Love this duo. It’s is like watching one friend trying to explain the plot of a movie while the other friend is trying to guess what’s going to happen next. lol
Mike is the master of interjection: to break up dry science into bite-sized morsels...with juvenile humor and subject tangents...to keep the viewers' absorption refreshed. He makes us WANT to get past his interruptions and back to the topic. Artfully masterful...!
I remember reading this exact same study several months ago for a paper in college. Awesome that I've come across it again, that kind of schoolwork feels like a waste of time I would never come across ever again
So there's a debate in the gymnast community about why they have such insane bicep development (it's unreal), and there was a Russian gymnast who said it's because the men train the Iron Cross which is essentially them holding their entire weight on rings with outstretched arms to the point of almost hyperextension. The theory was the biceps were working at their most lenghthened (and therefore weakest) state which caused the growth. I see now not only is that true, but the DEEP STRETCH they're milking in that position is doing WORK.
Love how Helms has insane chemistry with whoever his talking to, be it Trex, Zourdos, Omar, Dr.Mike... what a charismatic, smart man. Always distils complex topics into digestible brain-food.
Sounds like this is showing some of why supplementing lifting with yoga is very effective at increasing strength and size for many people, if not most.
Ancient yoga included longer isometric holds. Monks would meditate in certain positions for hours each day to gain "spiritual clarity" modern yoga is still excellent for mobility and circulation health, but it's also condensed into something you can fit into daily life. Compared to monks doing yoga, that itself was their life. It's the difference between doing enough to get some health benefits versus doing it to an extreme as its own lifestyle all day every day.
Last set of the day for any given muscle will get long length partials followed by a serious prolonged stretch from now. Gonna try it for a few weeks and see how it feels.
Since I was given exercises for Achilles tendonopathy, my calfs have ballooned. Also, the effect is reversible. Calf raises helped keep the tendon pain at bay.
Dr Mike, I have just seen Mr. Greg’s video that he made about you. I don’t know if what he said was completely true or not but if it is, I want you to know that you are an absolutely amazing person and couch. I’ve learned so much and still am from your video. I personally care about your well being and I don’t want anything bad to happen to you. We care about you and love and we don’t want to lose you. The fitness world would lose a Gem if anything happens to you. If anything is harming you please stop. Please stay safe and stay healthy.❤
As much as I love the training videos, I really enjoy the academic videos even more. I've learned much more on this channel than I learned in my degree in 2000.
I have mentioned this before. This was already studied and developed by Steve Holman and his partner on POF training which included a pre stretch movement, then mid range, then concentration. This was developed back in the 80s. It’s not new at all.
What i can ascertain from these studies is that its a short term adaptation in growth that you get from implementing the stretch on most exercises and it drops of pretty quick after that.
I would assume that applied mechanical tension techniques like they’re speaking of would drastically improve tendon strength. If a person can gain muscle mass in a way that also increases tendon strength they’d be far less prone to injury and be stronger in the long run. Future of fitness might be people pods that stretches you into various positions for 20-30 minutes a day. 🤔
Flexibility is actually a component of fitness that is most often missed.Elongating the muscles after a workout helps get rid of some of the lactic acid buildup and in my humble opinion?Helps me avoid injury.Nothing extreme.Just stretching those muscles after my cardio when they are warm and pliable.I am much less sore because of stretching and I just feel better.
Stretching after a workout has not been studied and doesn't really accomplish much. It does blunt the stretch reflex temporarily, and that means less contraction of the fatigued muscle (and less pain). But prolonged stretching and dynamic stretching (like yoga, calisthenics, etc.) have many beneficial effects. It just doesn't make sense to do them after a workout.
@@bobdog90 My background is in ballet.Which has been around for a very long time.And stretching absolutely IS crucial in every form of dance and in exercise.I competed in Ms.Fitness competitions back in the 90’s.And “flexibility “ was actually an area we were judged on.Strength,endurance,and flexibility.The muscles need to be all 3.I have to disagree with you.I do long,slow stretches.And when the muscles are warm?That is the best time to stretch because they are pliable.What you describe is NOT the type of stretching I do.I am actually working to INCREASE my flexibility.And at 63?I definitely do not need to pull or tear a muscle.
