USB Type-C Power Delivery Trigger Board || DIY or Buy
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- Опубліковано 13 чер 2020
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Commercial USB Type-C PD Trigger Board (affiliate link): s.click.aliexpress.com/e/_dZA5cwi
Websites which where shown during the video:
www.tindie.com/products/recla...
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www.usb.org/
In this episode of DIY or Buy we will have a closer look at a USB Type-C Power Delivery Trigger board. Such boards are used to output 5V, 9V, 12V, 15V or even 20V from a Power Delivery compatible power source. So I will be showing you how such a commercial board works and I will try to create my own DIY version of it in order to see whether it makes sense to DIY such a board or whether we should stick to the commercial solution instead. Let's get started!
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Music:
2011 Lookalike by Bartlebeats
Killing Time, Kevin MacLeod
(incompetech.com) - Наука та технологія
USB PD is the best thing since sliced heatshrinks. I've been using it on most of my projects and the convenience is real.
Wait, sliced heat shrinks? That exists?
@@GRBtutorials I think it's a joke on the anglophonic advertisement adage “best thing since sliced bread”. Which I've never understood. How are people incapable of slicing their own bread? Sliced bread has a shorter shelflife.
Well, it would be awsome if sliced heatshrink would exist. I always forget to put it on beforehand.
I'm not joking, they do exist. Just search as "heatshrink kit" and there are variety of them to choose. And as being the parody of "sliced bread", well that was my intention too but pre-cut heatshrinks are really convenient to use for me.
can you send schematic file of your USB_C pD? sandeep@sysargus.com
Even with „Buy“ as an outcome I think what you are doing is really worth it. I’m learning something new every video. Keep it going this way! 👍🏻
Thanks! Will do!
I'm watching your content for more than 3 years and I'm amazed how your channel evolved and how the quality of your materials raised. Keep it up!
Thanks for making these DIY/Buy videos! I know it's always a bit disappointing when the outcome is buy, but it's very helpful that you did the work to figure that out and shared it with us all 😁
I suggest TVS diodes on those CC pins. You want to try avoid large transients on cable removals
Could you elaborate what would cause the large transients? And why diodes would help that
LC Raz When you unplug the cable, there is a spike in voltage. This is due to the storage of energy in reactive elements of the circuit. An example would be an inductive load, when you unplug it the magnetic field rapidly breaks down and induces a high voltage. A TVS diode works by depending on the voltage to exceed its breakdown voltage. Essentially when the Spike exceeds the breakdown voltage of the diode, the diode will shunt to ground.
@FQD2N There is inductance everywhere, it might not be big, but it's there. Just because it's not on a cheap aliexpress board, doesn't mean it's not a good idea to have it. External interfaces (even USB connectors) should have some ESD protection minimum. TVSs are one way of doing that.
LC Raz built-in transistors serve the same purpose.
@FQD2N see this guide www.ti.com/lit/wp/slyy105/slyy105.pdf?ts=1592861588015 from TI. You can also checkout the datasheet for a reputable USB PD implementation like the stusb4500qtr chip which includes protection for this type of thing in the typical application example. The circuit designed in this video is a very naive implemenation
I've had the idea of somehow probing the pins of the type c, imitate the signal and maybe some day design my own PD powerbank. This video made me think twice about that thought 😅
Yep,....not that simple😅
@@greatscottlab Andreas Spiess had also a simple Video about hacking quickcharge. He also had A link to a github Page. They used an arduino nano to trigger quickcharge (They only Used 4or 5 resistors to Use the arduino as a trigger. No other ic.)
@@Enderkruemel quickcharge is something different from usb-pd.
@Statiscube Patreon donors get early access.
@Statiscube hol up
I can imagine how much effort you have put on the investigation etc. and put that all together into videos, I really appreciate it mate! Thanks, and keep up the good work!
There is something strangely satisfying about plugging a cable into a USB-C port. Unlike USB-A/B, It just so...hassle free!
USB-A:
Try to plug it in.
Doesn't fit.
Flip it over.
Try to plug it in again.
