This Fighter Jet Actually Flew in WW2 (And then the Allies Stole It) - The Me 262
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- Опубліковано 8 жов 2024
- Known as the Sturmvogel “Storm Bird” or Schwalbe “Swallow”, the German Messerschmitt Me 262 revolutionized warfare aviation and wreaked havoc on morale among the Allies during World War II. The very first fighter to use a jet engine, the Me 262 was faster and deadlier than any other fighter, but its mass production was complicated due to metal shortages, design challenges, and interference from the German leader himself. Yet, it was one of the most, if not the most, advanced aircraft used during World War II...
As images and footage of actual events are not always available, Dark Docs sometimes utilizes similar historical images and footage for dramatic effect. All content on Dark Docs is researched, produced, and presented in historical context for educational purposes. -
Made by BMW, performed well but was too expensive to upkeep... Holy shit
Just like BMW's cars.
@@Hat-
But nothing like their motorcycles
Jumo 004 engine had life of a few hours and YES like BMW cars overengineered over rated and overpriced. WOW what a trifecta
@@jw451 They had a life of 24-25 hours because a MOH and a total life of 60 hours, given the right metals though, that went up to 200-250 hours
@@southernbear736 regardless the British jet engines where superior in every way. WOW the things one gets to do when there is no clients and no work to do during the beginning of a pandemic crisis in Syd OZ on a Monday. #gofigure :P
Being a BMW owner, I’m veeeeeery familiar with their “engine problems”. LOL!
Motorcycles, not familiar with their cars having engine issues?
Lazar Jancic just off the top of my head, look to N63 (turbo V-8) and BMW V-10 .
Yea because the reciprocating engine in your bmw is the same as the turbo jets installed in the 262 🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻
Yup. I’ve got the N63tu in my X6.
@@Markymark09 well, the same company that made these make the vehicles today... just saying problems are problems with BMW no matter what. I know also the problems as I’ve had my m5 in the shop numerous times. They blame it on the rural areas I live in 😂. One of the few times I’ve actually wanted to give my lease back early.
Seriously, who needs the history channel when you have
1- Dark Docs
2- Mark Felton
3- Matsimus
4- Unknown5
5- Crash Course
It is a wonderful time to be alive :)
To be fair, this video is about as well researched as the history channel
*cough* Potential History *cough*
CurbsideUnderwood Yeah, Mark Felton is stellar. I discovered that channel a couple of months ago and I’ve been hooked ever since.
@@1993Crag History - the Channel with the 'fake shows' featuring bickering about the price of worthless junk?
I dunno, Matismus gets his facts wrong rather often. I'd say of all of them, Mark Felton is by far the best, since he's an actual historian.
2:46 - the tailwheel didn't interfere with the jet exhaust. The ground did. It was the exhaust rebounding from the ground that caused the problem with the elevators
The wing blanked out the elevators when the tail wheel was on the ground. The exhause tore up the runway.
@@moremoneyfordreadnoughts1100 The early flights with a prop in the nose rather than jet engines didn't have a problem with the elevators so the wing couldn't have been the problem
Germany: we have jets!
America: we have gas...
Chim Ritchelds In 1935, the most famous rabbi in America, Rabbi Stephen Wise, a friend of President Roosevelt, boasted: “Some call it Marxism, I call it Judaism.” (The American Bulletin, May 5,1935)
England ??
britain: we have jets as well!
Amerioca: we have lots and lots and lots of planes.
America will soon have nukes too
"first time i saw a jet i shot it down" -chuck yeager 1947
Only because the Germans had no fuel to train pilots. They just put you in a glider and pushed you off a hill. If you survived you were a pilot.
Very interesting. Why, in the early parts of the Doc, when the narrator speaks about the Me 262 do we see so many shots of the Whittle engine? It’s thematically confusing.
Because the content creator doesnt know jack shit about the topic.
Sam Nickerson yeah, such a shame dark docs got lucky with the recommended. His videos are so poorly researched.
Loved the quick glance of the B-47 time traveler.
At 0:15 , isn't that Whittle at the panel, and the Meteor project drawing office?
SevenMagpies yes
No other post-war operator of the Me 262 emerged - the Americans restocked through the Lockheed P-80 "Shooting Star" line and the British held the Gloster Meteor for frontline service while also continuing work of more advanced fighter forms. Czechoslovakia never utilized more than twelve Me 262s - nine being definitive Me 262 fighter types.
Also we have to remember that the British Vampire was very popular around the world and it was in service in WW2
Actually some Me-262's were used in the 6 Day war in 1967. Wild stuff. also Sherman tanks fought panzers there.
Neat fact, there is a museum not too far from where I live(like 4 ish hours, depending on who's driving) that happens to have a Soviet T-34-43, a Sherman 76 mine sweeper, and a Panzerkampfwagon Ausf. Mark 4 ([C?] produced in June 1943- for the Panzer-Abteilung SS Leibstandarte Adolf Hitler) captured and donated from that war in 1967. It is quite something to stand in front of these tanks and know their history.
It's a great museum with several rotating tanks that come in and out for display and shows(The Danville Virginia Tank Museum) :)
Since it's an old ICBM Minuteman factory it's like over 300,000 square feet, so if you decide to visit, make sure you go in the morning, because it is a lot of walking, but totally worth it!
Have a nice day 😎
@@TheHelghast1138 The Me 262s given to Israel (very sadly) is a myth...the story comes Syria brought to us by a post about it in the mid 2000s....Apparently the Syrians after hearing about a crash on a Israeli runway got reports of "Fast aircraft" being used by the Israelis...the reason this was odd is the Soviets and Americans weren't selling them equipment and due to a agreement that lasted a amount of time the British couldn't sell them jets either.
