Great episode. Joe is definitely more engaged here than most episodes. Questioning makes the episodes better but for whatever reason it felt like Joe was trying to disagree rather than question. This is coming from someone who isn’t very religious. Felt kinda bad for Meyer a few times but the guy isn’t phased a bit. Pure class. Great episode.
@@shefalichow7917Joe was asking tough questions but he is absolutely not the toughest guy he has had to deal with. Joe was asking lots of questions and really pushing the other side but he was respectful and not openly hostile like many people Stephen has debated in the past. I’ve heard Joe be way more hostile before, I he sounds genuinely curious here and is asking the questions he has.
@ryanhamstra49 I don't know if I would agree Joe was 100% respectful. Joe interrupted and critiqued Stephen's personal testimony suggesting it could be a figment of his imagination, he implied Stephen was in a cult because he is a Christian (but not am Iowaska taking Christian which is okay)....I think it was actually the grace and humility of Stephen that made Joe come around to him in the end.
I agree that this was a great discussion, mostly the presentation of the advancements of creation science and theological understanding from Stephen Meyer, and also that Rogan is more obviously out of his element, yet attempting over time to save face to his audience by unprofessionally pushing against Meyer's arguments and deep understanding of his subject matter and in the heat of his biases very clearly failing in the process. There are also zero historical reports from the cultures of the Holy Land of mushroom usage for enlightenment.
@@shefalichow7917I’ve read all of Meyer’s books, and watched a lot of interviews. He’s always a respectful class act. I appreciated Joe’s questions, because I knew that Dr. Meyer would answer them honestly and intelligently, and that onlookers would gain something from the conversation. You won’t get this kind of back and forth on network TV.
Thank you for having this educated, logical, respectful man of God! As a scientist myself and having come to the same conclusion of the undeniable Creator of all, I respect the bravery to defend that truth. Thanks Joe. Keep questioning. And when you search earnestly as I believe you are doing, you will find God.
Great episode. A lot of people here are upset with the way Joe is furiously questioning his guest's ideas, but i think the way Joe "grills" his guest makes the overall philosophical value of this conversation only higher!
Like so many, Joe is coming around to the fact that we live in a purpose-built realm! Evolution is the necessary conclusion of those who want to rule us and replace God with themselves, and it is an idea that existed way before Darwin wrote the Origin of a Species. People who believe they are created in the image of an all-powerful God do not bow to pretenders.
@@johnbatson8779 I mean, you could say that about anyone that has an opinion about this stuff because ultimately there's no clear right answer at the end of the day
If Joe is going to "grill" anyone for 3 hours, it needs to be this man. Stephen Meyer is someone who has such a refined thought process that even hearing his explanations of things he doesn't know, provides great clarity. He does not allow pride to control his philosophical arguments or reaction to truth seeking questions. Glad to see truth being sought on such a big platform.
@@kenziemacdonald181 Meyer is not a smart person. He promotes pseudoscience and Joe is too braindead to know it. Meyer wouldn’t stand a chance against an accredited expert in evolution.
God Bless Joe Rogan for having enough wisdom and sense to know that Dr Stephen Meyer is special enough to have repeatedly as a guest and engage him as long as he does,
Dr. Meyer is a very quiet gift to the world. You either know of him or "who?". He's brilliant. His perspectives and perceptions have opened many minds. Blessed.
You do realize that if god were a real concept , he wouldn’t be having this crisis ? He has no proof just his want ….we made the code ,we made the quantify that allows these to be measured ,we also made god ….. If god were a real thing we wouldn’t need to be punished…he wouldn’t even know what punishment is ,everything ever was his plan ! I can guarantee you god had nothing to do with the origin of life !?
@@jgage2344the difference between ur rambling and Stephen’s dissertation level conversation is stark and isn’t winning you anyone to your way of thinking
As I lay in bed after putting the kids to sleep listening to this discussion like I’m a kid listening to a met game not falling asleep lol great interview definitely buying a couple of Dr. Meyers books.
Truly. This man has been my man crush for 7 months since discovering a few things. Namely God. We came to the same conclusions almost the same way. And once past the conclusion and onto acceptance and asking, it's a new world. His demeanor and delivery is one of a kind. There's a calm in him. Grace.
Dr. Steve Meyer is a brilliant scientist and philosopher. He still remains such a humble and likeable man. I have so enjoyed his contributions. May God bless you with many years to discover and share more, Dr. Meyers!
Ya bro. I agree with point of view of Dr. Steven but I imagined myself in his place, I would have lost my cool middle of the debate. May God give this man more blessings and guidance.
I had spinal mingizus as a infant & spent 2 years in hospital then was hindered to braces due it was unable to walk & at the age of 4 taken to a church prayed over & walked out that is my account of my own personal Faith in God & spend a daily thanks for being healed
Joe... please don't discount all Stephen said because you can't know something in the future. As C.S. Lewis said, "I spent a long time trying to come to grips with my doubts, when I realized I needed to come to grips with what I know to be true. I've since moved from questions that I cannot answer, to answers that I cannot escape and it has been a great relief."
the gospel of Jesus Christ - commands you to take it personally - if you don't then you do so at your own peril - His message is - repent or perish IF stephen is a christian - then he should be portraying that everyone SHOULD take it personally
@@kablammy7I think you may have misunderstood the complement being given to Stephan here. He is able to defend his position for not only God, but the God of the Bible without losing his temper even when faced with someone being stubborn or misrepresenting the arguments being made. We are told in scripture by Paul to confront our opponents with "gentleness". Meyer was successful in that here. He deserves respect and to be commended for keeping his cool and presenting the evidence for God in a kind and respectful manner. Peter also speaks of showing respect in this way. Well done Meyer 🙏✝️🙏
@@kablammy7 2 Timothy 2:24-26 ESV [24] And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, [25] correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, [26] and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will. 1 Peter 2:12-17 ESV [12] Keep your conduct among the Gentiles honorable, so that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may see your good deeds and glorify God on the day of visitation. [13] Be subject for the Lord’s sake to every human institution, whether it be to the emperor as supreme, [14] or to governors as sent by him to punish those who do evil and to praise those who do good. [15] For this is the will of God, that by doing good you should put to silence the ignorance of foolish people. [16] Live as people who are free, not using your freedom as a cover-up for evil, but living as servants of God. [17] Honor everyone. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the emperor. 1 Peter 3:14-17 ESV [14] But even if you should suffer for righteousness’ sake, you will be blessed. Have no fear of them, nor be troubled, [15] but in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect, [16] having a good conscience, so that, when you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ may be put to shame. [17] For it is better to suffer for doing good, if that should be God’s will, than for doing evil.
@@Christus.Invictus thanks for your input - however - i think it you who do misconstrue - first off - i would not give reference to a poem that ends with the words -> ' I am the master of my fate, I am the captain of my soul. ' UNLESS i had NOT the Spirit of God teaching me that -> that is the worst fallacy that a man can conceive ( think about nimrod - the epitome of pride in the work of one's own hands and mind ) ( aside from nebuchadnezzar ) i think i understood and replied to the complementary comment as it was written - albeit - maybe they did not mean it exactly as they wrote it - and that fact alone would give some credence to your concern of my possible misapprehension . - furthermore - i think you have interwoven your most ideal thoughts of stephen's approach into your conceived misappropriation scenario - - i have no qualms or quibbles concerning stephen's actual information or presentation - my complaint was totally directed at what stephen lacks - and pointedly that is exactly the Spirit of truth - no complaints of the data or conception of that data . - it is indicative of the carnal mind that has no understanding of the spirit - similar to what the teachings of everything in the roman catholic world portrays . - there are two religions in the world 1 - all false - human centered religions - that magnify the creation or the works of creatures ( this includes MANY people who think they are doing good works for God and they may even call themselves christians ) 2 - the one true - God centered religion - that magnifies the work of the Creator - anyone who does not have the Holy Spirit - and do not show the light of the gospel of Jesus Christ to the world is not doing the work of God - they are doing the work of their own hands - aided by their own imaginations because without the Spirit of God - their ONLY understanding is carnal and NOT spiritual to any capacity whatsoever - it is written - the natural mind CANNOT understand anything of the Spirit - since i do not hear the true gospel from those who consistently magnify the creature - i do not have witness in the Spirit that they are one with God in their message - the whole purpose of this world is to glorify God - He will be glorified by exhibiting all of His attributes in everything that happens in this world
Steve Meyer has engaged in discussion and debate with many intelligent scientists, philosophers and thinkers. Rogan asked some great questions, but his questions are nothing new to Meyer.
I don't actually think that much went over Joes head. The concept is easy to understand but it just does not make that much sense as far as science go. Meyer and Lennox does the same thing every time they get questioned about evidence regarding their faith; they start talking about personal experience and ancient hearsay.
