Propaganda: How the Story of Eastern Europe is Rewritten for Political Gain
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- Опубліковано 1 бер 2024
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I love my greens for Breakfast.
The offer was amazing! Thanks
Simon.... Bro....I love you but.... 🤦♂️Just sometimes man.....You should ACTUALLY drink that stuff every day. It's legitimately good for you.
If you can't manage that, then try to at least be a little more convincing when you're trying to sell it😜
It's straight up cringe... You're better than that. #AG1
@jerimiah
Come on dude
Factboi doesn't do falsehoods
@@DMTrance87 🤣
I’m Norwegian, and i’ve decided it’s time now for Norway, Sweden and Denmark to get back our lands. England, Scotland, Ireland, France, Ukraine, Belarus, Russia, America, Iceland. So to the leaders of theese countries can just hand them over to us please, and we will split them brotherly between us and everyone will live happliy i promise. Thank you all for showing up to my TED Talk.
Swedish here, I approve of this comment.
As a Swed this is probably the only time I’m gonna agree with a Norwegian
As an American I agree with this crazy Norwegian’s idea. 👍🏼👍🏼
what happened to the replies? :o
@@lovesiriusblack what do you mean ? As you clearly can see my proposal has unanimously been adopted! Even the Swedes agreed to listen to a Norwegian proposal for the first time in history. Looks like they’ve learned from the past
As a Ukrainian I've never heard somebody dismissing Scandinavian influences here.
Even more, some people see themselves as straight lineage from Vikings. For example, some nationalistic groups use northern ornaments and symbols.
The thing is, Ukraine always were multicultural on one side, and simultaneously torn into pieces on the other, so a bit of influence either from far northern fjords, middle-eastern deserts or great Asian steppes isn't surprising at all.
A number of historians view the Nordic influence as either exaggerated or straight up mythical. Take a look at Oleksander Alfyorov for example.
As a dane you are welcome in my country..
All nationalistic groups use viking/norse ornaments and symbols around the world...
Yep. That’s true for my circle too. I never heard anyone complaining about Norman theory. I’d really embrace it but unfortunately this theory has somewhat shaky basis.
The only fact is that Ukraine is a very diverse country.
I also live in Ukraine and have had the same experience. The guy in the video is just creating narratives about what people believe in a place he doesn't know about and has never visited all to support his westoid interpretation of the current political climate in Eastern Europe.
There are numerous rune stones in Sweden telling about locals raiding and serving in the eastern countries. Also, loads of silver coins from Bysans and the arab countries have been found showing that people prospered and returned home with great wealth. It seems pretty obvious that they would have used bases along the rivers in the slavic countries to organize such journeys and this probably helped to form the power centers that later became the Kievan Rus. The Finns and Estonians were also influenced by these people passing through their lands and they still call swedish attributes "routsin" and Sweden "Routsi" which is pronounced in a way that sounds a lot like "Rus". For sure these Swedes must have had a huge impact while generating such wealth in the region, even though they probably were not the lone founders of those eastern slavic states.
3:10 "Has been the cause of invasion and territorial expansion for centuries". It hasn't been the _cause_ of squat. It's been the _pretext,_ absolutely, but the cause was just ordinary ambition and hunger for power, and a wanton disregard for the lives lost in its pursuit.
Since you live in the Czech Republic, it would be interesting to see a video about the history of this little nation. Its very colorful and interesting and almost seems like a miracle that our nation, language and customs managed to survive throughout the harsh times
The history since 1900 is a difficult topic to cover neutrally. Especially between 1900 and 1960 with the multicultural Czechoslovak state, the annexation of the especially multicultural Sudetengerman territories, the expulsion and extermination of the Jews, the deportation of the German speaking population after 1949. Not to mention the time under the Habsburgs, where the Czech language suffered, but modern Czech was created.
@@etuannowell yhea but look at the history of most countries and I'd say you'd struggle to find any that has no point in it that wouldn't be difficult or uncomfortable to tell.
However it's history and I know you're not really saying it shouldn't be told and I agree with you that it's hard to do neutrally especially as it's more recent history than most but it needs telling, needs learning and hopefully learned from but not judged in the wrong way. We have to try to understand it from all sides and not told in a bias way that's used to be critical of the country as it is now and most importantly it should be as true and honest as possible told as facts with context but without blaming a whole country etc. Yes it's often very hard to remain totally and utterly neutral but the best history tellers will do it, either just giving the facts without to much that is opinion or better trying to give and explain why from both sides and with the full context of the situation in and around that area and if needed the world.
I mean I'm British so trying to tell large parts of our history neutrally and without it being uncomfortable to hear is next to impossible. The only thing that makes it any easier to tell and feel less uncomfortable about is time and the separation between then and now which shouldn't really matter but really does and the earlier history of the Czech Republic really is interesting at points.
@@etuanno its difficult to cover neutrally because theres nothing neutral about those actions. They are atrocities. Thats probably the biggest reason it should be discussed. Many countries have committed atrocities. Im from the US, where most of our natives were wiped off the face of the earth in the name of expansion. The modern czech nation is a far cry from where it was in those time periods you mentioned. Probably the only egregious example that might still be relevant to the culture of modern Czechoslovakia is the expulsion of the german speaking population, but even then, that was right off the heels of ww2.
A country that does not fight for its freedom is at the mercy of other countries.
