Jews in Palestine between the Bar Kochba Revolt and the Muslim Invasion
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- Опубліковано 24 чер 2024
- A brief look at the origins of the term "Palestine" in the context of its application by Emperor Hadrian, and Jewish history in the region between the end of the Bar Kochba Revolt (136) and the Muslim Invasion (638).
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Thank you, Prof. Abramson. I am deeply appreciative of the depth of your knowledge of history and your commitment to share it.
You are very welcome
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I just wish your voice and wisdom had a wider audience. And never mind the haters.
Thanks for the supportive words!
Your observation is exactly correct!!! Thank you so much!!!
Excellent analysis, very well articulated. Looking forward to more.
Thank you very much.
I found a book, “The Jews of Palestine” by M. Avi Yonah that covers this period too, very interesting. I think it was published in Hebrew in the 1950s and translated into English in 1976 around the time the author passed away.
He was a great scholar
Dr Abramson I truly appreciate your lectures at this time and find them enlightening.
Am Yisrael Chai.
Thank you for another wonderful video! You are a great teacher, a much needed call voice these days. ❤
Thank you so much!
Another great video, and I think probably one of the most important ones. A lot of people erroneously believe that all Jews were ethnically cleansed from Judea after the Bar Kochba revolt, while the reality is that they had a continuous presence, just not in Jerusalem. Regarding the issue of settler colonialism, I think a strong case can be made that the real settler colonists were Arab families who moved into the region after the Muslim conquest. One cannot colonize one's own homeland (so Jews are definitely disqualified from being "settler colonizers"), but the Arab Muslims had their capitals in Medina under the Rashidun Caliphate and Damascus under the Umayyads. The Jews, Christians and Samaritans who lived in Syria Palaestina were reduced to dhimmi status and some did convert to the religion of the conquerors while under persecution, hence the shared DNA ancestry of many modern Palestinians.
Glad you found the video useful.
The Arabs didn't behave like "settler colonists" the way Israelians do. They would conquer the local population and convert it to Islam, and then they would mary some of the local women. There was no population replacement similar to what happened in Israel since a century. The Israelis have no plan to interbreed with the Palestinians, so you cannot expect any gradual apeasement of the racial tensions through gradual miscegenation. Islam is not a particularly racist ideology. Judaism is.
A wonderful video. If I have one suggestion, it's that you may find interesting to look closely at Julian the Apostate (who tried to rebuild the Temple), the Samaritan Revolts against Rome (in which Jews joined their "cousins" so-to-speak), and later the Jewish Revolt against Heraclius during the final Byzantine-Sassanid war (in which Jews against tried to rebuild the Temple). Jews remained a majority in the galilee and Jordan Valley until the Revolt against Heraclius.
As a cherry on top of the demographic history point, the ancestry of Palestinians is itself faulty insofar as it assumes there is an average Palestinian (just as it' s a bit faulty to assume an average Jew, given the diversity of Jewish groups). Palestinians from around Nablus apparently have quite a lot of Samaritan ancestry, as it was "kosher" under Christian doctrine to forcibly convert Samaritans in a way that it was not for Jews. And Palestinian Christians have more Samaritan ancestry than Palestinian muslims of the same area, likely because there was less opportunity for intermarriage with other muslims. In contrast, the area from Rafah to Jaffa and east to Lod and Ramle is mostly Egyptian in origin from the 19th and early 20th centuries. The third most common Palestinian last name is el Masri (literally "the Egyptian").
Wow this sounds fascinating! Do you have any sources you recommend on the topic?
Actually I just remembered Sam Aranow did a great video on the subject.
I always enjoy learning from your videos and mostly appreciate your intention to be fair and balanced despite clearly having a bias. ☮️ ✌️
Glad to hear it
Todah Rabah! Another informational video that I really appreciate you doing in these months. May you go from strength to strength!
I appreciate that
Thank you once again for another fine presentation. I continue to pray for you and your people. I hope to hear you speak in person someday.
Thank you so much
This is it! This is exactly what I've wanted to have elucidated for years! So fascinating. So the Jews have indeed had a continuous presence in this land since biblical times. Wow. And it's also fascinating because when Jews tried to revive or re-establish the Hebrew language as a first language in the 19th century, there were still native speakers in Israel who spoke it, right?! Linguistically this fascinates me. It's not at all easy to revive dead languages (Cornwall, Ireland, etc). Love your classes, profe!
Glad you found the video useful!
Really interesting, I am appreciating your informative videos with your easy to follow narration. Thanks
Glad you like them!
Dr ji good morning from Indian Hindu... your gracious and professional lectures on Middle East or JEWISH history are highly effective and objective in enlightenment of the lay people like me. Thank you for your remarkable services.❤💐🌹
Glad you find the videos useful!
@@HenryAbramsonPhDSir ji,🙏 You are a great walking encyclopaedia on Jewish history and the people....🌹❤️💐
Dear Prof. Abramson - I so look forward to your videos.
You are very generous in sharing your vast knowledge and deep understanding of not only Jewish history, but the histories of all cultures within that troubled area of the world, and how they've interrelated to Jewish history and culture, and how the many cultures within/without the Middle East continue to inform, enhance, and enlighten one another.
If only people could be less reactionary and more reasonable; certainly, sharing your videos, I believe, will help.
Thank you, Shalom! ~Michael
Thank you for the kind words; I’m glad you find the videos useful!
