I swear to god man, you're criminally under-viewed. I mean, reviews are reviews, but such an indepth analysis should really be seen. Especially nowadays where horror just seems to be thought of as "throw things in their face and go boo."
Thanks, I glad to hear that! Hopefully classic horror games will return to the mainstream with Resident Evil 7, assuming that its as good as the demos make it look
If you think horror has turned into a just jumpscare genre, try playing silent hill 1 and 2(no other). It will definitely definitely revive your taste for horror games. Edit: I wrote this before watching the vedio.
Doom is sort of a horror game. But instead of having horror inflicted on you, you are inflicting the horror. It almost parodys horror games. As when a scary enemy screams at you and instead of running away you just put a shotgun shell in its head.
The interesting thing is, you can easily make a game too scary. The problem with ot however is that most players will quit playing it because it is too much or they stay and get immune. The way to achieve this is stress. If your game is too stressful, people will very likely stop playing it. You need to balance things, and that is the hard part about creating a scary horror experience. This is why calm moments are so effective. For example, imagine playing outlast 1. The catch is, there are no calm moments. You are in constant danger, enemys are always there and chase sequences last up to 5 Minutes while giving you tasks to aquire objects while being chased. Also you only have one live. Dying means to restart the game from the beginning. It would probably be the scariest game of all time, but how many people are actually going to finish it? Won't it be too scary and stressful for the majority?
I've developed a huge kick for horror games after being too scared to play them all these years. They have an appeal other than scares and often have other mechanics to help engage you on replays (combat depth, multiple difficulties, speedrun challenges, etc.). I especially love when you have to go around collecting scarce resources, it really creates a sense of reward when you conserve properly, or relief when you've run out of ammo and find some lying around. One trend I hope doesn't continue in horror games: the hide and seek, no combat approach. I get the point, you're supposed to feel powerless and having no chance to fight back can create lots of tension in that way, but it only works for specific types of enemies that you can legitimately not fight, like ghosts. Otherwise it just kind of breaks immersion because you know in real life you'd have to engage eventually. Also, it creates an extra sense of terror when your first instinct is to hide and avoid an enemy but you have to face it head on.
11:36 - That is an alternate truth. They were creative to use the darkness and fog in the same sense. Originally, since Silent Hill was one of the 1st evolutionary 3D games set in real time, the fog and darkness hid the environment in the distance which would pop up and load later due to the Playstation's limited ram and loading time. So when the background would load as you came upon it, it would load within just enough distance to "fade" in instead of POP out of nowhere that actually helped enhance the experience of the "EFFECT/affect". 12:41 - which is why new age fear/horror would work well with this idea. Though, mostly conspiracy and suspense movies with action and agents usually build their entertainment off of this idea.
I find a good horror game not to necessarily be a scary one, but an interesting one. It has to have good themes, story, and characters. Atmosphere and being scary are still important, but I'll be more lenient on an interesting game than a scary one. Doing both, of course, would be the ultimate achievement.
@@Alpha-kt4yl Pretty sure he just means that the story/events protrayed by a given work of horror should be enough to qualify it as genuinely good writing even when the audience might not actively be scared of it.
Example:Silent Hill 2. It's a scary game, yes, in fact, a lot, but it's the least scary of the first 4 games, and it's considered the best by many, many fans
That's why I love the RE games because they always have a mystery to them that you need to solve by the end. And honestly they're the only games that can scare me anymore, the 2 and 4 remakes are great. The RE2make especially is scary as hell with a very foreboding atmosphere everywhere you go. Of course most people agree that RE games universally have good stories and characters, the themes are more subjective. Personally I just love the whole biological experimentation theme. Especially with RE7 being one of the scariest in the series and also taking the those themes a step further with a human bioweapon, while also subverting expectations from the action-filled RE5 by making the bioweapon an unassuming little girl, whose story is even quite tragic.
What do you think about that guy who jumps out of the oven in the last section of Resident Evil 4? That jumpscare comes out of nowhere after two big action setpieces, and leaves you in the tip of your toes for the rest of the game.
I didn't even remembered him lol, what I remember as really spooky moments were the Verdugo cutscene where it's shown running towards you, the first regenerators or the novistadors. Those were good moments
I'm old enough to have played the original Doom when it came out. Even as cartoony as it was, it was quite scary when suddenly a platform would lower from across a room and roaring demons would come running out at you. The sound design and sudden change in lighting caught you unprepared. Lots of people I've talked to told me they felt the same way. The original X-Com had a creature that was lightning fast and would breed zombies who would come after you right away too, so whether it attacked you or not, you were still in real trouble and it could cause a fright! And ... this was even with a turn-based strategy game! Ask anyone who played the original way back in the day, they'll tell you the same thing. There are plenty of ways to scare someone with a surprise that is not really a jump scare or an evil face blasting you from a screamer prank.
Mr Foxcade let me just say thank you for all the quality content you put out. I've have been on a steady binge of all your videos for the past while and they are some of my favorite on the platform, I hope to see you cover even more and you are a great example for if you put out quality content people will watch! Keep up the great work man
@@Foxcade anytime man! I always comment on creators I really enjoy watching because I think people don't get enough appreciation sometimes, your vids are some of the only ones I watch 100% so I'd be remiss if I didn't tell ya thanks
I would say Amnesia: The Dark Descent also played a key role reviving the genre. It cam 2 years before Slender and jump-started many UA-cam careers like Pewdiepie. The game is one of the classics in the genre as well. Slender is more of a concept game that got popularity due to being free and easy money for youtube screamers.
@@SaladPizzaRestaurant 🤦♂️. True terror is disempowering, as such a players ability to fight back must be limited or removed when making a horror game, otherwise you just have a horror themed action game. If you don't feel small/weak compared to your environment/enemies at least in the beginning, then the game can't be considered proper horror. Even then, you should never make them feel truly empowered, instead it should feel like a close call that you just barely got through.
@@kyleowen5299 removing the ability to fight back removes many of the things that made older horror games scarier. Enemies are no longer scary because everytime you see one you know you have to run and hide. It removes the "should I try to run past this thing or shoot it". Another thing that is missing in those games is the inventory management and limited amount of weapons and bullets. I just think that games like outlast or amnesia are more walking simulators than horror and I don't understand how anyone got scared playing those games.
@@SaladPizzaRestaurant I said limited or removed for a reason. If for example you find a gun you'll feel safer and relieved, but when they discover that not only is the ammo limited, but that it takes at least 2 shots to kill a normal enemy (I define kill in this case as being permanently removed from play), they'll think twice about engaging them, especially when you have the proverbial terminator after you. After all, which would you rather do, Kill the enemies and draw the "terminators" attention and every mook in 100 ft. (high risk, but will get through quickly if not caught, otherwise game over), or sneak past but possibly have to deal with the mooks while running away from your "terminator" analog (low risk, but chance of getting flanked). Couple this sort of decision making with properly timed encounters with a slow moving invincible foe (the proverbial "terminator" mentioned before) and you can make them enter situations where they must decide quickly whether to escape loudly while getting mobbed or sneak around and potentially getting caught. Additionally by making it clear that bullets only slow down you implacable foe, while simultaneously utilizing jump scare tactics when placing your encounters with him, you can incite panic in a player when they realize that everything that heard their gunfire is now moving towards them, while those who remain calm will notice an opportunity to sneak away using the mooks to slow down your "terminator". Edit: Oops, I repeated myself unnecessarily. But you get the point. Make using your weapon high risk and let the player screw themselves over. Stealth should be the option players favor more in a horror game after all. Additionally read what I said in my initial comment on empowerment in horror.
I played cod world at war in a custom match by myself and with the isolated feeling and fearful music I felt so terrified,that's how you make a open in day light horror game or game moment
I feel like I’m the only fella who thinks that RE4 has scary moments other than the Regenerator. The wolves, the invisible bug things, and U-3 still scare the shit out of me, even after the first playthrough
I completely agree. Verdugo, Dr. Salvador, the Garradors, the Plaga Knights when playing as Ashley. The game has tons of fear inducing enemies, encounters, and moments that create the tense experience. The only caveat being that the game turns into an action power-fantasy around the time you hit the island.
"When we're left alone in the dark, we feel alone." Ah, yes. When you're alone you feel alone. Very astute. Nah I'm kidding. I just came from Joe Anderson's "Why Horror Games Don't Scare Me" and this video is _way_ better.
Man while listening to the soundtracks running in the background, I knew this video was gonna be perfect especially the theme of Laura for Silent Hill 2, I just finished the game and I can't seem to get over it anytime soon makes me wish there were more games like that
If you're creating a scary scene it might also be helpful to have it fully lit at first, if it's scary in the daylight itll be even scarier in the dark
its been so long since ive played a good horror game.one that truly scared me.but i kinda find it funny a game like bloodborne frightened me more then outlast.I just wish more game would give you a larger reason to fear dying not just "oh no i got spooked."
I agree. Jumpscares aren't scary - they make me jump, but i'm not scared, i'm startled and paranoid of surprises. The only time I've been scared truly by a horror game was by PT, and that didn't go anywhere.
During my "research" for this video, I found that good horror video games are becoming harder and harder to find. I thought this might be just me since I found I'm a bit harder to scare than most, so its good to know I'm not the only one! :)
Sadly, atmosphere is something that is often disregarded in many games, though to be fair to the designers in can be hard to do. In one of my next videos, I'll actually be looking at how a certain game builds its atmosphere, though its not specifically a horror.
