Another thing I noticed is how Mami and Sayaka colors should be switched. If Madoka Magica is a play of the magical girl show then Mami would be blue while Sayaka should be yellow. In other magical girl shows the girls who are elegant lady older sister type figures are blue and maybe have a water theme. Probably because blue is a calming color while yellow is usually for the bright happy energetic girls who are friends with the main girl. Or underclassmen But in that way it makes sense that Mami would be Yellow. She's the most fragile of the group because her goal aside from living is gain a new family. To tie herself to another person again. Her witch, Candloro, becomes a choker for it's familiars that are warped versions of Kyouko and Madoka.
Does anyone else think the Labyrinths have influence over the girls? So In Charlottes labyrinth Mami ends up pressuring Madoka into wishing for a Cake after the battle. I want to say coincidence but knowing in post what happened to Charlotte (word from god) I think the Labyrinth had an influence on Mami. Could just be theme tho, Nagisa wished for a cheese cake for her mom who was dying of cancer. the cheese cake was what the mom wanted but not the thing she needed. On the surface Mami wanted an ally/friend but truly what she needed was to stop being a magical girl as it was something she never asked for, like cancer. Supper obviously we see how the witch Kirsten play's Madoka's memories back at her, which is what her wish was about, bottling up a memory presumably so she could watch it over and over, possibly to be filled with regret. In Elsa Maria's we see Sayaka fall into madness for her purpose, we see Elsa Maria's human silhouette never moving or stopping her prayers. She's single mindedly devoted to her prayer which Sayaka ends up single-mindedly devoted to her wish and the idea of it. Then Octavia, Sayaka's witch whose nature is "falling in love", the labyrinth drags Kyoko in immediately and I can't help but think the falling in love nature affected Sayaka. Up until then we couldn't say Kyoko loved Sayaka, she started to care for her but no way was that love. After the escape we see Kyoko keeping Sayaka's body fresh expending her magic and likely expending grief seed to do so since we know Kyoko must have had Elsa maria's Seed and how she operated. Grief seeds were the resource we know Kyoko valued over human life, so for her to expend them says a lot. She went into that battle knowing she could have won but she didn't because she wanted most was to saver Sayaka. Saya used her wish to ultimately get the love from someone who was never going to give it to her, and Kyoko wasted her life trying to save someone who didn't have the possibility of being saved.
Makes sense, since Soul Gems and Gried Seeds can absorb negative magic and emotions, I can easily see them influencing the girls. Would also make sense for Kyubey to encourage them to fight witches if it speeds up the incubation process.
19:02 had a similar observation. I actually believe Kyubey doesn't approach Girls who are well off, at least not usually. His line about girls jumping at the opportunity for a wish suggests he targets women more desperate for a wish, and less likely to think of the consequences of their actions.
Don't know if it's mentioned later on but Mami's "I'm not afraid of anything anymore!" line feels to be equivalent to Faust's "Stay, thou art so lovely, stay!". The moment of happiness leading to damnation. In Mami's case practically she rushed into relaxing too early with the future-vision of that happiness. Madoka wasn't yet there to fight together with her on the actual battlefield. In Faust also there was the catch that he uttered these words not about the actual present moment but his utopic vision of a future which Mephisto tried to take pragmatically ignoring the context. I don't mean that Mami died because she had that moment of happiness of course, Kyubey's contract doesn't have that same rule but it's a nice extra parallel contributing to the show. Sayaka's "There's no way I'll regret this line" in ep 5 also works in a similar way.
As someone struggling with finding a purpose while simultaneously worrying about the ticking clock ringing before I find it, this video, especially the part on existentialism, really hit me hard. In terms of the themes of trust and redemtion, it almost seems like Kyouko of all people is the only one other than Madoka to extend her trust to a former enemy, namely Sayaka, right as Kyoko sacrifices herself to finish Sayaka's witch. I also thought of other shows, especially Lyrical Nanoha where enemies to friends is so common it's practically a meme, but also RWBY, specifically the recent Volume 7. I think it's rather telling that the OP and ED for that Volume are _Trust Love_ and _Fear_ respectively.
Oh I have a lot to say about Sakura Kyoko and her ideology. Your comparisons to Nanoha (specifically A's) and even post-Monty RWBY are so accurate that you could probably do the episode 9 video all on your own!
It's so funny to hear you spell out how the cornerstone of magical girl values is that the world is grey and difficult, and no one is too far gone, so we should always practice compassion. This is arguably the most central belief I have as a person and I'm suddenly putting together that I absolutely learned this value from Sailor Moon. Never put that together before now 😅
Sharing my perspective and thoughts and that allowing you to draw those connections makes doing all of these videos worthwhile. It is why media and media criticism is meaningful. Thanks for sharing.
Analyzing where the series creators "Magica Quartet" come from is really a visit of Producer Iwakami's professional history. Briefly and chronologically: Shinbo: Iwakami's longtime and fruitful collaborator at Studio SHAFT, beginning with Hidamari sketch (with Iwakami wa a line producer for Aniplex). It was a conversation between them during the Bakemonogatari production that start the gears for PMMM (Shinbo, "For the mahou shoujo format, there should still be possibilities.") Bakemonogatari becoming a megahit gave the duo the corporate latitude to pursue the original work and creative flexibility to piecing together other members of the creative team that became known as Magica Quartet. Aoki Ume: Mangaka for the Houbunsha series Hidamari Sketch, as aforementioned the duo adapted into four successful anime seasons. Ume-sensei's *wide-face* style was not easy to animate, but Studio SHAFT under tutorage of Shinbo had gained a competency for. It was this familiarity that led to the duo to bring in Ume-sensei for the series' character design. A lot of the heroines personality were informed by her character designs (such as Mami as an ojou-sama). Urobuchi: Scouted by Iwakami for writing Fate/Zero (which he'll end up producing an anime for as well) at NitroPlus. Iwakami brought him to contradict Ume-sensei's cutesy art style to intentionally write "Chidamari Sketch". Along with his own works Fate/Zero and Saya no Uta, Urobuchi said that it was very strongly influenced by three of Director Akiyuki Shinbo's anime series, Hidamari Sketch, Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha, and Le Portrait de Petite Cossette. These four met at initial October 2008 design meeting for PMMM and became the series creator Magica Quartet. Alongside, the companies the represent - Aniplex, SHAFT, Houbusha, and NitroPLUS became the production committee and main financial backers of the project. As an aside, every Madoka manga and spinoff were published on Houbunsha magazines, including the franchise mag Kirara Magica.
