Thanks for watching Team! Your time can’t be replaced, and I’m *STOKED* that you chose to spend some of it here. If you want to *STAY* *STOKED* - subscribe & click the notification bell. Make sure you leave a comment to share your thoughts, questions, or experiences so we can master our craft. You can also find me on: Website: www.Stokermatic.com Facebook: facebook.com/groups/391967792881354/?ref=share Instagram instagram.com/stokercraft/ Amazon www.amazon.com/shop/stokermatic
A retired Marine friend recently broke his old Cammenga and asked what I use, an old Silva Ranger 15T. He admitted the Silva was good, but wanted that hefty half-pound of the Cammenga and bought a new one. As you say here, it's the user, not the tool. Taught my kids basic nav as pre-teens. The son used that knowledge as a wildland firefighter and now as a Life Flight PM. The daughter teaches basic maps and nav to her fourth grade students as an introduction to global exploration. Navigation is a lifetime skill. Thanks for the reminder 👍
I was an navigator in the Navy one of the first things when I buy a compass is I check it I set the declination for the area I'm in, and check it again. Then I use it the way it's meant to be used. Glad to hear somebody tell it like it is!
Couple years back I was showing some scouts how to use the Sunnto. Someone asked “What’s the mirror for?” Before I could answer, another scout said “So you can see who is lost”
Three years ago, I replaced the Cammenga I was issued by the Marine Corps back in 1980 (+/-). It still worked, it just got too cloudy Inside. I will not go into the bush without my Cammenga. I now have two Cammengas. The luminescent and the tritium. I like the tritium, but the luminescent is my favorite. I don’t know why. Land navigation is something that I taught to my boys, and my nephew when they were 14 years old. I think it’s just as important as making fire without matches. We have one more daughter at home. Baby Bear is 16, and can already beat most people in making fire with flint and steel, Land navigation is next for her. We just haven’t had the time yet. Love your technique here, so simple and yet so important. Two degrees variation can mean the difference between getting home and getting lost.
Are cammenga lensatic compasses good for general, survival use or is there a better suited compass for non military purposes? Currently in the market for an accurate, high quality compass and am not afraid to put some money into it (up to $500 usd). Thanks
@@Ferien7 Sorry to take so long to reply. The Cammenga Lensatic compass is my favorite and they are practically indestructible. I’ve used one for all my land navigation in the Marine Corps as well as hiking in the Rocky Mountains and all over the USA.
The funny thing is I’ve been camping for years, I’ll hike in for miles and miles and even been on new trails or in random areas trail blazing and never used a compass, I’ll use a map tho, but I’m normally fallowing land marks like streams/creeks or a ridge line of a mountain
Same here. I do find an altimeter handy to see how high on the slope I am and spotting weather shifts. But mostly it's just reading the map without instruments and looking back to see what my return trail looks like.
@@slappy8941 ya I get that, but I’m pretty good at just looking at landmarks or hills and judging that off a map, I normally fallow ridge lines or streams so you can’t get lost
Im glad you looked up the new declination. Our poles are changing, so that makes a huge difference. This was a great test to see. Awesome job on the video !
When I took Civil Engineering mapping, the best advice I got from my instructor was to not totally trust a sighting that was over 100 meters away from me. That multiple sighting was needed to stay real accurate.
Great Video!!!! Cave surveying in the cascades and sierras we always shot a backsight to account for any iron lodes and to minimize errors. Average the two and that's what we called the true bearing. It'll work also when testing a compass. The Brunton, the Suunto models you show were personal favorites for shooting bearings underground. Crawled miles of muddy cave with one or the other on a lanyard around my neck, and tucked into coveralls. They both survived. Bearings, underground, are shot at an anchored light, like the Maglite Solitare.
I cut my teeth on a Cammenga, keep a Suunto Clipper on my watchband, and I have a couple of Bruntons in some different kits, but my main compass the past several years is my Suunto MC-2. It's a very functional/multi-functional piece of kit. Enjoyed the video!!
Just saw the video and wanted to thank u for that answer as I've posted the question about inherent compass error elsewhere but you're the first to answer fully.
I never used mine much, years ago. When i did, though, the best one i ever had was a little round one i picked up at a flea market. It had a brass case with a tiny rotating sight that flipped up. It was old, no name brand on it. Always lead true, though, and fit in the handle of an old survival knife i got as a reward at a skeet shooting competition. Used the heck out of the knife.
As a retired archaeologist I used the Silva Ranger compass in the early 80s up until a couple of years ago. The older ones made primarily in Sweden were great and durable. These newer ones seem to be inferior and cheaply made. As I understand it, the Silva US models are made in Indonesia.
