An interesting video might be maintaining running shape/form in between races, like if someone wanted to maximize shape but only running once or twice a week
This is super interesting! I shall be digging in to the research and see what I can come up with. Could also apply this to the off season. Thanks for the suggestion, watch this space... 👀
Did you ever make a video about this? I am no longer "racing" - but want to keep running. I really need some kind of plan to follow to keep me trim but which is not race oriented . Running is not ALL about racing :)
Ok, the races are in X km, but then you say to run in X miles. I don't mind using miles, it's just nice if you also do the conversions. So a 5 - 10 k, would mean you want to aim for 13 to 24 kilometers etc. (5 - 8 miles)
A good one for This also is like a one rep max test, rún slow for long as you cna until your heart rate starts going into threshold, then take 70 percent of it and do it for 4 weeks and test once a month, distance tells nothing as all individuals are different, using the above my rest heart rate went from 68 to 47 and this allowed me to start harder running more effectively after 9 months to 12 months of only slow runs short and long 😁
Yeah this is a good one! You need to remember that heart rate can be affected by many factors so the results may be a little bit off depending on conditions, terrain and you recovery from previous sessions.
Thank you for these videos about slow running. That's precisely what I needed to not get burned out too quickly. I'm going to test the pacing and see the results during a half marathon this fall 💪
Hey how’s it going bob ? I started distance running in 2017 and I have been running training for half and full mostly I’m a long distance guy. But I come from a powerlifting and weight lifting back ground. My question is do u think heavy bench pressing like 5 sets 5 is slowing my pace down on most of my runs? And is it hurting my potential in the half and full? By heavy upper body? Reason I asked is because I enjoy lifting and I feel like it has helped my metabolism running and lifting . But I’ve heard from other runners that bench pressing can slow u down increase your oxygen need running long and faster. What do u think? I also noticed deadlifts have helped my speed a lot running. And I did notice when I took off from heavy upper body my pace was faster at easier efforts. What do u think? Think I need cut out heavy bench pressing?
Thanks for the question! I love this stuff. I do not think you need to cut out heavy bench press. The reason others have told you that it may be slowing you down is because of a weight issue. Muscle is heavy and weight has an effect on your running as the lighter you are the less force you have to generate to propel yourself forward. I don't believe bench press alone is going to add a significant enough amount of weight to cause an issue. Overall upper body mass will. However, that comes from a combination of exercises in the gym. As you have a power lifting background I would probably suggest a slight change in your training but not to eliminate bench press completely. Strength training is great and I think everyone should be doing some. I have bench press in my own gym routine, however, it's far from my strongest lift. If your bench press is strength and power focussed rather than hypertrophy focussed I don't think you will have any issues. Your diet will also play a huge role. If you are bulking to increase your bench press then the 'bulk' itself will have much more of an effect on your running than the bench press itself. If you are currently maintaining your weight and still pushing hard in the gym, upper body work should have a very minimal effect on your running. If you are in a calorie deficit then this will most likely have a positive impact on your running (for a while). However, I imagine you will soon hit a plateau in your bench press. The reason your heavy dealift is positively effecting your running is because you are targeting some of the running muscles and this will improve muscle fiber recruitment and make you a stronger and more resilient runner. This is great and I think you should keep this up. For myself, I use the force/velocity curve to guide my work in the gym. I aim for the strength - speed training zone which is heavy weight (80 - 90% 1 rep max) at a low volume but aiming for a powerful explosive lift. This is meant to build both strength and power without adding too much mass. I do however, lower both intensity and volume in the gym across all lifts as I get closer to a race. Usually from 4 weeks out from race day. As for it increasing your oxygen demand, I'm not sure, I would need to research this. I can't imagine it would though, unless you are adding a significant amount of body weight. You're not using your upper body much when running so I don't know why this would increase the oxygen demand. You do use your upper body through holding posture and arm drive. However, this is less so on longer distance events and generally your pecs would be relaxed while running so without contraction they shouldn't add much energy/oxygen demand. To sort of wrap this up I would say unless you're trying to add large amounts of muscle mass through bulking and hypertrophy-focused gym sets, I think you can still include bench press in your routine, with extremely minimal effect on your running. You may want to reduce the volume of your bench and focus on a more powerful lift (increasing bar speed). I think as long as you're not too tired from your gym sets to execute effective training for your running goals you should be in a good place to continue to bench. I hope this helps. We can go into much further detail if you want? You can always drop me an email on bob@bobthomasultra.com or feel free to continue with questions here as others may benefit from this discussion. Either way, I think what you're doing is great and keep up the good work! It awesome to see someone who loves both lifting and endurance sport!