@@etuanno There isn't any era of Czech history, which is described without any bias. Be it "olde times" of the Great Moravia, which according to one theory had 4 great houses, Mojmír house fell during Hungarian invasion, which played in cards of Přemyslids who according to this theory censored few things. Either way Vršovci, Slavníkovci died out later for Přemyslids meeting the same fate later, 14th century in case of the main branch (with the last female member marrying into Luxembourg dynasty), 18th for the minor branch.
There's a controversy with every Czech head of state. St. Václav (Wenceslaus I) was murdered by opposition led by his brother. Most of the texts portray him as a Saint building churches, spreading Christianity and building his kingdom while keeping Germans at bay. However there's lot of mystery from that time, which was romanticized a lot. Some say, that without his murder, there would be no Czech nationality nowadays, just another part of Germany or Austria. His brother Boleslav the Terrible was probably as much as important to Czech history.
Hussites are often seen as either bloody fanatics (extermination of Adamites or a catholic town here and there) or heroes, same going to their notable members. Jan Žižka was a capable military leader who turned them into professional army which shown crusaders one doesn't bring knife into a gunfight. Habsburg dynasty is seen often in negative light, but during their "dark imperial rule" Czech lands were prospering, being some of the most developed parts of the empire. Under Rudolph II the city of Prague was a center of science hosting many notable astronomers, alchemists and artists of that time.
Fast-forward to 20th century I cannot find any Czechoslovak president without a controversy. For example Masaryk made the state of Czech, Slovaks and back then Ruthenians possible with other achievements before and after he became the president. It's also said, they had to bring him "legs first" out of the office, some of his policies (for example against nobility) were counter-productive and he was no social democrat. Yet he was the picture of statesman and he wasn't afraid to get his hands dirty: Recently unveiled documents from Prague Castle point towards Masaryk paying an assassination of Lenin.
When I found out why Columbus Day was created in the US my jaw dropped. For anyone who doesn’t know, it was in an attempt to lessen hatred and prejudice towards Italians and Italian Americans following the lynching of 11 Italian Americans in New Orleans in 1892.
No one at the time even mentioned that Columbus was a Genoan, not Italian, because the country of Italy didn't exist until 1848.
@@DixonLu italian culture still existed tho, you're splitting hairs
I’m in the Midwest and we no longer celebrate Columbus Day, instead we recognize that day as Indigenous Peoples’ Day because Christopher Columbus was a fking monster. Several states have officially dropped it from the calendar entirely because again, he was a mass murdering demon of a human.
@@DixonLu Such an important distinction to make when running a PR campaign aimed at reducing violence. 🙄
Sounds exactly like a virtue signal. And like all the others, it's just stupid.
Maybe i misunderstood, but this is the first time I’ve heard anyone say that the vikings that was in Eastern Europe came via France/Normandy. I think it is generally accepted that they came from what is now eastern Sweden. The vikings, as most Europeans at the time, preferred to travel on water. eEen though they sometimes needed to cross land they brought their ships.
Yes, the map he puts up at 6:26 shows the river route they took. He even uses the term Varangian often - which technically only applies to those Norsemen who took jobs as royal guards in Miklagard (Constantinople).
The Vikings had occupied Sicily and the Vikings took the Croatian king captive in the year 1075, the king was pressured to sign and give up the cities in the Croatian coast, in addition there was fundraising in the Croatian church to buy the king free, but he passed away in captivity. Two years later, the Vikings lost to the Venetians who took control of Croatia's coast. Croatia was in wars to defend the country before the Vikings came and therefore had little military capacity due to many losses from before.
@@BranislavB-hx9zy another Russian bot... stop copy pasting your bs
I believe he's talking about different timeperiods. Vikings travelled down the Dnepr and Volga river from Sweden hundreds of years prior to the Norman era and Rollo. However, the Normans then pushed east from Normandie.
I think the reason for this is because the Normans famously conquered Britain, being the last to ever do so, and by the time all of this started, Britain was the most powerful nation on Earth...so you call it the 'Normanist-theory' to associate yourself with successful historical and current strength in Britain, rather than admit you were on the receiving end of the less civilized and heathen cousins of those people and still be accurate enough by admitting they were sort of the same group to some extent. (Yes the bending over backwards is going well)
Love the little gag trying to keep down the ag1 lol
He’s clearly just out of breathe. Heavy reach there my guy.
@@PeachM0de Yeah Simon trying to chug the thing in one gulp. I imagine if he sipped or used a straw there wouldn't be the gag.
@@PeachM0deone tiny sip and dude is out of breath? You are the one reaching my guy 😂😭
I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed 😂
Your comment isn't unique someone always says this you're Turning the comment section into a broken record
I am writing a college essay about ethnocentrism. And this episode just "randomly" pops up. It's amazing what google knows what you are doing.
Best of luck with your essay!
I would use words like creepy, uncomfortable, frightening rather than "amazing"
Very vague topic that could be applied to almost any country in the world
@connerjessop8422 he should do one about coincidence
It is pretty damn creepy if you haven't even mentioned starting writing the essay anywhere online.
It is important to note that Normans in this context are not the Rollo's men from Normandy (as claimed at the beginning of this video), but "men from the North" in general. Varyags, as they're known in the east. People from Scandinavia, not from Normandy.
