My name is Sean, I’m an active member of the Mormon church - church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. I served a mission in Japan, I didn’t always know what I was doing there but I felt pretty happy and enjoyed the adventure. A lot of people, millions prob, pray for the LDS missionaries every day. There’s a real power behind that, I believe I felt that. I liked what you said about emotions, connecting with God and trying to learn from His spirit can lead to many emotional responses, and we focus on that too much maybe. more important might be the inspiration that comes to our mind as we seek His guidance, kind of like meditation.. it’s all about our choices and inner intentions. My current belief/testimony is that: God is our Father, humans are His spiritual children, we all have God within us somehow. We have all been given the freedom to make choices, a beautiful gift from God. We can choose what we think about, write about, talk about and the whole idea is that God trust that we will choose good over the natural persuasions of evil and when we do, say or think unclean that Jesus life and atonement can make us clean again to be closer to God. I don’t think religion is as important as our inner desires and intentions. God will judge us justly looking on the inside. I think it will have less to do with our religious commitments and more to do with our intent and choices, we can all improve on choosing love and kindness each day. That’s where real value comes. Anyways thank you for sharing and being open and honest. Good luck with the Sister missionaries, they aren’t trying to trick you, and you don’t need to trick them. Learn together, ask questions together.. spread more love and kindness. Have great day people
As an inactive (but still believing jw), It was making friends with a intelligent and lovely Mormon and it reminded me of JWs in so many ways. It was researching the LDS church, its history and doctrines from their own literature and then started watching exMormons. It have me the strength to investigate the Watchtower and its history, etc. It’s a large part of my waking from my cult indoctrination. It was this that allowed me to eventually investigate the Bible and Christianity from an objective point of view. I am now atheist and happier than ever.
@@davidclover2248 Who is "David in their videos"? King David from the Bible? I am sorry your cat and mother were murdered. That is horrible. You are their god? I am confused......
Jesus is the way !!!!!!!! The truth it’s about faith not man made religion!!!! Our faith in Jesus Christ will save us!!!!! And we are saved through grace not works!!!!
@@nikoniko1455 that is your interpretation of a book written by men thousands of years ago. If it makes you happy and gives you meaning, great. You do you.
I'm sure I'm not the only ex-Mormon to watch your channel, so it was really fun to see this. There are tons of resources out there to find about all the interesting details, and I'm happy to answer any questions as well. Here are a couple of tidbits that came to mind when you were making your observations: * The LDS church went through a process called correlation back in the 50s or 60s that essentially froze their policies and culture in place in an attempt to normalize everything. That's a big part of why they look so dated in their clothing and styles. Until very recently male missionaries (Elders) were only allowed to wear white shirts. * In every missionary pair there is always one that is designated the senior companion who is in charge and the other is the junior companion. * The lessons they give are rehearsed ad-nauseum. It's changed a bit since I was a missionary but essentially recited the lesson word for word from a memorized script. * The apologetic for the language style of the BoM would be that it's "scriptural language" and it's what everyone was used to reading with the KJV. Given how minor this is compared to all of the other problems in Mormonism I never bring it up. * It would be considered scandalous among missionaries to refer to each other by their first names. It's *always* Elder/Sister XYZ. * It's quite rare for someone to reach out to ask for lessons (happened to me zero times in two years), so the sister missionaries are probably extremely eager to meet and give lessons rather than knocking doors or stopping people on the street.
Fellow exmo as well (from Utah no less)! - Wanted to add that the missionaries aren't perfect and you'll find a range of "apostate" missionaries bending the rules from time to time. Elders are way more prone to this than Sisters. The ones leaving for home soon are known as "trunkie" (ie, excited to pack up their trunks and leave) and are even more likely to exhibit "apostate behaviors" such as sleeping in past 6:30, using only your companion's last name, visiting less-active member's houses too often, or listening to non-approved LDS music (I listened to other Christian music which is not allowed). I had a very trunkie companion about half way through my mission and for 6 weeks, we did very little outside of watching movies and sight-seeing. Very apostate. Being a missionary sucks and I still have nightmares about finding myself in the field again in my 30's.
I knew a very zealous single JW sister who had been expelled in 2010. I learned a few years later that she had turned to the "religion" of Mormons. I think that there are people who have no choice but to be in a high-control "religion" to continue living. I think some JWs will still be JWs even after the Watchtower Society collapse.
hahahaha, why are you so mad and angry with fanatics of religions? all fanatic JWs, Mormons, SDAs, Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, Born Agains and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are LIARS, hateful, worthless, and useless human beings who will just become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever after their inescapable deaths. What else do you want? Why bother yourself with LIARS, worthless, and useless human beings? What for?
Good point. I think with many even if the religious doctrine was proven to be false they would still choose to believe it, it brings believers comfort that the answers to the universe are in a book. They dont like the unknown and the thought of ceasing to exist, religion offer a way out of that (it claims) i almost see it that they are a slave to their religion. Its sad and also pathetic! How anyone is convinced by a Devine jesus, Joseph smith, prophet Mohammed being historical figures is beyond me
2 LDS 'brothers' knocked on my door when I was deeply grieving my beloved husband's passing last year. I was so triggered by their 'ressurection' hope I started crying. They wanted to call me the following week. I wanted them gone so I gave them my number but ghosted their call. I always wondered what it would have been like though. Now I get to find out. Thanks Lloyd! This is a great idea.
