burner and these stories are going around. So its hard for newer guys like myself justify continuing in a trade where in 4 years time, I'm going to be screwed because my skill set isn't where it should be. That's just my experience as a first year tech about to go back to school for my second block of schooling. Are these thoughts addressed in depth in any of the upcoming videos as I'd like to improve as a technician but never given the time of day. Though I graduated through an Automotive program, I am considered a tire buster by the older guys, and not an up and comer. The frustration is real.
Full disclosure; I majored in computer science and design/write software for a living. I just do minor repairs on my vehicle for fun; I don't really need to do it to save money, I just like taking things apart and seeing how the insides work. I think one of the major barriers to entry that hasn't been mentioned yet is how ad hoc and sometimes even cloistered automotive knowledge is. Before I even thought of going to college, I was already programming fluently in multiple languages, reading the source code of my operating system to see how it worked, and reading RFCs for the major communications protocols. But it isn't as if there are publicly available specifications and schematics for vehicles. And with the increase in complexity in vehicle design over the past couple decades, you really can't just dive in with a set of wrenches and a little bit of mechanical intuition. If you don't already have someone in your life that knows a thing or two it is very hard to get started. Plus, manufacturer's do nasty things like require specialty tools and hide the ECM source code. Eric plays a very important roll in lowering that entry barrier by collecting, organizing, and presenting repair information in a coherent way so that all someone really needs is a little motivation. P.S. There are a surprising number of people in the comments that missed the "old people are part of the problem too" half of the message.
Great video the new folks going into the auto repair business needs to learn things also from us guys and ladies who grew up on the old school technology. For example i had a guy bring me his 55 chevy because none of the new Tech's knew how to rebuild a carburetor. He told me he went to 6 shops and everyone was afraid to touch it, i rebuilt the carb in 30 minutes had it back on the car and running good. Its a shame these new generation Tech's are scared to learn something old. Great job Eric keep it up .
I work at a chevy dealer and spent 2 years at a ford dealer and a year and a half at an indie shop. Im in my late 30s and just graduated tech school in 2015. I was a machinist and field service tech before. For me the most important thing is do you have a career path laid out? Do you have certain things you expect from me in a certain amount of time? Something I can shoot for and look forward to? But dealers can be veeery different. Some guys love helping newer guys get aquainted (to the point of being annoying sometimes) but if youve got a master tech in your shop that will help other guys and even lets you use tools here and there. Boy thats a difference maker. Service writers and managers make a big difference too. There are shops where everyone busts their hump all day and no one makes money and there are shops where its kind of laid back and everyone banks.
Eric your still kickin man i so happy that you "made it" from always working on the ground in practically a shed compared to your shop now... keep up the goodz. And happy birthday if its your birthday.
I think it starts back in high school where they have removed most shop type programs. cars, wood working, ect. I personally think the flate rate system needs to change... Warranty times are getting cut all the time, the average time now to overhaul a transmission is 5-6 hours the manufactures state you can get extra time it just needs to be signed off on, but every dealer i've been to or talking to guys at hands on training classes, the dealers don't to fill out the extra paper work. You can make a ton of money doing routine maintenance how ever most of the time you get a job its after someone else has done all the maintenance and they are coming in for a problem that only a handful of guys can diagnose. Personally for me if my paycheck was x amount every week id be happy no matter what id did. I'm fully certified in electric cars and have all 9 ases with 100% in GM training. I love my job, often i just hate how we are paid. The one good thing gm has done is offered up to an hour for electrical diag, you just have to have your punch times in place and a story to back it up.
The problem is you went into a dealership in the first place. This limits your ability to learn like tech in independent shops, were you need to be diverse in many makes and models. Maybe you start your own shop doing GM only, give better service than the dealer and their(GM) junk you'll be plenty busy!
I just started my first day at university for an Engineering degree today, and feel optimistic about it. Was in a dealership for almost 4 years and was good at it, but didn't see much of a future for myself long-term. As you said, both sides need to step-up. Many techs at the dealer left for greener pastures, but came back some time later, which scared me as to where things were headed. I do miss it sometimes, getting dirty with my hands, and being around my co-workers was fun. But rent kept going up, and my paycheck wasn't. I came in at opening and left short of closing too. Maybe after I graduate, I'll become the very thing I hated most when I questioned who the hell built whatever I was working on at the time.
Flat rate incentivizes some negative things, like speed over quality and anytime commission is involved, that can incentivize work that isn't really necessary. It's not all flat rate's fault. I would say part of it is just the business ethics of the people that run these businesses that have no compunction of taking advantage of people's ignorance, but that's always been there, but the up sell of unnecessary stuff during recalls and warranty repairs is annoying at best, but people fall for it. It's one of the reasons I don't use dealers or shops for maintenance and repairs as I haven't found a place that was up to my ethical standards, which would save me time at least. That said, I tend to agree with Eric, but the industry needs to fix itself.
I can attest to the lack of quality that flat rate encourages. I've seen some real half assed jobs from brakes to engines to recalls. Really D rate work from 30 year old Master Techs as well.
I may not be working in the automotive industry, but I do work in another field as a technician fixing phones and tablets but I do know how to turn a wrench and fix my own car when need be. I do on the other hand, have a younger brother teying to get in the automotive industry and whenever I work on my car I have him help me out. If I wasn't fixing phones I'd be in the auto repair industry myself. And you are right, it's going to need some work from both sides of the equation for this industry to continue to succeed and your work ethic can say quite a lot about you. I'm 20 almost 21 and I've been promoted to assistant manager a second time for the same company and plan on starting my own repair shop in the next few years. Every job I've had ever since my first real job I maintained a good ethic and left each one on a good note meaning I put in a two weeks notice none of that I don't like this job I'm not going to show up anymore. And each one has been very generous and gave me a a great reference. Hard work pays off ladies and gentlemen.
7:03 YOURE RIGHT ON POINT ERIC! AND THATS WHAT IT TAKES TO BE SUCCESSFUL IF ANY FIELD WHEATHER YOURE A MECHANIC OR A STOCK BROKER OR A DOCTOR.YOU SOLVE PROBLEMS
Hi Eric right out of high school in the Bay Area Iwent to a junior college and got my service technicians degree unfortunately I never really used it because I wound up working for winery as a facility maintenance technician, we have trucks and cars that I Im able to lightly work on, just today we had a hug truck Ford F550 box truck with the V 10 and the thing wouldn’t hardly idle it was hunting for an idle, I was able to remember some of my basic troubleshooting skills and found out that the air filter mass airflow sensor and the throttle bodies were all covered with oil etc, after cleaning everything with the appropriate cleaners idle finally stabilized.
Here in North Queens, there are 2 issues. Name brand stations replacing mechanic bays with a convenience store, and even busy, well located gas and repair shops, going out because of the value of the real estate they sit on. I worked in Auto Parts for a number of years, and even people I trusted too work on my car, screwed up. So I am hesitant to pay someone to work on my car, and never give anyone recommendations as too where to get their car fixed.
Part 1 - (who am I) I am a Data Center Storage Engineer who now freelances talent to business. Having said that, I also have a well equipped garage and just rebuilt a Ford Focus Engine and dropped it back in the other night. So I have both the mechanical and IT. Part 1 - Over the last year or so I was asked by the owner of a local auto repair shop (he actually owns two) that has 10 bays, two buildings. The owner is a friend of mine though another interest. One day he pulled into my driveway (just moved and no one knew where I was) and told me he needs me to redo his business. He wanted new computers, updated shop software, new phones, a video security system, wifi, integration with tablets and print stations for wiring diagrams. All of which I did for him. 70 network ports and counting at this point. Everyone has tablets, Identifix, shop management access, you name it. Access to all the information at their finger tips. During all this I learned from him a LOT about the stress points of a shop like that, got to know the service writers and the mechanics. The owner and the mechanics are all now "integrated" with IT and information to cope with the vast changes going on. This. . . .is were it is going.
Worked hard all my life. Showed up on time. Did quality, conscientious work always with integrity and not taking advantage of the customer ever. Sometimes even did work for free to help someone out in a bind with their car. But bosses still screwed me over. What gives? Such is life. Phil
Thank you for your integrity. I've heard some good advice: Don't take it personal if they dont thank you or appreciate you for you going the extra mile. Just do good for yourself knowing you dont screw ppl over like the rest of the super star productive workers aka scumbag cheats. But do look out for your own interests. If they want you work on your days off but wont pay your overtime rate, then decline politely saying you have plans. If you find a better opportunity leave. Always stay professional and polite no matter what. Also, stay positive by not associating with the cheats and get a hobby to take your mind off work all the time.
I'm doing car hard case diagnosis. As well, module repair(ecu, abs, clusters, etc). This is really interesting work. I have about 15yrs electronics repair experience.
I don't work in the automotive service/repair industry, but I hear so many coworkers and family blame the mechanics when they had a CV joint replaced and 2 weeks later their fuel pump goes out on their 2002 car with 232,765 miles and guess who they blame, yes the mechanic that put in the CV joint. People wrongfully blame the mechanics all the time.
Sort of like how your car is in the shop so you borrow someone's car just to go to the store for a gallon of milk, and as you're driving, the ABS light comes on and they say that you must have done something because it wasn't on before.
You can use sarcasm all you want, here in South Florida there's a serious trust issue with finding a trustworthy mechanic. Either their shop looks like a night time chop shop, their attitude is messy and rude, or they flat out lie to my face because I don't look like I know car stuff (or anything). So unless standards change and chain shops go away, the industry might as well die
All mechanics have dealt with scam artists like that. There are tons of examples I could give you after 30 years in the biz, and. I'm just one dude.
In my opinion, as well as experience, if someone you know is prone to this kind of scam, then it's only a small matter of time before they go sideways on you or anyone else. Do not trust these fools, even if they are in your family.
Pretty funny I hope you pointed out to your family member or friend that the fuel pump has absolutely nothing to do with the CV joint.
One of the reasons why they are fuel pump may have gone out is that they let their gas tank get so low as to make the fuel pump work very hard as well as not have enough fuel to help keep it cool since as I'm sure you know the fuel in your gas tank helps to keep the fuel pump cool.
It's the same in IT. You touched it once last year so it must be your fault that my 5 year old pc that is on 24/7 developed a problem today.
The problems in Automotive industry have a lot in common with the restaurant industry. I have a chefs ticket and a transmission rebuilders ticket. Both employers want fully qualified trained people to work for minimum wage. So there is a large turnover or a bunch of the unskilled producing mediocre or less work. All while the owner puts in a pool at home and the employees are trying to find their next meal.
I just rebuild top end engine that is flag 22 hours and the dealer charge customer more than 2000 in labor while I get pay 200 bucks do the math
F-ck that!
Exactly.
Fully qualified to be a BMW technician. Will start out at 34$ an hour.
Exactly
I suspect that any young man who can diagnose electrical problems in modern cars, can probably earn more in some field besides auto mechanic.
I fully agree with you.
Not if he's an independent, roving contractor - a friend of my does that as an AC tech and makes a really good living.
Sad, but true.
The auto manufacturers would LOVE to see techs go away completely. They would much rather sell you a new car any time your old one breaks down, but they aren't smart enough to realize because of some of the dirty shit they've done, people don't have enough money to buy new. It's just not an option.
Buying new cars is horribly wasteful and awful waste of money. There are so many cars taken off the road that are readily repairable and usable it boggles my mind. There are people that make 1/3 of what I make, complain they don't have any money, but drive around in brand new cars, at some $500.00 a month!