Good posting. I'll keep watching
Glad to hear it!
Another banger lecture. Thank you!
Much appreciated!
Thank you Dr. Abramson for your amazing educational videos. Tremendously helpful to understand the history.
I have a question on the Jews before the Arab conquest. I read somewhere that the Jews revolted against Emperor Heracleus and took over Jerusalem with Persians/ssasanids. But had to return the city back due to the political arrangement between the byzantines and ssasanids. That was the last attempt to reestablish Jewish Nation after Bar Kokba. I'd like to hear your thoughts on this.
God bless your efforts. Always with deep respect 🙏
Following this great historical facts in Kenya. Thanks professor.
Thanks for listening
I haven't watched this video yet (I will!) but I just wanted to post here to ask you a question. I keep hearing about Settler Violence in the West Bank. Could you please explain this? I tried searching for this in your previous videos but can't find any on this topic. If I have missed it and you have already touched on this subject, could you please post the link here. Thank you.
Hey Dr. Abramson - love your videos. Would love it if you made a video on the Jewish revolt against Heraclius, as it is widely considered "the last serious Jewish attempt to gain autonomy in Palaestina Prima prior to modern times."
Love your videos. The new captions are a bit distracting though.
Sorry. Mixed reviews. Some love them.
This is a great teaching, thank you!!
Is there someone equivalent to you with Samaritan History? I just started reading about their history that runs parallel to Jewish history. Like they have their own revolts, temple destructions , expulsions, resistance to assimilation, pogroms, and mass conversions. Like even after the Bar Kokhba revolts Samaritans fought along side with Jews that remained in the region in the 556 Samaritan revolts. And then Jewish revolt against Heraclius in 614 had serious implications to Samaritans… Canaanite history is better than Game of Thrones…
Awesome video! (I would sign up for membership if it were better days)
Glad you found it useful!
Thanks for this amazing historical study dr. Abramson. Learn more and more about jewish history 😇
Hello Dr Abramson thank you for this really great video. I love your video's.
You are very welcome
I'm grateful for you, Dr Abramson. תודה רבה.
Thank you!
Hello Henry, Shabbat Shalom.
It came to mind that much of what Bar Kokhba’s men is reminiscent of what Hamas did until now. Would you be willing to hear my examples to show this?
NB I am not an anti-Israel troll, the arguments I have to show this are that both were radical messianic groups that tried to fight off a foreign power despite all odds and led to horrible catastrophes being unleashed on their people. Both dug a lot of tunnels at the expense of civilians’ infrastructure , had dirty internal politics / narcissism of small differences, cared more about religion than their people, talked of liberating Jerusalem, persecuted Christians, attacked peaceful civilians who refused to join the war on their side.
I do not agree with your comparison at all.
That’s somewhat of a superficial comparison. True that Jewish revolts were initiated and prolonged by nationalist extremists against the wishes of the Rabbis. But thus us where the similarities end. The main difference I believe is that Jews were fighting a colonizing empire who outlawed many aspects of Jewish culture and religion. There were no other Jewish states and was viewed as a fight for survival. Nothing like that was happening to Arabs when Jews came back. There were ample opportunities for Arab to prosper in Israel as we do indeed see to those who were not belligerent. The highest bodies of Sunny Muslims have made a fatwa to rally all Arabs to Jihad war against Jewish state. Those chalices made and still continued by Hamas, is to deny Jews any foothold in the land.
@@HenryAbramsonPhDI invite you to read what Bar Kokhba’s men did to the poor farmers in Ein Gedi who produced perfume sold to the Roman Empire. (Set their houses on fire). What Bar Kokhba’s men did to Christians, how he said he’ll tie the Galileans feet in fetters, how many of them chopped their own fingers as a sign of loyalty to Bar Kokhba etc. The immense number of gifts they got from the ruler of Dibon. The elaborate corrupt network that he had, his plan to appoint a r@pist as the High Priest of the future temple he planned to build in Jerusalem.
Yes there was no Islam and even Judaism was in its early stages back then, so yes there was no globalist Jihadi-like motives or anything, but for example the Sadducees of which Bar Kokhba belonged Judaized the Itureans, the Moabites, the Edomites, the Ammonites and the remaining Canaanists in the coast by force, and a few years ago archaeological evidence of decapitation of women and children was found. Much later on in the Byzantine-Sassanid wars, Nehemiah ben Hushiel tried to take over Jerusalem with the Persians in a Hezbollah-like campaign of bloodshed, creating piles of skulls of priests in every monastery they went and killing Christians, ruining the great Jewish-Christian coexistence that characterised Nazareth. The ideology of all those messianic leaders of antiquity was a disaster for the Jewish people.
It’s a shame that he’d be the symbol of Zionism / Jewish national revival.
@@bengorelik1428I don’t think this conversation would be interesting but you’re projecting / telescoping a lot of modern issues to the past. There was a Jewish Kingdom of Himyar and Aksum was Jewish at around the same time as well. Nobody talked about colonialism back then, that’s all part of the modern progressive rights-centred, liberal talk.
Jews fought each other not because it was their only Jewish state, but because they were an autochthonous people from the land fighting against a foreign power. Palestinians and Arabs are not interchangeable, and a Palestinian would not want to just relocate to say Morocco or Mauritania because they are Arab countries- this misconception is common. Pan-Arabism is pretty new and pretty much conceived dead; Arabs are not a united people and see themselves in a much more tribal way.
