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When I first started GMing, I had a group full of loners, 3 to be exact. They all wanted to sit in dark corners and smoke pipes and take on Orc raiding parties singlehandedly. I decided I'd set a precedent and promptly killed one who wanted to go off and "fulfill his fathers dying wish", he got stuck in a trap that required two people to disarm
One of my DM thinks for some reason all rogues should be loners. I'm playing a ambassador. But in that party we don't have a leader yet. so she is slowly morphing into a leader.
Greatest loner i ever saw in a game had one simple caveat. He was shy. He wore his hood over his eyes so he felt comfortable because he didnt like people to look him in the eye. We was a good sword arm but once a pretty girl talked to him his front faded away as he stumbled over his words. Damn fine character
I think loner works better as a trait than a strict rule. I played a assassin who preferred to work alone, but ended being put into the role of a leader and so he had to balance the two. which I actually enjoyed more.
Cheat sheet: The Loner: -Self-Sufficient -Thoughtful (Not a recommended type) The Solver: -Questioning -Problem Solving The Adventurer: -Upbeat -Adventurous The Protector: -Strong -Justice Orientated The Ambassador -Peace-keeper -Easy going
I think a loner type would be worth playing if you, as a player, have already decided that as a process of personal growth you want them to outgrow the mentality and learn to trust and care for their party.
exactly what i was thinking. what of someone who is a lone wolf, but as he meet the group he finds some connection, something within that he enjoys and wish to continue being in this group? was thinking how cool it would be if he becomes a soul character beacuse of this seemingly mysterious emotional spirituality he experiences with this group, or a dependable, beacuse of his previous self sufficency now driven for the groups intrest.
I had a game where two people were independents who thought the world revolved around them. They quickly found that arrows can pierce even the thickest of heads.
In my first ever game, we were all adventurers almost to the detriment of our characters, we searched all nooks and corners, and at one point we would steal useful furniture from dungeons (chains, chairs, a piano and once a door), we would smash open walls if geometry would permit something from being in between the walls, and always broke open desks and chests, searching for secret compartments. But this was also a campaign were I was the leader and the protector towards my church, which I donated nearly 27k gold to by level 11, every time I would go shopping after I got what I was looking for (a improved weapon, better armor, cool magic armor, chemical weapons) then proceeding to give everything that was left to the church as charity. The DM was great, by level 4 I had handed over a lot of the wealth I had made, but every time I went on an adventure a servant of the church would present me with left over potions (saving my healing spells, also without me asking for them) once a wand and another time it was a holy weapon that a previous hero left behind. 10/10 adventure would donate my gold again.
A short post in defense of loner characters. I don't like playing loners, but they can be an interesting challenge. A great tipp for playing with loner type characters is to discuss common goals with the gm. A loner will band with a group if it serves a purpous. He might want to get revenge on that dragon, that destroyed his village. After the dragon is slain he might face a turning point. The player has to be willing to let his character develop over the course of the game. Maybe he gets attached to the group and becomes a protector or he might become the adventurer. You can get very interesting group dynamics this way. Sadly most players will overplay the loner act and go off on their own or might even betray the group. Good communication between gm and players is key to successfully integrating a loner pc into the party.
Possibly a loner might feel like they are duty-bound and supposed to help, even if they don't necessarily want to. Like if they owed a life-debt to a member of the party, or if they realized, i may not want to help and cooperate, but I feel like a whole lot of bad will be on my shoulders if i don't help or something like that. that could be interesting
I think "the loner" type could work. If they are cooperative and use their skills to help out the party, then I see no issue. The loner can stick with the party and help out. As long as the player doesn't go "lone wolf" then this type can work. In addition, this type can work well when combined with the dependable type. They may be a wallflower most of the time, but when party members are in trouble, the loner might actually rush out to help them out.
+Bobby Ranger Sometimes as is the case with our Pathfinder sessions, the Loner can actually really help the group as they are not always in the thick of battle and so can help the rest of the party who are drawing aggro. Absolutely Loners work but they need to be able to be a part of the party as well. Thanks for your comments and as always Happy Gaming!
Yeah it could work I think what I'd do is make the link on a personal basis, maybe have a sibling in the group or maybe there is this female character he like or an old friend. If there is a personal link for the loner to the group he might put up with the group and even start engaging with the other characters. I guess that could work My problem with the lonelr as I happened to see it in one party was that the player really had little to do because he wouldn't talk to us, he wouldn't interact with anyone always keeping his distance... it was quiet annoying really, so IF you feel like you have to play a loner, be sure you know what you are doing because otherwise you start doing nothing most of the time which is boring...
Bobby Ranger I agree. loners, when played right, are a source of theatric drama. A role played argument can end with the character opening up about something to the others
My loner has high charisma, so is able to win favour of people easily. He just doesn't see the point in forming an emotional attachment to people. He sees relationships as a means to an end, rather than a human need. It's caused by his sheltered and isolated childhood which was traumatically ended in being orphaned far from built-up settlements and having to fend for himself ever since. Why get close to people if everyone leaves him in the end? So he carries a vessel for an odd spiritual entity that leaves and returns over the dead of night and has never gotten over his parents' deaths. So alone time is crucial for him.
I normally make my characters loner starting out, so that they could feasibly be self sufficient during their quest up to lvl 1 when they were making their own decision, because once they start working with the group I like having room for character development. For example, I might make a rogue who prefers not to work with people, but when forced to work with a group because of a situation of life or death, they eventually grow to respect their party and become a more respectable character as time progresses. It allows for more longevity in my opinion.
I've played one loner and she was an intentional inversion- a seemingly hyper-capable and aloof ranger....Who actually didn't want to be aloof at all but suffered from extreme social anxiety that made social situations incredibly difficult for her, resulting in her isolating herself and becoming incredibly lonely before meeting the party. The party helping her come out of her shell and learn to cope with her anxiety was genuinely one of the most heartwarming character stories I've ever been lucky enough to take part in
The end of the video where you talk about making a dependable character reminded me of one of my favorite characters I have ever run. He was a wizard in dnd, who through some strange circumstances ended up becoming neutral evil, but remained fiercely loyal to the party, even though he had his own goals. So the party, of mostly good characters where very concerned about my slide to evil, but never kicked me out because I would always do whatever needed to be done to protect them, and I was the biggest single source of dps. All in all it was an amazing campaign filled with some amazing memories.
I know I’m about 5 years too late but I thought to comment. I recently found your channel for research purposes unrelated to D&D and I think it’s really helped me so far. So thanks. I’ve only had one good hour of a D&D session while playing with someone else’s character as I was filling in for them. I wasn’t then or now very familiar with the game but I did my best and chose to journey alone. So, I guess I made them a loner type. During the journey, the character came across an old tomb. They went to investigate it and ended up releasing an enemy that was forgotten from the ages. I managed to get the character outta there and back safely with the group. The group had just finished up murdering a relatively strong husband and wife for a place to stay, so they weren’t at all too thrilled that I had unleashed death upon everyone in the city, including them. There was no time to recuperate. It was a fun experience that I wish I had again but it never was a good time to play D&D. But I will say that because I played a loner, it made something interesting and cool happen to the band of murdering lunatics that I won’t ever forget. The loner type can work, but only if they are willing to join the group from time to time. I think having a loner, if done properly, can make for some interesting games. I would like to know if your opinion has changed on this over the years. Thanks and wish you the best!
I dont think an ambassador has to be 'easy going' necessarily. I played an ambassador character who was an Old One Warlock and he was more amiable than easy going. He was under a lot of mental strain and suffered near chronic pain due to the nature of his powers but he was also wise and very obviously well meaning. He was always rather serious but he was honest and clear headed, with a respectable attitude. People knew they could trust and respect him but I don't think anyone would describe him as easy going. He was easy to talk to but he treated issues with nothing less than complete seriousness.
As another relatively new D&D'er, I must also thank you. My DM recommended me to you, and your "6 Questions to create the ultimate backstory" video has immensely helped me improve my first character, and really helped me create a very good second character for my next campaign.
My character is the loner of the group and I mean the one who usually is more independent than the others, the one that is trying to do everything on their own, the main one who gets into arguments with the leader, saying things like "I had it," or "I got this," but at the same time my character is one of the most loyalist people in the group, and the one that feels the need to put the world's and everybody else's burden on their shoulders, the one who is distant but will be their whenever possible, is probably an introvert but only talks to at least one or two people, and lastly the one who ends up getting hurt but rejects the help or the one who feels the need to lead but will never speak up, or the one who feels the need to protect someone but has their own definition of protecting. The protector, the adventurer, and maybe the conscience are the people he might get along with the most.
Plus my loner character is the one in the group where everybody's wondering where they are and the loner is out saving a village or stopping bandits and comes back with an arrow in their side. I see her as having the dual nature of the adventurer and the protector, and by loner I mean an introvert sort if character who helps the group.
Okay, I will say that for a long time, I have struggled with enjoyment in dnd campaigns. I have often felt that everyone else knows what they're doing and I shouldn't step on their toes. I'll stay in my corner and perform my duties as needed. Had I known these personality types were a THING, it would have saved me a lot of woes. Thank you SO much for putting this list together, I feel like I have a little more confidence going forward and I know I don't HAVE to be the proactive 'talk to the king' type. I could simply be a peace-keeper or problem-solver. This is certainly a video I'm going to keep in my DnD toolbox from here on out-it can be the magical remedy for players who need a little extra encouragement. Not everyone has to be the voice of the group, and that's okay. Yes, it does require the participation of the player, but that's the thing- it could be used as a way to help them play their character. tr;dl- Aspiring DMs, share these personality types with your player if they feel useless and want to help;
11:20 it's so true I cannot think of ways to involve characters who care for nothing but themselves. The character is more than a sheet and this is a cooperative storytelling experience.
These are some great archetypes to use as a starting point. Add enough spice and quirks (and character development over time) and they will no doubt mutate so much that no two characters will feel alike. Just having a starting point for what to focus on I think is a great help - and if you dont have a really in-depth character backstory that really fleshes this stuff out then adpoting an archetype like this gives you a lot to start playing with and developing. I think the loner can work fine too - but it seems like it would be a very easy trap for an inexperienced (or maybe not fully mature) player, since the negative aspects of it come from trying to go the cliche route from all too many heroes in games and movies that we have been conditioned with. An inexperienced player thinks that's how a hero is supposed to be. An experienced one will find a way to mold that archetype into something interresting. Perhaps he is a loner who get reluctantly caught up in the events but then starts to warm up to the other characters and find that for the first time in his life he has found people and a cause he cares about. Loads of room to play there, but not one I'd advice a new player to go with.