I was a mechanic for 3.5 years, came in as a lube tech at a ford dealer while in school and the was promoted to general line (Main shop) technician doing recalls and such once i graduated. Was only a main shop tech for about half that time and up until last month I have left the industry. Ford has decided to cut most of their decent paying recalls down by almost half. Such as Door latches ex.(2.9 hours ---> 1.3 hours) and so on. Most of the recalls that Ford has put out are due to simple neglect of torque specs, proper testing and cheap Chinese parts...ex.( f150,explorer seat frame bolts improperly torqued)(foucs, fusion, escape,fiesta etc. door latches breaking and replacement)(escape side curtain air bag replacement due to improper deployment)(expedition seat track measurement and torque)(f150 transmission selector cable clip verification)(MT82 mustang transmission shift forks breaking) and mind you most of these recalls dont pay anything! .2 (12 min) to .7 (42 min) at most.. so by the time you grab the keys, find the car, pull it into your bay, grab parts form parts department, perform recall, return warranty parts and write up tech notes and thenand then park the car, you are WELLLLLL over the alotted 12-42 minutes they give you to perform the recall..BS!.. Worked with technicians who have been their 20+ years and they are becoming very discouraged at what the industry is becoming. Because im young (22), ive chosen to leave the industry and go onto bigger and better things. As the auto industry becomes more advanced in technology, pretty soon the mechanics who get paid to DIAGNOSE vehicles with their equipment will soon become PARTS RE-PLACERS as the computer will tell them what is wrong and what to replace, meaning most technicians who have gone to school and acquired all this knowledge in those 20+ years, will be forced from the industry as they will be replaced by dealers for cheaper workers with a vast knowledge gap. A huge disservice to the industry. Glad to be out of the business... Since my leave from the dealership, 4 other technicians have done the same....student technicians beware!
That's a real shame. Why are dealerships allowing the mfgs. to dictate how long a particular job is supposed to take? How can they expect that any job is going to take 12 minutes. I learned a long, long time ago that there is no such thing as a 10 minute job. If enough techs leave the dealerships then they are going to be forced to raise the wages and fix these stupid time allotments or forgo the work and let the independents handle it.
the computer tells them what's wrong, well they tried that at AT&T the computer tests your tel line and reads out a code, that way anyone could then tell the customer what's wrong and dispatch a tech to fix it. In the old days you sat on a test board with dials and switches and actually tested the line and had to have some knowledge.
Like I said. We need to pay these mechanics properly...
Look at the way companies treat their workers today, talked with my dr. yesterday she's fighting to get worker's comp benefits for one of her patients a truck driver that was let go after 27 yr. He was working 16-17 hr. a day which is illegal and when his heath gave out they let me go and now he has to fight for worker's comp & disability benefits from social security.
warranty times = labor theft. I told Volvo reps all the time they are stealing my labor and the dealership is not paying me if Volvo wont pay them. They're all crooked and make money off our blood and sweat.
Low manufacturer's warranty hours, low management respect and high cost of living and operation. I left because i was unappreciated and unmotivated. The lack of my motivation was seeing and hearing all of my senior techs talking about how theyre treated. The industry management, in my area, seems to not value loyalty and hard workers and will just as quickly kick a tech thats been with them for 20 years to the curb as they will the new guy. Its hard to want to make the dealer all their money and support their business when they treat you as disposable. And hoping it gets better doesn't work when your senior techs are getting the same treatment.
i hear you all i hear about from the other techs in my shop is how shitty warranty work pays...for instance a strut on a dodge journey is like 0.2hrs wich is nuts,,,,its so spurratic that some jobs youll get paid like 3hrs but only takes 1.5....ive worked on domestic all my life n makes me wonder in import warranty pays this bad?
@@Scypher0th it really depends. Some subaru payouts were fine. Some you were basically working for free. Which is why i personally don't like flat rate. Its one of the only careers where youre continuously asked to work for free. Or help out the owner with a used car by taking bs hours for the work it needs so the millionaire can make some more money off you. And dont get me started on healthcare through the company
I agree. The Service department brings in the serious money for a Dealership (Ford in my case) much more than the small percentage made on overall new car profit margins, and yet Technicians/Mechanics are treated like shop equipment at best. I have never been a "fast" technician, but I always did the 100% repair, whereas I would see other "Good" techs (read "fast") that cut so many corners, that morally I could not compete. Though by far my worst experience with flat-rate was working for Firestone. A new manager was hired that had his eye on a district manager position, and needed to get the shops "numbers" up, and thus forced techs to perform tons of free work. Cleaning your workspace is one thing, if you spill oil on the floor while repairing a car, it is your responsibility, but cleaning the entire building and doing "busy" work...? The previous manager would itemize this under "non-productive" time, so we still got paid. The new manager would have us organizing tire racks, scrubbing the exterior of the building, cleaning the parking lot, inventories, shop equipment repairs/maintainence, and demanded we not "flag" any hours to do so, in order to get the shop profits up. I refused to work for free, was called a cancer and was let go. Left a bad taste in my mouth for flat rate.
@@nerhu59 this is the same mentality i had and why i had an issue with flat rate. Im someone who takes pride in my work but i am not a fast tech. I take pride in doing it the right way the first time tho. If this takes alittle extra time then so be it, which makes flat rate a disadvantage.
I agree, the warranty times get shorter and shorter. Sometimes the dispatcher will throw you a good 30-60-90k service job to hopefully bring your time back up. Then again sometimes that doesn’t always happen. My Father worked for 30+ years as a tech and back then the times were a whole lot better than today. But he also said if you do one particular warranty job enough times, you’ll do the job more quickly. I myself was in used car reconditioning where the work was more plentiful, especially during certain times of the year.
As a UTI alumni and former technician for Audi, I will say working for a corporate dealership wasn't for me... even the industry wasn't. First the amount of debt you incur in order to go to UTI is outrageous and one can learn the same fundamentals at a local tech school. Second, you have to invest a ton of time in order to make decent money. I'm talking 8 to 10 years, which isn't ridiculous if u are young and starting off in the industry. Forget being older and learning the flat rate system. Jobs are handed down by team leaders and their friends are handed gravy work while you get shafted with diagnosis work. In the end, it just wasn't putting food on the table so I left the industry and went into another field. Take aways: company makes a ton for service repairs, techs make very little
good points. Yes the debt is a problem and UTI has made agreements that essentially keep other school graduates out of jobs. Take Mercedes-Benz, their dealer only hire UTI graduates- as if other schools don't teach students anything. Been there done that. My story is similar but I didn't go to UTI.
@@Mn09lfV6f I will say this, UTI does offer advanced training... well they partner with certain manufacturers and they charge you a good penny in order to attend their training. You come out at a higher level and in some cases very to pick the location you would like to work. However, it isn't cheap and your admittance into the program depends on GPA and other factors. Still you are able to very a head start on the competition. I believe they have ties with Ford, BMW, Fiat and maybe a couple more, it's been a while so I can't remember them all. I will say German engineering is very advanced and some dealers don't give a darn about how many ASE certifications you have. They want you to learn the systems of their vehicles and move up the tracks according to their tier levels.
I went to my local community college for a year, full time, for automotive tech in 2018. It cost me about $5,500, I think. Spent about another $1200 at Harbor Freight and I'm pretty well equiped. (To work on my own cars anyway)
@@isaiconchas2602 My local community college does those things too.For waaaay cheaper.
Everyone has a bad mechanic story... :( There is a lot of things that can and need to change at ALL levels to push the industry in the right direction.
I know I have a much more optimistic view than most, but I have also seen a TON of good in my career. Way more good than bad.
HumbleMechanic I wish I could break into the automotive industry. Theres a lot of apprentice programs here in Bahrain but I can't qualify without a highschool diploma. Instead Im working for my dad in the hospitality business .. pay is good but I'd rather be wrenching..
@Andrew H. All mechanics? So you, who never met me before, believe I am a fraud and do people wrong? Maybe you need to look at your sad, pathetic life and figure out how to remove your head out of your ass
Wsup humble mechanic! At age 35 married with kids i can't afford to switch carreers. I'd be earning a starting salary thats 3x less and with an annual increase of 5% max by law it really bites.. so instead I enjoy watching your videos after work!
My opinion it bias based on many years of seeing amazing customer service and techs going out of there way to do what is right. Do people get screwed on car repair? YEP!!! and that is not okay, those techs/shops should be called out for it.
I was in the industry in California from 1988 to 2008, 20 years. Grew up around people working on cars, and had a pretty sound background when I got my my first job at a Jeep Eagle dealer as an apprentice. I went to a VW/Audi independent for a few years, and then to a dealer. When I started in the 80's, flat rate was $20 an hour around here for a mechanic. When I left, I was an ASE mater tech(those tests are a joke), L1, had my California smog license (we did smog checks at the dealer I worked at, and they bumped me up a dollar for it, a friggin dollar.) and was an Audi master tech. I was at $28 flat rate. I could actually do diagnosis, so I was often bogged down with electrical and drivability problems no one else could seem to fix, and the subsequent fighting with the warranty administrator to get paid for diagnostic time. The pen is mightier than the wrench, and anyone who has worked at a dealer knows you are going to have to write a slew of lies to get paid for your time. Ever adjusted (downward) warranty times, shop politics, nowhere to promote to, being completely unappreciated, wear and tear on your body, bad knees, bad back, shops hiring too many techs for the workload, shops giving all the gravy work to low paid trainees, the list goes on. The pay has not kept up with inflation. That $20 in 1988 would be $44 now, and the amount of know how and training increased exponentially. Despite that, the lowlife grease monkey stereotype lingers. My last year I made 60 grand. I made that in 1990. I literally drove my truck into the shop with no notice, packed up my tools and box(an easy 25 to 30 grand worth at that point), and left. While I was packing, the service manager asked me what it would take for me to stay, I said $55 an hour, he actually laughed. I still do side jobs once in a while, and the last one I did, I made 90 bucks an hour, and the person was happy to pay it. That is how undervalued you are as a technician working for a shop.
While I taught my sons to fix things from day one, I steered them towards college also. Screw that whole industry. If they paid what techs are worth, they would have techs. If you are smart enough to be a competent tech on todays cars, you are smart enough to do something else. DO SOMETHING ELSE!
I briefly considered it, after starting on DIY auto repair and helping a few other people out. But wouldn't want to work in this field because:
-working under excessive time pressure
-dirty and unhealthy job
-modest pay compared to the health risks
It's only a dirty job if you don't wear gloves. As a DIY mechanic I realised that it's far easier to stop yourself getting dirty with disposable gloves than it is to get car dirt off you afterwards.
Good points, but I'll be devils advocate.
Being a mechanic has also given me other skills that I've found useful and profitable. Problem solving for one. Welding, time management, and I've also used my skills to branch out into plumbing, electrical wiring, tile, carpentry, as well as a few other trades. Not to mention entrepreneurship.
In essence, your skills don't have to end at the garage. You can move beyond it. It's really about self reliance if you think about it.
Eric, the industry,aka the older guys like us, need to help these young techs coming up in this industry, take the kids under our wings and help the grow as technicians. The industry is always changing, many rear brake jobs now require a scan tool, to retract the parking brake/piston.
Can I be under your wing Mike 🙄
Great to hear senior techs talking in that way and wanting to help the younger generation. Also enjoy the Pico dude there great fun ✌🏻
@@lenny2137 thanks!
@@SouthMainAuto i think Keith has you covered😉😁
They take your jobs along the way too
Maybe others are in the same boat as me. I'm 22 love working on my cars and friends cars. There's not a bolt I haven't touched on my 90 supra. But I'd never want to do it as a job. I'd rather work at costco making close to 60k a year in an air conditioned warehouse and do car stuff on my own personal time. Yes I would like to have a job working on cars but I see way to many people who literally work themselves into the grave in the auto industry. Not that that's always the case but in my area it happens alot.
Not that you can't make really good money in the auto industry but it just didn't seem inviting/a good route to take for me right out of high school. Believe it or not I actually worked with a guy at costco for awhile who was a master tech that was in and out of jobs trying to make a living hes at Firestone now until he can get back on at a dealer
Never underestimate the value of air conditioning.
That's a good point, and it's not a good idea to make your 'hobby' your 'job', because after it's a 'job', it stays a job. But if you love what you do, you never work a day in your life.
Man! I wish I had that perspective when I started in this field 30 years ago. age 53 still wrench'n.
Ok just don’t get yourself into debt and you won’t have a problem. Minimalism is a virtue.
I've worked for a few new car dealers and some private shops and the biggest thing I've learned is the service writer is usually your worst enemy and makes more than the tech actually doing the work and gets bonuses based on surveys from the customer about my work. The manufacturer's warranty times are absolutely ridiculous there's no way techs can do things in the allotted time they give you and when you don't your losing money. The service industry is in the shape it's in because of it's self. Tech's all deserve a raise and flat rate needs to go, all flat rate is designed for is to make hard working people work for free. For example I was the only one in my shop that could r and r a Kia Sportage transmission in 8 hours, warranty pays 4. If anyone can do it faster I'd like to see it
Oh you should try the turbos on V10 TDI Touraeg or a W8 engine in a Passat! Pure Hell!
