Unfortunately, there are huge numbers of people who know little & think he's a genius, spouting wisdom with every word he says. The fact that he's rich generates admiration in many that emotionally flavors their interpretation of anything he says in a positive way. "Stop using big words with me, man!" I'll just believe what my cult leader says.
His point about the compromises made in the F35 design to suit different requirements is widely known and often stated, including on this podcast, so not sure your snark is justified.
As a software engineer, I find the F-35 fascinating-it’s called the “hive mind” for a reason. You also have to consider that cyber and electronic warfare are significant factors.
I spoke to a Tesla engineer back in the day and he confirmed that Elon is not a genius and dosen't even understand code. He basically just hired a bunch of really smart engineers to do his bidding.
I will never forget watching The Colbert Report on Comedy Central in 2006 when Biz Stone was a guest explaining what Twitter was. I could not understand it, and could only guess it would regress people into childishness.
@@annehechesliverdonation9624 Yeah, I still remember the days when we didn't instantly know every dumb thing celebrities, politicians, and businessmen were thinking. They needed to actually sit down and have an interview or talk to a reporter. Now they just type and send and we're all the worse for it.
@@jimm.6542 yep, but he used it to buy a president and now we'll regret that for years to come. It's sickening how many people are just fine with corruption of the highest order because it makes them feel important and right.
Yeah, but the thing with top gun Maverick is that the entire mission could have been flown by drones without risking any pilot lives. The F-18 was not necessary for this mission, the F35 could have flown this mission….. which is basically a tailor made B2 strike
@@Matt-yg8ubMaybe but the guys are right in this video except that there is no intelligence in A.I. True A.I.s may never happen and are perhaps 100 years away at best. Those drone performances were amost certainly orchestrated. Remote control brings the danger of jamming. Elon is the master of snake oil. His robots in his show in wb studios were puppeted and orchestrated and he isn't the founder of Tesla. Ebberhard had a t0 car with li-ion and regenerative braking before Elon bought in with 6.5 million. Hondas robots were far more capable many years ago.
@@Matt-yg8ub The F-35 is ruled out because of "GPS jammers" in the initial briefing as an excuse not to use it for the film. IIRC, Superhornet pilots run-or used to-run an exercise literally called the "Death Star Trench Run" which is exactly the mission portrayed in the movie. I totally agree with a B2 being the right tool for the mission tho. But where's the fun on that?
@ dangerous to who though? I would imagine that most fighter pilots probably dislike Elon for the simple fact that he’s attacking their rice bowl, the idea that we need to maintain manned fighters into perpetuity.
Saying fighter jets or planes are obsolete because of drones is like saying trucks or trains are obsolete because of cars, or jackhammers are obsolete because of hammers. They are completely different tools. Why is this so hard for Elon to understand.
Not sure if this is best analogy. To me, drones vs F35 sound more like aircraft carriers vs battle ships. But who knows. Future wars will give the answer.
I think everyone gets that, but do you spend an ungodly fortune on crewed craft or drones in 2025? Smart money says spend more on drone development....
My concern about Elon-chan is that he may not be able to accept that not all his ideas are great; during the Tham Luang cave rescue, Elon came forward with a proposal for a child-sized subs to get them out rather than what was planned at the time by an international group of cave divers, some of whom were local expats who knew the area better than Elon does. When his plan was rejected in favor of the original extraction plan, Elon went on an ad hominem attack against the cave divers, calling them pedophiles and stuff. This doesn’t struck me as a proper behavior of someone that can be trusted to listen to experts who knew their job better than Elon knew of their jobs, let alone management of a government agency supposedly focused on “efficiency”.
Ryan McBeth is actually intelligent and Elon is just full of it. Elon is neither smart nor a genius. He is good at listening to other people’s ideas and using them as his own then making silly comments. As a retired engineer, who worked on the F-35, my opinion is much different. There will be drone wingmen but there will continue to be manned aircraft.
According to Ryan McBeth everyone other than him is wrong. Its his ability to speak and/or answer questions with an endless flow of truth and bullshit confidently that makes him appear more knowledgeable then he really is, even to himself.
@@tmack2506 No there won't. At some stage in the next 50 years, all aircraft will be unmanned. It will get to the point where the monkey in the plane doesn't add any value. Look at space travel, humans are basically only passengers, no need for actual astronauts. It's no ones fault, it's just progress.
35 maintainer here. Im not chronically on twitter to have a debate with him but it goes without saying some platforms are purpose built and drones are just not there in the fighter sense to compliment and or phase out the current inventory of fixed wing fast movers. Moreover i hate the master of none talk which is constantly being proven as baseless and just not true; man i sure do think this 9.2G+ platform that has the engine output to pull off the runway and hit an immediate vertical climb with no burner is outdated and not a good investment
His whole point is that AI should be at a point where it can replace pilots which makes sense. The only reason it isn’t is because it hasn’t been funded and prioritised enough.
@ and the retort of Mover was that its not practical bc you need a human being with critical thought behind the stick… which I wholeheartedly agree with
I read that the US military currently has a fair portion of f-35s not in working order (like 30-40%) such that they need more maintenance or whatever it is that I don't know about. while the target that we would wish to have is that only 20-25% of planes are "out of order" given (I've heard) the f-35 is hard to maintain I'm not sure this is an easy issue to fix but I'm assuming the
@kavinbala8885 1) half true depending on how you look at it 2) the only thing needed at any given time that hinders mission capability is parts and support equipment, not the ability to perform maintenance or how intermittent the maintenance is 3) the target is propositions made by bean counters and exaggerated and used as munitions against the aircraft by MSM 4) its not hard to maintain
Regarding the conversation from around 17:00, look at what happened with the kids that got stuck in the cave in Thailand and how Elon 'the genius' Musk treated the actual experts in cave diving...
@@liquidsnakex Maybe you should go fix wiki then. He's an experienced caver with knowledge about that specific cave, he's listed as an experienced diver, and the two often go hand in hand at least to some level. Ok, for the sake of argument he had no experience and was just a front spokesperson, maybe it's possible he took advice from the thousands of other *actual* dive experts at the scene calling MuZk's idea plain nuts? Remember Hyperloop? Not exactly a guy with feet on the ground.
As someone who has no war fighting experience and no experience designing fighter jets and combat drones, I'm not going to listen to someone who doesn't have any experience in those matters either.
Elon is a military defense contractor and he designs spacecraft.... and he knows how to balance a checkbook. But hey... go look up what the Navy said about the Zumwalt's to get them and now they want the next shiny thing.
After listening to his description of Hyperloop, I have no respect for his technical prowess or knowledge. "It's literally no more complicated than your air-hockey table, I promise. It's not that hard." This guy has left a trail of failed transportation projects behind that no minion dares talk about.
I'm just hoping he doesn't affect F35 output from Lockheed Martin or Government spending on the platform. The more misunderstood this aircraft is to those outside the platform, the better. Honestly, I'm happy people not in the know call it "Fat Amy", "ugly" , "can't dogfight"... just buy into it. But leave production alone - you've no clue just how capable this jet is.
You do know Lockheed stopped making that because they were working on the new F-16 they're only going to have parts for a few more years that's why they're literally almost 30% of the f-35s we have from the last 10 to 15 years are currently not airworthy
@@keepthinking2666 - I was personally at the Lockheed production factory in Fort Worth a short time ago, and I can promise you........F35's were still in full assembly all along the mile long line. Obviously, I don't have inside info as to the status moving forward, but there were too many to count at various stages of production. I guess it's possible they are going to ally nations.
He tries to not debate with those knowledgable on subjects quite deliberately to sound rather more smart than he actually is, he much prefers yes men and those willing but noticeably without the specific skills to test him. He is most smart indeed at finding and using people who really are smart in what they do while happily taking the credit for it. It’s a skill but not one that we should accept unchallenged, but sadly his power and cult like status make confronting him a difficult sometimes dangerous occupation.
@@stuartwillardscreenworx4035 he isn't smart at finding people who are actually good at their jobs else the cybertruck bumpers would not have fallen off and spacex would not be finally reaching nasa capabilities from the 1950s nor would he have lost any rockets at all i mean engine tech and design has been around for 100+ years his ship losses is the same as designing a bog standard diesel engine that fails under zero load. these are not things that should happen if he has the best people under him.
@@Facelessify1 he is smart enough to know how to bilk investors and tax payers but no hes pretty low IQ compared to other self proclaimed genious', even moreso comapred to normal people. about on par with the maga crowd
17:15 you are giving musk far too much credit. When he was disappointed by his tweets not getting as much attention as they used to and he asked a team of programmers at twitter, one of them said "maybe it's because you aren't as popular as you used to be." Musk fired that guy on the spot. He only surrounds himself with yes men these days.
I think he's never surrounded himself with anything but sycophants, unless they're actual expert engineers who do all the heavy lifting, like those at Space X. He's not doing that nor is he actually running Tesla.
Yes but no loiter capability or range or multi-role, and very limited sensors. A SAM can't be sent out to patrol an area and then come back and land. It has one goal: kill the thing that it's radar is locked on.
Nope. SAM's are "retarded" (I mean that in the literal sense). Drones with micro-munitions fielded in the thousands and cost as much as 1 sam are the new meta. Whats more. AI controlled drones will ALWAYS win. The first Guys to Remove that Guy in the killchain will be the winner. Its not just Air that will be in grave danger. Army and Navy drones built with Autonomy in mind will wreck...Emotions are not a factor. Ask the AI if you don't believe me! {Wink}
@@creigiihtondenynis39 There is a reason they don't fly those anymore. It's because the "high and fast" approach will not beat modern missiles and could not do so even back then. Flights generally skirted the edges of Soviet territory rather than overflying it precisely because of the risk of more modern SAMs being able to hit it.
The moment someone starts off complaining that a fighter does too many things, is the moment that I know the person has no idea what they're talking about.
Місяць тому+8
When Elmo comes up with a drone capable of supersonic speed, with the ability to deliver several tons of bombs so that it is undetected by enemy air defenses, and then the drone can even return to base and deliver all of that in the next 10 years, I'll give him a thumbs up. Elmo's fantasies very often collide with reality. Like the Cybertruck. He's been talking about a pickup truck since 2012, and introduced it in 2019, saying it would be bulletproof, shatterproof glass, no wipers or rear view mirrors, and that it would supposedly be able to swim. In late 2023 he finally started delivering it to customers and either nothing of what he promised has remained or he's delivered about halfway and it still has half the promised range. So when he delivers a swarm of combat drones that could replace the F-35 and its pilot, I'll admit he's done it. Until then, he'd better read the short story Superiority by Arthur C. Clark (it used to be required reading at MIT at some point).
when you can buy 10000 high performance drones for the cost of 1 F-35, you have to think hard about it. I don't have an opinion. It would be best to ask Ukrainian soldiers -they are the experts now. Pentagon is just a bunch of armchair strategists.
Haven’t they done the same with the F-15 and F-16 also? Also remember Israel is still not telling us how many F-35 were destroyed in that missile attack.
Elon is right though. The f35 is the most ridiculous expensive program of all time. It’s unbelievably expensive to the definition. Compare it to what Elon has achieved with his rockets. I’m sorry but more engineering went into his rocketry than the f35 project.
@@RedTeufel So he bought a company and uses NASA developed technology, then lets his engineers tweak it. OK. NASA could do the same, but they aren't allowed to use crashes as part of their development strategy.
A person being an expert manager, a visionary, or whatever you want to credit Elon with does NOT make him an expert in EVERY field. A genius should be smart enough to know that they are not a genius in every single thing they want to open their fat mouth about.
A good friend of mine works at ESA as a propulsion engineer, and the stories she tells, that she hears from SpaceX colleagues is astounding. Several employees theres main job is to keep Elon away from the actual engineers. They do not want a Cybertruck or Hyperloop situation 😂
Lol keep crying woke gay boy. Elon is the head engineer and designer at nearly all his companies. Actual engineers who work for his companies have confirmed this.
Well that's terrific, what happens if you get in a heavy EW environment and you lose the SATCOM your drone fleet becomes an easy target. No doubt there may well be a time the manned fighter becomes obsolete but it's not there yet, no doubt that time is going to come but it's not there yet.
