Don’t miss Rassie’s plan, be good enough to win but groom the next generation timeously so that the boks don’t drop off as player retire. He is totally in control. 50 players in a year sacrificing 2 games, nobody has that record.
@@willemsteyn7808 Perhaps, the Irish won by one point in the second test, but lost the first test by 7 to the Boks, so on average the Boks won the series!
England played as well but lost. Boks (by their standard) didn't play well but still won. England are now like Scotland, a good team but really need the planets to align to beat the best of the tier one nations.
England were inept. Saffers were vulnerable bleeding penalties, and England didn't have the whit to capitalise. Ccs is over rated, Earl played well then missed a crucial tackle. Furbank missed two tackles leading to tries. Alfie you were talking about England 3 of 4 being a minimum. Face facts son
Saffa here ... I think England can take a lot of heart out of this performance and the season. In New Zealand earlier this year, both matches could have gone either way. Again, the three big South Hemisphere autumn games were close run affairs. Hold on to Borthwick ... he's got aa plan ...
England have so much talent. We’re lacking at front row and that’s a big issue but I do see green shoots (Stuart, Baxter, Fasogbon, Opoku-Fordjour are all promising). In all other areas we have some serious talent. The problem is we don’t have a coaching set up that’s willing to put them all on the pitch!! Sleightholme and Feyi-Waboso should both start together with Ibitoye & Wade next cabs off the rank. That is pure electricity on the wings. We need to play to our strengths with regards to midfield, we lack a powerful 12 but we do have some electric athletes. Lawrence 12 with a fast athlete like Freeman 13 just makes sense. That’s a much more powerful midfield. Furbank then becomes obvious as the 2nd playmaker at 15 and JVP is an anti-talent selection. Let’s see Randall more while Mitchell is injured. The way to sort out our bench is to start selecting some of the supreme back 5 talent that we aren’t seeing play any minutes. Where’s Ted Hill, Tizard, Mercer, Barbeary, Evans in the wider squad?! Really not ok for them to not even be in the set up when you look at how weak our bench is.
Thanks Alfred. Always appreciate your insights. England's disallowed try had a forward pass not dissimilar to ours. So neck roll aside, it couldn't have been allowed. Main problem is defense. Cheslin's first try should have been stopped. Grant Williams should have been stopped. De Allende should have been stopped. I think that's your main weakness. Your attack is innovative, quick and varied. Marcus is key.
Rassie is preparing for the world cup... the team who can rotate their players between matches without missing a beat, will have the best chance to go all the way. The toll rugby takes on players these days is just so much... as we have seen with SA after beating the French in the quarters. Keeping players fresh between games week in and week out will be key...
Love your insight Alfred. As a springbok fan it was frustrating to watch us give away so many penalties. England have some star players but their overall impression is not cohesive
We believe in Rassie and therefore we are aware that he’s preparing and blooding new players into the system. We were not great today but what we know is that we have the experience to see out games.
I think England is on the right track. Build the team to start winning. They push New Zealand the push South Africa and they let them selves down against Australia. They key issue is that they don't have the quality off the bench yet. However it is a catch 22.... You first need to win consistently before you can build the depth that you need in rugby today. I think to many teams is still focusing on the first 15 but should rather focus on the first 23.
1) All of the blame cannot be directed at Borthwick, but I don't think he's the man to take England forward. The departure of Jones was the first red flag. He came from an elite set up - the kind that gives you two Webb Ellis trophies on the bounce - and left within seven months. He was replaced by a guy who got his club relegated from the Pro 14. There is no comparison! 2) England need to bite the bullet and jettison the old guard. There are three years left to build a team identity and playing style. Playing the likes of Dan Cole now, when you've got youngsters in reserve, makes absolutely no sense. You have to blood your youngsters against the best of the best and though Borthwick has blooded some, he hasn't blooded enough. 3) Rassie is the best coach in the world and en route to being the greatest of all time. What he has done since 2018 has been remarkable. He's taken the Boks at their lowest ebb - not figuratively, literally: they were the lowest-ranked they've ever been - and turned them into the greatest side in the world. He's done this while changing systems and personnel. 50 players fielded in this year alone and no team sheet being the same. To do that and manage only two narrow losses (one point and two!) is quite something.
England team better than their fans realise. Some tendencies that are fixable but great elements visible. That's the basis of a good team in the process of building. Borthwick still learning and might need some help to communicate better. Also a good conditioning coach and psychologist to help their concentration persevere. England for me are coming into playing within their rugby DNA vs outside it as with Eddie. Their loss record this year is against the top teams and then, not by much.
Boks keep winning without turning up, Eng & Scotland should be kicking themselves for falling short.. hopefully next year we see much more oiled Boks performances
Its the succession planning it's essential with the aging team! It's frustrating but not as bad as if we were losing. So I'll take that! We will reap the real benefits come 2027 while maintaining at least a top 3 spot which is again important for the pools
I think the mere fact that England is asking the Borthwick question is the greatest part of their problem. One can only build of you are given the freedom to fail. With the sword out right from the start, all coaches are doomed to fail. Ultimate success requires intermittent failure, and must be willing to learn from it. England is a great team. They always give SA the hardest of times.
