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- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
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There is no point to use a fleet this size. It take 2 people to rob these. They can be highly profitable if done correctly. You risk a 15 mill isk ship (cruiser) and a cloaked t1 hauler. You filament in, rob, filament out. Only 2 in 10 are ever defended. You will take anywhere from 50m-500m. It will be around 3000m3 maximum.
Its not about the money, its a way to get content and response fleets. The fight isn't with the loot its with the response fleet.
@@TheAsarath Where to start?
1) All fleet members should not be in local, they should ideally be perched inside a wormhole or an empty system. This is NS and to spike local like this stops the opposition from forming to come to attack you. You send 30 men, the locals will feel like they must send 50. All battles in Eve are asymmetrical. If you just put a couple on grid they will happily come if its defended. You can then have the numbers in your favour. You effectively counter the counter drop.
2) There is no need for the fleet to be at zero on the structure, this makes it easier for dictors/recons to land and bubble/tackle you. Kiki can hit at 50km, this should be the default orbit range of the site. There are sufficient kiki that range ammo will more than suffice. Kiki fit cost around 180mill +, so it only takes a couple of tornados to make this a very inefficient fleet or then there's the goon tactic of simply blobbing it with marauders with support so don't get ideas of killing them. Another reason you don't show all your fleet members at once.
3) Why is a fleet of Kiki being shield boosted? This is utterly absurd. No way to sugar coat this regardless of command ship, it should have had armour links.
4) 70+% of these are unguarded or only guarded by small alt fleets. As this FC found out. Hack message is in system when initialised, + 1 jump @ 8 mins, +2 at 5 mins. So command may only have 5 mins to prepare if locals were afk or not reporting it in intel. Attacking the structure was foolish as this will ping the Alliance and Corp Owners. You only need to attack the silo. Attacking structures provokes a different PvP response in NS.
5) If you want to force the locals to respond then attacking jump bridges or infrastructure related to player not alliance isk generation which affects everyone is the smarter play and will exhibit a much faster response. TBH a decent FC will go on DOTLAN look where the most active gate in the region is and head there. This fleet is around the same size as a defence fleet so seeing it like this is kind of sad. I understand maybe they were testing the mechanics but they could have done this as a much smaller group first, save wasting the time of others. They may have also got a fight like this.
I literally rob these everyday, we started with the ESS but they proved less lucrative and more defended! We have a spreadsheet which tracks the places who defended so if we filament in we know whether to rob it or not. Sigma are actually one of the few who are listed as defended funnily enough, so this may explain the misunderstanding ie their FC thinking it would start a fight. Goons and NC. also defend if in range, they don't defend pets skyhooks. Frat are 50/50 it depends on where you are in their space. All other alliances have a response rate so low they are considered undefended by us. We try to keep local count to an absolute minimum just the hacker and hauler, as we are more than happy to have a fight :) We will pop out a wormhole and join the fight, the hacker has enough HP/reps to allow us enough time to land and tackle, so the further we have to perch the bigger tank it needs.
If you're serious about robbing these you want signal not noise filaments contrary to popular belief, the same for ESS. You see without the action there are no pots of gold to rob. Your FC just needs to be able to read Dotlan so he can control your contact with the enemy. If it drops you into a hyper busy system he needs to know or be able to find the pipe out quickly. So you can fight in a quieter system with eyes to warn you of incoming threat. When behind enemy lines your ship should always be faster or cloakable. I personally fly a Nano Arti Cynabal. 4km/s 500 dps @110km 4k Alpha. (without boosters) They used to be better but still are very hard to kill and can sustain DPS on targets whilst kiting almost any other ship in the game. The Arties mean interceptors pay dearly if they burn for you to get tackle, bubbles are useless your in and out of it so fast. You only need to fear two ships, snipers (we carry damps to prevent this) and Khizriel (BC, same race, almost as fast, PRIMARIED), for everything else you kite and shoot. We regularly take on 30+man defence fleets with 5-10 of us. At first it was tough but now we cracked it as they say, we know what to do and when. Practice made not perfect but solid, drilled. This is where we regain the edge. You wont get this response with 30+ kiki reported in intel, you will just get ignored until you get hotdropped.
@@Mu7eD-Stream That's a lot of words to say you're maidenless.
Just means you cant be as wide spread as you're used too
That fleet flying looks cool.
I am sure, like most nullsec residents.. we have all become aware of how difficult it is to prevent a theft. Forming up to take on a 50man fleet can rarely be achieved in just 5-8mins. Getting a dscan, sending out a ping, and this is all assuming you are even made aware of the theft right away. It will need looking at again and a rethink, otherwise you should probably consider your own resources as already lost, and instead will need to go steal the resources you need. Or steal your own skyhooks until they rebalance this.
The mechanic itself (ignoring time restraints and responses for now) is HEAVILY favoured to those defending as there is no "bubble" like ESS. ESS is everyone warps to the same point no matter what. No tacticals, no MWDS, no cloaks. The only way to cheese ESS is to cloak a marauder outside the bubble which takes a tonne of time and 99% of the time you wasted that toon defending against nothing. With skyhooks you can create as many tactical warp-ins as you like meaning a well-commanded fleet of 5-10 tornados could have ripped apart this Kiki fleet if they didn't leave immediately. I don't like the way it's implemented either, but the *large* nullblocks should have absolutely no issue defending the ones they care about. In my opinion, I think 10 minutes is too long but I'm not a null pilot so there's some bias there of course!
@@Xethl I can speak for our experience with this. 10min timer is best case scenario of course for the defender. Typically we learn of a theft at about 3-5mins remaining. To form and combat that (unless of course it's like a solo/duo thief) is not feasible. Therefore, you either preform a response fleet and potentially keep alts sitting there in a fleet for hours at a time on the chance a skyhook gang appears or just lose it.
Then of course, off peak times are very hard to defend even for the biggest alliances in the game. PH and Goons etc. So smaller alliances, good luck!
Another thing we have seen, just like with ESS's.. folks are looking for ways to cheese thefts. With zero risk to themselves. Akin to the ESS 'run-away' solo stabbers.
All nullsec are actively stealing their own skyhooks on a daily or twice daily basis. Therefore right now, it's a bit silly for all concerned.
@@wingandaprayer883 yeah I agree with your points. I don't know the payout, if it's just 100M or so, I doubt we'll see any big fleets stealing them. My point was that defending a skyhook in your staging should be laughably easy, but defending your skyhooks 30j away from staging in a space you rent out should be hard, and I think that's good.
I think runaway Stabbers are fine, they're easy to kill so easy to push off. In general ESS has bought a lot more fights than would have happened, and I hope the same for Skyhooks.
I think similar with ESS, most fights will be a solo pilot looking for the lowest isk to risk (again same as100mn stabbers), and small gangs from wormholes of 5 or so people. Both of these should be easy for nullblocks to defend, small groups will struggle however. I think small groups struggle is actually a good thing when it comes to mag gas as it encourages them to actually mine their moons (where as nullblocks have more moons than they could ever mine), but to my understanding they need the ice to upgrade their space which sucks.
Thanks for sharing this.