To add a few other notable staffs: * Gekidan Inu Curry: independent animation troupe that took heavily after east-European animation traditions. They worked with Studio SHAFT on and off starting with Mario Holic ED. They're brought in essentially as a creative second unit to intentionally create cognitive dissonance during Witch's Labyrinth sequences. During their initial meeting with the Quartet, they're instructed "'Madoka Magica' should be a work that is on the extension line of 'Le Portrait de Petit Cossette' and has a different image from 'Lyrical Nanoha.'" * Kajiura: Scored Le Portrait de Petit Cossette early during her storied career. The score is very much peak-Kajiura (see her Sand Dream single), and Kajiura and Gekidan Inu Curry likely heavily influence each other creatively.
Studio SHAFT When CEO Kubota took helm of Studio SHAFT, the struggling studio was deep in rebuilding mode. Kubota scouted Shinbo after Le Portrait de Petit Cossette to lead the studio creatively, and Shinbo has been credited as Director of every Studio SHAFT series ever since. In the western fandom Shinbo tends to viewed in two camps - either Shinbo is everything Studio SHAFT, or Shinbo does nothing in Studio SHAFT. In truth, both misunderstood Shinbo's real role. Studio SHAFT really should be considered a school of animation, with Shinbo as its schoolmaster. SHAFT anime have particular set of house styles that distinguish from their contemporaries. These stylistic quirks came about initially for singular reason - saving money. Much of these Shinboism - eye closeups, monocolor frames, fast cuts, metonymy - were adopted to be both interesting visually while cheap to animate, an important concern during early Studio SHAFT's hungry days. At Studio SHAFT, these techniques were developed and disseminated, eventually forming a unified set of directorial quarks and house style. This not to say that SHAFT's directorial talents are homogeneous. If you know where to look, every SHAFT director have his/her own take of this unified of directorial language. Indeed, innovations outside of Shinbo were often adopted as well (check out the blog Camonte for a good breakdown of SHAFT directorial talents). If anime is the art of limited animation, Studio SHAFT took limited animation to its logical conclusion. In recent years Shinboism have spread its influence to rest of the industry. Since Madoka, Studio DEEN, Silver Link, A-1 all have Shinbo protege helming their own shows, with the directorial heritage plain to see (see the currently airing Kaguya anime).
I hope you talk about Rebellion and Nagisa Momoe because she really adds alot for simply being there. She's there to say sorry to Mami and help Homura. It feels like Madoka's values have seeped into her. She wanted to help the girl who ended her own despair and then help the girl she killed. She made Mami into a true magical girl. Mami had someone who was her enemy believe in her and follow her to the end. She truly has no reason to leave heaven, this would literally be her first time dealing with a witch.
@@clearandsweet I was rewatching your videos and I stumbled upon this reply! I’m super excited for your Rebellion video! I wonder if the recently announced Madoka movie will follow in Rebellion’s footsteps of… kind of invalidating the series? Or will it go back to still supporting the view that Madoka’s sacrifice, although bittersweet, is undeniably *good* (because Thats What Magical Girls Do)?
I am currently rewatching the series and I noticed something that did not stand out to me before. In this episode before they notice the greef seed at the hospital, Sayaka says something that does not shine a good light on her. She goes to the hospital to see Kyosuke, but is turned away because "it's not a good day for him". And then Sayaka follows it up with "And I came all the way here. It's pretty rude".... So she hears that her supposed sweetheart is having a bad day, and instead of wondering what's wrong, how bad it is she complains about how rude it is for the hospital staff to do exactly what they are supposed to do...
0:20 I literally upvoted that comment and now I see it in your video wtf It's a shame that almost no one nowadays goes into madoka magica blind because of all those ep 3 hints. I'm glad the only thing I knew was that something happens there, but it still changes your expectations a bunch.
I actually got mixed up and thought this anime was Doki Doki Literature Club (I had only seen a very small bit of Doki Doki Literature Club) when I first watched it so even though I knew it was dark, I suppose my expectations where thrown off in a way.
Nother good vid. One last thing, felt like it might be worth mentioning how Mami's defeat also comes after she uses her ultimate attack. Often in Magical Girl shows, the ultimate attack is meant to finish the foe without a second thought. When it fails, that's usually the sign of a new higher level threat that the girls will have to face. However, here, Mami's move fails against just a plain basic enemy, and she is given no chance to recuperate, she just dies.
