The discussion of 'excess' battery capacity reminded me of the old joke: The optimist sees the glass is half full. The pessimist sees the glass is half empty. The engineer sees the glass is twice the size it needs to be.
I love my volt. I go months without buying gas and when I feel like it, I can do a big road trip without ever thinking about finding a place to charge it. It just works for the world we live in now.
Sorry pal i'll take a 67 Impala or a 68 Mustang or a 72-78 firebird over a wimpy EV. Cars are meant to be loud and fast,not quiet and slow. But as they say, you do you.
I've always wanted to pick one up. Very cool car with a great concept. I'm a bit bummed GM discontinued it, hopefully someone makes a similar car and can fill the void or market it better.
I'm too busy watching the lava lamps. The video is long enough that they're going to erupt some time... but WHEN?? Will blue or orange be the first? (Edit: rats, they were already hot and just bulged up instead of erupting.)
yes, there are a lot of people who live in townhouses or apartments where it is not feasible to do overnight charging; at the same time, spending 30 minutes at a fast-charge port might also feel like a lot when most cars are able to go to a gas station and fill up in 6 minutes or less
You're describing a series hybrid. Honda has what you want with their E-Drive. BMW's i3 with Range Extender is an example as well. GM never really did this. Once the traction battery is depleted the ICE mechanically propels the car anywhere above 36mph. While the ICE can drive the generator to charge the battery, it's really not designed for it. It's essentially no different than a Prius mechanically, using a planetary gearset to allow the ICE to operate as a transmission in a parallel hybrid. Honda E-Drive and the i3 are essentially pure EVs (no transmission) and the ICEs provide a charge for them. Hondas system can connect the ICE directly, but without any gearing and only under specific low thrust conditions around 50-60mph.
Hate to burst your bubble. GM was very secretive about what the Volt really was. A regular hybrid. NOT a EV with a generator. I remember having discussions with Volt engineers who get huffy & puffy about it. They also claim they don't consume any fossil fuel just because they charge at work. Nope sorry, I Don't believe GM runs off solar.
12:06 -- That's GM's wheelhouse: making awesome cars that they never tell anyone about, and then killing them shortly afterwards because they didn't sell.
The Volt is perfect for places like where I live, Alberta Canada (or what I like to call Texas North). This province is the opposite of progressive. We have next to no charging infrastructure but vast open roads connecting our widely interspaced cities. Here, the argument that even long range EVs would be difficult to use on roadtrips actually has some validity, especially if you plan on going on remote mountain roads. Consequently, after first subscribing to the "all or nothing, full electric or bust/Elon Musk is the only true God and Savior" religion, I eventually came around to the more pragmatic view that (for the time being) a vehicle like the Chevy Volt is as probably as close as I can currently get to the green ideal I would like to hold myself to. And when I say, "a vehicle like the Chevy Volt", what I really mean is the Volt and only the Volt because there's really nothing else quite like it. The BMW i3 comes close. Sadly we ruled it out because, although to my own surprise, I kind of dig its Bizarro styling and it has more EV range than we need for the city, unfortunately even with the gasoline range extender, it still has less total range than we would be comfortable with for intercity trips. The Prius Prime also comes close, but it was ruled out because of its mediocre EV range that would likely see us burning gas even in the city. Well, and then there's the yuck factor of its abhorrent styling. But after those two (and I suppose the Hyundai Ioniq plug-in hybrid) there's really nothing else remotely fits. All my city driving needs are met by the Volt's EV range (with a small cushion left over if we run more errands than usual). Plus, on road trips I don't fear getting stranded in the middle of nowhere. Which is exactly what most of our province is, the middle of nowhere. We only have a few decent sized cities and then vast, vast nothingness in between. In 10 years, my hope is that infrastructure will have developed enough to allow us to get a full EV, because this is what I would prefer. But in the present, we would either need 2 cars (an EV AND a gas guzzler) or the one and only Volt. But the Volt is without question more efficient even when burning gas than any pure ICE vehicle out there. I'm sure I'm not the only one who fits in this boat. I fear that with the discontinuation of the Volt and dearth of similar options, we're leaving people who want to go electric but live in places like I do with little to no realistic alternatives and forcing them to stick with their gas guzzlers for another decade or so. And I think those who are climate aware would all agree that that's far too long.
Not a bad idea, but it was made by GM, who has a terrible reputation for making absolute garbage, because they try to make everything as cheap as possible.
Range anxiety kills electric cars. Most people don't realize that the voltech technology eliminates that. The marketing department at Chevy really messed it with how the Volt works. Want an electric car you have one. Want a car that can drive unlimited miles as long as you have gas,. You have one. Most people don't understand that.
GM engineers must have been so pissed off when they drop the car, what an insult to the amazing job they did. GM never trained dealers how to sell this car and most dealers never wanted to sell the car. My 2013 is amazing car, I let people drive mine and then they go out and buy one also. I have sold 6 Volts now.
@@LeonSteelpaw no, people just assume you fully discharge batteries, then charge for hours and repeat. Never mind that you can simply recharge daily without an issue
I wanted a Volt so badly, and I cannot believe more manufacturers didn't go this route. It's a much, much better "hybrid" model. 90% of what I need a car for on the rare occasions I need a car is for trips under 10 miles. But, a couple to several times a year, I need to do a long-range road trip of 180-600 miles.
It's awesome. Like many people who've had dozens of cars over decades; my (2015 Premiere) is my favorite car I've ever owned. I had a 2017 Corvette Z51 Manual Convertible but couldn't drive it 5 months or of the year in Michigan for instance.
I enjoy how you've internalized the voices of the hater youtube commenters so deeply that you're basically embodying and having conversations with them right on camera.
Chevy should've been the forefront for American Diesel hybrids. There's not a single popular hybrid with a Diesel option, not even the Prius. GM was the pioneer of introducing a Diesel option for pretty much most of their passenger car lineup, but that's no longer the case.
The volt is a good niche alternative to people who often do extend the range of a regular ev. They can drive electric most of the time but the couple of times a month they need to drive a lot they can just use the extender and not worry about it. For the rest a regular ev make much more sense and for the few people who do drive hours a day every day an ev is not a practical option anyway at the moment.
One ev difficulty is living in cities where basically no one has a driveway/garage. It won't matter how big the battery is if you can't charge it easily overnight because you have to park on the street.
@@SewerShark That's no good though if you'ven had to make a long journey so are low on power, need to get to work the next morning, it's late, the nearest charger is 20 minutes walk away and when you get there it's full with everyone else doing the same, and they're going to be there all night. Unlikely in suburbs, but big cities WILL have that problem if they go that route. Being able to fill up with a liquid fuel in minutes that doesn't have an expensive tank that progressively shrinks and doesn't vanish in cold weather is a better way. It doesn't then matter if you need to suddenly drive hundreds of miles more than usual, just fill up in 5 minutes and carry on. It adapts around you, you don't need to adapt around it. The Volt was one way of approaching the problem from that angle. We should be going forwards not backwards. There are ways to clean up transport without having to add in extra incoveniences that most of us do not have to put up with today.
@@thegearknob7161 you are still thinking EVs as regular cars. With gas and diesel, you need distribution centres (Gas stations) due to delivery restrictions. With electric, you already have an infrastructure...electric poles. All you need is the outlet. So, city councils could install those in your sidewalk, in the same way as there are parkimeters. But its too expensive, you say? Yes, but not everyone on your street has an EV, right? So you could ask the city hall to install it, and you and your neighbours could pay to install and have it partially subsided by the city council. Each charging station could be used for, let's say, 2 or 4 households, and you don't need to pull an extension from your window to the street. I think it's a win-win situation.
@@SewerShark Where I live there aren't really electric poles. It's all buried under ground and would involve digging up all the roads to get at. Which inevitably leads to yet another terrible patch job to cover it, and greatly adds to the cost. Can't use street lighting either because they aren't wired thickly enough to handle the current draw of charging hundreds of EVs at a greater rate than a hamster with a dynamo. I lived in a block of flats where the only parking was on the street, and was very limited. If everyone drove EVs, the council would have to install chargers down the length of that road to charge every single car since due to the way EVs get used, they're all going to be on charge overnight. The chargers would also take up space on the narrow pavement, to the point it may not actually be legal to install them there. My friends' house is another example. It's in an area that wasn't built with driveways. There is like a big communal car park, which the council have washed their hands of. Everyone hates each other and there is constant vandalism. There's no electric supply up that end, but even if there was and chargers were fitted you can bet that the chargers would get vandalised. Battery EVs are a concept that work if you are rich and have a house with your own driveway, but for the rest they are impractical.
Public charging stations by ALL public parking, including on street. Kinda like putting a charger in everywhere there is a currently a parking meter, and many more
Gen 1Volt owner, true believer! Bought nine gallons of gas during first year ownership, 7000 miles, charged only on solar power overnight. But, twice in the last few years have had to drive cross country. Didn’t have to give it a second thought. Wonderful concept. Great car, sorry they stopped production.
@@maxant4285One can have a battery installed with a home solar array so one can access that solar energy at night. It’s more expensive and less efficient than charging during the day off of home solar. But most people drive away from their home for the bulk of the daytime on a work day.
I drive a Model 3 and formerly drove a Leaf (and before that a 2007 Prius). I think the problem with the Volt is simple: people don't buy vehicles based on a logical assessment of their needs and objectives, they buy vehicles based on emotion. The Volt is a reasonable, practical choice. It's a vehicle that is almost as clean from a tailpipe emissions perspective as a pure EV, but which you can take on long trips. That should be an appealing prospect, but it's just not appealing emotionally. If you're not a green wonk, you aren't going to buy Bolt or a Volt. They just aren't cheap enough or otherwise appealing enough to appeal to someone who doesn't care about the environmental benefits. If you do care about the environment though, the idea of driving around in a vehicle with tailpipe emissions "sometimes" is icky. You have already decided to spend more, and now you're looking at the Volt in the mid-30k range. For close to that price, you could buy a Leaf Plus or a Kona or even the Model 3 SR+. Yeah, the Volt is more practical, and almost as clean. But you're still driving a vehicle with gas in the tank, and for many in the green crowd that's a no-go. The Volt is too expensive up-front for most people who don't care about the environment and doesn't have enough green cred for the people who do. The math says the Volt would be a great choice for a lot of people, but most people don't buy cars based on math. If they did, non-plug-in hybrids would be much more popular, because they almost always pay for their extra cost and then some in gas savings. Tesla's big innovation was to build a car that's high-tech, fast, and good looking, which happened to be electric. Everyone else believed that EVs should be sold to environmentalists, Tesla realized that the real market was rich people. I respect GM with the Bolt, and Nissan with the Leaf, and Hyundai with the Kona. I think all of them have their advantages. The Bolt is a great car in the wrong market. It's a tiny (on the outside) hatchback that's roomier than you think on the inside. That appeals to me, and to many in Europe elsewhere, but most Americans aren't willing to buy a vehicle that small. Tesla has quality issues, Elon says a lot of stupid things on Twitter, and their cars are in many ways weird. But the Model 3 is also, by far, the most technologically advanced EV on the market today. It has the highest efficency. It charges the fastest. You can get it with AWD. It has the best driver assistance features, even if Elon's self driving claims are silly. I am not a person who is going to trash GM or Nissan or Hyuandai for making EVs, or trash people who buy them. My parents drive a Leaf Plus, and I seriously considered buying one instead of the Model 3. I also considered the Bolt, but adaptive cruise control is a must for me.
People buy vehicles based on the actual needs rather than their "emotions". When I was shopping for a car a couple of years ago I knew that I had to have proper fully functional four wheel drive because the winters here in the mountains make the roads very dangerous if you don't have 4X4, so that immediately took anything that is "all wheel drive" off the list (because all wheel drive isn't proper four wheel drive) along with striking off ev's hybrids and most small cars off the list. So my remaining choices were: (A): Pick up truck: which I decided against because I couldn't find the one that I wanted (Ram 1500) with the diesel engine I wanted at a reasonable price. (B): mid sized SUV: I couldn't find one that was affordable without either being old or having really high miles. (C): Small SUV (Jeep Cherokee/Compass/Patriot): I ended up getting a patriot because it was the perfect size for my needs, had proper 4X4 and I could get a nice one for around $20.000.
@@Hammerhead547 I think you're both correct in that people have different relationships with cars. For some they're a status symbol; for others it is just a means to get from A to B; other people sit somewhere inbetween. That being said, most of the people in both groups aren't going to go into the sort of depth this video does, it is for the car manufacturers and distributers to package these technicalities in a way that makes sense to their target market, otherwise like the Volt, it will flop.
@@Hammerhead547 Your story does not prove that people don't buy cars based on emotions. All you told us is that you bought a car based on your needs, and that your needs didn't align with buying any kind of EV (which is fine). If everybody bought a car based on their needs instead of emotions, the roads wouldn't be congested with all these CUVs that nobody needs. Anyone who actually needs a lot of space should buy a minivan or station wagon, because CUVs have the same amount of space inside as a sedan (at least every one I've been in does). Anyone who actually needs off-road or bad weather capability should buy a real SUV like you did, because CUVs are terrible for off-road. CUVs really don't make sense in any situation, but people buy them anyway because they're for some reason considered "cool" while more practical vehicles aren't. Minivans are for "soccer moms", so soccer moms buy a CUV instead because they think it's cooler (even though as far as I'm concerned CUVs make you less cool than a miniman, because now you're not just a soccer mom, you're a stupid soccer mom with an impractical car).
>> If you're not a green wonk, you aren't going to buy Bolt or a Volt. That's not always the case. Take me, for example. I couldn't care less about being "green." But I've had two Volts nevertheless. First, I leased a 2012 Volt, and later bought a new 2014 Volt, because I wanted to do two things -- and neither was environmentally oriented (not that there's anything wrong with that). First, I wanted to flip OPEC the bird as much as possible. Second, I wanted to SAVE MONEY. Yes, the price of entry might be high, but that's NOT the same as TOTAL COST OF OWNERSHIP. I've saved far more than the difference in price vs.a comparable gas car, in "fuel" savings alone. FWIW, I live where electricity is about 14c/KWhr, right around the national average, so it's not like I live where I have cheap hydro or some other low-cost electricity either. None of this even addresses the performance and reliability of the Volt, which has been phenomenal. Best cars I've ever owned! But that's a whole other topic.
What you've taught me from this video is the Volt is literally the kind of car I've always said I wanted, right down to the engine starting up to provide heat... and naturally from my luck the car is gone when I hear about it.
That's what I'm doing. The word used is an ugly word to consumers. I. Buying from an authorized chevy dealership a 2019 volt and I cant wait to drive it
@@VideoArchiveGuy Wrong, video saver. I've had about 75 personal vehicles, including 2 Volts and 5 Teslas, and as much as many folks like to say poor build quality about both, those 7 cars were built better and more reliable than 80% of the others.
@@markusstrobl1067, indeed. In many ways its more about the cooling system than the batteries cells themselves. Still, I expect the tiny 8.8KWh battery in our O’Toyta Prius Prime to fizzle a lot more quickly than a Tesla’s, since I (pre-COVID anyway) cycle it twice a day! Also, it’s only forced-air-cooled rather than liquid-cooled, but for a tiny battery like that, that’s probably quite sufficient. Granted, that’s cycling only the middle ~5.5KWh of its full 8.8KWh raw capacity, which cuts the stress on the battery way down, but still, two cycles per day is definitely going to take a toll on it! So far though, its been getting 4.6 miles/KWh after 3 2/3 years! That doesn’t appear to have changed much, *yet at least* .
When the Volt first came out, I loved the concept and decided that I would own one someday. It took me until 2019, but I finally got my wish; I bought a second hand 2015 Volt on the day they stopped making the Volt. I must report I have never in my life been happier with my car. I live in an area where there are NO charging stations anywhere - and I charge at home with a level 2 charger in about 4 hours. I only have the one car and can't afford to have another car just for long trips. When I bought it, I was sort of sad that they were not going to be making this car anymore, but after driving it around for a few years, I am certain Chevy is making a MASSIVE mistake ending the Volt's production. Much of the US is rural and has no easy access to chargers - the only viable option to electric is a vehicle like the Volt. So far, my Volt has been problem free and very economical to drive, especially charging off my home's solar panels, but I really hope when I do have to get my next car, there is another cutting edge electric car out there that suits my needs as absolutely perfectly as the Volt does.
pinkace That is a completely inadequate understanding of the brilliance of the Volt. What you are describing is made by other manufacturers, but the Volt is far more sophisticated. Read up on it. It is fascinating.
sdmitch16 Well, you could do the research the same way I have, web searches for terms such as “Volt motor generator design”, for example. Omit the opinion results and seek out the somewhat denser technical documents. It’s really been worth the time for me. The concept isn’t rocket science but the execution comes pretty close. There are also UA-cam channels with tear-downs showing the actual machinery of the Volt that I find to be a great complement to the dry text. Even Volt owners aren’t aware of what’s going on in their cars. It is NOT just an electric car with a gas generator. Ironically, even this guy, talking for over a half hour, fails completely to point out the salient features. This upload is the worst possible way to learn about this fascinating design. He may know what’s going on, but he couldn’t possibly do a worse job of communicating it. In short, the Volt has both a gasoline engine and an electric motor, each of which drive the same wheels through the very same driveshaft, sometimes even simultaneously, according to a constantly evolving set of conditions the car is being used in. This is in stark contrast to every other hybrid vehicle, including train locomotives, Prius, BMW i3, etc. All of these use a simpler hybrid drive design combining existing methods and machinery. GM alone undertook the very hard work of a clean sheet of paper approach to solve all contingencies. Somewhere in a spreadsheet is a number representing a total of unrecoverable engineering investment for the Volt and I’ll bet that number is 10 digits long.
pinkace a 4 cylinder generator? Not quite. The engine is not just to charge the battery and actually doesn’t do a very good job of charging anyway. It’s there to create electricity to run the motors up until highway speeds. At highway speeds, then it’s off electric and on the gas engine. Lutz was not as happy as he could have been with this design, but it still got him noted as the first VP to get the “electric car” from GM to the masses. I wanted to get one way back, but my family size was too large to fit everyone. New things are on the way though. Pickup trucks in the future from all the auto makers and not just Tesla. Stand by for the future.