The Next generation fighter is going to have multiple drones that pair with a manned fighter. This is the step and the US is already developing this tech.
You know in that kind of environment, even a manned aircraft’s ability to know where it is, know where the target is, and bring weapons on target is not much better than drones.
Elon is confusing the Cybertruck with the F-35 😂 Maybe the idea is to have the drones put on a show for the enemy forces and distract them because no way is a tiny drone going to lift a 2,000 lbs JDAM, let alone carry it hundreds of miles !
Yes confronting his views just needs a modicum of common sense when he goes off piste doesn't it. He forgets endless trial and error and missed time timeframes in war is of a wholly different level and risk than wiping out Starships, You need to stay in the fight as you experiment and doing that by making largely unsubstantiated substantially amateurish claims about what will and will not work for a future conflict as if it’s proven fact will get you defeated very quickly.
20 plus wing man drones could put whipping on your enemies not to mention less live casualties. The cost of training fewer pilots is definitely cost cutting.
regular people has no vision. Elon is talking about the future, not now. but you have to go to the right direction. F35 is reaching an dead end and history will prove it. for unmanned AI plane, Chinese already show a production plane with 20 Ton payload. an AI plane with same or more power will cost less than 1/10th of F35 and NO experienced pilot needed and can be massively produced.
I don't know why you keep apologizing for Elon. He's the epitome of the Dunning Kruger Effect. I don't doubt he's good at what he actually does, but because he's good at that, doesn't make him an expert on air power but he thinks he knows everything.
OK, a few things here. Elon is an entrepreneur and a marketer. He is not an engineer or inventor. Frankly I value his opinion on defense or military matters roughly the same as I value the opinion of career lawyers and politicians on such things. A pilot can not be jammed. FULL STOP! Personally I despise the price tag of the 35 and how we shared the IP with our “allies”. Frankly I can’t understand why the 23 being a stealthier and and far longer legged airframe was not put into service. Elon’s opinion is just that. Given the guy is not an aviator on any level, and I’m fairly certain he has never fired a weapon at a range much less in anger. We don’t need to listen to him.
@@liquidsnakex Again, elon is not an engineer. He graduated with a BSc in physics and a BA in economics. After graduation, Musk moved to California to pursue a PhD in energy physics, but he left the course in just two days and launched his first company, Zip2, in 1995.
@@bigearl3867 Reality doesn't give two fu cks about what degree you have... he'll still be the Chief Engineer of the most advanced spacecraft company on the planet, whether you like it or not.
Remind me, when are Teslas going to be self driving? Was it 2018? In the 60s we had the "missles will replace aircraft" argument. Pilots are inherently flexible and their command link to the jet can't be hacked
@@TheMagicJIZZ thanks, it's been a week since someone has called me a genius. However, I'm struggling to understand your point. Computers are very good at routine, which people are bad at. Computers are very bad at abnormal, which people are good at. So if you can plan it computer's will be good at it, spaceflight is a great example of this, unless something goes wrong. Driving & military flying are bad examples of this, there are too many things which change dynamically. Now, what was your point? Because you can build a robot spacecraft you can build a robot fighter aircraft?
@@FasterLower self driving cars literally have to deal with every type of terrain and city layout plus people and drivers A plane literally had X Y X in axes in there dimensions of space. Autopilot is already good enough for taking off and landing. Having a jet fully autonomous fighting targets and completing ground attacks A self driving car with zero people in others driving is easy. It's easy to simulate. The crew dragon literally flies autonomously onto orbit It raises orbit on its own. You can literally select on the screen where you want to land in the pacific ocean. it calculates this on its own in real-time There's reason why we can't have autonomous fighter jets with advanced AI dogfighting software attacking based on certain signals for friendlies and enemies
Like right now? Have you been in one? It's 100% a harder problem to solve than flying a jet, targeting or adapting. You've got no idea unfortunately. You can't hack AI... Theres no code to hack. You can emp it, but hey, the pilot goes in that case because not a single pilot today is flying manually or not using avionics. So jammed or hacked are stupid excuses.
I'm surprised the phrase "Loyal Wingman" didn't come up in this discussion. I personally think that's going to be the "sweet spot" in the autonomy spectrum for like, the next two or three decades. A crewed F-35 "driver" complimented by a swarm of drone wingmen seems to combine the best of both worlds with few of the drawbacks. Also the F-35 has become surprisingly cheap per copy at this point-- if we need any sort of manned presence at all on the aerial battlefield they might as well be sitting in F-35s.
Elon says "edgy" BS to get attention. Remember, this is the same guy who made serious, false allegations about an expert diver trying to rescue children from a cave, and it was all because Elon couldn't be the hero.
F-35 is the cheapest airplane, as we speak. As per multiple US red flag exercises, the F-35 the kill ratio is 1:20 with 4gen aircraft. Why would you rather purchase 20 F-16s or FA-18s instead of single F-35??? If F-35 is roughly double the cost of F-16/FA-18, the F-35 is no brainer the cheapest air offense/defence period.
F-35 doesn't have the ability to defeat 20 F-16s. In multiple exercises F-35 accomplished it's mission. WVR the 20 to 1 goes to F-16. F-35 is actually more expensive than 4th generation jets like the F-16 and F-18 in the at the same point of it's lifespan. As jets get older maintance cost goes up. Why would you purchase 20 F-18s or F-16s. Because they generate more sorties than F-35 and are cheaper new. Also numbers are on the battlefield can help. You can overwealm the enemy. But mostly you might buy them for flight hours. Than you have F-15 EX which has more range and carries more missiles than F-35.
That's literally not true, the "is often times..." was added later by people who wanted to combat the common saying. You can actually look that up and see I'm right. However, neither version of the statement applies here, as the F-35 was designed for a specific purpose and fills that specific purpose. It might apply if it was trying to be an F-15 and A-10, but it's not.
@@ncwolfe I looked it up. Apparently the original phrase was "jack of all trades" (16 century), with "master of none "added later (18th century), and the "is often times" added even later (21st). All comes down to if you consider specialization vs generalization to be preferable.
Mover, you hit the nail on the head in reference to Elon’s comments on the F-35, or military planning in general… “from a position of somebody who doesn’t know air power”… I go further and say… from of position of somebody with no military or combat experience! It’s an insult for those of us who have served (33 years in my case). Can we do better than taking 20 years to deliver a new capability??? Yes, we did it in WWII. That crap definitely needs to be fixed. The problem is not the defense industrial base alone, it’s Congress and districts that want good paying jobs. As for autonomous AI-driven drones??? Sure, two words: cyber warfare.
Remember, there is a reason why at the one company he worked at which he didn’t control, Elon got fired in the first six months due to his incompetence. Remember, there is a reason why Elon gets insecure and lashes out when he is challenged… or even just receives questions in spaces that have scientists and engineers. Remember, there is a reason why at Elon’s companies there are people whose job description is basically to keep Elon away from the actual operations of the business
The difference between a human and software is that software can only make pattern-matched decisions on data it has access to from the past and whereas a human has imagination and intuition to adapt to situations where there is no relevant data. Software will get more and more capable, but it will always be limited.
Human ability to improvise is only relevant when there is time. For air combat while in the air, it’s mostly pattern matched decisions based on existing data even for humans, there’s even a fancy word for it, Training.
@@xuansu9036 - That's true if you are in a predefined dogfight or SAM evasion mode but there are many other scenarios where a unique situation occurs and AI will likely fail. Consider the Battle of Midway or Battle of Brittain and if humans had not done illogical actions then the outcome might have been total failure. Creativity and thinking outside the box will always be the purview of humans even though they have many other problems relative to AI robots.
@@xuansu9036because Go has fixed parameters and relatively simple mechanics. in a game of Go, you are not going to randomly see a previously undefined card, or a play using a previously unspecified game mechanic. a human will still adapt to a novel situation like that faster. to give a reductive example for the sake of explanation, suppose you train a convolutional neural network on pictures or pigs and horses. with a decent labelled training set, you can build an impressively accurate predictive model as long as you only give it pictures of pigs and horses to predict. now you give it a picture of a dog - itll think its a pig or horse. perhaps you configure a "uncertain" category for these situations, but then what about a bright green pig with black stripes? the model will be uncertain, whereas a human will recognise it as a new type of pig. obviously this example is super basic, and there can workarounds for *anticipated* situations and edge cases, but hopefully it illustrates my point.
Yes, but America's enemies are Musk's big thing. Americans are idiots for allowing what has happened. Russia & co are now in your establishment. Everyone in Europe can see it. Have a nice day.
“Doesn’t know air power in general “ ? Use the air and space to watch, listen to and kill adversaries while denying them that same ability. Anyone can guess what air power means in general. Doesn’t know a thing about it is exactly how Elon has started off most of the successful stuff he’s done so far….He seems to get the hang of it after starting off a little messy. Two of his biggest achievements were in fields other people were long time experts in and they were probably all saying he’s an idiot and it will never work. That said, I do personally think some of his ideas are just plain dumb. But using unmanned aircraft to fight and even replace pilots when technology allows sounds pretty logical. Heck if we can have autonomous 18 wheelers making deliveries, fighters doesn’t seem like much of a stretch.
And you would be shot down before you knew the 5th gen was even there. The network capabilities alone make 4th gen obsolete in modern long range missle exchanges.
network capabilities can be bolted to nearly any plane. Long range missiles can be mounted on about any upgraded 3rd gen or newer plane. A 5th plane turning its radar on, will be detected by 3rd gen if its electronics are fully up-to-date. And that is exactly what the F-35 is, just a expensive platform. The systems bolted on to it,makes it effective The plane, design and capabilitys as fighter, nope.
@@ToreDL87..True. Gripen Es from Sweden can use targeting data from the F35As their neighbours use to swat any dumb Putinist aircraft trying to head to them. Hypothetically. Especially with the Gripen E having the Meteor, it would be a perfect pair. F35s being like the special forces directing fire at enemy positions undetected from artillery or other assets.
6th gen NGAD concept contains manned fighters with unmanned companions called Loyal Wingman. It’ll be costly but the best of both worlds. You have to spend $ to stay on top.
I'm 35 years old, have never had a girlfriend, and am 5 years away from being able to do a really accurate halloween costume of The 40 Year Old Virgin. I say all this to establish just exactly how little I know about having sex, so that I can confidently point out that Elon Musk knows less about the military than I know about fucking.
@@MicMc539 No he is not! Elon has no power. Z-E-R -O ! He can tweet shit about the F-35 until hell freezes over, doesn't mean Trump is going to move on it. Trump relies mainly on Pete Hedseth for Military decisions. That is the opinion you want to watch for. Also, Congress is not going to easily let the F-35 get cancelled. There were many attempts for the executive branch to cancel the A-10 and its still around because of Congress.
Thank you! I absolutely HATE WHEN PEOPLE SAY “fighter jet”. I actually called out the website “the War Zone” when I said “saying fighter jet is redundant and stupid, and it makes you sound uneducated. The method of propulsion is irrelevant, and we don’t say B-2 “bomber jet”, or P-51 “fighter propeller” or “fighter piston engine” do we? No. So just call it “fighter” or “fighter aircraft”, or even “fighter plane”. The editor at the time straight up replied and said “ I’m going to make sure we make sure we call them “fighter jets”. I said “when you interview people in the Pentagon or military, do the pilots say “fighter jet?” I’m goin to bet they don’t and you sound like an amateur saying that. Fast forward to 2023…..they started to subtly drop the “jet” and just call them “fighter”. Of course, no credit given to the military guy who told them not to do it in the first place.😂
The main argument is that we can't know what we will know until the weapons start flying. At that point, each side will adapt. The classic sentiment of "your enemy also gets a vote" predicts that our predictions about how a war will be fought will change. Second is capabilities, to bridge the gap of ignorance into warfighting capability, our unmanned systems need information. This is what a large and networked series of platforms bring. This means that there isn't one kind of drone, system, program, datalink, aircraft, or weapon. Everything will have its niche. Technology development follows this pattern: diversity, complexity, and expansion (what it can be applied to). Future war will have more of each of those values and we need many smart people (not just one smart man) to make the warfighting a reality. It's hard to take a guy who knows nothing of our secret systems and capabilities and listen to him with any degree of seriousness. Even if he were granted clearance, he couldn't talk about it anyway (nor would he want to...), so anything he says is going to be a largely uninformed opinion of someone outside the circle of trusted persons who know the stakes and capabilities of our weapons and our adversaries.
