Just after finishing training I bought a 1966 Cherokee 180 for 45k minimal IFR. It was just a little faster than 172. Flew this beauty for 10 years, 600hrs. Cheaper than Cessna, easier to fly, excellent for a person in my situation. (Older, 64, female) Later sold part ownership. At 74 stopped flying. What a wonderful ride!!
You can be co-pilot at any flying school at whatever plane you like.... We all rented/renting planes to fly around, you indeed member of the flying community.
This was a good rundown, thanks for posting! My first airplane purchase was a 172 XP, which was relatively cheap to buy in decent shape ($45K), cheap to run and maintain (9-10 GPH running LOP), and a great plane to do a lot of learning in. I flew it 200+ hours in the 2 years I owned it, flew my PP check ride in it, and loved it. But like you, I found it just did t have the long legs my mission required. I looked at Bonanzas, but the Mooneys were just so much better in the areas I cared about. I bought a M20K (231) and have never looked back. I liked all the features you named, but I also liked the Mooneys’ safety record, which a lot of people are not aware of. I’ve flown 150+ hours per year in the 3 years Ive owned her, most of that XC, and most of that above 12,000 MSL. It gets me and my family where we need to go quickly and safely. Great community, great technical support, just an awesome marque.
Mooney's are great planes. I have many hours in them. But my favorite is the Cessna 177RG. Fast, economical, roomy and comfortable! No strut for outstanding visibility, 48 inch cabin width, two wide doors, and 142 kts cruise on 10 gph with 60 gallon tanks!
Thanks for the comment, I agree the Mooney is great but can find greatness in many planes. The Cardinal has a lot of awesome qualities which you have listed!
When I was young, my father owned a Bellanca Viking (predecessor to the Super Viking). Old school craftsmanship. One of the best wings in aviation. And, fast. I miss those days and that plane.
They seem like a good bargain right now too, maybe the Super Viking. I think people are afraid of the old school materials a bit (although they shouldn’t be)
So, I learned to fly in the Navy. While stationed abroad, I'd join the Navy Flying Club that was on base, if they had one. Depending on where I was at, we had all sorts of aircraft, from Cessna 150's, 152's, 172's, 182's, Piper Cherokees, Beech Barons and T-34's that active duty and family could rent. After I left the Navy, when I decided to look for an aircraft to own, I looked at many flavors and settled on a '77 Grumman Tiger AA-5B. Long story short, I wanted something that was simple to fly, economical to maintain, had great performance and range, was sporty and was easy to learn to fly when my kids decided to get into aviation. I've owned that same aircraft for several years now and, since then, my son has used it to get his private, instrument, commercial and CFI. We both fly it together for training as well as pleasure, taking it to Oshkosh whenever we can. My wife and daughters have no interest in flying GA, so the Tiger is a perfect fit for our needs. We've just completed a full panel upgrade, replacing the plastic panel with a treated aluminum, power coated panel, replaced the original A/I and HSI with two Garmin G5's, added a Garmin USB power port, and moved some instruments around to make it more user friendly. It makes instrument flying a dream. My only regret is not spending the cash on an autopilot, but that will come later. The Tiger is fast.. 140 KTAS at 8,500' MSL burning 8.5 to 9.5 GPH at 2600 RPM running 50 ROP. She holds 51 gallons usable fuel. We are based in Broomfield, Colorado (KBJC), just 25 miles north of Denver, so dealing with density altitude is always a challenge, but the Tiger does well with the Lycoming O-360 pumping out 180 HP. We just fly with tabs full to reduce the takeoff weight. That still gives us 38 gallons of usable fuel for a cross country. The Tiger is fun to fly.. very maneuverable and light on the controls. Like your Mooney, it loves to fly, so slowing it down on approach and landing can be a challenge for the new pilot. But, if you fly by the numbers and fine tune your technique, it's a breeze to make those landings a greaser. The large rudder is an excellent tool for handling crosswinds as there is plenty of rudder authority. The best feature of all is the sliding canopy. I just love that fighter pilot feeling it gives you... that, and it's great for those hot days as we can open it up about 1/4 way to cool things down. We just have to keep the airspeed under 113 KIAS per the POH. Congrats on your choice of the Mooney and have fun with it. Looking forward to many more videos from you. Here's a link so some videos of past flights we've made... ua-cam.com/channels/Yp1lsafqwcgdhMwwGx9ULA.htmlvideos
So awesome, what an amazing bond I’m sure you and your son have flying! I know many people who absolutely love the Grumman! I appreciate you watching!!!
Until I was forced out by the cost of flying I flew 150s up to 177s. The 150 was the most fun and a lot like flying a leaf! I really enjoyed putting it through everything it was capable of!!
I went through the same process a year ago and came to the same conclusion. I wanted something faster than a 172, reasonably efficient, a decent load carrying capability, and a good value. I really had my heart set on a V-tail Bonanza just because I think it’s the coolest looking GA plane ever made. Mooneys weren’t really on my list because I had no experience with them whatsoever and I had heard that they were really tight inside. I got to get up close to one while I was on the road with my job. Not as tight as everyone complains about. I happened to find one close to me for sale and thought I would go check it out on a whim. It was a beautiful M20J that had been loved on by it’s two airline pilot owners with one of them being in A&P with IA. He had gone through through it spinner to tail taking care of every issue. When I started talking to him about performance and efficiency, it just started ticking off every box that I had set. I finally realized that my mission would be 99% flying by myself and that I wanted something fast and efficient. There was no choice left. This Mooney was it! The acquisition cost was tens of thousands of dollars less than any other comparable plane of the same vintage. The reputation it has, as far as it being difficult to land, is absolute hogwash for anyone who knows how to fly a plane by the numbers. The one problem I had… I had to learn how to get it to slow down. Not a bad problem to have! I was able to complete a bucket list item with my Mooney. I flew from central Ohio to Tampa, Florida NONSTOP and got to land at the airport I taught at in my own airplane! PRICELESS!
I have found that most people who complain about Mooney's being "cramped" have never actually been in one. Unless you are trying to stuff 4 NBA players into a short-body, there's is more than adequate room. I think people see them sitting on the ground with the pilot seats fully aft against the bench and start jumping to conclusions. I fly my C with my seat fully forward for takeoff/landing, and one notch back from that in cruise - my rear passenger has *more* foot space than i do in both of those positions. As far as it being difficult to land.... I met my Mooney at W75 with its 2,000' runway. Landed there several times in my first few days of ownership, and never once needed more than half the runway to stop. Like you said - fly it by the numbers and everything is fine.
Chicken Kriket's I left from OSU and flew to ZPH (cheap gas) before a quick hop to TPF. Flight time was just a little under 5 hours and I burned about 42 gallons.
I’ve owned a 150, 172 and a Mooney. Mooney was my favorite. Took trips from Oklahoma to Oshkosh, Orlando and flew Angel Flights to Houston. No longer flying but attend OSH annually and will forever be a Mooniac!
There also is something to be said by the cockpit "feel." If you sit down in the pilot seat of a large Cessna, like a 210, 205, or 206, you notice that the dashboard panel goes way up in your face, esp. on the ground. The Mooney, OTOH, makes you feel like a fighter pilot. The controls are even more sensitive on the Mooney, and they are placed just right. Easy comparison: One is a steam locomotive; the other is an extension of you. It just FEELS good to pilot a Mooney.
Mooney is a great plane, but not for faint of heart or low time private pilot. Tricky to fly, insurance is up there and you need at least 7-10 hrs with an instructor before solo in one. Gotta have your comolex and high performance endorsement and 400 hrs recommended in last 3 yrs too, not to mention they sit much lower than a bonanza or 172. The old V-tail again not a good first airplane choice. Need the complex and high performance and at least 400 hrs. I'd also recommend all ppl candidates go take sine aerobatic lessons and learn about spins and recovery. We get spin training during the commercial phase... A C-172 or a Cherokee 140/160 are good entry level planes for the ppl student. And even for IFR. The next move up would be a C-182 or 206/207 are the work horses. A Cherokee 160 or 180 or a Cherokee 6 or a A33/34 Bonanza. Work your way up. I now or rather knew far to many now passed pilots that bought way more airplane than they could handle and paid the ultimate sacrifice with loss of their life, by having too much $, which doesn't equal safe or making a good informed decision. Just because you CAN buy it, doesnt mean you SHOULD buy it. And never be in a hurry to get anywhere, for anyone, ever. Also, get-there-itis is a widower of general aviation pilots. Lastly, do NOT play with mother nature in a plane. As Arnold Shwartzeniger says, you will lose..
I respect your opinion, but disagree on the difficulty of flying a Mooney. At least the C model we have. It’s proven to be quite easy to fly for a coupe of 150 hour pilots.
Piper Cherokee 235 was my first plane. I paid 35,000 for a 1964 model. 1400 pound useful load and 800nm+ range. It is rated IFR. Downside 14/gph and not that fast 130 kts. Great family cruiser if you will do regional travel 300-600nm.
Own a 1973 Cessna 172M. Have had it for almost 3 years and it’s been great. Did the interior and installed an engine monitor among other things. Amazing experience. I want to get my instrument rating and then step up to a Mooney M20J because it’s fast, low maintenance and low operating cost. Prefer a cosmetically in bad shape airplane that O can fix, but airframe and engine in excellent condition. Expect to do the switch in Q1 2021. Remember, the Bonanza flights fast because of the engine, Mooneys because of its wings! Thanks Roy Lopresti!
Awesome man, glad your loving the 172! What engine monitor did you put in? I couldn’t have said it better regarding the speed comparison between the BO and the Mooney!
I did a similar thing, what is my mission and what is the best plane. When I lived in Alaska, it was the Cessna 170. Now I am in the lower 48 and I went about the purchase decision for the flying I wanted to do down here, it came down to either a Bellanca Super Viking or a Mooney. I went with a 64 Mooney M20E. I have traveled all over the West and love the aircraft. I wanted the best bang for the buck and this plane is it!
I've owned several planes (including a Bonanza). I have a lot of time in Mooneys from my instructing days. The Mooney is great, but it's hard to work on due to being so tight on space. You get all that speed on low horsepower for a reason...everything is CRAMPED! I also worry about parts since the company is out of business. The Bonanza was more comfortable, but it was also very expensive to maintain. Once you get above a Cherokee or 172, the upkeep really starts killing you. I like them all. If you fit in a Mooney, it's a great choice.
Great run down. I just bought my first plane last Aug and went with the Mooney M20K231. They are great looking planes, can’t get off the ramp without 2 or 3 look-backs at her 😍
Mooneys porpoise like crazy.... A fellow pilot I knew owned a 69 E class. When he bought it, it had some corrosion and it hadn’t flown in over twenty years. With a lot of TLC we got the airplane airworthy. Even though it was the ugliest plane on the ramp, it was beautiful in the air. Unfortunately a few years ago he did a gear up landing and totaled it. I sure miss that plane.
Bummer about the gear up. I can't say that I agree with "porpoise like crazy". You certainly need to be on your airspeed, and understand how weight changes speeds over the numbers, but if you can manage those factors I feel mine lands quite easy.
I've wanted to buy a plane for most of my adult life. My favorites are the Mooney M20, Beechcraft Bonanza and Cessna 177RG (wider cabin than the 172 and no struts obstructing view). Unfortunately, I believe I'm likely going to end up with a 150 or even an old Aeronca Champ simply due to price. I would love to have a 4 place with a comfortable cabin, IFR rated and better range, but I won't need any of that for 60 to 80 percent of the flying I'll be doing and after 30 years of cravings, I want to make this a reality before I'm too old to clear my medical. Also, burning 5 gph vs 9 to 13 gph means I can fly more often. When I want to fly my wife and kids somewhere, I'll have to rent. When it's just me and possibly one skinny passenger, I won't have to check my bank account first. Also, the Aeronca's can burn auto gas or I may get lucky and stumble across one of those IFR 150s for night flying. The majority of the flying I'll be doing over the next few years will just be cruising up and down the coast line and rarely over 100 miles. While I would love to have a plane that could afford me longer distances, more comfort and more passengers, I simply can't fit it in my budget and still have money to fly it, upgrade it and maintain it.