Thank you Bob for the helpful tips! Yea I mostly just do compound movements , bench press , deadlifts and leg presses or lat pull downs 5x5 don’t really do a lot diff exercises to avoid bulk. I also tried running by heart rate but I wonder if it’s better to do long runs by feel vs heart rate. My best half is 1 hour and 44 min and my best 13 miler in training is 1 45. So do u think I need do most my longer runs 15-18 milers at 930-10 min paces? And how many speed sessions would u run week? I had my best half marathon in 2021 when I only ran 3 days week most my runs were in 845-915 range for runs and long runs
@@SuperTreybo Happy to help. Right let's get into it. One of my next videos is actually going to be about how many speed sessions you should do a week. Keep an eye out. As for the long run heart rate is great however, I like to use it as a guide and pace myself off feel. This way if I don't feel too good one day I can adapt the run to suit the day. I like to keep my long runs really easy as this builds aerboic capacity and a great base for you to build on with speed work. Once you start adding speed sessions it's also good to keep the long run slow otherwise you can quickly get into overtraining. I would recommend 2 speed sessions per week. For me this is the sweet spot and lets you push yourself hard on those days while allowing enough time to recover. You mentioned running 3 days a week in the past but haven't specified how many you currently run so I will give some options. 5 days; 2 Speed 2 Recoevry 1 Long 4 days; 2 Speed 1 Recovery 1 Long 3 days; (week 1) 2 Speed 1 Long (week 2) 1 Speed 1 Recovery 1 Long (Alternate these weeks) As for speed sessions themselves I would do a mix of Interval sessions and a Tempo run. For intervals I would do; Warm Up Easy 5 x 5 minutes quicker than Half Marathon Goal Pace - 2 Minutes Recovery (Slow jog or walk) Easy Cool Down For Tempo; Easy Warm Up 30 mins - 5 - 10 seconds quicker than Half Marathon Goal Pace continuos Long Easy Cool Down (2 - 3 miles) Don't set off too fast for your Tempo session. This should be a manageable effort. The idea is to encourage the body to sit in this pace and adapt to it. If you go out too hard and fade you won't achieve the same stimulus. You can also add time to these Tempo runs as you progress and keep the pace the same. I don't know what sort of Half Marathon time you want to hit so jumping straight to that goal pace may be too quick to start however, with consistency you can build to it. If you want to go deeper into training blocks and pace setting and progressions we can. I'll need to know what your goal is for the half marathon and how long you have to train to give you a good idea of what the sessions would look like. Remember that one session won't make your running but working hard consistently week after week will.
Real question: why do they constantly and casually switch between KMs and miles when they talk about this? Eg. “If you’re training for a 10km, then your long run should be 8-15 miles” 🤯. Sorry if it’s just me, but it’s really confusing. I realise it’s not just Bob here, I’ve seen others do it too. Why!? 😭😭😭. Can’t you just stick to one (ideally KMs) 🥺
I completely understand where you’re coming from! Right for me, the reason I switch is because I do all my training in miles however a ‘5K’ and ‘10K’ is a common race distance. It would feel odd to refer to these as a 3.1Mi and 6.2Mi. I think it’s because running is a global sport and different countries use different systems which creates the confusion! I’d be happy to help you break down the explanation into KMs if that would help?
@@BobThomasUltra thanks for the reply Bob. It’s all good, like I said it’s not just you, seems it’s just natural running lingo. And of course diff countries use diff measurements. Just a gripe I needed to get off my chest! But thanks for your explanation. I’d def stick to KMs personally 😜!
As a Canadian this is especially weird. I'm fully metric and used to seeing miles from the Americans, but expect my mother country to use the same units I do! Ah well, that's why it's nice to have conversion apps. 😁🍍
Yeah of course! My 5k best is 17:24. I don’t know what my 10k is as have never really gone for a TT. I focus my efforts a lot more on Ultras and silly challenges though so 5k and 10k aren’t really my focus 😀
@@BobThomasUltra I know that slow run is really efficient in terms of endurance but what you can say about running uphill? How many times should I run uphill during the week? It will be really tough mixing it up with slow long runs, don't you think?
