Hi Tony, I have been doing Electronic repairs for longer than you have been alive, I'm 72 now, and I have to say you are awesome! You repair things like this that I would have said were beyond economical repair, I don't know what you charge but I know it won't be enough, well done mate. Bob. UK
@@giantbellend he's talking about how human skin gets thinner as we age and loses it's resistence properties meaning smaller electric shocks are more likely to kill you compared to when we're younger
I just had a 3090 ftw3 ultra repaired by him it was a flat rate of 250, plus parts (5$) plus the cost of new thermal Pads was 25$. The card is 1,200-1,400$ new still I sent him so well worth it. He is way cheaper than north ridge repair
From these videos, I would say cards don't die when the thermal paste dries out. Cards fail when someone decides changing the thermal paste will help them compete!
Sometimes, repasting is kind of necessary after long use... or if the stock thermal paste is just awful. My 2080 has had the worst thermal paste that I've ever seen. I noticed because the temps were becoming awful after around a year of use only. I opened it and found the majority of the stock paste had pumped out. Had never done a repaste on a GPU before, luckily I knew to be careful and it paid off. Could use the card normally again with good temps for years until I upgraded recently.
As an owner of one of these cards, why someone would open it up this early in its life is beyond me. I didn’t crack open my 1080 Ti for 5 years until I replaced its thermals parts
because someone thought it was a good idea to suggest replacing the thermal paste like it’s an oil change every few months. the card owner, of course decided to mod it themselves.
@@H34Rt54 I didnt touch my 1080 gtx for 9 years and while not worth much anymore i was still super carefull, but after that my temps dropped like good 10-15c. not worth even opening at least for 5 years when is brand new
people are idiots they want 1 c down so bad or 5 c temp and break gpu :(((( easy thing if you want some temps down put one more cooler under your gpu ...
@@derim006 thats exactly how i killed my gtx 970 ti, i had no knowledge about cooling pads those small passive ones, probably removed it and fried it, oops.
Great repair, when I saw you placed the order, I picked the PCB board that's in better condition than others. I'm glad that it works! I'm trying to get better condition PCB boards now, hope that can make your repair work easier in the future.
@@niklasniklasniklas1 Well, you might get a bad one even you do videos. Just joking, it depends on what I have in hand, usually I'll pick the better condition boards to send
You sir, made me buy my own soldering station cuz i have multiple broken GPUs (mainly broken traces) and you made me learn about all that stuff. THANK YOU! (well, not a thank you from my GF.. xD) Oh and THATS what you call "better than factory"
@iabdullah5206 aah yes, that time I spent a solid $1,999.99 at newegg. I had a lot going on at that time, and I thought this purchase would help me feel better.
i believe he put one bolt and tightened it but the other side was a bit crooked, then the shoulder of the second bolt did that mess. Due to the plate inability to rotate from the tightened first bolt, the threads got in place correctly but the bolt was shifted enough for it's shoulder to act as a shear.
Imagine buying a $2000+ card, being unhappy enough with the temps etc that you take it apart to Kryosheet it, then you damage it in a way that's unrepairable on the original PCB. I've done full disassembly & installation of a HydroCopper block on a 3090 before (which was worth way more than $2k at the time cuz it was during the mining bubble) and I managed to do that, with it being my first time doing a block install myself, and did it perfectly enough that my temperatures were great & the card was happy the entire time I had it. Ran it up to ~700W draw on the 1000W BIOS with a pretty hefty OC & voltage increase for benchmarking, but daily I ran it in the stock wattage realm with a decent OC on stock voltage, never had any issues and it never saw 60C again once that block was on it unless I was pushing 650+W through it.
Sh$t happens. No one is as perfect as some others apparently are… if he bought and took apart a $2000 card you will be well aware of the issues of disassembly and reassembly.
do u get a lot of performance out of oc, like for games? I do ml workloads and even if I downvolt the core and downclock the memory I barely lose any performance in it
@@illyaeater on the 3090? it was notable but not huge gains, I ran it undervolt-OCed regularly, slightly undervolted with a significant OC over the stock Kingpin speeds (I forgot to mention it was a 3090 Kingpin I think). On the 4090 I have now actually OCing it is not worth it at all, I run 1025mV (which is an undervolt) at around 2810MHz or 950mV at ~2700MHz and the difference is negligible. I ran some Stable Diffusion stuff on it for a while with those settings, and the main thing on that was VRAM speed, so undervolting the GPU core made no noticeable difference in render times.
@@illyaeater OC is often for shits and giggles, only a few cards really show notable performance increases with OC without being outrageous in their power consumption. 20-series and 30-series showed pretty laughable gains for the power increases, while with the 6900XT I got roughly 10% more performance with 10% more power. Anything past 330W on it was basically wasted power and money. My 4080 is voltage limited and while I did go 3,000MHz+ just for the flex, the performance difference wasn't really worth the time of dialing in a stable OC. Honestly, at this point I often just undervolt and leave it like that. It runs cooler, it uses less power, and I cannot tell the difference in FPS.
FYI this is my card that was repaired and i have disassembled dozens of gpu's before but this was the first one i messed up on and man, i wish it was on one of my cheaper older gpu's, safe to say im not gonna be doing this again to a card im daily driving in the future.
