One of my dream jobs is doing art for Transformers comics and whenever I feel my work isn't very good, I tell myself that at least it isn't Pat Lee-bad.
Just an FYI, not all of it was Pat Lee's art, he had uncredited ghost artists either draw complete or partial issues or Pat would do the base character breakdowns and others would finish the figures and add the backgrounds.
The crazy thing is Lee's really great Wizard piece was pretty much the peak of his TF work. The very first issue featured the "marshmellow" look Lee became infamous for. I will be always grateful DW gave Don Figueroa a larger stage beyond Macromasters.
I was one of the supposed "new talent" that was brought in to replace the ever expanding list of unpaid artists just before DW's demise. Needless to say, I was looking forward to this video, spectacular job as always Chris!! Mind you, you were much kinder in regards to Pat Lee than many of us in the industry would have been.
@@Jackson-hp7rt Much appreciated! What's equally upsetting, is unless you were one of the in-house staff, many of us didn't know we were officially out of a job until we heard about it when everyone else did online. Pat Lee literally tucked his tail in and ran to Hong Kong with whatever stolen money he could. Sigh
I know the shady business behind the scenes of Dreamwave but their artwork is my favorite of all time. I have so many great memories back in summer of 02 of when my dad used to take me on his motorcycle and ride 30 miles to this comic book shop to purchase these books.
It was so cool to see Transformers in comic books again. These opened my son's eyes, at the time he was only 5 to 8 years old but he jumped into Japanese manga and it stayed with him until college. Just helped prove that good ol' Dad knew cool stuff even if it was from 20 years ago...or more. And with the internet he could get even more deeply into what he was interested in.
Proud owner of ALL the dw transformers comics just not beast wars. I've met Simon and have the scripts for the war within that didn't get published when I met him in London mcm at the excel centre. The g1 and Armada crossover was SERIOUSLY BADASS!!!!!
The More Than Meets The Eye profile books were the best thing Dreamwave ever did. I have those along with the Armada and Beast Wars versions. I do wish we could have gotten the extra profiles book(which would have included the Female Autobots). Hopefully, whoever gets the Transformers comic license after IDW will go back and give us that extra G1 profiles book. They also need to do profiles on Transformers Energon and Transformers Cybertron characters. We need that immediately!
we have had more G1 characters made under IDW in addition to characters that did not get profiles under DreamWave so we are due fr new Profile books. The Energon profile books from what I know were made but shelved due the bankruptcy and IDW decided as they were made with out paying the writer and artists, they(the books) would stay shelved
Could they have though? They were kinda blowing their wad so early one. By year 2 they’d already introduced the entire 84-86 cast, introduced unicron and we’re planning on him being the big bad in 2005. They were just going down the line by year of the toys being released in the 80s. It seemed pretty apparent they had no long term plans at all for the books. Whether is was 3 years or 5 it was pretty obvious they were never planning ahead
@@theEmirateXaaron Unless you were there working with them you can’t say for certain they had no plans for the future. With multiple stories being run in the different series releases, such as their G1, armada, and Energon comics that were never finished because of greedy executives there’s no way to know what the writers had planned beyond what was written and produced. Look at IDW’s transformers comics. They have multiple titles, many of which form a unified comic universe, and they put new ideas into their comics with titles like All Hail Megatron. If Dreamwave didn’t meet it’s end they could have gone down a similar path of exploring new ideas.
@@alexbelcher2206 they were literally introducing characters as if they were being released on the shelf. Dreamwave didn’t have long term plans because they didn’t even have short term plans
@@theEmirateXaaron Again, you don’t know that they had no plans. Look at the original comics and even the G1 cartoon. They did exactly what you said just now and yet the cartoon ran for around 6 years and the comics ran for even longer, even getting several spin off stories and additional comics from IDW such as regeneration one.
Dreamwave walked so that IDW could run. The War Within was easily the best thing that came out of the Dreamwave era (though I did enjoy the Armada/Energon comic as well). It's still a good read. The art from DW that Pat Lee didn't do holds up well (aside from the "mitten hands" syndrome everyone seems to have). It's obvious he put a lot of effort into that Wizard promo illustration, but doing sequential art on a monthly basis was obviously not his strong suite. I remember being so excited for these comics based on the previews in Wizard, and even enjoying them immensely at the time (thankfully I still have all the ones I bought back then).
I appreciate how diplomatic you were, considering what many people who worked with Pat Lee had to say about him. TFWiki has some of those details for those interested, but this video definitely does a good job of showing just how good Dreamwave was for the Transformers!
Dreamwave was the bridge between the Marvel and IDW comics that helped define how modern Transformers stories are written. Shame its legacy is stained by financial troubles.
I think the proper way to describe Dreamwave Transformers is a proud failure. They may have went out of business, but the impact they had on the lore and the fandom of the franchise speaks for itself, with many personality traits, storylines and character designs still carried on into the future.
Indeed. It's streamlined take on the brand made it easy to latch onto and take in, while not being afraid to adapt to ongoing series like Armada. It helped keep the name of the brand in circulation.
Well, you're lucky I don't have that kind of attitude. I have an antagonistic relationship with money and material wealth in general, but this is what happens when the young get rich and become spoiled brats in an instant.
I had that issue of Wizard Magazine and was mesmerized by Pat Lee's rendition of G1. I'd look at it wonder and about a future of the Transformers. I even bought the poster of the image. So much promise.
It's sux for us fans who have been with the franchise since 1984 and yeah it is nice to live the high life and be comfortable but once you live beyond your means and it starts effectively messing with other aspects of your work life or and then the help suffers then it makes me feel that as beautiful as these designs and style was and is, it makes me sad about the behind the scenes but happy that what the lore came out of it.
Dreamwave is the reason I came back to Transformers back in 2002. Dreamwave is the reason I finally watched the 1986 movie. Dreamwave is why I started collecting Generations & Legends scale Transformers. I know it was a terrible ending but I still have love for Dreamwave and wish I could read their entire G1 series
I actually got almost all the comics (missing only one) of the Armada and G1. They was sold as a 2 stories in one comic. Started the first half of the comic with Armada and then G1, then continued from G1 ending with the cybetron story while the Armada was still going. However because of poor sales here in Norway the comic ended with the Minicons going into the mysterious pod and Grimlock going of for him self for some reason. I did however only a few years ago get a hold of the collected Armada comic, so I at least got to know the end of that story.
I was hoping you would do this eventually. Aside from the company's downfall and Pat Lee's actions, this era of transformers brought in a lot of aspects to the transformers franchise that are still being used today
Every time I see that particular pose from Optimus in the thumbnail, I can't help but giggle a little bit since seeing the mess up anatomy the TFWiki showed behind the foreshortened arm lol Still whether we like or not, Dreamwave's legacy still lives with us through concepts like sunstorm, the fallen, dull surprise, and what not. I was barely even a child when they were being released so it must've been a wild time for fans only for it to get canned due to backwards treatment and mismanagement, especially from a certain "TransMan".
Fun fact, one of the money-managing problems Dreamwave faced at the time, was that apparently Pat Lee had a company-owned Porsche. So some of the company’s the money went to a fancy car Pat bought rather than the employees that the money had been owed to.
Can't wait to see Obscure Characters Month, what a way to cap off the year. Now, regarding Dreamwave, they did have a short but significant impact on the franchise. Hubris and shortsighted ambitions doomed them.
Thanks Chris, I recently enjoyed the timeline you wrote for Dreamwave it was very well put together, these comics got me back into collecting when they were out I was very sad they didn't finish there storys
I loved it! Dreamwave's unified style was one of my favorite things about it, I loved the designs and over all late 80s to mid 90s anime aesthetic & you rarely ended up with buying a book and the inside art didn't correlate with either the cover or previous book.I bought everything DW ever put out for TF at the time and I just couldn't get into IDW outside of 2 mini series they did in the marvel continuity. I love that even in WFC and newer toylines you still get some nods to DreamWave.