I know you said usually is the enemy, but, I am a service writer. At my shop after 4 years I make pretty much what a new apprentice would, and I get yelled at by customers all day. I don't get any bonuses in any shape or form. I think that is one thing technicians forget is that we handle the customer relations, because that is what keeps the work coming in the door. Not saying that one job is any better than the other. I would really like to become a tech eventually, but I can't afford the tools or schooling right now. Just keeping a roof over my head and my truck on the road is enough.
^ This , I'm also from Pa. and left the industry for exactly this reason . We Techs were treated like dirt at the Dealership . It got so bad Customers would call and ask to talk to Tech and avoided the Manager at all cost . It became extremely toxic . The Gas industry came to the area and I quit the Dealership ...bye bye
Sadly, the rip off artist moniker is definitely a where there is smoke there is fire type of thing. Finding shops you can trust is an issue.
click bait
I mainly associate that moniker with quick-oil-change shops, which are the most common target of sting ops to reveal scams in the industry ua-cam.com/video/-avpx8UTakI/v-deo.html
Some small shops are bad about that too though. One of my friends took his pickup to a couple shops in town, cause the rear end was making a clacking noise as he drove and he was sure the diff was going out. Here's how that played out:
*Shop 1*
Friend took it in to em, told em to fix it. Gets it back a day later, they tell him it was just fine and charge him for the inspection. He gets a quarter mile down the road and it makes the exact same noise.
*Shop 2*
Friend tells them about the issue, and about what the other shop did. They open it up and within the half hour mark they call him in to show him something
Mechanic: "Check this out; Does this look 'Fine' to you?" (digs into puddle of diff fluid and pulls up a handful of gear bits)
Friend: "F##K!"
Mechanic: "What shop did you say you took it to?"
Friend: "------ a few miles down the road"
Mechanic: "Thought so. You got an invoice?"
Then the mechanic called up the other shop and chews them a new one, and after some "negotiating", gets them to refund my friend his inspection fee. He also got my friend's diff fixed within a day and all was well after that.
This anecdote pretty much sums up the industry, there are good righteous shops out there providing a good reasonable service, and then there are those just trying to make the quickest buck for the least work possible. The problem is, until you have an experience like this, it's hard to find a shop that you can be sure won't screw you.
Before I retired and had no issues walking, I did. So my advice to anyone who thinks their mechanics are ripping them off is to get a second or even third opinion. Might turn out they were legit, or it might turn out that sandy vag is from being screwed raw.
Thank you! Someone else mentions this. I've been dying to find a mechanic to fix my AC at a reasonable price. Damn ridiculous out here.
It's mostly a rip off. If you spent the money on tools and equipment to do it yourself, you not only have the tools for life but also learn new skills and live with the satisfaction of an accomplishment.
Flat rate tech for 10+ years, in the industry for 14 years. I think the talent pool is suffering because shop owners aren't making an effort to attract. A journeyman electrician will make 50-60k per year, get better insurance for cheaper, get union support with a pension, get more vacation and time off. But a tech has to fight 4 other guys to flag 50+ hours per week to make 50-60k per year. No union, no pension, no (or minimal) 401k match (max 2% if I give 6%), and they barely contribute anything to pay insurance ($800+ per month for fam). And that's before we spend $30,000-$40,000 on tools. I've worked in 4 shops and interviewed at several others along the way, and they haven't varied much.
I could probably make my own response video to this explaining how much darker the automotive industry has gotten over the last 30 years, and/or how they seem to be trying to engineer the weekend home mechanic out of repairing their own cars. But I'll basically say this. Once a vehicle leaves the factory the manufacture doesn't really care about it anymore. If you can't repair it, and it costs too much to keep it on the road, then you'll buy another POS from them. So it's a bonus for them to engineer you out of the picture. You only have to look back to the late 80's to now and ask yourself why you rarely see cars from those eras anymore, yet you still see cars from as far back as the 50's. It ended for me when I realized on some cars you have to remove the intake manifold in order to change 3 out of your 6 spark plugs. Garbage engineering seems to be running rampant in the automotive industry these days, and it's a wonder why anyone wants to deal with it.
Thanks for your input. You might not see American vehicles from that age because they were ugly and didn't work very well. Emissions was just starting to be a thing and we were way behind when that came about. However, the Asian vehicles from that era are still around today and beloved by many.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that it's about perspective. Sure, the manufacturer wants to make money. Thats why they're in business after all, but I think the 'problem' is a bit more complicated than you allude to. Not saying you're wrong, just I think there is a lot more to it than that.
Thank you for your input.
And your absolutely correct. There is much more to it. That's why I could have made my own response video on the subject. I just don't have the editing software to do it anymore.
Even some of the Asian cars are not engineered as well as they could have been. I've watched the HVAC video on your Honda. But even then, Asian cars are in their own ballgame. They are beloved because they are built to last longer. But even then, when something does go up in them, it's costly.
And I haven't even started on automotive design these days. You only need to look at silhouettes of any mid sized car or SUV built these days to see that most look the same.
Automotive engineering has just gotten lazy, and I can't see where they put any thought into the guy who loves to work on his own stuff anymore.
But at the risk of writing out a script for a video reply I'll cut it there.
Thanks for the reply, and keep the great videos comming.
I think they key point that you are correct about is that; After the car leaves the plant, the manufacturer really does not give a shit about it at all. It is a liability at that point, and you are exactly right about, they would rather just put them up in a new vehicle again, as opposed to repairing the car under warranty. Technicians are an EXPENSE to the corporate mfg company, NOT an ASSET. Buisness 101: minimize expenses, invest in assets. To top it off, now COVID is a thing, and the economy is in deep shit from a massive government mandated shut down, and 1/2 of parts are on intergalactic backorder. Now customers really can't afford to fix their vehicle. Lots of warranty work. But remember, if you're doing warranty work, you're just an expense. Expect to be treated as such. Minimize.
The general love for cars have grown cold amongst teens and young adults. I have noticed that grand parents are really involved in raising their grandkids now. because of that, the love for trains, cars, trucks and heavy equipment seems to be pretty significant in the hearts and minds of todays children. There's still hope. In the mean time, missing a few meals when I was young never hurt. It only served to help adjust my way of thinking. The fear of having nowhere to sleep at night helped me to arrive to work on time on many occasions.
I couldn't not hit the like button enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The same is true of a lot of industries these days. If you want good staff you have to provide an environment that's far more welcoming than the one we started off in 20+ years ago
This industry needs fixing so awfully badly. I'll continue on UA-cam, but I'm dealing with school and work full time to get out.
I essentially had work and school full time to get into this field for a couple years even though I used my own cars, tools, and UA-cam rather than an unaffordable school.
This time I'm doing a very expensive school to get into network engineering. Thanks to the ETCG1 community I realized that techs move between these two fields successfully and enjoyably and I have to go where I'll be allowed to get old and get paid twice as much to start and twice as much to progress in the field.
@@DENicholsAutoBravado I was a network/security engineer for many years, and now I still don't get paid to work on cars 😂
Very true.
@@Badgertronix I said very true to the first comment. Oh. Wow. Didn't know I was changing my path to what you've done. Lol
@@Badgertronix well. Your work on UA-cam has done a lot better than me I'd hope your pittance was 2-3 times as much.
I was in the Automotive mechanic field for 10 years. I got out for a few reasons. One being the flat rate system, bad system that needs to go or give tech option of straight hourly wage.
Second the wage as compared to other trades, Automotive repair is highly technical and deserves a much higher wage. Less complicated trades pay more or at least equal to the automotive trade. Third lack of respect from employer and customers. Why put up with the bs from them? Forth the investment in tools is crazy as compared to other trades. I would never advise anyone to get into the Automotive trade. Fixing vehicles is a great hobby, which is what I do now, but a bad job/career in my honest opinion. Hopefully with less people getting into the Automotive trade and from what i see more techs getting out of the trade, shops will realize things have to change and make the changes to the things i mentioned. Cheers
Thank you for sharing your insight.
BuzzerAuto every shop I’ve been to across state to states, 90 % in it are dirtiest man can be, when slow Co workers rip off each other tools or anything their fingers can grab that includes front office to people behind ceo off the company
BuzzerAuto every shop in my area has a help wanted sign. Nobody in there right mind wants to do it anymore.
Kevin n go into I T, many cars owners nowadays drive their almost down to ground or up to 100k miles then trade in for new car, there’s too many so money isn’t much to make and if you like to work with your hands heating and ac is ok.
@Kevin nAfter 10 years as Auto Tech I was a Heavy Duty Technician for 10 years specializing in aerial equipment like boomlifts, scissor lifts, telehandlers and forklifts. Had an few nagging injuries from turning wrenches for 20 years and now I'm a Parts Person at HD shop. If I was to do it over again I would get into HVAC, Electrician or Elevator trades. I got my nephew into HVAC and it pays well and he likes the trade. Your skills will transfer over to any type mechanical trade. If you are starting over don't waste your money on these expensive private colleges. Look into a community college or just try and apply directly into a starting job position. A lot of employers will recognize your experience and train you at New job. Good luck
Also, if manufacturers are going to provide us these high end electronics in all of our cars, they need ways to test each component no matter how old those components get. I had a short circuit in my car and took it into the Chrysler service department, but no conventional methods were used to find the short circuit. They plugged in their machines to my car and just looked at the computer monitor for the results. They came back stating it might be the wireless receiver, but no guarantee. After replacing the wireless receiver, it did not fix the problem. There was still a short circuit and my car wouldn't run. Cars are made too complex these days that even experienced mechanics are having more and more difficulty locating problems in cars these days.
I admit that with some intermittent electrical issues you have to guess, but I would say that what you experienced might have more to do with the skill of the people using the equipment over the vehicle being too complicated. However, I wasn't there so I really can't say for sure.
A plumber charges the same as an auto shop, little tools, liability, knowledge, 1k of plumbing in your house vrs 60k auto with 30 computers
Please do a podcast! Also, from a young technician who is in the final days of his Auto degree, I've worked the pit for longer than I'm proud to admit because the dealership I worked for didn't see me as enough of an asset to try to move me into the main shop to do work. That seems to be standard practice in my area, unfortunately. Another is that nobody wants to give a young technician a true shot at work. I left the dealership to work for an independent shop where I was essentially put on the same jobs as the dealership for several months (8+), despite my love for electronics and diagnosis. My employer knew, he just didn't want me to mess anything up, which I understand but how do I get any "professional experience" when my employer wont give me a shot? Most young technicians, like myself, are largely looked over because many shops want at least 3 years of experience, where lube doesn't really count. This has largely discouraged me and many of my friends because we're treated like kids who have never touched a wrench before.
So while I work for this guy changing oil and rotating tires, I'm doing my own thing on the side because nobody knows how to deal with electrical issues anymore. I can't realistically use my "shade-tree" experience on a resume, but I'm making more working a few hours a week for myself than I do changing oil for a professional shop for 40 hours, and my customers love me!
Yeah I know what u mean I that why i left a dealership position I was in .Most places don't want train the new guys or they treat them horrible
Use your shade tree experience on your resume - I would also suggest you strike out on your own and set yourself up as an independent mobile specialist tech for electronics and electrical issues. Get one or two techs to act as a reference for you and visit a bunch of shops offering to do flat-rate diagnostics for them when they are stuck, leave your business card....
The reason the dealership looks over lube techs is because they don't want to pay them like mechanics, but they want to work them like mechanics. In short, they take advantage of your ambition.
Realistically it takes about 3 years to catch your stride in the industry, sometimes 5. Even then you'll probably still be trying to prove yourself.
That said, keep at your side work. If you're smart, you might start your own business of being 'the guy' when it comes to electrical and performance diagnosis. I'm seeing more shops and dealerships farm out this work to business that specialize in this work. It could be a real money maker for you someday. Just be sure to have your business set up right when the time comes. That's where most technicians fail when it comes to running their own business. They can fix things all day long, but they can't balance the books or promote the business properly and fail as a result.
No matter what I wish you luck. Thanks for weighing in.
Personally I believe the flat rate system needs to go away. It encourages lying to customers and is a major stress on families. For example I was at the dealership when the economy tanked, nobody was buying anything and my wife was pregnant with our first kid. I made the decision to move across the state for a job that was hourly. 7 years later I make a great living with the same fleet and earning a paycheck isn’t a stressful thing. Hourly is the only way to go
I agree.