Now we know that the British sold them Meteors which they weren't meant to and chances are, the shape of the engines and the know restrictions of imports meant that either MI6 planted the info or the Syrians came to the idea themselves they they MUST'VE gotten 262s from the Czechs
@Fred Jansen well according to two aviation enciclopedias I own says what I said
The Czech republic flew them after the war. They were produced by Avia.
The swept wings on the Me-262 were not there to increase the speed, the 18.5 degree leading edge sweep back had negligible effect on increasing the critical MACH number, the sweep back was adopted to cure a balance problem when the engines turned out to be heavier than expected.
Exactly!
Is that a B47 at 8:39? Post WW2 I think..
Bryon Kibildis he uses a lot of stock footage in these. They’re still interesting stories.
Yeah, I guess that it was the B47 that was chasing a UFO in the late 50's, and disappeared into a glowing cloud over Speonk, L.I. It probably went through a time warping field, & ended up over Stalag 13.
Yeah, Dark docs has no idea what they are talking about.
Yep, that's a B-47, not a WW2 aircraft.
I’m pretty sure we already know about the me-262
Yeah just what i was thinking. This channel used to have unique rare and unusual content but its gotten way to pedestrian lately. All stuff thats on 2 dozen other UA-cam channels. This episode especially
It's really lazy.
Bryce Would you rather have another Kung Fu flu vid?
David Schectman mm
The coolest thing about a ME262 was its starter motors. it had a little engine not unlike a lawnmower engine zip start and all to get the turbines started. No gen sets or big batteries required, however it was deadly if they shut off in flight as no one would go outside and pull the starter rope.
Even by todays standards thats still a bad ass looking platform...like our F-4 was
I always thought the Intruder looked sexy.
@Thane Mac Or it could be those terrible disco days shoes for shorty..platforms
The F-4 will always look mean.
Badass in looks yes.
But that doesn’t make it or an f4 phantom an dog fighter. They were both pushed into these roles with different results
As cool as the F4 looked, it was still proof that with enough thrust one can fly a brick.
Allied aircraft that shot down the Me-262 in air-to-air combat:
Spitfire IX and XIV
P-47D/M
P-51B/D
La-7
Tempest
The K/D defenetly favors the 262 - even if we don't count bombers
@@bluefox9436 Not really. It had 1.5 or so in total. For an interceptor/fighter this is horrifically poor.
@@1993Crag These were flown at the end of the war with a decimated Luftwaffe and pilots with no real training. They got as many of the living aces into them as possible but there weren't enough left. Most of them barely knew how to fly, let alone fight. Swap planes, Luftwaffe in P-51s and well trained allied airforces in Me-262s and the K/D would be huge.
@@xeigen2 So the Luftwaffe used aircraft not at all suited to being used by the Luftwaffe. That's not some mile stone of engineering, thats an absolute failure.
@ Not true. There were a lot of extremely inexperienced 262 units. The only unit comprised entirely of experienced "Experten" pilots was JV44 and that had a 4 to 1 kill ratio.
How did the Allies "steal It"? The British where working on the Glostor Meteor and the DH Vampire? The Meteor was used in home defence against the V1. The Germans took Frank Whittle's research since it was in public domain. And you missed out a big chunk, the Luftwaffe wanted it as a fighter, but then Hitler jumped in and wanted it to be a fast bomber so this increased the development time.
Firstly, Whittles original patent included both Axial and centrifugal flow elements. He concentrated on Centrifugal because it was simpler to build and a better use of materials at the time. This is why the Metropolitan-Vickers F.2 never saw service.
Secondly, practical axial flow engines were only possible because of the work of AA Griffiths and the people both at Heinkel and the RLM were more than aware of both Whittle and Griffiths work as they were publicly available and widely discussed pre-war.
Thirdly, the German engines were clearly less reliable. In some cases they might get as little as 6-8 hours of use out of a single engine because elements of it were deforming or 'creeping'. In contrast by the end of the war, 'British engines' could go 150 hours without overhaul and had survived in good order after 500 hours of testing. The Germans simply didn't have the metallurgy to make a reliable jet engine.
As you say. Do some research before you post, please.
@@yubari2517 You should probably do some of your own research. British didn't take anything from the German axial designs. MetroVic were playing with axial engines with twice the thrust of any German test engine before they ever saw a German jet.
@@yubari2517 Sorry, you are wrong. The Germans were very clear where they had their seed ideas from. If you go to the British War museum they have related documents there. Whittle was mentioned many times by the German engineers. True, they did try and improve on those early designs, but Whittle was the source.
History is made by the winners.
No boubt,the german‘s was many jears ago at this time , look at the V2 and than later the moon rocket.
Bullshit
*German engineering of advance technology*
Americans+Soviets: hippity hoppity your technology is part of our property
The Lockheed L-133 was an American jet fighter rejected in 1939 because the army said it was TOO advanced. The Me 262 was innovative but hardly world beating.
@@briandamage5677 same goes for the 88mm, people seem to think the Germans had the best stuff, but the Americans already had the 90mm.
@@briandamage5677 And the Army rejected a recon vehicle that could go at least 90 MPH becuase it was 'too fast'.
@@Raiser666ablle Yeah but who was getting shot at?
As far as I'm awere the 90mm didn't have accurate range finding to mid 44 so they were more inaccurate and clearly that gave the 88s an advantage.
Most Germany equipment was or is believed to be better dude to a few main reasons they were produced and put into combat before they were really ready yet still made an impressive impact maybe not over all but in what they could do they out competed there competition but it was due to a number of reasons.
And the biggest reason was probably superior taticts, bean at war longer bean planing for war since 1933 and one could also look at the fact they had many ace's.
But at the end of the day most nation's would probably have blamed equipment over traning/tactics any day.
@@brianlong2334 The US had radar controlled (as in the radar itself automatically aimed the gun itself) 90mm batteries at Anzio in early 1944 that were shooting down German planes. I'm pretty sure they had accurate range finding as well given that was simpler technology. The Germans had an edge in a few fields, but the Allies were more advanced in other fields during the war.