Hearing the fallen was not only gonna appear in a movie but be the main bad guy blew my mind as a kid cause I was not expecting the character to appear again
I really loved the Dream Wave comic. I wished they would bring the g1 dream back so they can finally finish it like they did with the Marvel g1 comic in regeneration 1 in idw.
I'm still impressed by how "modern" the art looks in a lot of early 2000s comics; aged like fine wine, as they say. Too bad I was a toddler at the time, so I couldn't read any of them.
This was a very good video detailing both the rise and fall of Dreamwave productions. It is incredibly interesting how in such a short time despite going out of business, they were able to have a big influence on the Transformers franchise. Just imagine if things were different; if they were still around or if they never made transformers comics the Transformers would look very different today.
I absolutely loved the Dreamwave comics. I stuck with Generation One, and got pretty much all of the various series. The War Within is perhaps my favourite comic series EVER and was getting exceptionally good, that’s the one I’m personally most gutted we never got a conclusion for. The G1 ongoing series was definitely hinting, in its final few editions, towards a re-envisioning in comic form of the original Transformers: the Movie in 2005. It would have been great seeing that. A real shame that the hard work of so many as undone by the excesses of the Lee brothers.
I loved the artwork of the dark ages comics, the visceral image of the fallen roaring in rage, bathed in shadow and flame on a mountain of bodies is amazing
I have the privilege of actually owning a near-complete collection of floppies of the Dreamwave comics that I got back in the day. I owe a lot of my continued participation in the fandom to them, despite their troubles.
The best part of this was hearing all my favorite writers and artists get a shout out!! Dream Wave definitely brings back lots of memories as I was 23 when their art started appearing everywhere. Fantastic videos as always!!!
I still have the original DW mini-series with apparently all of the variant covers as well. I considered selling them months ago, but now that my comics interest has been sparked again, I plan on reading through them once more. I also have many of the first year and a half of the Armada comics and a few of The War Within. Thanks for this excellent retrospective video!
THANK YOU! You just ended an eighteen year hunt. I had the Hardwired book as a kid and lost it in a move almost as soon as I got it, and well before I could finish it. I've since forgotten what it was called and have been trying, and failing, to figure it out and find it again since. I didn't even know it was part of a trilogy, now I have more to look into after that.
We got the Transformers DW comics over here in Sweden but it was published as a ''double comic book'', the first part was with the G1 story and then with the Armada one after that. After the G1 mini-series was done while the Armada comic continued they had added in the War Within story. The problem is that we only got 9 issues of the comic, despite that in a smaller text on the first opening page said that Transformers Armada will be released with 10 issues in 2003 but we only got ninth issue and that the tenth issue would be released in December....but I have been looking everywhere on the internet and it doesn't seem to exist a issue 10 of Armada at all. So it is a bummer that the whole international sales stopped because they weren't able to secure the license, which might be the cause of it. Or that the sales of the Armada comic over here was low. I have no clue at all. We also had contests where there was a small quiz on 3-4 comics where you could win yourself a Transformers Armada toy if you answered all the three questions correctly!
I was in contact with the guy being in charge, and it ended due to lack of financing and small publishing crew. They even made a transformers page called ntfa but I'm not sure if it's still active, wasn't very well updated and most of it was old tech specs from marvel. But they had a nice shop there too, bought my first G1 DVD collection there for 1200 sek. Was Rhino publishing so I didn't keep it
I always feel bad that several of the creators working for Dreamwave never got paid. Their work was, and still is, some of my favorite stuff in Transformers and the comics I grew up reading. The Sunstorm arc of the G1 ongoing is one of my favorites to re-read and if I ever got the chance I'd gladly thank those writers and artists for giving me the Transformers of my childhood, hooking me forever onto one of my favorite properties with some of best creative talent I've ever seen or read. I got back into the comics around midway through "Phase 2" of IDW and I never would have if it hadn't been for Dreamwave.
I remember how gutted I was when it suddenly ended. Went to every comic shop I could looking, not realising they had cancelled. Age of wrath was really getting good. I've still got some of those comics from 2004 too
The G1 series was bridging the gap between season 2 and the animated film in fact the stories were subtitled in the press as the "road to 2005". Optimus Prime was coming back.
One of my favorite aspects was blending the toys and the comics and the TV show. Like how Bumblebee and Brawn had their cartoon faces but also had face shields that matched their toys.
While I loved DreamWave's anime look to the art style, the brothers Lee were just arrogant to break away from Image. When Image was founded, most if not all of its creators released their titles under their respective studios with the Image "I". I loved James Raiz's artstyle for Armada, I even remember hunting down each issue of the More Than Meets The Eye books unitil I had them all. Dan Figueroa became an instant favorite for me, because ofhis artstyle, and when he began the (incomplete) monthly, the best story was with SunStorm. I loved how Guido Guidi's artstyle had an animation look to it for Armada. Well, can't wait for the next episode of The Basics. Wonder what's it gonna be about....? :)
Some things I like that Dreamwave did was that: In the Armada Comic, they included a lot of the toyline-exclusive characters, like Skywarp, Cheetor, Airaizor and Terrorsaur. In the Energon Comic, they continued to use Armada Characters, like Hoist and Thrust
Loved this one especially! Thank you Chris. I still remember that sad feeling when i found out that Dreamwave was no more. IDW, for me, could never reach the same level of nostalgia, with a few exceptions. Didn’t realize that it was 20 years ago already. We’re getting old
I loooved those ultimate guide books as a kid! Their beautiful pastiches of illustrations through the years definitely helped to inspire my fascination with comic-book style art, and gave my child brain get an initial, fumbling grasp of the exhaustive complexities and contradictions within various comics continuities. It pains me that the War Within series ultimately remained incomplete, but this video certainly puts Dreamwave's influence and eventual collapse into an understandable context!
I was there when Pat Lee established Dreamwave Productions in Image Comics. I got suckered to their Darkminds comics - at least for the first few issues. I was shocked when Dreamwave got to do the Transformers comics and expanded upon. I got the first two miniseries and a few issues of their regular series. I managed to complete the first arc in their Armada comics but sadly will not complete the first volume of The War Within with me missing out on issue 4 (and before anyone says go to E-Bay and it being cheap, from where I'm from shipping is VERY expensive and from where I'm from again I seem to have trouble finding it so yeah. No hope at all. 😭) Anyway it's kind of a bummer that Dreamwave imploded thanks to Pat Lee's actions and here I hope one day they reprint all those issues and gets a Marvel treatment having the incomplete stories to be completed today ala Regeneration One. One can only hope.
The Ultimate Guide and the Armada comics/artwork were so influential in shaping my early idea of what Transformers looked like, and what the expanded universe beyond the cartoons could be
When I collected few Armada figures back in the day, did get they back in comics but can legit recall seeing Dreamwave TF comic on my local supermarket; even had quick look at it. If them bois would have handled they money properly and didn't use company money for they needs, maybe Dreamwave could have managed to wrap up they series. But yeah, despite Dreamwave's crashing; it left legacy seeds behind,
I loved their comics, especially those with Don Figueroa's artwork. I was hoping IDW would pick up from where the regular series left off and release the issues that were never released featuring the female Transformers.
I do remember reading that they had thought about continuing the DW stories very briefly, but then decided not to either cause of the whole no one getting paid thing or simply they wanted to start their own stories.