Have this same card and although it sucks for the owner I am glad to see it was user error and not the fault of the card itself. Worry enough about the 12vhp connector, didn't need the extra worry. Cool to see the teardown and awesome repair as usual.
Proper Terminology is not underfill , but actually Corner staking , its purpose is to help with Shock/Vibe or CTE expansion breaking the BGA solder join. Sometimes it can be the same material as a full underfill, but a corner stake allows for a reworkable BGA.
What ever the term is, it still makes its way under the core to a point of surrounding the balls. So lets agree that this is corner underfill at the very least ?
Have same model. It's only 4090 that can fit in my computer case. Was curios that inside it, thanks to this video i know - my card have solid build without cost cutting.
Not sure how i got on your channel ....but totally intrigued ive watched alot of your videos , you have definitely perfected your skill and are probably one of the best ive watched on yt keep up good work man love your vids
Literally found out why my 6750 XT would have turbine fans from 0rpm to 100% last 2 months. Turns out i was literally gaming with 110C hotspot temps. Had similar reaction to 33:28
First repairman in history to say "I want one of these myself" and not go on to try and tell the customer the repair failed and he will buy the card for half of market value
As someone who uses AMD cards a lot and is used to like 20c+ delta, I'm almost used to never seeing a close delta. My own 4090 Suprim X had a ~15c delta on its normal bios, and around a 10-12 delta with its 666w bios
I need 2 of these for the same atx build for my ai trianing for work project... on a budget... hard to find case and mb for an am5 chip with room enough for 2 gpu or more. Offloading the cooling to a rad is one way I think it might fit better...
those pads he wanted you to use are actually good. when mill tolerances are in check, and they make contact with the die properly. dude prob needs a thicker pad. thermal grizzly doesn seem to make thicker ones it would seem, but there are other alternatives.
No, unfortunately it is not like liquid metal good. But PTM7950 is better than any other non-conductive paste, and by a measurable margin, and for the vast majority it should be the only thing you should ever use on your GPU if you're opening it up. Liquid metal is hands down, without a doubt, the best performing TIM, but there is rarely a justification for most everyone actually using it, especially if you're clumsy or don't follow directions well. The reason people think PTM7950 can compete with liquid metal is because most people are using those TIMs on nVidia GPUs, but nVidia GPUs do not have very accurate TJ sensors. If you compare liquid metal to PTM7950 on a Radeon GPU, which have more and much more accurate TJ sensors, you will usually see liquid metal outperform PTM7950 by ~6-8C TJ on air cooling, and upwards of ~10-15C TJ on water cooling.
I use Kryosheet on my own 4090 and im happy with it, but i can give you the advice to cover the surroundings of the core. These Cryosheets are conductive.
A bunch of youtubers, people on Reddit, and twitter are gushing over the Kryosheet. I tried one on a 7900xtx Red Devil and the temps are not that much better than the stock paste.
I buy the 50x50 sheets as well as the smd component sealer and then i use the over size to use little dabs of paste at edge of sheet around the gpu frame. Now on my Cpu 12900 i use the cpu frame mount from thermal Grizzly and the 50x50 pad i secure with small dots of paste on frame.
Incredible repair job. I guess the client wrecked the card when trying to install the cryo sheet on an already well cooled card. I would advise him against using this, as like u said, thermal paste is better for gpus.
It seems like the screw was forced through the hole hoping the misalignment will be fixed. Kryosheet is alright. I used carbonaut on laptop and usually cut it 1mm short to fit inside the CPU or GPU core and align the heatsink to see if it's flush and not moving if the heatsink has lower pressure. Then i apply black insulation tape around the core to prevent shorts just to be safe since laptop or mini pc will be moving around. The phase change is good alternative but still leaves behind residue. Edit: I think the sheet is 1-2mm bigger and it will slip out during shipping unless there is some adhesive or thermal paste underneath. I usually adjust the sizing on core directly. I did see sharp edges of core cuts the sheet sometimes and fall on SMD. Then again i think heatsink is very slightly warped on the left pushing the sheet to the right when flipping over.
They have so much empty space, but still they often put components really close to mounting holes. I dont believe that it would be so hard during projecting and development to move everything away from them, like even 5mm would be nice so even if PCB crack inside track would be not so prone to crack.
The problem with thermal paste is that it pushes out, not that it necessarily goes bad. It will eventually dry up, but pump out is usually a bigger enemy over a much shorter period of time. That's why PTM7950 is so popular.
@@bismuth7730 when i got it i did some benches before with paste then applied the ptm and ran again and it was a few c higher but im using a 7800x3d which doesnt get hot in the usual way so im an edge case :P i just cba with repasting more than yearly at most
One issue with the PTM/kyrosheet is that they work well on high temps (60+) since this is when they are changing the phases. I don't know if there is a reason to put it on something like this with AIO, since the temps will never reach the optimal spot for it to work well (correct me if im wrong) I have (probably fake) PTM on my 3080, I saw 90c hot spot on gelid paste after 5-6 months and decided to invest into that thing, so far so good, 82c hot spot with 340W at .950v 2025mhz
I tried the Kryosheet on my CPU and GPU. It changed the mounting distances on the GPU block and it would be easy to do what I saw on this card because it doesn't let the indexing pins/screw holes bottom out properly. Get it askew and I bet that could happen. I thought about shimming it with nylon washers and getting thicker pads but the pads were plenty thick. It just bothered me that it would make a gap between the backplate and acrylic. I just threw some Kryonaut Extreme (the pink stuff) on there and it's the knees bees. I want to shunt mod it but I'm scared to do that now. I have an ASUS 7900xtx. I can't even get the memory over 60c overclocked.
