I have a sneaking suspicion that the original developer of this is Feelworld. Menus looking similar to FW568. And the display panel itself (or the film/coating on it) seems to resemble mid-2000s ATM screens that had that “privacy” layer or coating so that the ATM screen wouldn't be seen from sideways.
After watching the rest of the video, most likely it requires an adapter cable with a different pinout than the generic VGA to BNC breakout you're using here. Perhaps a cable designed for one of the aforementioned projectors would work...
@@yukisaitou5004 Yes indeed as I have a old Epson XGA projector from the mid-2000s (XGA = 1024 x 768 which is slighter better then 720p) and it supports component input (YPbPr) via the VGA input port. It indeed uses a special component RCA to VGA D-Sub DB15 cable that has a different pin-out then VGA cable and the projector can auto detect when a component signal is imputed via this special cable vs a standard VGA/SVGA signal via a standard VGA cable. The standard pinout for these component to VGA cables is as follows (For a HD-DB15 VGA connector): 1=Red, 2=Green, 3=Blue, 5, 6, 7, 8, & 10= Ground/Earth, 13=Horizontal sync, 14=Vertical sync, 4, 9, 11, 12, & 15=Not used. With VGA input it’s all the same as component except for pin 4, 11, 12, & 15 being ID bits (ID bit 2, 0, 1, & 3 (Data Clock), in that order), 5=Ground/earth, 6, 7, 8=R, G, & B shields, and 9=DDC +5v. YPbPr does not use the ID bits pins of VGA. A D-Sub DB15 to RCA component (YpBr) converter cable is about $3 on Monoprice right now (They also sell female to female adaptors too for use with standard 3 pair component cables). I believe the pin-outs for YpBr to D-sub15 are fairly standard across projector models of the pre-HDMI/DVI era) unless specified otherwise in the devices spec sheet.
These have been turning up recently, there's demand in industrial applications for replacement for old crts in aging cnc mechines I wonder if the low end frequency supports cga with an adapter as in multi sync
I have an LCD TV (Daenyx DN-153) that supports 15.7 KHz h-sync, which I use for CGA/TGA conversion. There may be others that support it, but that LCD TV, which I happened across at a thrift store, happens to support it. The Composite sucks ass, but it does CGA/TGA over VGA with a simple resistor-diode bridge adapter just fine. So if you happen across a DN-153, pick it up.
I wonder if any of these are small-batch enough to have either a socketed ROM or flash with exposed JTAG. That would open up the ability to reprogram them, improving the firmware.
When you Frankensteined all the coax connectors together, it's possible it might have been white if the signal was stronger, but all of them being connected might have loaded it too much to have a good sync still be detected.
As far as i know RGB (over bnc or rca) has an impedance or 75 ohms, meaning the monitor itself acts as if it had a 75ohm resistor between the red signal input and ground, blue and ground, and green and ground. Adrian connected all of the monitor inputs in parallel - the computer was outputting a signal suitable for a monitor with the impedance of 75ohms, but the monitor was loading it the same as if it had three 75ohm resistors in parallel - with an effective impedance of 25 ohms on one signal wire, thus the signal voltage dropped too low
I bought a very similar one. So cheap, but so many inputs! I've found it really useful. I guess it's meant for things like security cameras, but I've hooked mine up to all sorts of systems.
@29:47, your retro-tank may be outputting 3.3v TTL logic on the H & V sync outputs. Some RGB samplers, like the one in the Eyoyo may require the old standard 5v TTL logic levels on the H&V sync inputs. So, the Eyoyo may just be going into power save mode, but may still work on some modes as it may be an edge case, or a difference in sync polarity based on video mode can help or hinder video mode recognition. This would not be an issue with older VGA cards which have the 5V TTL sync levels. Either that, or it's just lousy improperly tested firmware.
@@fumthings We are at a point in time where it is not worth the effort. If you truly want a good universal monitor, it would take a designer which has experience with all these old modes and really knows what they are doing and has all the proper video simulator test generators which are designed to send every good and lemon mode you can imagine. Such a developed monitor would never become profitable just because of the engineering time and effort required to truly do a good job.
I once accidentally damaged a cheap (modern) LCD monitor by feeding a 15kHZ signal from an Apple IIgs into it through a DB15 converter meant for Macintosh computers. (some of these video standards have the same connectors, but drastically different pinouts/signals) I wonder if a similar thing happened to your monitor in this video during the testing process. The potential damage could explain the corrupted text, red only YPbPr, and the black screen behavior where the monitor acted like it was short-circuited.
I don’t believe 15 kHz hurts, but VGA is 31 kHz indeed. Most VGA has wide range support nowadays, from 15 to +70 kHz. From what i heard, TTL signals can really do damage, but i haven’t experienced this yet. I have a TTL button on my 1084 commodore CRT, which i believe needs to be turned on for my Amiga 500.
@@jengelenm The Amiga doesn't output TTL-level video. Examples of things that do output TTL are MDA, CGA and EGA video cards, and the BBC Micro and Acorn Electron.
@@jengelenm Depending on the circuitry, a sync too low could effectively act like DC and pass through low pass filters meant to filter sync signals. Poorly designed if that's the case, but possible.
Try using a 2012-2015 cheapo dell 17/19" 4:3 monitor for a while. They crash all the time, have to power cycle them, never known a monitor to crash before
My ultimate retro computer monitor is Medion E73009 (MD82688) - it is an 10.1" LCD TV, which has all possible inputs: RF (both analog, and DVB-T), VGA, HDMI, EuroSCART (with RGB), Component Video (Y, Pb, Pr), S-Video, and Composite Video.
I recently (a month ago) bought one of these through Amazon - and the screen was bad right out of the box (I didn't even bother doing a plastic peel). So I got to do a return but did want to give them another chance and selected to replace it. The second unit was good - I use it for a backup camera screen on my car. Yes, mine was advertised as 'TFT LCD'. The OSD is wonky, as you discovered. And I went through the same aspect ratio failings that you did, but since this will be single-use (through the BNC connector) at least for the short-term it doesn't worry me either.
