Drummer Reacts : Mike Portnoy - The Great Debate
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- Опубліковано 30 бер 2023
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#mikeportnoy #progressivemetal #dreamtheater
Most underrated DT song, a true masterpiece.
Underrated by who?
By people who like the Beatles among others.
@@felipemillani8468 I’d like to show you my Jpm100 p1 signed by Petrucci himself you genius.
Portnoy is not only technically proficient, he is always very musical in his approach. He adapts and compliments the song as opposed to overpowering it with technical acrobatics. As a drummer of over 30 years, myself, I hold him in the highest respect and regard.
100% agreed. He's the epitome of the balance between making something really technical but without overpowering the song. Actually that is something DT does super well in general. There's never one thing going over the top over the other, unless it's a specific solo or moment in which it's done on purpose. However, you can listen to each instrument, each line on any song and you notice that each one is playing something interesting, complex in many cases but just enough so it doesn't overpower anything. That is something i'm always trying to achieve "would a guitarist, a bassist, a drummer have FUN playing this? Would it just be mindlessly noodling?"
I would say if you think that of Portnoy, than you would love Gavin Harrison (if you haven't heard of him already)...look up his video playing White Mist
@@soocool78 I love Gavin’s playing. Been a fan of Porcupine Tree for decades. He is extremely tasteful and smooth.
I like how he compliments Petrucci’s runs.
You're spot on, Mike's ability to write "catchy" parts in the context of insanely complex songs is what makes him so special.
Still my favorite band since 1992. DT forever!
His tuning is always top-notch, he really puts in the time to get the right sound
Was bad enough when Kevin Moore left but Mike Portnoy was such a huge part of DT’s sound and style. Irreplaceable drummer
True, although i'm very surprised that Mangini is doing amazingly. The sound came in more technical and refined whereas with MP was much more groovy and raw. Each drummer makes DT sound special
he brought the feel to the songwriting, he has that chaotic energy the rest of the band is missing
I actually really, really liked the couple of years they played with Derek Sherinian after Moore left. He was my favorite DT keyboardist. A great mix between Moore's heavy, atmospheric moodiness and Rudess' soulless virtuosity IMO. Derek was the sweet spot. It was a shame he didn't stick around longer.
Irreplaceable
Well the good news is out 😁😁
Those mini toms are called octobans and MP incorporates them heavily in his playstyle!
Octabans. Awesome man thank you for the info! I don’t think I’ve ever heard that name before
@@ArturoReacts I use roto toms in a similar way
@@fieryredpodcast I love both
Tama make Octobans, Pearl make Rocket Toms -- both are long tubey drums that sound awesome! 🎉
Old forum members call them octobarns 😂
Mike's polyrhythms are insane
His work on this album is super music serving. Really supporting the dynamics in the music and lyrics. Top 3 DT for me. Super hard to play.
I‘m a guitarist myself, but I really enjoy watching Mike. He has such a playful style, there is always something new going on with intricate details all over the place.
I think that playful style comes from his strong Kieth Moon influence.
This is some Jazz Fusion Shit Goin' on right here... Tony Williams... Billy Cobham... Bernard Purdie... You know what I mean? Mike Mangini was a Professor (literally) of Percussion at the Berklee school of music for quite a few years until Dream Theater called upon him to audition for the replacement of Portnoy... How do you replace him? The only true choice was Mangini, because he understands what Portnoy was all about. The only other Drummer In the audition that was even close was Marco Minneman... The audition process is on You Tube, a 3 part series.
I would have liked to have seen Marco Minneman fill that seat. He plays with such joy and technical prowess simultaneously. He’s a super cool dude too. Saw him in a clinic then got to go to dinner with him & Chad Wackerman afterwards. Amazing memories made that day!
Dream Theater hasn't been the same since the founding member left. Mangini is good. But c'mon. We all know the heart and soul of DT is MP.
Love them both and i gotta agree, MP brought that random funny-ness and crazy fills AND those … i CANT remember what you call.. mixing a bunch of songs into one.. 😅… damn wine. Instrumedley!! 😅
you nailed it with MP. He's so much more than a technical prog drummer. It's all about his attitude, personality, tasteful parts, feel, tone and performance.
This album is amazing!
This entire album, Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence is a spiritual experience for me. So good. Mike is my favorite drummer hands down. My most recent obsession however is a band called Spock’s Beard, the album Snow. Gives me a similar vibe.
