@@challengefatty I'd guess that for a lot of people, driving is more of a chore than anything else. Just try to enjoy the ride, you're still in a fantastic car!
🤔What will your fuel savings mean when you have to replace the battery at some point in the future that will cost you more than half the cost of the entire car when you bought it.
Most EV batteries are outlasting the cars they're in, apart from the uncooled Leaf batteries, which can be easily opened and repaired by 3rd parties. Renault had to cancel a couple of project they set up for re-using batteries IF they degraded badly because...... so few were handed back. Also if the engine in a current ICE car dies, it can write off a car too as the dealership will want to replace like for like brand new engine direct from the OEM
I never need to fill up at motorway services because my car has a 750 mile range and diesel is easily available everywhere. Not comparable to an EV with perhaps 300 mile range when you don't know if there'll be a queue for the next charge point or they're out of order.
I normally know whether charge points are down or busy because of the charge apps I use but I take your point. Things is 750miles is 10-11hrs of solid 70mph of cruising.... without a pee break! Jeeesuss
Have you had it mapped to be antisocial? The S58 in M3/4 is not a pleasant noise and a big reason I chose a W205 C63 over the M alternative. I need a V8 and the noise it makes in my life. I was gutted when BMW dropped the V8. I loved my E90 M3 competition, such a great car, precise, balanced and with an awesome engine.
*Mercedes 'B' Class that can get 2 Mountain bikes in rear without dismantling them, and on a Ski Holiday at Saalbach [sadly 5 years ago] got 3 passengers and all luggage including Ski's in with 1/3 seat down. Model W246 B200 CDi and 143 MPH (Verified by Sat-Nav) on Autobahn and on non-stop return trip 797 Miles **14:14** hours Average 54 MPH [inc Ferry] and 50.4 MPG. Since then got a 2019 [W247] B200CDi with all the kit - absolutely amazing and so quiet most passengers think they are in an Electric Version - I kid you not, at 60mph in 8th Gear engine 1100 RPM totally silent, on a good road like floating on air - and have achieved 85.6 MPG over 108 Miles at Average Speed of 53 mph !*
Great video. I don't have a full EV, but I do have the next best thing. I currently have a 2013 Toyota Auris 1.8 Hybrid. I get between 65 to 76 mpg Highways and much more city. It's a much much cheaper car to run than my previous car which was a 1.6 VW Golf Highline Petrol. That car got 48 to 52 mpg. I do have a fairly light foot. Overall the Toyota has saved me a total of 800 to 900 a year in fuel. I'm thinking of getting either a Toyota Prius Plug-In or a 62 KW Nissan Leaf as a choice for my next car.
range and time charging along with charge costs is peeps immediate thoughts . The battery life overall is down the line the one that brings up the issue when outside of manufacturer warranty due to either high mileage or the warrantied years either a repair or having to replace it with a brand new ££££££ or a refurbed £££ which will have a smaller time warranty. I still feel for the domestic mkt ev is the best of all the evils as hydrogen got shelved by the car manufacturers
i took a ev on ( 0- 60 in 7 secs v previous ice car nearly10 secs) virtually 8 weeks old COST me 33% LESS THAN OUT THE SHOWROOM BRAND NEW , charge home costs are £15 per week against £ 40 -45 pw v my reasonably frugal ice engine i px ed to get the ev .No ev road tax is lost by new dearer car insurance. Quieter and smoother pick up appeals to me and family plus the large high tec screen with no lag and voice control to quite a good number of everyday operations without having to take drivers eyes off the road. As in sh--e value wont know till after 3 -4 yrs when i px
*I have a 2019 Mercedes W247 B200 CDi that I have achieved 85.6 MPG over 106 Miles, and the Emissions (Cleaned with additional Catalytic Convertors, and aided by AdBlue) to reduce Nitrous Oxide (NOx) is one of the new breed [Euro 6] and .08 Parts per Million. By 2025 Euro 7 even tougher EU7 limits due mid-decade - are impressively clean, with sufficient exhaust after-treatment built in to trap the nasties that give Diesel a bad name.*
I agree with you that electric cars are more relaxed overall, less noise, less vibrations but this video kinda comes off as you presenting EVs in the most favorable light possible, and looking for solutions to their downsides while not offering the same favor to ICE cars. - ICE cars that allow you to precondition the interior before you enter them exist - You can use gloves to avoid having the pump nozzle leaving the nasty diesel smell on your hands. I think a latex glove + maybe a scented wipe after throwing the glove away should keep your hand smelling very nice. - Waking up to a fully charged electric car at home is so nice only because it prevents you from having to go to a charging station which is a bigger hassle when compared to an ICE car. - Adding to the previous point, your audi doesn't seem very economical with only 45 mpg uk, added to the relatively small fuel tank it leads to not covering that many more miles than in your previous EV, another diesel might have made you feel that benefit more. - Speaking of clunks and whizzes and bangs, when you go over something in an ICE car and you hear a scrape or something hit, you wonder if your front bumper hasn't been scratched too badly and if your exhaust hasn't been damaged. When it happens in an electric car and you happen to be driving a Hyundai ioniq 5 in Canada, it might be the start of a series of events that leads to you receiving a $60 k (canadian) quote for replacing the scratched battery and your car eventually being written off.