I gotta admit RE 2 remake made Zombies terrifying again..like you said making anything scary in the right context..being enclosed in a Police Station with Zombies now being formattable enemy's
@@HD-rq2og r/woosh, no really looking back they ARE locked inside with ya,them being difficult doesnt mean you are easy,you WILL kill at least 10 zombies,and if we dont count the times you died which we cant anyways because it never happened then it means that they are locked inside with you
@@winstonchurchill7822 why do you say woosh if you go on to explain why you are right? Woosh means you were joking... Also just because you survive doesn't mean they were the ones in trouble. I wouldn't say they are locked with you because you barely have any ammo, and most of the time are just trying to stay away from them. About %60-%70 of the zombies you don't actually kill, unlike a game like doom, where you stop pretty much everything in your way.
I know this isn't really a point the author was trying to drive home in this video, but I would argue that the Bilbo "jump scare" (and it was a jump scare for sure, in the Jackson movie) during Fellowship was actually horrifying- because the visage of the kindly old man we knew was transformed into some sort of malice-driven demon or some-such in that moment. It was an original scene- if I'm not mistaken- from the books showing the power and hold the one ring had over Bilbo and just how "horrible" =P its attraction was.
I'd also argue that that scene with the red faced monster (not sure what movie it's from) isn't really a jumpscare. It seemed a little too subtle to count as one.
An idea I had: A game that is randomly generated each time you play it. there are two randomly generated factors (the players are not told what they end up as) 1. Monster 2. Setting (place) Have a huge list of monsters and settings hidden in the code. Add new settings and monsters every once in a while with out saying the update (unless it's a bug fix) I was also thinking each monster has a different way to be beaten, but you have to find it on the map. (One a last part. I was also thinking not all settings would have the monster's weakness and the player wouldn't be told, but please tell me if it'd be a bad idea)
I don't think you have to actually put in whole new monsters, but utilize them differently from playtrough to playthrough. Can be done with placements, like in your first playthrough you might encounter a monster directly around the corner of a hallway, but on your second playthrough the monster is not there, instead one will crash through a window later on. (Obviously you want to randomize it in a way that it is not predictable. It shouldn't be predictable that no monster in the hallway means a monster crashing through the window, there should be the possibility that one happens, both happens or maybe even none of the two happens, as long as you keep the monster count around the same number maybe to keep the game balance up). You can also switch up the monster types from playthrough to playthrough. Maybe you encounter the harder monster somewhat earlier in another playthrough. For places I think small changes are also already enough. Maybe different doors are locked every playthrough, so you have to take some other routes everytime. Maybe various puzzles get randomized (for example if you have to type in a number code, have it being randomized completly, so a player can't just remember it between playthroughs and has to actively search for the clues, which will expose them to the possible threats on the way). Even loot placements can be randomized a bit. Imagine a player being low on health, trying to check the known health item spots from the last playthrough, just to notice that this time they're empty or filled with other items.
I bought both RE7 and RE2 this week and started playing 7 first. I got past the intro and now I'm exploring the house with Jack chasing me while I try to figure out where to go. I then realized that I do not like horror games, the tension is just too much for me. Having an unkillable enemy constantly chasing me gives me panic attacks.
I suggest try talking to yourself while playing or put something else in the background to offset the atmosphere. Having minor distractions like that can help you through these types of games.
It's the common misconception about the horror genre that it's about ‘scaring’. It just can not work, fundamentally. People get scared only when threat of something undesirable is real or genuinely believed to be. It takes experiencing just 2-3 films as a kid/teen to familiarize one with the sensations and false nature of their sources to form qualitatively very different reaction to them (still not happens to tiny minority of people though). Fear exists only within the realm of the work, for the audience it's either evocation of unease, unsettling atmosphere, sense of repulsion or simply the thrill ride (or blend of both sides).
Alright, imma big horror game fan or horror genre in general, I'm actually developing a game project for my university and as much as I want to make the player scared of being isolated it's difficult for me because I've been isolated and alone for so long that I'm so used to it, for me it feels scary to be in the crowded areas or with other people, but these are great horror game tips and my actual research for the final year is exactly as the title in the video, just reworded a bit, but after watching this and one of the other videos about beginner mistakes in horror games, I have found I did a few and I'm changing, but thanks, and great videos.
I think startling the player can be used to great effect like to rise tension but it should not be the pay off and it should be used sparingly so the player isn’t desensitized to it but also always keeps them on edge.
I still hold that a lot of horror games feel lackluster because we use one word to describe two different ideas. I personally like creating a distinction between Terror and Horror; Terror is the feeling of visceral panic, while Horror is the feeling of mounting dread. Terror is brought on by things like jumpscares or charging enemies, while Horror is brought on by things like a weak protaganist and an unsettling atmosphere. I've also seen this described as the difference between Action and Tension, but I don't think that quite captures it, because Tension and Action are more like ingredients that developers balance to get a specific result. Something like Until Dawn has short moments of tension building up to the action-focused jumpscares, to create frequent terror; Amnesia has long bouts of tension cut by brief action-packed chases, to create lasting horror. And then some games fall in the middle, like the first Dead Space, with tense exploration suddenly interrupted by frantic combat. If you ask me, understanding that difference between those two types of fear (and the specific balance between them you want to aim for) is the biggest step in making a good Horror game, as opposed to a good Terror game. It's something I've had on my mind a lot lately (as an indie game dev working on a horror game), and I felt like you were almost talking around that distinction. So, I thought I'd throw in my two cents on the subject. ^^ Edit: Just realized I should mention: this is your first video I've seen on this subject, so if you mention this idea later, someone please tell me so I don't feel TOO stupid. XD
13:00 that's the cover of Eldritch Tales, a tabletop rpg based on Lovecraft and cosmic horror. You should check it out. I think every aspiring developer who plans to make a good horro game needs to read 'The Philosophy of Horror: Or, Paradoxes of the Heart' by Noel Carroll, as well as 'The Weird and the Eerie' by Mark Fisher, a couple of books that explore what makes a horror work horror. There are a few more books that explore the topic in a serious way, but these two are the ones I find more useful and which I have used for my fiction and my roleplaying game adventures.
I'd actually argue that Doom is a horror game. Doom Guy is the monster and the demons, well, they're the ones shitting themselves when you turn the corner
What makes a person feel fear, Is all what you have said. But I think there's also one you haven't mentioned. That is *tension* or *thrill* many people hates the feeling of being chased, and or something that is looking for that and they have no choice but to run, or a feeling that something is behind them. A feeling that makes you panic. That's also one thing that what makes a game scary. For Example : Outlast 1/2, Alien: Isolation and Etc. But anyways! You are very underated, and you deserve much more. I love channels who deciphers and share deep meanings and great explanation.
But in the grand scheme of things its not to different from jumpscares. It creates high adrenelin and and forces players to make quick decisions. The Difference is the lenght of tension. While a Jumpscare is a small moment a chase is a extended moment. Chasing scences are somewhat hit and miss. Whatever is chasing you must find a fine line between deadlyness and harmless. If you can escape to easy and you see that the monster/psychopath/etc has trouble keeping up you quickly feel at ease and can even make fun of your pursuer. However when it is to deadly and will Game over the player you force the player into the same situation twice but due to the first encounter you completly break any momentum of building fear. The Player is able to mentally prepare and reflect on their mistakes while also understanding the danger that they are in. It breaks the immersion into the game and automaticly makes it less scary. And the last problem is the frequenzy. This is why I personally consider Amnesia the dark Decent a better horror game then Outlast. Amnesia keeps chase scences to a minimum while Outlast tosses you from one chase into the next. Outlast chases become predictable and every area that you enter you slowly over time get more of a mindset of allready planning your escape routes. You pretty much know at the last section of the game that you have to run from on area into the next from whatever your current threat is. While Outlast chases scences are brillant and can toss the unexpected at the player while also making the enemys rather harmless on normal difficulty to make surprises less punishing and ensuring the players survival, there are just too many of them. But here we have a flaw with the game of Outlast. It lets you choose the difficulty. It enables the player to make the chase to brutal and almost impossibel to survive on a first try where one mistake causes a reset. While Amnesia has also a hard mode it is clearly for challenge seekers and not the actuall expierence. So 99% of players will play the normal mode. But here is what Amnesia has done better then outlast when it comes to chase scenes. When the Players get caught and dies in most instances in the game they put the player back to the last checkpoint but the threat that killed them is removed. This goes against the players expectation and actually puts them back on the edge because suddenly they find themselfes in a unknow situation unsure of what happend. While they might reflect on their mistakes they are not able to put it into practice and makes them uncertaint about their abilitys. So while a chase can be a good highlight and adrenlin pusher, they are just like jumpscares something that needs to be used sparringly and should not be on what your game relies on.
Well I think co-op could work in horror video games, however like jumpscares they have to be used a certain way. Like maybe both players are separated or are working against each other.
