The Art of OP Anime Heroes
Вставка
- Опубліковано 28 чер 2024
- Overpowered Protagonists are one of the best AND worst things about Anime. Here's how some of the best do it right - and the rest... don't.
Watch The Eminence in Shadow 2nd Season now with a free HIDIVE Trial: tinyurl.com/MothersBasement23
Chapters:
00:00 - Intro
04:15 - Can He Beat Goku Tho
17:34 - Overpowered Fantasies
25:11 - The Art of Deconstruction
Support me on Patreon: / mothersbasement
Subscribe to Mother's Basement for anime and gaming videos every week: ua-cam.com/users/subscription_...
Validate me!
Follow me on twitter: / g0ffthew
Also on facebook: / mothersbasementofficial
And check out my Steam Curator page: steamcommunity.com/groups/moth...
and the new Mother's Basement Subreddit: / mothersbasement
In the depths of his Mother's Basement, Geoff Thew creates videos analyzing the storytelling techniques of anime and video games. He has been named the number one Worst UA-cam Anime Reviewer by The Top Tens. - Фільми й анімація
Sign up for a free trial and watch The Eminence in Shadow 2nd season NOW only on HIDIVE using my link: tinyurl.com/MothersBasement23
Anime is basically one big circle first Manga then Anime then Movie and it goes around and around🎨
There were 3 other cel3stial monkeys in JTW, so Toriyama was just following the source material
My least favorite Kirito? Cid.
That's right, you heard me. And no, I'm not kidding, I genuinely hate him more than any other version of Kirito, and genuinely take offense when people compare him to Momonga.
And before anyone starts whining and reeing that no, he's not a Kirito, kindly take off your blindfold, and look at the facts.
-Black-haired young man who dresses in a black trench coat
-Has a veritable harem of women after his dick for Reasons
-Wields a long black sword
-Figures out shit from basically no clues.
Moving on, I do not understand how people enjoy a show where the MC pointedly refuses to actually interact with the world and other characters around him, his head shoved so far up his own delusional asshole that he makes a singularity look loose.
Momonga is blind to a few things, but he is AWARE of things happening around him, and he plans. He isn't so delusional that he looks at everything around him and thinks it's a big ol' LARP.
To put it in another way; If the character refuses to engage with the story, *why should I engage with the story?* There's no real weight to anything if the MC refuses to treat things as actually happening.
Hi Geoff, I have a friend whos working on a isekai story. you probably got some comments from him, virtuoso his name btw. His story is about a 26yr old guy who lost interest from fiction due to saturation and blandness of the stories authors wrote on his time. After getting a job, the next morning, he soon realize that his whole apartment got transferred in another world, where rather being happy, he's extremely upset about it. Now he's finding his way back to his world. His mc has an ability to negate/destroy/denied/remove/erase any supernatural abilities no matter what it is. However, the most interest about his mc is that he's just don't really care about the problems of the world. He's not the typical isekai protagonist where he will always be the nice guy in fact, he's more of a stubborn type where people need to ask his help and there's a chance he would decline. I cant truly describe the mc but, my friend said that his mc will likely "snap people back into reality". I have read some of it, and I think it has potential to be good. Unfortunately its just written on paper yet and virt haven't post it on a website due to burnout and crippling depression he currently has rn. The title is Anti-fiction: My new "boring" life in another world, full of overused fictional cliches, stereotypes, and tropes (yeah long title I know). Hope he's doing well rn
Hmmm you really should've talked about the Cool Cooler Coolest Sakamoto from Haven't you heard, I'm Sakamoto.
And also, yes please do a video the Chimera ant arc.
Fun Fact: In journy to the west there were three other monkies that were exactly like Sun Wukong. They were called the Four Celestial Primates. And at the beginning of Z there is 4 full blooded sayians remaining
well, if you aren't counting the movies.
@@cybersaiyan9596 They aren't canon (Aside from Super Broly and Tarble), so...
@@cybersaiyan9596 Journey to the West has movies? I wonder if they're canon
Monkies
@@borby4584 Canon stopped having any meaning in Dragon Ball after Heroes and Xenoverse, both written by Toriyama. Dragon Ball is a multiverse. Everything is canon and nothing is canon.
Something I appreciate about two overpowered-protagonists of note from My Hero (All Might) and Jujutsu Kaisen (Gojo) is that the story examines how their sheer overpoweredness actually creates as many problems as it solves.
Take All Might for example: The man was such an unbeatable freak in his prime that he (unintentionally) single-handedly warped hero society around him. Everything in the world of My Hero ultimately leaned on the central pillar that was All Might so heavily that the moment he has to retire partway through the series society begins to unravel in a way it wouldn't have if someone more fallible had been the biggest force in hero society.
Gojo is a similar situation. Gojo is such an untouchable freak that the whole of Jujutsu society warps around him in a way that, the moment he's out of the picture, begins to spin out of control with disastrous results. A character in the Shibuya Incident arc even explicitly points this out to Yuji and Megumi, noting how the one man show that is Gojo is propping up an unhealthy and unsustainable amount of the status quo.
So sure, All Might and Gojo could 1v1 anyone in their respective setting, but ultimately they're not only powerless to fix the systemic problems of their world, they're (inadvertently) making them worse.
lets not forget Gojo being born had the unintended side effect of making Enemies stronger in a way similar to self preservation evolution, curses had to get stronger as not to just be completely outclassed, its a balance and he tipped it so far in one direction the world had to fix itself on its own and now people that could have fought curses are fucked because curse are worried about Gojo not them
This make me remember Reinhard from Re:Zero. But he is actually the reverse of this problem
He is Over Power because the bad poeple in that world is too many and too strong. So the world create the Overpowered Good Guy to protect the balance of that world
Gojo and Toshinori also both became teachers to bring up a generation that could understand and potentially change the world around them.
Ironically, the world of JJK might actually have been better off if Gojo had just up and killed all the higher ups who were too stuck in tradition and their own power to change with the times.
Even more unhealthy is that both characters are presenting a false unbeatable persona to try and scare off would be aggressors, but this closes off other people from reaching out to support them.
All Might is severely wounded to a degree that he couldn't take down half the amount villains he claims, yet can't spend any meaningful time grouped with other heroes because it would panic the population into thinking there's a world ending problem around the corner. That is if the constant threat of a villainous double agent leaking his weakness wasn't enough.
Meanwhile Gojo is consistently calm in any situation making people think he has all the answers and none of the problems, yet the main reason for that is because he's been tearing his brain apart and healing it to maintain a technique so long that he's in a constant state of detachment from the real world.
@@003dylanyou’re, like. Partially correct? Until you get to the final gojo bit. That has nothing to do with his persona. His brain is completely fine bro. He’s the way he is because of the bounty on his head from literal birth, how he was never allowed to be a person outside of being ‘the strongest’, and from the trauma and falling out of what happened with Toji and Riko, and then later on Geto. It’s an emotional wound, not detachment because of limitless and RCT.
My favourite thing about Gojo as a ridiculously OP character is that they establish two problems with his existence: 1. He can't be everywhere at once, and is constantly needed somewhere else. and 2. He's a *crutch* to a lot of the JJ sorcerer world. Characters often think "If this goes too badly we can back off and wait for Gojo to fix everything", and when it becomes apparent that that isn't an option it shows how reliant on him they were. Putting him in the flesh cube removed a HUGE safety net for humans as well as the biggest thing deterring curses from just going absolutely nuts on mankind.
If only Yuta was there. Curse you gege. Sidelined two op characters for narrative reasoning.
I love that it also works with from a narrative standpoint. You can't just have your OP character save the day if you want your work to stand out amongst its peers, you need something to generate tension.
