I always wondered what other pieces Carl Orff composed besides Carmina Burana. This is so beautiful, that I'm actually liking it more than Carmina Burana (or maybe because it's so worn out today).
Why Orff retired from the catalogue everything he composed before Carmina Burana? I have never understood. It reflects the knowledge, feelings and interests of an author on a particular moment of his life and with that background should be assumed and respected.
Yes, isn't that strange? Orff did say that when the Carmina Burana was published, something to the effect that everything that he had written before then should be forgotten. Luckily his colleague Gunild Keetman did not forget, and after the war, when they were asked to produce a radio series for children, his earlier work, with Keetman, was brought to life and carried forward.
Carl Orff's statement about telling his publishers to pulp everything they'd printed before Carmina Burana could well reflect something he said in his enthusiasm after the dress rehearsal of the premiere in June 1937, but he had quite the flair for the dramatic. In his Dokumentation (the eight volumes published by Hans Tutzing between 1975 and 1983, representing essentially what he wanted known of his life and work), he conceded of that often-repeated remark: "“So I had said this thoughtlessly, con leggerezza: a remark that, as I well knew, was true and also not true.” ("Ich hatte das con leggerezza so hingesagt: ein Ausspruch, der, wie ich wohl wußte, stimmte und auch nicht stimmte"; Vol. 4, p. 66). A few years earlier, he'd told interviewer Martin Konz that what he meant by that line was that he knew for the first time that he'd really gotten it right (Martin Konz, “Auf den Mond zu fliegen ist elementar. Rückbesinnung auf die Ursprünge: Interview mit dem Komponisten Carl Orff,” in Neue Musikzeitung, 24. Jahrgang, Heft 2, April/May 1975: 3). In fact, the only thing that his publishers withdrew were the cantatas from 1930 and 1932 on texts by Bertolt Brecht and Franz Werfel, and those had been quietly removed from their catalogue around 1933 since both those authors were banned by the Nazis (Brecht was an anti-Nazi Marxist; Werfel was Jewish). Orff did, however, revise some of his earlier pieces in the coming years, including his Monteverdi "Neugestaltungen" and his Entrata (a massive orchestration of William Byrd's "The Bells"). Several of his 1930 a cappella choruses on texts of Catullus were reworked into Catulli Carmina, and he used material of others for Die Bernauerin and Trionfo di Afrodite. Three of them were republished as Concento di Voci I: Sirmio, with minimal revision. In fact, those 1930 Werfel Cantatas are to Carmina Burana what Beethoven's Choral Fantasia is to his Ninth Symphony - essentially, trial runs. Though it would have been politically advantageous to re-release them immediately after WWII (associating himself with a banned author), he did not republish them until 1968, with very small revisions. He did go back to some of his earliest surviving works near the end of his life; publishing several Lieder from 1911 to 1920 was one of the last things he did.
@@andrewkohler9730 Thanks for your interesting for your very interesting and clarifying comment. I really appreciate it. Although those doubts or contradictions on the part of certain authors of seeing their artistic work withdrawn due to constant rework for reasons only understandable to the mind of its author have always been very alien to me. I see the creative work as an examination of a certain moment in the life of its creator. Once you have done the best you were capable of at that time and finished your exam with the premiere of it, let's go for something else. I have never understood well those withdrawals from the catalog or authors reworking and returning to the same work for years and years. Nevertheless doubt and creative suffering is despite everything an inexcusable part of the life of man with a creative vocation. Unfortunately. Otherwise all art would be made by robots or pre-programmed computers. And it is not the case. Greetings.
@@andrewkohler9730 Thanks for your interesting for your very interesting and clarifying comment. I really appreciate it. Although those doubts or contradictions on the part of certain authors of seeing their artistic work withdrawn due to constant rework for reasons only understandable to the mind of its author have always been very alien to me. I see the creative work as an examination of a certain moment in the life of its creator. Once you have done the best you were capable of at that time and finished your exam with the premiere of it, let's go for something else. I have never understood well those withdrawals from the catalog or authors reworking and returning to the same work for years and years. Nevertheless doubt and creative suffering is despite everything an inexcusable part of the life of man with a creative vocation. Unfortunately. Otherwise all art would be made by robots or pre-programmed computers. And it is not the case. Greetings.
UNEXPECTED in a double sense - a youth piece of Orff, so difficult to find and...the style, nothing to do wi the Orfistic personal card we all know so well...Do you all know where I can "chase" down DIE BERNAUERIN with some fair eng.ish or french, italian, spanish translation ? The German text is in "bayernishe farben", with strong voice accents not so easy to follow.... Thank you all.
