Can't wait to watch this! Teamfourstars recent DBZ abridged commentaries have been fantastic. Those three guys have this unbelievable comedic chemistry and its clear to see why they were so successful.
Káiser Eko has a sick burn there: Takahata: *imitates alien suction noises* Kaiser: oh, God! Takahata: what you don't like my sucking sounds? Kaiser : Hey I use all your lines
I think my favorite small, sub joke in DBZA is the Toriyama bird, where Goku tells the bird to “teach a dinosaur to ride atop a ball”, and No. 16 meets the same bird later on
I'm so glad I got confirmation that the International Channel actually existed, I almost thought I dreamed up those sub-less Japanese episodes of Dragon Ball Z.
HOLY SHIT I have been watching DBD for like 6 years now and never expected to see someone from TFS on the channel. So dope. Kaiser is so talented and he seemed to be the Dragonball lore guy of the TFS crew so its great to see him on here nerding out with you.
Most people don't remember this, but the first 10 or 20 episodes of Dragon Ball in Latin America were based on a previous dub by Video Doblajes called Zero y el Dragón Magico, which in turn was based on Harmony Gold's dub. Goku was Zero, Krillin was Cachito, Oolong was Mao Mao and Yamcha was Zedaki. This is the dub that was aired in Argentina's public television way before Magic Kids existed. Televisa redubbed those episodes and brought back the japanese names (mostly), but kept lots of oddities, so the Kame Hame Ha was called Glacial Wave, the Dragon Balls were called Fire Balls, etc. For example, the episode in which Roshi destroys Gyumaoh's mountain is called "Master Roshi's Glaciar Wave". It took about 50 episodes until the last few oddities finally disappeared.
To add on to the "Tsufurian/Tuffle" discussion at 31:46, the Blue Water dub of Dragon Ball GT actually used a middle ground name: "Tsuffle". Basically the FUNimation dub name, but with the Ts from the original Japanese restored. Simple, but it works, and I personally really like it, which is why it's my preferred name-choice for those guys.
Here in Arcentina, for late 80s/ early 90s kids, huge hit. Faithful dub with minimal censorship, it was broadcast mainly by the Magic Kids network. And we actually started with original DB. Also tons of merchandising which spoiled parts way ahead. Even the movies were released on vhs.
To this day I still don't understand why in the Latin American dub they used the opening of the Cell Arc for the Saiyan and Freeza Arc... They spoiled Goku and Vegeta SSJ and Future Trunks hundreds of episodes ahead of time.
@@Blasckk OH MY GOD, RIGHT?? I remember watching early Freeza Arc as a kid in Brazil and seeing Goku as a Super Saiyan in the intro. But honestly if anything that made me extremely excited. I absolutely HAD to watch the show every single day because I couldn't miss the moment when he turned Super Saiyan for the first time.
@@Blasckk my guess is that they just picked one and edited the whole thing by bunchs of episodes. It was spoiled anyway by the toys and sticker albums. If anything, it made us excited about it.
OMG THIS IS AMAZING! The joining of titans! I had hoped a collab might happen someday given both of you being so big and so active on Kanzenshuu. Thank you Lance and Scott!
The subject of Dragon Ball names is such an interesting one, especially for me since I'm from Latin America and sometimes we use TOTALLY different names and pronunciations in this side of the fandom. We call Chi-Chi "Milk" because Chi-Chi means tits so they censored that, but they were totally okay with Mr. Satan lol. Also some people seem to think Dr. Gero's name is Maki Gero because of a translation mistake and we can't decide on how to pronounce Vegeta (which is a non-issue in English). Hearing more about your experiences and Kaiser's was really fun, would love if you did a Part 3 of those videos talking about "Those Weird Dragon Ball Names". I love those videos!
Really glad to have the opportunity to listen to both of you discuss these topics. As a fan of the show, games, and behind the scenes of the different productions is awesome hearing from other fans who are deeply involved in those topics in different ways whether as research and or entertainment.
The Sanzu River story is interesting after seeing Power Rangers Samurai, which is largely a direct translation of Shinkenger, but it just uses the term "Sanzu River" _without_ clarifying or comparing to other concepts, to try to _hide_ the religious origins. It was also funny to learn that "Ji" was treated as the mentor's actual name when it was derived from an affectionate nickname meaning "old man." Who knows how many Sakuras have suffered the same dub pronunciation problem as Dabura?
Random aside on names, I too continue using "Krillin" because it's just easier, but "Blooma" has become totally ingrained into my mind as her name ever since I started watching DBD. It sounds better, feels more natural, and actually conveys the intended pun.
@@witchboy44 I mean, that first episode of DBD kinda serves as a test of sorts. A LOT of people drop it right away because of the Blooma debacle. We that remain either don't mind Blooma at all or become Blooma pilled lol
The fact that I had, and still have, episodes of DB in Nippon Golden Network, IChannel, and Real Media files. I'm the only guy who understands ALL of this.
33:40 I always thought a good way to bring “tsufurujin” to English would be Tufrian. An anagram of Fruit + the “ian” suffix, and it rolls off the tongue really well.
@dekufiremage7808 But "Saiyan" comes from "yasai", a 100%-Japanese word. "Tsufurujin" is based on "furuutsu", which, granted, is Japanese for "fruit", but it is also literally the English word "fruit" said with Japanese phonemes. So I think it's fair to bring it closer to English when we're adapting it. I mean, if we were to stick with "Tsufurian" for "Tsufurujin", logic dictates Bulma/Blooma should be Buruma over here too. After all, burumaa is a Japanese word, even though it's derived from the English bloomers. It's the same thing.
In Europe (France, Spain and Portugal) Mr. Satan's name had another issue, as the French translation (which was then translated into Spanish and Portuguese) had originally translated Picollo's name as Satan Petit Coeur, which means Little Heart of Satan (Coraçãozinho de Satan in Portuguese), so the name was already taken by the time Mr. Satan was introduced, and they named him Hercules instead... but before he showed up, you had some cards being sold on newstands, which not only showcased the Buu sage (when in Portugal they were still on Namek), but it also gave the names, so Mr. Satan was named Mr. Satan there, and it surprised me when he showed and was called Hercules.
In Spain, this is half true. Piccolo is called Pikolo with an accent in the first o, so Mr Satan is just Satán. But the dub translation is based in the French one like you said. Maybe true for Catalan tho.
