Zen 5 Leaks Are Crazy!
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- Опубліковано 5 вер 2024
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They can't launch X3D at the same time. It's stupid to expect that they can. The normal Zen 5 die is a component in the manufacture of X3D parts. It takes time to manufacture a sufficient supply of dies to go to market, and it takes time to package a sufficient number of stacked dies to go to market with X3D. If they waited until the latter were ready, they'd be sitting on a pile of normal Zen 5 dies that would otherwise be perfectly sellable right now. It's downright asinine to expect them to do that.
Can care less. The industry is so greedy that a 4 year old video cards (RX 6000 series). IS still being sold new on newegg.
You are CPU-bound and you dont even know it! 1080p know! Why dont you know?!
If you have a decent cpu within the last 5 years and you are mainly just gaming, I don't think any cpu from either company matters anymore!
Everyone should just calm down with the FOMO on everything, Do you really need it?
If you are still on a quad core from 2015 then yeah it's probably the right time to upgrade entire platform, But if you already have an 8 core within the past 5 years or less, Forget it.
Not true. Bought an 1800X as a stopgap when I moved to AM4. Bad IPC, can't OC like older Intel, ended up getting a 5600X instead of a 5800X3D just to be rid of it because it's slower than a 6th Gen i7 with a decent over clock.
@@Gen0cidePTB The 1800x was released 7 years ago
The opposite is true, GPUs are outpacing CPUs at 1080p and 1440p
@@zooteddd And was top of the range then, so it should compare well to a midrange 5 year old CPU
@@Gen0cidePTBThat's not how that works, that's not how that has ever worked on am4.
All of amds skus have basically been the same in gaming performance, no matter if it's 6 cores baseline or the top of the line 8 core.
As soon as you step up the generation however, you instantly see an improvement.
Hence why even the 2600 was noticeably better than the 1800x.
The "5 year old" rule checks out imo, since that's when Ryzen 3000 came out. And if you play at 1440p and own anything lower than an rtx 4080, you don't really need a better CPU in most scenarios.
I am at a point where i just wait to see how much more expensive next releases are going to be both CPU and GPU
To me the bigger issue with the X3D variant is that the Vcache is only on half of it. I realize they're trying to give people the best of both worlds for people who want higher clock speed cores for non gaming tasks and vcache for gaming but it's not working for gaming. You end up having to disable half the cores so you're effectively getting a 6 or 8 core CPU when you paid for a 12 or 16 core CPU when you're gaming. Put the vcache on all of it. If I care more about clock speed for productivity I'll get the non vcache variant and it'll be fine for gaming as well. If I care more about gaming I'll get the vcache variant and get vcache on all 16 cores for max gaming performance, and productivity will be fine (not as fast as the non vcache version but I if I got the vcache version I care more about the gaming performance.) If their scheduling/core parking stuff worked flawlessly then it might not be a big deal but it doesn't, and I suspect it never will.
It's not about putting the V-Cache on half or not. It's about the fact that connecting the V-Cache to two CCXs as you suggest would mean you would get half the bandwidth at most as the bus width now has to be split. You would get the same CCD to CCD latency issues you have with the cores themselves too, and your end result would be worse performance than if you just disabled the cores. This is even worse because V Cache internal latency is worse than RAM (it's much closer to the die but it's more like HBM and GDDR in that it has worse latency than DDR and therefore cache) so you would have lag spikes every time a CCX needed to access the other CCXs V Cache.
And, at least without a new version of windows there's no way to stop a thread from requesting data like that so the chip would go out to the public like that.
AMD like to push the boundaries but what most of us don't know is that they made lots of CPU things back in the day that windows refused to support. Phenoms could clock down to 160mhz and individually turn off cores but their power saving tech was never implemented into windows. That's 10 years before Intel did it with their Core designs.
@@Gen0cidePTB I'm not disputing any of that, but none of that is the customer's problem. AMD needs to figure out how to get Vcache to work effectively on both sides or stop selling the x900X3D and x950X3D IMO. The x800X3D is a great product. Maybe that should be the only X3D variant until they figure it out. Whether that requires a design change on AMD's part or a software change by Microsoft, again that's not the customer's problem. That's something AMD needs to figure out.
AMD and nvidia always overprice their products at launch. There's no negative for them. There's always that small group of people who will buy the newest thing at launch regardless of price. They can always drop the price later and people eventually end up buying it anyways.
Yes, all desktop chips AMD sells come from the bins of Server and Laptop. It has always been this way for Ryzen. The X3D dies were always intended for Epyc 1st and the gaming boost for Desktop is a happy side-effect. They just make the vanilla dies first so they get released 1st. There is still even a binning process to be done to package those with X3D that has to take place. This is why AM4 is still getting releases this far down the line, because the unused and likely subpar dies from the other segments still have a place to get sold. The same formula will work to benefit the life-span of AM5.
How you want them to do it, makes no sense. It's the best way for them to do it because they will never be able to make as much segment dedicated silicon as Intel.