Nice, a Spock’s shout out! And now Mike with Neal in NMB, Flying Colors, and Transatlantic transcends everything.
It's drummers and songs like this that help to keep me MOTIVTED in my quest to learn the drums at nearly 60 years old. That's right l'll be 59 in June and learning to play a kit
There’s no denying that Mike Mangini is an immense talent on the drums, that much is obvious, but Portnoy just has such a flare and color to his method. It’s like he sets up his kit like an old Dutch master’s palate and proceeds to paint with all the colors and all the blended hues therein. His flourishes just make you swoon.
Should listen to the whole album Six Degrees of Inner Turbulence. Mike Portnoy is the MVP of this album accordance to the vote by DT forum and the whole album sick! You should looking on it.
Dude, Those Flams at 5:45 ish get me every time.
Welcome to DT you are in for a crazy ride. Both drummers are incredible!
So, you bumped into a greatest songs of all time from DT... I really don't like ranking stuff, best song, best album, best band... But this song had such an impact on me while listening to it on cd back in 2002 when the 6 degrees album came and I had leuchemia at that time and in the song they are talking about stem cells and doctors and scientists and raising a question on whom we should be looking upon in terms of life and death... Reacting on Mike's drumming, being under impression you said a name which gave the answer to it which is "the light" they are reffering to in the song that we should actually be turning to. This song pretenciously holds the answer to the meaning of life. Dig into some more context of DT lyrics and find out. Peace.
The "return to the beginning" comment you made was so observant. That's exactly what they did, played out the intro backwards. Really cool that you noticed on the first listen given how much there is to take in. Helps when you're focusing on the drums though 😎
There are so many great Portnoy drum cam videos. Intramedley is great!
When I was in high school, the quiet break of this tune was mind-boggling to me…”how is he playing that rhythm?!”
Then you try it once and realize he’s just alternating his right hand lol. That’s the beauty of Portnoy’s playing, though. He takes simple concepts and makes them *super* interesting.
Welcome to Portnoy's fantastic world!
Cool react, man. Congrats! 👍
@8:42 - 9:12 this is the killing part for me too, man. crazy change progression beat. insane.
Portnoy is a monster!! My favorite drummer.
The way DT always approaches a studio and writing session, is for each member to bring a few other band's albums into it. They listen to the vibes of their favorite albums and pick about 5 albums that will somehow be highly recognizable on their own album. I remember when they were recording this album, and got the fans very excited. They said Tool's Aenima and Metallica's Master of Puppets were among two of the albums. You'll hear Slayer, Frank Zappa, King Crimson, Genesis, Pink Floyd, Yes, Rush, Meshuggah, and many others coming through their albums. Sometimes it's almost too obvious like in the case of this song. This is easily a lost Tool song.
13:16
Watch his left hand closely, he turning off the snare.
Mike is on tour with The Winery Dogs, one of many groups that he is part of. I love the man.
I think this is the best DT record. Love the musicianship of every track.
Please do Raise the knife drum cam! he goes hard in the cymbals!
Loving the video and your material man! Just a bit perplexed that you didn't point out the snare sound changes that Mike was doing. You should definitely check out his newer materials with his other current BANDS 😅 New sub for you!
Aye I’ve only been playing for a year lol I’m no pro drummer at all. I just love the drums and music in general 😁
Hilarious. I was saying how he looked like he was having fun and enjoying his stick rolls and flips and just having fun overall. 30 seconds later you pause it.....😄😄😄
It's like he's challenging himself. "How much can I cram into this performance. Can I get away with doing this? Let's give it a shot."
The whole band is ridiculous musically. They have all either gone to, or taught at, or given presentations at Berklee College Of Music. It's almost like free jazz at times, where they all play different time signatures, only It's all written purposefully. 🤯 "How many odd time signatures can we get in this song? All of them." 😄😄😄
Enjoyed the video. 👍🏼👍🏼 Be well!
Man, ive seen him many times live, his stick twirls, grooves, fills and showmanship are TOP NOTCH 😅. Fun and amazing drummer. Watch him with Transatlantic live, THATS amazing!
Mike Portnoy has incredible showmanship, love watching him play
In the making of this album I believe Portnoy cites Aenema by Tool as a big inspiration while going through a pile of CDs in the studio. This song in particular shows that.