Still doesn't fit.
Flip it over once more.
Try to plug it in yet again.
It fits.
USB-C:
Plug it in
As things get more and more advanced/complex, buy will usually end up being the winner. And buy has been the only choice for mission-critical applications.
But that has never stopped us from tinkering around, and its always a great learning experience. Just like your videos!
I went into programming after high school / uni but have ever since felt like I need a small-electronics education too. It's kinda fun that you can get that almost for free on youtube these days! You the man!
I've wanted to integrate USB Type C in a project and knowing the capabilities of power delivery has made life alot easier. Great video👌🏽
i just like how he explains it with the notes he takes
my question is what type of pen is that
stabilo fineliner
Stabilo Point 88
I'm just surprised that they haven't sponsored him yet.
Great Scott: [Opens new box of stabilo pens]
Me: ahhh new video time!
@@greatscottlab thanks
ever since the reflow soldering video came out, I was wondering what this project would be! great video.
Dear GreatScott, you are really amazing & you will not believe that you inspired me to do a lot of stuff in engineering. Good luck keep growing
I remembered glancing at this video 3 years ago. Luckily I remembered it just the other day for a project. You saved me yet again
Great video! There's actually an existing trigger IC which is the IP2721 that does all the work without the need for a microcontroller. There are currently two versions: one that can be either switched between 9V or 12V, and another between 15V and 20V by setting a select pin floating or high. If the pin is grounded, it will only output 5V
Nice one, when one knows which voltage to use. And also easier to solder by hand !
@@sporniket This is for a trigger board for devices. For the power supply/source, you'd need a PD compatible one.
Do you know if there's already a PD EPR (24/36/48V) version?
I made a PCB with STUSB4500 for my PD stuff and that IC works just great and is even simpler. It also comes with more security and features.
This is exactly the project I was currently working on! This is absolutely perfect timing! Solved 90% of my questions. Thanks
That is what I was hoping for :-)
@@greatscottlab Yeah I was researching to make a single board design to power my dslr camera via usb-c PD. But after this I'm just going to combine two existing boards. That is as you concluded way easier.
Diy would be the preferred method though in instances where you already are using a microcontroller for something else and needed power negotiation (eg in something like a soldering station for a TS 100 iron). If you have a specific use case where going the diy route will reduce part count it could definitely be worth it.
Just starting out in PCB design. Hoping I can get to this point one day where I can make a bunch of my own projects/designs. Thanks for the inspiration.
Very difficult project. Not easy to implement some of these protocols. Nice of the guy to help with the code. Great job !
Love this series, appreciate you man!
Making your own might be a waste of time, but your new understanding of the device is invaluable
Hi, I recently tried the JLC PCB service because of your videos and turns out it's a great service. $2+Shipping for 5, 2 layer PCB's as advertised, and high quality PCB's, compared to those from Pentalogix wich usually cost at least $40 the piece for boards of the same sizes. Only issue is of course wait time but even if you pay another $20 for priority shipping would still be cheaper
Really nice @Greatscott .....we are your fans....keep it up....looking for more such videos
This is QUAAALLLIITTYYY COOONNTTEEENNNNTTTTT;
Great content as always
Thanks :-)
Why is the content so high quality?
Of course, it is "Made in Germany" !!! :-)
@ so true :D
OMG How did I not know about USB-C PD? I'm super frustrated with myself right now, but very happy with you!
This is really a great video; thank you! I am planning to power a board with USB-C PD, and since the board power control is done with an ESP32 (which also allows OTA firmware updates and much more), it would be most convenient to buy an integrated solution, like CK224K. The issue there is, that it doesn't provide any status, so the only way to know if the triggering worked is to measure the voltage with an ADC input. It is not very convenient. Retargeting the PD software to ESP32 shouldn't be too difficult and gives much finer control. Plus, I can still use the D+/D- lines to reprogram the ESP32. In order of cost, I think the CK224K is about $0.60/pc @ 1000, and the FUSB302 is about $0.50/pc @ 1000. Then of course, there is the CYPD3177, but that one creeps closer towards $1/pc. I am still in doubt which part to use.