I used to be a “stretching is for wussies” person. Then a new yoga teacher appeared at the gym, and she was really hot, so I took the class. Chatted her up after (of course), explaining that my muscles were too advanced for yoga, and she encouraged me to try her stretching class. Long story short, I got undeniably stronger from adding a basic stretching routine, especially in my legs. I never closed the deal with yoga girl, but I’ll always remember her. See? Sometimes thinking with your wiener can open new doors and opportunities.
I do dumbbells down to my side and I was flat footed. I tried angling my foot and that work but my arms was down by my side and my lower back didn't hurt. Now I watched all of you're dumbell squat workouts, and you had them put there weights on shoulders or weights on both shoulders and angled calves. Now can you do a video about how to do squats properly with dumbells, please.
I think the only benefit to 'an hour of calf stretch' is that you can do it while doing something else, assuming you are a masochist or something. If you have a desk job it might not be the worst supplementary exercise.
I wonder if the stretching is more beneficial for animals regarding muscular growth because they're far more active to an extreme level when compared to humans making their joints far more mobile and ours as humans. Since we don't have to run for our lives on a daily basis or make extreme physical and instantaneous judgements and actions. I'm no professional at anything but putting some bro-science out if i can.
My grandad told me stretching grows muscle when I was about 20,I’m 61 now , this has been known a loooong time, nice to see it proven. He got it from health magazines in his youth. Just had a thought, the Spanish inquisition were on to something 😂
If your curious just test it yourself ive been running an expiriment where im training my buceos with heavy isometric hikds at different angles so far my weight on normal curls has went up ten pounds in just a few weeks i will continue to conduct this expiriment and return wuth results
Question though with this stretching stuff could it be used for medical patients 🤔 like Not looking for gains but do not lose muscle mass and maybe help with Defending from atrophy? ❤ yall for reading the critter paper think id have to buy a plane ticket... And supposedly they're the animals eh, good god.
It already exists, it's called active/passive stretching(also paired with exercises with assistance), usually done for patients with sci, paraplegics, comatose, and the like who are immobile that needs rehabilitation
Came here to ask this. It feels like this is more relevant to the PT/rehab application to prevent atrophy than an able-bodied human putting themselves in a torture device for funsies.
@bobdog90 mmm yeah thats a fair point but honestly don't know if the chest is a worry in their cases generally. Legs arms, and back(also be tricky I'd assume) are really what I was thinking and yeah definitely need to be rigorous in individual patient needs
I am interested. I don't care about pain but I am lazy and going to the gym 90 minutes a day 5 times a week is way too much. I do it and hate it for the last 10 years. If I can feel intense pain for 15 minutes 4 times a week and get the same benefits you can sign me in. Where can I find this stretching protocol?
1. The way Eric instantly shifts gears to handling Mike's comments (while leaning into the joke and tying it into the topic at hand) and then gets back to his original point without being derailed is just masterful. 2. Show us the calves!
Oh wow, I was actually one of the participants of the calf stretching study. Never thought I would see a video where it would be mentioned. Konstantin was a colleague of mine (same university at the time of the study). I can absolutely second Dr. Helms' opinion here, the stretching was painful, just do calf raises instead! Although we were allowed to take small breaks during the stretching if we were experiencing numbness (which we most certainly did), but the total stretching duration per day should not be below 45 minutes. We had to log our stretching times. Some anecdotal info for those who care: Many of us participants, myself included, actually profited the most not in cross section increases (measured by MRI btw), but in ankle joint flexibility instead. Flexibility was measured by a... rudimentary "device", where we pushed a small block forward with our knees while balancing on the same leg, and essentially doing a one legged squat (assisted by a door frame to hold on to). The measurement stopped when our heel lifted from the ground. Personally, I improved my ankle flexion in this "exercise" by about +4 cm (iirc) of pushing that block forward, which translated to an easier time going deeper on leg presses/squats/lunges etc.. So the main takeaway here is, if anyone has a problem with ankle flexion, perhaps give "extreme stretching" over multiple weeks a try. Not saying it will help, but it just might help you specifically!
Yes, aparantely it is the only way to do without cirurgies. 2 cm a year some claim, i read in another YT video that it was the case and there's some large community on reddit about it. I was curious about it, but not followed throught. So for people to have this legit concern, sadly this is the most a can point a way.