From the explanations in the video and below, it's apparently a more complicated setup. My question would be, "Is more complicated better?" One thing I like about electricity is that it's so simple and trouble-free, and I wonder how well this engineering wonder will age.
I think manufacturing the extra batteries even if not carried all the time is part of the cost/issue.. also in their present form, lithium batteries suffer from not being steadily used almost more than being used steady so not cost effective for intermittent use ore long term storage
@@charlesfowler4308 Currently Tesla charges somewhere between $3000 and $7000 for replacement batteries, in most cases. While not cheap, this is still far less than a new electric car.
I like your “anti-smug” in the forefront of most statements. I just bought a PHEV and I love it but I’m not going to make anyone else feel bad about what choices they’ve made. I can only control my own actions. Why ruin things for others?
I think that having a larger battery that you don't use often is better for battery longevity. Lithium batteries last longer when you don't fully charge or discharge them, so if you have a larger battery that lets you have 50 miles of range while staying between 60% and 40% of battery charge, the battery will last longer before seeing degradation.
I agree. Also a larger battery gives some breathing space as it gets old for current draw (like old phone batteries causing a phone to reset as the power draw drops too low).
Another misunderstanding of how the Volt works. The Volt''s battery algorithm neither charges nor discharges the battery pack to theoretical limits. It works in the middle range of charge to increase battery longevity.
jodudeit As in all things engineering, there is a point of diminishing returns with battery size. Audi’s ridiculous e-Tron is 25% battery by weight, 1400 lbs!!!, yet has a range of roughly 200 miles. Essentially towing the gas station.
@@TheRainHarvester not really... And if you drive 50 miles a day, there is a lot of saving here... Of course, DMV wants their taxes and gears are turning to add in an ev road tax...
@@TheRainHarvester When I bought my 2014, I kept hearing the average new car purchase price was about $35k. Yea, there are plenty that cost less and there are plenty costing much more. Granted there aren't any new EVs at the low end of the market. 100k / 28mpg * $2.75/gal. = $9821.00 some people get better mileage, some get worse.
Yeah, you’ll never finish if perfect is what you want. That’s what has destroyed so much of contemporary music, IMO. You got much better results with limited technology and faster turnaround time, as it used to be in the music recording industry.
@@TheProphet3113 Well yes, but also no. If you have a vision, you either fully realize it or you don't know what you want when you make it. Planning is a crucial phase in mending your ideas before you continue forward with them.
GM ran out of federal tax credits for it. Once they hit 200,00 units the tax rebate was done. It then became noncompetitive with vehicles that do still qualify for it like the Honda Clarity.
It's not popular, neither was the prius, insight, bolt, even tesla is not popular. They all are excessively expensive to own, maintain, or operate. Plus mining the metals is very expensive. Standard car batteries are expensive too.
@@SherrifOfNottingham Do we need to understand that you live in Outback of Australia or Northern territories of Canada with sign posts on the road - here is a gas station, next one is 500 miles away/980 km away?
Well yes and no. One company is very clearly putting out a voice that drives towards a more renewable future in the face of critics...the other is just chasing short term profits and uses Environmentally Friendly marketing when there's an easy win. But also happy to ditch their geen products if it's a bit unconvenient.
@@bosstowndynamics5488 uhm no. Sure, the Volt has been a good stepping stone and was a good car for the time. But GM is not pushing sustainability, they are focussed on 1-5 year profits. They're doing the bare minimum, just look at how proactive VW is being in their electrification efforts! Especially given their Dieselgate I am super impressed by how they have risen to the challenge. GM..."yeah sure we might make some electric cars here and there, but 85% will still be gas powered in 2023". Also Tesla is very proactive in allowing users to repair or tinker with their own cars. They released a big repair guide and offer super convenient on site repairs and proactive/predictive maintenance. There's also a huge aftermarket supply of products to enhance or repair the car and even Tesla service people will recommend them to you. Heck UA-camrs are turning them into pickup trucks! Your comment about them binning more parts makes absolutely no sense. Also, their charging network is proprietary but only because it pushes the boundaries of charging speed and Tesla has invited other manufacturers to use it IF they can do so at an acceptable rate as to not block stalls beyond what their own cars do. GM doesn't use is because they can't do so. Tesla has been very generous with their patents all in support of global fleet electrification which manufacturers actually do make use of. Tesla has shown that it will pursue the long sustainable game at the determent of profits. They very much want other manufacturers to succeed, but will keep pushing them until they do. So yeah, there absolutely is a Huge difference in culture between the two and as such I think it's fine to hold GM accountable for their behaviour and have people argue that one company IS better than the other wether that's Tesla, VW, Volvo...but GM and BMW are pretty darn low on that list IMO.
My view is that GM is a shitty company that doesn’t give a shit about it’s workers, customers or the enviroment. It also makes generally unreliable and poor quality products. I don’t want to give my money to a company like that.
I dream of a world where I can just connect and disconnect my heavy long range battery packs, allowing me to have better efficiency and cargo capacity when I'm not in road trip mode.
Yep, there's a few PHEV models that work effectively just like that. The BMW i3 is an example since it has a 2 cylinder gas engine as an optional range extender (albeit due to this, many people call it a REEV, Range Extended EV). The engine has no physical connection to the wheels, and instead ends up going right to a generator
I was just thinking that. For people who think the Volt is more complicated than a regular car, think about how much more 'stuff' would be needed to make a pure diesel locomotive. As they are right now, from what I understand, the diesel motor purely generates electricity, which drives electric motors. Change around the series / parallel connections to the different motors and you have electric gearing. Can you imagine the transmissions they'd need if you needed to transfer the diesel motor directly to the wheels? The 'hybrid' diesel electric is far more simple.
We love this. Totally on the ball! Also, we want to do a collab with you some time ;) Just a point: BMW i3 Rex has a much smaller engine than the volt:)
Yes, and the BMW i3 REX is still not a road trip vehicle.. The car is good up to 160 miles... 80 on electric, and 80 on gas... then you need to stop every 80 miles to put 2 gallons of gas in it as that is the size of the fuel tank. The i3 is fun and great for short trips, but it has a very limited radius. The newer i3s have a bigger battery, but I think they remove the REX to make room for it for a total range of 150 miles on electric.
@@davidlovy1271 the i3 is a city car though. City cars are a thing Americans struggle to understand with a fierce passion. Just like we have weekend cars for leisure, city cars are for inner city driving, so a city car will be horrible for long trips, it's not meant for them.
Although the video was a little long and disconnected at times, I completely understood it and you blew my mind. I had no idea that Mode 4 even existed! I just assumed the Volt was an EV with its own gasoline charger and nothing more. Turns out it's a much cool car than I realized!
I was always surprised how many people asked if it was possible to charge the battery from the gas engine like that was some amazing feature in practice you almost never use it.
@@lawnmowerdude selling plug-in hybrids on the grounds of energy efficiency is hard when 93% of the car-buying public doesn't know what energy is or how energy relates to automobiles
I loved the concept. I was really hoping all their vehicles would have gone this way. I think a big market loss was naming cars Volt and Bolt. “I said Volt, not Bolt!” “You’re just saying the same thing over and over!. 😂
Having driven many cars in the past, the Volt is by far the best vehicle I have ever owned in terms of ride performance and convenience as a commuter car. The engineering is brilliant and GM should be applauded for pulling this off, especially through the rough times following the great recession. The major problem (as was pointed out in the video) is that the average American can't understand the concept behind the Volt, and the dealership network has an even lesser understanding.
My 2018 Volt is very well built and engineered. My first car was a 81 Olds X-body, not very reliable but can say after a year with the volt... best fit and finish of any car I've owned. My last 2 cars were Hondas and these cars are pretty damn reliable and well built.
@@electrictroy2010 It is more than eliminating fear, it is eliminating the whole need for charging infrastructure. BMW i3 has a backup generator but it is less efficient snd low power so it is just a backup to an electric vechile. You can not really use BMW i3 without charging it and it would be a pain to go long range on its backup generator if a particular car even has it. Chevrolet Volt switches completely to conventional gasoline drivetrain on a highway when it is most efficient (after you have successfully drained most of your battery) and it is an EV in slow low range city traffic when an EV is most efficient. Its gasoline motor is not just some backup device, it is designed to be used regularily when it is needed in some of the normal use cases.
There sure are a remarkable number of wind turbines popping up all around this country, and battery storage projects are being greenlit left and right. The switch to renewables is happening right in front of you. Do you care to acknowledge it? That's the real question.
@@TechnologyConnextras Those renewables aren't as universally available as you like to think. It's sorta like assuming everybody has to drive hundreds of miles a day routinely.
@@WCM1945 Well, yea - but it's no secret that the same people advocating a transition to electric vehicles are also advocating a transition to renewable energy sources. That's the eventual goal.
At 29:15 reminded me of a BIG gripe I have with a lot of car reviewers. Inevitably when they talk about level 1 120v charging they always frame it in a way like “it will take days to charge” yeah a completely dead 300 mile battery pack. If you plug it in every day like a normal person, level 1 would be fine for most people’s 30 mile usage.
Spaced Invader neither one is adequate. If you want to know how quickly the battery is getting filled, you need to look at watts, not volts *or* amps. The thing is, for “120V” you can read “a standard 120V outlet with 15A capacity”, which means 1800W. Which is not a lot! A standard outlet in Europe is 230V by 16A aka 3680W. But in the US, “a 120V outlet” *means* 15A, typically. If you want a fast charger, you need 230V by 40+ amps, aka 10.000W or so. And if you want to charge 80kWh in an hour, well, you need about 80kW. That’d be 230V at 350 amps or, more likely, 400V three phase at 63A. That’s a pretty chunky cable.
A big thing about the Volt's battery stability was, that GM actually COOLED that battery using the radiator, and battery heat is generally the death of a battery. The Volt is perfect for me because i (a) drive around town during the week, never use gas for that, (b) most weekends have to go across the state, oopsie for an EV, at least an aggravation, (c) shoot to Florida once a year, and i put that thing on 80 miles an hour so i can make it in 13 hours.
2:29 "You are hauling around all that weight for no reason." I've always thought this about people who buy enormous ICE cars, trucks and SUVs for doing a daily commute of much less than 60 miles and not doing any hauling of heavy goods. Why not buy a compact car, save a ton of money and *rent* a more capable vehicle when you are going to be hauling lots of people or goods?
I refuse to buy an SUV because I have absolutely no need for one. I’ve got a sedan (which is arguably the least practical body right after a coupe) and yet it doesn’t matter. Because as most people, I drive alone to work most of the time, or at most there’s four people in the car when going out for dinner or something. Sure some people have 4 people in the family and they wanna all go on vacation, but maybe the public shouldn’t have given up on station wagons in US then
People generally need to buy a car for the most extreme duty that will be required, not the average. I mostly commute - I could, 5 days a week, own a 1 seat automobile. But I have a 5 person family, so I need a 5 seat car for any trip with my family; We are also very close to our extended family and frequently have "sleepovers" with their children, so we, about 5% of the time, need to carry 7 people. So we purchased a Dodge Journey - a relatively affordable 7 seat vehicle. As for SUVs (or more specifically crossovers, which most are, as opposed to truck-based SUVs) are taller and far more comfortable to ride in compared to sedans. I had a Ford Focus, which was a really nice car, but you sat really low and laid back, I prefer to sit more upright, but my head hit the roof.
I won't drive small cars in large part cause other drivers are idiots and driving is dangerous. These days my daily is a full size gas guzzling sedan in part cause I also have a lead foot, performance matters to me. I like the Volt concept but its too slow, some Teslas are fastish but won't go far enough and are too expensive.
I was just about to say that, the whole point of a big battery pack is to use the energy from say 30-70% and not charge past that or discharge less than, and potentially avoid fast charging as much as possible, it will get the absolute best out of the battery and if you keep that in mind even a tesla battery we're taking only about 40% of it's capacity (i know 40% here doesn't exactly reflect 40% of it's entire energy capacity but i'm trying to simplify things) using the example above which is extremely conservative but still for short distances it's what you want and thus again your 100kw battery pack turns into a "40kw" battery pack again veeeeery simplified here just for some quick youtube comment level of engineering numbers. Also bigger batteries allow you to fast charge with less damage to the battery pack just the fact you're sending less energy to each cell (given the same charge speed).
@@dashtesla "The whole point" bullshit my dude, the point of a bigger battery is to shout about how much more range it has. Go to tesla's website right now and go look at how they differentiate the battery sizes for each model: the range; and the acceleration.
except that the engine is more than 'just' a backup generator since in mode 4 it does directly drive the wheels. So it switches between Electric, Extended Range Electric, and Hybrid. So it can be 1 of 3 types of vehicles depending on its mode which is where people get confuses as they want to just drop it into one of the predefined boxes, but it belongs in all 3.
@@Patmorgan235Us not quite, the EV motor and gas engine are both connected to the same transmission media.gm.com/content/dam/Media/documents/US/Word/101010_volt_launch/Drive_Unit.doc
I liked the idea of the Volt. Thought it should have been the model for the US. Battery use for commuters but doesn't limit to you to limited battery range. I didn't get one because I didn't like the drive as much and wanted something with more storage. Went for a Prius V.
...and a mode where that diesel drives the wheels mechanically, rather than through a generator-motor path. On the highway onramp, a single, large, battery powered motor powers the drive shaft. On the highway, a second, smaller, battery powered motor cooperates with the first. When the batteries fall below a certain level, the engine turns on and the smaller motor acts as a generator, to take over for the batteries in powering the larger motor. When the batteries have fallen below a certain level, and the car is travelling at higher speeds, the electric motors turn off and their rotors become mechanical links in the drive train, between the engine and the drive shaft.
I'm not sure if anyone has thought of this, but a temporary extension battery (in the trunk?) that you can rent from a dealer would be ideal: * You don't carry the weight when you don't need to * You can get the range extension when you need it * The battery can be used(refreshed) by other people when *you* are not using it * This does rely on the dealer buying the battery and taking good care of it
Yes but when people travel long distances often times they are going for a getaway or a weekender. This would require them to need the trunk for storage.
this is something that irks me about electric vehicles: why are the battery packs secured so obsessively into the chassis of the vehicle? you pretty much have to take the entire car apart to do anything with them.. I understand that rechargable batteries are kind of a dangerous product, that can cause fires, but surely there must be a way to make them easier to add or remove so you could have modular energy setups for people who either need more range, or don't need as much
The general consumer population can’t even simply use google to research their own major purchases. It’s kind of sad really. They just throw money at the fully loaded car the salesman recommends because they like the color. Not even knowing or using a lot of the features or even knowing the model of vehicle they purchased.
@@gilberttorres8 so what? That doesn't change what it is? Why would I want to completely recharge the battery with the generator? I only want to charge it just enough till I can get somewhere to plug it in. That is smart engineering.
I cant speak for the rest of the world but at least in europe that concept was doomed from the start. The range extender was classified like a regular combustion engine in terms of taxation. Electric cars are exempt from that monthly tax on engine horsepower but cost more upfront because electric cars are more expensive to their diesel powered counterparts. Those cars are cheap to buy but you have higher running costs from that engine tax and fuel costs. So you basically have 2 choices: Electric car is expensive upfront but has low upkeep cost. Internal combustion engine car is cheap upfront but has higher costs while in use. This killed the Chevrolet Volt or Opel Ampera as it was called here because you had an expensive car to buy upfront just so you could pay a lot of taxes for that range extender. Just like the BMW i3. That car sold way better as an electric only car without the range extender than with that option included. That tax was the single reason. If the government would have classified the range extender different the story would have played out different but the way it was implemented caused the Volt to be a terrible buy resulting in devastating sales numbers.
@@theq4602 From Ireland to Japan, most of the Old World countries have such taxes. Think about it as a consumer's protection since the tax is an appetizer for the bigger gasoline and insurance expenses so it pushes people to think twice before getting a beefier car.
@@Sirius304 Range extenders are connected to the wheels, thats kinda the point, like the BMW REx is a 2 cylinder motorcycle engine connected directly to the rear wheels, the Volt can use its engine to run the wheels, its not like slapping a generator on the back of the car and calling it good, if anything those should be taxed higher as your putting the cart before the horse, by making a mechical device power a generator, which looses efficiency, which charges a battery, more loss in efficiency, which then has to power the motor, more loss which then powers the wheels, meanwhile, just slapping the engine right to the wheels has the least loss, I own a first gen volt, and I love that car. But it still isnt the most efficient thing for using the resources it needs if you live in an area that uses fuel to generate power, Where i live is mostly wind turbines and solar panels so using an electric makes sense, but that clusterfudge of using the engine to generate power, just to turn the wheels makes little sense if the engine can do it with none of the losses by the charging system...
Meanwhile in America, some states have the exact opposite problem, where you have to pay an extra tax to own an all-electric car because you're not paying any fuel taxes. A Volt would probably be exempt from that.
i don’t know if this was different 5 years ago, but people don’t chose to drive an original nissan leaf because they don’t want to carry around a battery. They drive it because it’s $12,000 car that doesn’t need gas
I never gave a thought to electric cars. I couldn't tell you the differences among an EV, a hybrid, a plug-in, a Tesla, a Prius, a Bolt or a Volt. But this video has me interested and thinking about it. Good on ya!
He sold me on my first Volt (a 2017 Premier) in September 2019, and that one sold me on my second one (for our daughter in nursing school, a 2012). Fantastic cars. We already had a rice cooker. 🤣
There's a Chinese company that's developing a modular EV battery swapping station It's a subscription based business model Basically it relies on enough EV manufacturers to sign on, make their EV's batteries modular and is swappable, and then the drivers can take their cars to the battery swapping stations, drive in, remain in the car, the station swaps the battery for the car with a fully charged battery. I thought this is fantastic, batteries nearing the end of their lives will be collected and be sent to energy farms, and the vehicle's value are not going to be impacted as the battery degrades, and if the service is able to gather a critical mass of users, it'll become essentially a utility where it can likely secure government funding to keep it running for the masses.
