As you brought up the 3 episode thing... we have to remember that when this released in Japan, it did release with the first 4 episodes all at once. Arguably, the first episode ALONE isn't MEANT to hook the viewer... rather it's just the first part of the introduction to Frieren, not the whole introduction on its own.
This brings up the argument of "weekly watching" and "pacing". You can't properly critique pacing unless you are watching the show all at once since only at one time ever will people be forced to watch or read something weekly. After that, it will forever be at whatever pace a person wants so the weekly pacing becomes irrelevant. Most people will probably watch at least an episode a night or every other night but I doubt just once a week. It makes you wonder if it's better to focus on that weekly pacing that is only ever going to be relevant now vs proper pacing which will be relevant for the rest of time.
@@upg5147 These days with the ability to wait and binge from the off? Definitely proper pacing overall. That even applied in the past if you were looking to sell box-sets. For example, I hear two things about One-Piece as an anime: - It's great! - The pacing suuuuuuucks And that's one that has had people watching it "weekly" for decades now. Even watching it weekly, there's arguments for proper pacing. I'm thinking of OP and DragonBall here a lot - where a fight could go on for months, because of the terrible pacing.
@@upg5147 I agree with that argument. I've made it myself a couple of times. I have to say tho, there's some (very few) anime that's been made with the weekly schedule in mind and are better that way than watching it when it's full released but yeah, most of the times the quality of a series skyrockets when one watches it at their own pace.
I think Frieren is the only anime I watched with my mother that actually made us feel like we were on a slow adventure through a fantastic fantasy world. Just like a soft dream.
@@midtaku5379 I've talked with a lot of friends that if there's an anime I would proudly show my mom, and she would probably like it, it's Frieren and we all agree for now :P
So how I found this anime helped me enjoy it so much. No one ever said anything about it to me, I never saw it recommended, I didn't even see it online with clips, but I kept seeing friends post nonspoiler memes about it. One day I finally thought to myself. If everyone is posting memes about this show, but no is talking bad about it. It must be incredible, because people are always happy to let you know when something is bad. This was just over a month ago, but it has always made me wonder if I would have liked it as much if everyone pushed/recommended it to me. It has made me hesitant to recommend the show too hard to people.
I totally understand where you're coming from. there have been many very popular shows that I have put of watching for a long time, because it was they were so recommended. And I think, in ways, i enjoyed those shows less due to that, than if I had discovered them by myself. I feel like when a show is being pushed to me, I get like....analytical? In ways. with Frieren, I just kind of stumbled upon it, watched it, and it's one of my favorite shows I've seen in a very long time.
Same. All I saw was one short video recommending it, so I tried it. I definitely let people know what they are in for with this show. It's slow, but it's cozy. And it doesn't have crazy twists, just subtle realizations that make the show so rewarding. It might be my favorite anime, but like he said in the video, it's hard to compare it to shows that have multiple seasons.
I think mine is somewhat similar, in essence. I only knew it as “a show with good worldbuilding and that one scene she tells someone to kill themself” Then I watched the 1st episode and was smacked in the face violently by how fucking amazing it is and also almost cried which is rare since I just don’t cry to media much at all ever.
I think there's a difference between dislike and hate. I dislike MLP, but I don't hate it. I don't care enough about MLP to hate it. It's kinda crazy how some people care enough to specifically hate something.
I think that it is linked to how much praise a show gets. Of course it's not justification. I am just saying, when everyone praises a product, that it forever raised the standard of the industry and fixed everything wrong with said industry; the people that don't feel that way about it may or may not feel frustrated. As if their views were incorrect, or atleast, outside of what is commonly thought. Some people may not care because they're not that much in contact with the product, or because they are focused on other stuff. Others however may act upon their feelings of frustration and express it one way or another, leading to unconstructed opinions or blatant hate speech.
@@Sammysapphira What do you mean? If a show is popular and people try to replicate but said popularity, it's not the fault of the creator. If you admit such behaviour then you should admit that we should collectively hate mushoku tensei for popularizing modern Isekai. Plus you have better to do than hating on some piece of media
I think hating a piece of media is fully justified if you have a small child who insists on watching Baby Shark or Skibid Toilet on repeat. Othewise, yeah, it`s more energy than it`s worth.
I find it poetic that FMAB where the MC is a rationalist that beives in science and technology while disregarding gods and magic as fairy tales is bested by Freiren, an anime that is all about magic, deamons and gods.
Another factor is that people tend to associate the anime they like with their personal identity. Their favorite anime can't be too popular, or else that would make them a basic person. Like, someone who's favorite film is The Godfather, because that's the go to example of a "great film." The actual quality of the product ceases to matter, simply because you can't use it to express your "individuality."
Not that I disagree with your point about someone "being a fan" of something less popular to make themselves sound better, but it isn't necessarily a bad thing in itself to make the shows you like a part of your identity. I think its important to take pride in what you truly like as it is part of representing who you are in a sense. Using myself as an example, I never shy away from telling someone my favorite anime is Aria, even though they make look at me weird for not saying something widely popular like One Piece or FMAB. Not out of a sense of superiority because it's less known but because it was such a positive impact on my life and what I strive to be and I'd like to be proud of that.
You just gave me the realization that the reason Frieren's MAL ranking is such a big talking point for this series isn't because MAL's ranking system is a reliable metric to judge the popularity or quality of an anime...it's SPECIFICALLY because it isn't. Brotherhood is amazing, but the fact it was never dethroned shows how broken the system really is, and Frieren still managed to overtake it. Regardless of your opinion on Frieren or MAL, that's worth talking about.
Mal is as baluable as any other democratic system its used as its most well known and populer of sources which bu boting standsrds means most reliable as has bigest voter base
FMAB is also fucking overrated for too many Years. I watched it and it was okay but nowhere that good that it deserves so long number 1.The Fanbase is also fucking cancer. They are disgusting. And because I laughing at them that Frieren will not be leaving number 1 for a long time.
The primary reason FMAB stayed at the top of the list isn't because it was the best anime ever made never to be topped. It's because it's fans are so rabid that they spent 10 years review bombing anything that threatened to take over the #1 position to keep it on top. Often without ever fairly evaluating the other shows first.
yeah the fma cabal has been a real thing at times, i remember them review bombing a couple shows a while back and the controversy around it, idk if they still do that as for fma itself i find it very mid, the original fma is better than brotherhood imo as well as for frieren, its good, but i feel like a lot of people who have frieren as their #1 didnt watch that many anime
I find calling the first episode of an anime "the pilot" very weird because in the anime industry, the pilot is the manga, the first episode is not a pilot, the studio is contracted to make the entire season and sometimes the entire series with all the seasons
Yea a pilot is to test whether to continue a show or not (if it does well), so wouldnt make sense. But he just meant the first episode here quite obviously and just misused the word
Well written shows deserve to be up there on the list. I love FMAB as well as Fieren's first season. Not sure I could pick a favorite since I like them for different reasons.
I completely agree, it's so hard to chose between them because they're barely even competitors within the genre. It's like asking whether I love my mom or my wife more. The metrics we use to determine what is "the best" will greatly affect the answers. The best at what? It's an empty question. FMA:B is my favorite anime of all time, and I'm fine with Frieren overtaking it because I know it isn't an actual representation of what is considered better.
I have a friend who hates it. We had a half-hour argument because three of us were watching Frieren together, and she refused to recognize the narrative purpose in having Fern fight with Frieren's clone. She kept arguing the entire scene was stupid because after other characters building her up and the narrative was framing Fern as being "The one who will surpass/beat Frieren", It ended up being Frieren herself who did most of the fighting against the clone. Pointing out in particular how her first sneak attack failed. Me and my other friend were trying to explain to her that the point of the scene wasn't that Fern was supposed to beat Frieren *now*, but that Fern would EVENTUALLY become able to. Her first sneak attack failed because Fern is still inexperienced and that was her first attempt, but she suceeded in her second attempt to prove she did indeed have the potential. But she just didn't get it, and refused to acknowledge the narrative through-line. She still insists that Frieren is trash and it saddens me that she brushes it off so flagrantly.
tbh at that point I wouldn't consider her my friend anymore if i were you (only partially a joke, im pretty serious about writing and stuff like that so disagreeing on something like this would turn me off hard) anyway its her loss for not recognizing something so good
@@rai.2876 Well, I expect my friends to not insult the things I love so blatanly, even if they don't like it for whatever reason. If one of my friends, knowing that I really like something, were to shit on my opinion like that... well it wouldn't be about the thing anymore lol
My take on FMAB is that the first episodes did not have that impact that the original FMA anime had. But the moment the FMA deviated from manga it went to hell... FMAB got on the level of the first half of FMA after that moment where it followed the manga and dropped all that sht FMA came up with. And considering Frieren... I havent seen a TV show with such attention to detail in a very looong time (if I have ever). They mostly show and tell very little, but you can get the whole picture from analyzing the small bits and that is something I really like. That and the very high production value make it my favorite anime.
@@susbedo9258 I don’t know if I would go as far as to say it’s much better than FMAB, but I think in several aspects (mainly during the first half) it blows FMAB out of the water. However, I think FMAB’s plot and world building is far better planned out and executed than FMA’s. Once you get to about episode 12 or so in FMAB the show really picks up and the way everything comes together in the last arc is really satisfying. I’d rate them both around the 8 to 10 range, since both are excellent series. I don’t really get the hate for FMA considering they did a pretty good job cutting the show short and still keeping it engaging and relatively competent, though the finale is a bit messy and definitely needed a few more episodes to properly develop and defeat the main villain and resolve the political situation at the end.
Brotherhood "rushes" the first arc of the manga because FMA added extra material to flesh that part out. After that, it takes its time and goes all out. That's why watching the first part of the original is recommended before watching FMA.
Another thought-provoking episode in the series! This topic has actually been on my mind recently as well, because of another explanation I heard for why popular media also tends to have a substantial group of people who dislike it, which is that the more popular something is, the more likely it is to reach outside of the audience it was made for. So, a show like Frieren is likely to get a lot more views from people who probably won't enjoy it than a show fewer people have seen or heard of. Just thought I'd add that to the list of reasons why popular things are sometimes looked down on.
One thing you do really well in your reviews are the disclaimers. Always on point, clear, needed and they are embedded in the flow of the video, instead of feeling like an annoying technicality you need to get done before the video proper starts. Good job!
I think I had the perfect exposure to Frieren First, because of some change in how my imagination works, I adore ambiance. I love the spaces inbetween that Frieren treats with so much care and detail, and I love the small, personal, insulated moments within every line of the story which ooze with genuinity and the detailed, homely spaces they take place in that make me feel cozy. -w- I can also treat well cared for and well crafted worlds and characters like a separate reality, and not only is Frieren made with the most care I've seen in (almost) any piece of media ever, its world is one that I can get lost in, something that I can imagine as real (not in the weird way, I promise!), and thinking like this removes any expectation or outside opinion on the work. No one's own personal opinion can influence my own, because as I see it, everyone can and will realize this world in their own way, and as long as the world keeps respecting itself and its inhabitants, my expectations of its reality are met, because how the story plays out is not in my hands, but more of its own. Basically, while there are people that Frieren doesn't emotionally resonate with, it resonates so much with me that it's causing vibrations :3
Best part about frieren is the characters and storytelling. Even in the manga it's just so consistently good and only gets better. Even minor characters in this series gets there own moments to shine. If El dorado and goddess monument arc gets adapted in a season to it's easily going surpass season 1 which is kinda insane given how good the first season was. The author of frieren takes his to build the characters which pays off greatly in the long run. Frieren fight scenes aren't even much prominent in the manga but when a fight happens it's incredibly tense and impactful because of the multiple layers character conflicts involved. Honestly peak writing in every way
This is so weird to me because care and detail was one of the main reasons I didn't like the show. It didn't feel like an organic world and people didn't seem to behave in natural ways, it felt like a generic shounen anime. However I just came to it from Dungeon Mushi so that could've given me unrealistic expectations
It's funny but both FMAB asnd FBJE, in their own way. deal essentially with the concept of mortality and what it means to live. It's just that FMAB deals with it in an "aggressive" way. Frieren instead in a more "pacific acceptance" way. it's sort of like the 5 stage of grief. Humanity is slowly accepting that dying is alright, after the medical boom that expanded our lifespan 20/30 years more. we still reaching that ultimate last step. and we are slowly understanding it? idk its just a thought i had while you spoke about the anime
Other way around: we are becoming increasingly less comfortable with death and the passage of time, which is why the themes can now have an impact. In the past these kinds of fairy tales were much more common but as theaters and audiences became more materialistic their morals went out of style. Hopefully what we're seeing now is the tipping point.
@@rumfordc yeah its another perspective. Tho tbh frieren doesnt treat death as unconfortable. But explores more what happen after life ends. (Beyond the journey ;) ) as Himmel's gradually vanishes from people's memories. His statues get dirty. His message forgotten. And thats not just him. There's also the elf monk and his human friend who were even more ancient heroes. Forgotten. But even so the message frieren gives is to "bring your memory into the future" (see the episode with the old dwarwen guard) which is what shes doing with himmel in her own way. Most of what she tells Fern and Stark stems directly from her experience with him and the hero's party (which is strange honestly considering shes more than a thousands years old. Did she not have any other exoeriences to share? But its just a nitpick). So as to bring not them. But their message into the future. Cause people die but ideas live on forever? Sort of?
@@simonenoli4418 >"did she not have other experiences to share?" She really didn't. She lived the majority of her life in isolation before joining the hero's party. The ten years she traveled with Himmel and the 2ish she has spent with Fern and Stark so far are probably the most eventful periods in her life.
@@ericsalsbery4363 i somehow doubt it. She traveled a lot with Flamme and continued to do so on her own to seek quirky spells. Its not like she buried herself in a cave like Serie did.
@@simonenoli4418 She says in one of the later episodes that after Flamme died she lived alone in her forest until Himmel came to recruit her for his party. From the way I understood it, her hobby of collecting spells only came about because Himmel praised her.