The Allies didn't steal it, it was taken as a War Prize by the allies, Germany lost the war.
War prizes are an allied term for stealing from the losers, no?
@@MrStehooper Since when has the loser in any war been able to keep any of their higher technology throughout the ages? Even the Romans absorbed the best technology from the peoples they conquerered, the British were really good at it as the British Empire expanded.
@@Chuck59ish Why so defensive? Stealing is stealing regardless of who wins, call it spoils, war prizes or just plain loot... Still stealing.
@@MrStehooper So why do you want to change history to have confirmed madmen win? I lost a grandfather at Ypres, Belgium in the First World War where the Germans thought poison gas was a good idea, I've know survivors of both the German and Japanese death camps, so yeah I get upset when people cheer for the losers.
@@MrStehooper no, acquiring the enemies military technology after a war you didn't start is not stealing, the Germans forfeited their military technology after they used it for a war of aggression.
I had the luxury of seeing an operational/flying ME 262 in Bitburg, Germany at an air show back in 2009. Man they are loud but awesome!
jeffDAPG that would have been one of REPLICA's built in the USA using modern GE CJ610 engines !!! and it belongs to the Messerschmidt co and built by the Me 262 project in Everett Washington,USA North of Seattle,
They needed chrome to cover the blades in the jet turbines and Turkey had loads but we (allies)did a deal with Turkey to stop the majority of it going to Germany.
Chromium, which becomes what we call chrome, but yes, you're correct.
Simon Walton chromium is added TO the blade material, not plate it.
Simon Walton Chrome doesn't "cover the blades" moron.
Very clickbaity title here, hell your past few videos have clickbaity titles and have been poorly researched.
Pick up your game.
YES BRO, THIS GUY PISSES ME OFF!
Hey, he made it to 10 minutes though!
yeah lets be angry at free content
@@Litheon11 Pretty weak argument. If he got ''angry'' because of low production values you would be right, but there are no excuses for poorly researched content.
Sarge Sacker25 - Criticism from the person with no videos and no views.
The swept wing increasing critical Mach number was actually a coincidence and happy accident. The ME262 had a swept wing to position the engines further rearward to counter a balance problem by moving the centre of gravity, inadvertently giving a better critical Mach number. High speed airflow wasn't studied enough at the time to understand that sweeping the wings gives you better speed because of the Mach cone and keeping surfaces behind the leading shockwave.
It was not a swept wing !!! !Only the leading edge was swept just like the 1930's DC3/C47's wing !! NOTHING NEW !!!
3:13 " Hello pretty lady, you wanna help me tune my Jet engine?"
PJN P cringey
@@Yeahbuddy-yf2cv no she's hot. You my fiend are "cringey".
d ellingson I didn’t say she wasn’t hot. I said what he said was cringe. Of course she’s hot im not blind
Hey!! Stop lewding my waifu!!
-a War Thunder weeb who named an Me-262 his waifu plane -
The allies got the meteor only a few months after the Me-262, it was fully developed in Britain. They didn't steal it.
Lol yes they did. They basically stole everything.
Yes the meteor was copied slightly but thank god the comment was here, I was concerned people forgot abot the Gloster meteor.
First jet engine was British.
@Carl Napp Metrovic had the axial F.5 before they ever saw a German engine. Twice the thrust, more reliable and even lighter then the German engines.
@princess phill Except the Meteor had a heap of shoot downs on V-1's in 1944 and saw a few hundred combat sorties over Germany in the last 2 months...
The UK Gloster flew on jet power in May 1941: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gloster_E.28/39 Whittle's engine was considerably more technically advanced needing servicing every 150 hours vs. Me.262's rebuild after 10 hours. The Me.262 had a better airframe though. The US also flew a jet based on Whittle's design, offered by the UK for free: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bell_P-59_Airacomet .
The me 262 was definitly more faster than the meteor
@@xx_lightning_xx5781 Not the Meteor F.4 flying at the end of the war.
xlerb The Brits brought a boat load of their technology to the USA as the TIZZARD mission whose purpose was to RESRARCG, DEVELOP, and PRODUCE the material for the Brits and the Whittle was included. GE saw the limitations and developed the axial flow J35 during the war as did Westinghouse their J30 and had it in a Navy jet the Phantom I during the war, the Navy's Banshee was developed from the PhantomI !! Facts of history !!
"... stole... " is a strong word.
I suppose Denmark, Norway, France, Belgium etc had only been borrowed by Germany.
SlideRulePirate Germany didn't take those countries to Germany though lol
@@davgpol what ever Naziweeb.
SlideRulePirate yes! The Germans looted EVERY country they invaded. Art,gold,military supplies,anything of value.
Some of the images are of the British jet engine. Meteors were available but forbiden to fly over enemy teritory.
Well, at stage they were allowed to do take part in ground attack missions
@BlueHavoc also the 262s cannon was pretty slow firing, more suitable for bombers than hitting fighters. Slow rate and slow muzzle velocity. The mg 151 would have made more sense.
@BlueHavoc The Meteor won out in basically everything but top speed, given this didn't stop plenty of props shooting down the 262 then the Meteor probably would have won
last 2 months of the war that was rescinded. Meteors flew combat air patrols, recon, ground attack over Germany. Hell the Meteor even shot up 48 German aircraft on the ground, including a flight of 262's.
Love all your videos, but the title on this one is kinda click baity
Thank you for another great vid and getting my mind off staying in my apt cause of obvious current situation we are dealing with.Keep up the amazing vids
The British made the meteor independently which destroyed V1 bombs .
Excellent film footage and sound.
I don't get the title, like yeah, I guess, but that doesn't make it special and it certainly wasn't stolen before the war was over, by 1944 the British were also producing the Meteor.