Those stripped boards are interesting, I wonder how they've done some of that damage as well. I guess given the mess they've made that they're working through these quickly. Weird how they'd be harvesting from such an expensive model of 4090 though, this Suprim watercooled model is not cheap and you'd think if the only goal was to get cores/memory to transplant to another board you would just be purchasing the cheapest 4090's available.
36:26 don't want to give you bad news but according with Roman (der8auer), if you use a sheet and then you have to remove it or by miss place or ever the sheet will not work so good (it can lose 20% to 30% efficient).
I have the same GPU, and i think the owner did what he was doing probably because of the hotspot temps. It goes beyond 70 C and sometimes it reaches the thermal limit of 84 C during the summer, which it sucks considering that it's liquid cooled. Many people fix the issue with the PTM7950 or the KryoSheet.
Nice repair, I like the MSI Suprim's. That Timespy score at the end wasn't very impressive, I just ran it on my Evga 3070 FTW 3 Ultra just for fun, I got 12,616 Timespy score, and 14,053 graphics score; the MSI 4090 here got a little over 18750, I would have thought a high end 4090 would be a lot better than a 3070 non-ti. For what it's worth, I got almost 8000 on the CPU score, but I get it, it's just a test rig with a low cost motherboard and CPU probably. I doubt you need fast ram, and CPU just to test GPU repairs, just to see if we get a picture.
It's running at PCI-E 3.0 which might explain that but... maybe not, I might be missing something. It's probably just a configuration thing, a 4090 should be scoring a lot higher you are right.
Unfortunately they would be better for about 6 months, and then they wouldn't be, and you'll be repasting. Both KP-X and Kryonaut (and Noctua NT-H2, and most of the other chart topping highest performance non-conductive TIMs) have severe pump out and migration issues, so they are not the pastes you want to use for anything other than temporary open air test bench setups and for sub-ambient cooling. Those pastes are great on a CPU IHS, but for GPU dies, just use PTM7950. Nothing else non-conductive keeps up with it, and you'll never need to reapply it. For those who aren't clumsy and can follow directions (which excludes most people), liquid metal is an even better option than PTM7950.
22:50 there seems to be another ripped component on the opposite side of the chip. Lower left corner of the video. Card seems to work, but that could cause some smaller issue.
Bare die applications of thermal paste pump out, because of a bigger expansion coefficient difference between die and cold plate. This means that GPU bare die, is where you need an interface material resistant to Pump Out, which is where kryosheet or PTM are positioned. Yes they are tough to apply, but they are the only materials that would last.Thermal pastes need to be reapplied every few months in a bare die scenario because of this issue.
A recent study by Igor's Lab has discovered that with this gen of Nvidia cards, the main manufacturers have been using some really bad thermal paste on the core from factory. The stuff is prone to pumping out completely within 6 months. Even my 7900 xtx temps on hotspot increased 15C within the year I owned it. So it seems to not just be limited to Nvidia GPUs. The Nvidia FE cards use PTM7950 from factory, so they are an exception to the issue.
Would be interesting to see the numbers, how many GPUs broke by themselves, and how many were destroyed by their owners, because they tried “improve” them.
This is knightmare fuel for me as i have the same card. I was thinking once the warranty is out to do a full thermal pad/paste refresh to give it maximum life....
thing about cryosheet is you never have to 'resheet' unlike thermal paste. if the card or cpu doesnt break you never need the heatsink off again until the chip does die.
also, der Bauer says the kyrosheet has got some of the oil in thermal compound so you can use a drop to hold the sheet in place while reinstalling heatsink etc.
I suggest the owner of the board to use the Honeywell Ptm7950, instead of the Thermal Grizzly Kryosheet ... the PTM is slightly more performing and also is not electrically conductive ... finally, to avoid opening the board for maintenance, I suggest using Upsiren's UTP-8 thermal putty on the VRM and VRAM, instead of the classic silicone thermal conductive pads ... Both of these interfaces have a lifespan of more than 5 years
first thing I did when I got my 4090 is to get a sag to support it then I undervolted it right up cause when not the max 450W triggers all the time, always on the cutoff like it wants to draw more power so bad.
Great job. That's a huge leap of faith project. The whole thing would have cost 70% the value of a new card? Otherwise, how is it worth it for you as a business?
The kryosheet is performing better than my stock MSI Liquid Suprim X. My GPU temp shoots up to the 60s and the hot spot hovers at 80-83. I am VERY much considering making this mod to my card now that I see solid proof of improved temps.
So far from my soldering experience, I found out that the difference between melting and not melting the LEDs is probably going from 350C to 300C. Don't know if that's possible on that PCB, but if they are not connected to some heavy copper, it should be fine.