For these things, you don't expect perfection. For your own particular setup, they're good or they're not. Experience tells me to keep finding old, especially portable TVs from around 12 years ago by companies like Toshiba, Technika or LG. They're not discovered yet, Goodwill and other charity shops pack old screens to the roof and an especially good find can see your Commodore or Laserdisc really look like it's on a superb monitor native to the resolution. I even found an LG television at the roadside the other year and even the VGA was good and crisp, and that's usually a weakest point for a telly.
Dell UltraSharp 2405FPW. You can still find them for a couple hundred or less. DVI up to 1920x1200, VGA that does support 15 kHz RGB, Component from 240p/480i up to 720p/1080i, s-video and composite that handles 240p properly. It was Dell’s first widescreen monitor and they went all out on the video processing. Excellent handling of analog signals. Oh, and the stand rotates so you can play tate games on it.
To solve the connector issues, you could use the monitor upside down and then use the built in rotate function - then the leads are coming out the top. Just a suggestion.
I’ve seen power adapters like that from Chinese sellers where the 240V prongs and the small black plastic shape at their base pull off to reveal a US 120V plug underneath
I know the type you are talking about, it's a little adapter on the end, I had one like that from China too but this one seems like it's a solid plastic PSU and doesn't have the US plug on it.
Being able to be powered by USB-C is quite handy though, especially if you're using it as a portable unit. Just bring a USB power bank, and jack into whatever.
i love that you write on your wall warts in big white letters what their volts and amps are, which is perfect for getting this info at a glance with middle-aged eyes. i've done that with ALL of mine, and then boxed them according to voltage. this saves me so much grief.
For the Application you want I would recommend building one. Research on a LCD Panel and then from there toss in a LVDS converter and all of the format modules. From my experience working with anything smaller then 10 - 13 inch is useless. I built one using a old Laptop LCD, LVDS converter and with HDMI Adapters to change the video format. I also have one of those Arcade RGB to VGA adapter boards for repairing Arcade Machines.
The component input definitely should sync on the green cable. The firmware is really buggy IMHO. The sync on red is probably why sync on green RGB isn't working either, maybe even the flakey VGA with the retrotank? Back in early 2000s I used a PC connected to a high end Toshiba CRT TV via a home made cable using component output on an early (ATI) Radeon card via the VGA port.
The Brightness drop isn't from the LCD it's from the light spreder used in the defuse stack for the backlite. I've run into this a few times and when taking them apart the raw defuser does the dimming at angles. Note if you try this to see if it's the defuser it will be brighter without the lcd in the way but will still dim out some at angles.
This monitor seems to be using those V56 LCD controllers that are sold on Aliexpress, and the board does have a component input. It's probably hidden under the monitor case.
Yep.Exactly what i thought. Thata an universal LVDS controller which are really good for reusing old laptop screens, by uploading the right firmware thru the USB port. I have two of those, so im curious about the lcd panel itself..would be nice to know the model number of it.
Remember those old iPad screens you got a couple of mailcall video's ago? You could have built one of these yourself. Those are 4:3 as well. I'm in the process of building one myself, currently designing a case to be 3d printed.
If someone sold a case to hold the LCD and controller, that would be amazing. Something with a little stand. I gave away those iPads so unfortunately don't have them anymore.
I have a couple of OLPC XO tablets, I've wanted to fond a way to repurpose them as screens (since I can't find a way flash it with a stripped-down, newer Android image)
I remember seeing those controller boards to reuse old laptop panels, they had for ipads too, and with a case However I'm not sure what keyboard to throw into AliExpress to find them again, since stuff like "iPad display controller" or "iPad to HDMI" didn't give the wanted results.
yeah, these screens are all based on this controller that you can find on banggood or aliexpress. If you have an old laptop panel you can use one of these to make a comparable or even better panel than that monitor.
33:42: There's an article online that's titled "Apple II and RGB Video" by Joel Buckley (from 11/7/2002) that describes the Apple IIgs as having sync on each of R, G, and B. Your Apple IIc appears to be built the same way. I don't really know why the sync was only picked up when you connected the Red component. One might speculate that maybe R could be a weaker signal here and less likely to interfere with or overwhelm the sync, but that's just me spitballing.
As far as i know RGB inputs on monitors (rca/bnc) have an impedance of 75ohms, and running a single signal into three monitor inputs at once loaded it to 25ohms, like three 75ohm resistors wired in parallel, dropping the voltage significantly
There are plenty of YPbPr to HD15 (VGA-style) component cables. There are so many, in fact, that I see them at thrift stores almost every time I look. Mojo price sells them too. Of course, you can use any VGA to 5BNC cable for YPbPr with some BNC to RCA adapters on the R, G, and B lines (ignore the H-sync and V-sync lines).
I bought one of these a few years ago, and at unboxing one of the pixels had physically melted a tiny hole in the screen. I use it for throwing a monitor on stuff that doesn't live near my other PCs, like the NAS in the basement. The OSD still baffles me every time.
That sony bluray player caught my eye, it appears to have a navigation screen very similar to the PS3. Just a thought but maybe you'd do a quick 2nd channel video on that?
It should be easy to find as it's in the description, but it seems he didn't use any video tags? BTW: When I google for Eyoyo EM08C UA-cam, this video is the first result.
I have the 14" 1024x768 version. Similar or worse view angles, and a glossy surface. IT handles composite well and has the same menus tructure. I haven't tried DOS modes yet but I expect it's the same as your 8" monitor.
It's possible that the VGA to BNC cable has some kind of monitor detect wiring inside it that advertises RGB. No clue why it would want sync on red, though. Another commenter suggested that the component inputs were simply not brought out to plugs on the back. That seems much more likely but still doesn't explain sync on red.