I completely understand your position here. I was mostly in the same place prior to finding a partner to purchase with. If having a bit more plane becomes any more important to you, I’d recommend opening yourself up to the thought of a partnership.
I am in the same boat but I doubt if I can afford a plane. I learned in 79/80 at beech aircraft and had to stop flying about 10 years later due to other hobbies. Last few years i’ve got my medical and gone through ground school to get brushed up. More realistically for me is to continue renting. My night vision is not what it used to be so night flying might be a no go. I used to love flying after dinner. Less traffic and the air is smooth. I could get three touch and goes done in 1/2 hour and then do some sight seeing of the Oc/la basin.
I started looking to buy Spring of 2020. Learned a ton along the way. I walked away from , what I thought were great birds because the seller would not let me take the plane to a separate A&P. They wanted me to use their guy. No way. So I walked and glad I did. Look at Gruman Americans Traveler. 4 place. Comfortable. Reasonable buy in. Upgradeable as you go. Not super fast but 120 or so. I found trade a planes filters a high help. Good luck.
Sounds like you have some solid principles and stuck to your guns, certainly the right choice! I walked away from one because the broker wouldn’t let me inspect as deep as I wanted!
The most often overlooked alternative, in my opinion, is the Bellanca Super Viking. I wasn't even aware of that aircraft as an option before I bought my Mooney M20J. Though I have no regrets, it would have been valuable to know about the Bellanca. Essentially, you can get all the same specs, as far as speed and payload, from a Bellanca at an average of about $15k less. The only downside is that they need a big 300hp flat six to achieve the same top speed as the Mooney with only 200hp. That means they guzzle gas in comparison. Nevertheless, I would put the Super Viking as my #2 choice behind the M20J overall. My #3 would be the V-tail Bonanza.
The Bellanca is a great plane.. the panels aren't setup very well in my opinion.. especially for modern avionics.. difficult/expensive to retrofit too.. also, they tend to have higher maintenance costs.. wood/fabric etc.. great flying planes tho.. fast.. thirsty.. lol.. I had a M20K for years.. love the Mooneys..
I owned a 1976 bellanca super Viking - on cover of AOPA pilot - fabulous aircraft. Fast, ski tube( or golf clubs) true 4 seater, did I mention FAST! I went from cessna 150 to the lycoming 300 up Viking. What a rush. Now back flying a 150. Life goes full circle.
I bought a Mooney back in the early 80's. A M20A, wood wing. Faster than the metal wing with the same engine. Loved it. I could economy cruise at about 150mph and about 5 to 6 gallons per hour. Better than my car and much faster. 170 mph at about 10 gph.
Thanks for helping people learn what things to think through and how to weigh the options against their mission. It’s so hard to learn how to think through these things with zero experience or reference and you’ve made a great video here that I think really helps. Thanks!
the flight school im at currently has 2 c152s, 2 150s, a 150 aerobat, 2 piper warriors and a c172. all the cessnas are ifr rated, and my favourite 152 (G-BNPY) has a different propeller which gives it a much higher cruise speed. It'll usually cruise easily at 100+ KIAS, had it clocking 140knts ground speed on the downwind leg of the circuit one day with a strong tailwind. the other c152 has been kitted out with a full g5 system and i think its an AERA 660 (this navigation is in both of the 152s). they are great planes to fly, okay a bit cramped inside, but at least the 152s do feel a lot more modern than the pipers in the fleet
V-tail Bonanzas have corrosion problems on the magnesium ruddervators with a MSB requiring replacement and few affordable options to comply. Another gotcha on the V-tail is you can take off in CG limits, but land with CG too far back after fuel burn with 4 full size adults. Have operated 3 Beech aircraft including V tail, they are expensive to maintain and operate but handle great in the air. Flying a Mooney 201 now, in my opinion the best Mooney in all payload and performance, operating costs and design trade offs, but will not carry 4 adults with more than 3 hours of fuel. Check for fuel tank seepage, water damage inside cabin structure on pilot side, engine mounts in prebuy but overall not to many issues on preowned Mooneys.
I was looking at a Piper Saratoga that was a steal for $37,000. It was perfect for me even though it was on the higher end of my budget. When I got in for the first time, it flew like a piston version of the Legacy Pilatus PC-12 that I fly for work. Felt amazing and handled well. I went to my bank and they said they'd approve me for financing in 2-3 days. The next day I get a call from the seller telling me someone bought it all cash. I was devastated. I ended up with a Mooney M20J, and while it's not as nice as the the Piper, I still love it
This is a great video Cory. With my experience, the C-152 was never an option. I sat in one at the flight school and the yolk was obstructed by my leg because I'm tall. I Did 2 hours in a M20J before I started flight training and loved it. Since then all my 278 hrs has been in the C-172. Obviously I looked at them 1st now that I've decided to buy an airplane, but they are expensive. People think of them like they are Hondas with great resale value, and they are slow. I started looking at the Pipers becaue they were cheaper and I've always loved low wing design planes. I later found out that the 140 was comparable to the 152 and under powered. My focus then switched to something between 160-200 hp. The piper 160 and 180 was looking to be the best option, and I was not interested in the 235 model as it was not efficient. Warriors and Archers are scarce, and that's when I met a few people including you, who showed me that the Mooney M20C is is a plane that deserves to be looked at with its speed and efficiency. I cant wait to find the right one and start taking trips beyound the North East where I normally fly, and be apart of the Mooney family.
Love the Mooney's. Such a pretty plane. One more good piece since your talking about first airplanes is safety. A plus for the 172 is that it has the lowest accident rate per 1000 hours of all the airplanes if I remember correctly. Clearly a reason why it's a staple at flight schools.
unfortunately we cannot really conclude anything about relative safety of many GA planes because they are flown by different pilots and used for different purposes. The fact that they are used so much for training could very well be the cause of a better safety record, not the result.
I think you’re right there with the training point. So many hours flown with instruction and in relatively safe situations (not flying across the country or in mountainous terrain)
It’s unfortunate you only looked at “older” Bonanzas, E-series, pre-60s. I trained on Cessnas & bought a C172, flown it 10 years, but moved up to a 1966 Bonanza, 285hp injected engine and upgraded to modern avionics 3 times now over, the last 24 years, I’m still in love, what a Great all around airplane. 👌 But, Mooneys are good airplanes also. 😊
I really appreciate the fact that you added the pros and the cons. I am trying to pursue my instrument as well as having aircraft that will get me places after I get my instrument. I am currently looking at Cardinals and Piper arrow three turbo.
Just started on my journey of obtaining a PPL. After about 45hrs in a Cherokee P28-140 I got introduced to a Mooney... and wow, I must say, it's an incredible aircraft. As a low hour pilot thought it would be easy to get behind the plane. Overall, great review and I enjoyed the video. Thank you sir!
Thank you for the kind words. I understand where you’re coming from, but I promise after 5-10 hours in the Mooney, the workload will feel no different than that Cherokee! Good luck as you finish your PPL!!!
I just about fell out of my chair when I saw N4061N in this video. I just bought it from a friend a month ago. It's currently at KDVT. Now I just need a CFI LOL! Thanks for the informative videos sir!
There is just something about the Mooney, and I'll tell you what it is... First a comparison using cars: American cars a few decades ago, even when brand new, felt "loosie goosie," in that the steering was imprecise, requiring constant adjustments. But then you borrow your brother's MG Midget two-seater sports car, and it is a delight to drive, with its precise rack & pinion steering, and a compact, everything-functional feel. Now, a comparison using airplanes: I grew up on Cessna singles. When you taxi them the steering feels imprecise, because there are springs between your rudder pedals and the nose wheel turning actuator. Plus, the taxiing Cessna feels "loosie goosie," from the fact that the gear struts are actually springs. Like an American car from long ago, the machine wallows a bit during taxi. And the visibility is limited, especially in the larger Cessna singles, by a big, intrusive dashboard, and, arguably, by the high wing. The first time you sit in the cockpit of a Mooney, well, you'll know what I mean. It feels like a fighter! You can see! It is as if you are going to strap the plane on. Everything tight and precise. When I was in the USAF, in pilot training, a cross-country F-104 stopped in for fuel. The pilot let me "sit" his cockpit. Even though I was then accustomed to the sleek T-38, this F-104 took me back to the Mooney days, with its sports car feel. In the Mooney I felt more "pilot" than practically anywhere else. I got to raise and lower the landing gear. I even got to operate a little gate that allows additional ram air to enter the engine and provide an extra bit of power. I could have had fighters in the USAF, but I opted for the C-9 patient-hauling DC-9, and eventually went to the airlines (my dream) where I "managed crews" in big ole flight decks, and where I found that cockpit space is surprisingly unimportant. After many planes, more than any other, ... That Mooney made me feel like a real pilot!
Mooney is the answer! The other planes I considered were the Arrow and the Socata TB series but the Mooney was hands down the best choice for us. I fly the M20F so it is has a 200hp engine (with 100 gallon tanks) but given the C model is shorter and lighter, it will fly faster than my F model. Long story short if you end up in a Mooney you will not be disappointed. There is just something special about flying a Mooney. My non-pilot wife has fallen in love with our little airplane as well because after flying cross country in a Piper Archer even she recognizes the benefits of the extra performance.
The two planes I’ve considered mostly have been a Piper Cherokee 6/Saratoga, and a Mooney M20. I like the Cherokee for its useful load and intimidating size (ramp appeal at least to me) but I also love the speed and range of the Mooney plus the retractable gear makes me smile
I looked at a Mooney and really liked the economy, speed and high-altitude capability. but the cabin was cramped and landings are tricky. When landing you've got to get your airspeed just right and round off at just the right height or you can float on ground effect until you run out of runway. So I checked the Bonanza v-tail, which is a more comfortable plane but decided it sacrificed to much aerodynamically for speed. Even Bonanza enthusiasts admit the plane isn't very stable in roll, yaw and pitch, is prone to Dutch roll, and many are lost in bad weather (Bonanza people tend to blame the pilots for this). I bought a Navion A, which is built very sturdy, has a roomy cabin with a back seat that's comfortable for adults, has very stable flight characteristics, and with full flaps touches down softly at only 50 mph. It isn't as fast as the Bonanza but I don't care, it flies like a dream! I wish the Navion would go back into production!
Would have been nice if you had put numbers to “cheap”, “expensive”, “slow”, “fast”, interesting video but since I don’t own a plane I have no idea how to interpret those statements.
Look at planes for sale on tradeaplane.com there are also general performance specs on there. If you want to get some additional cost/performance information planephd.com has estimated maintenance/ownership cost and some other performance info such as fuel burn etc.
My brother owned a Mooney Mark 21. I got some right seat time in it. A very easy plane to fly and the flaps made it seem like it could float, reliable enjoyable aircraft to fly. The other J-3 Piper. For an inexpensive plane all around good.
I rented a Diamond two seater, the DA20, to get my license. I loved it, but good ones are very expensive to buy. They cannot be made IFR, and I wanted an instrument rating. I rented a Cessna 172 for a good while. I liked it, but good ones that are IFR are pricey, and I did not want a loan. I also rented a Cherokee 140, but it did not perform well in climb. To avoid getting a loan, I paid cash for a Cessna 150 with a classic 6-pack of instruments and got my instrument rating in it. The Cessna 150/152 club is very active, and a great community. Surprisingly, it is filled with retired professional pilots. Many pros spring for a Cessna 150 for personal flying. My wife told me she will never fly with me. I'm allowed to fly with only one of our kids at a time. Therefore, until now, the Cessna 150 has been good enough. However, now that the kids are almost adults, I'm running into a problem with weight and balance in the Cessna 150. Two adults with full fuel is over max weight, and it climbs poorly on warm days while loaded heavily. I'm thinking about my plane number two. Must be affordable, no loans for me, IFR, and able to climb well with two adults and enough fuel, even on warm days. I also want to get my Commercial license. It is possible to do that in a Cessna 150, but I would have to install a glass panel and an autopilot. I'm considering my options.