This is not true. Bad EPYC chip's become Threadripper. Ryzen is a separate smaller die. CCXs move between them but the substrate and interposer for Ryzen and EPYC are incompatible.
@@Gen0cidePTB The CCD are exactly the same between the 3, the io die is what's different between them, along with the different packaging. The same thing is done with mobile APU die that get packaged for desktop.
As far as how fast zen5 will be in gaming, i think the non x3d versions will be about as fast as the zen4 x3d. With the x3d varients being ~15-20% faster
If you watched the video you would have seen that that is what he said.
@@randysalsman6992 cool
@@randysalsman6992 cool
@@randysalsman6992 neat
waiting to see how cpu mining will affect the pricing...
I saw an article claiming 50% increase. Im calling all kinds of Bullshlt on that. Maybe in like 1 application but, 50% across the board sounds like a Pipe Dream.
Depends on the game 100%.
@@BlackJesus8463 It doesn't. At games Zen 5 will be 15-20% faster as Paul said... in certain applications zen 5 will reach 40-50%.
The reason for waiting on v chach variants maybe they have to be binning enough of them before they can sell them.
I on AM5 B650 + R6 7600 + 32G upgrade cost me 10$ over for what I sold AM4 mainly due I buy broken mainboard and needed fix it. For next upgrade I waiting for zen6.
They can keep clock speeds and core counts but now they should keep improving chiplets design in terms of core to core latency and single-core IPC. Presumably everybody will be happy with these developments.
Core latency is the single biggest thing they need to focus on - there are of course patents and rumours that they're working on 3D-stacking pretty much everything, like a sandwich - so the IO-die will essentially be an interposer-die, if you like. The IO-Die is the big performance-killer for AMD right now, it's holding back their RAM-speeds quite a bit. (will be interesting to see what happens to Intel's ram-speed when they go MCM next architecture btw - I'm thinking there's a distinct possibility that they'll lose quite a bit of RAM-speed as a result of MCM-ing it)
Got a 7800x3d last year. Wont upgrade until the last AM5 cpu is out +1 year when theyre sellling it for cheap.
If the Chinese ban really happens, I don't see how prices won't be high. Both AMD and Intel will pass those sales losses onto western pricing.
Great reaction
I hope they fix the leakages by the time they're out so we can play without worry.
What leakages do you mean? Are there rumours that Ryzen 9000 has issues with electrical leakage on the transistor-level? Or do you just mean leaks about the products?
@@predabot__6778 Zen 5 leaks are crazy!
its 4nm chip so down from 6 nm you could expect atleast 20% increase if they completely didnt fck it up
I think people are saying no v-cache at launch because they are playing on "historic" mentality. The 5000 series came out. Then way later the 5800x3d launched. The 7700x came out and months later the 7800x3d came out. So TWICE they have sold the x3d AFTER the initial offering. BUT, sales for the 7000 series vs x3d models, they saw that everyone waited for v-cache. they had higher sales for the x3d than non.... the 7700x never sold out, not at microcenter, not at bestbuy, not at amazon. However the 7800x3d sold out at all 3 businesses. clearly x3d is what people want. and AMD should know this, and adjust. so while in history its been normal then x3d, it should now be x3d out the gate. its the smartest move, especially when motherboard venders need to make money too. by the time the x3d came out, motherboard prices dropped significantly. so they didn't profit like they usually did from early adopters. x3d initial release means motherboard manufacturers can drop new motherboards and get that price premium from those that want the best.... it just makes sense business wise.
my 7800x3d shits on intel for gaming. my fps i always high as hell. and im a 3440x1440 OLED gamer (alienware first gen qd-oled aka 175hz at 8bit color 144hz at 10bit color). only like 1 or 2 games where I don't get higher fps than my buddy's 7900x because it prefers higher clocks not higher cache, no big deal. most games love cache especially older games which are single core design and cache buffs that single core by huge amounts.
3D V cache should be the standard now and without it should be the cheaper CPUs for people who don't need it.
I just feel like the pricing people at AMD are stupid it's going to be at least until 2025 before we get the 9800X3D. It's the exact same problem they have when it comes to Nvidia, they could have crushed the 4080S if they dropped the price of the 7900 XTX to $800 but they didn't drop the price until recently and only by $100 for the crappiest partner cards and allowed Nvidia to once again dominate them. Why would you seriously buy a 7900 XTX over a 4080S for the same price, it makes no sense.
Why would an 8 core zen5 need 60 watt more to get a 200mhz uplift on a side note i think there is a high end rdna 4 card that might have a 120cu on it only 1 person said there was no high end rdn4 card and every one jumped on it but the same person was wrong about rdn3 its clock speeds and performance AMD have never said there is no high end rdna4 card so we shall wait and see.
Wow haven't watched this channel in about two years 🐖😂
Lol
If you're just a gamer you don't need more than 8 cores it's pointless for them to up the core count. 16 cores are already overkill just for gaming.
Adding more cores would result in more heat. Good IPC uplift > having more cores.