@@david7384 NASA's DC-X did that way back in the 90s with far less computing power than we have today. While only a proof on concept for vertical takeoff and landings, maybe Enron MuZk -head of Teslanos - took knowledge from that? If he didn't, it doesn't make a good engineer to re-invent the wheel.
@@gottagowork you're clearly an example of the people that lack nuance like the dude was saying in the clip above. obviously elon musk is kind of a big dumdumb and a manchild with a massive ego and a snake oil salesman and nobody is getting hyperlooped onto mars with their electric supercars with the cold gas thrusters through the tesla tunnels and recharging their brain implants with their solar roof tiles on their heads while on the way there in order to arrive on mars by 2015 and set up a new civilization or whatever.. but at the same time, it's not like it's just empty air between his ears. he's clearly smart in some ways and has done a very good job with his satellite internet and his rockets that can now do some really impressive stunts, and he has created a company for electric cars that while admittedly being pretty low quality and filled with ridiculous promises of super duper artificial intelligence nonsense that may accidentally swerve into oncoming traffic and kill you instead of driving you is still a very successful company that is worth a lot of money and that has sold a whole bunch of vehicles over the last decade or whatever. so i don't know why you wanna take that away from him. i really don't think that anybody else has created giant towers with giant metal arms to catch giant rockets the size of skyscrapers in order to be able to rebuild them and get more than single use out of them. it's pretty cool stuff. sure as heck ultimately accomplished more than you and me. no need to be petty and bitter and to attempt to take his accomplishments away from him. you can just be a normal person and be like "yep elon musk is a big baby and a massive egomaniac that has pushed a lot of ridiculous scams, but his rockets and satellites are pretty cool and his cars are alright" and just wish him the best when it comes to doing more of the cool useful stuff and less of the scams in the future. it's not really that deep or that complicated. people can have both good and bad qualities and both successes and failures. it doesn't have to be a pick between one or the other.
"Ai" as it is sold to the public nowadays shouldn't be called Ai in my opinion, because it is NOT intelligent at all. We are still waaaayyyyy away from real human-like intelligence. Elon is trying to scare us with Ai and what it could be, because he's just trying to make publicity, and that's it... He knows well at which stage Ai is currently (or maybe he is not...). Ai that we have today is "dumb" Ai, it's just a tool maybe to help or assist on certain task and that's it... But we are still lightyears away from '2001 space odyssey' Ai. People just don't understand how complex the humain mind, intelligence and brain is, And that is not something that's going to be replicated artificially soon, not in the near future that's for sure. Now onto the Military aviation domain, can a Ai drone beat a real pilot in a 5 minutes dogfight ? Yeah maybe, but can it replace a real Pilot involved in a campaign/war with all its correlated complexity (like situation assessment, observation, judgement, experience, etc...) NOWAY. We will have to wait a looonnng time before that happen. Like I said Ai is just a tool to assit on certain specific tasks and that's it !
An LLM can give you something that sounds exactly like HAL from 2001, the problem is that the output is unstructured, and, like you say, devoid of all intelligence. There is no meaning, no common sense, no concept of truth or fiction. That fancy human like response is just mindless generative prediction. The computer doesn't even 'know' it's doing this, computers don't know anything! They are finite state machines, we built them, there is no magic. If you want to see the best we can do right now, look no further than Siri, Alexa, Google, Bixby, and so on: Hey, turn on the flashlight: Here's what google has to say about "turning on a fleshlight".
He is trying to do with AI, what he did to SpaceX, and Tesla. He places himself as the authority on the topic, and scare mongers about the effects if he isn't in charge. Elon has a destructive God Complex that is darker than the casual observer knows. Read biographies on Elon. Read his insane Tweets. He is not all there, and his speech as become more, and more palsied.
@bobbyraejohnson true...but that's a much more complicated and involved endeavor...than a clever 17 year old in a basement somewhere...with a laptop...lol
You guys are giving Elon a bit too much praise. The one thing I'll give him is that he's able to get the brightest minds and convince people to do something in an unconventional way that normally wouldn't be done in most buisnesses. However, this approach isn't always a good thing and especially recently we've seen him doing this same tactic in much lower quality ways.
We absolutely still need fighters. Your back pack drones are not going to provide air defense at 35,000 feet. Own the sky, dominate the ground. The fighter pilot themselves are also still needed inside the jet to make decisions and to fly with true stealth. I'm just a silly 18 year old, what do I know?
The problem with always being the smartest guy in the room is that you start telling yourself you're an expert on everything, even things you have no clue about. The dumbest E-1 working the flight deck of the Carl Vinson knows more about carrier operations than Elon Musk does, and they don't let that guy cut entire defense programs. Edit: Also, anyone who's almost sh*t their pants because their Tesla decided to slam on the emergency brakes doing 80 in the middle of a deserted highway will probably tell you that Elon's confidence in AI might be a bit misplaced.
In the broader context, Elon is looking to trim the defense budget. My concern is that he might begin cutting programs like F-35 procurement (and promotion to foreign markets) without understanding the necessity and interconnection of what he's removing. The F-35 is more than a single combat platform, it's an integral component of our modern multi-domain combat strategy. Beyond that, it's a geopolitical tool which enables the US to be at the center of the defense needs of allied nations and even to entice the cooperation of countries who might want to get under our umbrella. There are valid complaints of every combat weapon system's development. Commonly, the F-35 is ridiculed for its high development and maintenance costs. Given that the F-35 should be regarded as three separate aircraft with commonalities, its cost is not as outrageous as it seems. In comparison to the only other 5th generation aircraft in US service, the F-35's per unit cost is far less than the F-22. For the most part, mainstream awareness of the F-35 has been influenced by adversaries like Russia and China who want Western voters to be unduly concerned and misinformed about the effectiveness and capabilities of the aircraft. At the moment AI isn't ready to take combat roles from human decision making and, given the concerns he has expressed in the past about the dangers of AI, I would be surprised to see Elon support giving AI such autonomy over weapon systems. As a fan of SpaceX and their design philosophies, I don't think the same process used to design Starship can be applied to the design of systems meant to deploy weapons.
problem is elon is the stupidest person in the room at all times except around tRump but he just isnt smart enough to figure it out. he knows little to nothing about space or spacecraft either ... he is currently trying to get to the 1960's but hasnt figured out nasa already has done what he is trying to do and he cant seem to understand ctrl+c then ctrl+v
Our modern multi-domain combat strategy is terrible cause we have not won a war with a decent power since WW2 we spend trillions of dollars on defense stuff with nothing to show for it. The USA is on the weakest economic footing that it has ever been.
excellently articulated comment. It should be pinned, IMHO - Especially the part about Chinese and Russian disinformation campaigns designed to affect public opinion and thus, official actions
The F-35 admittedly had quite some toothing problems, but at present it appears all these start-up problems are ironed out Its strength appears to be its electronics, its economy of scale (1000+ built, 3000,+ projected) and its reliability. A plane like that can project power with heavy missiles, something that a fleet of cheap drones can't. I didn't hear the Israeli's complain about its performance I suspect it will be decades before it becomes obsolete (which of course it will inevitably become). Good video, guys!
When you can deploy multiple drones like that with the same time and distance capabilities of an F-35 then yes, maybe they will replace Fat Amy. Until then, hard no!
Google range and dwell time of MQ9 and RQ4. Google range and dwell time of F-35 A pilot is under stress from G's and sitting in a confined space wondering where the enemy is. A drone operator is sitting in an airconditioned Conex wondering where his Monster Energy Drink went. Which one is under more stress and afraid of dying?
@@wrayday7149 now factor in payload capabilities and radar cross-section. there are things you can put on fat amy that you can't put on an MQ9 and places you can sneak the stealth fighter in but you can't the drone etc.
@@wrayday7149 Is an MQ9 or RQ4 survivable in a contested environment? No. You really should listen @cpthf3535 as it appears he knows quite a bit more than you.
@@cpthf3535you could make fat Amy a drone. The issue is being 100% confident in the decision chain of the drone. It has to be capable of autonomous action. Autonomous action with faulty, and possibly constantly changing, information.
The F-15EX, KC-46, and A-10 are all jobs programs that the USAF never wanted. The USAF does want to the F-35 and had been buying 48 per year for nearly a decade. Former C-130E/H Crew Chief here, 1999-2009 after growing up on Navy bases. I have seen a ton of ridiculous waste and experiments pushed on the Navy/USAF.
Veteran Alex Hollings on his UA-cam channel "Sandboxx" takes on Elon Musk's buffoonish take on military fighters vs. drones. He demolishes every one of Musk's claims dispassionately, supported by facts and logic. After watching Hollings give the reality of where our military technology is today with the integration of manned fighters, drones and AI it's clear that Musk has no clue as to what he's talking about. It would seem he's either trying to cast doubt in the public eye of the viability and necessity of the F-35 or he's just looking for attention. Either way it shows Musk is way out of his league and should go back to keeping his self driving cars from running people over.
8:20 Fun Fact: The word "man" derives from Old English "mann" (itself derived from Proto-Indo-European *mon or *monn) which simply meant "person" and did not indicate gender. "Wermann" meant male person (which also gave us werewolf, meaning "man-wolf"). Wifmann meant female person, hence "wife".
Numerous armed services around the world are not just buying but routinely using F-35s. I've seen them in flight. I'm still waiting to see my first driverless car. I know various militaries are experimenting with driverless vehicles, but they won't be making present model driver dependent cars redundant any time soon.
Dude doesn't know people are literally using Telsa auto pilot daily and have thus travelled 1,610 millions miles without intervention and it is predicted to require 6Billion miles to achieve Full Self driving. Do you people realize that technology has a optimization growth curve and you don't snap your fingers & have said technology y'all are going to very dissapointed when code flies these jets better than your favourite pilot.
@@geraldg350 Muskovite doesn't know that that car's not going far without a driver anytime soon and will be disappointed waiting for that unsupported AI to do more than support roles for the manned aircraft.
@@bluecedar7914 Being a luddite doesn't stop technological progress nobody said it's going to happen soon. You do realize that technology has a optimization growth curve that is non linear? and you saying all that AI will ever do is a support role for a manned aircraft is the dumbest thing ever being that is the hill you are going to die on carry on. I'll bet my left testicle between you and Musk you're the most likely to be dissapointed about the future simply from your inability to predict something as simple at this.
The F35 is a platform. Sensors cover all around them. The pilot sits staring straight ahead at the screens. You just need to place that pilot on the ground with a reliable connection to the aircraft. The aircraft can then be lighter and pull far more G's.
@@kevinhorne9643 comment from a really smart "keyboard worrier" who wouldn't dare mock Elon as stupid in a public gathering like a typical school yard Bully.
@@timcro1966 lol. He didn't even finish his degree at university, and has no technical qualifications whatsoever. You don't have to smart to be rich, you just have to be willing to screw over lots of other people in favour of yourself.
I am in agreement. When the situation is splitting hairs; you want a living, breathing pilot in the equation that gives final authority. To make the judgement call.
@@bobbyraejohnson no discount temu tony stark, stoney tart is just plain bad at everything. misses all his delivery dates, over promises and under delivers, tries to take credit for other peoples accomplishments, has skin so thin he makes glass frogs seem like rhinos, has bilked investors, has stolen tax dollars and failed to deliver what was promised. there is a ton more stuff this failure of a pile of carbon has failed on.
Cant remotely fly every combat mission from the US. You'd need to react faster than the signal would arrive in some cases, like air-to-air combat. That would be a big limiting factor. I'd also say Elon is financially invested in China to some extent, right? Would China like to see f-35 production axed? Probably. I'm sure they and Russia both couldnt believe how lucky they were when f-22 production was stopped, considering how far at least one of them closed that gap since. 50/50 whether Elon makes an actual effort to cancel the f-35
I'm sure he has, but instead of learning a lesson, would instead take that 'no' as inspiration to find ways around the 'no' to his advantage to get what he wanted.