@@Ferien7 Depends on what you want to use it for. The Cammenga Military Lensatic company is great, and good for general hiking, where you have great landmarks to go by. The only issue with them is that they have 1:50,000 meter scale base plate and are best used on 15 minute map, which are hard to come by, and are difficult to use with a USGS topo map which are 7.5 minute maps with a 1:24,000 scale. Also, it has no magnetic declination arrow house, so you have to keep that in mind, as well as some other tricks. But overall it is a great compass. If you want to do general backpacking then get an orienteering compass, like a Brunton or SUUNTO and even a Silva as all of these have multiple scale meters ranging from 1:24,000 to 1:50,000 and can be used with both 7.5 and 15 minute maps, and good ruler baseplates and magnetic declination arrows, which makes them easier to keep on course. The only downside with these compasses is that sometimes the bezel because of heat and dirt or the housing gets cracked which will create a bubble in the fluid. This bubble can throw off the reading.
@@coleparker so the lensatic and baseplate compasses can’t be used interchangeably? I say general use because I’m not sure about all of the ways I might need a compass, but orienteering for sure
@@Ferien7 Sure you can use both types interchangeably. I was just telling you the different types strengths and weaknesses. For orienteering I would go with the Baseplate maps: Suuntos and Bruntons and Silvas I mention as they are easier to use with Maps.
Good video Bill! I personally carry two full-size compasses: a Cammenga lensatic and the Suunto MC-2. I prefer using the Cammenga because of its ruggedness and that is what I used in the Rangers. The MC-2 compass has more features for survival purposes and that is why it is my primary backup.
Good brief explanation on accuracy. You are correct in saying the compass is not the problem it is the operator. I have both MC-2G and Cammenga here in Australia and both are pretty much measuring the same. The advantages of Cammenga are the reliability ( ie no bubbles) and toughness.
Is there any reason to buy the Suunto MC2 global compass over the Suunto MC2 northern hemisphere compass *other* than for traveling between the two hemispheres? Trying to learn about compasses and current options on the market
Nice to see that my Suunto MC-2G (global balance because I live in Jamaica) comes out best. Matches what I've found. By the way, if you have a good GPS (my multiband Garmin gives consistent 1.8m accuracy), you can use it to establish an accurate bearing from one point to another. Record the position for a tree you can see a good distance away from some other spot, get the position for that, and the GPS will give you the vector.
I went thru a similar process. Had Amazon send me a bunch... Only one is left, the rest returned. Turns out, we came to the same result. Thanks💌 Respect
The two most accurate compasses were mirror compasses, that give you a better sight picture. The military compass has a lens, that give you even more accuracy. That is probably why you get the error. 2 degrees doesn't matter... unless you are aiming artillery. :))
Thank you for the great comparison of the tools. I would stay that you should keep a good compass and compare others to it. I have bought a few compasses made in China that have a bad needle so stay with Silva, Suunto, and Brunton, and the high-dollar military one
I have just got onto your site and I want you to know you are a very good teacher of your craft.. I will be out tomorrow in the Australian Outback testing my Silva Mirror Compass.
Always dig the land nav Top. Yup,trust the tool. I told a golf buddy of mine that kept missing putts to the left that the ball was probably bent. He looked at me and said “ya know,I bet you’re right “. You knew I’d wonder about the lime green pencil 😂.
I trust the OD green lensatic compass with my life, really good mention about power lines/ large metallic vehicles or buildings. I think when you take your time and plot your points calmly- it’s easy, depending on the terrain. I would like to see a “stress shoot” equivalent for land nav. Maybe a little sleep deprivation/ dehydration along with fatigue: that’s when land nav would really get serious. After a firefight, I imagine that’s the time to recheck asthmuth
I used the silva Ranger in the Forest Service to plot land lines and to navigate in 1978 . I navigated out of a white out once in December. Earlier that fall I had to lead my crew boss and crew out of a huge circular meadow that we couldn't find the P line to get out. Heather the crew boss had the crew around the perimeter twice and couldn't find the exit. I said, "Do you want to keep looking, or can I use my compass? Of course she was angry with the usual comments. I pulled the map and took a bearing and pointed to where the P line had to be. We went over and found it within 2 minutes. Using a map ,plotting is everything. 😊
You are are right! It miss calculation, user error, not converting a grid to magnetic or magnetic to grid, trust your equipment, check it before going out make sure everything is operational, double check your map make sure it’s the right map, double check your readings double check your pace counts and always double check your grid coordinates and your operation orders.
Could the 2 degree variation be from the difference between using a base plate at the waist vs shooting from the cheek? The mirror & lensatic being a more accurate method of determining your azimuth.