I'm not to the end yet but thank you for acknowledging my deep seated dislike of Rebellion. I would elaborate why here but I'm kind of distracted at the moment. This is my favorite show of all time and I've rewatched countless times, but this is an oasis of deep long-form analysis in a desert of content, so thank you so much for making it! I'm actually having to euthanize my beloved pet snail right now and it's a fairly lengthy process, but binging these is helping distract from some of the pain. So again, thanks
To me, the most emotional moments of many of the episodes comes not only from the visuals, but from the voice acting. In episode three, it wasn't Mami's death itself, or the immediate reactions of the other girls. It was the moment when Homura picks up the grief seed, and Sayaka says, "Give it back. GIVE IT BACK!!!" Gut punch every time.
i think its unfair to say that Mami not trusting Homura was "wrong" it is her downfall in the end, and it is unlike a typical magical girl, yes. but is it a perfectly logical and sane decision. Mami is entirely convinced Homura is the enemy, and Homura has not tried to correct her for obvious reasons. Mami is confident that Homuras intentions are dangerous. in fact, anyone who doesnt know whats really going on with Homura (other than Madoka, who is the ideal magical girl as you said), would think the same. it was a mistake, but it was not irrational or out of place.
How do you feel about the other magical girls to come out after Madoka trying to chase it? I had the opposite. I watched it because I knew it was going to be dark. My anime experience is death note and mirai nikki. I just finished watching the entire Shugo Chara series and I was upset that it was over (I also was going to begin middle school and I'm on the autism spectrum, change is hard for me to deal with) While on Netflix seeing the poster of Madoka another pink magical girl made me sad. So I wanted something darker. I didn't need the history of magical girls but I felt that.
you say at 33:45 that it was Kyube that called Sayaka's attachment to Kyosuke, early on the episode. But I remember that was Madoka that say it, at least as I heard on the japanese dub. I don't know why they zoomed on Kyube's face, is because of that I think you thought the way you did. Great analysis by the way.
Oh was it? Dang I was listening to the English dub as I went through this and the voices are quite similar. I don't really like Cabanos as Madoka, tbh, especially when a lot of the other performances are very great. Well good catch, my bad.
@@clearandsweet It was Cabanos in the English dub, too. I think the shot was meant to show Kyūbe hearing it and realizing he could use that fact for his own ends, i.e., that the way to get Sayaka (and through her Madoka) to contract faster (they were hesitating about their wishes at that point) was via her love to Kyōsuke.
clearandsweet I have a suspicion as to why that might be, given how you’ve chosen to approach this videos (that I’m enjoying a bunch btw). It’s because it completely betrays the Mahou Shoujo values and ideals that the original series strived so hard to solidify and strengthen right?
@@josueroberto7356 that's exactly why rebellion is great, it is about Homura the only one who needed closure, she represents this betrayal of mahou shoujo values since the beginning, she took Madoka's spotlight as the typical magical girl protagonist from the moment she decided to stop Madoka from wishing and became a twisted protagonist, Homura is the reason why this is a deconstruction of the genre, her choices dictated the plot into a darker tone, rebellion shows that she was willing to take Madoka's spotlight as a goddess once more if that meant protecting her from Kyubey
@@josueroberto7356I'm exaggerating, but I feel like that's the whole point of PMMM. It casts all these values and ideals and plays them out while analyzing them from so many different perspectives. Rebellion doesn't damn the values Madoka herself holds dear, Homura never wants to take those values away from her, or change those parts of her, explicitly because they are her, and they are valuable (Does Homura view them as inherently valuable? Or do they only have value because they are Madoka?). But in doing so, it criticizes the failings of those values. What is the good and bad of self-sacrifice? What is the morality of it and its effects? To me, Rebellion is the most *deconstructive* part of the franchise. I take away from it that the only way to attain the goals and values of Magical Girls, is to not play into the Magical Girl system at all.
@@clearandsweet ah, I just meaning in relation to it being strong, but subtle foreshadowing of Kyoko’s past transgressions. I feel like foreshadowing is one of Urobuchi’s strongest tools as a writer, and what makes the twists and turns in his work feel so earned.
Sailor Moon really doesn't consistently offer redemption to all the bad guys though, that's one of the things that makes it still the formative embryo of the genre. The Manga offers it to almsot none of them, that Black Moon Clan especially is presented as without any valid redeeming value.
I have very few nice things to say about the manga, nor do I think Takeuchi understood or created anything related to the heart and themes of the genre. For the purposes of the themes, the Sailor Moon manga might as well be the Berserk manga. That said, yeah, not every bad guy in the anime gets their redemption, though most are offered it and have a choice to accept or decline. Definitely something that would become much more of a staple later on.
@@clearandsweet I used to be more like the Manga haters, but I've come to appreciate it, especially the Black Moon Saga which in the Anime is one of the low points. In the 90s Anime it seems like the character who get redeemed are the ones lucky enough to have spend non battle time with one of the protagonists.
@@Kuudere-Kun I feel you but I'll have to disagree. I think the black moon clan arc is one of my favorites specifically for how it treats the characters. Petz x Sapphire, then Sapphire x Diamond scenes are probably some of the strongest in the entire genre. And ya, redoing it after the fact, Jaedite and Eugeal and everyone should get the same treatment as Fish Eye and Nephrite, but hey, that's why we have Precure and Utena and the rest.
I love your work, lots of agreeing which unfortunately doesn't make for much of a potential discourse comment. Please don't go full internet and take my disagreement with one opinion as a personal attack on you as a person. I disagree that magical girls must always rise above and redeem. Pretty Soldier Sailor Moon 100% draws lines in the sand in Naoko Takeuchi's original. Sailor Moon fights for love and never gives up on faith for peace, but she will kill the instant she has to despite finding violence distasteful. It's only when she's written by men that she always has to rise above it all to reach their ideal of femininity. I love all adaptations, but I do fundamentally disagree with the idea that to embody love and hope and compassion and justice that one always has to rise above it all. I feel like the homogeneity of what magical girls and shoujo can be are sexist as heck, since largely it's male executives who have decided what is for girls? That action is a boys(Shonen) thing and romance is a girls(Shoujo) thing. In 2024 this is still a thing. Will probably still be a thing when/if someone randomly reads this comment in the future.