To be fair its been a brutal run of games. But then it was Englands (presumeably not Borthwicks but the money mens) choice to play NZ 3 times in a row with Australia and South Africa to follow and the gimme Japan games either side. That Ireland win is doing a lot of work, i think a year with only 2 and 3 pt wins over Italy and Wales and 2 Japan mismatches would leave England in full disaster mode.
Hoping in the long run these brutal games will be a turning point. Though have we gone backwards this autumn or just stalled as many England fans felt coming into this Autumn that 3 out of 4 wins was totally possible. Still feel Japan should have been the first game this Autumn . Sour grapes maybe but I’m gutted. Let’s keep Steve Borthwick though . 🏴
good video mate , ive said for a while england lack fitness and depth also they come out hyped up and play a great first 40 or maybe 60 but then as tiredness creeps in the superior cool headed team normally wins out, I still think england could do well in this years six nations as i think my team ireland are in a bit of a dip and france not sure how they will be but looked good yesterday
This constant search for a ‘perfect’ Bok performance is going to frustrate a lot of people. I’m not saying that shouldn’t be the goal but reality is the top 6 teams aren’t too far apart, more so than in any previous year and so Boks will be put under pressure believe me, just like we saw vs The ABs in the Championship, last week vs Scotland and yesterday vs England. Sure, there’s some things South Africa can control and execute better on but as the top nation, you’ll find teams will analyse them more than others. As for England, they look exceptional on attack & have certainly improved but put it this way, if SA or NZ had lost 5 in a row it would 1 million percent be a crisis🤷🏾😂
Agree with you . ...Im one of the Boks supporters waiting for a 90% game....waiting for us to click like we did at Twickenham against the AB before the WC . But as you say teams are so equal in quality nowadays that game where everything works is only gonne happen ones in a while ( blue moon ) so in the meantime our nerves will be tested finger nails chewed😅😅😅
The Autumn Nations Series tells me: That the Six Nations Championship is not better than the Rugby Championship and vice-versa. However, it does tell me which Teams are more settled, more experienced, more balanced, has more depth and also has the most efficient and impactful bench currently. The Overall on-field performances from Australia and Wales the last 2 years or so has to do with: Rugby Australia and it's other different Sporting Codes that is alot more Attractive and Lucrative amongst other things. The Welsh Rugby Union System needs to be remodeled and the Welsh Rugby Board has some Decisions to make with regards to it's Club Structures within Welsh Rugby.
🇮🇪fan - 🏴 are a capable team. The biggest threat to them are the fans calling for SB to be replaced. I agree with you 🏴 need continuity & team is not in crisis but are in transition with some players who might not be around for next RWC. Defence needs work but so does flair & creativity in attack (other than MS.). The SA try from two kick blocks was poor & MS poor defence is overlooked by his good forward play. Last try by Aus last week another example. The decision for 🏴 is do they change coach now or NOT, as before a WC will be too late. I’d stick with SB.
There is no doubt that England are a good side but not a top four side. I’d rank them around the same level as Scotland & Argentina (hopefully soon joined by Australia). If you had to pick 2 teams with the best in each position, only Itoje and Marcus Smith would maybe make it. Maybe it’s just a case that England just don’t have enough quality players to take on the top 4.
Boks are only in experimentation fase. Will see more 12 plus changes every game. Its not about world rankings. Its about having a 46 player pool come 2027
Bok supporter here,England played well,however they were playing against arguably the greatest Bok team ever.Mark of a great team is that they are able to win games even when they are not playing well.
My thoughts on the Boks are that it’s still the same old methods winning them games. They have great players but as yet we aren’t seeing this new style that they want to implement be successful. Maybe they won’t need a new style.
During the WC our defence was fine, one of our best attributes. Why did Borthwick feel we needed a blitz defence rather than either implementing gradual evolution or just developing our areas of weakness, eg our attack. The blitz at every opportunity style is clearly draining the energy from the players and it’s still not a system that even works well, not in the way England implement it, and we have now been waiting a long time for it to be effective… Things feel compounded by odd selections eg Forde, VPort, etc poor in defence and not quick in attack and of course odd timings of substitutions, as if Borthwick hasn’t got a feel for the game, or that he has a predetermined plan. It’s like driving with your handbrake on, there isn’t an appreciation for a whole joined up game plan in terms of strategy & player selection. I think there’s a good team there in potential but have my doubts about Borthwicks intuition and vision
As Saffer here I'm concerned at Borthwick's reading g of the game. It's just he hasn't got the players to execute his vision. Start with fitness and conditioning
Bok fan here! England played well… I think they can win Question? Where is Farrell? The Springboks are really not playing well 😢 I love them so much But wonder if Rassie is too experiential???? It stresses me out.. then they win? I don’t know 🤷🏽♀️
Rassie is building a squad to win the 2027 World Cup. His status as a double World Cup-winning coach gives him the licence to do that. All the other tier one coaches are under threat of sack if they don't win most tests, which is why they play their strongest 23s and play better. SA play a more disjointed game because no team sheet is the same. The skill it requires to do this and still win almost every test (a one point loss to Ireland, a two point loss to the Argies) is beyond impressive. It's unprecedented. The entire rugby establishment would be singing Rassie's praises if he were an Englishman, Frenchman, Irishman, or Kiwi. Since he's a Saffer, we get treated to lukewarm praise like 'South Africa are the best team in the world right now' and 'The Boks are a good team'. SA have done more in the last year than the entire northern hemisphere combined.