I still use my Cammenga. Marine Corps got me hooked on them. I prefer sighting compasses. I have Suunto, K&R and an old Silva Ranger. I have many base plate compasses from when I use to teach land Nav to our Emergency Response team. Most errors I see is user error. Especially not factoring the declination or subtracting when they should of been adding or Vice a versus!
My problem is that I'm a wheelchair user. No matter which wheelchair, even titanium frame, there's enough ferromagnetic material that it deflects compass needles a lot. And a variable amount at that, as I move my compass around within the confines of my wheelchair I see the needle point in different directions. I guess being a wheelchair user i don't go quite as wild as many, but
I think a Silva is great for backpacking. I have one.But I LOVE my Commenta. They are tuff as nails. You don't have to worry about a trip or fall breaking it. I look at things this way. There is good wight and bad wight. What you get for the extra wight. If you are a day or ultra light backpacking on Trais. Go with a Silva. If you're in combat, harsh Terrain, or night time land navigation. Go with a Cammenga. Just my two cents. Great video.
If you store your compasses among a log of magnetic stuff, they can become slightly inaccurate as the needle can be partially re-magnetized off the axis of the needle. I stored a compass next to some strong bar magnets in a box of stuff to entertain the grandchildren and reversed the needle's magnetic direction! They can be re-magnetised.
My Suunto mirror compass had a 5° deviation when I bought it. So I sent it back . I remember the Navy has to spin a ship to determine deviation before setting declination. I think it's the same thing with airplanes. I have about 10 compasses so I just put them down one after the other on a non-magnetic surface and see if they all point exactly the same and only one compass had a 5° deviation.
You have the map to correct your course along the way. Do you really go from a starting point to a stopping point 10 miles away, and you never look at the map along the way? In a desert it can be a good method
My local SAR group purchases several hundred mirrored compasses a year and over the years we've used Silva, Suunto, and Brunton. Each manufacturer has had some significant issues with individual batches we had to work through. Agree that most folks will ever notice the inaccuracy. During training we expect pairs to navigate point to point +/- 2 degrees so it's obvious when someone has a bad compass.
Point well made. The biggest navigational errors are in the navigator not the compass. If the compass is spot on but you don't use it properly you'll travel off course by way more than the degree or two that your compass is off by, but I will always want my 3h and MC-2 over cheaper compasses.
Declination on maps and online are good up to a point. We see curved magnetic declination lines however in reality they contour ferrous metals in the earth. The best method (without a landmark) is to record a stick shadow at solar noon (true north) and then note declination. Not all compasses are equal, quality matters. A compass is a great navigation aid. Properly used you can plot latitude and longitude (in conjunction with a precision watch and static solar tables)
I wanted to make this comment, because I answered a question about Magnetic vs True north to a commentator from San Diego. I gave him some confusing advice. To that commentator if he is on this page. First in California, True north is west of magnetic north, thus you subtract the 11 degrees declination the reading to get your True north bearing and add to get your magnetic bearing.
Is it true that the compass North showes in real to the south of the earth pole? 🤔 and if you put a compass in front of a magnet pole it attracts the opposite magnetic pole 🤔 im getting much confused, becourse I'm tieing to find out what magnetic pole my magnet have and I don't have marked magnets. 🤔
Another good video. I’ve always heard,”A poor workman blames his tools.” I use both type compasses but prefer a lensatic compass for its durability. That said all my baseplate compasses have a mirror on the cover. To be honest I find the mirror is most useful as a signaling device and protector for the compass body but they seem like a lighter version of the lensatic compass to me. Does that mean I’ve only really used one type of compass?
This video made me laugh, but only because of the remarks about long, straight sections of road running perfectly north-south. In the mountainous and wooded area where I live there is NOTHING perfectly straight and aligned to north. I would have to drive over 50 miles to the flat southernmost end of the county to find a road fitting that description. The nearest north-south gridded location is actually about 30 miles away, in Canada. Aside from that point, good video. Our county SAR team standardized on a Suunto mirror compass, which has worked great for us. It is absolutely accurate enough for any of our navigational needs and has not let anyone down.
Appreciate your service to the community brother! You do have me curious what county you live in. On a serious note, dead reckoning with error in mountainous terrain allows for much greater error assuming one has a map and can read it.
@@STOKERMATIC Thanks! SAR is the most satisfying volunteer work I have ever done. Over ten years with the team, and going strong. I'm in Ferry County, in beautiful NE WA. It's mostly mountains, national forest, and Colville Reservation, with minimal people. Just the way I like it!
Suunto mc2 global needle. I think it is a Silva expedition out of Canada , not Silva USA. But if it was Silva USA . It's the explorer. Where Silva is sourced , dictates if it was sweedish or some Asian country it was manufactured
Yhea I go out hiking on the missile range from time to time and I never need a compass our a freaking map, I just follow the explosions to the safest place and. Pray that I never get lost.