Joe is infuriating in this podcast. Stephen offers actual empirical evidence over and over and Joe just says “well maybe new tech in the future will disprove that”
A lot of people here are upset with the way Joe is furiously questioning his guest's ideas, but i think the way Joe "grills" his guest, makes the overall philosophical value of this conversation only higher.
I think it's okay to be skeptical. Jesus is after Joe. He wants a relationship with you, Joe. Keep asking questions, but the only way you will really know how real God is is by talking to him. Start praying and see what he does in your life. He wants a relationship with you
I understand Joe's perspective because I once sounded like him on this subject. Sounded like that for 40 years. Wasn't raised with it, wasn't introduced to it, but I now find myself claiming whole hearted to be a Christian in my faith. There's nothing that can be said to change a mind that doesn't want to. And it's not about changing one's mind, really. My mind didn't change, I just found the truth. I'm sure I've got some things wrong. Absolutely. But follow whatever you want to. History, math, biology, physics. It all leads to one place. And when you ask with an open and true heart, a promise is kept. A truth is revealed. And there's no way to deny it. I followed the science like Dr. Meyer. It's just where it lead. Magic isn't real, until the day it is.
Amen! I love Jesus and gave him my life and asked for forgiveness. He keeps a promise like no human to ever walk the earth.. God's eternal promise. I had a deeply spiritual experience in which the holy spirit led me to a pysch ward to do battle against some evil spirit that a man was channeling. He put me under mind control and seemed to read my entire mind but I just filled it with Jesus and there was nothing the evil could do to me. I witnessed mircales in the week that I spent but there's no doubt in my mind after going through this that occult practices are real. I saw the evil spirit in peoples eyes and I saw things that are like horror movies. But I called on my saviour's name and he delivered me and hopefully the others I prayed for. It sounds so crazy for me to say these things, my past self would think I'm crazy or something. But there's no greater gift than to know my soul is eternally safe in my loving saviour's arms
I believe In the end it is all about faith which I have. Joe looks for tangible absolutes in why Christians believe what they believe. I understand this, as I have had, and at times still have these very same thoughts/struggles. Meyer handles this very well, but it remains a faith in something that cannot be proven. Therefore to the non-believer it can possibly look like a sort of weakness that stems from some life experience that requires a "crutch" to cope with life, the crutch being the faith in G-d.
I struggled with my faith a lot, when I was younger. I watched Professor Meyers lectures to show that science does have evidence for the Christianic belief. Thank you for having him on the show and delving deeper into his psyche!
“I can see how comforting it can be for you to think that way” says Joe trying to discredit someone else with his own way of thinking that is comforting to him because he doesn’t believe God. Ironical
yup, Joe Rogan manifested during this podcast you can tell. He wants aliens, multiverse and absolutely weird stuff to be real rather than God and his son Jesus Christ
2 місяці тому+6
He was a Satanist. God being real would have severe consequences for him. In the end his fear of God doesn't allow him to acknowledge God. Ironical indeed.
Joe came into this podcast with a preconceived notion of discrediting the theory of a creator, but the beauty of it is that Stephen C. Meyer is eloquently researched in this topic that he was so permissive of Joe’s ignorant comparisons. I’m truly impressed how well he handles the conversation from someone who seemingly fires back at everything with relative personal experience versus someone who has used the anomalies of science, and math to create a scientific standpoint and not just a mere faith based perspective. The deeper you push the complexities the more a painter is evident in this landscape we call life. Call it what you will diety, Allah, zeus or God these innate behaviors within us make us question the universe but also understand it. It’s almost as if it was intended by the creator this way, as I feel science supports religion and religion can support science.
As an agnostic, I find this man presents the most compelling evidence for intelligent design. Add to that fact, he does it without the smug righteousness that many Christians exhibit, which ironically, only turns most atheists or agnostics off in the first place. More flies with Honey than with fire and brimstone.
I used to claim agnosticism. The complexity of the cell and bizarre reality of nature (such as the double slit experiment) are examples that led me to reject atheism. I do not believe nothingness or randomness can generate the levels of complex coordination we find in a single cell.
An important point in the conversation was missed by Dr. Meyer - we perceive things of faith with a faculty of faith, which can only be understood after the experience of it. I was an occultist and Vajrayana Buddhist for 23 years, tripped psychedelics at least 1500 times, but the experience of accepting Christ into my heart opened up a completely new aspect of reality, one that I had only glimpsed during my most profound meditations and my deepest 5 grams in silent darkness trips - a wavelength of reality that is pure love, pure peace, and total connectedness without the frenetic euphoria, toxic nausea, trembling and sweating, etc. It was like Christ entered my heart and I grew a new sense organ. Its hard to describe but its what bridges the gap between reason and faith. None of the arguments for God make any more sense than ontological positions of non linear infinite regress or Mahayana cosmology or whatever else, without the experience of the world of faith as a reference point. Once that experience is had, however, and Almighty God reveals Himself, its impossible to ignore the foundational truth that there is only one God, as three persons - the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Christ Jesus is God and he is waiting for you, anyone reading this, to accept him into their hearts as the true salvation. He does the work of soterial perfection for us, that's the great majesty and mystery of His love. We don't need to try to ascend, reach enlightenment, be totally righteous, etc. We simply must have total faith in him to lead us to the Father and vouch for us, essentially, after we die. In terms of faith and reason, the Apostle Paul put it best: "Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. For by it the elders obtained a good testimony. By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible." Hebrews 11-1
As a Christian I can agree that they’re plenty of smug Christians-especially on UA-cam, but I’ve also noticed that there is no shortage of smug atheists also.
1:37:00 Joe raises a good point but I would counter by saying most people would acknowledge that going to the gym and eating right are 100% better for them and would lead to a healthier more fulfilling life. HOWEVER, MANY people still don’t do it. They don’t just suddenly love going to the gym and feel drawn to it. God is different. Your switch can get instantly flipped and it doesn’t make ANY sense. ESPECIALLY, when having it flipped actually causes everything you felt was important and worked for to now appear worthless. It’s counter intuitive. Unless it’s happened to you just can’t understand it. I used to snicker at “born again” Christians. Even as a self professed Christian myself. THEN God flipped my switch :) Now I’m crazy just like them 😂
@@duracellbattery4829So he started believing in God because he "matured," not because God is real? Then why would believing in God be a sign of "maturity," then?
@@dealerovski82 What are you talking about? Once again, zero people in the scientific community take weinstein seriously. He hasn’t contributed anything to modern day science. Do you listen to any scientists who actually make contributions to science? Arm chair contrarians are seriously all you have? Weinstein speaks against the scientific community because they don’t accept his absolute gibberish papers. Please provide me with someone who actually contributes to science. Not just angry authors.
@@jessec4443 well that is your opinion, but Stephen has credits behind him and Jim has boatload of patents in microbiology…..so what the sci com might think is jealousy and nastiness.
@@piratessalyx7871 Stephen has a few degrees in the philosophy of science. He had published ONE paper, and it was explaining his dislike for evolution. That is literally his only contribution to academia, and it was a philosophical critique. He’s not even a scientist. You realise owning patents has absolutely nothing to do with contributions to science. Anyone can own a patent. It doesn’t even have to be work or do anything. I agree with the rest of the scientific community, when I say ‘James Tour is a complete and utter joke’. Once they both start making progress in the field of science I will gladly consider their ideas. I think you should carefully consider which professionals you should be focusing on. If these two are the highest authorities in your eyes, then you need to reevaluate your approach to understanding science.
I watched this episode when it came out. I remember thinking that Joe asked some touch questions which is great. Its unfortunate that he doesn't do the same with other folks like Graham Hancock and co. I remember when Hancock suggested the large stones that made up the Pyramids were levitated there by audio waves from people chanting...zero pushback from Joe.
Lol yeah I don't get it. Sometimes rogan asks good or tough questions, but sometimes he doesn't really push back at all even when it seems obvious someone is full of crap like Graham Hancock or Terrence Howard or Billy carson
First off I think Hancock has some good info but goes too far with assuming magical stuff! But you couldn't grill those guys , their not real scientists. We all know that, their entertainment, real science needs to be challenged.
1:44:10 Joe: “Yeah, but also you want a very particular truth, that you seem to have experienced, to be true. Like, this experience with God. This experience with this, this sort of frequency that you feel that if you achieve that, you are on, the world works in a more harmonious way.” Stephen: “Yeah I would say, uh, I’m not trying to conjure up something, it’s just been something that has…” Joe: “No one’s accusing you of that.” Stephen: “Yeah. Yeah.” Incredibly smoothly shakes off the accusation and the claim that there was no accusation in it. How does this man stand it? Where is his breaking point?