Elon also doesn't like: >Lidar or non-optical sensors for self-driving cars, hence Tesla squandering their lead in FSD >launch abort systems for crew aboard Starship >content moderation >free speech when it comes to Ukraine or criticising Elon Same guy who has bullshitted the world regarding AI-enabled Full Self Driving and is currently trying to pass off their Optimus robot as anything nearly as capable as Boston Dynamics Atlas? This guy has opinions on autonomous fighter jets? Thanks, but I'll pass. He's a crypto huckster and a vapourware salesman.
Any unmanned has to have a downlink in order to be controlled.. that datalink can be jammed.. then you either lose the drone/mission or need to have it to be autonomous.. and do you really want an autonomous drone shoting weapons? can you garantee it wont mistake allies with enemies ..or civilians?.. Sorry i just dont see them replacing meatballs...at least entirelly/majority
@@mp40submachinegun81 The same ai that currently cant even think outside the box and can only do stuff it was programmed to do by people? That fails when asked for cake recipies? That ai should be capable of reading and understanding a conflict zone?
@@zombi111980 you do know that all AI is not the same, right? Aegis already uses AI specifically for that issue of reading and understanding the conflict zone. That exists and is active duty. The only difference is that Aegis still has someone pushing the button.
There are a few problems when you have an endless amount (a bottomless pit) of funds coming in, this 35 is the result. If you subtract all that, you have an F-18.
*I am on the "Elon has too much money"* side. The money gives him power, and he can influence things in arenas he has no business messing with. People give way too much weight to everything he says. [Note: 10:25-Where is the evidence that Elon is a "genius"? And "genius" in what area? There are *NO* "geniuses" in *ALL* areas at once. People give his views more weight than they deserve simply because he is rich. He did NOT build those Space X rockets. He did not build any of the systems in them. He did NOT build Tesla or engineer any of the vehicles-he HIRED engineers to do these things. Where is the evidence that he is a genius, and in what area?] *I am also on the Mover's side concerning the human element.* How often must we explore this, get burned, and back up again? The most efficient system may end up being a human with 5-20 drones, I don't know. What I _am_ confident of is that the most efficient system (because morality will always be an issue) will include a human being. Despite the false analogy of comparing a computer to make decisions faster than a human, no AI can take an unexpected situation and bring various perspectives to bear on a solution as a human can. AI can _only_ process algorithms humans have trained it to do. If an unforeseen element is brought into the scenario, the AI is limited to only the algorithms the programs have given it to deal with the new information, which may not be applicable.
We don’t even know how to make general ai Elon is talking about. Everything we have now is literally thinking inside the box; it craps out as soon as you give it a novel problem.
Remember that Elon is in the same friend group as Palmer Lucky’s Anduril Industries Autonomous Military Drone company. Elon’s tweet (which he boosted on his own social media platform) is just an advertisement for Anduril Roadrunner or Boeing Ghostbat fast jet drones
Anyone else think its strange that the man who is against manned fighters because they are "obsolete" and a drone can do anything a manned craft can do, and better...still wants to send a crew on a suicide mission to...Mars?!
In Ukraine, FPV drones do pretty much 99% of what CAS was used for 20 years ago. Interdiction and strategic strikes are done exclusively using standoff weapons launched by fighters well behind the frontline. Air superiority fighters like the Su-27 and Su-30 are pretty much just used for air defense. Radar and EO guidance for SAMs has gotten advanced enough that flying over the frontline is pretty much never going to make sense against an enemy with modern air defense. The way you achieve air superiority now is by taking out as much of your enemy's aircraft and drones on the ground as you can. Flying in enemy airspace is already a thing of the past in modern peer-on-peer conflicts.
All true but... what about situations where your enemy lacks effective air defence (Iraq, arguably Russia or the next country the USAF wants to/is told to bully) and isn't V/STOL the capability that negates/mitigates airfield/launch site destruction? Also, what about the remote briny areas?
@garycheung5135 Non-stealth aircraft would be just as effective in an asymmetric conflict. Also, modern air-to-ground missiles can track and hit individual fighter jets on the ground.
People who say Elon's a genius never seem to think that about Elon when he talks about a field they actually know something about. He's a genius at nothing. He just talks as though he is and people fall for it.
Drone swarms like those in the video he shared, do not address the same problem space that the F-35 does, and Elon surely knows that, because in spite of his bloody-minded trolling nature, he's not stupid. He was shitposting, that's all. That's 90% of what he does online, and it's symptomatic of the fact that even though he's a reasonably intelligent person, he's about as mature as the average 13 year old boy.
Keep in mind that Elon also wanted to take the people out of car manufacturing, and ended up hiring a whole lot of people because it didn't work without them
I don't get all the hate towards Elon. He is absolutely right. Saying he doesn't know what he's talking about when there have been multiple comprehensive reports which points towards its failures and the astronomical price we've paid to keep the program running. It is a failure, plain and simple. People who focus and analyze on the course of the future know that many things are moving towards autonomous systems. Manned piloting will no longer be necessary and might actually be counter intuitive.
@@yoparsons80 You just proved my point. To say the future is autonomous is the most moronic thing to ever say. You and Elon are completely wrong. The clear as day example of modern war is happening as i type and what do you think is happening. It has gone BACK to classic warfare with trenches and artillery making the difference. This IS opposite of what most war pundits thought a modern war would play out. This includes manned pilots used by Israel infiltrating successfully which can turn the tide of their war. There's no doubt much like all programs from companies AND government there is waste but that is life. Elon can't even get his cars to navigate roads properly yet you think it'll work in war? You have zero clue. You couldn't even code a simple command in C-prompt let alone know what it takes AI/coding wise.
A lot of people who designed the f-35 didn’t go to war either. So that’s a dumb thing to say. You don’t have to go to combat to know the F-35 ain’t bad but is unreliable.
I would call the people who wrote the specifications fpr the F-35 stupid. Lockheed just had to do their best to get that thing flying somehow and i bet there where many engineers who thought the same as Elon
The F-35 may be ugly to some but it's way prettier than the Cybertruck.
It's ok. They are both designed to minimize radar cross section. 😂
hm
it certainly flies much better
F35 is not ugly?
@@petersmythe6462 by being made up of flat pieces of stainless steel?
Elon was never my go to source on fighter jets 👊🏼
Ford and GM also said Elon was not their go to source on cars 😂😂
Unfortunately, there are huge numbers of people who know little & think he's a genius, spouting wisdom with every word he says. The fact that he's rich generates admiration in many that emotionally flavors their interpretation of anything he says in a positive way. "Stop using big words with me, man!" I'll just believe what my cult leader says.
His point about the compromises made in the F35 design to suit different requirements is widely known and often stated, including on this podcast, so not sure your snark is justified.
But he will be one who will recommend to Trump which big government program or even agency to cut.
OR Rockets or EV`s Or Satellites or Neurolink All done better than anyone in the Previous 50 years
As a software engineer, I find the F-35 fascinating-it’s called the “hive mind” for a reason. You also have to consider that cyber and electronic warfare are significant factors.
I spoke to a Tesla engineer back in the day and he confirmed that Elon is not a genius and dosen't even understand code. He basically just hired a bunch of really smart engineers to do his bidding.
I will argue that smart business people hire smarter people to do the heavy lifting.
@@yepyep6916 agreed, but hiring smart people does not make one a smart business person.
@@196cupcake that’s true too
He had lots of money to hire the best and brightest which Elon is not one of. Steve Jobs all over again.
This is total lack of understanding of how startups are built and founded
Twitter is arguably the worst thing that has happened to humanity
I will never forget watching The Colbert Report on Comedy Central in 2006 when Biz Stone was a guest explaining what Twitter was. I could not understand it, and could only guess it would regress people into childishness.
Yes, and Musk made it a complete cesspool.
@@annehechesliverdonation9624 Yeah, I still remember the days when we didn't instantly know every dumb thing celebrities, politicians, and businessmen were thinking. They needed to actually sit down and have an interview or talk to a reporter. Now they just type and send and we're all the worse for it.
@@jimm.6542 yep, but he used it to buy a president and now we'll regret that for years to come. It's sickening how many people are just fine with corruption of the highest order because it makes them feel important and right.
“Maybe so Sir, but not today.” - Maverick
Yeah, but the thing with top gun Maverick is that the entire mission could have been flown by drones without risking any pilot lives. The F-18 was not necessary for this mission, the F35 could have flown this mission….. which is basically a tailor made B2 strike
@@Matt-yg8ubMaybe but the guys are right in this video except that there is no intelligence in A.I. True A.I.s may never happen and are perhaps 100 years away at best. Those drone performances were amost certainly orchestrated. Remote control brings the danger of jamming. Elon is the master of snake oil. His robots in his show in wb studios were puppeted and orchestrated and he isn't the founder of Tesla. Ebberhard had a t0 car with li-ion and regenerative braking before Elon bought in with 6.5 million. Hondas robots were far more capable many years ago.
@@Matt-yg8ub The F-35 is ruled out because of "GPS jammers" in the initial briefing as an excuse not to use it for the film. IIRC, Superhornet pilots run-or used to-run an exercise literally called the "Death Star Trench Run" which is exactly the mission portrayed in the movie. I totally agree with a B2 being the right tool for the mission tho. But where's the fun on that?
I don't like you you're dangerous
Iceman 😂 you being Elon
@ dangerous to who though? I would imagine that most fighter pilots probably dislike Elon for the simple fact that he’s attacking their rice bowl, the idea that we need to maintain manned fighters into perpetuity.
Saying fighter jets or planes are obsolete because of drones is like saying trucks or trains are obsolete because of cars, or jackhammers are obsolete because of hammers. They are completely different tools. Why is this so hard for Elon to understand.
Great point
I think he is not okay with the absurd cost, DOGE
Not sure if this is best analogy. To me, drones vs F35 sound more like aircraft carriers vs battle ships. But who knows. Future wars will give the answer.
I think everyone gets that, but do you spend an ungodly fortune on crewed craft or drones in 2025?
Smart money says spend more on drone development....
Elon doesn't really understand anything. He just thinks he does.
He's comparing apples and fish and doesn't know it.
Or your misunderstanding his point on the future if warfare.
@@randomuser942464 Just like when people made the point that you didn’t need a gun in a fighter and you didn’t need to learn dogfighting.
@@randomuser942464 "Who needs to spend money on conventional weapons like ships and aircraft? NUKES are the future of warfare!" -US Congress in 1948
Totally agreed
On the thumbnail it said "Elon doesn't like the F35"
*NEWS FLASH:* Elon doesn't like any technology that he can't claim he invented.
My concern about Elon-chan is that he may not be able to accept that not all his ideas are great; during the Tham Luang cave rescue, Elon came forward with a proposal for a child-sized subs to get them out rather than what was planned at the time by an international group of cave divers, some of whom were local expats who knew the area better than Elon does.
When his plan was rejected in favor of the original extraction plan, Elon went on an ad hominem attack against the cave divers, calling them pedophiles and stuff.
This doesn’t struck me as a proper behavior of someone that can be trusted to listen to experts who knew their job better than Elon knew of their jobs, let alone management of a government agency supposedly focused on “efficiency”.
Agree! Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
Ryan McBeth dropped a very good video about this topic and was not scared to say, ELON IS WRONG!
Ryan McBeth is actually intelligent and Elon is just full of it. Elon is neither smart nor a genius. He is good at listening to other people’s ideas and using them as his own then making silly comments. As a retired engineer, who worked on the F-35, my opinion is much different.
There will be drone wingmen but there will continue to be manned aircraft.
According to Ryan McBeth everyone other than him is wrong. Its his ability to speak and/or answer questions with an endless flow of truth and bullshit confidently that makes him appear more knowledgeable then he really is, even to himself.
@@tmack2506 No there won't. At some stage in the next 50 years, all aircraft will be unmanned. It will get to the point where the monkey in the plane doesn't add any value. Look at space travel, humans are basically only passengers, no need for actual astronauts. It's no ones fault, it's just progress.