I agree. I’ve always thought they should be using add on modular battery packs. Lithium Ion batteries are relatively light, and the modular approach is already being used on other things like battery powered lawn mowers. Of course the owner would need to plan ahead when going on an extended trip and install the extended battery modules. Otherwise the owner would have to visit more charging stations.
Ivan Diaz lol this is the most snobby comment I've ever read. Who are you to to tell anyone how to spend their money? A car is overkill for most people in fact a bike meets their daily needs! Lol A car isn't as binary as meeting the range required. People have families, don't wanna be out in the heat / cold / rain / wind, physically can't ride a bike, don't WANT to ride a bike etc.
@@Eexpers There's nothing snobby about literally stating a fact. Most people do not NEED car, hence the word need. yet you had plenty of WANTS listed for why people, regardless of the actual distance needed to travel, WANT a car rather than a bicycle. But, of course, predictably, you point this fact out and people like you get butthurt and immediately resort to all sorts of hilarious justifications for why their lives personally could not possibly be accommodated without a two ton living room sized wheelchair to get them around from one place to another.
@@ivandiaz5791 you're defining things completely arbitrarily on your own arbitrary metrics. you seem really hung up on size too... you sound completely uninformed and and arrogant. i'm not arguing with you
Oh also speaking of the "but electricity is dirty" (and I'm not mocking the point, just paraphrasing it quickly, etc.) -- ANY electric vehicle powered by ANY large scale source of electricity, and by large scale I mean a full sized power plant, is going to be cleaner per mile than even the most efficient ICE vehicle. Meaning it's not just a matter of electricity being able to be produced by renewables, it's that the filthiest coal plant can power its weight in electric vehicles with less pollution generated per mile driven than any ICE vehicle. Our friend thermodynamics comes into play in that the power plant is always going to be efficient enough to beat the tiny engine in a normal vehicle pollution per mile wise. And obviously you're 100% correct in that the trend is away from Coal anyway (and Coal is the only fuel source that is even in the ballpark pollution wise, there's absolutely no contest comparing a Natural Gas-fired plant with ICE engines and it becomes more and more slanted in the Electric Vehicles favor from there, etc.)
Not arguing, just curious: does that point take into consideration electrical transmission losses, or that during peak electrical use, oil-fired turbines and even diesel ICE 'peaker' plants are used? Its very inefficient to mine and transport coal. Coal mining also has a huge environmental impact.
@@Tommy_Mac No. That's all true, don't get me wrong. But those are more efficient overall than refining millions of gallons of gasoline and diesel. Even the few diesel-fired peaking plants are a more efficient use of diesel fuel as the larger the motor, the more efficient it is just because of thermodynamics. Coal-fired plants can hit 50% efficiency, Natural Gas fired turbines can match that and be as high as 70-75% in a combined cycle (where you use the hot exhaust to produce steam for an auxiliary steam turbine.) Even the losses in the transmission lines doesn't come anywhere near the inefficiency of using refined petroleum fuels. As a perfect example, it takes the energy equivalent of three barrels of petroleum to refine one barrel of fuels. At most you have to wash coal (speaking of high-sulphur coal), Natural Gas...something the United States is currently enjoying an enormous surplus in...is even less energy intensive to capture and much cleaner to burn. Depending upon petroleum directly is just the least efficient system anyway you slice it (and notice I didn't even mention climate change, I was talking solely about the economics of it, etc.)
@@nucflashevent "Coal-fired plants can hit 50% efficiency, Natural Gas fired turbines can match that and be as high as 70-75% in a combined cycle (where you use the hot exhaust to produce steam for an auxiliary steam turbine.)" Where do those numbers come from? The numbers I see are lower in every case. Now its true that Wikipedia is not perfect but this number seems a better fit for the physics. "and 56 - 60% (LEV) for combined-cycle gas-fired plants." You numbers seem to require Unobtanium for the turbines.
Found this video at random after watching some of his channel...as a car car guy,this blows me away that I never heard about how the Volt ACTUALLY works. Im glad a stuck around for this,like Ive been on the fence about buying a older electric for regular driving...but this has totally opened my mind to this car. Blown past these things all the time,never thought anything of them...kinda cool
Now we can build cars with ~3x the normally needed range, build the car with the base 1x range battery, and a space to slide in the other 2x battery. This add-on battery could be rented for the time needed.
Love my Volt! I’ve driven long term an i3 REX, a Model 3, and a Model S. The Volt is my recommended electric car. The Volt is the best value for your dollar. It’s comfortable like a Cadillac with surprisingly good electric range, decent handling, great acceleration, and very low cost of ownership. The cost to drive 1500 electric miles is only $40 with the ac and stereo blasting. Looking forward to picking up a second Volt soon. Keep up the great work.
This is actually similar to the first diesel train. This is actually not the first time similar concept was used. Diesel locomotives started the same way, diesel turbines powering electric motors.
@cedric1997 yeah they still are but not exclusively, I think diesel engines without the electric motor are used for shunting etc. Although there are ALSO electro-diesel trains which can run either as pure electric trains or as diesel-electrics, used on certain lines.
@@jcardboard No, you'd be hard-pressed to find anything besides diesel-electric locomotives (at least in the U.S.). There was only one kind of diesel-hydraulic locomotive ever produced for the U.S. but it was German design and failed miserably. The electro-diesel hybrid locomotive you speak of is most likely the ALP45DP used on New Jersey Transit, however in both modes the traction motors are electric. The difference being that the pantograph supplies direct current while the engine turns an electric generator.
The concept of standard and removable batteries across manufacturers would be great. Short range, you have 1 battery. Going for a longer trip? Go to a gas station and 'rent' more batteries. Gas stations could be battery swappers instead of chargers. No wait. (Didn't read all comments - unsure if this idea was circulated)
I'm a bit late to this party, but I just have to chime in. I just bought a 2012 Volt to replace the giant van that I loved, but no longer need. I absolutely love it. Even though it is 11 years old, it works beautifully and suits my needs perfectly. I really wish more auto makers would have gone this route as an option. A refined version with a 100 - 150 mile battery with a small backup generator for an additional 100 - 150 miles would be a fantastic transitional car while we switch over to electric.
The "premium" recommendation might make sense in some locales. Where I live in Canada, some of the gas stations only offer ethanol-free fuel as premium, and ethanol-free fuel tends to keep better in my experience. In my vintage motorbikes, ethanol fuel tends to collect moisture and gel up with time vs. ethanol free fuel keeping without issue.
I’m currently a Tesla Model 3 driver, for reference. Here on my thoughts on the Volt as a someone that prefers sporty cars and understands how cars, EVs, and the Volt works. 1. It should have been diesel. Much more efficient as generators because of the torque. 1a. I know that would have made selling it harder because the US is stupid about diesel cars. 2. The marketing on it was terrible. 2a. They shouldn’t have made the concept car look like a sports car. 2b. I think the styling turned off a lot of people. 3. It should have started as a Cadillac. The higher cost would be more expected and it would have helped recoup the development costs quicker. 4. I think the idea, tech wise, was really smart. Most people wouldn’t have to think about it very differently than a normal car. You don’t have to worry about charging infrastructure. Nothing different about route planning for trips. It’s a really great design to help people transition to EVs. There should be more cars like that, not less. Personally , the Volt was never for me. The Tesla fits the performance mold for me in an EV package. Thanks for taking the time to teach more people how it worked, as I think that was never done well.
Putting regular gas into a computerized engine will not harm it...the computer will just adjust the ignition timing to prevent preigition and knocking...therefore your performance will be degraded.
@@emofreako true but still unlikely to cause serious damage unless you're putting in some seriously awful, very low RON / MON fuel. We carry out durability testing and engine calibration against poor quality fuels to make sure the knock controller has sufficient authority to deal with it safely :)
Just re-read and I think I missed the point slightly - you're talking more about stability tolerance to late combustion phasing? In this case, the only answer I have is: yes, engine design and calibration is a very complicated system of trade-offs and things like this are guaranteed to be the cause of many engineers' headaches and coffee jitters for any given engine variant 😅
Learning new stuff all the time. It never occurred to me that at least some modern engines may be able to adjust like that (even though that's essentially what flex fuel engines do to my understanding I never extended thought to high compression engines).
A knock sensor is just a microphone that listens for pinging from the combustion chamber. If there is, the computer retards the timing which degrades the power output for the combustion.
Could they not make the batteries modular? A base model has an xx capacity battery, with a few slots available to purchase or rent additional batteries when the buyer needs additional range regularly, or occasionally for longer trips?
That will likely not be an option at all in 2026 when the federal fleet average becomes 54.5 MPG. Unless some sort of magic is involved, this will almost certainly require some kind of hybridization. Look for car prices to increase dramatically.
@@cpufreak101 Doesn't matter. If car companies want to sell their vehicles in California, they will still need to adhere to those CAFE standards. Oregon and Washington are also considering joining them.
@@Chordonblue ah that's right, forgot about CARB there a min, though I do also know the current administration is trying to rule that California and other states do not have the "power" to enforce that, and as it stands right now I don't think anyone knows of it's legally enforceable or not
@@cpufreak101 I would think it is. If a state doesn't want to let a certain kind of car enter their borders, it doesn't matter what they base their decision on, really. I would think they could make this stick. After all, as California goes, so we all go, as the saying goes... Unfortunately...
@P Mason Not all of then, most of them have dynamic brakes, this system of brakes disipates most if not all of the electricity produced by braking in resistive loads.
@@acynder1 diesel electric mining trucks are a good example of resistive dynamic brakes (retarders). Bringing 1,000,000+lbs of loaded truck to a near complete stop, or holding a steady speed downhill, with what is essentially an oversized space heater was pretty impressive to experience when I drove them.
@@b.c.2281 My grandfather from my dad side loves to tell when he "raced" his colleages down a really twisty and dangerous mounthain pass nearby here when Alsa bringed the new buses with "electric brakes" as he calls them. It was quite of a thing to have back then and he really enjoyed it.
Diesel electric locomotives were what came to my mind as well. In some discussions I'd had on topics related to vehicle power for rail transit, the possibilities of diesel electric tri-mode LRVs had come up: powered from catenary in urban settings that also charges a battery, battery powered at "urban" speeds off catenary and diesel electric for "suburban" or "commuter" speeds. The idea was basically to leverage existing unelectrified trackage but taking advantage of electrified track where it existed, with a long term goal of incremental electrification.
I've questioned for some time why you don't see more diesel electric tractor trailers... you wonder how much fuel they waste every time they cycle through 10 or 15 gears every time they pull away from a stoplight.
Cool! I worked on the 2nd gen Volt, BoltEV, and the next gen powertrain over 9 years at GM. A lot of what's made has to do with EV government credits, and somewhat marketing. I'd be glad to talk about non-proprietary stuff if you're interested - I left GM a few months ago.
@@rafterh2181 There were ones that do similar things as the Volt, but not the exact same power flow or clutch configurations / optimizations. A couple years before the Volt (2010), the BYD F3DM (2008) was the first extended range EV (can run as a pure EV at all road legal speeds and then as a hybrid when the battery runs down), and was old only in China. The Prius Prime is probably the closest thing to the Volt that still exists, being able to drive at up to 80+mph without the gas engine. However, the Prius Prime's EV range of 25 miles is shorter than both the F3DM and Volt (especially the 2nd generation with 50+ miles EV range).
@@rafterh2181 I forgot the BMW i3 Rex (no electric top speed limit, but generator can't keep up with battery drain at sustained high loads) and i8 (EV mode top speed of 75mph).
@@yueibm So do they work like a Volt in that they are an EV with a generator? If you blow an engine in a Volt you could still charge it and drive it 50 miles
Until charging infrastructure improves, we'll still need large batteries and/or range-extenders. Tesla is obviously well ahead of the game on that front, but Chevy had a decent bridge technology. It was the massive housecleaning that GM did that doomed it, not the concept.
CCS combo fast charging infrastructure is coming along nicely. This is what everybody besides Nissan uses and Tesla will eventually have an adapter for that connector as well. Look in Plugshare app for a full list of stations.
There's more to infrastructure than charging stations. Every Joule required to move that car over its entire range has to come from the charger. Imagine every household having 2-3 EVs charging at night. It would make the AC load in a 100 deg heat wave look like a walk in the park. The utilities, the lines, the transformers, are not ready for this load.
@@ThatEEguy2818 well the good news is the grid has many years to adapt to this by using the smart grid and peak hours and other technologies. So far I do not see them complaining. Adoption of electric vehicles takes time
I expect we'll see the concept,.again. now that electric trucks are coming out, ANY amount of towing absolutely eviscerates the range. TFL Truck channel tried towing a modest trailer with a Model X and it was just...bad. Performance was great, of course (which is the major benefit of EVs), but the range was unacceptable. Ford has been teasing their electric trucks. We know GM is working on one. The Chevy Volt concept is basically perfect; it's an EV when you're driving around town and not hauling something, and it's an ICE vehicle when you're towing a load. The electric motors can also propel it during acceleration, leaving the ICE to operate when it's at its most efficient on the highway at relatively low RPM. Basically what I'm trying to say is that the Volt concept HAS to come back if electric trucks are going to be a thing, because without a revolution (not evolution) in battery tech, the level of technology in 2019 doesn't let you tow anything more than a canoe for longer than about 100 mi, and even then the amount of batteries required put the sales price upwards of Denali or King Ranch prices.
A better use of the extra battery capacity would be grid energy storage. Imagine if virtually every electric car could be connected to your house at night and function like a powerwall charging on lower price energy and then supplying your house during the day. Alternatively, you could charge the car during the day on solar at home or at work and then power your house at night. Both options would justify having a battery which 80% you don't use for the majority of the year.
So you don't want to have a fully charged car? It sounds like you plan on just buying a car to leave parked as a battery, instead of driving as a car. Also, you are using life cycles for an expensive vehicle battery, so not really that great of an idea financially.
@@KaitouKaiju that's why you never charge the battery to maximum capacity, rather than running it to max and then discharging it into the grid. Every time you charge or discharge it takes life away from the battery.
I live in Germany, and the EV Problem is simply the price and resurses. Manny EV's comming back from leasingcompenies to the dealers after 3 to 4 years and no one want's to buy them. The battery capasity ist most times under 70 %. Replacing the battery costs most times over 5000€. And the price new ist most times 10000€ to 20000€ more then the normal oil burning equivilant. And the electrik grid is not build to deal with such a high load. An Elektrik expert once said, that we have to fortifie the elektric grid up to 6 times the capacity it has now. That means 6 Times more power plants and 6 times more cables. That is not possible in such a short time. And to commedate that much energy with renuebles is nothing but fantasy. In Germany the current renuable amount of the entire energieproducktion is 5,5 %. And our retardet politicans say, that they want to have only renueble energy in a view jears. And remember, we need 6 times mor than now on top of that. And now energieprices skyrocketing and stripping everyone of theyr monney so les and les people can efford an EV. So the car companys simply don't sell much EV's. And what doesent sell is getting kiked out of produktion. Simple economics.
why do sailboats waste energy by dragging a small diesel trolling motor around? that one does make sense as, what happens when its suddenly not windy, do you just live there until the currents take you somewhere else, The volt has the same concept and just like the motor on a sailboat, its genius.
Surly the answer to the ever increasing battery size issue is a simple one. To either make a range of batteries of diffent capacities or include the ability to fit addition batteries as required.
Perhaps for the same reasons many of us do? I also have crimp connectors in RJ-22, RJ-11, RJ-14, RJ-25, as well as BNC, SO-239/PL-259, N, SMA, etc., for multiple types of coax and countless other crimp connector types for other electronics, radio, telecom projects. Some of us simply have interesting side projects. ;-)
Aaron Kaase Trust me, you’d be surprised how much stuff is sitting on my electronics and amateur radio workbenches during the few UA-cam videos I have done. Not just a ton of test gear and loose tools, but loose parts, piles of partially disassembled electronics awaiting repairs...its a proper mess. Those projects need plenty of time on the healing bench before they are properly ready to be repaired!
My thoughts on the bigger batteries: You get a lot more benefits from a bigger battery pack than just more range. You can charge it faster and you don't stress the individual cells that much doing so. You also don't charge the pack that often if you're just doing your daily driving. And you get better acceleration and top speed because you get more current out of the pack. The only downsides are initial cost and weight, but I think if you have the money for it, you should go for a bigger battery pack.
Saying weight is one of "the only" downsides and downplaying it is silly. It's a *significant* amount of weight, and more weight means more power needs to be used to move the car, making it less efficient and putting more strain on the battery cells. There's a sweet spot; the answer isn't to just cram more and more and more battery in.
The other benefit is longevity. I drive a 30kWh Leaf in the UK. Using data from other owners, the degredation of the battery looks like most of us should have at least 75% capacity at 10 years old. So by 15-20 years old we should have over 50% range. I need 50 miles a day, and my car can do 120 miles, meaning by the time it's 10 years old it should still be able to do over 90 miles, and well over 60 miles when it's 15 years old. That's great for me. But say someone needed 95 miles for their daily commute? Well they'd get less than 10 years use from the car (OK so in the UK the average car age is only 7 years), and would have to either buy a new car, have the battery upgraded (there are 3rd parties that will fit a 40kWh battery to your old 24kWh Leaf, or replace the degraded cells with newer ones, restoring the original range) or stop to charge for a bit on the way home. With a car that starts with a higher range, that 25% loss at 10 years still leaves the owner with a decent range. A 200 mile car drops to 150 miles, so you can keep the car for longer, and it retains more value when you go to scrap it.