Early Zionist leaders spoke of Zionism exactly as a colonial project, and they didn’t see anything wrong with it. Don’t try to ignore that. There is no contradiction, Zionism started as a colonial project and also Palestinians were not consolidated as a people then.
Of course Islamism is a despicable ideology and of course I do not defend them, I agree that for Azhar university to declare that Hamas killing people, kidnapping women and r@ping them is acceptable in Islam is depraved. At the same time the same concept exists in Judaism, if you google אישה יפת תואר. But the idea is similar and I feel like Islam is the wet dream of fanatical Jews in the 2nd temple period who wished for a superset of their religion that would facilitate forced conversions and expansionism. Indeed this is what recent scholars have discovered, that Islam drew a lot of influence from some heretical Judeo-Christian sects in the Arabian desert.
Dr. Abramson another wonderful and insightful video!!!
Thank you very much! Glad you found it useful.
Thank you Dr. Abrahamson for your lectures. In your opinion what is the origins of Zodiac images in 4th century Galilean synagogues.
Another video
Thank you... open my eyes on the history and real issue.. we in indonesia always receive very different version one🙏
Thanks for watching!
Dr. Abramson, can you explain Exodus 15:14? Who was the "Palestina" Moses was speaking of in this verse? Thank you. Shabbat Shalom
Very nice video as always!
Some thoughts, I believe that the different empires before the Romans also altenated between naming the region after eithier Judea or Palestina. Do you have an idea as to why some rulers chose one name of the other?
E.g. Persian Empire named the region after Judea. Macedonian Empire named it after Palestina.
Unfamiliar with the Macedonian reference.
Thank you so much for all the work you do in bringing light to history and for all the passion you have for the truth.
I thought it may be pertinent to address a point of contention between mainstream historians and traditional Islamic thought. (I myself am neither a Jew nor a Muslim.) It seems a factor that may lead these two sides to "talk past each other" is the paradigm of the traditional Islamic narrative. The traditional Islamic narrative, according to the research I have done, seems to be based on oral tradition and not on any historical, archeological or any other physical evidence. And the narrative itself seems to proport that Islam is not an innovation of the Arab empire under the leadership of the Abbasids, as history says, but rather it has existed since creation. Therefore all peoples who have followed "Allah" and remained obedient to Him , since creation, are Muslim.
This paradigm is anachronistically applied to all faithful Jews, Christians, and other peoples for all of history.
So, the traditional Islamic narrative anachronistically projects this paradigm on all peoples of the land of "Palastine". Therefore, they would argue against the view that they are a people from outside the land or that their religion and traditional is an innovation of the eighth or ninth century, or even the seventh century as their tradition suggests.
I know this was long and I'm surrounded you have heard this before. I just thought it was relevant to the conversation.
Thanks for your comment
Thank you for this lecture.
You are very welcome
Dr. Abramson, I've actually taken a different approach. I've chosen just to call it the land of Israel during lectures regardless of the time period, while clarifying the temporary name (Judaea, Palestine, etc.) with an explanation of why the land of Israel was called that at the time. Thank you for your amazing lectures! I've been learning from you for six years! Chag urim sameach!
Also an appropriate strategy, especially for scholarly readers. Thank for the kind words!
If Palestinians will refer to the land as Palestine, when the political entity on top of the land is judea, or the kingdom of Israel, there is no issue calling the land that Jund Falastin takes place in is Eretz Yisrael, only following the same logic
But the land of Israel was not the land of Israel until Moses. It was Hebron where there was a very small settlement.
Imagine if the Irish people insisted on calling it the Land of Canaan because it is declared their homeland in their native annals. (The Irish claim to be a remnant of the Phoenicians of Canaan in texts as ancient as the Leningrad and Aleppo codices.)
This is dangerous rhetoric since the Irish people have a more ancient claim to the land than the Jewish people have.
Now the LORD had said unto Abram, Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee: 2And I will make of thee a great nation, and I will bless thee, and make thy name great; and thou shalt be a blessing: 3And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed. @@derekpmoore
@@derekpmoore there is no genetic evidence nor historic evidence that supports what you are saying
But please go off on your khazar conspiracies and how modern Irish people have any genetic relation to ancient Canaanite samples
There are quite a few publications on the climate in Levant during severe drought (Bond 1 event) aka Late Antique Little Ice Age. The most of towns were near collapse just before Muslim invasion, which may help understanding...
Thanks Dr. Abramson. The understanding of continuous Jewish presence in the region is important, but not the whole story. I’m curious of two other related topics that will help sober both sides of the current conflict: (1) the records of non-Jewish presence amongst the population in the land of Israel prior and during Roman occupation, (2) the evidence of Jewish ancestry amongst the modern day non-Jewish Palestinians. I believe if both sides recognize that the other are in fact not interlopers, they will more easily learn to tolerate and embrace one another.
Useful suggestion
Near my home town in Israel, there is a Druze village called Pki'in. I remember going there as a kid and was told that there was one Jewish family left in Israel after the Romans. It always felt like a myth to me, so your video was welcomed informaiton. Do you have a video on Jewish presence after the Arab conquest? If not, would you make one?
R. Ephraim Palvanov had a great video recently about how we adapted to non-Temple life by drawing the lions share of influence from the Essene culture (already adapted to life without a Temple) rather than Pharisaic- which did leave Rabbinicism it's calendar.