@@ajnz2420 Trains were invented 200 years ago, but they still have drivers😅
@@sergfreeman2987 the modern trains don't. Look at all the rapid trains in China, all self driven.
35 maintainer here. Im not chronically on twitter to have a debate with him but it goes without saying some platforms are purpose built and drones are just not there in the fighter sense to compliment and or phase out the current inventory of fixed wing fast movers.
Moreover i hate the master of none talk which is constantly being proven as baseless and just not true; man i sure do think this 9.2G+ platform that has the engine output to pull off the runway and hit an immediate vertical climb with no burner is outdated and not a good investment
@FatherExo - we need more people like you to talk about this cause there is lot's of BS out there (not just about F-35 but any system platform).
His whole point is that AI should be at a point where it can replace pilots which makes sense. The only reason it isn’t is because it hasn’t been funded and prioritised enough.
@ and the retort of Mover was that its not practical bc you need a human being with critical thought behind the stick… which I wholeheartedly agree with
I read that the US military currently has a fair portion of f-35s not in working order (like 30-40%) such that they need more maintenance or whatever it is that I don't know about. while the target that we would wish to have is that only 20-25% of planes are "out of order" given (I've heard) the f-35 is hard to maintain I'm not sure this is an easy issue to fix but I'm assuming the
@kavinbala8885 1) half true depending on how you look at it
2) the only thing needed at any given time that hinders mission capability is parts and support equipment, not the ability to perform maintenance or how intermittent the maintenance is
3) the target is propositions made by bean counters and exaggerated and used as munitions against the aircraft by MSM
4) its not hard to maintain
Regarding the conversation from around 17:00, look at what happened with the kids that got stuck in the cave in Thailand and how Elon 'the genius' Musk treated the actual experts in cave diving...
Fun fact: Vernon Unsworth had zero expertise in diving, you're just a victim of disinformation and apparently damn proud of it 🤣
@@liquidsnakex Maybe you should go fix wiki then. He's an experienced caver with knowledge about that specific cave, he's listed as an experienced diver, and the two often go hand in hand at least to some level. Ok, for the sake of argument he had no experience and was just a front spokesperson, maybe it's possible he took advice from the thousands of other *actual* dive experts at the scene calling MuZk's idea plain nuts? Remember Hyperloop? Not exactly a guy with feet on the ground.
@@liquidsnakex another maga 🐑, the world has enough, thanks
Wasn't that the same submarine that wouldn't have fit through the narrow passages of the cave?
@@theussmirage yep musk is about as smart as my pet rock!
As someone who has no war fighting experience and no experience designing fighter jets and combat drones, I'm not going to listen to someone who doesn't have any experience in those matters either.
Elon is a military defense contractor and he designs spacecraft.... and he knows how to balance a checkbook.
But hey... go look up what the Navy said about the Zumwalt's to get them and now they want the next shiny thing.
After listening to his description of Hyperloop, I have no respect for his technical prowess or knowledge. "It's literally no more complicated than your air-hockey table, I promise. It's not that hard." This guy has left a trail of failed transportation projects behind that no minion dares talk about.
@@wrayday7149
He does NOT design spacecraft. He has people for that, and it's not him.
@wrayday7149 Rockets and satellites are different animals, we're talking about fighter jets and drones.
@@Skank_and_Gutterboy Chill with the wacky conspiracy theories, he's literally the Chief Engineer of SpaceX.
I'm just hoping he doesn't affect F35 output from Lockheed Martin or Government spending on the platform. The more misunderstood this aircraft is to those outside the platform, the better. Honestly, I'm happy people not in the know call it "Fat Amy", "ugly" , "can't dogfight"... just buy into it. But leave production alone - you've no clue just how capable this jet is.
You do know Lockheed stopped making that because they were working on the new F-16 they're only going to have parts for a few more years that's why they're literally almost 30% of the f-35s we have from the last 10 to 15 years are currently not airworthy
@@keepthinking2666 - I was personally at the Lockheed production factory in Fort Worth a short time ago, and I can promise you........F35's were still in full assembly all along the mile long line. Obviously, I don't have inside info as to the status moving forward, but there were too many to count at various stages of production. I guess it's possible they are going to ally nations.
I agree with you we need that plane. The pilots that fly the F-35 they love it.
@@daves536finland bought 64, and Im assuming countries near Russia are buying too.
@@makestank4800 - I personally know some F35 pilots, and indeed to a man / and woman, they do love the jet.
Please remember the self drive function on his cars still crashes. And that is only in two planes of motion.
That seems harder, actually. In the air gives more elbow room and is more forgiving.
Hardly. Millions of mile of data shows it to be way, way safer than human drivers.
Elon sounds smart until he talks about a topic you are knowledgeable about lol
elon sounds smart until he talks lol
sorry you had some extra words in there taht was gumming up your comment 🤣🤣🤣
He tries to not debate with those knowledgable on subjects quite deliberately to sound rather more smart than he actually is, he much prefers yes men and those willing but noticeably without the specific skills to test him. He is most smart indeed at finding and using people who really are smart in what they do while happily taking the credit for it. It’s a skill but not one that we should accept unchallenged, but sadly his power and cult like status make confronting him a difficult sometimes dangerous occupation.
He doesn't even sound smart when he talks about stuff he, allegedly and supposedly, knows about.
@@stuartwillardscreenworx4035 he isn't smart at finding people who are actually good at their jobs else the cybertruck bumpers would not have fallen off and spacex would not be finally reaching nasa capabilities from the 1950s nor would he have lost any rockets at all i mean engine tech and design has been around for 100+ years his ship losses is the same as designing a bog standard diesel engine that fails under zero load. these are not things that should happen if he has the best people under him.
@@Facelessify1 he is smart enough to know how to bilk investors and tax payers but no hes pretty low IQ compared to other self proclaimed genious', even moreso comapred to normal people. about on par with the maga crowd
17:15 you are giving musk far too much credit. When he was disappointed by his tweets not getting as much attention as they used to and he asked a team of programmers at twitter, one of them said "maybe it's because you aren't as popular as you used to be." Musk fired that guy on the spot. He only surrounds himself with yes men these days.
We had a couple of people with power that where like this before in world history. It never ended well.
You watching too much msnbc. The failing news network😂🤦🏻♂️
I think he's never surrounded himself with anything but sycophants, unless they're actual expert engineers who do all the heavy lifting, like those at Space X. He's not doing that nor is he actually running Tesla.
@@Sar2831 you're brownnosing Elon a little too much.
lol fake news everwhere
An air superiority drone is currently called a SAM.
Basically this! Just think of it as a reusable first stage for a SAM missile.
Yes but no loiter capability or range or multi-role, and very limited sensors. A SAM can't be sent out to patrol an area and then come back and land. It has one goal: kill the thing that it's radar is locked on.
Nah been defeated continuously by an airplane.....SR71🤣
Nope. SAM's are "retarded" (I mean that in the literal sense). Drones with micro-munitions fielded in the thousands and cost as much as 1 sam are the new meta. Whats more. AI controlled drones will ALWAYS win. The first Guys to Remove that Guy in the killchain will be the winner. Its not just Air that will be in grave danger. Army and Navy drones built with Autonomy in mind will wreck...Emotions are not a factor. Ask the AI if you don't believe me! {Wink}
@@creigiihtondenynis39 There is a reason they don't fly those anymore. It's because the "high and fast" approach will not beat modern missiles and could not do so even back then. Flights generally skirted the edges of Soviet territory rather than overflying it precisely because of the risk of more modern SAMs being able to hit it.
The moment someone starts off complaining that a fighter does too many things, is the moment that I know the person has no idea what they're talking about.
When Elmo comes up with a drone capable of supersonic speed, with the ability to deliver several tons of bombs so that it is undetected by enemy air defenses, and then the drone can even return to base and deliver all of that in the next 10 years, I'll give him a thumbs up.
Elmo's fantasies very often collide with reality. Like the Cybertruck. He's been talking about a pickup truck since 2012, and introduced it in 2019, saying it would be bulletproof, shatterproof glass, no wipers or rear view mirrors, and that it would supposedly be able to swim. In late 2023 he finally started delivering it to customers and either nothing of what he promised has remained or he's delivered about halfway and it still has half the promised range.
So when he delivers a swarm of combat drones that could replace the F-35 and its pilot, I'll admit he's done it. Until then, he'd better read the short story Superiority by Arthur C. Clark (it used to be required reading at MIT at some point).
when you can buy 10000 high performance drones for the cost of 1 F-35, you have to think hard about it. I don't have an opinion. It would be best to ask Ukrainian soldiers -they are the experts now. Pentagon is just a bunch of armchair strategists.
I just think it's funny that the guy who created the world's ugliest "truck" doesn't like the world's ugliest fighter jet.
That title belongs to the YF32.
@mikewaterfield3599 Never used. There certainly are uglier concepts though.
@@mikewaterfield3599 X-32
@ technically she did get a Y designation. That thing however is objectively the ugliest combat aircraft ever devised outside the Soviet Union.
@ fair, I could anything that made it to a Y stage of development.
Isreal just carried out a mission deep into Iran with no losses with the F-35, so it's definitely top notch.
Haven’t they done the same with the F-15 and F-16 also?
Also remember Israel is still not telling us how many F-35 were destroyed in that missile attack.
Israel Air Force has countless successful missions going back to 1967, and the highest kill ratio, all before the F35 was even conceived 😂
@@grospipo20 No 4th or 4.5 gen aircraft would survive over the Ukraine battlefield ......the 5th gen F-35 would own the sky and ground.
They didn't enter Iranian airspace lol.
Israel are at the pointy end, if they think it’s the platform to lead a strike, when they have F15s following them, tells the story
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
problem is the ketamine and ego keep him from getting past mount stupid and falling into the pit of despair and realization.
Elon is right though. The f35 is the most ridiculous expensive program of all time. It’s unbelievably expensive to the definition. Compare it to what Elon has achieved with his rockets. I’m sorry but more engineering went into his rocketry than the f35 project.
@@RedTeufel no
@@RedTeufel So he bought a company and uses NASA developed technology, then lets his engineers tweak it. OK.
NASA could do the same, but they aren't allowed to use crashes as part of their development strategy.
@@RedTeufel nasa would have been shut down if it blew up a fraction of the rockets that space x has lol
Could a drone go in and rescue Col. Ted Masters...I don't think so!
good point
Cyber Iron. 😂😂😂
A person being an expert manager, a visionary, or whatever you want to credit Elon with does NOT make him an expert in EVERY field. A genius should be smart enough to know that they are not a genius in every single thing they want to open their fat mouth about.
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
Can you imagine the amount of nicknames given to Elmo by the hoards of engineers he surrounds himself with?
He's basically The Simpsons monorail guy.
A good friend of mine works at ESA as a propulsion engineer, and the stories she tells, that she hears from SpaceX colleagues is astounding. Several employees theres main job is to keep Elon away from the actual engineers. They do not want a Cybertruck or Hyperloop situation 😂
How many multi billion dollar companies have you got? None? Stfu then.
Nice shout out, there can’t be two monorail guys at the same time, surely? 🍊🤡 will jealous. Is the USA now shelbyville?
Lol keep crying woke gay boy. Elon is the head engineer and designer at nearly all his companies. Actual engineers who work for his companies have confirmed this.
Politely disagree. Lyle Lanley was charismatic. Elon has no discernible personality.
Well that's terrific, what happens if you get in a heavy EW environment and you lose the SATCOM your drone fleet becomes an easy target. No doubt there may well be a time the manned fighter becomes obsolete but it's not there yet, no doubt that time is going to come but it's not there yet.
The Next generation fighter is going to have multiple drones that pair with a manned fighter. This is the step and the US is already developing this tech.
ok so it's an easy target? the missile costs more 😂
You know in that kind of environment, even a manned aircraft’s ability to know where it is, know where the target is, and bring weapons on target is not much better than drones.
@@skellington2000they are too stupid to realize
@@skellington2000 EVERY incoming and outgoing signal is jammable. You just need time to develop your capability.
Elon is confusing the Cybertruck with the F-35 😂
Maybe the idea is to have the drones put on a show for the enemy forces and distract them because no way is a tiny drone going to lift a 2,000 lbs JDAM, let alone carry it hundreds of miles !