This was the first video I've ever seen on your channel. I just completed watching it just now. I already subscribed and rated it thumbs up. I liked your criteria analyzing and summaries of each plane. I'm a planning to purchase one this and begin lessons in it, so it won't have to be my forever plane, but maybe it will be. I absolutely loved how you fit the title of your channel into the last line of your video presentation. That moved me. Great work!
I have to say, they were both real possibilities as I searched for a bird. Likely the biggest reason is moved past the 150 was the discovery of a gentlemen who wanted to partner in a plane. It pushed the budget to a place where a 4 seat airplane was a possibility.
@@MyTimeToFly And what are your impressions of partnering, now that you've done it? (Loaded question, I know, since your partner is likely to read your reply, but we do what we can.)
I wouldn’t hold back, even knowing he might read it. For me, it’s been a great experience. Wes and I have similar goals, are both financially stable, and both fly about the same amount. I can definitely see where it could go badly if you had the wrong partners involved!
I always hated working on Mooneys' avionics. That sloped windshield makes for a tight fit when you're trying to reach behind the panel from the top. I can only imagine that they'd be a dream to own and fly, though. Every owner I spoke to had 0 regrets.
Thanks for the real world feedback. I've always hesitated to move to the 1 piece windshield due to the added complexity of getting to the avionics. For now, my avionics are easily accessible through 2 access panels just in front of the windshield.
I really want a 150hp Citabria, but so does everybody else right now, apparently. About the time I'm asking for logbooks, somebody else is holding out a check. I'm also realizing how impractical they really are - and I'm not talking about the VFR panel, I'm talking about the low useful load and the low speed. So now I'm looking at a Grumman - about double the useful load, and a good 20kt faster, and probably cheaper to insure with its tricycle gear (haven't verified that yet), but not really able to land on the semi-improved Forest Service strips that make up our "adventure flying" here in the mountainous southwest. 172? Flown one - meh. Bonanza? Flown a Debonair - too much work to be fun. Mooney? Haven't flown one, but probably a similar workload to the Bonanza/Debonair, and it's getting away from my "mission". What does all this mean? Nothing. If I knew, I'd have made a decision by now.
I looked at all of these as well, over the course of about 2 years before I made a purchase. I trained in a 172, but since 99% of my flying is by myself, I couldn't justify owning or renting a 4-place. With that mission in mind, I landed on the 150 and I absolutely love it. I've taken my daughter up once, but her previous medical issues became more challenging, resulting in her not being able to fly anymore. 3 years into ownership, and the mission really hasn't changed. I take a passenger up at least once a month, but some of my friends that want to go flying with me just won't fit, and even if they did, max gross makes it impractical due to the limited fuel we'd be able to take. I do still look at getting something faster someday in addition to the 150 (I really, really like the Bonanza), but the need isn't there yet so I can't justify it. Plus I myself don't like the idea of only having one exit door. That's really my only beef with the majority of low-wing planes, and I hate it because Cherokees and Bonanzas are just a joy to fly.
My first airplane was a straight 35 Beech Bonanza, 1948 SN 1525 N 4504 V. I too bought mine, without any time in a Bonanza. I took an airliner to Newark N J from N E Ohio and paid the man. Done a few take off and landings, and was socked in for almost a week in Monmouth County Airport. I found it very east to fly and land, and that's with no adjustable prop nor retract time.` It had the E 185 HP engine, which meant 185 HP on take-off only. I owned it for 18 years and surely enjoyed it. I did do the spar mod and the A.D. on the V tail block. I top overhauled it and put new plexiglass in. Flew it many hours and sold it for $2200 more than I paid for it. ($5600). Sold it in 1982, when I got married. A fine fine airplane.
Well done. Similar to some car channels and magazines when talking about bang for the buck, where "Miata is always the answer," pilots in the quest to move up to some capability frequently find "Mooney is the answer."
When I was getting my Commercial ticket, a Mooney 201 was my complex aircraft. Boy was it, just not in the way I expected. It had the manual gear and pump down flaps. Touch-and-goes at the old Marana, AZ, airfield (now Pinal), touchdown, accelerate, rotate, gear up, release the flap hydraulic pressure, the engine quits. The pressure release knob was next to the mixture and I pulled the mixture instead. Pushed it back in and continued on. Landing at Sky Harbor in summer, RWY 26, on final we hit a fast rising thermal and gained a couple of hundred feet. The tower gave me permission to do a 360° / 65° spiral but that didn't help much so he said I could land long and, if so, how long. I told him that I might make the 2nd half of the runway. He cleared me and I made it. I needed speed-breaks on that thing. It saved me a looooon taxi to the FBO, though.
@@MyTimeToFly Grumman TR2, AA5, plus an Aerobat C-150 and AC Super Decathlon (for acro time) during my commercial training. Twin Commander for the multi. My Private was mostly a PA-28 but my examine was in a C-150. My commercial examine was in the Mooney.
I'm 11 hours into getting my ticket and bought a house in an air park, so I guess you can say it's gonna happen. From my research you can fly a M20C @ C150 speeds and almost have C150 fuel burn. Most ppl don't seem to know that and recommend a Bo or a Commanche. Of course, that C150 isn't ever going to cruise @ 150kts. Mooney and AA5 is on my short list. There are MANY RVs in my airpark though. I'm debating on Mooney and having to find an A&P or RV and doing the work in my hangar next to my house. Downside there is having to fly commercial when we take the 7 yo. I always wanted a Long Eze, but getting that in and out of our 2200' strip would be sketchy. I've been watching your videos for a few months now. Keep it up.
Thanks a lot for being here, and congrats on the hangar house. Sounds like you’ve got a fair number of decisions to make. My only real recommendation...be patient. It’s not easy, but the perfect deal will present itself when the time is right!
I would like a Piper. My second choice would be an aero commander 114B, a fast wide cabined 4 place plane, single engine of course. Mooneys are awesome little planes. That forward angled rudder is lie no other!
I chose an A-10C with Link 16, CBU-105's, Mk-82 Air, 6 AGM 65Ds, a couple of AIM-9Xs, and brand spanking new wings. Set me back a pretty penny, but I demand the most of my aircraft. Buyer beware, though....the 30 mike mike GAU kicks like a mule. #BRRRRRRRRRRT
I own the first BE35 that you showed N9606K. We took the same journey a few years ago C152, C172, PA28, M20J, BE35 took a hard look at all. C152 to small. C172 To expensive, PA28 to slow, M20J to small and they all leaked fuel, BE35 Fast and roomy but not cheap. Nice video.
Looking at Maules & Cessna 180s for backcountry flying, but nothing beats the Sexy Bonanzas. I have logged more time in Bonanzas & Barons than all my tailwheel time put together. Enjoyed your video
I've flown the Cessna 152, 172, 172RG, 210 and the Piper Cherokee. I considered purchasing a Vans, a Beech Bonanza and a Mooney because of the speed but the Mooney won out because of the economy flying and maintenance since I use it for work.
First plane I ever flew was a Mooney. I was 9 years old. My dad let me take the controls for a minute. There were 8 members in his flying club, and soon after that they traded up to a Cessna Citation for the extra room and speed. But we all missed the Mooney.
My "mission", plain and simple, is pleasure flying, and for that I purchased a Magni M16 gyroplane. I've flown 8 different kinds of single-engine aircraft and, by a wide margin, the gyro is the most fun to fly. An open-cockpit gyroplane is the motorcycle of the sky.
I wouldn’t never have thought they would be so much fun! I’ve never even sat in one. How are the maintenance requirements compared to a fixed wing aircraft?
@@MyTimeToFly A little bit higher than a fixed-wing airplane because of the moving parts of the rotor assembly, but considerably less than a helicopter.
Thanks for being here Paul! I have no doubt the community would welcome you with open arms. Your best bet is to find a local airport and just start hanging around a little. Listen, observe, and ad find a way to start getting involved!
Kind of surprised not to see a Piper Archer on your short list. Similar with the 180 hp engine, seating, 10gph fuel rate, available parts, knowledgeable repair folks, etc. I’ve been looking at planes for a similar missions as yours, considered some of the same planes, and the Archers seem like one of the best options out there. Proof, I think, is they are in such high demand and so can be hard to find. But I think with some patience and research they are obtainable and an excellent option.
The Archer was definitely discussed once or twice, but likely due to limited supply we never found one that fit our mission just right...for the right price.
Thanks for the video. I am right where you were. 172, 182, Beech 35, or Mooney. The only thing not on your pros and cons was insurance cost. The beech is almost triple. compared to the other three.
Saratoga? or Saratoga II for retractable.I also like the DA-40 with Diamond being the safest aircraft in GA plus the most innovative in both airframe and diesel engine, so flying over the Rockies is no big deal because of the turbocharger. Also consider this: a 10GPH aircraft burning 100ll is $4.55x10 x 2000 (hours) is $91,000 for 2k hrs of engine life. A DA-40 diesel is 6GPH at $4,07 x 2,000 hours so fuel cost over engine life is $48,840 . The salesmen never calculated that for you? Surprise. Prices are national averages today from AirNav. $45.50 per hour vs $24.42 per hour for fuel. I wish Textron had the brains to put the Continental CD300 in the G36 Bonanza and STC it to the older ones.. The stressful part about buying an aircraft is trying to take a limited (job) income and try to fit $1 where you want $5 to be.
Mooney's are as you found out a sweet plane. I was chief pilot for a Mooney service center and have flown over 1,500 hrs, flying all models from the C through the Acclaim. my two preferred models were the J (201) or the Ovation. one nice thing, starting with the J and K models is, they stretched the cabin to give more elbow room and leg room between the seats. I ended up having the privilege of doing the initial flight test on the 310 STC for the ovation and Acclaim.
Wow Ron, what an awesome opportunity you had! I hope to move up to the J model someday...but need the budget to grown before that happens! Thanks for watching!
Had s friend that had a 66' J. Put a new 180 hp motor in and prop. Bought it for $37k, spent another 22k on the above two items. She cruises at 175 kts@10k ft and 11.8 gph. I didn't like the manual Johnson style gear bar and manual johnson bar flaps. He finally upgraded to a 71' and got electric flaps andd gear. I miss his 66' J. A Chinese aviation student wanted something fun and fast and took 10 hrs with a instructor in it. He was training in G1000 archers. Problem is he had under 200 hrs (the chinese kid, 22 yrs old),no IFR. He died in ghe plane 3 days later trying to scud run a layer of mild precip from KFLG to KDVT. CFIT/ mountains ruined his day, permanently. Collision was estimated over 220 kts.
Again, just an opinion here. You seem to care significantly about the amount of hours somebody has. Although not insignificant, just because somebody has fewer hours than the next guy, doesn’t mean they are now a better/safer pilot. Good decision making starts from hour 1, and is driven by personality and good instruction.
Nice analysis. I have owned several Mooneys starting with a 1984 201 (J), then two 252's, a TLS and a Bravo (both are M20M's) and now have a 1995 Ovation which I love! Great fast planes and very efficient!!
So what are the differences between a TLS and a Bravo? Both are turbocharged, different engine package? The Continental vs Lycoming debate still rages on, which one to pick?
@@MidnightMechanic They are the same. The original M20M (TLS) had a problem with oil cooling the cylinder heads and they added a modification labeled "Bravo" to the Lycoming engine. The TLS (Turbo Lycoming System) my partner and I bought already had the Bravo conversion and therefore was identical in fuselage and engine and flight characteristics as the Bravo we got later. Only major difference is that the Bravo had a G1000 vs steam gauges in the TLS.
Which one to pick? Bravo vs Ovation? Depends on your "mission". If you plan to do a majority of mountain flying out west or routinely fly out of high altitude airports I would pick the turbocharged Bravo. It will burn more fuel for sure but get you above terrain without issues. Otherwise the Ovation is incredibly efficient since you can reliably run it lean of peak.
