Guitar Tuners and the Buffer Question
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- Опубліковано 30 вер 2017
- Three guitar tuners to check out here, Boss Chromatic Tuner, The Mooer Chromatic Tuner and the F Zone Chromatic Tuner, which one is the best and which one would you use.
Also I explain the extra benefits of the Boss Tuner and it may surprise you.
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Wow good to know about the buffer. I had know idea about it and have had that tuner for years . Thanks
Super appreciate this review because of the explanation of the "buffer" feature!
I have the Mooer E-Lady Flanger and it is just as good as any High-end Pedal on my board. Love It.
The fzone is the one for me, as I run a WL-50 wireless, no buffer really needed, and it still has a second always on output to key my Zuul noise gate in the loop. Great info!!!
What's cool is about half of the Kokko mini pedals (dirt cheap clones) that actually give the option to have then buffer and you can turn this feature on and off by holding the footswitch down. None of the UA-cam videos or reviews I have found so far have mentioned this and it works pretty well.
Never knew that. Much thanks❤️. I have the unit you have on the right. Same model. Tu-2. In my playing days , never used one because all my money went for drugs and 0 gear. Would have made life a lot easier back then. We would tune before the gig then wing it.
Loved the vid
I have had the Mooer for a couple years. it is easy to see and fast. I love it.
I had an issue with mine, it does not like going in front of my wah pedal, makes a very strange noise, could be the wah pedal but I dont get an issue with other pedals.
I like the strobe tuner function on the boss, I thought it was a gimmick at first but realised you can get in tune way quicker with it. As for buffers I’m not fussed got a volume, treble, mid and bass knobs on my amp turn those up problem solved 😉
Not boring!!
Thanks very good info
I read the joyo tuner ped for $41 has a buffer
You're a sort of right with the "buffers are good"-statement, but there are few things to consider;
1) Fuzzes react to guitar. That means that they won't work the same way with buffer first.
2) Same with some wah pedals. You'll get the annoying screech with a buffer.
3) If you have some sort of "always on"-pedal at your board, it'll act as a buffer.
4) If you have many pedals with buffer in your board, you'll get a degradation in your dynamics.
On the other hand, if you have a lot of true bypass pedals, the buffer corrects the level and clarity. It'll also strenghten the signal from board to amp, if using long cables. I'm no way of saying that the buffers are only bad. It is really depending of your rig if they work or not.
Personally I have kind of 3-stages at my pedalboard - Fuzz etc, looper pedal with distortions etc. and a boost pedal with good buffer to send healthy signal to amp. Basicly there are two buffers at bypassed state; tuner between fuzz & loop sections and boost at the end.
While these are good points, you are missing some nuance as it relates to fuzz and buffers. Players should be aware if they have ANY impedance sensitive pedals; these are typically vintage pedals which includes fuzz, wah, treble boosters etc. They should always go in front of the buffer in your signal chain so as not to compromise sound quality like you mentioned.
That said, if you went out today and bought a new big muff without any silicon or germanium transistors you are 100% able to put it behind a buffer without any issues.
You could use the boss tu-2 tuner as buffer only (which you could place anywhere in your effects chain) and use baby tuner Mooer for tuning needs
Not boring at all. Quite spot on actually
I did not know that.was thinking of getting a buffer.and there it is.i had one all the time.i normally leave my tu 2 on top of my amp..years ago wanted to go guitar straight into the amp.stuck with it.now going to put it back on the bord.the perfect vid for me today.nise one
Brilliant
Thank you for this video! Everything you say is true. I do not know how I have gone so long without my boss Tu-3. I used to just go with a delay pedal and the amp. The tuner is paramount to great gigs and solid recordings. I spend atleast 10 minutes tuning my instruments before recording
With the tu2 and the tc electronic one I think I'm pretty safe. Lovely pedals
Hi!
Very interesting video!:)
I had also used a boss tu2 before a switched to a korg pitchblack racktuner. I still have that if i want to switch back. I do switch tuners a lot thats why I dont only own 2 tuners but 12 different tuners.
I obsested witch them, they just make it sound better !:)
Sometimes i use a analog needle tuner like the boss tu12 or sometimes just a clip on tuner like my peterson clip tuner,it tepends.
My current tuner, the pitchblack racktuner has a kabelcheck function that i really like and also it looks like a spaceship, blue bright lights and a big display that i can still see if im sitting far away from my amp.
The other important fact of a tuner is how accurate they are, the korg tuners are really like the strobe tuners very accurate to the last cent.
You can power other boss pedals from the boss
good video :) now one about noise gates
Have the Korg pitch black rack tuner and can't turn the led off so is constantly on when playing can be irritating at times and honestly prefer the pedal tuners but I have a cheap version on my pedal board, think I'd like the tu-2
Hi Dave, great channel. I like the 'live band' gear review - much more relevant than studio/office/bedroom reviews.
As for a bright-LED buffered tuner, TC Electronic's latest Polytune 3 pedal claims to adjust brightness to suit its surroundings, and now includes their most popular buffer. I haven't tried one of these yet, but it's on my list.