I like your point of view but I completely disagree with it. The most important thing that qualifies a magical girl is the idea of eternal redemption and hope for everyone regardless of circumstance. If you give up on someone then it is wrong to have hope for them and I will tell you it's wrong every time. Furthermore, I have almost zero respect for Takeuchi's writing, and I hate her rendition of Sailor Moon on most levels, barring aesthetically. The work of Junichi Sato and the rest of the team at Toei Animation in the early to mid '90s (which included plenty of women all throughout the process) made the modern magical girl genre, and put all the themes of the genre into the show. And I've been arguing on the internet since before some of you were born! I absolutely know how to separate an attack on my position from who I am as a person! Thank you for your comment and for watching.
@@clearandsweet I don't recall read of women in power positions back then. Women had their projects cut up and repackaged by men with values of the stories changed by the production a lot more back then. The characters are all flanderized: Mars' snark was dialed up to hot headed, Mercury isn't confident and smart and lonely anymore because she has to be shy now, Jupiter was given masculine traits with her plant based powers erased just because she's the tall and strong one, Minako was reduced to being a goofy fun loving idol with all of her leadership and depth removed. Tuxedo Mask is completely ruined. The live action version she was actually allowed to have creative approval over, and it's leagues better than the anime. She was having fun and poked fun at her own work as it came out (it's even in the scans). The core ideas of the character came from her, but the show didn't want to let her grow up like the manga did. Magical girls can represent that, but it's limiting and sexist. Hope for a better future doesn't mean you keep giving chances to those who want hope to disappear, because they are actively going to hurt people and magical girls should bring genuine hope. It's never too late to turn your life around type of hope yes. I loved Sailor Moon R having the team realize that the sisters were exploited as pawns who needed saving. Always forgiving people no matter how bad they are? That leads to body counts.
@@ETPlayground They took a terrible story and bland characters and gave them personality and interpersonal relationships and goals. They made them into people where in the manga they were nothing beyond their looks. They gave the story stakes and themes. The entire team from animation directors to writers to episodic directors to art directors had plenty of women at every step along the way. You can go on anime news network and just look at the cast credits. Your narrative of labeling it a product of men is just patently false, and indeed Takeuchi has talked about how much her original manga was affected by her (male) editor and the desires of the higher-ups at Kodansha in interviews many times in the past, so I could just as easily make your argument in reverse as well.
@@clearandsweet I never said anything bad about that show itself, just that it is not the original and the characters had plenty of complexity in their stories. I disagree that the senshi were bland, just that they were poorly developed on the page. Like when you write a story and forget to help the audience get to know your characters well because you're rushed. She was rushed to finish her story, change her planned ending that the anime was allowed to use, and pushed to extend it. Her editor and friend Oas-P helped her with the idea for Chibiusa. The epic ending two parter was supposed to be in the manga. She wanted each senshi to sacrifice herself brutally for the friend they love (possibly with flashbacks or some tell don't show because deadlines) but was told "this is Shoujo manga, you can't do that!!" They had next to no development on panel which I agree was an issue, but as previously stated PGSM provides an example of how her visions for her characters could have been portrayed with more time put into, with some anime influences and making it kind of traditional to invent a new character similar to Sailor V's personality with significant differences and calling her Sailor Venus. I WISH she'd make a revised edition with her original planned ending and other details, but can't see it happening. Apparently Heavy Metal Papillon is a belly dancer with a daughter, but that never made it from the character notes, again I suspect because of deadlines. Every version of Sailor Moon has some glaring flaws, but she does deem true evil to be consistently "Unforgivable!" and fights it in hope that some day she will no longer have to. Unlike us she gets to visit her future where she has achieved that for herself and everyone (again, Takeuchi's idea, and I believe she deserves respect for her work even if it's one's least favourite adaptation). Every version has something to enjoy, I was originally trying to say that it seems to be a common trend where men writing girls tend to be more inclined toward the idea that to give hope that magical girls must always rise above to an extreme of purity. Which brings to my mind how that mindset is pushed on people fighting for their rights to always rise despite the literal violence that may be happening. I don't think it's misogyny since that's intentional, despite the norms of the time when one of my favourite shows was made. That kinda stuff makes me appreciate the good in the work more, especially when the women behind it are doing well after the fact. I agree that your magical girl thesis statement applies to the metaphysics of the Madoka Magica universe though, I definitely forgot to mention that. Mine is that I believe that magical girls can be whatever the creator of the story intends. Limitations on who someone can be because of what they happen to be feels like the shackles or recloseting (re+closet+ing in case that's only clear in my head) of writing to me. My narrative comes from several different sources over decades of being a fan. I'm not part of the "omg she wrote it to cure her sadness" part of the fandom, I assure you. I've honestly invested more time than is likely healthy learning background stuff about the show over the years. And the rise of video essays led to even more information over the years. I'm not trying to demonize men either, it sucks but it was the norm and dwelling serves nobody. I don't agree with how she was treated, but it's a brutal industry and in the end several versions of the story came to exist to be enjoyed.
It's a shame these get such low views, cause they're really good
seriously
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Another thing I noticed is how Mami and Sayaka colors should be switched. If Madoka Magica is a play of the magical girl show then Mami would be blue while Sayaka should be yellow. In other magical girl shows the girls who are elegant lady older sister type figures are blue and maybe have a water theme. Probably because blue is a calming color while yellow is usually for the bright happy energetic girls who are friends with the main girl. Or underclassmen
But in that way it makes sense that Mami would be Yellow. She's the most fragile of the group because her goal aside from living is gain a new family. To tie herself to another person again. Her witch, Candloro, becomes a choker for it's familiars that are warped versions of Kyouko and Madoka.
Does anyone else think the Labyrinths have influence over the girls?