First of all great and timely lecture. Secondly, if the majority of Jews were still living in Israel even after the destruction of the temple when did they become the minority and why? We're more continually forced out? Thanks
Roman hostility, natural migration in and out of the region
17:00 I did my 23andme and i was well aware that I'm Ashkenazi Jewish but I scored some Italian as well even though I have zero Italians in my family.
I'm a living conformation of this.
Very interesting
You mentioned wishing politicians on opposite sides still engaged each other cordially and respectfully.
Well dont worry. Behind closed doors they still do.
Awesome videos! Thanks 🙏🇮🇸
Glad you like them!
I think the “starbursts” represent the the four major recognized patriarchal centers of the day. Alexandria, Jerusalem, Antioch, and Rome.
Probably
Very interesting…Ohhh …I’m an Italian American glad we’re in the story lol
If 4th century Jews made a mosaic with rounded menorah branches only a few hundred years after Titus, does this perhaps provide evidence that Chabad's strict interpretation of the menorah having those ugly straight branches inaccurate? Is the mosaic you show a photo of the earliest Jewish image of a menorah that isn't Roman depiction of the temple?
Just enjoy your menorah and keep your eyes off everyone else's if you don't like how theirs are angulated!!!!!! Life's too short bro
Very informative. I think the Mishna and the (less commonly used) Talmud demonstrate the literary and scholarly contribution of Jews in that land.
Many people erroneously think that after 70 CE Jews vanished from there.
I would be grateful if you could continue to show some of the continuity afterwards.
One immense scholarly achievement was the addition of the niqqud (vowel points + cantillaton marks) to the consonantal text of the Hebrew Bible by the Masoretes from Tiberias (culminating in the Leningrad Codex and the Aleppo Codex, the earliest copies of the Tanakh; the latter is earlier and more accurate, but was damaged during riots against Syrian Jews). Without this contribution, neither Jews nor Christian would be able to pronounce words or understand the syntax.
The events during the Crusaders and Saladin are unfamiliar to me. I understand that Jews were sometimes forbidden from accessing Jerusalem. I understand that Jews inhabited Safed, but overall very few. I know about the immigration from Shklov in the 1800s, but I guess that in previous centuries only few individuals immigrated.
Demonstrating the continuity in these centuries is important for me.
Shulhan Arukh by Yosef Caro in the 16th century in Safed - a basic text in Judaism. So the Jewish community was very intellectual and literate, not some miserable peasants.
You really put together great historical videos. I never get tired of listening to any of them . I also encourage relatives to listen.
I somewhat disagree on your assessment of the effects of the pact of Omar on the Jews who lived in Arab countries between the 7th and 20Th century. The laws imposed on the Jews by the pact insured total perpetual submission. The jews in Europe suffered horribly during those 1300 years but the persecussions did not beat the fight in them like the dhimmitude did to Jews in Arab lands.
Thanks prof. Abramson i am very well informed especially by your lectures on the `jews of Palestina ... i enjoy your lectures may Hashem Barak... .....Agikuyu of kenya came from Bet Israel in the same manner as jcob sent one house east to face his brother Asaf... or the House of Kush and especially .... whose form of government was exactly as the Sanhedren run jews of the era 136 CE .... best regard my history rabbi
Thank you! Not a Rabbi, just a regular guy.
Thankyou Professor Abramson. we need more historians to speak and less tiktok influencers, that's for sure. could you do a review of the book about the Jewish demography between 70 and 1492? "the chosen few"?
Thanks for the kind words. I’m not familiar with that work.
Not only was this territory not one political unit with a capital, but its borders don't resemble today's "full" israel. There was no line separating the area with Lebanon - this wasn't modern Lebanon with British-French lines. The Galilee Panhandle was created thanks to Jewish settlements there 100 years ago. There was no Rafah-to-Aqaba artificial line to mark the border with Egypt.
In short, there isn't even an agreed shape to the piece of earth both sides are yearning for.
Yes to truly understand the region it's better to ignore the mandate/modern borders completely and refer to its physical boundaries as seen from space with the actual Palestine region being the south west corner of the fertile crescent
I understand why the author of the book would say settler colonialism from the context of British and French aspirations in the region 100 years ago as well as the opportunities that created for Zionists to push for the creation of the modern State of Israel.
I also understand the settler colonial viewpoint from my own history. My ancestors were French colonists in Quebec. They left France 400 years ago. If I went back to France and tried to claim land or citizenship, the French govt. would laugh at me then deport me. I would have to go through the immigration process like everyone else despite my ancestral ties to France.
I also see your viewpoint on Jews returning to their ancestral homeland.
The real question is always gonna be do Jewish people in the holy land have more right over Palestinians and do Jewish people have the right to return to this land more than Palestinian refugees ?
Yes as even the Balfour declaration stipulated equal rights
@@stephenchappell7512
It did but there was a different plan.
There is an interesting old video for president trauman explaining how replacing Palestinians with Jewish ppl should by done slowly and step at a time so it doesn’t aggregate a lot of tension until Israel will takes the historical Palestine totally for Zionist and all Palestinians will be kicked out.