Well, i wouldn't say that they can charge faster, usually, the big size only gives you more problems, like the need for better (usually heavier) thermal management systems, the problem of slow charging due to the size of the battery, the obvious problem of weight and the problem of space. Larger batteries are all over worse than small batteries that are just big enough for the task. Also, as the weight gets worse over higher energy capacity, batteries are just not cut for lonf distance travel, that's when fuel cells can show their full potential. They too have a great drawback, essentially efficiency. However, as travel distances grow, this disadvantage fades more and more away. Fuel cells also have the benefit of being easily expendable for higher ranges, one additional drawback of battery packs. So it is like it always was, everything has it's benefits and drawbacks and nothing is perfect. It lies in our hands to use the technologies that we know to creat the best suited system ;D.
@@Enthropical_Thunder : From where/what did you get this seemingly erroneous statement? "usually, the big size only gives you more problems, like the need for better (usually heavier) thermal management systems"
The Toyota hybrid was also a fantastic design... in its day... no switching gears in the "transmission", just a single planetary gearset that could allow EV Mode, or blend electric drive with mechanical drive... continuously variable transmission without any friction drives, clutches, or CVT nonsense. Our 2008 Highlander Hybrid has over 265k miles and has been unimaginably reliable... even the brake pads are original. But I won't replace it with another hybrid now that my BMW i3 BEV has shown me how maintenance free a car can be.
I'm thankful for the explanation. I always understood the Volt was as an electric car that has an on-board generator that has no function other than to re-charge the battery. Basically, a diesel-electric locomotive but in a sedan form. The railroad industry figured out that this was a great idea in the 1950s, and somehow GM didn't market the car in that fashion. It seems like it's basically like that in modes 1-3, but mode 4 kind of throws the wrench in that academic definition since there's then a mechanical link between the engine and driveline.
There isn't a mechanical link to the drivetrain,. Mode 4 simply holds the voltage at whatever limit you set it to (essentially giving you a reserve for extended hill climbs over what hill mode does, or lets you keep that capacity for later)
@@tom4775 Transaxle mode, not driving mode. The 4th Transaxle mode directly connects the engine to the wheels at highway speeds to improve fuel efficiency. Though, it's only the case for gen 2
I understand that this isn't easy but it would be cool if you could just have expansion battery packs. So you have your main daily driver which is lighter but if you want to go on a road trip you just plug in extra capacity
I love my Chevy Volt. I don’t put gas in it until I need to go visit my daughter or go on a road trip longer than 50 miles. Best car I have own except for my 69 firebird (nothing beats Detroit muscle).
Battery packs should be standardized and able to be swapped out. Then range becomes effectively unlimited and charging stations can use off peak energy to charge the packs at night.
23:30 Toyota hybrids do not have conventional belt driven cvts. The transmission in toyota hybrids have been the planetary gearset since the 1st generation prius.
Indeed, there is a planetary gearset that basically subtracts the speed of MG A and MG B to pretend there is a CVT. One of the MGs is permanently fixed to the combustion engine. Energy flows from MG A to MG B or the other way around but if MG B is kept at standstill there is a direct drive path from engine to wheels. No clutches at all - only a parking brake. Quite smart, to be honest.
I'm a car guy with gasoline in my blood. I drive a Mustang, play with Studebakers and my favorite way to spend a vacation day is on a road trip. All that being said I thought the Volt was great idea when it came out, and I still do. The fact that it failed has everything to do with politics and idiocy on GM's part. If instead of the Volt GM had introduced the (Voltec?) powertrain in the little Cadillac first GM would still have been hailed for introducing that new technology, it would have enhanced Cadillac's reputation and the well heeled early adopter types would have snapped them up, helping to defray the cost of development. That's how new automotive technologies have always been introduced. It's an economic model that has been proven to work over and over again. GM tried to turn that on its head, it's no surprise the scheme failed, that's what happens when politics tries to overcome economics.
I've never understood why the auto industry hasn't embraced a diesel (or gas)-electric powerpack. You get the benifits of a fully electric drivetrain, with the range of an IC engine.
Yeah, that is my problem whit EV, they are too dependant on the conditions that youre in. an ICE doesnt have that problem. I think on your point that is both complexity and reliabity. Its hard to make these systems right and the are not embraced has "pure enough" from the enviromalentis to get a chance to prove themselves. Also I think that EV have a really bad problem on the fact that modern cars have to much tech and bs built in them. I just cant trush any new car regardless of powerplant to be running in 15 years time winout major repairs put in them, I can understand an old car (+20 years) having serius engine problems because at + 250.000 km the engine itself becomes a fungible part. But EV will have to replace their batts in more or less 10 years, and for the full batt ones the batts alone are more than half of their stiker price on the showroom. This means that once the batt dies, so does the rest of the car. If I spend 20k€ on a car you cant spect me to put 10k€ in 10 years because the bats are bad. And on the batts part, they dont have any standard at all soo I fear that It will happen the same that happens with smartphones. If the batt dies, their bats are not produced anymore, soo any replacement you can find will be a similar aged batt, that means that it is already on their lifes end, even if brand new...
@@acynder1 Some electric vehicles use cylindrical battery cells of a standard form factor. The pack is custom but the cells aren't. So the pack can get new cells, possibly with more capacity than when the car was new, rather than just gently used old cells or perhaps new cells from the manufacture (they have to produce spare parts for some time). But others use the pouch style battery cells, I don't know how much standardization there is of those cells. I have 200K miles on my 2013 Volt and the pack still has 85-90% of its capacity.
@@danwat1234 The physical shape of the cells isn't the problem, the aviability of the batt module is, cells are welded on with nikel wire inside the module so even if you recicle the module and put new cells in the cost of the job can easy be more than 25% of the cars worth, and nobody will pull with that. And not to mention the rest of the car, an EV is the house of wonders of electrical gremlins has they age. Just on lead free welds breaking up from age and vibrations would be a nighmare. Not to mention any of the components dying like elecetrolityc caps, transistors and such. Or what would happen if an update bricks the car? I just dont trush Manufacturers to make a car to last 15y the normal way, Much less an EV.
Its the same reason that Ferdinand Porsche's Heavy tank idea in WW2 did not pan out, it is a extremely complex system to get working right without the whole thing bursting into flames like his tanks using this system did. It becomes heavy very fast and weight limitations are real with Gas-electric drives. Its not a huge of a issue on massive trains but getting it down to car size and being reliable without being too massive or weighing too much is a problem.
Well, the good solution is to have a tiny battery on basically all cars, and just make car rental for long range travel the norm. These rental cars would have the battery capacity (or on-board generator like the Volt, which really isn't rocket science as that's exactly how all diesel locomotives work), while individual cars would have just the adequate range, lower mass (thus higher safety, economy of material in the battery pack and chassis), and be more affordable.
Can't wet just have an option to plug in a larger battery in the boot, for the long trips? You could rent one from a recharge station and just have the built in smaller battery for everyday use.
I really miss my volt. I had a 2012, and it did not have enough back seat room for 2 carseats. Where I live, there are NO superchargers. People regularly drive to a city about 620km (385 miles) away. There are NO superchargers along the route. Driving a pure electric turns a 6 hour drive into an overnight trip. Even a top of the line, max battery capacity, is not enough to make the trip on one charge. That is why I love the Volt. Pure electric in the city, gas to allow for long trips without having to charge overnight.
Dave Dave, out of curiosity, whereabouts do you live? I know there are some significant coverage gaps in the supercharger network, especially in the middle of the US, so I just wanted to know how sparse you're talking, and whether there is more infrastructure planned or even rolled out since your comment here. I loved my Volt, but I live in the Bay Area where things like level 2 chargers are plentiful (though surprisingly DC fast charging is pretty rare still). I got it because I needed HOV lane stickers, as the carpool lane typically reduced my commute from 1.5h to 45m EACH WAY! So when the green HOV stickers were set to expire, my Model 3 reservation was called up and I said "screw it, why not?" and bought one without ever driving or even sitting in one. Again, the first Model 3 I ever even *sat in* was my own on the delivery day. My Model 3 has been, hands down, the best impulse buy I ever made. The line in this video about the Volt being EV w/ training wheels is spot on, so range anxiety was mostly not at issue, but it still crossed my mind. Cali's supercharger network quickly proved that concern unwarranted, and though I recognize the coverage gaps exist, I look at the map and can't think of any reason why I'd ever need to go through such areas. (Not saying such rural areas are bad, I just don't know rural folks and no reason to visit.) When available, or even when 3rd party level 2 chargers are available, and my car knows I don't have the charge to make it, it will automatically route to the supercharger (or level 2 charger) that makes the most sense. As you near the charger the battery is conditioned to optimal charge temperatures too, so the other day I charged from 10% to 87% in ~23min on a gen 2 supercharger (150kW, and gen 3 are 250kW). It was almost done before I could find something to watch on UA-cam TV through the touchscreen. In the past it's been done before I could finish walking the dogs on long trips. I guess the point here is that the most common reason people hesitate to go electric are range anxiety and charge times relative to gas station stops. I honestly didn't fully get over either before getting a BEV. But Tesla has proven to me that it making those concerns unfounded is actually possible. We just need the infrastructure to do it. Tesla may not have been able to get chargers around you yet (much of it depends on private land owners wanting them, which is rough in anti-tesla areas), but as one company their reach is impressive and they've shown that real public investment in EV infrastructure can make widespread adoption a reality. Shifting subsidies from legacy energy sources to things like fast charging stations is well beyond due I think. Really though, I'm glad you're enjoying your Volt. It's really a fantastic car that I'd considered the best I'd ever owned... until getting my current car. I was still quite sad when GM killed it off and production was stopped, but I too understand why they did it. Anyway, I hope you are able to enjoy your Volt for years to come! If you've made it this far... what the hell is wrong with you?? I'm not even gonna read this, and I freaking wrote it!
@@CurtisShimamoto I live in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada, one of the largest cities within about an almost 400 mile radius, and the population is under 300,000. We just do not have the population density, or EV density. Provinces like Ontario or Quebec have the population density and enough EVs to make it worth while to put in chargers. Nothing has changed since my original post, and it likely won't for a long time.
@@davedave8263 interesting, thanks for the super quick reply! From what you describe, you're right... and it probably will not be prioritized to receive such infrastructure anytime soon either unfortunately. It's definitely areas like yours that I've long realized will continue to make plug in hybrids and BEVs w/ range extenders not only viable for years to come, but quite necessary even. I've lived in populated areas for my entire life, so I couldn't imagine having to basically drive to Los Angeles (from here in silicon valley) to get to any kind of decently sized city. Thanks again for the response! Enjoy your Friday and have a great weekend. :)
You purchase one that has a full battery pack, but you can remove some of the battery. That way, you're only carrying the amount you need for usual days, and for longer trips, you can put more battery in. Maybe even allow space for "expansion packs".
If things go well my next car will be 'lectric. It'd be interesting to see modular battery units. Add more as you need them. Swap them around, plug them into your house as solar storage cells...
@@GBOAC But, with the EV-1 GM went way beyond what was required by law. Other companies just took existing ICE models and fitted them with batteries and motors. The EV-1 was designed from the ground up as an EV. It really was an amazing accomplishment for the time.
I recently bought a Volt as my first car. For what I need it for, it's great. Pretty much every day I use only electricity. I haven't filled it up since I got it and still have half a tank left (I got it in February and now it's April) I love it so much. Totally agree with your "EV with training wheels" analogy.
Why not use a small battery car with an option to add another battery pack stored at the consumer's home, easily installed for the extra range when traveling?
The discussion of 'excess' battery capacity reminded me of the old joke:
The optimist sees the glass is half full.
The pessimist sees the glass is half empty.
The engineer sees the glass is twice the size it needs to be.
Now I wonder if there isn't a variant on that joke where "engineer" is replaced with "bean counter".
@@RailRide I've seen a variant where the engineer cut the cup in half.
@@RailRide No, the bean counter says, "why are we making it out of glass? We could be sourcing it from a plastics plant in China."
lol
so when you're more thirsty than usual you must refill the glass twice or thrice, and each refill takes a couple hours
I love my volt.
I go months without buying gas and when I feel like it, I can do a big road trip without ever thinking about finding a place to charge it.
It just works for the world we live in now.
I love my volt as well - 80% of my driving is all electric.
Sorry pal i'll take a 67 Impala or a 68 Mustang or a 72-78 firebird over a wimpy EV.
Cars are meant to be loud and fast,not quiet and slow. But as they say, you do you.
I've always wanted to pick one up. Very cool car with a great concept. I'm a bit bummed GM discontinued it, hopefully someone makes a similar car and can fill the void or market it better.
@@freebird0147 Teslas are quiet and fast.
@@freebird0147 pretty sure there is an inverse relationship to loudness of cars and penis size
Me, 10 minutes in: "Is he ever going to use that marker?"
I'm too busy watching the lava lamps. The video is long enough that they're going to erupt some time... but WHEN?? Will blue or orange be the first? (Edit: rats, they were already hot and just bulged up instead of erupting.)
Me 30 minutes in... "he repeats himself so much, this could be a 10 min video".
AVERAGE American drives 15,000 miles a year. That stat cones from the DOT and the gentleman who thought 80,000 was typical was just being stupid
.
Chekhovs gun
@@ZlothZloth, there’s an orange lava lamp?! Why am I not seeing an orange lava lamp??🙁
Translation: "The Volt is essentially an electric vehicle with an onboard generator." I always did like this concept over other "hybrid" EVs.
not quite...
yes, there are a lot of people who live in townhouses or apartments where it is not feasible to do overnight charging; at the same time, spending 30 minutes at a fast-charge port might also feel like a lot when most cars are able to go to a gas station and fill up in 6 minutes or less
You're describing a series hybrid. Honda has what you want with their E-Drive. BMW's i3 with Range Extender is an example as well. GM never really did this. Once the traction battery is depleted the ICE mechanically propels the car anywhere above 36mph. While the ICE can drive the generator to charge the battery, it's really not designed for it. It's essentially no different than a Prius mechanically, using a planetary gearset to allow the ICE to operate as a transmission in a parallel hybrid. Honda E-Drive and the i3 are essentially pure EVs (no transmission) and the ICEs provide a charge for them. Hondas system can connect the ICE directly, but without any gearing and only under specific low thrust conditions around 50-60mph.
Hate to burst your bubble. GM was very secretive about what the Volt really was. A regular hybrid. NOT a EV with a generator. I remember having discussions with Volt engineers who get huffy & puffy about it. They also claim they don't consume any fossil fuel just because they charge at work. Nope sorry, I Don't believe GM runs off solar.
yeah, except for when it isnt
12:06 -- That's GM's wheelhouse: making awesome cars that they never tell anyone about, and then killing them shortly afterwards because they didn't sell.
Lol good nobody buys them . they went bankrupt that's how good there great cars where.
to wit
I saw 2 only.
EVs are excessively expensive to own, maintain, operate.
@@mddunlap03 ford was hit bad too, same with crystler.
@@shadowopsairman1583 Literally none of those three things is true, lol
The Volt was a great bridge between gas and electric. It is a truly big loss.
agreed.
The Volt is perfect for places like where I live, Alberta Canada (or what I like to call Texas North). This province is the opposite of progressive. We have next to no charging infrastructure but vast open roads connecting our widely interspaced cities. Here, the argument that even long range EVs would be difficult to use on roadtrips actually has some validity, especially if you plan on going on remote mountain roads. Consequently, after first subscribing to the "all or nothing, full electric or bust/Elon Musk is the only true God and Savior" religion, I eventually came around to the more pragmatic view that (for the time being) a vehicle like the Chevy Volt is as probably as close as I can currently get to the green ideal I would like to hold myself to. And when I say, "a vehicle like the Chevy Volt", what I really mean is the Volt and only the Volt because there's really nothing else quite like it. The BMW i3 comes close. Sadly we ruled it out because, although to my own surprise, I kind of dig its Bizarro styling and it has more EV range than we need for the city, unfortunately even with the gasoline range extender, it still has less total range than we would be comfortable with for intercity trips. The Prius Prime also comes close, but it was ruled out because of its mediocre EV range that would likely see us burning gas even in the city. Well, and then there's the yuck factor of its abhorrent styling. But after those two (and I suppose the Hyundai Ioniq plug-in hybrid) there's really nothing else remotely fits.
All my city driving needs are met by the Volt's EV range (with a small cushion left over if we run more errands than usual). Plus, on road trips I don't fear getting stranded in the middle of nowhere. Which is exactly what most of our province is, the middle of nowhere. We only have a few decent sized cities and then vast, vast nothingness in between.
In 10 years, my hope is that infrastructure will have developed enough to allow us to get a full EV, because this is what I would prefer. But in the present, we would either need 2 cars (an EV AND a gas guzzler) or the one and only Volt. But the Volt is without question more efficient even when burning gas than any pure ICE vehicle out there. I'm sure I'm not the only one who fits in this boat.
I fear that with the discontinuation of the Volt and dearth of similar options, we're leaving people who want to go electric but live in places like I do with little to no realistic alternatives and forcing them to stick with their gas guzzlers for another decade or so. And I think those who are climate aware would all agree that that's far too long.
I have a Clarity. Seems to be based on the same basic concept.
We have crossed that bridge a while ago. The bridge is no longer needed.
Not a bad idea, but it was made by GM, who has a terrible reputation for making absolute garbage, because they try to make everything as cheap as possible.
Range anxiety kills electric cars. Most people don't realize that the voltech technology eliminates that.
The marketing department at Chevy really messed it with how the Volt works.
Want an electric car you have one.
Want a car that can drive unlimited miles as long as you have gas,. You have one. Most people don't understand that.
GM engineers must have been so pissed off when they drop the car, what an insult to the amazing job they did. GM never trained dealers how to sell this car and most dealers never wanted to sell the car. My 2013 is amazing car, I let people drive mine and then they go out and buy one also. I have sold 6 Volts now.
Exactly. The only failing of the volt was the marketing
Exactly!