Cessna p210n. Speed, capacity, can outclimb the weather. Business trips. Enough money. propeller control. Radar Handles all but the inop strips. Even some that are
I would have encouraged you go with a C182, unlike the 172, the 182 is a true 4 place airplane. Reasonable to maintain with great resale value. Stable like a 172 but with a 4 place engine. Having grown up with Bonanza's, there is truly no greater airplane that is if your flush with cash. You should also consider some of the pipers, I have many an hour in a Bonanza, and they are truly a joy to fly but God the cost to maintain one. Constant speed prop, flower flaps, retractable landing gear with fully enclosed gear doors, ours has the retractable step. None of these things are cheap. If your concerned about fuel burn per hour you really can't afford a complex single. I can buy a piper wing for what a Bonanza aeleron costs. Plus finding a good beech mechanic is another story. Plus the 182 is going to behave like a high performance 172.
@@MyTimeToFly I know, several factors contribute to that. I think popularity due to ease of flying for a entry level pilot. Basically you've got a 172 magnum. Although it four seats anything much above sea level and a 172 is a good two person airplane. I can't name the number of accidents I've seem with high density altitude and 172's that the owner tried to fly with four people because it had four seats. I've told more than one 172 pilot if your going to fly the western mountain states take the back seats out! Their dead weight, you can't use them safely so why pack the weight. Often if it were just two people I would pull the back seat out of my V35K which also allowed me to keep my center of gravity as far forward as possible plush was 44lbs lighter. Plus for a low time pilot things don't get ahead of you so quickly with a 182. You get into true IMC, get sloppy on the on Instruments, leave the power on and you can quickly be approaching 200 kias. One thing my father who was a 35 year ATP passed on. If you find yourself in turbulent IMC slowly pull the nose up, drop the gear, bring in 2300rpm open your cowel flaps and you can quit worrying about your airspeed running away, I would imagine this holds true for a Mooney
Again great points and very practical advice regarding the seats. The Mooney certainly can be configured such that the airspeed won’t get away from you. But, if you’re not proactive about getting the gear down...it can and will get fast!
@@MyTimeToFly my father was a 36,000 ATP, who lived to fly and put an airplane on more that sat in it. In his early years when he wasn't flying the DC3 for West Coast Airlines he was flying charter and demo/sales for the Beechcraft dealer in Boise. My God that man could fly a Bonanza well, but what stands out is a couple pointers he gave me. First watch your CG as the V Tails could easily be loaded into an aft CG condition that with full tanks you don't even notice until several hours into the flight you find you keep having to add just a hair of nose down trim every once in a while, until your configuring for landing and you find yourself having real difficulty maintaining trim and having to add more power just to keep the nose down, and then it wants to flair about 100ft agl. The other observation mentioned earlier is lowering the gear. He said if you find yourself in severe turbulence, especially IMC lower the gear, even if your way above VNE lower the gear now granted as he said you may tear off a gear door, but it might keep you from getting killed. Another was if you find yourself in mountainous terrain and maybe being forced to remain VFR because of conditions and the canyons are getting narrower, pull the power back, lower the gear, lower 15-20 degrees of flaps, open the cowel flaps, and bring your power up to about 70-75% and you'll be able to fly at 75-90kias all day long make tight high bank turns and not loose it or stall because your now 20-30kias above stall. Just some useful information. Also he ALWAYS pulled out the pilots hand book and checked our density altitude and what our take off run should be given our weight and altitude. Happy Skies
Went with late model cessna 150M. Panel included gtn 650 - adsb in/out- mogas stc. So an ifr trainer burning premium autofuel with hourly operating cost of $22 to 24 dollars per hour. Whats not to love.
I like Mooney aircraft, they are remarkably efficient airplanes. My mission is different than yours since I live in Alaska. I've got a Cessna 180 on wheels in the summer and skis in the winter. I've also got a 182 on floats that gets to sit out the winter months. I think you approached your search logically and methodically and ended up with the right airplane. If I ever have a need for a faster, longer ranged airplane I would be looking at the same types you did. I like Debonairs, Cessna 210s, and Mooneys.
Aeronca Champ. The most fun you’ll have flying. Probably the least expensive aircraft to own as long as you don’t ruin the fabric. Great for $100 hamburgers but not so much for long XC.
Hoping to finish my TW endorsement in a Champ this Spring. It is incredibly fun to fly. Not sure I could (should?) afford to hangar one. The Mooney is on a different part of the mission spectrum...feels like an M20 could really open up some XC adventures. Will I really find the time to take off work for that? Maybe a Pitts would be best... :)
@@MyTimeToFly For pretty much all the reasons we could imagine, they are considered notoriously ill suited to cross country. People do manage to attend acro competitions without trailering them, though, so how bad could they be? :)
Congrats on your new buy! Excellent summary of the thought process. I’ve had a similar reactions in the hunt. Cessna owners are very proud. Birds in the reasonable range have outdated equip. Updated glass is just crazy money. Did same as you probably...joined mooneyspace, bonanza society, COPA, etc. Tons of valuable advice from the “communities.” Got my IFR last summer in a Cherokee 180. You’ll love doing yours in your own plane. I’m envious lol! Hopefully Covid will ease up soon so I can begin prebuys. Happy flying!
I have over 1,000 hr. in the 172 and many more in the 152 , turbo 182 and the 210 . For my own it would have to be the 172 RG . A bit more range can be added and it makes a good simple instrument platform . It is much cheaper to fly as well .
Piper Malibu is great for family vacays while if you wanna go solo flights or training we have c152 or the Cherokee 140, sr22 is by far my favourite. The traveller is also pretty good a bit less comfortable though
It might seem that way, but there are many 150s that are priced substantially higher than a C model Mooney. Of course many Mooney models are more expensive than the C.
Thanks for using my 1976 Cessna 150 M at the start of your video. N820ST is an IFR airplane. I bought it that way, but I have upgraded all the avionics and also the instrument panel it's self. New paint job was done last year. Interior was updated 3 years ago.
It seems you may have missed the most successful practical aircraft in the game a PA28 Cherokee. The PA28 180 is a very rugged all round aircraft with the Lycoming 0360 is a very good aircraft for charter, as its short strip performance at AUW is excellent.
I have no doubt it’s a great platform, it simply wasn’t on my list. I didn’t intend for this video to be the end all list of first airplanes...it was simply my short list.
Dave, I would suggest flying each and picking. Plane owners are Ego Maniacs about their planes. Besides Mooneys are the best! Great economy fast strong good payload and by the way my girl 1978 M20 J does not have bladders and never been resealed. She’s hangered her entire life and I don’t land on grass. Good luck. ps The Comanche 250/260 was my second choice.
The reason I went with the piper 260 is because it was a true 4 passenger low Wing retractable gear. The reason I picked on that plane and particular his because it only had a little over 2,000 hours on the plane and zero on the engine. I did all my training in a Cessna 182
My analysis was the same. Mooney came out on top. I could not justify the extra expense of an older, slower Bonanza, especially when my mission profile is usually just me and the dog.
Just after finishing training I bought a 1966 Cherokee 180 for 45k minimal IFR. It was just a little faster than 172. Flew this beauty for 10 years, 600hrs.
Cheaper than Cessna, easier to fly, excellent for a person in my situation. (Older, 64, female) Later sold part ownership. At 74 stopped flying.
What a wonderful ride!!
Thanks so much for sharing Susan! Your story is an inspiration to many, I have no doubt about that!!!
Due to my physical abilities, I'll never be a pilot, so I do enjoy watching videos on many different types of planes.
Thanks so much!
Don’t worry you’re already a legend
But you could be a passenger!
You can be co-pilot at any flying school at whatever plane you like....
We all rented/renting planes to fly around, you indeed member of the flying community.
I don't know your condition but you know that you can get a sport pilot's license if you have a driver's license
This was a good rundown, thanks for posting! My first airplane purchase was a 172 XP, which was relatively cheap to buy in decent shape ($45K), cheap to run and maintain (9-10 GPH running LOP), and a great plane to do a lot of learning in. I flew it 200+ hours in the 2 years I owned it, flew my PP check ride in it, and loved it. But like you, I found it just did t have the long legs my mission required. I looked at Bonanzas, but the Mooneys were just so much better in the areas I cared about. I bought a M20K (231) and have never looked back. I liked all the features you named, but I also liked the Mooneys’ safety record, which a lot of people are not aware of. I’ve flown 150+ hours per year in the 3 years Ive owned her, most of that XC, and most of that above 12,000 MSL. It gets me and my family where we need to go quickly and safely. Great community, great technical support, just an awesome marque.
Couldn’t have said it better myself, great stuff!
At the 2:10 mark, that’s my Cessna 150!!!
Thanks for adding it into tour video
And a beautiful bird she is! Very similar paint to the 172 I most recently flew!
thats sick lol
We have had our Mooney J model for almost 20 years and have taken it to every state in the lower 48. It is indeed a magic carpet!
So awesome Daniel, I've only been over 5 states or so...I have to check more off the list.
Mooney's are great planes. I have many hours in them. But my favorite is the Cessna 177RG. Fast, economical, roomy and comfortable! No strut for outstanding visibility, 48 inch cabin width, two wide doors, and 142 kts cruise on 10 gph with 60 gallon tanks!
Thanks for the comment, I agree the Mooney is great but can find greatness in many planes. The Cardinal has a lot of awesome qualities which you have listed!
When I was young, my father owned a Bellanca Viking (predecessor to the Super Viking). Old school craftsmanship. One of the best wings in aviation. And, fast. I miss those days and that plane.
They seem like a good bargain right now too, maybe the Super Viking. I think people are afraid of the old school materials a bit (although they shouldn’t be)
So, I learned to fly in the Navy. While stationed abroad, I'd join the Navy Flying Club that was on base, if they had one. Depending on where I was at, we had all sorts of aircraft, from Cessna 150's, 152's, 172's, 182's, Piper Cherokees, Beech Barons and T-34's that active duty and family could rent. After I left the Navy, when I decided to look for an aircraft to own, I looked at many flavors and settled on a '77 Grumman Tiger AA-5B. Long story short, I wanted something that was simple to fly, economical to maintain, had great performance and range, was sporty and was easy to learn to fly when my kids decided to get into aviation. I've owned that same aircraft for several years now and, since then, my son has used it to get his private, instrument, commercial and CFI. We both fly it together for training as well as pleasure, taking it to Oshkosh whenever we can. My wife and daughters have no interest in flying GA, so the Tiger is a perfect fit for our needs. We've just completed a full panel upgrade, replacing the plastic panel with a treated aluminum, power coated panel, replaced the original A/I and HSI with two Garmin G5's, added a Garmin USB power port, and moved some instruments around to make it more user friendly. It makes instrument flying a dream. My only regret is not spending the cash on an autopilot, but that will come later.
The Tiger is fast.. 140 KTAS at 8,500' MSL burning 8.5 to 9.5 GPH at 2600 RPM running 50 ROP. She holds 51 gallons usable fuel. We are based in Broomfield, Colorado (KBJC), just 25 miles north of Denver, so dealing with density altitude is always a challenge, but the Tiger does well with the Lycoming O-360 pumping out 180 HP. We just fly with tabs full to reduce the takeoff weight. That still gives us 38 gallons of usable fuel for a cross country. The Tiger is fun to fly.. very maneuverable and light on the controls. Like your Mooney, it loves to fly, so slowing it down on approach and landing can be a challenge for the new pilot. But, if you fly by the numbers and fine tune your technique, it's a breeze to make those landings a greaser. The large rudder is an excellent tool for handling crosswinds as there is plenty of rudder authority. The best feature of all is the sliding canopy. I just love that fighter pilot feeling it gives you... that, and it's great for those hot days as we can open it up about 1/4 way to cool things down. We just have to keep the airspeed under 113 KIAS per the POH.
Congrats on your choice of the Mooney and have fun with it. Looking forward to many more videos from you. Here's a link so some videos of past flights we've made...
ua-cam.com/channels/Yp1lsafqwcgdhMwwGx9ULA.htmlvideos
So awesome, what an amazing bond I’m sure you and your son have flying! I know many people who absolutely love the Grumman! I appreciate you watching!!!
My first plane was a 77 Grumman Cheetah. I sold it to buy a Mooney. Although I loved the Mooney, I wish I had never sold the Cheetah.
Brad
Flying from 4 years DA62 and just love it...❤️
I have a little time in a DA20, it was fun for sure. The DA62 is one awesome looking twin!
Until I was forced out by the cost of flying I flew 150s up to 177s. The 150 was the most fun and a lot like flying a leaf! I really enjoyed putting it through everything it was capable of!!