Nick Steinmetz at that time I worked at the only Ford dealer around. We were starving. Many indy shops in town had to close doors. It was the worst I’ve ever seen. Now with my hourly fleet job I make $90k a year and it’s relaxed more than any job I’ve ever had.
I’m not saying you’re wrong so please don’t take it as such. I’m saying my experiences differ is all
Glad to hear it worked out for you. Thanks for your input.
But the idea of fleet sounds so yucky. We get fleet cars in everynow and then, all it is is oil changes and tire rotations, getting them to buy anything big is like pulling teeth, how do you make 90k a year on hourly? Do u make $50 AN hr?
srv3fender I will not get into detail about exactly how much I make but let’s just say I get paid very well and sometimes o/t is allowed. As for quality of work. At my company we are held to a high standard, if it’s broken fix it no questions asked. We primarily use OEM products and have access to OEM manuals to make sure the job is done correctly. The only time we send something out is when we get backed up and can not afford to have the asset down any longer.
Let me comment on the Australian system. Australia runs a system of trade schools in each state whom are empowered to train, test and certify apprenticeships, a system of both theory and hands on training supported by industry. This system of training has been industry standard for decades and produced excellent tradesman but has began to deteriorate due to multiple failures, due to becoming irrelevant, loss of certification and ISO standards,escalating costs and industry bring training inhouse and becoming more product specific. I work in the Australian mining industry as a Mechanical Engineer, but started my career as a diesel mechanic. The normal apprenticeship term in Australia is four years, but are now being shortened by up to 2 years under the guise of 'accelerated learning'. Unfortunately, this is producing ' technicians ' whom lack mechanical knowledge, life skills, incentive, common sense and industry knowledge. A very real problem that has no real resolution. I spent 6 years competing my apprenticeship, working under highly skilled tradesmen and senior mentors, in conditions that are now considered extreme. But the knowledge and skills my seniors ' bestowed and passed ownership onto me ', I'm forever grateful for. Thanks for starting the conversation Eric. 👍👍
Thank you for your perspective!
I came into AT&T when the company had it's own schools and excellent training. After they broke up the Bell System that all changed. And I was taught by a senior man with 30 years experience. I read the BSP's, Bell System Practices that showed you the correct way to do things.
I have a shop but I’m focusing on Hybrid and electric vehicles. Mainly servicing or upgrading battery packs. Its easy money compared to regular automotive service. All these aging EV and hybrid need battery pack service more than ever. They only last 7-10 years. That’s why Tesla warranty the battery pack for 100k miles that’s about 7 years. Price comparison on servicing vs buying a new battery pack is significant. Repaired battery usually last couple of years but much cheaper. Customers do not tend to look into the future, all they want is to get their car running now
i had a UTI once
Jackson bermingham nice
And who hasn't worked on their car in the nude.
🤣😃🤣 lol
@El oso_714 Don't use it to turn the bacon and you'll be fine.
Cranberry juice and vodka clears it right up.
Eric I graduated from UTI, did the ford fact program and bmw Step, worked for bmw of sf for 10 years, now I run my own little one man shop repairing rolls Royce, Bentley and other exotics.
The schooling itself was not easy and do not recommend to anyone unless you can commit to the program. If you can make through it. You can become a very wealthy person being an honest technician these days.
Very interesting topic of discussion. For a start, makes me realise there are huge differences to the US and the UK where I am.
Over there, it seems to be that most technicians are forced to work flat rate. If you wanna make a decent living, you need to be good at what you do. That is a huge incentive to always better yourself, and ultimately that means better service for your customers.
Over here, you show up to work and you get paid. That's regardless of how busy the shop is, how good your work is, and that right there means there is no incentive to want to better yourself. Only the rare technicians that actually have some integrity and pride will go on to make great money, but my point is you don't need to be good to make a living, unlike over there. Personally, I have been a professional for over 16 years now, and made a damn good living from it. I have pride in my work, and treat everybody's vehicle the same way I always did.
As for new people coming into the trade, I don't feel like the integrity is there and people are just looking for a job rather than a career. All that means is they will do the bare minimum, and the end result is crap customer service.
'people are just looking for a job rather than a career' Outside of certain specialisms, many (perhaps most) people entering the jobs market now have no expectation of a job for life and little expectation of a career. They've grown up watching industries being run down by economic and technological changes (Amazon killing the High Street, Uber killing taxi firms etc.) so they enter the market expecting to be exploited and then dumped the moment they're not needed, which is exactly the kind of work environment I've experienced just a decade ahead of them.
Flat rate has good things, but also bad. I have seen master techs with 25 years of experience work 9 hours for one hours pay because they got a bad ticket. The shop favorite gets the gravy and the person the dispatcher dislikes get shat on. When you start off with out the experience and tools you go broke while you need to buy more tools. Most new people find a better job before they even have a chance to get the tools and experience to make a living.
Thank you for your perspective. Unfortunately, flat rate doesn't inspire getting better at what you do so much as cutting corners to make more money. That's not true for everyone, but it is for enough to mention it.
I've been employed as a dealership tech in Ireland (pretty much the same as the UK, paid hourly) and in Alberta, Canada (pretty much the same as the US, flat-rate pay). Neither is good! Paid hourly you just don't get paid for all the amount of your knowledge and skills that you are trying to develop - and therefore it just doesn't make sense to get better, to put all the time, effort and money in self-education and tools. No stress and I liked the job, but I wasn't happy with what it paid. On a flat rate, you won't get paid for that skill and knowledge either as you'll make way more money just changing brake pads and doing PDIs than applying yourself to electrical and driveability diagnostics! You are, in fact, rewarded for doing the bad job, cutting as many corners as possible, and punished for doing your best. I admit the pay was OK (although only while the shop was busy!), but the work was extremely (!) stressful. Basically, I was as naive as you are thinking that flat-rate provides an incentive for good work and self-development - it doesn't. Instead, three years working in flat-rate dealerships were the worst time in my entire career (25 years and counting)
It's hard to respect the auto industry in general. Cars are too expensive for most people and millennials HATE buying brand new, dealerships pay abhorrent rates to their technicians, independent shops hate letting people use their own parts and it's hard to find good, affordable mechanics in general, and there's no more "go work with Dad and then be absolved into the company" scenarios. Overall the field is on the down trend. Diesel is the only profitable sub category of automotive repair, in my opinion. Again, just my opinion. Not many young people, especially millennials and Gen Z, want to pay $5000 for their own tools that they have to provide in order to work in a non air-conditioned and stressful environment making $13 an hour when they can get a job at a call center making $15 and up.
I started at 13 an hour flag rate which was a lot less than that lacking experience. The only reason I put up with it was that I could no longer work in a cubicle environment. It was brutal and while it never really got easier, at least in a few years I was making twice as much. Right now they know I'll fix anything which is awful because they won't pay me right working on old cars. 2 to 3 times as broken as what they're willing to sell it for AND they want me to fix it?
Shops everywhere cheat their techs. With my immense technical skills doing diag and such....sigh. The industry needs fixing so bad.
I can make more than $20/hour delivering pizzas and washing dishes... Usually about ~$15/hour with tips, but busy nights can double my paycheck in tips.
Exactly, guys. I started at 14.50/H flat rate. The tech I was being trained by started at 15 an hour in the 80's! Not to mention, his education and tools were cheaper than mine were.
@@DENicholsAutoBravado I 100% agree that industry needs an overhaul bad, but I think all industry's need overhauled.
@@willberham i made 10 bucks/ hr the top tech made 400 week take home before snapon bill. I know guys that make money but its a sucky line of work in NY
They need to do away with the flat rate system. It’s hard to make a decent living on the flat rate system with all of the warranty work. Honda offers you a maintenance plan when you buy a new car so all service is free up until like 36000 miles. Also warranty through Honda that lasts until 120000 or 9 years. I’m putting axle seals or wheel bearings in cars that are 8 years old with 100k on them. Also under that maintenance plan, what’s considered a B123 is a brake service, oil change, tire rotation, filters, and trans fluid. That exact service use to be 3 hours time for a flat rate tech. Also known as a 60k service. Now? It’s 2. We get 2 hours for the same service. Oh, and if it’s under the maintenance contract, it pays .9. And changing trans fluid in these new cvts isn’t just dumping in 3 quarts. Our new 9 speed pilot we have to put into “maintainence mode” and run it through 4 gears, let it idle, then check the fluid by pulling out check plug on trans. For .4 hours CUSTOMER PAY. The flat rate system needs to go. We don’t get enough non warranty work to get 40 hours a week. Just a couple of years ago I was averaging 50-55. Now I’m averaging 45 and dropping.
Sounds like things have gotten even worse since I left. Thanks for the update and good luck.
Two words......SIDE JOBS!!
@@WrenchWorksAZ If you have to do side jobs to make ends meet, why not just cut out the vampire in your life and open a shop.
Its the fault of the car makers. They put in many useless features that can go bad and make diagnosis more complicated. I would pay top dollar for a new Accord or Civic made exactly the same way as they were built two decades ago.
Agree-and the small size of cars means no room in the engine compartment-look at an AUDI-you practically have to take the car apart to gain access.
Ad Mirer Maybe that is part of the reason so many people buy trucks. I still have the ‘96 Suburban I bought new, and traded my ‘03 Chevy pickup for a new ‘14 crew cab GMC Denali. It seems highly rated new cars sit so low they scrape the sidewalk as they enter driveway. I will keep buying rear wheel drive trucks, with no turbos, and engines that aren’t turned sideways.
sexiewasd 👍🏻 If my “Burb” engine ever goes I may put a new crate engine in it. I already put a new crate transmission in it. It was cheaper brand new from factory than rebuild. I don’t care about mpg, it’s my 2nd vehicle, has 185,000 miles. Excellent visibility in all directions is one of many reasons I like it. Wife got rear ended in accident. We had to get new bumper. Car that hit ours was totaled. Enjoy your Burb!
sexiewasd PS: the humble mechanic must really have a passion (or addiction 😖) to those V-Dubs.
There was a time that things like air conditioning, power steering, power windows were considered useless. Problem is makers build cars to be built not repaired. They dont consider what it takes to repair a vehicle.
Rather than blame the car repair industry. I blame the car industry in general. They are making cars that requires multiple discipline to repair. It used to be mechanical, then mechanical and electrical, and now its mechanical, electrical and software.
And without something like the OBD2 standard for the software portion, its hard for car technicians to keep up.
I've long been one of the guys who would pop the hood and investigate what might be wrong with my car. So watching channels like yours and other car diagnosing & repair tips and tricks is FASCINATING! Your approach is like a detective following the evidence and like a scientist confirming your findings for a successful fix. I'm sure like myself that there are millions of kids out there considering a field of endeavor who are contemplating their careers by watching successful car repair channels like yours.
UA-cam content is a WIN-WIN for humanity. I believe channels like yours are helping people in ways you cannot even imagine. And the way I think that auto content like yours can help is by talking about how you got into the industry and the paths you had to cross. Because that information helps the guy who wants to decide now. And it answers the very 1st question on a career path minded person is "how do I start".
Oh and thanks for all you do!
As technology gets more complicated you have to be more skilled and knowledgeable about it. I see them as a car doctors since is a huge responsibility and liability since people can get hurt or die while driving their cars due to a misdiagnosed or incorrectly installed parts. The sad part is that they work hard, slowly hurt their bodies while working under unsafe and unhealthy conditions, get paid little and are sometimes underappreciated by the public, the employer and others. Hope this abuse change one day, and business owners invest and care more for their people.
My Dad was a mechanic at a dealership and at home.One rule He always had.If you were putting in a bolt or a nut on a stud never let a phone call stop you from tightening it up before you take the call.Most people will not remember to get that one as they were distracted.He was very structured and analogical about all His work because it means life or death on the road
F R As a pro mechanic, I want to thank you for your understanding of what it's like for us and also for having enough respect to call us doctors. Iv'e always said if a mechanic has 10 or more years experience then he or she is now a doctor of machines. If we're not then who is ??? Unfortunately we're not treated that way....