This is the ONLY interview I've seen Joe be just flat out disrespectful and combative. It's like it took everything in him not to even want to see it from his guests point of view. Almost like he was afraid it MIGHT have him questioning his own BS.
To be fair to Joe its VERY VERY difficult to remain cool when talking to these idiots.... The way they peddle such total bullshit as facts, its insulting to the person on the receiving end, so Joe actually did well keeping his cool if you ask me.
I thought Joe was hungover, at first… …then Joe became more and more guarded, even to the point of thinking narrowly. I was surprised. He proposed a huge multi universe, but didn’t ask Meyer how he touches God. It’s ok Meyer probably meditates and prays, a good enough action. In the end Joe intensely pushed his psychedelic ego. My Mom had a psychedelic drip and electric shocks, in Alberta, Canada, so contributed to the experimental trials 😱. Meyer’s response as to what the goal is saying I t’s the designer’s goal, and that is to restore his relationship between the Creator (God himself) and us (the creation, including animals). Charismatics have an honest pursuit, and become ecstatic without psychedelics. Part of the problem here is: I’m not Catholic, nor is Stephen Meyer. I don’t believe that taking the bread (host), and grape juice (sometimes wine) is actually the flesh & blood of Jesus, proclaimed by priests. I’m pretty sure Joe, as a child, took the blood and flesh in his child’s mind. To me that is a demonic act, forced upon him.
@benskinner1713 number one: did you listen to his argument? Number 2: does Joe blow a fuse when people talk about their trippy experiences on DMT? If someone takes psychedelics and says "bro, the machine elves told me we're interconnected and we should love each other", Joe is all ears and does NOT push back the way he did here. He should at least be consistent.
Important wisdom from the Bible regarding some of Joes beliefs. "Be SOBER-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour." "For false christs and false prophets will arise and perform GREAT signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect." "Beloved, do NOT believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world." - The Word of God
I think a lot of people are highly misinterperting Joe here. He is a highly curious individual, which it great for conversation. He helps dive into areas of unknown that many of us have or have had. I never thought he was rude, but just passionate about challenging all ideas. This does more good for the conversation. As I see it, it helps Stephen recall and explain his findings & beliefs. This might be one of my favorite podcasts so far! I never know much about Stephen. I want to read his books within the next year for sure!
Rogan should invite Lennox, Meyer, Tour, Behe, Dembski, Polkinghorne, Barnes, Ross, Swinburne, Collins, etc. Intelligent design is not a pseudoscience. It's scientific investigation in its purest form. God, at least, it's plausible.
I am on your page too. Thanks for listing all these experts. You gave me some names I have not heard yet. I would like to add some also.Lewis, Piper, Sproul, Behe, Habernas, Murray, Martin, Craig, McArthur and Moreland,
Christians are idiots. They spend their time arguing whether Jesus was born in Bethlehem or Nazareth without bothering to acknowledge those are references to Virgo and Mazzaroth.
Grand orderly design. It’s not ‘random’, it happens slowly over time, the ones that survive and procreate’s traits are passed on while the weak ones die off, survival of the fittest - evolution. Unless you have a better explanation then a ‘god’ which there is absolutely no proof of, you can’t call the theory of evolution laughable.
@Seanph25 by definition, separated as a word, yes... but as a process over time, and as part of a theory of evolution, those mutations and natural selections, add up to adaptation and change over time, often in response to the environment. This overall process is not random at all. The needed changes survive and are passed on to future generations as part of the process of natural selection, and evolutionary theory.
I totally understand Dr Stephen, I became Christian in 2005 by my own choice and around there I was experiencing this "powerful force", extremely powerful love that would cause me to rethink my actions, or bring this sense of conviction. And as "a good person" as I thought I was, like most people, I was selfish still before "encouter" this power... When you study the bible you know that is the Holy Spirit, a supernatural power that Rogan doesn't get it, he has been trying to rationalize the power... It's quite simple, I bet Rogan can be generous, even towards strangers, however, he is still selfish in nature. Would he put others ahead of his own interests? Would he have actions to save a stranger's life? That's the kind of selfisness Dr Stephen is talking about, and this powerful love is unexplainable! A burning fire in your chest, genuine peace. When you feel this power, you will want to forgive and even hug anyone who has "tormented" you for years, your own "enemies". And that doesn't come from you, it comes from the power.
Exactly. It's pointless.. someone who is committed spiritually have already gone through the denial phase of trying to rationalize their experiences. But when they accumulate over years, it gets harder to convince yourself that it's all coincidental, so you have to make a decision: surrender or keep denying. I myself surrendered to god.
Someone once told me you can only primarily communicate spiritual truths by your state of being. Explanation through words is only secondary to that. I think thats true
@@hamza5106 That is true. And I speak from experience. My father's bloodline is a psychic pathogen that induces Satori. Spend enough time around a Stiles and you'll either ascend or go insane.
A great exchange of the complexities involved in life. Spiritual is alien to a materialistic attached, egotistical, self-righteous perspective. Unpacking the complexities of that is an infinite debate, which in and of itself, the nature of that complexity is beautiful!
I love and respect Stephen Meyer soooo much! I’ve read his books Darwin’s Doubt and The Return of the God Hypothesis. I recommend these books. I believe he wrote things in laymen’s terms but the books are still beyond my knowledge of science. You’ll learn tons and you’ll be utterly amazed by all that has been discovered!
There is indeed a lot of evil in this world but please don't forget there are also many good human beings who will sacrifice their lives to do good things.
And then one day, absolutely nothing came from absolutely nowhere and became a quantity that we understand is everything. Whatever everything is. Lol...
I find it more amazing that these humans can break it down more to lay persons (us) to a point that we can understand. Bottom line; God exists. At what point do we need more? Understand with an open mind. Begin to comprehend. God is.
I wish rogan would have questioned those two nutty guys he had on I think it was Terrence Howard and Billy carson, they were just spouting what sounded like bizarre off the wall pseudoscience rubbish but rogan didn't seem to question them very much for some reason
@@steventhompson399 The idea of a God that people will have to face on judgement day makes people uncomfortable, and so they respond by pushing back disproportionately hard, the way Joe did here.
@@johnbatson8779 Meyer is a Fool? He has earned a PHD in philosophy and philosophy of science at Cambridge. He also debated and had discussions with brilliant minds from all over the science and philosophy world. If you think Meyer is a fool, then who do you think is intelligent?
C.S lewis wrote an essay titled "Meditation in a tool shed", for me its a profound essay because it showed me something in my thinking that I was taking for granted, after having heard that and now listening to Joe I feel like the essay may have been written for him 😂
Rogan says "I want to hear what your viewpoint is on this...." and then when Stephen Meyer this is what I believe" Rogan tries to convert him to his point of view."
I don't think Joe was trying to convert Dr. Meyer to his point of view as much as it was that Joe was desperately insistent that Dr. Meyer's POV couldn't *possibly * be correct because that would require Joe to re-examine his entire world view, and that would threaten the very core of who he is; if psychology has taught us one thing, it's that humans will go to extraordinary lengths to avoid examining our core beliefs once they are set.
I respect Joe, love his podcast.. But you can tell his world view was challenged with Meyer. Joe's hostility and push back shows just how profound this engagement was to Joe's beliefs. Myer was calm, collective, and brought forth a lot of philosophical and scientific evidence for GOD.
Joe Rogan I can't help but think your trippin' thru this episode........I'm def entertained by your skepticism of absolute faith, and your push to understand it. I was uncomfortable but could not stop listening. Thankyou.
Joe Rogan is who he is because he allows others to speak. This interview is telling. He isn't open to hearing a reason for God and sought to explain everything Stephen Meyer said in terms of the kind of atheist tropes found in a Neil DeGrasse Tyson episdode.
I’m so happy he has him in here. Please don’t compare him to Terrence or Billy. This man knows actual science. Whether you agree with him or not is fine but he’s not a kook
@@niikiitssflood me with every podcast what a patient geniune genius. That's hard work playing this role especially if your not interested. Thanks Joe and guest speakers! Meet the World!
We understand what? Ourselves? Explaining ourselves with limited understanding is like explaining science without thought. Science is the manifestation of a question. God is the question and the answer. God is the answer we seek. He has answers all. We need to not seek our answers with immediacy but will eventually find His will. We are self instead of being Him. He is us and we are Him. He wants us to love Him. Once we understand Him, we cannot not love Him. It is impossible not to do otherwise.
Lost a lot of respect for Joe with this experience. Don't understand why he thought being combative was the way to go. Though I am not a religious person myself, I find Stephen Meyer to be very engaging and interesting.