I think that sating that the vikings left very little or nothing is the wrong way to put it. Christianity and its nations leaders made sure to eradicate, burn and destroy much of it, also our own converted pagan leaders did a lot of this. Chuches built on top of important sites, runestones destroyed, people killed for not wanting to change beliefs etc. And I think some of the sources are really good, due to the oral storytelling traditions of some of them. But for prroof, yes. If one needs videos to ackknowledge normans and vikings contributions to history then... If anything their importance was played down due to the hatred of pagan beiliefs in Europe.
Norse and Scandinavian is the Ethnicity, Vikings was their job... You would never call Henry Morgan Jamaican because lived in Port Royal and pirated the Caribbean... He was a Welsh pirate... Vikings were pirates from mainly Scandinavia but they also kidnapped and indoctrinated from all over Europe, why do people always assume the vikings never raided in all directions is beyond ignorance...
"Do they come as traders?"
"No. They come as VIKINGS!"
@@rokulus7910 exactly...."The name's Vike-G and I get RESPECT, your cash and your jewelry is what I EXPECT!" LOL
Vikings were not pirates, pirates were outlaws who didn't have a nation or place to really call home, they didn't build or created anything , Vikings traded more than raided, they build nations, build ships, houses and lots of other stuff, they married into royal families in Europe and they actually had a lot of laws they lived under, Norse and Vikings are not two different things , in Scandinavia we talk about the Viking age , and it includes every thing that happened in that time, where as the term Norse is much broader than the Viking age , but it was the same people
@@veronicajensen7690 is it possible to have Vikings from other ethnicities than Nordic?
@@AmedeeVanGasse they literally kidnapped and indoctrinated a lot of people during their raids, so yes yes there were vikings that weren't born in Norway, Sweden or Denmark, Hell.... Finland a Scandinavian country get zero respect when it comes to Viking lore, they had coastal warriors as well but most of their raiding was done inland... Same with Estonia which isn't even considered Scandinavian had Vikings....
0:38 Face twisted in disgust, words choked... but _am_ being paid to endorse this product: _"It tastes great!"_
Can confirm, it's shit and really isn't all that great and is insanely overpriced.
and then goes on to shill for Russia for the next 90% of his video.
The "taste great" with the gagging face is never too old. 🤣🤣🤣
Can you do an episode on the Romanian orphanages during communist rule?
Carta 77 would be a great ItS episode, I agree. But episode suggestions are taken on the subreddit. /r/simonwhistler
or romanian pick pockets?
Why what happened in the Romnian orphanages during the communist rule?
@@qj4ib I see your post is a few days old... but we don't talk about orphanages in our country back during that period. Not a lot of people know what happened back then. After partially banning abortion (only after 4 kids were you allowed to have them), the communists had a big problem on their hands with a somewhat increased birth rate, which then went back down because women started having illegal abortions. They still found a way. This meant a lot of unwanted children being deserted by their families, which placed a massive strain on orphanages which already were poorly managed, staffed and funded. The result was... basically communist prisons, but with children. Children were abused, beaten, starved, dirty, kept in chains like animals. These details became public only after the 1989 Revolution.
@@ME-ke7qc Being Romanian, if there's a signature Romanian crime, it's not theft, but corruption... bribery and nepotism. Now THAT's our thing! And we're not doing it as some villain rubbing his hands trying to take over the world. A lot of it is a matter of "come on, he's family and he helped me out once, so I'll help him in return" It's more about being a family man and showing gratitude to the people who were your friends in your time of need. I've met legit corrupt politicians, but they've been probably some of the nicest superiors I've ever had. They didn't treat me like dirt or anything like that. Even though I know they took bribes and are guilty of corruption, I can't feel any hate towards them, because they were nice to me. Others I don't know? Sure, f those guys. But the ones I know? Nah... I get it that the law does what it needs to do, but don't ask me to hate them.
My Grandmother and Grandfather were form Novogorod and north of there. they taught me that the Thunder was Perkunas. When they seen me watching Thor the 60's cartoon they stated that was Him.
@paulpowell4871 Sth doesn't add up in your story. I presume by Novogorod you mean [Veliky] Novgorod, Russia en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veliky_Novgorod. If so the slavic god of thunder is Perun. Perkunas is his Baltic equivalent. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perun#Etymology. Why did your grandparents from Novgorod, Russia refer to the Baltic god?..
@@varyap9431 Maybe they where Ingrians (Finno related)?
Probably because of the ruler mix. There were connections with the dukes of the Baltic countries who could leave their pagan traditions.
@@varyap9431Novgorod often invited Baltic Pagan princes to act as military commanders and there is a population near the region that share more DNA with Balts than Russians. It's worth remembering that much of the areas that are inhabited by Slavs now were previously inhabited by Balts and Finno-Ugric peoples. The area that OP describes would be that area where the Balt descendants live today so it's not out of the question that some of these details remained.
You possibly have Baltic blood in you then. Perkunas is the God of Thunder in Lithuanian Paganism and there is a population north of Novgorod that are closer to other Balts (Lithuanians and Latvians) than Slavs.
It's all Sweden baby!
true🧐
Allt är Sverige bebis! 😊
Roslagen😊
Not Denmark?
I thought they did it all😉
Yep Swedish Vikings went East along with their hired mercenary help the Finns and the Danes and Norwegians went West.
When you released this video I was in the Sofia cathedral and a guided tour in the nearby historic museum in Kyiv. I learned alot about this subject. As a dane I was amazed.
really enjoy you and the team's work.
defo buying every sponsored product 😉
🤣
As mentioned in a title, this is much more complex subject. Archeological evidence shows that there is more that we do not know about. For example Gnyozdovo seems to be more influential on history of the region, but it vanished from the maps. And what about influence of Bizantium, Khazars, Polovtse and mission of Cyril and Methody. I understand of significance of influence of Norsmen in this region, but there is much more in the picture to be consider that it makes far complex history.