Hiya! Just wanna leave my experience with Frieren here: I don't hate the show, it just never managed to grab me. I watch up to episode 8, and I stopped here because I really didn't feel like there was any point of contention in the story. All challenges and threats Frieren and her party faced could really easily be dispatched, same goes for the interpersonal frame and the conflict Frieren felt at the beginning of the series. I really wanted to like the show, and after every episode I took the time to analyse it with my friend who was watching it with me! I could see all the ingredients for an amazing anime, but felt the writing stunted 90% of the shows potential. The show hasn't shown me what it wants to talk about, and I'm left here wondering if it ever will beyond what was established in the first 4 episodes.
I would consider watching a few more episodes, as although I don’t remember what goes on in ep 8 I do know it got better for me with each episode. Cause I too had dropped it, but maybe a month later picked it up and started to enjoy it
I agree with you. I'm at episode 16 or 18, watching it with friends who all love it. The writing feels very stunted and I expected the world building to be good, but every town and forest looks the same as the last. We get to see Frieren's recent history with the flashbacks, but we don't really get to see any history of the world we're in. As it's about Frieren growing less apathetic and more interested, it would have been a really good chance to explore more of the actual world in the current timeline. But instead of that, they just keep throwing in pretty flat new characters that need exposing and who Frieren can react to. I have more gripes with how the series has done certain things, but to me, this is the most glaring. I love fantasy, I had really hoped to like this series.
While I agree with your observations of the hype meta, how popularity can prompt a knee-jerk oppositional reaction, I don't think it's the full picture. Personally, I've yet to encounter meaningful engagement with critiques of Frieren. Mind you, there are a lot of aspects of the anime I enjoyed. However, I found myself frustrated with how conflict is set up and resolved, and I became far too aware of the dynamic by the end of Aura's arc. First, a problem is introduced in the present. Next we get a flashback to the past which clues in the audience. Finally, the encounter is handily resolved by our protagonists. It's like if a heist scene showed the audience the full plan in advance, then it goes off without a hitch - there's no intrigue or excitement! As a result, the flashbacks in Frieren cheapen conflict and tension building because it tuns out that Frieren already had a trick up her sleeve from centuries ago, and the battle is a foregone conclusion in her eyes. Not even Fern or Stark were in any real danger despite their comparative inexperience fighting demons, because Frieren said so. The only way tension could be maintained at this point is if the information telegraphed in flashbacks was then subverted. Between noticing this, and people's starry-eyed takes about how the work is an absolute masterpiece, my feelings grew dissonant as I had lost the magic. I'm glad other people enjoy the work, I just happen to find myself in this awkward position where I keep hearing about how amazing it is, and it reminds me of what I didn't get to experience.
Funnily enough I was just explaining this to someone today. Frieren is far and away my favorite show and possibly story of all time, and yet I don't think it's the best written. hell, maybe its not even the second best. one of the flaws, like you said, is that the solution to a majority of the fights (if not all of them) are rather straightforward and telegraphed. the way I saw, fights never needed to be anything more than that. in fact, to me thats precisely why the fights achieve what they want to. in both adventures (with Himmel and in the present), it was/is never a question of if she CAN bond with people, but if she WOULD and if she sees the value in doing so. by the end of season 1, Frieren is a lot more empathetic towards other people (hell Eisen even explicitly says so rather early on), and that's because of every interaction she's had with other people, big or small. sometimes, those interactions happen to be battles, but since the battles are meant to be just instances of interpersonal connection rather than a thrilling action sequence, the outcome doesn't need to be a mystery. however, I do believe it is very much possible to make the battles interesting in and of themselves without detracting from this and has potential to elevate the scene even further, but whether or not that would happen in practice is up for debate. all i know is that the way it's been done in Frieren so far, I like that they've stayed true to their original goal and prioritized the character dynamics over the battle dynamics, but that may just be my preference/taste. spoilers below for anime watchers i guess? one of my favorite examples of this is stark killing the dragon. the second you learn that the big ass canyon is a result of stark's training, literally anyone could figure out how that fight was gonna go down. the mystery of the outcome was never the point of the fight, it was just a moment for stark to gain some confidence and, probably more importantly, a moment for frieren to have an impact/develop a bond with someone. I hope I don't sound like I'm trying to convince you to love Frieren. You just noted a lack of engagement with Frieren's shortcomings and I wanted to provide my perspective. Of course, even after reading this maybe you still don't see it that way, or maybe you do and the simplistic nature just doesn't particularly resonate with you. I'm very much biased towards Frieren because amidst the trends of modern storytelling (where standing out skews towards increasingly complex premises) I've been searching for awhile now for stories with a couple elements: highlight the beauty of the simple things (since so many stories have such grandiose concepts/events now), have solid world building in a Tolkien-esque style (I just feel like Tolkien-esque worlds are more about subversion than embracing it), and a story with a simple Hero's Journey structure (which I feel like has gone out of style lately with a few exceptions like Edge of Tomorrow, another one of my absolute favorites). Frieren just happens to be all of the above and then some, so I'm VERY biased. But anyways, I just like discussing storytelling, and I'd love to hear your thoughts! It's not too often I get to openly disagree with someone and then discuss about why, so it'd be a treat to hear your perspective
@@olivertan8994 my perspective which is quite opinionated is this: the main cast kinda sucks frieren, fern, and start are nearly perfect characters barring 1 weakness (bonding, anger, confidence). the characters dont learn or grow throughout the series; it does not feel that much of a journey, especially for fern or stark. (mainly about strength, but also character as well) with a series that’s main focus is the characters: if you don’t like the main cast, you just cant like the series (also everything is predictable in frieren to me. i dont really consider it a flaw, but i feel like the conclusions werent rewarding enough; which is mainly just frieren’s lore)
@@stego- yeah that makes perfect sense. the fondest road trip you had with your best buds would probably not even be enjoyable if you went with a group of acquaintances, and as far as characters go, i just happened to see a lot of myself and my best friends in them, so i very quickly became attached. i think saying the main cast is nearly perfect aside from 1 flaw is JUST A SMIDGE too reductive (just a bit) but in general yeah, a perfectly reasonable complaint. but, i do disagree with one thing and i want to ask about another. i don't think that the cast hasn't learned anything, i think that they just haven't become actionable yet. i think the events of s1 are part of a slow, methodical, and subtle internal accumulation of experiences for the characters before something clicks and they finally have external growth. there has yet to be any of that in s1, like you said, so that's all speculation/hope, but i think it's WELL within the realm of possibility. my question is what makes you not see it as a journey? i think my definition of what a journey is is rather simple, and so it fits for me, but i'd love to know if i missed/overestimated something or if you have a different criteria for what you see as a journey. thanks for the thoughts though! i gave a rather...hefty recommendation to a few of my friends in which i now think i should re-emphasize the impact of my own personal biases in my enjoyment of Frieren in order to avoid unmet expectations
@olivertan8994 I get that you love Frieren and, as you said, are probably biased because of it, but to say that the world is tolkien-esque feels like an insult towards Tolkien. There's so much history interwoven into every bit of Tolkien's world. Everything has 3 layers of history to it, even sth simple as the name of the river Brandywine/Baraduin. Frieren's world lacks history. The villages, planes, and forests lack individual personality, architecture, and a story of why it's there. Even the religion in Frieren, which has a kinda big role in the series as many characters are hinted to being religious or are priests, lacks depth. The religion gets further introduced with exposure by talking about it, but it hasn't been shown much in a natural way (none to very few churches in the distance of the places they visit/ none to few little chapels/ people making religious signs/ different offshoots of the religion in different regions). The characters have the same problem. Their main personality trait is their literal name in German and they have very few distinctions besides that one thing. They aren't that well rounded. They also feel very disconnected from the places they're from, there's no traditional dress, no local customs they have that are different from other characters, etc. Tolkien is so good at exactly this, which is why his world feels so alive and true. Avatar the last airbender/TLOK also did a very good job at this. Less deep as Tolkien, but ATLA has a history that gets slowly revealed and has regional distinctiveness, even in areas where the elements are more mixed. Frieren doesn't even come close to Avatar's world building in my opinion, let alone Tolkien. Sorry for the rant. I really care about good world-building
No work of art has ever garnered 100% likes as Pey's dislike of the Sistine Chapel would indicate. Art is subjective. One person is triggered by a work, and another person is not by that same work. One can make factual statements of things like who wrote something, when was it created, how much did it gross at the box office, and on and no. But other statements such as "This work is a masterpiece, this work is GOOD. And you should like it, because I like it" don't wash. One cannot prove ABSOLUTE GOODNESS in anything. Does not someone feel offended when that person likes a work and their best friend turns traitor and dislikes it? How do you process that information? "To each his/her own" or "We are no longer friends"?
Interesting take. I can agree with most of the points being made. Speaking for myself, during the first episode I formed the impression that the characters are two-dimensional. Not flat but not extremely complex either. Of course as I watched more, I changed my mind about their complexity. They actually feel like real people. During the first seven episodes, I considered the show to be "good". A solid show that is definitely worth watching but no more than that. Then came episode 8 where Aura appeared and it was revealed why Frieren is called "Frieren the Slayer"... and that's where my jaw dropped. That spectacular episode convinced me that this anime is truly something special. My admiration further increased as I kept watching and now I believe it's one of the best works of fiction ever made.
Thank you for letting me know that you agree with most of the points being made. You are very important so I was wondering! Now that you agree, I agree as well.
@@rumfordcI don't understand, are you being sarcastic? If so, very poor choice of words. You aren't saying anything of substance here. I don't see the point of your reply...
@@angelodescordo8455 Just letting you know that I can agree with most of what you've said. Isn't that nice to hear? Now you know. Also, just so you know, I'm speaking for myself.
I think another big factor is being let down by something overhyped. Oshi No Ko felt that way when I finally got around to watching it. It was great, but certainly not #1 material. But it had been so hyped up that i was dissapointed it didnt "live up" to the insane hype. Ironically, when I got around to watching Inception a couple years ago (like 8 years after the relase and everyone was actually kinda criticial of it now) i legit though it was one of the best movies ive ever seen. To summarize, if you expect something to be absolutely amazing, and it is...well its kinda just met your expectations, and moat people would rate it lower for not being above expectations. Thats why I prefer to start all my experiences at a 5/10, and then can go up or down from there.
@@KK-ef1ow This is how I felt about Demon Slayer, for example. Everyone was hyping it up and saying it was great, so I went to check out what all the fuss was about. But it ended up being mostly just because of it's animation. In an actual story sense it was just mediocre, maybe slightly above average.
What immediately killed Oshi No Ko for me was when the guy(I think he was a producer or something) just casually accepted an intelligent talking baby and rights it off as a by product of social media influence. I know it's probably a petty reason on my part but sometimes it's the simplest of things like those that can ruin a potentially good series for me as it puts me off so much that I discontinue it. While I can't use Inception as an example as you did since I was hooked from the first time I saw the trailer(didn't get to watch it till years later), I can relate using Transformers(the first movie) as an example. I avoided it for years due to the bias I had that movie adaptations on anime wouldn't live up to my expectations, so when it came out I was in 7th/8th grade and wanted to do nothing with it. Around 2010 my dad came from abroad with it on DVD and I was bored enough to give it a try...to date, the helicopter transformation scene in the beginning of the movie remains my all time favorite of the series because it completely tore down my bias with how it blew my mind. Sorry for the wall of text but your comment brought up some memories and emotions that I felt were relatable.
5:35 yep, this is my reason not liking popular media. People recommend a lot to me then when I tried it, it's just decent or even bad. So lucky for me I found Frieren by myself, not through recommendation. If I were recommended, maybe I also won't like Frieren.
i think a really interesting idea is that i believe the author of frieren stated that it was originally pitched as a comedy, not an adventure through the human experience. i believe it was supposed to be a pretty generic hero vs demon king gag story, but it eventually evolved to what it is now. idk really interesting idea consider how frieren uses comedy (a topic i think would be super intriguing to hear your thoughts on)
The scene that sold me on Frieren and pushed me to continue watching after hearing great things about it and being mildly interested in the first episode, was actually the second episode, specifically a line said by Heiter. "If there is even just one precious memory in the walls of your mind, I think it would be a waste to die." This was the line that spoke to me, and pushed me to continue watching, even dragging my friend with me so we could watch it together.
I started reading the manga I think before the anime was even announced, so maybe you’ll find my thoughts interesting when I say the first episode also didn’t hook me. It had already become my favorite manga, so I didn’t need convincing to watch the anime, but after the first episode, I wasn’t sure it was hitting the same as the manga. I was going to watch it no matter what, but I felt the nature of the story was more fit for short chapters, and I thought the format of humor didn’t translate well to animation. I also was initially underwhelmed by the animation, particularly with the meteor shower, but I can’t put my finger on why as I don’t believe that anymore. I don’t remember when it was that I changed my mind, it might’ve been Qual, Stark, maybe the demons. The more and more I watched the more I began to love the anime. But there was also a sense of pride that came up when I started seeing it actually become popular. The memes of Frieren saying k**l yourself particularly got on me nerves. For me, I was watching some great writing, great animation and a powerful moment that made me love the manga because I loved the way demons were depicted. But now I was seeing people compare Frieren to that one dude who’s name I forget, like come on it’s a serious and badass scene. I didn’t understand how people can love Aura so much when it’s Frieren that’s the highlight of her appearance, and I despised the p**nographic art drawn of my favorite characters (still do honestly). I felt sort of protective of Frieren, it was sort of like, “I knew about this amazing story before everyone else, I know how to actually appreciate it. Everyone else is so shallow.” But at some point I realized, why am I complaining that my favorite story is now at the top of myanimelist? I’ve wanted to see people enjoy the series, I now get to watch this beautiful animation. So what if some people don’t view it the exact same as me? So what if some people say stupid things sometimes? So what if some people don’t really care for the show? I can enjoy it the same way whether thousands or hundreds are watching as well. I moved past my pride, and now I can truly appreciate my favorite show
i think honestly if fmab was released now in 2024 and got tons of praise, a lot of people who hated frieren would of also hated fmab, some people may just genuinely not like frieren but i noticed a lot of people people don't like change of their favorite animes.