@@grand_max66 as someone personally involved in a similar situation (company folded in 2019 and didn't pay us) and who is still now going through the legal system to unravel matters, I know how messy it can be trying to take on existing work that is subject to legal proceedings. By the time the matter is resolved several years later it becomes too late for anyone who cared about it to want to revisit it and get a conclusion to it. If they did try to continue it before the legal issues are resolved it then damages any claims the original writers and artists have as their work is then in the public domain and the same work is getting money from another source so they cannot argue they have lost out.
It is a shame to..Dreamwave’s Transformer story experience was so much more superior to IDW. Really wish we had seen, their explanation for female Transformers…and everything else.
It was just leading toward unicron an it really wasn't that well written. Idws original stories were far better. I'm glad they didn't tie themselves down with an inferior version.
I was born in 2003 so have no nostalgic ties to dream wave or their comics. And yet I absolutely love them, the art the mature story’s and what it did for transformers as a hole. I don’t too actively collect comics but every time I’m in a comic or book store and I see dream wave tf comics I pick them up and one day I want to own all of them if I can
One thing I find hilarious is that Lee's artwork would be criticized for being misproportioned and often compared to Rob Liefeld. Liefeld is actually the one to have originally hired and mentored Lee.
Don't forget the humans with "dull surprised" expression (Lazarus looked like he was still dead) and all the cracked lines on the bodies of the robots.
IDW had its own ups and downs but man I think Dreamwave takes the cake of dropping the ball so hard it went straight through to the Earths core and out the other side.
I remember buying that exact issue of Wizard, and I still have it in a box with many comics from the era! This was one of the best videos I've ever seen in the Basics series, it answered many questions I had and so many more that hadn't occurred to me. I feel if there's a lesson to take away it's to work diligently and honestly.
I do find it a bit of a shame that Dreamwave went bankrupt, sad that they couldn’t finish their Transformers stories. Still afterwards we got IDW’s take and we can all say that it was epic!
13:22 I know that Simon Furman and John-Paul Bove will be having a panel session at this year's "Roll-Out Roll-Call" talking about the "transition" of sorts from Dreamwave to IDW Publishing. Think they might reference this video?
Dreamwave is a prime example of just because they were the first to bring a series back to the fore, doesn't mean it always has the best intentions. But, it can never be understated or overstated just how DW effectively brought the brand back from obscurity. So many ideas and concepts. So many fan favorites....and the utter disappointment when it all came crashing down because of inexperienced leadership. But it is why I have more respect for IDW because DW embodies more of a classical depiction of Mecha, IDW could be considered the modernized version. Although, I can understand why people would prefer Dreamwave. as both really they tell the story, just in different ways. With different styles. That said, whatever became of Dream Engine? Did it ever succeed or did it bomb like DreamWave Proper? Or the Lee Brothers?
100% People forget how dead the franchise was back in the 90s. Pat Lee's drawing may be criticized for the stylized proportions, but Hasbro saw something in his work for Wizard Magazine that really perfectly suited the mecha concept of Transformers. I still prefer Dreamwave to IDW.
@@ericliu8488 it was one of the more unique art styles especially for it's time. As odd as the proportions are, what should be stated is that the way it was drawn was kinda "loud" particularly with some coloring (Although that distinction goes to 90's G2.)
While Dreamwave brought back the comics there were still shows and toys so to say the franchise was dead is not accurate. Generation 2, while consisting of reruns of the G1 cartoon, had it’s own toy line and comics. And Beast Wars and Beast Machines were both new concepts for Hasbro and had their shows and toys. And in the early 2000s we got the original Robots in Disguise cartoon and toys as well as the Unicron Trilogy which Dreamwave did make some comics for.
…I’m confused. What do you mean by “classical” and “modernized” depictions of mecha? That sounds a little strange. When it comes to mecha I’m more familiar with the “super” and “real” split.
@@battlinjoe2592 The details and designs associated with them. For DreamWave, they used what could be considered "chunky" and blockier designs that wouldn't be too out of place on a Gundam, much like how Toei would animate robots and mobile suits. Modern depictions would have a lot more integrated details, sleeker designs, more moving parts to build up the hype, and sharper edges like antenna, armored plates, and many other elements. To me, it feels more like a leap in technology or consider "Alien". As the blockier kind are more simplified, Earthly.
Yup, same. Takara even used a lot of Pat Lee's art for the covers to the boxes of their G1 reissues back then. I have a few of them including Optimus and Megatron. Crazy to think that Pat Lee was instrumental in starting a TF revival that had he managed it better financially, he could still be reaping its rewards to this day instead of being known as a failure.
Dreamwave's failure always makes me sad because what the writers were doing had me so excited, especially what James and Adam were doing on the main series. IDW never inspired that as much in me. It was fun, action packed, and they seemed to really be building up to something, one of the few times the quasi-spiritual aspects actually worked for me. Additionally, I've never been a fan of Simon's work in Transformers most of the time, but somehow what he did in Armada and Energon I really liked. (I even liked what Saracinni did in the first Armada story and I was NOT a fan of the first G1 miniseries. Something magical about that series.) As for Wildman, complain about the house style affecting his if anyone out there wants to but in the Marvel run they looked like people in costumes while in the Dreamwave stories they actually looked like robots. I also liked what they were doing with MegaMan, continuity errors aside, and while their take on TMNT was hardly in line with the Fox cartoon it was supposed to be a tie-in to, the Archie comics did the same thing with the original cartoon and still made their own decent continuity. So if Pat Lee hadn't screwed everyone over this would have been a great Transformers franchise addition rather than a disaster. It's still my favorite take thus far, which makes me sad it never achieved the greatness it was headed for.
IDW stuff and some great moments, but the Dreamwave's 2nd mini to ongoing really was hitting the right notes for me. Shockwave taking over and then Starscream running things for awhile and then the return of Megatron....only for it to be cancelled. Sigh.
@@cheeseburger12 yea Dreamwave’s ongoing TF is probably way better than most of the mainline IDW ongoings, like the best TF series from IDW has always been spin-off titles like MTMTE and such
@@dajokahbaby1506 I didn't care for MTMTE much. Some spotlights have been amazing. I've liked things. But usually there is always something not quite right.
I was a big fan of it, but it wasn't what the DW audience wanted! DW and Devil's Due had a tendency to advertise these kinds of TF comics by doing little more than showing some designs and saying "look what they turn into in THIS one!" (the War Withins, the DDP Joe crossovers), and that's how they promoted the WWII crossover, with lots of toyetic Don Fig designs. But then the book itself arrived, and Jae Lee was just not here to draw toys bashing into one another! I've never forgotten that moment where the Joes think they've run into an ordinary soldier, wearing a trenchcoat and a helmet, and Lee's art fully sells that... until suddenly from out of the shadows the PILE DRIVERS emerge and you realise it's RUMBLE! Wouldn't have worked in the DW faux-anime style everyone was grousing about it not having back in the day!
I was working in a comic book store in the UK when this all started. We were already re-ordering #1 the day it shipped it was such a knock out success in terms of sales. Also all the early issues having either an Autobot or Decepticon variant cover was either a great way to double sales, or a logistical nightmare keeping track on what cover each standing order customer had wanted 😂 The domino effect of seeing over that first year of Dreamwave TF comics what 80's property other companies were trying to bring back as a comic was wild ride
The War Within was a definitely a highlight of this era. Other than Furman coming back to write, it gave us Don Figueroa’s art for the first time. I also have a bit of nostalgia for the Armada and Energon comics, the latter of which was head and shoulders above the cartoon.
First time professionally. He did a fan comic back in the day called Macromasters that was based on scratch-built toys he made along with the post-movie G1 cast. I think making his own figures helped when it came to designing new forms for the Cybertronian years of the Transformers.