@@MPJ784you definitely can. Speaking from experience. Definitely. Don’t start with an hr though maybe 3 minutes 5x a week and add 30 secs every 3-4 weeks
Two questions: 1) That pec study suggests stretching can potentially result in surprising big gains. Why don’t we seem to see people that stretch getting very muscular from it? At least in my experience, I don’t see men or women that exclusively do yoga type exercises getting more muscular like someone that regularly lifts weights. 2) With weightlifting, progressive overloading is pretty simple - just add weight or improve technique. But with stretching, isn’t it possible that at some point you can’t really get any more flexible, or if you did you might increase your risk of injuries? Also, the fact that women saw less hypertrophy because they were already more flexible raises some questions. AFAIK, this isn’t seen with resistance training - if someone can lift more weight initially, that won’t impede their ability to develop more muscle. I think this stretching research is really interesting and potentially signals something very insightful, and it also raises a lot more questions about how it could actually be applied to increase muscle growth.
Definitely some good questions. I think your first one points to the fact that you probably need some concurrent resistance/stretching not just stretching. And yes you can’t go past a certain point of stretching or you will rip things 😂
1) I believe the answer to this question you allude to in your second question, and that’s because you eventually reach a point where you can’t stretch further. Whereas resistance training you can always throw another 5 or 10lbs on 2) Yes, when you stretch you’re going past your bodies initial range of motion, let’s say if you reach a point of dorsiflexion or plantar flexion that’s beyond its reasonable/ideal range of motion. Your ankle is naturally able to flex so much more, but that doesn’t mean it’s able to support the weight of your body at those points of flexion. (Used the ankle just as an example) 3) well this is seen in resistance training, which is the reason why trained individuals aren’t as keen to studies done on untrained individuals because they have a higher receptivity to muscle growth and is why they get what’s known as “newbie gains”, so I would think of the already flexible women as trained individuals in a resistance training group. Not to say, just because I lift more weight means I’ve been training longer. That’s usually the case, especially in relative weight, but not always of course. Hope this helps answer any questions, or maybe even raise more !
I would guess that the reason less flexible people are able to see better gains would be because a muscle is able to generate more force at shorter lengths. So if a muscle is maximally stretched at a relatively short length then it will be resisting the stretch with much higher force than if it was at a longer length.
Pec example had people do 15 minute holds at maximum stretch for the exact same muscle group 4 times a week. Is that similar to how yogis train? Yogis can pipe in on this. Also hypertrophy is easier when you are also on a calory surplus, do you see a lot of yogis combine there training with bulking? Most people I know who go to the gym but try to avoid gaining weight also don't look visibly much more muscular
Reverse Nordics seem to be very effective for quads for me personally and they put the quads into a nasty stretch - hold the stretch for extended periods if you are a masochist
@@freniisammii Yes, deficit Bulgarian split-squats are brutal af, tip for those is to use an aerobic step for a bigger deficit and also increase the distance between your front leg and supporting (back) leg - this will force you to use less weight but shifts emphasis to the glutes even more
People used to say you should stretch the muscle after every set for an extra 10-15 seconds or so for extra hypertrophy and then science said it didn’t work.. science will continually show bros of the past knew their shit from trial and error
Different protocol that hits the same mechanism. Using stretching to go beyond the point of failure after typical sets are done. It's not that far outside the Dorian Yates method of using your spotter to get partial reps in the stretch position to go beyond failure after not being able to do more full range of motion reps.
"science will continually show bros of the past knew their shit from trial and error" - science NOT continually show that people from past was right all along. You are making survival bias. Yes, science show, that some methods "from past" can make sense. But science also show a ton of examples opposite of that. Partials in short range? - bad idea. "must do bench, squad, deadlift" - not necessary. Train biceps once a week - bad idea. A lot of protein like 4 grams per 1 kg - too much, doesnt give more benefit. Gotta it immediately after or workout wasted - not exactly. And etc. Bros not always knew that shit. Bros know a lot a good stuff, but also a lot of not so great stuff and a lot of BS.
Because the science knows more about the human body "in general", while the men who are actively learning how to take care of their own bodies, know way more about their own bodies than science knows about the human body in general. Science is cool, but referring to the latest scientific discoveries like it's the only objective and final truth is not only ignorant and dumb, but a completely anti-scientific thinking method too.
Eric is a black belt in not letting dr mike derail the conversation every 30 seconds.
He's normal and Mike is hilarious
It’s time for an intervention with Dr. Mike. Once or twice per video is amusing. Every 30 seconds is excessive, tedious, and extremely distracting.
@@bretrobbins3150It's subjective to your tastes. I personally think he should half the jokes.
@@bretrobbins3150My thought exactly!