I wonder if joe realizes that he doesn't press non biblical or secular views using the bible like he presses biblical views using secular thought. He should.
Why would he. The bible is just one of many books and is no ultimate arbiter. Why wouldn’t he use ancient Mayan teachings or texts, they are written by people too? Your statement makes no sense.
@rarebirdjones I think he should bc the bible is the topic in several of the answers. Just use a more balanced approach. I don't think there is anything wrong with him using other writings or secular ideas just don't leave the bible out of that process. It's there too.
This is an ID historian of science, but Joe keeps going personal. He doesn't ask why, where, who, how of ID science. Instead he goes to personal theology and philosophy. Joe needs to run this back 100%
If I were that judge, I would have replied to Darrow's defense : "I am sentencing these two to death because of the infinite forces at work through the millions of years of evolutionary processes have programmed me to do so."
@@419 Well, if I believe as you do and I have no objective standard for moral values, then yes, you are correct, it is just your opinion vs mine. I believe this wondrous universe has meaning because of the righteous God who created it and has established a basic morality in everyone's heart. That is why I think I am correct. You, of course, can follow your own path. You have that right.
@@LLPOF I believe the same thing you do. I just assumed that since you used evolution as a basis for your moral judgement that you didn't have a true objective source of morality.
To admit the existence of God means not living in sin. Getting high is not a connection to God. Joe isn't ready to put that down yet. Pretty cool that all the road blocks he throws out just prove creation to be true❤❤❤
Imagine, Joe trying to convince Dr Meyer of what his experience was with Jesus... I have no words. Doesn't have a clue. A great part of this interview was wasted on Joe trying to figure out why Dr Meyer believes in Jesus rather than on Dr Meyer's work. Joe doesn't have a clue of the spiritual and it's obvious. Wish Joe would just shut up and let his guest talk about their work.
Joe is literally dogging him hard on his experience of God , he has never dogged a guest so hard. Joe trying to get Steven to admit his experience was do to other circumstances than god ....thats why Steven said, " this is counter productive"... referring to Joe cutting him off consistently when trying to explain his experience with god. Pathetic in Joe's behalf 😮
It amazes me how he sits there, all giddy, and gobbles up whatever BS guests like Billy Carson or Terrence Howard shove down his throat, yet he draws the line at Christianity and calls it cultish. Think he’s been hit in the head a few times at this point..
Rather than focus on joes demeanor, focus on the Dr.'s responses. They were clear, concise and respectful. This speaks volumes to Dr. Meyers intellect, which obviously outweighs Rogan's. When interviewing terrence howard, Joe actually talks with someone who hasnt the slightest clue of what they're talking about, which mirrors his intellect on the subject. Joe is a smart guy, but come on, he isnt "educated" as a lot of his guests are.
I learn so much from some of joes guests. these ones are awesome. the entertainment ones can be funny though, glad he puts this stuff out there for people without access to these kinda people
Jo assumes that when one finds faith, they gain comfort from joining a club. A lot of people who “adopt’ the “thought” of god, do so surrounded by opposition and some completely alone. I feel Jo is trying to diminish this connection to a desperate need to belong to something rather than an involuntary personal revelation that unfortunately one cannot possibly understand until it happens to them. Yes young people can work themselves into a frenzy over a lot of things, it’s not “cool” to follow Jesus in a lot of places in this world, what one tends to receive it ridicule, not comfort from joining a club. You cannot prove that you are in love to someone else, you cannot prove faith to someone else. It’s about you and the one.
Great episode. Joe is definitely more engaged here than most episodes. Questioning makes the episodes better but for whatever reason it felt like Joe was trying to disagree rather than question. This is coming from someone who isn’t very religious. Felt kinda bad for Meyer a few times but the guy isn’t phased a bit. Pure class. Great episode.
The man has remarkable patience, dealing with a buffoon, like Joe; that's all I'll say.
@@shefalichow7917Joe was asking tough questions but he is absolutely not the toughest guy he has had to deal with. Joe was asking lots of questions and really pushing the other side but he was respectful and not openly hostile like many people Stephen has debated in the past. I’ve heard Joe be way more hostile before, I he sounds genuinely curious here and is asking the questions he has.
@ryanhamstra49 I don't know if I would agree Joe was 100% respectful. Joe interrupted and critiqued Stephen's personal testimony suggesting it could be a figment of his imagination, he implied Stephen was in a cult because he is a Christian (but not am Iowaska taking Christian which is okay)....I think it was actually the grace and humility of Stephen that made Joe come around to him in the end.
I agree that this was a great discussion, mostly the presentation of the advancements of creation science and theological understanding from Stephen Meyer, and also that Rogan is more obviously out of his element, yet attempting over time to save face to his audience by unprofessionally pushing against Meyer's arguments and deep understanding of his subject matter and in the heat of his biases very clearly failing in the process. There are also zero historical reports from the cultures of the Holy Land of mushroom usage for enlightenment.
@@shefalichow7917I’ve read all of Meyer’s books, and watched a lot of interviews. He’s always a respectful class act. I appreciated Joe’s questions, because I knew that Dr. Meyer would answer them honestly and intelligently, and that onlookers would gain something from the conversation. You won’t get this kind of back and forth on network TV.
Thank you for having this educated, logical, respectful man of God! As a scientist myself and having come to the same conclusion of the undeniable Creator of all, I respect the bravery to defend that truth. Thanks Joe. Keep questioning. And when you search earnestly as I believe you are doing, you will find God.
What is your specialty? Just curious!
Great episode.
A lot of people here are upset with the way Joe is furiously questioning his guest's ideas, but i think the way Joe "grills" his guest makes the overall philosophical value of this conversation only higher!
He is just asking the questions what atheists would ask... its ok..
If your idea can't stand the hardest questions it's invalid.
Like so many, Joe is coming around to the fact that we live in a purpose-built realm! Evolution is the necessary conclusion of those who want to rule us and replace God with themselves, and it is an idea that existed way before Darwin wrote the Origin of a Species. People who believe they are created in the image of an all-powerful God do not bow to pretenders.
@@Jayf1981well said Jay
Seems that Joe makes assumptions about what the guest is trying to say, because Joe is confused about what the guest is actually trying to say.
Dr Meyer is very respectful, debates well and communicates effectively. He's fun to listen to.
Totally agree. Dr Meyer displays the quality of humility of a great scholar.
Came across as totally delusional
He is a natural educator.
@@johnbatson8779 I mean, you could say that about anyone that has an opinion about this stuff because ultimately there's no clear right answer at the end of the day
Knowing that God exist give me so much joy. Otherwise life will be pointless.
If Joe is going to "grill" anyone for 3 hours, it needs to be this man. Stephen Meyer is someone who has such a refined thought process that even hearing his explanations of things he doesn't know, provides great clarity. He does not allow pride to control his philosophical arguments or reaction to truth seeking questions. Glad to see truth being sought on such a big platform.
Meyer is a dolt who peddles pseudoscience. And you’re dimmer than him so you think he’s intelligent. How sad.
@DisposableSupervillainHead hominine anyone?nchman
So true.
@@kenziemacdonald181 Meyer is not a smart person. He promotes pseudoscience and Joe is too braindead to know it. Meyer wouldn’t stand a chance against an accredited expert in evolution.
The hallmark of a true scientist.
God Bless Joe Rogan for having enough wisdom and sense to know that Dr Stephen Meyer is special enough to have
repeatedly as a guest and engage him as long as he does,
Dr. Meyer is a very quiet gift to the world. You either know of him or "who?". He's brilliant. His perspectives and perceptions have opened many minds. Blessed.
Rogan has wisdom? What a revelation haha.
You do realize that if god were a real concept , he wouldn’t be having this crisis ?
He has no proof just his want ….we made the code ,we made the quantify that allows these to be measured ,we also made god …..
If god were a real thing we wouldn’t need to be punished…he wouldn’t even know what punishment is ,everything ever was his plan !
I can guarantee you god had nothing to do with the origin of life !?
@@jgage2344the difference between ur rambling and Stephen’s dissertation level conversation is stark and isn’t winning you anyone to your way of thinking
@@jgage2344 you got it all figured don't ya
As I lay in bed after putting the kids to sleep listening to this discussion like I’m a kid listening to a met game not falling asleep lol great interview definitely buying a couple of Dr. Meyers books.
Stephen Meyer, a man of grace.
If you call being dishonest and feeding into the delusions of vulnerable gullible victims of the christian religion "grace" then yeah....
Truly. This man has been my man crush for 7 months since discovering a few things. Namely God. We came to the same conclusions almost the same way. And once past the conclusion and onto acceptance and asking, it's a new world. His demeanor and delivery is one of a kind. There's a calm in him. Grace.