Loved this :D Could you do a part 2, where you talk more about the series itself? Like favourite characters, arcs and storylines.And ofc least favorite things about Dragon Ball, to make the video more spicy. I think it would be really interesting to hear you talk about :)
1:14:25 Another fun fact that's relevant to what's being talked about: In the FUNimation dub of OG DB, the title they used for episode 100, "Life?! Death?! A Last Resort", was "The Spirit Cannon", referring to the Tri-Beam/Kikōhō. I have no idea why they decided to change the name for the episode title specifically, when in that dub they still used "Tri-Beam". But! Blue Water, because they used the FUNi script as a jumping-off point for their dub while they slowly transitioned to adapting straight from the original Japanese instead of just referencing it (like a Bible translation), actually decided to use that name in their dub of OG DB, so the Kikōhō in the Blue Water dub is called the "Spirit Cannon". Which is a much cooler name than fuckin' Tri-Beam. Kinda wish it was used in Abridged, as that clapback at Cell from Tien would still work. It would just be "S-Spirit Can-Go Fuck Yourself..." instead. Still works!
Loved hearing the chat, as someone that comes from a country where many of the original japanese names were kept, including Kuririn and Mr.Satan, it was an enjoyable discussion. Also because the two are some of my favourite writting on Dragon Ball content: Kaiser great comedy and storyline on the source material, Mistare incredibly well done research and analysis video, and both respecting and bringing up the source material to people that are not all familiar (like using Unmei no Hi: Tamashi tai Tamashi on your Cell arc related projects, I ended up loving both the original song and the cover done to DBZA).
My first exposure to the Japanese version was on UA-cam around 2006 or 2007. Having played Buu Fury on the GBA, I wanted to go reminisce about the show and stumble upon many clips on UA-cam that use Japanese audio like Gohan's SSJ2 transformation or Vegeta's Final Flash and watched most of the Buu Sage in Japanese with Spanish subtitles. I also came across alot Dragon Ball original content that hasn't been dubbed, like the Plan to Eradicate Saiyian and Yo! Son Goku and His Friends.
I just want to say, as a member of your international audience, it's always a blast when you use the original Japanese names or terms, because that's what most of us outside the US recognize too. Sure, you're American so it's totally fair that DBZA for instance is full of references to the American dub(s), which we can appreciate too in some level, thansk to of all the games which are almost never localized in other languages. But honestly, as a Brazilian fan,to hear you guys use the likes of "Tenshinhan", "Genki-Dama", "Kienzan", has always been a treat! As for DBD, it's just so much easier to follow the dissection when you use the original names too. And it's extremely rare, too. Sadly, most internet content is in English and as such it's hard to find Dragon Ball stuff that isn't extremely influenced by the American versions. So I'm very thankful for MistareFusion and DBD for providing us with so much content that can speak to people from all around the world, not just Americans!
@@Galvatronover Think of it this way: if fans of the American dub groan whenever they hear Kienzan or Kikoho, you can imagine international fans will collectively groan when they hear Destructo Disc or Tri Beam. It's not the end of the world, but it'd be better for everyone if we just used the same names. And what's better than the original names to make sure everyone is on the same page?
@@Vashkey I got to see the Suncoast TV ads that always mentioned Bardock Father of Goku and History of Trunks at the end! I've never been there either, but at least I knew those two mythical stories were on video somewhere there!
1:16:56-1:17:05 Funny enough, Krillin does say "Taiyōken" in episode 22 and episode 38 of Kai, but Goku and Cell still say "Solar Flare" when they use the technique.
RE: Bra v. Bulla, I feel like I'm coming from a weird place where I got into Dragon Ball via the funimation dub, so a lot of those versions of those names are well known to me, but I was familiar with GT from the internet and whatnot years before Funimation got around to dubbing it, so "Bulla" has always been wrong to my ears. Also, while "Hercule" was the version I was introduced to initially, I always loved "Mr. Satan" and read the former as an obvious bit of sanitation. You can say I've always been something of a Satanist.
We also had the International Channel near Chicago. I remember the episodes airing I think at 7 PM Sundays Central Time in an hour block. I remember watching all of the Buu saga this way while Frieza Saga was still airing on Toonami. To think how much has changed since then.
I think I downloaded that exact Goku vs. Majin Vegeta Real Media clip. Then spent a whole day trying to find a media player online that would play it. All on dialup
It’s so weird to me that Viz uses Hercule still today. I know they tend to like to keep things consistent (Bardock excluded) with what they’ve done before. But that one’s still odd to me.
Can corroborate the Latin American Spanish dub do on occasion coincide with the Japanese / English translated manga names, though often time it probably comes from the language itself instead of being faithful (for instance Kakaroto just sounds more natural since names tend to end in vowels in Spanish). Others do take from other translations, I do believe we call Krillin and Bulma as so. However for things like attack names they are VERY faithful; we use genkidama, makankosappo, dodonpa, aaaall the good stuff
Ah, there was a short period of my teenage years where I resigned to call him Torankusu lol. In addition to "Japanese version go brrrrr", I was also of the mindset that the name puns of Dragon Ball were lame and needed to sound more "unique", and obviously Japanese approximations sounded alien to my dumbass teen self. Thankfully, that didn't last long, and even more thankfully, I didn't ever refer to him as such in online discussions. And now I recognize the name puns for the true uniqueness they bring to the series.
First exposure I had to the Japanese voiceover work was the Dragon Ball Z: The Legend game for the Sega Saturn... which originally was only released in Japan, but because DBZ had become so popular in France, Spain and Portugal, it was released here in early to mid 1997, and it featured the original audio with text translated into French. It also had the effect of spoiling the entire anime, which at the time was still airing the Saiyan Saga over here.
The biggest problem as far as Gokuu's voice goes is that people skip Dragon Ball. For people that don't skip half of the series, that's just a natural progression of his voice. And about the names, I didn't grow up with the English dub, so, took quite a while to encounter those names, and they are dumb, but I don't really care as long as converting them to katakana leads right back to the original name, that's my very loose standard. And as far as what I write, I tend to go more Japanese than most, but I generally stick with names that people could actually look up online (along with the title) and find the character, because nobody that I talk to knows Dragon Ball at all, and also just to be understandable. So, I go with Kuririn (though Krillin does go right back to Kuririn if you turn it into katakana, but also, why change it when that's not the way that I say his name?), but I keep Bulma. Which is not even wrong, it is both a valid romanization and is in the original. Ultimately it doesn't matter to me too much because it definitely doesn't matter to the Japanese. Only the kana do. And if you watch in Japanese, you know how their names are actually said, so, it's all fine.