Great video. It's hard for me to say why this show didn't click with me, everyone was so archetypelike and so powerful that it made me uninterested on it from start to finish, not just the pilot. I probably fell victim of the overhype and dared the show to surprise me and it didn't. The overexposure started for me when everyone hyped the manga a couple years back and i read the first chapter really found it bland, but didn't give it a chance past the 1 chapter. All the hype that came even before the anime aired made me question why a show that crappy 1 ch i read a couple years back was being so praised, so even if i did try to give it a fair chance and watched all of it, it was apparently doomed from the start for me
On the subject of the characters being too powerful to "create any stakes" it is because there is no need for there to be. The purpose of their journey is simply to travel north so Frieren can see Himmel. Every "fight" or conflict they run into where they need to use their powers is simply a means to an end. Take the dragon vs Stark fight early on. It's purpose isn't to show off how strong Stark and the rest of them are in comparison to it, the watcher/reader can already tell that when they see the canyon from his training. It's to give Stark a chance to build his confidence in himself and his desire to protect the villagers. The exam arc is the same thing. It is merely a means to an end so that they can continue traveling. Not saying your wrong for not liking it anyways I just wanted to share that.
I'll be honest... When I see/hear everyone going on about a show, I almost actively avoid it. A few recommendations? Heck yeah - I'll go watch that! Everyone not shutting up about it, be it GOT, Lost etc etc. That's when it gets on my nerves, and I'll not want to go near it.
yes i used to be like this as well thats why i never watched opm until years later there is nothing wrong with it too because the hype can really get in the way of a natural experience of the show in question waiting until the hype dies down so you can give it a more organic chance usually results in a more authentic experience
People actually hate it? Sorry but I can't take it serious when people hate such a chill, calm and beautiful show. I've seen such comments quite a few times but none of them are giving good arguments for why they hate the show, except ,,it's slow". But those are the same people that love One Piece or Boruto (which took almost 200 episodes to get really good in its own way). No hate to OP and Boruto though.
If a show takes 200 episodes to get good, it’s simply not good. One piece however is good from the start, better by episode 4 and at worst it is great by episode 35
@@assimilater-quicktips you're correct with One Piece. I was only referring to Boruto with the 200 episodes thing, but One Piece has such great humor, world building and many other things that make it great from the start.
@@wamaschawama5178 one piece has a lot of emotion at the start too. Shanks losing his arm, fucking chouchou losing his store, usopp losing his mom, sanji starving. A lot of people overlook east blue I think mainly because Luffy kind of breezes through any difficulty, but East blue has a lot of heart and that’s what made me fall in love with one piece Boruto I unapologetically did not last 200 episodes and no amount of convincing will bring me back😂
Hate is quite a strong word for my taste... But I guess you can consider me someone who hated Frieren. And my reasoning is not it being slow, but rather the characters. They are impossible to believe in or feel anything towards. They're what I'd define as "1-dimensional characters". The personality of each one of them could be described in one short sentence, at best. And that's a really big problem, I think. Cause the entire show is based on the interactions between different people, mainly Frieren and her party but occasionally others as well. I don't mind this kind of story, but then interesting characters must be the top priority for the author. Did I see it in Frieren? No, unfortunately I did not
ANN has been a "holy cow". There have been classic series from the 80's and 80's that have very VERY high qualifications to be in the top 10, which have been superseded in the ranking as years go buy and new people, who never seen those older series, have come along. There are good reasons why IMDB has certain top 10 which includes many older movies, and if, let's say a marvel superhero movie would become number one... what would that say? Would it suddenly really be the number one movie of ALL TIME? I don't think so... Also, when anime became "mainstream" way back when, people who before that loved everything about it, quit, because it "became too popular"... there was no other reason but the fact that now they weren't a part of underground scene anymore and the thing they held so dear wasn't secret or unknown anymore. I knew some of these people who quit personally... that's just how some people are. They need to belong to something that's theirs and "only theirs"... it's not special anymore if anyone else knows about it as well.
Talking about art and blend products, Wits speech from the Stormlight Archive comes to mind, because it exemplifies perfectly why art must be distinct and risk being hated, in order to be good, profound or meaningful to someone. It reads: "All great art is hated. It is obscenely difficult - if not impossible - to make something that nobody hates. Conversely, it is incredibly easy - if not expected - to make something that nobody loves. This makes sense, if you think about it. Art is about emotion, examination, and going places prople have never gone before to discover and investigate new things. The only way to create something that nobody hates is to ensure that it can't be loved either. Remove enough spice from a soup, and you'll just end up with water. Human taste is as varied as human fingerprints. Nobody will like everything, everybody dislikes something, someone loves that thing you hate - but at least being hated is better than nothing. To risk metaphor, a grand painting is often about contrast: brightest brights, darkest darks. Not grey mush. That a thing is hated is not proof that it's great art, but the lack of hatred is certainly proof that it is not. "
i think that quote is overrated because it being loved is also no indicator of quality, and the way its being phrased kinda normalizes hate as inevitable which i dont like the way i see it is that the best art is the art that you care about a lot on a personal level, not the art that is the most popular art is subjective after all so all that matters is how much you like something, the total amount of people who like or hate or love something means nothing
It's fantastic to have this video enter the conversation when the Internet is so quick to love on or hate on something indiscriminately. It's complicated, but I feel this video approached it with nuance.
Frieren is the best anime I've ever watched. Despite thst, my favourite anime is about a highschool wind ensemble/ band. (Hibike Euphonium!) Proving your point, at least to myself. Even though Frieren is statistically better than Hibike Euphonium, I like the latter more. Because once again... The show, the characters, and the setting resonates far more better than a boomer mage travelling and tracing her journey back to hopefully see her "hero"'s soul.
You are so right about oversaturation. I loved Frieren and your videos are awesome, but I decided not to subscribe to this channel. Because if I did, then youtube would've started forcing your videos down my throat when I wasn't in the mood to watch them. So instead I memorized the channel's name, and come here every now and then to watch something the piques my interest.
Personally, I think being so popular that people started hating you is one hell of an achievement. If anything, the size of the anti-fan base is usually the better measurement of the success and popularity of something.
I liked Frieren enough but I have to admit that it sometimes got really slow. Some people just wont like that kind of anime. I tend to not like what is popular mostly because they just don't interest me. Anime like Full Metal Alchemist, Attack on Titan, and One Piece just don't do anything for me. I was told I'd like Frieren and so I avoided it for a while. I eventually was bored one day and had nothing better to do with my time so watched one episode. And then another. And another. Until I had finished the show and wanted more.
I don't really see what exactly Frieren subverts. It met nearly every expectation I had of it. I guess you could say it subverted by general expectation that media tries to subvert my expectations, but that doesn't count to me, that's the minimum.
Felt the same way with AOT. It was overhyped for me. Watched season one and half of two; barely grabbed me. Stopped forcing myself to watch it, but ppl kept on talking about it. It annoyed because I didn’t get the appeal of it that everyone felt for it. I realized now that it just wasn’t my thing
Here for this series all the way to the end, funny enough I could not even finish the first Ep of the Frieren when I first watched it, only after a couple more episodes aired did I go back to it because I was pressured, needless to say, it jumped all the way to my favorite show. Thank you for the breakdown in this video, I was confused on some of the blatant hate a few people were throwing at the show, it just can’t be helped.
It's a pretty good show. Is it the best? Doubt it. At what point was I hooked? Literally: reading the very premise. I didn't come to the show looking for quality or something exciting, or something heart-wrenching. I came to the show looking for an exploration of the nature of time, and an eerie mirror to an RP character I made years ago who in tern was designed as a reflection of myself. I'm happy to say that I got that. Everything else was just a bonus to me. I actually had trouble believing that it was so popular because the reasons that it appealed to me were so personal that I couldn't imagine that so many people would feel the same way.
@@wamaschawama5178 depending on what year you put them in, neither of them top oshi no ko for me. And as much as I love apothecary diaries, it is only the start of the year and there’s still oshi no ko season 2. Idk if season 2 will match season 1 but I’m not declaring anime of 2024 at this point
@@assimilater-quicktips that's understandable. Oshi no Ko was awesome, had some very realistic dialogues and nice songs. Will S2 already come out this year?
The first episode didn't leave me a great impression either. The main reason being the lack of subtlety with the theme : look ! those guys adventured for 10 years, the falling stars only happen every 50 years, she says she want to look around for spells for 100 years ! And every damn time, Frieren is just "that's nothing, bro". Yeah, I get it, you are an elf and you have zero empathy. Can we move on ? As a result, the "everyone is older now" bit was, well, not surprising. I feel it would have had a lot more impact if the story didn't say anything about time early on, and focused on developing those characters.
Exactly, it's a missed opportunity on the concept portrayed which you describe succinctly. The concept is really interesting but the execution felt like it failed at conveying this successfully. To contrast, Delicious In Dungeon (Dungeon Meshi) has the concept of cooking central to the story (in a dungeon adventure story setting) and delivers perfectly on that premise and even avoids being bogged down by it with a developing story, wide range and cast of characters and interactions and the art is excellent too. As the video announced at the beginning, the tag of top anime seems a bit misleading in the first place and perhaps that's all there is to the idea that Frieren probably ends up dealing with more criticism than other animes?
People cares too much about ranking and numbers these days. If you enjoy other anime, if you enjoy Frieren, is it really that matter what the ranking says, I wonder Can totally understand why people love Frieren and it's number #1 in a popular site. The only negative thing about it is that 26 episodes is not enough xD
You raise an interesting point. If this show wasnt released with first 4 episodes at once it could easily have struggled as people watched episode one, marked it as mid, and never got hyped enough to return for the next episodes. But with the first 4 out, its pretty easy for people to watch multiple episodes at once. And the show offers no reason to leave if the next episode is available. Sure, someone may leave due to external reasons, such as needing sleep, or wanting to do something else, but the show has very little in the way of pain points, and is put together well enough that boredom is not a huge threat. The average viewer may not be super engaged yet, and those requiring more stimulation may decide to seek it elsewhere, but a decently intelligent/perceptive individual is unlikely to say “this sucks”. Granted, I came in knowing the show was good due to mentions of it in writing discussions so I am never got the newcomers experience and may be wrong. about the lack of immediate grand hooks. Very easy to sleep on this show if you don’t know its good coming in. Viewing style would also matter a lot. Someone who watched episode one and stopped there could easily have missed the subtle beauty of this show, or at least . Being released first 4 episodes at once means a lot of people did not leave and not come back. In my opinion the first episode is not P
I HATE the mentality that shows and anime and such HAVE to be super special awesome from episode one or chapter one. Most anime hit an initial peak at EPISODE 5, so watching only one or three episodes does a disservice to the show.
I think jjk would have been à better example. Personally, I ve never seen anyone claim they dislike frieren, while i see people say jjk is trash for no reason pretty often
Ive just found and binged your channel lol, great work man, very good and profesional videos, however as a manga reader the jjk ones were really funny lmao
All I know Gushing Over Magical Girls, had more sales Bluray and DVD in Japan than Friren, I can see a success of a niche as well on sales and numbers on sales aka money proves it.
Obviously the points of the video still stand but it should be noted that FMAB doesn’t just stay at the top because it’s good. It stays at the top because when something overtakes it, a small but vocal group of obnoxious fans start a brigading campaign to downvote the usurper. There just weren’t enough of them to take down frieren
At first, i tough that it was an isekai Then, one day i was bored, a dub comparison appeared and decided to watched it, i tough "probably is a comedical adventure like Dragonball", same thing i said about "Tengoku Daimakyou", and it again, my expectations were totally wrong But at least Frieren have a peaceful world Pds: english speakers maybe know that other anime as "Heavenly Delusional" Pds2: when a new song catches me, i force myself to not listen that song so frecuently, because i will be tired of it quickly
I think people hate Frieren for many reasons I think the biggest reason is because its different and does not really fall into its trope or at least when it does its done in a way adapts to the show It treats the female characters like characters - Fern does not simply exist for Stark and Frieren was her own character and not just there for Himmel (Makes there relationship stronger in reality) Its more of a slow burn (Its not too action heavy and I find most Anime fans hate non action heavy shows a big reason why a lot of Slice of life and romance shows get hated on a lot The biggest reason I think, Its more of a character piece than a show case of power like a lot of popular shows
Yeah, I would say it definitely feels like a Slice of Life show that kind of snuck it's way into the main stream because of the fantasy setting and magic etc etc. It's also not really the kind of show you can mostly turn your brain off and enjoy, it's very much something that asks questions of the viewer and that can make it difficult to watch.
You do go in to more depth in your own way, but I think there really is a lot to the “meta” point you talk about. There are many times where this “meta” can take media somewhere but it is when they break this meta in some way that they reach some new height. And many times this “meta” can be quite a western thing so I’m sure for westerners there’s value to be found there. Spirited Away is a great example with its “breaking the meta” by not really following the story mountain idea (in broad terms). Studio ghibli in general really can be defined by not following metas in many ways. I mention “western” meta mainly because I’m sure that’s what is most commonly viewed by your viewers, me included, and since it applies to many popular movies. But of course, everywhere has “metas”. This doesnt mean actively breaking the meta is what makes good media good, but rather that not being restricted by it is what can push something to the next level. You mention a lot, in your way, how frieren seems to have a great balance of this idea.
I think this also relates to why people haven’t been liking the marvel movies recently as they seem to just be creating a “template” of action movies to follow some meta or recipe without actually adding much… depth. Yeah sure that can be entertaining, cool fights yay, but not much else. You dont have to go against the meta to “fix” this either, fried em breaks some tropes but embraces many others like you say. This balance and style, in how they are shown in the show, make it clear the creators weren’t “bound” by these metas. Sometimes the meta could be applied, sometimes it was broken. Not being bound by the meta really gives creators freedom and it shows.
Sorry for yapping in your comment section lol I love the show too and appreciate your work, thought I could try out giving my own input too. This vid was a great one thanks mate
I look at my anime list and imdb from time to time. To get some suggestions on what to watch. But Psycho-Pass is Ranked #239 on my anime list and not on imdb's top 250, while shows like Hunter x Hunter are ranked 8 and 34. (A show I dit not even finish) So I know that there are shows out there that I consider some of the best ever made, that will never make the list's. But there are also shows like Frieren and Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood that I love and still are able to top the list's. So I keep watching shows that makes the lists and shows that do not make the list. Lately I have enjoyed Vinland Saga, Odd Taxi and Blue Eyed Samurai. All shows that take there time telling there story and take there side correctors seriously. I can recommend all of them.