This is absolutely fascinating, I had no idea this was a debate
"The United States celebrates Columbus with an almost saintly vigor"...who wrote that? That's like saying the same thing about Margaret Thatcher in the U.K.
yeah, this mightve been true before the year 2000, maybe. But even then, people were constantly talking about columbus and the shit he did to the natives. No one thinks that highly of columbus over here. Especially not in this day and age.
@@dogsbecutevery true. I don’t know anyone who has even mentioned Colombus day since leaving school. And even in school it wasn’t in a positive light lol.
@@fastmadcow in school it was glossed over. There was a coloring page, a nursery rhyme,and learn a few factoid about the ships and stuff about the spice trade and how the queen of Spain was hesitant to give him money.
@@dogsbecuteeven then I'd say he was never worshiped in the US. He stuck mainly to the Caribbean and didn't really explore much if north America, the liberals associate him with colonialism and gate him while conservatives don't really support him since he has no real connection to the US and he was a foreigner who explored foreign places.
@@arthas640 Yes. I am american. I am fully aware how wrong simon was.
Another contender is how the word "Rus" possibly comes from Roslagen (an area in Sweden) "Ro" literally mean "to row" or "peace". It's all hard to verify either way =) as people were mostly illiterate.
Roman historian Jordanes talked about the Rus in the 6th century and the name comes from the Roxalani. I have no idea why so many serious people are ignorant to this elephant in the room. They were Alans of the "Rox" or or "Rus" variant.
@@pravak6745The the reason it comes into question is because vikings were visiting the roman empire and there are theories about "roxalani" being derived from rus and Alani (another people).
In short: There is no definitive answer, only theories based on different evidence.
@@Mukation I am glad you know about it, but Jordanes is not the only source. I am confident it comes from Roxalani who dwelled in Ukraine. Persian, Arab, and Jewish sources also describe the Rus in detail including their appearance, clothing, tattoos, diet, practices, yet we still hear nonsense about "rowers".
@@pravak6745 The problem with your theory is that those texts are not reffering to the slavs, nor the swedes.
While we do know the old norse and the finns had a word that in context would make sense as to the origin of the term "rus".
@@Mukation The norse did have a role to play in the Rus state, but the name did not come from "rowers" as this is long after authentic references to Rus as a people in Ukraine. Norman theory for Rus name is fanciful, very convenient, and self-serving to the russo centric and german centric historians. There is also archeologic, linguistic, and ethnographic evidence for the Roxalani theory and there is more and more being uncovered... "History" is a process and it is going to be an interesting process to witness.
I read the title as Pagoda when the notification came across my screen and was deeply perplexed
This made me think of the 45 minute historical tangent Putin gave during Tucker Carlson's first interview with him.
And similarly putting forth the Russian fiction that they were the Kyivan Rus. Kyiv was founded in the 400s, Vikings showed up around 800 (soon after the Kyivan Rus converted to Orthodox Christianitu). Moscow was a swamp. Moscow was founded around 1400. Their princes gained some regional power as tax collectors for their overlords, the Mongols. Only a couple of centuries later did the Muscovites steal the name Russia, pretending to be descendants of the Kyivan Rus.
That was the catalyst for this video.
@@laurie9557 keep feeding lies. The last Rurikovich was the tsar of Moscow while Kiev was under polish occupation. Now live with that information.
@@borisnikator7060 since rather than fight like the kyiv did the moscowite bent the knee and sucked the mongols C
@@laurie9557 Kiev was a Khazar city until it was conquered by Rurik.
Rus princes ran to their northman relatives for help when they squabble among each other, so this is not theory. While Moskowia was mongolian part since mongolian invasion. In 16-th century it took over in Golden Horde by taking Kazan and Siberia during internal wars for power and remained Golden Horde up to nowadays. Then it stole name "Russia", two-head chicken as symbol from Byzantine and even tried to call itself Rome. History of Russia rewritten many times and they still trying to rewrite it.
Last time I was this early, Simon still had hair x
HE HAD HAIR???
@@nile2566yea left his head grew out his face
They say that hair and wisdom can rarely be found on same head. 😁
The Rus. People that orginally came from Roslagen. The name comes from the rodslag, which is an old coastal Uppland word for a rowing crew of warrior oarsmen. Ruotsi in finnish. The people that rows. The people that use oars. They came with their boats across the Baltic sea from Roslagen. When the passed Åland in their way in to the Finnish bay and further down to eastern Europe they often used their oars. There you have it. / Micke P
"tastes great!" *hesitates and struggles to gulp it down* lmaoo
Love your content 😊😊
The most farcical policy in the very sovereign state of Belarus, is that to speak Russian is officially promoted, while to speak genuine belarusian in public can be punished as treacherous. Lukashenka might need to sort things out!
A real interesting watch. I honestly believed that all this had been settled decades, if not centuries ago. Having received an education in the west, living in the UK, in a county that was very much within the Danelaw, I'm very biased in my belief that Normans and Scandinavians lorded over the Slav's in Kiev, organized trade down the Dnipro river onwards to Byzantium, before they inevitably integrating into the local culture.