What gets me about the Hercule situation is that I still see the name used in official manga and game translations, but can you even watch an English dub that still uses it? It appears all the rereleases and streams of the show are derived from the uncut versions that only use "Mister Satan", so new fans will have no context for where "Hercule" first entered the picture in their territory! This is why it's important to preserve recordings of the Toonami broadcasts and such, I think!
In that spirit, I like to say many of the pokemon names and terminology in their original japanese. Like Hitokage, Satoshi or Monster Ball. I think its neat.
I have not once came across anyone who knows or uses the original Japanese names so your would be first. There are so many localization changes with Pokemon that I wouldn't even know were to begin. xD
I have not once came across anyone who knows or uses the original Japanese names so your would be first. There are so many localization changes with Pokemon that I wouldn't even know were to begin. xD
As one of the latin american fans who appreciates pronouncing Goku correctly and watched DB first, Kaiserneko's creative perspective was incredibly important for me to connect with DBZA. It wasn't an exclusive club for people watching the english dubs (an easy pitfall when the abridging scene started) and that made me and millions more fall in love with it, and even appreciate things the actual english dubs have.
Personally, I've never understood why Funimation continues to refuse to use Goku's full name. Like, I'm sure there was some asinine reason they dropped it in the olden days of 1998 (probably thought it'd confuse American kids or something), but nowadays, I'm pretty sure even most dub fans are aware the character's full name is "Son Goku", so why continue to pretend it doesn't exist? Otherwise, my least favorite dubism might be the whole "Tsuru Sen'nin/Shen/Hero" debacle.
They used it one time in the Kai dub where Super Saiyan Gokou makes his big 'ol speech against Freeza on Namek. I can't think of any other time where they use his full name.
@KaiserNeko You don't actually have Nappa call him "Mark Hercule Satan"! He calls him "Mark Satan" and then says he doesn't like the first name and asks Vegeta if he likes "Hercule" better. So the bad joke you don't like was never there to begin with
For the brazillian dub, we use : gokuu (similar pronunciation to you guys), saiyajin, namekusei, satan (similar to how MF pronounces), kuririn, makankosapo, kienzan, genki dama, taiyoken, rogafufuken, kikohoh (the first episodes of z called it kikoho-dah), dodonpa, kami-sama (piccolo just calls him kami though), piccolo daimaoh, tenshinhan, shen, senhor kaioh, bills instead of beerus, chiatzu was changed to chaos, dabura (with the same pronunciation as jp), we also kept the original music THANK GOD!... except for the insert songs, sadly. We kept bulma, we originally used bra but it was changed to buula, vegeta's attacks were translated to portuguese in dbz ,except the galick ho, which was originaly called that, but was changed to galick gun (post 2013), the other attacks are also in english now... they always were in english in the old movies though... weird. Kaioshin is another inconsistency case, he was originaly called supremo senhor kaioh (supreme lord kaioh), in gt it was changed to supremo kaioh-sama, and post 2013 he started being called kaioshin. Edit: we also pronounce pan like the japanese, because the japanese actually stole the word from portuguese (pão = pan)
53:30 Holy crap somebody mentioned that anime block! I've never heard anybody else mention since it aired on TV... ...nor have I been able to spell it...
@@devilskind92 I had to look this up, but it appears that it's derived from Galician-Portugese. This is the variant of portugese spoken at the time of borrowing. It appears that when Galician and Portugese broke into separate languages that Galician retained the old pronunciation from Galician-Portugese. That pronunciation is pan and is relatively identical to the Japanese pronunciation.
I used to be all for name consistency, but I’ve waned in recent years. Dragon Ball (especially in English markets) is anything but consistent most of the time. I was first exposed to the show with episodes switching between the Kikuchi, Johnson and Faulconer scores, in tandem with the jarring season 4 voice changes that came from redubbing seasons 1-3, so I’m used to not everything adding up.
In the weebiest justification, they're likely going with how that word is pronounced with a Japanese dialect. But yes, linguistically speaking, we should pronounce it the same way we do Abra-Kadabra
To be honest I love people who pronounce the names however they want. If people want to say Saiyan or Kuririn, Torankusu, Tuffles, General Tao, Hercule, King Kai, Muten Roshi, ect. Im all for that. I think of the Japanese dub of Star Trek, they changed Sulu to Kato, and Scotty to Charlie. The reason behind these changes are interesting and are a conversation ice breaker. I remember when I visited Japan and telling my friends that and they were like "Whaaaaa?" On the topic of Satan's name, My Head Cannon is "Mr. Mark Hercule Savage Satan III"
Mark is his legal name, Hercule Savage was his changed name when he became a rising star, Satan was his heel / villain era, and now he's stuck with it.
I think "Tuffle" is an attempt to reverse fruit, but modified a bit to sound like a more natural word. Fruit tends with a t, Tuffle starts with a T Fruit has a U Sound, the second letter of Tuffle is U but it's pronounced differently Fruit starts with Fr, Tuffle swaps the R for an L and adds an E so it looks right. As for as alternate things you could go with, Toofra would probably be the best way to preserve the pun, though I think Toofle would also work
well, "Pan" is the Japanese word for Bread. Le Pain is the French word for bread that's pronounced very similarly. But going off the spelling, it's just the Japanese word.
I kind of have an interesting Dragon Ball story Back in 2009, I got into the series through my school library, I had heard about Dragon Ball through some kids here and there back in the 2000's and of course, flash animations referencing the series (Super Mario Bros. Z anyone?) But I was always in the library every lunch break due to my own social anxiety at the time, and I saw the first three volumes of Dragon Ball, not Z, DRAGON BALL, the actual start of the manga I read those volumes so much that the library took note of it and actually bought both Viz Manga box sets just so I could read them And as a result, I actually started a small cult following at school Kids were renting volumes quite frequently, Kids who even don't watch Anime wanted to see what it was about, and they were even impressed This was also JUST before Kai had aired in Japan too
I still think Bulla sounds way to similar to Bulma. The first time I watched GT as a kid I was so confused because I had no idea who she was and on the GBA Video cart I watched it on, it was hard to tell that they said "Bulla" not "Bulma" so I was confused that they called Vegeta her dad and assumed it was a weird mistranslation lol.