True, if I'd been given a more economic diesel things would be different. But I'd have to get a diesel to do 90-100mpg for it to match an EV cost wise and that was what I was trying to put across. Even if it had the optional 60litre tank or 80, whatever. the cost for each mile is double. The frequency of fill ups is not an issue for me, just how much it hurts my bank balance! That quote for the Ioniq 5 battery is insane considering the amount of impact testing batteries need they go through before they are homologated. It takes a heck of a lot more than the odd scrape to do anything to the meat&veg of a battery and make it 'sub-optimal' - I'd need to read more about it as it sounds sketchy.
Follow up, yes the battery price is right... wow. I would also state that if you were to hit timber at highway speed in an Ice Car you can easily take out the oil pan and the gearbox casing which in a lot of modern cars can right them off too. As a factory fresh and trans, then labour at a main dealer is going to be ruinous.
*Fact is Modern Diesels emit less CO2 (Euro 6) and have AdBlue Technology and enormous torque at low revs - love my B200 8 Speed AMG CDi [2019] with all the kit - 85.6 MPG over 108 Miles at Average Speed of 53 MPH and engine so quiet you can hear every word in songs playing from Multi-Media System - rarely seen over 2000 rpm and in Eco Mode if chosen can FreeWheel for Miles ! Hey Mercedes Take me home !*
I had a kia EV, in terms of space and power more than i ever need, but i do long stints(120 km one way or more) but the tax benefits are decreasing and as a companycar i had costs of 300 euro a month (12%tax) but if i remain using the same car in 1,5 years that will be 500 euro a month. Looking at a diesel or PHEV for the next car, cause ice is 23% tax and EV is gonna be 22% tax.
I just went EV. I’ve never been interested in engines, oil and gear boxes. To me, combustions sound too much and never react as soon as I want them. Interesting video. Not sure I got the message of you went back to diesel though.
Yeah, I needed to be clearer. It was a abit click baity, Its a work thing, the car I ordered was prioritised to a paying VW customer so I have to take one of the availble cars in stock and the closest thing to my request was this one
The second I can buy an EV that I don’t have to drive or interact with other than select on an app where I want it to take me I’m in!! Oh and I also want wireless charging built into my drive so I don’t have to plug it in ! Cmon my phone has done that for years 😂
lol, all the people who are saying that it's cheaper to run a petrol/diesel car... maybe you're from the US of A. but fuel costs a lot in much of the world, as well as service and repairs, and of course we haven't spoken about environmental costs. Those who don't drive much, I get it, going electric doesn't make much difference, and it does cost a lot both to buy and environmentally up front. If you were to just say, I want a car that goes from A to B without much hastle and i don't care that I'm putting diesel fumes into the air, then live up to it. You can also say that electric cars will have higher depreciation rates because battery prices are going down. But I find it so funny is the ignorant people who can only come up with the reason of "it costs a lot to replace the battery" when battery replacements for electric cars are probably even more rare than ICE engine replacements and transmission replacements, which aren't exactly cheap either.
The surge in demand for EVs really only started around 2019-2020 so there aren't that many on the road yet and those that are, are mostly less than 4 years old. Let's revisit your comment about battery replacements being more rare than ICE engine replacements in another 4 years.
5:24 0.07 pence per mile without road duty. Is same as 0.15 pence per mile with Road Duty (and the 20% vat on Road Duty that we pay) So if you equalised the taxation charge. The real cost would be the same. And that equalisation of taxation is inevitable at some point soon.