No. He’s a man of pseudoscience and the “god of the gaps”.
A con man preaching religion.
Dr. Steve Meyer is a brilliant scientist and philosopher. He still remains such a humble and likeable man. I have so enjoyed his contributions. May God bless you with many years to discover and share more, Dr. Meyers!
God bless you, too!
Ya bro. I agree with point of view of Dr. Steven but I imagined myself in his place, I would have lost my cool middle of the debate. May God give this man more blessings and guidance.
he didnt say a single scientific thing
@@godlychrixal9520 If multiple organs work in harmony towards one goal. If its not design, I dont know what it is.
@@zasyed114 thats survival and evolution at play :)
There are times when Joe can't keep up; this was one of them. I admire his willingness to engage even when he speaks from a knowledge deficit.
I still thinks he asks some good questions, despite some of them obviously coming from a place of defensiveness.
I had spinal mingizus as a infant & spent 2 years in hospital then was hindered to braces due it was unable to walk & at the age of 4 taken to a church prayed over & walked out that is my account of my own personal Faith in God & spend a daily thanks for being healed
no you didnt
Meningitis?
Yes the lining around your brain, in your spine.
Eat raw meat - aajonus vonderplanitz
Joe... please don't discount all Stephen said because you can't know something in the future. As C.S. Lewis said, "I spent a long time trying to come to grips with my doubts, when I realized I needed to come to grips with what I know to be true. I've since moved from questions that I cannot answer, to answers that I cannot escape and it has been a great relief."
What a fantastic quote!
Amen brother
Where is this quote from?
C.S. Lewis really is a treasure
Also, if you are going discount ideas based on that reasoning, then you are going to have to throw a whole lot of your ideas out Joe? 😉😂
Dude is the epitome of don’t take it personally 👍 smooth job, traversing those pitfalls without getting stuck 🫡
the gospel of Jesus Christ - commands you to take it personally - if you don't then you do so at your own peril
- His message is - repent or perish
IF stephen is a christian - then he should be portraying that everyone SHOULD take it personally
@@kablammy7I think you may have misunderstood the complement being given to Stephan here. He is able to defend his position for not only God, but the God of the Bible without losing his temper even when faced with someone being stubborn or misrepresenting the arguments being made. We are told in scripture by Paul to confront our opponents with "gentleness". Meyer was successful in that here. He deserves respect and to be commended for keeping his cool and presenting the evidence for God in a kind and respectful manner. Peter also speaks of showing respect in this way. Well done Meyer 🙏✝️🙏
@@kablammy7
2 Timothy 2:24-26 ESV
[24] And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, [25] correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, [26] and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will.
1 Peter 2:12-17 ESV
[12] Keep your conduct among the Gentiles honorable, so that when they speak against you as evildoers, they may see your good deeds and glorify God on the day of visitation. [13] Be subject for the Lord’s sake to every human institution, whether it be to the emperor as supreme, [14] or to governors as sent by him to punish those who do evil and to praise those who do good. [15] For this is the will of God, that by doing good you should put to silence the ignorance of foolish people. [16] Live as people who are free, not using your freedom as a cover-up for evil, but living as servants of God. [17] Honor everyone. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the emperor.
1 Peter 3:14-17 ESV
[14] But even if you should suffer for righteousness’ sake, you will be blessed. Have no fear of them, nor be troubled, [15] but in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect, [16] having a good conscience, so that, when you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ may be put to shame. [17] For it is better to suffer for doing good, if that should be God’s will, than for doing evil.
@@Christus.Invictus
thanks for your input - however - i think it you who do misconstrue -
first off - i would not give reference to a poem that ends with the words ->
'
I am the master of my fate,
I am the captain of my soul.
'
UNLESS i had NOT the Spirit of God teaching me that -> that is the worst fallacy that a man can conceive ( think about nimrod - the epitome of pride in the work of one's own hands and mind ) ( aside from nebuchadnezzar )
i think i understood and replied to the complementary comment as it was written - albeit - maybe they did not mean it exactly as they wrote it - and that fact alone would give some credence to your concern of my possible misapprehension .
- furthermore - i think you have interwoven your most ideal thoughts of stephen's approach into your conceived misappropriation scenario -
-
i have no qualms or quibbles concerning stephen's actual information or presentation - my complaint was totally directed at what stephen lacks - and pointedly that is exactly the Spirit of truth - no complaints of the data or conception of that data .
-
it is indicative of the carnal mind that has no understanding of the spirit - similar to what the teachings of everything in the roman catholic world portrays .
-
there are two religions in the world
1 - all false - human centered religions - that magnify the creation or the works of creatures ( this includes MANY people who think they are doing good works for God and they may even call themselves christians )
2 - the one true - God centered religion - that magnifies the work of the Creator
-
anyone who does not have the Holy Spirit - and do not show the light of the gospel of Jesus Christ to the world is not doing the work of God - they are doing the work of their own hands - aided by their own imaginations because without the Spirit of God - their ONLY understanding is carnal and NOT spiritual to any capacity whatsoever - it is written - the natural mind CANNOT understand anything of the Spirit
-
since i do not hear the true gospel from those who consistently magnify the creature - i do not have witness in the Spirit that they are one with God in their message
-
the whole purpose of this world is to glorify God - He will be glorified by exhibiting all of His attributes in everything that happens in this world
Steve Meyer has engaged in discussion and debate with many intelligent scientists, philosophers and thinkers. Rogan asked some great questions, but his questions are nothing new to Meyer.
I would absolutely love to see Dr. John Lennox on the Joe Rogan Podcast!!!🙏
Yup yup
Dr. Lennox would run circles around him
@don3com Fore sure John Lennox is extremely intelligent. That is why I would like to see him on the show.
Dr. Meyer was incredibly gracious to Joe, as much he was saying was flying over Joe’s head.
I don't actually think that much went over Joes head. The concept is easy to understand but it just does not make that much sense as far as science go. Meyer and Lennox does the same thing every time they get questioned about evidence regarding their faith; they start talking about personal experience and ancient hearsay.
@@antonw-uw4ovOh it definitely went over his head. Did it go over your head also?
@@dasdrei5059 ever heard of an hominem argument? It basically means you are to dumb to play the game so you have to make up your own game.
@@antonw-uw4ov Do you mean the very hypocritical game you are playing right now?
And have you ever heard of a straw man or a red herring?@@antonw-uw4ov
Stephen C. Meyer should come on every time he drops a new title.
If only rogan challenged Terrance Howard & Billy Carson like he pressed this man smh
Joe is infuriating in this podcast. Stephen offers actual empirical evidence over and over and Joe just says “well maybe new tech in the future will disprove that”
@@Jessemfguirehe offered virtually no empirical evidence. What herbs are you smoking
A lot of people here are upset with the way Joe is furiously questioning his guest's ideas, but i think the way Joe "grills" his guest, makes the overall philosophical value of this conversation only higher.
Zion
Good point! @@KasparOne
I think it's okay to be skeptical. Jesus is after Joe. He wants a relationship with you, Joe. Keep asking questions, but the only way you will really know how real God is is by talking to him. Start praying and see what he does in your life. He wants a relationship with you
Amen sister...
I understand Joe's perspective because I once sounded like him on this subject. Sounded like that for 40 years. Wasn't raised with it, wasn't introduced to it, but I now find myself claiming whole hearted to be a Christian in my faith. There's nothing that can be said to change a mind that doesn't want to. And it's not about changing one's mind, really. My mind didn't change, I just found the truth. I'm sure I've got some things wrong. Absolutely. But follow whatever you want to. History, math, biology, physics. It all leads to one place. And when you ask with an open and true heart, a promise is kept. A truth is revealed. And there's no way to deny it. I followed the science like Dr. Meyer. It's just where it lead. Magic isn't real, until the day it is.
Well said
Amen! I love Jesus and gave him my life and asked for forgiveness. He keeps a promise like no human to ever walk the earth.. God's eternal promise.
I had a deeply spiritual experience in which the holy spirit led me to a pysch ward to do battle against some evil spirit that a man was channeling. He put me under mind control and seemed to read my entire mind but I just filled it with Jesus and there was nothing the evil could do to me. I witnessed mircales in the week that I spent but there's no doubt in my mind after going through this that occult practices are real. I saw the evil spirit in peoples eyes and I saw things that are like horror movies. But I called on my saviour's name and he delivered me and hopefully the others I prayed for. It sounds so crazy for me to say these things, my past self would think I'm crazy or something. But there's no greater gift than to know my soul is eternally safe in my loving saviour's arms
well said indeed
JESUS IS KING HE IS THE FINE TUNER COME ON JOE!