Reminds me when i avoided Solo Leveling when it was super popular and hyped up. Only read it for myself once the Excitement died down. 😂 One of the first Manwhas that got me into Korean and Chinese Manhua and Manhwas.
I'll be honest, I didn't watch the anime, but I read the manga for FMA, and I wouldn't even put it on my top 10, but the reason I think it's been number 1 for the longest time is that it's a solid show and a safe option for recommending anyone. I think the reason for Frieren to be able to dethrone it is because it's also a solid show that you are able to recommend anyone.
It's kinda funny comparing FMAB and Frieren. Not for the reason you think. FMAB was my first anime. My anime obsessed friend convinced me to watch it. After watching it, I could tell it was good, but I felt like it was not for me. I thought anime was not for me. Almost three years later and I have totally changed my mind. I really love anime, and I feel like I have finally watched enough anime to understand the niche of it that I enjoy. It was fun to come full circle and recommend Frieren to my friend who got me into it all in the first place. So for right now at least, Frieren is my favorite anime. That may change, but for now I just know I love this show to death.
I neeeed to watch Frieren, I want to. I have a feeling it's right up my alley, and that I might even rewatch it several times. But I'm too sleep deprived and depressed to enjoy it to the fullest rn ):
I'm usually big on the must watch shows, and will happily defend them. But Frieren just wasn't for me, and I'd be happy to leave it at that. But my god, do I get sick of things like "Let me explain how this genre or show is bad by comparing it to Frieren". No, I didn't like Frieren and you did, Frieren is for you. I liked this other thing and you didn't, it wasn't for you. The fans need to stop demanding everything turns into Frieren-colored goop. I don't hate Frieren, but I hate the community that uses it as a both a weapon and a universal standard.
That happened with things like Naruto, Harry Potter, and other oversaturated series. Heck, Cowboy Bebop hurt Outlaw Star because "Group of people on spaceship = OUTLAW STAR NOT BEBOP, OUTLAW STAR BAD!" when the series are severely different from each other and aren't good for comparison.
I'd like to claim I'm open minded in understanding the other sides opinion, but this happened only a few times to me. JoJo Part 7 Steel Ball Run The Batman No Game No Life Are 3 series that I dont follow the majority consensus and would like to believe i have a pretty strong argument as to why i think thats the case.
Let’s be honest it’s not gonna be NR 1 forever. I loved frieren but FMAB has withstood the test of time, time and time again. This is recency bias. Again I LOVED FRIEREN. FMAB will be back.
I don‘t think FMAB will be ever back at 1. Frieren has had a Rating of over 9.35 since it ended 3 Months ago. ONCE Season 2 comes around it might Even have a higher Score. FMAB will Never be No 1 on MAL again. Moreover smth Like being on No 1 with that big of a difference for over 6 Months can‘t be just „recency bias“ my guy
the only reason i clicked this video is because i know the quality of Pey's videos. the title rly made me think this was some kindah rage/click bait type of video i'm generally not interested in
for my mic I use a Neumann tlm 103 paired with an UAD Apollo Quad. Right now Im away from home though so i've been using an apollo solo with my laptop!
In this era of speedrunning, short attention span and instant gratification, frieren was a breath of fresh air, while yeah JJK was entertaining I didn't really care that much about the characters, frieren makes me want to take the time to understand each character and empathize with them, I can see why little kids wouldn't like it as they're so used to fast-paced action every second.
I already didn't think too highly about one piece, i already didn't like most typical shounens, I mostly watch weirder shows like Monogatari or Revue Starlight. But I want to make sure I when i think I won't like something so I watched 50 episodes of it and lo and behold I didn't like it. I then forced myself to read 200 chapters because "It gets good at Arabasta". I feel like i was just focusing on the things I dislike because I already got annoyed at friends saying it's the best thing ever while not giving my favourite shows a try. So I think your first point really applies to me! I don't think I would have liked one piece anyway but I think the constant stream of people hyping it up really didn't help.
Outlaw Star and Cowboy Bebop both have 5th episodes that make a better introduction to the series than the first 4, because the 5th episode is either when the main characters are together and things get really fun... or it's when you find out that there's more to Spike that it seems and the shit hits the fan. But honestly, you NEED to give a lot of series 5 or 6 episodes to get going, sometimes more. If things HAVE to fully hook you from moment one you're being a spoiled brat and you NEED more patience. So your homework assignment is to look up webcomics that seem interesting... and read them, and keep up with them, *and then watch as the majority of them disappear because the creator had to focus on other issues or they changed or any of many other reasons why webcomics end*. Build up some tolerance for things NOT being perfect right off the bat, and for losing stories that you loved.
If I have a criticism about frieren is the world is kinda generic fantasy land, the characters are deadpan, and the whole stuff is kinda boring (I'm talking about the manga, the anime fixed a lot of these problems and put fast pacing) Frieren is very good in what it tries(be a slice of life), but FMA is much more ambitious and manages to succeed in these ambition, in stakes, unique world building, complex characters with motivations
I don't dislike frieren because its popular, I dislike it because I didn't enjoy watching it, it wasn't interesting to me. I have read multiple novels with similar story, so I was quite surprised people being so positive about it when it's nothing really special.
I love Frieren not necessarily because of the story but especially how the story is told, how the characters interact and the world is constructed and of course how the magic system works
This should be the opinion on any piece of media anyone experiences. It should really be only personal preference of which you like something or don’t like something. I think it might also be more common to experience a dislike for something when it is popular. Sometimes that popular thing seems forced or you can recognise specifically that if it is popular for a specific concept than why is something else that you know is similar. I have experienced this with popular things like one piece but I have also experienced it with much less popular things and I’ve realised the issue of not liking something can come from anything wether it’s about the thing or not. I don’t like it because I just don’t like it, or I do like it just because I do like it.
I really liked the first few chapters of frieren, but i didnt really think the later chapters were anything special. What sets Frieren apart is that its a pretty decent execution on the concept of lifespan, at least the best in terms of anime. However does it justify the top spot? I guess to enough people it is, but I personally think more about the Konosuba cast than i do Frieren in general, and this was before frieren was an anime and konosuba was back in relevancy with season 3...
I rarely read the description and was apatic to this anime for a long time, because the only thing I was seeing is a kudere elf, which didn't resonate with me. But I'm subscribed to a ton of reaction channels and almost every person was reacting to it, so I decided to give it a try. So, in my case, popularity drove me in even though Ihate a lot of popular stuff. I think popularity a least is a reason to give it a try for a lot of people.
I think Frieren is mid because characterization is weak, character drama is very weak, most of the tension revolves around "well actually I can do this [queue flashback]" and then they beat the tension moment.
I love LOTR, and fantasy, and so Frieren - on the surface - easily qualifies as something I would potentially like. I don't remember clearly how it went so here's an approximation: First heard of it from a mention in a video or something, and then I saw it again a couple of times and heard it's got 'Tolkien' vibes. Finally, I looked it up and the positive reception seemed solid, but I didn't look deeper into it so I knew almost nothing about it, and I'm not in anime circles so it didn't get overhyped for me (unlike Arcane which was getting promoted and praised everywhere). And so I begin the first episode and the characters are talking about having defeated the Big Bad and are on their way back to this city. Okay, that's different. Maybe they're gonna flashback to it, idk. I keep watching; the art looks great, the colors are pleasant, the vibes are chill - and then they have a talk about the meteor shower and they focus on how the elf perceives time so differently from the rest of the party and how detached and impersonal she seems. Okay, cool, I assume that's gonna come up later. And then I get to them parting ways and she says she'll visit them again 50 years later... ✨ TIME SKIP MONTAGE ✨ and it was beautiful but, woah, I wasn't expecting the time skip. 👀 And then they meet again and Himmel's so old now and the theme of Frieren's perception of time returns. Then the party goes on a journey as Frieren had promised to take them a better spot to watch the meteor shower, we get a close-up of Himmel and then... Himmel's dead. And we're at the funeral. Some strangers comment on how Frieren's not even sad. Rude. Heiter and Eisen defend her with humor and that was wholesome. And then the burial scene happens, and Frieren starts sobbing. I, at the time, had recently lost a relative, maybe a month ago. And even before then, a few relatives in the past. I wasn't expecting grief to be a major theme. I got a bit teary-eyed. I think that was when I felt the 'heart' of the show. I guess that was what hooked me, so I kept watching, and Fern's introduced in episode 2 and the theme of grief returns, and I kept watching, then magic was a highlight in episode 3 and it was cool. So on and so forth. I was always left wanting for more. (*Side note: It's been a while since I watched it and I haven't rewatched it at all, so apologies for inaccuracies.) So now, honestly, it currently sits up there among my top favorites of all time, being LOTR, Avatar: The Last Airbender, (insert a few less universally loved shows here), etc. The slow pace only bothered me a couple of times, but rest of the time, I loved the coziness of it. And the quality of the show had stayed consistent throughout. In my personal experience, while I see the hype now - partly 'cause I look for it - it's not quite 'popular' enough. I've seen more JJK buzz without looking for it. Even my younger sister knows about JJK, as she told me as I recently started it and she asked the title, but she hasn't/hadn't heard about Frieren back when I was watching it.
not liking a popular piece of media can lead some (weird) people to try to treat you as the odd one for not liking it like "everyone else". something being popular only means that and has, more often than not, little to nothing to do with how good it may be. when people try to argue that, i often like to remind them that junk food is extremely popular, but can hardly be considered as the best tasting food on the planet. one man's trash is another man's treasure.
AoT and Rurouni Kenshin: Trust & Betrayal is my favourite anime ahead of Frieren. However, Frieren is technically the best anime and deserves the top spot at MAL without a question.
Huh. I never would have considered Frieren's first episode as slow-paced, to be honest. Also I thought the first four episodes were originally aired collectively as "the pilot", which is why the season is 28 episodes rather than the usual 24?
I believe that the rating doesn't show whether it's the best anime or not. The rating shows how likely a person is to like the anime and the closer the rating is to 10, the higher the chance of that.
I had the exact opposite experience with frieren, for me the first few episodes where really cozy and it had me interested in where the show was gonna go and based on the first episode setting the expectation of having themes of heavy grief and regret but as the show progressed I enjoyed it less and less as I realized that those themes would never be explored and when the show just kept trying to hammer in how great these characters are despite most of them being really unlikable. Himmel and Fern are honestly some of the worst characters I have ever seen in anime. There was still some things I liked though, probably as many things as I dislike so in the end frieren is a 5/10 for me, a few characters, the style and the music were definitely very good but it just isn't enough to make up for the rest. I also do agree that complaining that it's too slow and boring isn't a valid criticism, it's the whole point, I just don't think they did the premise very well
Guitar player at a bar or club: "Any requests?" THAT GUY: "FREEBIRD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" Guitar player: "Any OTHER requests?" ^Witness the reason why Freebird was a disappointment when I heard it after over a decade of that bullshit "joke" about the song.
Honestly, I know Fullmetal Alchemist's top spot has been the subject of a lot of drama with a big clash between communities, but as much as I love Frieren, I feel like Fullmetal Alchemist kinda belongs there more. I don't think I can reasonably compare the shows in terms of which I consider better, but Fullmetal Alchemist is iconic, and left such an enormous legacy in a way that only a few shows can compete with. Like maybe Attack on Titan or Avatar (if you consider that an anime). Of course, Frieren may go on to prove itself as one of the greats, but I feel like it still has yet to reach it's most pivotal moments in this first season. Also I never noticed the Disney Hamilton logo had detail on the person, I thought it was just a silhouette like the Broadway version
As you brought up the 3 episode thing... we have to remember that when this released in Japan, it did release with the first 4 episodes all at once.
Arguably, the first episode ALONE isn't MEANT to hook the viewer... rather it's just the first part of the introduction to Frieren, not the whole introduction on its own.
Which makes me wonder, did Pey watch the first episode alone, or did he watch the first four together?
This brings up the argument of "weekly watching" and "pacing". You can't properly critique pacing unless you are watching the show all at once since only at one time ever will people be forced to watch or read something weekly. After that, it will forever be at whatever pace a person wants so the weekly pacing becomes irrelevant. Most people will probably watch at least an episode a night or every other night but I doubt just once a week. It makes you wonder if it's better to focus on that weekly pacing that is only ever going to be relevant now vs proper pacing which will be relevant for the rest of time.
@@upg5147 These days with the ability to wait and binge from the off? Definitely proper pacing overall. That even applied in the past if you were looking to sell box-sets.
For example, I hear two things about One-Piece as an anime:
- It's great!
- The pacing suuuuuuucks
And that's one that has had people watching it "weekly" for decades now.
Even watching it weekly, there's arguments for proper pacing. I'm thinking of OP and DragonBall here a lot - where a fight could go on for months, because of the terrible pacing.
The first 4 episodes of Frieren aired on the same day on Crunchyroll as well.
@@upg5147 I agree with that argument. I've made it myself a couple of times. I have to say tho, there's some (very few) anime that's been made with the weekly schedule in mind and are better that way than watching it when it's full released but yeah, most of the times the quality of a series skyrockets when one watches it at their own pace.
I think Frieren is the only anime I watched with my mother that actually made us feel like we were on a slow adventure through a fantastic fantasy world. Just like a soft dream.
Reading this comment makes me want to convince my mom to watch it now.
@@midtaku5379 I've talked with a lot of friends that if there's an anime I would proudly show my mom, and she would probably like it, it's Frieren and we all agree for now :P
“Anime that you can watch with your mother” should be its own genre.
@@midtaku5379 If you think your mother will enjoy it, you should do it.
Watch Natsume's Book of Friends and Mushishi
So how I found this anime helped me enjoy it so much. No one ever said anything about it to me, I never saw it recommended, I didn't even see it online with clips, but I kept seeing friends post nonspoiler memes about it. One day I finally thought to myself. If everyone is posting memes about this show, but no is talking bad about it. It must be incredible, because people are always happy to let you know when something is bad.
This was just over a month ago, but it has always made me wonder if I would have liked it as much if everyone pushed/recommended it to me. It has made me hesitant to recommend the show too hard to people.
I totally understand where you're coming from. there have been many very popular shows that I have put of watching for a long time, because it was they were so recommended. And I think, in ways, i enjoyed those shows less due to that, than if I had discovered them by myself.