Don't people understand that theres several passive charging methods in play as well? my sisters prius (first model) adds charge from braking
@@LeonSteelpaw no, people just assume you fully discharge batteries, then charge for hours and repeat. Never mind that you can simply recharge daily without an issue
I wanted a Volt so badly, and I cannot believe more manufacturers didn't go this route. It's a much, much better "hybrid" model. 90% of what I need a car for on the rare occasions I need a car is for trips under 10 miles. But, a couple to several times a year, I need to do a long-range road trip of 180-600 miles.
It's awesome. Like many people who've had dozens of cars over decades; my (2015 Premiere) is my favorite car I've ever owned. I had a 2017 Corvette Z51 Manual Convertible but couldn't drive it 5 months or of the year in Michigan for instance.
I enjoy how you've internalized the voices of the hater youtube commenters so deeply that you're basically embodying and having conversations with them right on camera.
AVERAGE American drives 15,000 miles a year. That stat cones from the DOT and the gentleman who thought 80,000 was typical was just being stupid
.
Three word summary of this video;
ramble ... pause ... ramble
Chevy should've been the forefront for American Diesel hybrids. There's not a single popular hybrid with a Diesel option, not even the Prius. GM was the pioneer of introducing a Diesel option for pretty much most of their passenger car lineup, but that's no longer the case.
i enjoyed it :3
The volt is a good niche alternative to people who often do extend the range of a regular ev. They can drive electric most of the time but the couple of times a month they need to drive a lot they can just use the extender and not worry about it.
For the rest a regular ev make much more sense and for the few people who do drive hours a day every day an ev is not a practical option anyway at the moment.
I enjoyed its relaxed rambling.
Am I allowed to say self entitled millennials need not comment?
One ev difficulty is living in cities where basically no one has a driveway/garage. It won't matter how big the battery is if you can't charge it easily overnight because you have to park on the street.
Whilst it's true, if cities and countries are willing to become green, there will be a need to invest in public charging stations.
@@SewerShark That's no good though if you'ven had to make a long journey so are low on power, need to get to work the next morning, it's late, the nearest charger is 20 minutes walk away and when you get there it's full with everyone else doing the same, and they're going to be there all night. Unlikely in suburbs, but big cities WILL have that problem if they go that route.
Being able to fill up with a liquid fuel in minutes that doesn't have an expensive tank that progressively shrinks and doesn't vanish in cold weather is a better way. It doesn't then matter if you need to suddenly drive hundreds of miles more than usual, just fill up in 5 minutes and carry on. It adapts around you, you don't need to adapt around it. The Volt was one way of approaching the problem from that angle.
We should be going forwards not backwards. There are ways to clean up transport without having to add in extra incoveniences that most of us do not have to put up with today.
@@thegearknob7161 you are still thinking EVs as regular cars. With gas and diesel, you need distribution centres (Gas stations) due to delivery restrictions.
With electric, you already have an infrastructure...electric poles. All you need is the outlet. So, city councils could install those in your sidewalk, in the same way as there are parkimeters.
But its too expensive, you say? Yes, but not everyone on your street has an EV, right? So you could ask the city hall to install it, and you and your neighbours could pay to install and have it partially subsided by the city council. Each charging station could be used for, let's say, 2 or 4 households, and you don't need to pull an extension from your window to the street. I think it's a win-win situation.
@@SewerShark Where I live there aren't really electric poles. It's all buried under ground and would involve digging up all the roads to get at. Which inevitably leads to yet another terrible patch job to cover it, and greatly adds to the cost.
Can't use street lighting either because they aren't wired thickly enough to handle the current draw of charging hundreds of EVs at a greater rate than a hamster with a dynamo.
I lived in a block of flats where the only parking was on the street, and was very limited. If everyone drove EVs, the council would have to install chargers down the length of that road to charge every single car since due to the way EVs get used, they're all going to be on charge overnight. The chargers would also take up space on the narrow pavement, to the point it may not actually be legal to install them there.
My friends' house is another example. It's in an area that wasn't built with driveways. There is like a big communal car park, which the council have washed their hands of. Everyone hates each other and there is constant vandalism. There's no electric supply up that end, but even if there was and chargers were fitted you can bet that the chargers would get vandalised.
Battery EVs are a concept that work if you are rich and have a house with your own driveway, but for the rest they are impractical.
Public charging stations by ALL public parking, including on street. Kinda like putting a charger in everywhere there is a currently a parking meter, and many more
Gen 1Volt owner, true believer! Bought nine gallons of gas during first year ownership, 7000 miles, charged only on solar power overnight. But, twice in the last few years have had to drive cross country. Didn’t have to give it a second thought. Wonderful concept. Great car, sorry they stopped production.
Charging on solar over night is amazing. How exactly you do that?
@@maxant4285 He did it by bullshitting
@@ultrastoat3298LOL
@@ultrastoat3298or charge a 20 kWh battery at home in the day then charge the 16 kWh volt from the battery at night.
@@maxant4285One can have a battery installed with a home solar array so one can access that solar energy at night.
It’s more expensive and less efficient than charging during the day off of home solar. But most people drive away from their home for the bulk of the daytime on a work day.
I drive a Model 3 and formerly drove a Leaf (and before that a 2007 Prius).
I think the problem with the Volt is simple: people don't buy vehicles based on a logical assessment of their needs and objectives, they buy vehicles based on emotion.
The Volt is a reasonable, practical choice. It's a vehicle that is almost as clean from a tailpipe emissions perspective as a pure EV, but which you can take on long trips. That should be an appealing prospect, but it's just not appealing emotionally.
If you're not a green wonk, you aren't going to buy Bolt or a Volt. They just aren't cheap enough or otherwise appealing enough to appeal to someone who doesn't care about the environmental benefits.
If you do care about the environment though, the idea of driving around in a vehicle with tailpipe emissions "sometimes" is icky. You have already decided to spend more, and now you're looking at the Volt in the mid-30k range. For close to that price, you could buy a Leaf Plus or a Kona or even the Model 3 SR+. Yeah, the Volt is more practical, and almost as clean. But you're still driving a vehicle with gas in the tank, and for many in the green crowd that's a no-go.
The Volt is too expensive up-front for most people who don't care about the environment and doesn't have enough green cred for the people who do.
The math says the Volt would be a great choice for a lot of people, but most people don't buy cars based on math. If they did, non-plug-in hybrids would be much more popular, because they almost always pay for their extra cost and then some in gas savings.
Tesla's big innovation was to build a car that's high-tech, fast, and good looking, which happened to be electric. Everyone else believed that EVs should be sold to environmentalists, Tesla realized that the real market was rich people.
I respect GM with the Bolt, and Nissan with the Leaf, and Hyundai with the Kona. I think all of them have their advantages.
The Bolt is a great car in the wrong market. It's a tiny (on the outside) hatchback that's roomier than you think on the inside. That appeals to me, and to many in Europe elsewhere, but most Americans aren't willing to buy a vehicle that small.
Tesla has quality issues, Elon says a lot of stupid things on Twitter, and their cars are in many ways weird. But the Model 3 is also, by far, the most technologically advanced EV on the market today. It has the highest efficency. It charges the fastest. You can get it with AWD. It has the best driver assistance features, even if Elon's self driving claims are silly.
I am not a person who is going to trash GM or Nissan or Hyuandai for making EVs, or trash people who buy them. My parents drive a Leaf Plus, and I seriously considered buying one instead of the Model 3. I also considered the Bolt, but adaptive cruise control is a must for me.
People buy vehicles based on the actual needs rather than their "emotions".
When I was shopping for a car a couple of years ago I knew that I had to have proper fully functional four wheel drive because the winters here in the mountains make the roads very dangerous if you don't have 4X4, so that immediately took anything that is "all wheel drive" off the list (because all wheel drive isn't proper four wheel drive) along with striking off ev's hybrids and most small cars off the list.
So my remaining choices were:
(A): Pick up truck: which I decided against because I couldn't find the one that I wanted (Ram 1500) with the diesel engine I wanted at a reasonable price.
(B): mid sized SUV: I couldn't find one that was affordable without either being old or having really high miles.
(C): Small SUV (Jeep Cherokee/Compass/Patriot): I ended up getting a patriot because it was the perfect size for my needs, had proper 4X4 and I could get a nice one for around $20.000.
@@Hammerhead547 I think you're both correct in that people have different relationships with cars. For some they're a status symbol; for others it is just a means to get from A to B; other people sit somewhere inbetween. That being said, most of the people in both groups aren't going to go into the sort of depth this video does, it is for the car manufacturers and distributers to package these technicalities in a way that makes sense to their target market, otherwise like the Volt, it will flop.
@@Hammerhead547 Your story does not prove that people don't buy cars based on emotions. All you told us is that you bought a car based on your needs, and that your needs didn't align with buying any kind of EV (which is fine).
If everybody bought a car based on their needs instead of emotions, the roads wouldn't be congested with all these CUVs that nobody needs. Anyone who actually needs a lot of space should buy a minivan or station wagon, because CUVs have the same amount of space inside as a sedan (at least every one I've been in does). Anyone who actually needs off-road or bad weather capability should buy a real SUV like you did, because CUVs are terrible for off-road. CUVs really don't make sense in any situation, but people buy them anyway because they're for some reason considered "cool" while more practical vehicles aren't. Minivans are for "soccer moms", so soccer moms buy a CUV instead because they think it's cooler (even though as far as I'm concerned CUVs make you less cool than a miniman, because now you're not just a soccer mom, you're a stupid soccer mom with an impractical car).
>> If you're not a green wonk, you aren't going to buy Bolt or a Volt.
That's not always the case. Take me, for example. I couldn't care less about being "green." But I've had two Volts nevertheless. First, I leased a 2012 Volt, and later bought a new 2014 Volt, because I wanted to do two things -- and neither was environmentally oriented (not that there's anything wrong with that).
First, I wanted to flip OPEC the bird as much as possible. Second, I wanted to SAVE MONEY. Yes, the price of entry might be high, but that's NOT the same as TOTAL COST OF OWNERSHIP. I've saved far more than the difference in price vs.a comparable gas car, in "fuel" savings alone.
FWIW, I live where electricity is about 14c/KWhr, right around the national average, so it's not like I live where I have cheap hydro or some other low-cost electricity either.
None of this even addresses the performance and reliability of the Volt, which has been phenomenal. Best cars I've ever owned! But that's a whole other topic.
Brian Cairns Excellent comment!
I think there is another layer as well, which boils down to emotion disguised as logic.
What you've taught me from this video is the Volt is literally the kind of car I've always said I wanted, right down to the engine starting up to provide heat... and naturally from my luck the car is gone when I hear about it.
You can always buy used!
That's what I'm doing. The word used is an ugly word to consumers. I. Buying from an authorized chevy dealership a 2019 volt and I cant wait to drive it
Plus it was ugly and, as a GM, it was unreliable with poor build quality.
Get a Prius prime PHEV or RAV4 Prime PHEV instead!
@@VideoArchiveGuy Wrong, video saver.
I've had about 75 personal vehicles, including 2 Volts and 5 Teslas, and as much as many folks like to say poor build quality about both, those 7 cars were built better and more reliable than 80% of the others.
A big battery on an EV has the advantage that it doesn’t get cycled as often or as deeply as a smaller battery, so it will last longer.
@mike h Then the analysis is, what will come first with either configuration?
mike h, in the case of automotive-grade batteries we’re talking about decades, but yes, eventually they will degrade in an inactive state.
Very good point. I have one of those "big battery" EVs and after close to 8 years the battery degradation is only 4%.
@@markusstrobl1067, indeed. In many ways its more about the cooling system than the batteries cells themselves.
Still, I expect the tiny 8.8KWh battery in our O’Toyta Prius Prime to fizzle a lot more quickly than a Tesla’s, since I (pre-COVID anyway) cycle it twice a day! Also, it’s only forced-air-cooled rather than liquid-cooled, but for a tiny battery like that, that’s probably quite sufficient.
Granted, that’s cycling only the middle ~5.5KWh of its full 8.8KWh raw capacity, which cuts the stress on the battery way down, but still, two cycles per day is definitely going to take a toll on it!
So far though, its been getting 4.6 miles/KWh after 3 2/3 years! That doesn’t appear to have changed much, *yet at least* .
@@markusstrobl1067 8 years 4% degradation is about nothing, you car were all time parked?
When the Volt first came out, I loved the concept and decided that I would own one someday. It took me until 2019, but I finally got my wish; I bought a second hand 2015 Volt on the day they stopped making the Volt. I must report I have never in my life been happier with my car. I live in an area where there are NO charging stations anywhere - and I charge at home with a level 2 charger in about 4 hours. I only have the one car and can't afford to have another car just for long trips. When I bought it, I was sort of sad that they were not going to be making this car anymore, but after driving it around for a few years, I am certain Chevy is making a MASSIVE mistake ending the Volt's production. Much of the US is rural and has no easy access to chargers - the only viable option to electric is a vehicle like the Volt. So far, my Volt has been problem free and very economical to drive, especially charging off my home's solar panels, but I really hope when I do have to get my next car, there is another cutting edge electric car out there that suits my needs as absolutely perfectly as the Volt does.
14 minutes in and I feel like Millhouse waiting for the firework factory "When is he going to use the white board?!"
Finally minute 21:29 use the whiteboard
The white board was the most remarkable invention of the 20th century.
@@AlbertMoff the true hero of this comment section
Just say ‘the Volt carries around a gas-powered generator’. Simple.
pinkace That is a completely inadequate understanding of the brilliance of the Volt. What you are describing is made by other manufacturers, but the Volt is far more sophisticated. Read up on it. It is fascinating.
@@artysanmobile Read about it where?
sdmitch16 Well, you could do the research the same way I have, web searches for terms such as “Volt motor generator design”, for example. Omit the opinion results and seek out the somewhat denser technical documents. It’s really been worth the time for me. The concept isn’t rocket science but the execution comes pretty close. There are also UA-cam channels with tear-downs showing the actual machinery of the Volt that I find to be a great complement to the dry text.
Even Volt owners aren’t aware of what’s going on in their cars. It is NOT just an electric car with a gas generator. Ironically, even this guy, talking for over a half hour, fails completely to point out the salient features. This upload is the worst possible way to learn about this fascinating design. He may know what’s going on, but he couldn’t possibly do a worse job of communicating it.
In short, the Volt has both a gasoline engine and an electric motor, each of which drive the same wheels through the very same driveshaft, sometimes even simultaneously, according to a constantly evolving set of conditions the car is being used in. This is in stark contrast to every other hybrid vehicle, including train locomotives, Prius, BMW i3, etc. All of these use a simpler hybrid drive design combining existing methods and machinery. GM alone undertook the very hard work of a clean sheet of paper approach to solve all contingencies. Somewhere in a spreadsheet is a number representing a total of unrecoverable engineering investment for the Volt and I’ll bet that number is 10 digits long.
pinkace a 4 cylinder generator? Not quite. The engine is not just to charge the battery and actually doesn’t do a very good job of charging anyway. It’s there to create electricity to run the motors up until highway speeds. At highway speeds, then it’s off electric and on the gas engine. Lutz was not as happy as he could have been with this design, but it still got him noted as the first VP to get the “electric car” from GM to the masses. I wanted to get one way back, but my family size was too large to fit everyone.
New things are on the way though. Pickup trucks in the future from all the auto makers and not just Tesla. Stand by for the future.
From the explanations in the video and below, it's apparently a more complicated setup. My question would be, "Is more complicated better?" One thing I like about electricity is that it's so simple and trouble-free, and I wonder how well this engineering wonder will age.
What we really need are modular batteries-like you can add battery packs when you need more range and switch out dead ones.
I commented about that.
Yh but then a company can't charge you (pun intentioned) for a whole new car
I think manufacturing the extra batteries even if not carried all the time is part of the cost/issue.. also in their present form, lithium batteries suffer from not being steadily used almost more than being used steady so not cost effective for intermittent use ore long term storage
@@charlesfowler4308 Currently Tesla charges somewhere between $3000 and $7000 for replacement batteries, in most cases. While not cheap, this is still far less than a new electric car.
And have the option of a range extender that will fit in the same space as a battery module.
I like your “anti-smug” in the forefront of most statements. I just bought a PHEV and I love it but I’m not going to make anyone else feel bad about what choices they’ve made. I can only control my own actions. Why ruin things for others?
AVERAGE American drives 15,000 miles a year. That stat cones from the DOT and the gentleman who thought 80,000 was typical was just being stupid
.
I think that having a larger battery that you don't use often is better for battery longevity. Lithium batteries last longer when you don't fully charge or discharge them, so if you have a larger battery that lets you have 50 miles of range while staying between 60% and 40% of battery charge, the battery will last longer before seeing degradation.
I agree.
Also a larger battery gives some breathing space as it gets old for current draw (like old phone batteries causing a phone to reset as the power draw drops too low).
This is true, but it's also a lot heavier, so having double the batteries won't make it last twice as long before degrading.
Another misunderstanding of how the Volt works. The Volt''s battery algorithm neither charges nor discharges the battery pack to theoretical limits. It works in the middle range of charge to increase battery longevity.
Degradation has been overstated
jodudeit As in all things engineering, there is a point of diminishing returns with battery size. Audi’s ridiculous e-Tron is 25% battery by weight, 1400 lbs!!!, yet has a range of roughly 200 miles. Essentially towing the gas station.
Our 2014 volt has only used just over 100 gallons of fuel in 5 years. Amazing vehicle.
myriadcorp I used 100 gallons this week...
But it costs a lot more than a normal car. That's a lot of gas. 100k miles?
After the tax rebate my brand new fully loaded volt only cost 23k. You can buy volts for 12k used now.
@@TheRainHarvester not really...
And if you drive 50 miles a day, there is a lot of saving here...
Of course, DMV wants their taxes and gears are turning to add in an ev road tax...
@@TheRainHarvester When I bought my 2014, I kept hearing the average new car purchase price was about $35k. Yea, there are plenty that cost less and there are plenty costing much more. Granted there aren't any new EVs at the low end of the market.
100k / 28mpg * $2.75/gal. = $9821.00 some people get better mileage, some get worse.