(I apologize in advance for this long ass comment, sometime I like to ramble on for a lot longer than I should) I find that horror is kinda fundamentally flawed in games, because things that would make good horror, don't make a good game. Being disempowered may make it scarier, but that usually means you get restricted with awkward movement. I find it a bit cheap when the monster or whatever you're up against is only a threat because you move like a tank. The monster isn't strong, you are weak. This is why I don't find many full on horror games to actually be good games, you either get something like outlast where you can't do anything to the enemy besides running away, which isn't very interesting gameplay by itself, or you get something like Layers of Fear or PT which I compare to the haunted house rides at amusement parks. They take you through a spooky environment, and maybe it will be scary for a little bit, before you realize that you actually aren't in any danger. There's no actual threat, just scripted scares that happen, once you realize there is no danger, it becomes a lot less scary. When it's no longer scary, what is the game? Just walking around and looking at the spooks. That leads into the biggest flaw with horror in any medium not just games, the more you are exposed to something, the less it scares you. I used to be scared of Five Nights at Freddy's, before there were four sequels. And even the first game no longer has much of an effect on me, because I've been way too over exposed by it. And again, without being scared, what is the game? Would you play FNAF if the gameplay was untouched but it removed any horror elements? I find the scariest things in games come from non horror games, because you're not expecting to be scared, and the game doesn't sacrifice anything to disempower you. For example, Rayman 3, you spend the entire game easily fighting the hoodlums, it shows you that you are strong and capable. But then you reach the desert of the Knaaren. The atmosphere becomes darker and the Knaaren are invincible, you cannot defeat them. The Knaaren are scary because you are not weak, you've been kicking ass the entire game, but the Knaaren still overpower you. This level in goofy lighthearted cartoonish Rayman 3 has scared me more than any actual horror game, because the reason I feel disempowered, is because up until then, I am powerful. Again, sorry for the long ass comment, I like to go really in depth and had a lot on my mind with the subject.
The scariest thing in videogames in when you're low on health in a very demanding fast paced action game where one little thing gone wrong can mean losing a lot of progress
@The Red Guy - you make some great points- I agree, to a point, that scares in games where you don’t expect them can be scarier than most horror games, but I disagree about games disempowering you not being fun, or good games. The original Outlast did it right. You were in a mental asylum, and didn’t know which patients would simply ignore you, and which would get agitated and start chasing you down (other than the main antagonists, Chris Walker, the naked twins, and the walrider). The sequel is where Outlast kind of falls apart. It’s one thing to be a journalist surrounded by maniacs and not fight back, but in the farmland in II there’s so many things they could’ve done to make it a bit more, realistic. I’d have been grabbing a shovel, or hoe, or any other gardening tool as a weapon to defend myself, were I in that situation. A lot of horror is in the presentation, and atmosphere. Outlast, Alien: Isolation, Amnesia, and RE 7 are prime examples of how the perfect atmosphere can make or break a horror game. Just my 2 cents!
I actually tend to think the whole "limited control" and disempowerment thing is a pretty cheap and lazy way to create horror...I tend to think games like dark souls and blood borne are far better at creating tension dread and terror than most games in the actual survival horror genre. Real fear comes when ya have options that allow or rather ya have choices and you're forced to decide whether or not to hide run or fight, the game should lean in that order but not always...1 when they or it find you and they will eventually then 2 you should flee until there's no where left to go then 3 ya left with no option but to face it... When ya can can't hide ya run and when ya can't run any more you fight and when ya can't fight ya die...that's scary...but to truly work it needs to be dynamic and not overly scripted, ya need well thought out mechanics and good A.I rather than a game director and level designers that want to control every little detail according to their plan and pace. When ya have weapons and actual control along with what you think is a smart strategy, I.E a good common sense plan only for it to fail and for the enemies or monsters to just bypass overcome, adapt or just barrel straight through...that's horrific. Making it so a player is a slow weakling incapable of fighting back and that has only one repetitive response isn't scary it's boring, having the equivalent of a character who can only move at a snails pace or can only hide in cupboards and under beds etc is like playing as the brain dead bimbo in those old slasher flicks who just randomly trips and stumbles over their own feet so the slow walking psycho can catch up or like in the zombie movies where there's always that one person who goes crazy or is dumber than the walking corpses who lets them in and gets everyone killed etc...lazy uncreative cliche...in games this limited control shit often means there's no panic or conflict when it comes to playing the game because there's no making quick or instinctive life and death decisions in a limited time...ya just do X because that's all ya can do...there is no Y and Z.
I know I am late to the conversation and I tend to agree. You can give a player a weapon and they can still be "powerless". Deadspace 1 and 2 do this very well in creating horror and paranoia in the player. Just because I can shoot something in the face doesn't mean I feel powerful in that scenario. F.E.A.R the first game also does very well in wrapping horror with action, as well as Condemned. And I am not a fan of these Outlast, Amnesia style type games and want to see more Deadspaces and F.E.A.Rs which terrify me more. The other type of horror game where you have no weapons and are limited to hide in a closest just frustrates and bores me after a while.
I agree,you dont have to make the character stripped of resources for a game to be scary. I found New Londor in Ds1 and The upper Cathedral ward and the Yahgul unseen villiage in Bloodborne scary as shit seeing them and in those games your character has swords and weapons
I think a good horror game is the story it tells, and environmental storytelling, like darkwood, and dead space. and models, like in phasmophobia. And location, like in (not a game) Star Wars Blackwing. Which takes place in space.
The only two games offering complete new frightening enemies not already seen a thousand times before were the possessed machines from Alan Wake (possessed logging and farm machinery suddenly awakens in some dark eerie possessed kind of life to attack Alan with sharp saw blades, crushing bulldozers, combine harvesters suddenly start their huge diesel engines on foggy desolated nightly fields and begin hunting down Alan with no one sitting in the illuminated driver`s cabin........ this was absolutely fresh new and an exciting yet frightening new style of horror). I really like that, the idea that every kind of common machinery like cars, trucks, tractors etc being able to become a random killing machine is absolute frightening and makes every road, every field, every garage, highly dangerous and unsafe. And Soma brought some intense fresh monster ideas to life, based on the hide&seek classics Outlast 1 and Alien Isolation and it`s predecessor Penumbra Black Plague. Everything else is classic horror, nothing we haven`t seen a thousand times before, but it`s still great and it still works because it targets on ancient human fears (becoming prey, being killed in a very gruesome and painful way and getting eaten by a predator, being hunted down in a forest or abandoned buildings and finding a random gruesome looking gory corpse like for example in Condemned Criminal Origins or Blair Witch triggering the fear of being stalked by an unknown murderer and getting killed in the same painful way like that victim before us, being eaten alive by zombies or creatures like in Resident Evil 2 Remake, and other classic horror themes.) Nothing new - but it`s still frightening if it`s a well-made game ;)
I'm a huge fan of ur videos I've watched so many of them, and I'd love to see u do live streams or playthroughs of maybe more niche titles or just to get ur critical and unique and fair point of view.
Sometime soon I do plan on getting into streams, it's just a matter of taking the time to get it set up. Maybe by the new year i will get that going :)
Horror is hard to do because humans are designed to adapt and normalize things. 1 or 2 scares is good but after awhile we get bored. Its why action movies are the most popular. Its hard to get bored of cool fights and also they are easier to write.
“Having played Resident Evil 4 more times than I can count, theres nothing in this game that will ever scare me again.” I dont know about that for me at least. The Iron Maidens still get me good each time I play
A good horror game, has to scare you from time to time but also be playable and fun, some games take it too far to one extreme, and people usually either don´t finish them or don´t consider them horror games. Alien Isolation is one example, the whole setup is perfect, scary and builds tension, but when you realize that you are completely powerless and you have to avoid this one enemy (the Alien) it becomes a chore, it is not scary anymore, just frustrating as hell..the whole game is reduced to walk slowly and silently from one room to another trying to avoid the Alien until you find a save booth.. rinse and repeat again and again, if they had added a little bit more action sequences in the game it would have been much better.. or even the ability to fight off the Alien sometimes (like the Nemesis in RE3) that would have improved the game a lot. That is why it sold poorly and will probably never get a sequel. Then you have the other extreme like Resident Evil 5 or 6 where it becomes a shooter and also not scary at all... Until Dawn is surprisingly a good horror game (though the characters move way to slow when you control them), the earlier Resident Evil games were also good in that they had the correct balance between action/power/scare factor... Most games actually fall in the survival category more than the horror category, like the Evil Within, as much as it tries it is never scary, but it is still a good survival game with lots of gore...
It's been out a while now so I dont need to say spoilers.....but that fetus baby monster in Biohazard VIIIage was genuinely frightening, I had to pause the game during that. It has everything, the ambience and the music. Even the mansion you enter to get to that part was quiet, too quiet. It felt...off. The entire build up to it was well executed.
10:41 anyone else remember shadow of innsmouth having that god awful bit at the start of each chapter going "dude I'll tell you but you're gonna go crazy hearing this believe me it's insane"? It worked on page 1, but each chapter made the statement more grating till it became downright annoying, just get to the story already!
silent hill homecoming is so underrated its crazy, same with downpour. yes the pc port has major technical issues and run problems but the game itself is excellent. the combat is so good and the environments are creepy. good story. its got it all. downpour is one of the most intense, surreal experiences ive had in a horror game. i dont understand the hate. maybe ppl expected something other than what they got? maybe players who would normally play these games had too many other games on the go at the time. who knows.
I understand the hate, because I played the first 4 rather than the last 4. The studios changed, multiple times. Team Silent was no longer in charge. The other western developers do not completely understand what the original TS design philosophy was and how they created the atmosphere and monsters out of that philosophy, including references. So Silent Hill lost all cohesiveness.