@@ImperiaGinenter... AUTHORS
@@ImperiaGin??? You understand that this was done on purpose, correct? That gojo is more of a narrative foil than a main character and that his mere existence actively created the tragedy that followed. He’s more like a walking disaster than a hero, a humanoid typhoon if you will, as others have pointed out, such that he tipped the scales too hard and when he was taken off the scales they flipped off the table and everything went insane.
God JJK is so good. I skipped it when it first started it’s run but Akutami sense I really has given us the shonen version of bakemonegatari.
There’s also the fact he increased the power of cursed spirits by just existing
One great thing about Mob is the idea that having super op powers is pointless if one does not wish to fight. I think to often in anime, especially bad anime, a characters combat ability is the only consideration.
Exactly. While he's certainly crazy OP in a power sense, the things he really wants in life aren't things that you can just explode into happen. So while he's strong enough to destroy the world and beat anybody, it doesn't bring him any closer to his true goals and that's what makes him worm.
That because solving conflicts without force, or those that cannot be resolved by force requires complex conflicts and nuanced solutions.
This is primarily one of the reasons that The Disastrous Life of Saiki K will probably never die as a comedy. Because it in that story, the OP protagonist just wants to be left alone to live his life and get some coffee jelly, but he is surrounded by eccentric characters that push him to use his OP abilities to avoid other people.
Because combat is the only resolution system in the IP!
XD
Q_q
Psycho-Pass does something similar, with the Sibyl system is so good at preventing crime that people don't know how to react if a weakness in the system is found. As soon as one crime is committed in broad daylight and the criminal escapes unscathed, public order immediately breaks down
Yugi cant sneeze a planet apart, but he does have s trap card that will let him redirect your planet busting sneeze back at you, leave you with 2200 metaphorical or even literally life points, summon dark magician or any of his retrains and swing for game. He also set that trap card thirteen turns ago.
But then it turns out he was decapitated instantaneously by sayain saga level vegeta lol
@@mookiestewart3776Nope, drowning mirror force. Lowkey though I wonder if Yugis mind hacks would work against Dragon Ball characters.
@@projectmessiah like older dragonball characters?? That would be interesting….top tier current dragonball characters essentially manipulate/ destroy reality itself with just their existence so…..also just fyi yugi can have any card he wants , he still needs time for his neurons in his brain to activate to think about the card he wants to play, then to move his body to play the card , sayain saga vegeta was many orders of magnitude faster than light and could 100% decapitate him before he even thought of the word “duel” . He’s getting no diffed bruh , sorry to tell ya .
@@mookiestewart3776 Yeah but Vegeta would probably stand there and let him do his attack first, like if their not in character you dont need anywhere near Saiyan Saga Vegeta considering that the short distance speed feats displayed by Master Roshi in Goku and Krillins training arc would proably be enough to deal with Yugi drawing a card but most Dragon Ball characters wouldnt just attack a guy drawing a card even if they knew they were fighting him. Also I didnt want to bring it up because its kinda dumb but if Yugi summons some of his strongest monsters (Which with his powers he can make real as shown in season 0/the early chapters of the manga) then he woud also beat pretty much everyone up to the end of Z if you go into the lore of the monsters abilitys and scaling seeing as it goes into the low multiversal teritory.
@@mookiestewart3776 Also I forgot to mention that Yugis mind/soul hax aren't card dependent he can just do it
Being OP is relative. You just have to make sure that that 'relative' doesn't become 'absolute' and 'constant' in your story. If it does, chances are you're just not actually exploring interesting areas you could have taken your story into, and really could use adding some "So it's like this, *but* ..." in your storytelling.
Yeah, like sun wukong did meed enemies he couldnt just defeat and got help from oddly many deities he beat up earlier.
That's one way to do it, but practicaly speaking, that's avoiding the OP - if there are threats at or above the protagonist's level, they may be endgame levels, but not truly OP. For a truly OP protagonist story to be interesting, you need a diferent source of narative tension. As mentioned in the video, Saitama and Mob are both absolutely and unquestionably OP, but the story is still interesting, because the narative tension comes from things they can't punch.
@@petrsevcik5044 Exactly. Another example is Ainz from Overlord. Ainz's power means he can streamroll anything 1v1 outright or with enough prep. However, this doesn't really help with his main goal (find other players, hopefully his old guild members). Plus, Ainz himself is out of his depth, but his success is really due to the hyper competent and loyal NPCs by his side. The story of Overlord also puts a lot of focus on other characters, building up their stories and the world around them. The entertainment comes from seeing the effects of Ainz and Nazarick on the world and the people they come into contact with.
Ainz maybe OP, with incredible resources, but he's far from infallible and seeing what that unique combo does to the world around him is where the fun is. The narrative tension comes from getting invested in the collective character that is world of Overlord itself and the people who make it up.
Saitama would like a word.
@marocat4749 so many deities that you have to ask why they even sent wukong
Calling Frieza a "real estate speculator" is honestly too accurate and I never thought of it that way 😂
The story was written well enough hide that laconic fact
XD
Actually, the writer made him with that in mind, it was completely intentional.
@@thatonecommunist Well, yes, he conquers planets, that's his whole M.O., lol. What made it funny was putting it into modern-day terms and phrasing it like our current housing crisis across the world 😅.
Frieza wasn't as evil tho
@@BewareTheLilyOfTheValley ...no, i'm saying akira toriyama literally said he was a real estate speculator AT THE TIME.
My favorite part of the Gojo loss was when they said “Gojo isn’t like Itadori. He can accept losses from cursed spirits. What he can’t accept is people killed by Gojo”. It’s a level of psychology you don’t actually see in most fights against powerful protagonists
The thing that makes Hisoka scary is that bungee gum has the properties of both rubber and gum, obviously.
It has the properties of both rubber and gum you see, quite deadly!
Thank you. I said this aloud, I'm glad it's been recorded digitally.
I love the joke, but man everything about Hisoka is scary. Literally every attribute he has. It's like someone wrote a list of things that people are afraid of and stuck them all in one creepy dude. The man is a cunning, sociopathic, intelligent, rubber-gum-weilding p**o.
And worst of all.
He's a clown.
@@DrEnzyme
Literally, when I heard him say that, I didn't actually quite agree. I do see his point, but I feel like the fact that they're scheming, cunning, and battle savy is on the same level as scary as how rare it is that they give a 💩about *_anything_* or *anyone* that isn't their main goals.
Uvo, for instance, was decently clever, but he literally got out of a situation by screaming his opponent to death. Those guys wouldn't have lasted a blink _with_ the jump, but even with it there wasn't much any way to beat him. Generally, it seems, a sufficiently powerful/skilled (I'm not saying it's like Dragonball where you can overpower hax. I mean that if you're a skillful enough Nen user in a certain way or draw a good game of Janken when it comes to typing or abilities, you don't actually need as much "power" to defeat them). And his main belief was that you should be able to take/do what you want, if you can.
Admittedly, I'm not going to correct him outright, _especially_ considering the amount of HxH I've watched (~60 episodes ), it's just _that's_ what _I_ normally found more fearful about them. That part where the samurai dude had tears over Uvo, I wanted Gon to combo him after winning that arm wrestle...