I did all my training in a 150, I wouldn’t want to stuff myself back in one now…but it was fun back then.
I went through the same process a year ago and came to the same conclusion. I wanted something faster than a 172, reasonably efficient, a decent load carrying capability, and a good value. I really had my heart set on a V-tail Bonanza just because I think it’s the coolest looking GA plane ever made. Mooneys weren’t really on my list because I had no experience with them whatsoever and I had heard that they were really tight inside. I got to get up close to one while I was on the road with my job. Not as tight as everyone complains about. I happened to find one close to me for sale and thought I would go check it out on a whim. It was a beautiful M20J that had been loved on by it’s two airline pilot owners with one of them being in A&P with IA. He had gone through through it spinner to tail taking care of every issue. When I started talking to him about performance and efficiency, it just started ticking off every box that I had set. I finally realized that my mission would be 99% flying by myself and that I wanted something fast and efficient. There was no choice left. This Mooney was it! The acquisition cost was tens of thousands of dollars less than any other comparable plane of the same vintage. The reputation it has, as far as it being difficult to land, is absolute hogwash for anyone who knows how to fly a plane by the numbers. The one problem I had… I had to learn how to get it to slow down. Not a bad problem to have! I was able to complete a bucket list item with my Mooney. I flew from central Ohio to Tampa, Florida NONSTOP and got to land at the airport I taught at in my own airplane! PRICELESS!
Wow, what an awesome story! Thank you for sharing, and I’m glad you found the Mooney!
From where in the Oh did you leave from and how long was the flight?
I have found that most people who complain about Mooney's being "cramped" have never actually been in one. Unless you are trying to stuff 4 NBA players into a short-body, there's is more than adequate room. I think people see them sitting on the ground with the pilot seats fully aft against the bench and start jumping to conclusions. I fly my C with my seat fully forward for takeoff/landing, and one notch back from that in cruise - my rear passenger has *more* foot space than i do in both of those positions.
As far as it being difficult to land.... I met my Mooney at W75 with its 2,000' runway. Landed there several times in my first few days of ownership, and never once needed more than half the runway to stop. Like you said - fly it by the numbers and everything is fine.
I definitely agree with your thoughts here. I’m every bit as comfortable in the Mooney as I compare it to all other small planes I’ve flown.
Chicken Kriket's I left from OSU and flew to ZPH (cheap gas) before a quick hop to TPF. Flight time was just a little under 5 hours and I burned about 42 gallons.
I’ve owned a 150, 172 and a Mooney. Mooney was my favorite. Took trips from Oklahoma to Oshkosh, Orlando and flew Angel Flights to Houston. No longer flying but attend OSH annually and will forever be a Mooniac!
They do suck you in for sure!
There also is something to be said by the cockpit "feel." If you sit down in the pilot seat of a large Cessna, like a 210, 205, or 206, you notice that the dashboard panel goes way up in your face, esp. on the ground. The Mooney, OTOH, makes you feel like a fighter pilot. The controls are even more sensitive on the Mooney, and they are placed just right. Easy comparison: One is a steam locomotive; the other is an extension of you. It just FEELS good to pilot a Mooney.
I couldn’t agree more!
Good choice! My first airplane was an M20C and now own an M20K. Love the very economical Mooney speed.
Thanks Paul! I’m loving mine so far!
Mooney is a great plane, but not for faint of heart or low time private pilot. Tricky to fly, insurance is up there and you need at least 7-10 hrs with an instructor before solo in one. Gotta have your comolex and high performance endorsement and 400 hrs recommended in last 3 yrs too, not to mention they sit much lower than a bonanza or 172. The old V-tail again not a good first airplane choice. Need the complex and high performance and at least 400 hrs. I'd also recommend all ppl candidates go take sine aerobatic lessons and learn about spins and recovery. We get spin training during the commercial phase... A C-172 or a Cherokee 140/160 are good entry level planes for the ppl student. And even for IFR. The next move up would be a C-182 or 206/207 are the work horses. A Cherokee 160 or 180 or a Cherokee 6 or a A33/34 Bonanza. Work your way up. I now or rather knew far to many now passed pilots that bought way more airplane than they could handle and paid the ultimate sacrifice with loss of their life, by having too much $, which doesn't equal safe or making a good informed decision. Just because you CAN buy it, doesnt mean you SHOULD buy it. And never be in a hurry to get anywhere, for anyone, ever. Also, get-there-itis is a widower of general aviation pilots. Lastly, do NOT play with mother nature in a plane. As Arnold Shwartzeniger says, you will lose..
I respect your opinion, but disagree on the difficulty of flying a Mooney. At least the C model we have. It’s proven to be quite easy to fly for a coupe of 150 hour pilots.
You’re correct Pat. I did not have to get the HP rating for my 180hp Mooney.
@Pat Rowan He just wanted to drop his little lecture, nevermind the details.
Piper Cherokee 235 was my first plane. I paid 35,000 for a 1964 model. 1400 pound useful load and 800nm+ range. It is rated IFR. Downside 14/gph and not that fast 130 kts. Great family cruiser if you will do regional travel 300-600nm.
For sure a workhorse, it would make me want a Cherokee 6!
Own a 1973 Cessna 172M. Have had it for almost 3 years and it’s been great. Did the interior and installed an engine monitor among other things. Amazing experience. I want to get my instrument rating and then step up to a Mooney M20J because it’s fast, low maintenance and low operating cost. Prefer a cosmetically in bad shape airplane that O can fix, but airframe and engine in excellent condition. Expect to do the switch in Q1 2021. Remember, the Bonanza flights fast because of the engine, Mooneys because of its wings! Thanks Roy Lopresti!
Awesome man, glad your loving the 172! What engine monitor did you put in? I couldn’t have said it better regarding the speed comparison between the BO and the Mooney!
My Time To Fly indeed! Good job. I put the EDM830. Greta engone monitor👌🏽
I’ll certainly be looking for something for the Mooney!
I did a similar thing, what is my mission and what is the best plane. When I lived in Alaska, it was the Cessna 170. Now I am in the lower 48 and I went about the purchase decision for the flying I wanted to do down here, it came down to either a Bellanca Super Viking or a Mooney. I went with a 64 Mooney M20E. I have traveled all over the West and love the aircraft. I wanted the best bang for the buck and this plane is it!
Right on! I’ve heard the Bellanca flys awesome as well!
Get that extra inch of manifold pressure with the ram air. Have flown M20 E super 21's many times to Latin America
Rock on man! Gotta love the Mooney!
At the 10:42 mark is my M20K 252 on the grass in Smithville, TX. We now live in Denver and I keep 252AD at KBJC.
So cool! Thanks for watching Paul
Congratulations from a fellow Mooniac, met Don Maxwell last week, a fantastic guy!
I've owned several planes (including a Bonanza). I have a lot of time in Mooneys from my instructing days. The Mooney is great, but it's hard to work on due to being so tight on space. You get all that speed on low horsepower for a reason...everything is CRAMPED! I also worry about parts since the company is out of business. The Bonanza was more comfortable, but it was also very expensive to maintain. Once you get above a Cherokee or 172, the upkeep really starts killing you. I like them all. If you fit in a Mooney, it's a great choice.
Thank you sir
Great run down. I just bought my first plane last Aug and went with the Mooney M20K231. They are great looking planes, can’t get off the ramp without 2 or 3 look-backs at her 😍
Thanks David. You are correct, the Mooney is a beautiful plane: I hope that K treats you well!
It's a 4 seater sports car for the air, just pretend you're driving a Porsche, air cooled flat 6 to boot!
Awesome machines, even my flat 4 get 160 mph with ease!
I’m a fellow M20K owner. Totally awesome airplane.
Most definitely
Mooneys porpoise like crazy.... A fellow pilot I knew owned a 69 E class. When he bought it, it had some corrosion and it hadn’t flown in over twenty years. With a lot of TLC we got the airplane airworthy. Even though it was the ugliest plane on the ramp, it was beautiful in the air. Unfortunately a few years ago he did a gear up landing and totaled it. I sure miss that plane.
Bummer about the gear up. I can't say that I agree with "porpoise like crazy". You certainly need to be on your airspeed, and understand how weight changes speeds over the numbers, but if you can manage those factors I feel mine lands quite easy.
@My Time To Fly I stand corrected; if you don't watch your speed, it will porpoise on you.
That I can agree with!
I've wanted to buy a plane for most of my adult life. My favorites are the Mooney M20, Beechcraft Bonanza and Cessna 177RG (wider cabin than the 172 and no struts obstructing view). Unfortunately, I believe I'm likely going to end up with a 150 or even an old Aeronca Champ simply due to price. I would love to have a 4 place with a comfortable cabin, IFR rated and better range, but I won't need any of that for 60 to 80 percent of the flying I'll be doing and after 30 years of cravings, I want to make this a reality before I'm too old to clear my medical. Also, burning 5 gph vs 9 to 13 gph means I can fly more often. When I want to fly my wife and kids somewhere, I'll have to rent. When it's just me and possibly one skinny passenger, I won't have to check my bank account first. Also, the Aeronca's can burn auto gas or I may get lucky and stumble across one of those IFR 150s for night flying. The majority of the flying I'll be doing over the next few years will just be cruising up and down the coast line and rarely over 100 miles. While I would love to have a plane that could afford me longer distances, more comfort and more passengers, I simply can't fit it in my budget and still have money to fly it, upgrade it and maintain it.
I completely understand your position here. I was mostly in the same place prior to finding a partner to purchase with. If having a bit more plane becomes any more important to you, I’d recommend opening yourself up to the thought of a partnership.
I am in the same boat but I doubt if I can afford a plane. I learned in 79/80 at beech aircraft and had to stop flying about 10 years later due to other hobbies. Last few years i’ve got my medical and gone through ground school to get brushed up. More realistically for me is to continue renting. My night vision is not what it used to be so night flying might be a no go. I used to love flying after dinner. Less traffic and the air is smooth. I could get three touch and goes done in 1/2 hour and then do some sight seeing of the Oc/la basin.
Always good to know your limitations! Good man!
I started looking to buy Spring of 2020. Learned a ton along the way. I walked away from , what I thought were great birds because the seller would not let me take the plane to a separate A&P. They wanted me to use their guy. No way. So I walked and glad I did. Look at Gruman Americans Traveler. 4 place. Comfortable. Reasonable buy in. Upgradeable as you go. Not super fast but 120 or so. I found trade a planes filters a high help. Good luck.
Sounds like you have some solid principles and stuck to your guns, certainly the right choice! I walked away from one because the broker wouldn’t let me inspect as deep as I wanted!
The most often overlooked alternative, in my opinion, is the Bellanca Super Viking. I wasn't even aware of that aircraft as an option before I bought my Mooney M20J. Though I have no regrets, it would have been valuable to know about the Bellanca. Essentially, you can get all the same specs, as far as speed and payload, from a Bellanca at an average of about $15k less. The only downside is that they need a big 300hp flat six to achieve the same top speed as the Mooney with only 200hp. That means they guzzle gas in comparison. Nevertheless, I would put the Super Viking as my #2 choice behind the M20J overall. My #3 would be the V-tail Bonanza.
I’ve also heard the Bellanca is the most “true” flying aircraft out there. An absolute pleasure from what I’ve heard! Thanks for watching!
The Bellanca is a great plane.. the panels aren't setup very well in my opinion.. especially for modern avionics.. difficult/expensive to retrofit too.. also, they tend to have higher maintenance costs.. wood/fabric etc.. great flying planes tho.. fast.. thirsty.. lol.. I had a M20K for years.. love the Mooneys..
I hope to fly in a Bellanca someday!
I owned a 1976 bellanca super Viking - on cover of AOPA pilot - fabulous aircraft. Fast, ski tube( or golf clubs) true 4 seater, did I mention FAST! I went from cessna 150 to the lycoming 300 up Viking. What a rush. Now back flying a 150. Life goes full circle.
Life sure does have a way of coming back around. I haven’t had the chance of flying a Viking, but I hope to soon.