@@bretrobbins3150 eh, I love it, personally.
Love this duo. It’s is like watching one friend trying to explain the plot of a movie while the other friend is trying to guess what’s going to happen next. lol
So true 😂
👋 I'm that friend that guesses! Calling is half the fun 😂
The future of bodybuilding will be guys strapped into stretch contraptions with IV BCAAs 8 hours a day
That sounds like some "I have no mouth and I must scream" type of sht
EAA's, no point in skipping down to only BCAAs
So gyms become BDSM caves?
@@TheDubass so no change?
@@mastervule1844This made me laugh out loud thank you 😂
The constant interrupting can be a bit off putting, but I think it’s just due to how excited Mike is about this info !!
Dr. Mike geeking hard as fuck. He's definitely thinking about stretching something of his
Mike is the master of interjection: to break up dry science into bite-sized morsels...with juvenile humor and subject tangents...to keep the viewers' absorption refreshed. He makes us WANT to get past his interruptions and back to the topic. Artfully masterful...!
I remember reading this exact same study several months ago for a paper in college. Awesome that I've come across it again, that kind of schoolwork feels like a waste of time I would never come across ever again
So there's a debate in the gymnast community about why they have such insane bicep development (it's unreal), and there was a Russian gymnast who said it's because the men train the Iron Cross which is essentially them holding their entire weight on rings with outstretched arms to the point of almost hyperextension. The theory was the biceps were working at their most lenghthened (and therefore weakest) state which caused the growth. I see now not only is that true, but the DEEP STRETCH they're milking in that position is doing WORK.
Exactly. why is this perfect example of the effect of stretching in humans being overlooked?
So Dante Trudell and his Doggcrapp (DC) Training regimen was right? Extreme stretching after hitting the muscle group
Love how Helms has insane chemistry with whoever his talking to, be it Trex, Zourdos, Omar, Dr.Mike... what a charismatic, smart man. Always distils complex topics into digestible brain-food.
Sounds like this is showing some of why supplementing lifting with yoga is very effective at increasing strength and size for many people, if not most.
The ancient yoga texts say that yoga will give you the strength of an elephant (not modern yoga, but ancient monk style yoga)
@@PcCAvioN what's the difference? What protocols that do ancient yoga have that modern yoga don't? (Out of curiosity)
@@PcCAvioN Which is obviously not literally true since elephants are beyond human strength, but it seems to be correct albeit exaggerated!
@@PcCAvioNwell… Thats a lie
Ancient yoga included longer isometric holds. Monks would meditate in certain positions for hours each day to gain "spiritual clarity"
modern yoga is still excellent for mobility and circulation health, but it's also condensed into something you can fit into daily life. Compared to monks doing yoga, that itself was their life.
It's the difference between doing enough to get some health benefits versus doing it to an extreme as its own lifestyle all day every day.
Omg, Erik is so goood for this content. Perfect man to this colab. Thank you sir
Dante Trudel and his extreme stretching was right. Watch Doggcrapp, a 3 decade old program, become popular
Let's fucking go! Been a fan of DC for years!
I'd expect someone with your username to recommend something called dog crap
Last set of the day for any given muscle will get long length partials followed by a serious prolonged stretch from now. Gonna try it for a few weeks and see how it feels.
Still can't compute 😂
Same!
Since I was given exercises for Achilles tendonopathy, my calfs have ballooned.
Also, the effect is reversible. Calf raises helped keep the tendon pain at bay.
Rack pulls are amazing for traps 🇧🇷❤💪🏼
I believe this, I trained my body with isometrics
Thank you for the great video!!
16:00 I love the pause reps.
Dante aka DC was onto this decades ago. Justified! Extreme stretching is for real …
Instant like for Dr. Eric Helms.
Crazy. I remember Frank Zane saying that stretching between sets was core to his training philosophy. I thought he was a quack for saying so!
Dr Mike, I have just seen Mr. Greg’s video that he made about you.
I don’t know if what he said was completely true or not but if it is, I want you to know that you are an absolutely amazing person and couch. I’ve learned so much and still am from your video. I personally care about your well being and I don’t want anything bad to happen to you. We care about you and love and we don’t want to lose you. The fitness world would lose a Gem if anything happens to you. If anything is harming you please stop. Please stay safe and stay healthy.❤
didn't John meadows have a lot to say on the post set extreme stretching?
A truly legendary sign-off at the end there.