I believe In the end it is all about faith which I have. Joe looks for tangible absolutes in why Christians believe what they believe. I understand this, as I have had, and at times still have these very same thoughts/struggles. Meyer handles this very well, but it remains a faith in something that cannot be proven. Therefore to the non-believer it can possibly look like a sort of weakness that stems from some life experience that requires a "crutch" to cope with life, the crutch being the faith in G-d.
I struggled with my faith a lot, when I was younger. I watched Professor Meyers lectures to show that science does have evidence for the Christianic belief. Thank you for having him on the show and delving deeper into his psyche!
Religion is astrology. Why would astrology have any remote relation to reality. Grow up. Religion has NOTHING to do with God.
“I can see how comforting it can be for you to think that way” says Joe trying to discredit someone else with his own way of thinking that is comforting to him because he doesn’t believe God. Ironical
yup, Joe Rogan manifested during this podcast you can tell. He wants aliens, multiverse and absolutely weird stuff to be real rather than God and his son Jesus Christ
He was a Satanist. God being real would have severe consequences for him. In the end his fear of God doesn't allow him to acknowledge God. Ironical indeed.
Even the devil acknowledges Gods existence.
Then he transitions...that's what cults do...and tells the story of the gay porn star hypnotherapist cult leader. Lol.
This is probably the most interesting dialogue I have seen in my entire life, and I am sure I will get back to it a lot of times in the future.
Sucks to be you these people are the least interesting I've ever seen.
Joe came into this podcast with a preconceived notion of discrediting the theory of a creator, but the beauty of it is that Stephen C. Meyer is eloquently researched in this topic that he was so permissive of Joe’s ignorant comparisons. I’m truly impressed how well he handles the conversation from someone who seemingly fires back at everything with relative personal experience versus someone who has used the anomalies of science, and math to create a scientific standpoint and not just a mere faith based perspective. The deeper you push the complexities the more a painter is evident in this landscape we call life. Call it what you will diety, Allah, zeus or God these innate behaviors within us make us question the universe but also understand it. It’s almost as if it was intended by the creator this way, as I feel science supports religion and religion can support science.
Very beautifully written ❤🎉
Finally, the full episode which should have more views than Katt Williams and Terrence Howard combined.
They should do an episode with Kat Williams, Terrance Howard and Meyer combined.
As an agnostic, I find this man presents the most compelling evidence for intelligent design. Add to that fact, he does it without the smug righteousness that many Christians exhibit, which ironically, only turns most atheists or agnostics off in the first place. More flies with Honey than with fire and brimstone.
seems he lives by the bible verse 1 Peter 3:15 and 2 Timothy 2:15.
I used to claim agnosticism.
The complexity of the cell and bizarre reality of nature (such as the double slit experiment) are examples that led me to reject atheism.
I do not believe nothingness or randomness can generate the levels of complex coordination we find in a single cell.
An important point in the conversation was missed by Dr. Meyer - we perceive things of faith with a faculty of faith, which can only be understood after the experience of it. I was an occultist and Vajrayana Buddhist for 23 years, tripped psychedelics at least 1500 times, but the experience of accepting Christ into my heart opened up a completely new aspect of reality, one that I had only glimpsed during my most profound meditations and my deepest 5 grams in silent darkness trips - a wavelength of reality that is pure love, pure peace, and total connectedness without the frenetic euphoria, toxic nausea, trembling and sweating, etc. It was like Christ entered my heart and I grew a new sense organ. Its hard to describe but its what bridges the gap between reason and faith. None of the arguments for God make any more sense than ontological positions of non linear infinite regress or Mahayana cosmology or whatever else, without the experience of the world of faith as a reference point. Once that experience is had, however, and Almighty God reveals Himself, its impossible to ignore the foundational truth that there is only one God, as three persons - the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Christ Jesus is God and he is waiting for you, anyone reading this, to accept him into their hearts as the true salvation. He does the work of soterial perfection for us, that's the great majesty and mystery of His love. We don't need to try to ascend, reach enlightenment, be totally righteous, etc. We simply must have total faith in him to lead us to the Father and vouch for us, essentially, after we die.
In terms of faith and reason, the Apostle Paul put it best:
"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. For by it the elders obtained a good testimony. By faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that the things which are seen were not made of things which are visible."
Hebrews 11-1
As a Christian I can agree that they’re plenty of smug Christians-especially on UA-cam, but I’ve also noticed that there is no shortage of smug atheists also.
I recommend listening to Dr. John Lennox.
1:37:00 Joe raises a good point but I would counter by saying most people would acknowledge that going to the gym and eating right are 100% better for them and would lead to a healthier more fulfilling life. HOWEVER, MANY people still don’t do it. They don’t just suddenly love going to the gym and feel drawn to it.
God is different. Your switch can get instantly flipped and it doesn’t make ANY sense. ESPECIALLY, when having it flipped actually causes everything you felt was important and worked for to now appear worthless.
It’s counter intuitive.
Unless it’s happened to you just can’t understand it.
I used to snicker at “born again” Christians. Even as a self professed Christian myself. THEN God flipped my switch :)
Now I’m crazy just like them 😂
@@stevrgrs I'm glad you submitted your will to the Highest
It’s called maturing. Not god my friend. But whatever makes you happy I guess.
Blissful ignorance.
That same switch can work the other way too. One day you may suddenly start realizing god isn’t real.
@@Gruwg2024 Less likely.
@@duracellbattery4829So he started believing in God because he "matured," not because God is real? Then why would believing in God be a sign of "maturity," then?
I just love Stephen, love all his talks. Just like Dr. James Tour…love scientists that love God too…
Stephen is a book writer and James tour does screaming youtube videos. They are complete jokes in the scientific community.
Jokes on the sc com, what have we learned these past podcasts with weinstin and covid?
@@dealerovski82 What are you talking about? Once again, zero people in the scientific community take weinstein seriously. He hasn’t contributed anything to modern day science. Do you listen to any scientists who actually make contributions to science? Arm chair contrarians are seriously all you have? Weinstein speaks against the scientific community because they don’t accept his absolute gibberish papers. Please provide me with someone who actually contributes to science. Not just angry authors.
@@jessec4443 well that is your opinion, but Stephen has credits behind him and Jim has boatload of patents in microbiology…..so what the sci com might think is jealousy and nastiness.
@@piratessalyx7871 Stephen has a few degrees in the philosophy of science. He had published ONE paper, and it was explaining his dislike for evolution. That is literally his only contribution to academia, and it was a philosophical critique. He’s not even a scientist. You realise owning patents has absolutely nothing to do with contributions to science. Anyone can own a patent. It doesn’t even have to be work or do anything. I agree with the rest of the scientific community, when I say ‘James Tour is a complete and utter joke’. Once they both start making progress in the field of science I will gladly consider their ideas. I think you should carefully consider which professionals you should be focusing on. If these two are the highest authorities in your eyes, then you need to reevaluate your approach to understanding science.
I watched this episode when it came out. I remember thinking that Joe asked some touch questions which is great. Its unfortunate that he doesn't do the same with other folks like Graham Hancock and co. I remember when Hancock suggested the large stones that made up the Pyramids were levitated there by audio waves from people chanting...zero pushback from Joe.
Lol yeah I don't get it. Sometimes rogan asks good or tough questions, but sometimes he doesn't really push back at all even when it seems obvious someone is full of crap like Graham Hancock or Terrence Howard or Billy carson
First off I think Hancock has some good info but goes too far with assuming magical stuff! But you couldn't grill those guys , their not real scientists. We all know that, their entertainment, real science needs to be challenged.
@@TonyWilliams-f8y the problem is that some people do see it as truth. Joe has repeated his talking points many times.
@ProductofNZ I think joe takes this more serious, there's more meat on the bone.
Joe was insufferable on this. Stephen cites like 50 experts and Joe is like
"sO YOu bElieVe iT beCaUse oTheR pEoPle sAiD sO?!"
idk about that
1:44:10 Joe: “Yeah, but also you want a very particular truth, that you seem to have experienced, to be true. Like, this experience with God. This experience with this, this sort of frequency that you feel that if you achieve that, you are on, the world works in a more harmonious way.”
Stephen: “Yeah I would say, uh, I’m not trying to conjure up something, it’s just been something that has…”
Joe: “No one’s accusing you of that.”
Stephen: “Yeah. Yeah.” Incredibly smoothly shakes off the accusation and the claim that there was no accusation in it. How does this man stand it? Where is his breaking point?
This is the ONLY interview I've seen Joe be just flat out disrespectful and combative. It's like it took everything in him not to even want to see it from his guests point of view. Almost like he was afraid it MIGHT have him questioning his own BS.