Games is the only media that can put you in the "DIRECT" experience of horror. You are the character and its up to you to survive. As movies, is just an hour long but creates the image for the viewer, its still just a watch. Books are probably the best version of horror besides games because what goes into your mind and the level it is able to affect/effect you as an experience, really depends on your own personal experience as well as you you mentally perceive what the writer or author is trying to deliver to you. When you sleep, it grows within your mind and becomes apart of your perceptions. Ultimately, bottom line: Fear exists in the mind. It really is quite personal in depends on the individual. Books have no visuals, so your mind creates it for yourself. Everyone's personal imagery perception of a "look" differs from that of another person's. It is their own mind of fear. Just the way someone probably had a bad experience with a particular situation that causes them to be afraid of the idea alone where it could not affect someone else the same. Rape for example,....personal.
I agree with your assessment of Doom (2016), and it’s why I’m not a fan of that game. Doom 3 on the other hand, scared the shot outta me back in the day! Also agree with unpredictability. A good comparison of that is Outlast and Alien: Isolation. I’m not saying Chris Walker isn’t scary, but he’s not as scary as the xenomorph, due to their ai. Walker has patterns he follows while patrolling for the player, whereas, they mad the ai for the alien more reactive, and unpredictable. You never really know if the alien is going to walk away from your hiding space, or suddenly swing back around and give you a face full of mini-mouth! I’ve played Alien: Isolation a handful of times, 3 on nightmare mode, and the alien still scares the crap outta me at times!
I find it hard to be scared by anything honestly. I don't know, I tend to be scared of what I can't control more than anything else. Still, an interesting video.
I can understand that mentality, its the fear of making the wrong choice. That's why Xcom could be classified as horror, because it limits information, so you are never 100% sure about your choices
I personally call the feeling decision horror. When the decision stumps you with an uneasy and dreadful feeling. My first time playing, I looked at a upgrade menu for like 5 minutes. As if any choice could be my last.
I have that feeling when playing Fire Emblem, since a dead character is dead forever. It makes me think a horror focused strategy game could be a thing.
Great video, though i do feel like your a bit to narrow in your view of what is horror. Grated you did say that anything can be scary in the right context. In recent years what horror is has been clallenged and redefined a lot. Take for instance your point on predictability. While it can ruin the sense of fear, if done properly it can add to the experiance. The looming sense of dread when you know something is just around the corner. I feel like true horror takes whats scary about things you know and mixes it in with the unknown. A killer stalking the halls, you knowing its there but not where. Knowing at any momwnt he could be around the corner or behind you. If executed correctly horror can be found in the fimilar and unfamiliar.
Hey just a question, what’s the song used in the background, the one with the piano. It starts at 3:35 I swear I’ve heard this song in like every horror related video
I don't know why it is so beloved. It's just Amnesia + Alien, it's not original at all, both the Alien and the robots have been in media since the 70's
@@waltuh11121 Amnesia didn't invent the "unkillable monster that always chases you" trope. It also borrows way more from System Shock 2 than from Amnesia. It's also a really good game.
Man I know this video is really old by now, but have you played Subnautica? It's not even supposed to be a horror game, but no other game ever made me nope out like it. It kinda nails all your points by default due to the setting (Well not so sure if it stays unpredictable the whole way through, I'm too much of a pussy to find out). Maybe it's just me and my own fear of water, though.
great mention. This game plays on all of the mentioned tropes, and does so (maybe) unintentionally. limited control - humans are not aquatic creatures. Swimming is very limited, and we have to breathe too. darkness and isolation - pretty obvious. the ocean is big and dark, and you are alone. fear of the unknown/unnatural - swimming over large, deep bits of the ocean with no idea whats below is one of the most terrifying parts of this game. My experience with the "Dead Zone" in VR was one of 'nope nope nope.' unpredictability - while many creatures are based on animals we know (like fish, manatees, alligators), the reapers are something completely new. Each creature you encounter in the game poses new risks and challenges. arguably survival horror, and it's not even marketed like that.
If you're looking for unique Horror like Music, Sounds and Ambiance from scratch, I am more than happy to help you! Just reply and we can start right away!
often when a horror game makes you alone it means its not a good horror game take phasmaphobia for example sure that game is terrifying when your by yourself but it still manages to be scary even with 3 other friends that makes a good horror game plus i enjoy a bit of story with my fear so other characters are kind of necessary a good horror game dosent need you to be alone in order to be afraid only bad ones do resident evil is more of a story adventure than it is horor
Phasmophobia in my eyes can be scary because of the randomized factor. You never know what type of ghost you're dealing with until you find it out. You might have an easy time or a hard time based on RNG. Sure, there are rules when the ghost can hunt (mainly average team sanity), but as long as you have no dedicated truck camper, no one can tell how high or low your sanity is, which leaves you out in the open when to expect the next hunt. There is also the fear of losing all your equipment on death, especially early on, when you haven't grinded a lot of money. You're death could very well mean, that the next mission has to be done with less or not as good equipment as before. But I still have to say, it's way more scary when you're alone. When playing with friends we often joke around and stuff and whenever we hear noises (things getting dropped or whatever) we can also try to explain that it was one of our team mates dropping something and we even have the possibility the ghost will get a team member instead of ourselves. But Phasmophobia also has the problem of becoming less scarier the more often you play it, because you'll inevitably learn it's rules and what can happen and what can't happen and as soon has you've grinded enough money, there is also no big fear of losing all your stuff anymore, because you know, you can just simply replace it instantly again.
Personally a good horror game must have a single quality. It gets worse the more you think about it. Like a toilet that always sticks out 2 tounges if you sit on it or that you were killing monsters, but you only thought they were monsters. The realizstion that it's worse than expected.
1 more thing I would add is "Lack of Power" which is also a great factor in horror games and this makes alien isolation such a great game. Alien isolation has people on board, we know alien franchise very well so fear of unknown is also little, also the device it gives us to detect the movement of alien diminishes the unpredictability. But its still a good horror game because, we cannot do anything to the alien, we are completely powerless [also it can kill us in one hit] which brings a huge terror while playing the game which makes us hide and watch every of our step. It is slightly different from limited control because while limited control would be each and every bullet counts, you have to strategise and micromanage, lack of power means you cannot do anything to change the situation, just hide yourself and be out of sight until alien starts looking for you in other rooms, which will give you small small windows to progress the game
Probably my favorite of yours I've seen so far, second is probably the DMC3 retrospective... still not buying the validity of "character action" as something other than your label for complex hack n slash games.
I swear to god man, you're criminally under-viewed. I mean, reviews are reviews, but such an indepth analysis should really be seen.
Especially nowadays where horror just seems to be thought of as "throw things in their face and go boo."
Thanks, I glad to hear that!
Hopefully classic horror games will return to the mainstream with Resident Evil 7, assuming that its as good as the demos make it look
If you think horror has turned into a just jumpscare genre, try playing silent hill 1 and 2(no other). It will definitely definitely revive your taste for horror games.
Edit: I wrote this before watching the vedio.
Well 7 years later and fnaf only got worse
Doom 2016 is a horror game… in a way. It just flips everything and this time *you* are the dreaded unstoppable walking terror for demons.
Doom is sort of a horror game. But instead of having horror inflicted on you, you are inflicting the horror. It almost parodys horror games. As when a scary enemy screams at you and instead of running away you just put a shotgun shell in its head.
Doom is horror in reverse it survival horror for demons
So it's the first 2nd person horror game? 🤔
You are a game horror
so um... not a horror game
The interesting thing is, you can easily make a game too scary. The problem with ot however is that most players will quit playing it because it is too much or they stay and get immune. The way to achieve this is stress. If your game is too stressful, people will very likely stop playing it. You need to balance things, and that is the hard part about creating a scary horror experience. This is why calm moments are so effective.
For example, imagine playing outlast 1. The catch is, there are no calm moments. You are in constant danger, enemys are always there and chase sequences last up to 5 Minutes while giving you tasks to aquire objects while being chased. Also you only have one live. Dying means to restart the game from the beginning. It would probably be the scariest game of all time, but how many people are actually going to finish it? Won't it be too scary and stressful for the majority?
I've developed a huge kick for horror games after being too scared to play them all these years. They have an appeal other than scares and often have other mechanics to help engage you on replays (combat depth, multiple difficulties, speedrun challenges, etc.). I especially love when you have to go around collecting scarce resources, it really creates a sense of reward when you conserve properly, or relief when you've run out of ammo and find some lying around.
One trend I hope doesn't continue in horror games: the hide and seek, no combat approach. I get the point, you're supposed to feel powerless and having no chance to fight back can create lots of tension in that way, but it only works for specific types of enemies that you can legitimately not fight, like ghosts. Otherwise it just kind of breaks immersion because you know in real life you'd have to engage eventually. Also, it creates an extra sense of terror when your first instinct is to hide and avoid an enemy but you have to face it head on.
11:36 - That is an alternate truth. They were creative to use the darkness and fog in the same sense. Originally, since Silent Hill was one of the 1st evolutionary 3D games set in real time, the fog and darkness hid the environment in the distance which would pop up and load later due to the Playstation's limited ram and loading time. So when the background would load as you came upon it, it would load within just enough distance to "fade" in instead of POP out of nowhere that actually helped enhance the experience of the "EFFECT/affect".