As much as I love the training videos, I really enjoy the academic videos even more. I've learned much more on this channel than I learned in my degree in 2000.
I have mentioned this before. This was already studied and developed by Steve Holman and his partner on POF training which included a pre stretch movement, then mid range, then concentration. This was developed back in the 80s. It’s not new at all.
10:42 you can tell the exact moment Dr.Mike fell in love
We need more Eric Helms!
Sounds great for people that cannot move. Like people in coma that suffers big muscle loss
I refuse to believe anything other than that Dr Mike and Scot Mendelson are long lost brothers 😮
What i can ascertain from these studies is that its a short term adaptation in growth that you get from implementing the stretch on most exercises and it drops of pretty quick after that.
I would assume that applied mechanical tension techniques like they’re speaking of would drastically improve tendon strength. If a person can gain muscle mass in a way that also increases tendon strength they’d be far less prone to injury and be stronger in the long run.
Future of fitness might be people pods that stretches you into various positions for 20-30 minutes a day. 🤔
Dr Eric Helms is a G
Bishnu Charan Ghosh
Flexibility is actually a component of fitness that is most often missed.Elongating the muscles after a workout helps get rid of some of the lactic acid buildup and in my humble opinion?Helps me avoid injury.Nothing extreme.Just stretching those muscles after my cardio when they are warm and pliable.I am much less sore because of stretching and I just feel better.
Stretching after a workout has not been studied and doesn't really accomplish much. It does blunt the stretch reflex temporarily, and that means less contraction of the fatigued muscle (and less pain). But prolonged stretching and dynamic stretching (like yoga, calisthenics, etc.) have many beneficial effects. It just doesn't make sense to do them after a workout.
Has not been studied and doesn't really accomplish much? @bobdog90
@@bobdog90 My background is in ballet.Which has been around for a very long time.And stretching absolutely IS crucial in every form of dance and in exercise.I competed in Ms.Fitness competitions back in the 90’s.And “flexibility “ was actually an area we were judged on.Strength,endurance,and flexibility.The muscles need to be all 3.I have to disagree with you.I do long,slow stretches.And when the muscles are warm?That is the best time to stretch because they are pliable.What you describe is NOT the type of stretching I do.I am actually working to INCREASE my flexibility.And at 63?I definitely do not need to pull or tear a muscle.
It makes sense. When someone hangs for long periods in attempts to do a pull-up. Over time that stretch has shown to cause hypertrophy in the muscles.
So... this is an extra reason for trying long length partials?
I used to be a “stretching is for wussies” person. Then a new yoga teacher appeared at the gym, and she was really hot, so I took the class. Chatted her up after (of course), explaining that my muscles were too advanced for yoga, and she encouraged me to try her stretching class. Long story short, I got undeniably stronger from adding a basic stretching routine, especially in my legs. I never closed the deal with yoga girl, but I’ll always remember her. See? Sometimes thinking with your wiener can open new doors and opportunities.
I have always wondered about this, really interesting to see this topic adressed
Yeah I feel like the research on this topic has always shown negative effects of stretching. Until now
I do dumbbells down to my side and I was flat footed. I tried angling my foot and that work but my arms was down by my side and my lower back didn't hurt. Now I watched all of you're dumbell squat workouts, and you had them put there weights on shoulders or weights on both shoulders and angled calves. Now can you do a video about how to do squats properly with dumbells, please.
Dr Mike is so rich he doesn’t give a shit about getting demonetized with kungflu comments 😂
Dante Trudel aka doggcrapp was surely on to something
Case study of me does sound like a fantastic album name
I think the only benefit to 'an hour of calf stretch' is that you can do it while doing something else, assuming you are a masochist or something. If you have a desk job it might not be the worst supplementary exercise.
I wonder if the stretching is more beneficial for animals regarding muscular growth because they're far more active to an extreme level when compared to humans making their joints far more mobile and ours as humans. Since we don't have to run for our lives on a daily basis or make extreme physical and instantaneous judgements and actions.
I'm no professional at anything but putting some bro-science out if i can.
Didn't DC (Doggcrapp) training feature 'extreme' stretching?
Can we have links or names of researches?
Basically what I heard:
Mechanical Kinstretch
Do you get sore after this hypertrophic stretching?
this doesn’t surprise me, but I am surprised at how long they were holding the stretched position, it sounds like a lot of volume
My grandad told me stretching grows muscle when I was about 20,I’m 61 now , this has been known a loooong time, nice to see it proven. He got it from health magazines in his youth.