I feel like when a show is being pushed to me, I get like....analytical? In ways. with Frieren, I just kind of stumbled upon it, watched it, and it's one of my favorite shows I've seen in a very long time.
Same. All I saw was one short video recommending it, so I tried it. I definitely let people know what they are in for with this show. It's slow, but it's cozy. And it doesn't have crazy twists, just subtle realizations that make the show so rewarding. It might be my favorite anime, but like he said in the video, it's hard to compare it to shows that have multiple seasons.
I think mine is somewhat similar, in essence. I only knew it as “a show with good worldbuilding and that one scene she tells someone to kill themself”
Then I watched the 1st episode and was smacked in the face violently by how fucking amazing it is and also almost cried which is rare since I just don’t cry to media much at all ever.
You know your viewers value the your work when there’s essentially no comments before the runtime of the actual video itself
Finally
I think there's a difference between dislike and hate. I dislike MLP, but I don't hate it. I don't care enough about MLP to hate it. It's kinda crazy how some people care enough to specifically hate something.
I think that it is linked to how much praise a show gets. Of course it's not justification. I am just saying, when everyone praises a product, that it forever raised the standard of the industry and fixed everything wrong with said industry; the people that don't feel that way about it may or may not feel frustrated. As if their views were incorrect, or atleast, outside of what is commonly thought. Some people may not care because they're not that much in contact with the product, or because they are focused on other stuff. Others however may act upon their feelings of frustration and express it one way or another, leading to unconstructed opinions or blatant hate speech.
@@josephsavio1972we had that last year aswell with baldurs gate, just the way of the world i guess
Many shows deserve hate for irreparablely damaging the medium such as sword art online
@@Sammysapphira What do you mean? If a show is popular and people try to replicate but said popularity, it's not the fault of the creator. If you admit such behaviour then you should admit that we should collectively hate mushoku tensei for popularizing modern Isekai. Plus you have better to do than hating on some piece of media
I think hating a piece of media is fully justified if you have a small child who insists on watching Baby Shark or Skibid Toilet on repeat.
Othewise, yeah, it`s more energy than it`s worth.
I find it poetic that FMAB where the MC is a rationalist that beives in science and technology while disregarding gods and magic as fairy tales is bested by Freiren, an anime that is all about magic, deamons and gods.
Another factor is that people tend to associate the anime they like with their personal identity. Their favorite anime can't be too popular, or else that would make them a basic person. Like, someone who's favorite film is The Godfather, because that's the go to example of a "great film." The actual quality of the product ceases to matter, simply because you can't use it to express your "individuality."
This. Never underestimate the power of pride and snobbish superiority.
Not that I disagree with your point about someone "being a fan" of something less popular to make themselves sound better, but it isn't necessarily a bad thing in itself to make the shows you like a part of your identity. I think its important to take pride in what you truly like as it is part of representing who you are in a sense. Using myself as an example, I never shy away from telling someone my favorite anime is Aria, even though they make look at me weird for not saying something widely popular like One Piece or FMAB. Not out of a sense of superiority because it's less known but because it was such a positive impact on my life and what I strive to be and I'd like to be proud of that.
Gross
You just gave me the realization that the reason Frieren's MAL ranking is such a big talking point for this series isn't because MAL's ranking system is a reliable metric to judge the popularity or quality of an anime...it's SPECIFICALLY because it isn't. Brotherhood is amazing, but the fact it was never dethroned shows how broken the system really is, and Frieren still managed to overtake it. Regardless of your opinion on Frieren or MAL, that's worth talking about.
Mal is as baluable as any other democratic system its used as its most well known and populer of sources which bu boting standsrds means most reliable as has bigest voter base
FMAB is also fucking overrated for too many Years. I watched it and it was okay but nowhere that good that it deserves so long number 1.The Fanbase is also fucking cancer. They are disgusting. And because I laughing at them that Frieren will not be leaving number 1 for a long time.
@@Gecko3456I also hate how you can just bombard a show with 1 so the entire show score get lower because a jealous fanbase
The primary reason FMAB stayed at the top of the list isn't because it was the best anime ever made never to be topped. It's because it's fans are so rabid that they spent 10 years review bombing anything that threatened to take over the #1 position to keep it on top. Often without ever fairly evaluating the other shows first.
yeah the fma cabal has been a real thing at times, i remember them review bombing a couple shows a while back and the controversy around it, idk if they still do that
as for fma itself i find it very mid, the original fma is better than brotherhood imo as well
as for frieren, its good, but i feel like a lot of people who have frieren as their #1 didnt watch that many anime
I find calling the first episode of an anime "the pilot" very weird because in the anime industry, the pilot is the manga, the first episode is not a pilot, the studio is contracted to make the entire season and sometimes the entire series with all the seasons
Yea a pilot is to test whether to continue a show or not (if it does well), so wouldnt make sense.
But he just meant the first episode here quite obviously and just misused the word
Well written shows deserve to be up there on the list. I love FMAB as well as Fieren's first season. Not sure I could pick a favorite since I like them for different reasons.
Frieren is so much better. FMAB is really fucking overrated
I completely agree, it's so hard to chose between them because they're barely even competitors within the genre. It's like asking whether I love my mom or my wife more. The metrics we use to determine what is "the best" will greatly affect the answers. The best at what? It's an empty question. FMA:B is my favorite anime of all time, and I'm fine with Frieren overtaking it because I know it isn't an actual representation of what is considered better.
@@Gecko3456chill man, you look no different than those FMAB maniacs
@@bamers404Fmab maniacs gotta let go of nostalgia. Its nowhere near top 1
I have a friend who hates it. We had a half-hour argument because three of us were watching Frieren together, and she refused to recognize the narrative purpose in having Fern fight with Frieren's clone. She kept arguing the entire scene was stupid because after other characters building her up and the narrative was framing Fern as being "The one who will surpass/beat Frieren", It ended up being Frieren herself who did most of the fighting against the clone. Pointing out in particular how her first sneak attack failed.
Me and my other friend were trying to explain to her that the point of the scene wasn't that Fern was supposed to beat Frieren *now*, but that Fern would EVENTUALLY become able to. Her first sneak attack failed because Fern is still inexperienced and that was her first attempt, but she suceeded in her second attempt to prove she did indeed have the potential.
But she just didn't get it, and refused to acknowledge the narrative through-line.
She still insists that Frieren is trash and it saddens me that she brushes it off so flagrantly.
tbh at that point I wouldn't consider her my friend anymore if i were you (only partially a joke, im pretty serious about writing and stuff like that so disagreeing on something like this would turn me off hard) anyway its her loss for not recognizing something so good
@@rai.2876 Well, I expect my friends to not insult the things I love so blatanly, even if they don't like it for whatever reason. If one of my friends, knowing that I really like something, were to shit on my opinion like that... well it wouldn't be about the thing anymore lol
She hates Frieren for that one thing in narrative? How...
Maybe she expects Fern to win at that fight, just like with what happens on most Shonen Anime "underdog" fights?
Dear lord, just reading this made me really REALLY upset (and sad on your behalf) lol
My take on FMAB is that the first episodes did not have that impact that the original FMA anime had. But the moment the FMA deviated from manga it went to hell... FMAB got on the level of the first half of FMA after that moment where it followed the manga and dropped all that sht FMA came up with.
And considering Frieren... I havent seen a TV show with such attention to detail in a very looong time (if I have ever). They mostly show and tell very little, but you can get the whole picture from analyzing the small bits and that is something I really like. That and the very high production value make it my favorite anime.
This might be a hot take, but FMA is actually much better than FMAB
If you want a show with high attention to detail watch monogatari, especially second seson (which is actually season 4 but whatever).
@@susbedo9258 I don’t know if I would go as far as to say it’s much better than FMAB, but I think in several aspects (mainly during the first half) it blows FMAB out of the water. However, I think FMAB’s plot and world building is far better planned out and executed than FMA’s. Once you get to about episode 12 or so in FMAB the show really picks up and the way everything comes together in the last arc is really satisfying. I’d rate them both around the 8 to 10 range, since both are excellent series. I don’t really get the hate for FMA considering they did a pretty good job cutting the show short and still keeping it engaging and relatively competent, though the finale is a bit messy and definitely needed a few more episodes to properly develop and defeat the main villain and resolve the political situation at the end.
Brotherhood "rushes" the first arc of the manga because FMA added extra material to flesh that part out. After that, it takes its time and goes all out.
That's why watching the first part of the original is recommended before watching FMA.
Another thought-provoking episode in the series! This topic has actually been on my mind recently as well, because of another explanation I heard for why popular media also tends to have a substantial group of people who dislike it, which is that the more popular something is, the more likely it is to reach outside of the audience it was made for. So, a show like Frieren is likely to get a lot more views from people who probably won't enjoy it than a show fewer people have seen or heard of. Just thought I'd add that to the list of reasons why popular things are sometimes looked down on.
One thing you do really well in your reviews are the disclaimers. Always on point, clear, needed and they are embedded in the flow of the video, instead of feeling like an annoying technicality you need to get done before the video proper starts. Good job!
Thank you! I'll make sure to keep putting effort into those
I think I had the perfect exposure to Frieren
First, because of some change in how my imagination works, I adore ambiance. I love the spaces inbetween that Frieren treats with so much care and detail, and I love the small, personal, insulated moments within every line of the story which ooze with genuinity and the detailed, homely spaces they take place in that make me feel cozy. -w-
I can also treat well cared for and well crafted worlds and characters like a separate reality, and not only is Frieren made with the most care I've seen in (almost) any piece of media ever, its world is one that I can get lost in, something that I can imagine as real (not in the weird way, I promise!), and thinking like this removes any expectation or outside opinion on the work. No one's own personal opinion can influence my own, because as I see it, everyone can and will realize this world in their own way, and as long as the world keeps respecting itself and its inhabitants, my expectations of its reality are met, because how the story plays out is not in my hands, but more of its own.
Basically, while there are people that Frieren doesn't emotionally resonate with, it resonates so much with me that it's causing vibrations :3
I agree. I love it when stories have good world-building because it makes the audience more immersed in it.
Best part about frieren is the characters and storytelling. Even in the manga it's just so consistently good and only gets better. Even minor characters in this series gets there own moments to shine. If El dorado and goddess monument arc gets adapted in a season to it's easily going surpass season 1 which is kinda insane given how good the first season was. The author of frieren takes his to build the characters which pays off greatly in the long run. Frieren fight scenes aren't even much prominent in the manga but when a fight happens it's incredibly tense and impactful because of the multiple layers character conflicts involved. Honestly peak writing in every way
This is so weird to me because care and detail was one of the main reasons I didn't like the show. It didn't feel like an organic world and people didn't seem to behave in natural ways, it felt like a generic shounen anime. However I just came to it from Dungeon Mushi so that could've given me unrealistic expectations
It's funny but both FMAB asnd FBJE, in their own way. deal essentially with the concept of mortality and what it means to live.
It's just that FMAB deals with it in an "aggressive" way. Frieren instead in a more "pacific acceptance" way.
it's sort of like the 5 stage of grief. Humanity is slowly accepting that dying is alright, after the medical boom that expanded our lifespan 20/30 years more.
we still reaching that ultimate last step. and we are slowly understanding it?
idk its just a thought i had while you spoke about the anime
Other way around: we are becoming increasingly less comfortable with death and the passage of time, which is why the themes can now have an impact. In the past these kinds of fairy tales were much more common but as theaters and audiences became more materialistic their morals went out of style. Hopefully what we're seeing now is the tipping point.
@@rumfordc yeah its another perspective. Tho tbh frieren doesnt treat death as unconfortable. But explores more what happen after life ends. (Beyond the journey ;) ) as Himmel's gradually vanishes from people's memories. His statues get dirty. His message forgotten.
And thats not just him. There's also the elf monk and his human friend who were even more ancient heroes. Forgotten.
But even so the message frieren gives is to "bring your memory into the future" (see the episode with the old dwarwen guard) which is what shes doing with himmel in her own way. Most of what she tells Fern and Stark stems directly from her experience with him and the hero's party (which is strange honestly considering shes more than a thousands years old. Did she not have any other exoeriences to share? But its just a nitpick).
So as to bring not them. But their message into the future.
Cause people die but ideas live on forever? Sort of?
@@simonenoli4418 >"did she not have other experiences to share?"
She really didn't. She lived the majority of her life in isolation before joining the hero's party. The ten years she traveled with Himmel and the 2ish she has spent with Fern and Stark so far are probably the most eventful periods in her life.
@@ericsalsbery4363 i somehow doubt it. She traveled a lot with Flamme and continued to do so on her own to seek quirky spells. Its not like she buried herself in a cave like Serie did.
@@simonenoli4418 She says in one of the later episodes that after Flamme died she lived alone in her forest until Himmel came to recruit her for his party. From the way I understood it, her hobby of collecting spells only came about because Himmel praised her.
Hiya! Just wanna leave my experience with Frieren here:
I don't hate the show, it just never managed to grab me. I watch up to episode 8, and I stopped here because I really didn't feel like there was any point of contention in the story. All challenges and threats Frieren and her party faced could really easily be dispatched, same goes for the interpersonal frame and the conflict Frieren felt at the beginning of the series.
I really wanted to like the show, and after every episode I took the time to analyse it with my friend who was watching it with me! I could see all the ingredients for an amazing anime, but felt the writing stunted 90% of the shows potential.
The show hasn't shown me what it wants to talk about, and I'm left here wondering if it ever will beyond what was established in the first 4 episodes.
I would consider watching a few more episodes, as although I don’t remember what goes on in ep 8 I do know it got better for me with each episode. Cause I too had dropped it, but maybe a month later picked it up and started to enjoy it
I agree with you.
I'm at episode 16 or 18, watching it with friends who all love it. The writing feels very stunted and I expected the world building to be good, but every town and forest looks the same as the last. We get to see Frieren's recent history with the flashbacks, but we don't really get to see any history of the world we're in. As it's about Frieren growing less apathetic and more interested, it would have been a really good chance to explore more of the actual world in the current timeline. But instead of that, they just keep throwing in pretty flat new characters that need exposing and who Frieren can react to.