So apparently this piece thing is only for PR 🤷♂️
So who’s land was it before the Roman’s, Greek, Syrians, and Nebuchadnezzar . It belonged to the jews( Hebrews) and who gave them the land forever? The same eternal one who placed his name in Jerusalem forever
AD, not CE. Anno Domini. Much easier to understand. :)
I appreciate you, your contents here and the way of presenting it.
Keep up the good work, just... please, don't mix up attacks to your religion and attacks to you personally..
respecting ideas and respecting people for me are apples and oranges, don't you think?
( maybe it's just semantics, the definition of respect is a bit fuzzy.)
I'm fine with people who argue with my research. Usually they don't provide any support other than hateful remarks.
During the same period of the various Jewish-Roman war's, Judaism was also losing many people to Christianity, initially as Messianic Jews, later into mainstream Christianity
Lets actually take a look at the bible.
Abram was from Ur of chaldeans, previously known as the Sea land Dynasty, previously known as "Akkad and Sumer" auspiciously known as Babylon, previously known as Sumer. Ur was one of the early formative settlement during the Ubaid, but was wiped out because of it low elevation and proximity to the Ephrates. It was redeveloped after the great flood of Shurrupak. The initial settlement of nearby Eridu is from the upper tigris, the Hassuna and later Samarrah cultures. Abram's mythical city was a city-state with a primary tutelary god Suen/Nanna (Wisdom), he then went to the city of Harran, also devoted to the god Suen, after which he became a nomad under the umbrella god El,**, a god of colonizers. El was positioned, probably during Ur III as a father god in Canaan and he apparently had tabernacle sites on many peaks on the periphery of the Sumerian world, El was a close derivative of the sumerian An, whose sole distinction is that El was the bull of the heavens and An, at least in the later tradition, owned the bull of the heavens which gilgemesh killed. In genesis it claims that Abram built a temple site to El, Beth El, which appears not to be true because that would have been sacrilidge in their belief, El had mountain top tabernacles, temples were taboo. If we remember the story, Sarah insisted that her son take a wife from back east (the civil people) and the same is true for Jacob, his wife comes from his uncle, who is also from Ur. And in case you are thinking Ur was just a young city. Eridu (Seat of Enki, Yah): 5450 BCE. Uruk (Seat of An) 4200 BCE. Ur, first layers, 5450bCE, reoccupation layer 2600-2900 BCE. Tammuz's (Dumizids city) Bad Tibera, early copper age (Its name means wall of smiths). Larsa, thr city were Ezekial had his visions (2600 + BCE). All of these cities lie within a radius of 35 miles. Its not a coincidence.
So lets look at the archaeology. The region of the levant is an area with some of the oldest anthroplogy for modern humans. The venus of Golan is a mother earth fetish which dates to 250,000 years ago. The oldest neolithic site is roughly speaking Natufia, which was later replaced by Jericho, just north of Natufia in Gaizentep wheat was domesticated, sheep were domesticated in the region and to the west cattle were domesticated 10,000 years ago in central anatolia. Jericho persisted until the end of the third millenium BCE, about the time Ur III expanded. At the same time middle bronze age sites appear. Beth Anath, Urushalim, Beth Lahmi. All of these sites reference mesopotamian gods
Shalim is the basturd son of El (Dawn/Peace)
Anath is the middle Eupratean god of the hunt/war from the minor kingdom of Suhum.
Lahmi is the guardian of Enki (Ea and in Ebla, Ia (in cuneiform) Yah in phonecian).
Beth Shemesh, Shamesh/Utu the sun god.
But did Sumer conquer the all of canaan? No. While many cities had destruction layers at this time, many cities and local gods survived. Ba'al Gad (what you call tribe of Gad) was worshipped at the base of Mt. Hermon. Both Ba'al Hadad and El had sites on top of Mt. Hermon. Asherah (Athirath) was very popular across the Eastern mediterranean and down into Arabia. Ba'al Hamon represented the gate way cities from the coastal plains to the Judean Hills (The place where the Roman Govener was ambushed that initiated the Jewish revolt). Hazor was a canaanite town, in fact the Hammarabi like law code was found in Hazor. The mesopotamians settled into canaan to establish trade routes.
So both the bible and the archeaology agree, settlers from the east colonized parts of canaan. So lets look at probable sites, Hazor was probably administered from Babylon, Bethlehem is a colonized town, Urushalim also a colonized town. So two of the most important towns in the Jewish religion appear to have been eastern colonial settlements.
Ok so that deals with the claim, who were the original settlers on the land . . .Not Abram. If you want to make a claim who is most entitled . . .Jericho. So lets throw out that argument because its bunk.
Gods chosen people. Lets take a look at this. The first historical encounter with Y--H is the shasu, who are associated with a place YHW/YHWA. The next historical document shows Y--H in the Kuntillet Ajrud inscription is a god, along with Asherah gods of Samaria and Yemen. This reiterates the long close association of Y--H with bedoins of the Aravah and points South East. The temple diety developed on the trading endpoints of bedoin trade. So that the very first people whom the British incurred upon diring the mandate were these bedoin, the wahhabi that moved their herds between Arabia and Palestine, these people were forced to flee to Arabia or settle in Jordan or S. Israel (and become second class in Israel). These are the peoples the Zionist portayed as unworthy and without claim to the land. In fact, they have the longest claim of any people on their grazing lands. Which god do they follow, the god of Abraham and Moses? And so we have the "one true scotsman argument here"
What about the other peoples on the land. The Israelites were exiled by the Assyrians and replaced, maybe 30% with people from the far ends of their empire. The idumeans were along the endpoints of the western peninsular trade, so closely related to those bedoins. The people along the coast were pelestia from the Aegean. During the Exilic people they followed various and sundry religions and many were forcibly converted to Judaism by the Macabees, most of the Jews actually were coerced to become Jews. The Samarians resisted and they were declared enemies. So that of the people who were actually from Judah in the 7th century, only a few thousand returned from exile.