Just had a thought, the Spanish inquisition were on to something 😂
@3:29- Careful Mike... 😂 That was gold!!! (I'm of Jewish heritage as well😅- so I enjoyed the joke)
I see Eric Helms, I click.
jelqing is truly the new meta
If your curious just test it yourself ive been running an expiriment where im training my buceos with heavy isometric hikds at different angles so far my weight on normal curls has went up ten pounds in just a few weeks i will continue to conduct this expiriment and return wuth results
Yeah isometrics are nice. How’s the training going so far
Ok all I’m hearing here is I need to start stretching after I lift to get optimum hypertrophy. I’m hearing do both
Great talk
Neck training! Dr Mike, when will you talk about the neck?
this reminds me of pigmie's experiment where he only did super heavy lenghtened isometrics for a week and added a few pounds to all his PRs
Sounds very close to eccentric-focused full ROM repetitions to me.
Extreme stretch for the muscle may be good, but potentially very bad for the joint.
I think this is the first time I've seen Dr. Mike be fully unhinged and have someone take it nonchalantly in stride.
Question though with this stretching stuff could it be used for medical patients 🤔 like Not looking for gains but do not lose muscle mass and maybe help with Defending from atrophy? ❤ yall for reading the critter paper think id have to buy a plane ticket... And supposedly they're the animals eh, good god.
I'd be pretty wary of putting a frail person in a chest stretching device.
It already exists, it's called active/passive stretching(also paired with exercises with assistance), usually done for patients with sci, paraplegics, comatose, and the like who are immobile that needs rehabilitation
Came here to ask this. It feels like this is more relevant to the PT/rehab application to prevent atrophy than an able-bodied human putting themselves in a torture device for funsies.
@bobdog90 mmm yeah thats a fair point but honestly don't know if the chest is a worry in their cases generally. Legs arms, and back(also be tricky I'd assume) are really what I was thinking and yeah definitely need to be rigorous in individual patient needs
@@rhaven090 dope as shit tbh 👌
The meta is changing
So, we're back to an explanation as to why gymnasts are jacked. Particularly people who do rings and what not. That kind of makes sense.
I am interested. I don't care about pain but I am lazy and going to the gym 90 minutes a day 5 times a week is way too much. I do it and hate it for the last 10 years. If I can feel intense pain for 15 minutes 4 times a week and get the same benefits you can sign me in. Where can I find this stretching protocol?
ah yes, horrific animal abuse well within my comprehension. Excellent video!!
that comb over isnt working anymore...time to do the Mike izzy hairstyle!
Didn’t Mike Mentzer suggest this
No joke, but I'm stealing the B.D.S.M. reference!
Science has advanced so much that we can finally have a a good stimulus in a hotel gym. What a time to be alive
Great chemistry
So… Where can I get this calf stretching torture device…? Asking for a friend.
Good shit
"just for comedy's sake..." *deadpan stare changes the subject* 😂
Doc can you please do a video on anabol hardcore they sell them on Amazon it claims it’s not steroids but idk could educate us on it thanks.
Isn't this the same principle behind the calf strength shoes?
Doesnt this have implications for calisthenics?
What are BFR bands (or BFR wraps as he calls them) good for?
I stretch between sets.. does thay count?
Eric: So there was a study…
Dr Mike: And this study was done on a Sasquatch, an ASEXUAL Sasquatch. Actually, 500 of them!
Dr. Mike is my spirit animal. Which is also a Sasquatch.
True 🤣 Thanks for the addition Mike
Eric: we started stretching….
Mike: TIE ME UP AND FUCK ME MUSCLE MAN
Sarcasm is a potent spice. A sprinkle enhances the dish. Too much ruins it.
1. The way Eric instantly shifts gears to handling Mike's comments (while leaning into the joke and tying it into the topic at hand) and then gets back to his original point without being derailed is just masterful.
2. Show us the calves!
could you do a video on jelqing?
😂 hahaha
I dont want any theory bullshit, I want hands on. Tangible.
Take matters into your own hands, literally.
yes, ive seen guides in text but im a visual learner
I'd pay extra for that
Oh wow, I was actually one of the participants of the calf stretching study. Never thought I would see a video where it would be mentioned. Konstantin was a colleague of mine (same university at the time of the study). I can absolutely second Dr. Helms' opinion here, the stretching was painful, just do calf raises instead! Although we were allowed to take small breaks during the stretching if we were experiencing numbness (which we most certainly did), but the total stretching duration per day should not be below 45 minutes. We had to log our stretching times.