12:41 - which is why new age fear/horror would work well with this idea. Though, mostly conspiracy and suspense movies with action and agents usually build their entertainment off of this idea.
I find a good horror game not to necessarily be a scary one, but an interesting one. It has to have good themes, story, and characters. Atmosphere and being scary are still important, but I'll be more lenient on an interesting game than a scary one. Doing both, of course, would be the ultimate achievement.
By interesting, do you mean that you want to delve deeper into the game despite the creepiness?
@@Alpha-kt4yl Pretty sure he just means that the story/events protrayed by a given work of horror should be enough to qualify it as genuinely good writing even when the audience might not actively be scared of it.
Example:Silent Hill 2. It's a scary game, yes, in fact, a lot, but it's the least scary of the first 4 games, and it's considered the best by many, many fans
That's why I love the RE games because they always have a mystery to them that you need to solve by the end. And honestly they're the only games that can scare me anymore, the 2 and 4 remakes are great. The RE2make especially is scary as hell with a very foreboding atmosphere everywhere you go. Of course most people agree that RE games universally have good stories and characters, the themes are more subjective.
Personally I just love the whole biological experimentation theme. Especially with RE7 being one of the scariest in the series and also taking the those themes a step further with a human bioweapon, while also subverting expectations from the action-filled RE5 by making the bioweapon an unassuming little girl, whose story is even quite tragic.
What do you think about that guy who jumps out of the oven in the last section of Resident Evil 4? That jumpscare comes out of nowhere after two big action setpieces, and leaves you in the tip of your toes for the rest of the game.
That scared the hell out of me as a kid! It was awesome.
I remember that after that, I started to walk carefully by every single furniture that could fit a human body inside, like wardrobes, fridges, Etc.
I didn't even remembered him lol, what I remember as really spooky moments were the Verdugo cutscene where it's shown running towards you, the first regenerators or the novistadors. Those were good moments
Man, I've found some quality content today. Definitely subbed, and I hope you continue to make content like this.
I'm old enough to have played the original Doom when it came out. Even as cartoony as it was, it was quite scary when suddenly a platform would lower from across a room and roaring demons would come running out at you. The sound design and sudden change in lighting caught you unprepared. Lots of people I've talked to told me they felt the same way. The original X-Com had a creature that was lightning fast and would breed zombies who would come after you right away too, so whether it attacked you or not, you were still in real trouble and it could cause a fright! And ... this was even with a turn-based strategy game! Ask anyone who played the original way back in the day, they'll tell you the same thing. There are plenty of ways to scare someone with a surprise that is not really a jump scare or an evil face blasting you from a screamer prank.
Mr Foxcade let me just say thank you for all the quality content you put out. I've have been on a steady binge of all your videos for the past while and they are some of my favorite on the platform, I hope to see you cover even more and you are a great example for if you put out quality content people will watch! Keep up the great work man
Thank you, that means a lot to me :)
@@Foxcade anytime man! I always comment on creators I really enjoy watching because I think people don't get enough appreciation sometimes, your vids are some of the only ones I watch 100% so I'd be remiss if I didn't tell ya thanks
As much as I hate Slender, I also think it's responsible for reviving the horror genre in gaming.
I would say Amnesia: The Dark Descent also played a key role reviving the genre. It cam 2 years before Slender and jump-started many UA-cam careers like Pewdiepie. The game is one of the classics in the genre as well. Slender is more of a concept game that got popularity due to being free and easy money for youtube screamers.
@@Tpoleful I think games like slender and amnesia ruined horror. Games where you can't fight back are not scary at all.
@@SaladPizzaRestaurant 🤦♂️.
True terror is disempowering, as such a players ability to fight back must be limited or removed when making a horror game, otherwise you just have a horror themed action game.
If you don't feel small/weak compared to your environment/enemies at least in the beginning, then the game can't be considered proper horror. Even then, you should never make them feel truly empowered, instead it should feel like a close call that you just barely got through.
@@kyleowen5299 removing the ability to fight back removes many of the things that made older horror games scarier. Enemies are no longer scary because everytime you see one you know you have to run and hide. It removes the "should I try to run past this thing or shoot it". Another thing that is missing in those games is the inventory management and limited amount of weapons and bullets. I just think that games like outlast or amnesia are more walking simulators than horror and I don't understand how anyone got scared playing those games.
@@SaladPizzaRestaurant I said limited or removed for a reason. If for example you find a gun you'll feel safer and relieved, but when they discover that not only is the ammo limited, but that it takes at least 2 shots to kill a normal enemy (I define kill in this case as being permanently removed from play), they'll think twice about engaging them, especially when you have the proverbial terminator after you.
After all, which would you rather do, Kill the enemies and draw the "terminators" attention and every mook in 100 ft. (high risk, but will get through quickly if not caught, otherwise game over), or sneak past but possibly have to deal with the mooks while running away from your "terminator" analog (low risk, but chance of getting flanked).
Couple this sort of decision making with properly timed encounters with a slow moving invincible foe (the proverbial "terminator" mentioned before) and you can make them enter situations where they must decide quickly whether to escape loudly while getting mobbed or sneak around and potentially getting caught.
Additionally by making it clear that bullets only slow down you implacable foe, while simultaneously utilizing jump scare tactics when placing your encounters with him, you can incite panic in a player when they realize that everything that heard their gunfire is now moving towards them, while those who remain calm will notice an opportunity to sneak away using the mooks to slow down your "terminator".
Edit: Oops, I repeated myself unnecessarily.
But you get the point.
Make using your weapon high risk and let the player screw themselves over.
Stealth should be the option players favor more in a horror game after all.
Additionally read what I said in my initial comment on empowerment in horror.
I played cod world at war in a custom match by myself and with the isolated feeling and fearful music I felt so terrified,that's how you make a open in day light horror game or game moment
I feel like I’m the only fella who thinks that RE4 has scary moments other than the Regenerator. The wolves, the invisible bug things, and U-3 still scare the shit out of me, even after the first playthrough
I completely agree. Verdugo, Dr. Salvador, the Garradors, the Plaga Knights when playing as Ashley. The game has tons of fear inducing enemies, encounters, and moments that create the tense experience. The only caveat being that the game turns into an action power-fantasy around the time you hit the island.
"When we're left alone in the dark, we feel alone."
Ah, yes. When you're alone you feel alone. Very astute.
Nah I'm kidding. I just came from Joe Anderson's "Why Horror Games Don't Scare Me" and this video is _way_ better.
I was planning to watch it, thx for the info mate
Feel alone or be alone can be two different things
Joes video was so stupid
Man while listening to the soundtracks running in the background, I knew this video was gonna be perfect especially the theme of Laura for Silent Hill 2, I just finished the game and I can't seem to get over it anytime soon makes me wish there were more games like that
So many great points in here. Also bonus points for using that beautiful Symphony of the Night music.
If you're creating a scary scene it might also be helpful to have it fully lit at first, if it's scary in the daylight itll be even scarier in the dark
its been so long since ive played a good horror game.one that truly scared me.but i kinda find it funny a game like bloodborne frightened me more then outlast.I just wish more game would give you a larger reason to fear dying not just "oh no i got spooked."
I agree. Jumpscares aren't scary - they make me jump, but i'm not scared, i'm startled and paranoid of surprises. The only time I've been scared truly by a horror game was by PT, and that didn't go anywhere.
During my "research" for this video, I found that good horror video games are becoming harder and harder to find. I thought this might be just me since I found I'm a bit harder to scare than most, so its good to know I'm not the only one! :)
Foxcade you're definitely right here. Too many games focus too much on the jump scares, not enough on atmosphere and creating a scary setting.
Sadly, atmosphere is something that is often disregarded in many games, though to be fair to the designers in can be hard to do. In one of my next videos, I'll actually be looking at how a certain game builds its atmosphere, though its not specifically a horror.
Foxcade atmosphere is important but i wish games could make me fear death on a mechanical level
Silent Hill soundtrack was the best choice of music for this video it's one of the best game music made
I gotta admit RE 2 remake made Zombies terrifying again..like you said making anything scary in the right context..being enclosed in a Police Station with Zombies now being formattable enemy's
You are not locked inside with them,THEY are locked inside with YOU
@@HD-rq2og r/woosh,
no really looking back they ARE locked inside with ya,them being difficult doesnt mean you are easy,you WILL kill at least 10 zombies,and if we dont count the times you died which we cant anyways because it never happened then it means that they are locked inside with you
@@winstonchurchill7822 why do you say woosh if you go on to explain why you are right? Woosh means you were joking... Also just because you survive doesn't mean they were the ones in trouble. I wouldn't say they are locked with you because you barely have any ammo, and most of the time are just trying to stay away from them. About %60-%70 of the zombies you don't actually kill, unlike a game like doom, where you stop pretty much everything in your way.
@@HD-rq2og you realize i said
but really right? also
yes they are hard but that doesnt mean you are a loser, you are HARDER
@@HD-rq2og i said woosh as a joke i dont really think this way but i pointed out facts
I know this isn't really a point the author was trying to drive home in this video, but I would argue that the Bilbo "jump scare" (and it was a jump scare for sure, in the Jackson movie) during Fellowship was actually horrifying- because the visage of the kindly old man we knew was transformed into some sort of malice-driven demon or some-such in that moment. It was an original scene- if I'm not mistaken- from the books showing the power and hold the one ring had over Bilbo and just how "horrible" =P its attraction was.