I love Mob because despite knowing hes unlikely to lose any given fight, you DO worry about him. Pretty much CONSTANTLY. not so much his physical safety but his psyche, hes such a sweet kid, and he goes through so much, especially in season two, that despite being Just a Guy with no real ability to do anything, i found myself wanting to jump into the screen and protect mob, more than once. I think this is mostly achieved by mob really being just a kid with a big heart and a good head on his shoulders trying his best to achieve what his powers cant give him. Seeing him emotionally hurt is genuinely heartbreaking when you're looking at him through the eyes of someone like Reigen. You want mob to grow into a healthy and well adjusted adult, you want him to achieve his goals and be proud of himself. You want him to be HAPPY. Regarding the Chimera ant arc, one of the most interesting things i think a lot of shonen can do is make someone winning a fight feel like a loss. Victory feeling bitter because, even though the fight was won, you feel like you lost a piece of the character to get there. Like their innocence.
in the beginning, youre excited to see what Mob can do with his powers, you want to see what happens when he goes apeshit, when he gets to that 100%, and it pays off immensely because its so well done, and its cool to see psychic powers kick ass.
but as we moved on thru the story, i found myself less excited and more sad when he hits the 100%, because he’s in such distress. im glad to see someone share a similar sentiment.
I think that second part applies not just to Gon's fight, but also Netero vs the Chimera Ant King. He trained all his life to make sure he was ready in case he ever needed to save Humanity, to the point he literally gave up everything else he could have ever had just for power, and then that threat is *born* so goddamn powerful, it basically invalidates him completely. I mean, Netero _technically_ wins by giving Meruem acute radiation poisoning that'll end him in a few hours, but he had to die for that to happen. Hunter x Hunter was just a goddamn masterpiece from start to finish.
I don't think Netero was training to save anyone. He implies that he was actually kind of a bad dude who cared about nothing but fighting, but once he became overwhelmingly strong, there was no reason to keep beating people up, and he ended up assuming a grandfatherly role by coincidence. That's why he insisted on killing the ant king even after he outright said he had no intention of destroying or enslaving humanity, and actually wanted to improve the current system of government to protect the weak (since komugi helped him realize that people had value outside of fighting). @@ericlamb4501
I think what makes Gojo so enjoyable as an OP hero is that he is Doomed By The Narrative to points that should not even be possible. I also enjoy that it forces the villainous forces in Jujutsu Kaisen to move in unconventional ways. Shibuya after all was not intended to be the all-out bloodbath that it turned out to be; they literally just wanted to seal Gojo to get him out of the way. Beating him was never on their to-do list.
What's good about Gojo is that everyone knows he is the strongest. There's no underestimating or misunderstanding with him, everyone knows you should not fuck with him directly, which forced villains to think strategically. Like a good portion of the story up until Shibuya was about disaster curses preparing a plan to seal Gojo. And even after being sealed everything revolves around him. Gojo is the most important existence in Jujutsu society and everyone knows it. That makes the story more intriguing i think
Yeah he's basically given all the plot armour and then the narrator trying to kill it
@@kujojotarostandoceanman2641You need to learn how to use the term plot armor correctly.
Yes it was lol. Mahito literally transfigured a couple (hundred I’m pretty sure?) humans. Chose himself murdered like 10+ and Jogo and Hanami as well. Dragon ducking ate a shit ton of human. I guess they didn’t intend for Sukuna to just straight murderer everyone within his radius but even without that it was 100% a blood bath from the start as they intended it to be to try and distract Gojo and make restrict his power
@@oscar3153 you do have a point, and perhaps my phrasing was off. What I was going for was "It wasn't intended to be an all out war between the curses and the sorcerers with massive casualties on all sides"
White girl goku gojo will never NOT be the king of backshots
THE NOISE I made when I read this comment
@@mothersbasementSAME you're the Best jeff😊😊😊😊❤❤❤❤❤
You got me wheezing
What a minute-
what the hell
Luffy is my favorite Goku. I remember fondly realizing that during the war legitimately every character with a name, whom he had not already beaten up, could kill him dead in a second. But he was so insignificant to the struggle that he is able to accomplish his goal (before y'know THAT). I continue to enjoy his slow rise to attaining a power that may make him the most powerful Goku of all. That being the powers of Popeye the sailor man.
O
M
G
XD
And he still get his ass beat by the real goku
@@edwardmyers9492 so?
@@edwardmyers9492Popeye ? Never.
I've fallen out of love with One Piece early on because of the Alabasta arc, but goddamn if it doesn't have good characters, even if the art style seems basic as dishwater. I don't doubt Luffy will become king of the pirates, that's kinda just how shounen go, but his 'never give up' attitude toward his dream rubbing off on others who do end up helping him out in return is great
A manga I'm particularly fond of is Record of a Fallen Vampire, whose protagonist, Akabara Strauss, is so overpowered that the entire plot was set into motion by world leaders' attempting to assassinate him as being *too* overpowered that they feared him as a threat to them even though he only wanted peace. And, like, they failed, obviously, but the attempt itself destroyed his entire kingdom and pretty much everything he held dear, and even after the time skip from then to the present day he still has nothing because of all the repeated attempts on his life and because of the dark truths he's hiding from everyone else. Record of a Fallen Vampire has a lot of those dark truths from various sources. Basically, Strauss's power is so great that the fear of him became a driving force in the world that caused far more problems than he ever could have by simply going apeshit with all his strength.
That's a really neat story. It makes the strength of the protagonist the problem that has to be solved.
It also sounds a little like the backstory of Hellsing.
ahh, that one was a classic, dude was so op he terraformed the moon, or was it another planet, i forget
That's the kind of realistic development I expect would happen in isekai fantasies. When you are so powerful you break all conventions of the world, everyone would probably consider you as big a threat as whatever demon king they are facing
That's kinda based. Makes me want Season 2 of Misfit of Demon King Academy though...
@@dracosfire7247Technically no, the problem is people's irrational fear and preemptive responses. Which is very realistic.
I do really love how Gojo is an absolute nightmare, a global threat, only kept in check by... the fact that he's a pretty chill, kinda dumb guy. Absolutely no aspirations for world domination in his pretty head. He's just a guy doing his best to protect humanity, because he's *really good at it.*
Dumb? No, he might seem that way on the outside but everything he does is calculated. He has a lot of emotion hidden away that slips through once in a while. At least that's how I see him. He might seem relaxed but the whole flashback arc with Geto was to show that he is always alert and primed after what happened.
He explicitly states that he takes a sideline approach on things for the sake of others. He's aware that if he were to do most things, he'd end up being so good at them it'd tip the balance (in the same way he's already tipped the power level balance in the world of curses)
He's not really dumb, just intentionally as uninvolved in this as he can be because he's aware how he's a fucking elephant walking amongst a bunch of ants. I'd replace "kind dumb" with "kinda considerate" I guess.
Agreed, I did a rewatch after the flashback arc, and it's interesting how it re-contextualizes a lot of what seemed like aloofness as open contempt and barely held back murderous rage. @@backonlazer791
He's not dumb...
What everyone else here said. He's really just a chill goofball when things are ok.
As a 40+ year old AniMom, I've faced that, "dude, isn't anime just cartoons? You're an adult..." More times than I can count. But it's gotten relatively easier in the past 5-7 years, as it's become more mainstream and I can even enjoy anime movies at my local theater. 😅
Good for US
I'M 43
XD
Can you be my mom? :)
Do your kids watch anime with you put of curiosity?
The reason why at age 38, I still watch Anime. People older than me always watched it so i never stopped. Thank You.
@@Mahlak_Mriuani_Anatman 🤣✌️
The interesting bit about Dragonball Z is that Goku actually wins very few battles on his own. Radditz, Vegeta, Cell and Buu all took a team effort. Freeza is the only one that lost on a straight up one v one.
One of my favorite Goku’s is Senku. “What if you put all the muscle of a Goku in the brain.” Is a great idea. And he works as an OP protag because he physically can’t do all the stuff he needs to do. He can science it yes but he can’t perfectly craft or build a lot of it. He needs help and is thus balanced out by his friends.