Some anecdotal info for those who care:
Many of us participants, myself included, actually profited the most not in cross section increases (measured by MRI btw), but in ankle joint flexibility instead. Flexibility was measured by a... rudimentary "device", where we pushed a small block forward with our knees while balancing on the same leg, and essentially doing a one legged squat (assisted by a door frame to hold on to). The measurement stopped when our heel lifted from the ground. Personally, I improved my ankle flexion in this "exercise" by about +4 cm (iirc) of pushing that block forward, which translated to an easier time going deeper on leg presses/squats/lunges etc.. So the main takeaway here is, if anyone has a problem with ankle flexion, perhaps give "extreme stretching" over multiple weeks a try. Not saying it will help, but it just might help you specifically!
thanks for sharing
Did the stretching result in DOMS similar to resistance training?
I am actually very interested in this kind of flexibility specifically! Is there any kind of device available commercially that holds this stretch?
Solid, very informative comment
What did the calf stretching device look like?
We need a sequel, can you grow your shlong by stretching?
jelqmaxxing and edging on top bro
Yes, aparantely it is the only way to do without cirurgies.
2 cm a year some claim, i read in another YT video that it was the case and there's some large community on reddit about it.
I was curious about it, but not followed throught.
So for people to have this legit concern, sadly this is the most a can point a way.
@@MPJ784you definitely can. Speaking from experience. Definitely. Don’t start with an hr though maybe 3 minutes 5x a week and add 30 secs every 3-4 weeks
Yeah its common knowledge at this point
@@999rocky6how to do it?
Dr Mike would throw 99% of people off their game with this banter. This guy could not be rattled 😂😂 what a pro. Big respect 🫡
Eric Helms has experience talking with Omar (a goofy goober, in ways similar to Mike)
I love how Mike constantly makes puns while the guy tries to ignore it and explain.
He doesn't ignore them at all. He laughs at them and just continues with the topic
@@Dave.Mustaine.Is.Geniuswelax
OK, who all wants a BDSM shirt? Bench, deadlifts, squat, military press. 😂
please make this a thing XD
I need it
@@MrPizzaSUS already saw it a few weeks back if i remember correctly.
Dude I literally have “I practice BDSM” on my home gym
Whiteboard. People never know what it means😂
@@IronOathFitness XD
Eric and Mike have great chemistry. I feel like he's one of the few interviews that picks up what Mike is putting down
Right! Do you listen to his Iron Culture podcast?
only dr Eric can tolerate dr Mike's jokes to the frequency that was showin in this vid (once every 15 seconds)
It's like a constant test of his resolve and it just washes over him whilst he stays completely focused. Awesome.
He 100% has the same type of humor. Listen to his podcast with Omar
I would equally idiotic and they wasted my time and I wanted it back
If only other things could grow by stretching 🥲
It's not a muscle though
Just have faith in the process
It did for me, except now it’s kinda detached…
@@creepersKy now you can just use a strap on
Tugging and stretching are two totally different things bro!
Two questions:
1) That pec study suggests stretching can potentially result in surprising big gains. Why don’t we seem to see people that stretch getting very muscular from it? At least in my experience, I don’t see men or women that exclusively do yoga type exercises getting more muscular like someone that regularly lifts weights.
2) With weightlifting, progressive overloading is pretty simple - just add weight or improve technique. But with stretching, isn’t it possible that at some point you can’t really get any more flexible, or if you did you might increase your risk of injuries?
Also, the fact that women saw less hypertrophy because they were already more flexible raises some questions. AFAIK, this isn’t seen with resistance training - if someone can lift more weight initially, that won’t impede their ability to develop more muscle.
I think this stretching research is really interesting and potentially signals something very insightful, and it also raises a lot more questions about how it could actually be applied to increase muscle growth.
Definitely some good questions. I think your first one points to the fact that you probably need some concurrent resistance/stretching not just stretching.