I have more gripes with how the series has done certain things, but to me, this is the most glaring. I love fantasy, I had really hoped to like this series.
@@canwejustnotcrazy how wrong of an opinion you have
While I agree with your observations of the hype meta, how popularity can prompt a knee-jerk oppositional reaction, I don't think it's the full picture. Personally, I've yet to encounter meaningful engagement with critiques of Frieren. Mind you, there are a lot of aspects of the anime I enjoyed. However, I found myself frustrated with how conflict is set up and resolved, and I became far too aware of the dynamic by the end of Aura's arc.
First, a problem is introduced in the present. Next we get a flashback to the past which clues in the audience. Finally, the encounter is handily resolved by our protagonists. It's like if a heist scene showed the audience the full plan in advance, then it goes off without a hitch - there's no intrigue or excitement! As a result, the flashbacks in Frieren cheapen conflict and tension building because it tuns out that Frieren already had a trick up her sleeve from centuries ago, and the battle is a foregone conclusion in her eyes. Not even Fern or Stark were in any real danger despite their comparative inexperience fighting demons, because Frieren said so. The only way tension could be maintained at this point is if the information telegraphed in flashbacks was then subverted.
Between noticing this, and people's starry-eyed takes about how the work is an absolute masterpiece, my feelings grew dissonant as I had lost the magic. I'm glad other people enjoy the work, I just happen to find myself in this awkward position where I keep hearing about how amazing it is, and it reminds me of what I didn't get to experience.
same here
Funnily enough I was just explaining this to someone today. Frieren is far and away my favorite show and possibly story of all time, and yet I don't think it's the best written. hell, maybe its not even the second best. one of the flaws, like you said, is that the solution to a majority of the fights (if not all of them) are rather straightforward and telegraphed. the way I saw, fights never needed to be anything more than that. in fact, to me thats precisely why the fights achieve what they want to. in both adventures (with Himmel and in the present), it was/is never a question of if she CAN bond with people, but if she WOULD and if she sees the value in doing so. by the end of season 1, Frieren is a lot more empathetic towards other people (hell Eisen even explicitly says so rather early on), and that's because of every interaction she's had with other people, big or small. sometimes, those interactions happen to be battles, but since the battles are meant to be just instances of interpersonal connection rather than a thrilling action sequence, the outcome doesn't need to be a mystery. however, I do believe it is very much possible to make the battles interesting in and of themselves without detracting from this and has potential to elevate the scene even further, but whether or not that would happen in practice is up for debate. all i know is that the way it's been done in Frieren so far, I like that they've stayed true to their original goal and prioritized the character dynamics over the battle dynamics, but that may just be my preference/taste.
spoilers below for anime watchers i guess?
one of my favorite examples of this is stark killing the dragon. the second you learn that the big ass canyon is a result of stark's training, literally anyone could figure out how that fight was gonna go down. the mystery of the outcome was never the point of the fight, it was just a moment for stark to gain some confidence and, probably more importantly, a moment for frieren to have an impact/develop a bond with someone.
I hope I don't sound like I'm trying to convince you to love Frieren. You just noted a lack of engagement with Frieren's shortcomings and I wanted to provide my perspective. Of course, even after reading this maybe you still don't see it that way, or maybe you do and the simplistic nature just doesn't particularly resonate with you. I'm very much biased towards Frieren because amidst the trends of modern storytelling (where standing out skews towards increasingly complex premises) I've been searching for awhile now for stories with a couple elements: highlight the beauty of the simple things (since so many stories have such grandiose concepts/events now), have solid world building in a Tolkien-esque style (I just feel like Tolkien-esque worlds are more about subversion than embracing it), and a story with a simple Hero's Journey structure (which I feel like has gone out of style lately with a few exceptions like Edge of Tomorrow, another one of my absolute favorites). Frieren just happens to be all of the above and then some, so I'm VERY biased. But anyways, I just like discussing storytelling, and I'd love to hear your thoughts! It's not too often I get to openly disagree with someone and then discuss about why, so it'd be a treat to hear your perspective
@@olivertan8994 my perspective which is quite opinionated is this: the main cast kinda sucks
frieren, fern, and start are nearly perfect characters barring 1 weakness (bonding, anger, confidence). the characters dont learn or grow throughout the series; it does not feel that much of a journey, especially for fern or stark. (mainly about strength, but also character as well)
with a series that’s main focus is the characters: if you don’t like the main cast, you just cant like the series
(also everything is predictable in frieren to me. i dont really consider it a flaw, but i feel like the conclusions werent rewarding enough; which is mainly just frieren’s lore)
@@stego- yeah that makes perfect sense. the fondest road trip you had with your best buds would probably not even be enjoyable if you went with a group of acquaintances, and as far as characters go, i just happened to see a lot of myself and my best friends in them, so i very quickly became attached. i think saying the main cast is nearly perfect aside from 1 flaw is JUST A SMIDGE too reductive (just a bit) but in general yeah, a perfectly reasonable complaint. but, i do disagree with one thing and i want to ask about another. i don't think that the cast hasn't learned anything, i think that they just haven't become actionable yet. i think the events of s1 are part of a slow, methodical, and subtle internal accumulation of experiences for the characters before something clicks and they finally have external growth. there has yet to be any of that in s1, like you said, so that's all speculation/hope, but i think it's WELL within the realm of possibility. my question is what makes you not see it as a journey? i think my definition of what a journey is is rather simple, and so it fits for me, but i'd love to know if i missed/overestimated something or if you have a different criteria for what you see as a journey.
thanks for the thoughts though! i gave a rather...hefty recommendation to a few of my friends in which i now think i should re-emphasize the impact of my own personal biases in my enjoyment of Frieren in order to avoid unmet expectations
@olivertan8994 I get that you love Frieren and, as you said, are probably biased because of it, but to say that the world is tolkien-esque feels like an insult towards Tolkien.
There's so much history interwoven into every bit of Tolkien's world. Everything has 3 layers of history to it, even sth simple as the name of the river Brandywine/Baraduin.
Frieren's world lacks history. The villages, planes, and forests lack individual personality, architecture, and a story of why it's there. Even the religion in Frieren, which has a kinda big role in the series as many characters are hinted to being religious or are priests, lacks depth. The religion gets further introduced with exposure by talking about it, but it hasn't been shown much in a natural way (none to very few churches in the distance of the places they visit/ none to few little chapels/ people making religious signs/ different offshoots of the religion in different regions).
The characters have the same problem. Their main personality trait is their literal name in German and they have very few distinctions besides that one thing. They aren't that well rounded.
They also feel very disconnected from the places they're from, there's no traditional dress, no local customs they have that are different from other characters, etc.
Tolkien is so good at exactly this, which is why his world feels so alive and true.
Avatar the last airbender/TLOK also did a very good job at this. Less deep as Tolkien, but ATLA has a history that gets slowly revealed and has regional distinctiveness, even in areas where the elements are more mixed. Frieren doesn't even come close to Avatar's world building in my opinion, let alone Tolkien.
Sorry for the rant. I really care about good world-building
No work of art has ever garnered 100% likes as Pey's dislike of the Sistine Chapel would indicate. Art is subjective. One person is triggered by a work, and another person is not by that same work. One can make factual statements of things like who wrote something, when was it created, how much did it gross at the box office, and on and no. But other statements such as "This work is a masterpiece, this work is GOOD. And you should like it, because I like it" don't wash. One cannot prove ABSOLUTE GOODNESS in anything. Does not someone feel offended when that person likes a work and their best friend turns traitor and dislikes it? How do you process that information? "To each his/her own" or "We are no longer friends"?
Interesting take. I can agree with most of the points being made.
Speaking for myself, during the first episode I formed the impression that the characters are two-dimensional. Not flat but not extremely complex either. Of course as I watched more, I changed my mind about their complexity. They actually feel like real people.
During the first seven episodes, I considered the show to be "good". A solid show that is definitely worth watching but no more than that. Then came episode 8 where Aura appeared and it was revealed why Frieren is called "Frieren the Slayer"... and that's where my jaw dropped. That spectacular episode convinced me that this anime is truly something special. My admiration further increased as I kept watching and now I believe it's one of the best works of fiction ever made.
Thank you for letting me know that you agree with most of the points being made. You are very important so I was wondering! Now that you agree, I agree as well.
@@rumfordcI don't understand, are you being sarcastic? If so, very poor choice of words. You aren't saying anything of substance here. I don't see the point of your reply...
@@angelodescordo8455 I approve of this little take you have here. It meets a portion of my standards.
@@rumfordc You're confusing me. But alright, I guess...
@@angelodescordo8455 Just letting you know that I can agree with most of what you've said. Isn't that nice to hear? Now you know. Also, just so you know, I'm speaking for myself.
frieren caused me to start having existential crisis' of how short life is. 8/10
frieren caused me to think i should start gambling at mimics in games
10/10
It's not short it's that we don't use it as we should
I think another big factor is being let down by something overhyped. Oshi No Ko felt that way when I finally got around to watching it. It was great, but certainly not #1 material. But it had been so hyped up that i was dissapointed it didnt "live up" to the insane hype. Ironically, when I got around to watching Inception a couple years ago (like 8 years after the relase and everyone was actually kinda criticial of it now) i legit though it was one of the best movies ive ever seen.
To summarize, if you expect something to be absolutely amazing, and it is...well its kinda just met your expectations, and moat people would rate it lower for not being above expectations. Thats why I prefer to start all my experiences at a 5/10, and then can go up or down from there.
@@KK-ef1ow This is how I felt about Demon Slayer, for example. Everyone was hyping it up and saying it was great, so I went to check out what all the fuss was about. But it ended up being mostly just because of it's animation. In an actual story sense it was just mediocre, maybe slightly above average.
What immediately killed Oshi No Ko for me was when the guy(I think he was a producer or something) just casually accepted an intelligent talking baby and rights it off as a by product of social media influence. I know it's probably a petty reason on my part but sometimes it's the simplest of things like those that can ruin a potentially good series for me as it puts me off so much that I discontinue it. While I can't use Inception as an example as you did since I was hooked from the first time I saw the trailer(didn't get to watch it till years later), I can relate using Transformers(the first movie) as an example. I avoided it for years due to the bias I had that movie adaptations on anime wouldn't live up to my expectations, so when it came out I was in 7th/8th grade and wanted to do nothing with it. Around 2010 my dad came from abroad with it on DVD and I was bored enough to give it a try...to date, the helicopter transformation scene in the beginning of the movie remains my all time favorite of the series because it completely tore down my bias with how it blew my mind. Sorry for the wall of text but your comment brought up some memories and emotions that I felt were relatable.
I continue to love listening to your insights on art, anime and especially Frieren! Thank you! ❤
5:35 yep, this is my reason not liking popular media. People recommend a lot to me then when I tried it, it's just decent or even bad.
So lucky for me I found Frieren by myself, not through recommendation. If I were recommended, maybe I also won't like Frieren.
i think a really interesting idea is that i believe the author of frieren stated that it was originally pitched as a comedy, not an adventure through the human experience. i believe it was supposed to be a pretty generic hero vs demon king gag story, but it eventually evolved to what it is now. idk really interesting idea consider how frieren uses comedy (a topic i think would be super intriguing to hear your thoughts on)
The scene that sold me on Frieren and pushed me to continue watching after hearing great things about it and being mildly interested in the first episode, was actually the second episode, specifically a line said by Heiter.
"If there is even just one precious memory in the walls of your mind, I think it would be a waste to die."
This was the line that spoke to me, and pushed me to continue watching, even dragging my friend with me so we could watch it together.
I started reading the manga I think before the anime was even announced, so maybe you’ll find my thoughts interesting when I say the first episode also didn’t hook me.
It had already become my favorite manga, so I didn’t need convincing to watch the anime, but after the first episode, I wasn’t sure it was hitting the same as the manga. I was going to watch it no matter what, but I felt the nature of the story was more fit for short chapters, and I thought the format of humor didn’t translate well to animation. I also was initially underwhelmed by the animation, particularly with the meteor shower, but I can’t put my finger on why as I don’t believe that anymore. I don’t remember when it was that I changed my mind, it might’ve been Qual, Stark, maybe the demons. The more and more I watched the more I began to love the anime.
But there was also a sense of pride that came up when I started seeing it actually become popular. The memes of Frieren saying k**l yourself particularly got on me nerves. For me, I was watching some great writing, great animation and a powerful moment that made me love the manga because I loved the way demons were depicted. But now I was seeing people compare Frieren to that one dude who’s name I forget, like come on it’s a serious and badass scene. I didn’t understand how people can love Aura so much when it’s Frieren that’s the highlight of her appearance, and I despised the p**nographic art drawn of my favorite characters (still do honestly).
I felt sort of protective of Frieren, it was sort of like, “I knew about this amazing story before everyone else, I know how to actually appreciate it. Everyone else is so shallow.” But at some point I realized, why am I complaining that my favorite story is now at the top of myanimelist? I’ve wanted to see people enjoy the series, I now get to watch this beautiful animation. So what if some people don’t view it the exact same as me? So what if some people say stupid things sometimes? So what if some people don’t really care for the show? I can enjoy it the same way whether thousands or hundreds are watching as well. I moved past my pride, and now I can truly appreciate my favorite show
i think honestly if fmab was released now in 2024 and got tons of praise, a lot of people who hated frieren would of also hated fmab, some people may just genuinely not like frieren but i noticed a lot of people people don't like change of their favorite animes.
Great video. It's hard for me to say why this show didn't click with me, everyone was so archetypelike and so powerful that it made me uninterested on it from start to finish, not just the pilot. I probably fell victim of the overhype and dared the show to surprise me and it didn't. The overexposure started for me when everyone hyped the manga a couple years back and i read the first chapter really found it bland, but didn't give it a chance past the 1 chapter. All the hype that came even before the anime aired made me question why a show that crappy 1 ch i read a couple years back was being so praised, so even if i did try to give it a fair chance and watched all of it, it was apparently doomed from the start for me
On the subject of the characters being too powerful to "create any stakes" it is because there is no need for there to be. The purpose of their journey is simply to travel north so Frieren can see Himmel. Every "fight" or conflict they run into where they need to use their powers is simply a means to an end. Take the dragon vs Stark fight early on. It's purpose isn't to show off how strong Stark and the rest of them are in comparison to it, the watcher/reader can already tell that when they see the canyon from his training. It's to give Stark a chance to build his confidence in himself and his desire to protect the villagers. The exam arc is the same thing. It is merely a means to an end so that they can continue traveling. Not saying your wrong for not liking it anyways I just wanted to share that.