Great reaction dude. Please watch Mike's drum cam for the love version if Sacrificed Sons ... it will blow you away
Totally agree, that man is mind blowing person, luv him \m/
Yeeeah dudes an amazing drummer and just a cool as fuck dude
You're right. This song reminds Tool - 46&2
Probably my favorite song aside from Glass Prison on this album. And yes, especially at this time, around the Ænima/Lateralus era, the band was really drawing influence from Tool. But they did great about doing it in their own way.
Anybody on Earth as a drummer will never listen a cymbal clear sound like Portnoy cymbals he is unique individual with tremendous quality.
You should check out some of his newer works with the Winery Dogs, a power trio
Don't know if you can hear this, but "The Great Debate" on this album reminds me of "Siberian Khatru" by Yes. Both have wonderfully logical, flowing areangements that just seem to naturally evolve from almost completely a performance point of view. Both songs sound and feel almost improvised by their bands - even though there's no way that happened.
Recommendation: "Beyond This Life" from "Live at Budokan," from their "Train of Thought" tour. VERY satisfying from a percussive point of view, and - that's the only spoiler I'll give.
If you like the high-hat work I would suggest Take the Time. There isn't a whole lot but what there is sounds great.
This was really a Portnoys drumstyle exhibition song
This song is really, really damn good. You picked up on it somewhat, but if you go back and check the intro all the way up through to where the first pre-chorus riff kicks in (after all the audio samples), you'll notice that the entire sequence is played in reverse during the song's outro. It's a really creative element that I don't think I've really ever seen any other drummer/band do before, at least to that extent.
You should listen to the glass prison
watch Oki Padlan (jasad-Siliwangi) drum
Not sure why Mike gets so much hate... he's a phenomenal drummer!
Watch Lamar do enter sand man lol. He is amazing as well
Simplement the best! A god.... 🙏
Check our Terri bozzio drum solo it’s amazing he does a drum off with portnoy on one also
Prime era DT IMO. 😍
PH, é você!?
what makes portnoy so amazing is not that he writes this crazy ass impossible to play parts, it is because every single bar is as easy as it can be, but he never stays more than 2 bars doing the same thing, and in a 13 minute song with hundreds of diferent bars with diferent time signatures it makes the song almost impossible to remember fully and to play like its nothing, like hes doing here
Not always speed but style and time changing what makes him great.
Dude,they are called Octobans.
He's no Danny Carey
React drum solo mike mangini - the alien
These song shoud named “grand Zero” but beacuse of 09.11. They rename to the great debate.
Mike Portnoy the best 🔥
Hey Arturo ,
Who do you seriously think is better overall as a dedicated drummer
Mike Portnoy
OR
El Siberiano
??????????
I've got my answer but what's yours ?
Mike of course. Even if there are things Mike can’t do that el Estepario can Mike just has so much life and musical experience working with other giants in the industry. I mean Mike helped pave the way for drummers like el Estepario to even exist in the first place.
This is arguably DT’s best song. I think they peaked musically and creatively when they wrote Six Degrees.
Agreed 100%
There has never been another record like it 🤘🏻
A very young induction in percussion hall of fame.
TOOL ON STEROIDS.....BAD ASS JAM. SO MUCH ENERGY!!!
Am I the only one that thinks this song is very Tool like? Right after I typed this you said that
Lol nope I got that exact vibe 😂 good timing
It does have the vibe but come on toll ain’t even close to dream theaters skill.
@@darrenlucas7362 you don’t have to convince me. Dream theater is my favorite band.
Portnoy gives a master class every time he sits behind the kit
Owesam
Mike's showmanship is something (I think) is missing now. Mike M is amazing, but Mike P was a showman and a drummer!
Mike Portnoy's magnum opus.
This is why I prefer portnoy over mangini , for him it’s just a better vibe
How you a drummer of ages and not know MP my brother?
Mangini has no chance...
I once suggested that you do a comparison between Mangini's drumming and Portnoy's drumming on the song, 'Finally Free'. Here is a link to a video ua-cam.com/video/JC4EZEytgXY/v-deo.html
It's funny, you say your not a DT fan but you keep saying how you love things the DT is famous for doing. What I mean is, maybe you should look into them more? I mean it's cool if they are not your cup of tea. But it sounds like you need to listen to them more before deciding that. :) The keyboard player for one, plays very prominently in the band. Some say TOO prominently at times. 8 minutes is a SHORT DT song. Almost all of their songs are telling a story. And often it's a very deep story. The bassist is really really good. But so is everybody. Are you a fan of the signature changes? There are a zillion of them. They have been around since 1988 and average releasing a new cd every 2-3 years. So lots of things to discover. Just maybe stay away from the "Astonishing" cd for a bit. It's their "Mr. Roboto"(Really bad concept album by Styx, that marked the end for the group) moment that has most DT fans thinking what were THEY thinking. It's a rock opera gone bad. LOL.