No offense fellow Transformers fan, but your last point really isn't saying much. The animated Armada and Energon projects were absolute rubbish. Thank Primus for Dreamwave's comic series. The toylines were pretty neat too 👍
@@residentrump3271 The Unicron Trilogy suffered for a lot of reasons. Cartoon Network was in a rush to get the Armada show on their new Saturday night lineup even though it wasn't ready, the studio they were using to dub the show didn't have their info straight (five different characters were called Leader-1 in the early episodes), nobody told the replacement Japanese studio that Cybertron/Galaxy Force was supposed to be in the same continuity as the two previous shows, and I've maintained for years that none of the media used the Mini-Con idea to their full potential, writing them off as power boosters rather than weapons and armor unless they had another mode. The comics at least made the Mini-Cons into characters but they disappeared for Energon, made a less annoying Kicker but gave him superpowers beyond being an Energon "divining rod", and told some really good stories with the characters. It didn't have the issues the shows did so it was able to achieve better results.
@@ShadowWingTronix I get what you're saying, but the Energon animated series was still inferior to DW comics version. As you noted, DW made the minicons much more appealing than the animated series, I loved what they did with the arc depicting Duallor (I may have spelled his name wrong) being a self appointed minicon savior. The Unicron trilogy deserved a better animated version and a completed comic from Dreamwave. Just one humble nerd's opinion...
Fun Fact: Thanks to The Ultimate Guide we could say that The Dreamwave universe Is the mainstream or we could say, the ultimate and defintiive G1 universe, also, The Beast Wars AND Beast Machines cartoons are canon in that universe, AND thus The IDW gathering and ascending are also canon in Dreamwave, and The Expanded material of The Beast era (mostly convention material like comics, text stories AND Profiles) are canon also
If I had a nickel for every company I knew of that went downhill quickly because of inexperienced business owners trying to live the high life, I'd have two nickels, which isn't a lot but it's weird that it's only happened twice.
I wasn’t really into Transformers or Comics at the time, but I do remember the ubiquity of that very specific chunky art style. To this day I have second hand nostalgia for that look. Real shame it all imploded like it did.
I think the silver lining with DW is that so many of the names mentioned in this episode are still important to the Transformers comics today. Just a shame Pat didn’t pay them. This made me want to look over some of my sparse DW collection to have a little chuckle so I found an Armada comic that was distributed for Free Comic Book Day. Turns out Figuroa drew it so there wasn’t much to dunk on. There was however a letter from Pat Lee to the fans printed in the back which reads quite awkwardly with the benefit of hindsight.
They had elements that I liked like. doing a who's who of Transformers that included micromasters and most of the G1 figures very cool as well as the army characters giving each one a bit of personality beyond of what the cartoons would be and I must say that I really liked what they were preparing with Jetfire AND Elita-one I found it very interesting. I don't know if it really bothers me so much that it was thought of, it's just that some ideas could have been recycled or finished in a better way but well at least the continuity of idw despite some of its problems (I still think the idea of making Starsaver a villain was going too far) my opinion a worthy reinvention of the generation 1 universe with elements of basically all the others. thanks for the video
My parents want me to guidebook when I was a kid and I reread that thing constantly. I still on my original copy as well as the updated version and got one of them signed by Garry Chalk and David Kaye
As said in the video, it's sad to not be able to talk about Dreamwave's time with Transformers as I loved and still love it. Sure it was for "edgy 20 somethings" and I guess that was me at the time, but I love a lot of the new ideas and directions they went, I love the art - weird proportions and all. When I look back, without Dreamwave I'm not sure I'd still be a TF fan at 36. I hadn't been watching the cartoons or keeping up with the toys and although I absolutely love Animated now, at the time mostly combined with the terrible live action stuff I was feeling I had to "let it go" as such.
I bought those Dreamwave comics its have great story telling and character development. Both Autobots and Decepticons in each side. The War Within, Prime Directive, War and Peace, and Transformers Micromasters are my faves But saw in the info went burned out and crash...
Pat Lee's art is my favorite TF art followed by Wildmans. I was fully in on Dreamwave's TF line, buying each book monthly and couldn't wait for the next release. The cliffhangers we were left on were extremely painful. Once IDW started, I picked up the first few issues and the art wasn't dynamic, the cost was much higher per issue and I just couldn't do it, I dropped it completely. I've tried to get back into IDW's version of the TF and each time I'm disappointed. I just don't find their writing all that exciting or the art dynamic enough to keep my interest.
Saw them in the local shops and HAD to pick them up. The art popped. It was everything I wanted at the time and loved them. Shame it came crashing down. Just great ideas that just influenced Transformers new 20 year dominance as a brand.
Thanks for this one Chris. I was a big fan of Dreamwaves work. More the stories I guess! That ongoing G1 series was so good. I hope James McDonough returns one day.
i had all the issues right up until the issue that was supposed to have elita-1 . i think it was supposed to be out in dec and the shop said it was running late, then a few months later heard it was all over...sad times
The golden rule of business. My personal money is in my right pocket, my business's money is in my left pocket and never shall they mix
Exactly
The fact that Dreamwave optimus has a long neck,and it was hidden by his arm in that poster,make it even funnier
Man, when I first saw the art back in the day, I thought it was the coolest thing ever, but yeah once you notice stuff..
My old illustration teacher in college used to say, "if you can cheat in art and get away with it, then do it."
That’s that old art school of Liefeld 😂
@@SpiderHam Liefeld only "got away with it" because he was paid. He certainly failed in the eyes of the fans and critics.
@@ShadowWingTronix Don't forget he's that cheerleader in the cheer group that did more cheering than working.
Apparently, someone at one point read Pat Lee’s TFWiki article and decided “yeah, I’m not gonna partner with this guy for this business idea”.
That's not even the best part: that same guy also wound up finding Don Figueroa's TFWiki article and decided "I'll partner with this guy instead".
One of my dream jobs is doing art for Transformers comics and whenever I feel my work isn't very good, I tell myself that at least it isn't Pat Lee-bad.
Just an FYI, not all of it was Pat Lee's art, he had uncredited ghost artists either draw complete or partial issues or Pat would do the base character breakdowns and others would finish the figures and add the backgrounds.
@@BatFan1 no... Pat "Mr. Talented" Lee would never do that...
The crazy thing is Lee's really great Wizard piece was pretty much the peak of his TF work. The very first issue featured the "marshmellow" look Lee became infamous for.
I will be always grateful DW gave Don Figueroa a larger stage beyond Macromasters.
I was one of the supposed "new talent" that was brought in to replace the ever expanding list of unpaid artists just before DW's demise. Needless to say, I was looking forward to this video, spectacular job as always Chris!!
Mind you, you were much kinder in regards to Pat Lee than many of us in the industry would have been.
I’m so sorry for the shit you and various other talented artists had to go through with this studio.
@@Jackson-hp7rt Much appreciated!
What's equally upsetting, is unless you were one of the in-house staff, many of us didn't know we were officially out of a job until we heard about it when everyone else did online. Pat Lee literally tucked his tail in and ran to Hong Kong with whatever stolen money he could. Sigh
what happened to the founders?
@@godzillameister They skipped town to Hong Kong
Damn bro, Im sorry, I hope you are doing better now, Pat Lee better get hit in the knee
I know the shady business behind the scenes of Dreamwave but their artwork is my favorite of all time. I have so many great memories back in summer of 02 of when my dad used to take me on his motorcycle and ride 30 miles to this comic book shop to purchase these books.
It was so cool to see Transformers in comic books again. These opened my son's eyes, at the time he was only 5 to 8 years old but he jumped into Japanese manga and it stayed with him until college. Just helped prove that good ol' Dad knew cool stuff even if it was from 20 years ago...or more. And with the internet he could get even more deeply into what he was interested in.