Hey Bill....you know what I just learned? A compass needle can get jacked up and reverse polarity. I pulled out a Brunton and Silva stored together in a junk drawer and they were pointing south. I'm like, "wth?! Did we just have some massive global event I wasn't aware of??" Then I got to thinking, maybe these need to be remagnetized. I took a neodymium magnetic from an old hard drive and placed it on the silva...moved it around a bit and walla...back to pointing north!! Searched the internet to confirm and it turns out this is how it's done. Here's your next video, brother!
Oh man! Glad you got it figured out. Hasn’t ever happened to me, but I think at first it would freak me out too, especially with as fast as the poles are moving lately.
cool video, I am researching a new compass since I lost my old one was hoping to see the brand Im looking for here I used to live in Tacoma/midland area, graduated from Franklin Pierce in 1984 miss the PNW
I had to watch a second time to remember which compass was spot on. You forgot to declare the winner. Video shows me why the Suunto is so popular. And Second it shows why US Military has used the Lensatic compass for years. From the way I understand it the Two work a little different. The Suunto may be the easiest for civilians to learn ?
I've never seen a bad compass. You need to understand land navigation. The simplest compass will do the same things that the most expensive compass will do.
I have a 40 year old Silva that I bought for a buck at a flea market 20 years ago and a Silva Explorer that I bought last year. I do most of my hiking in the Rocky Mountains and I mostly navigate by terrain association.
@@STOKERMATIC I mostly navigate by Terrain Association because I'm mostly hiking in Heavenly forested areas and I'm mostly hiking in areas that I'm familiar with. But, I do occasionally go outside the Manuver Box and that's where knowing how to do a resection and plot my position on the map so I CAN orient myself to the terrain comes in.
When the world turn to sh*t(hopefully not) I'm glad you showed me what to get. I see alot of people bought those cheapass kit where the compass is like in a bracelet or those with metal around it, so they not lasting long. Survival of the fittest i guess
Thanks for watching Team! Your time can’t be replaced, and I’m *STOKED* that you chose to spend some of it here.
If you want to *STAY* *STOKED* - subscribe & click the notification bell. Make sure you leave a comment to share your thoughts, questions, or experiences so we can master our craft.
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A retired Marine friend recently broke his old Cammenga and asked what I use, an old Silva Ranger 15T. He admitted the Silva was good, but wanted that hefty half-pound of the Cammenga and bought a new one. As you say here, it's the user, not the tool.
Taught my kids basic nav as pre-teens. The son used that knowledge as a wildland firefighter and now as a Life Flight PM. The daughter teaches basic maps and nav to her fourth grade students as an introduction to global exploration. Navigation is a lifetime skill. Thanks for the reminder 👍
That’s awesome you teach your kids that!
I was an navigator in the Navy one of the first things when I buy a compass is I check it I set the declination for the area I'm in, and check it again. Then I use it the way it's meant to be used. Glad to hear somebody tell it like it is!
Couple years back I was showing some scouts how to use the Sunnto. Someone asked “What’s the mirror for?” Before I could answer, another scout said “So you can see who is lost”
😅
🤣🤣
Hey I have the same profile pic! Spaceman Spiff for the win!
Doubted my compass one time . Let distant highway noise cloud my judgment. The compass doesn’t lie . Good video. Have a great evening
Three years ago, I replaced the Cammenga I was issued by the Marine Corps back in 1980 (+/-). It still worked, it just got too cloudy Inside.
I will not go into the bush without my Cammenga. I now have two Cammengas. The luminescent and the tritium. I like the tritium, but the luminescent is my favorite. I don’t know why.
Land navigation is something that I taught to my boys, and my nephew when they were 14 years old. I think it’s just as important as making fire without matches.
We have one more daughter at home. Baby Bear is 16, and can already beat most people in making fire with flint and steel, Land navigation is next for her. We just haven’t had the time yet.
Love your technique here, so simple and yet so important. Two degrees variation can mean the difference between getting home and getting lost.
Good stuff brother!
Are cammenga lensatic compasses good for general, survival use or is there a better suited compass for non military purposes? Currently in the market for an accurate, high quality compass and am not afraid to put some money into it (up to $500 usd). Thanks
Commenga was founded in 1992
@@JamesCZFEA
My mistake. You are correct.
My original was an M1950 and I believe it was a Stocker and Yale (I’ll have to dig it out to be sure).
@@Ferien7
Sorry to take so long to reply.
The Cammenga Lensatic compass is my favorite and they are practically indestructible.
I’ve used one for all my land navigation in the Marine Corps as well as hiking in the Rocky Mountains and all over the USA.