I believe it was Voltaire who said that "perfect is the enemy of good."
A name for a car?
Yeah, you’ll never finish if perfect is what you want. That’s what has destroyed so much of contemporary music, IMO. You got much better results with limited technology and faster turnaround time, as it used to be in the music recording industry.
I'll consider this, tho I pride myself with the fact that I've been planning my comic for months at this point.
@@theshamanite Planning itself isn't bad, just embrace that if you need it to be perfect it will never be done.
@@TheProphet3113 Well yes, but also no. If you have a vision, you either fully realize it or you don't know what you want when you make it. Planning is a crucial phase in mending your ideas before you continue forward with them.
AT GM HEADQUARTERS -" DAM THAT CHEVY VOLT WAS GOOD IDEA !!!, LETS KILL IT"
GM ran out of federal tax credits for it. Once they hit 200,00 units the tax rebate was done. It then became noncompetitive with vehicles that do still qualify for it like the Honda Clarity.
It's not popular, neither was the prius, insight, bolt, even tesla is not popular. They all are excessively expensive to own, maintain, or operate.
Plus mining the metals is very expensive.
Standard car batteries are expensive too.
@@shadowopsairman1583 uh. The Prius was very successful.
@@SockyNoob still VERY successful. Worldwide.
YT COMMENTATORS: "DAM THAT CAPSLOCK WAS A GOOD IDEA!!! LETS USE IT CONSTANTLY!"
I like the Volt because there is no range anxiety, you don't even have to think about it yet most of the time you'll be in electric mode anyway.
On the other hand I have range anxiety daily in my ICE vehicle.
I still get range anxiety because I hate switching to gas mode.
Maybe I'm just an anxious person though
@@SherrifOfNottingham Do we need to understand that you live in Outback of Australia or Northern territories of Canada with sign posts on the road - here is a gas station, next one is 500 miles away/980 km away?
No, my tank only gives me about 300 miles, and because of gas prices fuel is a harsh budget to actually fill it full.
N20Joe To me, it is the perfect car, at least conceptually. GM did not have the courage to make a success of it.
Tesla vs GM is a silly thing to argue.
"My favorite car company's the poorest run."
"No, my favorite car company's the poorest run!"
Well yes and no. One company is very clearly putting out a voice that drives towards a more renewable future in the face of critics...the other is just chasing short term profits and uses Environmentally Friendly marketing when there's an easy win. But also happy to ditch their geen products if it's a bit unconvenient.
@@bosstowndynamics5488 uhm no. Sure, the Volt has been a good stepping stone and was a good car for the time. But GM is not pushing sustainability, they are focussed on 1-5 year profits. They're doing the bare minimum, just look at how proactive VW is being in their electrification efforts! Especially given their Dieselgate I am super impressed by how they have risen to the challenge. GM..."yeah sure we might make some electric cars here and there, but 85% will still be gas powered in 2023". Also Tesla is very proactive in allowing users to repair or tinker with their own cars. They released a big repair guide and offer super convenient on site repairs and proactive/predictive maintenance. There's also a huge aftermarket supply of products to enhance or repair the car and even Tesla service people will recommend them to you. Heck UA-camrs are turning them into pickup trucks! Your comment about them binning more parts makes absolutely no sense. Also, their charging network is proprietary but only because it pushes the boundaries of charging speed and Tesla has invited other manufacturers to use it IF they can do so at an acceptable rate as to not block stalls beyond what their own cars do. GM doesn't use is because they can't do so. Tesla has been very generous with their patents all in support of global fleet electrification which manufacturers actually do make use of. Tesla has shown that it will pursue the long sustainable game at the determent of profits. They very much want other manufacturers to succeed, but will keep pushing them until they do. So yeah, there absolutely is a Huge difference in culture between the two and as such I think it's fine to hold GM accountable for their behaviour and have people argue that one company IS better than the other wether that's Tesla, VW, Volvo...but GM and BMW are pretty darn low on that list IMO.
My view is that GM is a shitty company that doesn’t give a shit about it’s workers, customers or the enviroment. It also makes generally unreliable and poor quality products. I don’t want to give my money to a company like that.
John Stroud Eh, certain companies do. GM is especially bad.
And they are both GIANT corporate welfare queens.
"There's weeds everywhere and we should get into them." I appreciate that.
In Canada (my country), that would be "There's (legal) weed everywhere, and we should get into it." :)
Good, maybe you can explain it to me then...
0MindSwept0 I think he’s saying there are complexities behind everything and they should be explored
I dream of a world where I can just connect and disconnect my heavy long range battery packs, allowing me to have better efficiency and cargo capacity when I'm not in road trip mode.
My friend, to me you have just described how an EMD locomotive works. With batteries added.
I was thinking the same thing! the Volt is basically a locomotive in mode 3.
...just needs that train horn sound to impress the great point you just made!
Terry Bingham that’s what I was thinking too.
Yep, there's a few PHEV models that work effectively just like that. The BMW i3 is an example since it has a 2 cylinder gas engine as an optional range extender (albeit due to this, many people call it a REEV, Range Extended EV). The engine has no physical connection to the wheels, and instead ends up going right to a generator
I was just thinking that. For people who think the Volt is more complicated than a regular car, think about how much more 'stuff' would be needed to make a pure diesel locomotive. As they are right now, from what I understand, the diesel motor purely generates electricity, which drives electric motors. Change around the series / parallel connections to the different motors and you have electric gearing. Can you imagine the transmissions they'd need if you needed to transfer the diesel motor directly to the wheels? The 'hybrid' diesel electric is far more simple.
We love this. Totally on the ball! Also, we want to do a collab with you some time ;)
Just a point: BMW i3 Rex has a much smaller engine than the volt:)
But the i3 is smaller and drastically lighter than the Volt.
Yes, and the BMW i3 REX is still not a road trip vehicle.. The car is good up to 160 miles... 80 on electric, and 80 on gas... then you need to stop every 80 miles to put 2 gallons of gas in it as that is the size of the fuel tank. The i3 is fun and great for short trips, but it has a very limited radius. The newer i3s have a bigger battery, but I think they remove the REX to make room for it for a total range of 150 miles on electric.
@@davidlovy1271 the i3 is a city car though. City cars are a thing Americans struggle to understand with a fierce passion. Just like we have weekend cars for leisure, city cars are for inner city driving, so a city car will be horrible for long trips, it's not meant for them.
The Malibu is still shipping with voltec drivetrain and smaller battery
@@davidlovy1271 New i3 still have the REX option in the US, but not Europe. The battery still takes up the same space under the car.
Although the video was a little long and disconnected at times, I completely understood it and you blew my mind. I had no idea that Mode 4 even existed! I just assumed the Volt was an EV with its own gasoline charger and nothing more. Turns out it's a much cool car than I realized!
It’s all for efficiency. I remember this being a bone of contention on the Chevy volt forms back in the day because it wasn’t a “true ev”.
I was always surprised how many people asked if it was possible to charge the battery from the gas engine like that was some amazing feature in practice you almost never use it.
@@lawnmowerdude selling plug-in hybrids on the grounds of energy efficiency is hard when 93% of the car-buying public doesn't know what energy is or how energy relates to automobiles
I loved the concept. I was really hoping all their vehicles would have gone this way. I think a big market loss was naming cars Volt and Bolt. “I said Volt, not Bolt!” “You’re just saying the same thing over and over!. 😂
Discrimination against Spanish speaking people.
@@edgarpryor3233 yeah, and Russian speaking people. And Chinese speaking people. And penguins.
Having driven many cars in the past, the Volt is by far the best vehicle I have ever owned in terms of ride performance and convenience as a commuter car. The engineering is brilliant and GM should be applauded for pulling this off, especially through the rough times following the great recession. The major problem (as was pointed out in the video) is that the average American can't understand the concept behind the Volt, and the dealership network has an even lesser understanding.
My 2018 Volt is very well built and engineered. My first car was a 81 Olds X-body, not very reliable but can say after a year with the volt... best fit and finish of any car I've owned. My last 2 cars were Hondas and these cars are pretty damn reliable and well built.
IT eliminated fear. People worry EVs will run out of battery & leave them stranded. The Volt EV eliminated that fear, by having a backup engine
.
@@electrictroy2010 It is more than eliminating fear, it is eliminating the whole need for charging infrastructure. BMW i3 has a backup generator but it is less efficient snd low power so it is just a backup to an electric vechile. You can not really use BMW i3 without charging it and it would be a pain to go long range on its backup generator if a particular car even has it. Chevrolet Volt switches completely to conventional gasoline drivetrain on a highway when it is most efficient (after you have successfully drained most of your battery) and it is an EV in slow low range city traffic when an EV is most efficient. Its gasoline motor is not just some backup device, it is designed to be used regularily when it is needed in some of the normal use cases.
"Energy agnostic"... I like that.
Except it's talking about its potential, rather than what really happens. In many places it's switching gas for coal.
There sure are a remarkable number of wind turbines popping up all around this country, and battery storage projects are being greenlit left and right.
The switch to renewables is happening right in front of you. Do you care to acknowledge it? That's the real question.
@@TechnologyConnextras Those renewables aren't as universally available as you like to think. It's sorta like assuming everybody has to drive hundreds of miles a day routinely.
@@WCM1945 Well, yea - but it's no secret that the same people advocating a transition to electric vehicles are also advocating a transition to renewable energy sources. That's the eventual goal.
@@HermanVonPetri Yep. Now if there was only a concerted effort to spread that around the country.
At 29:15 reminded me of a BIG gripe I have with a lot of car reviewers. Inevitably when they talk about level 1 120v charging they always frame it in a way like “it will take days to charge” yeah a completely dead 300 mile battery pack. If you plug it in every day like a normal person, level 1 would be fine for most people’s 30 mile usage.
Spaced Invader neither one is adequate. If you want to know how quickly the battery is getting filled, you need to look at watts, not volts *or* amps. The thing is, for “120V” you can read “a standard 120V outlet with 15A capacity”, which means 1800W. Which is not a lot! A standard outlet in Europe is 230V by 16A aka 3680W. But in the US, “a 120V outlet” *means* 15A, typically. If you want a fast charger, you need 230V by 40+ amps, aka 10.000W or so. And if you want to charge 80kWh in an hour, well, you need about 80kW. That’d be 230V at 350 amps or, more likely, 400V three phase at 63A. That’s a pretty chunky cable.
@@JasperJanssen what's that in mAh per hour?
rymes14 that’s not a thing.
@@JasperJanssen whoosh. Thatsthejoke.jpg
rymes14 not much of a joke.
A big thing about the Volt's battery stability was, that GM actually COOLED that battery using the radiator, and battery heat is generally the death of a battery. The Volt is perfect for me because i (a) drive around town during the week, never use gas for that, (b) most weekends have to go across the state, oopsie for an EV, at least an aggravation, (c) shoot to Florida once a year, and i put that thing on 80 miles an hour so i can make it in 13 hours.
2:29 "You are hauling around all that weight for no reason." I've always thought this about people who buy enormous ICE cars, trucks and SUVs for doing a daily commute of much less than 60 miles and not doing any hauling of heavy goods. Why not buy a compact car, save a ton of money and *rent* a more capable vehicle when you are going to be hauling lots of people or goods?
Too worried about their image.
I refuse to buy an SUV because I have absolutely no need for one. I’ve got a sedan (which is arguably the least practical body right after a coupe) and yet it doesn’t matter. Because as most people, I drive alone to work most of the time, or at most there’s four people in the car when going out for dinner or something. Sure some people have 4 people in the family and they wanna all go on vacation, but maybe the public shouldn’t have given up on station wagons in US then
People generally need to buy a car for the most extreme duty that will be required, not the average. I mostly commute - I could, 5 days a week, own a 1 seat automobile. But I have a 5 person family, so I need a 5 seat car for any trip with my family; We are also very close to our extended family and frequently have "sleepovers" with their children, so we, about 5% of the time, need to carry 7 people. So we purchased a Dodge Journey - a relatively affordable 7 seat vehicle.
As for SUVs (or more specifically crossovers, which most are, as opposed to truck-based SUVs) are taller and far more comfortable to ride in compared to sedans. I had a Ford Focus, which was a really nice car, but you sat really low and laid back, I prefer to sit more upright, but my head hit the roof.
Ride comfort and visibility
I won't drive small cars in large part cause other drivers are idiots and driving is dangerous. These days my daily is a full size gas guzzling sedan in part cause I also have a lead foot, performance matters to me. I like the Volt concept but its too slow, some Teslas are fastish but won't go far enough and are too expensive.
There's also the consideration that a bigger battery allows for a lesser charge%, greatly expanding the life of the battery pack.
_...but the future refused to change..._
I was just about to say that, the whole point of a big battery pack is to use the energy from say 30-70% and not charge past that or discharge less than, and potentially avoid fast charging as much as possible, it will get the absolute best out of the battery and if you keep that in mind even a tesla battery we're taking only about 40% of it's capacity (i know 40% here doesn't exactly reflect 40% of it's entire energy capacity but i'm trying to simplify things) using the example above which is extremely conservative but still for short distances it's what you want and thus again your 100kw battery pack turns into a "40kw" battery pack again veeeeery simplified here just for some quick youtube comment level of engineering numbers. Also bigger batteries allow you to fast charge with less damage to the battery pack just the fact you're sending less energy to each cell (given the same charge speed).
@@dashtesla "The whole point" bullshit my dude, the point of a bigger battery is to shout about how much more range it has. Go to tesla's website right now and go look at how they differentiate the battery sizes for each model: the range; and the acceleration.
The Volt : An Electric car with a backup gas generator in it.
Easy peazy
Also great confortable car :D
except that the engine is more than 'just' a backup generator since in mode 4 it does directly drive the wheels. So it switches between Electric, Extended Range Electric, and Hybrid. So it can be 1 of 3 types of vehicles depending on its mode which is where people get confuses as they want to just drop it into one of the predefined boxes, but it belongs in all 3.
Not generator. Back up gas drive train.
@@Patmorgan235Us not quite, the EV motor and gas engine are both connected to the same transmission media.gm.com/content/dam/Media/documents/US/Word/101010_volt_launch/Drive_Unit.doc
@@casualdanger you can run the gas engine to charge the battery
I liked the idea of the Volt. Thought it should have been the model for the US. Battery use for commuters but doesn't limit to you to limited battery range. I didn't get one because I didn't like the drive as much and wanted something with more storage. Went for a Prius V.
One of the reasons why I bought my volt and how I usually explain it. Is that it is like a diesel electric freight train.
Yes, with a battery.
...and a mode where that diesel drives the wheels mechanically, rather than through a generator-motor path.
On the highway onramp, a single, large, battery powered motor powers the drive shaft. On the highway, a second, smaller, battery powered motor cooperates with the first. When the batteries fall below a certain level, the engine turns on and the smaller motor acts as a generator, to take over for the batteries in powering the larger motor. When the batteries have fallen below a certain level, and the car is travelling at higher speeds, the electric motors turn off and their rotors become mechanical links in the drive train, between the engine and the drive shaft.
Highway travel uses less energy than on-ramp acceleration
The volt would fit my needs perfectly. I drive 11 miles each way for work and I occasionally like to go on road trips for vacation and work trips.
Used Volts are very reasonably priced.
Yes you would LOVE it!
im not american and i feel uncomfortable help
zatty 11 miles is like 17 km
I want to say kudos to you for having this conversation calmly, rationally, and realistically while being intellectually honest and open.
I ALWAYS correct people on the volt and I never really call it an engine, I just say generator to avoid more confusion
Josh, the engine does drive the wheels in the most extreme need.
The second gen the engine will propel the vehicle above a certain speed, they downgraded it from range extended to a hybrid.
josh maier Well, you are ALWAYS incorrect. You shouldn’t be ‘splaining if you aren’t understanding.
I'm not sure if anyone has thought of this, but a temporary extension battery (in the trunk?) that you can rent from a dealer would be ideal:
* You don't carry the weight when you don't need to
* You can get the range extension when you need it
* The battery can be used(refreshed) by other people when *you* are not using it
* This does rely on the dealer buying the battery and taking good care of it
Yes but when people travel long distances often times they are going for a getaway or a weekender. This would require them to need the trunk for storage.
@@carsonallaby7798 shit, i did not think of that...
Battery in the trunk, luggage in a ski-box?
This would only work in a car which has space in the hood but maybe a frunk like compartment with cables to hook it up
this is something that irks me about electric vehicles: why are the battery packs secured so obsessively into the chassis of the vehicle? you pretty much have to take the entire car apart to do anything with them..
I understand that rechargable batteries are kind of a dangerous product, that can cause fires, but surely there must be a way to make them easier to add or remove so you could have modular energy setups for people who either need more range, or don't need as much
ALTHOUGH obviously it can't be TOO easy to replace the battery, because then battery theft becomes an issue..
What's so hard to understand? It is an electric car with a built in gas generator to recharge the battery.
You can't recharge the battery with the engine onces its completely runs out. Unless you turn on mountain mode before the battery completely runs out.
markleyg So completely wrong. Read more.
The general consumer population can’t even simply use google to research their own major purchases. It’s kind of sad really. They just throw money at the fully loaded car the salesman recommends because they like the color. Not even knowing or using a lot of the features or even knowing the model of vehicle they purchased.
@@gilberttorres8 so what? That doesn't change what it is? Why would I want to completely recharge the battery with the generator? I only want to charge it just enough till I can get somewhere to plug it in. That is smart engineering.
@@artysanmobile completely wrong? What is incorrect of what I stated?
I'm really stressed out about that old iPod charger on the desk. Like, can't focus on your video, im just staring at that.
Grow up lmao
Weirdo
Wow lol
Agreed i kept focusing on it to
I cant speak for the rest of the world but at least in europe that concept was doomed from the start. The range extender was classified like a regular combustion engine in terms of taxation. Electric cars are exempt from that monthly tax on engine horsepower but cost more upfront because electric cars are more expensive to their diesel powered counterparts. Those cars are cheap to buy but you have higher running costs from that engine tax and fuel costs. So you basically have 2 choices: Electric car is expensive upfront but has low upkeep cost. Internal combustion engine car is cheap upfront but has higher costs while in use.