I'd also argue that that scene with the red faced monster (not sure what movie it's from) isn't really a jumpscare. It seemed a little too subtle to count as one.
@@TheBlueLink3 The movie is Insidious. I'd argue that it is a jump-scare primarily because of the elevation in sound when you see the face.
I like the thumbnail, it shows all these uncanny, distorted humans/creatures and then u see a teddy bear with a top hat
Lel
An idea I had:
A game that is randomly generated each time you play it.
there are two randomly generated factors (the players are not told what they end up as)
1. Monster
2. Setting (place)
Have a huge list of monsters and settings hidden in the code.
Add new settings and monsters every once in a while with out saying the update (unless it's a bug fix)
I was also thinking each monster has a different way to be beaten, but you have to find it on the map.
(One a last part. I was also thinking not all settings would have the monster's weakness and the player wouldn't be told, but please tell me if it'd be a bad idea)
Sounds similar to Monstrum
I don't think you have to actually put in whole new monsters, but utilize them differently from playtrough to playthrough.
Can be done with placements, like in your first playthrough you might encounter a monster directly around the corner of a hallway, but on your second playthrough the monster is not there, instead one will crash through a window later on. (Obviously you want to randomize it in a way that it is not predictable. It shouldn't be predictable that no monster in the hallway means a monster crashing through the window, there should be the possibility that one happens, both happens or maybe even none of the two happens, as long as you keep the monster count around the same number maybe to keep the game balance up). You can also switch up the monster types from playthrough to playthrough. Maybe you encounter the harder monster somewhat earlier in another playthrough.
For places I think small changes are also already enough. Maybe different doors are locked every playthrough, so you have to take some other routes everytime. Maybe various puzzles get randomized (for example if you have to type in a number code, have it being randomized completly, so a player can't just remember it between playthroughs and has to actively search for the clues, which will expose them to the possible threats on the way). Even loot placements can be randomized a bit. Imagine a player being low on health, trying to check the known health item spots from the last playthrough, just to notice that this time they're empty or filled with other items.
I bought both RE7 and RE2 this week and started playing 7 first. I got past the intro and now I'm exploring the house with Jack chasing me while I try to figure out where to go.
I then realized that I do not like horror games, the tension is just too much for me. Having an unkillable enemy constantly chasing me gives me panic attacks.
I can see that but for me, It's what's exciting in that game.
I suggest try talking to yourself while playing or put something else in the background to offset the atmosphere. Having minor distractions like that can help you through these types of games.
Cool how was it after a year
He is killable, as well as slow and relatively weak
this has to be the most gen z thing that ive ever read
It's the common misconception about the horror genre that it's about ‘scaring’. It just can not work, fundamentally. People get scared only when threat of something undesirable is real or genuinely believed to be. It takes experiencing just 2-3 films as a kid/teen to familiarize one with the sensations and false nature of their sources to form qualitatively very different reaction to them (still not happens to tiny minority of people though). Fear exists only within the realm of the work, for the audience it's either evocation of unease, unsettling atmosphere, sense of repulsion or simply the thrill ride (or blend of both sides).
Imagine a horror game with monsters and such, but with a behavior AI like rainworlds?.
Alright, imma big horror game fan or horror genre in general, I'm actually developing a game project for my university and as much as I want to make the player scared of being isolated it's difficult for me because I've been isolated and alone for so long that I'm so used to it, for me it feels scary to be in the crowded areas or with other people, but these are great horror game tips and my actual research for the final year is exactly as the title in the video, just reworded a bit, but after watching this and one of the other videos about beginner mistakes in horror games, I have found I did a few and I'm changing, but thanks, and great videos.
I think startling the player can be used to great effect like to rise tension but it should not be the pay off and it should be used sparingly so the player isn’t desensitized to it but also always keeps them on edge.
I still hold that a lot of horror games feel lackluster because we use one word to describe two different ideas. I personally like creating a distinction between Terror and Horror; Terror is the feeling of visceral panic, while Horror is the feeling of mounting dread. Terror is brought on by things like jumpscares or charging enemies, while Horror is brought on by things like a weak protaganist and an unsettling atmosphere. I've also seen this described as the difference between Action and Tension, but I don't think that quite captures it, because Tension and Action are more like ingredients that developers balance to get a specific result. Something like Until Dawn has short moments of tension building up to the action-focused jumpscares, to create frequent terror; Amnesia has long bouts of tension cut by brief action-packed chases, to create lasting horror. And then some games fall in the middle, like the first Dead Space, with tense exploration suddenly interrupted by frantic combat. If you ask me, understanding that difference between those two types of fear (and the specific balance between them you want to aim for) is the biggest step in making a good Horror game, as opposed to a good Terror game.
It's something I've had on my mind a lot lately (as an indie game dev working on a horror game), and I felt like you were almost talking around that distinction. So, I thought I'd throw in my two cents on the subject. ^^
Edit: Just realized I should mention: this is your first video I've seen on this subject, so if you mention this idea later, someone please tell me so I don't feel TOO stupid. XD
I'm so easily scared that I had to close my eyes for a good third of the video to focus on the many interesting things you said.
Nice one
13:00 that's the cover of Eldritch Tales, a tabletop rpg based on Lovecraft and cosmic horror. You should check it out.
I think every aspiring developer who plans to make a good horro game needs to read 'The Philosophy of Horror: Or, Paradoxes of the Heart' by Noel Carroll, as well as 'The Weird and the Eerie' by Mark Fisher, a couple of books that explore what makes a horror work horror. There are a few more books that explore the topic in a serious way, but these two are the ones I find more useful and which I have used for my fiction and my roleplaying game adventures.
I just noticed you're playing music from "Layers of Fear." LMAO!!!
Dead Space: Here we've showed you the enemy and its weakness, given you weapons and a map. Are you still scared?
Me: Shitless
Lmao, that game is terrifying.
I'd actually argue that Doom is a horror game. Doom Guy is the monster and the demons, well, they're the ones shitting themselves when you turn the corner
What makes a person feel fear, Is all what you have said. But I think there's also one you haven't mentioned. That is *tension* or *thrill* many people hates the feeling of being chased, and or something that is looking for that and they have no choice but to run, or a feeling that something is behind them. A feeling that makes you panic. That's also one thing that what makes a game scary. For Example : Outlast 1/2, Alien: Isolation and Etc. But anyways! You are very underated, and you deserve much more. I love channels who deciphers and share deep meanings and great explanation.
But in the grand scheme of things its not to different from jumpscares. It creates high adrenelin and and forces players to make quick decisions. The Difference is the lenght of tension. While a Jumpscare is a small moment a chase is a extended moment. Chasing scences are somewhat hit and miss.
Whatever is chasing you must find a fine line between deadlyness and harmless. If you can escape to easy and you see that the monster/psychopath/etc has trouble keeping up you quickly feel at ease and can even make fun of your pursuer.
However when it is to deadly and will Game over the player you force the player into the same situation twice but due to the first encounter you completly break any momentum of building fear. The Player is able to mentally prepare and reflect on their mistakes while also understanding the danger that they are in. It breaks the immersion into the game and automaticly makes it less scary.
And the last problem is the frequenzy. This is why I personally consider Amnesia the dark Decent a better horror game then Outlast. Amnesia keeps chase scences to a minimum while Outlast tosses you from one chase into the next. Outlast chases become predictable and every area that you enter you slowly over time get more of a mindset of allready planning your escape routes. You pretty much know at the last section of the game that you have to run from on area into the next from whatever your current threat is.
While Outlast chases scences are brillant and can toss the unexpected at the player while also making the enemys rather harmless on normal difficulty to make surprises less punishing and ensuring the players survival, there are just too many of them. But here we have a flaw with the game of Outlast. It lets you choose the difficulty. It enables the player to make the chase to brutal and almost impossibel to survive on a first try where one mistake causes a reset.
While Amnesia has also a hard mode it is clearly for challenge seekers and not the actuall expierence. So 99% of players will play the normal mode. But here is what Amnesia has done better then outlast when it comes to chase scenes. When the Players get caught and dies in most instances in the game they put the player back to the last checkpoint but the threat that killed them is removed. This goes against the players expectation and actually puts them back on the edge because suddenly they find themselfes in a unknow situation unsure of what happend. While they might reflect on their mistakes they are not able to put it into practice and makes them uncertaint about their abilitys.
So while a chase can be a good highlight and adrenlin pusher, they are just like jumpscares something that needs to be used sparringly and should not be on what your game relies on.
Well I think co-op could work in horror video games, however like jumpscares they have to be used a certain way.
Like maybe both players are separated or are working against each other.
you explain every detail so well
Used this to make my new game thx for making this
Oof, I hope I didnt ruin your game
What's it called?
@@Foxcade it's still in progress we didnt choose a name yet
Cool, let me know when it's done. I'd really like to see it!
@@Foxcade same.
1:22
Anxiety disorder: Let me introduce myself
really shitty situation being so invested in horror storys but not being able to play one
This is a damn good video, well played Fox!
For the life of me, I CANNOT find Five Nights at Freddy’s scary at all, not even a little bit
(I apologize in advance for this long ass comment, sometime I like to ramble on for a lot longer than I should)
I find that horror is kinda fundamentally flawed in games, because things that would make good horror, don't make a good game. Being disempowered may make it scarier, but that usually means you get restricted with awkward movement. I find it a bit cheap when the monster or whatever you're up against is only a threat because you move like a tank. The monster isn't strong, you are weak.