Cool, glad you enjoyed the live band review
Oh i forgott. I think the korg has a buffer built in because it is a high end tuner,the rackmounted tuners.
I think i dont really care about the buffer im not to worry about my sound as long as it sound good to me.
Interesting info, thanks Dave. I have a Korg Pitchblack custom tuner, not sure if it has built in buffer or not. Note to self, must look this up !!!!
I have been using Korg Pitchblack of late also, I'm not so happy with it, compared to the Mooer it's a bit sloppy and slow. How you finding yours.
Compared to the cheap clip on tuner I first had, it's better, but not tried any others. I'm just a beginner really (at the age of 64 lol). I have a 2012 LP studio, now equipped with Irongear Steam Hammers and a roller bridge (after seeing your enthusiasm) and string butler at the other end to take care of tuning issues. Also a Schecter Omen 8 string.
A Line Pod HD300, Orange micro Terror into an old Marshall 12" cab completes my home rig. Nothing special, but enough to drive the neighbours nuts when I want lol.
Just picked up a used Boss yesterday for $30, works 👍
If you have a long lead from your effects board put another buffer at the end.
Great video, interesting stuff about the buffer! Going to order the Mooer though as I'm an old fart with bad eyes. Did spot that you have more Mooer pedals, curious to know which ones?
I must admit the Mooer has a great visual for its size, I use Mooer pedals for Chorus, Delay and Phaser, Tc for the reverb and and a dunlop for the wah, thats it, I dont use any other effects apart from my fingers :)
The F-Zone/Monoprice actually has a buffer built in too, to use it just use the second output instead. IT does affect the sound when it's on though.
I got the "Fzone" for $11 on Amazon because I got tired of unplugging my guitar or bass to check to make sure it was in tune which it usually is so I ordered the FZone to replace my little Korg that i've had for years and it works great just kinda annoying and I don't even gig . Well I read good reviews on the FZone but it really does suck a lot of tone from my bass rig, it took a lot of the highs out and at first I thought my amp or bass was messing up until I remembered on one of the reviews it mentioned the tone suckage and it's true. The Fzone also lags and i found my guitar was actually getting out of tune because I thought it showed in tune but it was like a second or half second slow. My son who uses a strobe tuner on his pedal board said I need a buffer or to get a BOSS tuner because they come with built in buffers so that's why i'm here.
also all behringer pedals are buffered since they are exact Boss clones
Remember too much buffer pedal colour the guitar tone as well
TC Electronics Polytune Mini has a selectable buffer 😊
I didnt even bother to check my new polytune but indeed it does, keeping it off as it hurts my wah for some reason.
Personally I don't have boss tuner yet, If it put my boss noise suppressor first in chain do you think it will works as a buffered?
not sure, you will have to check with the manufacturer
Any Boss pedal will work as a buffer.
Hi Dave, today a guy from Thomann music store told me to put the TU-3 tuner to the end of the chain. Especialy to use the buffer? I am a beginner and now confused a bit. I would put it in the pole position as you did . I think this is the most seen configuration. Was the guy wrong?
He's a twat
I've got the Mooer Chromatic Tuna :-0 its a great little unit. Old farts with slowly deteriorating eyesight will also appreciate not having to keep putting their glasses on to read the Mooer's display.
:-0
I've used the Mooer for a couple years. Way better than the Boss.
Stirling Archer Hi Stirling: i would like to know if the mooer tuner is or isn't true bypass. I'd appreciate your answer. Thanks
haha
Does the Boss DD20 have a built in buffer?
It may not, you will have to check spec.
I use an EHX rams head and Boss Blues driver at the beginning of my chain and I want to buy tc electronic polytune mini as a tuner/buffer. how should I order it. tuner, rams head, Blues driver? or rams head, Blues driver, Tuner
I have no idea, try different ways
@@DaveBarlowGuitar it's all good thanks anyway
TC Electronic polytuner has a buffer I think.
I will look into that :)
@@DaveBarlowGuitar Quick Google for you www.andertons.co.uk/guitar-dept/electric-guitar-accessories/tuners-metronomes/tc-electronic-polytune-3-tuner-pedal-%28w-bonafide-buffer%29
Buffer/true bypass switch inside
If you use the wireless, the receiver have a low output impedance and do not suffer from top end losses. No need for a buffer.
Good point and thanks for the comment, but I got some interesting clarification from my wireless manufacturer @ Smoothound, see below :)
The buffer question really depends on why you're asking
cause the answer is yes ... and no.
A buffer in your signal chain does two things:
1. It'll have a very high input impedance. This means it won't load what ever
comes before it.
2. It'll have a very low output impedance. This means that it's output isn't
affected by what comes after it.
The transmitter has a very high input impedance. It acts as a buffer wrt
passive pickups. It's a bit like fitting a pre-amp in your guitar.
The receiver, however, has a middling output impedance. Unlike lots of other
wirelesses on the market, I deliberately increased the output impedance
of the receiver to 10kOhms which is similar to a typical pickup coil impedance.
Coil impedances vary quite a lot so I picked something in the middle.
The reason for this is I wanted the receiver output to behave in a similar way
to a pickup coil when you connect it to an amp or even more so, something like
a Fuzz Face. The result is that the system sounds OK with a Fuzz Face. Without
that extra impedance it would sound horrible with a Fuzz Face.