I'll be honest... When I see/hear everyone going on about a show, I almost actively avoid it.
A few recommendations? Heck yeah - I'll go watch that!
Everyone not shutting up about it, be it GOT, Lost etc etc. That's when it gets on my nerves, and I'll not want to go near it.
Same
yes i used to be like this as well
thats why i never watched opm until years later
there is nothing wrong with it too because the hype can really get in the way of a natural experience of the show in question
waiting until the hype dies down so you can give it a more organic chance usually results in a more authentic experience
People actually hate it? Sorry but I can't take it serious when people hate such a chill, calm and beautiful show. I've seen such comments quite a few times but none of them are giving good arguments for why they hate the show, except ,,it's slow". But those are the same people that love One Piece or Boruto (which took almost 200 episodes to get really good in its own way). No hate to OP and Boruto though.
If a show takes 200 episodes to get good, it’s simply not good. One piece however is good from the start, better by episode 4 and at worst it is great by episode 35
@@assimilater-quicktips you're correct with One Piece. I was only referring to Boruto with the 200 episodes thing, but One Piece has such great humor, world building and many other things that make it great from the start.
@@wamaschawama5178 one piece has a lot of emotion at the start too. Shanks losing his arm, fucking chouchou losing his store, usopp losing his mom, sanji starving. A lot of people overlook east blue I think mainly because Luffy kind of breezes through any difficulty, but East blue has a lot of heart and that’s what made me fall in love with one piece
Boruto I unapologetically did not last 200 episodes and no amount of convincing will bring me back😂
Hate is quite a strong word for my taste... But I guess you can consider me someone who hated Frieren. And my reasoning is not it being slow, but rather the characters. They are impossible to believe in or feel anything towards. They're what I'd define as "1-dimensional characters". The personality of each one of them could be described in one short sentence, at best. And that's a really big problem, I think. Cause the entire show is based on the interactions between different people, mainly Frieren and her party but occasionally others as well. I don't mind this kind of story, but then interesting characters must be the top priority for the author. Did I see it in Frieren? No, unfortunately I did not
@@mrgriboman371 that's fair, even though characters like Frieren herself and Serie didn't feel 1 dimensional to me personally.
ANN has been a "holy cow". There have been classic series from the 80's and 80's that have very VERY high qualifications to be in the top 10, which have been superseded in the ranking as years go buy and new people, who never seen those older series, have come along.
There are good reasons why IMDB has certain top 10 which includes many older movies, and if, let's say a marvel superhero movie would become number one... what would that say? Would it suddenly really be the number one movie of ALL TIME? I don't think so...
Also, when anime became "mainstream" way back when, people who before that loved everything about it, quit, because it "became too popular"... there was no other reason but the fact that now they weren't a part of underground scene anymore and the thing they held so dear wasn't secret or unknown anymore.
I knew some of these people who quit personally... that's just how some people are. They need to belong to something that's theirs and "only theirs"... it's not special anymore if anyone else knows about it as well.
Talking about art and blend products, Wits speech from the Stormlight Archive comes to mind, because it exemplifies perfectly why art must be distinct and risk being hated, in order to be good, profound or meaningful to someone.
It reads:
"All great art is hated. It is obscenely difficult - if not impossible - to make something that nobody hates. Conversely, it is incredibly easy - if not expected - to make something that nobody loves.
This makes sense, if you think about it. Art is about emotion, examination, and going places prople have never gone before to discover and investigate new things. The only way to create something that nobody hates is to ensure that it can't be loved either. Remove enough spice from a soup, and you'll just end up with water.
Human taste is as varied as human fingerprints. Nobody will like everything, everybody dislikes something, someone loves that thing you hate - but at least being hated is better than nothing. To risk metaphor, a grand painting is often about contrast: brightest brights, darkest darks. Not grey mush. That a thing is hated is not proof that it's great art, but the lack of hatred is certainly proof that it is not. "
i think that quote is overrated because it being loved is also no indicator of quality, and the way its being phrased kinda normalizes hate as inevitable which i dont like
the way i see it is that the best art is the art that you care about a lot on a personal level, not the art that is the most popular
art is subjective after all so all that matters is how much you like something, the total amount of people who like or hate or love something means nothing
It's fantastic to have this video enter the conversation when the Internet is so quick to love on or hate on something indiscriminately. It's complicated, but I feel this video approached it with nuance.
Frieren is the best anime I've ever watched. Despite thst, my favourite anime is about a highschool wind ensemble/ band. (Hibike Euphonium!)
Proving your point, at least to myself.
Even though Frieren is statistically better than Hibike Euphonium, I like the latter more. Because once again... The show, the characters, and the setting resonates far more better than a boomer mage travelling and tracing her journey back to hopefully see her "hero"'s soul.
You are so right about oversaturation. I loved Frieren and your videos are awesome, but I decided not to subscribe to this channel. Because if I did, then youtube would've started forcing your videos down my throat when I wasn't in the mood to watch them. So instead I memorized the channel's name, and come here every now and then to watch something the piques my interest.
Personally, I think being so popular that people started hating you is one hell of an achievement. If anything, the size of the anti-fan base is usually the better measurement of the success and popularity of something.
hitler if he had twitter acc:
It’s a good measurement but idk about “better”
I liked Frieren enough but I have to admit that it sometimes got really slow. Some people just wont like that kind of anime. I tend to not like what is popular mostly because they just don't interest me. Anime like Full Metal Alchemist, Attack on Titan, and One Piece just don't do anything for me. I was told I'd like Frieren and so I avoided it for a while. I eventually was bored one day and had nothing better to do with my time so watched one episode. And then another. And another. Until I had finished the show and wanted more.
I don't really see what exactly Frieren subverts. It met nearly every expectation I had of it. I guess you could say it subverted by general expectation that media tries to subvert my expectations, but that doesn't count to me, that's the minimum.
Felt the same way with AOT. It was overhyped for me. Watched season one and half of two; barely grabbed me. Stopped forcing myself to watch it, but ppl kept on talking about it. It annoyed because I didn’t get the appeal of it that everyone felt for it. I realized now that it just wasn’t my thing
Thank God my expectations were low and I was open to this show having been on a hiatus from anime. It really made it that more enjoyable.
Here for this series all the way to the end, funny enough I could not even finish the first Ep of the Frieren when I first watched it, only after a couple more episodes aired did I go back to it because I was pressured, needless to say, it jumped all the way to my favorite show. Thank you for the breakdown in this video, I was confused on some of the blatant hate a few people were throwing at the show, it just can’t be helped.
It's a pretty good show. Is it the best? Doubt it. At what point was I hooked? Literally: reading the very premise. I didn't come to the show looking for quality or something exciting, or something heart-wrenching. I came to the show looking for an exploration of the nature of time, and an eerie mirror to an RP character I made years ago who in tern was designed as a reflection of myself. I'm happy to say that I got that. Everything else was just a bonus to me.
I actually had trouble believing that it was so popular because the reasons that it appealed to me were so personal that I couldn't imagine that so many people would feel the same way.
This remind me of joey not watching to make people angry another reason as well not in mood for something good or dark
I like Frieren but I definitely felt the pain of it overshadowing apothecary diaries which connected to me a lot better
Apothecary Diaries and Frieren are definitely my animes of the year along with Dungeon Meshi & Mushoku Tensei S2. I can't get enough of them.
@@wamaschawama5178 depending on what year you put them in, neither of them top oshi no ko for me. And as much as I love apothecary diaries, it is only the start of the year and there’s still oshi no ko season 2. Idk if season 2 will match season 1 but I’m not declaring anime of 2024 at this point
@@assimilater-quicktips that's understandable. Oshi no Ko was awesome, had some very realistic dialogues and nice songs.
Will S2 already come out this year?
@@wamaschawama5178 starts next week
@@wamaschawama5178I think my reply got lost in the void, oshi no ko starts next week
The first episode didn't leave me a great impression either. The main reason being the lack of subtlety with the theme : look ! those guys adventured for 10 years, the falling stars only happen every 50 years, she says she want to look around for spells for 100 years ! And every damn time, Frieren is just "that's nothing, bro". Yeah, I get it, you are an elf and you have zero empathy. Can we move on ?
As a result, the "everyone is older now" bit was, well, not surprising. I feel it would have had a lot more impact if the story didn't say anything about time early on, and focused on developing those characters.
Exactly, it's a missed opportunity on the concept portrayed which you describe succinctly. The concept is really interesting but the execution felt like it failed at conveying this successfully.
To contrast, Delicious In Dungeon (Dungeon Meshi) has the concept of cooking central to the story (in a dungeon adventure story setting) and delivers perfectly on that premise and even avoids being bogged down by it with a developing story, wide range and cast of characters and interactions and the art is excellent too.
As the video announced at the beginning, the tag of top anime seems a bit misleading in the first place and perhaps that's all there is to the idea that Frieren probably ends up dealing with more criticism than other animes?
On topic of resonating art ... find a free afternoon and go through all of Haibane Renmei. It won't just resonate, it will blow you away.
Good vid. I'm on episode 7. It's nice, but people saying it's the best anime of all time are completely insane.
People cares too much about ranking and numbers these days. If you enjoy other anime, if you enjoy Frieren, is it really that matter what the ranking says, I wonder
Can totally understand why people love Frieren and it's number #1 in a popular site. The only negative thing about it is that 26 episodes is not enough xD
You raise an interesting point. If this show wasnt released with first 4 episodes at once it could easily have struggled as people watched episode one, marked it as mid, and never got hyped enough to return for the next episodes.
But with the first 4 out, its pretty easy for people to watch multiple episodes at once. And the show offers no reason to leave if the next episode is available.
Sure, someone may leave due to external reasons, such as needing sleep, or wanting to do something else, but the show has very little in the way of pain points, and is put together well enough that boredom is not a huge threat.
The average viewer may not be super engaged yet, and those requiring more stimulation may decide to seek it elsewhere, but a decently intelligent/perceptive individual is unlikely to say “this sucks”.
Granted, I came in knowing the show was good due to mentions of it in writing discussions so I am never got the newcomers experience and may be wrong.
about the lack of immediate grand hooks. Very easy to sleep on this show if you don’t know its good coming in.
Viewing style would also matter a lot. Someone who watched episode one and stopped there could easily have missed the subtle beauty of this show, or at least .
Being released first 4 episodes at once means a lot of people did not leave and not come back.
In my opinion the first episode is not
P
I HATE the mentality that shows and anime and such HAVE to be super special awesome from episode one or chapter one.
Most anime hit an initial peak at EPISODE 5, so watching only one or three episodes does a disservice to the show.
Had yet to finish an entire season of anime in a few years now. Frieren was the first to break the Streak, swiftly followed by Delicious in Dungeon.
😊
I think jjk would have been à better example. Personally, I ve never seen anyone claim they dislike frieren, while i see people say jjk is trash for no reason pretty often
Sistine chapel barely breaks in the top 20 best thing to see within walking distance of Saint Peter's square.
Ive just found and binged your channel lol, great work man, very good and profesional videos, however as a manga reader the jjk ones were really funny lmao
Lmaoo so fair. Heard it gets pretty wild but haven't read much yet
My inpatient ass cant wait for season3 i had to read manga after finishing season2, anyway yea its quite crazy man
All I know Gushing Over Magical Girls, had more sales Bluray and DVD in Japan than Friren, I can see a success of a niche as well on sales and numbers on sales aka money proves it.
oh my glorious king pey where do i even begin
Obviously the points of the video still stand but it should be noted that FMAB doesn’t just stay at the top because it’s good. It stays at the top because when something overtakes it, a small but vocal group of obnoxious fans start a brigading campaign to downvote the usurper. There just weren’t enough of them to take down frieren
for me frieren was a normal series nothing special but that doesnt mean i hate it
Frieren is amazing. Funny this came up while we're watching it again.
At first, i tough that it was an isekai
Then, one day i was bored, a dub comparison appeared and decided to watched it, i tough "probably is a comedical adventure like Dragonball", same thing i said about "Tengoku Daimakyou", and it again, my expectations were totally wrong
But at least Frieren have a peaceful world
Pds: english speakers maybe know that other anime as "Heavenly Delusional"
Pds2: when a new song catches me, i force myself to not listen that song so frecuently, because i will be tired of it quickly
I think people hate Frieren for many reasons
I think the biggest reason is because its different and does not really fall into its trope or at least when it does its done in a way adapts to the show
It treats the female characters like characters - Fern does not simply exist for Stark and Frieren was her own character and not just there for Himmel (Makes there relationship stronger in reality)
Its more of a slow burn (Its not too action heavy and I find most Anime fans hate non action heavy shows a big reason why a lot of Slice of life and romance shows get hated on a lot
The biggest reason I think, Its more of a character piece than a show case of power like a lot of popular shows
Yeah, I would say it definitely feels like a Slice of Life show that kind of snuck it's way into the main stream because of the fantasy setting and magic etc etc. It's also not really the kind of show you can mostly turn your brain off and enjoy, it's very much something that asks questions of the viewer and that can make it difficult to watch.
You do go in to more depth in your own way, but I think there really is a lot to the “meta” point you talk about. There are many times where this “meta” can take media somewhere but it is when they break this meta in some way that they reach some new height. And many times this “meta” can be quite a western thing so I’m sure for westerners there’s value to be found there. Spirited Away is a great example with its “breaking the meta” by not really following the story mountain idea (in broad terms). Studio ghibli in general really can be defined by not following metas in many ways. I mention “western” meta mainly because I’m sure that’s what is most commonly viewed by your viewers, me included, and since it applies to many popular movies. But of course, everywhere has “metas”.
This doesnt mean actively breaking the meta is what makes good media good, but rather that not being restricted by it is what can push something to the next level. You mention a lot, in your way, how frieren seems to have a great balance of this idea.