I'm not sure what you mean. There's a long "e" sound in Vegeta. We say it. Unless I cut it out, we even talk about it in this video. But if not, I discussed it in the naming video I did earlier this year. ua-cam.com/video/U8zWGGrQf4M/v-deo.html
@@MistareFusion Nevermind, i thought there's supposed to be an "e" sound after the "ʒ". But seems like it's almost non-existent and doesn't matter that much. Just wanted to ask cause that's how people in my country usually call the character. That's, like, "vedʒeta" or something. Different question then, are you familiar with the fact that the Funimation dub/Crunchyroll sub "Ultra Instinct" is an adaptation? It's really supposed to be "The Secret Of Self-Centered" or "The Secret Of Selfishness". I personally just call it Migatte No Gokui since nobody calls Kaioken the First of the King of the World. Also, love your work.
No they do not. Piccolo is an English word that refers to a type of flute. You're not going to pronounce it any way except the English way if you're speaking English lmao.@@GMan873
Hello, im Maxtime(Ignore what youtube says here, it refuse to let me put my nickname), and im a weeb. Im from Latin America and i love to watch anything in it's original language. I encounter Dragon Ball thanks to a local TV program that happen in one of the famous amusement parks, where they put both first an episode of Dragon Ball and then an episode of Dragon Ball Z, they also showed other animes like Slayers, Ranma 1/2, no Sailor Moon weirdly enough but they did Sakura Card Capture. Here they almost all of the original Japanese names with few exceptions like Kuririn which was Krillin and ironically, they didn't censure a lot including blood, but they censure Chi-Chi's name to Milk... I mean it's close still to the pum, but still weird (Yes we also have Bra here... Not Bulla... Don't ask...)... I grew up using words like Saiya-jin and Super Saiya-jin, Tsufuru(We use Tsufurian too weirdly enough not Tsufuru-jin), human's(Which i didn't know it was mean to refer to all mortals as a kid and i through the Kaioshin didn't understood with the kind of being he was talking too the Saiya-jins). And since i grew watching both, i never had a conflict between both of then, in fact, while Cha-la-head-cha-la is everyone's favorite song(And we have a translated version here), my favorite it's Fantastical adventure(That's how the name of the song translated to Spanish). And my favorite story arc is the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai, and i just love it. And i like the manga more then the anime, this changed over time, and it was thanks to my encounters with Naruto(Which i just lost the love for it over time) and Bleach(Which i love until to this day even then ending, it was the first manga that let me with a satisfying ending like Dragon Ball did) I also used to be an elitist about the original names, on everything, but i grew out of it... Just respect who i named then whatever you like then or not. I also just cannot not watch anything in it's original language, i just completely dislike dubs, with one exception and this exception, it's because i grew up with it. Dragon Ball, i watch both, Japanese and Latin Spanish. First the Japanese and then the Latin Spanish, i just love them both the same, it's the only case i have regarding a franchise, all the others the moment i hear the original language... I just can't bring myself with the exception of Dragon Ball. P.S: Also for some reason we censure Beerus to Bills... I don't know why, we drink beer a lot here...
It's KaiserNeko. He knows we love him.
I understood that reference
I guess?
@@TylerCharlesFisherYo know we love him, Tyler Charles Fisher
We do love THE KaiserNeko
Two people who care about correctly pronouncing names and words! Love it.
Can't wait to watch this! Teamfourstars recent DBZ abridged commentaries have been fantastic. Those three guys have this unbelievable comedic chemistry and its clear to see why they were so successful.
Káiser Eko has a sick burn there:
Takahata: *imitates alien suction noises*
Kaiser: oh, God!
Takahata: what you don't like my sucking sounds?
Kaiser : Hey I use all your lines
I think my favorite small, sub joke in DBZA is the Toriyama bird, where Goku tells the bird to “teach a dinosaur to ride atop a ball”, and No. 16 meets the same bird later on
He does WHAT?!?
I'm so glad I got confirmation that the International Channel actually existed, I almost thought I dreamed up those sub-less Japanese episodes of Dragon Ball Z.
Fantastic talk! You guys are great.
Thanks so much!
HOLY SHIT I have been watching DBD for like 6 years now and never expected to see someone from TFS on the channel. So dope. Kaiser is so talented and he seemed to be the Dragonball lore guy of the TFS crew so its great to see him on here nerding out with you.
I didn't exactly expect it but Kaiser has been a patrón for a long while now
I don't think I've ever said this before, but I think my favorite part of this video was all the talk about Satan.
hell yea
Haven't listened to it yet but i'm not that surprised because Lance has some great takes on Satan.
Hail Satan!
Most people don't remember this, but the first 10 or 20 episodes of Dragon Ball in Latin America were based on a previous dub by Video Doblajes called Zero y el Dragón Magico, which in turn was based on Harmony Gold's dub. Goku was Zero, Krillin was Cachito, Oolong was Mao Mao and Yamcha was Zedaki. This is the dub that was aired in Argentina's public television way before Magic Kids existed.
Televisa redubbed those episodes and brought back the japanese names (mostly), but kept lots of oddities, so the Kame Hame Ha was called Glacial Wave, the Dragon Balls were called Fire Balls, etc. For example, the episode in which Roshi destroys Gyumaoh's mountain is called "Master Roshi's Glaciar Wave". It took about 50 episodes until the last few oddities finally disappeared.
Two of my favourite DBTubers in one video? Le Gasp!
This was such a fun listen! I loved hearing about the Hierarchy of Peeves
“I’m glad to see that bra persists no matter what”
-Scott Frerichs
So awesome to see you here! Bunch of big big dragonball youtubers in one place I didn’t expect
To add on to the "Tsufurian/Tuffle" discussion at 31:46, the Blue Water dub of Dragon Ball GT actually used a middle ground name: "Tsuffle". Basically the FUNimation dub name, but with the Ts from the original Japanese restored. Simple, but it works, and I personally really like it, which is why it's my preferred name-choice for those guys.
Y'know, I actually really appreciate just how chill the discussion turned out to be, as much as the description tried to make me think otherwise.
Here in Arcentina, for late 80s/ early 90s kids, huge hit. Faithful dub with minimal censorship, it was broadcast mainly by the Magic Kids network. And we actually started with original DB. Also tons of merchandising which spoiled parts way ahead. Even the movies were released on vhs.