He only gets like this when people talk about religion or dislike weed
To be fair to Joe its VERY VERY difficult to remain cool when talking to these idiots.... The way they peddle such total bullshit as facts, its insulting to the person on the receiving end, so Joe actually did well keeping his cool if you ask me.
I thought Joe was hungover, at first…
…then Joe became more and more guarded, even to the point of thinking narrowly. I was surprised. He proposed a huge multi universe, but didn’t ask Meyer how he touches God. It’s ok Meyer probably meditates and prays, a good enough action.
In the end Joe intensely pushed his psychedelic ego. My Mom had a psychedelic drip and electric shocks, in Alberta, Canada, so contributed to the experimental trials 😱.
Meyer’s response as to what the goal is saying I t’s the designer’s goal, and that is to restore his relationship between the Creator (God himself) and us (the creation, including animals). Charismatics have an honest pursuit, and become ecstatic without psychedelics.
Part of the problem here is:
I’m not Catholic, nor is Stephen Meyer. I don’t believe that taking the bread (host), and grape juice (sometimes wine) is actually the flesh & blood of Jesus, proclaimed by priests. I’m pretty sure Joe, as a child, took the blood and flesh in his child’s mind. To me that is a demonic act, forced upon him.
@@BonSkirmish1312 *_The way they peddle such total bullshit as facts_* Like? Give an example please.
@benskinner1713 number one: did you listen to his argument?
Number 2: does Joe blow a fuse when people talk about their trippy experiences on DMT? If someone takes psychedelics and says "bro, the machine elves told me we're interconnected and we should love each other", Joe is all ears and does NOT push back the way he did here. He should at least be consistent.
Important wisdom from the Bible regarding some of Joes beliefs. "Be SOBER-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour." "For false christs and false prophets will arise and perform GREAT signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect." "Beloved, do NOT believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world." - The Word of God
Well. I give respect to Joe for having Steve on. Steve is an incredible brilliant mind of our day.
I think a lot of people are highly misinterperting Joe here. He is a highly curious individual, which it great for conversation. He helps dive into areas of unknown that many of us have or have had. I never thought he was rude, but just passionate about challenging all ideas. This does more good for the conversation. As I see it, it helps Stephen recall and explain his findings & beliefs. This might be one of my favorite podcasts so far! I never know much about Stephen. I want to read his books within the next year for sure!
Dr. Meyer not only writes well, he also speaks very well as he articulates these complex issues.
Rogan should invite Lennox, Meyer, Tour, Behe, Dembski, Polkinghorne, Barnes, Ross, Swinburne, Collins, etc. Intelligent design is not a pseudoscience. It's scientific investigation in its purest form. God, at least, it's plausible.
I am on your page too. Thanks for listing all these experts. You gave me some names I have not heard yet. I would like to add some also.Lewis, Piper, Sproul, Behe, Habernas, Murray, Martin, Craig, McArthur and Moreland,
I am sooo happy that God has his witnesses everywhere! Dear Christians, be pure, be just, be diligent!
Christians are idiots. They spend their time arguing whether Jesus was born in Bethlehem or Nazareth without bothering to acknowledge those are references to Virgo and Mazzaroth.
Even as a kid I thought evolution was a simplistic way to explain something so complex. Randomness creating everything around us is laughable.
Grand orderly design. It’s not ‘random’, it happens slowly over time, the ones that survive and procreate’s traits are passed on while the weak ones die off, survival of the fittest - evolution. Unless you have a better explanation then a ‘god’ which there is absolutely no proof of, you can’t call the theory of evolution laughable.
Evolution is not random. So maybe you don't understand the complexity of evolution.
@@1968cedarmutations are said to be random and natural selection don't have any plane or design it's just randomness
(According to Darwinist)
@@1968cedarit is by definition random
@Seanph25 by definition, separated as a word, yes... but as a process over time, and as part of a theory of evolution, those mutations and natural selections, add up to adaptation and change over time, often in response to the environment. This overall process is not random at all. The needed changes survive and are passed on to future generations as part of the process of natural selection, and evolutionary theory.
I totally understand Dr Stephen, I became Christian in 2005 by my own choice and around there I was experiencing this "powerful force", extremely powerful love that would cause me to rethink my actions, or bring this sense of conviction. And as "a good person" as I thought I was, like most people, I was selfish still before "encouter" this power... When you study the bible you know that is the Holy Spirit, a supernatural power that Rogan doesn't get it, he has been trying to rationalize the power... It's quite simple, I bet Rogan can be generous, even towards strangers, however, he is still selfish in nature. Would he put others ahead of his own interests? Would he have actions to save a stranger's life? That's the kind of selfisness Dr Stephen is talking about, and this powerful love is unexplainable! A burning fire in your chest, genuine peace. When you feel this power, you will want to forgive and even hug anyone who has "tormented" you for years, your own "enemies". And that doesn't come from you, it comes from the power.
Beautifully stated!
Experiencing this comment currently
so true
Love is patient. Wow this man is full of love haha
One cannot explain the spiritual to someone who has made up their mind there is no such thing and has never experienced it.
Same as someone unconscious to spirituality... would nvr question how three of there colleges recently all passed in tragic accidents😮
Exactly. It's pointless.. someone who is committed spiritually have already gone through the denial phase of trying to rationalize their experiences. But when they accumulate over years, it gets harder to convince yourself that it's all coincidental, so you have to make a decision: surrender or keep denying.
I myself surrendered to god.
Everyone is on their own spiritual journey is the only thing I have found to be true.
Someone once told me you can only primarily communicate spiritual truths by your state of being. Explanation through words is only secondary to that. I think thats true
@@hamza5106 That is true. And I speak from experience. My father's bloodline is a psychic pathogen that induces Satori. Spend enough time around a Stiles and you'll either ascend or go insane.
A great exchange of the complexities involved in life.
Spiritual is alien to a materialistic attached, egotistical, self-righteous perspective.
Unpacking the complexities of that is an infinite debate,
which in and of itself,
the nature of that complexity is beautiful!
Stephen Meyer is a genius
Plant the seed and see if it sprouts. We are praying for you Joe. 🙏
I love and respect Stephen Meyer soooo much! I’ve read his books Darwin’s Doubt and The Return of the God Hypothesis. I recommend these books. I believe he wrote things in laymen’s terms but the books are still beyond my knowledge of science. You’ll learn tons and you’ll be utterly amazed by all that has been discovered!
Huge fan of Dr. Meyer. Great job!
Seems like Joe is the one desperately wanting God not to exist. Also very arrogant toward his guest
There is indeed a lot of evil in this world but please don't forget there are also many good human beings who will sacrifice their lives to do good things.
Excellent conversation and very difficult questions by Joe. I appreciate the candor and grace of Dr. Meyer.
Just, one of my favorite guests. Let's get it on.
Meyer is darwinists worst nightmare
He can easily be disproven@@TyrellWellickEcorp
@@nunskybuilds5704 Your argument has no purpose in our conversation. Everybody can whatever and whatever the whatever. Thanks
#Showyourmath2024
And then one day, absolutely nothing came from absolutely nowhere and became a quantity that we understand is everything. Whatever everything is. Lol...
@@nunskybuilds5704 No he can’t be lol. I’ve seen him debate high stature scientists who never successfully refuted any of his arguments
Would have been great to hear him discuss his scientific writing rather than making him defend why he's a Christian.
give joe enough time and it all comes down to drugs and aliens.
😂😂😂
Ain't that the truth!
And Jiu-Jitsu.
and Orcas and Dolphins
This has been the greatest podcast I’ve ever experienced. These two are my intellectual hero’s
Heroes
God help us all!!!
Stephen I can understand but Joe is not an intellectual giant.
You must be seeing double. There is only one Dr. Stephen Meyer and he's not a twin as far as I know.
@@josephbrown9685He’s no dummy. He’s very intelligent, but not spiritually wise. Big difference. Stephen has both. Rare indeed
I find it more amazing that these humans can break it down more to lay persons (us) to a point that we can understand. Bottom line; God exists. At what point do we need more? Understand with an open mind. Begin to comprehend. God is.
This was kind of difficult to listen to. Joe grilled this guy so insanely hard on literally every point.
I wish rogan would have questioned those two nutty guys he had on I think it was Terrence Howard and Billy carson, they were just spouting what sounded like bizarre off the wall pseudoscience rubbish but rogan didn't seem to question them very much for some reason
@@steventhompson399 The idea of a God that people will have to face on judgement day makes people uncomfortable, and so they respond by pushing back disproportionately hard, the way Joe did here.
Many points which the guest didn't even raise. Rogan isn't following along, is arguing against what he assumes the guest is talking about.