But vehicle exercise duty here in the UK for BEVs is £0 and in the course of fairness would then have to put vehicle exercise duty on to the diesel, which here in the UK is waaaaaaaaaay more(270/Yr first year, £190 second year onwards) So it would make it an even bigger gap.
@@challengefatty why are you talking about vehicle excise duty. Apart from the fact that this bribe is slowly being removed. I was talking about Fuel Duty. Which is £0.55 per litre approx plus VAT . So around 0.70 per litre of the diesel costs. So , as that taxation value decreases with Enforcement of a technology that is presently not considered by the public to be fit for purpose, then that taxation loss will be made up somewhere. It's already being clearly spelled out that all the cameras are for Road Charge by the mile. So EVs will in the end get the same taxation costs per mile as Petrol and Diesel vehicles.
I get what you're saying, but we have to pay the tax on fuel in the same way I pay the tax on the electricity I use. most people can't remove the tax, so doing so wouldn't be representative.
I'd love to get a scrapped tesla, remove the battery, and figure out how to install a diesel motor to produce electricity for the electric motors. A diesel electric Tesla would be awesome!
But why? 😋 Why have the massive energy loses and NVH issues of a diesel attached to an electric drive train? With all the work you'd have to do on find places to put the fuel tank, exhaust, as well as the power generation, buffer battery and inverters and time spent on calibration you might aswell juat buy a Passat!
@@challengefatty I had to think about it for a minute. These are the best reasons I could come up with: 1)It would sound amazing 2)I'm a West Virginian 3)I could roll coal on rednecks with big diesel pickups Do you really have to use inverters if you generate AC directly?
I have diesel(opel insignia caravan 2.0) 2016 and for 8 years and 240 000 km except oil changes and and one time chain replace nothing else .I can drive 1100 km on highway speed (130 km/h) on one tank,on slower roads like set on 80 km/h adaptive cruise i can do 1500-1600 km on one tank! I have also 2003 diesel that still runs great and i use it to tow 1.5 ton 4 person caravan ,off course it has some maintenance (rebuild turbo) but nothing mayor EV are ok for second car but when you put on paper you will never get that money back ,not even remotely . Now with taxes on Chines EVs also gone that EVs will be any cheaper
I think you are missing my point - yes you maybe able to go further on a tank. But I'm talking about cost per km. If it Costs you 12ct for every km you do in the Insignia, and an ev costs 6ct per km, it doesn't matter if you can do 1100 km in one go, because that 1100km will have cost 66euros more. Every oil change is what 50-70euros, every 15000 km, Timing Belt is 350euros? In 280,000km, and EV would save 16800euros in fuel, 900+350euros in oil changes and belts... so 18050 Euros saved. Thats quite a bit. I definitely take your point on towing though, there are few EVs that can tow 1+tons
My commute car has gone 300000km and only things chainged are oil sparkplugs oilfilter airfilter and brakes. Not sure what ice car you drove thar needed all that lol
I'm retired now, at the time my annual mileage dropped drastically and it's still falling. I have experienced thousands of miles in my friend's Model 3 Tesla. If I could easily upgrade to an EV I would. But with my requirements it would only offer marginal benefits, with a very substantial investment. Perhaps one day, but not yet.
Thousands of moving parts, compared to the tens of thousands of electrical connections in the humungous battery in the EV, I'll take the ICE vehicle thanks. Go watch a few video's showing thermal runaway and it might change your mind.
you mean the interlocked connections that put the HV system to 0volts if broken, each with 2fault releases or the handful of bolted connections internal to the pack that are torque checked by smart tooling? Nobody ever seems to be worried about the big sloshing tank of explosive liquid under their kids seats thats taken to the glowing hot engine in pipes that age and decay. I mean watch a few car fire videos and it might change your mind
@@challengefatty I've seen plenty of ICE car fires all of which can be put out with water. Conversely these battery fires cannot, even a water bath cannot extinguish them. So how many diesel cars have exploded then? Not many in over a hundred years of use. Even the fire service is ill-equipped to deal with battery related fires. Just a matter of time before a family is trapped inside, when all the electrics fail so the doors won't open and the fire service cannot do anything but watch them burn.
most regions around the world require all cars to have a mechanical door release, even the Teslas with their electric door buttons, have a mechanical release(they may not be well known, but they are there). Diesel does explode, it'd be a pretty sh*t fuel if it didn't! - I've been in a diesel fire in a car and trust me it took hold pretty quick. It may not have exploded but they go up quick Also EV fires can be put out with water and quickly using things like a Stingray. Yes, I'll admit that fire services need training and equipement updates, but they would for any new tech or change in tech.