The funny thing is I’ve been camping for years, I’ll hike in for miles and miles and even been on new trails or in random areas trail blazing and never used a compass, I’ll use a map tho, but I’m normally fallowing land marks like streams/creeks or a ridge line of a mountain
Same here. I do find an altimeter handy to see how high on the slope I am and spotting weather shifts. But mostly it's just reading the map without instruments and looking back to see what my return trail looks like.
@@mervmartin2112 that would be cool to have a mete, and ya I do the same just look at the surroundings
@@mervmartin2112 that would be cool to have a mete, and ya I do the same just look at the surroundings
A compass allows you to use landmarks to find your exact position when waypoints aren't available.
@@slappy8941 ya I get that, but I’m pretty good at just looking at landmarks or hills and judging that off a map, I normally fallow ridge lines or streams so you can’t get lost
Im glad you looked up the new declination. Our poles are changing, so that makes a huge difference. This was a great test to see. Awesome job on the video !
How often do the poles change? Does declination for a given area change during a year’s time? Just getting into compasses and trying to learn. Thanks
Same, never heard this before
When I took Civil Engineering mapping, the best advice I got from my instructor was to not totally trust a sighting that was over 100 meters away from me. That multiple sighting was needed to stay real accurate.
Thanks for sharing this. I always take to heart advice from people with tons of experience , and a Civil Engineer Definitely falls into that category
Great Video!!!! Cave surveying in the cascades and sierras we always shot a backsight to account for any iron lodes and to minimize errors. Average the two and that's what we called the true bearing. It'll work also when testing a compass. The Brunton, the Suunto models you show were personal favorites for shooting bearings underground. Crawled miles of muddy cave with one or the other on a lanyard around my neck, and tucked into coveralls. They both survived. Bearings, underground, are shot at an anchored light, like the Maglite Solitare.
Appreciate you sharing your experience!
I cut my teeth on a Cammenga, keep a Suunto Clipper on my watchband, and I have a couple of Bruntons in some different kits, but my main compass the past several years is my Suunto MC-2. It's a very functional/multi-functional piece of kit. Enjoyed the video!!
Right on!
Just saw the video and wanted to thank u for that answer as I've posted the question about inherent compass error elsewhere but you're the first to answer fully.
I never used mine much, years ago. When i did, though, the best one i ever had was a little round one i picked up at a flea market. It had a brass case with a tiny rotating sight that flipped up. It was old, no name brand on it. Always lead true, though, and fit in the handle of an old survival knife i got as a reward at a skeet shooting competition. Used the heck out of the knife.
Very good thanks for the information 😊
As a retired archaeologist I used the Silva Ranger compass in the early 80s up until a couple of years ago. The older ones made primarily in Sweden were great and durable. These newer ones seem to be inferior and cheaply made. As I understand it, the Silva US models are made in Indonesia.
So what do you recommend now for general and survival use? Looking for a good, high quality compass
@@Ferien7 Depends on what you want to use it for. The Cammenga Military Lensatic company is great, and good for general hiking, where you have great landmarks to go by. The only issue with them is that they have 1:50,000 meter scale base plate and are best used on 15 minute map, which are hard to come by, and are difficult to use with a USGS topo map which are 7.5 minute maps with a 1:24,000 scale. Also, it has no magnetic declination arrow house, so you have to keep that in mind, as well as some other tricks. But overall it is a great compass.
If you want to do general backpacking then get an orienteering compass, like a Brunton or SUUNTO and even a Silva as all of these have multiple scale meters ranging from 1:24,000 to 1:50,000 and can be used with both 7.5 and 15 minute maps, and good ruler baseplates and magnetic declination arrows, which makes them easier to keep on course. The only downside with these compasses is that sometimes the bezel because of heat and dirt or the housing gets cracked which will create a bubble in the fluid. This bubble can throw off the reading.
@@coleparker so the lensatic and baseplate compasses can’t be used interchangeably? I say general use because I’m not sure about all of the ways I might need a compass, but orienteering for sure
@@Ferien7 Sure you can use both types interchangeably. I was just telling you the different types strengths and weaknesses. For orienteering I would go with the Baseplate maps: Suuntos and Bruntons and Silvas I mention as they are easier to use with Maps.
Good video Bill!
I personally carry two full-size compasses: a Cammenga lensatic and the Suunto MC-2.
I prefer using the Cammenga because of its ruggedness and that is what I used in the Rangers.
The MC-2 compass has more features for survival purposes and that is why it is my primary backup.
I dig it!
Good brief explanation on accuracy.
You are correct in saying the compass is not the problem it is the operator.
I have both MC-2G and Cammenga here in Australia and both are pretty much measuring the same.
The advantages of Cammenga are the reliability ( ie no bubbles) and toughness.
Right on!