Proud owner of ALL the dw transformers comics just not beast wars. I've met Simon and have the scripts for the war within that didn't get published when I met him in London mcm at the excel centre.
The g1 and Armada crossover was SERIOUSLY BADASS!!!!!
Seeing galvatron getting merc by Armada Megatron was so sick
The More Than Meets The Eye profile books were the best thing Dreamwave ever did. I have those along with the Armada and Beast Wars versions. I do wish we could have gotten the extra profiles book(which would have included the Female Autobots). Hopefully, whoever gets the Transformers comic license after IDW will go back and give us that extra G1 profiles book. They also need to do profiles on Transformers Energon and Transformers Cybertron characters. We need that immediately!
Yes
we have had more G1 characters made under IDW in addition to characters that did not get profiles under DreamWave so we are due fr new Profile books. The Energon profile books from what I know were made but shelved due the bankruptcy and IDW decided as they were made with out paying the writer and artists, they(the books) would stay shelved
Loved this episode.....Dreamwave could have been so much greater. But this is what happens when greed takes over .... Sad....
Could they have though? They were kinda blowing their wad so early one. By year 2 they’d already introduced the entire 84-86 cast, introduced unicron and we’re planning on him being the big bad in 2005. They were just going down the line by year of the toys being released in the 80s. It seemed pretty apparent they had no long term plans at all for the books. Whether is was 3 years or 5 it was pretty obvious they were never planning ahead
@@theEmirateXaaron very valid points .... perhaps I am looking through the lense of nostalgia....
@@theEmirateXaaron Unless you were there working with them you can’t say for certain they had no plans for the future. With multiple stories being run in the different series releases, such as their G1, armada, and Energon comics that were never finished because of greedy executives there’s no way to know what the writers had planned beyond what was written and produced. Look at IDW’s transformers comics. They have multiple titles, many of which form a unified comic universe, and they put new ideas into their comics with titles like All Hail Megatron. If Dreamwave didn’t meet it’s end they could have gone down a similar path of exploring new ideas.
@@alexbelcher2206 they were literally introducing characters as if they were being released on the shelf. Dreamwave didn’t have long term plans because they didn’t even have short term plans
@@theEmirateXaaron Again, you don’t know that they had no plans. Look at the original comics and even the G1 cartoon. They did exactly what you said just now and yet the cartoon ran for around 6 years and the comics ran for even longer, even getting several spin off stories and additional comics from IDW such as regeneration one.
Dreamwave walked so that IDW could run. The War Within was easily the best thing that came out of the Dreamwave era (though I did enjoy the Armada/Energon comic as well). It's still a good read. The art from DW that Pat Lee didn't do holds up well (aside from the "mitten hands" syndrome everyone seems to have). It's obvious he put a lot of effort into that Wizard promo illustration, but doing sequential art on a monthly basis was obviously not his strong suite.
I remember being so excited for these comics based on the previews in Wizard, and even enjoying them immensely at the time (thankfully I still have all the ones I bought back then).
I appreciate how diplomatic you were, considering what many people who worked with Pat Lee had to say about him. TFWiki has some of those details for those interested, but this video definitely does a good job of showing just how good Dreamwave was for the Transformers!
Dreamwave was the bridge between the Marvel and IDW comics that helped define how modern Transformers stories are written. Shame its legacy is stained by financial troubles.
Sadly it was. That was a great shame how creators and artists were effectively ripped off by not being paid.
And capitalism is a bitch to as I say
@@nicholasdickens2801 While the owner was purchasing Porsches and stuff🤣🤣
@@RID01S I think I bought one Porsche at that time, although it was not my favorite Hot Wheels car. LOL 😁😆
Facts!!!
I think the proper way to describe Dreamwave Transformers is a proud failure. They may have went out of business, but the impact they had on the lore and the fandom of the franchise speaks for itself, with many personality traits, storylines and character designs still carried on into the future.
Indeed. It's streamlined take on the brand made it easy to latch onto and take in, while not being afraid to adapt to ongoing series like Armada. It helped keep the name of the brand in circulation.
The thing is it's not because of the comic. It's pats arrogance and "get rich quick" attitudes
Well, you're lucky I don't have that kind of attitude. I have an antagonistic relationship with money and material wealth in general, but this is what happens when the young get rich and become spoiled brats in an instant.
Precisely and exactly!
The same can also be applied to the live action movies as well
I had that issue of Wizard Magazine and was mesmerized by Pat Lee's rendition of G1. I'd look at it wonder and about a future of the Transformers. I even bought the poster of the image. So much promise.
It's sux for us fans who have been with the franchise since 1984 and yeah it is nice to live the high life and be comfortable but once you live beyond your means and it starts effectively messing with other aspects of your work life or and then the help suffers then it makes me feel that as beautiful as these designs and style was and is, it makes me sad about the behind the scenes but happy that what the lore came out of it.
Dremwave was a major part of my life as a TF fan, as their comics came out when I finally had a job and could afford to buy things for myself :)
So, it was because the popularity and money that got through Pat Lee's head that Dreamwave comics have gone bankrupt?
It would seem so.
@@foldabotZ yikes.......
Dreamwave is the reason I came back to Transformers back in 2002. Dreamwave is the reason I finally watched the 1986 movie. Dreamwave is why I started collecting Generations & Legends scale Transformers. I know it was a terrible ending but I still have love for Dreamwave and wish I could read their entire G1 series
I actually got almost all the comics (missing only one) of the Armada and G1. They was sold as a 2 stories in one comic. Started the first half of the comic with Armada and then G1, then continued from G1 ending with the cybetron story while the Armada was still going. However because of poor sales here in Norway the comic ended with the Minicons going into the mysterious pod and Grimlock going of for him self for some reason. I did however only a few years ago get a hold of the collected Armada comic, so I at least got to know the end of that story.
I was hoping you would do this eventually.
Aside from the company's downfall and
Pat Lee's actions, this era of transformers
brought in a lot of aspects to the
transformers franchise that are still being used today
Yeah, like the fallen, shockwave scientist eyc
This is my comment! I wrote it back when he announced it earlier in the week!
@@pkrockinomega4184 I do like your comment because it really respects Dreamwave,If you anyone annoyed by that,I promise I will never do it again
@@bilal_Hadjlaoui907 That's okay. But next time you should probably mention whose comment it was originally if you're going to quote it.
I have a small respect to Dreamwave for utilizing a white Optimus that was part of Ultra Magnus toy as his second form.
Every time I see that particular pose from Optimus in the thumbnail, I can't help but giggle a little bit since seeing the mess up anatomy the TFWiki showed behind the foreshortened arm lol
Still whether we like or not, Dreamwave's legacy still lives with us through concepts like sunstorm, the fallen, dull surprise, and what not. I was barely even a child when they were being released so it must've been a wild time for fans only for it to get canned due to backwards treatment and mismanagement, especially from a certain "TransMan".
Fun fact, one of the money-managing problems Dreamwave faced at the time, was that apparently Pat Lee had a company-owned Porsche. So some of the company’s the money went to a fancy car Pat bought rather than the employees that the money had been owed to.
Can't wait to see Obscure Characters Month, what a way to cap off the year.
Now, regarding Dreamwave, they did have a short but significant impact on the franchise.
Hubris and shortsighted ambitions doomed them.
The appropriate response to this video is dull surprise.
Thanks Chris, I recently enjoyed the timeline you wrote for Dreamwave it was very well put together, these comics got me back into collecting when they were out I was very sad they didn't finish there storys
I loved it! Dreamwave's unified style was one of my favorite things about it, I loved the designs and over all late 80s to mid 90s anime aesthetic & you rarely ended up with buying a book and the inside art didn't correlate with either the cover or previous book.I bought everything DW ever put out for TF at the time and I just couldn't get into IDW outside of 2 mini series they did in the marvel continuity. I love that even in WFC and newer toylines you still get some nods to DreamWave.