Well they did there is NO question historically people from Scandinavia were the basis of the royal families in Kiev and for a time in Novgohrod. Moscow was a pitiful meaningless little village for most of that time.
Yeah, I thought this was all long settled. I had no idea the evidence is apparently pretty flimsy regarding the actual extent of the power of the Normans.
theres no bias, thats what happened. hell, even Putin admitted as much in his "Interview" with tucker carlson when he was giving his russified history of ukraine. He mentioned it during the establishment of the principality of Moscow.
@@deanfirnatine7814 A meaningless little village ended up being one of the most historically significant nations, while Kiev never recovered.
@@neonyankunEverything has it's beginnong and it's end. All empires sooner or later fall.
Great video
History is quite paradoxical subject. The more sources I use to learn history of the Balkans, the less I know about the history. We should learn from history, but not use it for identity. Me is me, a person that grew in the age of the internet, and my identity is unique, completely different from my parents and my ancestors (people that lived without internet and mass instant communication). That is all that matters in terms of identity, anything else is just political struggle for power.
This is a cool summation. The sheer amount of changes in country borders even up to 30 years ago should make us feel astounded that the current age we're in has not had nearly as many conflicts. The war in Ukraine is just one of those that was much more commonplace throughout the world.
The Varangians were not related to the Normans in France (who went on to conquer England, areas of Italy, etc).
I mean, they were originally all Vikings from Scandinavia, but the similarities end there.
While the Normans were Vikings from Norway and Denmark attacking Britain and France, the Varangians were mostly swedes exploring the rivers in Eastern Europe.
Best time to sponser beginning or end
Well this was borderline misinformation because of everything you left out. The Rus themselves called themselves Swedish and this is stated in contemporary sources. They were from Roslagen (law of Ros or Rus) where the word actually comes from. Roslagen is the Swedish area where Birka, Uppsala and now Stockholm is located. It was NOT the Normans (whom indeed were Norsemen but as we call ourselves Norrmän in specifically Sweden and Norway) that relocated to today's Normandy, that laid the foundation of the Kievan Rus, but Swedish Vikings from Roslagen during the Vendel-age (pre-viking age) when we actually founded many Cities in the “land of Ros/Rus” like Ladoga and nowadays Novgorod and not the least Kiev itself. Swedes, Finns and the predecessors of the Polish people lived their side by side and they are the predecessors of many nations of today like Ukraine, Belarus and Russia. The Poles or “slavs” greatly outnumbered the Swedish ruling elite and eventually threw out the ruling class Viking overlords. The slavs almost immediately started fighting each-other and it became so grim that they eventually invited the Swedish Vikings Rurik and his brother's Sineus and Truvor back to rule over them which happened during the 860s, during the Viking age, and they accepted. They returned with accompanying private Viking armies and created order once again in the region and then with the connections and network of the ruling Viking elite families all over Scandinavia and the known world they set up trade and infrastructure and lay the groundwork for what eventually became several great nations.
Every time Simon takes a drink of that ag1 his voice gets automatically deeper, I swear he’s trying not to gag😂😂
Gotta admire scholars and historians for finding the grains of truth on the beaches of bias, propaganda and storytelling
Plus Moscovia has renamed itself to Russia (in 1721!) basically stealing the name of whole etnic group
Academics specializing in history, particularly modern and contemporary history, have established a difference. On the one hand the “national novel” which is very well described in the video and on the other an intellectual work where everything is done to avoid biases.
Skipped the first 1 minute and 35 seconds with sponsorblock automatically
AG1 Decoding the Unknown episode please. Surely it can't be so delicious... can it? ;)
Superb video Simon ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
I'm always skeptical of any story saying a native tribe 'asked' an outsider to be their king.
When i read that i assume it is at best a Rollo situation, where he gets some land in exchange for guarding against other vikings.
And at worst it is a genocidal conquerer proving that 'winner writes history'.
Thing is, Novgorod had done exactly that (invite outsider knyazes) later in it's history, which was more documented. In general, IIRC, modern perception is that Varangians started as merely military commanders, who later had gotten civilian power (still limited by local elites aka "startsy grodskiye")
It was a common practice among the Slavs. The first organized state of the Western Slavs was the so-called "Samo's State". Samo was a Germanic trader (probably of slaves), who was literally chosen by the leaders of the Slavic tribes (most likely his "business associates") to rule over them, probably to avoid mutual conflicts. Under his leadership they defeated the Franks, and when he died the state fell apart as well(because of internal conflicts, of course). A similar thing applies to Bulgarians and some others, but each case is specific and extends through different periods of time.
As for Kievan Rus, archaeological findings indicate that the Normans lived exclusively within the existing Slavic settlements and did not establish their own separate settlements. The houses in which they lived did not differ from the Slavic ones (by the remains of ceramics and various religious figurines found in houses, it is known in which the Normans lived and in which the Slavs). Thus, there is no indication of any hierarchical relationship. Further, Yaroslav the Wise, allegedly a direct male descendant of the legendary Rurik (for whose existence there is no material evidence), had three sons and their samples were analyzed. Two were I2a haplogroup and one N1. Of course, this means that someone was not his real son. Historians think that the one with the N1 haplogroup is not his son, because the two with the I2a haplogroup had a common male ancestor, i.e. the father, and it is also known from documents that Yaroslav's wife (who was of Scandinavian origin) often received Norman traders (Vikings). to the court. Of course, there is no evidence and it is speculation, but it is certainly more logical that his heirs with the I2a haplogroup are his sons. The I2a haplogroup is dominantly present among southern Slavs, and it is found in a significant percentage only among Ukrainians and Belarusians today. Before they broke into the Balkans(one or two centuries before the establishment of Kievan Rus), the southern Slavs (the general Sclaveni tribe) lived approximately in the area of today's western Ukraine and southern Belarus. This would mean that Rurik (or whoever was the first ruler and founder of Kievan Rus) was simply of local origin.