W
one of my favorite aspects of this is despite his big brain and meticulous step by step process in achieving his goals he often skips steps to a detriment to himself, such as not remembering how vital gears and a water wheel are for scaling up and automation till chrome and kaseki basically reinvent it on their own
This is validating the my mum school of anime protagonist names where everyone is ‘a goku’
To be fair, Frieren is considered shounen, so shounen can still be enjoyed by an older crowd.
Frieren so peak
In all honesty, the whole concept of "adults can't enjoy things that kids do" is a real stupid idea in hindsight. You can enjoy whatever the hell you want to enjoy, whether you're a child, teenager or adult. No one should tell you what to like and dislike as it's your life and you live it anyway you want to.
@@tavaedenton3338 "When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up." - CS Lewis.
Eh, these classifications are honestly only useful in broad strokes.
Like, Kaguya-Sama is considered seinen, and while it can definitely be enjoyed by adults I do feel like it skews younger in its audience than Frieren.
@tavaedenton3338 yeah. I think it is paired with the idea that kids media doesn't have to be good.
There was a lot of low effort stuff that kids watched, but in hindsight realized was very shallow, poorly written, repetitive...and so they associated it with being stuff to grow out of, that knowing more meant not enjoying that stuff, that vocally saying you don't enjoy that stuff shows you know more and are more adult.
I always found the key to One Punch Man to be the concept of how its lonely at the top. That when you have no challenges left before you there is no more motivation to live or improve beyond basic human necessity, a distillation of the human NEED for challenge. When you know there is nothing to threaten you it is simple to become bored and complacent the same as OPM does and he only cares to find someone, ANYONE who can make him struggle in the slightest.
It’s funny how every video talking about anything related to shonen tropes or ideas invariably leads to Geoff talking about how good Hunter x Hunter and Jujutsu Kaisen are…
…AS HE SHOULD BECAUSE THEY’RE GREAT
Can I get an honest answer from a hxh fan. Also this is me genuinely asking and not trying to be mean.
I never understood the hxh hype because as someone who tried it and made it all the way to the latter half of the fight with the Chimera Ant king, I alwayd felt like it was a clever show treating me the viewer as an absolute idiot. It utterly overexplains everything to the point it becomes unbearable. You see a character look anrgy and then get a 5 minute internal monolouge from them explaining in excrucriating detail that they are angry. This also throws the pacing off and means every part of the conflict gets ages to resolve. (My favourite manga is OP so I don't have an issue with a story being long)
So I want to know if its just my problem and noone else sees that or if its a anime vs manga issue or if to you the good just overshadows these issues?
@@frosthammer917 I think Togashi just understands how illiterate the shonen community is
@@frosthammer917 Speaking for myself I like how detailed that is. It's probably just a personal taste thing, because I never felt like an idiot or had any problems with the pacing.
@@frosthammer917 This is most shounen, ngl
@@frosthammer917I love hxh but I have to agree with you. Sometimes the do too much telling instead of showing.
Surprised you didn't mention Ainz from Overlord. That story does some good storytelling with overpowered characters. Either having the OP characters having to act cautious exploring an unfamiliar world, or by watch developed side characters come up against the OP ones.
While Ainz is strong, his own goals are hopeless dreams like reuniting with his friends. In that way, he is as hopeless as the people he kills for, ultimately, no reason, as conquering the world _isn't_ his goal.
@@slavishentity6705 That's why Overlord is a tragedy. It's about Ainz losing his soul. He is still OP and, in my opinion, well written.
@@slavishentity6705The sort of 'What-If' story where ainz only got isekaid in his lich body and not with nazerith is a good contrast
My Goku daydreams always get cut short when I remember how it won't make me less awkward in public. Being an OP demigod has shocking little real world applications when you want to live a fulfilling life (the theme of Mob Psycho 100 essentially)
Nah that's just you.
My Goku daydreams involve nothing but abuse of Instant Transmission and his(relatively) minor psychic abilities. Also, instant freedom from financial insecurity as hunting actually becomes a viable source of food and money.
Now that I think of it, it's kind of like wealth. Money won't give you happiness, but it sure as hell gives you less things to be unhappy about.
I do agree that Soma is very similar to a Yugioh protagonist, but it's not Yugi Moto, to me it's Jaden Yuki. Both are under/overdogs in a special academy looking to be the best. But while everyone else treats the anime's competition like the most serious expression of strength and anyone who doesn't take is seriously doesn't deserve to be here, both Jaden and Soma cut through the bullshit and do what duel/cook just because it's fun and getting better at it is what they love doing.
He even looks a bit like Jaden.
Honestly stories focusing on the OP character’s personality/mentality is a lot of more interesting to me than just feats. Characters like Saitama and Mob are a great example of this
"I have killed the part that cringes" I wish I had that strength.
Goku may unironically have inspired the whole grind generation
that would be an unfortunate legacy to leave
@@comyuse9103
so how did Gojo helped you
You are vastly overestimating the broad cultural impact of anime, probably because you and your circle are more entrenched than most. When it comes down to it it is a niche hobby and even if more people have heard of it than actually engage with it, they still don't know the first thing about who Goku is as a character. It's mostly surface level.
Lol he might actually be if you think about it.
And you are vastly underestimating the broad cultural impact of anime because it's clear as day you simply want to diminish its value in favor of upholding what you think is more important when it's not. You cannot say Goku being the first anime character to show up for the Thanksgiving parade, being a mascot for the Olympics, have several mcu and dceu directors admit to writing scenes in their films as an homage tp the franchise and have dozens upon dozens of sports professionals make constant references to dragon ball and pretend it's "surface level" or that it's a "niche hobby". To say you're grasping at straws would be an overstatement
@@LegendXD00 Dude. Stop being so desperate for validation. "Oh, my god. Someone successful and influential mentioned something I like! Look, Mom! It's a real hobby, it's real I tell you!" Just enjoy the thing without having to tell yourself it is also just as important for everyone else or tying to reaffirm yourself through other people. The mere fact that you knew all these things off the top of your head shows that you are desperately searching for others to tell you what you like is good because you can't convince yourself of its inherent merit independently.
Literally every single example you listed does not require an iota of knowledge about Goku as a character. Just that he exists. And that he screams while punching stuff and powering up. You know, surface level stuff. It's the same as tons of people babbling on about "blue pilled", "red pilled" or "the Matrix" while never having watched the original movies. It's surface level references.
I enjoy anime and manga myself but I am under no illusions that if you grab somebody off the streets and start prattling about anime they will know what you mean instead of going "Oh, so you like cartoons? That's like Disney, right?".
I can't believe Eminence in Shadow literally just hired you to boost them this time. They really said "Yeah, this guy got it!" and they were absolutely right.
The moon is red
the frenzy has begun
Run if you value your life
Netero vs Meruem fight is still my all-time favorite, because everything goes perfect. Tge animation, the music, the choreography, tension and of course, the punchline
So I also follow Overly Sarcastic Productions, and Red actually touches on a way to use OP heroes in her video on Powerhouses, as well as just any of her videos on the 5-man band. Basically, if you have an OP hero, throw a problem at them that they can't just hit until it goes away. It's kinda why early Naruto was interesting, where the shinobi had to think of a way to use their tools to get a win over on their opponents, instead of just breaking out the biggest moves (so the fight between Temari and Sikamaru for instance). It's also why the fight between Ochako and Bakugo was so good, because Ochako didn't pull out some brand new power, just used the abilities we've seen her have from the beginning to nearly beat Bakugo.
god i wish naruto was better, it could have been so much better than dragon ball with knives.
@@comyuse9103I know it's reductive, but I do think Naruto lost a bit of its potential when the protagonist in a story about ninjas is wearing bright orange and loves to scream.