So I love uphill running! I think it is probably the best thing you can do to directly strengthen the running muscles. However, I understand it is difficult to fit in. I mad this video about hills which will hopefully help: ua-cam.com/video/UofhOSX2Gpk/v-deo.html So to get more hills in there is no harm in putting your slow run on a hilly route. This will make the run take longer so you'll need to find the sweet spot between adding hills and it not taking up all of your time. You ca also put intervals on a hill. I love this as it basically become hill repeats. It's great for strengthening your muscles plus the addition of gravity means that you can achieve the same cardiovascular strain for less pounding of the legs. I would say if you're looking to improve top end speed with your intervals then hills is not the place to go as you cardiovascular system will hold you back before your mechanics do. That is generally the case most of the time however it is exaggerated when going up hill.
Hi, so I can give you a better answer could you answer a couple of questions for me? How many days a week do you run? What does you speed work look like? Do you have recovery runs? Do you already do a long run and how far? How long until you effort? As a blanket recommendation I would say between 5-10 miles would be enough. You could go further up to 16 if you’re training a lot (6 days a week) the long run should be really easy and your aiming to keep good for and build your base fitness.
in 2013 i ran 1 hour 45 mins for half marathon and my longest run was 10 miles. i have not ran one since then. i bet those miles are for people who want to run faster
So you’re correct there is an increased risk of injury. That’s often the case with running. More miles = more chances of injury. This is why it’s super important on these longs runs to take it slow. That will help combat the injury risk. As far as benefit goes it fully depends on what you’re training for! I’d argue that going over 3 hours is a must if you’re attempting an ultra but maybe not if you’re going for a marathon. However, if your marathon time is slower it is useful to get used to that amount of time on your feet. As always with running it’s a balance, wether you want to go further or faster to get there you need to push your limits and that comes with an increased risk. I just hope with more information we can all get to where we want and keep the risks as low as possible. 😊
An interesting video might be maintaining running shape/form in between races, like if someone wanted to maximize shape but only running once or twice a week
This is super interesting! I shall be digging in to the research and see what I can come up with. Could also apply this to the off season. Thanks for the suggestion, watch this space... 👀
Did you ever make a video about this? I am no longer "racing" - but want to keep running. I really need some kind of plan to follow to keep me trim but which is not race oriented . Running is not ALL about racing :)
Ok, the races are in X km, but then you say to run in X miles. I don't mind using miles, it's just nice if you also do the conversions. So a 5 - 10 k, would mean you want to aim for 13 to 24 kilometers etc. (5 - 8 miles)
A good one for This also is like a one rep max test, rún slow for long as you cna until your heart rate starts going into threshold, then take 70 percent of it and do it for 4 weeks and test once a month, distance tells nothing as all individuals are different, using the above my rest heart rate went from 68 to 47 and this allowed me to start harder running more effectively after 9 months to 12 months of only slow runs short and long 😁
Yeah this is a good one! You need to remember that heart rate can be affected by many factors so the results may be a little bit off depending on conditions, terrain and you recovery from previous sessions.
Great video! Thanks for the valuable info!
Thanks! Glad you got something from it 🙌
Thank you for these videos about slow running. That's precisely what I needed to not get burned out too quickly.
I'm going to test the pacing and see the results during a half marathon this fall 💪
Amazing Robert, glad you got something from the videos! Good luck on the half marathon! Let me know how you get on 🙌
Double days sound kick ass
Ohh yeah! Love a double run day 🙌
Yeah, but I'm not getting up "super early in the morning" for anyone, not even Bob.
Hey how’s it going bob ? I started distance running in 2017 and I have been running training for half and full mostly I’m a long distance guy. But I come from a powerlifting and weight lifting back ground. My question is do u think heavy bench pressing like 5 sets 5 is slowing my pace down on most of my runs? And is it hurting my potential in the half and full? By heavy upper body? Reason I asked is because I enjoy lifting and I feel like it has helped my metabolism running and lifting . But I’ve heard from other runners that bench pressing can slow u down increase your oxygen need running long and faster. What do u think? I also noticed deadlifts have helped my speed a lot running. And I did notice when I took off from heavy upper body my pace was faster at easier efforts. What do u think? Think I need cut out heavy bench pressing?
Thanks for the question! I love this stuff.
I do not think you need to cut out heavy bench press. The reason others have told you that it may be slowing you down is because of a weight issue. Muscle is heavy and weight has an effect on your running as the lighter you are the less force you have to generate to propel yourself forward.