Hi Eric, I'm a 22 year old parts store manager, I have quite a few friends around my age in the automotive repair industry. I started learning about cars in my second year at a STEM school, I grew up loving industrial design and really enjoyed the artistic part of it. I started learning how to work on cars and within three years I went from barely being able to jump start a car to having the tools and knowledge to rebuild the engine in my car, which I had to do a few months ago. As for my friends who went through an ASE program at the local college, I've found my knowledge surpasses theirs and I have a deeper understanding of how a vehicles inner workings come together and how to diagnose problems. In the technical schools, they teach you what might be the problem but not how to diagnose it properly. My friends are lube techs and part swappers working in a dealership with more or less than $5000 of debt after going on the tool trucks for the first time, it's unfortunate. It just goes to show that in order to work on something you have to have a true drive, motivation, and passion for it.
You need better friends. The truth is experience is what counts in this industry. However, a good education can give you the foundation you need to become a great technician. Just because you rebuilt an engine, doesn't mean you'd be a good technician. Don't get me wrong, your achievements are significant, but compared to someone that does it every day, you're just a weekend warrior that got lucky. It's a lot different when you get up in the morning and go to work in a repair shop, trust me on that. You're not a technician until you've failed miserably and you feel like you never want to do it again. I'm not saying that to be mean, I'm saying that because you have those days as well as the days where you solve the unsolvable. THAT is what makes you a real technician, the failures you overcome, not the achievements you gloat about.
Thank you for your input.
TOTALLY PROFOUND!!
Flat rate days are coming to an end. These younger people dont have the same opportunity to turn as much time as in the past. At the european dealer i work at, the amount of customer pay work is 3/4 less than it used to be. They cut all of our cp service times to warranty, large portion of cars are cpo warranty until 100k, and they all have service packages from day 1.There's not enough cp work to make up for getting 9 hrs to replace piston rings. They raise the rate and cut the times often. It was 80 an hr 11 yrs ago and is now 160.
In 1983 the local honda dealership's labor rate was $22. Techs made $11. and you were fired quickly if you couldn't cut it. Today labor rate is $115. Top flat rate tech prob making $22-25. And piston rings on a honda odyssey is like 7.8 hrs for cyl.s #1-3 and .8 for cyl #4...crazy
Sad, but true.
If all the techs save money to cover their expense's for a couple of weeks, you all could walk out and bring them to their knees, then negotiate higher wages!
What you speak about is so true. I’m retired now but was an electronic tech for over 50 years. Started with vacuum tubes and left off with flat screen tv. And computersof all types. , I adapted , and that’s what you have to do to stay a float. Thanks Eric. Going to add this video linked to Facebook.
Thanks Eric, I am 38 years old and am retraining in this field. You are right about the younger generation as I am at school with them. We all have our own way of doing and learning things. But for me being somewhere in the middle age makes it a bit of a challenge, I am also a solo dad so trying to learn new skills and juggle life. But I am really enjoying it, Apprenticeship next year can’t wait. Cheers!
Good luck. Its an awful business to be in unless you get a unicorn shop that pays decent
Or can land a local government mechanic job as I was lucky enough to do.
Get a union job at least they dont low ball you if you have the experience
Yea, it can be tough starting out, or going back in your case. I admire your work ethic and wish you and your family good luck.
Big part of it is the flate rate. Dealers make a mistake and make the mechanics pay for there mistake by under cutting the times. Recalls have cut back so much that you will loose on time. 90 percent of work done at dealers are warranty work. Dealers cut back so much that they don't pay to diagnose cars anymore just plug in the scan tool and replace whatever it tells you too. Just parts changer at dealer now. Didn't change part don't get payed. Need to clock in and clock out per line and run time, test drive car at least 2 miles and tag and bag your part you changed all for not even a half an hour for many warranty items. The other problem is these money hungry schools like UTI. After you get out you still start as entry level making $15 hr and these schools are pumping these kids out that they are replaceable because there's another student that finished every day. I am a UTI graduate and a Mercedes Elite graduate. Was a good run back when i went in year 2000 and the pay was still good. In my opinion being a mechanic is not worth it anymore. Last time i check UTI was close to 40k after evething said and done that's ridiculous. I wouldn't recommend to anyone.
Entry level position: 5 years experience required.
This is the catch. Need a job to get experience, but lowest rung positions are experience required. Good luck.
Yep very true.
Walk into a shop in person and tell them you want to work, don't just hand in a resume, talk to the owner. Every shop I've ever been to is looking for a guy. Literally stumbling over mechanic jobs everywhere. If you're serious they will hire you. You don't need to have experience. No decent boss on the planet is going to fire you if you learn fast, work hard, and do what needs to get done. You will be at the bottom doing shitty work. When there's no more tires and oil changes for a bit, and the shops clean, just go and pull in a car and start working on it. Don't ask. Take initiative and if they don't let you work move shops. All the information/knowledge you need is on the internet. You will make min wage, so what? That's exactly what I did. I started at $7 and hour 2 years later I was making over $30, doing advanced diagnostics(CAN bus)/engine swaps and whatever came my way, I fixed it. From nothing. Worked 80 hours a week and studied everyday on top. Meanwhile there's guys there my age with double and triple my "experience" and they can only do brake and suspension jobs. Don't expect to get anywhere working 8 hours a day and leaving right on the dot when it's "home time" either.
OR, you can sit around complaining. Take your pick.
I give you credit for doing that. But why would you want to sell your soul to a Job? I am a very hard worker I've been told. 40 hours a week is enough on the regular basis. I work about a 100 hours of overtime a year. My Wife and the dogs are more important than a job.
Be the first one to work, work hard, and be the last one to leave when your shift is over. I think that is the point that rsx123 was trying to make about working 80 hours a week.
My plan was to eventually go part-time at a decent wage and go to college, and I didn't want to go to college at 30 so I did what I had to. It burned me out badly. But it taught me so much and it was temporary. I now work 45 hours a week max, Saturdays off. I am not worried about having work because shops talk about who works where and so do the tool truck guys. The tool truck guys know hundreds of shops and they know who can do what and who needs workers. I have a list of shops I can work at so it doesn't own my soul. It pays off.
Flat rate at a dealership sucks. Working on nothing but warranty work does not pay the bills.
Hmm..I dunno...The amount of money a good auto tech makes doesn't sound like much of a payoff compared to the amount of time, effort, and skills needed to become one.
It is a long game that's for sure.
U can make 100 hour paycheck a week, u just have to work 100+ hours/week to get it. No, I'm not joking.
From experience starting out in the modern industry the pay wage needs to be higher and training needs to be more forgiving. Starting out new techs need to buy a lot of tools and spend a lot of money. Either a higher wage or a pay stiffen every pay should be given to go towards tools so young techs can live and build easier. I ran into you are shown once before you do a new job but aren’t given any hands on practice before you are handed the job on your own. They expect the first try to be perfect. I don’t know anyone who can do a job perfect the first time they try. The industry should also hire old techs to simply train new techs and not have to worry about themselves getting jobs done. Basically bring is guys to be teachers and mentors. I loved the master tech I was under and learned a lot but he didn’t have time to help unless we where slow or he needed extra hands to do a job. I do agree with mostly everything you said though it was a good video with a lot of good points.
I left the field because no respect or good pay to support a family. I did what etcg said. I showed up applied my self and worked hard. For what a dollar or two over minimum wage. I make more now as I entered the education field, and cleaning toilets at the same time. Sadly bit truly.
sometimes techs get careless, took my SRT8 Jeep for an oil change, usually do it myself but was in there buying some speed parts at the dealership so what the hell....
came home and the next day under my Jeep was a medium sized puddle of oil, the oil pan bolt wasn't tightened properly...went under there and tightened it myself and all was well
...but I did call the shop and tell the manager who I knew for a couple of years about this minor incident and that he needs to have a little chat with his guys...had that bolt fallen off as I was driving home and dumped all that oil out I could've seriously damaged my engine, if not blown it totally, he was doing his version of huge mia culpa and I appreciated it and told me that will never happen again, straight up dude, and he even offered me a free change next time, which was cool since synthetic oil is expensive, twice as much as regular oil...
so...shit happens
hence why I do what I can on my cars myself...the only person I truly trust anyway!
I got free service on my car but I do my own oil changes. I know what lube techs are ... they are bored out of their minds and careless and clueless.
If you take your vehicle to a national chain store chances are you will be upsold and spend more. I know of one chain whose practice is that no matter the work needed they will look the entire car over and have a minimum estimate of $1000. Find a decent independent local technician. Ask friends family coworkers where they take their cars. When you find one stick with them. Also the younger generation coming up are different and shops are going to need to adjust.
Nick Steinmetz
These are the same shops who will tell people that by law they can’t let them leave their shop because their car is to unsafe. Yes it has happened I’ve had it tried on me and know at least 3 women who were told that bullshit. I deal with shops who will fix the problem at hand and give me honest advice about future work needed. I will never trust a National chain. Their business model is sell sell sell.
I work for a national chain, and we do inspections on almost every single car that comes in, but we tailor each inspection depending on the job. For example, if we are doing a simple tire patch, we wont look under the hood. Or if we do a oil change we don't look at the brakes. Mostly because, hey, we have the car in the air, check ball joints, check the tie rods, cv boots. Maybe we can make a few bucks, but it also prevents the customer coming back in 2 weeks and saying "hey, ever since you did an oil change on my car, the front end clunks..." or something like that. Bare minimum we check all of the exterior lights and the tire tread and pressures. Not as a scam, more of piece of mind. We tell each customer that we check the cars over, and if they don't want us to, we don't.
I was a telecom technician (retired 11 years now). Yup, we had numerous slackers protected by the union. Advances in technology actually made my job prehistoric after I retired. The crew I worked in was disbanded.
I think I was a pretty good hobbyist gear head wrench turner but knew my limits. Now that I'm REALLY old, many times I take my vehicles to shops. I've quit going to dealers as I found that was a giant waste of time. I've tried many local mechanics and finally found one that is about 10 miles away from home but is worth the drive. These guys actually repair and build hot rods so I figured why not. So far they haven't disappointed me. I dread the time when they close. My friend who owned a transmission shop retired this year. I hope my transmissions hold up till I can't drive anymore.
Thank you for sharing that insight. Something we will all face at some point.
I've been in the fields now for 14 years. Started at an independent shop when i was 17. 31 at the time of this post. Currently working for a dealership. My biggest thing is that I have gaps in my knowledge and finding a good way to fill them has been difficult. For example I was an ASE certified tech in brakes and steering and suspension when I was 19.Then at my last job that seemed good enough for my boss and I was never pushed to grow and encouraged to grow. So I think its very easy to develop a certain skill level then get stuck at that level in this industry. I'm currently studying to take 3 re certification test and try and push myself to grow. On a separate note I try to help out everyone in the shop if I can. Showing people different ways(hopefully better) to do things or approach a problem should help them learn and grow which is what everyone should be doing. If I know something that can help someone and I don't show them when they ask me for help I feel like I'm doing a disservice to the entire shop and that tech. Sure we all work for our own pay check but if one person loses a customer because an error that could have been prevented then their won't be a next time for the customer to come back which in the end loses business.
Great points. Thanks for your input.
I own a shop and techs are more flaky and less reliable than they have ever been, its very sad. Cant show up on time, calling in sick, unwilling to study and learn and I pay very well. The industry is loaded with alcoholics, drug users, techs who are uninsurable due to SR22's or Dui's. The techs you finally do hire have seem to have baby mama drama, garnishments, child support payments and live pay check to paycheck with no savings and constantly need draws. Another thing I notice looking at resumes is constant job hopping, never the same job for more than a year or two.
You're not alone in that thinking. ua-cam.com/video/TydU5aho4yo/v-deo.html
Valid discussion, Eric, but it's unlikely things will change for the better anytime soon. Charles has pointed out in one of his videos that vehicles need a lot less maintenance than they did 15-20 years ago, so there's that. Dealership service depts. usually operate with one or two master / senior techs, and a bunch of oil change and tire work monkeys. Most flat rate techs are struggling, fighting an uphill battle against getting short-changed by warranty time, starved out by shady service writers (has happened to me more than once), or chasing non-existent complaints by flakey fruitcake customers.
Customers, on average, don't seem to give a damn about maintaining their vehicles (doesn't make sense to slack on that, a car represents an investment second only to a house), and often will play the blame game or whatever else it takes to get repair / service work for free.