You might be interested in one of those retina iPad LCD controllers. I think that (with a retrotink) would be the perfect combination. 3D print whatever kind of case you want.
I saw one in use recently -- it looked very nice. The problem is the lack of case and all that -- I liked the idea of something all self-contained like this and not fragile.
@@adriansdigitalbasement2 You could also buy a pre-made case for the iPad LCD from Laser Bear Industries. RetroRGB recently did a stream where they put one together.
@@adriansdigitalbasement2 I recently tried two different controllers for iPad2 LCDs and both were terrible. Both had trouble syncing. One had severe artifacting when displaying VGA resolutions and the other couldn't display them without terrible overscan and wonky colours. Maybe they were just broken? Ymmv but the other annoying thing was that the OSD of *both* controllers displayed the resolution in a little box in the corner every time the resolution changed with no way of turning the feature off.
I have been using a no-name 10.1 inch monitor that was sold as a security camera monitor on my bench for a couple of years. It is great because it lets me test a variety of computers without taking up much space. My bench is really small.
I bought one of these to go with my ttl vga project, but it doesn't handle a 640x480 vga signal properly. The Image and the OSD comes out weird with strange horizontal lines (I get that from PC's output as well as my own vga circuit). Works fine at higher resolutions.
An interesting test would be the 15kHz RGB output in the various modes of Atari ST and Amiga.... but this would be stuff for another video I guess.... But thanks a lot for this one!
22:00: The actual pixel resolution (sans overscan) for VGA 9x16 chars in 80x25 text mode should be *720x400* (and do ignore the lies on Wikipedia). Alternatively, the highest standard VGA (non-SVGA) graphics resolution would be the 640x480 like you mentioned, but "720x480" isn't really a thing.
I was looking for a 1280x1024 LCD monitor that had HDMI, S-Video and VGA inputs - with the ability to read PAL and NTSC and a 15kHz signal. I ended up getting a Tyco American Dynamics 17" Multiple Input Monitor (ADLCD17MB) and I am very happy with it. It works very well with a Commodore Amiga using an Amiga RGB to S-Video/VGA adapter. I recommend this monitor if you don't want something as small as the one in this video and don't mind the 4:3 ratio.
I've used various sizes of Eyoyo (and similar brands) for mini arcades and other such projects. The ONE feature that I'd love to see is to be able to adjust overscan. My current retro project is taking a 9" B&W tv and replacing the CRT, adding a Raspberry P 4B+, so I can make a stand-alone game system (with Bluetooth game pads).
For my retro computing / gaming, I got a used Dell 2007FP monitor on eBay which is 4:3, has Composite/VGA/DVI-D/S-Video, and a small sound bar. It's old, CCFL, and TN, but it honestly looks pretty good and scales lower resolutions well. For RGB inputs, I built a couple GBSControl units with SCART connectors. They are amazing.
Few months ago I bought a similar monitor from AliExpress, only with a 9.7" screen. It actually had a proper IPS screen with good viewing angles unlike the one you are reviewing. Unfortunately, it does not work well with my PAL Atari 800XE hooked over RetroScaler 2x. It shows the picture and looks nice but apparently it always runs at 60 Hz so anything that should scroll smoothly is jerky. I ended up selling it to a friend who will use it with a Raspberry Pi.
tons of PS1 lasers are dying, you need to swap it with a new laser, or opt out with the xstation, but that one is more tricky to install since it requires soldering.
I bought this screen and it's perfect, works for my ZX spectrum 48/128, VIC20/C64, VGA PC, Amiga, Raspberry Pi and old game consoles. Retro computers' images ,converted to composite are crisp and clear. I also use an early 40 inches LCD 720p TV still with RCA AV in/out , EU Peritel, UHF-VHF tuner, HDMI, auto 4:3/16:9 ratios and multistandards (PAL, SECAM, MESECAM, NTSC), meaning I can connect nearly anything on this, retro computers, retro consoles, VCR, ... I'll be very sad when it'll die but it's already nearly 20 years old and still works fine, except for the remote controller.
This looks like the type of monitor I've installed in MANY big rigs (semi trucks, 18 wheelers, or lorries for you people across the pond). Great for backup or blind spot cameras.
I suggest changing the flip so you can use the monitor upside down that would solve all your input problems, but off angle might be worse that direction!
I have one of the first Acer widescreen LCDs. Still works like a charm. Was before most anything at all was in widescreen. Had to force resolutions then in games to match. Lol. I don't use it anymore of course last 15 years or more, but it still works fine. I now have a 49" Ultra wide curved. THAT is fantastic.
Usually, in devices like this, YPbPr is done through an adapter plugged into the VGA port; I'm guessing they're using a non-standard pinout though. -- As for the contractors, maybe look into getting some right angle adapters.
I knew right away that was not an IPS panel seeing the viewing angle in the manual. They do seem to have an IPS version on Aliexpress (170° viewing angle) but either the wrong one was ordered.. or they sent the wrong product; probably the latter. I would've raised a complaint!
I had to look up the title at 22:14 because I didn't know how to spell "Galencia" and now I'm headed down the rabbit hole of new C64 productions: galencia.itch.io/galencia
bdwilcox says: "Hey kids. I was just a tech wannabe who couldn't solder to save his life. But now that I've been eating my delicious and nutritious Daisy Sour Cream, my solders would make even Adrian Black jealous. So eat nutritious Daisy Sour Cream, full of vitamin A and calcium for strong teeth and bones. Now sold in the dairy/deli section of your favorite grocers."
A lot of older Sharp LCD's required you to have all of the YPbPr connectors terminated in the dual AV/Component jacks in order for the video processing to trigger.
Those old HP PA-RISC boxes used sync-on-green, too. I remember it being a real PITA finding a monitor that would work with one, back in the early 2000s.
