This is a tremendous help to those in the fellowship devoted to combating the ever present danger of AA devolving into a cult of personality built from myths about its founders. Keeping accurate history alive which displays the human struggle of sobriety and ethical credibility among members, warts included, is pivotal to demonstrating the great thing so many people have built together in AA.
Note for A.A. Truth Seekers - In his recent "MORE HAS BEEN REVEALED" (2) presentation Bill reveals in the section "About My Mistakes" (14min 49sec) that he had "got it wrong" about ... (see above 1h21:41) when he is speaking about August 15th "Hank didn't go to meeting" and Hank drinking in August 16th and 19th - this revelation was the result of persuasive arguments by Historian John B. (NJ). The three August dates are in fact references to a "Henry Heller" a newcomer who had stopped drinking in march of 1939.
Very intriguing. Congratulations on uncovering a lost bit of history in AA. I know in early years of AA founding New York and Akron had very different views about program. Dr. Bob heavy leaning on religion and New York not so much so. Only in nominal ways. A book about that would also be fascinating and informative. Perhaps get to the bottom of this whole dislike of Bill Wilson by early members like Clarence Snyder. There still exists a certain discounting of Bill by many of the Akron-Cleaveland- Detroit, members of AA today. A detailed history of that could be informative also. Again congratulations on the fine book you've produced.
Thank you for posting this great information. I am currently listening to the audible version of your book and aside from the narrators annoying mimicking of Bill's voice, it is a wealth of information. Perhaps you should do the narration on the next production.
What I heard about Wilson, was that all he was interested in doing, was making money out of AA. He apparently authored little (if anything) in the Big Book, yet he was able to fraudulently acquire sole copyright to it, from which he became quite well off. Prior to that, in an attempt to raise funds to publish the Big Book, he created an unincorporated company and sold worthless shares in it, then kept most of the money, but AA keeps quiet about all of this. In 1956, he tried LSD, then tried to convince the AA board of trustees to endorse it as a cure for alcoholism, which it wouldn't go for. In 1963, he butted heads with the board, again, this time wanting it to give 10% of his estate's Big Book royalties to his mistress, Helen Wynn, upon his death. They at first balked , but then begrudgingly agreed. Also, around that time, there was a group of senior members who called themselves the 'Founder's Watch' committee. They would accompany Wilson to AA speaking engagements and when they saw him trying to seduce any young women there, they would intervene. This was done to avoid it scandalizing the AA name. Yeah, sounds like a really credible guy. AA doesn't deny any of these facts, but prefers to keep them all quiet. But try telling any AA member this, and they'll most claim it's all lies. And then they wonder why they're considered a cult.
All true, I'm sure- & yet the "program", along with principles of spirituality works. I like think of it as a classic case of "not letting the messenger ruin the message" 😊
@@daverychling2970 You lot sure seem given to defaulting to those platitudinous responses. Perhaps that's an indication of AA's unsophistication and it's attraction to mainly the lower classes All AA does, is simply parrot shit out of the bible, so what is its supposed profundity, there? It could just as well be described as a Sunday school for the aforementioned, lower classes. The term 'spirituality' is an ambiguous term, overused, to the point of meaninglessness. It's actually interesting, how so many of your kind so ardently that term, and that of humility, yet are anything but that, on the outside. This makes me believe that all your AA mishegoss in really used as just a politically expedient affectation.
20 years sober. Well done. The messianic narrative of Bill W's hero's journey is not the correct narrative he had a lot of help. All idols have feet of clay.
Don't be more critical of yourself I'd doest help. Infact most like free will doesn't exist not only is your experience illusion but you also probably not in charge at all ie call it spirit god ect
So, Brooklyn is three miles west of NYC? I think you're a little fucked up there, guy. How much did AA pay you, to write another hagiography about them? How about the Toronto intergroup that tried claiming religious organization status, under the Ontario Human Rights Code? AA head office must have had a little talk with them about that.
I have over 30 years sober yet, I’ve learned so much from your work. Thank You, Sir!
This is a tremendous help to those in the fellowship devoted to combating the ever present danger of AA devolving into a cult of personality built from myths about its founders. Keeping accurate history alive which displays the human struggle of sobriety and ethical credibility among members, warts included, is pivotal to demonstrating the great thing so many people have built together in AA.
Thanks - Reading The Big Book will never be the same now that I’ve seen this… God Bless You
Incidentally, I got sober in 82, 85, 91, and the last time 94. Will see what happens today! The last time I got sober, it was on a prayer!!