To this day I still don't understand why in the Latin American dub they used the opening of the Cell Arc for the Saiyan and Freeza Arc... They spoiled Goku and Vegeta SSJ and Future Trunks hundreds of episodes ahead of time.
@@Blasckk OH MY GOD, RIGHT?? I remember watching early Freeza Arc as a kid in Brazil and seeing Goku as a Super Saiyan in the intro. But honestly if anything that made me extremely excited. I absolutely HAD to watch the show every single day because I couldn't miss the moment when he turned Super Saiyan for the first time.
@@Blasckk my guess is that they just picked one and edited the whole thing by bunchs of episodes. It was spoiled anyway by the toys and sticker albums. If anything, it made us excited about it.
OMG THIS IS AMAZING! The joining of titans! I had hoped a collab might happen someday given both of you being so big and so active on Kanzenshuu. Thank you Lance and Scott!
The subject of Dragon Ball names is such an interesting one, especially for me since I'm from Latin America and sometimes we use TOTALLY different names and pronunciations in this side of the fandom. We call Chi-Chi "Milk" because Chi-Chi means tits so they censored that, but they were totally okay with Mr. Satan lol. Also some people seem to think Dr. Gero's name is Maki Gero because of a translation mistake and we can't decide on how to pronounce Vegeta (which is a non-issue in English).
Hearing more about your experiences and Kaiser's was really fun, would love if you did a Part 3 of those videos talking about "Those Weird Dragon Ball Names". I love those videos!
I'd love to do another one of those!
Really glad to have the opportunity to listen to both of you discuss these topics. As a fan of the show, games, and behind the scenes of the different productions is awesome hearing from other fans who are deeply involved in those topics in different ways whether as research and or entertainment.
Saving this for a train ride tomorrow. Very excited
The Sanzu River story is interesting after seeing Power Rangers Samurai, which is largely a direct translation of Shinkenger, but it just uses the term "Sanzu River" _without_ clarifying or comparing to other concepts, to try to _hide_ the religious origins. It was also funny to learn that "Ji" was treated as the mentor's actual name when it was derived from an affectionate nickname meaning "old man."
Who knows how many Sakuras have suffered the same dub pronunciation problem as Dabura?
German naruto, sasuke and sakura do!
Random aside on names, I too continue using "Krillin" because it's just easier, but "Blooma" has become totally ingrained into my mind as her name ever since I started watching DBD. It sounds better, feels more natural, and actually conveys the intended pun.
This series has made us based and Blooma Pilled
@@witchboy44 I mean, that first episode of DBD kinda serves as a test of sorts. A LOT of people drop it right away because of the Blooma debacle. We that remain either don't mind Blooma at all or become Blooma pilled lol
Same!! Bulma has always been weird and clunky, I'm so glad MistareFusion introduced me to Blooma as an option.
I use Kuririn because I lived in two countries where he's called Kuririn xD
@@Mari_IzuWhich ones, if I may ask?
I distinctively remember discovering your channel because kaiserneko recommended it
The fact that I had, and still have, episodes of DB in Nippon Golden Network, IChannel, and Real Media files. I'm the only guy who understands ALL of this.
Absolutely adored this chat!!! I live for this kind of stuff tbh
The discussions about first finding DBZ are the same stories I have. It's so refreshing to know there are other nerds as bad as I am.
Lance your math joke at the end was the funniest thing you've ever said. I'm not sure if that's a good or a bad thing but it is most certain
Yesss 2 of my favorite creators together!!
33:40 I always thought a good way to bring “tsufurujin” to English would be Tufrian. An anagram of Fruit + the “ian” suffix, and it rolls off the tongue really well.
Half agreed, but then it's kind of weird to localize the pun for the tsufurujin but not for the saiyans.
@dekufiremage7808 But "Saiyan" comes from "yasai", a 100%-Japanese word. "Tsufurujin" is based on "furuutsu", which, granted, is Japanese for "fruit", but it is also literally the English word "fruit" said with Japanese phonemes. So I think it's fair to bring it closer to English when we're adapting it.
I mean, if we were to stick with "Tsufurian" for "Tsufurujin", logic dictates Bulma/Blooma should be Buruma over here too. After all, burumaa is a Japanese word, even though it's derived from the English bloomers. It's the same thing.
@@devilskind92 Alright yeah you've convinced me
In Europe (France, Spain and Portugal) Mr. Satan's name had another issue, as the French translation (which was then translated into Spanish and Portuguese) had originally translated Picollo's name as Satan Petit Coeur, which means Little Heart of Satan (Coraçãozinho de Satan in Portuguese), so the name was already taken by the time Mr. Satan was introduced, and they named him Hercules instead... but before he showed up, you had some cards being sold on newstands, which not only showcased the Buu sage (when in Portugal they were still on Namek), but it also gave the names, so Mr. Satan was named Mr. Satan there, and it surprised me when he showed and was called Hercules.
Pretty sure here in Spain he was still Mr.Satan but yeah the translation being based upon another translation gave us a whole lot of other problems.
In Spain, this is half true. Piccolo is called Pikolo with an accent in the first o, so Mr Satan is just Satán. But the dub translation is based in the French one like you said.
Maybe true for Catalan tho.
Loved this :D
Could you do a part 2, where you talk more about the series itself? Like favourite characters, arcs and storylines.And ofc least favorite things about Dragon Ball, to make the video more spicy. I think it would be really interesting to hear you talk about :)
1:14:25 Another fun fact that's relevant to what's being talked about: In the FUNimation dub of OG DB, the title they used for episode 100, "Life?! Death?! A Last Resort", was "The Spirit Cannon", referring to the Tri-Beam/Kikōhō.
I have no idea why they decided to change the name for the episode title specifically, when in that dub they still used "Tri-Beam". But! Blue Water, because they used the FUNi script as a jumping-off point for their dub while they slowly transitioned to adapting straight from the original Japanese instead of just referencing it (like a Bible translation), actually decided to use that name in their dub of OG DB, so the Kikōhō in the Blue Water dub is called the "Spirit Cannon". Which is a much cooler name than fuckin' Tri-Beam. Kinda wish it was used in Abridged, as that clapback at Cell from Tien would still work. It would just be "S-Spirit Can-Go Fuck Yourself..." instead. Still works!