Ah, the Cybertruck. Or, as I like to call it, the Incelica.
Yes confronting his views just needs a modicum of common sense when he goes off piste doesn't it. He forgets endless trial and error and missed time timeframes in war is of a wholly different level and risk than wiping out Starships, You need to stay in the fight as you experiment and doing that by making largely unsubstantiated substantially amateurish claims about what will and will not work for a future conflict as if it’s proven fact will get you defeated very quickly.
I'm sure they could build a drone to carry a jdam 100s of miles though.
20 plus wing man drones could put whipping on your enemies not to mention less live casualties.
The cost of training fewer pilots is definitely cost cutting.
regular people has no vision. Elon is talking about the future, not now. but you have to go to the right direction. F35 is reaching an dead end and history will prove it. for unmanned AI plane, Chinese already show a production plane with 20 Ton payload. an AI plane with same or more power will cost less than 1/10th of F35 and NO experienced pilot needed and can be massively produced.
I don't know why you keep apologizing for Elon. He's the epitome of the Dunning Kruger Effect. I don't doubt he's good at what he actually does, but because he's good at that, doesn't make him an expert on air power but he thinks he knows everything.
OK, a few things here. Elon is an entrepreneur and a marketer. He is not an engineer or inventor. Frankly I value his opinion on defense or military matters roughly the same as I value the opinion of career lawyers and politicians on such things. A pilot can not be jammed. FULL STOP! Personally I despise the price tag of the 35 and how we shared the IP with our “allies”. Frankly I can’t understand why the 23 being a stealthier and and far longer legged airframe was not put into service.
Elon’s opinion is just that. Given the guy is not an aviator on any level, and I’m fairly certain he has never fired a weapon at a range much less in anger. We don’t need to listen to him.
The F-35 is no more expensive than the F-16.
Elon is an engineer and an inventor...... you might want to reassess your evaluations.
Chill with the conspiracy theories... he's literally the Chief Engineer of SpaceX.
@@liquidsnakex
Again, elon is not an engineer.
He graduated with a BSc in physics and a BA in economics. After graduation, Musk moved to California to pursue a PhD in energy physics, but he left the course in just two days and launched his first company, Zip2, in 1995.
@@bigearl3867 Reality doesn't give two fu cks about what degree you have... he'll still be the Chief Engineer of the most advanced spacecraft company on the planet, whether you like it or not.
Remind me, when are Teslas going to be self driving? Was it 2018? In the 60s we had the "missles will replace aircraft" argument. Pilots are inherently flexible and their command link to the jet can't be hacked
Hey genius what do you think the crew dragon is? It's 100% autonomously flown
@@TheMagicJIZZ thanks, it's been a week since someone has called me a genius. However, I'm struggling to understand your point. Computers are very good at routine, which people are bad at. Computers are very bad at abnormal, which people are good at. So if you can plan it computer's will be good at it, spaceflight is a great example of this, unless something goes wrong. Driving & military flying are bad examples of this, there are too many things which change dynamically. Now, what was your point? Because you can build a robot spacecraft you can build a robot fighter aircraft?
@@FasterLower self driving cars literally have to deal with every type of terrain and city layout plus people and drivers
A plane literally had X Y X in axes in there dimensions of space. Autopilot is already good enough for taking off and landing. Having a jet fully autonomous fighting targets and completing ground attacks
A self driving car with zero people in others driving is easy. It's easy to simulate. The crew dragon literally flies autonomously onto orbit
It raises orbit on its own. You can literally select on the screen where you want to land in the pacific ocean. it calculates this on its own in real-time
There's reason why we can't have autonomous fighter jets with advanced AI dogfighting software attacking based on certain signals for friendlies and enemies
Like right now? Have you been in one? It's 100% a harder problem to solve than flying a jet, targeting or adapting. You've got no idea unfortunately. You can't hack AI... Theres no code to hack. You can emp it, but hey, the pilot goes in that case because not a single pilot today is flying manually or not using avionics. So jammed or hacked are stupid excuses.
What is moving the frontline in Ukraine is Russia using 1500 kg glide bombs against fortified positions at scale.
Surely not a Model S Plaid 😂
And Shovels!
And the mega attacks on logistics and headquarters in the rear with their iskanders.
@@slezyorla Nahh but the cybertruck could be used. But i dont think it will glide that well.
true
Thanks!
GREAT VIDEO! by the way I had taco bell as a midnight snack so now im bouta go sit on the toilet and drop a few elons!
I'm surprised the phrase "Loyal Wingman" didn't come up in this discussion. I personally think that's going to be the "sweet spot" in the autonomy spectrum for like, the next two or three decades. A crewed F-35 "driver" complimented by a swarm of drone wingmen seems to combine the best of both worlds with few of the drawbacks.
Also the F-35 has become surprisingly cheap per copy at this point-- if we need any sort of manned presence at all on the aerial battlefield they might as well be sitting in F-35s.
leader need this vision to spend money on it.
Elon says "edgy" BS to get attention. Remember, this is the same guy who made serious, false allegations about an expert diver trying to rescue children from a cave, and it was all because Elon couldn't be the hero.
F-35 is the cheapest airplane, as we speak. As per multiple US red flag exercises, the F-35 the kill ratio is 1:20 with 4gen aircraft. Why would you rather purchase 20 F-16s or FA-18s instead of single F-35??? If F-35 is roughly double the cost of F-16/FA-18, the F-35 is no brainer the cheapest air offense/defence period.
on over priced flying turkey is what it is lol
F-35 doesn't have the ability to defeat 20 F-16s. In multiple exercises F-35 accomplished it's mission. WVR the 20 to 1 goes to F-16. F-35 is actually more expensive than 4th generation jets like the F-16 and F-18 in the at the same point of it's lifespan. As jets get older maintance cost goes up. Why would you purchase 20 F-18s or F-16s. Because they generate more sorties than F-35 and are cheaper new. Also numbers are on the battlefield can help. You can overwealm the enemy. But mostly you might buy them for flight hours. Than you have F-15 EX which has more range and carries more missiles than F-35.
Jack of all trades and master of none, is often times better than master of one. That is the saying.
It's one of those quaint sayings that got reversed - like "blood is thicker than water" means the opposite of what everyone thinks it does.
Mr X's engineers didn't tell him that one. You can't appropriate what you haven't had explained to you.
That's literally not true, the "is often times..." was added later by people who wanted to combat the common saying. You can actually look that up and see I'm right. However, neither version of the statement applies here, as the F-35 was designed for a specific purpose and fills that specific purpose. It might apply if it was trying to be an F-15 and A-10, but it's not.
@@ncwolfe I looked it up. Apparently the original phrase was "jack of all trades" (16 century), with "master of none "added later (18th century), and the "is often times" added even later (21st). All comes down to if you consider specialization vs generalization to be preferable.
Mover, you hit the nail on the head in reference to Elon’s comments on the F-35, or military planning in general… “from a position of somebody who doesn’t know air power”… I go further and say… from of position of somebody with no military or combat experience! It’s an insult for those of us who have served (33 years in my case).
Can we do better than taking 20 years to deliver a new capability??? Yes, we did it in WWII. That crap definitely needs to be fixed. The problem is not the defense industrial base alone, it’s Congress and districts that want good paying jobs.
As for autonomous AI-driven drones??? Sure, two words: cyber warfare.
Remember, there is a reason why at the one company he worked at which he didn’t control, Elon got fired in the first six months due to his incompetence.
Remember, there is a reason why Elon gets insecure and lashes out when he is challenged… or even just receives questions in spaces that have scientists and engineers.
Remember, there is a reason why at Elon’s companies there are people whose job description is basically to keep Elon away from the actual operations of the business
How is the Cybertruck automated driving program doing ?
Fantastic, they're dropping Version 13 soon. Might wanna check that out
Extremely well? I mean. Not sure what your comment implies. The tesla self driving is literally decades ahead of anything else.
The difference between a human and software is that software can only make pattern-matched decisions on data it has access to from the past and whereas a human has imagination and intuition to adapt to situations where there is no relevant data. Software will get more and more capable, but it will always be limited.
Human ability to improvise is only relevant when there is time. For air combat while in the air, it’s mostly pattern matched decisions based on existing data even for humans, there’s even a fancy word for it, Training.
@@xuansu9036 - That's true if you are in a predefined dogfight or SAM evasion mode but there are many other scenarios where a unique situation occurs and AI will likely fail. Consider the Battle of Midway or Battle of Brittain and if humans had not done illogical actions then the outcome might have been total failure. Creativity and thinking outside the box will always be the purview of humans even though they have many other problems relative to AI robots.
@@WJV9 if we use AI program that plays game of Go as example, AI is actually much more creative than humans.
@@xuansu9036because Go has fixed parameters and relatively simple mechanics. in a game of Go, you are not going to randomly see a previously undefined card, or a play using a previously unspecified game mechanic. a human will still adapt to a novel situation like that faster.
to give a reductive example for the sake of explanation, suppose you train a convolutional neural network on pictures or pigs and horses. with a decent labelled training set, you can build an impressively accurate predictive model as long as you only give it pictures of pigs and horses to predict. now you give it a picture of a dog - itll think its a pig or horse. perhaps you configure a "uncertain" category for these situations, but then what about a bright green pig with black stripes? the model will be uncertain, whereas a human will recognise it as a new type of pig. obviously this example is super basic, and there can workarounds for *anticipated* situations and edge cases, but hopefully it illustrates my point.
Drone light shows aren't unique to China. We have them here too and some events are replacing fireworks with them 😢
Yes, but America's enemies are Musk's big thing. Americans are idiots for allowing what has happened. Russia & co are now in your establishment. Everyone in Europe can see it. Have a nice day.
“Doesn’t know air power in general “ ?
Use the air and space to watch, listen to and kill adversaries while denying them that same ability.
Anyone can guess what air power means in general.
Doesn’t know a thing about it is exactly how Elon has started off most of the successful stuff he’s done so far….He seems to get the hang of it after starting off a little messy. Two of his biggest achievements were in fields other people were long time experts in and they were probably all saying he’s an idiot and it will never work.
That said, I do personally think some of his ideas are just plain dumb. But using unmanned aircraft to fight and even replace pilots when technology allows sounds pretty logical.
Heck if we can have autonomous 18 wheelers making deliveries, fighters doesn’t seem like much of a stretch.
Yeah... that's why conmen usually appeal to gullible people I guess
Murphy's Laws of Combat...
And you would be shot down before you knew the 5th gen was even there. The network capabilities alone make 4th gen obsolete in modern long range missle exchanges.
You are making the people who marketed 5th gen so happy right now.
4th, 4.5 and 5th gen all have datalink, if a 5th gen acts as an AWACS for 4th gen, the 4th gen can still do damage (and at a cheaper cost).
network capabilities can be bolted to nearly any plane. Long range missiles can be mounted on about any upgraded 3rd gen or newer plane.
A 5th plane turning its radar on, will be detected by 3rd gen if its electronics are fully up-to-date. And that is exactly what the F-35 is, just a expensive platform. The systems bolted on to it,makes it effective The plane, design and capabilitys as fighter, nope.
@@ToreDL87..True. Gripen Es from Sweden can use targeting data from the F35As their neighbours use to swat any dumb Putinist aircraft trying to head to them. Hypothetically.
Especially with the Gripen E having the Meteor, it would be a perfect pair. F35s being like the special forces directing fire at enemy positions undetected from artillery or other assets.
6th gen NGAD concept contains manned fighters with unmanned companions called Loyal Wingman. It’ll be costly but the best of both worlds. You have to spend $ to stay on top.
Not just 6th gen, the 'Loyal Wingman' program is also being designed to operate alongside the F35.
I'm 35 years old, have never had a girlfriend, and am 5 years away from being able to do a really accurate halloween costume of The 40 Year Old Virgin. I say all this to establish just exactly how little I know about having sex, so that I can confidently point out that Elon Musk knows less about the military than I know about fucking.
Well that's unfortunate for you and the D.o.D., 'cause Elon is taking a shovel and bucket to the later.