I thought there would be some covert allied mission to steal the jet from an airfield.
I liked the video, but I gave a thumbs down for the click-bait title.
Thank you for the informative posts. They're always 👍
Great vid as always !
This Fighter Jet Actually Few in WW2 (And then the Allies Stole It)? Actually and Stole it? Clickbait generator said to use those words? Delivering regular content isn't easy, but most viewers here are knowledgable, provocative titles are not necessary when there is really nothing new being brought to light. Next do the V2 rocket: "This Rocket Actually Flew in WW2 (And then the Allies Stole It)" For extra clicks add: Stole it and Went to the Moon! As others have noted, the jet engine design didn't start there.
AMEN! DARK DOCS IS CLICK BAIT, NOT INFO!
While darkdocs did give a weak title, I don't think he is just trying to do clickbait.
Yah, and Germany got (stole) their design from a British inventor.
@𝕮𝖆𝖗𝖙𝖎 after they took the idea from a British inventor, and gave the design to BMW.
well they didn't buy it. spoils of war is tantamount to stealing but seems to be acceptable.
1:03 I can't be the only person to have heard "Dr. Voldemort"
xD You're definitely not lol
Pronator Tendon umm you spelled “Tom Riddle” wrong...
Woldemar Voigt was a very famous scientist from the late XIXth century. He had done pivotal work in the field of mechanical engineering (introducing tensor notation in stress-strain analysis), optics and electromagnetism (the Voigt effect) as well as in relativity (he formulated a variant of the Lorenz transformation). I had no idea he worked on the Messerschmidt
Does EVERYONE forget about the Meteor and P80? The Meteor (an objective upgrade) was fielded in July 1944 only 3 months after the Me262, and the P80 (also an objective upgrade) was fielded in January of 1944. Funnily enough, if you account for an entire SQUADRON being operational-ready status instead of mixed-makeup and experimental intercepts, the Meteor was truly the first fully ready jet. The Me262 was basically obsolete by mid-1944 tech-wise using very crude engine machining leading to reliability issues, and only held an advantage in speed(about 25mph over the meteor) and use, due to the desperation Germany faced while using them; the Allies could afford to just run prop fighters as the 262 threat was minimal at best, only fielding the Meteor to intercept V-1 rockets. Once Germany lost the role of air superiority, even P-51s and Tempests were a huge threat to the jets, as props were much more capable at acceleration and maneuverability.
"And the allies stole it." ...NO, the allies captured it. A BIG difference between the two.
@SidtheKid that's the thing about warfare, there is nothing fair about it. When you wage a war and your entire country is captured, the winning side abolishes any and all parts of the former government and begins the long and tedious process of forming new governance. Since the Nazi government nationalized all parts of military arms development and production, all technology and research belongs to the government and said prizes won are taken by the victors.
The ME262s primitive production process by unskilled workers gave it a rough, unfinished surface. This ironically broke up the sticky boundary layer of air flow making it even faster. Without proper development, disintegrating engines or enough qualified pilots, it was amazing what they achieved
8:38
*talks about a ww2 plane*
*proceeds to show footage of a post-war american bomber*
One of the best looking aircraft ever
Just imagine if they had all the proper materials for this jet and they worked out all the bugs and Kinks who knows what would have happened
Robert Jones
While the Me-262 was a deadly fighter even with its engine troubles, there was no way it was going to turn the tide.
Bk Jeong yeah and the British with the Americans shortly behind were putting jets into service too
@@FrostySire Yeah. The P-80 would have been superior to either the Meteor or the Me-262, since it was somewhat faster than the Me-262, and a LOT faster than the Meteor, plus a better climbing rate compared to both as well as having a more reliable engine than the Me-262.
@@bkjeong4302 Which P-40 cause I definitely know your meaning the Tomahawk
@@lt.x-02s-wyvern25
Sorry, meant the P-80.
America: we have the best jet fighter
Germany: ...
the soviet hey Germany....we ALLIES led by USA Kicked your @$$'s too !!!
Yes and the Red Tails (Tuskegee Airmen) shot the first jet down in WWII.
The Messerschmitt Me 262 was the German answer to a failing war effort heading into 1945 during World War 2 (1939-1945). It was championed by some of the major players of the war though ultimately limited in its combat reach by forced design decisions, shortages of critical war materials, engine reliability, inexperienced pilots, and the Allied bombing campaign. The Me 262 could have been a game-changer for the Germans had it been given the necessary resources it required to make its mark on the war early on and provide a turning point for the German defense.
great video...complete with ultra-rare seldom-seen footage...but im not too sure about that gear-down BOEING B-47 Stratojet on final-approach attacking a German airstrip in WW2 tho, but hey...at least it wasnt a Fokker Triplane or the Spirit of St. Louis.
All this talk showing the German jet program when one of the opening scenes was of the British jet program...
that was Whittle alright.....if im not mistaken, that particular beautiful-bean footage is from when he had 1 of his 1st engines run-away wild in rpm on him, he couldnt shut it down, and it grenaded and almost killed him....those british huh?
The B47 went so fast it went back in time before it landed.
This was a very informative video but even better are all of the comments that tell even more or the story. Like thee comment below from Keith Ramsey. I had read that story before (I love the history of WWII, because it could still teach us all something..) and remember it. Thanks for posting this and thanks to the informative comments made by your viewers.
The Allies didn't steal it... they won the war. To the victor goes the spoils. But they already had the jet engine... in fact, they had aircraft already in service during the end of WWII in the P59, the P80 and the Gloster Meteor. (The Meteor was the only one to see "combat" in fighting the V1 Doodlebugs.)
The p39 was not a jet. It was odd being mid engined. But the engine in the P80 was more advanced than the me262. What was more advanced about the 262 was it's wing shape.
Also their was the P59, which flew in 1943, but had inferior performance to the p51.