This killed the Chevrolet Volt or Opel Ampera as it was called here because you had an expensive car to buy upfront just so you could pay a lot of taxes for that range extender. Just like the BMW i3. That car sold way better as an electric only car without the range extender than with that option included. That tax was the single reason.
If the government would have classified the range extender different the story would have played out different but the way it was implemented caused the Volt to be a terrible buy resulting in devastating sales numbers.
You have a tax on engine horsepower? Good god you people are bonkers.
Correction, _monsters._
@@theq4602 From Ireland to Japan, most of the Old World countries have such taxes. Think about it as a consumer's protection since the tax is an appetizer for the bigger gasoline and insurance expenses so it pushes people to think twice before getting a beefier car.
@@Sirius304 Range extenders are connected to the wheels, thats kinda the point, like the BMW REx is a 2 cylinder motorcycle engine connected directly to the rear wheels, the Volt can use its engine to run the wheels, its not like slapping a generator on the back of the car and calling it good, if anything those should be taxed higher as your putting the cart before the horse, by making a mechical device power a generator, which looses efficiency, which charges a battery, more loss in efficiency, which then has to power the motor, more loss which then powers the wheels, meanwhile, just slapping the engine right to the wheels has the least loss, I own a first gen volt, and I love that car. But it still isnt the most efficient thing for using the resources it needs if you live in an area that uses fuel to generate power, Where i live is mostly wind turbines and solar panels so using an electric makes sense, but that clusterfudge of using the engine to generate power, just to turn the wheels makes little sense if the engine can do it with none of the losses by the charging system...
Meanwhile in America, some states have the exact opposite problem, where you have to pay an extra tax to own an all-electric car because you're not paying any fuel taxes. A Volt would probably be exempt from that.
i don’t know if this was different 5 years ago, but people don’t chose to drive an original nissan leaf because they don’t want to carry around a battery. They drive it because it’s $12,000 car that doesn’t need gas
I never gave a thought to electric cars. I couldn't tell you the differences among an EV, a hybrid, a plug-in, a Tesla, a Prius, a Bolt or a Volt. But this video has me interested and thinking about it. Good on ya!
I rented a Volt once and loved it. It was super fun to drive. Sad they've discontinued it.
You already sold me on a rice cooker and now you're about to sell me on a car
He's selling you on a car that is no longer manufactured.
@@axelliljencrantz4462 I mean he did it with a toaster too
He sold me on my first Volt (a 2017 Premier) in September 2019, and that one sold me on my second one (for our daughter in nursing school, a 2012). Fantastic cars. We already had a rice cooker. 🤣
both my internet connected rice cooker and my volt are things I never knew I needed...
There's a Chinese company that's developing a modular EV battery swapping station
It's a subscription based business model Basically it relies on enough EV manufacturers to sign on, make their EV's batteries modular and is swappable, and then the drivers can take their cars to the battery swapping stations, drive in, remain in the car, the station swaps the battery for the car with a fully charged battery.
I thought this is fantastic, batteries nearing the end of their lives will be collected and be sent to energy farms, and the vehicle's value are not going to be impacted as the battery degrades, and if the service is able to gather a critical mass of users, it'll become essentially a utility where it can likely secure government funding to keep it running for the masses.
Why not an add on battery, or even engine that can stay in the garage when not going on a long trip?
A/C Propulsion had an amazing range-extending ICE trailer for their electric cars. I'm still a bit upset the idea didn't catch on.
I agree. I’ve always thought they should be using add on modular battery packs. Lithium Ion batteries are relatively light, and the modular approach is already being used on other things like battery powered lawn mowers. Of course the owner would need to plan ahead when going on an extended trip and install the extended battery modules. Otherwise the owner would have to visit more charging stations.
Ivan Diaz lol this is the most snobby comment I've ever read. Who are you to to tell anyone how to spend their money?
A car is overkill for most people in fact a bike meets their daily needs! Lol
A car isn't as binary as meeting the range required. People have families, don't wanna be out in the heat / cold / rain / wind, physically can't ride a bike, don't WANT to ride a bike etc.
@@Eexpers There's nothing snobby about literally stating a fact. Most people do not NEED car, hence the word need. yet you had plenty of WANTS listed for why people, regardless of the actual distance needed to travel, WANT a car rather than a bicycle.
But, of course, predictably, you point this fact out and people like you get butthurt and immediately resort to all sorts of hilarious justifications for why their lives personally could not possibly be accommodated without a two ton living room sized wheelchair to get them around from one place to another.
@@ivandiaz5791 you're defining things completely arbitrarily on your own arbitrary metrics.
you seem really hung up on size too... you sound completely uninformed and and arrogant.
i'm not arguing with you
Oh also speaking of the "but electricity is dirty" (and I'm not mocking the point, just paraphrasing it quickly, etc.) -- ANY electric vehicle powered by ANY large scale source of electricity, and by large scale I mean a full sized power plant, is going to be cleaner per mile than even the most efficient ICE vehicle. Meaning it's not just a matter of electricity being able to be produced by renewables, it's that the filthiest coal plant can power its weight in electric vehicles with less pollution generated per mile driven than any ICE vehicle. Our friend thermodynamics comes into play in that the power plant is always going to be efficient enough to beat the tiny engine in a normal vehicle pollution per mile wise.
And obviously you're 100% correct in that the trend is away from Coal anyway (and Coal is the only fuel source that is even in the ballpark pollution wise, there's absolutely no contest comparing a Natural Gas-fired plant with ICE engines and it becomes more and more slanted in the Electric Vehicles favor from there, etc.)
Not arguing, just curious: does that point take into consideration electrical transmission losses, or that during peak electrical use, oil-fired turbines and even diesel ICE 'peaker' plants are used?
Its very inefficient to mine and transport coal. Coal mining also has a huge environmental impact.
@@Tommy_Mac No. That's all true, don't get me wrong. But those are more efficient overall than refining millions of gallons of gasoline and diesel.
Even the few diesel-fired peaking plants are a more efficient use of diesel fuel as the larger the motor, the more efficient it is just because of thermodynamics.
Coal-fired plants can hit 50% efficiency, Natural Gas fired turbines can match that and be as high as 70-75% in a combined cycle (where you use the hot exhaust to produce steam for an auxiliary steam turbine.)
Even the losses in the transmission lines doesn't come anywhere near the inefficiency of using refined petroleum fuels.
As a perfect example, it takes the energy equivalent of three barrels of petroleum to refine one barrel of fuels.
At most you have to wash coal (speaking of high-sulphur coal), Natural Gas...something the United States is currently enjoying an enormous surplus in...is even less energy intensive to capture and much cleaner to burn.
Depending upon petroleum directly is just the least efficient system anyway you slice it (and notice I didn't even mention climate change, I was talking solely about the economics of it, etc.)
@@nucflashevent
"Coal-fired plants can hit 50% efficiency, Natural Gas fired turbines can match that and be as high as 70-75% in a combined cycle (where you use the hot exhaust to produce steam for an auxiliary steam turbine.)"
Where do those numbers come from? The numbers I see are lower in every case.
Now its true that Wikipedia is not perfect but this number seems a better fit for the physics.
"and 56 - 60% (LEV) for combined-cycle gas-fired plants."
You numbers seem to require Unobtanium for the turbines.
@@ethelredhardrede1838 Aside from a weird mismatch of numbers, the point still stands.
One big bad engine is a lot better than a 100,000 lil engines.
@@zachjollimore4339
The conclusion is true. But he should not use BS to support it. That is my point. It still stands.
Found this video at random after watching some of his channel...as a car car guy,this blows me away that I never heard about how the Volt ACTUALLY works. Im glad a stuck around for this,like Ive been on the fence about buying a older electric for regular driving...but this has totally opened my mind to this car. Blown past these things all the time,never thought anything of them...kinda cool
Now we can build cars with ~3x the normally needed range, build the car with the base 1x range battery, and a space to slide in the other 2x battery. This add-on battery could be rented for the time needed.
I've wanted a volt for awhile now, not really sold on any current battery-only EV given the range I drive to go skiing or camping.
Lots of good deals on used ones!
QB89Dragon get one. You won’t be disappointed.
Love my Volt! I’ve driven long term an i3 REX, a Model 3, and a Model S. The Volt is my recommended electric car. The Volt is the best value for your dollar. It’s comfortable like a Cadillac with surprisingly good electric range, decent handling, great acceleration, and very low cost of ownership. The cost to drive 1500 electric miles is only $40 with the ac and stereo blasting. Looking forward to picking up a second Volt soon. Keep up the great work.
This is actually similar to the first diesel train.
This is actually not the first time similar concept was used.
Diesel locomotives started the same way, diesel turbines powering electric motors.
@cedric1997 yeah they still are but not exclusively, I think diesel engines without the electric motor are used for shunting etc. Although there are ALSO electro-diesel trains which can run either as pure electric trains or as diesel-electrics, used on certain lines.
@@jcardboard No, you'd be hard-pressed to find anything besides diesel-electric locomotives (at least in the U.S.). There was only one kind of diesel-hydraulic locomotive ever produced for the U.S. but it was German design and failed miserably. The electro-diesel hybrid locomotive you speak of is most likely the ALP45DP used on New Jersey Transit, however in both modes the traction motors are electric. The difference being that the pantograph supplies direct current while the engine turns an electric generator.
The concept of standard and removable batteries across manufacturers would be great. Short range, you have 1 battery. Going for a longer trip? Go to a gas station and 'rent' more batteries. Gas stations could be battery swappers instead of chargers. No wait. (Didn't read all comments - unsure if this idea was circulated)
I'm a bit late to this party, but I just have to chime in. I just bought a 2012 Volt to replace the giant van that I loved, but no longer need. I absolutely love it. Even though it is 11 years old, it works beautifully and suits my needs perfectly. I really wish more auto makers would have gone this route as an option. A refined version with a 100 - 150 mile battery with a small backup generator for an additional 100 - 150 miles would be a fantastic transitional car while we switch over to electric.
Our Volt is truly amazing. 1,800 miles on one full tank.
The "premium" recommendation might make sense in some locales. Where I live in Canada, some of the gas stations only offer ethanol-free fuel as premium, and ethanol-free fuel tends to keep better in my experience. In my vintage motorbikes, ethanol fuel tends to collect moisture and gel up with time vs. ethanol free fuel keeping without issue.
The tank in the Volt is one of the few cars that has a pressurized and completely sealed tank to prevent this exact problem
13:30 This is exactly what my Prius Prime Plug-in Does. But also sometimes it charges the battery with the engine while stationary
11:11 "They had their heads..."
*look up*
"...in the clouds"
Oh. That... That's not what I thought you were going to say.
Golfhaus he’s a wordsmith, that’s for sure
I’m currently a Tesla Model 3 driver, for reference. Here on my thoughts on the Volt as a someone that prefers sporty cars and understands how cars, EVs, and the Volt works.
1. It should have been diesel. Much more efficient as generators because of the torque.
1a. I know that would have made selling it harder because the US is stupid about diesel cars.
2. The marketing on it was terrible.
2a. They shouldn’t have made the concept car look like a sports car.
2b. I think the styling turned off a lot of people.
3. It should have started as a Cadillac. The higher cost would be more expected and it would have helped recoup the development costs quicker.
4. I think the idea, tech wise, was really smart. Most people wouldn’t have to think about it very differently than a normal car. You don’t have to worry about charging infrastructure. Nothing different about route planning for trips. It’s a really great design to help people transition to EVs. There should be more cars like that, not less.
Personally , the Volt was never for me. The Tesla fits the performance mold for me in an EV package.
Thanks for taking the time to teach more people how it worked, as I think that was never done well.
Putting regular gas into a computerized engine will not harm it...the computer will just adjust the ignition timing to prevent preigition and knocking...therefore your performance will be degraded.
But if it's high compression, you can only back the timing off so much before it starts performing pretty ass.
@@emofreako true but still unlikely to cause serious damage unless you're putting in some seriously awful, very low RON / MON fuel. We carry out durability testing and engine calibration against poor quality fuels to make sure the knock controller has sufficient authority to deal with it safely :)
Just re-read and I think I missed the point slightly - you're talking more about stability tolerance to late combustion phasing? In this case, the only answer I have is: yes, engine design and calibration is a very complicated system of trade-offs and things like this are guaranteed to be the cause of many engineers' headaches and coffee jitters for any given engine variant 😅
Learning new stuff all the time. It never occurred to me that at least some modern engines may be able to adjust like that (even though that's essentially what flex fuel engines do to my understanding I never extended thought to high compression engines).
A knock sensor is just a microphone that listens for pinging from the combustion chamber. If there is, the computer retards the timing which degrades the power output for the combustion.
Could they not make the batteries modular? A base model has an xx capacity battery, with a few slots available to purchase or rent additional batteries when the buyer needs additional range regularly, or occasionally for longer trips?
I work in the Ford Escape plant and the 2020 model will have a plug-in hybrid (both PHEV and FHEV), available.
That will likely not be an option at all in 2026 when the federal fleet average becomes 54.5 MPG. Unless some sort of magic is involved, this will almost certainly require some kind of hybridization. Look for car prices to increase dramatically.
@@Chordonblue you do realize the 54.5 mpg Target isn't a thing anymore right? Trump administration managed to get it froze at 20ish MPG
@@cpufreak101 Doesn't matter. If car companies want to sell their vehicles in California, they will still need to adhere to those CAFE standards. Oregon and Washington are also considering joining them.
@@Chordonblue ah that's right, forgot about CARB there a min, though I do also know the current administration is trying to rule that California and other states do not have the "power" to enforce that, and as it stands right now I don't think anyone knows of it's legally enforceable or not
@@cpufreak101 I would think it is. If a state doesn't want to let a certain kind of car enter their borders, it doesn't matter what they base their decision on, really. I would think they could make this stick. After all, as California goes, so we all go, as the saying goes... Unfortunately...
So its like a diesel electric locomotive?
With a battery also! I think it's the best type ev to have,
@P Mason Not all of then, most of them have dynamic brakes, this system of brakes disipates most if not all of the electricity produced by braking in resistive loads.
@@acynder1 diesel electric mining trucks are a good example of resistive dynamic brakes (retarders). Bringing 1,000,000+lbs of loaded truck to a near complete stop, or holding a steady speed downhill, with what is essentially an oversized space heater was pretty impressive to experience when I drove them.
@@b.c.2281 My grandfather from my dad side loves to tell when he "raced" his colleages down a really twisty and dangerous mounthain pass nearby here when Alsa bringed the new buses with "electric brakes" as he calls them. It was quite of a thing to have back then and he really enjoyed it.
Diesel electric locomotives were what came to my mind as well.
In some discussions I'd had on topics related to vehicle power for rail transit, the possibilities of diesel electric tri-mode LRVs had come up: powered from catenary in urban settings that also charges a battery, battery powered at "urban" speeds off catenary and diesel electric for "suburban" or "commuter" speeds. The idea was basically to leverage existing unelectrified trackage but taking advantage of electrified track where it existed, with a long term goal of incremental electrification.
I've questioned for some time why you don't see more diesel electric tractor trailers... you wonder how much fuel they waste every time they cycle through 10 or 15 gears every time they pull away from a stoplight.
Cool! I worked on the 2nd gen Volt, BoltEV, and the next gen powertrain over 9 years at GM. A lot of what's made has to do with EV government credits, and somewhat marketing. I'd be glad to talk about non-proprietary stuff if you're interested - I left GM a few months ago.
So no other car or hybrid works like a Volt?
@@rafterh2181
Apparently
@@rafterh2181 There were ones that do similar things as the Volt, but not the exact same power flow or clutch configurations / optimizations. A couple years before the Volt (2010), the BYD F3DM (2008) was the first extended range EV (can run as a pure EV at all road legal speeds and then as a hybrid when the battery runs down), and was old only in China. The Prius Prime is probably the closest thing to the Volt that still exists, being able to drive at up to 80+mph without the gas engine. However, the Prius Prime's EV range of 25 miles is shorter than both the F3DM and Volt (especially the 2nd generation with 50+ miles EV range).
@@rafterh2181 I forgot the BMW i3 Rex (no electric top speed limit, but generator can't keep up with battery drain at sustained high loads) and i8 (EV mode top speed of 75mph).
@@yueibm So do they work like a Volt in that they are an EV with a generator? If you blow an engine in a Volt you could still charge it and drive it 50 miles
Alternate solution: standardized, swappable battery packs. And every "filling station" would serve as a grid battery.
Until charging infrastructure improves, we'll still need large batteries and/or range-extenders. Tesla is obviously well ahead of the game on that front, but Chevy had a decent bridge technology. It was the massive housecleaning that GM did that doomed it, not the concept.
CCS combo fast charging infrastructure is coming along nicely. This is what everybody besides Nissan uses and Tesla will eventually have an adapter for that connector as well. Look in Plugshare app for a full list of stations.
There's more to infrastructure than charging stations. Every Joule required to move that car over its entire range has to come from the charger. Imagine every household having 2-3 EVs charging at night. It would make the AC load in a 100 deg heat wave look like a walk in the park. The utilities, the lines, the transformers, are not ready for this load.
@@ThatEEguy2818 well the good news is the grid has many years to adapt to this by using the smart grid and peak hours and other technologies. So far I do not see them complaining. Adoption of electric vehicles takes time
They already complain when a heat wave comes along. They're going to need to replace hardware before this is over.
I expect we'll see the concept,.again. now that electric trucks are coming out, ANY amount of towing absolutely eviscerates the range. TFL Truck channel tried towing a modest trailer with a Model X and it was just...bad. Performance was great, of course (which is the major benefit of EVs), but the range was unacceptable.
Ford has been teasing their electric trucks. We know GM is working on one. The Chevy Volt concept is basically perfect; it's an EV when you're driving around town and not hauling something, and it's an ICE vehicle when you're towing a load. The electric motors can also propel it during acceleration, leaving the ICE to operate when it's at its most efficient on the highway at relatively low RPM.