There is a dvd of die Bernauerin with subtitles. Also the Kurt Eichorn cd has the text in English and French translation. The Eichorn cd is very well done. The dvd is well acted but not that well played.
@@Listenerandlearner870 Agreed regarding both those performances of Die Bernauerin - each is well worth getting to know. I wish there were a more literal English translation available; what the booklet and titles have is the performance translation by Fritz Andre Kracht, which was used at the American premiere of Die Bernauerin in 1968 (the only performance of which I'm aware in a majority-English-speaking country), which seeks to capture the flavor of the Bavarian dialect. Unfortunately, it really softens the libretto (similarly to Marc Blitzstein's admittedly very skillful performance translation of Die Dreigroschenoper). A prime example is in the vicious, sexually degrading language of the Hexen who exult in the murder of Agnes Bernauer: "Zageltasch" becomes "chatterbox," when in fact it is a vulgar term for vagina - literally "dick pouch." (Edit: I just revisited the Kracht, and apparently it's "blabbermouth" - point remains, though!)
@@Listenerandlearner870 I'd like to mount a performance some day in America with the original Bavarian and English titles (getting permission to do my own translation).
Die Bernauerin is my personal favorite of Orff's works. Its treatment of what Karl Jaspers called "die Schuldfrage" is heart-rending and, unfortunately, always timely.
If I had not been told who actually wrote this, I would have been clueless as to the real composer. Very impressionistic. An obscure French composer, perhaps.
A fun period piece combining the Germanic with a very strong presence of French Impressionist, in both the writing and especially the use of the orchestra. So unlike this composers later sound and aesthetic, and 'Pretty,' too.
The only work by Orff that I have heard outside of Carmina Catulli,Burana and Trionfo. Thank you so much.
Orff transcends national styles - he has his own voice.
His music sounds like flowers opening
What a wonderful piece. Would never have guessed it was written by Orff. Definitely more French in sound.
I always wondered what other pieces Carl Orff composed besides Carmina Burana. This is so beautiful, that I'm actually liking it more than Carmina Burana (or maybe because it's so worn out today).
Inattendu de la part de Orff. J'ignorais que le style impressionniste faisait partie de sa palette orchestrale généralement plus expressionniste.
Carl Orff must have been fascinated by Claude Debussy or other French composers, when he composed this piece.
Great!
Fantastic post - thank you:)
Very beautiful and nature-like, very different style than the Orff of Carmina Burana! More French and impressionistic than hardcore 20th century.
Happy Birthday Carl Orff.
Why Orff retired from the catalogue everything he composed before Carmina Burana? I have never understood. It reflects the knowledge, feelings and interests of an author on a particular moment of his life and with that background should be assumed and respected.
Yes, isn't that strange? Orff did say that when the Carmina Burana was published, something to the effect that everything that he had written before then should be forgotten. Luckily his colleague Gunild Keetman did not forget, and after the war, when they were asked to produce a radio series for children, his earlier work, with Keetman, was brought to life and carried forward.
Carl Orff's statement about telling his publishers to pulp everything they'd printed before Carmina Burana could well reflect something he said in his enthusiasm after the dress rehearsal of the premiere in June 1937, but he had quite the flair for the dramatic. In his Dokumentation (the eight volumes published by Hans Tutzing between 1975 and 1983, representing essentially what he wanted known of his life and work), he conceded of that often-repeated remark: "“So I had said this
thoughtlessly, con leggerezza: a remark that, as I well knew, was true and
also not true.” ("Ich hatte das con leggerezza so hingesagt: ein
Ausspruch, der, wie ich wohl wußte, stimmte und auch nicht stimmte"; Vol. 4, p. 66). A few years earlier, he'd told interviewer Martin Konz that what he meant by that line was that he knew for the first time that he'd really gotten it right (Martin Konz, “Auf den Mond zu fliegen ist elementar. Rückbesinnung auf die Ursprünge: Interview mit
dem Komponisten Carl Orff,” in Neue Musikzeitung, 24. Jahrgang, Heft 2, April/May 1975: 3).
In fact, the only thing that his publishers withdrew were the cantatas from 1930 and 1932 on texts by Bertolt Brecht and Franz Werfel, and those had been quietly removed from their catalogue around 1933 since both those authors were banned by the Nazis (Brecht was an anti-Nazi Marxist; Werfel was Jewish). Orff did, however, revise some of his earlier pieces in the coming years, including his Monteverdi "Neugestaltungen" and his Entrata (a massive orchestration of William Byrd's "The Bells"). Several of his 1930 a cappella choruses on texts of Catullus were reworked into Catulli Carmina, and he used material of others for Die Bernauerin and Trionfo di Afrodite. Three of them were republished as Concento di Voci I: Sirmio, with minimal revision.