British jet engines were a different type than the German jet engines.
I believe you are thinking of the P59 aircomet
that is not true, they stole it
I spotted a Heinkel 280 and an Arado 234 in there! Sweet footage.
Ironically, jet tech was not introduced fast enough to ensure a swift air victory for the germans.
It had several design flaws too. And really brittle
Aniruthan Senju no new technology is perfect we still have no counter to ballistic missiles
@@keirandunwoodie8138 they could have used those resources on something else. But their quality over quantity mindset. Destroyed them
Aniruthan Senju the v1 and v2 where complete game changers still used today
@@keirandunwoodie8138 they were a good design. But not accurate,you can launch it in general direction of a city. But can't accurately hit any important installation or factories. And allied had radar and later variants of spitfire and hurricanes can catch them easily. And they cost a LOT.
Love all your UA-cam channels. Keep doing what your doing. #DarkDocs #DarkSkies
The Gloster Meteor beat the Me 262 into squadron service by a few days.
Yes but the 262 actually went into combat
@@03Phenex I guess they were that desperate.
Still both planes were incredible and way ahead of their time.
Great as always
3:55 Star Wars assassin droid parts.
well yes: the coffemaker from wich ig-88s head was made was a burning chamber of a old jet engine. so those parts are droid parts.
The theory of axial flow was proposes before 1922. It would be 20 years before an air-frame capable of using such an engine was possible. With the great depression of the 1930's money wasn't available to develop a jet engine. Both the USA and USSR bench tested experimental axial flow turbines before entering the war with the UK already working on it's centrifugal engine, later copied and used on the MIG15 in the Korean war. Whittle was fully aware that axial flow would be superior low to his centrifugal engine but as he said "if we want a jet for this war it has to be centrifugal flow. Axial flow is for the next war"
The engines were a load of junk and looked like they were made by a bloke in a shed and the aircraft a comparative failure compared to the Meteor which remained in service wit the RAF until the mid 60's
Compared to the fact that me-262 was built with very limited material an being constantly bombed so their factories where practically non exist while the brits had dam near unlimited supplies an money an time to throw at the meteror, i would say the me 262 100% holds it on compared to rhe meteror. On a side note hitler having a huge ego an poking his nose in just about every design being rd an constantly changing the requirements or shuttingdown the project entirley(stg44) didnt help their war effort.
Flying Heritage Museum has already fired up their 262 with rebuilt Jumos incorporating rebuilt more modernized parts. Very impressive.
jpriest But it has not flown and the owner Paul Allen has died and his museum has been sold and closed, it may never fly !! !
Wow, Your video’s are usually so well researched but this one is so full of inaccurate information. Hitler never demanded that the 262 be modified to carry bombs and in fact all German fighters had to have this design feature and was demanded by the RLM and it was Adolf Galland who literally got Goering to bypass the RLM so that 262’s would be ready to defend the fatherland.
The subject of wing sweep on the 262 is also a source of confusion as the fact was that originally the 262 had no wing sweep but it was introduced to help correct the center of gravity being incorrect due to the original engines being overweight . The RLM had done some research on swept wings so they were not surprised when this helped the performance and stability of the 262
The Allies and in particular Britain knew of the advantages of axial compressors and another British engineer Alan Arnold Griffith had designed an engine around an axial compressor but the air ministry preferred the whittle designed engine because it was simpler to manufacture and believed to be more reliable. Griffith and whittle were great rivals after Griffith had reviewed whittles calculations on how a gas turbine could be made to work, discovered an error and rejected it thus meaning that whittle did not get much air ministry money to aid his research Ironically a later version of this engine was the Bristol Sidderly Sapphire that competed with the Rolls-Royce Avon in the 1950’s and 60’s.
They're nice to see fly. I got a chance to see one do so in 2016, and it will get everyone's attention at an airshow.
ratagris They are replicas using modern GE CJ610 engines !! !
Eh, at 7:27 you have images of the Heinkel he 280, with a straight wing and twin vertical stabilizers... That is very unknown plane.
True
how can you say a plane is vulnerable/bad because of landing speeds, EVERY plane slows down on landing approach....smh
It's because it would sometimes burst into flames on take off and landing because a lot of the plane was just one big fuel tank (I think there was a mechanical issue with whatever pumped the fuel to the engine causing it to catch fire but it was to late in the war to actually fix it)
As long as one bullet hit the tank it would immediately explode
@@xS1leNtRapt0rZ that was happening because fuel leaking out of engine when plane had tail wheel, hot exhausts + tilted engines= fuel leaking >> fire after tricycle wheel the problem went mostly away
+ Germans had selfsealing tanks for planes they werent dumb about this thing
@@thesturmovik6410 ya that's what the issue was I couldn't remember it off the top of my head
Altho I do know that during the final weeks of the war that was a big issue for them because German high command and logistics basically collapsed so a lot of the pilots had to deal with the issue and hope they made it back
@@xS1leNtRapt0rZ the last 6 months was a clusterfuck for germany this was happening everywhere
Extra vulnerability on takeoff because of 2 things:
1. Allies had air-superiority by that time.
2. Engines prone to flame-out, especially when a pilot is being attacked & he advances the throttle too quickly.
Also, only the very first 4 prototypes were taildraggers. ALL production were tricycle.
So close to 300k you can do it !!!!
And the Gloster meteor?
Fury 45 and the p-59?
The Me-262 was hardly the only jet fighter to fly in WW2. Hell, it wasn't even the only one deployed. Even the British Meteor was technically deployed. Germany had two deployed fighters and one jet bomber that saw combat, plus about another dozen FLYING prototypes of different models, including flying wings. The He-178 was the first turbojet aircraft. The He-280 was the first jet fighter plane, but it was not adopted.