@@MicMc539 No he is not! Elon has no power. Z-E-R -O ! He can tweet shit about the F-35 until hell freezes over, doesn't mean Trump is going to move on it. Trump relies mainly on Pete Hedseth for Military decisions. That is the opinion you want to watch for. Also, Congress is not going to easily let the F-35 get cancelled. There were many attempts for the executive branch to cancel the A-10 and its still around because of Congress.
This is the best comment I've see all day 😭😭
Bull. If you were really as described, you'd be a massive Elon stan.
This comment needs to be put on a fucking plaque in UA-cam's Comment HOF room.
Thank you! I absolutely HATE WHEN PEOPLE SAY “fighter jet”. I actually called out the website “the War Zone” when I said “saying fighter jet is redundant and stupid, and it makes you sound uneducated. The method of propulsion is irrelevant, and we don’t say B-2 “bomber jet”, or P-51 “fighter propeller” or “fighter piston engine” do we? No. So just call it “fighter” or “fighter aircraft”, or even “fighter plane”. The editor at the time straight up replied and said “ I’m going to make sure we make sure we call them “fighter jets”. I said “when you interview people in the Pentagon or military, do the pilots say “fighter jet?” I’m goin to bet they don’t and you sound like an amateur saying that.
Fast forward to 2023…..they started to subtly drop the “jet” and just call them “fighter”. Of course, no credit given to the military guy who told them not to do it in the first place.😂
The main argument is that we can't know what we will know until the weapons start flying. At that point, each side will adapt. The classic sentiment of "your enemy also gets a vote" predicts that our predictions about how a war will be fought will change. Second is capabilities, to bridge the gap of ignorance into warfighting capability, our unmanned systems need information. This is what a large and networked series of platforms bring. This means that there isn't one kind of drone, system, program, datalink, aircraft, or weapon. Everything will have its niche. Technology development follows this pattern: diversity, complexity, and expansion (what it can be applied to). Future war will have more of each of those values and we need many smart people (not just one smart man) to make the warfighting a reality.
It's hard to take a guy who knows nothing of our secret systems and capabilities and listen to him with any degree of seriousness. Even if he were granted clearance, he couldn't talk about it anyway (nor would he want to...), so anything he says is going to be a largely uninformed opinion of someone outside the circle of trusted persons who know the stakes and capabilities of our weapons and our adversaries.
lot of people forget elon's HYPERLOOP. We are all riding on hypeloop nowadays.
guess you forgot his rockets that can land themselves 😂
Or the tunnels we have to use with our cars
@@david7384 NASA's DC-X did that way back in the 90s with far less computing power than we have today.
While only a proof on concept for vertical takeoff and landings, maybe Enron MuZk -head of Teslanos - took knowledge from that?
If he didn't, it doesn't make a good engineer to re-invent the wheel.
@@david7384 Wich where invented by actual engineers and patented BEFORE he got into the company.
@@gottagowork you're clearly an example of the people that lack nuance like the dude was saying in the clip above.
obviously elon musk is kind of a big dumdumb and a manchild with a massive ego and a snake oil salesman and nobody is getting hyperlooped onto mars with their electric supercars with the cold gas thrusters through the tesla tunnels and recharging their brain implants with their solar roof tiles on their heads while on the way there in order to arrive on mars by 2015 and set up a new civilization or whatever..
but at the same time, it's not like it's just empty air between his ears. he's clearly smart in some ways and has done a very good job with his satellite internet and his rockets that can now do some really impressive stunts, and he has created a company for electric cars that while admittedly being pretty low quality and filled with ridiculous promises of super duper artificial intelligence nonsense that may accidentally swerve into oncoming traffic and kill you instead of driving you is still a very successful company that is worth a lot of money and that has sold a whole bunch of vehicles over the last decade or whatever.
so i don't know why you wanna take that away from him. i really don't think that anybody else has created giant towers with giant metal arms to catch giant rockets the size of skyscrapers in order to be able to rebuild them and get more than single use out of them. it's pretty cool stuff. sure as heck ultimately accomplished more than you and me.
no need to be petty and bitter and to attempt to take his accomplishments away from him. you can just be a normal person and be like "yep elon musk is a big baby and a massive egomaniac that has pushed a lot of ridiculous scams, but his rockets and satellites are pretty cool and his cars are alright" and just wish him the best when it comes to doing more of the cool useful stuff and less of the scams in the future.
it's not really that deep or that complicated. people can have both good and bad qualities and both successes and failures. it doesn't have to be a pick between one or the other.
"Ai" as it is sold to the public nowadays shouldn't be called Ai in my opinion, because it is NOT intelligent at all. We are still waaaayyyyy away from real human-like intelligence.
Elon is trying to scare us with Ai and what it could be, because he's just trying to make publicity, and that's it... He knows well at which stage Ai is currently (or maybe he is not...).
Ai that we have today is "dumb" Ai, it's just a tool maybe to help or assist on certain task and that's it... But we are still lightyears away from '2001 space odyssey' Ai.
People just don't understand how complex the humain mind, intelligence and brain is, And that is not something that's going to be replicated artificially soon, not in the near future that's for sure.
Now onto the Military aviation domain, can a Ai drone beat a real pilot in a 5 minutes dogfight ? Yeah maybe, but can it replace a real Pilot involved in a campaign/war with all its correlated complexity (like situation assessment, observation, judgement, experience, etc...) NOWAY. We will have to wait a looonnng time before that happen.
Like I said Ai is just a tool to assit on certain specific tasks and that's it !
An LLM can give you something that sounds exactly like HAL from 2001, the problem is that the output is unstructured, and, like you say, devoid of all intelligence. There is no meaning, no common sense, no concept of truth or fiction. That fancy human like response is just mindless generative prediction. The computer doesn't even 'know' it's doing this, computers don't know anything! They are finite state machines, we built them, there is no magic. If you want to see the best we can do right now, look no further than Siri, Alexa, Google, Bixby, and so on: Hey, turn on the flashlight: Here's what google has to say about "turning on a fleshlight".
He is trying to do with AI, what he did to SpaceX, and Tesla. He places himself as the authority on the topic, and scare mongers about the effects if he isn't in charge. Elon has a destructive God Complex that is darker than the casual observer knows. Read biographies on Elon. Read his insane Tweets. He is not all there, and his speech as become more, and more palsied.
You have no idea what you're talking about. I'm a software engineer and modern "AI", which are massive trained neural nets, will blow your mind.
You are so wrong its almost funny
@@ioijiopjkiopjkpif they are so good, why do we still need software engineers
If somebody hacks our drone fighters...they can use them against us...
Our pilots can't be turned against us...
Oh yes they can 😂 they can be propagandized to do evil things against their own citizens.
@bobbyraejohnson true...but that's a much more complicated and involved endeavor...than a clever 17 year old in a basement somewhere...with a laptop...lol
You guys are giving Elon a bit too much praise. The one thing I'll give him is that he's able to get the brightest minds and convince people to do something in an unconventional way that normally wouldn't be done in most buisnesses. However, this approach isn't always a good thing and especially recently we've seen him doing this same tactic in much lower quality ways.
I think a manned fighter used in conjunction with a few drones it will control is the best scenario here.
That's literally what they're doing with the F-35
What's the speed, range, and service ceiling of drones? Even suggesting that F-35s aren't needed is so degrading to morale and national security.
We absolutely still need fighters. Your back pack drones are not going to provide air defense at 35,000 feet. Own the sky, dominate the ground.
The fighter pilot themselves are also still needed inside the jet to make decisions and to fly with true stealth.
I'm just a silly 18 year old, what do I know?
the military is NOT a business
Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) does not appear to be a Congress-authorized-and-funded Federal entity
The problem with always being the smartest guy in the room is that you start telling yourself you're an expert on everything, even things you have no clue about. The dumbest E-1 working the flight deck of the Carl Vinson knows more about carrier operations than Elon Musk does, and they don't let that guy cut entire defense programs. Edit: Also, anyone who's almost sh*t their pants because their Tesla decided to slam on the emergency brakes doing 80 in the middle of a deserted highway will probably tell you that Elon's confidence in AI might be a bit misplaced.
That 'drone swarm' would fall prey to even this old beast : en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8.8_cm_Flak_18/36/37/41
In the broader context, Elon is looking to trim the defense budget. My concern is that he might begin cutting programs like F-35 procurement (and promotion to foreign markets) without understanding the necessity and interconnection of what he's removing. The F-35 is more than a single combat platform, it's an integral component of our modern multi-domain combat strategy. Beyond that, it's a geopolitical tool which enables the US to be at the center of the defense needs of allied nations and even to entice the cooperation of countries who might want to get under our umbrella.
There are valid complaints of every combat weapon system's development. Commonly, the F-35 is ridiculed for its high development and maintenance costs. Given that the F-35 should be regarded as three separate aircraft with commonalities, its cost is not as outrageous as it seems. In comparison to the only other 5th generation aircraft in US service, the F-35's per unit cost is far less than the F-22.
For the most part, mainstream awareness of the F-35 has been influenced by adversaries like Russia and China who want Western voters to be unduly concerned and misinformed about the effectiveness and capabilities of the aircraft.
At the moment AI isn't ready to take combat roles from human decision making and, given the concerns he has expressed in the past about the dangers of AI, I would be surprised to see Elon support giving AI such autonomy over weapon systems.
As a fan of SpaceX and their design philosophies, I don't think the same process used to design Starship can be applied to the design of systems meant to deploy weapons.
problem is elon is the stupidest person in the room at all times except around tRump but he just isnt smart enough to figure it out. he knows little to nothing about space or spacecraft either ... he is currently trying to get to the 1960's but hasnt figured out nasa already has done what he is trying to do and he cant seem to understand ctrl+c then ctrl+v
Our modern multi-domain combat strategy is terrible cause we have not won a war with a decent power since WW2 we spend trillions of dollars on defense stuff with nothing to show for it. The USA is on the weakest economic footing that it has ever been.
excellently articulated comment. It should be pinned, IMHO - Especially the part about Chinese and Russian disinformation campaigns designed to affect public opinion and thus, official actions
The F-35 admittedly had quite some toothing problems, but at present it appears all these start-up problems are ironed out
Its strength appears to be its electronics, its economy of scale (1000+ built, 3000,+ projected) and its reliability. A plane like that can project power with heavy missiles, something that a fleet of cheap drones can't.
I didn't hear the Israeli's complain about its performance
I suspect it will be decades before it becomes obsolete (which of course it will inevitably become).
Good video, guys!
If they did have complaints about its performance, I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be made as a public announcement.
reliability: nope
@@gottagoworkyeah, they wouldn’t use it. But they did
Common folk act like the F-35 is the only fighter that's ever had teething issues.
No F-22s have crashed since it's R&D years and that was one jet.
When you can deploy multiple drones like that with the same time and distance capabilities of an F-35 then yes, maybe they will replace Fat Amy. Until then, hard no!
Google range and dwell time of MQ9 and RQ4.
Google range and dwell time of F-35
A pilot is under stress from G's and sitting in a confined space wondering where the enemy is.
A drone operator is sitting in an airconditioned Conex wondering where his Monster Energy Drink went.
Which one is under more stress and afraid of dying?
@@wrayday7149 now factor in payload capabilities and radar cross-section. there are things you can put on fat amy that you can't put on an MQ9 and places you can sneak the stealth fighter in but you can't the drone etc.
@@wrayday7149 Is an MQ9 or RQ4 survivable in a contested environment? No. You really should listen @cpthf3535 as it appears he knows quite a bit more than you.
@@cpthf3535you could make fat Amy a drone. The issue is being 100% confident in the decision chain of the drone. It has to be capable of autonomous action. Autonomous action with faulty, and possibly constantly changing, information.
@ I would not consider the Reaper or the Hawk in the same category as the off the shelf battery operated drones shown in his video. Get real. 🤨
The F-15EX, KC-46, and A-10 are all jobs programs that the USAF never wanted. The USAF does want to the F-35 and had been buying 48 per year for nearly a decade.
Former C-130E/H Crew Chief here, 1999-2009 after growing up on Navy bases. I have seen a ton of ridiculous waste and experiments pushed on the Navy/USAF.