I changed my EVGA FTW3 1070 the day it got out of warranty, the difference? I knew what I was doing and dropped the temps from ~80°C to low 60's. Never touched it again and it is still not getting higher than mid 60's
Actually sir I think your wrong. Yes that is a mounting hole however the idea with the metal spring plate is to shift the application of the mounting force from the circuit board at the hole to the back of the PCB where it will be applied to GPU die instead of bending the PCB. Interestingly I ran in to this dilemma installing a water water block on my GPU because I kind of wanted to use the original metal spring and thus the high tension but decided to trust Alphacool engineering and make use of the Alphacool backplate instead. Alphacool just gives you 4 screws with foam washers so that all of the force is applied on those holes. In practice since the other 3 holes and additional screws would locate the PCB you should be able to get away with using the original PCB.
Doesn't matter, you still have a lot of clamping/crushing force being applied directly to the repair site, I wouldn't trust any epoxy to handle that long term without deforming and breaking or shorting the (many) tiny repair wires.
With all due respect PTM is the best for gpu's. The reason for that is the bare die contact will make paste pump out over time and PTM is way less effected by that cause its a phase change material. Its funny since MSI and Nvidia both use PTM as there thermal interface material. Doubt they would use it if it was not good.
I'd say either the screw was deformed, or what most likely happened is that he pulled on the screw either way too strong or it wasn't yet unscrewn completely, and he pulled on it hard.
I am currently using this gpu. And as I started watching the video, I was worried at first (this model has a chronic problem?) . But when I continued later, like John Travolta looking around Pulp Fiction movie, I asked to him, WHY? Why did you get into trouble for no reason? 🤦 Edit: der8auer said that something like an application cream / thermal paste will be sent with the kryosheet so that it could be applied easily and would not move from where it was placed, but I guess it did not come out of this.
i noticed you put the wrong value resistor on the back near the chip, thats why you card is pulling .5A more than it should do, this is why you get such bad temps! just an FYI
Must personally say thanks for the vid, i have this card and would rather take it apart myself than take it to a local shop for sure. Not that id even have to in its life time. I still baby the card even during gaming. Awesome vid man keep up the good work^
As if someone grabbed the card then swang radiator over their head. It seems water cooled cards just change the positions of weak points, not completely eliminate them.
Hi Tony, I have been doing Electronic repairs for longer than you have been alive, I'm 72 now, and I have to say you are awesome! You repair things like this that I would have said were beyond economical repair, I don't know what you charge but I know it won't be enough, well done mate. Bob. UK
@@rct3bigthe hell are you rambling on about.
@@rct3big 🤡🤡
@@giantbellend he's talking about how human skin gets thinner as we age and loses it's resistence properties meaning smaller electric shocks are more likely to kill you compared to when we're younger
It doesnt look economical to me either, but then i remember that graphics card in this video is about $2000.
I just had a 3090 ftw3 ultra repaired by him it was a flat rate of 250, plus parts (5$) plus the cost of new thermal
Pads was 25$. The card is 1,200-1,400$ new still I sent him so well worth it. He is way cheaper than north ridge repair
From these videos, I would say cards don't die when the thermal paste dries out. Cards fail when someone decides changing the thermal paste will help them compete!
😭
dunno my 1060 is still running after 8 years....
@@HarmonRAB-hp4nk my 1070 is running very cool after 7.5 years. if everything is working why even bother repasting it
@@zemudikat because you should be replacing paste over time, "working" doesn't mean healthy.
Sometimes, repasting is kind of necessary after long use... or if the stock thermal paste is just awful. My 2080 has had the worst thermal paste that I've ever seen. I noticed because the temps were becoming awful after around a year of use only. I opened it and found the majority of the stock paste had pumped out. Had never done a repaste on a GPU before, luckily I knew to be careful and it paid off. Could use the card normally again with good temps for years until I upgraded recently.
As an owner of one of these cards, why someone would open it up this early in its life is beyond me. I didn’t crack open my 1080 Ti for 5 years until I replaced its thermals parts
Some people don't understand the saying "if it ain't broken don't fix it."
because someone thought it was a good idea to suggest replacing the thermal paste like it’s an oil change every few months. the card owner, of course decided to mod it themselves.
@@H34Rt54 I didnt touch my 1080 gtx for 9 years and while not worth much anymore i was still super carefull, but after that my temps dropped like good 10-15c. not worth even opening at least for 5 years when is brand new
Dude literally could have left this card alone and it would have been just fine for years.
people are idiots they want 1 c down so bad or 5 c temp and break gpu :(((( easy thing if you want some temps down put one more cooler under your gpu ...
🫡
makes u wonder what people are using when taking and putting back together
Maybe they surprise seeing the hotspot temp and gddr6x temp that reached 100c when rendering
@@derim006 thats exactly how i killed my gtx 970 ti, i had no knowledge about cooling pads those small passive ones, probably removed it and fried it, oops.
Sometimes, the customer is not always right.. Hopefully the customer will listen to you on keeping those temps down.
The transition works like this: you need to heat it up a couple of times and it will settle.
The full saying is "The customer is always right, in matters of taste". They aren't smart, just that they know what they like.
Great repair, when I saw you placed the order, I picked the PCB board that's in better condition than others. I'm glad that it works! I'm trying to get better condition PCB boards now, hope that can make your repair work easier in the future.
Order from where?
@@thomaskunz8029I’m guessing the guy that commented sells donor boards and Tony bought it from him. Didn’t think that was a hard guess but…
Can please drop your link so we can check your boards?