I agree with the Best Price Day 1 (But it will never happen) - have the Positive Press to go with it - instead of the usual way they launch with silly prices then just drop them - but that is just playing the market & same with any product, be it Games, GPU's, Phones, Cars etc... - Launch high and your ("Have to have it first" Fools) buy them - drop the price and your wallet watching customers start to buy - then rock bottom (Just before new chips launch) that's when I will be buying now as I'm tight as * * * * 🤣🤣 (because the 5900X & 3080TI wiped me out 🤣🤣)
Please don't talk about IPC, to the user only the resulting performance is relevant and that depends on clock frequency. Personally I'm still not sure if a X3D Zen5 is even relevant for me. If the vanilla variant is good enough for my performance target I go with that and with more than 8 cores. In this and several other channels it sounds like gaming is the only use for cpus but this is not the case. For every X3D cpu sold to DIY customers there are sold probably hundreds or thousands of the vanilla one in this and other channels. I believe for AMD the X3D variants are not as much a cash cow as they are a marketing instrument.
Hype train is crazy
realistic i dont see more than 10%. then 3d v cache will give you your 15-18%. this is if everything goes AMD's way.
Same Clock Speed, 15% Increase, Lower Latency. Thats it.
If you have a 7800x3d , you won't need a new cpu for at least 5 years.
yes AMD need to make 10 core ccd
Listen man. Why are you so focus on number of core total. E-cores are only good for benchmark, tbh. I was so regret to praise Intel e-core as an elegant, intelligent, cost effective performance solution.
==>Very very laggy experience.
Intel 11th give a better experience than Intel 13th. Lucky me I'm using my company money, not mine, to experience E-core 😅
I want the six core x3d!
40% faster is what he claim is . If true, granted a massive pile a salt, but if it is i am all aboard. Intel are not even compettition at this point.
It won't be 40% that's a pipe dream. It'll be 20% at games and 40% at workload.
AMD always takes the piss...
Motherboard prices and features gotta get back to normal. That should go without saying. I'm with you on the performance gains for Zen5. It's gonna be a bit, but not a lot. The kicker will be how much Zen4 supply stays on the market and what its prices do.
I had a Zen1 AM4 rig and wanted to get a 3700X as an upgrade, but they stayed at $300 for years. It just wasn't worth the money to upgrade. I ended up waiting for a BIOS update and shoved a 5800X3D in it instead. That'd be like getting a 7700X now and waiting for a Zen6 "11800X3D" to come out in a few years because a 9800X/X3D was overpriced.
I automatically discount every AMD rumor I hear. At best they meet the rumor. Often they fall short. Sometimes they fall _FAR_ short like RDNA3. I think the problem is AMD are their own biggest fanboys so leaks are always dramatically optimistic.
Then you have to be concerned if it IS good, you know damn well AMD is going to overcharge for it. Zen4 was decent but came at eyewatering prices that took too long to come down. Then all you have to do is look at Threadripper pricing to know _exactly_ what they'll do if they have a dominant lead. They already proved that by charging a laughable $800 for the 5950x when it wasn't even that dominant, then got matched months later by a far cheaper 12900k.
AMD is now losing that TSMC cheat code they've taken advantage of for years now with Intel Foundry catching them, and I expect power usage to be reduced drastically with Arrow Lake. With Apple always getting first dibs on cutting edge nodes Intel will quickly be on _better_ nodes than AMD.
AMD NEEDS to drop prices with Zen5 and take full advantage of releasing first before people realize Intel is coming back hard. If they price gouge again and leave gamers hanging without an X3D variant Intel is going to steal those customers right out from under them.
When AMD became like Intel in pricing my excitement in new Ryzen CPUs have massively gone down.
When AMD became like Nvidia,,,
AMD cpu prices are good mate , what hell you on ? , rx7800x3d is $350.00 , it's faster than Intel $750 cpu in gaming , even 7950x is $550 32 core cpu .
Now compare to Intel in 2017 Intel 10 core was $2000 , $500 only got you 4core CPUs ,
Now if you trolling then go fuxk yourself.
lipstick on the sort? mb
AMD will launch before Intel sonthey won't launch all thier chips until they knw what Intel has and at what price. Also theybhave to stock pile chips to be matched with Cache for X3D.
AMD has pruce flexibility with Chiplets and but Intel does not have that.
intel is screwed unless they move to a new node, if they don't move to TSMC they are fucked, because the architecture is screwed up, and they have been losing money and every market share. I hate to say it but eventually their probably gonna only make lowin CPU's and that's it. It will cost billions of dollars to fix the node issue because they are just too far behind, the best bet if for them to move to TSMC.
revelations. mb
I wish your channel the best, but I can't watch because of the curse words. If you think about it, anybody with kids and anybody at work cannot play this video because the cursing is way too much. UA-cam's algorithm will also hold this against you, and not recommend your videos to specific demographics that are either too young or otherwise categorically a bad match for repeated cursing. Wish you the best.
Leaks 🤣😂😅
AMD will more than likely do what they did last did Release the 8800X3D for $450 and 6 months lately they will drop it to $350. Again...