Veteran Alex Hollings on his UA-cam channel "Sandboxx" takes on Elon Musk's buffoonish take on military fighters vs. drones. He demolishes every one of Musk's claims dispassionately, supported by facts and logic. After watching Hollings give the reality of where our military technology is today with the integration of manned fighters, drones and AI it's clear that Musk has no clue as to what he's talking about. It would seem he's either trying to cast doubt in the public eye of the viability and necessity of the F-35 or he's just looking for attention. Either way it shows Musk is way out of his league and should go back to keeping his self driving cars from running people over.
8:20 Fun Fact: The word "man" derives from Old English "mann" (itself derived from Proto-Indo-European *mon or *monn) which simply meant "person" and did not indicate gender. "Wermann" meant male person (which also gave us werewolf, meaning "man-wolf"). Wifmann meant female person, hence "wife".
Jack of all trades, master of none,
But often times better than a master of one. Remind us of how that driverless car is going Heron Mask.
Its going pretty well. But not from Tesla.
Numerous armed services around the world are not just buying but routinely using F-35s. I've seen them in flight. I'm still waiting to see my first driverless car. I know various militaries are experimenting with driverless vehicles, but they won't be making present model driver dependent cars redundant any time soon.
Dude doesn't know people are literally using Telsa auto pilot daily and have thus travelled 1,610 millions miles without intervention and it is predicted to require 6Billion miles to achieve Full Self driving. Do you people realize that technology has a optimization growth curve and you don't snap your fingers & have said technology y'all are going to very dissapointed when code flies these jets better than your favourite pilot.
@@geraldg350 Muskovite doesn't know that that car's not going far without a driver anytime soon and will be disappointed waiting for that unsupported AI to do more than support roles for the manned aircraft.
@@bluecedar7914 Being a luddite doesn't stop technological progress nobody said it's going to happen soon. You do realize that technology has a optimization growth curve that is non linear? and you saying all that AI will ever do is a support role for a manned aircraft is the dumbest thing ever being that is the hill you are going to die on carry on. I'll bet my left testicle between you and Musk you're the most likely to be dissapointed about the future simply from your inability to predict something as simple at this.
Elon is a tech investor not Tony Stark.
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
The F35 is a platform. Sensors cover all around them. The pilot sits staring straight ahead at the screens. You just need to place that pilot on the ground with a reliable connection to the aircraft. The aircraft can then be lighter and pull far more G's.
To quote Foghorn Leghorn, Elon, "is about as sharp as a sack of wet mice".
What does that make you? I'm pretty sure he is smarter than you.
@@timcro1966 My Elon fanboy detector is blaring on this comment!
@@kevinhorne9643 comment from a really smart "keyboard worrier" who wouldn't dare mock Elon as stupid in a public gathering like a typical school yard Bully.
@@timcro1966 True intelligence is knowing what you don't know. Elon knows nothing about fighter aircraft and the missions they perform.
@@timcro1966 lol. He didn't even finish his degree at university, and has no technical qualifications whatsoever. You don't have to smart to be rich, you just have to be willing to screw over lots of other people in favour of yourself.
I am in agreement. When the situation is splitting hairs; you want a living, breathing pilot in the equation that gives final authority. To make the judgement call.
The dude has 12 kids with 3 different women.
Do you guys *really* believe he’s going to take inputs from others?
only from that ketamine addled smooth brain hes got floating around with plenty of x-tra empty space in his skull.
😂 why do I have a feeling you people hate him more because of politics.
@@bobbyraejohnson no discount temu tony stark, stoney tart is just plain bad at everything. misses all his delivery dates, over promises and under delivers, tries to take credit for other peoples accomplishments, has skin so thin he makes glass frogs seem like rhinos, has bilked investors, has stolen tax dollars and failed to deliver what was promised. there is a ton more stuff this failure of a pile of carbon has failed on.
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
Cant remotely fly every combat mission from the US. You'd need to react faster than the signal would arrive in some cases, like air-to-air combat. That would be a big limiting factor.
I'd also say Elon is financially invested in China to some extent, right? Would China like to see f-35 production axed? Probably. I'm sure they and Russia both couldnt believe how lucky they were when f-22 production was stopped, considering how far at least one of them closed that gap since. 50/50 whether Elon makes an actual effort to cancel the f-35
Elon the famous defense analyst and specialist in air power, rich guy who never gets told no.
I'm sure he has, but instead of learning a lesson, would instead take that 'no' as inspiration to find ways around the 'no' to his advantage to get what he wanted.
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
I feel a lot better having pilots flying than some armed AI autonomous system flying around. We all saw Terminator.😮
Elon also doesn't like:
>Lidar or non-optical sensors for self-driving cars, hence Tesla squandering their lead in FSD
>launch abort systems for crew aboard Starship
>content moderation
>free speech when it comes to Ukraine or criticising Elon
Same guy who has bullshitted the world regarding AI-enabled Full Self Driving and is currently trying to pass off their Optimus robot as anything nearly as capable as Boston Dynamics Atlas? This guy has opinions on autonomous fighter jets?
Thanks, but I'll pass. He's a crypto huckster and a vapourware salesman.
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
Any unmanned has to have a downlink in order to be controlled.. that datalink can be jammed.. then you either lose the drone/mission or need to have it to be autonomous.. and do you really want an autonomous drone shoting weapons? can you garantee it wont mistake allies with enemies ..or civilians?..
Sorry i just dont see them replacing meatballs...at least entirelly/majority
Hes said AI
@@mp40submachinegun81 wich takes us to problem 2: Would you trust an AI to make war for you?
@@sparrowltThe enemy will.
@@mp40submachinegun81 The same ai that currently cant even think outside the box and can only do stuff it was programmed to do by people? That fails when asked for cake recipies? That ai should be capable of reading and understanding a conflict zone?
@@zombi111980 you do know that all AI is not the same, right?
Aegis already uses AI specifically for that issue of reading and understanding the conflict zone. That exists and is active duty. The only difference is that Aegis still has someone pushing the button.
People keep not mentioning one thing that I find important. How high can these drones fly in comparison to a military aircraft?
Elon - " Introducing the Cyber Jet "
Flying fridge with wings...
Who cares what he means😂😂😂😂
Kinda funny about the guy who runs two engineering companies doesn't understand how G limits work on fighters.
he doesnt understand much of anything really just barel knows where his next ketamine fix is.
The full quote is: Jack of all trades, master of none is often more useful than a master of one.
Unless that Jack charges a lot more than the Master at that sector, and that Jack comes late and made many mistakes as well
There are a few problems when you have an endless amount (a bottomless pit) of funds coming in, this 35 is the result. If you subtract all that, you have an F-18.
*I am on the "Elon has too much money"* side. The money gives him power, and he can influence things in arenas he has no business messing with. People give way too much weight to everything he says. [Note: 10:25-Where is the evidence that Elon is a "genius"? And "genius" in what area? There are *NO* "geniuses" in *ALL* areas at once. People give his views more weight than they deserve simply because he is rich. He did NOT build those Space X rockets. He did not build any of the systems in them. He did NOT build Tesla or engineer any of the vehicles-he HIRED engineers to do these things. Where is the evidence that he is a genius, and in what area?]
*I am also on the Mover's side concerning the human element.* How often must we explore this, get burned, and back up again? The most efficient system may end up being a human with 5-20 drones, I don't know. What I _am_ confident of is that the most efficient system (because morality will always be an issue) will include a human being. Despite the false analogy of comparing a computer to make decisions faster than a human, no AI can take an unexpected situation and bring various perspectives to bear on a solution as a human can. AI can _only_ process algorithms humans have trained it to do. If an unforeseen element is brought into the scenario, the AI is limited to only the algorithms the programs have given it to deal with the new information, which may not be applicable.
We don’t even know how to make general ai Elon is talking about. Everything we have now is literally thinking inside the box; it craps out as soon as you give it a novel problem.
Remember that Elon is in the same friend group as Palmer Lucky’s Anduril Industries Autonomous Military Drone company. Elon’s tweet (which he boosted on his own social media platform) is just an advertisement for Anduril Roadrunner or Boeing Ghostbat fast jet drones
Anyone else think its strange that the man who is against manned fighters because they are "obsolete" and a drone can do anything a manned craft can do, and better...still wants to send a crew on a suicide mission to...Mars?!
In Ukraine, FPV drones do pretty much 99% of what CAS was used for 20 years ago. Interdiction and strategic strikes are done exclusively using standoff weapons launched by fighters well behind the frontline. Air superiority fighters like the Su-27 and Su-30 are pretty much just used for air defense. Radar and EO guidance for SAMs has gotten advanced enough that flying over the frontline is pretty much never going to make sense against an enemy with modern air defense. The way you achieve air superiority now is by taking out as much of your enemy's aircraft and drones on the ground as you can. Flying in enemy airspace is already a thing of the past in modern peer-on-peer conflicts.
All true but... what about situations where your enemy lacks effective air defence (Iraq, arguably Russia or the next country the USAF wants to/is told to bully) and isn't V/STOL the capability that negates/mitigates airfield/launch site destruction? Also, what about the remote briny areas?
@garycheung5135 Non-stealth aircraft would be just as effective in an asymmetric conflict. Also, modern air-to-ground missiles can track and hit individual fighter jets on the ground.
People who say Elon's a genius never seem to think that about Elon when he talks about a field they actually know something about. He's a genius at nothing. He just talks as though he is and people fall for it.
Yep. You got it; bullsh!t baffles brains !
Drone swarms like those in the video he shared, do not address the same problem space that the F-35 does, and Elon surely knows that, because in spite of his bloody-minded trolling nature, he's not stupid. He was shitposting, that's all. That's 90% of what he does online, and it's symptomatic of the fact that even though he's a reasonably intelligent person, he's about as mature as the average 13 year old boy.
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
Translation…
Elon: I want the USA to pay for my AI..
Keep in mind that Elon also wanted to take the people out of car manufacturing, and ended up hiring a whole lot of people because it didn't work without them
Pilots only fly the planes that’s all
I don't get all the hate towards Elon. He is absolutely right. Saying he doesn't know what he's talking about when there have been multiple comprehensive reports which points towards its failures and the astronomical price we've paid to keep the program running. It is a failure, plain and simple. People who focus and analyze on the course of the future know that many things are moving towards autonomous systems. Manned piloting will no longer be necessary and might actually be counter intuitive.
You couldn’t even pass a military test let alone a fast mover test so sit down and shut up.
They’re more hating him because he supported Trump.
Leftists commies are all crying about him. Funny thing is most of them drive Tesla's, lol.
@@BLAZEREN101 huhh? What are you even saying? Make sense.
@@yoparsons80 You just proved my point. To say the future is autonomous is the most moronic thing to ever say. You and Elon are completely wrong. The clear as day example of modern war is happening as i type and what do you think is happening. It has gone BACK to classic warfare with trenches and artillery making the difference. This IS opposite of what most war pundits thought a modern war would play out.
This includes manned pilots used by Israel infiltrating successfully which can turn the tide of their war. There's no doubt much like all programs from companies AND government there is waste but that is life.
Elon can't even get his cars to navigate roads properly yet you think it'll work in war? You have zero clue.
You couldn't even code a simple command in C-prompt let alone know what it takes AI/coding wise.
Elon Musk has never been to war. He is playing at war like Tony Stark. He is a genius who lacks practical context.
A lot of people who designed the f-35 didn’t go to war either. So that’s a dumb thing to say. You don’t have to go to combat to know the F-35 ain’t bad but is unreliable.
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.
Careful Lads, don't criticise Space Karen
Gonky, Elon is not a genius, he just had a rich father, like Trump…ugh
🎯
Autonomous drones aren't anywhere near prepared to do the job of a human in a fighter jet.
did he just call the people at Lockheed/skunk Works idiots…
I would call the people who wrote the specifications fpr the F-35 stupid. Lockheed just had to do their best to get that thing flying somehow and i bet there where many engineers who thought the same as Elon
I like Elon, but I wish he'd keep it to his businesses.
I liked him about 3 years ago. He is on a spiral right now.
Elon has becoming a shining example of the Dunning Kruger effect.