Fun fact, Funimation actually misspelled it in their episode title card as "Spirit Canon", with one N.
Loved hearing the chat, as someone that comes from a country where many of the original japanese names were kept, including Kuririn and Mr.Satan, it was an enjoyable discussion.
Also because the two are some of my favourite writting on Dragon Ball content: Kaiser great comedy and storyline on the source material, Mistare incredibly well done research and analysis video, and both respecting and bringing up the source material to people that are not all familiar (like using Unmei no Hi: Tamashi tai Tamashi on your Cell arc related projects, I ended up loving both the original song and the cover done to DBZA).
I don't think the Terry Gross reference was super niche, especially for your audience. But I could be wrong haha! I loved it.
Love you both! Brings me back to the old days of watching Dragon Ball on bootleg VHS tapes
My first exposure to the Japanese version was on UA-cam around 2006 or 2007. Having played Buu Fury on the GBA, I wanted to go reminisce about the show and stumble upon many clips on UA-cam that use Japanese audio like Gohan's SSJ2 transformation or Vegeta's Final Flash and watched most of the Buu Sage in Japanese with Spanish subtitles. I also came across alot Dragon Ball original content that hasn't been dubbed, like the Plan to Eradicate Saiyian and Yo! Son Goku and His Friends.
I just want to say, as a member of your international audience, it's always a blast when you use the original Japanese names or terms, because that's what most of us outside the US recognize too.
Sure, you're American so it's totally fair that DBZA for instance is full of references to the American dub(s), which we can appreciate too in some level, thansk to of all the games which are almost never localized in other languages. But honestly, as a Brazilian fan,to hear you guys use the likes of "Tenshinhan", "Genki-Dama", "Kienzan", has always been a treat!
As for DBD, it's just so much easier to follow the dissection when you use the original names too. And it's extremely rare, too. Sadly, most internet content is in English and as such it's hard to find Dragon Ball stuff that isn't extremely influenced by the American versions. So I'm very thankful for MistareFusion and DBD for providing us with so much content that can speak to people from all around the world, not just Americans!
how is it harder to follow ?
@@Galvatronover Think of it this way: if fans of the American dub groan whenever they hear Kienzan or Kikoho, you can imagine international fans will collectively groan when they hear Destructo Disc or Tri Beam.
It's not the end of the world, but it'd be better for everyone if we just used the same names. And what's better than the original names to make sure everyone is on the same page?
This was a super interesting listen wouldn't even mind if you did more stuff like this
Shit I remember the international channel. I didn't get that and one of my friends did and I was so jealous. Kaiser must have been in a rich family
I also never got to go to Suncoast. Everyone told me how great it was but the closest one was like an hour away🥲
@@Vashkey I got to see the Suncoast TV ads that always mentioned Bardock Father of Goku and History of Trunks at the end! I've never been there either, but at least I knew those two mythical stories were on video somewhere there!
Not "rich" but definitely middle class. Which for some folks is ric I suppose. @.@
I discovered your channel through Kaiser mentioning you on Twitter, it’s only fitting that he’s featured on the channel! Y’all’s chat was wonderful 😊
1:16:56-1:17:05
Funny enough, Krillin does say "Taiyōken" in episode 22 and episode 38 of Kai, but Goku and Cell still say "Solar Flare" when they use the technique.
RE: Bra v. Bulla, I feel like I'm coming from a weird place where I got into Dragon Ball via the funimation dub, so a lot of those versions of those names are well known to me, but I was familiar with GT from the internet and whatnot years before Funimation got around to dubbing it, so "Bulla" has always been wrong to my ears. Also, while "Hercule" was the version I was introduced to initially, I always loved "Mr. Satan" and read the former as an obvious bit of sanitation. You can say I've always been something of a Satanist.
I like pronouncing it "Mister Saturn"
We also had the International Channel near Chicago. I remember the episodes airing I think at 7 PM Sundays Central Time in an hour block. I remember watching all of the Buu saga this way while Frieza Saga was still airing on Toonami. To think how much has changed since then.
What the hell?!? I don't understand how this doesn't have more views.
Honestly, I don't either. =P
I think I downloaded that exact Goku vs. Majin Vegeta Real Media clip. Then spent a whole day trying to find a media player online that would play it. All on dialup
Please do this again!! I live for this.
I also started calling her Blooma because MF's videos. It sounds cuter, represents the pun better and its honestly just fun to way. Blooma
Pan is also bread in spanish.
It’s so weird to me that Viz uses Hercule still today. I know they tend to like to keep things consistent (Bardock excluded) with what they’ve done before. But that one’s still odd to me.
Can corroborate the Latin American Spanish dub do on occasion coincide with the Japanese / English translated manga names, though often time it probably comes from the language itself instead of being faithful (for instance Kakaroto just sounds more natural since names tend to end in vowels in Spanish). Others do take from other translations, I do believe we call Krillin and Bulma as so. However for things like attack names they are VERY faithful; we use genkidama, makankosappo, dodonpa, aaaall the good stuff
Oh my god I remember the Blooma thread on the Daizex forum! I forgot that’s the first place I saw that spelling too
This is the best crossover
Ah, there was a short period of my teenage years where I resigned to call him Torankusu lol. In addition to "Japanese version go brrrrr", I was also of the mindset that the name puns of Dragon Ball were lame and needed to sound more "unique", and obviously Japanese approximations sounded alien to my dumbass teen self. Thankfully, that didn't last long, and even more thankfully, I didn't ever refer to him as such in online discussions. And now I recognize the name puns for the true uniqueness they bring to the series.
Oh shit, Damkylan! I didn't expect to see you here!
First exposure I had to the Japanese voiceover work was the Dragon Ball Z: The Legend game for the Sega Saturn... which originally was only released in Japan, but because DBZ had become so popular in France, Spain and Portugal, it was released here in early to mid 1997, and it featured the original audio with text translated into French. It also had the effect of spoiling the entire anime, which at the time was still airing the Saiyan Saga over here.
The biggest problem as far as Gokuu's voice goes is that people skip Dragon Ball. For people that don't skip half of the series, that's just a natural progression of his voice. And about the names, I didn't grow up with the English dub, so, took quite a while to encounter those names, and they are dumb, but I don't really care as long as converting them to katakana leads right back to the original name, that's my very loose standard.