This has been common practice in Europe for a long time. The current royal family in Sweden are descendants of Jean-Baptiste Jules Bernadotte, or Charles XIV. He was invited to rule Sweden after gaining popularity for his kind treatment of Swedish prisoners he had captured after a battle at Lübeck.
Many countries have invited rulers from what is today Germany, and it's a major reason why many European rulers were related. There's a picture taken in 1913 of Tsar Nicholas II of Russia and King George V of Britain standing next to each other and you can clearly see that they're related (they were cousins)
@@boogeyman4937The question is: Was it common back when Rurik supposedly did it or did it become "common practise" a few centuries after that claim was written down?
@@Mukation Samo's state was founded in 623(7th century). The sources from which we learn this are Frankish this time, not Slavic. Kievan Rus was founded at the end of the 9th century, and Nestor's chronicles were written from the turn of the 11th to the 12th century.
There is no concrete evidence that Rurik existed at all, so if Nestor is lying about the invitation to the Normans to come and rule over the Slavs, then Rurik himself and the whole story around him could also be a lie.
I have already said, there is no concrete evidence for either one or the other, but the findings and texts that exist lean towards a middle ground. The Vikings were certainly an important part of Kievan Rus and most certainly participated in its creation, but to say that they literally founded it is a gross exaggeration and underestimation of the Slavs in general.
I love the AG1 sponsored vids. Only bcs simon is trying his hardest to not puke
Please keep the Viking content coming!!it’s incredibly interesting and sorely lacking in coverage
Roslagen in Sweden…
This debate reminds me of how some Japanese and Korean nationalists insist their culture/history/language developed completely independently and were not influenced or copied from china in any way
Influenced yes. Copied no.
American here: most of us either ignore Columbus Day, call it Indigenous Peoples Day, or only know it's even happening because we might get the day off.
Yeah, it’s crazy that no one here in the USA really cares about Columbus Day (or Columbus in general) but there’s people fighting for it
The Sopranos disagree
The only people I have ever heard use the term "Indigenous People's Day" are Leftist politicians on T.V.
I'm here to support this comment and my fellow American
Lmao almost nobody’s calling it indigenous peoples day, most people call it Columbus Day compared to that. What a weird thing to be bold and wrong about
what? of course there is archaeological evidence of dominant norse culture in the kievan rus, the writing is in norse runes!
And in Novgorod.
13:54 "tsardom of russia"
it's when you are on topic from wiki influenced by "russian prop"
never in any historical sources of pre 1721 year you will not able to find something like this but you will successfully found muskovia as in western sources as well as it's how they called their state so by definition it's more correct to call tsardom of muscovy. if you check oldest map those territories always where marked like muskovia, tartaria and few more names. And only in 1721 when their tsar renamed country to "great russian empire" it's the first time when really something with rus' appeared in their name. The only ruthenians people at those time at their territory were Novgorod, but if you ask them even they will tell you that they're invaded by muskovia :). On the maps you will find muskovia successfully up to ~1800... yes wiki sometimes can be very misleading especially when it's poisoned by russian prop.
Simon. Just so we're clear, the bit about Columbus? NO. No, we do not. At. ALL.
Viking is something you 'do', not something you are.
Until recently we only knew it was Columbus Day because we didn't get mail or because we went to the bank and it was closed.
its complicated
Hello Simon, I would love to see a video either here or on Warographics about the Czechoslovak communist coup in the late '40s.
Please do one on the otto warmbier case
Afaik the nazis also liked the teutonic knights and northern crusade: as proof of a near-constant 'germanic' presence in Eastern Europe
(There was also a huge presence in eastern europe of jews who fled the holy roman empire)
All 8 of my great grandparents were Slavs, and my DNA confirms it. Interestingly, the only other DNA in my otherwise Slavic profile is a very small amount that is attributed to Sweden/Denmark.
Personally it isn't about Ukrainian, Russian or Polish. It's about the outlook on life. The west isn't perfect but at least you can get ahead in life
@5:50 ish I misheard you, I thought you said 'Fenugreek culture'... .😂
Fenno-Ugric
As a Swede I have never thought that the theory that Ruric came from Roslagen - the area near Stockholm that I'm from - would in any way lessen the national identity of Ukrainians or Russians. In Sweden we chose to import a French Marshal and made him king in 1818 and I don't think that lessens my Swedishness.
To me all this does is show us how interconnected we all are.. which I suppose is also a terrifying thought for Putin.
Sounds like you really loved the taste of that AG1 lol
Lmao
Makes you fat once you get over 30 unless you're a gym person or heavy into fitness
Well There isn’t really any doubt about the fact that the rus/varangians were scandinavian, or more precisely, that they originated from sweden. They gradually became more and more culturally, and ethnically slavic, due to intermarriage and just natural assimilation over time. By the time the mongols invaded, they were as good as completely slavic.
I love how people always love to ignore Lithuania as rulers instead saying polish-lithuania please people stop saying false history it was Lithuania then later Polish-Lithuania ruled 13:40
True.