Hearing the fallen was not only gonna appear in a movie but be the main bad guy blew my mind as a kid cause I was not expecting the character to appear again
I really loved the Dream Wave comic. I wished they would bring the g1 dream back so they can finally finish it like they did with the Marvel g1 comic in regeneration 1 in idw.
I'm still impressed by how "modern" the art looks in a lot of early 2000s comics; aged like fine wine, as they say. Too bad I was a toddler at the time, so I couldn't read any of them.
This was a very good video detailing both the rise and fall of Dreamwave productions. It is incredibly interesting how in such a short time despite going out of business, they were able to have a big influence on the Transformers franchise. Just imagine if things were different; if they were still around or if they never made transformers comics the Transformers would look very different today.
I absolutely loved the Dreamwave comics. I stuck with Generation One, and got pretty much all of the various series.
The War Within is perhaps my favourite comic series EVER and was getting exceptionally good, that’s the one I’m personally most gutted we never got a conclusion for.
The G1 ongoing series was definitely hinting, in its final few editions, towards a re-envisioning in comic form of the original Transformers: the Movie in 2005. It would have been great seeing that.
A real shame that the hard work of so many as undone by the excesses of the Lee brothers.
2:26 Funny because IDW Publishing was formed the year prior. Could they have gotten the TF license first and published comics a few years beforehand?
I loved the artwork of the dark ages comics, the visceral image of the fallen roaring in rage, bathed in shadow and flame on a mountain of bodies is amazing
I have the privilege of actually owning a near-complete collection of floppies of the Dreamwave comics that I got back in the day. I owe a lot of my continued participation in the fandom to them, despite their troubles.
The best part of this was hearing all my favorite writers and artists get a shout out!!
Dream Wave definitely brings back lots of memories as I was 23 when their art started appearing everywhere.
Fantastic videos as always!!!
I still have the original DW mini-series with apparently all of the variant covers as well. I considered selling them months ago, but now that my comics interest has been sparked again, I plan on reading through them once more. I also have many of the first year and a half of the Armada comics and a few of The War Within. Thanks for this excellent retrospective video!
THANK YOU! You just ended an eighteen year hunt.
I had the Hardwired book as a kid and lost it in a move almost as soon as I got it, and well before I could finish it. I've since forgotten what it was called and have been trying, and failing, to figure it out and find it again since. I didn't even know it was part of a trilogy, now I have more to look into after that.
We got the Transformers DW comics over here in Sweden but it was published as a ''double comic book'', the first part was with the G1 story and then with the Armada one after that. After the G1 mini-series was done while the Armada comic continued they had added in the War Within story. The problem is that we only got 9 issues of the comic, despite that in a smaller text on the first opening page said that Transformers Armada will be released with 10 issues in 2003 but we only got ninth issue and that the tenth issue would be released in December....but I have been looking everywhere on the internet and it doesn't seem to exist a issue 10 of Armada at all. So it is a bummer that the whole international sales stopped because they weren't able to secure the license, which might be the cause of it. Or that the sales of the Armada comic over here was low. I have no clue at all. We also had contests where there was a small quiz on 3-4 comics where you could win yourself a Transformers Armada toy if you answered all the three questions correctly!
I was in contact with the guy being in charge, and it ended due to lack of financing and small publishing crew. They even made a transformers page called ntfa but I'm not sure if it's still active, wasn't very well updated and most of it was old tech specs from marvel. But they had a nice shop there too, bought my first G1 DVD collection there for 1200 sek. Was Rhino publishing so I didn't keep it
I absolutely loved that more than meets the eye book as a kid. Wish I had it because it’s one of the things that got me into transformers!
I always feel bad that several of the creators working for Dreamwave never got paid. Their work was, and still is, some of my favorite stuff in Transformers and the comics I grew up reading. The Sunstorm arc of the G1 ongoing is one of my favorites to re-read and if I ever got the chance I'd gladly thank those writers and artists for giving me the Transformers of my childhood, hooking me forever onto one of my favorite properties with some of best creative talent I've ever seen or read. I got back into the comics around midway through "Phase 2" of IDW and I never would have if it hadn't been for Dreamwave.
I remember how gutted I was when it suddenly ended. Went to every comic shop I could looking, not realising they had cancelled. Age of wrath was really getting good. I've still got some of those comics from 2004 too
The G1 series was bridging the gap between season 2 and the animated film in fact the stories were subtitled in the press as the "road to 2005". Optimus Prime was coming back.
One of my favorite aspects was blending the toys and the comics and the TV show. Like how Bumblebee and Brawn had their cartoon faces but also had face shields that matched their toys.
While I loved DreamWave's anime look to the art style, the brothers Lee were just arrogant to break away from Image. When Image was founded, most if not all of its creators released their titles under their respective studios with the Image "I". I loved James Raiz's artstyle for Armada, I even remember hunting down each issue of the More Than Meets The Eye books unitil I had them all. Dan Figueroa became an instant favorite for me, because ofhis artstyle, and when he began the (incomplete) monthly, the best story was with SunStorm. I loved how Guido Guidi's artstyle had an animation look to it for Armada.
Well, can't wait for the next episode of The Basics. Wonder what's it gonna be about....? :)
Some things I like that Dreamwave did was that:
In the Armada Comic, they included a lot of the toyline-exclusive characters, like Skywarp, Cheetor, Airaizor and Terrorsaur.
In the Energon Comic, they continued to use Armada Characters, like Hoist and Thrust
Really neat how the War Within Starscream inspired the same character's design in Cybertron/Galaxy Force
Loved this one especially! Thank you Chris. I still remember that sad feeling when i found out that Dreamwave was no more. IDW, for me, could never reach the same level of nostalgia, with a few exceptions. Didn’t realize that it was 20 years ago already. We’re getting old
I loooved those ultimate guide books as a kid! Their beautiful pastiches of illustrations through the years definitely helped to inspire my fascination with comic-book style art, and gave my child brain get an initial, fumbling grasp of the exhaustive complexities and contradictions within various comics continuities. It pains me that the War Within series ultimately remained incomplete, but this video certainly puts Dreamwave's influence and eventual collapse into an understandable context!
Lol, I always assumed IDW stood for Image Dream Wave... I now know better, thanks!
I was there when Pat Lee established Dreamwave Productions in Image Comics. I got suckered to their Darkminds comics - at least for the first few issues. I was shocked when Dreamwave got to do the Transformers comics and expanded upon. I got the first two miniseries and a few issues of their regular series. I managed to complete the first arc in their Armada comics but sadly will not complete the first volume of The War Within with me missing out on issue 4 (and before anyone says go to E-Bay and it being cheap, from where I'm from shipping is VERY expensive and from where I'm from again I seem to have trouble finding it so yeah. No hope at all. 😭) Anyway it's kind of a bummer that Dreamwave imploded thanks to Pat Lee's actions and here I hope one day they reprint all those issues and gets a Marvel treatment having the incomplete stories to be completed today ala Regeneration One. One can only hope.
The Ultimate Guide and the Armada comics/artwork were so influential in shaping my early idea of what Transformers looked like, and what the expanded universe beyond the cartoons could be
When I collected few Armada figures back in the day, did get they back in comics but can legit recall seeing Dreamwave TF comic on my local supermarket; even had quick look at it.
If them bois would have handled they money properly and didn't use company money for they needs, maybe Dreamwave could have managed to wrap up they series.
But yeah, despite Dreamwave's crashing; it left legacy seeds behind,
Was looking forward to this one! Thanks for all your lovely work, Chris : )
I loved their comics, especially those with Don Figueroa's artwork. I was hoping IDW would pick up from where the regular series left off and release the issues that were never released featuring the female Transformers.