I always have thought that you do not have to choose what you want to be based on what is more trending or not. You have to choose your profession based on what you are good in, because you will be good in what you like to do and you feel comfortable. This is the only way to enjoy with your job and not to be frustrated when you grow older and look behind what you have done. A good mechanic is that person that feels good when he smells fuel or grease and enjoys with the sound of a V8. I am a telecommunications engineer who has been working in an office for more than 20 years but I envy my son because he is going to be what he always has wanted. I am sure he will be a good mechanic and a happy man. Eric, thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Well, around here where I live I see a bunch of people that dont wanna work, lol. Lets face it, a career in automotive is hard work. Most of the kids around here just dont wanna do hard work. I see it in the aluminum plant 8 work at too. I got out of the field because I seen the places of business I was working take advantage of customers more than help them. But that was just my experience. It's funny to me though cause there are times the youth makes me feel like a genius when one of them sees me di something and asks me how I did it. When you offer to show them the interest seems to instantly walk away
Thanks for your input and good luck with the channel.
ETCG1, its something new to me and thanks. Your one of the reasons why I started it. Of course i got a lot to learn myself, lol
I've seen it the other way too. I've seen young kids work their butt off 12-15/hours a day and eager to learn from everyone. I've seen old farts that just want to cruise (refuse to learn any electrical diag) and do the prepaid gravy and get to work late 20 mins late and leave 30 mins early every day and call out sick every few weeks. Stop blaming the dumb kids. It's the individual.
I was both a certified auto and motorcycle mechanic in my younger days, worked at dealerships and my own shops, quickly learned that it was not for me, because the lack of returns both monetary and personal(dealing with people), most of same reasons previously posted. One the issues is that the car repair industry is poorly regulated, ie, licensing, training,etc. There's a lot of part changers, no a lot troubleshooting.
I was fortunate to hold an A+P certificate and had a very successful aviation career, was not perfect, but is a higly regulated field, with lots of training, quality control and personal growth/satisfaction. Also much less dirt and grease all over you. BTW you are personally liable when you work on aircraft, you could get up to jailtime for wrongdoing !!
That said is not for everyone !!
5:30 don't sell yourself short. There's a lot we can learn from you.
It's hard to motivate people to work for it if they're constantly being told they'll never make money, slave away for nothing... that attitude is causing a problem too
Good point. Thanks for the comment.
I learned fractions and numbers by passing wrenches to my pop, as a very young child (3-4 yrs old). By the time I got into school I knew how to count, do some math and read/write, which eventually got me bumped up to 1st grade after two weeks in Kindergarten. Perseverance is the key to success for anyone. If you don't try, you don't know.
Community Colleges need to continue to offer training for trade jobs (mechanic, plumber, electrician, carpenter, etc). Those jobs are not going away but they do require training. Those wanting to work in those jobs need to find ways to motivate themselves to become qualified to fill trade jobs. Those willing to work hard and excel will succeed. Glad UTI is still going strong and also willing to sponsor your video. Excellent and timely video - thanks for posting!
Well said. Agreed.
Sad part is most people are'nt going into trade jobs anymore but they are needed and one can make a good living being in the industry.
My community college does teach trades, they have a great automotive tech program, but idk about those others you mentioned.
I went into programming at my local cc, and unlike the university that delves into heavy math and code theory, they teach the basics of coding and the different coding environments then teach common practices in the industry (in addition to the soft skills in said formal environment)
You get nothing from UTI. Do the research. You get way more going to a community college for less.
Johnathon Van Durme
True! Most shops I have worked for call those technicians "Paper Techs", because they look great on their paper application, but do not know how to perform repairs in reality. Certifications and diplomas look great on the showroom wall, but do not mean the technicians know what they are doing.
Eric, this is happening not just on the automotive industry, I work in a factory and I'm a maintenance technician and I see it there too.. the younger generation does not have the drive that I was brought up.. it's really wierd.. but I agree with you totally!
I really hope that it gets better.. but we will adapted to any changes that come in the future just like we do now..
Keep up the good work!!
I have a lovely 10k bill since I wanted to pursue my passion. Job after job, no pay. Left the field to do Uber and I immediately made more money doing that. Also in the HVAC field now. It totally sucked and killed my passion.
Only 10k... lucky you
a real passion never dies for good.
here you are watching car-videos and passionately replying ;)
@@workingcountry1776 Yes, 20k in scholarships/grants etc. I was a 3.9 gpa student with an almost perfect attendance. Good point Nathan lol.
A friend of mine got bent over really good by the Matco guy. long story short he payed off his snap-on bill to give him 1 big bill and add that all onto his matco "tab" and into just Matco tools. At a retarded interest rate and well over 18k in debt when he only makes 25-30k a year. He was just out of high school and didn't know better and is still paying the price 4 years later and he dosnt even have a job that needs those tools anymore. He just sprays bed liners
Strong Tower Lawn Care : Bargain!
I was an up and coming tech at 19 years old. Showed up for work every day and watched the old dogs work as I did oil changes and tires. I proved my worth to the company and showed my loyalty for 2 years and really stepped up the expectation.
I asked for a raise because I was only making 9 bucks an hour. So they paid me my hourly wage plus whatever the job paid. I'd get 30 mins per oil change, an hour for rotate/balance plus oil.
I worked so hard that I could squeeze in 5-6 cars an hour alone. I was 1 step shy of running all day.
On my down time I'd clean up after the guys. I'd observe and help out with anything, watched engine rebuilds, trans replacements, doing diagnostic. Eventually I started doing recalls and warrantee work. I was excited because I felt I was making progress. Then the dealership owner wants to cut costs. Hires a shop supervisor that sees me, a grease monkey, making almost 2700 a month changing oil and doing minor repairs.
3 months in, he tells me on a Friday at 5 after everyone's gone, after I cleaned 7 bays. That it was my final day, that they have a guy starting Monday. No warning, no "hey we're worried we're paying too much and can't afford you. Maybe we can shuffle things around"
I proceeded to do things I regret, because I truly loved working there.
I flung my chair in rage, I shouted at the new supervisor who replaced me with a minimum wage burnout with no drive,
I called the boss, I told him his pos supervisor is making the workplace hell and that firing me was a mistake. How loyal I was and how much I enjoyed working with everyone. He proceeded to tell me with a smile, he trusts his supervisors decision.
People were scared of me because how verbally aggressive I was.
I worked for pennies on the dollar for nearly 3 years, just to get canned to intentionally hire some loser who didn't even make it 3 months at my pace.
What's funny is soon after 3 other people from the shop left and they were stuck with more repairs than they could handle.
Since then I've decided working on my own cars for enjoyment is better, and have bounced around since. I'm 26 now and it still makes me wonder where my life would be if it wasn't for people trying to save a buck
simple, ditch the flat rate system. this system rewards poor practices. instead, make the system pay more for better performance skills, such as complete, proper diagnosis, and complete repairs that fix the problem the first time. pay more for your improved electronic/electric system diagnostic repairs. you cannot flat rate a adaptive cruise control failure to determine vehicle distance, (just a example). High Skill and competency level should be rewarded, not how fast you can cut corners and make high money profit. that will go a long way fixing our image.
Wow Eric you hit this one out of the park. This is a topic that hits close to home for me. I just spent a year working in a body shop. I was hoping to catch on as a helper and learn body work or painting. I am 47 and jumped in on the ground floor as a porter. I found some of the guys were willing to share there knowledge others were not. I am not afraid to put in a hard days work. I leave my area clean and walk way from a job. Proud of the work i have done. I find as am currently looking for a new job. No one wants to give anyone a chance to learn. Everyone seems to want experience, but they are not willing to pay anyone with experience. So i ask how is someone going to get experience? If shops are not willing to hire without experience? I am gifted to be able to fix stuff with my hands. I am looking to start a new career at my age. I would love to hear from anyone on any suggestion of how to get started.
Erik
I had the same problem with tv repair years ago, it's a cut throat business, the guy down the street will talk bad about you and never offer any help. we did make friends with a few shops and sent work back and forth, but most techs didn't want to teach me anything.
Thats exactly how the auto industry is. The "experienced" ones keep everything to themselves because they dont want you to catch on and do their job as well as them. Its a very miserable industry and i dont even recommend trying to learn it from the ground up at your age to be honest.
I think it's because being cheap and that's customer-wise. A friend of mine took his car to one of the cheapest mechanics in the area. He came back without *interior side lamps* . This scam could happen, because this *shed* was known for lowest prices and that's it.
I often hear about cars that breaks after a month of daily usage. I think it's because of cheapest parts replaced by people who have cheapest stakes for a reason.
Another example: my dad put his van to cheapest guy who even didn't do cars daily. He was to replace an axle with a bearings (it was FWD, though). After he did so, we took the car but something did rumble. Turns out he failed to insert the axle properly, so he applied excessive force and speaking of bearing: no grease whatsoever. It had to be taken care of again.
I do take my car to one of the most expensive mechanics, because I do have guarantee he can't afford to lose his prestigious name so he won't do anything wrong and I know my ride is ready to go anywhere.
Cheap customers go to cheap ghetto mechanics and get what they pay for. They can cry all they want, I have zero sympathy for cheapskate toxic customers. I also have zero sympathy for the ghetto mechanics that give the good techs a bad name when the customers sues them or brings about payback. Let these two scumbags types of ppl wallow in misery.
Eric I couldn’t agree more with what you are saying.... I’m a tech in Ireland just turned 30 started my apprenticeship when I was 16 and learned my trade from an old school mechanic but kept my new school mentality which has benefited me massively as the years went by.
New guys I see coming into the trade now are way behind in both knowledge and skill compared to 8 or 10 years ago and there are very few guys or girls entering the trade here in Ireland. Good mechanics are very very hard to find but yet we still don’t get paid near as much as a plumber or electrician which drives me nuts.... Honestly in Ireland I don’t ever see this changing and in my eyes it is down to one thing and that is the customer and their overall lack of understanding of how their car works and how it needs constant maintenance and yes sometimes repair. Rather than try and be educated by actual professional mechanics/technicians they just jump on google reviews telling everyone how much of a scammer you are cause you replaced a timing belt 3 months ago and now they need an EGR valve and clearly that’s the techs fault 🙄Anyway rant over love the channel dude keep up the good work 👍🏻
Interesting. Sorry to hear about your difficulties, but it's nice to know we're not alone. Hang in there. I wish you the best and thank you for your input.
It's amazing how all seasoned mechanics think alike all over the world we are battling the same problems. I just type similar comparison to plumbers and electricians earlier.
Eric, I came back into the automotive industry after the military in 05 and it was a much different game than it was in the 90s. I worked on a draw for a dealer and it was nuts. Fast forward and I have my shop in Columbus (not too far from you lol) and I've decided to stop doing open drive up work. Now Im a personal contract tech for multiple people and their families. Helps build a great set of trust. I mentioned that because, like doctors, our insurance is insane. However, we don't make as much. I believe the industry is collapsing from the inside out. I worry about hiring young people. Most aren't willing to put in the extra hours afterwards to learn or those that are don't understand why I want them to understand the fundamentals of a clean shop; meaning they are too good to clean tools and floors. Crap, I was paying a kid $20/hr under the table and I still couldn't get him to pay attention or regurgitate an operation. Sometimes he'd show up and others he wouldn't. I also don't think younger kids even think about being a tech as a "real job". Often enough you don't even see techs working on your cars anymore. Your car goes into a dealership broken, the waiting room is nice, and poof car is fixed. I had a younger guy argue with me at AutoZone that the expensive obd scanners fixed all the problems too and as a mechanic I should know that. ::facepalm::. When a child can't see that person making "magic" to a car due to insurance or management not letting customers watch or see techs work, kids can't dream of that job and that job doesn't exist to them. I think I'm the only person on Earth who gets out of their car at Valvoline to talk with the kids everyone else has blinders (hey I go when I'm too lazy to do something myself). Add to all that, cars becoming more disposable, and people don't associate a big work force with the maintenance of disposable products.
Lemme explain my "disposable car" comment. Cars last so much longer now. we're seeing them in the multi-hundreds of thousands of miles before catastrophic failure. However, when they do go, they usually aren't worth fixing thus people just go buy a new one.
Hi neighbor. Thanks for the input. You make a lot of good points, but you also proved another one. You can't keep a good technician down. You saw the writing on the wall and changed your business plan. Good on you for that.