So if i were to order one i would get a bad one ’cause i don’t do videos? 😂
@@niklasniklasniklas1 Well, you might get a bad one even you do videos. Just joking, it depends on what I have in hand, usually I'll pick the better condition boards to send
3D printers are going strong in the background! I've seen a lot of your designs!
Would be really interested in your printers and their setup!
Bambulab P1S
Very nice printer but firmware is closed source making it a pain in the back for people like me
You sir, made me buy my own soldering station cuz i have multiple broken GPUs (mainly broken traces) and you made me learn about all that stuff. THANK YOU! (well, not a thank you from my GF.. xD)
Oh and THATS what you call "better than factory"
I believe thermal grizzly now includes a little bit of oil to help hold the sheet in place during install. i saw a derbauer video explaining it.
I have this same card and I pray the day never comes when I need it repaired.
How much did it cost you?
@iabdullah5206 aah yes, that time I spent a solid $1,999.99 at newegg. I had a lot going on at that time, and I thought this purchase would help me feel better.
Finally! A hybrid GPU fix! I have been dying for this!
cryosheets need 4 corner extensions with small glue tabs. It's great in theory but a nightmare in practice.
You have the patience of Job- without the sores and lice. Strong work!
i believe he put one bolt and tightened it but the other side was a bit crooked, then the shoulder of the second bolt did that mess. Due to the plate inability to rotate from the tightened first bolt, the threads got in place correctly but the bolt was shifted enough for it's shoulder to act as a shear.
Mad respect, you beautiful bastard Tony. Much love
Thanks !
when you do the time lapse my brain autoplays the king of the hill opening.
Imagine buying a $2000+ card, being unhappy enough with the temps etc that you take it apart to Kryosheet it, then you damage it in a way that's unrepairable on the original PCB.
I've done full disassembly & installation of a HydroCopper block on a 3090 before (which was worth way more than $2k at the time cuz it was during the mining bubble) and I managed to do that, with it being my first time doing a block install myself, and did it perfectly enough that my temperatures were great & the card was happy the entire time I had it. Ran it up to ~700W draw on the 1000W BIOS with a pretty hefty OC & voltage increase for benchmarking, but daily I ran it in the stock wattage realm with a decent OC on stock voltage, never had any issues and it never saw 60C again once that block was on it unless I was pushing 650+W through it.
Sh$t happens. No one is as perfect as some others apparently are… if he bought and took apart a $2000 card you will be well aware of the issues of disassembly and reassembly.
do u get a lot of performance out of oc, like for games? I do ml workloads and even if I downvolt the core and downclock the memory I barely lose any performance in it
@@illyaeater on the 3090? it was notable but not huge gains, I ran it undervolt-OCed regularly, slightly undervolted with a significant OC over the stock Kingpin speeds (I forgot to mention it was a 3090 Kingpin I think).
On the 4090 I have now actually OCing it is not worth it at all, I run 1025mV (which is an undervolt) at around 2810MHz or 950mV at ~2700MHz and the difference is negligible. I ran some Stable Diffusion stuff on it for a while with those settings, and the main thing on that was VRAM speed, so undervolting the GPU core made no noticeable difference in render times.
@@illyaeater OC is often for shits and giggles, only a few cards really show notable performance increases with OC without being outrageous in their power consumption. 20-series and 30-series showed pretty laughable gains for the power increases, while with the 6900XT I got roughly 10% more performance with 10% more power. Anything past 330W on it was basically wasted power and money. My 4080 is voltage limited and while I did go 3,000MHz+ just for the flex, the performance difference wasn't really worth the time of dialing in a stable OC.
Honestly, at this point I often just undervolt and leave it like that. It runs cooler, it uses less power, and I cannot tell the difference in FPS.
FYI this is my card that was repaired and i have disassembled dozens of gpu's before but this was the first one i messed up on and man, i wish it was on one of my cheaper older gpu's, safe to say im not gonna be doing this again to a card im daily driving in the future.
Have this same card and although it sucks for the owner I am glad to see it was user error and not the fault of the card itself. Worry enough about the 12vhp connector, didn't need the extra worry. Cool to see the teardown and awesome repair as usual.
Your supposed to tack the cryo sheet down with a little thermal paste. I use a toothpick doesn't take much.. Keep up the good work God Bless.
I have this same card. Runs cool, very quiet, and does great in every game as well as AI stuff where the 24gb is useful.
Proper Terminology is not underfill , but actually Corner staking , its purpose is to help with Shock/Vibe or CTE expansion breaking the BGA solder join. Sometimes it can be the same material as a full underfill, but a corner stake allows for a reworkable BGA.
What ever the term is, it still makes its way under the core to a point of surrounding the balls.
So lets agree that this is corner underfill at the very least ?
Have same model. It's only 4090 that can fit in my computer case. Was curios that inside it, thanks to this video i know - my card have solid build without cost cutting.
Not sure how i got on your channel ....but totally intrigued ive watched alot of your videos , you have definitely perfected your skill and are probably one of the best ive watched on yt keep up good work man love your vids
Nice work! I have the same GPU. I love it. I keep it in stock.
Literally found out why my 6750 XT would have turbine fans from 0rpm to 100% last 2 months. Turns out i was literally gaming with 110C hotspot temps. Had similar reaction to 33:28
First repairman in history to say "I want one of these myself" and not go on to try and tell the customer the repair failed and he will buy the card for half of market value
I got of this, works well and quietly. Thats most important to me. Hot free system
I tried using that kryo sheet for a month on my gpu. Definitely had higher temps and I switched back to paste.