This is why I don't find many full on horror games to actually be good games, you either get something like outlast where you can't do anything to the enemy besides running away, which isn't very interesting gameplay by itself, or you get something like Layers of Fear or PT which I compare to the haunted house rides at amusement parks. They take you through a spooky environment, and maybe it will be scary for a little bit, before you realize that you actually aren't in any danger. There's no actual threat, just scripted scares that happen, once you realize there is no danger, it becomes a lot less scary. When it's no longer scary, what is the game? Just walking around and looking at the spooks.
That leads into the biggest flaw with horror in any medium not just games, the more you are exposed to something, the less it scares you. I used to be scared of Five Nights at Freddy's, before there were four sequels. And even the first game no longer has much of an effect on me, because I've been way too over exposed by it. And again, without being scared, what is the game? Would you play FNAF if the gameplay was untouched but it removed any horror elements?
I find the scariest things in games come from non horror games, because you're not expecting to be scared, and the game doesn't sacrifice anything to disempower you. For example, Rayman 3, you spend the entire game easily fighting the hoodlums, it shows you that you are strong and capable. But then you reach the desert of the Knaaren. The atmosphere becomes darker and the Knaaren are invincible, you cannot defeat them. The Knaaren are scary because you are not weak, you've been kicking ass the entire game, but the Knaaren still overpower you. This level in goofy lighthearted cartoonish Rayman 3 has scared me more than any actual horror game, because the reason I feel disempowered, is because up until then, I am powerful.
Again, sorry for the long ass comment, I like to go really in depth and had a lot on my mind with the subject.
The scariest thing in videogames in when you're low on health in a very demanding fast paced action game where one little thing gone wrong can mean losing a lot of progress
@The Red Guy - you make some great points- I agree, to a point, that scares in games where you don’t expect them can be scarier than most horror games, but I disagree about games disempowering you not being fun, or good games. The original Outlast did it right. You were in a mental asylum, and didn’t know which patients would simply ignore you, and which would get agitated and start chasing you down (other than the main antagonists, Chris Walker, the naked twins, and the walrider). The sequel is where Outlast kind of falls apart. It’s one thing to be a journalist surrounded by maniacs and not fight back, but in the farmland in II there’s so many things they could’ve done to make it a bit more, realistic. I’d have been grabbing a shovel, or hoe, or any other gardening tool as a weapon to defend myself, were I in that situation. A lot of horror is in the presentation, and atmosphere. Outlast, Alien: Isolation, Amnesia, and RE 7 are prime examples of how the perfect atmosphere can make or break a horror game. Just my 2 cents!
Just play bloodborne, you'll thank me later
Amazing video! I need to look at more of your content if this is anything to go by.
Nice vid, this could be a series
I actually tend to think the whole "limited control" and disempowerment thing is a pretty cheap and lazy way to create horror...I tend to think games like dark souls and blood borne are far better at creating tension dread and terror than most games in the actual survival horror genre.
Real fear comes when ya have options that allow or rather ya have choices and you're forced to decide whether or not to hide run or fight, the game should lean in that order but not always...1 when they or it find you and they will eventually then 2 you should flee until there's no where left to go then 3 ya left with no option but to face it...
When ya can can't hide ya run and when ya can't run any more you fight and when ya can't fight ya die...that's scary...but to truly work it needs to be dynamic and not overly scripted, ya need well thought out mechanics and good A.I rather than a game director and level designers that want to control every little detail according to their plan and pace.
When ya have weapons and actual control along with what you think is a smart strategy, I.E a good common sense plan only for it to fail and for the enemies or monsters to just bypass overcome, adapt or just barrel straight through...that's horrific.
Making it so a player is a slow weakling incapable of fighting back and that has only one repetitive response isn't scary it's boring, having the equivalent of a character who can only move at a snails pace or can only hide in cupboards and under beds etc is like playing as the brain dead bimbo in those old slasher flicks who just randomly trips and stumbles over their own feet so the slow walking psycho can catch up or like in the zombie movies where there's always that one person who goes crazy or is dumber than the walking corpses who lets them in and gets everyone killed etc...lazy uncreative cliche...in games this limited control shit often means there's no panic or conflict when it comes to playing the game because there's no making quick or instinctive life and death decisions in a limited time...ya just do X because that's all ya can do...there is no Y and Z.
I know I am late to the conversation and I tend to agree. You can give a player a weapon and they can still be "powerless". Deadspace 1 and 2 do this very well in creating horror and paranoia in the player. Just because I can shoot something in the face doesn't mean I feel powerful in that scenario. F.E.A.R the first game also does very well in wrapping horror with action, as well as Condemned. And I am not a fan of these Outlast, Amnesia style type games and want to see more Deadspaces and F.E.A.Rs which terrify me more. The other type of horror game where you have no weapons and are limited to hide in a closest just frustrates and bores me after a while.
I agree,you dont have to make the character stripped of resources for a game to be scary. I found New Londor in Ds1 and The upper Cathedral ward and the Yahgul unseen villiage in Bloodborne scary as shit seeing them and in those games your character has swords and weapons
Good horror starts you weak, and progressively empowers you, like resident evil games did for 1, 2, and 7.
Thankfully you clarified that it was Halloween at the time of recording. I was about to flip!
I think a good horror game is the story it tells, and environmental storytelling, like darkwood, and dead space. and models, like in phasmophobia. And location, like in (not a game) Star Wars Blackwing. Which takes place in space.
You don't need music to make a good horror game or any horror film at all,for example like quiet place
The only two games offering complete new frightening enemies not already seen a thousand times before were the possessed machines from Alan Wake (possessed logging and farm machinery suddenly awakens in some dark eerie possessed kind of life to attack Alan with sharp saw blades, crushing bulldozers, combine harvesters suddenly start their huge diesel engines on foggy desolated nightly fields and begin hunting down Alan with no one sitting in the illuminated driver`s cabin........ this was absolutely fresh new and an exciting yet frightening new style of horror).
I really like that, the idea that every kind of common machinery like cars, trucks, tractors etc being able to become a random killing machine is absolute frightening and makes every road, every field, every garage, highly dangerous and unsafe.
And Soma brought some intense fresh monster ideas to life, based on the hide&seek classics Outlast 1 and Alien Isolation and it`s predecessor Penumbra Black Plague.
Everything else is classic horror, nothing we haven`t seen a thousand times before, but it`s still great and it still works because it targets on ancient human fears (becoming prey, being killed in a very gruesome and painful way and getting eaten by a predator, being hunted down in a forest or abandoned buildings and finding a random gruesome looking gory corpse like for example in Condemned Criminal Origins or Blair Witch triggering the fear of being stalked by an unknown murderer and getting killed in the same painful way like that victim before us, being eaten alive by zombies or creatures like in Resident Evil 2 Remake, and other classic horror themes.) Nothing new - but it`s still frightening if it`s a well-made game ;)
The number one thing to a great Horror game is one word...silence
I'm a huge fan of ur videos I've watched so many of them, and I'd love to see u do live streams or playthroughs of maybe more niche titles or just to get ur critical and unique and fair point of view.
Sometime soon I do plan on getting into streams, it's just a matter of taking the time to get it set up. Maybe by the new year i will get that going :)
@@Foxcade Yay!!!!! I'm super happy to hear that
The real question is,what do you fear the most
You should have a million subs by now your videos are so high quality
Thanks! Though these are definitely not worth a million subs, but I would be psyched to get past 10k by the end of the year!
Horror is hard to do because humans are designed to adapt and normalize things. 1 or 2 scares is good but after awhile we get bored. Its why action movies are the most popular. Its hard to get bored of cool fights and also they are easier to write.
i wanna recommend this vid to my friends who wants horror games
“Having played Resident Evil 4 more times than I can count, theres nothing in this game that will ever scare me again.” I dont know about that for me at least. The Iron Maidens still get me good each time I play
Why am I watching this at night?
A good horror game, has to scare you from time to time but also be playable and fun, some games take it too far to one extreme, and people usually either don´t finish them or don´t consider them horror games. Alien Isolation is one example, the whole setup is perfect, scary and builds tension, but when you realize that you are completely powerless and you have to avoid this one enemy (the Alien) it becomes a chore, it is not scary anymore, just frustrating as hell..the whole game is reduced to walk slowly and silently from one room to another trying to avoid the Alien until you find a save booth.. rinse and repeat again and again, if they had added a little bit more action sequences in the game it would have been much better.. or even the ability to fight off the Alien sometimes (like the Nemesis in RE3) that would have improved the game a lot. That is why it sold poorly and will probably never get a sequel. Then you have the other extreme like Resident Evil 5 or 6 where it becomes a shooter and also not scary at all... Until Dawn is surprisingly a good horror game (though the characters move way to slow when you control them), the earlier Resident Evil games were also good in that they had the correct balance between action/power/scare factor... Most games actually fall in the survival category more than the horror category, like the Evil Within, as much as it tries it is never scary, but it is still a good survival game with lots of gore...