I bought a Mooney back in the early 80's. A M20A, wood wing. Faster than the metal wing with the same engine. Loved it. I could economy cruise at about 150mph and about 5 to 6 gallons per hour. Better than my car and much faster. 170 mph at about 10 gph.
Very cool! I’d love to get a ride in an A someday! Thanks for watching!
Thanks for helping people learn what things to think through and how to weigh the options against their mission. It’s so hard to learn how to think through these things with zero experience or reference and you’ve made a great video here that I think really helps. Thanks!
Thank you kindly!
Just bought an e33a bonanza today. All of the f mods and absolutely perfect.
Congrats!!! Sounds like an amazing bird!
the flight school im at currently has 2 c152s, 2 150s, a 150 aerobat, 2 piper warriors and a c172. all the cessnas are ifr rated, and my favourite 152 (G-BNPY) has a different propeller which gives it a much higher cruise speed. It'll usually cruise easily at 100+ KIAS, had it clocking 140knts ground speed on the downwind leg of the circuit one day with a strong tailwind. the other c152 has been kitted out with a full g5 system and i think its an AERA 660 (this navigation is in both of the 152s). they are great planes to fly, okay a bit cramped inside, but at least the 152s do feel a lot more modern than the pipers in the fleet
Very cool, I did all of my training in a 150 then a 152. The 150 didn't even have an intercom. We literally yelled at each other to communicate!
Just came across this video!! That’s me in the thumbnail flying N757UD at a Young Eagle event!!!
That’s awesome man! Thank you for taking part in such a worth cause.
V-tail Bonanzas have corrosion problems on the magnesium ruddervators with a MSB requiring replacement and few affordable options to comply. Another gotcha on the V-tail is you can take off in CG limits, but land with CG too far back after fuel burn with 4 full size adults. Have operated 3 Beech aircraft including V tail, they are expensive to maintain and operate but handle great in the air. Flying a Mooney 201 now, in my opinion the best Mooney in all payload and performance, operating costs and design trade offs, but will not carry 4 adults with more than 3 hours of fuel. Check for fuel tank seepage, water damage inside cabin structure on pilot side, engine mounts in prebuy but overall not to many issues on preowned Mooneys.
I certainly haven’t regretted the Mooney purchase! Thanks for your insight!
I was looking at a Piper Saratoga that was a steal for $37,000. It was perfect for me even though it was on the higher end of my budget. When I got in for the first time, it flew like a piston version of the Legacy Pilatus PC-12 that I fly for work. Felt amazing and handled well. I went to my bank and they said they'd approve me for financing in 2-3 days. The next day I get a call from the seller telling me someone bought it all cash. I was devastated. I ended up with a Mooney M20J, and while it's not as nice as the the Piper, I still love it
That sounds like a crazy deal, must have been a long time ago? The J is a great platform!
This is a great video Cory. With my experience, the C-152 was never an option. I sat in one at the flight school and the yolk was obstructed by my leg because I'm tall. I Did 2 hours in a M20J before I started flight training and loved it. Since then all my 278 hrs has been in the C-172. Obviously I looked at them 1st now that I've decided to buy an airplane, but they are expensive. People think of them like they are Hondas with great resale value, and they are slow. I started looking at the Pipers becaue they were cheaper and I've always loved low wing design planes. I later found out that the 140 was comparable to the 152 and under powered. My focus then switched to something between 160-200 hp. The piper 160 and 180 was looking to be the best option, and I was not interested in the 235 model as it was not efficient. Warriors and Archers are scarce, and that's when I met a few people including you, who showed me that the Mooney M20C is is a plane that deserves to be looked at with its speed and efficiency. I cant wait to find the right one and start taking trips beyound the North East where I normally fly, and be apart of the Mooney family.
We will love having you, it’s a great group of folks from what I can tell!
Love the Mooney's. Such a pretty plane. One more good piece since your talking about first airplanes is safety. A plus for the 172 is that it has the lowest accident rate per 1000 hours of all the airplanes if I remember correctly. Clearly a reason why it's a staple at flight schools.
The 172 does have some redeeming qualities, it can take a beating for sure!
unfortunately we cannot really conclude anything about relative safety of many GA planes because they are flown by different pilots and used for different purposes. The fact that they are used so much for training could very well be the cause of a better safety record, not the result.
I think you’re right there with the training point. So many hours flown with instruction and in relatively safe situations (not flying across the country or in mountainous terrain)
It’s unfortunate you only looked at “older” Bonanzas, E-series, pre-60s. I trained on Cessnas & bought a C172, flown it 10 years, but moved up to a 1966 Bonanza, 285hp injected engine and upgraded to modern avionics 3 times now over, the last 24 years, I’m still in love, what a Great all around airplane. 👌
But, Mooneys are good airplanes also. 😊
The Cessna172 XP. Very good choice. I love mine. I'm never in a hurry to get anywhere, very fun airplane.
There is no doubt the 172 is a great airplane. My family had a 66’ 172 that I loved dearly!
I really appreciate the fact that you added the pros and the cons. I am trying to pursue my instrument as well as having aircraft that will get me places after I get my instrument. I am currently looking at Cardinals and Piper arrow three turbo.
Those seem to be good options as well. I settled on the Mooney as the speed/cost ratio is unbeatable (in my opinion).
Just started on my journey of obtaining a PPL. After about 45hrs in a Cherokee P28-140 I got introduced to a Mooney... and wow, I must say, it's an incredible aircraft. As a low hour pilot thought it would be easy to get behind the plane. Overall, great review and I enjoyed the video. Thank you sir!
Thank you for the kind words. I understand where you’re coming from, but I promise after 5-10 hours in the Mooney, the workload will feel no different than that Cherokee! Good luck as you finish your PPL!!!
I just about fell out of my chair when I saw N4061N in this video. I just bought it from a friend a month ago. It's currently at KDVT. Now I just need a CFI LOL! Thanks for the informative videos sir!
That’s awesome man! Congrats on the new bird!
There is just something about the Mooney, and I'll tell you what it is...
First a comparison using cars: American cars a few decades ago, even when brand new, felt "loosie goosie," in that the steering was imprecise, requiring constant adjustments. But then you borrow your brother's MG Midget two-seater sports car, and it is a delight to drive, with its precise rack & pinion steering, and a compact, everything-functional feel.
Now, a comparison using airplanes: I grew up on Cessna singles. When you taxi them the steering feels imprecise, because there are springs between your rudder pedals and the nose wheel turning actuator. Plus, the taxiing Cessna feels "loosie goosie," from the fact that the gear struts are actually springs. Like an American car from long ago, the machine wallows a bit during taxi. And the visibility is limited, especially in the larger Cessna singles, by a big, intrusive dashboard, and, arguably, by the high wing.
The first time you sit in the cockpit of a Mooney, well, you'll know what I mean. It feels like a fighter! You can see! It is as if you are going to strap the plane on. Everything tight and precise. When I was in the USAF, in pilot training, a cross-country F-104 stopped in for fuel. The pilot let me "sit" his cockpit. Even though I was then accustomed to the sleek T-38, this F-104 took me back to the Mooney days, with its sports car feel.
In the Mooney I felt more "pilot" than practically anywhere else. I got to raise and lower the landing gear. I even got to operate a little gate that allows additional ram air to enter the engine and provide an extra bit of power.
I could have had fighters in the USAF, but I opted for the C-9 patient-hauling DC-9, and eventually went to the airlines (my dream) where I "managed crews" in big ole flight decks, and where I found that cockpit space is surprisingly unimportant.
After many planes, more than any other, ...
That Mooney made me feel like a real pilot!
Such a great comparison Richard, thank you for sharing. Beyond that, thank you for your service. It's men like you that make this country great!
I bought a Mooney. For the speed, economy, and versatility you can’t beat the Mooney!
So true!!!
The actual answer is "whatever you can afford" so for most of us that's an ercoupe.
And as a bonus you can fly cabriolet style :)
I’d love an Ercoupe. Simple flying!
Mooney is the answer! The other planes I considered were the Arrow and the Socata TB series but the Mooney was hands down the best choice for us. I fly the M20F so it is has a 200hp engine (with 100 gallon tanks) but given the C model is shorter and lighter, it will fly faster than my F model. Long story short if you end up in a Mooney you will not be disappointed. There is just something special about flying a Mooney. My non-pilot wife has fallen in love with our little airplane as well because after flying cross country in a Piper Archer even she recognizes the benefits of the extra performance.
Great analysis Buck! I couldn’t be more happy with my Mooney as well!
Nice video. I like it that you show pros and cons
The two planes I’ve considered mostly have been a Piper Cherokee 6/Saratoga, and a Mooney M20. I like the Cherokee for its useful load and intimidating size (ramp appeal at least to me) but I also love the speed and range of the Mooney plus the retractable gear makes me smile
So true man. As my kids get older, I’ll likely have to move to a Cherokee 6. But for now, a sexy sleek retract it is!
I looked at a Mooney and really liked the economy, speed and high-altitude capability. but the cabin was cramped and landings are tricky. When landing you've got to get your airspeed just right and round off at just the right height or you can float on ground effect until you run out of runway. So I checked the Bonanza v-tail, which is a more comfortable plane but decided it sacrificed to much aerodynamically for speed. Even Bonanza enthusiasts admit the plane isn't very stable in roll, yaw and pitch, is prone to Dutch roll, and many are lost in bad weather (Bonanza people tend to blame the pilots for this). I bought a Navion A, which is built very sturdy, has a roomy cabin with a back seat that's comfortable for adults, has very stable flight characteristics, and with full flaps touches down softly at only 50 mph. It isn't as fast as the Bonanza but I don't care, it flies like a dream! I wish the Navion would go back into production!
Very cool! I haven’t had the chance to fly in a Navion, but hope to some day!
Would have been nice if you had put numbers to “cheap”, “expensive”, “slow”, “fast”, interesting video but since I don’t own a plane I have no idea how to interpret those statements.
Thanks Kevin, you’ve opened my eyes to what might be important to non owners.
Cessna 172 200,000 bonanza 600,000 mooney EXPENSIVE
I don’t know who’s buying new planes...but it’s not me!
Look at planes for sale on tradeaplane.com there are also general performance specs on there.
If you want to get some additional cost/performance information planephd.com has estimated maintenance/ownership cost and some other performance info such as fuel burn etc.
Thanks for pointing us to some helpful tools! I appreciate you watching!
My brother owned a Mooney Mark 21. I got some right seat time in it. A very easy plane to fly and the flaps made it seem like it could float, reliable enjoyable aircraft to fly. The other J-3 Piper. For an inexpensive plane all around good.
She is most definitely a joy to fly! I hav s some time in a super cub, but have never had the chance to fly a J-3...some day!
I rented a Diamond two seater, the DA20, to get my license. I loved it, but good ones are very expensive to buy. They cannot be made IFR, and I wanted an instrument rating. I rented a Cessna 172 for a good while. I liked it, but good ones that are IFR are pricey, and I did not want a loan. I also rented a Cherokee 140, but it did not perform well in climb. To avoid getting a loan, I paid cash for a Cessna 150 with a classic 6-pack of instruments and got my instrument rating in it. The Cessna 150/152 club is very active, and a great community. Surprisingly, it is filled with retired professional pilots. Many pros spring for a Cessna 150 for personal flying. My wife told me she will never fly with me. I'm allowed to fly with only one of our kids at a time. Therefore, until now, the Cessna 150 has been good enough. However, now that the kids are almost adults, I'm running into a problem with weight and balance in the Cessna 150. Two adults with full fuel is over max weight, and it climbs poorly on warm days while loaded heavily. I'm thinking about my plane number two. Must be affordable, no loans for me, IFR, and able to climb well with two adults and enough fuel, even on warm days. I also want to get my Commercial license. It is possible to do that in a Cessna 150, but I would have to install a glass panel and an autopilot. I'm considering my options.
Seems well thought through! I’d put the Mooney on your short list!
This was the first video I've ever seen on your channel. I just completed watching it just now. I already subscribed and rated it thumbs up. I liked your criteria analyzing and summaries of each plane. I'm a planning to purchase one this and begin lessons in it, so it won't have to be my forever plane, but maybe it will be. I absolutely loved how you fit the title of your channel into the last line of your video presentation. That moved me. Great work!