And yes you can’t go past a certain point of stretching or you will rip things 😂
1) I believe the answer to this question you allude to in your second question, and that’s because you eventually reach a point where you can’t stretch further. Whereas resistance training you can always throw another 5 or 10lbs on
2) Yes, when you stretch you’re going past your bodies initial range of motion, let’s say if you reach a point of dorsiflexion or plantar flexion that’s beyond its reasonable/ideal range of motion. Your ankle is naturally able to flex so much more, but that doesn’t mean it’s able to support the weight of your body at those points of flexion. (Used the ankle just as an example)
3) well this is seen in resistance training, which is the reason why trained individuals aren’t as keen to studies done on untrained individuals because they have a higher receptivity to muscle growth and is why they get what’s known as “newbie gains”, so I would think of the already flexible women as trained individuals in a resistance training group. Not to say, just because I lift more weight means I’ve been training longer. That’s usually the case, especially in relative weight, but not always of course.
Hope this helps answer any questions, or maybe even raise more !
I would guess that the reason less flexible people are able to see better gains would be because a muscle is able to generate more force at shorter lengths. So if a muscle is maximally stretched at a relatively short length then it will be resisting the stretch with much higher force than if it was at a longer length.
We do. Yoga people get more muscular significantly compairwd to baseline without any extra muscle training
Pec example had people do 15 minute holds at maximum stretch for the exact same muscle group 4 times a week. Is that similar to how yogis train? Yogis can pipe in on this. Also hypertrophy is easier when you are also on a calory surplus, do you see a lot of yogis combine there training with bulking? Most people I know who go to the gym but try to avoid gaining weight also don't look visibly much more muscular
Reverse Nordics seem to be very effective for quads for me personally and they put the quads into a nasty stretch - hold the stretch for extended periods if you are a masochist
You thing deficit lunges/smith squats could do the same thing for glutes?
@freniisammii thought provoking... 🤔
Smith machine Bulgarian split squats are brutal... Hurts so good.
@@freniisammii Yes, deficit Bulgarian split-squats are brutal af, tip for those is to use an aerobic step for a bigger deficit and also increase the distance between your front leg and supporting (back) leg - this will force you to use less weight but shifts emphasis to the glutes even more
@@JohnSmith-wh7mk so should I do a pause on the last rep to really take advantage of this "stretch" mechanic?
Wtf I was just thinking of this in my head I thought this was an old video and my phone was reading my thoughs
Literally same thing happened to me.
You have no free will, its all pre-determined.....
u high bro
This happens to me pretty often with youtube. I'll be thinking of something then i get recommend a video about the subject. How
Every video some comment like this on any channel. It's getting annoying
Yes Dante Trudel ( DC Training) has been preaching extreme stretching at the end of working each muscle group, for decades!
Go Dante!!
Team3DAlpha used to preach the stretch protocol!!! Pretty cool to finally see the science catch up with his predictions
Yeah his heavy stretch pump training 👌🏾
People used to say you should stretch the muscle after every set for an extra 10-15 seconds or so for extra hypertrophy and then science said it didn’t work.. science will continually show bros of the past knew their shit from trial and error
Completely different protocol.
Different protocol that hits the same mechanism. Using stretching to go beyond the point of failure after typical sets are done. It's not that far outside the Dorian Yates method of using your spotter to get partial reps in the stretch position to go beyond failure after not being able to do more full range of motion reps.
What is the device for calf stretching you use?
"science will continually show bros of the past knew their shit from trial and error" - science NOT continually show that people from past was right all along. You are making survival bias.
Yes, science show, that some methods "from past" can make sense. But science also show a ton of examples opposite of that.
Partials in short range? - bad idea.
"must do bench, squad, deadlift" - not necessary.
Train biceps once a week - bad idea.
A lot of protein like 4 grams per 1 kg - too much, doesnt give more benefit.
Gotta it immediately after or workout wasted - not exactly.
And etc.
Bros not always knew that shit. Bros know a lot a good stuff, but also a lot of not so great stuff and a lot of BS.
Because the science knows more about the human body "in general", while the men who are actively learning how to take care of their own bodies, know way more about their own bodies than science knows about the human body in general. Science is cool, but referring to the latest scientific discoveries like it's the only objective and final truth is not only ignorant and dumb, but a completely anti-scientific thinking method too.
Oh my God how many Achilles tendons did they snap 😰
That's what I said those sound like very extreme measures for a study 😢
0! Probably made them better! 😎👍🏻
Probably too many😂
Vindication for Dante Trudel and DoggCrapp OG's!
Yep. What's old is new again! Dante told me about this in 2007 and the Internet back in the 90s on professional muscle.
Doggcrapp was onto something a long time ago with the painful stretching at the end of your sets perhaps