So In Charlottes labyrinth Mami ends up pressuring Madoka into wishing for a Cake after the battle. I want to say coincidence but knowing in post what happened to Charlotte (word from god) I think the Labyrinth had an influence on Mami. Could just be theme tho, Nagisa wished for a cheese cake for her mom who was dying of cancer. the cheese cake was what the mom wanted but not the thing she needed. On the surface Mami wanted an ally/friend but truly what she needed was to stop being a magical girl as it was something she never asked for, like cancer.
Supper obviously we see how the witch Kirsten play's Madoka's memories back at her, which is what her wish was about, bottling up a memory presumably so she could watch it over and over, possibly to be filled with regret.
In Elsa Maria's we see Sayaka fall into madness for her purpose, we see Elsa Maria's human silhouette never moving or stopping her prayers. She's single mindedly devoted to her prayer which Sayaka ends up single-mindedly devoted to her wish and the idea of it.
Then Octavia, Sayaka's witch whose nature is "falling in love", the labyrinth drags Kyoko in immediately and I can't help but think the falling in love nature affected Sayaka. Up until then we couldn't say Kyoko loved Sayaka, she started to care for her but no way was that love. After the escape we see Kyoko keeping Sayaka's body fresh expending her magic and likely expending grief seed to do so since we know Kyoko must have had Elsa maria's Seed and how she operated. Grief seeds were the resource we know Kyoko valued over human life, so for her to expend them says a lot. She went into that battle knowing she could have won but she didn't because she wanted most was to saver Sayaka. Saya used her wish to ultimately get the love from someone who was never going to give it to her, and Kyoko wasted her life trying to save someone who didn't have the possibility of being saved.
Interesting reading! I like it.
Makes sense, since Soul Gems and Gried Seeds can absorb negative magic and emotions, I can easily see them influencing the girls. Would also make sense for Kyubey to encourage them to fight witches if it speeds up the incubation process.
19:02 had a similar observation. I actually believe Kyubey doesn't approach Girls who are well off, at least not usually. His line about girls jumping at the opportunity for a wish suggests he targets women more desperate for a wish, and less likely to think of the consequences of their actions.
Don't know if it's mentioned later on but Mami's "I'm not afraid of anything anymore!" line feels to be equivalent to Faust's "Stay, thou art so lovely, stay!". The moment of happiness leading to damnation. In Mami's case practically she rushed into relaxing too early with the future-vision of that happiness. Madoka wasn't yet there to fight together with her on the actual battlefield. In Faust also there was the catch that he uttered these words not about the actual present moment but his utopic vision of a future which Mephisto tried to take pragmatically ignoring the context. I don't mean that Mami died because she had that moment of happiness of course, Kyubey's contract doesn't have that same rule but it's a nice extra parallel contributing to the show. Sayaka's "There's no way I'll regret this line" in ep 5 also works in a similar way.
As someone struggling with finding a purpose while simultaneously worrying about the ticking clock ringing before I find it, this video, especially the part on existentialism, really hit me hard.
In terms of the themes of trust and redemtion, it almost seems like Kyouko of all people is the only one other than Madoka to extend her trust to a former enemy, namely Sayaka, right as Kyoko sacrifices herself to finish Sayaka's witch. I also thought of other shows, especially Lyrical Nanoha where enemies to friends is so common it's practically a meme, but also RWBY, specifically the recent Volume 7. I think it's rather telling that the OP and ED for that Volume are _Trust Love_ and _Fear_ respectively.
RWBY has always seemed closer to the magical girl genre compared to action, at least to me with the undertones
Oh I have a lot to say about Sakura Kyoko and her ideology. Your comparisons to Nanoha (specifically A's) and even post-Monty RWBY are so accurate that you could probably do the episode 9 video all on your own!
It's so funny to hear you spell out how the cornerstone of magical girl values is that the world is grey and difficult, and no one is too far gone, so we should always practice compassion. This is arguably the most central belief I have as a person and I'm suddenly putting together that I absolutely learned this value from Sailor Moon. Never put that together before now 😅
Sharing my perspective and thoughts and that allowing you to draw those connections makes doing all of these videos worthwhile.
It is why media and media criticism is meaningful. Thanks for sharing.
Analyzing where the series creators "Magica Quartet" come from is really a visit of Producer Iwakami's professional history. Briefly and chronologically:
Shinbo: Iwakami's longtime and fruitful collaborator at Studio SHAFT, beginning with Hidamari sketch (with Iwakami wa a line producer for Aniplex). It was a conversation between them during the Bakemonogatari production that start the gears for PMMM (Shinbo, "For the mahou shoujo format, there should still be possibilities.") Bakemonogatari becoming a megahit gave the duo the corporate latitude to pursue the original work and creative flexibility to piecing together other members of the creative team that became known as Magica Quartet.
Aoki Ume: Mangaka for the Houbunsha series Hidamari Sketch, as aforementioned the duo adapted into four successful anime seasons. Ume-sensei's *wide-face* style was not easy to animate, but Studio SHAFT under tutorage of Shinbo had gained a competency for. It was this familiarity that led to the duo to bring in Ume-sensei for the series' character design. A lot of the heroines personality were informed by her character designs (such as Mami as an ojou-sama).
Urobuchi: Scouted by Iwakami for writing Fate/Zero (which he'll end up producing an anime for as well) at NitroPlus. Iwakami brought him to contradict Ume-sensei's cutesy art style to intentionally write "Chidamari Sketch". Along with his own works Fate/Zero and Saya no Uta, Urobuchi said that it was very strongly influenced by three of Director Akiyuki Shinbo's anime series, Hidamari Sketch, Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha, and Le Portrait de Petite Cossette.