I bought one similar to this with all the same options, and the same dodgy viewing angle. I used it for my ZX Spectrum Laptop I built. LOL. It does a perfect job.
we used the 12" version of one of these to replace a 13" CRT that went to air in an arcade machine combined with one of those GBS RGB>VGA converters, worked pretty well actually
Adrian, you are such a great source of information. i just had a thought, would it be possible to blog or archive the transcripts of your videos to make a searchable reference source for faults and issues dealt with. would anyone find that useful?
Bought my TV as it had component. Went to connect my original Xbox and heart sank as no connector. Relieved as manual said "YPrPb via VGA". Found out VGA to Red Green Blue phono adapters are a thing. Worked fine with audio through Red White of composite. I'm dumb so just do what I'm told. Plug in what fits without understanding 😂
The tech specs miss out the response time, cd/m2 and Hz frequency. I believe this is 12ms response time, 60hz, 250cd. Eyoyo also sell a 10.4", 4:3 screen. It has 800 x 600 max res, 75hz, 6ms response time and 350cd
I noticed when you connected the monitor through the HDMI-VGA adapter that the lights on the RetroTink flashed. That makes me suspicious of two possibilities: one, maybe the adapter is trying to power itself from the VGA port and the monitor isn't able to supply enough power, or two, the monitor's EDID might be confusing the adapter and/or the RetroTink. You need a DA or something like that to isolate the power/EDID from the video format part of the test.
These mini monitors like this are all over the place and the prices vary greatly depending who you buy from. Like you said, useful for testing but not much else.
on the playstation -- if the player plays upside-down, just open the unit and turn the metal slider rod in the assembly a bit, it'll continue working again for a long time. don't forget to lube.
This monitor would be better if its BIOS accepted also 15 Khz as vertical frequency. Here in Brazil the M1721A LG LCD monitors are loved by the retro community because we can use RGB in VGA @ 15 Khz, the image as its best. IT is 4:3 too, has also composite, S-Video and RF (using an add on), audio and runs smoothly with european computers. A must have for everyone (and I have 4 of them).
Yeahhhh... if that thing shipped directly from PRoC (versus, say, Taiwan), you are going to want to examine or replace the external AC adapter. Some of the adapters I've gotten directly from China, on cheap / no-name products, have had truly dangerous gaps in fault protection when I pulled them apart and looked inside.
We had 21" and 23" crt's at work back in the day, so propably lcd's in the same size were avaliable too? The crt's were REALLY long though, took the whole desk from wall to edge of desk. Had to extend the desk on the back to fit a keyboard in front. Was rediculous really.
![Adrian's Digital Basement ][](http://yt3.ggpht.com/ytc/AIdro_k7CrQRe71qN6c0Ua7A1P_I8KkxjqLa70u0zYeCvdvnKw=s48-c-k-c0x00ffffff-no-rj)
I have a sneaking suspicion that the original developer of this is Feelworld. Menus looking similar to FW568. And the display panel itself (or the film/coating on it) seems to resemble mid-2000s ATM screens that had that “privacy” layer or coating so that the ATM screen wouldn't be seen from sideways.
If composite looks that good with chroma on, it must have a damn good comb filter in the demodulator.
Try it on the Ti99.
You're probably right about Y/Pb/Pr being through the VGA port, that was a common thing on projectors before HDMI became ubiquitous.
After watching the rest of the video, most likely it requires an adapter cable with a different pinout than the generic VGA to BNC breakout you're using here. Perhaps a cable designed for one of the aforementioned projectors would work...
@@yukisaitou5004 Yes indeed as I have a old Epson XGA projector from the mid-2000s (XGA = 1024 x 768 which is slighter better then 720p) and it supports component input (YPbPr) via the VGA input port. It indeed uses a special component RCA to VGA D-Sub DB15 cable that has a different pin-out then VGA cable and the projector can auto detect when a component signal is imputed via this special cable vs a standard VGA/SVGA signal via a standard VGA cable. The standard pinout for these component to VGA cables is as follows (For a HD-DB15 VGA connector): 1=Red, 2=Green, 3=Blue, 5, 6, 7, 8, & 10= Ground/Earth, 13=Horizontal sync, 14=Vertical sync, 4, 9, 11, 12, & 15=Not used. With VGA input it’s all the same as component except for pin 4, 11, 12, & 15 being ID bits (ID bit 2, 0, 1, & 3 (Data Clock), in that order), 5=Ground/earth, 6, 7, 8=R, G, & B shields, and 9=DDC +5v. YPbPr does not use the ID bits pins of VGA. A D-Sub DB15 to RCA component (YpBr) converter cable is about $3 on Monoprice right now (They also sell female to female adaptors too for use with standard 3 pair component cables). I believe the pin-outs for YpBr to D-sub15 are fairly standard across projector models of the pre-HDMI/DVI era) unless specified otherwise in the devices spec sheet.
@@Charlesb88 great info.
These have been turning up recently, there's demand in industrial applications for replacement for old crts in aging cnc mechines I wonder if the low end frequency supports cga with an adapter as in multi sync
I have an LCD TV (Daenyx DN-153) that supports 15.7 KHz h-sync, which I use for CGA/TGA conversion. There may be others that support it, but that LCD TV, which I happened across at a thrift store, happens to support it. The Composite sucks ass, but it does CGA/TGA over VGA with a simple resistor-diode bridge adapter just fine. So if you happen across a DN-153, pick it up.
I wonder if any of these are small-batch enough to have either a socketed ROM or flash with exposed JTAG. That would open up the ability to reprogram them, improving the firmware.
need Honda connector for CNC, also vibration proof is a critical thing.
When you Frankensteined all the coax connectors together, it's possible it might have been white if the signal was stronger, but all of them being connected might have loaded it too much to have a good sync still be detected.
With three hooked together like that, the sync signal would be cut to 1/3. I think he would need to have an active input mixer.