Even with a terrible cohesion, libbok useless at fly, we still too good for England or else. Everyone in the biggest sportspub in jhb SA thought we were going to lose.
Just how do you arrive at that conclusion. Without Mannie cross kick, Cheslin would not have scored that try, this is why Rassie who has a great rugby mind decides to use Mannie like he does Siya. You’re just mistaken, i would comment it was not Mannie’s best but it met Rassie’s plan.
I have to admit, this bok performance wasn't great... We're clearly still trying to figure things out. Now imagine how dangerous we will be when we're firing at all cylinders 🇿🇦🇿🇦 Let's go!
Given the legitimate try that was disallowed, Englands second try was started with a well forward pass in their half so should’ve been called back, that’s a 14 point swing just on the officials. Then we add in the penalties that were just mystical, so much so the tv director never replayed them or the reason for the yellow card so I recon SA was way over penalised. England escaped a yellow card even though they committed apartheid for other fouls they executed 4 neck rolls and a no arms tackle but zero cards. I think the actual score with a neutral ref is 50:13 in SA favour. That’s how much trouble England is in, it’s crisis time.
Not a crisis, but a moment of clarity. We have enough evidence now. Borthwick is responsible for the back room ordeals, so can’t use that disruption as an excuse. He’s responsible for baffling, unmerited selections, he’s responsible for coaching an unsustainable defence and blunt attack. We’re entirely reliant on Smith creating magic, there’s no effective strategy. The team has gone backwards, and it’s worth remembering that Borthwick started his tenure saying England “couldn’t do anything well”. His picks for this game were badly exposed. JVP error prone and ponderous. Steward’s qualities entirely offset and then some by his defensive and attacking frailties. The entire bench adds nothing. Borthwick lacks imagination, lacks charisma, and lacks the honesty required to make hard decisions about his preferred picks. Time to go. But he’ll stay for the 6N, which I have little doubt will expose him even more.
Keep Borthwick , keep losing, what a record. With the players England has, there simply is no excuse to be losing consistently. Look at what Joe Schmidt has done with Australia in such a short space of time with little resource's and a very small selection of players compared to England. England just played a poor South African side at home and the Boks won comfortably. England badly need a better Coach than Borthwick
I don't think England's problem is lack of ability. They have the players. As Alfred said, the South Africans know how to win close games. In contrast it seems like England don't have that dog in them like SA to absolutely refuse to submit to give up and grind things out even if things are going against them. What England needs is a good motivator of a coach with a lot more energy than Borthwick that can gel the team to play for each other. Currently it seems that it's not the best environment to work in with coaches leaving. Maybe there are still remnants of the working environment created by Eddie Jones which everyone agreed was not great to say the least.
You talk about the bench but it was obvious to all casual observers that the bench is poorly selected but Borewick thought otherwise. It is because he is a poor judge of players so as a selector he is not up to the job. Coaching is another issue maybe.
South Africa are a great side England in patches played as good But JVP was given a lesson on how hard it is at international level Some very poor choice of keeping the ball in the forwards when they weren't moving the ball Again towards the end blowing And poor bench And again JG off after 50 mins he is the bloody captain SB needs to change or go
Time for the old guard to go [D.COLE-J.GEORGE-T.CURRY?- G.FORD-E.DALY-H.SLADE- ect And for Bothwick to really blood the young talent like A.Opaku-Fordjour E.Iyogun H.Tizzard R.Tuima G.Ogre C.Langdon ] It;s also time Bothwick looked at and solved the center question by looking at players like W.Butt - L.Anyawu - Z.Wimbush Bothwick also needs to pick more on form rather THAN REPUTATION So the likes of T.Willis and T.Hill G.Pepper - T.Pearson get looked at and tested at international level As for Englands defence that also needs sorting Blizt yes but do it with a drift to start then turn in and more 1st up tackling practice is needed and breakdown work While offensively England are hit and miss More offloading at pace needs to be practiced and better support line running and is needed England currently have the nuclus of a potentially world beating team/dquad But there has been too much disruption and they have gone backwards since the summer
England not in a crisis.They are going to do well in six nations.Marcus Smith has developed into the fly halve South Africans wish Manie Libbok would but did not become.🇿🇦
England fans need to keep in mind who they played in the last 5 games!! A tiny bit of luck and England could’ve won at least 3 of those!! SA this year has been frustrating to watch as a fan with all the changes and lack of continuity. Saturday they barely made 3rd gear….
Boks not at their best, England are close to getting it right, I think England are currently missing star players, Marcus is close to being one, but battle to find a star after that. Itoje doesn’t seem at his best, England are very close to getting it right. Defence is suspect.