Note for A.A. Truth Seekers - In his recent "MORE HAS BEEN REVEALED" (2) presentation Bill reveals in the section "About My Mistakes" (14min 49sec) that he had "got it wrong" about ... (see above 1h21:41) when he is speaking about August 15th "Hank didn't go to meeting" and Hank drinking in August 16th and 19th - this revelation was the result of persuasive arguments by Historian John B. (NJ). The three August dates are in fact references to a "Henry Heller" a newcomer who had stopped drinking in march of 1939.
Very intriguing. Congratulations on uncovering a lost bit of history in AA. I know in early years of AA founding New York and Akron had very different views about program. Dr. Bob heavy leaning on religion and New York not so much so. Only in nominal ways. A book about that would also be fascinating and informative. Perhaps get to the bottom of this whole dislike of Bill Wilson by early members like Clarence Snyder. There still exists a certain discounting of Bill by many of the Akron-Cleaveland- Detroit, members of AA today. A detailed history of that could be informative also. Again congratulations on the fine book you've produced.
@Eremias Ranwolf Are you speaking of Akron based or New York?
The book you authored is excellent. Many thanks. DOS 2/15/87.
Thank you for posting this great information. I am currently listening to the audible version of your book and aside from the narrators annoying mimicking of Bill's voice, it is a wealth of information. Perhaps you should do the narration on the next production.
Fascinating. Thank you.
What I heard about Wilson, was that all he was interested in doing, was making money out of AA. He apparently authored little (if anything) in the Big Book, yet he was able to fraudulently acquire sole copyright to it, from which he became quite well off. Prior to that, in an attempt to raise funds to publish the Big Book, he created an unincorporated company and sold worthless shares in it, then kept most of the money, but AA keeps quiet about all of this.
In 1956, he tried LSD, then tried to convince the AA board of trustees to endorse it as a cure for alcoholism, which it wouldn't go for. In 1963, he butted heads with the board, again, this time wanting it to give 10% of his estate's Big Book royalties to his mistress, Helen Wynn, upon his death. They at first balked , but then begrudgingly agreed. Also, around that time, there was a group of senior members who called themselves the 'Founder's Watch' committee. They would accompany Wilson to AA speaking engagements and when they saw him trying to seduce any young women there, they would intervene. This was done to avoid it scandalizing the AA name.
Yeah, sounds like a really credible guy. AA doesn't deny any of these facts, but prefers to keep them all quiet. But try telling any AA member this, and they'll most claim it's all lies. And then they wonder why they're considered a cult.
All true, I'm sure- & yet the "program", along with principles of spirituality works. I like think of it as a classic case of "not letting the messenger ruin the message" 😊
@@daverychling2970 You lot sure seem given to defaulting to those platitudinous responses. Perhaps that's an indication of AA's unsophistication and it's attraction to mainly the lower classes All AA does, is simply parrot shit out of the bible, so what is its supposed profundity, there? It could just as well be described as a Sunday school for the aforementioned, lower classes.
The term 'spirituality' is an ambiguous term, overused, to the point of meaninglessness. It's actually interesting, how so many of your kind so ardently that term, and that of humility, yet are anything but that, on the outside. This makes me believe that all your AA mishegoss in really used as just a politically expedient affectation.
Thank you. My mom is a Parkhurst.
Thank you!
Thank you so much
Read the book. Tough getting thru this with all that clicking. My keyboard can be silenced. A voracious reader and I enjoy getting to know authors.
Do you know if Hank was ever a well driller, and if he had a grandson named Marvin?
I ran into Joe with the white extended cab at the cruise. #S10MAFIA
Amazing that the book finally happened after all that…..Mentioning Hanks contribution puts a dent in the romantic notion that it was all Bill.
20 years sober.
Well done.
The messianic narrative of Bill W's hero's journey
is not the correct narrative he had a lot of help.
All idols have feet of clay.
Atheists have some of the strongest faith I have ever seen.
Don't be more critical of yourself I'd doest help. Infact most like free will doesn't exist not only is your experience illusion but you also probably not in charge at all ie call it spirit god ect
So, Brooklyn is three miles west of NYC? I think you're a little fucked up there, guy. How much did AA pay you, to write another hagiography about them? How about the Toronto intergroup that tried claiming religious organization status, under the Ontario Human Rights Code? AA head office must have had a little talk with them about that.
Please slow down alittle.
Lol hes east coast