As far as i know RGB (over bnc or rca) has an impedance or 75 ohms, meaning the monitor itself acts as if it had a 75ohm resistor between the red signal input and ground, blue and ground, and green and ground. Adrian connected all of the monitor inputs in parallel - the computer was outputting a signal suitable for a monitor with the impedance of 75ohms, but the monitor was loading it the same as if it had three 75ohm resistors in parallel - with an effective impedance of 25 ohms on one signal wire, thus the signal voltage dropped too low
15:36 I bet you need ypbpr to vga cable. I had one for an ancient LCD TV years ago.
Looks like it could be a good fit for the MiSTer.
I bought a very similar one. So cheap, but so many inputs! I've found it really useful. I guess it's meant for things like security cameras, but I've hooked mine up to all sorts of systems.
These vga to bnc component cables were used for crts with rgb component input, iiyama made them. Component for video is different.
@29:47, your retro-tank may be outputting 3.3v TTL logic on the H & V sync outputs. Some RGB samplers, like the one in the Eyoyo may require the old standard 5v TTL logic levels on the H&V sync inputs. So, the Eyoyo may just be going into power save mode, but may still work on some modes as it may be an edge case, or a difference in sync polarity based on video mode can help or hinder video mode recognition. This would not be an issue with older VGA cards which have the 5V TTL sync levels. Either that, or it's just lousy improperly tested firmware.
would a 3.3v to 5v level shifter adaptor help with this maybe?
@@fumthings We are at a point in time where it is not worth the effort. If you truly want a good universal monitor, it would take a designer which has experience with all these old modes and really knows what they are doing and has all the proper video simulator test generators which are designed to send every good and lemon mode you can imagine. Such a developed monitor would never become profitable just because of the engineering time and effort required to truly do a good job.
I once accidentally damaged a cheap (modern) LCD monitor by feeding a 15kHZ signal from an Apple IIgs into it through a DB15 converter meant for Macintosh computers. (some of these video standards have the same connectors, but drastically different pinouts/signals) I wonder if a similar thing happened to your monitor in this video during the testing process. The potential damage could explain the corrupted text, red only YPbPr, and the black screen behavior where the monitor acted like it was short-circuited.
Had an old Syncmaster that died similarly, it kept corrupting the EEPROM and regularly had to be reflashed to even turn on.
I don’t believe 15 kHz hurts, but VGA is 31 kHz indeed. Most VGA has wide range support nowadays, from 15 to +70 kHz. From what i heard, TTL signals can really do damage, but i haven’t experienced this yet. I have a TTL button on my 1084 commodore CRT, which i believe needs to be turned on for my Amiga 500.
@@jengelenm The Amiga doesn't output TTL-level video. Examples of things that do output TTL are MDA, CGA and EGA video cards, and the BBC Micro and Acorn Electron.
@@jengelenm Depending on the circuitry, a sync too low could effectively act like DC and pass through low pass filters meant to filter sync signals. Poorly designed if that's the case, but possible.
@@Zeem4 I think the Amiga does both digital TTL and analog RGB.
I gotta say... I've never seen a OSD crash before.
Try using a 2012-2015 cheapo dell 17/19" 4:3 monitor for a while. They crash all the time, have to power cycle them, never known a monitor to crash before
My ultimate retro computer monitor is Medion E73009 (MD82688) - it is an 10.1" LCD TV, which has all possible inputs: RF (both analog, and DVB-T), VGA, HDMI, EuroSCART (with RGB), Component Video (Y, Pb, Pr), S-Video, and Composite Video.
I recently (a month ago) bought one of these through Amazon - and the screen was bad right out of the box (I didn't even bother doing a plastic peel). So I got to do a return but did want to give them another chance and selected to replace it. The second unit was good - I use it for a backup camera screen on my car.
Yes, mine was advertised as 'TFT LCD'. The OSD is wonky, as you discovered. And I went through the same aspect ratio failings that you did, but since this will be single-use (through the BNC connector) at least for the short-term it doesn't worry me either.
For these things, you don't expect perfection. For your own particular setup, they're good or they're not. Experience tells me to keep finding old, especially portable TVs from around 12 years ago by companies like Toshiba, Technika or LG. They're not discovered yet, Goodwill and other charity shops pack old screens to the roof and an especially good find can see your Commodore or Laserdisc really look like it's on a superb monitor native to the resolution.
I even found an LG television at the roadside the other year and even the VGA was good and crisp, and that's usually a weakest point for a telly.
Dell UltraSharp 2405FPW. You can still find them for a couple hundred or less. DVI up to 1920x1200, VGA that does support 15 kHz RGB, Component from 240p/480i up to 720p/1080i, s-video and composite that handles 240p properly. It was Dell’s first widescreen monitor and they went all out on the video processing. Excellent handling of analog signals. Oh, and the stand rotates so you can play tate games on it.
In Asia, there is no model you mentioned. It's terrible.
Youd probably need a monoprice VGA > Component cable. with the RGB lines on the DB15 being Y Pb and Pr respectively.
To solve the connector issues, you could use the monitor upside down and then use the built in rotate function - then the leads are coming out the top. Just a suggestion.
The VGA port is used for ypbr
I’ve seen power adapters like that from Chinese sellers where the 240V prongs and the small black plastic shape at their base pull off to reveal a US 120V plug underneath
I know the type you are talking about, it's a little adapter on the end, I had one like that from China too but this one seems like it's a solid plastic PSU and doesn't have the US plug on it.
Being able to be powered by USB-C is quite handy though, especially if you're using it as a portable unit. Just bring a USB power bank, and jack into whatever.
i love that you write on your wall warts in big white letters what their volts and amps are, which is perfect for getting this info at a glance with middle-aged eyes. i've done that with ALL of mine, and then boxed them according to voltage. this saves me so much grief.
What a good idea! I will adopt it too.