@@boiyado6717 The thing with Naruto is the "Chakra power" system it self was never a "Stealth based power system" from the very beginning you got see a giant fox almost nuke a village. Naruto was never a strategic stealth based story Naruto is a full Battle Shonen by engagement design. I mean the biggest red flag that Naruto was always going to be "traditional Shonen power fest" was the incorporation of the Rasengan skill ,and the Chidori skill those techniques are power busters for Naruto and Sasuke's characters why would the main characters have moves that mess with the opponent when it does not fit their designs of engagement. The whole Zabuza situation worked since Naruto and Sasuke do not have their power buster skills at that point in the story ,and Shikimaru vs Temari situation worked since Shikimaru is not a power buster type of character like Naruto, Sasuke, Garaa and Rock Lee are all power type characters that fight in a full all out offensive way. The only 3 characters in Naruto that have a skill that requires strategic value are Shiikimaru, Ino, and Shino yes just those characters. the rest is are just the "Sharingan" user's that's it.Naruto was only using the theme of a ninja show even Kishimotto said he wanted kaiju battles in Naruto ,so that was another Red Flag and those kaiju battles are also in Naruto's first part before Naruto Shippuden happens.
The thing with Naruto is the "Chakra power" system it self was never a "Stealth based power system" from the very beginning you got see a giant fox almost nuke a village. Naruto was never a strategic stealth based story Naruto is a full Battle Shonen by engagement design. I mean the biggest red flag that Naruto was always going to be "traditional Shonen power fest" was the incorporation of the Rasengan skill ,and the Chidori skill those techniques are power busters for Naruto and Sasuke's characters why would the main characters have moves that mess with the opponent when it does not fit their designs of engagement. The whole Zabuza situation worked since Naruto and Sasuke do not have their power buster skills at that point in the story ,and Shikimaru vs Temari situation worked since Shikimaru is not a power buster type of character like Naruto, Sasuke, Garaa and Rock Lee are all power type characters that fight in a full all out offensive way. The only 3 characters in Naruto that have a skill that requires strategic value are Shiikimaru, Ino, and Shino yes just those characters. the rest is are just the "Sharingan" user's that's it. Naruto was only using the theme of a ninja show even Kishimotto said he wanted kaiju battles in Naruto ,so that was another Red Flag and those kaiju battles are also in Naruto's first part before Naruto Shippuden happens.
@@1BadAssArchAngelvs14 there's a great video from around 4 years ago that actually covers this concept lmao. "Naruto: How to Destroy your Own Worldbuilding".
it's a great video that touches on the glaring differences between the original series and Shippuden. i enjoy the core story of Naruto, but i can see and even have many gripes with how messy the themes and actual story play out.
I think another reason Luffy works so well earlier in the show is we never feel that his ability is overpowered but the sheer imagination of how he uses it MADE him kind of overpowered compared to his opponents. Like now that he has Haki Luffy would dominate Crocodile so hard without thinking, but back in Alabasta he had to do silly shit like turn himself into a giant water balloon or use his own blood to harden Crocodile for attacks to succeed. That's part of why Gear 5th is so exciting is because unlike Gear 4th forms which were all about Haki improvements 5th goes back to just letting Luffy do some crazy imaginative bullshit again and turn the fight into a literal cartoon.
Great point
The fact that Luffy was dead to rights so many times before Gear 5 also made that "earn the OP move" aspect HIT. Like that silly water balloon & blood trick? Both done after Crocodile had effectively killed him once & twice respectively & that was before Lucci made him look like a fool & he had to quickly think of both Gear 2 & 3 as they approached Enies Lobby. And then you add in Ivankov's high risk healing of Magellan's poison & ALL the beatings he got from the crews of Big Mom & Kaido combined & it's really no wonder his DF finally awakened.
I think Subaru in Re:Zero is one of the most interesting takes on overpowered abilities. Return by death turns every batte into a video game level where he needs to find the right set of actions to win, but it's the core of Subaru's very character that reintroduces the tension. His fear of death remains even with this power, but his need to save everyone gives him a hero complex that feeds his insecurities about his incompetence. He is also one of the few characters you could argue suffer more than Guts, and seeing him break just to struggle again for someone else hits you in the heart hard.
I do want to add to this by saying that Subaru isn't even Re: Zero's 'Goku'. Instead that goes to Reinhard. Yet, besides helping Subaru clear the 'tutorial' day, he is essentially never around to save the day. That's because he is busy with his own stuff being a knight, and while he's a nice guy, he has other priorities he has to deal with. Heck he is so OP, that in one of the alternative What If scenario's, Subaru literally couldn't beat him despite having essentially unlimited attempts to do so. Instead Subaru had to create the perfect scenario to discredit and ruin Reinhard's reputation in order to get a 'win' over him.
Agreed, it's fascinating to give a character functional immortality and timeline resets but balance that with the fact that he *will* feel the horror and physical pain of every one of his deaths and the psychological pain of every failure he resets over. Plus, Return by Death has the additional caveat that it is not fully controlled by Subaru. He can choose when he dies, but he *can't* choose his timeline reset checkpoints, and he can't ever go back beyond the last checkpoint that he hit. He doesn't get unlimited redos to save everyone he wants to save at every checkpoint; he gets exactly enough redos to correct whatever the thing giving him these abilities wants fixed and no more.
and that's not even getting into the sealed village arc (I don't know the actual name of the arc but the one with the killer bunnies from hell as one of the deaths) having the climax be that another character learns about his ability & he's forced to wager with them on not using it for the problem anymore in order to even get the win condition out of them. Legit solving that particular puzzle must have been like playing an old moon logic adventure game for Subaru.
It's interesting to remember that Sun Wukong is a morally gray agent of chaos who often causes problems or allows them to get out of hand with his antics, rather than just solving them for the protagonist of the story. It's a bit surprising that amoral OP characters like Hellsing's Alucard, who intentionally allow the tension to ratchet up for their own benefit (not unlike the monkey king), aren't more common as a way to have your OP char and have drama for your protagonist too. Having the OP character as a force of nature in the story while increasingly focusing on the little people works well in series like One Punch Man and Overlord because you don't know if they will steamroll the villain in time to save the side characters you are invested in.
Gojo solves one of my main issues with Dragonball: how drastically the world would be if one or a few people held power exponentially stronger than everyone else combined trunks kinda covers this when goku dies of a heart attack in his timeline but the series never covers how important having goku and vegeta around really is because even when they die they still save the day like in the buu arc
trunks timeline is the one where Goku existing showed the world relyed on him too much as with him gone it couldnt do anything
The god of destruction sets up the idea that there was a balance and the saiyan race upset that balance with their ability to grow so fast, in a way earth only really lasted as long as it did thanks to Goku since in Universe 6 it had long since been destroyed already but that universe still functioned
@@sdbzfan1 its vaguely setup but never ececuted on
@@HexCypherrand you don’t know how to spell executed ……bruh if the way the world reacts to the characters is your problem with dragonball you’ve missed the point of dragonball
@@mookiestewart3776
1. Mocking someone for a slight misspelling (c is right next to x on a typical US keyboard, after all) is lazy and low.
2. So you’re saying no one should ever do any deep thinking about or expect much of anything from the connections between the world and the characters in a story? That’s a pretty sad take
There is the dragonball super super hero movie. Which goes over what if goku and vegeta werent there to protect the planet. Gohan and piccolo take over. I mean, its kinda straight forward
I would totally watch that Chimera Ant video holy shit. One of the (many, many, many) things that kills me about this arc is that in the end, all of Netero's "OP-ness" hardly did anything in the fight against Meruem. His power, his endless training, his patient dedication, all of these virtuous qualities make him earn Meruem's respect, but they don't even put a dent in him. No, the thing that enevtually gets the better of the Chimera Ants is them understimating the sheer scope of human malice. (Only to be then hit by the equally big scope of human kindness as Komugi chooses to die with Meruem.) It takes a lot of writing skill to create a species like the Chimera Ants and STILL pull off the "humans are the real monsters here" so poignantly
Personally the way I always put it with strong protagonists is that 'if the question isn't *if* they can win, make the question *how* they win'. By all means, soup your protag up with all the most hilariously powerful abilities you can fit on them, but make your scenarios introduce question marks to be answered within the conflict. Maybe your guy is Saitama or Dante and he's so strong that you just want to know what the slapstick is going to look like. Maybe your villain has a specific powerset that changes the rules of engagement like it's a Jojo stand battle. Maybe your character is at moral odds with the situation where their power level can easily clean house, like you have someone with a specific guaranteed one-hit-kill they actively want to avoid using at all costs because they're trying not to be a murderer anymore. Honestly, I think 'character who is good at things and looks cool doing it' is far from a dead concept, you just have to remember your fights are more than just the punches that get thrown.