These four met at initial October 2008 design meeting for PMMM and became the series creator Magica Quartet. Alongside, the companies the represent - Aniplex, SHAFT, Houbusha, and NitroPLUS became the production committee and main financial backers of the project. As an aside, every Madoka manga and spinoff were published on Houbunsha magazines, including the franchise mag Kirara Magica.
To add a few other notable staffs:
* Gekidan Inu Curry: independent animation troupe that took heavily after east-European animation traditions. They worked with Studio SHAFT on and off starting with Mario Holic ED. They're brought in essentially as a creative second unit to intentionally create cognitive dissonance during Witch's Labyrinth sequences. During their initial meeting with the Quartet, they're instructed "'Madoka Magica' should be a work that is on the extension line of 'Le Portrait de Petit Cossette' and has a different image from 'Lyrical Nanoha.'"
* Kajiura: Scored Le Portrait de Petit Cossette early during her storied career. The score is very much peak-Kajiura (see her Sand Dream single), and Kajiura and Gekidan Inu Curry likely heavily influence each other creatively.
Studio SHAFT
When CEO Kubota took helm of Studio SHAFT, the struggling studio was deep in rebuilding mode. Kubota scouted Shinbo after Le Portrait de Petit Cossette to lead the studio creatively, and Shinbo has been credited as Director of every Studio SHAFT series ever since.
In the western fandom Shinbo tends to viewed in two camps - either Shinbo is everything Studio SHAFT, or Shinbo does nothing in Studio SHAFT. In truth, both misunderstood Shinbo's real role. Studio SHAFT really should be considered a school of animation, with Shinbo as its schoolmaster.
SHAFT anime have particular set of house styles that distinguish from their contemporaries. These stylistic quirks came about initially for singular reason - saving money.
Much of these Shinboism - eye closeups, monocolor frames, fast cuts, metonymy - were adopted to be both interesting visually while cheap to animate, an important concern during early Studio SHAFT's hungry days. At Studio SHAFT, these techniques were developed and disseminated, eventually forming a unified set of directorial quarks and house style.
This not to say that SHAFT's directorial talents are homogeneous. If you know where to look, every SHAFT director have his/her own take of this unified of directorial language. Indeed, innovations outside of Shinbo were often adopted as well (check out the blog Camonte for a good breakdown of SHAFT directorial talents).
If anime is the art of limited animation, Studio SHAFT took limited animation to its logical conclusion. In recent years Shinboism have spread its influence to rest of the industry. Since Madoka, Studio DEEN, Silver Link, A-1 all have Shinbo protege helming their own shows, with the directorial heritage plain to see (see the currently airing Kaguya anime).
I hope you talk about Rebellion and Nagisa Momoe because she really adds alot for simply being there. She's there to say sorry to Mami and help Homura. It feels like Madoka's values have seeped into her. She wanted to help the girl who ended her own despair and then help the girl she killed. She made Mami into a true magical girl. Mami had someone who was her enemy believe in her and follow her to the end. She truly has no reason to leave heaven, this would literally be her first time dealing with a witch.
I love your reading. Rebellion video should be out next week.
@@clearandsweet I was rewatching your videos and I stumbled upon this reply! I’m super excited for your Rebellion video! I wonder if the recently announced Madoka movie will follow in Rebellion’s footsteps of… kind of invalidating the series? Or will it go back to still supporting the view that Madoka’s sacrifice, although bittersweet, is undeniably *good* (because Thats What Magical Girls Do)?
I am currently rewatching the series and I noticed something that did not stand out to me before.
In this episode before they notice the greef seed at the hospital, Sayaka says something that does not shine a good light on her.
She goes to the hospital to see Kyosuke, but is turned away because "it's not a good day for him". And then Sayaka follows it up with "And I came all the way here. It's pretty rude"....
So she hears that her supposed sweetheart is having a bad day, and instead of wondering what's wrong, how bad it is she complains about how rude it is for the hospital staff to do exactly what they are supposed to do...
0:20 I literally upvoted that comment and now I see it in your video wtf
It's a shame that almost no one nowadays goes into madoka magica blind because of all those ep 3 hints. I'm glad the only thing I knew was that something happens there, but it still changes your expectations a bunch.
To be fair, Madoka is the Evangelion of anime
I actually got mixed up and thought this anime was Doki Doki Literature Club (I had only seen a very small bit of Doki Doki Literature Club) when I first watched it so even though I knew it was dark, I suppose my expectations where thrown off in a way.
Nother good vid. One last thing, felt like it might be worth mentioning how Mami's defeat also comes after she uses her ultimate attack. Often in Magical Girl shows, the ultimate attack is meant to finish the foe without a second thought. When it fails, that's usually the sign of a new higher level threat that the girls will have to face. However, here, Mami's move fails against just a plain basic enemy, and she is given no chance to recuperate, she just dies.
I'm not to the end yet but thank you for acknowledging my deep seated dislike of Rebellion. I would elaborate why here but I'm kind of distracted at the moment. This is my favorite show of all time and I've rewatched countless times, but this is an oasis of deep long-form analysis in a desert of content, so thank you so much for making it! I'm actually having to euthanize my beloved pet snail right now and it's a fairly lengthy process, but binging these is helping distract from some of the pain. So again, thanks
Le back, had to go binge PMMM for the first time in a long while because this just made me itch to watch it again
21:00 One must imagine Homura happy.
To me, the most emotional moments of many of the episodes comes not only from the visuals, but from the voice acting.
In episode three, it wasn't Mami's death itself, or the immediate reactions of the other girls. It was the moment when Homura picks up the grief seed, and Sayaka says, "Give it back. GIVE IT BACK!!!" Gut punch every time.
This is my kind of series, I’m so happy I found your channel
I just dreamt of watching your vids and today you upload!!