@@BertGrink also put them in individual sandwich bags to keep their cords from all getting tangled together
@@gusmueller4413 Oh I just wrap the cord around the wallwart and tie the end around the coil
Old MacDonald had a screen, Eyoyo Eyoyo!
For the Application you want I would recommend building one. Research on a LCD Panel and then from there toss in a LVDS converter and all of the format modules. From my experience working with anything smaller then 10 - 13 inch is useless.
I built one using a old Laptop LCD, LVDS converter and with HDMI Adapters to change the video format. I also have one of those Arcade RGB to VGA adapter boards for repairing Arcade Machines.
The component input definitely should sync on the green cable. The firmware is really buggy IMHO. The sync on red is probably why sync on green RGB isn't working either, maybe even the flakey VGA with the retrotank?
Back in early 2000s I used a PC connected to a high end Toshiba CRT TV via a home made cable using component output on an early (ATI) Radeon card via the VGA port.
The Brightness drop isn't from the LCD it's from the light spreder used in the defuse stack for the backlite. I've run into this a few times and when taking them apart the raw defuser does the dimming at angles. Note if you try this to see if it's the defuser it will be brighter without the lcd in the way but will still dim out some at angles.
This monitor seems to be using those V56 LCD controllers that are sold on Aliexpress, and the board does have a component input. It's probably hidden under the monitor case.
Yep.Exactly what i thought. Thata an universal LVDS controller which are really good for reusing old laptop screens, by uploading the right firmware thru the USB port. I have two of those, so im curious about the lcd panel itself..would be nice to know the model number of it.
Remember those old iPad screens you got a couple of mailcall video's ago? You could have built one of these yourself. Those are 4:3 as well. I'm in the process of building one myself, currently designing a case to be 3d printed.
If someone sold a case to hold the LCD and controller, that would be amazing. Something with a little stand. I gave away those iPads so unfortunately don't have them anymore.
I have a couple of OLPC XO tablets, I've wanted to fond a way to repurpose them as screens (since I can't find a way flash it with a stripped-down, newer Android image)
I remember seeing those controller boards to reuse old laptop panels, they had for ipads too, and with a case
However I'm not sure what keyboard to throw into AliExpress to find them again, since stuff like "iPad display controller" or "iPad to HDMI" didn't give the wanted results.
yeah, these screens are all based on this controller that you can find on banggood or aliexpress.
If you have an old laptop panel you can use one of these to make a comparable or even better panel than that monitor.
It's funny how this controller costs now twice the price I had paid 2 years ago.
33:42: There's an article online that's titled "Apple II and RGB Video" by Joel Buckley (from 11/7/2002) that describes the Apple IIgs as having sync on each of R, G, and B. Your Apple IIc appears to be built the same way. I don't really know why the sync was only picked up when you connected the Red component. One might speculate that maybe R could be a weaker signal here and less likely to interfere with or overwhelm the sync, but that's just me spitballing.
Love messing around with new tech for old things. Very useful.
As far as i know RGB inputs on monitors (rca/bnc) have an impedance of 75ohms, and running a single signal into three monitor inputs at once loaded it to 25ohms, like three 75ohm resistors wired in parallel, dropping the voltage significantly
Well, perhaps that's the clue...
Component in via vga
There are plenty of YPbPr to HD15 (VGA-style) component cables. There are so many, in fact, that I see them at thrift stores almost every time I look. Mojo price sells them too. Of course, you can use any VGA to 5BNC cable for YPbPr with some BNC to RCA adapters on the R, G, and B lines (ignore the H-sync and V-sync lines).
YPbPr input via a VGA port is pretty common on projectors, though they usually come with an adapter. Not all the adapters are the same, though.
OMG, now I want to see more random tiny Chinese monitors tested. I would love to have a small display with sync-on-green for my bench.
There's a schematic for a simple SoG to RGBHV converter on raphnet, shouldn't cost more than a few dollars to build.
Keep an eye out for nec multisync 18" lcd monitors. Quite a few support SoG. The 18" one is not much bigger than this one, though theyre vga only.
I bought one of these a few years ago, and at unboxing one of the pixels had physically melted a tiny hole in the screen. I use it for throwing a monitor on stuff that doesn't live near my other PCs, like the NAS in the basement. The OSD still baffles me every time.
You can make a sync on green converter btw, You can find it on Cameron gray's video about the Next Pizza box at about 18 minutes in.
That sony bluray player caught my eye, it appears to have a navigation screen very similar to the PS3. Just a thought but maybe you'd do a quick 2nd channel video on that?
Sony's XMB was a standard part of their design language for a while back then, I think. They abandoned it after a while.
I'd put the name of the product into the title so people looking for reviews can find it
It should be easy to find as it's in the description, but it seems he didn't use any video tags?
BTW: When I google for Eyoyo EM08C UA-cam, this video is the first result.
but then where would you put the click bait?
I have the 14" 1024x768 version. Similar or worse view angles, and a glossy surface. IT handles composite well and has the same menus tructure. I haven't tried DOS modes yet but I expect it's the same as your 8" monitor.
Yeah just wish it handed non interlaced composite video properly. I've had a few other people report the 14" and 10" models are good
With all those mounting options, it looks like and interesting platform to make a DIY teleprompter.
It's possible that the VGA to BNC cable has some kind of monitor detect wiring inside it that advertises RGB. No clue why it would want sync on red, though.
Another commenter suggested that the component inputs were simply not brought out to plugs on the back. That seems much more likely but still doesn't explain sync on red.
You might be interested in one of those retina iPad LCD controllers. I think that (with a retrotink) would be the perfect combination. 3D print whatever kind of case you want.
I saw one in use recently -- it looked very nice. The problem is the lack of case and all that -- I liked the idea of something all self-contained like this and not fragile.
@@adriansdigitalbasement2 You could also buy a pre-made case for the iPad LCD from Laser Bear Industries. RetroRGB recently did a stream where they put one together.