I'm a proud owner of one of this card and after thermal paste and pads change it rocks😅
I love my suprim liquid x 4090, amazing card. Came from a suprim x 3070ti. Msi suprim are my favorite cards since evga is gone.
I love that card. It was the only 4090 that would fit in my case.
Same. Only 4090 that fits. Actually awesome it's AIO, dumps the heat out of the case.
As someone who uses AMD cards a lot and is used to like 20c+ delta, I'm almost used to never seeing a close delta. My own 4090 Suprim X had a ~15c delta on its normal bios, and around a 10-12 delta with its 666w bios
I need 2 of these for the same atx build for my ai trianing for work project... on a budget... hard to find case and mb for an am5 chip with room enough for 2 gpu or more. Offloading the cooling to a rad is one way I think it might fit better...
those pads he wanted you to use
are actually good. when mill tolerances
are in check, and they make contact with
the die properly. dude prob needs a thicker
pad. thermal grizzly doesn seem to make thicker ones
it would seem, but there are other alternatives.
I watch every video you make. Being I've been a heavy equipment tech up ubove the arctic circle and after mastering the
Yes! Another Reballing episode ❤️🙌
This proves that the customer isn't always right!
Such skill.....always a pleasure, sir!
That Honeywell is actually good, like liquid metal good.
No, unfortunately it is not like liquid metal good. But PTM7950 is better than any other non-conductive paste, and by a measurable margin, and for the vast majority it should be the only thing you should ever use on your GPU if you're opening it up. Liquid metal is hands down, without a doubt, the best performing TIM, but there is rarely a justification for most everyone actually using it, especially if you're clumsy or don't follow directions well.
The reason people think PTM7950 can compete with liquid metal is because most people are using those TIMs on nVidia GPUs, but nVidia GPUs do not have very accurate TJ sensors. If you compare liquid metal to PTM7950 on a Radeon GPU, which have more and much more accurate TJ sensors, you will usually see liquid metal outperform PTM7950 by ~6-8C TJ on air cooling, and upwards of ~10-15C TJ on water cooling.
If I recall correctly, there will be some liquid available for the kryosheet so you can "glue" it for application
I use Kryosheet on my own 4090 and im happy with it, but i can give you the advice to cover the surroundings of the core. These Cryosheets are conductive.
A bunch of youtubers, people on Reddit, and twitter are gushing over the Kryosheet. I tried one on a 7900xtx Red Devil and the temps are not that much better than the stock paste.
For CPU and specific builds is good , for gpu i would prefer one good thermal paste too ,easier to keep where you need it
You’re like a guardian angel looking over our GPU shoulder making us all sleep safely at night 😇.
I buy the 50x50 sheets as well as the smd component sealer and then i use the over size to use little dabs of paste at edge of sheet around the gpu frame.
Now on my Cpu 12900 i use the cpu frame mount from thermal Grizzly and the 50x50 pad i secure with small dots of paste on frame.
When using kryosheet, put a drop of silicon oil to keep it in place
Ronan said the new rev of the kryosheet will have it included in the package
Some background synthwave would be nice for the timelapse
.SID tunes rule ok!
Incredible repair job. I guess the client wrecked the card when trying to install the cryo sheet on an already well cooled card. I would advise him against using this, as like u said, thermal paste is better for gpus.
It seems like the screw was forced through the hole hoping the misalignment will be fixed.
Kryosheet is alright. I used carbonaut on laptop and usually cut it 1mm short to fit inside the CPU or GPU core and align the heatsink to see if it's flush and not moving if the heatsink has lower pressure. Then i apply black insulation tape around the core to prevent shorts just to be safe since laptop or mini pc will be moving around. The phase change is good alternative but still leaves behind residue.
Edit: I think the sheet is 1-2mm bigger and it will slip out during shipping unless there is some adhesive or thermal paste underneath. I usually adjust the sizing on core directly. I did see sharp edges of core cuts the sheet sometimes and fall on SMD. Then again i think heatsink is very slightly warped on the left pushing the sheet to the right when flipping over.
They have so much empty space, but still they often put components really close to mounting holes. I dont believe that it would be so hard during projecting and development to move everything away from them, like even 5mm would be nice so even if PCB crack inside track would be not so prone to crack.
Its like the manufacture set a trap for careless users
where is those cool music backgrounds?) I loved them so much) repair is awesome as usual though))
The problem with thermal paste is that it pushes out, not that it necessarily goes bad. It will eventually dry up, but pump out is usually a bigger enemy over a much shorter period of time.
That's why PTM7950 is so popular.
i use it on my cpu even tho its not great for it just cause i cba repasting :D
@@Desalater2 PTM7950 rivals best thermal pastes out there, what do you mean its not great??
I tried a Kyrosheet on my laptop and wasn't satisfied with the results switched to PTM7950 and have never looked back, all my systems now use PTM7950.
@@bismuth7730 when i got it i did some benches before with paste then applied the ptm and ran again and it was a few c higher but im using a 7800x3d which doesnt get hot in the usual way so im an edge case :P i just cba with repasting more than yearly at most
One issue with the PTM/kyrosheet is that they work well on high temps (60+) since this is when they are changing the phases.