or you habe a character that is having to be very bvery moral and hold back like superman, and can be challenged by his own morals
Misfit of Demon King Academy is pretty much that. Anos Voldigoad doesn't want to just mass slaughter his idiot descendants, or the equally misguided humans, seeing as he literally let himself "die" to end the war rather than just glassing every other civilization in the world.
The guy can kill Death, but he can't kill racism and political scheming. Not immediately, anyway.
@@FelisImpurrator Anos is mid.
@@Based_Gigachad_001 Nah, you're mid. Gottem
@@FelisImpurrator 😐
I love when opening songs play in the battle fights or in the series finale!
Yeah when the OP hits at just the right moment it’s magic
It's not the OP playing but one of my favorite anime moments is Aizen's reveal when he turns off Ichigo's ass-kicking music. That shit was *chefs kiss* magnifique.
@JustSomeSkin and it never plays again - it's always a remix without lyrics for the rest of the show. Ichigo had his ass kicked so hard he lost his Theme Song lmao
Huh, I never really thought about it but you're completely right. For all of the ability to dub Satoru Gojo has, he is ALWAYS denied the dubs he wants. And with the manga in the state it is right now, the dub he wants now more than any other is one he can't take for himself; It's up to everyone else instead. Strong writing!
My favourite has got to be Accelerator. He is figuratively and literally untouchable for most of his story, yet his power does nothing but alienate him from everyone else until he just accepts being the villain. He has all the power and none of the compasion of a protagonist, and the moment that changes, he becomes one.
A Chumba-Wumba reference was the last thing I was expecting. Well done!
Please explain...
@@Ramsey276one - Pop song from the 90s. It's called "Tubthumping". (I'd post a link, but UA-cam doesn't let me.)
@@d.b.4671 understandable
XD
In an era becoming increasingly saturated with power fantasy op mc’s, I think Gojo Satoru is an op character done right. From the first episode we meet him and every ep afterwards, he always shows up to save the day and can’t be fucked with.
We as the viewers become amazed just like the cursed spirits seeing his abilities. We feel as safe as his students when he’s on the scene. We learn his backstory and he’s a genuine prodigy. But even with all of that, he’s got his flaws. And those flaws end up having some pretty big effects in the long run. Even with all that power, he’s still human.
10:03
"He is never satisfied with being strong enough"
That sentence only reminds me of that scene of Zoro (I think) after Thriller Bark where the subtitles say: "I need to get stronger", while he's lifting a giant weight with his legs...
look when your endgame goal is to beat the guy who one shot you with the equivalent of a table knife, that's gonna make you push yourself.
You know this video really made me appreciate stories like the persona series
like Frieren, like Mob, Like One Punch Man
Having Power only solves some of the main characters issues, connections with others, the bonds you make along the journey we call life, thats what really matters, shonen teaches us all the time, my friends are my power yet all anyone cares about in those stories is can they beat the big bad. i think this is why I always flip between watching anime and reading because im looking for stories that are more than just fighting, if I want to fight I'll play a video game but characters are why I watch stories, I want to see people interact and grow not just beat the shit out of eachother like a fighting game
"Don't come to the adventurers' guild tomorrow" is crazy 😭
"don't come to the adventurer's guild tomorrow" BRUH. That's exactly the vibe but you didn't have to say it like that.
We can rebuild him... better... faster... With less callbacks to previous scenes in one or more seasons in that dude's anime!
23:00 "hey, dont come to the adventures guild tomorrow" made me fucking HOWL!!!
I'm glad you included the DnD level 20 post campaign anime that is Frieren
Essentially, if a character is too overpowered, they don’t have room for growth. That’s what made following Goku in Dragonball Z or Yusuke in YuYu Hakusho so enthralling. They had serious adversity to overcome, and you never knew if they would win. Characters like Gojo really remove the stakes in a story.
Well, Gojo would if he wasn’t also a bit of a fuckup
@@mothersbasement So true
@@mothersbasement Gojo's biggest issue for me was his personality. I know he's supposed to be kinda aloof and arrogant. But even if he does take things seriously or really care when it's important, I have met WAY too many people who act that way to actively choose to torture myself by watching it.
gojo as a character removes the stakes, but jjk as a story is written such that gojo doesnt even remove the stakes; simply the villains hope to circumvent gojo and still be able to murder everyone
Gojo does not remove stakes. He is bound by the laws and techs of other characters as well. He REALLY is he strongest and that defies the actions of everyone around him. Having him being so strong only shapes the themes of the story, he barely gets a win out of anything he is in
As a Chinese person who was fed Jttw stuff at like a really young age, thanks for mentioning Wukong lmao
I think Gojo is extremely similar in their solitary circumstances and extreme loneliness from having like absolutely no one else to relate to, except that he had Geto and somehow STILL lost him
I love stories that acknowledge the loneliness of an overpowered being, because it actually humanises them and gives us a reason to sympathize. They can beat everyone in a fight but what about other things, are they the best at making friends as well as enemies? What makes them unique makes them unable to find relatable people to grow close to
My favorite thing about Satoru Gojo is when he finally does get sealed, it's like the story itself punishes the cast for relying on him with many, many brutal deaths among the cast. It's a criticism of what happens when you get too reliant on Goku.
Please GOD make both a Chimera Ant video AND a second Eminence in Shadow video. Please need to know about how good this series is (and the show hasn't even gotten to the reverse isekai arc yet!)
The what
@@samt3412you heard me
My favorite Goku might actually be Archer (Gilgamesh) from Fate because it's basically what if Goku was the villain. It's especially interesting in Fate/Zero since you go in knowing he wins but not how the whole fight goes down.
Gil has a win button in the form a Ea that the only reason he loses is because he didnt pull it out at the start of the fight
Ah yes,the frieza.
I find Gil fun because you can't defeat him just through being 'stronger'. In the Fate route, he's defeated by two things. Firstly, unnecessarily using Ea when he could have easily defeated Saber without it. Without that, Saber wouldn't be able to surprise him with Avalon, meaning she'd never get a chance to use Excalibur. Secondly, Shirou giving up Avalon in order to help Saber also represents what Gil lacks, someone who he truly cares about. In reality, the fight isn't Saber vs Gilgamesh, it's Saber and Shirou vs Gil and Shirou and Saber vs Kotomine. Because of their bond, they are able to subvert Gil's strength, and end up winning.
In UBW, Gil's loss is also because of two main reasons. Firstly, UBW counters his treasury, as Shirou can outpace Gil's summoning. This also goes into another part of UBW, where the one person Shirou will always win against is himself, and Gil's treasury is just an inferior version of his own abilities. The other reason why Shirou wins is that while Gil has pride so great that even the darkest desires of humanity can't corrupt him, Shirou lacks any pride. Where Gil hoards countless weapons, Shirou creates those same weapons. As such, Shirou doesn't allow him to use Ea, which is also stated to be the one weapon he couldn't copy.