Moreover, the people, Arab Jews and Palestinian Arabs - virtually genetically indistinguishable. In fact very little difference between lebanese, Arab Jews and Palestinians, even parts of Turkey. Whereas the dominant zionist settlers are primarily mixed eastern European descent.
I want peace and I want Israel to survive, but in the face of evidence we need to stop telling our favorite narratives. Jews are a religion, if you wanted to give a specific place were they had the longest continuous ties then Babylon/Bagdad would be that place because that is the inscription site of the Talmud. A culture that persisted from 595 BCE until 1950. As undestood the zionist bombed them in order to scare the remainder to aliyah to Israel.
Isra'el. The struggle/striving for El. El was the peacemaker, he was the god of trade, he was the father of the gods and god of the fathers, he was the light when the LBAC ended, he was the god Samu'el waxed romantically over, he was the god of sojourners and wanderers. His [grand] children were Anath (Shamgar of Anath), Shalim, Astarte, Shamesh, Yahu, Hadad. El was not afraid of other beliefs or languages. They recently found yet another language, written in cuneiform, the same script developed by the scribes of El. There was no tower of Babel, Uruk (Erech)- your god of old - El, embraced trade. Before the first letter of paleohebrew was written, many peoples tongues were written in the script of El. Look up the ancient law code of Hazor, that language was also used in "Isra'el"
Look eyes wide open into your blind spot, see the gods of old as they were, not as you want them to be, when you understand them you will understand the origin of religions which is in linear paths with your religion.
I find it very interesting that you mentioned genetics. I personally believe that a large section of the local muslims are jews who where forcibly exislamized And if we did the dna of the current inhabitants of this area we would find a lot of commonalities. Based on the bible and Isaac and Ishmael this is the longest case of sibling rivalry.
Sad but true
And you’re also very correct about DNA not being accurate determinant of lineage . I’ve done my dna with ancestry about 10 years ago. I am 🇬🇷 A long saga similar to 🇮🇱
Initially I was deemed 60% Italian. Then I became more geek but 30% Turkish🤯🙀
Eventually I am not Turk anymore but became 20% Bulgarian. All results from a single sample. 🤷🏻♀️
BTW the going theory is that the philistines were Mycenaean Greeks 😅😂
Thank you once again for your lectures Dr Abramson. The genetic question is interesting, one wonders what a DNA test would show for both Palestinian muslim and Israeli Jew who can trace their ancestors as having lived on that land prior to 1900, no difference I would think.
nb, maybe you can sending special energic for jerusalem light rabbi......for me feeling, he is very sweet man, don't need to fight for right to excist.......thank you, "g'd" for all special human in the (corrupt) world. It weare high light to.........humane world.
Thanks for watching
What about now, where are the current Pal
🇮🇱❤️✡️❤️🇮🇱 Paslms 29:11, The Lord will give strength unto His people, the Lord will bless His people with peace 🇮🇱❤️✡️❤️🇮🇱
Amen
Professor: “it’s quite likely that Hadrian’s thinking was…”
All a bunch of baseless conjecture and suppositions. 🤦♂️
Hadrian didn't leave a diary to reveal his innermost thoughts, sorry. But I'm certainly not alone in drawing the obvious conclusions.
Dr. Abramson, as a historian, do you not find it relevant to discuss the key Zionist thinkers from the original conferences, the parties of labour, general, and religious Zionists, key members and points of view? Wouldn’t you find this a very relevant historical discussion on the question of “colonization”. It seems to me talking about the basis of right to ownership is a distraction from the material destructive colonization 100 year process
Yes, but not in this video
I am Christian and believe that the world must accept the Bible as the proof of the Jewish claim to the land.
Nice to meet you
I am a humanist/rationalist and I think that's the wrong way. Most humans don't believe in your bible - even most Christians don't believe in its literal truth.
Putting sacred books or gods and goddesses on the table is not a shareable solution by definition: the jew god, v. 1.0, promised that land to Jews, this muslim god, v. 3.0, instead promised that Jews will be wiped out before the end of times... not compatible. Leave sacred text at home would be a good start.
@@nefaristo The God of the Jewish people is the only one God, you claim to be a humanist- rationalist but you believe that men can become pregnant.
@@helderet4756 as I just said, most humans don't believe in your specific god and, even worse, the two versions of the same god involved here say two incompatibile things. So maybe it's better to reason on more common ground.
And: when did I say that men can get pregnant? Look, I said it, I'm a rationalist, I cannot be woke at the same time... My religion forbids me to make unreasonable claims😅.
@@nefaristo I worship 🛐 Hashem, the only one and true God, the God of Israel who created the universe 🌌 and there is no other besides him. The others are false Gods
I don't think it's true that more than half of Israelis are descendants of Jews from Arab countries but it's true that a little more than half of Israelis are descendants of Jews who came from Islamic countries. A lot of Jews came from Turkey and Iran which are not Arab countries.
Thanks!