I hope we can just hangon to the same coaching staff for 12 months and see In the space of three years we have had more defence coaches than J Lo ex husbands Other than that we need real leadership on thr field
England possible Six Nations champions!! If they can get past France, with Ireland looking good for the taking. From a bok fan that loves to see Eng lose!! They scored tries against us. They are definitely on the up. They just need to get their mentality right. Go Bokke!! We'll done England!!
@Camcolito No. Still hate them. I just see where they are now verses where they were. Add to that Ireland on the decline. French looking iffy. England is losing due to small errors in execution and failures in their mentality. Things that can be overcome relatively quickly. They're really looking like they're on the up and up.
If you discount the " try " , then its a bit like missing a number when doing arithmetic your never going to come to a true answer or an honest assessment of the problem , unless you keep getting dishonest officials
Re Springboks, I'm worried. They regressed for me even just since RC. Some basic elements are now a problem and not getting better. E.g. handling, positioning, defensive lines (I realise it's a different style), lineouts etc. These are things they did well in 2023. Can't blame everything on new Tonyball being implemented. Poor quality rugby being played recently and definately frustrating to watch.
As a half-Pom, I can assure you that you have the wrong head-coach. Poor selections, lack of leadership charisma, unimaginative, lacks total rugby qualification and most importantly, his ‘negative / conservative’ mind-set. Sticking with Jones for years too long was nuts - and sticking with a SB set-up is also just wasted time / opportunity. Our Boks played terribly and still should have won by far more. Your comments reflect English issues. Far too conservative and lacking ambition / creativity. Accountant rather than design engineer/innovative scientific/creative artist.
England have shown proper quality despite losing 5 games. They are not in crisis and we need to appreciate their talent and stick with them. They are going to be winners and a proper threat in the 2027 REC
I think England have the players but I don’t believe smith is all he’s cracked up to be. He was tired last 20 made many mistakes, never passes the ball doesn’t drive the team but kicks the ball or runs himself, cant long pass cant long kick. There is something not right about him. As far as bortwick is concerned, it might be too late sacking him after the 6 nations and England have a habit of getting really bad coaches.
@@davidboyle1193 Coach has his ideas and needs time to get his ideas and team together. Have a bit of patience is what i mean. Maybe judge him fairer after the 6 nations.
Kolbe is the Messi of rugby
Messi doesn't dive.
Will be disappointed but not surprised if Kolbe isn't nominated for world player of the year. He deserves it
Don’t miss Rassie’s plan, be good enough to win but groom the next generation timeously so that the boks don’t drop off as player retire. He is totally in control. 50 players in a year sacrificing 2 games, nobody has that record.
Facts. Best performances will come. Also we are not such romantics...Dr Rassie's plan is higher win rate and blood many players "50 players" 🇿🇦🇿🇦
He did not sacrifice the Ireland game, that was his best side and they were fast asleep in the first 30 minutes and lost.
And springbiks dominated the 2nd half of that game mate@@willemsteyn7808
@@willemsteyn7808 Perhaps, the Irish won by one point in the second test, but lost the first test by 7 to the Boks, so on average the Boks won the series!
@ Agree, just making point that the changes do impact on momentum, a worthwhile price to be ready for the future challenges.
No tackle on DeAllende is ever simple, especially a one on one. He is one if not the strongest center in world rugby.
Still I understand his point. Looked too easy a miss at this level.
England played as well but lost. Boks (by their standard) didn't play well but still won. England are now like Scotland, a good team but really need the planets to align to beat the best of the tier one nations.
Harsh but accurate.
England were inept. Saffers were vulnerable bleeding penalties, and England didn't have the whit to capitalise. Ccs is over rated, Earl played well then missed a crucial tackle. Furbank missed two tackles leading to tries. Alfie you were talking about England 3 of 4 being a minimum. Face facts son
Agreed. This wasn't a great performance from the Bokke but relieved we won
Don't sack Borthwick, sack the RFU board.
sack both ... do an Elon Musk .
Yeah, neither are up to scratch
First time watching your channel. Great analysis. I’ll be back. 👍
This and Eggchasers are my go too as well as the rugby analyst.
Saffa here ... I think England can take a lot of heart out of this performance and the season. In New Zealand earlier this year, both matches could have gone either way. Again, the three big South Hemisphere autumn games were close run affairs. Hold on to Borthwick ... he's got aa plan ...
Fellow Saffa here. I see what you did there 😉. Yes, keep the losing coach in. Yes.
England have so much talent. We’re lacking at front row and that’s a big issue but I do see green shoots (Stuart, Baxter, Fasogbon, Opoku-Fordjour are all promising).
In all other areas we have some serious talent. The problem is we don’t have a coaching set up that’s willing to put them all on the pitch!! Sleightholme and Feyi-Waboso should both start together with Ibitoye & Wade next cabs off the rank. That is pure electricity on the wings. We need to play to our strengths with regards to midfield, we lack a powerful 12 but we do have some electric athletes. Lawrence 12 with a fast athlete like Freeman 13 just makes sense. That’s a much more powerful midfield. Furbank then becomes obvious as the 2nd playmaker at 15 and JVP is an anti-talent selection. Let’s see Randall more while Mitchell is injured.