Guys, he doesn't advertise this often but i by chance stumbled on his actual gameplay with friends and it is literally the best on the net if you don't mind that they don't have critical role kind of budget. I cannot recommend watching his Bacon RPG series (which started as pathfinder and ports to 5e) enough! They also play star/futuristic themes as well but thats not my thing. Once you see the chemistry and patience of him and his friends (some perhaps completely new players) you will probably have a completely different impression. You've got to watch them in action! I am completely unaffiliated with anyone on this channel and just want to spread the word. Browse his channel. Most episodes I've watched are 30 minutes or less in duration because i don't often have 2.5 hrs for watching other games. He edits out a lot of the math of calculating damage and (since that takes up most of the time in episodes) it makes the play time be concise and compelling. Highly enjoyable and made me a better DM! Im posting this on his popular videos because of the proverb "let other praise you and not thee thyself"
Totally get your point about the loner but the interesting part there the story arc of them becoming a team player and bonding with their party but that would take some discussion with the DM before hand AND some good role playing. Can be good though.
So, fun thing: We have two Loners in our game. One's my character, who's only being secluded and brooding, because he can't yet reveal to the party what his traveling motives are (we're getting there and I hope it's as exciting for everyone as it has been for a fellow player I've discussed what they know from being around him). He's by no means self reliant, though, having been around in the world for 2-3 years and mostly in one village, where he was rehabilitated from horrible wounds he sustained from the object of his vengeance, an evil party. The other is our Barbarian Goblin, whom we've been able to convince to travel with us (my character's motive for wanting him around being that he wants a meatshield to protect him along the way) and in turn he'd get to smash more cultists' heads in. We ended up owing him a favor by him agreeing and we're waiting on the shoe to drop.
I don't know, I once created a loner with the idea that he was trying to get over himself. My basic view on character creation is to ask what this guy wants out of the adventure, and so I asked the DM for my character's intro to be - him getting kicked in the balls by a bunch of goblins who he had tried to take on single handed, only to end up getting captured by their teamwork, and having nobody to bail his ass out. The whole idea being that his story starts with a comeuppance, and the rest of it being him trying to force himself to change for the better.
I have been a Dungeon/Game master for a little over three years, and in these years I have been pushing my lovely lone wolves to attempt to play someone/something new. Sadly I have been forced to make restricting campaigns or character building where they must be a certain alignment, or play a certain way. Hopefully they learn soon, I have in fact directed them to your wonderful videos, some of the best instructive videos I have seen for Table Top RPGs. Thank you Sir
Going through these videos again for some inspiration. I guess I've been The Solver with insane note taking and adding everything up which is a lot of fun. I have a great story where I, solver, and the bard, protector, created something beautiful together. We had to fetch a religious book from a ruin in order to gain passage to where we could find information. Thing is it was protected by golems. The bard was not with us so we agreed to it. When he found out about all of it he went huge nope mode and told us to go back and tell the quest giver we changed our minds. I solved the issue! "Wait, wait wait. We do not have to venture down bellow to fetch this book." I set up the plans for a scam! - Wizard+cleric faked the religious book. - Bard prepared an epic tale about our adventures down in these ruins. - Barbarian and I beat each other up to create some bludgeoning damage to aid with the story. - Ranger insisted on getting our pass the legal way which would take FOREVER in game time, time we did not have. Recently my rogue died and was resurrected by... something after a very very bad deal (For story purpose). Figured death would change my character a bit so decided to add one more flaw. Currently I have 2 flaws: Once someone questions my courage I never back down no matter how dangerous the situation. AND I fear my next death, what have I gotten myself into?. The play quite well into each other. I had planned on going warlock multiclass later on but this was too good of a moment to give up. Though I am trying to figure out how death would change him in a RP aspect.
Sounds like a true Bard... and well done to the team for sticking together on making the book work! The whole death thing is very interesting, and the flaws are really cool. Your GM must be smiling at the options you've presenter her / him. Sometimes keeping the character the same is better than multiclassing just for the sake of it.
I share a lot of your sentiments on Loners who completely reject social interactions however I feel like there are ways to make them fulfilling for everyone. One time I had created this character for a seafaring campaign. I was one of the crew getting paid so there was no way for me to go. My friend and I also agreed on having met before when he rescued me from enslavement so I had him to trust and nobody else. The reason my character was a Loner in the first place was because he had a real Tragic Backstory(tm). So even if he wanted in his heart to be a part of a group, he felt like he didn't deserve something like that. He was also a drug addict and self-sabotaging in many other ways. I created this sad character to watch him grow with the power of ***friendship***. He ended up best friends with another stoic elf and quit drugs because he wanted his Paladin crush to like him.
Loners can be done right, but they rarely ever are. When used right, the loner isn't a character type like the others. It should be used as a starting point, and ultimately changed throughout the story into one of the other types. Loners are a shell, not a core. A good "loner" doesn't want to be a loner. 1.) Shyness is one good example of a loner character done well. They are loners not because they want to be, but because they just don't know how to do anything else. 2.) Another good loner is one who is completely self-sufficient, but realizes that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. There's a reason it's a common trope in movies. 3.) Perhaps they do ingratiate themselves with the party, but are slow to trust outsiders. Trust is a very precious thing to them, so it builds that inter-party relation when the character speaks of trust. 4.) What if the character is of a monstrous race, and isn't a loner by nature, but by circumstance? The "finer races" might view them as monsters, and push them away, giving the monstrous character reason to want to prove that monstrous races aren't pure evil, but are just misunderstood. Most of the time, though, people just want to be the asshole who thinks of themselves as "Billy Badass", sitting in the corner of the tavern like Aragorn with their hood up, and the only light on their face coming from the burning embers of their pipe-weed. But, they often forget that Aragorn, very quickly, shed that "loner" personality type and donned the protector/leader role. I encounter other players like this all the time. As a fellow player, I make it a point to mess with them whenever I can. If they don't want interaction, I'll make them interact by doing things like challenging them to drinking competitions, or arm wrestling. If they refuse to participate in the story, my character might taunt their character for "being afraid". I do what I can to hook that other player into joining the group that they wanted to join, but for some reason doesn't want their player to join.
A group of friends and I are setting up for our first(ish) game, our GM has played multiple times but everyone else is a newbie. One of my friends is playing a tiefling ranger and was going for the more loner type I had been setting up my own character (gnome druid) and went, “huh, our classes seem to bounce off of each other well” and we ended up building a backstory together. Where his character was escaping a mob after escaping a hellish land, for my little gnome to help him, teaching him about the landscape etc. My character lived on the way outskirts of a village and never really interacted with other humanoids besides the ones in her circle. My gnome is the adventurer, enthusiast and eager after building the trust with the tiefling, dragged him off to the adventure. As the start of the campaign my character will be the reason for him being in the party, but the hope/plan is as he trust the party more he will be less of the loner type. Not sure how things will go, but I can’t wait to find out when we start next month!
The loner can be interesting if done right. Granted a rouge who refuses to help and goes to do his own thing isn't ideal. But a fighter who has trust issues due to his past, and is actively dealing with those issues as he slowly opens up to the party can be interesting and draws story out of the fellow players.
Thanks a lot for these videos. Your videos not only helped me with my RP skills, but also helped me create more dynamic characters in a graphic novel I am writing and illustrating. I really appriciate your knowledge.
Only a pleasure! Glad you have been enjoying them. Let us know when your graphic novel comes out so we can check it out. Hope you keep watching and sharing :)
I took your mention of the loner architype as a challenge, what I came up with is someone from a far land who is the rightful hair, but as such a position attracts assasins and the fact that they would find the position a pain due to all the beuracracy they decided to leave someone else in charge of the region in their stead, this leads to the mentality where they do not trust many people, nor do they reveal their identity, they join the first adventuring party they could find in order to conceal their identity and so that they would have people who could defend them from any would-be assailents. Despite this fact they tend to go against their better judgement and sense of self-preservation if someone needs help.
+doombybbr Now this is an excellent response to that challenge. Because look at all the work you've put into making the character NOT a loner, even though they are. You have given the character a NEED to work with other people - they have to appear to be part of the party because otherwise assassins will find them. So 10 points to you, and I'd love this character at my table any day :)
+doombybbr The last loner archtype I played was very much like what was laid out, he was a prince that was being hunted by his brother. He joined the adventuring party to have people around him to help protect him and to help conceal him. When he first joined he did not trust anyone, was silent and aloof. Slowly, he transformed into a different archtype. As he got to know the other members of the party and learned that he could trust them. He went from loner to probably closer to leader (was a prince after all)! But was really a bit more reserved than that as he was still in hiding.
I would say that Caleb Widogast from Critical Role is a “Loner” character. He is self-sufficient with his own goals in the best way possible, thoughtful in both his intellect and creative magical solutions as well as in how he cares for his teammates
Thank you so much for these videos, I've been experiencing a lot of struggle with my background and fleshing out my character. As I had just 7 days to make my costume, which was a faun, I left the background to a friend of mine,for we were connected. However I realised quickly that I had no idea what my character was like. Luckily, no one asked me about my past, so I was about to change almost everything, and flesh her out some more. Thank you so so much!
wonderful job my friend! My boyfriend and I are just getting into tabletop roleplaying games and we are watching your series. Thank you for putting this together!
Only a pleasure and that's great that you both are getting into tabletop RPGs :) Let us know how your games go? Love seeing our community grow. Welcome to the table and thanks for commenting.
I don't think the loner is particularly antithetical to group work. I'm a loner but it's not as if I'm unable to work in a group or towards a goal, although perhaps I'm reading 'loner' as 'introvert'. A loner can definitely work, but the times when they choose to be alone are important - wishing to constantly be alone or do everything alone is a sign of bad play but as a nuance to a character it can be well done.
Absolutely agree with you. It's about finding times when it works in character and within the party to be alone, however a lot of players play the loner as someone who doesn't engage and does everything alone.
In one of my first games, I played a Protector who tried to be a Leader to an Adventurer who was waaay smarter than he was... He ended up finding himself on the sharp end of a spear half way through the first campaign while the Adventurer got to live the tale.
I play a loner drow rogue in a pathfinder game, but I always try to bring the party to my plans, trying to convince them to help me as well as I help them. As I see it, you can totally do a loner, provided you have a good reason to be in the party. In my case, my drow have a severe fear of his clan coming to get him, so he needs as many allies as possible to survive.
My current character, a barbarian-rogue, is a loner, but he's not the loner. He's a loner but he's actually the conscience type because he's caring and is willing to help people and be a team player.
Though usually done the unhelpful way, the Loner be made to work wonderfully if played as very task-oriented and professional. Think of them as being here to get the job done, not make friends (though they should quickly come to find the party advantageous to that end and maintain a working relationship with them) -- and mixing their style a bit with the Solver or the Dependable. They never AVOID teamwork, but might prefer to work more on the fringes of the group as a scout or a flank guard or what have you. Finding a good balance can be rather tricky, so I'd recommend this one more for veterans than for the new players who are often ironically the ones who want to play the Loner. One of those "learn the rules before you learn to break them" sorts of things.
in our first game we had a loner character in our party and after realizing that he wouldn't talk about himself or his past or his goals and seeing him wander around by himself again and again the others just accepted him and didn't even ask for his opinion or anything anymore. they were not against him being there but he was ignored a lot and not really helped with anything because he never did anything with or for them either. sadly tho, he died shortly after and is now somewhat of a meme in our group.