I don't know if there is a reason to put it on something like this with AIO, since the temps will never reach the optimal spot for it to work well (correct me if im wrong)
I have (probably fake) PTM on my 3080, I saw 90c hot spot on gelid paste after 5-6 months and decided to invest into that thing, so far so good, 82c hot spot with 340W at .950v 2025mhz
I tried the Kryosheet on my CPU and GPU. It changed the mounting distances on the GPU block and it would be easy to do what I saw on this card because it doesn't let the indexing pins/screw holes bottom out properly. Get it askew and I bet that could happen. I thought about shimming it with nylon washers and getting thicker pads but the pads were plenty thick. It just bothered me that it would make a gap between the backplate and acrylic. I just threw some Kryonaut Extreme (the pink stuff) on there and it's the knees bees. I want to shunt mod it but I'm scared to do that now. I have an ASUS 7900xtx. I can't even get the memory over 60c overclocked.
Wow! This is Art!
Those stripped boards are interesting, I wonder how they've done some of that damage as well. I guess given the mess they've made that they're working through these quickly. Weird how they'd be harvesting from such an expensive model of 4090 though, this Suprim watercooled model is not cheap and you'd think if the only goal was to get cores/memory to transplant to another board you would just be purchasing the cheapest 4090's available.
Cryosheet placement: Just take a ruler and measure the distances from the top and left. No way you can misplace it.
36:26 don't want to give you bad news but according with Roman (der8auer), if you use a sheet and then you have to remove it or by miss place or ever the sheet will not work so good (it can lose 20% to 30% efficient).
I actually don't like it, prefer kryonaut
Thats bad news for the customer, not for me.
I'd never use this garbage even if it was brand new.
@@northwestrepair yeah, not a fan too, sure it can be use for some stuff but don't like it
@@northwestrepair same. It's only a 10/10 for CPUs or laptops tho. For GPU.. fuck, even MX4 is a good enough thermal paste.
I have the same GPU, and i think the owner did what he was doing probably because of the hotspot temps. It goes beyond 70 C and sometimes it reaches the thermal limit of 84 C during the summer, which it sucks considering that it's liquid cooled. Many people fix the issue with the PTM7950 or the KryoSheet.
Amazing work👍👍👍💪💪💪
I've been waiting for this kind of repair.
The dude already broke a 4090, he will be knocking on your door again with that cryosheet.
Nice repair, I like the MSI Suprim's. That Timespy score at the end wasn't very impressive, I just ran it on my Evga 3070 FTW 3 Ultra just for fun, I got 12,616 Timespy score, and 14,053 graphics score; the MSI 4090 here got a little over 18750, I would have thought a high end 4090 would be a lot better than a 3070 non-ti. For what it's worth, I got almost 8000 on the CPU score, but I get it, it's just a test rig with a low cost motherboard and CPU probably. I doubt you need fast ram, and CPU just to test GPU repairs, just to see if we get a picture.
It's running at PCI-E 3.0 which might explain that but... maybe not, I might be missing something. It's probably just a configuration thing, a 4090 should be scoring a lot higher you are right.
KP-X or Kryonaut Extreme would be much better, great vid as always. Keep up the good work🙂
Unfortunately they would be better for about 6 months, and then they wouldn't be, and you'll be repasting. Both KP-X and Kryonaut (and Noctua NT-H2, and most of the other chart topping highest performance non-conductive TIMs) have severe pump out and migration issues, so they are not the pastes you want to use for anything other than temporary open air test bench setups and for sub-ambient cooling.
Those pastes are great on a CPU IHS, but for GPU dies, just use PTM7950. Nothing else non-conductive keeps up with it, and you'll never need to reapply it. For those who aren't clumsy and can follow directions (which excludes most people), liquid metal is an even better option than PTM7950.
22:50 there seems to be another ripped component on the opposite side of the chip. Lower left corner of the video. Card seems to work, but that could cause some smaller issue.
Why are these videos relaxing 🤣🤣
Bare die applications of thermal paste pump out, because of a bigger expansion coefficient difference between die and cold plate. This means that GPU bare die, is where you need an interface material resistant to Pump Out, which is where kryosheet or PTM are positioned. Yes they are tough to apply, but they are the only materials that would last.Thermal pastes need to be reapplied every few months in a bare die scenario because of this issue.
A recent study by Igor's Lab has discovered that with this gen of Nvidia cards, the main manufacturers have been using some really bad thermal paste on the core from factory. The stuff is prone to pumping out completely within 6 months. Even my 7900 xtx temps on hotspot increased 15C within the year I owned it. So it seems to not just be limited to Nvidia GPUs. The Nvidia FE cards use PTM7950 from factory, so they are an exception to the issue.
Would be interesting to see the numbers, how many GPUs broke by themselves, and how many were destroyed by their owners, because they tried “improve” them.
Owner doesn't deserve this GPU....please refund him and send him a 2080.
Nothing wrong with a 2080 maybe send him a 560 TI don't let an idiot destroy a 2080.
LOL you are killing me
Haha!
send 2080 to me and i'll send back something hi end760 Tino need for any paste
Definitely 😞
the use of that cryo sheet should be included in the terms of warranty since it might cause the item to be returned during the warranty period.