I do remember reading that they had thought about continuing the DW stories very briefly, but then decided not to either cause of the whole no one getting paid thing or simply they wanted to start their own stories.
@@grand_max66 as someone personally involved in a similar situation (company folded in 2019 and didn't pay us) and who is still now going through the legal system to unravel matters, I know how messy it can be trying to take on existing work that is subject to legal proceedings. By the time the matter is resolved several years later it becomes too late for anyone who cared about it to want to revisit it and get a conclusion to it.
If they did try to continue it before the legal issues are resolved it then damages any claims the original writers and artists have as their work is then in the public domain and the same work is getting money from another source so they cannot argue they have lost out.
It is a shame to..Dreamwave’s Transformer story experience was so much more superior to IDW. Really wish we had seen, their explanation for female Transformers…and everything else.
@@saturncrush so much more superior huh?
It was just leading toward unicron an it really wasn't that well written. Idws original stories were far better. I'm glad they didn't tie themselves down with an inferior version.
I was born in 2003 so have no nostalgic ties to dream wave or their comics. And yet I absolutely love them, the art the mature story’s and what it did for transformers as a hole. I don’t too actively collect comics but every time I’m in a comic or book store and I see dream wave tf comics I pick them up and one day I want to own all of them if I can
One thing I find hilarious is that Lee's artwork would be criticized for being misproportioned and often compared to Rob Liefeld. Liefeld is actually the one to have originally hired and mentored Lee.
Seriously!? I didn’t know that. You learn something new every day.
Well, that explains a lot.
And I'm guessing Lee has yet to pay Liefeld for the lessons
Don't forget the humans with "dull surprised" expression (Lazarus looked like he was still dead) and all the cracked lines on the bodies of the robots.
It all makes sense
The war within series were one of my favorites .
IDW had its own ups and downs but man I think Dreamwave takes the cake of dropping the ball so hard it went straight through to the Earths core and out the other side.
I remember buying that exact issue of Wizard, and I still have it in a box with many comics from the era! This was one of the best videos I've ever seen in the Basics series, it answered many questions I had and so many more that hadn't occurred to me. I feel if there's a lesson to take away it's to work diligently and honestly.
Here me out, We should make a Dreamwave transformers comic book continuation by Dark Horse comics.
I do find it a bit of a shame that Dreamwave went bankrupt, sad that they couldn’t finish their Transformers stories. Still afterwards we got IDW’s take and we can all say that it was epic!
I tend to disagree, but fair enough.
13:22 I know that Simon Furman and John-Paul Bove will be having a panel session at this year's "Roll-Out Roll-Call" talking about the "transition" of sorts from Dreamwave to IDW Publishing. Think they might reference this video?
Furman lived through the collapse of DW himself, I don't think he needs to reference one of my videos to recount it! 😅
Obscure Character December? Oh yeah, I'm ready for the basics on *Slayride* .
Dreamwave is a prime example of just because they were the first to bring a series back to the fore, doesn't mean it always has the best intentions.
But, it can never be understated or overstated just how DW effectively brought the brand back from obscurity. So many ideas and concepts. So many fan favorites....and the utter disappointment when it all came crashing down because of inexperienced leadership. But it is why I have more respect for IDW because DW embodies more of a classical depiction of Mecha, IDW could be considered the modernized version. Although, I can understand why people would prefer Dreamwave.
as both really they tell the story, just in different ways. With different styles.
That said, whatever became of Dream Engine? Did it ever succeed or did it bomb like DreamWave Proper? Or the Lee Brothers?
100% People forget how dead the franchise was back in the 90s. Pat Lee's drawing may be criticized for the stylized proportions, but Hasbro saw something in his work for Wizard Magazine that really perfectly suited the mecha concept of Transformers. I still prefer Dreamwave to IDW.
@@ericliu8488 it was one of the more unique art styles especially for it's time. As odd as the proportions are, what should be stated is that the way it was drawn was kinda "loud" particularly with some coloring (Although that distinction goes to 90's G2.)
While Dreamwave brought back the comics there were still shows and toys so to say the franchise was dead is not accurate. Generation 2, while consisting of reruns of the G1 cartoon, had it’s own toy line and comics. And Beast Wars and Beast Machines were both new concepts for Hasbro and had their shows and toys. And in the early 2000s we got the original Robots in Disguise cartoon and toys as well as the Unicron Trilogy which Dreamwave did make some comics for.
…I’m confused. What do you mean by “classical” and “modernized” depictions of mecha? That sounds a little strange. When it comes to mecha I’m more familiar with the “super” and “real” split.
@@battlinjoe2592 The details and designs associated with them. For DreamWave, they used what could be considered "chunky" and blockier designs that wouldn't be too out of place on a Gundam, much like how Toei would animate robots and mobile suits.
Modern depictions would have a lot more integrated details, sleeker designs, more moving parts to build up the hype, and sharper edges like antenna, armored plates, and many other elements. To me, it feels more like a leap in technology or consider "Alien". As the blockier kind are more simplified, Earthly.
I bought so many of their posters.
Yup, same. Takara even used a lot of Pat Lee's art for the covers to the boxes of their G1 reissues back then. I have a few of them including Optimus and Megatron. Crazy to think that Pat Lee was instrumental in starting a TF revival that had he managed it better financially, he could still be reaping its rewards to this day instead of being known as a failure.
Gosh Dreamwaves transformers short but spectacular run.
Dreamwave's failure always makes me sad because what the writers were doing had me so excited, especially what James and Adam were doing on the main series. IDW never inspired that as much in me. It was fun, action packed, and they seemed to really be building up to something, one of the few times the quasi-spiritual aspects actually worked for me.
Additionally, I've never been a fan of Simon's work in Transformers most of the time, but somehow what he did in Armada and Energon I really liked. (I even liked what Saracinni did in the first Armada story and I was NOT a fan of the first G1 miniseries. Something magical about that series.) As for Wildman, complain about the house style affecting his if anyone out there wants to but in the Marvel run they looked like people in costumes while in the Dreamwave stories they actually looked like robots. I also liked what they were doing with MegaMan, continuity errors aside, and while their take on TMNT was hardly in line with the Fox cartoon it was supposed to be a tie-in to, the Archie comics did the same thing with the original cartoon and still made their own decent continuity.
So if Pat Lee hadn't screwed everyone over this would have been a great Transformers franchise addition rather than a disaster. It's still my favorite take thus far, which makes me sad it never achieved the greatness it was headed for.
IDW stuff and some great moments, but the Dreamwave's 2nd mini to ongoing really was hitting the right notes for me. Shockwave taking over and then Starscream running things for awhile and then the return of Megatron....only for it to be cancelled. Sigh.
@@cheeseburger12 yea Dreamwave’s ongoing TF is probably way better than most of the mainline IDW ongoings, like the best TF series from IDW has always been spin-off titles like MTMTE and such
@@dajokahbaby1506 I didn't care for MTMTE much. Some spotlights have been amazing. I've liked things. But usually there is always something not quite right.
Agree. I like Dreamwave more than IDW. The only thing I like from IDW is the Wreckers saga .
@@miyako1909 IDW had some great moments. A few great Spotlights. But Dreamwave overall just felt better.
Now I know where all that incredible artwork came from that I have seen for years. Thanks Chris for another amazing video!
7:57 Is that the Gesselschaft in the background? You mean to say we could have had a Mega Man Legends comic, too?
Dammit, Dreamwave!
Jae Lee's art on the GI Joe crossover was amazing.