I had a loner character that was a rouge that was quite distent from the party at first it took him a few sessions to warm up to one of the characters and only after he revealed his secret (he was a tifling hiding with bandages and robes) he often went of to scout and information gather with the occasional help of his new sorcerer friend and his invisibility spell
I was playing a dwarven volcano druid who based on this video was an artist. Arrive in the main city, my dwarf goes looking for a deli. There's a meeting in a tavern, eat some pie at the bar. The party is breaking up to do individual things in the city, goes back to the deli.
I know you detest the loner type in RPG games but what if your loner character as part of their back story is a loner because of some great tragedy that happened and thus he does not like being around other beings for fear of that tragedy repeating itself and he takes part in this quest to try and find himself again and maybe even trust others again. I feel that type of loner would be ideal for an RPG game.
You are talking there about a premeditated journey that the loner goes on which will ultimately shift them from loner to something else. That I am perfectly OK with. It's the loner who remains so that I have an issue with!
that is totally understandable if someone is going to remain a loner without any kind of character growth then why are they playing in a group. also real quick I would like to say thank you for your videos being new to table top pen and paper RPG'S videos like this are a godsend to me when it comes to character creation.
Had a character end up a loner, she wasn't meant to be, but the rest of the party immediately alienated her by doing really stupid crap. Every time she's gone 'maybe I can trust them' they've done something stupid again. Still really working on bringing her into the group, sending her on a side quest, bringing in a guest character, then bringing her back. I hope it works
I'm currently playing a loner type but he works with the party, he needs the party. Hes been a loner for so long but now he realizes he needs a party to help him complete his goals. In exchange he has offered his aid to each party member as a thank you for assisting him. Would that be a functional Loner?
I once played a pseudo Loner where I played this Rat Bastard of a dwarf who did not care about morals or the other people in his group all he wants to do is get rich and get shiny loot. So he was a scheming untrustworthy bastard but he would see things through to the end and get the most profit for himself and others. He was tolerated because while he could manipulate his fellow adventurers he would also manipulate the NPCs as well. He also had all the contacts with the criminal underclasses. So while like you my GM hated loaners he found it interesting how the other players interacted with me. On the one hand I am a usefull member of the team with many good skill and contacts. But on the other hand they did not trust my lying ass one bit.
after having watched this as well as most of the detailed descriptions I just feel compelled to make this comment. I don't know if anyone here has read the book series calles "animorphs" they are amazing btw, but the characters follow these character types so closely, they are a perfect character study really. So here is my quick Which animorph is which charactertype and how do they give it and interesting egde? So obviously (to anyone knowing the series that is) Jake is the leader, interestingly he never wanted to be the leader, he was not captain of a sportsteam or anything, it's just that evweryone decided he should be the leader so he figured someone had to do it. This ofcourse led to some interesting inner conflict, character growth as well as, to some degree, loss of moral values over time. Also he had to tackle heavy conscious questions, would he risk losing the whole team to maybe save one? Ofcourse everyone would hate him if he just let's one team member dye like that... besides him hating himself Cassie is the conscious but also partly ambassedor. She has strict moral values but over the cause of a war she has to permanently rethink her values, is it Ok to sacrifice a few thousands to rescue millions? It is ok to orph sentien beings against their will? Were does sentients even beginn? At points she feels like she has to quit but always returns because she feels she has this duty, she, through he conscience alone even managed to befriend an enemy and make that enemy an ally, soemthing no one else could have done, and not because of strategic planning but because she wanted to believe. I really loved that character XD Marco is the solver, he asks the right questions and often knows how to get to the answer. Then he will make a plan, the most efficient plan he can see and he can be very ruthless in that planning. Once he sees the solution of how to get from A to B he has to persue it. But he keeps getting in personal conflict, has to see in how far emotions get in the way, or inhow far is plans kill off his emotions because of everysthing he is willing to sacrifice to get to the result. Rachel is the soul. She develops a passion for the fight. sure she fights for the cause, but she loves the danger, she lives in the thrill of the fight, fior her it becomes a way of live that she can't get free of. But this almost destroys her, makes it impossible for her to even fathom a normal life anymore. She becomes so enthralled in fighting that she borders insane. Now the two most difficult characters to clearly put in thiese categories for me are Tobias and Ax.... I would say Tobias is a Loner Type,, but with the want to company he just doesn't really know how to do that and becoming a hawk clearly doesn't help. but in the end he is a teamplayer... so in theend I rather tend to dependable. He will do anything for the group, he scouts, he puts himself in danger, he would theoratically sacrifice his life for the cause. so yeah I go with dependable Ax could also be a dependable... but I'd guess I would rather go with Protector. He swears his loyalty to a prince as well as a cause, the fight against the Yeerks. But his loyalty is tested time and time again, the loyalty to his people, to the war even to his human friends, and he has to dicide what he values most and how far he would go. This means sometimes going direktly against orders since his cause is his highest priority, higher than his loyalty to any person which does some harm in the end. yeah if there are any animorph lovers out there I would like to know if you agree or disagree and maybe like my comment ;) btw sorry for the bad writing... I hope it's decipharable ^^
In a oneshot I played a survivor with survivor's guilt. He was in the corner of the bar drinking alone. The other characters met up quickly and proceeded to ignore my character. Occasionally I asked the DM if my character noticed anything unusual, to which the DM said "nope". I'd send my character to the bar to get more drink or outside to relieve himself to purposely cross paths with the other PCs. They ignored the weirdly shaped completely hidden robed figure sulking around the tavern. It was very boring spending half the game being effectively an NPC.
I can't say I have much experience playing with them, but I imagine a loner can work as long as he/she has an arc. Maybe we have a character with ye olde tragic backstory who needs to learn to trust people again, perhaps they're street urchin who has to learn what trust is in the first place, or it might just be that they're a bit shy. The descriptor "doesn't work well with others" should always be followed by "yet."
yea, im going to playing my first ever campaign, and i did roll with a loner/hermit background. I wanted that general idea that since my character had been ostracized by society, that he remained alone to avoid being hurt again, is generally traumatized by things that happened. in the event of meeting up with the main party that he would join them as a last resort for his goals, but slowly open up to them little by little. I'd picture him as a dependable loner, that he doesn't participate in normal social situations but has his newfound family's backs.
It sounds like there could be a lot of overlap like the protector becoming the conscience when the party decides to go off on a particularly dangerous quest by making sure that everyone has their gear in good condition and their potions and what-not all lined up and ready to go.
When I think about the loner I see a hermit or an out-lander who has had a difficult life, they don't necessarily know how to properly interact with others effectively, or they have been hurt badly by someone else. The idea for a character like this would be for them to find a way to deal with and over come those problems and find a way to at least intact well with the party.
My character is both an adventurer AND a Protector, but only of nature (ESPECIALLY oceans). If the ecosystem is threatened, the become a protector. I justified this, by having the character have the entertainer’s characteristic “my mind or mood can change as quickly as the key in a song”
Not going to lie. The idea of a GM catering to my own sense of direction in a game sounds amazing. I guess, honestly, I would be a Problem Solver by your standards. More often than not the problems I'm solving come from the other party members fucking around excessively. Once I have an objective, though, I tend to go after it with both barrels. Distressingly often this means separating from the party to "fix" things behind the scenes.
Other party members can be problematic lol Sometimes you need to find the way to play within the party to solve those problems however lest your character gets left out of the main adventure, so just keep an eye on that.
If only my GMs would allow me to apply "permanent" problem solving to my "teammates". I've had some daffy fucking co-players. For your pleasure, I hope, is a short story of mine. We had taken on a dungeon and came to the major puzzle at the end, just before the boss. We had the boss's door and a little plaque above it with some designs in a certain order. Down the hall were four rooms, each with a little design above the door. Each room had its own challenge and a switch. We were warned that throwing the switches in the correct order would open the door to the boss. Doing so in the wrong order would reset all of the rooms. My buddy faced down the first room challenge. It was a demon thing in lizard person form. It was, in fact, the daughter to the NPC that was guiding us, except evil and edgy n's shit. My buddy was playing a Paladin so he handled it in his own way. Everybody got mad at me after he killed her because I wanted to skin her and make a new scabbard. There was a fist fight. After that, the Paladin never challenged me to a fist fight again but I didn't get my new scabbard either. Next room was empty. Kind of boring but oh-well. Third room had a giant scorpion. I cut one of its arms off, did over half its total HP in damage and gave it a heart attack. One-shot kill. I was pretty stoked. The Paladin was upset because he didn't get to hit it. After that he and I chilled out in that room and let the other party members handle the last one on their own. We had been doing all of the real work up to that point. Five players - FIVE PLAYERS (yes, it was a crowded game) - ended up getting their asses kicked by three Halfling berserker NPCs. Once that resolved itself (the dragon cleric made a phenomenally lucky roll) the players then spent the next hour trying to figure out what to do next. When they explored the idea of back-tracking I lost my cool and got the GM's attention. I asked him if I could make a memory check on the plaque above the boss's door. I passed. I asked for a logic check of some sort to find any correlation between the plaque and the carvings above each door. I passed. From there I was able to discern an order. I went through each room and flipped the switches in order (losing my other ear in the process to a booby trap in the empty room) then walked in on them as they were bickering and flipped the last switch. The boss's door opened. Without another word, I walked in on him, pulled my throwing axe and hurled it at his face as hard as I could. My God, the story doesn't end here. The Paladin came out of nowhere and knocked the axe out of the air then began to chide me on attacking before asking question. I inquired as to what team he was on then we both got hit by lightning from the boss, who took his turn to chide both of us on not being able to recognize evil when we saw it. So I stepped to the side and let my teammates get their asses kicked for a little while, took the time to figure out his special moves and gimmicks, then came back in to finish the job once I figured out what his weakness was. It was kind of difficult to kill the guy on a moral sense, though. He possessed the Paladin, threw everybody in to a pile and threatened to pin them to the floor with his great sword. I was all for seeing that happen at this point. Not to say I've had all wins. I once tricked a Drow High Priestess to let me teleport her to our camp so we could capture and interrogate her. Almost caused a full party wipe. Apparently Drow society is a matriarchal meritocracy. Who knew.
Great vid, the only thing I disagree with is about the loner. If the Loner works with the GM it can be a very interesting character for group dynamics and his background could be intertwined with the campaign, don't hate loners. It is a valid archetype to play and characters evolve and grow. The adventurer may get almost killed by a treasure chest trap and start being less so and the loner may have his ass saved by the group and be grateful choosing then to help first and then go after his goal, for example.
My character Tacious is definitely an Adventurer :) it's fun to annoy the party by just doing things without thinking about consequences. I absolutely understand why, it's pretty dangerous, BUT it keeps the party going.
Currently playing with an Adventurous Loner... Geez, the amount of times I've had to hint to him that doing something alone may not be the best course of action. He once tried to solo (he was level 1, mind you) a Rhino, meant to prevent the party from going back. Needless to say, he got knocked out before long...