Is there any reason to buy the Suunto MC2 global compass over the Suunto MC2 northern hemisphere compass *other* than for traveling between the two hemispheres? Trying to learn about compasses and current options on the market
@@Ferien7 No reason at all. Stick the the northern hemisphere balanced.
Nice to see that my Suunto MC-2G (global balance because I live in Jamaica) comes out best. Matches what I've found. By the way, if you have a good GPS (my multiband Garmin gives consistent 1.8m accuracy), you can use it to establish an accurate bearing from one point to another. Record the position for a tree you can see a good distance away from some other spot, get the position for that, and the GPS will give you the vector.
I went thru a similar process. Had Amazon send me a bunch... Only one is left, the rest returned. Turns out, we came to the same result. Thanks💌 Respect
Rock on (though I have and use all of these)
Hey Top always enjoy your vids! You get me thinking. Thanks!
The two most accurate compasses were mirror compasses, that give you a better sight picture. The military compass has a lens, that give you even more accuracy. That is probably why you get the error.
2 degrees doesn't matter... unless you are aiming artillery. :))
Thank you for the great comparison of the tools. I would stay that you should keep a good compass and compare others to it. I have bought a few compasses made in China that have a bad needle so stay with Silva, Suunto, and Brunton, and the high-dollar military one
Good video, thanks for sharing , God bless !
🙏
Best military channel foreal! My wife is a special operator like me we a team..she loves riggs!
Thank you
awesome man!
I have just got onto your site and I want you to know you are a very good teacher of your craft.. I will be out tomorrow in the Australian Outback testing my Silva Mirror Compass.
Where do you get your maps and are they 1:50? I would love to get the same map size we used when I was in. Thanks!
Awsome video very informative
Thanks amigo!!
i was field artillery. i still have my brunton among other ones. love he silvas
Great job sir!!
🥃
As always good info and well explained!
Good video. Good advice on Trust U'r Compass.
Thank you for the upload. Very eye-opening.
Great short explanation on declination.👍 Always trust the tools unless you know it's faulty. I always need to reset my button compass 😂
Always dig the land nav Top. Yup,trust the tool. I told a golf buddy of mine that kept missing putts to the left that the ball was probably bent. He looked at me and said “ya know,I bet you’re right “. You knew I’d wonder about the lime green pencil 😂.
😂 🤣😂
Thank you.
Excellent!...as always.
👊
Like motorcycle racing, the "problem" usually occurs between the seat and the handlebars! LOL!! Great video!
I trust the OD green lensatic compass with my life, really good mention about power lines/ large metallic vehicles or buildings. I think when you take your time and plot your points calmly- it’s easy, depending on the terrain.
I would like to see a “stress shoot” equivalent for land nav. Maybe a little sleep deprivation/ dehydration along with fatigue: that’s when land nav would really get serious.
After a firefight, I imagine that’s the time to recheck asthmuth
I used the silva Ranger in the Forest Service to plot land lines and to navigate in 1978 . I navigated out of a white out once in December. Earlier that fall I had to lead my crew boss and crew out of a huge circular meadow that we couldn't find the P line to get out. Heather the crew boss had the crew around the perimeter twice and couldn't find the exit. I said, "Do you want to keep looking, or can I use my compass? Of course she was angry with the usual comments. I pulled the map and took a bearing and pointed to where the P line had to be. We went over and found it within 2 minutes. Using a map ,plotting is everything. 😊
You are are right! It miss calculation, user error, not converting a grid to magnetic or magnetic to grid, trust your equipment, check it before going out make sure everything is operational, double check your map make sure it’s the right map, double check your readings double check your pace counts and always double check your grid coordinates and your operation orders.
☝️☝️
Great video and well explained with the errors compass have.
Could the 2 degree variation be from the difference between using a base plate at the waist vs shooting from the cheek? The mirror & lensatic being a more accurate method of determining your azimuth.
Possibly - but 2 degrees won’t get you lost in my experience.
Does it matter that the poles have shifted though.
I still use my Cammenga. Marine Corps got me hooked on them. I prefer sighting compasses. I have Suunto, K&R and an old Silva Ranger. I have many base plate compasses from when I use to teach land Nav to our Emergency Response team. Most errors I see is user error. Especially not factoring the declination or subtracting when they should of been adding or Vice a versus!
Awesome stuff!!
My problem is that I'm a wheelchair user.
No matter which wheelchair, even titanium frame, there's enough ferromagnetic material that it deflects compass needles a lot. And a variable amount at that, as I move my compass around within the confines of my wheelchair I see the needle point in different directions.