I don't believe bench press alone is going to add a significant enough amount of weight to cause an issue. Overall upper body mass will. However, that comes from a combination of exercises in the gym. As you have a power lifting background I would probably suggest a slight change in your training but not to eliminate bench press completely. Strength training is great and I think everyone should be doing some. I have bench press in my own gym routine, however, it's far from my strongest lift.
If your bench press is strength and power focussed rather than hypertrophy focussed I don't think you will have any issues. Your diet will also play a huge role. If you are bulking to increase your bench press then the 'bulk' itself will have much more of an effect on your running than the bench press itself. If you are currently maintaining your weight and still pushing hard in the gym, upper body work should have a very minimal effect on your running. If you are in a calorie deficit then this will most likely have a positive impact on your running (for a while). However, I imagine you will soon hit a plateau in your bench press.
The reason your heavy dealift is positively effecting your running is because you are targeting some of the running muscles and this will improve muscle fiber recruitment and make you a stronger and more resilient runner. This is great and I think you should keep this up.
For myself, I use the force/velocity curve to guide my work in the gym. I aim for the strength - speed training zone which is heavy weight (80 - 90% 1 rep max) at a low volume but aiming for a powerful explosive lift. This is meant to build both strength and power without adding too much mass. I do however, lower both intensity and volume in the gym across all lifts as I get closer to a race. Usually from 4 weeks out from race day.
As for it increasing your oxygen demand, I'm not sure, I would need to research this. I can't imagine it would though, unless you are adding a significant amount of body weight. You're not using your upper body much when running so I don't know why this would increase the oxygen demand. You do use your upper body through holding posture and arm drive. However, this is less so on longer distance events and generally your pecs would be relaxed while running so without contraction they shouldn't add much energy/oxygen demand.
To sort of wrap this up I would say unless you're trying to add large amounts of muscle mass through bulking and hypertrophy-focused gym sets, I think you can still include bench press in your routine, with extremely minimal effect on your running. You may want to reduce the volume of your bench and focus on a more powerful lift (increasing bar speed). I think as long as you're not too tired from your gym sets to execute effective training for your running goals you should be in a good place to continue to bench.
I hope this helps. We can go into much further detail if you want? You can always drop me an email on bob@bobthomasultra.com or feel free to continue with questions here as others may benefit from this discussion.
Either way, I think what you're doing is great and keep up the good work! It awesome to see someone who loves both lifting and endurance sport!
Thank you Bob for the helpful tips! Yea I mostly just do compound movements , bench press , deadlifts and leg presses or lat pull downs 5x5 don’t really do a lot diff exercises to avoid bulk. I also tried running by heart rate but I wonder if it’s better to do long runs by feel vs heart rate. My best half is 1 hour and 44 min and my best 13 miler in training is 1 45. So do u think I need do most my longer runs 15-18 milers at 930-10 min paces? And how many speed sessions would u run week? I had my best half marathon in 2021 when I only ran 3 days week most my runs were in 845-915 range for runs and long runs
@@SuperTreybo Happy to help. Right let's get into it.
One of my next videos is actually going to be about how many speed sessions you should do a week. Keep an eye out.
As for the long run heart rate is great however, I like to use it as a guide and pace myself off feel. This way if I don't feel too good one day I can adapt the run to suit the day. I like to keep my long runs really easy as this builds aerboic capacity and a great base for you to build on with speed work.
Once you start adding speed sessions it's also good to keep the long run slow otherwise you can quickly get into overtraining.
I would recommend 2 speed sessions per week. For me this is the sweet spot and lets you push yourself hard on those days while allowing enough time to recover.
You mentioned running 3 days a week in the past but haven't specified how many you currently run so I will give some options.
5 days;
2 Speed
2 Recoevry
1 Long
4 days;
2 Speed
1 Recovery
1 Long
3 days;
(week 1)
2 Speed
1 Long
(week 2)
1 Speed
1 Recovery
1 Long
(Alternate these weeks)
As for speed sessions themselves I would do a mix of Interval sessions and a Tempo run.
For intervals I would do;
Warm Up Easy
5 x 5 minutes quicker than Half Marathon Goal Pace - 2 Minutes Recovery (Slow jog or walk)
Easy Cool Down
For Tempo;
Easy Warm Up
30 mins - 5 - 10 seconds quicker than Half Marathon Goal Pace continuos
Long Easy Cool Down (2 - 3 miles)
Don't set off too fast for your Tempo session. This should be a manageable effort. The idea is to encourage the body to sit in this pace and adapt to it. If you go out too hard and fade you won't achieve the same stimulus.