Awesome video Eric. I can not agree more. I only been in this field since February as a service writer and it is so hard to see people come in and not work. I work in a flat rate shop and it blows my mind how slow and rude and inconsiderate these techs can be. Some think they Gods blessing on the shop and with out them that the shop work suffer. I just wish people would have so motivation to work hard and long. It is so dame hard to find good work ethic in this field of industry.
Just like you need artistic skill to go to art school you need technical aptitude to be a mechanic. And less and less people have that.
And a lot of younger techs do not want to get their hands dirty, only wanting to work with the computer systems of the car, and see undercar repairs as beneath their dignity.
I went to art school. ;)
You are looking more and more like an artist (french accent)!
Eric im a long time fan and subscriber i would like to thank you for inspiring me to become interested in the automotive field i am currently attending a motoring institute and looking forward to one day being a master tech just gotta stay motivated and stay dirty 👌🏼
Thank you! I never get tired of hearing how my work helps people. Good luck in school and with your career!
Work hard? Nah, I'm going to be a youtuber! :-)
Yea, that's easy.....
Great message Eric, the field presents many opportunities for a self motivated young person. We repaired hybrid vehicles in my shop often. Not difficult, just different.
Do not do the auto repair industry a disservice advertising TV shows like all girls garage. That is nothing more than a moneymaking propaganda by the velocity channel. It is nothing more than an infomercial for one product or another with very little to know how to actually included. The show has taken a drastic turn for the worst over the years. Not just picking on that one show, it’s all the shows on the velocity channel these days. Much more can be learned by watching UA-cam videos such as yours, then anything produced by velocity. I understand the women all girls garage have to make a living, but it does very little to help the industry other than tell me where to buy one part or another which also I can see by simply watching the commercials.
Rick I totally understand your point of view on commercialized TV programs. Yes those types of TV shows offer little to no knowledge or insight when it comes to A viewer that wants A show that will teach such viewer something. I will say that those who can make a pay check by doing such shows should be supported, because we are all car family. If you don't like such shows, like myself, then such person can ignore said item. At the end of the day if I were to think about any of the TV shows that you or I dislike and the people associated with such show, I also remember that I my skill set is and forever will be much greater then said TV show people. That being said I don't really care, because I do car stuff for me
Dan Bertholf I remember old shows like the shade tree mechanic from the late 80s early 90s which actually contain automotive how to. Shows in our days only contain installing parts and information on where to buy said part. Very annoying when watching something put out by someone like Eric, you will see mistakes. Yes, Eric has made some mistakes and show them on camera he didn’t cut and retake and bases videos on a script. This is real how to. I just find the commercialized television programs for automotive how to be a complete waste of time and nothing more than an infomercial. If I want to buy a Harley fuel injection system, I already know where to get it. I am fully aware that Cornwell Matco Mac and snap on make tools. I don’t need to be told that in every show. Also, why not show how to remove an engine from a vehicle with nothing more than a floor jack jack stands and a cherry picker and hand tools. Show people how to do things the way they word be likely to do it in their own garage. This is why I don’t watch those shows anymore, and I stick more with UA-cam videos. I know I have been a little bit hard on Eric at times with some content, but his videos are far superior than anything on television these days.
@@rickgaine3476 I never had those shows growing up, and I didn't find Eric's channel Intel after I was a serious technician that had my own mindstate on how I fix automobiles. I watch his stuff cause its enjoyable. I learned how to work on cars because iI had to, so maybe we should make a show together that really shows people something realistic. Im not the best tech in the world, but I do know that all the all nighters i have spend figuring it out has taught me. In modern times there is two kinds on people that watch car stuff, those who just want to see car stuff and those who understand car stuff that need real programming.
Dan Bertholf I remember watching one of Eric‘s old videos years ago when you put an engine in the Dodge pick up only to find out that the engine was pleased. Rather than destroying footage, Eric decided to show the video with the mistake in it which I really appreciate it, because it was a learning experience for everybody. That’s not something you will see on a television show. Eric can be appreciated for that, and for his honest approach at automobile how to repair is. Like I said, I may not have always agreed of them, and truthfully, I have probably been a bit unfair to him in other comments, but his videos really are top notch. And Eric, I do apologize for the snippy things I’ve sent you another comments in the past. Past. I also apologize for the mistakes in his comment due to auto correct on the iPhone.
Great advice, work ethics is very important. Totally agree that now a days it’s important to have sofware and hardware skills to be a good technitian and young people are great candidates to achive this. Just took my BMW, E90 to a nephews friend that is starting his business in his garage and he was very professional, on time, clean and got the job done properly and UA-cam has a lot to do with that, thanks to people like Erick showing how to properly repair cars helps a lot THANKS FOR HELPING THE COMMUNITY.
In my area it's amazing the number of auto tech selling their tools and running away from the business.
Etcg1 i work as a tech currently and my gripes with the industry don’t necessarily have to be there but, they are. You made a good point about the flat rate system. Many young guys including myself have been discouraged from being techs because of it. We all have to pay bills and it’s not easy as a beginner. You get around it but it seems like there is a high amount of pressure now in this age to get cars in and out faster. Not to down play on older techs that have been in the industry for 20-30 years but it seems when the older techs started the technology wasn’t so advanced. Now it seems like the younger techs are expected to dive in head first into deep side and be expected to know many things of the vehicle or brand in a short amount of time while getting used to the flat rate system. With that being said and again not taking anything away from old timers in the business but they have grown with the product and have been educated with the technology in the product gradually as it has been introduced over the years. I’d like your input to this and if I’m wrong let me know too. I do understand that at some point people had to learn about technology way back but systems were less complex 20-30 years ago. Thank you.
Personally I don't think new techs should work flat rate. I think they should be paid hourly and work under a more experienced technician who can show them the way. This way we can 'grow' new talent instead of throwing them into the deep end expecting them to swim.
Thank you for your comment and good luck in your career.
Every field you have to pay your "dues"! Plumber's, electricians, they call them apprenticeships...us old techs didn't know everything right out of the gate, it takes time. I'm 53 and still wrench'n with my two man shop and making a good living but, again,IT TAKES TIME. Even if you go to college to become a doctor, it will take time to build a clientele to were you make enough to pay for your overhead. IMO your generation wants everything NOW!! Sorry pal doesn't work that way. Sooner you realize this the better off you'll be.
I think that dealerships and bad repair shops really don't help with there attitude of 'profit is god', Rip off the 'Cash cow' or customer if you can. (Honesty is a problem)
Who would want to work in such a immoral environment?
No one needs or wants more stress in there life, it is destructive.
i've been there, no thanks :-(
Feeling that you have done a good honest job is the best, not just how much money you get.
Just my Opinion, Sorry for waffling.
No worries, I love waffles. That said, there is another side to this. Operating a repair shop is very expensive. Workmans comp alone will set you back big time. Not to mention insurance and equipment cost. Unfortunately if technicians are going to get paid more, the cost of auto repair will have to come up accordingly.
As always, thanks for your input.
There are many sides to the question, but you don't want every comment to be a book of everything :)
Waffles are nice :-D
I think it's in a lot of industries but it's easy to single out the auto industry. I've seen the rip off the cash cow in the medical industry a lot more but no one questions them that much. The medical industry upsells lots of tests, exploratory procedures and experimental therapies that are used to make their clinic or medical group more money. Also, the prescribe a lot of pills and alot of other pills to counter the side effects of the first 5 set of pills.
Eric I believe you made some good points in this video! As a former VW mechanic and ironically a former UTI student, there's a lot of hope built up into new recruits! What these tech colleges DON'T mention is the low side of the flat rate system, or "guarantee" rate! I left the automotive field for just that reason! A lot of people that go into the field aren't aware of the shop hierarchy or pecking order! My twin brother and I were 2 of the highest skilled techs, but we got most of the "grunt" work! Our pay was mostly guarantee rate! My brother was the only master tech in the shop! I took great pride in the work I did, but simply didnt go anywhere!
In the shop there was two different techs! You had actual technicians, and you had the garden variety hacks! In a 5 year stretch, I had ZERO comebacks! I took the time and actually diagnosed the problem! The "hacks" would simply change the part they thought was bad and move on! By the time the problem resurfaced, they had already been paid! If they were busy working on something else, then that comeback would get handed off to the next lowest person in the pecking order! The only problem with that is that the comeback DOES NOT get charged to the customer! If it goes to the original tech, then he gets paid nothing! If it goes to another person then it gets charged to internal!
I could go on a lot longer about this! I think your videos are great! I've watched everyone of them! The information you give is probably the best I've seen! I simply have a problem with the internal workings of dealerships, and how they accept new techs! Do they have to prove themselves, YES! It's just very hard for new techs to prove themselves, if the service managers or advisors simply won't give them the chance to because someone else is quicker!
Not Worth it anymore
UTI is a great sponsor to have. UTI is very respectable I almost went there but I went to Hobart Institute of Welding Technology instead. I work on cars out of my own shop and cars are changing fast and you must keep reinvesting in your equipment and education or you will be left in the past. Eric makes so many valid points and speaks only the truth about both sides of the fence. Eric is a good technician that is great at making videos and public speaking.
The lack of people coming into the field is a product of two things. Democrats pushing government dependence and socialism, killing the want for people to earn their own way. Second the declining wages for automotive technicians vs the rising costs of tools and training.
T Web I drove through New Jersey last week and even in the "Nice" areas 3/5 houses are abandoned or on sale for really low prices do to over taxation. I drove past a 5 bedroom house that had a sign for 39k.......the property taxes would be close to 3grand a month
RIGHT ON, BROTHER!!!
@@lovemym16 Here in NJ we are held prisoner by the NJEA or better known as the New Jersey Education Association or a more fitting name is the New Jersey Extortion Association, the school administrators and there are several for each district make ridiculous salaries then there is the busted pension funds now the gas tax is going up 4 % on top of the 23 % a couple of years ago our new Democrat governor as with all Democrats never met a tax he didn't like it's complete madness.
I closed my shop 8 years ago and to me, it was a blessing in disguise, I don't miss it. I so much enjoy doing my own repairs
Great topic. You hit the nail on the head. It's about work ethic and pride in what you do. Millenials need to step up (for those who haven't yet) and make a living through an honest days work. Wether it's wrenching on cars, banging on a keyboard or flipping a burger...get the job and take pride in it. Own it.
34 years ago I started sacking groceries for a local chain of grocery stores. Now I manage a drug store for one of the largest chains of drug stores. And I make damn good money doing it. And I love what I do.
I grew up wrenching on cars. I have passed that knowledge and love of doing it on to both of my son's. All three of of my daughter's have helped me in the garage through the years and still do at times. They don't always know exactly what I'm doing but they'll turn a wrench or hold a flashlight for me if I ask.
I know have a grandson that I am passing my knowledge on to. Maybe he will be the one to go on and become a service tech. You never know.
Through the years of working on cars with my younger son (who is 24 now) one of his friends would come over and watch us, fetch tools for us, etc... his father and grandfather are/were brick masons. He went to college and got a business degree in accounting and planned to take over the family business one day...then one day his plans changed. He says he was inspired by what we made look so easy and he loves BIG trucks. So moved to Cleveland, enrolled in a tech college, did his time there and is now a diesel tech here in Michigan. He loves what he does.
So there is always hope for MORE people to find their way to auto tech careers.
My niece once had a boyfriend who is looking to get into the industry and I told him about UTI.
I told him if he gets into the automotive repair industry he will never be for want of work.
I do some minor Automotive repairs myself stuff that I can handle stuff that I have the equipment to handle.
I tried to get my nephew interested in doing the basic of Automotive repairs but he had no interest. I told my niece's boyfriend about this and that my nephew is one of the reasons why you will always have work.
I then proceeded to ask my nephew if his school had shop class, he told me they did. I then asked him, why not take one? You know what his reply was, I don't want to get dirty.
I just hung my head in disappointment. Kids today they don't want to do physical labor. While I am not that old that is where I've gained most of all of my skills, that and also by watching people who do physical labor and repair things.
My neighbor who lived across the alley was constantly tinkering around in his garage primarily repairing lawn mowers that were thrown out by people that he picked up from his sons salvage yard, this is where I learned how to repair things.
Sorry for the long comment if anyone has taken their time to read it thank you.