It's amazing how much time we will spend on building something just to see if we can do it, regardless of how much easier it is to buy. I always enjoy learning, but it can get frustrating.
The second IC on commercial is FUSB302B, and ST also had own USB-C PD controller - STUSB4700
You mean 4500. The 4700 is source, not sink.
@@oraszuletik yeah, and this too
DIY is not the winner but global knowledge improved a lot with this video
@GreatScott! You did a lot of work to get this figured out so you deserve mad respect. Now that it's done, why recommend buying the commercial board over adding that chip to your designs? Most of your projects and ours will have an Arduino-compatible processor and an i2c bus. Am I missing something
THANK YOU FOR SUCH A QUALITY CONTENT!😃
Glad you enjoy it!
I've just had the idea to use this as a fan driver (starting with 12v, then after the spin-up, reducing to 9v and 5v), and voilà, appears at the last scene :)
Thank you for this video.
Yes the winner can be buy, but it worth making simple enough library like QC3 control to make projects with PD more affordable. Again thank you
I am so glad you made a video about this. I have been wondering for a while how difficult it is to implement. Liebe Grusse aus Suedafrika
If you want to inspect the USB PD protocol, I recommend the AVHzY CT-2. It's mainly used for triggering and measuring power draw (which it's fantastic for) but it'll also enumerate all the available power levels and connect to desktop software to show you all the messages going back and forth. Super handy, I used it for evaluating ~30 power banks. Also a minor nit: USB-PD isn't only for USB Type C. PD 1.0 works with micro-USB and type A/B. PD 2.0 is the main one you're a fan of I think, with the separate config channel on the Type C connector.
Thanks for the information
GreatScott! In case you didn't see, I edited my comment to add a little nitpick about PD and Type C. Don't want people to see your comment and think you're agreeing with something you didn't see.
Thanks Scott for the informative video. I have just ordered one of those PD boards and going to try it out.
Have fun!
now im reaaallly interrested in what makes usb-pd tick!
Well, you only have 600 pages to read!
@@YonatanAvhar quarantine time *dabs*
In my opinion buying is the best option always, unless you can save a lot of money by DIY or unless it doesn’t exist what you want. But I’ve to admit it is very interesting and informative making things yourself
Wow, great walkthrough/project
Thanks for sharing 👍😀
It's so useful now my home made project can be use a power bank instead of mains voltage. Good job. Keep it up.
Great 👍
Man, you've been around for a long time. First video I watched was you assembling a 3d printer I think
Sir your subscriber from India. #staysafe
Thank you so much as I am searching for similar guidelines so far. And occasionally your this video solve my mystery failed similar attempt before: I mixed up between CCs and SUBs pins of the very same USBC female connector you are using... Thanks a lot again!
p.s. 0:52 PD would in fact not deliver any power at all, neither the most basic 5V, if your device does simply only connect to the VBUS and GND pins, i.e. connect a non-USB-C device with a USB PD sink via passive adapters. This is because while VSUB of other type-A based fast charging (as well as legacy USB) would always have at least 5V, a compliance USBC PD source would instead have no voltages (or so called "high impedance") until it detected something is connected, by detecting if either one CC pin is pulled down by the sink, which is pulled up by the source itself. As non-USB-C does not have CC pins as all it do not "power up" any PD sources.
Super information. Saved me for doing this my selv. Thanks Scott.
5:23 ElectroBOOM: Don't do that, bro!
dont get it
@@m4gg197 He is too close to that powered up circuit with that metal conductive screwdriver
@@sziluchannel yeah but its only powered with 5-20 v on 5 amps. thats not dangerous is it?
@@m4gg197 Not dangerous, but he still can ruin his circuit with that screwdriver, as ElectroBOOM does always.
Szilu Channel now l get it 😅
I have one of these that even has a small lcd display on it that shows me the voltage I've selected as well as the current. It also has a USB-C Male and female connector and a female USB-A connector. I bought it as part of a set with a voltage/current meter to test my chargers and cables with, think I paid 18 euros in total and it also came with a Quick Charge trigger and some other bits. At these prices it's really hard to build something like this yourself.