This is knightmare fuel for me as i have the same card. I was thinking once the warranty is out to do a full thermal pad/paste refresh to give it maximum life....
thing about cryosheet is you never have to 'resheet' unlike thermal paste. if the card or cpu doesnt break you never need the heatsink off again until the chip does die.
also, der Bauer says the kyrosheet has got some of the oil in thermal compound so you can use a drop to hold the sheet in place while reinstalling heatsink etc.
Just use a few drops of isoproply alcohol so the sheet sticks to the core while mounting the cooler.
Very nice work and great troubleshooting! Doc BC
I suggest the owner of the board to use the Honeywell Ptm7950, instead of the Thermal Grizzly Kryosheet ... the PTM is slightly more performing and also is not electrically conductive ... finally, to avoid opening the board for maintenance, I suggest using Upsiren's UTP-8 thermal putty on the VRM and VRAM, instead of the classic silicone thermal conductive pads ... Both of these interfaces have a lifespan of more than 5 years
first thing I did when I got my 4090 is to get a sag to support it then I undervolted it right up cause when not the max 450W triggers all the time, always on the cutoff like it wants to draw more power so bad.
Great job. That's a huge leap of faith project. The whole thing would have cost 70% the value of a new card? Otherwise, how is it worth it for you as a business?
0:25 the highest performance 4090 is the Asus Matrix 4090
The kryosheet is performing better than my stock MSI Liquid Suprim X. My GPU temp shoots up to the 60s and the hot spot hovers at 80-83. I am VERY much considering making this mod to my card now that I see solid proof of improved temps.
Im using cryosheet and im going to keep using cryosheets because they work better than thermal paste.
This customer really needs to be more careful
So far from my soldering experience, I found out that the difference between melting and not melting the LEDs is probably going from 350C to 300C.
Don't know if that's possible on that PCB, but if they are not connected to some heavy copper, it should be fine.
4:08, can we populate all the regular gaming gpu phases since both boards are almost identical? Or would that cause problems?? Would it be beneficial?
I changed my EVGA FTW3 1070 the day it got out of warranty, the difference? I knew what I was doing and dropped the temps from ~80°C to low 60's. Never touched it again and it is still not getting higher than mid 60's
Great job!!
Actually sir I think your wrong. Yes that is a mounting hole however the idea with the metal spring plate is to shift the application of the mounting force from the circuit board at the hole to the back of the PCB where it will be applied to GPU die instead of bending the PCB.
Interestingly I ran in to this dilemma installing a water water block on my GPU because I kind of wanted to use the original metal spring and thus the high tension but decided to trust Alphacool engineering and make use of the Alphacool backplate instead. Alphacool just gives you 4 screws with foam washers so that all of the force is applied on those holes.
In practice since the other 3 holes and additional screws would locate the PCB you should be able to get away with using the original PCB.
Doesn't matter, you still have a lot of clamping/crushing force being applied directly to the repair site, I wouldn't trust any epoxy to handle that long term without deforming and breaking or shorting the (many) tiny repair wires.
Не знал что есть и большой канал, подписался и сюда)
got the same card and i'm super happy with it, but seeing this hurts ...
With all due respect PTM is the best for gpu's. The reason for that is the bare die contact will make paste pump out over time and PTM is way less effected by that cause its a phase change material. Its funny since MSI and Nvidia both use PTM as there thermal interface material. Doubt they would use it if it was not good.
R370 is a 1kΩ, R215 is a 10kΩ according to your board diagram. Order of magnitude difference.
That's nice to know for the grand total 6 owners of that card
great repair
I'd say either the screw was deformed, or what most likely happened is that he pulled on the screw either way too strong or it wasn't yet unscrewn completely, and he pulled on it hard.
I am currently using this gpu. And as I started watching the video, I was worried at first (this model has a chronic problem?) . But when I continued later, like John Travolta looking around Pulp Fiction movie, I asked to him, WHY? Why did you get into trouble for no reason? 🤦
Edit: der8auer said that something like an application cream / thermal paste will be sent with the kryosheet so that it could be applied easily and would not move from where it was placed, but I guess it did not come out of this.
Can you also make a video on how to remove modern phone screen's broken front glass, I broke whole LCD because it's so thin and fragile.
i noticed you put the wrong value resistor on the back near the chip, thats why you card is pulling .5A more than it should do, this is why you get such bad temps! just an FYI
Yeah you can drop the delta to 10% with paste, but for how long? Honeywell is excellent for GPUs. I am using it on RX7900XT, CPU and laptops.
if you want miracles, northwestrepair every day. the impossible happens on camera 🤣
Asus ROG Matrix Platinum is the best performing 4090, it uses liquid metal and is $3200
Nooo can't be! Surely a Zotac budget model is! Like mentioned in the video! /s
The liquid metal causes oxidation, so after that it’s the worst performing 4090.
its actually the HOF, the Matrix platinum is just a Strix with LM and a kinda crap AIO strapped to it, its nothing special.
@@monkeypuppies444 oh wow? How do the pcb's compare then?
@@RAMPED to my knowledge nothing was changed with the pcb design.
Must personally say thanks for the vid, i have this card and would rather take it apart myself than take it to a local shop for sure. Not that id even have to in its life time. I still baby the card even during gaming. Awesome vid man keep up the good work^
As if someone grabbed the card then swang radiator over their head. It seems water cooled cards just change the positions of weak points, not completely eliminate them.