@@challengefattyGood luck to you. If you are happy to potentially have your house burnt down or to take out a entire multi-storey car park more power to you. For the record diesel does not "explode" easily typically requiring compression and heat in order to do so. I think I'll avoid all the risks and not bother, I'm not really interested in owning a car that can accelerate out of control by itself or that isn't actually green for the planet until you driver over 100,000km.
@@challengefatty Fun fact.... if the MG EV5 was a diesel it would cost over £ 17 - 000 for 112-000 miles.... How big oil owns ICE owners bank accounts.
My 21 6 speed Kia forte got mid 40's mpg and was about $40 to fill (before Bidens prices kicked in) Absolutely no reason to buy some soulless EV trashbox. If my Kia was available in a diesel with the manual I absolutely would've went that route but the corrupt epa said we can't have them.
God I wish I had US fuel prices - I miss them so much! The thing is after 25+ years of sh*tbox cars with 'character' I bought myself to commute in, the peace and quiet of a soulless EV trashbox was a game changer!!
How much does it cost to charge a Tesla? Model X feature a 100 kWh battery pack as well. Same battery size, same price - $16.47 to fully charge your Model X from 0-100%. With a 100 kWh battery on the Model S at $0.14 per kWh, plus the 15% additional energy required due to inefficiency, it will cost approximately $16.47 to fully charge your Model S from 0-100%. EPA estimated range of 405 miles
The details of this case stem from a video by the Fully Charged Show channel on UA-cam. He shockingly informs that the first battery swap he did was when his Model S did a jaw-dropping 666,666 km (~414,250 miles), What is even more interesting is the fact that he replaced the brake discs and pads at 460,000 km (~285,800 miles)
Give it 5-10 years and all those savings you'll need on a new battery pack they degrade slowly with every charge cycle, fuel tanks however do not shrink. We need some real long term tests if we are to figure out which is truly cheaper.
Fuel tanks don't shrink, thats true, but engines become less and less efficient as the mileage racks up, so range does change. As for degredation, there are plenty of EV taxis that have been abused and rapid charged constantly and still have good range after 300+ thousand miles.
@@Kalire21 you mean like someone else buying a new car? I’m at 100k miles and still fully chargeable battery. Supposedly good for 400k miles. We shall see.
@@Kalire21I don’t have an ev but have to admit that the battery degradation horror stories are mostly mythical. Once you factor in dpf, Dmf, dsg and other horror failures the ev’s are way more reliable.
ive never seen someone so unhappy about driving a brand new audi xD
Imagine what I'd be like driving a citreon 😂
There are some personal issues I'm having at the moment which are probably tilting the balance too!
@@challengefatty I'd guess that for a lot of people, driving is more of a chore than anything else. Just try to enjoy the ride, you're still in a fantastic car!
I do love the car, sorry that didn't come across - I am very VERY VEEEERY lucky to have it!
My 1997 Discovery with 382000 miles still gets 500+ miles to a tank and costs £70 to fill up with biodiesel from a local farm
Fair play, but that old girl has probably seen some sights!
🤔What will your fuel savings mean when you have to replace the battery at some point in the future that will cost you more than half the cost of the entire car when you bought it.
Most EV batteries are outlasting the cars they're in, apart from the uncooled Leaf batteries, which can be easily opened and repaired by 3rd parties. Renault had to cancel a couple of project they set up for re-using batteries IF they degraded badly because...... so few were handed back.
Also if the engine in a current ICE car dies, it can write off a car too as the dealership will want to replace like for like brand new engine direct from the OEM
I never need to fill up at motorway services because my car has a 750 mile range and diesel is easily available everywhere. Not comparable to an EV with perhaps 300 mile range when you don't know if there'll be a queue for the next charge point or they're out of order.
I normally know whether charge points are down or busy because of the charge apps I use but I take your point. Things is 750miles is 10-11hrs of solid 70mph of cruising.... without a pee break! Jeeesuss
@@challengefattyit’s not compulsory to empty the tank in one sitting. 😊
Exactly! that's why 750mile range is not mandatory I couldn't managed the 4-5hrs of my 300mile EV without need a coffee and a piss!