*There is a myth that the Germans were way ahead of the British in jet engines and planes in WW2, when the opposite is true.* The WW2 German jet engines were extremely unreliable with low performances and very high fuel consumption. The German *axial-flow* turbojets never worked as they wanted, being developed up to 1953 by the French to obtain a usable engine. The French lost a lot of time playing around with the German engines, instead of working with the British. The French and Soviets after WW2 tried to improve the German axial-flow engines and largely failed.
The Germans did not invent the axial-flow turbojet, they based everything on Frank Whittle's patents. The British Metropolitan-Vickers F.1 axial-flow engine was running on a test bed in 1941. The F.2 was an axial-flow being an extremely advanced design using a nine-stage axial compressor, annular combustor, and a two-stage turbine. It powered a Meteor in November 1943. It was considered unreliable and never saw use during the war, hence why the British went for the reliability, controllability and quick development of the centrifugal turbojets. The Metro-Vick F.3 was the first ever *turbofan* in 1943. Metro-Vick developed the F.9 Sapphire, however left the jet business in 1947 giving all their designs to Armstrong Siddeley, who commercially produced the Armstrong Siddeley Sapphire engine, which was licence built in the US as the J-65.
The British in order to get a usable and reliable jet engine, with the technology of the time, went for a *centrifugal* design rather than the troublesome axial-flow design. This design produced less thrust than an axial-flow but was quicker to develop and reliable outperforming the best piston engines planes at the time. It took 5 months to develop, while the first _reliable_ axial-flow engine was the 1950 Rolls Royce Avon, which took 5 years to get right. The Avon is still in production as a ground based gas turbine, with the aero version in production for 30 years.
In 1945 the French made and tested some German designed turbo jets made with quality steel unavailable to German industry in WW2. They ran for 25 hours instead of the 10 hours of the Germans engines that used poorer quality steel. Not much better. The German axial-flow engines failed because of heavy design flaws. The centrifugal compressor used by the first British Meteor plane was fine and much more reliable, but unable to reach high compression ratios. This limited performances. Centrifugal compressors were used up to the 1960s.
In 1945 the team from the French ATAR laboratory plus some BMW and Junkers engineers, were engaged by the French SNECMA research bureau, with the objective to build a new reliable and performing axial-flow turbojet. The BMW 003/Jumo004 was considered unusable. It was tested on the first French jet aircraft, the 1946 So6000 Triton, overheating and exploding. The plane only flew with a Rolls Royce Nene centrifugal turbojet.
The ATAR project took 6 years to produce the first acceptable axial-flow turbojet (ATAR 101 B1), produced in 1953. So 8 years research and developments by the French using the German jet engines as the base. It was installed on the first French jet fighter, the Dassault Ouragan.
The French lost a lot of time because the German jets had poor efficiency and some concept fails. Essentially in the combustion chambers and fresh air circulation to reduce the external temperature of the engine. The BMW jet was known for overheat problems which precluded fuselage installation.
*The question at the end of WW2 was: what is the most efficient way to produce jet fighters?* The answer was clearly not adopting the German design of engine and fuselage. The build costs for a jet engine were much higher than a piston engine, with the fuel consumption near 3x. The centrifugal compressor the British adopted in some planes was the best choice with 1944-45 technology, more compression pressure was not an advantage when the hot turbine was unable to resist higher temperatures. The German turbojets had big overheat problems as the engine would not work in an enclosed fuselage for single engined fighters. This defect was immediately noted by the French on the 1946 "SO 6000 Triton" prototype, and by the Soviets on the 1946 Mig 9. The Soviets quickly replaced the BMW 004B2 by the centrifugal Rolls Royce Nene which worked without problems, dismissing the BMW engine for fighter planes. The Rolls Royce Nene was copied to the last nut by the USSR being installed in the Mig 15 being used effectively in the Korean war.
The Meteor was the first proper fully developed jet plane introduced operationally. The 262 was slightly faster than the Meteor F3, but extremely unreliable. *The British would never put into the sky such an undeveloped plane as the me262.* The British could have had a jet fighter operational in 1941, but it may have been as bad as the me262. The Germans advanced R&D on jets after they interrogated captured British RAF men. They learned the British were advanced in jet technology and flying prototype planes. Until then the Germans had no intention of mass producing jet planes.
The rushed together Me262 started claiming kills on 26 July 1944, the Meteor claimed its first V1 kill a few days later on the 4 August 1944. *But the Meteor was a proper fully developed jet plane, not a thrown together desperate effort as the me262 was.* The me262 fuselage was similar to a piston plane with the pilot over the wings obscuring downward vision, while the Meteor was a proper new design fuselage specifically for jet fighters with a forward of the wings pilot position giving superior pilot vision, as we see in planes today. The cockpit was very quiet. The sweptback wings of the me262 were to move the engines further back for better weight distribution, not for aerodynamic reasons as is thought the case. The me262's airframe was based on piston engine planes, even with an initial rear tail wheel. The tricycle landing gear was only introduced when it was found the thrust of the jet engines would scorch the runway surface as the exhaust faced downwards. The Meteor's airframe was designed purely for jet propulsion even with a high tail to prevent thrust interfering with the tail which could affect control.
Centrifugal compressors were not obsolete being used in turboprops. Between a turbo jet and a turboprop, the only difference is the turbine, not the compressor. The last centrifugal compressor jet engine still in service on a handful of commercial aircraft like the Fokker 27, is the Rolls Royce Dart turboprop. A very reliable engine made in 27 versions, but with high fuel consumption to modern engines. The Rolls Royce Dart Turboprop turbo jet engine was produced the longest, being a comparable design turbojet to the likes the Rolls Royce Nene. The rugged engine was produced from 1946 up to 1987.
It’s worth remembering that the Germans only had access to less pure fuel, and so had to engineer their engines and aircraft to suit. Considering this, I think it’s pretty impressive what the Germans were able to produce, of course without meaning to discredit the sheer brilliance of British engineering and design.