I guess being a wheelchair user i don't go quite as wild as many, but
I think a Silva is great for backpacking. I have one.But I LOVE my Commenta. They are tuff as nails. You don't have to worry about a trip or fall breaking it. I look at things this way. There is good wight and bad wight. What you get for the extra wight. If you are a day or ultra light backpacking on Trais. Go with a Silva. If you're in combat, harsh Terrain, or night time land navigation. Go with a Cammenga. Just my two cents. Great video.
Couldn’t agree more!
New to this, already excited to learn more!👍
Your going to make us all land nav experts TOP good shit!
👊
Don't forget that the pole has moved significantly, so we need to get a true north before considering a bearing.
Love these vids so much, learning a shit ton
If you store your compasses among a log of magnetic stuff, they can become slightly inaccurate as the needle can be partially re-magnetized off the axis of the needle. I stored a compass next to some strong bar magnets in a box of stuff to entertain the grandchildren and reversed the needle's magnetic direction! They can be re-magnetised.
My Suunto mirror compass had a 5° deviation when I bought it. So I sent it back . I remember the Navy has to spin a ship to determine deviation before setting declination. I think it's the same thing with airplanes. I have about 10 compasses so I just put them down one after the other on a non-magnetic surface and see if they all point exactly the same and only one compass had a 5° deviation.
Two degrees difference over ten miles is approximately 1,844 feet. That’s almost a half a mile.
You have the map to correct your course along the way. Do you really go from a starting point to a stopping point 10 miles away, and you never look at the map along the way? In a desert it can be a good method
I think plaid is the official off-duty garb of Army peeps. Blue, especially.
🤣😂
My local SAR group purchases several hundred mirrored compasses a year and over the years we've used Silva, Suunto, and Brunton. Each manufacturer has had some significant issues with individual batches we had to work through. Agree that most folks will ever notice the inaccuracy. During training we expect pairs to navigate point to point +/- 2 degrees so it's obvious when someone has a bad compass.
Appreciate your service to your community Joe! What you and your Team does matters!
Point well made. The biggest navigational errors are in the navigator not the compass. If the compass is spot on but you don't use it properly you'll travel off course by way more than the degree or two that your compass is off by, but I will always want my 3h and MC-2 over cheaper compasses.
Declination on maps and online are good up to a point. We see curved magnetic declination lines however in reality they contour ferrous metals in the earth. The best method (without a landmark) is to record a stick shadow at solar noon (true north) and then note declination. Not all compasses are equal, quality matters.
A compass is a great navigation aid. Properly used you can plot latitude and longitude (in conjunction with a precision watch and static solar tables)
I've been using the same Silva Ranger compass that I bought way back in 1993.
Use the string on your compass. Longer lighting line = smaller mistakes
How about borrowing a "M2 Shaving Mirror w/compass" and tell the folks about converting mils to degrees?
If you subtract 2 degrees from the compasses that reported 17 degrees, then they would be just as accurate?
Good video. God bless. From Glenn CATT in Massachusetts . I don't want my compass off .
I wanted to make this comment, because I answered a question about Magnetic vs True north to a commentator from San Diego. I gave him some confusing advice. To that commentator if he is on this page. First in California, True north is west of magnetic north, thus you subtract the 11 degrees declination the reading to get your True north bearing and add to get your magnetic bearing.
Hello, teacher, I have a question to ask.If the magnetic declination diagram is displayed within one degree.Need to add or subtract？
If the magnetic pole is to your EAST:
From Grid to Mag -
From Mag to Grid +
If the magnetic pole is to you WEST
From Grid to Mag +
From Mag to Grid -
Boat compasses are fun to calibrate ,not available on handhelds!
I bet!
Is it true that the compass North showes in real to the south of the earth pole? 🤔
and if you put a compass in front of a magnet pole it attracts the opposite magnetic pole 🤔 im getting much confused, becourse I'm tieing to find out what magnetic pole my magnet have and I don't have marked magnets. 🤔
The north pole is negative. The southern pole is positive.
German Shepherds are the best...
"Nothing magnetic on my person" metal button clips all over his shirt
Not all metal is magnetic. I'm not sure what his buttons are made from.
Another good video. I’ve always heard,”A poor workman blames his tools.” I use both type compasses but prefer a lensatic compass for its durability. That said all my baseplate compasses have a mirror on the cover. To be honest I find the mirror is most useful as a signaling device and protector for the compass body but they seem like a lighter version of the lensatic compass to me. Does that mean I’ve only really used one type of compass?
Bought a UST folding map compass and it fell apart in a bag so I bought a good compass
This video made me laugh, but only because of the remarks about long, straight sections of road running perfectly north-south. In the mountainous and wooded area where I live there is NOTHING perfectly straight and aligned to north. I would have to drive over 50 miles to the flat southernmost end of the county to find a road fitting that description. The nearest north-south gridded location is actually about 30 miles away, in Canada.