And as far as what I write, I tend to go more Japanese than most, but I generally stick with names that people could actually look up online (along with the title) and find the character, because nobody that I talk to knows Dragon Ball at all, and also just to be understandable. So, I go with Kuririn (though Krillin does go right back to Kuririn if you turn it into katakana, but also, why change it when that's not the way that I say his name?), but I keep Bulma. Which is not even wrong, it is both a valid romanization and is in the original. Ultimately it doesn't matter to me too much because it definitely doesn't matter to the Japanese. Only the kana do. And if you watch in Japanese, you know how their names are actually said, so, it's all fine.
What gets me about the Hercule situation is that I still see the name used in official manga and game translations, but can you even watch an English dub that still uses it? It appears all the rereleases and streams of the show are derived from the uncut versions that only use "Mister Satan", so new fans will have no context for where "Hercule" first entered the picture in their territory! This is why it's important to preserve recordings of the Toonami broadcasts and such, I think!
In that spirit, I like to say many of the pokemon names and terminology in their original japanese. Like Hitokage, Satoshi or Monster Ball. I think its neat.
Or Pikachu, Nidoran, or Mew. Wonder what their English names are.
@@danielquinlan2457 =P
I have not once came across anyone who knows or uses the original Japanese names so your would be first. There are so many localization changes with Pokemon that I wouldn't even know were to begin. xD
I have not once came across anyone who knows or uses the original Japanese names so your would be first. There are so many localization changes with Pokemon that I wouldn't even know were to begin. xD
As one of the latin american fans who appreciates pronouncing Goku correctly and watched DB first, Kaiserneko's creative perspective was incredibly important for me to connect with DBZA. It wasn't an exclusive club for people watching the english dubs (an easy pitfall when the abridging scene started) and that made me and millions more fall in love with it, and even appreciate things the actual english dubs have.
Personally, I've never understood why Funimation continues to refuse to use Goku's full name. Like, I'm sure there was some asinine reason they dropped it in the olden days of 1998 (probably thought it'd confuse American kids or something), but nowadays, I'm pretty sure even most dub fans are aware the character's full name is "Son Goku", so why continue to pretend it doesn't exist?
Otherwise, my least favorite dubism might be the whole "Tsuru Sen'nin/Shen/Hero" debacle.
They used it one time in the Kai dub where Super Saiyan Gokou makes his big 'ol speech against Freeza on Namek. I can't think of any other time where they use his full name.
It's me! I got the NPR reference!
I'm also one of the 3 me and my grandma listen to NPR everyday
Been wanting to see you two collab!
The inevitable collab of awesome.
@KaiserNeko You don't actually have Nappa call him "Mark Hercule Satan"! He calls him "Mark Satan" and then says he doesn't like the first name and asks Vegeta if he likes "Hercule" better. So the bad joke you don't like was never there to begin with
Ooh, nice catch!
Oh right! STILL, Mark Satan is still unfortunately misleading. But nice catch.
For the brazillian dub, we use : gokuu (similar pronunciation to you guys), saiyajin, namekusei, satan (similar to how MF pronounces), kuririn, makankosapo, kienzan, genki dama, taiyoken, rogafufuken, kikohoh (the first episodes of z called it kikoho-dah), dodonpa, kami-sama (piccolo just calls him kami though), piccolo daimaoh, tenshinhan, shen, senhor kaioh, bills instead of beerus, chiatzu was changed to chaos, dabura (with the same pronunciation as jp), we also kept the original music THANK GOD!... except for the insert songs, sadly.
We kept bulma, we originally used bra but it was changed to buula, vegeta's attacks were translated to portuguese in dbz ,except the galick ho, which was originaly called that, but was changed to galick gun (post 2013), the other attacks are also in english now... they always were in english in the old movies though... weird. Kaioshin is another inconsistency case, he was originaly called supremo senhor kaioh (supreme lord kaioh), in gt it was changed to supremo kaioh-sama, and post 2013 he started being called kaioshin.
Edit: we also pronounce pan like the japanese, because the japanese actually stole the word from portuguese (pão = pan)
1:16:57 ah yes, they did use Taioken at least once in Kai. Krillin uses it when getting away from Dodoria.
OMG! MORE MISTARE FUSION!
53:30
Holy crap somebody mentioned that anime block! I've never heard anybody else mention since it aired on TV...
...nor have I been able to spell it...
Probably because it's not fondly remembered.
I love your videos and think you both look very nice.
Oh hey It Scott
1:11:59 This is super pedantic, but it's actually the portugese word for bread.
No, that's fair.
Portuguese for bread is "pão" though. And "pain" (French) sounds exactly like Pan's name, unlike "pão".
@@devilskind92 I had to look this up, but it appears that it's derived from Galician-Portugese. This is the variant of portugese spoken at the time of borrowing. It appears that when Galician and Portugese broke into separate languages that Galician retained the old pronunciation from Galician-Portugese. That pronunciation is pan and is relatively identical to the Japanese pronunciation.
Well this was an unexpected crossover.
Terry Gross! All Things Considered! Hell yeah!
Merci pour cette collaboration 👌👌
I also had the international channel I even used to watch the Spanish dub on Telemundo because it was uncensored
Powerful union of nerds
Btw mistarefusion either i didnt notice youve transitioned and are now called leila or i found your doppelganger!
Oh fuck yeah let's go
I used to be all for name consistency, but I’ve waned in recent years. Dragon Ball (especially in English markets) is anything but consistent most of the time.
I was first exposed to the show with episodes switching between the Kikuchi, Johnson and Faulconer scores, in tandem with the jarring season 4 voice changes that came from redubbing seasons 1-3, so I’m used to not everything adding up.
Love you guys 🌍❤️
Doesn't matter what people may say, just wear what you want bro ;)
Wouldn't the best way to say Dabra be "Dab-Ruh", instead of "Dah-Bruh". As in, the last syllables of "Ab-Ruh-Kuh-Dab-Ruh"?
In the weebiest justification, they're likely going with how that word is pronounced with a Japanese dialect.
But yes, linguistically speaking, we should pronounce it the same way we do Abra-Kadabra
... Who the hell pronounces abracadabra like that!?
@@samueloak1600 a Japanese non native English speaker?
@@SumTr011 I meant "Dab-ruh". What is that, what even is that?
@@samueloak1600 how do you pronounce it?