Keep in mind he has a video on how to play a loner. That said I think it would be intuitive for a loaner to be the one to draw the party together after failing on his own 'I need muscle, oh, I can't convince them, I need a convince, I can't keep talking I need a leader' and with that you can write a narrative of a loner and a silver and probably a concious getting some muscle and a leader, that's a full party and everyone gets their character goals worked out.
I think my next character is going to have multi personality disorder. Every time I finish a long rest I will pick a random card out of a pile I make and follow that personality for the day. Each personality will remember important information when needed, but not exactly what the last personality did. Also, each personality doesn’t know that the others exist and wonders why they did certain actions. I personally think it will be interesting not knowing what actions I will take until I know what my personality will be, or even having large regrets about past actions that I did without a second thought at the time.
I am in 2 campaigns with a group of friends and it’s my first time playing. I have one character who is the adventurer and one who is the protector and it’s kind of fun playing the two different sides xD
The loner is certainly a complicated character to do right in D&D. Let’s say your loner is a mercenary type, like my lizardfolk and my Dragonborn, who both have their own goals and aren’t joining a party for the group, but for themselves. Why are they joining a group? Because it’s easier to do bigger jobs with better rewards if you’ve got other people with you. They are looking at the party as a means to be greater, not as friends or comrades. He will protect a party member because it benefits his goals to have the help. He is still disconnected socially, and has the potential to stop being like that, but he has a reason to stay with the party.
I feel like no character is exclusively any one of these qualifiers. For instance, the character I'm playing now is largely a Loner -- I know, it's sad, but listen. He's not just a Loner, because even if he'd rather doing things by his own power, he recognises he can't do everything by himself. He enjoys working with the party, but simply because it's effective. He is self sufficient, to a point, which is what makes him prefer to not work with the party. But he's also not an idiot, and knows he is much more effective when he has his allies by his side.
The trick with the Loner is to be a bit introverted, or shy, or perhaps likes to observe and analyze people more than converse with them. It's perfectly fine to be a little detached, so long as you're doing it in a way that's conducive to the story, or constructive to the group play. But don't be Tony Stark or Batman. Nobody like to have a Batman on their team, and we have more pressing issues to deal with than your character's ego and daddy issues.
I'm currently playing a campaign and I think my character is a mix of the conscious and the ambassador, though she doesn't really have much of a leader to run things by either at the moment so she just tries to keep the party together, we don't have much of a leader I think mostly because we just finished session 2 recently, so hoping to see if we end up having a leader..
Characters can be aloof without that being a problem. You wouldn't expect a Grey Elf to drink and sing with the others when it's time to feast. Maybe she would make a speech at the beginning expressing gratitude and valuing camaraderie between the Elder People and the lesser races and then would excuse herself to her quarters. She still depends on the group, she's still willing to pursue the same objectives as they are, but she's a freaking Grey Elf, and should act like one, right? "The solver" is my burden. Everybody expects me to play that role even if I don't want to... "The adventurer" sounds more like a character trait I inherited from my mum. I'm a completionist. You may have played with someone who was like that. "Being upbeat" is just one of the strategies used by competionists in RPG sessions to get others to help them fulfil their obsession. "The ambassador"! I wish I had one of those in any of the three campaigns I'm playing. That's a very nice role to have around. I wonder what D&D class would best fit this. Maybe a wizard or a monk or perhaps a knowledge bard.
I've made quite a few loners, but I compensate for the apparent flaw by putting in their story that they don't really *want* to be alone. Something in their past typically drives them to be a loner type, but at the same time they long for companionship and are perfectly capable of being loyal to those that are loyal to them. As a result "loner" became more a back story trait while "the soul" (mentioned in part 1 of this) or "the adventurer" might be more accurate to how they would actually interact with the party. I wouldn't say loners should "fuck off," necessarily, they just need to be sure their "loner" status doesn't interfere with the game. It should simply be a character type that is used to enhance the game or as the character's history as opposed to becoming the focus of that character's role entirely. Just my opinion. I think the main problem isn't the loner type itself, but the fact that many people do it wrong.
One of the Loners I did dream up was for D&D, which was (WARNING: ULTRA GENERIC AND TOTALLY UNORIGINAL CHARACTER COMBINATION) a Tiefling Warlock who was rather dark, lonely and aloof. He was anti-Social, spiteful and vindictive. Now, that would be normally bad, but I looked at the whole Tiefling lore of being hated and outcast by everyone and everything. So I went: "Hmmm, what about a character that has sort of been brought up with that hatred and ostracized, and just can't be around people because he doesn't know HOW to be around people except to return everything with silence and hostility?" Now, I haven't played this character for D&D yet, but that's the basic premise. I hope to slowly bring him out of the shell and teach him social skills.
What about a loner who is still somewhat sociable but just keeps people at a “safe distance”? I’m planning on playing a rogue like this where he is decently charismatic and could conceivably be the face of the party if no one else steps up; it’s just that his first and best friend got hurt because of him so he is paranoid about having real friends. I don’t want to go full-loner; my favorite part about dnd is the inter party relationships. I just think for a while he is going to hold back on letting these people be his true friends.
I have "Loner" I guess, well he is more the stay at base and do the research and has the other players help him. Though he does come on quests from time to time.
How would yall make a good loner character? I like the idea of a self-sufficient person who doesn't feel the need to be with others for social reasons, only for pragmatic reasons, but I don't know if that would make a good RP character
I love your videos man, they're so well done! :D Also the way you talk is just great (although the accent is doing my head in, i cant figure out what it is. Sounds south african with some english and australian in it) And your opinion of the loner is 100% correct. I had someone in one of my games refuse to talk to my character even when my character spoke to theirs because their character was a 'loner', just why bother playing?!
+Kurt Miller Thanks Kurt. For the record I'm 100% South Africa, but born in a part of South Africa called the last outpost of England and raised by very British parents. The Ozzie twang is perhaps because I tend to use that accent to emphasize certain words as it's a great accent for emphasis.
I have a anti loner half-orc forced to work in the circus (whitch is based in a regien were half-orcs are oddities)after his parents may have been killed he was isolated in the circus so he never had any real friends or family he now after escaping the circus just wants two things 1.to belong to a group of people 2. to be treated as a person by the public
I have a character who seems to be a loner type. We rolled for completely random backgrounds and her's is wrought with betrayal and revenge so I've played her as rightfully mistrustful. Although I know at her core she's more of the "Protector" type. she's driven by a desire for justice (it was even in her background) and to keep others safe... she just struggles to trust people and make lasting relations. So far the struggle to get her attached and integrated has created some funny problems but I hope I havent upset anyone in my group for it x( My character was a bastard born half elf in a world where elves are caught and sold into slavery. Although she was raised with her human relatives, after her mother died her grandparents clipped her ears to try and hide her half bred status. She's driven by a strong sense of justice and great love for the elf race. But due to her treatment by her family she grew up suspicious and mistrustful of most people-mainly humans. Even betrayed her family by falling in with mercenaries and destroying their business before setting out on her own. though I really enjoy her random backstory and how it molds her, my favorite random roll had to be that she started with a folded boat.... on a map with mostly mountains and trees.
I've really enjoyed this series and it's given me a fair bit to think about. As a GM I try to anticipate my what my players do in a given situation and also ensure the game "ticks their boxes" enjoyment-wise. An invaluable resource in understanding the players is an old book by Robin Laws called Robin's Laws (clever, huh?). In this book he describes the various player types and what rules system/scenarios they would like. You've gone beyond that and I need to figure out if any of your categories match my players. (They generally play the same character no matter their stats etc.) I have one question though. Are the roles mutually exclusive? I can imagine an instance where a dwarf fighter who is also an Adventurer, want to explore further, but in the right situation The Protector if a dwarf colony is being attacked by an Orc Warband.
+Andy Simmons I shall look out for that book! Look these types are drawn directly from a system used by corporates the world over - Ennegrams. I just applied them to character creation :) And no they are not mutually exclusive. They often overlap - typically one has One dominate and then two minor which become dominate under stress or intimate encounters. An adventurer type when faced with certain death of the party may become a staunch protector, or ambassador. But their fall back once the threat is gone will be to push on type of thing. Not sure if that helps?
Yes, thank you. I'll have to look into Ennegrams. Speaking as a player, not s GM, I'be found this series very useful. I'll certainly be applying these ideas to future characters. (And speaking as a GM, they'll be useful for NPCs too.)
What about the tweeners, say a Protector with loner tendencies. Like I played a right nasty assassin usually who ends up close to their party, but when someone needs to do the horrible things, the bad things that would weigh on the soul, that is me, because I love my wacky dysfunctional crew. So I go on my own to eliminate the threat that the party can't(evil but well loved nobleman for example.)
while the loners are a difficult character, if done right, a loner can be turned around. Only IF the player is willing to adjust his character as well. Imagine the party being poisoned by the enemy and abducted--for lore dump purposes. And the loner, being aloof, realizes his newfound friends are missing, and thus tracks them down, and helping them escape. --then, that's gonna be the perfect time for them to actually interact and connect with the party. become that one guy who is rarely around but is extremely loyal to the party.
I feel that loners are a good source of theatric drama. Meaning they would start as closed off and aloof, but start to open up to others in the role playing conversations or dramatic arguments
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When I first started GMing, I had a group full of loners, 3 to be exact. They all wanted to sit in dark corners and smoke pipes and take on Orc raiding parties singlehandedly. I decided I'd set a precedent and promptly killed one who wanted to go off and "fulfill his fathers dying wish", he got stuck in a trap that required two people to disarm
+Snat Man OOoooh I like that. Did it solve the loner attitude?
Bacon Battalion RPG They actually all rewrote their characters, but now we've gotten to the point where we can laugh about it :)
Awesome! That's really cool!
One of my DM thinks for some reason all rogues should be loners. I'm playing a ambassador. But in that party we don't have a leader yet. so she is slowly morphing into a leader.
Greatest loner i ever saw in a game had one simple caveat. He was shy. He wore his hood over his eyes so he felt comfortable because he didnt like people to look him in the eye. We was a good sword arm but once a pretty girl talked to him his front faded away as he stumbled over his words. Damn fine character
Ah so a loner but dedicated to the party?
Bacon Battalion RPG Yeah, he was devoted to his friends but he just couldnt deal with people, he didnt have it in him. He outright feared attention
That's great game play because he is a loner who supports and helps the party albeit in a way that will let them go unnoticed.
I think loner works better as a trait than a strict rule. I played a assassin who preferred to work alone, but ended being put into the role of a leader and so he had to balance the two. which I actually enjoyed more.
Interesting role reversal!
Cheat sheet:
The Loner:
-Self-Sufficient
-Thoughtful
(Not a recommended type)
The Solver:
-Questioning
-Problem Solving
The Adventurer:
-Upbeat
-Adventurous
The Protector:
-Strong
-Justice Orientated
The Ambassador
-Peace-keeper
-Easy going
I think a loner type would be worth playing if you, as a player, have already decided that as a process of personal growth you want them to outgrow the mentality and learn to trust and care for their party.