Thank you for supporting the research!
"Palestineans" is ancient Coptic, describing a migrating "invading" tribe from Minoan Crete island. At times hired as mercenaries. They "invaded" some time after the exodus. Check The term "Invader" in Hebrew, and "Falasha" in Ethiopian. This is why I always call Arabs using the term on themselves #FakeStine'ans or #FalseStine'ans . For Jews words matter as blessings or curses.
Not sure about your etymology
Ben Gurion himself said that the Palestinians are descended from the Jews who remained in the land after the Muslim conquest. The Arabs came in, Arabised and Islamised Palestine when they were rulers over the natives of the land, exacting tribute and taxes over them.
The only reason why they speak Arabic is because it’s a lingua Franca, like the Anglosphere & the commonwealth speak English but aren’t actually AngloSaxon.
The Ashkenazic Jews are only 20% Levantine DNA, the rest is European majority admixture.
I’m willing to send the pertinent articles to prove my point.
All the best.
Thanks for your observations.
Yes but Arabic only became the lingua franca in lands where they already spoke a related semito-hamitic language as Persian remained spoken in the east despite the Iranian plateau being conquered at the same time as the Levant and North Africa
@@stephenchappell7512
They spoke a range of languages, all the way from Greek to Aramaic which from what I understand is a pidgin Canaanite or Hebrew language.
the Christian palestinians are descneded from converted jews but the moslem are foreigners mostly.
@@Sapnfap
No they're not
check out Misinai Tsvi
This “who has the most ancient claim to the land” argument is very dangerous since the Irish have a verifiable claim to the land that is much more ancient than the Jewish claim to the land.
I have a question Rabbi Abramson. Are the Jewish people made up of all ethnic groups of the world? And thanks for this outstanding lecture in this video. Am Yisrael Chai 🥂
Thank you, not a Rabbi, just a regular guy. And yes, Jews come from a wide range of ethnicities
@@HenryAbramsonPhD I know but for me all Jewish men are like Rabbi's to me. Everyone of them has something good to teach.
Way to go trying to frame this video as a unbiased analysis but in reality it’s dripping in bias. Even the title. ‘Before Islam was in the region’, ‘the Muslim takeover’, you mean the ottomans?, Muslims were always in a Palestine, so we’re Jews. Settler colonialism refers to the building of a nation state to make way for a foreign population. Yes Jews can be foreign to the land were their religion and ethic identity was born! You really believe Jews en mass from all over the world with various admixtures and unique cultural identities are indigenous to a region they have no recent ancestral ties to? You’re ridiculous! What about the native population??!!! The Jewish and Arab Palestinians?!! Are you going to ignore the ethnic cleansing that took place in order to make way for this new nation state that you refer to as as the most successful anti colonial project in history? Stop trying to rewrite history and words to benefit your people and your people only. Heavily biased video and analysis!
Not much point in commenting on your perspective, but I’ll clarify the Ottoman question; you are off by many centuries. Look everything else up in an encyclopedia, not social media.
@@HenryAbramsonPhD why wouldn’t there be a point? I’ll accept I was wrong with the ottoman thing, but I don’t see you acknowledging the rest of my comment. I literally have a degree and read extensively from reputable sources on the Palestine/Israel issue but yea okay ‘social media’ is such a problem 🙄
Are all the 12 tribes in Israel ?
The thing I’ve noticed about these people is they do contradict themselves a lot, in this man’s lecture about the genetic bottleneck he made an extreme blunder and exposed himself and his people as not being who they claimed to be. Starting with the Kalonymus family, who was originally from Italy, moved, to I believe he said Germany to start the Ashkenazy for those who don’t know ashkenaz is the son of Japheth if you read Torah but they originated from Italy he said so some one make it make sense now don’t get me wrong the children of Israel were also in Italy as well, they were scattered throughout the four corners of the earth like Torah said. But the children of Israel did not originate from these places they originated from Israel but yes their were Jews in Rome Italy and you know what the Roman’s called them, NIGER ! Then the Roman’s kicked them out of Rome and Israel and the Roman’s assimilated the culture you guys have do more research because a lot of the information is just disingenuous.
He has sources. What are yours?
“These people”
@@TM-100 my sources are the same sources he used in his genetic bottleneck/founder event seminar did you not read what I wrote?
@@HenryAbramsonPhDDr. don’t get offended. You are a People group. Are you not ? It’s just how I speak,would community be a better choice? And in no way am I being antisemitic I’m just pointing out the flaws and what you have said it as a human first I have the right to do that. And you also have the right to disagree, I am also Semitic, so please save the antisemitic trope for someone who doesn’t know anything about anything.
@@mackruler6771 I certainly read what you wrote & you don't have any sources. Please link your sources
Dr. Abramson - you're awesome. And I love all of your history and your takes on almost everything. Zionism is 100% colonialist. There are all kinds of official groups w/ "colonialist" in their names. It was conceived of when colonialism didn't have a negative connotation. The entire world & UN agrees... Giving Jews a place to live and call home is great... but it's been almost 80 years, and the leaders of Israel have failed the Jews... and killed a ton of people in doing so.
What are you talking about? Zionism is not colonialism.
very clever. again. thanks
The overwhelming majority of israelites living in the Land within these dates were samaritans and not jews
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Thank you
The European Jewish invasion drove Palestinian Jews, who were afraid of the European Jewish militias, from their homes, and these fleeing Jewish people lost their homes in the post-Holocaust European Jewish invasion of Israel. If you were a more native Jewish person, you were punished by invading foreign Jewish people if you hid out in Damascus with your grandparents during the battles.