The reason I don't have an EV is because it don't do pops, bangs, bwap bwap, braappppp like my BMW M4.
Each to there own - enjoy what you enjoy!
Have you had it mapped to be antisocial? The S58 in M3/4 is not a pleasant noise and a big reason I chose a W205 C63 over the M alternative. I need a V8 and the noise it makes in my life. I was gutted when BMW dropped the V8. I loved my E90 M3 competition, such a great car, precise, balanced and with an awesome engine.
*Mercedes 'B' Class that can get 2 Mountain bikes in rear without dismantling them, and on a Ski Holiday at Saalbach [sadly 5 years ago] got 3 passengers and all luggage including Ski's in with 1/3 seat down. Model W246 B200 CDi and 143 MPH (Verified by Sat-Nav) on Autobahn and on non-stop return trip 797 Miles **14:14** hours Average 54 MPH [inc Ferry] and 50.4 MPG. Since then got a 2019 [W247] B200CDi with all the kit - absolutely amazing and so quiet most passengers think they are in an Electric Version - I kid you not, at 60mph in 8th Gear engine 1100 RPM totally silent, on a good road like floating on air - and have achieved 85.6 MPG over 108 Miles at Average Speed of 53 mph !*
Always been a fan of MPVs over CUVs/SUVs
Great video. I don't have a full EV, but I do have the next best thing. I currently have a 2013 Toyota Auris 1.8 Hybrid. I get between 65 to 76 mpg Highways and much more city. It's a much much cheaper car to run than my previous car which was a 1.6 VW Golf Highline Petrol. That car got 48 to 52 mpg. I do have a fairly light foot. Overall the Toyota has saved me a total of 800 to 900 a year in fuel. I'm thinking of getting either a Toyota Prius Plug-In or a 62 KW Nissan Leaf as a choice for my next car.
range and time charging along with charge costs is peeps immediate thoughts . The battery life overall is down the line the one that brings up the issue when outside of manufacturer warranty due to either high mileage or the warrantied years either a repair or having to replace it with a brand new ££££££ or a refurbed £££ which will have a smaller time warranty.
I still feel for the domestic mkt ev is the best of all the evils as hydrogen got shelved by the car manufacturers
i took a ev on ( 0- 60 in 7 secs v previous ice car nearly10 secs) virtually 8 weeks old COST me 33% LESS THAN OUT THE SHOWROOM BRAND NEW , charge home costs are £15 per week against £ 40 -45 pw v my reasonably frugal ice engine i px ed to get the ev .No ev road tax is lost by new dearer car insurance. Quieter and smoother pick up appeals to me and family plus the large high tec screen with no lag and voice control to quite a good number of everyday operations without having to take drivers eyes off the road. As in sh--e value wont know till after 3 -4 yrs when i px
*I have a 2019 Mercedes W247 B200 CDi that I have achieved 85.6 MPG over 106 Miles, and the Emissions (Cleaned with additional Catalytic Convertors, and aided by AdBlue) to reduce Nitrous Oxide (NOx) is one of the new breed [Euro 6] and .08 Parts per Million. By 2025 Euro 7 even tougher EU7 limits due mid-decade - are impressively clean, with sufficient exhaust after-treatment built in to trap the nasties that give Diesel a bad name.*
I thought you had an Elderly VW diesel?
I agree with you that electric cars are more relaxed overall, less noise, less vibrations but this video kinda comes off as you presenting EVs in the most favorable light possible, and looking for solutions to their downsides while not offering the same favor to ICE cars.
- ICE cars that allow you to precondition the interior before you enter them exist
- You can use gloves to avoid having the pump nozzle leaving the nasty diesel smell on your hands. I think a latex glove + maybe a scented wipe after throwing the glove away should keep your hand smelling very nice.
- Waking up to a fully charged electric car at home is so nice only because it prevents you from having to go to a charging station which is a bigger hassle when compared to an ICE car.
- Adding to the previous point, your audi doesn't seem very economical with only 45 mpg uk, added to the relatively small fuel tank it leads to not covering that many more miles than in your previous EV, another diesel might have made you feel that benefit more.
- Speaking of clunks and whizzes and bangs, when you go over something in an ICE car and you hear a scrape or something hit, you wonder if your front bumper hasn't been scratched too badly and if your exhaust hasn't been damaged.