Yes. There must be growth!
exactly what i was thinking. what of someone who is a lone wolf, but as he meet the group he finds some connection, something within that he enjoys and wish to continue being in this group? was thinking how cool it would be if he becomes a soul character beacuse of this seemingly mysterious emotional spirituality he experiences with this group, or a dependable, beacuse of his previous self sufficency now driven for the groups intrest.
@@MrEddie4679 werent the Avengers also loners? each a super hero in their own way but they didnt want to cooperate in the beginning?...
I had a game where two people were independents who thought the world revolved around them. They quickly found that arrows can pierce even the thickest of heads.
Round of applause for that.
In my first ever game, we were all adventurers almost to the detriment of our characters, we searched all nooks and corners, and at one point we would steal useful furniture from dungeons (chains, chairs, a piano and once a door), we would smash open walls if geometry would permit something from being in between the walls, and always broke open desks and chests, searching for secret compartments. But this was also a campaign were I was the leader and the protector towards my church, which I donated nearly 27k gold to by level 11, every time I would go shopping after I got what I was looking for (a improved weapon, better armor, cool magic armor, chemical weapons) then proceeding to give everything that was left to the church as charity. The DM was great, by level 4 I had handed over a lot of the wealth I had made, but every time I went on an adventure a servant of the church would present me with left over potions (saving my healing spells, also without me asking for them) once a wand and another time it was a holy weapon that a previous hero left behind. 10/10 adventure would donate my gold again.
A short post in defense of loner characters. I don't like playing loners, but they can be an interesting challenge. A great tipp for playing with loner type characters is to discuss common goals with the gm. A loner will band with a group if it serves a purpous. He might want to get revenge on that dragon, that destroyed his village. After the dragon is slain he might face a turning point. The player has to be willing to let his character develop over the course of the game. Maybe he gets attached to the group and becomes a protector or he might become the adventurer. You can get very interesting group dynamics this way. Sadly most players will overplay the loner act and go off on their own or might even betray the group. Good communication between gm and players is key to successfully integrating a loner pc into the party.
Possibly a loner might feel like they are duty-bound and supposed to help, even if they don't necessarily want to. Like if they owed a life-debt to a member of the party, or if they realized, i may not want to help and cooperate, but I feel like a whole lot of bad will be on my shoulders if i don't help or something like that. that could be interesting
I think "the loner" type could work.
If they are cooperative and use their skills to help out the party, then I see no issue. The loner can stick with the party and help out. As long as the player doesn't go "lone wolf" then this type can work.
In addition, this type can work well when combined with the dependable type. They may be a wallflower most of the time, but when party members are in trouble, the loner might actually rush out to help them out.
+Bobby Ranger Sometimes as is the case with our Pathfinder sessions, the Loner can actually really help the group as they are not always in the thick of battle and so can help the rest of the party who are drawing aggro. Absolutely Loners work but they need to be able to be a part of the party as well. Thanks for your comments and as always Happy Gaming!
If the loner isn't going "lone wolf," doesn't that make the character something other than a loner?
Yeah it could work I think what I'd do is make the link on a personal basis, maybe have a sibling in the group or maybe there is this female character he like or an old friend. If there is a personal link for the loner to the group he might put up with the group and even start engaging with the other characters. I guess that could work
My problem with the lonelr as I happened to see it in one party was that the player really had little to do because he wouldn't talk to us, he wouldn't interact with anyone always keeping his distance... it was quiet annoying really, so IF you feel like you have to play a loner, be sure you know what you are doing because otherwise you start doing nothing most of the time which is boring...
Bobby Ranger I agree. loners, when played right, are a source of theatric drama. A role played argument can end with the character opening up about something to the others
My loner has high charisma, so is able to win favour of people easily. He just doesn't see the point in forming an emotional attachment to people. He sees relationships as a means to an end, rather than a human need. It's caused by his sheltered and isolated childhood which was traumatically ended in being orphaned far from built-up settlements and having to fend for himself ever since. Why get close to people if everyone leaves him in the end? So he carries a vessel for an odd spiritual entity that leaves and returns over the dead of night and has never gotten over his parents' deaths. So alone time is crucial for him.
I normally make my characters loner starting out, so that they could feasibly be self sufficient during their quest up to lvl 1 when they were making their own decision, because once they start working with the group I like having room for character development. For example, I might make a rogue who prefers not to work with people, but when forced to work with a group because of a situation of life or death, they eventually grow to respect their party and become a more respectable character as time progresses. It allows for more longevity in my opinion.
Makes sense as long as there is progression!
aka leverage
7. Curious George
I've played one loner and she was an intentional inversion- a seemingly hyper-capable and aloof ranger....Who actually didn't want to be aloof at all but suffered from extreme social anxiety that made social situations incredibly difficult for her, resulting in her isolating herself and becoming incredibly lonely before meeting the party. The party helping her come out of her shell and learn to cope with her anxiety was genuinely one of the most heartwarming character stories I've ever been lucky enough to take part in
The loner character can be done correctly, but it's definitely a difficult artform to master.
Alex Bourne I very much agree
I would argue that Caleb Widogast from Critical Role is an example of a Loner done correctly
Great gm: "the solver"
Me: ooohh, he might be me
in the presence of the King the Soul is looking at the fantastic works of art going "Daaaammnnn" or flirting with the beautiful prince/princess.
The end of the video where you talk about making a dependable character reminded me of one of my favorite characters I have ever run. He was a wizard in dnd, who through some strange circumstances ended up becoming neutral evil, but remained fiercely loyal to the party, even though he had his own goals. So the party, of mostly good characters where very concerned about my slide to evil, but never kicked me out because I would always do whatever needed to be done to protect them, and I was the biggest single source of dps. All in all it was an amazing campaign filled with some amazing memories.
I know I’m about 5 years too late but I thought to comment. I recently found your channel for research purposes unrelated to D&D and I think it’s really helped me so far. So thanks. I’ve only had one good hour of a D&D session while playing with someone else’s character as I was filling in for them. I wasn’t then or now very familiar with the game but I did my best and chose to journey alone. So, I guess I made them a loner type. During the journey, the character came across an old tomb. They went to investigate it and ended up releasing an enemy that was forgotten from the ages. I managed to get the character outta there and back safely with the group. The group had just finished up murdering a relatively strong husband and wife for a place to stay, so they weren’t at all too thrilled that I had unleashed death upon everyone in the city, including them. There was no time to recuperate. It was a fun experience that I wish I had again but it never was a good time to play D&D. But I will say that because I played a loner, it made something interesting and cool happen to the band of murdering lunatics that I won’t ever forget. The loner type can work, but only if they are willing to join the group from time to time. I think having a loner, if done properly, can make for some interesting games. I would like to know if your opinion has changed on this over the years. Thanks and wish you the best!
I dont think an ambassador has to be 'easy going' necessarily. I played an ambassador character who was an Old One Warlock and he was more amiable than easy going. He was under a lot of mental strain and suffered near chronic pain due to the nature of his powers but he was also wise and very obviously well meaning. He was always rather serious but he was honest and clear headed, with a respectable attitude. People knew they could trust and respect him but I don't think anyone would describe him as easy going. He was easy to talk to but he treated issues with nothing less than complete seriousness.
I'm new playing D&D, and I've found these videos the most helpful on UA-cam for someone like me. Do keep up the great work!
+Ben Stannard Thank you and welcome to the table!
As another relatively new D&D'er, I must also thank you. My DM recommended me to you, and your "6 Questions to create the ultimate backstory" video has immensely helped me improve my first character, and really helped me create a very good second character for my next campaign.
That's great feedback thank you! Remember if you have any questions feel free to share them in a comment and I'll try to answer them!
My character is the loner of the group and I mean the one who usually is more independent than the others, the one that is trying to do everything on their own, the main one who gets into arguments with the leader, saying things like "I had it," or "I got this," but at the same time my character is one of the most loyalist people in the group, and the one that feels the need to put the world's and everybody else's burden on their shoulders, the one who is distant but will be their whenever possible, is probably an introvert but only talks to at least one or two people, and lastly the one who ends up getting hurt but rejects the help or the one who feels the need to lead but will never speak up, or the one who feels the need to protect someone but has their own definition of protecting. The protector, the adventurer, and maybe the conscience are the people he might get along with the most.
Plus my loner character is the one in the group where everybody's wondering where they are and the loner is out saving a village or stopping bandits and comes back with an arrow in their side. I see her as having the dual nature of the adventurer and the protector, and by loner I mean an introvert sort if character who helps the group.
That's a great description, and sounds like a really cool character.
Okay, I will say that for a long time, I have struggled with enjoyment in dnd campaigns. I have often felt that everyone else knows what they're doing and I shouldn't step on their toes. I'll stay in my corner and perform my duties as needed. Had I known these personality types were a THING, it would have saved me a lot of woes. Thank you SO much for putting this list together, I feel like I have a little more confidence going forward and I know I don't HAVE to be the proactive 'talk to the king' type. I could simply be a peace-keeper or problem-solver.
This is certainly a video I'm going to keep in my DnD toolbox from here on out-it can be the magical remedy for players who need a little extra encouragement. Not everyone has to be the voice of the group, and that's okay. Yes, it does require the participation of the player, but that's the thing- it could be used as a way to help them play their character.
tr;dl- Aspiring DMs, share these personality types with your player if they feel useless and want to help;
11:20 it's so true
I cannot think of ways to involve characters who care for nothing but themselves. The character is more than a sheet and this is a cooperative storytelling experience.
These are some great archetypes to use as a starting point. Add enough spice and quirks (and character development over time) and they will no doubt mutate so much that no two characters will feel alike. Just having a starting point for what to focus on I think is a great help - and if you dont have a really in-depth character backstory that really fleshes this stuff out then adpoting an archetype like this gives you a lot to start playing with and developing.
I think the loner can work fine too - but it seems like it would be a very easy trap for an inexperienced (or maybe not fully mature) player, since the negative aspects of it come from trying to go the cliche route from all too many heroes in games and movies that we have been conditioned with. An inexperienced player thinks that's how a hero is supposed to be. An experienced one will find a way to mold that archetype into something interresting. Perhaps he is a loner who get reluctantly caught up in the events but then starts to warm up to the other characters and find that for the first time in his life he has found people and a cause he cares about. Loads of room to play there, but not one I'd advice a new player to go with.
Guys, he doesn't advertise this often but i by chance stumbled on his actual gameplay with friends and it is literally the best on the net if you don't mind that they don't have critical role kind of budget. I cannot recommend watching his Bacon RPG series (which started as pathfinder and ports to 5e) enough! They also play star/futuristic themes as well but thats not my thing. Once you see the chemistry and patience of him and his friends (some perhaps completely new players) you will probably have a completely different impression. You've got to watch them in action! I am completely unaffiliated with anyone on this channel and just want to spread the word. Browse his channel. Most episodes I've watched are 30 minutes or less in duration because i don't often have 2.5 hrs for watching other games. He edits out a lot of the math of calculating damage and (since that takes up most of the time in episodes) it makes the play time be concise and compelling. Highly enjoyable and made me a better DM! Im posting this on his popular videos because of the proverb "let other praise you and not thee thyself"
Totally get your point about the loner but the interesting part there the story arc of them becoming a team player and bonding with their party but that would take some discussion with the DM before hand AND some good role playing. Can be good though.