The way to sort out our bench is to start selecting some of the supreme back 5 talent that we aren’t seeing play any minutes. Where’s Ted Hill, Tizard, Mercer, Barbeary, Evans in the wider squad?! Really not ok for them to not even be in the set up when you look at how weak our bench is.
I have a question, if England played so well and South Africa didn’t play so well , yet look at the score . Same for Scotland. Curious.!
Thanks Alfred. Always appreciate your insights. England's disallowed try had a forward pass not dissimilar to ours. So neck roll aside, it couldn't have been allowed. Main problem is defense. Cheslin's first try should have been stopped. Grant Williams should have been stopped. De Allende should have been stopped. I think that's your main weakness. Your attack is innovative, quick and varied. Marcus is key.
If Marcus should get injured now England is screwed...he carries a big part of that team...same with France...without Dupont they look very average.
Dude a loss is a loss. If these were Springbok results we would consider this a crisis.
England played well just lost to better side in time they will become better. Nothing to panic about we were there a few years ago.
Rassie is preparing for the world cup... the team who can rotate their players between matches without missing a beat, will have the best chance to go all the way. The toll rugby takes on players these days is just so much... as we have seen with SA after beating the French in the quarters. Keeping players fresh between games week in and week out will be key...
Love your insight Alfred. As a springbok fan it was frustrating to watch us give away so many penalties. England have some star players but their overall impression is not cohesive
It’s not about the team… it’s about the program. Depth is a culture
The amount of missed tackles for England!!! 😮. Against SA attackers we had no chance
We believe in Rassie and therefore we are aware that he’s preparing and blooding new players into the system. We were not great today but what we know is that we have the experience to see out games.
It will be a mistake to try replace Borthwick now. You have to have perspective when playing against the No1 ranked team.
… and the number 8 ranked team last week ?
I think England is on the right track. Build the team to start winning. They push New Zealand the push South Africa and they let them selves down against Australia. They key issue is that they don't have the quality off the bench yet. However it is a catch 22.... You first need to win consistently before you can build the depth that you need in rugby today. I think to many teams is still focusing on the first 15 but should rather focus on the first 23.
1) All of the blame cannot be directed at Borthwick, but I don't think he's the man to take England forward. The departure of Jones was the first red flag. He came from an elite set up - the kind that gives you two Webb Ellis trophies on the bounce - and left within seven months. He was replaced by a guy who got his club relegated from the Pro 14. There is no comparison!
2) England need to bite the bullet and jettison the old guard. There are three years left to build a team identity and playing style. Playing the likes of Dan Cole now, when you've got youngsters in reserve, makes absolutely no sense. You have to blood your youngsters against the best of the best and though Borthwick has blooded some, he hasn't blooded enough.
3) Rassie is the best coach in the world and en route to being the greatest of all time. What he has done since 2018 has been remarkable. He's taken the Boks at their lowest ebb - not figuratively, literally: they were the lowest-ranked they've ever been - and turned them into the greatest side in the world. He's done this while changing systems and personnel. 50 players fielded in this year alone and no team sheet being the same. To do that and manage only two narrow losses (one point and two!) is quite something.
Agree with your thoughts. Stick with current setup. From a saffa.
Alfie, reporting live and direct from Bokenham Stadium.
England team better than their fans realise. Some tendencies that are fixable but great elements visible. That's the basis of a good team in the process of building. Borthwick still learning and might need some help to communicate better. Also a good conditioning coach and psychologist to help their concentration persevere. England for me are coming into playing within their rugby DNA vs outside it as with Eddie. Their loss record this year is against the top teams and then, not by much.
Boks keep winning without turning up, Eng & Scotland should be kicking themselves for falling short.. hopefully next year we see much more oiled Boks performances
Its the succession planning it's essential with the aging team! It's frustrating but not as bad as if we were losing. So I'll take that! We will reap the real benefits come 2027 while maintaining at least a top 3 spot which is again important for the pools
I think the mere fact that England is asking the Borthwick question is the greatest part of their problem. One can only build of you are given the freedom to fail. With the sword out right from the start, all coaches are doomed to fail. Ultimate success requires intermittent failure, and must be willing to learn from it. England is a great team. They always give SA the hardest of times.
Great report.
To be fair its been a brutal run of games. But then it was Englands (presumeably not Borthwicks but the money mens) choice to play NZ 3 times in a row with Australia and South Africa to follow and the gimme Japan games either side.
That Ireland win is doing a lot of work, i think a year with only 2 and 3 pt wins over Italy and Wales and 2 Japan mismatches would leave England in full disaster mode.
Hoping in the long run these brutal games will be a turning point. Though have we gone backwards this autumn or just stalled as many England fans felt coming into this Autumn that 3 out of 4 wins was totally possible. Still feel Japan should have been the first game this Autumn . Sour grapes maybe but I’m gutted. Let’s keep Steve Borthwick though . 🏴
good video mate , ive said for a while england lack fitness and depth also they come out hyped up and play a great first 40 or maybe 60 but then as tiredness creeps in the superior cool headed team normally wins out, I still think england could do well in this years six nations as i think my team ireland are in a bit of a dip and france not sure how they will be but looked good yesterday
This constant search for a ‘perfect’ Bok performance is going to frustrate a lot of people. I’m not saying that shouldn’t be the goal but reality is the top 6 teams aren’t too far apart, more so than in any previous year and so Boks will be put under pressure believe me, just like we saw vs The ABs in the Championship, last week vs Scotland and yesterday vs England. Sure, there’s some things South Africa can control and execute better on but as the top nation, you’ll find teams will analyse them more than others.