@@F4GRAPHICS The quality of fuels and materials available to the Germans during the war is not a valid excuse for engine designs that couldn't be made reliable after the war using quality fuels and materials.
It's interesting to note that when it came time to power the Mig-15, the Soviets were quite happy to use the Rolls-Royce Nene.
History is made by the winners.
Ok France say that the german jet is crap. Ok. The UK say „ we Inventars the jet“ . Ok . But i trink the only flying jet in 1945 was a german jet. (And rocket) but hey ... maybe the Amerikaner Inventars the rocket ore the car 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
First reliable axial flow jet engine was the J35 by GE !!!
At this time there are no original Me 262s flying. There are 5 replicas that have been built that were built using new parts that were copied from an original aircraft. With the exception of using General Electric engines they virtually identical to wartime aircraft.
There is one original 262 that has been restored to airworthy condition, and has Jumo 004 engines with functioning 2 cycle starter motors. It should fly sometime in 2020.
jnichols The Me262 that Paul Allen owned with his flying Heritage Museum may never fly since Paul died and the Museum was closed and sold, as far as they got was some taxi test !!! Paul Allen was the co founder with Bill Gates of Microsoft, he had the money for the project !! !
I'm Frank Whittle and I don't approve of this message.
Hello, I'm also Air Commodore Sir Frank Whittle.
I patented, and published a design for the jet engine in 1930. A design which inspired the German researchers.
My engine design (which was initially ignored by the RAF) powered the Gloster E28/39 which first flew in 1941, which led to the Gloster Meteor which first flew in March '43 and became operation in July 1944. An aircraft also capable of over 600mph.
if this aircraft did not have engine problems and the germans had enough resources they could have won the war
I wonder how many times the title of this video will change over the next week 🤔
I have pics of these planes that my grandfather took during the war. Pretty cool
02:50 "It was one of the most..if not the most advanced aircraft used during WW2"...shows an Me262 getting shot down.
The Me262 was a disaster, it required materials that they didn't have, it had extremely fragile engines, guzzled scarce fuel &, despite its claimed "Wonder Weapon" status had an air-to-air kill ratio of ONLY 1.5 to 1. In the hands of the very few skilled pilots the Luftwaffe had left it could be deadly, but most weren't & paid the price with their lives. At the very high speeds it could achieve they found it hard to hit anything AND it couldn't stop.........yes, no Air Brakes, so it had a very long, very vulnerable, glide back to base (which it would have to do very soon after take off because of poor endurance) where it would S-L-O-W-L-Y lose speed, making it a sitting duck for Allied Fighters as it was unable to accelerate away quickly due to the very fragile engine problem. Worst of all, the inexperienced pilots who tried to use the speed often found that they entered a dive that they couldn't escape from & aerodynamic forces prevented opening the canopy.
The B-29 was BY FAR the most advanced airplane to see service in the war. Being the fastest of the firstest doesn't make it the most advanced.
Between 1948 and 1955, Adolf Falland was an advisor of the recently independized Argentine Air Force (FAA).
As such he wrote manuals on air combat tactics and doctrine for turbojet fighters.
He flew the recently acquired FAA's Gloster Meteor F.4. Later he stated that the ideal 1st generation jet fighter would have been a Me-262 propelled by RR Derwebt turbojets.
Also, it must be remembered that Howard Hughes tried to race a Me-262 in the Bendix races in the late 1940s; he was not allowed to do so, because its perfomance was superior to that of the Lockheed P-80C in USAF service at the time.
Galland!
Yeah, might wanna change the "stole" part. Spoils of war.
Technically it wasn't stolen
In the final days of the war a German pilot defected to the allies after seeing that the war was lost and deciding that he'd rather have the Americans and British have first grabs at the jet engine rather than the Soviets but the allies didn't believe that he was genuinely defecting and imprisoned him for several months (give or take I can't remember exactly) before he was released and asked to help with understanding the me 262
@@xS1leNtRapt0rZ Forgot about that too, Not stolen, not spoils, but given LMAO.
@@patrikhellstrom4590 I mean I'm sure there was some espionage but I don't think the allies had a complete blueprint until it was given to them so technically everyone is right
@@xS1leNtRapt0rZ I agree. But stolen is still a bit strong for what it most likely was. :p
First 262 in the Allies' hands was in March 1945. First flight of the P-80 was in January 1944. Me-262 had axial flow engines, while the P-80 had a centrifugal compressor. So how was it stolen?
Thank you! Shared.
The Allies "Stole" nothing. To the victor go the spoils.
Thats still stealing.
@@4450krank It's not stealing if you kill the people who owned it while backed by your government. DUH
They didn't steal it
It was given to the allies by a German pilot that defected to the allies at the end of the war because he didn't want the Soviets to get ahold of it
@@xS1leNtRapt0rZ - There were German jets scattered across Germany. There was no single German pilot that handed over German jet technology. They rounded it up and took it. And if the 'Plan" was to prevent this tech from falling into the hands to the Soviets, it was a huge failure.
@@4450krank - It's like poker. The winner takes the pot. After Germany took Czechoslovakia, they "borrowed" their type 38 tank which was superior to their own Panzer I and Panzer II. Hitler himself declared it to be "total war." He got what he wanted! In any case, the Allies were making up ground quickly on what the Germans developed and then some. The Soviets captured the BMW jet engines and the designers and shipped them home to the USSR. but when it came to powering the Mig 15, they went with a British design.
The Me262 was way ahead of it,s time
It was not.