@@davidadiwego4608god and I will have a good joke about fools like Meyer
@@johnbatson8779 Meyer is a Fool? He has earned a PHD in philosophy and philosophy of science at Cambridge. He also debated and had discussions with brilliant minds from all over the science and philosophy world. If you think Meyer is a fool, then who do you think is intelligent?
C.S lewis wrote an essay titled "Meditation in a tool shed", for me its a profound essay because it showed me something in my thinking that I was taking for granted, after having heard that and now listening to Joe I feel like the essay may have been written for him 😂
BASED Meyer
At least he can spell
Rogan is super BASED. You BASED as well. Me too.
What's your point?🤷
BASED 🗿
Say you're from the dumbest generation without saying you're from the dumbest generation...
@@maxdoubled4800So based
Very smart man ! Why can’t we get politicians like him ? Can you imagine ?
I don't think he's cut out for that job. But I can imagine a better world where he would be.
Rogan says "I want to hear what your viewpoint is on this...." and then when Stephen Meyer this is what I believe" Rogan tries to convert him to his point of view."
@@matt200matt
Whatever excuses or reasons Rogan gives he’ll never escape the truth substantiated by fulfilled prophesies.
I don't think Joe was trying to convert Dr. Meyer to his point of view as much as it was that Joe was desperately insistent that Dr. Meyer's POV couldn't *possibly * be correct because that would require Joe to re-examine his entire world view, and that would threaten the very core of who he is; if psychology has taught us one thing, it's that humans will go to extraordinary lengths to avoid examining our core beliefs once they are set.
We need to get Cliffe Knechtle on here ASAP
I respect Joe, love his podcast.. But you can tell his world view was challenged with Meyer. Joe's hostility and push back shows just how profound this engagement was to Joe's beliefs.
Myer was calm, collective, and brought forth a lot of philosophical and scientific evidence for GOD.
Joe Rogan I can't help but think your trippin' thru this episode........I'm def entertained by your skepticism of absolute faith, and your push to understand it. I was uncomfortable but could not stop listening. Thankyou.
Joe casually, debating philosphy in great manners, with one of the greatest thinker of all time, thanks
When I think of the big bang I am reminded of Pslam 19 "The heavens declare the glory of God; the skies proclaim the work of his hands"
Only 260k views???
Should be at least 1M
Awesome episode! I love your guest and can’t wait to read his books!!!
Wouldn't it be nice to have politicians who were this articulate?
Joe was on the ropes this whole episode
Joe, you have too many Christians praying for God to open your eyes and heart.
Huh?
@@angelamattson4892rage bait bots I imagine
I love how curious joe is about everything...... but religion, he presses the most which i find most curious
Joe Rogan is who he is because he allows others to speak. This interview is telling. He isn't open to hearing a reason for God and sought to explain everything Stephen Meyer said in terms of the kind of atheist tropes found in a Neil DeGrasse Tyson episdode.
Stephen Meyer does an excellent job describing the evidence that there is no doubt that God exist.
Now this is a humble man, Tyson could learn a thing
He's a con man. You ever hear of good cop bad cop? Yeah it's the same police dept. There's more than one sales tactic, moran.
This has one of the lowest recent view counts while being one of the best episodes recently
I’m so happy he has him in here. Please don’t compare him to Terrence or Billy. This man knows actual science. Whether you agree with him or not is fine but he’s not a kook
Bravo Mr Meyer!
Why am I being flooded with Old Rogan podcasts?
I was thinking the exact same thing wtf is going on?
I think they are uploading the podcasts which were exclusive to spotify.
Because they are shady the heat came through
@@niikiitssflood me with every podcast what a patient geniune genius. That's hard work playing this role especially if your not interested. Thanks Joe and guest speakers! Meet the World!
Jamie just uploaded 500+ vids from the podcast ...Thats what someone was saying on another video.
We understand what? Ourselves? Explaining ourselves with limited understanding is like explaining science without thought. Science is the manifestation of a question. God is the question and the answer. God is the answer we seek. He has answers all. We need to not seek our answers with immediacy but will eventually find His will. We are self instead of being Him. He is us and we are Him. He wants us to love Him. Once we understand Him, we cannot not love Him. It is impossible not to do otherwise.
Meyer makes some great arguments
Love Stephen C Meyer, please have John Carson Lennox on! 🙏
Lost a lot of respect for Joe with this experience. Don't understand why he thought being combative was the way to go. Though I am not a religious person myself, I find Stephen Meyer to be very engaging and interesting.
Great episode, love to listen to Dr. Meyer’s talk always ❤
I wonder if joe realizes that he doesn't press non biblical or secular views using the bible like he presses biblical views using secular thought. He should.
Why would he. The bible is just one of many books and is no ultimate arbiter. Why wouldn’t he use ancient Mayan teachings or texts, they are written by people too? Your statement makes no sense.
@rarebirdjones I think he should bc the bible is the topic in several of the answers. Just use a more balanced approach. I don't think there is anything wrong with him using other writings or secular ideas just don't leave the bible out of that process. It's there too.
Me and this guy together would make a great case for God evidentiary, experiential, philosophical, and spiritual.
That was deep.Well done Joe and Stephen.👏
This is an ID historian of science, but Joe keeps going personal. He doesn't ask why, where, who, how of ID science. Instead he goes to personal theology and philosophy. Joe needs to run this back 100%
If I were that judge, I would have replied to Darrow's defense : "I am sentencing these two to death because of the infinite forces at work through the millions of years of evolutionary processes have programmed me to do so."
Couldn't you also say "I'm not sentencing them, because my evolution is telling me not to"?
@@419 You could, but not me.
@@LLPOF Okay well it's just your opinion vs mine then. So why is yours right?
@@419 Well, if I believe as you do and I have no objective standard for moral values, then yes, you are correct, it is just your opinion vs mine. I believe this wondrous universe has meaning because of the righteous God who created it and has established a basic morality in everyone's heart. That is why I think I am correct. You, of course, can follow your own path. You have that right.
@@LLPOF I believe the same thing you do. I just assumed that since you used evolution as a basis for your moral judgement that you didn't have a true objective source of morality.
To admit the existence of God means not living in sin. Getting high is not a connection to God. Joe isn't ready to put that down yet.
Pretty cool that all the road blocks he throws out just prove creation to be true❤❤❤
Imagine, Joe trying to convince Dr Meyer of what his experience was with Jesus... I have no words. Doesn't have a clue. A great part of this interview was wasted on Joe trying to figure out why Dr Meyer believes in Jesus rather than on Dr Meyer's work. Joe doesn't have a clue of the spiritual and it's obvious. Wish Joe would just shut up and let his guest talk about their work.
Joe is trying hard God not to exist. Tough luck Joe. God bless you Dr. Meyer, you are full of wisdom.
Joe is literally dogging him hard on his experience of God , he has never dogged a guest so hard. Joe trying to get Steven to admit his experience was do to other circumstances than god ....thats why Steven said, " this is counter productive"... referring to Joe cutting him off consistently when trying to explain his experience with god. Pathetic in Joe's behalf 😮
A lot of Joe’s questions I imagine were answered in his Wes Huff interview. SO EXCITED TO SEE IT!! Is it out yet??
The biggest blunder science has made is eliminating the Creator out of creation. - Walter Russell.
This was an interesting conversation. Calm on both sides. Helped me to assess the arguments fairly.
Hopefully this brings people closer to christ!
It amazes me how he sits there, all giddy, and gobbles up whatever BS guests like Billy Carson or Terrence Howard shove down his throat, yet he draws the line at Christianity and calls it cultish. Think he’s been hit in the head a few times at this point..
Rather than focus on joes demeanor, focus on the Dr.'s responses. They were clear, concise and respectful. This speaks volumes to Dr. Meyers intellect, which obviously outweighs Rogan's. When interviewing terrence howard, Joe actually talks with someone who hasnt the slightest clue of what they're talking about, which mirrors his intellect on the subject. Joe is a smart guy, but come on, he isnt "educated" as a lot of his guests are.
I learn so much from some of joes guests. these ones are awesome. the entertainment ones can be funny though, glad he puts this stuff out there for people without access to these kinda people
Thank ‘god’ Joe Rogan actually showed up for this one 💪🏽
Jo assumes that when one finds faith, they gain comfort from joining a club. A lot of people who “adopt’ the “thought” of god, do so surrounded by opposition and some completely alone. I feel Jo is trying to diminish this connection to a desperate need to belong to something rather than an involuntary personal revelation that unfortunately one cannot possibly understand until it happens to them. Yes young people can work themselves into a frenzy over a lot of things, it’s not “cool” to follow Jesus in a lot of places in this world, what one tends to receive it ridicule, not comfort from joining a club. You cannot prove that you are in love to someone else, you cannot prove faith to someone else. It’s about you and the one.