I think this also relates to why people haven’t been liking the marvel movies recently as they seem to just be creating a “template” of action movies to follow some meta or recipe without actually adding much… depth. Yeah sure that can be entertaining, cool fights yay, but not much else. You dont have to go against the meta to “fix” this either, fried em breaks some tropes but embraces many others like you say. This balance and style, in how they are shown in the show, make it clear the creators weren’t “bound” by these metas. Sometimes the meta could be applied, sometimes it was broken. Not being bound by the meta really gives creators freedom and it shows.
Sorry for yapping in your comment section lol I love the show too and appreciate your work, thought I could try out giving my own input too. This vid was a great one thanks mate
yu yu hakusho > all. frieren is a very heartfelt and endearing show though, its hard not to smile at the feelings of nostalgia it induces
I didn’t realize Frieren was still #1 I thought it would be just a temporary thing like most shows on Mal
I look at my anime list and imdb from time to time. To get some suggestions on what to watch.
But Psycho-Pass is Ranked #239 on my anime list and not on imdb's top 250, while shows like Hunter x Hunter are ranked 8 and 34. (A show I dit not even finish)
So I know that there are shows out there that I consider some of the best ever made, that will never make the list's.
But there are also shows like Frieren and Fullmetal Alchemist: Brotherhood that I love and still are able to top the list's.
So I keep watching shows that makes the lists and shows that do not make the list.
Lately I have enjoyed Vinland Saga, Odd Taxi and Blue Eyed Samurai. All shows that take there time telling there story and take there side correctors seriously. I can recommend all of them.
Reminds me when i avoided Solo Leveling when it was super popular and hyped up. Only read it for myself once the Excitement died down. 😂 One of the first Manwhas that got me into Korean and Chinese Manhua and Manhwas.
I'll be honest, I didn't watch the anime, but I read the manga for FMA, and I wouldn't even put it on my top 10, but the reason I think it's been number 1 for the longest time is that it's a solid show and a safe option for recommending anyone. I think the reason for Frieren to be able to dethrone it is because it's also a solid show that you are able to recommend anyone.
It's kinda funny comparing FMAB and Frieren. Not for the reason you think. FMAB was my first anime. My anime obsessed friend convinced me to watch it. After watching it, I could tell it was good, but I felt like it was not for me. I thought anime was not for me. Almost three years later and I have totally changed my mind. I really love anime, and I feel like I have finally watched enough anime to understand the niche of it that I enjoy. It was fun to come full circle and recommend Frieren to my friend who got me into it all in the first place. So for right now at least, Frieren is my favorite anime. That may change, but for now I just know I love this show to death.
I neeeed to watch Frieren, I want to. I have a feeling it's right up my alley, and that I might even rewatch it several times. But I'm too sleep deprived and depressed to enjoy it to the fullest rn ):
I'm usually big on the must watch shows, and will happily defend them. But Frieren just wasn't for me, and I'd be happy to leave it at that. But my god, do I get sick of things like "Let me explain how this genre or show is bad by comparing it to Frieren". No, I didn't like Frieren and you did, Frieren is for you. I liked this other thing and you didn't, it wasn't for you. The fans need to stop demanding everything turns into Frieren-colored goop.
I don't hate Frieren, but I hate the community that uses it as a both a weapon and a universal standard.
That happened with things like Naruto, Harry Potter, and other oversaturated series.
Heck, Cowboy Bebop hurt Outlaw Star because "Group of people on spaceship = OUTLAW STAR NOT BEBOP, OUTLAW STAR BAD!" when the series are severely different from each other and aren't good for comparison.
I'd like to claim I'm open minded in understanding the other sides opinion, but this happened only a few times to me.
JoJo Part 7 Steel Ball Run
The Batman
No Game No Life
Are 3 series that I dont follow the majority consensus and would like to believe i have a pretty strong argument as to why i think thats the case.
It deserves it, not because it's perfect, but because when new anime watchers look it up and they watch it, it's a guaranteed good impression
Let’s be honest it’s not gonna be NR 1 forever. I loved frieren but FMAB has withstood the test of time, time and time again. This is recency bias.
Again I LOVED FRIEREN. FMAB will be back.
I don‘t think FMAB will be ever back at 1. Frieren has had a Rating of over 9.35 since it ended 3 Months ago. ONCE Season 2 comes around it might Even have a higher Score. FMAB will Never be No 1 on MAL again.
Moreover smth Like being on No 1 with that big of a difference for over 6 Months can‘t be just „recency bias“ my guy
the only reason i clicked this video is because i know the quality of Pey's videos. the title rly made me think this was some kindah rage/click bait type of video i'm generally not interested in
thought it is kinda boring there isn't really a plot
Thats the plot
the entire show is just them walking around and being nostalgic?
@@TheBrew3 If you think thats what the show is about, than the show isn't probably for you.
@@mortgu i dropped it after 4 eps
@@TheBrew3 Ok thats crazy for me, but do what ever you like. 👍
Subscribed, liked, commented. Great content 👌
Amazing voice, what microphone/audio system do you use?
for my mic I use a Neumann tlm 103 paired with an UAD Apollo Quad. Right now Im away from home though so i've been using an apollo solo with my laptop!
@@PeyTalksAnime I appreciate the response, thanks
This video is very enjoyable and educational
In this era of speedrunning, short attention span and instant gratification, frieren was a breath of fresh air, while yeah JJK was entertaining I didn't really care that much about the characters, frieren makes me want to take the time to understand each character and empathize with them, I can see why little kids wouldn't like it as they're so used to fast-paced action every second.
I already didn't think too highly about one piece, i already didn't like most typical shounens, I mostly watch weirder shows like Monogatari or Revue Starlight. But I want to make sure I when i think I won't like something so I watched 50 episodes of it and lo and behold I didn't like it. I then forced myself to read 200 chapters because "It gets good at Arabasta". I feel like i was just focusing on the things I dislike because I already got annoyed at friends saying it's the best thing ever while not giving my favourite shows a try. So I think your first point really applies to me! I don't think I would have liked one piece anyway but I think the constant stream of people hyping it up really didn't help.
Outlaw Star and Cowboy Bebop both have 5th episodes that make a better introduction to the series than the first 4, because the 5th episode is either when the main characters are together and things get really fun... or it's when you find out that there's more to Spike that it seems and the shit hits the fan.
But honestly, you NEED to give a lot of series 5 or 6 episodes to get going, sometimes more. If things HAVE to fully hook you from moment one you're being a spoiled brat and you NEED more patience.
So your homework assignment is to look up webcomics that seem interesting... and read them, and keep up with them, *and then watch as the majority of them disappear because the creator had to focus on other issues or they changed or any of many other reasons why webcomics end*.
Build up some tolerance for things NOT being perfect right off the bat, and for losing stories that you loved.
If I have a criticism about frieren is the world is kinda generic fantasy land, the characters are deadpan, and the whole stuff is kinda boring (I'm talking about the manga, the anime fixed a lot of these problems and put fast pacing)
Frieren is very good in what it tries(be a slice of life), but FMA is much more ambitious and manages to succeed in these ambition, in stakes, unique world building, complex characters with motivations
I personally dont like frieren, and I love FMA. But I know plenty of ppl who love frieren but dislike FMA.
I don't dislike frieren because its popular, I dislike it because I didn't enjoy watching it, it wasn't interesting to me. I have read multiple novels with similar story, so I was quite surprised people being so positive about it when it's nothing really special.
I love Frieren not necessarily because of the story but especially how the story is told, how the characters interact and the world is constructed and of course how the magic system works
This should be the opinion on any piece of media anyone experiences. It should really be only personal preference of which you like something or don’t like something. I think it might also be more common to experience a dislike for something when it is popular. Sometimes that popular thing seems forced or you can recognise specifically that if it is popular for a specific concept than why is something else that you know is similar. I have experienced this with popular things like one piece but I have also experienced it with much less popular things and I’ve realised the issue of not liking something can come from anything wether it’s about the thing or not. I don’t like it because I just don’t like it, or I do like it just because I do like it.
You should say drop a like because I forgot to on the other videos watching this playlist
I really liked the first few chapters of frieren, but i didnt really think the later chapters were anything special.
What sets Frieren apart is that its a pretty decent execution on the concept of lifespan, at least the best in terms of anime. However does it justify the top spot? I guess to enough people it is, but I personally think more about the Konosuba cast than i do Frieren in general, and this was before frieren was an anime and konosuba was back in relevancy with season 3...
I rarely read the description and was apatic to this anime for a long time, because the only thing I was seeing is a kudere elf, which didn't resonate with me. But I'm subscribed to a ton of reaction channels and almost every person was reacting to it, so I decided to give it a try. So, in my case, popularity drove me in even though Ihate a lot of popular stuff. I think popularity a least is a reason to give it a try for a lot of people.
I think Frieren is mid because characterization is weak, character drama is very weak, most of the tension revolves around "well actually I can do this [queue flashback]" and then they beat the tension moment.
How long have you been watching anime?
@@tallymargaretboing2778 leave him alone, he doesnt know what he is talking about
@@chronoshroom3237 That's one way to (poorly) address criticism.
I love LOTR, and fantasy, and so Frieren - on the surface - easily qualifies as something I would potentially like. I don't remember clearly how it went so here's an approximation: First heard of it from a mention in a video or something, and then I saw it again a couple of times and heard it's got 'Tolkien' vibes. Finally, I looked it up and the positive reception seemed solid, but I didn't look deeper into it so I knew almost nothing about it, and I'm not in anime circles so it didn't get overhyped for me (unlike Arcane which was getting promoted and praised everywhere).
And so I begin the first episode and the characters are talking about having defeated the Big Bad and are on their way back to this city. Okay, that's different. Maybe they're gonna flashback to it, idk. I keep watching; the art looks great, the colors are pleasant, the vibes are chill - and then they have a talk about the meteor shower and they focus on how the elf perceives time so differently from the rest of the party and how detached and impersonal she seems. Okay, cool, I assume that's gonna come up later.
And then I get to them parting ways and she says she'll visit them again 50 years later... ✨ TIME SKIP MONTAGE ✨ and it was beautiful but, woah, I wasn't expecting the time skip. 👀 And then they meet again and Himmel's so old now and the theme of Frieren's perception of time returns. Then the party goes on a journey as Frieren had promised to take them a better spot to watch the meteor shower, we get a close-up of Himmel and then...
Himmel's dead. And we're at the funeral. Some strangers comment on how Frieren's not even sad. Rude. Heiter and Eisen defend her with humor and that was wholesome. And then the burial scene happens, and Frieren starts sobbing.
I, at the time, had recently lost a relative, maybe a month ago. And even before then, a few relatives in the past.
I wasn't expecting grief to be a major theme. I got a bit teary-eyed. I think that was when I felt the 'heart' of the show. I guess that was what hooked me, so I kept watching, and Fern's introduced in episode 2 and the theme of grief returns, and I kept watching, then magic was a highlight in episode 3 and it was cool. So on and so forth. I was always left wanting for more.
(*Side note: It's been a while since I watched it and I haven't rewatched it at all, so apologies for inaccuracies.)
So now, honestly, it currently sits up there among my top favorites of all time, being LOTR, Avatar: The Last Airbender, (insert a few less universally loved shows here), etc. The slow pace only bothered me a couple of times, but rest of the time, I loved the coziness of it. And the quality of the show had stayed consistent throughout.
In my personal experience, while I see the hype now - partly 'cause I look for it - it's not quite 'popular' enough. I've seen more JJK buzz without looking for it. Even my younger sister knows about JJK, as she told me as I recently started it and she asked the title, but she hasn't/hadn't heard about Frieren back when I was watching it.
this roommate guy sounds pretty rad tbh
I'm a pretty big fan
not liking a popular piece of media can lead some (weird) people to try to treat you as the odd one for not liking it like "everyone else".
something being popular only means that and has, more often than not, little to nothing to do with how good it may be. when people try to argue that, i often like to remind them that junk food is extremely popular, but can hardly be considered as the best tasting food on the planet.
one man's trash is another man's treasure.
Frieren is literally a discount casshern sins
AoT and Rurouni Kenshin: Trust & Betrayal is my favourite anime ahead of Frieren. However, Frieren is technically the best anime and deserves the top spot at MAL without a question.
Huh. I never would have considered Frieren's first episode as slow-paced, to be honest.
Also I thought the first four episodes were originally aired collectively as "the pilot", which is why the season is 28 episodes rather than the usual 24?
Gosh, your concept of Art is soooooo much better than James Joyce's.
I believe that the rating doesn't show whether it's the best anime or not. The rating shows how likely a person is to like the anime and the closer the rating is to 10, the higher the chance of that.
I had the exact opposite experience with frieren, for me the first few episodes where really cozy and it had me interested in where the show was gonna go and based on the first episode setting the expectation of having themes of heavy grief and regret but as the show progressed I enjoyed it less and less as I realized that those themes would never be explored and when the show just kept trying to hammer in how great these characters are despite most of them being really unlikable.
Himmel and Fern are honestly some of the worst characters I have ever seen in anime.
There was still some things I liked though, probably as many things as I dislike so in the end frieren is a 5/10 for me, a few characters, the style and the music were definitely very good but it just isn't enough to make up for the rest.
I also do agree that complaining that it's too slow and boring isn't a valid criticism, it's the whole point, I just don't think they did the premise very well
This idk guy has fire quotes
Guitar player at a bar or club: "Any requests?"
THAT GUY: "FREEBIRD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
Guitar player: "Any OTHER requests?"
^Witness the reason why Freebird was a disappointment when I heard it after over a decade of that bullshit "joke" about the song.
Honestly, I know Fullmetal Alchemist's top spot has been the subject of a lot of drama with a big clash between communities, but as much as I love Frieren, I feel like Fullmetal Alchemist kinda belongs there more. I don't think I can reasonably compare the shows in terms of which I consider better, but Fullmetal Alchemist is iconic, and left such an enormous legacy in a way that only a few shows can compete with. Like maybe Attack on Titan or Avatar (if you consider that an anime). Of course, Frieren may go on to prove itself as one of the greats, but I feel like it still has yet to reach it's most pivotal moments in this first season.
Also I never noticed the Disney Hamilton logo had detail on the person, I thought it was just a silhouette like the Broadway version
Honestly, while I couldn't care less about MAL, I do prefer Frieren over FMAB. Not that I dislike FMAB, but it's not even in my top 25.