As for England, they look exceptional on attack & have certainly improved but put it this way, if SA or NZ had lost 5 in a row it would 1 million percent be a crisis🤷🏾😂
Indeed. Peaking between world cups is precisely not what you want. The Boks have always understood this.
Agree with you . ...Im one of the Boks supporters waiting for a 90% game....waiting for us to click like we did at Twickenham against the AB before the WC . But as you say teams are so equal in quality nowadays that game where everything works is only gonne happen ones in a while ( blue moon ) so in the meantime our nerves will be tested finger nails chewed😅😅😅
The Autumn Nations Series tells me:
That the Six Nations Championship is not better than the Rugby Championship and vice-versa.
However, it does tell me which Teams are more settled, more experienced, more balanced, has more depth and also has the most efficient and impactful bench currently.
The Overall on-field performances from Australia and Wales the last 2 years or so has to do with:
Rugby Australia and it's other different Sporting Codes that is alot more Attractive and Lucrative amongst other things.
The Welsh Rugby Union System needs to be remodeled and the Welsh Rugby Board has some Decisions to make with regards to it's Club Structures within Welsh Rugby.
🇮🇪fan - 🏴 are a capable team. The biggest threat to them are the fans calling for SB to be replaced. I agree with you 🏴 need continuity & team is not in crisis but are in transition with some players who might not be around for next RWC. Defence needs work but so does flair & creativity in attack (other than MS.). The SA try from two kick blocks was poor & MS poor defence is overlooked by his good forward play. Last try by Aus last week another example. The decision for 🏴 is do they change coach now or NOT, as before a WC will be too late. I’d stick with SB.
There is no doubt that England are a good side but not a top four side. I’d rank them around the same level as Scotland & Argentina (hopefully soon joined by Australia). If you had to pick 2 teams with the best in each position, only Itoje and Marcus Smith would maybe make it. Maybe it’s just a case that England just don’t have enough quality players to take on the top 4.
They are slightly better than Scotland.
Agree. Smith and Itoje stand out!
Boks are only in experimentation fase. Will see more 12 plus changes every game. Its not about world rankings. Its about having a 46 player pool come 2027
Bok supporter here,England played well,however they were playing against arguably the greatest Bok team ever.Mark of a great team is that they are able to win games even when they are not playing well.
SAFA here, keep the coach et Al. Great team. Bound Tobe winners
My thoughts on the Boks are that it’s still the same old methods winning them games. They have great players but as yet we aren’t seeing this new style that they want to implement be successful. Maybe they won’t need a new style.
DeAllende is more like Ardie Savea. They are both deceptively strong and fast. You need a really strong tackler if not two!
During the WC our defence was fine, one of our best attributes. Why did Borthwick feel we needed a blitz defence rather than either implementing gradual evolution or just developing our areas of weakness, eg our attack.
The blitz at every opportunity style is clearly draining the energy from the players and it’s still not a system that even works well, not in the way England implement it, and we have now been waiting a long time for it to be effective…
Things feel compounded by odd selections eg Forde, VPort, etc poor in defence and not quick in attack and of course odd timings of substitutions, as if Borthwick hasn’t got a feel for the game, or that he has a predetermined plan.
It’s like driving with your handbrake on, there isn’t an appreciation for a whole joined up game plan in terms of strategy & player selection.
I think there’s a good team there in potential but have my doubts about Borthwicks intuition and vision
Absolutely to be a Springbok Supporter
The six nations will be the test.
😂😂😂😂😂 six gun grill.
Question...what would England be like without Marcus Smith? 🤔
as a Saffa Supporter on point of View,our mission is to Win Games thats all entertaining Games come last.😂😂😂😂
Man for man the whole set up, not up to international standard. This team would struggle in the prem !
As Saffer here I'm concerned at Borthwick's reading g of the game. It's just he hasn't got the players to execute his vision. Start with fitness and conditioning
Bok fan here!
England played well…
I think they can win
Question? Where is Farrell?
The Springboks are really not playing well 😢 I love them so much
But wonder if Rassie is too experiential????
It stresses me out..
then they win?
I don’t know 🤷🏽♀️
50 players in a season and still winning 80%
It's essential he has no choice that team is aging! He will reap the rewards come 2027 whilst maintaining a winning record I'll take that anyday
Rassie is building a squad to win the 2027 World Cup. His status as a double World Cup-winning coach gives him the licence to do that. All the other tier one coaches are under threat of sack if they don't win most tests, which is why they play their strongest 23s and play better. SA play a more disjointed game because no team sheet is the same. The skill it requires to do this and still win almost every test (a one point loss to Ireland, a two point loss to the Argies) is beyond impressive. It's unprecedented. The entire rugby establishment would be singing Rassie's praises if he were an Englishman, Frenchman, Irishman, or Kiwi. Since he's a Saffer, we get treated to lukewarm praise like 'South Africa are the best team in the world right now' and 'The Boks are a good team'. SA have done more in the last year than the entire northern hemisphere combined.