Aside from that point, good video. Our county SAR team standardized on a Suunto mirror compass, which has worked great for us. It is absolutely accurate enough for any of our navigational needs and has not let anyone down.
Appreciate your service to the community brother! You do have me curious what county you live in. On a serious note, dead reckoning with error in mountainous terrain allows for much greater error assuming one has a map and can read it.
@@STOKERMATIC Thanks! SAR is the most satisfying volunteer work I have ever done. Over ten years with the team, and going strong.
I'm in Ferry County, in beautiful NE WA. It's mostly mountains, national forest, and Colville Reservation, with minimal people. Just the way I like it!
Suunto and Silva compasses have a stated accuracy of 2.5° for their hemisphere-dependent needles and 2° for their global needles, iirc.
What model Silva and Suunto are you using for the test?
Suunto mc2 global needle.
I think it is a Silva expedition out of Canada , not Silva USA. But if it was Silva USA . It's the explorer.
Where Silva is sourced , dictates if it was sweedish or some Asian country it was manufactured
Sand Sox right on Suunto, the Silva is the explorer.
Great advice. A wicked expensive compass won't make up for poor fundamentals.
All too true!
Yhea I go out hiking on the missile range from time to time and I never need a compass our a freaking map, I just follow the explosions to the safest place and. Pray that I never get lost.
Well artillery must shoot on target. These 2 degrees are critical
Hey Bill....you know what I just learned? A compass needle can get jacked up and reverse polarity.
I pulled out a Brunton and Silva stored together in a junk drawer and they were pointing south. I'm like, "wth?! Did we just have some massive global event I wasn't aware of??" Then I got to thinking, maybe these need to be remagnetized. I took a neodymium magnetic from an old hard drive and placed it on the silva...moved it around a bit and walla...back to pointing north!! Searched the internet to confirm and it turns out this is how it's done.
Here's your next video, brother!
Oh man! Glad you got it figured out. Hasn’t ever happened to me, but I think at first it would freak me out too, especially with as fast as the poles are moving lately.
@@STOKERMATIC 🤣 shoot! I thought for sure you'd have with all your experience. Really easy to replicate so check it out. It's kind of a trip!
So, which compass shouldn't I buy? 😮💨
The one that don't come with a fake Rambo knife 😆😁
Looking forward to next time! Drag me along…
Still don't know which one I should not buy.
The compass is "Holdin' me back"
Cammenga takes the win!
I’ve used a Cammenga since 1980 when the Marine Corps gave me my first one. Always reliable, and tough as nails.
👍🏼👍🏼
I think this would be even more interesting if you repeated it in reference to the north star!
Are you aware that they changed the runway numbers after 2006? Runways are magnetic headings. Just FYI...
I'll stick with my ARMY COMPASS, never heard of those other ones.
If your compass is 2 degrees out it will through you out by that amount.
This is great test to see the impact:
ua-cam.com/video/-XsRYOUUVEc/v-deo.html
A compass is only as good as the user.
Nice 👍🖖
Title: "Don't buy THIS compass"
Video: Does not say which compass should not he purchased.
cool video, I am researching a new compass since I lost my old one
was hoping to see the brand Im looking for here
I used to live in Tacoma/midland area, graduated from Franklin Pierce in 1984
miss the PNW
I had to watch a second time to remember which compass was spot on. You forgot to declare the winner. Video shows me why the Suunto is so popular. And Second it shows why US Military has used the Lensatic compass for years. From the way I understand it the Two work a little different. The Suunto may be the easiest for civilians to learn ?
Any of them is a fine choice, and most civilians prefer a baseplate, but the ‘how’ they work is the same with minor differences based on the model.
A compass will not work correctly around anything made of metal of any sort.
I've never seen a bad compass. You need to understand land navigation. The simplest compass will do the same things that the most expensive compass will do.
You have a kind of compass of cap. Jack Sparrow?
I have a 40 year old Silva that I bought for a buck at a flea market 20 years ago and a Silva Explorer that I bought last year.
I do most of my hiking in the Rocky Mountains and I mostly navigate by terrain association.
Right on!
@@STOKERMATIC I mostly navigate by Terrain Association because I'm mostly hiking in Heavenly forested areas and I'm mostly hiking in areas that I'm familiar with.
But, I do occasionally go outside the Manuver Box and that's where knowing how to do a resection and plot my position on the map so I CAN orient myself to the terrain comes in.
When the world turn to sh*t(hopefully not) I'm glad you showed me what to get.
I see alot of people bought those cheapass kit where the compass is like in a bracelet or those with metal around it, so they not lasting long. Survival of the fittest i guess
Would feel better if you weren’t wearing that watch, while doing the testing.
Looked plastic to me, but good point..... don't need anything ferrous nearby.
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