So, fun thing: We have two Loners in our game.
One's my character, who's only being secluded and brooding, because he can't yet reveal to the party what his traveling motives are (we're getting there and I hope it's as exciting for everyone as it has been for a fellow player I've discussed what they know from being around him). He's by no means self reliant, though, having been around in the world for 2-3 years and mostly in one village, where he was rehabilitated from horrible wounds he sustained from the object of his vengeance, an evil party.
The other is our Barbarian Goblin, whom we've been able to convince to travel with us (my character's motive for wanting him around being that he wants a meatshield to protect him along the way) and in turn he'd get to smash more cultists' heads in. We ended up owing him a favor by him agreeing and we're waiting on the shoe to drop.
I don't know, I once created a loner with the idea that he was trying to get over himself. My basic view on character creation is to ask what this guy wants out of the adventure, and so I asked the DM for my character's intro to be - him getting kicked in the balls by a bunch of goblins who he had tried to take on single handed, only to end up getting captured by their teamwork, and having nobody to bail his ass out.
The whole idea being that his story starts with a comeuppance, and the rest of it being him trying to force himself to change for the better.
I have been a Dungeon/Game master for a little over three years, and in these years I have been pushing my lovely lone wolves to attempt to play someone/something new. Sadly I have been forced to make restricting campaigns or character building where they must be a certain alignment, or play a certain way. Hopefully they learn soon, I have in fact directed them to your wonderful videos, some of the best instructive videos I have seen for Table Top RPGs. Thank you Sir
My absolute pleasure! I only hope it improves their fun, and by default your own!
Going through these videos again for some inspiration.
I guess I've been The Solver with insane note taking and adding everything up which is a lot of fun. I have a great story where I, solver, and the bard, protector, created something beautiful together.
We had to fetch a religious book from a ruin in order to gain passage to where we could find information. Thing is it was protected by golems. The bard was not with us so we agreed to it.
When he found out about all of it he went huge nope mode and told us to go back and tell the quest giver we changed our minds.
I solved the issue! "Wait, wait wait. We do not have to venture down bellow to fetch this book." I set up the plans for a scam!
- Wizard+cleric faked the religious book.
- Bard prepared an epic tale about our adventures down in these ruins.
- Barbarian and I beat each other up to create some bludgeoning damage to aid with the story.
- Ranger insisted on getting our pass the legal way which would take FOREVER in game time, time we did not have.
Recently my rogue died and was resurrected by... something after a very very bad deal (For story purpose). Figured death would change my character a bit so decided to add one more flaw.
Currently I have 2 flaws:
Once someone questions my courage I never back down no matter how dangerous the situation.
AND I fear my next death, what have I gotten myself into?.
The play quite well into each other.
I had planned on going warlock multiclass later on but this was too good of a moment to give up.
Though I am trying to figure out how death would change him in a RP aspect.
Sounds like a true Bard... and well done to the team for sticking together on making the book work! The whole death thing is very interesting, and the flaws are really cool. Your GM must be smiling at the options you've presenter her / him. Sometimes keeping the character the same is better than multiclassing just for the sake of it.
I share a lot of your sentiments on Loners who completely reject social interactions however I feel like there are ways to make them fulfilling for everyone. One time I had created this character for a seafaring campaign. I was one of the crew getting paid so there was no way for me to go. My friend and I also agreed on having met before when he rescued me from enslavement so I had him to trust and nobody else. The reason my character was a Loner in the first place was because he had a real Tragic Backstory(tm). So even if he wanted in his heart to be a part of a group, he felt like he didn't deserve something like that. He was also a drug addict and self-sabotaging in many other ways. I created this sad character to watch him grow with the power of ***friendship***. He ended up best friends with another stoic elf and quit drugs because he wanted his Paladin crush to like him.
Loners can be done right, but they rarely ever are. When used right, the loner isn't a character type like the others. It should be used as a starting point, and ultimately changed throughout the story into one of the other types. Loners are a shell, not a core. A good "loner" doesn't want to be a loner.
1.) Shyness is one good example of a loner character done well. They are loners not because they want to be, but because they just don't know how to do anything else.
2.) Another good loner is one who is completely self-sufficient, but realizes that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. There's a reason it's a common trope in movies.
3.) Perhaps they do ingratiate themselves with the party, but are slow to trust outsiders. Trust is a very precious thing to them, so it builds that inter-party relation when the character speaks of trust.
4.) What if the character is of a monstrous race, and isn't a loner by nature, but by circumstance? The "finer races" might view them as monsters, and push them away, giving the monstrous character reason to want to prove that monstrous races aren't pure evil, but are just misunderstood.
Most of the time, though, people just want to be the asshole who thinks of themselves as "Billy Badass", sitting in the corner of the tavern like Aragorn with their hood up, and the only light on their face coming from the burning embers of their pipe-weed. But, they often forget that Aragorn, very quickly, shed that "loner" personality type and donned the protector/leader role. I encounter other players like this all the time. As a fellow player, I make it a point to mess with them whenever I can. If they don't want interaction, I'll make them interact by doing things like challenging them to drinking competitions, or arm wrestling. If they refuse to participate in the story, my character might taunt their character for "being afraid". I do what I can to hook that other player into joining the group that they wanted to join, but for some reason doesn't want their player to join.
A group of friends and I are setting up for our first(ish) game, our GM has played multiple times but everyone else is a newbie. One of my friends is playing a tiefling ranger and was going for the more loner type I had been setting up my own character (gnome druid) and went, “huh, our classes seem to bounce off of each other well” and we ended up building a backstory together. Where his character was escaping a mob after escaping a hellish land, for my little gnome to help him, teaching him about the landscape etc. My character lived on the way outskirts of a village and never really interacted with other humanoids besides the ones in her circle. My gnome is the adventurer, enthusiast and eager after building the trust with the tiefling, dragged him off to the adventure. As the start of the campaign my character will be the reason for him being in the party, but the hope/plan is as he trust the party more he will be less of the loner type. Not sure how things will go, but I can’t wait to find out when we start next month!
The loner can be interesting if done right. Granted a rouge who refuses to help and goes to do his own thing isn't ideal. But a fighter who has trust issues due to his past, and is actively dealing with those issues as he slowly opens up to the party can be interesting and draws story out of the fellow players.
Thanks a lot for these videos. Your videos not only helped me with my RP skills, but also helped me create more dynamic characters in a graphic novel I am writing and illustrating. I really appriciate your knowledge.
Only a pleasure! Glad you have been enjoying them. Let us know when your graphic novel comes out so we can check it out. Hope you keep watching and sharing :)
I took your mention of the loner architype as a challenge, what I came up with is someone from a far land who is the rightful hair, but as such a position attracts assasins and the fact that they would find the position a pain due to all the beuracracy they decided to leave someone else in charge of the region in their stead, this leads to the mentality where they do not trust many people, nor do they reveal their identity, they join the first adventuring party they could find in order to conceal their identity and so that they would have people who could defend them from any would-be assailents.
Despite this fact they tend to go against their better judgement and sense of self-preservation if someone needs help.
+doombybbr Now this is an excellent response to that challenge. Because look at all the work you've put into making the character NOT a loner, even though they are. You have given the character a NEED to work with other people - they have to appear to be part of the party because otherwise assassins will find them. So 10 points to you, and I'd love this character at my table any day :)
+doombybbr The last loner archtype I played was very much like what was laid out, he was a prince that was being hunted by his brother. He joined the adventuring party to have people around him to help protect him and to help conceal him. When he first joined he did not trust anyone, was silent and aloof. Slowly, he transformed into a different archtype. As he got to know the other members of the party and learned that he could trust them. He went from loner to probably closer to leader (was a prince after all)! But was really a bit more reserved than that as he was still in hiding.
That's be an absolutely thrill to be in one of your adventures. You make me thrist to play.
I would say that Caleb Widogast from Critical Role is a “Loner” character. He is self-sufficient with his own goals in the best way possible, thoughtful in both his intellect and creative magical solutions as well as in how he cares for his teammates
Thank you so much for these videos, I've been experiencing a lot of struggle with my background and fleshing out my character. As I had just 7 days to make my costume, which was a faun, I left the background to a friend of mine,for we were connected. However I realised quickly that I had no idea what my character was like. Luckily, no one asked me about my past, so I was about to change almost everything, and flesh her out some more. Thank you so so much!
that moment when you're juggling having to be the leader, the soul, the adventurer, and the protector all at the same time.
This gives great insight for GM's aswell! I'll be bringing your GREATPC videos to the table when we launch our next campaign and make new characters.
+kainan613 That's great feedback, thank you! Let us know how it goes?
Great video's and really helpful to improve as a player. Hope to see more of this in the future
+Unmei No Niji Glad to hear it, and there are many more on the way!
wonderful job my friend! My boyfriend and I are just getting into tabletop roleplaying games and we are watching your series. Thank you for putting this together!
Only a pleasure and that's great that you both are getting into tabletop RPGs :) Let us know how your games go? Love seeing our community grow. Welcome to the table and thanks for commenting.
I don't think the loner is particularly antithetical to group work. I'm a loner but it's not as if I'm unable to work in a group or towards a goal, although perhaps I'm reading 'loner' as 'introvert'. A loner can definitely work, but the times when they choose to be alone are important - wishing to constantly be alone or do everything alone is a sign of bad play but as a nuance to a character it can be well done.
Absolutely agree with you. It's about finding times when it works in character and within the party to be alone, however a lot of players play the loner as someone who doesn't engage and does everything alone.
In one of my first games, I played a Protector who tried to be a Leader to an Adventurer who was waaay smarter than he was... He ended up finding himself on the sharp end of a spear half way through the first campaign while the Adventurer got to live the tale.
I play a loner drow rogue in a pathfinder game, but I always try to bring the party to my plans, trying to convince them to help me as well as I help them. As I see it, you can totally do a loner, provided you have a good reason to be in the party. In my case, my drow have a severe fear of his clan coming to get him, so he needs as many allies as possible to survive.
My current character, a barbarian-rogue, is a loner, but he's not the loner. He's a loner but he's actually the conscience type because he's caring and is willing to help people and be a team player.
Though usually done the unhelpful way, the Loner be made to work wonderfully if played as very task-oriented and professional. Think of them as being here to get the job done, not make friends (though they should quickly come to find the party advantageous to that end and maintain a working relationship with them) -- and mixing their style a bit with the Solver or the Dependable. They never AVOID teamwork, but might prefer to work more on the fringes of the group as a scout or a flank guard or what have you.
Finding a good balance can be rather tricky, so I'd recommend this one more for veterans than for the new players who are often ironically the ones who want to play the Loner. One of those "learn the rules before you learn to break them" sorts of things.
Lol I didn't see you had a video specifically about loners that makes most of these points!
Having so much fun watching these. Giving me some seriously fun ideas. Keep it up GM! Loving it!