Oh trust me they are growing on me lol after seeing more and more of their work I’m like ok…. NOW I get it 😁
@@ArturoReacts Hey, I got into Symphony "X" before DT. But the thing for me is DT grows on you the more you listen. Symphony "X" never grew past my initial opinion of them. DT is very versatile. But I think I mentioned, I think the songs are better when Portnoy was in the group. Portnoy wrote a lot of them with Petrucci. Him, Petrucci and John Myung the bassist, were the three founding members. And all from Long Island. Petrucci and Myung were H.S buddies. Portnoy was from another town on the island and they never met until they all went to Berkley. This is the second singer but he has been with them since the second album in 1990 I think. He's from Canada. And this is the third and by far the best key board player. He has been with them from around 96 I think. He is a Julliard graduate. And the new drummer, Mangini, is a drum professor at Berkley.
Unfortunately I'm just watching/hearing a random playing on a way too big set, he could play the same stuff in a 5 pieces drum set with way more solid technique and time keeping 🤷♂ There's nothing that special in this drumming. Sorry!
He doesn't have a big set just to play a big set. Much in the same way a guitar player has multiple frets and strings to create notes so too does a drummer have multiple music options with a large kit. I personally have an 11-piece drumset with 16 cymbals because my band covers multiple genres of music and it's nice to have multiple tones and textures for everything we play.
And while you may find his drumming not to your taste there are MANY people out there who hold him in high regard just as I'm sure the drummers you praise may not be particularly praise-worthy by others.
Furthermore, he has won 30 Modern Drummer awards, is in their hall of fame, and has recorded multiple successful albums when he was with Dream Theater as well as many other projects he has been involved in so he's not a "random" as you so ignorantly claimed. If it didn't do anything for you; fine. I'm sure you have your own particular preference of music and the drummers who play said music. I think jazz for example is absolutely boring and while I can appreciate the skill a jazz drummer possesses I find them to be incredibly pretentious (yes, some drummers regardless of genre are the same) and their playing style has no real appeal for me.
Bottom line is you can do more and have more options with a large kit in a genre such as progressive metal than you can on a small kit and if you're a drummer who plays multiple genres like I do then there really is no other option than to have a bigger kit and suggesting that drummers are or will be better playing a smaller kit is entirely subjective and an opinion that not everyone will share.
@@dernergertler749 probably you don’t know me but I’m not a beginner… Those are not my points. This is just a huge sentimental fan reaction. So ok 🤷♂️ bye
@Riccardo Merlini It's not about who you are and what you know but since you're not a beginner one would think you would at least know who Mike Portnoy is. And since you also brought up technique I went ahead and checked out some of your videos (you're welcome for the views) and found your playing to be overkill. Your playing, while good, did not seem to service the song and instead seemed to focus more on your hand speed and desire to put an unnecessary amount of fills where they weren't needed. I also found instances where your time-keepikg skills were questionable (most likely due to your need for said unnecessary fills). Now, I don't proclaim to be a great drummer by any means but I have been listening to music since birth (41 years and counting) and feel I have a very musical ear and your playing, while technically good, lacked musicality to my ears.
I prefer Portnoy's playing to Mangini's (who is currently Dream Theater's drummer) simply because of Portnoy's inclination toward treating his drums as a musical instrument instead of a bunch of drums to beat on. Mangini may be a more technically proficient drummer than Portnoy just like other drummers are more proficient than Neil Peart (who happens to be my absolute favorite drummer) but I suppose in the end it's all about preference. I prefer musicality over flash and technical proficiency. There's nothing that can compare to a drummer treating his kit as part of the composition of a song.
@@dernergertler749 "Portnoy's inclination toward treating his drums as a musical instrument". This. And we can end all comparison discussion right here. MP's "musicality" is what wins him fans everywhere he plays. I love older DT stuff, also MP's work with Neal Morse and other projects is spectacular.
Amazing!!! Wow.
Brother, check out Acid Rain by Liquid Tension Experiment. Mike kills it.
That was a polyrythm Mike was playing
Are you a drummer? You seem to be impressed by the really easy, childish fills. But say nothing about the amazing use of two hi-hats...