Basically what I'm trying to say is that the Volt concept HAS to come back if electric trucks are going to be a thing, because without a revolution (not evolution) in battery tech, the level of technology in 2019 doesn't let you tow anything more than a canoe for longer than about 100 mi, and even then the amount of batteries required put the sales price upwards of Denali or King Ranch prices.
The Volt is such a unique car and it's a shame that there's nothing on the market to replace it.
A better use of the extra battery capacity would be grid energy storage. Imagine if virtually every electric car could be connected to your house at night and function like a powerwall charging on lower price energy and then supplying your house during the day. Alternatively, you could charge the car during the day on solar at home or at work and then power your house at night. Both options would justify having a battery which 80% you don't use for the majority of the year.
So you don't want to have a fully charged car? It sounds like you plan on just buying a car to leave parked as a battery, instead of driving as a car.
Also, you are using life cycles for an expensive vehicle battery, so not really that great of an idea financially.
@@ke6gwf It's not good for the battery to stay topped up all the time anyway
Making it a part of a self cycling system isn't bad
@@KaitouKaiju that's why you never charge the battery to maximum capacity, rather than running it to max and then discharging it into the grid.
Every time you charge or discharge it takes life away from the battery.
I live in Germany, and the EV Problem is simply the price and resurses. Manny EV's comming back from leasingcompenies to the dealers after 3 to 4 years and no one want's to buy them. The battery capasity ist most times under 70 %. Replacing the battery costs most times over 5000€. And the price new ist most times 10000€ to 20000€ more then the normal oil burning equivilant.
And the electrik grid is not build to deal with such a high load. An Elektrik expert once said, that we have to fortifie the elektric grid up to 6 times the capacity it has now. That means 6 Times more power plants and 6 times more cables. That is not possible in such a short time. And to commedate that much energy with renuebles is nothing but fantasy. In Germany the current renuable amount of the entire energieproducktion is 5,5 %. And our retardet politicans say, that they want to have only renueble energy in a view jears. And remember, we need 6 times mor than now on top of that. And now energieprices skyrocketing and stripping everyone of theyr monney so les and les people can efford an EV. So the car companys simply don't sell much EV's. And what doesent sell is getting kiked out of produktion. Simple economics.
Watching this video a year later, thank you for the term energy agnostic, that finally give me a word to use than the over explaining i do
I've watched hours and hours of your videos and I've never seen you more uncomfortable explaining anything.
I don't see anyone asking why sailboats waste energy dragging a small diesel trolling motor around.
why do sailboats waste energy by dragging a small diesel trolling motor around? that one does make sense as, what happens when its suddenly not windy, do you just live there until the currents take you somewhere else, The volt has the same concept and just like the motor on a sailboat, its genius.
Whelan Sailboats are required to have a motor. Some areas, such as the harbor in Vancouver, British Columbia, have no sailing zones.
Surly the answer to the ever increasing battery size issue is a simple one. To either make a range of batteries of diffent capacities or include the ability to fit addition batteries as required.
Why do you have uncrimped -RJ-45- -ethernet- 8P8C plugs on your table?
Meta trolling
Perhaps for the same reasons many of us do?
I also have crimp connectors in RJ-22, RJ-11, RJ-14, RJ-25, as well as BNC, SO-239/PL-259, N, SMA, etc., for multiple types of coax and countless other crimp connector types for other electronics, radio, telecom projects. Some of us simply have interesting side projects. ;-)
Power Over 8P8C
@@ethanpoole3443 All of those sitting on your table in plain view as you're broadcasting UA-cam videos. ;-)
Aaron Kaase Trust me, you’d be surprised how much stuff is sitting on my electronics and amateur radio workbenches during the few UA-cam videos I have done. Not just a ton of test gear and loose tools, but loose parts, piles of partially disassembled electronics awaiting repairs...its a proper mess. Those projects need plenty of time on the healing bench before they are properly ready to be repaired!
Love the volt ... charge it at work and rarely pay for energy at home. Then went out of town a few times on fuel. It's amazing.
My thoughts on the bigger batteries:
You get a lot more benefits from a bigger battery pack than just more range. You can charge it faster and you don't stress the individual cells that much doing so.
You also don't charge the pack that often if you're just doing your daily driving.
And you get better acceleration and top speed because you get more current out of the pack.
The only downsides are initial cost and weight, but I think if you have the money for it, you should go for a bigger battery pack.
Saying weight is one of "the only" downsides and downplaying it is silly. It's a *significant* amount of weight, and more weight means more power needs to be used to move the car, making it less efficient and putting more strain on the battery cells. There's a sweet spot; the answer isn't to just cram more and more and more battery in.
The other benefit is longevity. I drive a 30kWh Leaf in the UK. Using data from other owners, the degredation of the battery looks like most of us should have at least 75% capacity at 10 years old. So by 15-20 years old we should have over 50% range. I need 50 miles a day, and my car can do 120 miles, meaning by the time it's 10 years old it should still be able to do over 90 miles, and well over 60 miles when it's 15 years old. That's great for me. But say someone needed 95 miles for their daily commute? Well they'd get less than 10 years use from the car (OK so in the UK the average car age is only 7 years), and would have to either buy a new car, have the battery upgraded (there are 3rd parties that will fit a 40kWh battery to your old 24kWh Leaf, or replace the degraded cells with newer ones, restoring the original range) or stop to charge for a bit on the way home. With a car that starts with a higher range, that 25% loss at 10 years still leaves the owner with a decent range. A 200 mile car drops to 150 miles, so you can keep the car for longer, and it retains more value when you go to scrap it.
Well, i wouldn't say that they can charge faster, usually, the big size only gives you more problems, like the need for better (usually heavier) thermal management systems, the problem of slow charging due to the size of the battery, the obvious problem of weight and the problem of space.
Larger batteries are all over worse than small batteries that are just big enough for the task.
Also, as the weight gets worse over higher energy capacity, batteries are just not cut for lonf distance travel, that's when fuel cells can show their full potential.
They too have a great drawback, essentially efficiency.
However, as travel distances grow, this disadvantage fades more and more away. Fuel cells also have the benefit of being easily expendable for higher ranges, one additional drawback of battery packs.
So it is like it always was, everything has it's benefits and drawbacks and nothing is perfect.
It lies in our hands to use the technologies that we know to creat the best suited system ;D.
@@Enthropical_Thunder : From where/what did you get this seemingly erroneous statement? "usually, the big size only gives you more problems, like the need for better (usually heavier) thermal management systems"
@@bigcheese781
From my mechanical engineering studies .....
The Toyota hybrid was also a fantastic design... in its day... no switching gears in the "transmission", just a single planetary gearset that could allow EV Mode, or blend electric drive with mechanical drive... continuously variable transmission without any friction drives, clutches, or CVT nonsense. Our 2008 Highlander Hybrid has over 265k miles and has been unimaginably reliable... even the brake pads are original. But I won't replace it with another hybrid now that my BMW i3 BEV has shown me how maintenance free a car can be.
I'm thankful for the explanation. I always understood the Volt was as an electric car that has an on-board generator that has no function other than to re-charge the battery. Basically, a diesel-electric locomotive but in a sedan form. The railroad industry figured out that this was a great idea in the 1950s, and somehow GM didn't market the car in that fashion. It seems like it's basically like that in modes 1-3, but mode 4 kind of throws the wrench in that academic definition since there's then a mechanical link between the engine and driveline.
There isn't a mechanical link to the drivetrain,. Mode 4 simply holds the voltage at whatever limit you set it to (essentially giving you a reserve for extended hill climbs over what hill mode does, or lets you keep that capacity for later)
@@tom4775 Transaxle mode, not driving mode.
The 4th Transaxle mode directly connects the engine to the wheels at highway speeds to improve fuel efficiency.
Though, it's only the case for gen 2
@@tjoloi You learn something new every day!
I understand that this isn't easy but it would be cool if you could just have expansion battery packs. So you have your main daily driver which is lighter but if you want to go on a road trip you just plug in extra capacity
I love my Chevy Volt. I don’t put gas in it until I need to go visit my daughter or go on a road trip longer than 50 miles. Best car I have own except for my 69 firebird (nothing beats Detroit muscle).
Yea, I have to look for opportunities to burn gas or it will sit in my tank for 3 months.
Battery packs should be standardized and able to be swapped out. Then range becomes effectively unlimited and charging stations can use off peak energy to charge the packs at night.
23:30
Toyota hybrids do not have conventional belt driven cvts. The transmission in toyota hybrids have been the planetary gearset since the 1st generation prius.
Indeed, there is a planetary gearset that basically subtracts the speed of MG A and MG B to pretend there is a CVT. One of the MGs is permanently fixed to the combustion engine.
Energy flows from MG A to MG B or the other way around but if MG B is kept at standstill there is a direct drive path from engine to wheels. No clutches at all - only a parking brake.
Quite smart, to be honest.
I'm a car guy with gasoline in my blood. I drive a Mustang, play with Studebakers and my favorite way to spend a vacation day is on a road trip.
All that being said I thought the Volt was great idea when it came out, and I still do. The fact that it failed has everything to do with politics and idiocy on GM's part.
If instead of the Volt GM had introduced the (Voltec?) powertrain in the little Cadillac first GM would still have been hailed for introducing that new technology, it would have enhanced Cadillac's reputation and the well heeled early adopter types would have snapped them up, helping to defray the cost of development. That's how new automotive technologies have always been introduced. It's an economic model that has been proven to work over and over again.
GM tried to turn that on its head, it's no surprise the scheme failed, that's what happens when politics tries to overcome economics.
I've never understood why the auto industry hasn't embraced a diesel (or gas)-electric powerpack. You get the benifits of a fully electric drivetrain, with the range of an IC engine.
Yeah, that is my problem whit EV, they are too dependant on the conditions that youre in. an ICE doesnt have that problem.
I think on your point that is both complexity and reliabity. Its hard to make these systems right and the are not embraced has "pure enough" from the enviromalentis to get a chance to prove themselves. Also I think that EV have a really bad problem on the fact that modern cars have to much tech and bs built in them. I just cant trush any new car regardless of powerplant to be running in 15 years time winout major repairs put in them, I can understand an old car (+20 years) having serius engine problems because at + 250.000 km the engine itself becomes a fungible part. But EV will have to replace their batts in more or less 10 years, and for the full batt ones the batts alone are more than half of their stiker price on the showroom. This means that once the batt dies, so does the rest of the car. If I spend 20k€ on a car you cant spect me to put 10k€ in 10 years because the bats are bad. And on the batts part, they dont have any standard at all soo I fear that It will happen the same that happens with smartphones. If the batt dies, their bats are not produced anymore, soo any replacement you can find will be a similar aged batt, that means that it is already on their lifes end, even if brand new...
@@acynder1 Some electric vehicles use cylindrical battery cells of a standard form factor. The pack is custom but the cells aren't. So the pack can get new cells, possibly with more capacity than when the car was new, rather than just gently used old cells or perhaps new cells from the manufacture (they have to produce spare parts for some time). But others use the pouch style battery cells, I don't know how much standardization there is of those cells. I have 200K miles on my 2013 Volt and the pack still has 85-90% of its capacity.
@@danwat1234 The physical shape of the cells isn't the problem, the aviability of the batt module is, cells are welded on with nikel wire inside the module so even if you recicle the module and put new cells in the cost of the job can easy be more than 25% of the cars worth, and nobody will pull with that. And not to mention the rest of the car, an EV is the house of wonders of electrical gremlins has they age. Just on lead free welds breaking up from age and vibrations would be a nighmare. Not to mention any of the components dying like elecetrolityc caps, transistors and such. Or what would happen if an update bricks the car? I just dont trush Manufacturers to make a car to last 15y the normal way, Much less an EV.
Oil Industry Nuff said
Its the same reason that Ferdinand Porsche's Heavy tank idea in WW2 did not pan out, it is a extremely complex system to get working right without the whole thing bursting into flames like his tanks using this system did. It becomes heavy very fast and weight limitations are real with Gas-electric drives. Its not a huge of a issue on massive trains but getting it down to car size and being reliable without being too massive or weighing too much is a problem.
Well, the good solution is to have a tiny battery on basically all cars, and just make car rental for long range travel the norm. These rental cars would have the battery capacity (or on-board generator like the Volt, which really isn't rocket science as that's exactly how all diesel locomotives work), while individual cars would have just the adequate range, lower mass (thus higher safety, economy of material in the battery pack and chassis), and be more affordable.
Can't wet just have an option to plug in a larger battery in the boot, for the long trips? You could rent one from a recharge station and just have the built in smaller battery for everyday use.
Or have a constant charge unit, like a compact petrol generator that fits in the boot of the car.
It would be impractically heavy
Would change the front/rear weight distribution. Manufacture can't assume the user has the strength to change out battery modules.
I really miss my volt. I had a 2012, and it did not have enough back seat room for 2 carseats. Where I live, there are NO superchargers. People regularly drive to a city about 620km (385 miles) away. There are NO superchargers along the route. Driving a pure electric turns a 6 hour drive into an overnight trip. Even a top of the line, max battery capacity, is not enough to make the trip on one charge. That is why I love the Volt. Pure electric in the city, gas to allow for long trips without having to charge overnight.
I can not imagine driving 400 miles to some city on a regular basis. lol. I'm about 2 hours away from Boston and that's about my limit.
Dave Dave, out of curiosity, whereabouts do you live? I know there are some significant coverage gaps in the supercharger network, especially in the middle of the US, so I just wanted to know how sparse you're talking, and whether there is more infrastructure planned or even rolled out since your comment here.
I loved my Volt, but I live in the Bay Area where things like level 2 chargers are plentiful (though surprisingly DC fast charging is pretty rare still). I got it because I needed HOV lane stickers, as the carpool lane typically reduced my commute from 1.5h to 45m EACH WAY! So when the green HOV stickers were set to expire, my Model 3 reservation was called up and I said "screw it, why not?" and bought one without ever driving or even sitting in one. Again, the first Model 3 I ever even *sat in* was my own on the delivery day.
My Model 3 has been, hands down, the best impulse buy I ever made. The line in this video about the Volt being EV w/ training wheels is spot on, so range anxiety was mostly not at issue, but it still crossed my mind. Cali's supercharger network quickly proved that concern unwarranted, and though I recognize the coverage gaps exist, I look at the map and can't think of any reason why I'd ever need to go through such areas. (Not saying such rural areas are bad, I just don't know rural folks and no reason to visit.)
When available, or even when 3rd party level 2 chargers are available, and my car knows I don't have the charge to make it, it will automatically route to the supercharger (or level 2 charger) that makes the most sense. As you near the charger the battery is conditioned to optimal charge temperatures too, so the other day I charged from 10% to 87% in ~23min on a gen 2 supercharger (150kW, and gen 3 are 250kW). It was almost done before I could find something to watch on UA-cam TV through the touchscreen. In the past it's been done before I could finish walking the dogs on long trips.
I guess the point here is that the most common reason people hesitate to go electric are range anxiety and charge times relative to gas station stops. I honestly didn't fully get over either before getting a BEV. But Tesla has proven to me that it making those concerns unfounded is actually possible. We just need the infrastructure to do it. Tesla may not have been able to get chargers around you yet (much of it depends on private land owners wanting them, which is rough in anti-tesla areas), but as one company their reach is impressive and they've shown that real public investment in EV infrastructure can make widespread adoption a reality. Shifting subsidies from legacy energy sources to things like fast charging stations is well beyond due I think.
Really though, I'm glad you're enjoying your Volt. It's really a fantastic car that I'd considered the best I'd ever owned... until getting my current car. I was still quite sad when GM killed it off and production was stopped, but I too understand why they did it.
Anyway, I hope you are able to enjoy your Volt for years to come! If you've made it this far... what the hell is wrong with you?? I'm not even gonna read this, and I freaking wrote it!
@@CurtisShimamoto I live in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada, one of the largest cities within about an almost 400 mile radius, and the population is under 300,000. We just do not have the population density, or EV density. Provinces like Ontario or Quebec have the population density and enough EVs to make it worth while to put in chargers. Nothing has changed since my original post, and it likely won't for a long time.
@@davedave8263 interesting, thanks for the super quick reply! From what you describe, you're right... and it probably will not be prioritized to receive such infrastructure anytime soon either unfortunately. It's definitely areas like yours that I've long realized will continue to make plug in hybrids and BEVs w/ range extenders not only viable for years to come, but quite necessary even. I've lived in populated areas for my entire life, so I couldn't imagine having to basically drive to Los Angeles (from here in silicon valley) to get to any kind of decently sized city.
Thanks again for the response! Enjoy your Friday and have a great weekend. :)
Another point, Volt ICE runs on an engineered load ramp with additional limits on temp, rpm, etc. this improves overall emission control.
You purchase one that has a full battery pack, but you can remove some of the battery. That way, you're only carrying the amount you need for usual days, and for longer trips, you can put more battery in. Maybe even allow space for "expansion packs".
Have you met people? Most people would not be competent enough to do that.
If things go well my next car will be 'lectric.
It'd be interesting to see modular battery units. Add more as you need them. Swap them around, plug them into your house as solar storage cells...
But it was the GM EV-1 that convinced Tesla to produce the Tesla Roadster, so...
However GM needed to produce the EV-1 because of California law, not because they felt like building EV's for nice reasons.
@@GBOAC But, with the EV-1 GM went way beyond what was required by law. Other companies just took existing ICE models and fitted them with batteries and motors. The EV-1 was designed from the ground up as an EV. It really was an amazing accomplishment for the time.
I recently bought a Volt as my first car. For what I need it for, it's great. Pretty much every day I use only electricity. I haven't filled it up since I got it and still have half a tank left (I got it in February and now it's April) I love it so much. Totally agree with your "EV with training wheels" analogy.
Why not use a small battery car with an option to add another battery pack stored at the consumer's home, easily installed for the extra range when traveling?