Achievement unlocked: get in their heads
Three episode rule arises from anime tradition of each episode laying out character, setting, and plot respectfully.
it makes you use your head. I saw what you did there.
“It requires you to use your head” T.T cheap shot buddy
i think its unfair to say that Mami not trusting Homura was "wrong"
it is her downfall in the end, and it is unlike a typical magical girl, yes. but is it a perfectly logical and sane decision. Mami is entirely convinced Homura is the enemy, and Homura has not tried to correct her for obvious reasons. Mami is confident that Homuras intentions are dangerous. in fact, anyone who doesnt know whats really going on with Homura (other than Madoka, who is the ideal magical girl as you said), would think the same. it was a mistake, but it was not irrational or out of place.
How do you feel about the other magical girls to come out after Madoka trying to chase it? I had the opposite. I watched it because I knew it was going to be dark. My anime experience is death note and mirai nikki. I just finished watching the entire Shugo Chara series and I was upset that it was over (I also was going to begin middle school and I'm on the autism spectrum, change is hard for me to deal with) While on Netflix seeing the poster of Madoka another pink magical girl made me sad. So I wanted something darker. I didn't need the history of magical girls but I felt that.
you say at 33:45 that it was Kyube that called Sayaka's attachment to Kyosuke, early on the episode. But I remember that was Madoka that say it, at least as I heard on the japanese dub. I don't know why they zoomed on Kyube's face, is because of that I think you thought the way you did.
Great analysis by the way.
Oh was it? Dang I was listening to the English dub as I went through this and the voices are quite similar. I don't really like Cabanos as Madoka, tbh, especially when a lot of the other performances are very great.
Well good catch, my bad.
@@clearandsweet It was Cabanos in the English dub, too. I think the shot was meant to show Kyūbe hearing it and realizing he could use that fact for his own ends, i.e., that the way to get Sayaka (and through her Madoka) to contract faster (they were hesitating about their wishes at that point) was via her love to Kyōsuke.
30:55 Can't believe someone could possibly hate Rebellion, which is the single greatest thing that happened in the history of anime ever ;_;
There is much to discuss in this regard, superlative claims included.
clearandsweet I have a suspicion as to why that might be, given how you’ve chosen to approach this videos (that I’m enjoying a bunch btw). It’s because it completely betrays the Mahou Shoujo values and ideals that the original series strived so hard to solidify and strengthen right?
@@josueroberto7356 that's exactly why rebellion is great, it is about Homura the only one who needed closure, she represents this betrayal of mahou shoujo values since the beginning, she took Madoka's spotlight as the typical magical girl protagonist from the moment she decided to stop Madoka from wishing and became a twisted protagonist, Homura is the reason why this is a deconstruction of the genre, her choices dictated the plot into a darker tone, rebellion shows that she was willing to take Madoka's spotlight as a goddess once more if that meant protecting her from Kyubey
@@josueroberto7356I'm exaggerating, but I feel like that's the whole point of PMMM. It casts all these values and ideals and plays them out while analyzing them from so many different perspectives. Rebellion doesn't damn the values Madoka herself holds dear, Homura never wants to take those values away from her, or change those parts of her, explicitly because they are her, and they are valuable (Does Homura view them as inherently valuable? Or do they only have value because they are Madoka?). But in doing so, it criticizes the failings of those values. What is the good and bad of self-sacrifice? What is the morality of it and its effects?
To me, Rebellion is the most *deconstructive* part of the franchise. I take away from it that the only way to attain the goals and values of Magical Girls, is to not play into the Magical Girl system at all.
Surprised you didn't mention Kyoko being Mami's previous student when she lightly chastised Sayaka
Lol I briefly do in the kyoko/sayaka fight in EP 5
@@clearandsweet ah, I just meaning in relation to it being strong, but subtle foreshadowing of Kyoko’s past transgressions. I feel like foreshadowing is one of Urobuchi’s strongest tools as a writer, and what makes the twists and turns in his work feel so earned.
Sailor Moon really doesn't consistently offer redemption to all the bad guys though, that's one of the things that makes it still the formative embryo of the genre. The Manga offers it to almsot none of them, that Black Moon Clan especially is presented as without any valid redeeming value.
I have very few nice things to say about the manga, nor do I think Takeuchi understood or created anything related to the heart and themes of the genre. For the purposes of the themes, the Sailor Moon manga might as well be the Berserk manga.
That said, yeah, not every bad guy in the anime gets their redemption, though most are offered it and have a choice to accept or decline.
Definitely something that would become much more of a staple later on.
@@clearandsweet I used to be more like the Manga haters, but I've come to appreciate it, especially the Black Moon Saga which in the Anime is one of the low points.
In the 90s Anime it seems like the character who get redeemed are the ones lucky enough to have spend non battle time with one of the protagonists.
@@Kuudere-Kun I feel you but I'll have to disagree. I think the black moon clan arc is one of my favorites specifically for how it treats the characters. Petz x Sapphire, then Sapphire x Diamond scenes are probably some of the strongest in the entire genre.
And ya, redoing it after the fact, Jaedite and Eugeal and everyone should get the same treatment as Fish Eye and Nephrite, but hey, that's why we have Precure and Utena and the rest.
I love your work, lots of agreeing which unfortunately doesn't make for much of a potential discourse comment. Please don't go full internet and take my disagreement with one opinion as a personal attack on you as a person.