So it does act like a buffer but one with an output impedance of 10k.
I was watching That Pedal Show last night and they looked at a passive
overdrive pedal that needed a buffer before it. The wireless receiver would not
work well in this case because the passive overdrive has a transformer input
which needs the very low output impedance of a buffer. In the vast
majority of cases though you can consider that it does have a buffer just one
whose output is designed to look like the output of a guitar pickup.
Regards
Chris
10k output impedance is a bit higher than I would expect but....
Couple of points:
First, a bit off topic: passive pickup guitar have a DC resistance of somewhere between 7k and 15k. 10k would be the average. Simple to measure, good indicator for the output. The actual working impedance of the pickup (which is AC, or audio signal) is usually 10x higher or more. Something in the range of 100k to 200k. Then comes the volume pot, which messes things even more. That's why the amp has to have huge input impedance, usually 1M ohm. And a long cable does attenuates high frequencies.
Now on topic some points:
1: 10k is not that much. I am willing to bet that it is not attenuated at all by the following pedals..
2: Something that a lot a people do: they use a long cable, then buffer. Practically they feed an already attenuated signal (on high frequencies) into the buffer. For the buffer to do its job, it has to stay close to the guitar (long ago I had a battery powered one fixed to my strap). Some buffers can be inserted inside the guitar as well. They are called preamps, also. Now the wireless is even better. But the idea is, after a buffer you can use a long cable, before is useless.
This takes me to point 1: if the long cable is missing, there is nothing else to attenuate the receiver signal. Pedals don't attenuate. True bypass switches do not attenuate.
And last: let's suppose I'm wrong, and something attenuate the receiver signal. Your guitar pickup see the transmitter only. No attenuation there. Then the attenuated signal from receiver will drop in level, but not loose highs, like a passive pickup. If the receiver is designed to mimic a passive pickup, it should have an output transformer. Lots of wire. I will open mine, for a sneak peek ;)
Hope this helps, and see who is becoming the most boring on this page :)
Shit dude, you need to get out more LOL, no really, thanks for the comments, ACE
👍🇺🇸❤
so why do I still have 'tone suck' if I have a Boss TU3 and a BOSS dd7 in my chain?
patch leads, how long is your guitar lead, are connections good, is your guitar good, check your amp, could be many reasons, if you could bring it round to me I would have you running with the sweetest sound ever.
Thanks. 50 watt Marshall OLD one.. I always just used the wah pedal. but now, after all these years, I have an MXR carbon Copy, the tuner, the wah, and this little green Behringer OD,,,. it never sounds as good or as full and rich as straight in.. good quality 18 foot from guitar, 20+ foot to the amp... let me ask you this; should the BOSS TU3 go FIRST, then wah, OD, and finish with the CARBON COPY... would that be the most optimum? I don't know what the Behringer OD or cry baby wah is (True bypass or buffered) I have been going into the Wah first..
Dave, not sure if your singer mates 100% accurate with the buffer idea. The thing about the two other tuner pedals is they're true bypass, which means it doesn't degrade the signal when they're off (or out of circuit). Actually having a buffer in front can degrade the signal just by their very nature. The problem being that most pedals have some sort of front end buffer included in their circuit - and boss pedals tend to have them engaged all the time (whether the effects in or out - electronic switching). So if you have 10 effects in series, 10 buffers = a lot of background noise, hence why a true bypass switch tends to be a better option in regards to signal degradation. If I'm building effects, it's always a true bypass switch. Buffers tend to help older badly designed effects circuits that have a low input impedance (fuzz faces, wah's from memory) which drop the impedance of your pickups (being that they're both effectively in parallel). Funnily enough, I'm waiting on one of those cheapie tuners to arrive from ebay. I'll rip it apart when it arrives and have a look whats going on inside and let you know.
For sure, my wah pedal always sounds better without that Boss pedal in front
Another thing Dave, Wah's are well renowned for not being true bypass and some actually stay partially on, even when switched off. Great if you like that sort of thing. You can change the switch inside to a DPDT switch if the excess tone suck is too much.
Just got that tuner in the mail today. Ripped it apart, but you can't see what's on one of the boards as they're piggy backed. Says it's true bypass, but I'm not 100% convinced. I'd have to do a trace of it as I think there's more going on with the switch, but I don't think it's buffered. Also pretty impressed that it's got a metal case (not plastic like it looks). Little slow, but not too bad for price!
On a side note, I was reading up on pedal bypass designs and tend to agree with the statement that most of the mechanical switches these days are getting cheaper (quality as well) and not lasting as long. Plus the fact they were made to switch higher voltages, not just small signals and tarnish the terminals. That's one good thing Boss have going is they use momentary switches designed for 500000+ presses, regardless of the buffer issue. A 20c part easily replaced and will work again for 20 yrs!
in regard to the fzone, have you noticed that the the display is way too bright? like i literally can’t make out the letters if i’m standing because it’s soo bright. the letters only come clear when i crouch 😭😭
Cant see the boss in a daylight gig though
Boss has a bright switch
where?