@@adriansdigitalbasement2 I recently tried two different controllers for iPad2 LCDs and both were terrible. Both had trouble syncing. One had severe artifacting when displaying VGA resolutions and the other couldn't display them without terrible overscan and wonky colours. Maybe they were just broken? Ymmv but the other annoying thing was that the OSD of *both* controllers displayed the resolution in a little box in the corner every time the resolution changed with no way of turning the feature off.
I have been using a no-name 10.1 inch monitor that was sold as a security camera monitor on my bench for a couple of years. It is great because it lets me test a variety of computers without taking up much space. My bench is really small.
I bought one of these to go with my ttl vga project, but it doesn't handle a 640x480 vga signal properly. The Image and the OSD comes out weird with strange horizontal lines (I get that from PC's output as well as my own vga circuit). Works fine at higher resolutions.
Hello James Sharman!
@@ducksonplays4190 Hello There
FYI: This OSD looks like pretty standard Realtek RTD2660/2662 controller firmware.
yep ! so should be easy to reflash or patch
An interesting test would be the 15kHz RGB output in the various modes of Atari ST and Amiga.... but this would be stuff for another video I guess.... But thanks a lot for this one!
I've heard that this brand had its ups and downs. 😉
I heard the products could be ordered but only with strings attached
@@sprint955st But luckily, they ship Around the World
While walking the dog? Cool
Y'all are a bunch of yoyos
Bought several Eyoyo monitors in the past for my retro projects and they are great for the money
22:00: The actual pixel resolution (sans overscan) for VGA 9x16 chars in 80x25 text mode should be *720x400* (and do ignore the lies on Wikipedia).
Alternatively, the highest standard VGA (non-SVGA) graphics resolution would be the 640x480 like you mentioned, but "720x480" isn't really a thing.
19:40 - The picture is stretched vertically. It's NOT ok!
I have one of these with only composite inputs. I was unimpressed, but kept it.
I was looking for a 1280x1024 LCD monitor that had HDMI, S-Video and VGA inputs - with the ability to read PAL and NTSC and a 15kHz signal. I ended up getting a Tyco American Dynamics 17" Multiple Input Monitor (ADLCD17MB) and I am very happy with it. It works very well with a Commodore Amiga using an Amiga RGB to S-Video/VGA adapter. I recommend this monitor if you don't want something as small as the one in this video and don't mind the 4:3 ratio.
from what i can see it looks pretty good to me for the price and features it has.
What is the model number of the Asus monitor? I am looking for a monitor that supports sync on green.
Seeing the post it note in front of the LCD is a hilarious size comparison.
For a stand, I vote for attaching it to the sour cream container permanently with the double sided adhesive.
I have one of these (from Amazon) and I love it. Have it on the wall behind my monitor. I used it with my Apple II for a bit too.
I've used various sizes of Eyoyo (and similar brands) for mini arcades and other such projects. The ONE feature that I'd love to see is to be able to adjust overscan. My current retro project is taking a 9" B&W tv and replacing the CRT, adding a Raspberry P 4B+, so I can make a stand-alone game system (with Bluetooth game pads).
For my retro computing / gaming, I got a used Dell 2007FP monitor on eBay which is 4:3, has Composite/VGA/DVI-D/S-Video, and a small sound bar. It's old, CCFL, and TN, but it honestly looks pretty good and scales lower resolutions well. For RGB inputs, I built a couple GBSControl units with SCART connectors. They are amazing.
The 2001FP is IPS and I thought all the 20" 1600x1200 displays were as well. Are you sure yours is TN?
@@eDoc2020 I'm not sure, it's a Dell 2007FPb. It does look better than most TN panels, but not entirely convinced it's IPS.
I have a 2007FPb and it's definitely IPS. Maybe the CCFL backlight is throwing you. It's doing N64 duty like a trooper. 240p over S-video works right.
Few months ago I bought a similar monitor from AliExpress, only with a 9.7" screen. It actually had a proper IPS screen with good viewing angles unlike the one you are reviewing. Unfortunately, it does not work well with my PAL Atari 800XE hooked over RetroScaler 2x. It shows the picture and looks nice but apparently it always runs at 60 Hz so anything that should scroll smoothly is jerky. I ended up selling it to a friend who will use it with a Raspberry Pi.
tons of PS1 lasers are dying, you need to swap it with a new laser, or opt out with the xstation, but that one is more tricky to install since it requires soldering.
15"-17" should be the ultimate retro lcd.
I bought this screen and it's perfect, works for my ZX spectrum 48/128, VIC20/C64, VGA PC, Amiga, Raspberry Pi and old game consoles.
Retro computers' images ,converted to composite are crisp and clear.
I also use an early 40 inches LCD 720p TV still with RCA AV in/out , EU Peritel, UHF-VHF tuner, HDMI, auto 4:3/16:9 ratios and multistandards (PAL, SECAM, MESECAM, NTSC), meaning I can connect nearly anything on this, retro computers, retro consoles, VCR, ... I'll be very sad when it'll die but it's already nearly 20 years old and still works fine, except for the remote controller.
This looks like the type of monitor I've installed in MANY big rigs (semi trucks, 18 wheelers, or lorries for you people across the pond). Great for backup or blind spot cameras.
Kinda glad it doesn't work with sync on green. The thought of somebody hooking an SGI up to one of these cheap 8" screens fills me with dread! :)
HAHAH!!!!!!
I suggest changing the flip so you can use the monitor upside down that would solve all your input problems, but off angle might be worse that direction!
I have one of the first Acer widescreen LCDs. Still works like a charm. Was before most anything at all was in widescreen. Had to force resolutions then in games to match. Lol. I don't use it anymore of course last 15 years or more, but it still works fine. I now have a 49" Ultra wide curved. THAT is fantastic.