Yes. For 200 years prior PLC it was a part of Grand Duchy of Lithuania
Norseman amongst the Slavs? This debate reminds me of the Aryan Invasion Theory in India 🇮🇳 and how the Hindutva crowd despise it.
All nationalism is an exercise in story telling that walks the line between fact and fiction.
It isn't a debate. The word "Russia" literally comes from the Norse word "Rus". Historical accounts place the Norse throughout Slavic lands, and the Verangean Guard were Norse. Those who claim anything to the contrary are fools.
The AIT isn't even considered 'current' anymore and yet Hindu extremists still bang on about it as if it is being taught as absolute history.
But I guess Aryan Migration Theory just doesn't sound as scary, so it wouldn't server their propaganda needs.
@@sillyfreeman "trader" or "merchant".
@@SkunkApe407Except Norse called the area Gardariki. And there's no norse word "Rus". Best case is from Finnish Ryuotsi, IIRC.
What? Another Simon Channel? One more subscription
I would say most of our identity we derive from the Cossack period. Most of our folklore and tradition is about Cossacks. To go as deep as the Middle Ages is to speculate without substance. Too much has changed since then.
as a Norwegian I am not surprised about the vikings influencing different parts of the world, those guys went around poking at plenty of places around the world
Did you know the Vikings too AG1 Before Battle 😮
I teach civics and today’s lesson is on propaganda. And this video popped into my notifications today… spooky.
I did my DNA through ancestry, and uploaded it to GED match and got some balkan ancestry even though I have 0 people in my tree from that area. Ancestry says tho all together i am almost half scandinavian.
The Vikings had occupied Sicily and the Vikings took the Croatian king captive in the year 1075, the king was pressured to sign and give up the cities in the Croatian coast, in addition there was fundraising in the Croatian church to buy the king free, but he passed away in captivity. Two years later, the Vikings lost to the Venetians who took control of Croatia's coast. Croatia was in wars to defend the country before the Vikings came and therefore had little military capacity due to many losses from before. 17% of today's Croats have Scandinavian genes.
GAG1 ad again! Let's look for Factboi's #retchface
I got here early. I brought chairs and popcorn for everyone.
It's a weird thing for me. I was raised by a first-generation Italian, and I have 2 native american kids. I have found it easier to just skip the whole day. And when it comes to Columbus, I am brutly honest, and about him and why their is a holiday.
pretty sure no one here thinks that highly of columbus, thats interesting to see that foreigners think we condone his actions lol. I also thought we changed the name of columbus day to something else. idk. Thanksgiving has always been sus to me since hes the reason they got wiped out, so i just refer to it as turkey day.
@@dogsbecute we don't do that holiday much either. It's a good excuse for our yearly turkey
Putin literally spent 30 minutes of speaking about how the Vikings came to Novgorod and later to Kiev. But sure Russia is definitely against the Viking theory 😂
However Novgorod is not the founder of Russia at all.
@@etuanno That's all fake news, Lithuanians founded Russia bro.
@@etuanno The history of Ukrainian state begins in the 20th century, what kind of “Kievan Rus” are you talking about? Kyiv is a russian city, and always has been. The memory of culture, myths and other folklore has been preserved in the consciousness of exclusively the Russian people, it has lived in us for centuries. You will not find anything like this among Ukrainians, this is a FACT. Why are some people from Kyiv trying to take away from us, from the Russian people, our traditions, culture, our history and why does the West believes them... I am writing from a translator, but I hope you understand me
@@sanders1012 Well you see the history of the people on the soil of the country called Ukraine is difficult. Depending on how far you look back, you will find interesting things. Talking about history, the Kingdom of Galicia-Volhynia was the successor state of the Kievan Rus (that got overran by the golden horde). They then got incorporated into Poland-Lithuania and the Western part into Habsurg territory after the Partitions of Poland in the 18th century. In the South were the Crim Tartars since the 13th century up until the Russians ethnically cleansed them from there.
Kiev as the city wasn't Muscovite / Russian until 1667, then the Russification began.
So the whole Columbus thing in the United States is pretty far out of date. Well I certainly grew up with that back in the day my kid and my students never heard any of that nonsense. Thankfully we've moved on from that turd.
Hey, it's great-granddad Rollo!
The names of these early leaders were slavic versions of the norse Helge, Waldemar, Hrørik and Ivar. Oleg, Vladimir, Rurik and Ivan/Igor. Helga became Olga.
Except valdemar and ivan, valdemar seems more like a Slavic name vladi- to rule, Mir- world or peace.
It's weird that a portion of some peoples get all worked up about whether some Scandinavians were involved in their origin stories??? They must know that they got flattened by the Mongols just a couple of centuries later... I'd be more upset about that, to be honest...🤔
No one in Russia dismisses vikings influence in fact it is one of the main points to claim Ukraine. Last Rurikovich (ruling vikings dynasty) was the tsar of Moscow. And the first capital was Ladoga (Russia), then Novgorod (Russia) and only after them Kiev (Ukraine).
It is Ukraine that tries to wash those facts.
lmao first of all that doesn't justify a claim on Ukraine nor is this real history
Kyiv is referred to as the Mother of all Rus cities for a reason. Kyiv was a major city while Moscow was still uninhabited swamp.
Regardless Russia is not the Rus. You have no claim to Ukraine.