Thanks a bunch Danny! I really appreciate you being here.
struggling to imagine a set of circumstances where your choices are a 150 or a Bonanza
I have to say, they were both real possibilities as I searched for a bird. Likely the biggest reason is moved past the 150 was the discovery of a gentlemen who wanted to partner in a plane. It pushed the budget to a place where a 4 seat airplane was a possibility.
@@MyTimeToFly And what are your impressions of partnering, now that you've done it? (Loaded question, I know, since your partner is likely to read your reply, but we do what we can.)
I wouldn’t hold back, even knowing he might read it. For me, it’s been a great experience. Wes and I have similar goals, are both financially stable, and both fly about the same amount. I can definitely see where it could go badly if you had the wrong partners involved!
I always hated working on Mooneys' avionics. That sloped windshield makes for a tight fit when you're trying to reach behind the panel from the top. I can only imagine that they'd be a dream to own and fly, though. Every owner I spoke to had 0 regrets.
Thanks for the real world feedback. I've always hesitated to move to the 1 piece windshield due to the added complexity of getting to the avionics. For now, my avionics are easily accessible through 2 access panels just in front of the windshield.
I really want a 150hp Citabria, but so does everybody else right now, apparently. About the time I'm asking for logbooks, somebody else is holding out a check. I'm also realizing how impractical they really are - and I'm not talking about the VFR panel, I'm talking about the low useful load and the low speed. So now I'm looking at a Grumman - about double the useful load, and a good 20kt faster, and probably cheaper to insure with its tricycle gear (haven't verified that yet), but not really able to land on the semi-improved Forest Service strips that make up our "adventure flying" here in the mountainous southwest. 172? Flown one - meh. Bonanza? Flown a Debonair - too much work to be fun. Mooney? Haven't flown one, but probably a similar workload to the Bonanza/Debonair, and it's getting away from my "mission". What does all this mean? Nothing. If I knew, I'd have made a decision by now.
I love it, I can just feel your thought process! Thank you for sharing!
I looked at all of these as well, over the course of about 2 years before I made a purchase. I trained in a 172, but since 99% of my flying is by myself, I couldn't justify owning or renting a 4-place. With that mission in mind, I landed on the 150 and I absolutely love it. I've taken my daughter up once, but her previous medical issues became more challenging, resulting in her not being able to fly anymore. 3 years into ownership, and the mission really hasn't changed. I take a passenger up at least once a month, but some of my friends that want to go flying with me just won't fit, and even if they did, max gross makes it impractical due to the limited fuel we'd be able to take. I do still look at getting something faster someday in addition to the 150 (I really, really like the Bonanza), but the need isn't there yet so I can't justify it. Plus I myself don't like the idea of only having one exit door. That's really my only beef with the majority of low-wing planes, and I hate it because Cherokees and Bonanzas are just a joy to fly.
No doubt a 150 meets a great number of missions. My wife made it clear that 4 seats were a must for me! Thanks for watching, and enjoy that 150!
Check out mojogrips channel there was a low wing on there with two doors
My first airplane was a straight 35 Beech Bonanza, 1948 SN 1525 N 4504 V. I too bought mine, without any time in a Bonanza. I took an airliner to Newark N J from N E Ohio and paid the man. Done a few take off and landings, and was socked in for almost a week in Monmouth County Airport. I found it very east to fly and land, and that's with no adjustable prop nor retract time.` It had the E 185 HP engine, which meant 185 HP on take-off only. I owned it for 18 years and surely enjoyed it. I did do the spar mod and the A.D. on the V tail block. I top overhauled it and put new plexiglass in. Flew it many hours and sold it for $2200 more than I paid for it. ($5600). Sold it in 1982, when I got married. A fine fine airplane.
Such a cool story! What an adventure that pickup must have been!
Well done. Similar to some car channels and magazines when talking about bang for the buck, where "Miata is always the answer," pilots in the quest to move up to some capability frequently find "Mooney is the answer."
Most definitely, Mooney for the win!
When I was getting my Commercial ticket, a Mooney 201 was my complex aircraft. Boy was it, just not in the way I expected. It had the manual gear and pump down flaps. Touch-and-goes at the old Marana, AZ, airfield (now Pinal), touchdown, accelerate, rotate, gear up, release the flap hydraulic pressure, the engine quits. The pressure release knob was next to the mixture and I pulled the mixture instead. Pushed it back in and continued on.
Landing at Sky Harbor in summer, RWY 26, on final we hit a fast rising thermal and gained a couple of hundred feet. The tower gave me permission to do a 360° / 65° spiral but that didn't help much so he said I could land long and, if so, how long. I told him that I might make the 2nd half of the runway. He cleared me and I made it. I needed speed-breaks on that thing. It saved me a looooon taxi to the FBO, though.
Sounds like a bunch of fun. What did you fly prior to the Mooney. I was mostly 172, what a difference!
@@MyTimeToFly Grumman TR2, AA5, plus an Aerobat C-150 and AC Super Decathlon (for acro time) during my commercial training. Twin Commander for the multi. My Private was mostly a PA-28 but my examine was in a C-150. My commercial examine was in the Mooney.
Sounds like a lot of fun flying to me! Everybody should get that wide range of experience!
@@MyTimeToFly The VA paid for most of my commercial. Much of my PPL time was before I joined the Army. I finished it in Tucson when I got out.
That’s fantastic...I sincerely thank you for your service!!!
I'm 11 hours into getting my ticket and bought a house in an air park, so I guess you can say it's gonna happen. From my research you can fly a M20C @ C150 speeds and almost have C150 fuel burn. Most ppl don't seem to know that and recommend a Bo or a Commanche. Of course, that C150 isn't ever going to cruise @ 150kts. Mooney and AA5 is on my short list. There are MANY RVs in my airpark though. I'm debating on Mooney and having to find an A&P or RV and doing the work in my hangar next to my house. Downside there is having to fly commercial when we take the 7 yo. I always wanted a Long Eze, but getting that in and out of our 2200' strip would be sketchy. I've been watching your videos for a few months now. Keep it up.
Thanks a lot for being here, and congrats on the hangar house. Sounds like you’ve got a fair number of decisions to make. My only real recommendation...be patient. It’s not easy, but the perfect deal will present itself when the time is right!
Thanks! Great intel!
Thanks for watching!
A cessna 172 will always have my heart, but these are some great planes to consider.
Thank you kindly! I agree, the 172 is a staple. It is great to get experience in a variety of aircraft!
The Mooney is a great choice, I opted for a Comanche for the larger cabin and weight/balance advantage
I do love the Comanche as well. Had we found the right Comanche, I would have bought it!
I would like a Piper. My second choice would be an aero commander 114B, a fast wide cabined 4 place plane, single engine of course. Mooneys are awesome little planes. That forward angled rudder is lie no other!
In don’t know much about the commander’s, I’ve seen a few for sale and do like their design.
Aero commander is a twin engine chief.
Its a Rockwell Commander. The 112, 114, 114T and 115T are all good.
The model im looking at is the Gruman American because it has over 1000lbs useful load and its slightly faster than the Cessnas with longer range
I hear they are a blast to fly as well, nimble and smooth!
I chose an A-10C with Link 16, CBU-105's, Mk-82 Air, 6 AGM 65Ds, a couple of AIM-9Xs, and brand spanking new wings. Set me back a pretty penny, but I demand the most of my aircraft. Buyer beware, though....the 30 mike mike GAU kicks like a mule. #BRRRRRRRRRRT
The A-10 is a beast (from the outside looking in). Thanks for serving our country!!!
I own the first BE35 that you showed N9606K. We took the same journey a few years ago C152, C172, PA28, M20J, BE35 took a hard look at all. C152 to small. C172 To expensive, PA28 to slow, M20J to small and they all leaked fuel, BE35 Fast and roomy but not cheap. Nice video.
The struggle is real! Thanks so much man!
Good video. I don't agree with your choice, but of course, I'm partial to the V-tails.
Thanks Chris, the V-tail is a beautiful bird! Hard to go wrong there!
Looking at Maules & Cessna 180s for backcountry flying, but nothing beats the Sexy Bonanzas. I have logged more time in Bonanzas & Barons than all my tailwheel time put together.
Enjoyed your video
Thanks a bunch Stephen. As my family grows, I could definitely see moving into a Bonanza (if my wallet can afford it)
I really like the M20J
Me too Gregg. I hope to upgrade to one at some point. Unless I skip right over it to an Ovation or something crazy awesome like that!
I've flown the Cessna 152, 172, 172RG, 210 and the Piper Cherokee. I considered purchasing a Vans, a Beech Bonanza and a Mooney because of the speed but the Mooney won out because of the economy flying and maintenance since I use it for work.
Great synopsis Tim! I love the Vans aircraft as well, but the cost for a 4 place RV-10 was just unreachable for me. Mooney for the win!
First plane I ever flew was a Mooney. I was 9 years old. My dad let me take the controls for a minute. There were 8 members in his flying club, and soon after that they traded up to a Cessna Citation for the extra room and speed. But we all missed the Mooney.
Very cool, although the jump from a Mooney to a Citation seems like an incredible upgrade.
@@MyTimeToFly Oops, my bad. I meant Centurion. Yeah, a Citation would have been way cooler though! :-)
Ahhh...that makes way more sense!
Great video. Thanks for taking us through your thought processes in making your selection.
My pleasure, I appreciate you watching!
I agree! Good choice
I appreciate you watching!
My "mission", plain and simple, is pleasure flying, and for that I purchased a Magni M16 gyroplane. I've flown 8 different kinds of single-engine aircraft and, by a wide margin, the gyro is the most fun to fly. An open-cockpit gyroplane is the motorcycle of the sky.
I wouldn’t never have thought they would be so much fun! I’ve never even sat in one. How are the maintenance requirements compared to a fixed wing aircraft?
@@MyTimeToFly A little bit higher than a fixed-wing airplane because of the moving parts of the rotor assembly, but considerably less than a helicopter.
Sounds reasonable, I’ll have to learn some more...maybe find one to ride in someday!
@@MyTimeToFly be careful - you might never want to fly your Mooney again! 😁
Easy now...that seems a little crazy!
I subbed. I want to fly, but- I’m a nobody. I haven’t taken one class. Thanks for your motivating videos- I want to be in your club.
Thanks for being here Paul! I have no doubt the community would welcome you with open arms. Your best bet is to find a local airport and just start hanging around a little. Listen, observe, and ad find a way to start getting involved!
Thanks for adding my 150 at 3:02 AKA the "Turdbird"
Hahahaha...I love it!
Kind of surprised not to see a Piper Archer on your short list. Similar with the 180 hp engine, seating, 10gph fuel rate, available parts, knowledgeable repair folks, etc. I’ve been looking at planes for a similar missions as yours, considered some of the same planes, and the Archers seem like one of the best options out there. Proof, I think, is they are in such high demand and so can be hard to find. But I think with some patience and research they are obtainable and an excellent option.
The Archer was definitely discussed once or twice, but likely due to limited supply we never found one that fit our mission just right...for the right price.
Thanks for the video. I am right where you were. 172, 182, Beech 35, or Mooney. The only thing not on your pros and cons was insurance cost. The beech is almost triple. compared to the other three.
Wow, your right...that is a miss. My Mooney insurance certainly isn’t cheap! That is a big plus for the non-retracts.
9:44 cool paint
Definitely a great style, thanks for watching!!!
Saratoga? or Saratoga II for retractable.I also like the DA-40 with Diamond being the safest aircraft in GA plus the most innovative in both airframe and diesel engine, so flying over the Rockies is no big deal because of the turbocharger. Also consider this: a 10GPH aircraft burning 100ll is $4.55x10 x 2000 (hours) is $91,000 for 2k hrs of engine life. A DA-40 diesel is 6GPH at $4,07 x 2,000 hours so fuel cost over engine life is $48,840 . The salesmen never calculated that for you? Surprise. Prices are national averages today from AirNav. $45.50 per hour vs $24.42 per hour for fuel. I wish Textron had the brains to put the Continental CD300 in the G36 Bonanza and STC it to the older ones..