Glad to hear it and will do our best to keep it up :)
in our first game we had a loner character in our party and after realizing that he wouldn't talk about himself or his past or his goals and seeing him wander around by himself again and again the others just accepted him and didn't even ask for his opinion or anything anymore. they were not against him being there but he was ignored a lot and not really helped with anything because he never did anything with or for them either. sadly tho, he died shortly after and is now somewhat of a meme in our group.
I had a loner character that was a rouge that was quite distent from the party at first it took him a few sessions to warm up to one of the characters and only after he revealed his secret (he was a tifling hiding with bandages and robes) he often went of to scout and information gather with the occasional help of his new sorcerer friend and his invisibility spell
I was playing a dwarven volcano druid who based on this video was an artist. Arrive in the main city, my dwarf goes looking for a deli. There's a meeting in a tavern, eat some pie at the bar. The party is breaking up to do individual things in the city, goes back to the deli.
I know you detest the loner type in RPG games but what if your loner character as part of their back story is a loner because of some great tragedy that happened and thus he does not like being around other beings for fear of that tragedy repeating itself and he takes part in this quest to try and find himself again and maybe even trust others again. I feel that type of loner would be ideal for an RPG game.
You are talking there about a premeditated journey that the loner goes on which will ultimately shift them from loner to something else. That I am perfectly OK with. It's the loner who remains so that I have an issue with!
that is totally understandable if someone is going to remain a loner without any kind of character growth then why are they playing in a group. also real quick I would like to say thank you for your videos being new to table top pen and paper RPG'S videos like this are a godsend to me when it comes to character creation.
Had a character end up a loner, she wasn't meant to be, but the rest of the party immediately alienated her by doing really stupid crap. Every time she's gone 'maybe I can trust them' they've done something stupid again. Still really working on bringing her into the group, sending her on a side quest, bringing in a guest character, then bringing her back. I hope it works
I'm currently playing a loner type but he works with the party, he needs the party. Hes been a loner for so long but now he realizes he needs a party to help him complete his goals. In exchange he has offered his aid to each party member as a thank you for assisting him. Would that be a functional Loner?
I once played a pseudo Loner where I played this Rat Bastard of a dwarf who did not care about morals or the other people in his group all he wants to do is get rich and get shiny loot. So he was a scheming untrustworthy bastard but he would see things through to the end and get the most profit for himself and others. He was tolerated because while he could manipulate his fellow adventurers he would also manipulate the NPCs as well. He also had all the contacts with the criminal underclasses. So while like you my GM hated loaners he found it interesting how the other players interacted with me. On the one hand I am a usefull member of the team with many good skill and contacts. But on the other hand they did not trust my lying ass one bit.
after having watched this as well as most of the detailed descriptions I just feel compelled to make this comment. I don't know if anyone here has read the book series calles "animorphs" they are amazing btw, but the characters follow these character types so closely, they are a perfect character study really. So here is my quick Which animorph is which charactertype and how do they give it and interesting egde?
So obviously (to anyone knowing the series that is) Jake is the leader, interestingly he never wanted to be the leader, he was not captain of a sportsteam or anything, it's just that evweryone decided he should be the leader so he figured someone had to do it. This ofcourse led to some interesting inner conflict, character growth as well as, to some degree, loss of moral values over time. Also he had to tackle heavy conscious questions, would he risk losing the whole team to maybe save one? Ofcourse everyone would hate him if he just let's one team member dye like that... besides him hating himself
Cassie is the conscious but also partly ambassedor. She has strict moral values but over the cause of a war she has to permanently rethink her values, is it Ok to sacrifice a few thousands to rescue millions? It is ok to orph sentien beings against their will? Were does sentients even beginn? At points she feels like she has to quit but always returns because she feels she has this duty, she, through he conscience alone even managed to befriend an enemy and make that enemy an ally, soemthing no one else could have done, and not because of strategic planning but because she wanted to believe. I really loved that character XD
Marco is the solver, he asks the right questions and often knows how to get to the answer. Then he will make a plan, the most efficient plan he can see and he can be very ruthless in that planning. Once he sees the solution of how to get from A to B he has to persue it. But he keeps getting in personal conflict, has to see in how far emotions get in the way, or inhow far is plans kill off his emotions because of everysthing he is willing to sacrifice to get to the result.
Rachel is the soul. She develops a passion for the fight. sure she fights for the cause, but she loves the danger, she lives in the thrill of the fight, fior her it becomes a way of live that she can't get free of. But this almost destroys her, makes it impossible for her to even fathom a normal life anymore. She becomes so enthralled in fighting that she borders insane.
Now the two most difficult characters to clearly put in thiese categories for me are Tobias and Ax....
I would say Tobias is a Loner Type,, but with the want to company he just doesn't really know how to do that and becoming a hawk clearly doesn't help. but in the end he is a teamplayer... so in theend I rather tend to dependable. He will do anything for the group, he scouts, he puts himself in danger, he would theoratically sacrifice his life for the cause. so yeah I go with dependable
Ax could also be a dependable... but I'd guess I would rather go with Protector. He swears his loyalty to a prince as well as a cause, the fight against the Yeerks. But his loyalty is tested time and time again, the loyalty to his people, to the war even to his human friends, and he has to dicide what he values most and how far he would go. This means sometimes going direktly against orders since his cause is his highest priority, higher than his loyalty to any person which does some harm in the end.
yeah if there are any animorph lovers out there I would like to know if you agree or disagree and maybe like my comment ;)
btw sorry for the bad writing... I hope it's decipharable ^^
In a oneshot I played a survivor with survivor's guilt. He was in the corner of the bar drinking alone. The other characters met up quickly and proceeded to ignore my character. Occasionally I asked the DM if my character noticed anything unusual, to which the DM said "nope". I'd send my character to the bar to get more drink or outside to relieve himself to purposely cross paths with the other PCs. They ignored the weirdly shaped completely hidden robed figure sulking around the tavern. It was very boring spending half the game being effectively an NPC.
I can't say I have much experience playing with them, but I imagine a loner can work as long as he/she has an arc. Maybe we have a character with ye olde tragic backstory who needs to learn to trust people again, perhaps they're street urchin who has to learn what trust is in the first place, or it might just be that they're a bit shy. The descriptor "doesn't work well with others" should always be followed by "yet."
yea, im going to playing my first ever campaign, and i did roll with a loner/hermit background. I wanted that general idea that since my character had been ostracized by society, that he remained alone to avoid being hurt again, is generally traumatized by things that happened. in the event of meeting up with the main party that he would join them as a last resort for his goals, but slowly open up to them little by little. I'd picture him as a dependable loner, that he doesn't participate in normal social situations but has his newfound family's backs.
Another great video. These videos have been a huge help. Thank you.
+Ranar999 Only a pleasure! :)
Yeah, I rewatch each of these videos each time I make a character.
It sounds like there could be a lot of overlap like the protector becoming the conscience when the party decides to go off on a particularly dangerous quest by making sure that everyone has their gear in good condition and their potions and what-not all lined up and ready to go.
The embassador, aka you were the only party member that didn't dump charisma so now you're the face of the party
When I think about the loner I see a hermit or an out-lander who has had a difficult life, they don't necessarily know how to properly interact with others effectively, or they have been hurt badly by someone else. The idea for a character like this would be for them to find a way to deal with and over come those problems and find a way to at least intact well with the party.
My character is both an adventurer AND a Protector, but only of nature (ESPECIALLY oceans). If the ecosystem is threatened, the become a protector.
I justified this, by having the character have the entertainer’s characteristic “my mind or mood can change as quickly as the key in a song”
Not going to lie. The idea of a GM catering to my own sense of direction in a game sounds amazing.
I guess, honestly, I would be a Problem Solver by your standards. More often than not the problems I'm solving come from the other party members fucking around excessively. Once I have an objective, though, I tend to go after it with both barrels. Distressingly often this means separating from the party to "fix" things behind the scenes.
Other party members can be problematic lol Sometimes you need to find the way to play within the party to solve those problems however lest your character gets left out of the main adventure, so just keep an eye on that.
If only my GMs would allow me to apply "permanent" problem solving to my "teammates". I've had some daffy fucking co-players.
For your pleasure, I hope, is a short story of mine. We had taken on a dungeon and came to the major puzzle at the end, just before the boss. We had the boss's door and a little plaque above it with some designs in a certain order. Down the hall were four rooms, each with a little design above the door. Each room had its own challenge and a switch. We were warned that throwing the switches in the correct order would open the door to the boss. Doing so in the wrong order would reset all of the rooms.
My buddy faced down the first room challenge. It was a demon thing in lizard person form. It was, in fact, the daughter to the NPC that was guiding us, except evil and edgy n's shit. My buddy was playing a Paladin so he handled it in his own way. Everybody got mad at me after he killed her because I wanted to skin her and make a new scabbard. There was a fist fight. After that, the Paladin never challenged me to a fist fight again but I didn't get my new scabbard either.
Next room was empty. Kind of boring but oh-well.
Third room had a giant scorpion. I cut one of its arms off, did over half its total HP in damage and gave it a heart attack. One-shot kill. I was pretty stoked. The Paladin was upset because he didn't get to hit it. After that he and I chilled out in that room and let the other party members handle the last one on their own. We had been doing all of the real work up to that point.
Five players - FIVE PLAYERS (yes, it was a crowded game) - ended up getting their asses kicked by three Halfling berserker NPCs. Once that resolved itself (the dragon cleric made a phenomenally lucky roll) the players then spent the next hour trying to figure out what to do next. When they explored the idea of back-tracking I lost my cool and got the GM's attention.
I asked him if I could make a memory check on the plaque above the boss's door. I passed. I asked for a logic check of some sort to find any correlation between the plaque and the carvings above each door. I passed. From there I was able to discern an order. I went through each room and flipped the switches in order (losing my other ear in the process to a booby trap in the empty room) then walked in on them as they were bickering and flipped the last switch. The boss's door opened. Without another word, I walked in on him, pulled my throwing axe and hurled it at his face as hard as I could.
My God, the story doesn't end here. The Paladin came out of nowhere and knocked the axe out of the air then began to chide me on attacking before asking question. I inquired as to what team he was on then we both got hit by lightning from the boss, who took his turn to chide both of us on not being able to recognize evil when we saw it. So I stepped to the side and let my teammates get their asses kicked for a little while, took the time to figure out his special moves and gimmicks, then came back in to finish the job once I figured out what his weakness was.
It was kind of difficult to kill the guy on a moral sense, though. He possessed the Paladin, threw everybody in to a pile and threatened to pin them to the floor with his great sword. I was all for seeing that happen at this point.
Not to say I've had all wins. I once tricked a Drow High Priestess to let me teleport her to our camp so we could capture and interrogate her. Almost caused a full party wipe. Apparently Drow society is a matriarchal meritocracy. Who knew.