In fact, those 1930 Werfel Cantatas are to Carmina Burana what Beethoven's Choral Fantasia is to his Ninth Symphony - essentially, trial runs. Though it would have been politically advantageous to re-release them immediately after WWII (associating himself with a banned author), he did not republish them until 1968, with very small revisions. He did go back to some of his earliest surviving works near the end of his life; publishing several Lieder from 1911 to 1920 was one of the last things he did.
@@andrewkohler9730 Thanks for your interesting for your very interesting and clarifying comment. I really appreciate it. Although those doubts or contradictions on the part of certain authors of seeing their artistic work withdrawn due to constant rework for reasons only understandable to the mind of its author have always been very alien to me. I see the creative work as an examination of a certain moment in the life of its creator. Once you have done the best you were capable of at that time and finished your exam with the premiere of it, let's go for something else. I have never understood well those withdrawals from the catalog or authors reworking and returning to the same work for years and years. Nevertheless doubt and creative suffering is despite everything an inexcusable part of the life of man with a creative vocation. Unfortunately. Otherwise all art would be made by robots or pre-programmed computers. And it is not the case. Greetings.
@@andrewkohler9730 Thanks for your interesting for your very interesting and clarifying comment. I really appreciate it. Although those doubts or contradictions on the part of certain authors of seeing their artistic work withdrawn due to constant rework for reasons only understandable to the mind of its author have always been very alien to me. I see the creative work as an examination of a certain moment in the life of its creator. Once you have done the best you were capable of at that time and finished your exam with the premiere of it, let's go for something else. I have never understood well those withdrawals from the catalog or authors reworking and returning to the same work for years and years. Nevertheless doubt and creative suffering is despite everything an inexcusable part of the life of man with a creative vocation. Unfortunately. Otherwise all art would be made by robots or pre-programmed computers. And it is not the case. Greetings.
@@susankennedy5739 She did good.
UNEXPECTED in a double sense - a youth piece of Orff, so difficult to find and...the style, nothing to do wi the Orfistic personal card we all know so well...Do you all know where I can "chase" down DIE BERNAUERIN with some fair eng.ish or french, italian, spanish translation ? The German text is in "bayernishe farben", with strong voice accents not so easy to follow.... Thank you all.
There is a dvd of die Bernauerin with subtitles. Also the Kurt Eichorn cd has the text in English and French translation. The Eichorn cd is very well done. The dvd is well acted but not that well played.
@@Listenerandlearner870 Agreed regarding both those performances of Die Bernauerin - each is well worth getting to know. I wish there were a more literal English translation available; what the booklet and titles have is the performance translation by Fritz Andre Kracht, which was used at the American premiere of Die Bernauerin in 1968 (the only performance of which I'm aware in a majority-English-speaking country), which seeks to capture the flavor of the Bavarian dialect. Unfortunately, it really softens the libretto (similarly to Marc Blitzstein's admittedly very skillful performance translation of Die Dreigroschenoper). A prime example is in the vicious, sexually degrading language of the Hexen who exult in the murder of Agnes Bernauer: "Zageltasch" becomes "chatterbox," when in fact it is a vulgar term for vagina - literally "dick pouch." (Edit: I just revisited the Kracht, and apparently it's "blabbermouth" - point remains, though!)
@@andrewkohler9730 thanks for a great response. It would need to be a very idiomatic English version.
@@Listenerandlearner870 I'd like to mount a performance some day in America with the original Bavarian and English titles (getting permission to do my own translation).
Die Bernauerin is my personal favorite of Orff's works. Its treatment of what Karl Jaspers called "die Schuldfrage" is heart-rending and, unfortunately, always timely.
Reminds me of Joseph Marx's orchestral works.
If I had not been told who actually wrote this, I would have been clueless as to the real composer. Very impressionistic. An obscure French composer, perhaps.
I thought the same thing, it sounds like Debussy, with maybe just a dash of Richard Strauss
Une piece de Charles Orphe...
A fun period piece combining the Germanic with a very strong presence of French Impressionist, in both the writing and especially the use of the orchestra. So unlike this composers later sound and aesthetic, and 'Pretty,' too.
Far more original than his later works.
20 years after Debussy's faun. Sounds to me like a skilled student composition.
Before Les Noces.
Lupri hardini Williams antiomo feoma ungala unaka
Great!