This is now a Frieren appreciation space
Bungo Stray Dogs has several ridiculously overpowered protagonists (and antagonists, and 'antagonist turned protagonists), but what keeps it fresh is that each of them have at least one fatal flaw.
Atsushi has one of the most powerful attack abilities, and it's nigh on impossible to truly kill him. But the constant abuse he went through as a child has left him with cripplingly low self-esteem and cripplingly high anxiety, both of which make it difficult for him to use his ability to its fullest extent. Also, he really doesn't want to kill people, and this makes his fights that much harder because he doesn't fight to kill (usually, there are a few exceptions). His kindness drives the story forward and has earned him some strong allies, but it limits his own strength.
Dazai has THE most useful non-attack ability in the entire series (ability nullification), and he's one of the greatest chessmasters too. But his ability is activated by touch (meaning he has to get up close to anything he's trying to nullify), and the fact that his ability is constantly on means he can't be affected by helpful abilities either. So if he gets stabbed, no magic healing for him. He actually got taken out of a good chunk of a story arc because he got shot in the gut and had to go through surgery and sit in a hospital for several days. Along with this, he is a sociopath who makes morally questionable choices, and is only on the side of good because his dead BFF told him to do good. He doesn't really care about most of the people he's saving, he just cares about living up to that ideal his dead BFF set out for him.
Akutagawa is one of those 'antagonist turned protagonist' characters, who was the Big Bad of the first season. His ability is horrifically dangerous and even now he is on par with Atsushi and defeats most of his enemies with ease. But his ability isn't being used to its full potential because it works better as a defense/support ability than an attack one, so it's like he's brute forcing his way through sword battles with a spoon. He's started to hit the limit of his ability, and he won't be able to progress much further unless he accepts that his ability is better used by enhancing someone else's ability. But he's stubborn and bloodthirsty and getting him to team up with anything is a monumental chore.
I could go on forever but the series (especially the manga and the light novels) is full of complex characters like this. Even the secondary characters are essay-worthy. (Fukuzawa, Chuuya, and Ango are THE most tragic characters in the entire series too, each for different reasons. I couldn't even pick just one here, all three of them have been through some shit.)
BSD probably has one of my favorite power systems in recent memory and you did a great job of putting why into words!
Getting sponsored by Eminence in Shadow... (and I guess, HiDive) Way to hit the top man, way to peak.
Incredible video as always. I think it’s best to give really OP characters solid, clear weaknesses. The biggest example of this is Superman, of course. Everyone knows that kryptonite is his main one, but there’s also magic, and the rarely used red sunlight.
D&D's high levels are kinda ruined purely by spellcasters being so ridiculously powerful at that point. A 20th level party of martial characters is much more reasonable than any 20th level wizards, or other spellcasting classes with access to the OP spells
Lvl 20 bards are just gods
You literally get a genie wish as a spell
-Wait, you get how many more wild shapes today?
@@appelofdoom8211*infinite magic clone wish factory
As someone who ran a mid level party into a 20th level wizard inside the body of a dragon, then his own body, and 2 back up clone bodies, the opness of wizards is a lot like their greatest strength.
It's on paper. 😂
30:03 You mentioned Gwenpool, you have my respect.
as with most things shonen, I think Soul Eater's take on the 'goku' is the most interesting.
Out of our central trio of meisters, Maka, the protagonist protagonist is... nothing THAT special power wise, while both Kid and Black Star slowly build up to a power level that makes literal menaces to the (madness of) order. Or well one of them. The other just sorta becomes Order.
And yet Maka is undeniably the core of the story, her friendship slash protective instincts with/for best enby Crona are the spine of what is, by far, the best shonen story every put to ink (IMO)
Now if only the author hadn't gotten bored and rushed the ending...
Now that you’ve spoken the idea into existence, I would KILL for like a 3 hour long video just discussing and dissecting chimera ant. I feel like I could talk about it until my head falls off.
I do love Gojo. He's a fun character, and I think it's really interesting watching all the ways fights have to be written around him. Like in season 1 where this was this veil whose only function was to keep him out. Or yeah, Shibuya (please no spoilers I'm anime only and an episode behind). Looking forward to the consequences of that
The problem with high level DND, is that WOTC doesn't make any content for it, in a game with actual high level content like PF2, it's pretty fun.
It also takes a different style of DMing than you can employ at lower and mid levels. While all DMs should be able to improv, you can get by with significantly less. Once players hit 7th level spells the DM has to be prepared for anything, or rather prepare to be entirely unprepared most of the time. At least in my opinion.
I def agree that for DnD WotC has provided essentially no resources to help high level campaigns. Which sucks, I love high level and when I was able to be a player(forever DM life) I was always looking forward to being able to use those awesome high level abilities I've been drooling over for literal years, only for most campaigns be set to end around level 12.
As another non-battle battle series OP protag, Blank from No Game No Life are still super entertaining, because while they predictably win every game - 'Blank doesn't lose' - the fun is in trying to figure out the secret clues to the game that let them do that, because it ALWAYS plays fair with the mystery and always sets the twists up beforehand. It's genuinely like reading a Sherlock Holmes novel that way... albeit a very, very silly and horny one.
yeah stuff like "oh yeah of course the living chess board has morale levels" is absolute peak & makes me all the sadder that WE STILL DON'T HAVE A SEASON 2 (I don't know where the anime season ended compared to the books)
please make that chimera ant video it'd go crazy
i think mob is probably my favorite of the overpowered protagonists out there because if you look at mob psycho 100 as a whole, its never mobs powers which save the day-its his kindness. and his willingness to extended kindness to literally anyone who needs it, be they evil spirit, megalomaniac, his friends, or himself, is his most important trait. hes just a good kid, and you want to see him succeed because of it.
Ninja Scroll introduced protag-kun Jubei as supremely cool and badass--and then immediately threw him up against the Devils of Kimon, who all outclass him. Only his wits, some help from love interest Kagero, and infighting within the villains' ranks allow him to succeed. Something its many imitators never seemed to understand.
Great point!
"Gradual win button" is an amazing descriptor. Nearly did a spit take on that.
A story that does the OP characters thing in a unique way is a manhwa called The Warrior Returns, where they pit multiple isekai 'heroes' who've each reached their own respective endgames against the protagonist who's also reached his isekai endgame (at least at the start) You probably won't see this, but I just wanted to mention this because it's a story that's so interesting but so not talked about lol
That seems interesting to read, might check it later.
That actually sounds like a sick premise ngl
The thing that I love about Anos Voldigoad is that he finds new ways to be OP.
Having a loving & supportive relationship with his parents means he's more OP than all those other protags who don't even have on screen families or engage in escapism by pretending they don't exist.
He's so OP in romance that he helps his best guy friend propose to one of the women in his harem using an ancient tradition that's touching and narratively symbolic because he's OP in being a bro and being a romantic.
He doesn't personally take part in or win every fight because he's OP at inspiring his friends.
It's always exciting to see what new ways he's going to break the system.