When it happens in an electric car and you happen to be driving a Hyundai ioniq 5 in Canada, it might be the start of a series of events that leads to you receiving a $60 k (canadian) quote for replacing the scratched battery and your car eventually being written off.
True, if I'd been given a more economic diesel things would be different. But I'd have to get a diesel to do 90-100mpg for it to match an EV cost wise and that was what I was trying to put across. Even if it had the optional 60litre tank or 80, whatever. the cost for each mile is double. The frequency of fill ups is not an issue for me, just how much it hurts my bank balance!
That quote for the Ioniq 5 battery is insane considering the amount of impact testing batteries need they go through before they are homologated. It takes a heck of a lot more than the odd scrape to do anything to the meat&veg of a battery and make it 'sub-optimal' - I'd need to read more about it as it sounds sketchy.
Follow up, yes the battery price is right... wow. I would also state that if you were to hit timber at highway speed in an Ice Car you can easily take out the oil pan and the gearbox casing which in a lot of modern cars can right them off too. As a factory fresh and trans, then labour at a main dealer is going to be ruinous.
After 5 minutes of this video, I gave up waiting for the point.
Thanks for the feedback, I'll try and make my conclusions a bit quicker👍
*You have not driven a Modern Euro 6 compliant Mercedes A or B Class !*
*Fact is Modern Diesels emit less CO2 (Euro 6) and have AdBlue Technology and enormous torque at low revs - love my B200 8 Speed AMG CDi [2019] with all the kit - 85.6 MPG over 108 Miles at Average Speed of 53 MPH and engine so quiet you can hear every word in songs playing from Multi-Media System - rarely seen over 2000 rpm and in Eco Mode if chosen can FreeWheel for Miles ! Hey Mercedes Take me home !*
Thats Awesome! enjoy what you enjoy!
75000km in my model 3 and easily the best car I have owned so far
I had a kia EV, in terms of space and power more than i ever need, but i do long stints(120 km one way or more)
but the tax benefits are decreasing and as a companycar i had costs of 300 euro a month (12%tax) but if i remain using the same car in 1,5 years that will be 500 euro a month.
Looking at a diesel or PHEV for the next car, cause ice is 23% tax and EV is gonna be 22% tax.
That sucks!
What this all was about... You are having some serious chrisis or what.
Steady on! I'm a bit down at the moment, but crisis is a stretch
I just went EV. I’ve never been interested in engines, oil and gear boxes. To me, combustions sound too much and never react as soon as I want them. Interesting video. Not sure I got the message of you went back to diesel though.
Yeah, I needed to be clearer. It was a abit click baity, Its a work thing, the car I ordered was prioritised to a paying VW customer so I have to take one of the availble cars in stock and the closest thing to my request was this one
@@challengefatty Okay, I get it 👍🏻
The second I can buy an EV that I don’t have to drive or interact with other than select on an app where I want it to take me I’m in!! Oh and I also want wireless charging built into my drive so I don’t have to plug it in ! Cmon my phone has done that for years 😂
lol, all the people who are saying that it's cheaper to run a petrol/diesel car... maybe you're from the US of A. but fuel costs a lot in much of the world, as well as service and repairs, and of course we haven't spoken about environmental costs. Those who don't drive much, I get it, going electric doesn't make much difference, and it does cost a lot both to buy and environmentally up front. If you were to just say, I want a car that goes from A to B without much hastle and i don't care that I'm putting diesel fumes into the air, then live up to it. You can also say that electric cars will have higher depreciation rates because battery prices are going down. But I find it so funny is the ignorant people who can only come up with the reason of "it costs a lot to replace the battery" when battery replacements for electric cars are probably even more rare than ICE engine replacements and transmission replacements, which aren't exactly cheap either.
The surge in demand for EVs really only started around 2019-2020 so there aren't that many on the road yet and those that are, are mostly less than 4 years old. Let's revisit your comment about battery replacements being more rare than ICE engine replacements in another 4 years.
Gladly
5:24 0.07 pence per mile without road duty. Is same as 0.15 pence per mile with Road Duty (and the 20% vat on Road Duty that we pay)
So if you equalised the taxation charge. The real cost would be the same. And that equalisation of taxation is inevitable at some point soon.
But vehicle exercise duty here in the UK for BEVs is £0 and in the course of fairness would then have to put vehicle exercise duty on to the diesel, which here in the UK is waaaaaaaaaay more(270/Yr first year, £190 second year onwards) So it would make it an even bigger gap.