It's called ISRAEL
Were there any Ashkenazim that accompanied Moses to the Promised Land? How about Ethiopian Jews? If genetics doesn't matter, then the concept of a Jewish homeland makes no sense!
You seem to have the story backwards. Jewish genetics have always been mixed, ever since the days they left Egypt with "the multitudes". As for diaspora ommunities all around the world, why exactly is it so difficult to understand that two millenia dispersed in exile will change how people look?
@@koopon3900 if you live with the whites long enough, you too will have blonde hair and blue eyes!
Sir, there are few facts that you have conveniently skipped:
1- No mention of ancient Jews in the Holy Land you converted Christianity and Islam. Many did to avoid the Jizzya. Did it even occur to you that modern day Palestinians have ancient roots to the Levant?
2- You mentioned the DNA of the Ashkenazis being linked to the Middle East -- studies carried out my Zionist Jews for political reason (Hint hint: Conflict of interest). What about the DNA of the Palestinians? Did you even try to research this subject?
3- What about Christian Palestinians? Obviously they could not have come with the Islamic conquest. So what is their origin?
Here is a shocking statement that I whole-heartedly believe in: If you take the DNA from a typical Hamas member and compare their DNA to ancient Jews, his score will blow your score away!!!! Hamas members are more indigenous in terms of DNA than Ashkenazi Jews by far.
By the way, can you tell me what DNA reference all these Zionist driven DNA studies used to represent ancient Jews? Did they reference DNA from ancient Jewish bones or did they reference present day Levant people?
You raise some important points but I don't think the Dr 'conveniently skipped' anything as there is only so much ground you can cover at one time but hopefully he'll get round to reading your comment and dealing with some of your points raised in a future vid
@@stephenchappell7512
The problem with Dr Abramson and other Zionists like him is making the exclusive descend claim of ancient Jews. They don't acknowledge those who left the faith over the past 2000 years and do not acknowledge those who joined the faith over the past 2000 years -- not to mention the significant dilution of any ancient DNA after 60+ generation mixing with non-Jewish locals. Judging from the fact that Ashkenazi Jews look Europeans, Yemenite Jews look Yemenite, Ethiopian Jews look Ethiopian, Moroccan Jews look Moroccan, does bring the DNA exclusivity claim into question. Of course I do not trust any politically motivated DNA study conducted by Zionists.
@@johns22 I think you are being needlessly hyperbolic and confrontational. Where does the Dr. make the claim that only modern Jewish groups have the sole exclusive claim to a physical bloodline connection with the ancient Israelites? It would be hard for him to ever claim such a thing given that he had already made countless of videos in the past about Jewish persecution and assimilation throughout the centuries, and naturally it follows from that that many people today hold some amount of Jewish ancestry.
Second of all, there are no studies that compare modern Jewish DNA to ancient Israelite DNA. The only studies that have been conducted use proxies, meaning they use ancient Middle Eastern DNA samples from individuals not deemed to be Israelite or they use DNA samples from other Middle Eastern groups. Almost all studies that I have heard of, even those having concluded no Israelite connection, show that a significant chunk of European Jewish ancestry derives from the Middle East. The Middle Eastern source population/s from which this ancestral segment derives is under contention in some studies as I have said, but there is no disagreement about it being from the Middle East.
@@MrEVAQ
I am confused by your post. I have few clarification questions:
1- So do you believe that Palestinians carry more Levantine DNA than European Jews?
2- Do you believe that Palestinians are more likely to be related in terms of DNA to ancient Israelites (I am asking for your opinion even if there are no clear DNA studies)?
3- Say the Palestinians are proven scientifically to be significantly more related to ancient inhabitants of the land than European Jews, should this make a difference on how Zionists view the Palestinian claims and rights?
Why am I asking all these questions? Because the Zionist narrative does imply exclusive connection to the ancient Israelites and labels Palestinians as foreigners who immigrated to the area around little over one century ago with no ancient connection to the land.
@@johns22
1. It is clear from DNA testing that most Palestinians, especially those in the West Bank carry significant amounts of Levantine ancestry, if not more than your average European Jew.
2. It's hard to say, but I would not be at all surprised if many (if not the majority) of the average Palestinian's ancestors had been Jews who had assimilated into the dominant culture throughout the centuries (especially in the West Bank). Meaning, I am in fact inclined to think that most Palestinians derive a good amount of their ancestry from Jews.
3. Since you're using the word "should", then I should say no. In my approach there should be no ethnostates in the first place, so I feel no incentive to justify or annul anyone's right to remain in a country based on arbitrarily drawn borders and racial purity contests. But ultimately this is just my idealistic dream.
When you say the "Zionist narrative" what do you mean? Zionism is simply the right of Jews to create their own country in their historical homeland. What you have mentioned is maybe what some Zionist thinkers claim, but that's not what Zionism is. Zionism doesn't say anything about Palestinians, because Zionism isn't about the Palestinians, it's about the Jews.
Most importantly More and more “Jews” even in modern “state of Israel “ are now believers in Truth ie Jesus as the Lord. Thank You Lord Jesus Yeshua
Why the quotation marks?
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Thank you