Learning more on USB type C from U, Thanks man!!!!
You're welcome :-)
Great video, just showes that custom silicon is there for a purpose. It is a similar thing with bus communication like i2c and 485/232. If you dont have a good reason to reinvent the wheel, just go to Goodyear.
You are doing Great...love you
Excellent project 👍 I liked it
Wow, you did really put alot of effort in that project. Thanks for sharing. Btw, Do you use Pspice for pcb-schematics?
Your explanation is very helpful
Glad it was helpful!
Great Scott! that's what we call a metric shit-ton amount of work. thanks for illuminating on the sheer complexity of USB-C power management.
I understand that if you want to cycle power modes by pressing the button the buy option is the best, but if you work on a larger project that requires one specific power mode than I think the diy option would be better as you can program your gadget to request that one specific mode.
Awesome video anyway, thank you 👍👍👍
Yeah that's true. Most applications don't require changing the voltage on the go
Ehmagherd, your face!
It is good to finally see you ^_^
Hej Scott
Thanks for another great video!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I would consider using USB-C port in my project that uses USB interface, and I am considering using the FUSB302 or ST equivalent so I get the amperage I need from the buck-boost DC-DC converter based battery charger to juice up a parallel or serial setup of Lithium-ion cells on the board. So DIY is occasionally better than just buy the whole thing especially if you want the DIY electronic projects to be very compact.
Very amazing. Thanks for your great tutorial about USB type C power delivery.
Glad it was helpful!
Was für ein großartiges Projekt .. Prima!!!
USB C is amazing, and PD is by far the best feature. I do wish that it was a bit simpler for DIY enthusiasts to actually implement for themselves.
Have a look at the Quickcharge 3 protocol. It's limited to 12V, but it can do any voltage from 5 to 12V and is much cheaper to implement (there is even Arduino library for it).
Oh nice, I knew about voltage boosters and love them, but that USB-C Power Delivery trigger board is a lot easier to use :)
This is pretty much how I made a portable external monitor to carry with my laptop. An old 1080p laptop panel, cheap driver board, USB power bank and a 12v converter works well.
Great job. Wish I could get free stuff to work on lol. Love the videos. You sure learn alot keep up the great work
Wie immer gutes Video!
Exactly what I needed
Love the t shirt
Very informative video thanks
What the... I was just researching this the last few days to convert some devices to accept USB-C. Edit: To clarify, I meant USB-C PD. I'm primarily looking for the power-source (above 5V3A), not the data transfer (but also looking for something which combines both)
i really want to do this to some devices too.
If just accept type c charge and data transfer i think he have other video for it
Look for DIY perks USB-C conversion video, he has very simple explanation for non techy people. Combine his solution with basic electronics here, Thank me later 😀
@@sdffsdafdsfsdfsd I'm looking to convert devices which don't feature USB Power input. (Stuff that requires more than 5V or 15W). I'm also wondering if a board exists that accepts USB-C PD Power but also features USB data transfer to a device behind it. Haven't found anything like that so far.
@@NorthcodeNoCh I think you would need to DIY a passthrough board which includes D± and a 5V regulator.
Good Stuff as always .... thanks for the (needed) leason ! And yes I think I will just go out and buy one ...
Great work!
Danke Scott
thank you for beeing so honest :)
damn king, you been working out.
I'm glad that the negotiation process is complicated, you wouldn't want a crashed USB controller to fooling it into giving out 20V in the USB port
Nice, great video as always. Random question: have you ever thought of using your skills to get into eurorack modular synthesis / electronic music? It would be nice to watch some content like that on your channel.
Maybe one day!
Suggested comment: I like your videos, subscribed.
Nicely done
Everything about USB is way more complicated than it needs to be. That is what you get with something designed by a committee. And it has a fundamental design error. Although it is differential to give it noise immunity one of the signalling conditions makes both lines go the same way. The end result is noise can cause it to disconnect.