Now, Rurikids don’t rule Muscovy for quite a long time, so how exactly could the usurpers that came from your so called „last Rurikovich” claim the lands of Ruś?
Besides, Ladoga has no connection to Ruś, it was simply very far away from the Ruś heartland, a land of some Finnish tribes. Novgorod was a capital of an independent merchant republic, until Muscovites came and genocided all of its population.
@@olezhkoo you are talking about much later times. Learn about Rus to know where it all started.
@@borisnikator7060 I’m talking exactly about the point you’re trying to make. Even if we talk about the mythical Rurik and his descendants. How could the usurpers from the „Romanov” family who ruled Muscovy, who were later replaced by the German usurpers, lay any claim at all on the lands of Ruś? Novgorod and Ladoga were not “the first capitals of Rus”, in the best case these were the temporary stops or minor trading hubs on the way to Kyiv. Archeology shows that Novgorod did now even exist as a city before Kyiv was already quite a big settlement.
We can argue all day long, but the fact is that there is no modern country that can trace itself back directly to Ruś. We need to accept that fact and stop pretending otherwise.
Pretty sure that picture was the Saxe-Coburgs with the Romanovs, not the Windsors...
Windsors were of the house of Saxe Coburg Gotha….
Ag1 is Soylent Green! And Soylent Green is people!
As a Norwegian I am proud to be the descendant of the most prolific explorers, traders and conquerers, however that's because their crimes are 1000 years in the past 😂
The Vikings had occupied Sicily and the Vikings took the Croatian king captive in the year 1075, the king was pressured to sign and give up the cities in the Croatian coast, in addition there was fundraising in the Croatian church to buy the king free, but he passed away in captivity. Two years later, the Vikings lost to the Venetians who took control of Croatia's coast. Croatia was in wars to defend the country before the Vikings came and therefore had little military capacity due to many losses from before. This is historic information from the Norwegian embassy in Zagreb, which also mentioned that during the German invasion on 9 April 1940, officer Birger Eriksen ordered fire with a Croatian-made torpedo from the Rijeka weapons factory against the invading German forces and contributed to the sinking of the Blücher ship in the Oslo fjord.
17% of today's Croats have Scandinavian genes.
Gags litterally everytime he drinks the (G)AG1 😅
The name Rus comes from French rouge (red ), it is analogous to the name of Permian people of Komi (commie).
Is this evidence of a pre-historical USSR ?
The ancient cosmonaut theorists believe so.
just on how many channels are you on simon?
Does simon breakfast on magic spoon or AG1 ????
Also the debate whether first king of Poland was of Norse origin (Mieszko I / Dago).
Tego juz sie nie dowiemy w 100 procentach, ale to bardzo prawdopodobne.
Are you referring to the "judge from Sardinia" with the name "Dagome"? There are two theories about this document, either Mieszko's Christian name was Dagobert either multiple times rewritten document accumulated numerous mistakes in the process - look Sardinia...
@@Pandzikizlasu80 that, but also allegedly his burial site was typical for the Norse. Additionally Swietoslawa as far as I remember was very important norse princess or something - I do not remember all the details, this all is what I heard from a friend who had formal education in archeology
@@MultiGolonka Everything in Poland was looking very Norse because Poland was within this culture. The same many aspects of today's Polish culture look very western, up to the burials - cremation, but rather no American tribe conquered us, neither Andrzej Duda is American. Ok, many accuse the prime minister Donald Tusk of being German and most probably the same thing was with Mieszko 😂
@@Pandzikizlasu80 true to an extent - as far as I know, there was a considerable difference between slavic and norse burials (the way the mounds were built), so there's that. For the sake of argument one may throw in Vandals for reference, whose burials where vastly different and rather gruesome. But generally yes, the cultures merged and influenced each other all over the world, Poland is no exception to that - maybe even more so since we really had a lot of distinct tribes / peoples living in what is Poland today.
Nestor was not the author of the Primary Chronicle
I knew about this norman theory. Never considered there would be an opposing one. I can see how non Scandinavian nations wanna downplay scandi influence in culture and tribe settling. But most Scandinavians have no clue that this even happened. So its not us pushing it. I have known of the 'rus since a Dan Carlin episode a decade ago i think.
Columbus Day is no longer universally celebrated in the US, certainly not where I am in the Midwest. A number of states have officially dropped from their calendars because Columbus was a monster.
From nowadays standards for sure. But the impact of the diseases the explorers brought with them is gigantic. Without them, they would've never succeeded.
A number of states drank the koolaid of some radical elements without double checking historical documents, because anything these groups don't like is Hitler.
On behalf on my text file, thank you for no longer making chapter tiles on Into the Shadows !
US Federal holidays are nothing more than an opportunity for adults to get holiday pay and for children to get another day off school.
While it's still considered a holiday, many no longer celebrate Columbus day. Many government agencies remain open as they no longer recognize it.
Rurik came from the region of Roslagen ( law of the Ros) in Sweden. There of the name Rossia of Kyivan Rus because of the influx of Scandinavians. Sweden is still called Ruotsi in Finnish and Rootsi in Estonian.
The reader here has obviously not red the viking sagas. Named vikings and their friends in Russia and Ukraine were an integral part of the early history of all of these countries. The name Rus even means Vikings or boatmen, referring to the Norsemenn rowing up rivers to the black sea.
Kievian Russ is a very recent term. It was always just called Russ. Term was relatively recently created by Russian historians after the name's appropriation by Moscovits tsardom.