To be honest I love people who pronounce the names however they want. If people want to say Saiyan or Kuririn, Torankusu, Tuffles, General Tao, Hercule, King Kai, Muten Roshi, ect. Im all for that.
I think of the Japanese dub of Star Trek, they changed Sulu to Kato, and Scotty to Charlie. The reason behind these changes are interesting and are a conversation ice breaker. I remember when I visited Japan and telling my friends that and they were like "Whaaaaa?"
On the topic of Satan's name,
My Head Cannon is "Mr. Mark Hercule Savage Satan III"
Mark is his legal name, Hercule Savage was his changed name when he became a rising star, Satan was his heel / villain era, and now he's stuck with it.
@@aetherkid yes! Haha I love incorporating all into his name as part stage personality's Lore haha
I think "Tuffle" is an attempt to reverse fruit, but modified a bit to sound like a more natural word.
Fruit tends with a t, Tuffle starts with a T
Fruit has a U Sound, the second letter of Tuffle is U but it's pronounced differently
Fruit starts with Fr, Tuffle swaps the R for an L and adds an E so it looks right.
As for as alternate things you could go with, Toofra would probably be the best way to preserve the pun, though I think Toofle would also work
Those are some tough truffles
I watched the international channel!!
well, "Pan" is the Japanese word for Bread. Le Pain is the French word for bread that's pronounced very similarly. But going off the spelling, it's just the Japanese word.
The Japanese is a loan word from Portuguese, written pão. パン is the closest that they could get with Japanese phonetics.
What a breath of Fresh Air 😉
1:17:38 Scott would've gone with Mago Gosora
100%
Two worlds collide!!
Also your fit is cute
I kind of have an interesting Dragon Ball story
Back in 2009, I got into the series through my school library, I had heard about Dragon Ball through some kids here and there back in the 2000's and of course, flash animations referencing the series (Super Mario Bros. Z anyone?)
But I was always in the library every lunch break due to my own social anxiety at the time, and I saw the first three volumes of Dragon Ball, not Z, DRAGON BALL, the actual start of the manga
I read those volumes so much that the library took note of it and actually bought both Viz Manga box sets just so I could read them
And as a result, I actually started a small cult following at school
Kids were renting volumes quite frequently, Kids who even don't watch Anime wanted to see what it was about, and they were even impressed
This was also JUST before Kai had aired in Japan too
Them buying the other volumes is so nice of them!
@@Videospiel-Man5730 I was a regular visitor and I never caused trouble, was even friends with some of the student staff
The greatest Crossover
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAS
I'm one of the three people here that listens to NPR
I still think Bulla sounds way to similar to Bulma. The first time I watched GT as a kid I was so confused because I had no idea who she was and on the GBA Video cart I watched it on, it was hard to tell that they said "Bulla" not "Bulma" so I was confused that they called Vegeta her dad and assumed it was a weird mistranslation lol.
I got that reference!
Interesting video my dragon ball friends
So... Why do you pronounce "Goku" like in the original version, but you never pronounce the second "e" in "Vegeta" like in the original word?
I'm not sure what you mean. There's a long "e" sound in Vegeta. We say it. Unless I cut it out, we even talk about it in this video. But if not, I discussed it in the naming video I did earlier this year. ua-cam.com/video/U8zWGGrQf4M/v-deo.html
@@MistareFusion Nevermind, i thought there's supposed to be an "e" sound after the "ʒ". But seems like it's almost non-existent and doesn't matter that much. Just wanted to ask cause that's how people in my country usually call the character. That's, like, "vedʒeta" or something.
Different question then, are you familiar with the fact that the Funimation dub/Crunchyroll sub "Ultra Instinct" is an adaptation? It's really supposed to be "The Secret Of Self-Centered" or "The Secret Of Selfishness". I personally just call it Migatte No Gokui since nobody calls Kaioken the First of the King of the World.
Also, love your work.
They pronounce Piccolo's name wrong too.
No they do not. Piccolo is an English word that refers to a type of flute. You're not going to pronounce it any way except the English way if you're speaking English lmao.@@GMan873
Hello, im Maxtime(Ignore what youtube says here, it refuse to let me put my nickname), and im a weeb. Im from Latin America and i love to watch anything in it's original language.
I encounter Dragon Ball thanks to a local TV program that happen in one of the famous amusement parks, where they put both first an episode of Dragon Ball and then an episode of Dragon Ball Z, they also showed other animes like Slayers, Ranma 1/2, no Sailor Moon weirdly enough but they did Sakura Card Capture.
Here they almost all of the original Japanese names with few exceptions like Kuririn which was Krillin and ironically, they didn't censure a lot including blood, but they censure Chi-Chi's name to Milk... I mean it's close still to the pum, but still weird (Yes we also have Bra here... Not Bulla... Don't ask...)... I grew up using words like Saiya-jin and Super Saiya-jin, Tsufuru(We use Tsufurian too weirdly enough not Tsufuru-jin), human's(Which i didn't know it was mean to refer to all mortals as a kid and i through the Kaioshin didn't understood with the kind of being he was talking too the Saiya-jins). And since i grew watching both, i never had a conflict between both of then, in fact, while Cha-la-head-cha-la is everyone's favorite song(And we have a translated version here), my favorite it's Fantastical adventure(That's how the name of the song translated to Spanish). And my favorite story arc is the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai, and i just love it.
And i like the manga more then the anime, this changed over time, and it was thanks to my encounters with Naruto(Which i just lost the love for it over time) and Bleach(Which i love until to this day even then ending, it was the first manga that let me with a satisfying ending like Dragon Ball did)
I also used to be an elitist about the original names, on everything, but i grew out of it... Just respect who i named then whatever you like then or not. I also just cannot not watch anything in it's original language, i just completely dislike dubs, with one exception and this exception, it's because i grew up with it. Dragon Ball, i watch both, Japanese and Latin Spanish. First the Japanese and then the Latin Spanish, i just love them both the same, it's the only case i have regarding a franchise, all the others the moment i hear the original language... I just can't bring myself with the exception of Dragon Ball.
P.S: Also for some reason we censure Beerus to Bills... I don't know why, we drink beer a lot here...
The Dragon Ball fandom needs more Chads.
😅
Oh fuck it's kaiser.
I think I have a crush on fusion ngl
OH MY GOD I remember watching this channel only seeing the dbd of the 23rd tenkaichi. I am happy i rediscovered this channel again.
So glad to have you back!