Thanks, great video. Please consider making a voltage / current programmable PSU using the new usbc PD PPS standard.
1:29 you put a smile on my face 😍
🤨 wut
There are several trigger pcbs available but is there one that does the other end? Eg so you can do something like convert a PC power supply into a USB C PD "charger"? What do they put in car chargers?
If an Arduino can't even manage it with the help of an external IC, that pretty much sums up how complex the USB-C PD protocol is...
You never get free lunch in engineering. USB-C is extremely flexible and can do anything from USB, DP, audio and even PCI-E, but it comes at the cost of complicated configuration. Still it's a very cool protocol and there are some IC's that get the job done for PD with very little hassle
Apollo 11 didn't stand a chance ;)
It seems to me that it would definitely be doable if you're only concerned to use the arduino as a sink. The protocol isn't that complicated, the source offers a choice of available modes, the sink accept, the source confirms and then sends a packet when the power is stable. So you basically only need to extract the values from the available modes, and craft a packet to select the one you want which seems doable in 2k of ram (the packets are around 30 bits.)
The basic sink implementation is fairly simple, but when you look into daisychaining, bidirectional PD etc.. It is complex.
@@satibel I think you came to the correct conclusion
Hi dagh! I love USB Ciea, because of powar deliveria
Great 👍 Scott !!!!
Consider using STUSB4500 and STUSB4700 ICs, there can even act as standalone controller or can be driven via I2C and are much easier to use
Does the DIY or Buy version stores the previous stage? For eg, of I configure the output voltage to be 12V by pressing the push button, and then power down, will it start at 12V next time, or back to 5V? This feature will be much more suitable for permanent projects.
Thanks. Placed order
Would be cool to see a diy usb-c 18650 powerbank video. Keep up the good work.
On my to do list
Love you bro !
Why is his voice so soothing?
Is it the accent? Tone? A combination?!
You are amazing Bro
lmao its my 1st time listening on headphones and i just realised how bass boosted the intro is xD
I recently had to make a small usb 1.0 HID implementation to create a virtual joystick and oh boy, usb is hard
That sound nice, do you have a video? Or any documentation it would be nice to learn such thing for diy home joystiking :-9
That’s why you learn it in elementary school in Germany
I still remember the USB Song. I will try to translate it as good as possible:
„1 carries voltage and 4 the ground, be careful to not switch around.
For data it goes the other way round. Pin 2 is data minus and pin 3 data plus.
Remember to never mix up host and device.“
It goes on with a second verse about the first bytes that are transmitted etc. it basically teaches the core principles of the USB 1.1 Standard. The third verse is about best practices and limitations. Lovely little children’s song.
@@WurstPeterl You learn about USB in elementary school? The only thing we learned was how to use MS paint... welcome to Czech Republic lmao
USB is great in principle, but 600+ pages just to document power? 🤮 What a design-by-committee mess!!!
Hey there what's the best way run one USB c charge port into multiple outputs to do a 5v charge on my 6s 10amp fishing drone so I can charge it with a solar panel at the beach ..my first idea which I got some boards from Ali is a 5amp 1-20v in and out DC to DC supplier then run that to individual boards so each cell is individually protected still and I want to add a tiny fan
Hi. I can't find a video how to incorporate this usb c pb into a diy atx bench top power supply. Is it as simple as connection it to the 12v wires? And what mod can I do to change the output V?
I got shocked.
I knew I knew this voice........the I saw it was you
I watch a lot of your videos............but never seen you face............now I have
Thank for the videos
Grüß aus Dänemark 😅😂😅😂😅😂😅😂😅
Somebody lost weight. Good on you Scott!
Thank :-)
I have an idea: DIY or buy a cheap desoldering gun? What's the cheapest desoldering gun you can get? I really need one before I rip apart asolutely every and all solder pads in the world trying to desolder large pin count components from lead free boards 😂
And what about one of those solderex automatic soldering irons; buy, or diy using a stepper motor and a 3d printer feeder mechanism? And great video as always, your content is always great.