00:38 HIT OR MISS
It's been out a while now so I dont need to say spoilers.....but that fetus baby monster in Biohazard VIIIage was genuinely frightening, I had to pause the game during that. It has everything, the ambience and the music. Even the mansion you enter to get to that part was quiet, too quiet. It felt...off. The entire build up to it was well executed.
10:41 anyone else remember shadow of innsmouth having that god awful bit at the start of each chapter going "dude I'll tell you but you're gonna go crazy hearing this believe me it's insane"? It worked on page 1, but each chapter made the statement more grating till it became downright annoying, just get to the story already!
silent hill homecoming is so underrated its crazy, same with downpour. yes the pc port has major technical issues and run problems but the game itself is excellent. the combat is so good and the environments are creepy. good story. its got it all. downpour is one of the most intense, surreal experiences ive had in a horror game. i dont understand the hate. maybe ppl expected something other than what they got? maybe players who would normally play these games had too many other games on the go at the time. who knows.
I understand the hate, because I played the first 4 rather than the last 4.
The studios changed, multiple times. Team Silent was no longer in charge.
The other western developers do not completely understand what the original TS design philosophy was and how they created the atmosphere and monsters out of that philosophy, including references.
So Silent Hill lost all cohesiveness.
PT also had the benefit of being short.
Games is the only media that can put you in the "DIRECT" experience of horror. You are the character and its up to you to survive. As movies, is just an hour long but creates the image for the viewer, its still just a watch. Books are probably the best version of horror besides games because what goes into your mind and the level it is able to affect/effect you as an experience, really depends on your own personal experience as well as you you mentally perceive what the writer or author is trying to deliver to you. When you sleep, it grows within your mind and becomes apart of your perceptions. Ultimately, bottom line: Fear exists in the mind. It really is quite personal in depends on the individual. Books have no visuals, so your mind creates it for yourself. Everyone's personal imagery perception of a "look" differs from that of another person's. It is their own mind of fear. Just the way someone probably had a bad experience with a particular situation that causes them to be afraid of the idea alone where it could not affect someone else the same. Rape for example,....personal.
I agree with your assessment of Doom (2016), and it’s why I’m not a fan of that game. Doom 3 on the other hand, scared the shot outta me back in the day! Also agree with unpredictability. A good comparison of that is Outlast and Alien: Isolation. I’m not saying Chris Walker isn’t scary, but he’s not as scary as the xenomorph, due to their ai. Walker has patterns he follows while patrolling for the player, whereas, they mad the ai for the alien more reactive, and unpredictable. You never really know if the alien is going to walk away from your hiding space, or suddenly swing back around and give you a face full of mini-mouth! I’ve played Alien: Isolation a handful of times, 3 on nightmare mode, and the alien still scares the crap outta me at times!
Well Doom 2016 is not meant to be a horror game at all, neither are Doom 1 and 2, Doom 3 is the outcast in the series.
“Ever think when you’re alone to check behind yourself”
*checks behind self immediately while home alone in the dark at night*
Thanks for that btw
You wanna make a good horror game, first step is to make sure that anything csn one shot ya.
I find it hard to be scared by anything honestly. I don't know, I tend to be scared of what I can't control more than anything else. Still, an interesting video.
Resident evil 2 remake is a great survival horror game
what a great video, you sir have a new subscriber.
Also the Doom soundtrack plays a slight role, doesn't it?
Hey man fantastic video wish I found this channel sooner. Also, whats the music you used at the beginning of the video?
Thanks, and the music is Theme of Laura (reprise) from Silent Hill 2
Bioshock 2 theme....nice
is it weird that duskers filled me with a sense of horror when making decisions?
I can understand that mentality, its the fear of making the wrong choice. That's why Xcom could be classified as horror, because it limits information, so you are never 100% sure about your choices
I personally call the feeling decision horror. When the decision stumps you with an uneasy and dreadful feeling. My first time playing, I looked at a upgrade menu for like 5 minutes. As if any choice could be my last.
I have that feeling when playing Fire Emblem, since a dead character is dead forever. It makes me think a horror focused strategy game could be a thing.
Great video, though i do feel like your a bit to narrow in your view of what is horror. Grated you did say that anything can be scary in the right context. In recent years what horror is has been clallenged and redefined a lot. Take for instance your point on predictability. While it can ruin the sense of fear, if done properly it can add to the experiance. The looming sense of dread when you know something is just around the corner. I feel like true horror takes whats scary about things you know and mixes it in with the unknown. A killer stalking the halls, you knowing its there but not where. Knowing at any momwnt he could be around the corner or behind you. If executed correctly horror can be found in the fimilar and unfamiliar.
Hey just a question, what’s the song used in the background, the one with the piano. It starts at 3:35
I swear I’ve heard this song in like every horror related video
Hope I’m not too late but it’s the Resident Evil 2 save theme
Strange how the SOMA captures were very overexposed. Great video tho
I find your lack of Alien: Isolation disturbing.
I don't know why it is so beloved. It's just Amnesia + Alien, it's not original at all, both the Alien and the robots have been in media since the 70's
@@waltuh11121
Amnesia didn't invent the "unkillable monster that always chases you" trope.
It also borrows way more from System Shock 2 than from Amnesia.
It's also a really good game.
This is dope broski
Bad fnaf take. It's the paranoia and atmosphere that make it scary. Jump scares can also be really good, like in Alien
Man I know this video is really old by now, but have you played Subnautica? It's not even supposed to be a horror game, but no other game ever made me nope out like it. It kinda nails all your points by default due to the setting (Well not so sure if it stays unpredictable the whole way through, I'm too much of a pussy to find out). Maybe it's just me and my own fear of water, though.
great mention. This game plays on all of the mentioned tropes, and does so (maybe) unintentionally.
limited control - humans are not aquatic creatures. Swimming is very limited, and we have to breathe too.
darkness and isolation - pretty obvious. the ocean is big and dark, and you are alone.
fear of the unknown/unnatural - swimming over large, deep bits of the ocean with no idea whats below is one of the most terrifying parts of this game. My experience with the "Dead Zone" in VR was one of 'nope nope nope.'
unpredictability - while many creatures are based on animals we know (like fish, manatees, alligators), the reapers are something completely new. Each creature you encounter in the game poses new risks and challenges.
arguably survival horror, and it's not even marketed like that.
So thaaatsss why I get so sweaty playing fnaf
If you're looking for unique Horror like Music, Sounds and Ambiance from scratch, I am more than happy to help you! Just reply and we can start right away!
often when a horror game makes you alone it means its not a good horror game take phasmaphobia for example sure that game is terrifying when your by yourself but it still manages to be scary even with 3 other friends that makes a good horror game plus i enjoy a bit of story with my fear so other characters are kind of necessary a good horror game dosent need you to be alone in order to be afraid only bad ones do resident evil is more of a story adventure than it is horor
Phasmophobia in my eyes can be scary because of the randomized factor. You never know what type of ghost you're dealing with until you find it out. You might have an easy time or a hard time based on RNG. Sure, there are rules when the ghost can hunt (mainly average team sanity), but as long as you have no dedicated truck camper, no one can tell how high or low your sanity is, which leaves you out in the open when to expect the next hunt. There is also the fear of losing all your equipment on death, especially early on, when you haven't grinded a lot of money. You're death could very well mean, that the next mission has to be done with less or not as good equipment as before.
But I still have to say, it's way more scary when you're alone. When playing with friends we often joke around and stuff and whenever we hear noises (things getting dropped or whatever) we can also try to explain that it was one of our team mates dropping something and we even have the possibility the ghost will get a team member instead of ourselves.
But Phasmophobia also has the problem of becoming less scarier the more often you play it, because you'll inevitably learn it's rules and what can happen and what can't happen and as soon has you've grinded enough money, there is also no big fear of losing all your stuff anymore, because you know, you can just simply replace it instantly again.
Needs more views.
Personally a good horror game must have a single quality. It gets worse the more you think about it.
Like a toilet that always sticks out 2 tounges if you sit on it or that you were killing monsters, but you only thought they were monsters.
The realizstion that it's worse than expected.
Can anyone tell me what the music that starts at about 16:40 is? I've heard it before and can pinpoint it. It's beautiful
Honestly no idea but it is beautiful Holy crap
I really want to play res 4 but i hate the controls. I just watch someone play it.
Have you even played Doom 3?
1 more thing I would add is "Lack of Power" which is also a great factor in horror games and this makes alien isolation such a great game. Alien isolation has people on board, we know alien franchise very well so fear of unknown is also little, also the device it gives us to detect the movement of alien diminishes the unpredictability. But its still a good horror game because, we cannot do anything to the alien, we are completely powerless [also it can kill us in one hit] which brings a huge terror while playing the game which makes us hide and watch every of our step.
It is slightly different from limited control because while limited control would be each and every bullet counts, you have to strategise and micromanage, lack of power means you cannot do anything to change the situation, just hide yourself and be out of sight until alien starts looking for you in other rooms, which will give you small small windows to progress the game
Probably my favorite of yours I've seen so far, second is probably the DMC3 retrospective... still not buying the validity of "character action" as something other than your label for complex hack n slash games.
Were is bloodbourne
Heaven Smiles, it's more paranoia then fear.
Heaven Smiles? Never heard of it. All I find when I search it is the enemies from Killer 7
aaand there is PT....
7dayz to die is an actually great Horror game
Really good video 🦊
Yes, that theme! YESSS!!!
So, does death ruin horror games?
What was the pixelated game he showed?