You Made My night better Jeff! Thanks you're awesome 😊😊😊😊😊😊😊
Ditto
Work was rough, it good to see a video like this after a day of grinding 🪓
I got so excited when you started to talk about jttw and sun wukong
If you are gonna have a character be stupid broken from the word go, you need to either a) give this character a bunch of problems she cant solve by punching (legend of korra) or b) give the show a more lighthearted, character driven tone (bofuri)
I was thinking of overpowered protagonists not discussed in the video or in any of the comments I read and now I'm wondering how Koro-sensei from Assassination Classroom would fit into this discussion. I guess maybe it might not exactly be fair or correct to call him a protagonist because even though he's part of the main cast he's also sort of the big enemy of the show. He does end up fighting an even stronger enemy, on the protagonist's side but always he's their target as well as their teacher. It also sort of is tangential to a story like Mob Psycho where ultimately Koro-sensei is trying to teach everyone how to live a fulfilling life and not go down the path he went down that lead him to be in the situation he's in. But instead of focusing on the pitfalls of being strong in the sense of power and nothing else, it's more like a wholistic well rounded strength. Or maybe it's more accurate to say a character like Mob was really strong in one thing and had a really hard time in everything else, while Koro-sensei originally had no morals and stunted emotions that was a master or could easily master pretty much any skill.
Really great video, loved that you gave so many different examples so the video remained interesting
I'm loving these videos that are focused on something other than one show recently. This one and the Shonen power systems video come to mind. I'd love to see more anime tropes broken down, it's a lot of fun to watch!
Funny, you talking about Jobless Reincarnation reminds me of Rimuru Tempest, who, although starting out with some really good skills, didn’t just start firing black lightning bolts of death: he had to earn all the cool magic and other skills he uses later on
the other he had in the cave he spawned in sure, but still earned the village he made as well
i mean, in the same way i earned breakfast by cooking it, i suppose. rimuru is stupidly op almost immediately, it is all just mildly more fun than the average isekai garbage that is out today.
26:40 - ohhhh, that is a TOP TIER PUN, and I am SO MAD i literally NEVER thought of that combination of heart and cardio before... Truly applause worthy pun there
Damn the HxH segment was so good, great video
The fun part about anime is knowing and not knowing. Twists get bigger and the "KO" scenes just get better because of the allure of "how are they gonna win this time" with that tiny, tiny, teeensy seed of doubt where you might think " are they still going to win?"
Also with Gojo hes got the superman complex. Superman is invincible so how do you take him out? You have to smarter than him. Thats why he"s got the best villians in the comics
An interesting trend I've seen in more and more isekai and fantasy anime is that it'll add a gimmick to nerf the protagonist; either reducing their levelling rate or outright not making them able to level, despite such nerfs they can still go toe-to-toe with whatever the plot throws in their general direction. The earliest example I can think of is Naofumi from Shield Hero Season 1 (his initial nerf being a shield isn't a weapon and he can't pick up other weapons, and because of political schemes he's a pariah and has to resort to buying slaves, although each subsequent season he has some nerf, curse, or level gimmick to deal with, he also more recently has to deal with Myn...Bitch earning her namesake; although, despite a shield not technically being a weapon, I've played enough Hades and watched enough Marvel movies to know a slab of solid metal is still a slab of solid metal, magic, divine, otherwise, or not). But more recent examples I can think of include:
- Makoto from Moonlit Fantasy
- Sunraku from Shangri La Frontier
- Luciel from The Great Cleric (his inability to level is revealed to be inadvertently of his own choice; he just got as many skills as possible before he learned what was making him unable to level-up)
- Myne from Ascendance of a Bookworm (she doesn't level per-say, but she is like 10-12 and sickly, her own magical mcguffin powers harm her, so I feel like that counts; she is basically a walking Chernobyl that can go nuclear with her emotions).
- On a similar note to Myne, Pastry (yes, that's his name; a lot of the characters are named after food but it's not entirely consistent so every so often it hits you like a truck, also apples are called "bonkas" and it's taken 100 percent seriously, it comes up fairly often) from Sweet Reincarnation (he's not sick, he's just 8 and most of his opponents are grown-ass men with swords)
I don't know what my point was with all this, I just think it's funny.
I'll just add that Myne isnt really overpowered in her settings.
Her immense magic power is treated like a nuclear reactor that everyone want to secure their city mana supply to not litterally freeze to death. She cant fight, she cant do physical labor, she doesnt have any common sense and got big trouble socializing.
The real overpowered one in ascendance of a bookworm is in fact Ferdinand who can do litterally everything
@@anonyme4881 yeah, the most op thing about her is that she lived in a learned society (and wasn't a mentally stunted [wo]man-child with no intellectual curiosity) so she has a baseline level of knowledge and points of reference that the people around her don't. which is sort of meant to be the original premise behind isekai (instead of the actual op bullshit). she also has to contend with the _issues_ of being a better-than-average mana battery and how coping with it without understanding it has only made it worse.
Elric of Melniboné did it earlier and better than all these chumps.
Oh heck yeah, my basement sense was tingling
Great video. I always enjoy your analytical commentary on my favorite entertainment medium. Thank you for what you do Sir.
Man was waiting for you to talk about this. 😂
What I find so interesting narratively as well is how Magical Girl Anime fit into this kind of protagonist genre. Theyre obviously not Shonen, thank the heavens but Usagi or Madoka are essentially all powerful gods of their respective verses. Especially Sailor Moon, as something that has a longer and more episodic runtime rather than Madoka Magica, its kind of interesting to see the same kind of escalation.
And Madoka is I think the most interesting kind of an OP protagonist because in order to become strong enough to reach her goal, she has to sacrifice the very person who made that wish to begin with.
I will never forgive gege for doing Gojo so dirty. Story and everything else be damned.
I like Plague's character analysis on Gon, and how Hunters tend to be more animalistic in their motivations the stronger they get, while the ants seem to be strong when they return to humanity. It's an interesting dichotomy that had to be explained to my idiot self, who was just clapping his hands at the funny punch-child punching. I wanted to share in case anyone wanted to think about HxH some more before Jeff releases his own video on the arc
OK, "Card-iectomy" is actually pretty good wordplay... cardiectomy is heart-excision, and also has "card" in it, so it can be read as either removing the "heart" from the "cards," or just removing the "cards"
The chimera ant arc is so beautifully haunting, and it will always stay with me.
Thank you for another great video!!
I always love your content. Its sooo good your anime knowledge may be unmatched.
I think it’d be hilarious if there was a legit Gwenpool Isekai anime, but Gwen immediately realized it was a Japanese adaptation of an American comic and that her comic knowledge would be near-useless since adaptations like Marvel Disk Wars, Future Avengers and the Blade, Wolverine, X-Men and Iron Man anime’s weren’t 1:1 with the source material
I'm surprised you didn't bring up the Slime isekai. Rimuru is another example of an op protagonist, however, due to the structure of the story of that anime, most of the time, that power is basically useless. Rimuru faces a lot of problems that he just can't solve with brute strength, and has to use his head and people skills to resolve those problems. Furthermore, when Rimuru reaches the super late game power levels, each fight feels a lot less like a fight, and more like an execution. Being so op that you can wipe out an entire army on your own is framed more as a tragedy than a triumph.
yeah forcing the OP character into a being a nation leader in a political setting is a really cool hook because yeah of course he was able to get a loyal set of followers & build a town but he's now the leader of a monster town in a world that still doesn't like monsters.
Always love your vids man
God when Geoff puts out a video essay it never fucking misses
The Kingdoms of Ruin and Ragna Crimson "Gokus" are pretty interesting in the current seasons.
Also the Misfit of Demon Academy is still a great Goku.
Love your content!
Interesting timing for this video. Relatively recently I watched(listened to) a couple other pretty lengthy video essays (detail diatribes) totaling close to 3 hours about Superman, basically boiling down to "Superman isn't supposed to be as boring and uninteresting as he's been made out to be int he past decade or so, his movies just need to be directed by someone who actually understands the types of obstacles that can challenge a character with OP powers." I also just finished an anime and was considering rewatching one where the protag was this OP character, leading me to think of the superman video essay, and now you've released this comprehensive guide of "how to have OP characters and retain storytelling credulity"