I think we got hammered with penalties. (whining a little) Whatever, ENG played well and were competitive. Ben Earl. player of the match for Eng.
Even with a terrible cohesion, libbok useless at fly, we still too good for England or else.
Everyone in the biggest sportspub in jhb SA thought we were going to lose.
Still Libbok produced an amazing try with kolbe.... It won the match.
Just how do you arrive at that conclusion. Without Mannie cross kick, Cheslin would not have scored that try, this is why Rassie who has a great rugby mind decides to use Mannie like he does Siya. You’re just mistaken, i would comment it was not Mannie’s best but it met Rassie’s plan.
Manie's general play was not bad at all....and by this time we know about his kicking...if Manie plays we have to have a backup goalkicker
For all the TEAM changing we (SA) have done well thanks to a brave Management team.
SA is a lucky country BUT it is going to run OUT.
I have to admit, this bok performance wasn't great... We're clearly still trying to figure things out. Now imagine how dangerous we will be when we're firing at all cylinders 🇿🇦🇿🇦 Let's go!
Given the legitimate try that was disallowed, Englands second try was started with a well forward pass in their half so should’ve been called back, that’s a 14 point swing just on the officials. Then we add in the penalties that were just mystical, so much so the tv director never replayed them or the reason for the yellow card so I recon SA was way over penalised. England escaped a yellow card even though they committed apartheid for other fouls they executed 4 neck rolls and a no arms tackle but zero cards. I think the actual score with a neutral ref is 50:13 in SA favour. That’s how much trouble England is in, it’s crisis time.
Not a crisis, but a moment of clarity. We have enough evidence now. Borthwick is responsible for the back room ordeals, so can’t use that disruption as an excuse. He’s responsible for baffling, unmerited selections, he’s responsible for coaching an unsustainable defence and blunt attack. We’re entirely reliant on Smith creating magic, there’s no effective strategy. The team has gone backwards, and it’s worth remembering that Borthwick started his tenure saying England “couldn’t do anything well”. His picks for this game were badly exposed. JVP error prone and ponderous. Steward’s qualities entirely offset and then some by his defensive and attacking frailties. The entire bench adds nothing. Borthwick lacks imagination, lacks charisma, and lacks the honesty required to make hard decisions about his preferred picks. Time to go. But he’ll stay for the 6N, which I have little doubt will expose him even more.
As the kiwi despite find a way to lose against the wallabies i see improvement but time to review if don't win games after 6 nations.
Keep Borthwick , keep losing, what a record. With the players England has, there simply is no excuse to be losing consistently. Look at what Joe Schmidt has done with Australia in such a short space of time with little resource's and a very small selection of players compared to England. England just played a poor South African side at home and the Boks won comfortably. England badly need a better Coach than Borthwick
Comfortably? As a bok fan I disagree... I don't know how the Boks won that one again... Was tight. 😂
Allianz curse…
Spot on 👍
Are u for real? A poor Bok side? What a joke
What players?
I don't think England's problem is lack of ability. They have the players. As Alfred said, the South Africans know how to win close games. In contrast it seems like England don't have that dog in them like SA to absolutely refuse to submit to give up and grind things out even if things are going against them. What England needs is a good motivator of a coach with a lot more energy than Borthwick that can gel the team to play for each other. Currently it seems that it's not the best environment to work in with coaches leaving. Maybe there are still remnants of the working environment created by Eddie Jones which everyone agreed was not great to say the least.
Thank you for calling it Twickenham! Don't let the suits dictate what we call it.
You talk about the bench but it was obvious to all casual observers that the bench is poorly selected but Borewick thought otherwise. It is because he is a poor judge of players so as a selector he is not up to the job. Coaching is another issue maybe.
South Africa are a great side
England in patches played as good
But
JVP was given a lesson on how hard it is at international level
Some very poor choice of keeping the ball in the forwards when they weren't moving the ball
Again towards the end blowing
And poor bench
And again JG off after 50 mins he is the bloody captain
SB needs to change or go
Biggest problem is the coaching, needs fixing now.
Time for the old guard to go [D.COLE-J.GEORGE-T.CURRY?- G.FORD-E.DALY-H.SLADE- ect And for Bothwick to really blood the young talent like A.Opaku-Fordjour E.Iyogun H.Tizzard R.Tuima G.Ogre C.Langdon ] It;s also time Bothwick looked at and solved the center question by looking at players like W.Butt - L.Anyawu - Z.Wimbush Bothwick also needs to pick more on form rather THAN REPUTATION So the likes of T.Willis and T.Hill G.Pepper - T.Pearson get looked at and tested at international level As for Englands defence that also needs sorting Blizt yes but do it with a drift to start then turn in and more 1st up tackling practice is needed and breakdown work While offensively England are hit and miss More offloading at pace needs to be practiced and better support line running and is needed England currently have the nuclus of a potentially world beating team/dquad But there has been too much disruption and they have gone backwards since the summer
England not in a crisis.They are going to do well in six nations.Marcus Smith has developed into the fly halve South Africans wish Manie Libbok would but did not become.🇿🇦
Boks lack if cohesive bomb squad looked less effective, not seeing the impact that their attack coach is making.