Usually, in devices like this, YPbPr is done through an adapter plugged into the VGA port; I'm guessing they're using a non-standard pinout though. -- As for the contractors, maybe look into getting some right angle adapters.
I tore it down and used the LCD and control board in my “pet laptop” project. It is great. I got mine on Amazon.
I knew right away that was not an IPS panel seeing the viewing angle in the manual.
They do seem to have an IPS version on Aliexpress (170° viewing angle) but either the wrong one was ordered.. or they sent the wrong product; probably the latter. I would've raised a complaint!
I had to look up the title at 22:14 because I didn't know how to spell "Galencia" and now I'm headed down the rabbit hole of new C64 productions: galencia.itch.io/galencia
So to use this, don’t forget to order the Sour Cream as an option 😉. Thank you for making these videos!
Unfortunately the lack of fruit yoghurt compatibility is a real deal-breaker, for me 😏
bdwilcox says: "Hey kids. I was just a tech wannabe who couldn't solder to save his life. But now that I've been eating my delicious and nutritious Daisy Sour Cream, my solders would make even Adrian Black jealous. So eat nutritious Daisy Sour Cream, full of vitamin A and calcium for strong teeth and bones. Now sold in the dairy/deli section of your favorite grocers."
Tell 'em you want a dollop of daisy with that lcd!
A lot of older Sharp LCD's required you to have all of the YPbPr connectors terminated in the dual AV/Component jacks in order for the video processing to trigger.
Just got to the VGA section, damn that sucks =(
Those old HP PA-RISC boxes used sync-on-green, too. I remember it being a real PITA finding a monitor that would work with one, back in the early 2000s.
That brand also has an IPS model.
Looks very similar to the one I got for fitting into one of my Amstrad PPC640s :D
May I ask, were you inspired by Noel´s Retro Lab? 😁
@@BertGrink No actually, I'll have to look into that! I bought mine about 18 months ago I just never got round to doing it :P
use vga for the best text.you were wanting sinc on green comp, you got sinc on red rgb.
Have used projectors that use the vga port for RGB, component and analog HD video inputs to save money on ports and space
i wonder if it would do 15khz RGB? The PS1 and PS2 output that natively.
Someone follows Jotego on Twitter, haha.
I bought one similar to this with all the same options, and the same dodgy viewing angle. I used it for my ZX Spectrum Laptop I built. LOL. It does a perfect job.
we used the 12" version of one of these to replace a 13" CRT that went to air in an arcade machine combined with one of those GBS RGB>VGA converters, worked pretty well actually
Adrian, you are such a great source of information. i just had a thought, would it be possible to blog or archive the transcripts of your videos to make a searchable reference source for faults and issues dealt with. would anyone find that useful?
Bought my TV as it had component. Went to connect my original Xbox and heart sank as no connector. Relieved as manual said "YPrPb via VGA". Found out VGA to Red Green Blue phono adapters are a thing. Worked fine with audio through Red White of composite. I'm dumb so just do what I'm told. Plug in what fits without understanding 😂
The tech specs miss out the response time, cd/m2 and Hz frequency. I believe this is 12ms response time, 60hz, 250cd. Eyoyo also sell a 10.4", 4:3 screen. It has 800 x 600 max res, 75hz, 6ms response time and 350cd
I noticed when you connected the monitor through the HDMI-VGA adapter that the lights on the RetroTink flashed. That makes me suspicious of two possibilities: one, maybe the adapter is trying to power itself from the VGA port and the monitor isn't able to supply enough power, or two, the monitor's EDID might be confusing the adapter and/or the RetroTink. You need a DA or something like that to isolate the power/EDID from the video format part of the test.
I bet the YPbPr is either the VGA or the USB-C input.
There’s actually an ips version, 8” 4:3
the BNC connector might be meant for stuff like hospital equipment, or a digital microscope?
Man, you have the VESA mount holes right on the back of the LCD! But the monitor is a nice catch... Congrats!
The YPbPr might be over the VGA connector
These mini monitors like this are all over the place and the prices vary greatly depending who you buy from. Like you said, useful for testing but not much else.
on the playstation -- if the player plays upside-down, just open the unit and turn the metal slider rod in the assembly a bit, it'll continue working again for a long time. don't forget to lube.
The numbers are a match for the first-generation iPad mini display. Maybe the bad viewing angles are because of the matte cover glass.
These are great for little shoe-box and picture-frame-glass teleprompters.
This monitor would be better if its BIOS accepted also 15 Khz as vertical frequency.
Here in Brazil the M1721A LG LCD monitors are loved by the retro community because we can use RGB in VGA @ 15 Khz, the image as its best. IT is 4:3 too, has also composite, S-Video and RF (using an add on), audio and runs smoothly with european computers. A must have for everyone (and I have 4 of them).
Yeahhhh... if that thing shipped directly from PRoC (versus, say, Taiwan), you are going to want to examine or replace the external AC adapter. Some of the adapters I've gotten directly from China, on cheap / no-name products, have had truly dangerous gaps in fault protection when I pulled them apart and looked inside.
Some component inputs won't work without all 3 connected, my TV is like that..which is annoying
I wonder if running it in “YPbPr” with your tink in passthrough mode VGA would work like you wanted and wasn’t getting before…
The largest 4:3 LCD display I've ever seen was 21.3". Anyone know if they ever made them bigger than that? I don't think they did.
The biggest 4:3 LCD I have ever seen was 17"
Maybe in TVs?
We had 21" and 23" crt's at work back in the day, so propably lcd's in the same size were avaliable too? The crt's were REALLY long though, took the whole desk from wall to edge of desk. Had to extend the desk on the back to fit a keyboard in front. Was rediculous really.
@@Santor- Yeah, I know what you mean. I had one of those monsters too. A 21" Viewsonic CRT. It was massive.
@@BertGrink I've seen a lot of 19" (and still use some for server uses)
Thoses are screen for your shopping list where it show the total price.