I disagree that magical girls must always rise above and redeem. Pretty Soldier Sailor Moon 100% draws lines in the sand in Naoko Takeuchi's original. Sailor Moon fights for love and never gives up on faith for peace, but she will kill the instant she has to despite finding violence distasteful. It's only when she's written by men that she always has to rise above it all to reach their ideal of femininity. I love all adaptations, but I do fundamentally disagree with the idea that to embody love and hope and compassion and justice that one always has to rise above it all. I feel like the homogeneity of what magical girls and shoujo can be are sexist as heck, since largely it's male executives who have decided what is for girls? That action is a boys(Shonen) thing and romance is a girls(Shoujo) thing. In 2024 this is still a thing. Will probably still be a thing when/if someone randomly reads this comment in the future.
I like your point of view but I completely disagree with it.
The most important thing that qualifies a magical girl is the idea of eternal redemption and hope for everyone regardless of circumstance. If you give up on someone then it is wrong to have hope for them and I will tell you it's wrong every time.
Furthermore, I have almost zero respect for Takeuchi's writing, and I hate her rendition of Sailor Moon on most levels, barring aesthetically. The work of Junichi Sato and the rest of the team at Toei Animation in the early to mid '90s (which included plenty of women all throughout the process) made the modern magical girl genre, and put all the themes of the genre into the show.
And I've been arguing on the internet since before some of you were born! I absolutely know how to separate an attack on my position from who I am as a person! Thank you for your comment and for watching.
@@clearandsweet I don't recall read of women in power positions back then. Women had their projects cut up and repackaged by men with values of the stories changed by the production a lot more back then. The characters are all flanderized: Mars' snark was dialed up to hot headed, Mercury isn't confident and smart and lonely anymore because she has to be shy now, Jupiter was given masculine traits with her plant based powers erased just because she's the tall and strong one, Minako was reduced to being a goofy fun loving idol with all of her leadership and depth removed. Tuxedo Mask is completely ruined. The live action version she was actually allowed to have creative approval over, and it's leagues better than the anime. She was having fun and poked fun at her own work as it came out (it's even in the scans). The core ideas of the character came from her, but the show didn't want to let her grow up like the manga did. Magical girls can represent that, but it's limiting and sexist. Hope for a better future doesn't mean you keep giving chances to those who want hope to disappear, because they are actively going to hurt people and magical girls should bring genuine hope. It's never too late to turn your life around type of hope yes. I loved Sailor Moon R having the team realize that the sisters were exploited as pawns who needed saving. Always forgiving people no matter how bad they are? That leads to body counts.
@@clearandsweet also Sailor Moon IS Naoko Takeuchi's. She wrote created and wrote it, they just adapted it and treated her terribly the entire time.
@@ETPlayground They took a terrible story and bland characters and gave them personality and interpersonal relationships and goals. They made them into people where in the manga they were nothing beyond their looks. They gave the story stakes and themes.
The entire team from animation directors to writers to episodic directors to art directors had plenty of women at every step along the way. You can go on anime news network and just look at the cast credits. Your narrative of labeling it a product of men is just patently false, and indeed Takeuchi has talked about how much her original manga was affected by her (male) editor and the desires of the higher-ups at Kodansha in interviews many times in the past, so I could just as easily make your argument in reverse as well.
@@clearandsweet I never said anything bad about that show itself, just that it is not the original and the characters had plenty of complexity in their stories. I disagree that the senshi were bland, just that they were poorly developed on the page. Like when you write a story and forget to help the audience get to know your characters well because you're rushed. She was rushed to finish her story, change her planned ending that the anime was allowed to use, and pushed to extend it. Her editor and friend Oas-P helped her with the idea for Chibiusa. The epic ending two parter was supposed to be in the manga. She wanted each senshi to sacrifice herself brutally for the friend they love (possibly with flashbacks or some tell don't show because deadlines) but was told "this is Shoujo manga, you can't do that!!" They had next to no development on panel which I agree was an issue, but as previously stated PGSM provides an example of how her visions for her characters could have been portrayed with more time put into, with some anime influences and making it kind of traditional to invent a new character similar to Sailor V's personality with significant differences and calling her Sailor Venus. I WISH she'd make a revised edition with her original planned ending and other details, but can't see it happening. Apparently Heavy Metal Papillon is a belly dancer with a daughter, but that never made it from the character notes, again I suspect because of deadlines. Every version of Sailor Moon has some glaring flaws, but she does deem true evil to be consistently "Unforgivable!" and fights it in hope that some day she will no longer have to. Unlike us she gets to visit her future where she has achieved that for herself and everyone (again, Takeuchi's idea, and I believe she deserves respect for her work even if it's one's least favourite adaptation). Every version has something to enjoy, I was originally trying to say that it seems to be a common trend where men writing girls tend to be more inclined toward the idea that to give hope that magical girls must always rise above to an extreme of purity. Which brings to my mind how that mindset is pushed on people fighting for their rights to always rise despite the literal violence that may be happening. I don't think it's misogyny since that's intentional, despite the norms of the time when one of my favourite shows was made. That kinda stuff makes me appreciate the good in the work more, especially when the women behind it are doing well after the fact. I agree that your magical girl thesis statement applies to the metaphysics of the Madoka Magica universe though, I definitely forgot to mention that. Mine is that I believe that magical girls can be whatever the creator of the story intends. Limitations on who someone can be because of what they happen to be feels like the shackles or recloseting (re+closet+ing in case that's only clear in my head) of writing to me. My narrative comes from several different sources over decades of being a fan. I'm not part of the "omg she wrote it to cure her sadness" part of the fandom, I assure you. I've honestly invested more time than is likely healthy learning background stuff about the show over the years. And the rise of video essays led to even more information over the years. I'm not trying to demonize men either, it sucks but it was the norm and dwelling serves nobody. I don't agree with how she was treated, but it's a brutal industry and in the end several versions of the story came to exist to be enjoyed.
wait you hate Rebellion? hmm damn.
Oh I have a full video about it. Keep on keeping in, it comes up later