M W S spot on brother. My brother and I been working on our own motocross bikes since we were 6. No adult help either. "Here's the tools and the manual and figure it out" along with vitamins, homework and EFD discipline. (Read 70's old school no-BS) Kids since then (even) been raised Soft and Spoiled. My bro and I still fix everything we can, automotive to carpentry and plumbing, he was also an electrician for many years. Kids these days, a lot, just worthless GAMERS. And parents too lazy and stupid to not beat them senseless. I played video games as a kid too, but also chopped wood until midnight with frozen fingers by flashlight or floodlights. Yeah we chopped enough wood to supply the US army, haha, anyway, f*** these lazy kids I forgot my point. Ahhhh f*** 'em all !!!!!!! 😄
Doesn't want to get dirty?! Blasphemy!
@@ETCG1 kid you not, that's what he told me😔
I’m a younger guy trying to work my way up, and I can honestly say I love having the older guys around they have so much knowledge, tips, and tricks that help tremendously! Us younger guys just need to listen and come ready to bust some ass everyday.
I was leaving the business, but I decided to get out of the dealership network instead. It really helped me grow as a tech. I'm better off making salary instead of flat rate but there has to be some sort of profit sharing built in as well. Finding something wrong with a car in the shop and reporting it to the customer starts/ begins with the tech, so he should get something for it if a sale is made. The flat rate system in my opinion is messing up the industry, and doesn't give an average tech enough time to learn everything new coming out and also make a real living wage (at least 75K per. year).
I've seen the work of a specialist electric vehicle/hybrid shop in a big city spend months on a customers electric vehicle, then bill them $4500 for the honor of still having a non running vehicle. Seriously. So the customer got a hold of me years after I stopped repairing/modifying electric vehicles. In 6 hours I had it running. I'm 58 years old. I drew my own schematics of the 3 phase electric vehicles I use to service from customers world wide. This was before Tesla, Nissan, etc had their hardware on the road. There is nobody for me to pass my knowledge down to. After market repair services are becoming mandatory for electric vehicles as they get past their warranty periods. All over Craigslist there are people claiming to refurb battery packs with used parts. It's easy work. But it's not very technical. The demand is getting higher each year. Yet nobody that I can see is being trained for that market. Eric, you have the perfect mindset and skills to be one of those EV techs. In just over a year, Tesla's will start to fall out of warranty for example. Entertainment value aside, the only tech-ish person I've seen on UA-cam is Rich Rebuilds. His knowledge of Tesla is expanding rapidly. I'd like to see you as a serious wrench, collaborate with someone like Rich to broaden your already wide skill set. I don't know him. But I know what I see as his EV skills being valuable, just like your skills.
love what we do, i think this will bring us far ahead instead of focusing which industry will make u earn more money. I like to repair stuffs, from IT to automotive, i like to learn and keep improving. Especially watching your ericthecarguy video which enable me to do some repairs on my own car.
By trade I'm a retail manager, but it's truly a art form to have the knowledge to understand and diagnose a vehicle. I've seen people not taking the time to fully find out what a vehicle needs and then just throwing parts at a car and then complaining that the noise didn't go away. Taking the time to fix the root of a issue is extremely important. That's why I work on my own stuff, but I will own it...I have a tire guy and he's amazing.
Unfortunately as a first year Tech, I find myself battling the industry for an opportunity to learn. I can read, I can watch videos. However, experience as I'm sure you know comes from the practical side of things. So an instance where I'm focusing on a brake job, the gravy work as we all call it. I'm shoved aside eating the bullet because the licensed tech can A) Do it faster and B) Wants that pay check. So my opportunity to learn and gain a skill set is tossed aside for that quick dollar. I'm not going to say it's like this everywhere but as I've worked at a Honda Dealership, an Independent Shop and now a larger private chain, its easy to say that our learning is on the back burner and these stories are going around. So its hard for newer guys like myself justify continuing in a trade where in 4 years time, I'm going to be screwed because my skill set isn't where it should be.
That's just my experience as a first year tech about to go back to school for my second block of schooling. Are these thoughts addressed in depth in any of the upcoming videos as I'd like to improve as a technician but never given the time of day. Though I graduated through an Automotive program, I am considered a tire buster by the older guys, and not an up and comer.
The frustration is real.
Full disclosure; I majored in computer science and design/write software for a living. I just do minor repairs on my vehicle for fun; I don't really need to do it to save money, I just like taking things apart and seeing how the insides work.
I think one of the major barriers to entry that hasn't been mentioned yet is how ad hoc and sometimes even cloistered automotive knowledge is. Before I even thought of going to college, I was already programming fluently in multiple languages, reading the source code of my operating system to see how it worked, and reading RFCs for the major communications protocols. But it isn't as if there are publicly available specifications and schematics for vehicles. And with the increase in complexity in vehicle design over the past couple decades, you really can't just dive in with a set of wrenches and a little bit of mechanical intuition. If you don't already have someone in your life that knows a thing or two it is very hard to get started. Plus, manufacturer's do nasty things like require specialty tools and hide the ECM source code. Eric plays a very important roll in lowering that entry barrier by collecting, organizing, and presenting repair information in a coherent way so that all someone really needs is a little motivation.
P.S. There are a surprising number of people in the comments that missed the "old people are part of the problem too" half of the message.
Great video the new folks going into the auto repair business needs to learn things also from us guys and ladies who grew up on the old school technology. For example i had a guy bring me his 55 chevy because none of the new Tech's knew how to rebuild a carburetor. He told me he went to 6 shops and everyone was afraid to touch it, i rebuilt the carb in 30 minutes had it back on the car and running good. Its a shame these new generation Tech's are scared to learn something old. Great job Eric keep it up .
I work at a chevy dealer and spent 2 years at a ford dealer and a year and a half at an indie shop. Im in my late 30s and just graduated tech school in 2015. I was a machinist and field service tech before. For me the most important thing is do you have a career path laid out? Do you have certain things you expect from me in a certain amount of time? Something I can shoot for and look forward to? But dealers can be veeery different. Some guys love helping newer guys get aquainted (to the point of being annoying sometimes) but if youve got a master tech in your shop that will help other guys and even lets you use tools here and there. Boy thats a difference maker. Service writers and managers make a big difference too. There are shops where everyone busts their hump all day and no one makes money and there are shops where its kind of laid back and everyone banks.
Eric your still kickin man i so happy that you "made it" from always working on the ground in practically a shed compared to your shop now... keep up the goodz. And happy birthday if its your birthday.
Thank you!
I think it starts back in high school where they have removed most shop type programs. cars, wood working, ect. I personally think the flate rate system needs to change... Warranty times are getting cut all the time, the average time now to overhaul a transmission is 5-6 hours the manufactures state you can get extra time it just needs to be signed off on, but every dealer i've been to or talking to guys at hands on training classes, the dealers don't to fill out the extra paper work. You can make a ton of money doing routine maintenance how ever most of the time you get a job its after someone else has done all the maintenance and they are coming in for a problem that only a handful of guys can diagnose. Personally for me if my paycheck was x amount every week id be happy no matter what id did. I'm fully certified in electric cars and have all 9 ases with 100% in GM training. I love my job, often i just hate how we are paid. The one good thing gm has done is offered up to an hour for electrical diag, you just have to have your punch times in place and a story to back it up.
"Write your stories" as HumbleMechanic likes to say. Hang in there, and thank you for your input.
The problem is you went into a dealership in the first place. This limits your ability to learn like tech in independent shops, were you need to be diverse in many makes and models. Maybe you start your own shop doing GM only, give better service than the dealer and their(GM) junk you'll be plenty busy!
I just started my first day at university for an Engineering degree today, and feel optimistic about it. Was in a dealership for almost 4 years and was good at it, but didn't see much of a future for myself long-term. As you said, both sides need to step-up. Many techs at the dealer left for greener pastures, but came back some time later, which scared me as to where things were headed. I do miss it sometimes, getting dirty with my hands, and being around my co-workers was fun. But rent kept going up, and my paycheck wasn't. I came in at opening and left short of closing too. Maybe after I graduate, I'll become the very thing I hated most when I questioned who the hell built whatever I was working on at the time.
Flat rate incentivizes some negative things, like speed over quality and anytime commission is involved, that can incentivize work that isn't really necessary. It's not all flat rate's fault. I would say part of it is just the business ethics of the people that run these businesses that have no compunction of taking advantage of people's ignorance, but that's always been there, but the up sell of unnecessary stuff during recalls and warranty repairs is annoying at best, but people fall for it. It's one of the reasons I don't use dealers or shops for maintenance and repairs as I haven't found a place that was up to my ethical standards, which would save me time at least. That said, I tend to agree with Eric, but the industry needs to fix itself.
I can attest to the lack of quality that flat rate encourages. I've seen some real half assed jobs from brakes to engines to recalls. Really D rate work from 30 year old Master Techs as well.
I may not be working in the automotive industry, but I do work in another field as a technician fixing phones and tablets but I do know how to turn a wrench and fix my own car when need be. I do on the other hand, have a younger brother teying to get in the automotive industry and whenever I work on my car I have him help me out. If I wasn't fixing phones I'd be in the auto repair industry myself. And you are right, it's going to need some work from both sides of the equation for this industry to continue to succeed and your work ethic can say quite a lot about you. I'm 20 almost 21 and I've been promoted to assistant manager a second time for the same company and plan on starting my own repair shop in the next few years. Every job I've had ever since my first real job I maintained a good ethic and left each one on a good note meaning I put in a two weeks notice none of that I don't like this job I'm not going to show up anymore. And each one has been very generous and gave me a a great reference. Hard work pays off ladies and gentlemen.
7:03 YOURE RIGHT ON POINT ERIC! AND THATS WHAT IT TAKES TO BE SUCCESSFUL IF ANY FIELD WHEATHER YOURE A MECHANIC OR A STOCK BROKER OR A DOCTOR.YOU SOLVE PROBLEMS
Hi Eric right out of high school in the Bay Area Iwent to a junior college and got my service technicians degree unfortunately I never really used it because I wound up working for winery as a facility maintenance technician, we have trucks and cars that I Im able to lightly work on, just today we had a hug truck Ford F550 box truck with the V 10 and the thing wouldn’t hardly idle it was hunting for an idle, I was able to remember some of my basic troubleshooting skills and found out that the air filter mass airflow sensor and the throttle bodies were all covered with oil etc, after cleaning everything with the appropriate cleaners idle finally stabilized.
Here in North Queens, there are 2 issues. Name brand stations replacing mechanic bays with a convenience store, and even busy, well located gas and repair shops, going out because of the value of the real estate they sit on. I worked in Auto Parts for a number of years, and even people I trusted too work on my car, screwed up. So I am hesitant to pay someone to work on my car, and never give anyone recommendations as too where to get their car fixed.
Part 1 - (who am I) I am a Data Center Storage Engineer who now freelances talent to business. Having said that, I also have a well equipped garage and just rebuilt a Ford Focus Engine and dropped it back in the other night. So I have both the mechanical and IT. Part 1 - Over the last year or so I was asked by the owner of a local auto repair shop (he actually owns two) that has 10 bays, two buildings. The owner is a friend of mine though another interest. One day he pulled into my driveway (just moved and no one knew where I was) and told me he needs me to redo his business. He wanted new computers, updated shop software, new phones, a video security system, wifi, integration with tablets and print stations for wiring diagrams. All of which I did for him. 70 network ports and counting at this point. Everyone has tablets, Identifix, shop management access, you name it. Access to all the information at their finger tips. During all this I learned from him a LOT about the stress points of a shop like that, got to know the service writers and the mechanics. The owner and the mechanics are all now "integrated" with IT and information to cope with the vast changes going on. This. . . .is were it is going.
Worked hard all my life. Showed up on time. Did quality, conscientious work always with integrity and not taking advantage of the customer ever. Sometimes even did work for free to help someone out in a bind with their car. But bosses still screwed me over. What gives? Such is life. Phil
Thank you for your integrity. I've heard some good advice: Don't take it personal if they dont thank you or appreciate you for you going the extra mile. Just do good for yourself knowing you dont screw ppl over like the rest of the super star productive workers aka scumbag cheats. But do look out for your own interests. If they want you work on your days off but wont pay your overtime rate, then decline politely saying you have plans. If you find a better opportunity leave. Always stay professional and polite no matter what. Also, stay positive by not associating with the cheats and get a hobby to take your mind off work all the time.
I'm doing car hard case diagnosis. As well, module repair(ecu, abs, clusters, etc). This is really interesting work. I have about 15yrs electronics repair experience.