The stressful part about buying an aircraft is trying to take a limited (job) income and try to fit $1 where you want $5 to be.
I'm a very big diesel fan, specifically in cars / trucks...I agree there is great opportunity for them in airplanes
Thanks for an awesome video and sharing.. I own a Cessna 150j my first plane. I'd love to get a Mooney.
Thanks so much Waqar. I'm loving the Mooney, but a Cessna 150 will always have a special place in my heart. I hope to own a 150 some day as well!
Great job on the process of making your choice! It was interesting to hear what you considered with all of them!
Thanks man! In any of lifes adventures, choices are plentiful. I think I'll stick with the Mooney for now, like you have the Neon!
I just found one.
1979 Mooney M20K 231 It's beautiful.
Mooney's are as you found out a sweet plane. I was chief pilot for a Mooney service center and have flown over 1,500 hrs, flying all models from the C through the Acclaim. my two preferred models were the J (201) or the Ovation. one nice thing, starting with the J and K models is, they stretched the cabin to give more elbow room and leg room between the seats. I ended up having the privilege of doing the initial flight test on the 310 STC for the ovation and Acclaim.
Wow Ron, what an awesome opportunity you had! I hope to move up to the J model someday...but need the budget to grown before that happens! Thanks for watching!
Had s friend that had a 66' J. Put a new 180 hp motor in and prop. Bought it for $37k, spent another 22k on the above two items. She cruises at 175 kts@10k ft and 11.8 gph. I didn't like the manual Johnson style gear bar and manual johnson bar flaps. He finally upgraded to a 71' and got electric flaps andd gear. I miss his 66' J. A Chinese aviation student wanted something fun and fast and took 10 hrs with a instructor in it. He was training in G1000 archers. Problem is he had under 200 hrs (the chinese kid, 22 yrs old),no IFR. He died in ghe plane 3 days later trying to scud run a layer of mild precip from KFLG to KDVT. CFIT/ mountains ruined his day, permanently. Collision was estimated over 220 kts.
Dec 2019.
Again, just an opinion here. You seem to care significantly about the amount of hours somebody has. Although not insignificant, just because somebody has fewer hours than the next guy, doesn’t mean they are now a better/safer pilot. Good decision making starts from hour 1, and is driven by personality and good instruction.
I thought J’s all had 200hp.
Nice analysis. I have owned several Mooneys starting with a 1984 201 (J), then two 252's, a TLS and a Bravo (both are M20M's) and now have a 1995 Ovation which I love!
Great fast planes and very efficient!!
So true. Some day I’ll step up into a big boy Mooney like you! I think a J is the next step for me.
So what are the differences between a TLS and a Bravo? Both are turbocharged, different engine package? The Continental vs Lycoming debate still rages on, which one to pick?
@@MidnightMechanic
They are the same. The original M20M (TLS) had a problem with oil cooling the cylinder heads and they added a modification labeled "Bravo" to the Lycoming engine. The TLS (Turbo Lycoming System) my partner and I bought already had the Bravo conversion and therefore was identical in fuselage and engine and flight characteristics as the Bravo we got later. Only major difference is that the Bravo had a G1000 vs steam gauges in the TLS.
Which one to pick? Bravo vs Ovation? Depends on your "mission". If you plan to do a majority of mountain flying out west or routinely fly out of high altitude airports I would pick the turbocharged Bravo. It will burn more fuel for sure but get you above terrain without issues. Otherwise the Ovation is incredibly efficient since you can reliably run it lean of peak.
There the same to me...out of my budget!
Cessna p210n. Speed, capacity, can outclimb the weather.
Business trips. Enough money.
propeller control.
Radar
Handles all but the inop strips. Even some that are
No doubt they are a capable platform!
I would have encouraged you go with a C182, unlike the 172, the 182 is a true 4 place airplane. Reasonable to maintain with great resale value. Stable like a 172 but with a 4 place engine. Having grown up with Bonanza's, there is truly no greater airplane that is if your flush with cash. You should also consider some of the pipers, I have many an hour in a Bonanza, and they are truly a joy to fly but God the cost to maintain one. Constant speed prop, flower flaps, retractable landing gear with fully enclosed gear doors, ours has the retractable step. None of these things are cheap. If your concerned about fuel burn per hour you really can't afford a complex single. I can buy a piper wing for what a Bonanza aeleron costs. Plus finding a good beech mechanic is another story.
Plus the 182 is going to behave like a high performance 172.
All good points. I think what stopped is from going 182 was the purchase price. It was double the Mooney (if equipped roughly the same)
@@MyTimeToFly I know, several factors contribute to that. I think popularity due to ease of flying for a entry level pilot. Basically you've got a 172 magnum. Although it four seats anything much above sea level and a 172 is a good two person airplane. I can't name the number of accidents I've seem with high density altitude and 172's that the owner tried to fly with four people because it had four seats. I've told more than one 172 pilot if your going to fly the western mountain states take the back seats out! Their dead weight, you can't use them safely so why pack the weight. Often if it were just two people I would pull the back seat out of my V35K which also allowed me to keep my center of gravity as far forward as possible plush was 44lbs lighter.
Plus for a low time pilot things don't get ahead of you so quickly with a 182. You get into true IMC, get sloppy on the on
Instruments, leave the power on and you can quickly be approaching 200 kias. One thing my father who was a 35 year ATP passed on. If you find yourself in turbulent IMC slowly pull the nose up, drop the gear, bring in 2300rpm open your cowel flaps and you can quit worrying about your airspeed running away, I would imagine this holds true for a Mooney
Again great points and very practical advice regarding the seats. The Mooney certainly can be configured such that the airspeed won’t get away from you. But, if you’re not proactive about getting the gear down...it can and will get fast!
@@MyTimeToFly my father was a 36,000 ATP, who lived to fly and put an airplane on more that sat in it. In his early years when he wasn't flying the DC3 for West Coast Airlines he was flying charter and demo/sales for the Beechcraft dealer in Boise. My God that man could fly a Bonanza well, but what stands out is a couple pointers he gave me. First watch your CG as the V Tails could easily be loaded into an aft CG condition that with full tanks you don't even notice until several hours into the flight you find you keep having to add just a hair of nose down trim every once in a while, until your configuring for landing and you find yourself having real difficulty maintaining trim and having to add more power just to keep the nose down, and then it wants to flair about 100ft agl.
The other observation mentioned earlier is lowering the gear. He said if you find yourself in severe turbulence, especially IMC lower the gear, even if your way above VNE lower the gear now granted as he said you may tear off a gear door, but it might keep you from getting killed. Another was if you find yourself in mountainous terrain and maybe being forced to remain VFR because of conditions and the canyons are getting narrower, pull the power back, lower the gear, lower 15-20 degrees of flaps, open the cowel flaps, and bring your power up to about 70-75% and you'll be able to fly at 75-90kias all day long make tight high bank turns and not loose it or stall because your now 20-30kias above stall.
Just some useful information. Also he ALWAYS pulled out the pilots hand book and checked our density altitude and what our take off run should be given our weight and altitude.
Happy Skies
Went with late model cessna 150M. Panel included gtn 650 - adsb in/out- mogas stc. So an ifr trainer burning premium autofuel with hourly operating cost of $22 to 24 dollars per hour. Whats not to love.
That’s awesome. Don’t see many 150s with a GTN 650 install!
Try to purchase what you need. Avionics upgrades will break your bank.
Yes sir! A wise man once told me to “let somebody else pay for the upgrade” buy the whole plane from them.
I’m doing my license stuff now but I want a Piper J-3 Cub…. Because they’re awesome and the most simple way to fly
They are awesome! I hope you find the right one!
I like Mooney aircraft, they are remarkably efficient airplanes. My mission is different than yours since I live in Alaska. I've got a Cessna 180 on wheels in the summer and skis in the winter. I've also got a 182 on floats that gets to sit out the winter months. I think you approached your search logically and methodically and ended up with the right airplane.
If I ever have a need for a faster, longer ranged airplane I would be looking at the same types you did. I like Debonairs, Cessna 210s, and Mooneys.
Thanks for sharing James! It sounds like you’ve got a great fleet for your mission!
Aeronca Champ. The most fun you’ll have flying. Probably the least expensive aircraft to own as long as you don’t ruin the fabric. Great for $100 hamburgers but not so much for long XC.
I haven’t had the opportunity to fly in one, but I definitely understand how it could be a great choice for a slightly different mission!
Hoping to finish my TW endorsement in a Champ this Spring. It is incredibly fun to fly. Not sure I could (should?) afford to hangar one. The Mooney is on a different part of the mission spectrum...feels like an M20 could really open up some XC adventures. Will I really find the time to take off work for that? Maybe a Pitts would be best... :)
A Pitts would be fun, but I don’t think they hold much fuel. I could definitely see having a STOL taildragger and the Mooney long term!
@@MyTimeToFly For pretty much all the reasons we could imagine, they are considered notoriously ill suited to cross country. People do manage to attend acro competitions without trailering them, though, so how bad could they be? :)
I’m up for any challenge!
Congrats on your new buy! Excellent summary of the thought process. I’ve had a similar reactions in the hunt. Cessna owners are very proud. Birds in the reasonable range have outdated equip. Updated glass is just crazy money. Did same as you probably...joined mooneyspace, bonanza society, COPA, etc. Tons of valuable advice from the “communities.” Got my IFR last summer in a Cherokee 180. You’ll love doing yours in your own plane. I’m envious lol! Hopefully Covid will ease up soon so I can begin prebuys. Happy flying!
Thanks Jeff! Enjoy the hunt, and safe flying!
I’ve been looking at 177RG. My uncle says they are awesome, he is an AME who owns a maintenance shop/FBO
The do seem like very nice airplanes, just a bit hard to find. I’m sure you’re experiencing that! Good luck Ryan!
I have over 1,000 hr. in the 172 and many more in the 152 , turbo 182 and the 210 . For my own it would have to be the 172 RG . A bit more range can be added and it makes a good simple instrument platform . It is much cheaper to fly as well .
Cheaper to fly that what, a 182?
Piper Malibu is great for family vacays while if you wanna go solo flights or training we have c152 or the Cherokee 140, sr22 is by far my favourite. The traveller is also pretty good a bit less comfortable though
Are all these planes available in a club you are part of?
@@MyTimeToFly no they arent but I'm looking to buy one of these planes, not now but in a few years time...
Big difference in cost between a 150 and a Mooney!!! Nice plane!
It might seem that way, but there are many 150s that are priced substantially higher than a C model Mooney. Of course many Mooney models are more expensive than the C.
Thanks for using my 1976 Cessna 150 M at the start of your video. N820ST is an IFR airplane. I bought it that way, but I have upgraded all the avionics and also the instrument panel it's self. New paint job was done last year. Interior was updated 3 years ago.
My pleasure sir!
It seems you may have missed the most successful practical aircraft in the game a PA28 Cherokee. The PA28 180 is a very rugged all round aircraft with the Lycoming 0360 is a very good aircraft for charter, as its short strip performance at AUW is excellent.
I have no doubt it’s a great platform, it simply wasn’t on my list. I didn’t intend for this video to be the end all list of first airplanes...it was simply my short list.
Dave, I would suggest flying each and picking. Plane owners are Ego Maniacs about their planes. Besides Mooneys are the best! Great economy fast strong good payload and by the way my girl 1978 M20 J does not have bladders and never been resealed. She’s hangered her entire life and I don’t land on grass. Good luck. ps The Comanche 250/260 was my second choice.
You got that right...we all think we have the best plane ever made!!! In all seriousness, I would love a J!
The reason I went with the piper 260 is because it was a true 4 passenger low Wing retractable gear. The reason I picked on that plane and particular his because it only had a little over 2,000 hours on the plane and zero on the engine. I did all my training in a Cessna 182
The Comanche 260 is a great platform! We considered a 180 Comanche, it just wasn’t quite the right deal for us.
My analysis was the same. Mooney came out on top. I could not justify the extra expense of an older, slower Bonanza, especially when my mission profile is usually just me and the dog.
For sure, it’s a great cross county bird. Can haul anything that fits if you’re by yourself!