You can also add time to these Tempo runs as you progress and keep the pace the same.
I don't know what sort of Half Marathon time you want to hit so jumping straight to that goal pace may be too quick to start however, with consistency you can build to it. If you want to go deeper into training blocks and pace setting and progressions we can. I'll need to know what your goal is for the half marathon and how long you have to train to give you a good idea of what the sessions would look like.
Remember that one session won't make your running but working hard consistently week after week will.
Real question: why do they constantly and casually switch between KMs and miles when they talk about this? Eg. “If you’re training for a 10km, then your long run should be 8-15 miles” 🤯. Sorry if it’s just me, but it’s really confusing. I realise it’s not just Bob here, I’ve seen others do it too. Why!? 😭😭😭. Can’t you just stick to one (ideally KMs) 🥺
I completely understand where you’re coming from! Right for me, the reason I switch is because I do all my training in miles however a ‘5K’ and ‘10K’ is a common race distance. It would feel odd to refer to these as a 3.1Mi and 6.2Mi. I think it’s because running is a global sport and different countries use different systems which creates the confusion! I’d be happy to help you break down the explanation into KMs if that would help?
@@BobThomasUltra thanks for the reply Bob. It’s all good, like I said it’s not just you, seems it’s just natural running lingo. And of course diff countries use diff measurements. Just a gripe I needed to get off my chest! But thanks for your explanation. I’d def stick to KMs personally 😜!
As a Canadian this is especially weird. I'm fully metric and used to seeing miles from the Americans, but expect my mother country to use the same units I do! Ah well, that's why it's nice to have conversion apps. 😁🍍
Hello Bob I would like to ask you one thing. What's your personal best at 5km and 10km run?
Yeah of course! My 5k best is 17:24. I don’t know what my 10k is as have never really gone for a TT. I focus my efforts a lot more on Ultras and silly challenges though so 5k and 10k aren’t really my focus 😀
@@BobThomasUltra I know that slow run is really efficient in terms of endurance but what you can say about running uphill? How many times should I run uphill during the week? It will be really tough mixing it up with slow long runs, don't you think?
So I love uphill running! I think it is probably the best thing you can do to directly strengthen the running muscles. However, I understand it is difficult to fit in.
I mad this video about hills which will hopefully help: ua-cam.com/video/UofhOSX2Gpk/v-deo.html
So to get more hills in there is no harm in putting your slow run on a hilly route. This will make the run take longer so you'll need to find the sweet spot between adding hills and it not taking up all of your time. You ca also put intervals on a hill. I love this as it basically become hill repeats. It's great for strengthening your muscles plus the addition of gravity means that you can achieve the same cardiovascular strain for less pounding of the legs.
I would say if you're looking to improve top end speed with your intervals then hills is not the place to go as you cardiovascular system will hold you back before your mechanics do. That is generally the case most of the time however it is exaggerated when going up hill.
Hi Bob, I want to prep the absolute best for a 2mile full effort. For the two miles, what should my ""long"" run be distance wise?? Thanks
Hi, so I can give you a better answer could you answer a couple of questions for me? How many days a week do you run? What does you speed work look like? Do you have recovery runs? Do you already do a long run and how far? How long until you effort? As a blanket recommendation I would say between 5-10 miles would be enough. You could go further up to 16 if you’re training a lot (6 days a week) the long run should be really easy and your aiming to keep good for and build your base fitness.
in 2013 i ran 1 hour 45 mins for half marathon and my longest run was 10 miles. i have not ran one since then. i bet those miles are for people who want to run faster
I think in general more miles means better running economy so it's a great way to squeeze out some extra speed for race day!
Evidence suggests going more than 3hrs there is not much to gain but there is a increase in risk of injury.
So you’re correct there is an increased risk of injury. That’s often the case with running. More miles = more chances of injury. This is why it’s super important on these longs runs to take it slow. That will help combat the injury risk. As far as benefit goes it fully depends on what you’re training for! I’d argue that going over 3 hours is a must if you’re attempting an ultra but maybe not if you’re going for a marathon. However, if your marathon time is slower it is useful to get used to that amount of time on your feet. As always with running it’s a balance, wether you want to go further or faster to get there you need to push your limits and that comes with an increased risk. I just hope with more information we can all get to where we want and keep the risks as low as possible. 😊
BASE! (How slow can you go?)
Not slow enough 😅