@@challengefatty why are you talking about vehicle excise duty. Apart from the fact that this bribe is slowly being removed. I was talking about Fuel Duty.
Which is £0.55 per litre approx plus VAT .
So around 0.70 per litre of the diesel costs.
So , as that taxation value decreases with Enforcement of a technology that is presently not considered by the public to be fit for purpose, then that taxation loss will be made up somewhere.
It's already being clearly spelled out that all the cameras are for Road Charge by the mile.
So EVs will in the end get the same taxation costs per mile as Petrol and Diesel vehicles.
I get what you're saying, but we have to pay the tax on fuel in the same way I pay the tax on the electricity I use. most people can't remove the tax, so doing so wouldn't be representative.
I'd love to get a scrapped tesla, remove the battery, and figure out how to install a diesel motor to produce electricity for the electric motors. A diesel electric Tesla would be awesome!
But why? 😋
Why have the massive energy loses and NVH issues of a diesel attached to an electric drive train? With all the work you'd have to do on find places to put the fuel tank, exhaust, as well as the power generation, buffer battery and inverters and time spent on calibration you might aswell juat buy a Passat!
@@challengefatty I had to think about it for a minute. These are the best reasons I could come up with:
1)It would sound amazing
2)I'm a West Virginian
3)I could roll coal on rednecks with big diesel pickups
Do you really have to use inverters if you generate AC directly?
I mean, OK, those are reasons.
Yes the inverters control the power going to the electric motor.
Gone back to oil, oil changes, timing chains, transmission, transmission oil, o2, o2 sensors, fuel injectors, pistons, piston rods, valves, valve springs, gaskets, head gaskets, gasoline/ diesel. Yea. Makes sense.
Exactly. For a fun car, where you get enjoyment from tinkering - fine. But for the most peoples daily drivers.... its insane isn't it
I have diesel(opel insignia caravan 2.0) 2016 and for 8 years and 240 000 km except oil changes and and one time chain replace nothing else .I can drive 1100 km on highway speed (130 km/h) on one tank,on slower roads like set on 80 km/h adaptive cruise i can do 1500-1600 km on one tank!
I have also 2003 diesel that still runs great and i use it to tow 1.5 ton 4 person caravan ,off course it has some maintenance (rebuild turbo) but nothing mayor
EV are ok for second car but when you put on paper you will never get that money back ,not even remotely .
Now with taxes on Chines EVs also gone that EVs will be any cheaper
I think you are missing my point - yes you maybe able to go further on a tank. But I'm talking about cost per km. If it Costs you 12ct for every km you do in the Insignia, and an ev costs 6ct per km, it doesn't matter if you can do 1100 km in one go, because that 1100km will have cost 66euros more.
Every oil change is what 50-70euros, every 15000 km,
Timing Belt is 350euros?
In 280,000km, and EV would save 16800euros in fuel, 900+350euros in oil changes and belts... so 18050 Euros saved. Thats quite a bit.
I definitely take your point on towing though, there are few EVs that can tow 1+tons
Also - I love Insignias!!! one of my favourite distance eaters!
My commute car has gone 300000km and only things chainged are oil sparkplugs oilfilter airfilter and brakes. Not sure what ice car you drove thar needed all that lol
I'm retired now, at the time my annual mileage dropped drastically and it's still falling. I have experienced thousands of miles in my friend's Model 3 Tesla. If I could easily upgrade to an EV I would. But with my requirements it would only offer marginal benefits, with a very substantial investment. Perhaps one day, but not yet.
Do you mind me asking what you currently drive?
lets talk depreciation of EV's ???
@fredflintstone1 and how it sucks.... but its an awesome thing for people getting into 2nd hand EVs
@@challengefatty there's a reason for that - nobody wants one. Too risky.
I do
@@challengefattyMe too, just bought me one.