The ambassador is SO me! And even kind of how I play sometimes too x3 Depends on the character
Great vid, the only thing I disagree with is about the loner. If the Loner works with the GM it can be a very interesting character for group dynamics and his background could be intertwined with the campaign, don't hate loners. It is a valid archetype to play and characters evolve and grow. The adventurer may get almost killed by a treasure chest trap and start being less so and the loner may have his ass saved by the group and be grateful choosing then to help first and then go after his goal, for example.
Very good timing! I just spent a session as a wallflower and I wanted to find ways to have fun.
+TreasureFox Well I hope this helps, and feel free to ask more questions! Also please let us know how it goes in your next session? We happy to help!
I'll let you know! It'll be in two weeks.
My character Tacious is definitely an Adventurer :) it's fun to annoy the party by just doing things without thinking about consequences. I absolutely understand why, it's pretty dangerous, BUT it keeps the party going.
Thank you so much for making these videos me and my brothers are haveung olds more fun in dnd because of these videos
Currently playing with an Adventurous Loner... Geez, the amount of times I've had to hint to him that doing something alone may not be the best course of action. He once tried to solo (he was level 1, mind you) a Rhino, meant to prevent the party from going back. Needless to say, he got knocked out before long...
Keep in mind he has a video on how to play a loner.
That said I think it would be intuitive for a loaner to be the one to draw the party together after failing on his own 'I need muscle, oh, I can't convince them, I need a convince, I can't keep talking I need a leader' and with that you can write a narrative of a loner and a silver and probably a concious getting some muscle and a leader, that's a full party and everyone gets their character goals worked out.
I think my next character is going to have multi personality disorder. Every time I finish a long rest I will pick a random card out of a pile I make and follow that personality for the day. Each personality will remember important information when needed, but not exactly what the last personality did. Also, each personality doesn’t know that the others exist and wonders why they did certain actions. I personally think it will be interesting not knowing what actions I will take until I know what my personality will be, or even having large regrets about past actions that I did without a second thought at the time.
these are great videos thank you
I am in 2 campaigns with a group of friends and it’s my first time playing. I have one character who is the adventurer and one who is the protector and it’s kind of fun playing the two different sides xD
The loner is certainly a complicated character to do right in D&D. Let’s say your loner is a mercenary type, like my lizardfolk and my Dragonborn, who both have their own goals and aren’t joining a party for the group, but for themselves. Why are they joining a group? Because it’s easier to do bigger jobs with better rewards if you’ve got other people with you. They are looking at the party as a means to be greater, not as friends or comrades. He will protect a party member because it benefits his goals to have the help. He is still disconnected socially, and has the potential to stop being like that, but he has a reason to stay with the party.
I feel like no character is exclusively any one of these qualifiers. For instance, the character I'm playing now is largely a Loner -- I know, it's sad, but listen. He's not just a Loner, because even if he'd rather doing things by his own power, he recognises he can't do everything by himself. He enjoys working with the party, but simply because it's effective. He is self sufficient, to a point, which is what makes him prefer to not work with the party. But he's also not an idiot, and knows he is much more effective when he has his allies by his side.
I've been finding at least 1 thing in every video that I haven't considered
The trick with the Loner is to be a bit introverted, or shy, or perhaps likes to observe and analyze people more than converse with them. It's perfectly fine to be a little detached, so long as you're doing it in a way that's conducive to the story, or constructive to the group play.
But don't be Tony Stark or Batman. Nobody like to have a Batman on their team, and we have more pressing issues to deal with than your character's ego and daddy issues.
Robin liked batman on his team
I'm currently playing a campaign and I think my character is a mix of the conscious and the ambassador, though she doesn't really have much of a leader to run things by either at the moment so she just tries to keep the party together, we don't have much of a leader I think mostly because we just finished session 2 recently, so hoping to see if we end up having a leader..
Characters can be aloof without that being a problem. You wouldn't expect a Grey Elf to drink and sing with the others when it's time to feast. Maybe she would make a speech at the beginning expressing gratitude and valuing camaraderie between the Elder People and the lesser races and then would excuse herself to her quarters. She still depends on the group, she's still willing to pursue the same objectives as they are, but she's a freaking Grey Elf, and should act like one, right?
"The solver" is my burden. Everybody expects me to play that role even if I don't want to...
"The adventurer" sounds more like a character trait I inherited from my mum. I'm a completionist. You may have played with someone who was like that. "Being upbeat" is just one of the strategies used by competionists in RPG sessions to get others to help them fulfil their obsession.
"The ambassador"! I wish I had one of those in any of the three campaigns I'm playing. That's a very nice role to have around. I wonder what D&D class would best fit this. Maybe a wizard or a monk or perhaps a knowledge bard.
I've made quite a few loners, but I compensate for the apparent flaw by putting in their story that they don't really *want* to be alone. Something in their past typically drives them to be a loner type, but at the same time they long for companionship and are perfectly capable of being loyal to those that are loyal to them. As a result "loner" became more a back story trait while "the soul" (mentioned in part 1 of this) or "the adventurer" might be more accurate to how they would actually interact with the party.
I wouldn't say loners should "fuck off," necessarily, they just need to be sure their "loner" status doesn't interfere with the game. It should simply be a character type that is used to enhance the game or as the character's history as opposed to becoming the focus of that character's role entirely. Just my opinion. I think the main problem isn't the loner type itself, but the fact that many people do it wrong.
i am often a mix of the conscience and the solver. weird combo i know but i really like making combo characters
Dm: "you come across an intricate ring sitting covered in dust on a dias"
Gnome illusionist who is on the verge of being con-killed: I PUT IT ON!
I am so a protector lol I likes it
One of the Loners I did dream up was for D&D, which was (WARNING: ULTRA GENERIC AND TOTALLY UNORIGINAL CHARACTER COMBINATION) a Tiefling Warlock who was rather dark, lonely and aloof. He was anti-Social, spiteful and vindictive. Now, that would be normally bad, but I looked at the whole Tiefling lore of being hated and outcast by everyone and everything. So I went: "Hmmm, what about a character that has sort of been brought up with that hatred and ostracized, and just can't be around people because he doesn't know HOW to be around people except to return everything with silence and hostility?"
Now, I haven't played this character for D&D yet, but that's the basic premise. I hope to slowly bring him out of the shell and teach him social skills.
What about a loner who is still somewhat sociable but just keeps people at a “safe distance”? I’m planning on playing a rogue like this where he is decently charismatic and could conceivably be the face of the party if no one else steps up; it’s just that his first and best friend got hurt because of him so he is paranoid about having real friends. I don’t want to go full-loner; my favorite part about dnd is the inter party relationships. I just think for a while he is going to hold back on letting these people be his true friends.
I have "Loner" I guess, well he is more the stay at base and do the research and has the other players help him. Though he does come on quests from time to time.
How would yall make a good loner character? I like the idea of a self-sufficient person who doesn't feel the need to be with others for social reasons, only for pragmatic reasons, but I don't know if that would make a good RP character
I wasn't identifying with any of the character types until the Adventurer came up 😂
I love your videos man, they're so well done! :D Also the way you talk is just great (although the accent is doing my head in, i cant figure out what it is. Sounds south african with some english and australian in it)
And your opinion of the loner is 100% correct. I had someone in one of my games refuse to talk to my character even when my character spoke to theirs because their character was a 'loner', just why bother playing?!
+Kurt Miller Thanks Kurt. For the record I'm 100% South Africa, but born in a part of South Africa called the last outpost of England and raised by very British parents. The Ozzie twang is perhaps because I tend to use that accent to emphasize certain words as it's a great accent for emphasis.
I have a anti loner half-orc forced to work in the circus (whitch is based in a regien were half-orcs are oddities)after his parents may have been killed he was isolated in the circus so he never had any real friends or family he now after escaping the circus just wants two things 1.to belong to a group of people 2. to be treated as a person by the public
omg the first one was my friend whole heartedly
I have a character who seems to be a loner type. We rolled for completely random backgrounds and her's is wrought with betrayal and revenge so I've played her as rightfully mistrustful. Although I know at her core she's more of the "Protector" type. she's driven by a desire for justice (it was even in her background) and to keep others safe... she just struggles to trust people and make lasting relations. So far the struggle to get her attached and integrated has created some funny problems but I hope I havent upset anyone in my group for it x(
My character was a bastard born half elf in a world where elves are caught and sold into slavery. Although she was raised with her human relatives, after her mother died her grandparents clipped her ears to try and hide her half bred status. She's driven by a strong sense of justice and great love for the elf race. But due to her treatment by her family she grew up suspicious and mistrustful of most people-mainly humans. Even betrayed her family by falling in with mercenaries and destroying their business before setting out on her own.
though I really enjoy her random backstory and how it molds her, my favorite random roll had to be that she started with a folded boat.... on a map with mostly mountains and trees.
I've really enjoyed this series and it's given me a fair bit to think about. As a GM I try to anticipate my what my players do in a given situation and also ensure the game "ticks their boxes" enjoyment-wise. An invaluable resource in understanding the players is an old book by Robin Laws called Robin's Laws (clever, huh?). In this book he describes the various player types and what rules system/scenarios they would like. You've gone beyond that and I need to figure out if any of your categories match my players. (They generally play the same character no matter their stats etc.)
I have one question though. Are the roles mutually exclusive? I can imagine an instance where a dwarf fighter who is also an Adventurer, want to explore further, but in the right situation The Protector if a dwarf colony is being attacked by an Orc Warband.
+Andy Simmons I shall look out for that book! Look these types are drawn directly from a system used by corporates the world over - Ennegrams. I just applied them to character creation :) And no they are not mutually exclusive. They often overlap - typically one has One dominate and then two minor which become dominate under stress or intimate encounters. An adventurer type when faced with certain death of the party may become a staunch protector, or ambassador. But their fall back once the threat is gone will be to push on type of thing. Not sure if that helps?
Yes, thank you. I'll have to look into Ennegrams. Speaking as a player, not s GM, I'be found this series very useful. I'll certainly be applying these ideas to future characters. (And speaking as a GM, they'll be useful for NPCs too.)
Glad you like them :)
What about the tweeners, say a Protector with loner tendencies. Like I played a right nasty assassin usually who ends up close to their party, but when someone needs to do the horrible things, the bad things that would weigh on the soul, that is me, because I love my wacky dysfunctional crew. So I go on my own to eliminate the threat that the party can't(evil but well loved nobleman for example.)
while the loners are a difficult character, if done right, a loner can be turned around. Only IF the player is willing to adjust his character as well.
Imagine the party being poisoned by the enemy and abducted--for lore dump purposes. And the loner, being aloof, realizes his newfound friends are missing, and thus tracks them down, and helping them escape. --then, that's gonna be the perfect time for them to actually interact and connect with the party. become that one guy who is rarely around but is extremely loyal to the party.
I feel that loners are a good source of theatric drama. Meaning they would start as closed off and aloof, but start to open up to others in the role playing conversations or dramatic arguments
what about a loner that becomes less of a loner, learning how to fit in the group to eventually reach his goals, learning to care about them
JUST only now realized this is straight up the enneagram
My group has no leader, we have a solver/ambassador mix and a solver/protector mix that both help make decisions for the party.