I was a big fan of it, but it wasn't what the DW audience wanted! DW and Devil's Due had a tendency to advertise these kinds of TF comics by doing little more than showing some designs and saying "look what they turn into in THIS one!" (the War Withins, the DDP Joe crossovers), and that's how they promoted the WWII crossover, with lots of toyetic Don Fig designs. But then the book itself arrived, and Jae Lee was just not here to draw toys bashing into one another!
I've never forgotten that moment where the Joes think they've run into an ordinary soldier, wearing a trenchcoat and a helmet, and Lee's art fully sells that... until suddenly from out of the shadows the PILE DRIVERS emerge and you realise it's RUMBLE! Wouldn't have worked in the DW faux-anime style everyone was grousing about it not having back in the day!
War Within was their masterpiece.
I was working in a comic book store in the UK when this all started. We were already re-ordering #1 the day it shipped it was such a knock out success in terms of sales. Also all the early issues having either an Autobot or Decepticon variant cover was either a great way to double sales, or a logistical nightmare keeping track on what cover each standing order customer had wanted 😂
The domino effect of seeing over that first year of Dreamwave TF comics what 80's property other companies were trying to bring back as a comic was wild ride
The War Within was a definitely a highlight of this era. Other than Furman coming back to write, it gave us Don Figueroa’s art for the first time. I also have a bit of nostalgia for the Armada and Energon comics, the latter of which was head and shoulders above the cartoon.
I loved those stories best.
First time professionally. He did a fan comic back in the day called Macromasters that was based on scratch-built toys he made along with the post-movie G1 cast. I think making his own figures helped when it came to designing new forms for the Cybertronian years of the Transformers.
No offense fellow Transformers fan, but your last point really isn't saying much. The animated Armada and Energon projects were absolute rubbish. Thank Primus for Dreamwave's comic series. The toylines were pretty neat too 👍
@@residentrump3271 The Unicron Trilogy suffered for a lot of reasons. Cartoon Network was in a rush to get the Armada show on their new Saturday night lineup even though it wasn't ready, the studio they were using to dub the show didn't have their info straight (five different characters were called Leader-1 in the early episodes), nobody told the replacement Japanese studio that Cybertron/Galaxy Force was supposed to be in the same continuity as the two previous shows, and I've maintained for years that none of the media used the Mini-Con idea to their full potential, writing them off as power boosters rather than weapons and armor unless they had another mode.
The comics at least made the Mini-Cons into characters but they disappeared for Energon, made a less annoying Kicker but gave him superpowers beyond being an Energon "divining rod", and told some really good stories with the characters. It didn't have the issues the shows did so it was able to achieve better results.
@@ShadowWingTronix I get what you're saying, but the Energon animated series was still inferior to DW comics version. As you noted, DW made the minicons much more appealing than the animated series, I loved what they did with the arc depicting Duallor (I may have spelled his name wrong) being a self appointed minicon savior. The Unicron trilogy deserved a better animated version and a completed comic from Dreamwave. Just one humble nerd's opinion...
Fun Fact: Thanks to The Ultimate Guide we could say that The Dreamwave universe Is the mainstream or we could say, the ultimate and defintiive G1 universe, also, The Beast Wars AND Beast Machines cartoons are canon in that universe, AND thus The IDW gathering and ascending are also canon in Dreamwave, and The Expanded material of The Beast era (mostly convention material like comics, text stories AND Profiles) are canon also
8:56 RID would not have been different enough from G1 and Armada/ Energon to justify publishing it at the same time as those two. Why have the poll?
If I had a nickel for every company I knew of that went downhill quickly because of inexperienced business owners trying to live the high life, I'd have two nickels, which isn't a lot but it's weird that it's only happened twice.
That's the story of at least a third of small businesses that get success, I'd say
I think you'd have way more than two nickels.
You’d have enough to buy them all.
I wasn’t really into Transformers or Comics at the time, but I do remember the ubiquity of that very specific chunky art style. To this day I have second hand nostalgia for that look. Real shame it all imploded like it did.
I think the silver lining with DW is that so many of the names mentioned in this episode are still important to the Transformers comics today. Just a shame Pat didn’t pay them. This made me want to look over some of my sparse DW collection to have a little chuckle so I found an Armada comic that was distributed for Free Comic Book Day. Turns out Figuroa drew it so there wasn’t much to dunk on. There was however a letter from Pat Lee to the fans printed in the back which reads quite awkwardly with the benefit of hindsight.
Dreamwave The Fallen is still the best depiction of the character
They had elements that I liked like. doing a who's who of Transformers that included micromasters and most of the G1 figures very cool as well as the army characters giving each one a bit of personality beyond of what the cartoons would be and I must say that I really liked what they were preparing with Jetfire AND Elita-one I found it very interesting. I don't know if it really bothers me so much that it was thought of, it's just that some ideas could have been recycled or finished in a better way but well at least the continuity of idw despite some of its problems (I still think the idea of making Starsaver a villain was going too far) my opinion a worthy reinvention of the generation 1 universe with elements of basically all the others.
thanks for the video
Did they jinx themselves by creating the fallen?
My parents want me to guidebook when I was a kid and I reread that thing constantly. I still on my original copy as well as the updated version and got one of them signed by Garry Chalk and David Kaye
I can’t wait for obscure characters month 2023 in just a few weeks!
As said in the video, it's sad to not be able to talk about Dreamwave's time with Transformers as I loved and still love it.
Sure it was for "edgy 20 somethings" and I guess that was me at the time, but I love a lot of the new ideas and directions they went, I love the art - weird proportions and all.
When I look back, without Dreamwave I'm not sure I'd still be a TF fan at 36. I hadn't been watching the cartoons or keeping up with the toys and although I absolutely love Animated now, at the time mostly combined with the terrible live action stuff I was feeling I had to "let it go" as such.
I bought those Dreamwave comics its have great story telling and character development. Both Autobots and Decepticons in each side.
The War Within, Prime Directive, War and Peace, and Transformers Micromasters are my faves But saw in the info went burned out and crash...
I honestly wish IDW or some other publishing company pick up the stories they left behind and continue them properly
Finally getting to better know Dreamwave and finding out that I don’t have to wait as long for my favorite month is great!
That DK Ultimate Guide was the thing that got me back into Transformers as an adult.
I never realized about Dreamwave being inexperienced and egotistical until recently.
I see Skullgrin, Wheelie, Hot Shot (I think, kinda hard to make out) and…Wolfang? I was honestly expecting Injector.
I always loved Dreamwave over IDW Tfs series.... still do.
My favourite part was finally seeing Omega Supreme get some attention. He's always been my favorite.
3:34 Man, that was my Desktop Background at that Time. For a looong Time. 🥰
Pat Lee's art is my favorite TF art followed by Wildmans. I was fully in on Dreamwave's TF line, buying each book monthly and couldn't wait for the next release. The cliffhangers we were left on were extremely painful. Once IDW started, I picked up the first few issues and the art wasn't dynamic, the cost was much higher per issue and I just couldn't do it, I dropped it completely. I've tried to get back into IDW's version of the TF and each time I'm disappointed. I just don't find their writing all that exciting or the art dynamic enough to keep my interest.
Always wondered what happened there.. thanks for the expose
Their art was everywhere. I think that if you look for a character, the Dreamwave art will be one of the first in the images section.
Saw them in the local shops and HAD to pick them up. The art popped. It was everything I wanted at the time and loved them. Shame it came crashing down. Just great ideas that just influenced Transformers new 20 year dominance as a brand.
Thanks for this one Chris. I was a big fan of Dreamwaves work. More the stories I guess! That ongoing G1 series was so good. I hope James McDonough returns one day.
i had all the issues right up until the issue that was supposed to have elita-1 . i think it was supposed to be out in dec and the shop said it was running late, then a few months later heard it was all over...sad times