Thousands of moving parts, compared to the tens of thousands of electrical connections in the humungous battery in the EV, I'll take the ICE vehicle thanks. Go watch a few video's showing thermal runaway and it might change your mind.
you mean the interlocked connections that put the HV system to 0volts if broken, each with 2fault releases or the handful of bolted connections internal to the pack that are torque checked by smart tooling? Nobody ever seems to be worried about the big sloshing tank of explosive liquid under their kids seats thats taken to the glowing hot engine in pipes that age and decay. I mean watch a few car fire videos and it might change your mind
@@challengefatty I've seen plenty of ICE car fires all of which can be put out with water. Conversely these battery fires cannot, even a water bath cannot extinguish them. So how many diesel cars have exploded then? Not many in over a hundred years of use. Even the fire service is ill-equipped to deal with battery related fires. Just a matter of time before a family is trapped inside, when all the electrics fail so the doors won't open and the fire service cannot do anything but watch them burn.
most regions around the world require all cars to have a mechanical door release, even the Teslas with their electric door buttons, have a mechanical release(they may not be well known, but they are there). Diesel does explode, it'd be a pretty sh*t fuel if it didn't! - I've been in a diesel fire in a car and trust me it took hold pretty quick. It may not have exploded but they go up quick
Also EV fires can be put out with water and quickly using things like a Stingray. Yes, I'll admit that fire services need training and equipement updates, but they would for any new tech or change in tech.
@@challengefattylithium batteries do runaway regardless of water submersion
@@challengefattyGood luck to you. If you are happy to potentially have your house burnt down or to take out a entire multi-storey car park more power to you. For the record diesel does not "explode" easily typically requiring compression and heat in order to do so. I think I'll avoid all the risks and not bother, I'm not really interested in owning a car that can accelerate out of control by itself or that isn't actually green for the planet until you driver over 100,000km.
The reason I drive petrol is because there are no electric cars in my price category.
valid and reasonable reason. If I didn't have this car thrrough work I'd probably still be driving one too
@@challengefatty Fun fact.... if the MG EV5 was a diesel it would cost over £ 17 - 000 for 112-000 miles.... How big oil owns ICE owners bank accounts.
There's the Rolls Royce Spectre now....
@@sushiginger444 I wonder if they accept a Volvo from 2005 witch I paid 3k for as a equal trade for a Rolls royce
@@carl6589if you go along and ask the salesman, please record it and post his reaction.
Is that you Joe?
no?
@@challengefatty You look like Joe.
you flatter me, he's much better looking and twice as humble
@@challengefatty He?
@@challengefatty Which Joe are you talking about?
A petrol or diesel Tesla would be much more successful for Tesla.
As someone in the industry who is non teslas biggest fan, I'd respectfully disagree
Good for you for going back to diesel, but no manual transmission? Coma.
So the moral of the story is that...EV's are better than ICE! Love it!
My 21 6 speed Kia forte got mid 40's mpg and was about $40 to fill (before Bidens prices kicked in) Absolutely no reason to buy some soulless EV trashbox. If my Kia was available in a diesel with the manual I absolutely would've went that route but the corrupt epa said we can't have them.
God I wish I had US fuel prices - I miss them so much!
The thing is after 25+ years of sh*tbox cars with 'character' I bought myself to commute in, the peace and quiet of a soulless EV trashbox was a game changer!!
How much does it cost to charge a Tesla?
Model X feature a 100 kWh battery pack as well. Same battery size, same price - $16.47 to fully charge your Model X from 0-100%.
With a 100 kWh battery on the Model S at $0.14 per kWh, plus the 15% additional energy required due to inefficiency, it will cost approximately $16.47 to fully charge your Model S from 0-100%. EPA estimated range of 405 miles
The details of this case stem from a video by the Fully Charged Show channel on UA-cam.
He shockingly informs that the first battery swap he did was when his Model S did a jaw-dropping 666,666 km (~414,250 miles),
What is even more interesting is the fact that he replaced the brake discs and pads at 460,000 km (~285,800 miles)
Sorry dudes. Real person here. In 5 years of my model 3, I’ve replaced….tires
Give it 5-10 years and all those savings you'll need on a new battery pack they degrade slowly with every charge cycle, fuel tanks however do not shrink. We need some real long term tests if we are to figure out which is truly cheaper.
Fuel tanks don't shrink, thats true, but engines become less and less efficient as the mileage racks up, so range does change. As for degredation, there are plenty of EV taxis that have been abused and rapid charged constantly and still have good range after 300+ thousand miles.
@@Kalire21 you mean like someone else buying a new car? I’m at 100k miles and still fully chargeable battery. Supposedly good for 400k miles. We shall see.
@@Kalire21I don’t have an ev but have to admit that the battery degradation horror stories are mostly mythical. Once you factor in dpf, Dmf, dsg and other horror failures the ev’s are way more reliable.