Technically they lost the war and it was a war trophy. Not theft
♦ German engineer Ohain did not design a reverse flow engine. His engine had a centrifugal compressor and a radial inflow (centrifugal turbine - a design never used in any production engine - this was a patent filed by Whittle). Ohain even commented on its unusual design when he read Whittle's patent prior to filing his own: From Ohain's biography:
_"When I saw Whittle’s patent I was almost convinced that it had something to do with boundary layer suction combinations. It had a two-flow, dual entrance flow radial flow compressor that looked monstrous from an engine point of view. Its flow reversal looked to us to be an undesirable thing, but it turned out that it wasn't so bad after all though it gave some minor instability problems."_
♦ Whittle's reverse flow design is the basis for almost all turboprop engines in production;
♦ Britain had axial-flow engines running in 1941 - the same time that Franz had his Jumo running. The Metrovick F.2 flew in a Meteor in 1943. The F.2 transpired into the Sapphire which the US built under licence as the J-65 and then modified it as the J-47;
♦ Westinghouse in the US was given a Whittle engine, and plans for improvements. They made such a hash of it that Whittle had to go to the US to assist. The US government gave the project to GE who made the I-16 which transpired into the first US built jet engine. The US licensed the Ghost for the P-80/T-33 and the RR Nene. The Nene was used by the Soviets in the MIG 15;
♦ Ohain's engine was not produced being shelved by 1943. No engine was built using his design;
♦ Whittle also R&D'd axial-flow engines. The metallurgy was not advanced enough at the time. Whittle's engines produced far more thrust than the German axial-flows and far more reliable;
♦ The PT-6, PWC 100/150 are derivatives of Whittle's designs being still produced;
• Whittle's centrifugal-flow engines were built under licence in the US after WW2 - the J-33, J-42 and J-48;
• The Olympus was the world's first 2 shaft turbojet and the first to exceed 10,000 pounds of thrust;
• The 1950 Avon was the first reliable axial-flow engine. Also the longest produced gas turbine in history being still in production as a land based generator;
• The RR Conway was the world's first turbofan;
• The RB-211 was the world's first 3 shaft turbofan;
• The Rolls Royce Trent was the world's first turboprop to fly;
• British axial-flows led the post war world in technology and power;
• The axial-flow Sapphire was built in the US as the J-65. The GE J-47 was based on the Sapphire.
*Frank Whittle invented the modern turbojet.*
So the germans created a jet and the allies stole it? Yet the meteor went into operational service before the me262 aswell as Sir Frank Whittle creating the turbojet engine before the Germans. The allies stole jack all when it came to the me262.
But the meteor.... was well...
The meteor
Source?. I couldnt find anything saying that and i found sources saying that the first jet was german and flew in 1939
kattensjingo a pattent was created by a french man but nothing was built. Sir Frank Whittle had built the engine before the germans did. The me262 gets all the credit because it was the first to see combat
RayCowPlayz YT the meteor did its job, performance wise yeah it worse but reliability it was better. And it shows that by the fact it remained in service with multiple nations for decades
@@fazsum41 Whittle had a patent in 1930! His big problem was getting the RAF interested.
Finally he did get their attention, and in 1941 created the Gloster E.28/39 which led to the operational Gloster Meteor.
@kattensjingo Yes, the first operation jet aircraft was German, but the first jet engine was invented and demonstration by Whittle. Production of a British jet aircraft was delayed by "stuffed-shirts" at the RAF.
IIRC only thing the ME262 feature the Allies "stole" for later aircraft was the swept wing design.
Keep them comin brother!!!
"...almost impossible to counter...": until the Redtails started flying Mustangs
And also Until the Yak-9 started shooting their shvak cannons
It is a beautiful vehicle.
10 years before the Germans
The credit for the invention of the jet engine went to Great Britain's Frank Whittle. Whittle, who registered a patent for the turbojet engine in 1930, received that recognition but did not perform a flight test until 1941.
Inventor: Hans von Ohain; Frank Whittle
Jet Engines - Stanford CS
Me262 was being made before world war 2 during that same time
The Gloster Meteor jet fighter also flew and saw combat in WW2 (1944), and the Allies DIDN'T steal it. It was designed and built in the UK...... The Me 262 first flew with jet engines on the 18th July 1942. The Gloster Meteor wasn't far behind, with the first flight on 5th March 1943. Not too far behind given the fact that England was having the sh*t bombed out of it some of the time. A Gloster Meteor broke the World Speed record on 7th November 1945, with a speed of 606mph........
Me 262 was deadly to bombers, sort of, and not particularly dangerous to fighters.
Why is there video of a B-47 Stratojet at the 8:38 mark?
Come on who doesn’t know this flew. No matter where you look you hear about it
So you didnt like this fantastic compilation of actual facts, footage, tactics and references? One wonders why you are watching airplane youtubes at all.
War makes technology beautiful yet dangerous
The Me 262 was too little, too late. Allied armies still would have conquered Germany even if the combined bombing campaign wasn’t a success
Bro can you re-make every original dark 5 video with narration please? This is the time when we are all cooped up inside and need this kind of non-stop content. ♥️
But it ain’t stealing when you build a terror weapon and lose the war, sorry.
It might help if you got your engine types right and edited the film so it showed the correct version of the plane at the right time instead of mixing them up all over the place. Could have been a good video if it had more attention to detail shown.
*[War Thunder players have joined the chat]*
Me-163 gang where you at
Also yes I know the 163 is a rocket fighter not jet lol
where does he get these wonderful toys?...i cant get enough of these videos
Nice jet Germany, would be a shame if...someone came and took it from you👨🏻🦰
Off the top of my head, I can name EIGHT jet fighters that flew in WW2. If you include rocket fighters, at least four more.
I think we forgot Japanese 262
*Kikka*
Very Nice video, thanx for that. Small notation @ 8:35 - this is a PAK Anti tank gun.
A very advanced aircraft which, like almost all new and advanced technologies, had a slew of teething problems which would be incrementally improved and solved over following aircraft.
"First time I saw a jet, I shot it down. I was 1st in my group to shoot down an Me-262. He was on final - not very sportsmanlike - but what the hell?" - Chuck Yeager