You got to break a few eggs to make an omelet. They are on an upward curve.
England played fairly well, I thought. Fell off a bit towards the end. Marcus is dam good.
Fairly well?? What, are you a water polo player??
Match was there for the taking Boks down to 14 with 10 minutes left..... I was really expecting an English win.
Bench is atrocious. Been in all of these games until the subs come on
England fans need to keep in mind who they played in the last 5 games!! A tiny bit of luck and England could’ve won at least 3 of those!!
SA this year has been frustrating to watch as a fan with all the changes and lack of continuity. Saturday they barely made 3rd gear….
Boks not at their best, England are close to getting it right, I think England are currently missing star players, Marcus is close to being one, but battle to find a star after that. Itoje doesn’t seem at his best, England are very close to getting it right. Defence is suspect.
I hope we can just hangon to the same coaching staff for 12 months and see
In the space of three years we have had more defence coaches than J Lo ex husbands
Other than that we need real leadership on thr field
The Boks made England look better than they are because they never got out of 3ed gear!
Mr smith just cant defend, need an upgrade
England competitive but SA have better players
but we lost!
Soften the blow?
England possible Six Nations champions!! If they can get past France, with Ireland looking good for the taking. From a bok fan that loves to see Eng lose!! They scored tries against us. They are definitely on the up. They just need to get their mentality right. Go Bokke!! We'll done England!!
I fancy Scotland to beat England again in the 6 Nations. Scotland can match England upfront and their backline is superior.
Saffas love England now because they always beat them 😂
@Camcolito No. Still hate them. I just see where they are now verses where they were. Add to that Ireland on the decline. French looking iffy. England is losing due to small errors in execution and failures in their mentality. Things that can be overcome relatively quickly. They're really looking like they're on the up and up.
We are in a crisis.
England, actually, are very good - but when it comes down to the wire, they are physically and mentally soft.
From SA. Keep your coach. Don't be rash.
If you discount the " try " , then its a bit like missing a number when doing arithmetic your never going to come to a true answer or an honest assessment of the problem , unless you keep getting dishonest officials
Boks had no rhythm- England were impressive for 60 minutes
England is not in a crisis, Rubbish. They were very unlucky in losing against Springboks as well as All Blacks. Give them a few more months .
Re Springboks, I'm worried. They regressed for me even just since RC. Some basic elements are now a problem and not getting better. E.g. handling, positioning, defensive lines (I realise it's a different style), lineouts etc.
These are things they did well in 2023. Can't blame everything on new Tonyball being implemented. Poor quality rugby being played recently and definately frustrating to watch.
All Blacks should've won but let France in the game. Thats my take on it Alfred
Keep borthwick keep losing.
As a half-Pom, I can assure you that you have the wrong head-coach. Poor selections, lack of leadership charisma, unimaginative, lacks total rugby qualification and most importantly, his ‘negative / conservative’ mind-set. Sticking with Jones for years too long was nuts - and sticking with a SB set-up is also just wasted time / opportunity. Our Boks played terribly and still should have won by far more. Your comments reflect English issues. Far too conservative and lacking ambition / creativity. Accountant rather than design engineer/innovative scientific/creative artist.
England have shown proper quality despite losing 5 games. They are not in crisis and we need to appreciate their talent and stick with them. They are going to be winners and a proper threat in the 2027 REC
They just haven't
The English team is not good, they keep on losing. They must fix the problem. Winning is the only thing that matters. GO BOKKE.
Lol another loss for the English private schoolboys!
Embarrassing defeat once again
Can't say half of them look look like toffs.
I think England have the players but I don’t believe smith is all he’s cracked up to be. He was tired last 20 made many mistakes, never passes the ball doesn’t drive the team but kicks the ball or runs himself, cant long pass cant long kick. There is something not right about him. As far as bortwick is concerned, it might be too late sacking him after the 6 nations and England have a habit of getting really bad coaches.
Without smith U would have lost by 30.
Have the players for what?
You're to woke mate ,stevie wonder can see that borthwick is out of his depth
that's a bit harsh!
@dannydct1 harsh on who
@@davidboyle1193 Coach has his ideas and needs time to get his ideas and team together. Have a bit of patience is what i mean. Maybe judge him fairer after the 6 nations.
@dannydct1 he has no ideas
❤🇿🇦...a third world country..😂..with a first world country Springbok team.....and a corrupt and useless Anc goverment 😢...Go Rassie and Bokke ❤🇿🇦
We’re turning into a third world country now too mate. But with a crap rugby team 😂
@Daniboi971 love ye
sorry are you talking sa or eng?
AMC is no longer im power..You cant blame them anymore. GNU is now in charge.
@jadenphilander8799 🤣🤣🤣