I'm so sorry you went through that. They're programmed to take advantage of moments of weakness. In their minds they're simply offering a bandage to a wound, but really they're taking advantage of your pain to push their religion. You know this is true because they don't just mourn with you, which is what Christ taught us to do. They always want something. I feel sick when I think about how I used to do that as well Once again I'm so sorry you experienced that. I offer you a hug from the U.S. 🤗
@Pamela Ruth , My sincere condolences on the loss of your dear husband. I’m sending you a hug ❤ Near a shady wall a rose once grew, Budded and blossomed in God’s free light, Watered and fed by the morning dew, Shedding it’s sweetness day and night. As it grew and blossomed fair and tall, Slowly rising to loftier height, It came to a crevice in the wall Through which there shone a beam of light. Onward it crept with added strength With never a thought of fear or pride, It followed the light through the crevice’s length And unfolded itself on the other side. The light, the dew, the broadening view Were found the same as they were before, And it lost itself in beauties new, Breathing it’s fragrance more and more. Shall claim of death cause us to grieve And make our courage faint and fall? Nay! Let us faith and hope receive- The rose still grows beyond the wall, Scattering fragrance far and wide Just as it did in days of yore, Just as it did on the other side, Just as it will forever-more. 🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻 SINCERE CONDOLENCES, FROM H.R.H PRINCE LOUIS XAIVER DE LUXEMBOURG , OF THE ROYAL & GRAND DUCAL HOUSE OF NASSAU-WEILBURG, PRINCE OF THE GRAND DUCHY OF LUXEMBOURG 🇱🇺 🙏🏻
This was so interesting! I recently started watching the real housewives of Utah and one of the housewives Heather talks a lot about her journey out of the mormon. She was a very devout mormon for most of her life and now coming out of the religion she feels cheated out of her youth basically. In the show she holds a wake for her dad who passed away and most of the rest of her family don't come because they don't wanna associate with her since she openly went 'against' the religion. The shunning, the strict culture, a lot of similarities between mormonism and JW for sure
I admit I have not seen that show, but there are three and maybe four branches of Mormonism some are more radical than the main branch in Salt Lake City but they are separate religions.
I live in SLC Utah. Previously, I live in Park City, Utah. Heather is the daughter of one of my best friends. Housewives is NOTHING like the ladies in Utah. Not any of the “Housewives” represent at all. It is so awful to see them yell am scream at each other. Who does that! Ugh!
@@robertshaw8537 Based on how she talked about it and how the showed portrayed it, Heather was just part of mainstream mormonism. What are the other branches? I mean there is theologically only one recognized "branch", no? FLDS for example are not considered a part of the mormon church
Hi Lloyd, Ex-JW living in Utah here! Everything you’ve described in this video is spot-on. There are plenty of interesting similarities between the LDS and the witnesses. When I first moved to Utah it was kind of triggering at times. My landlady even vented to me about how her daughters were no longer LDS! When I told her I was raised JW she said “I knew you were raised well!” 😒 But I’ve since met so many lovely ex-LDS individuals with whom I have a lot in common! I’ll be looking forward to hearing more about your chats with these young LDS missionaries.
Former cult members, without proper therapy and a really strong personal (not online, but real friends) support group, are always susceptible to the next "fix." It's addictive like anything else to feel you know *the* truth, once you get used to that feeling. Wishing you freedom to think and personal fulfillment Lloyd. Watch Under The Banner of Heaven if you want to learn about the Mormon cult
I watched it and it was so well done. It showed how the Mormon Church is being chipped away from the right by those who want to go back to the days of polygamy and the 19th century Mormonism, and from the left by educated Mormons who are learning the real history of the church from online sources.
One more time Michael, one of the main teachings of the Morman Church is "FREE AGENCY" people can choose to be a member or choose not to be a member, cults don't do that, cults indoctrinate you into guilt for thinking about leaving, I repeat myself, One of the main teachings of the Mormon Church is "free Agency" so stop the Jehovah's Witness judgmentalism, let people choose.
I'm not sure that The Banner of Heaven is the way to learn more about LDS. Read their material on their website and learn for yourself rather than through an entertainment medium. Nothing important is usually gained by learning ONLY through 'anti' material, which is lazy if you're serious about any faith.
@@rutherglenroad8109 I agree that reading "anti" material shouldn't be the only source. I lived in Utah for two years which taught me a lot about LDS people and beliefs. All religions will provide a simplistic and positive view of their histories and beliefs. One example of this for LDS history and beliefs is the practice of polygamy. This practice is one reason the Mormons were so opposed during Joseph Smith's time. Mormons are taught that this practice, which is condoned in the Old Testament, was because there were many single women who needed a husband to care for them. That wasn't true. Joseph Smith had over 30 wives, at least 9 of which were already married to Mormon men who he sent on missions to far off places like England, so their wives were left and Joseph told them that God had commanded him to marry them, but to keep it secret, because it was unlawful to practice polygamy in the U.S. Brigham young had 56 wives. Polygamy was practiced until the U.S. government threatened to destroy the Mormon Church if they didn't give up polygamy. It wasn't until 1890 that the church officially stopped polygamy in order to become a state. This is a part of their history that Mormons today wish to escape. All of this information is available online and is the reason so many Mormons are questioning their beliefs and many leaving. It's a lot like JW history which is not taught to seekers or new members.
I grew up Mormon and it's the reason I love your show. Mormonism and JW are so similar yet different and so we can look at each other to be able to look at ourselves
I also love to play football (soccer) and I used to play it when I was a JW with other JWs. It was so frustrating because they used to take it so seriously, blaming me for any mistakes, putting on me a lot of pressure for a stupid football game, even if I was a teenager and they were 30-40 years old. When I left the cult and I started playing with other people, I realized how much JW are frustrated and obsessed by controlling the others because they're controlled in litterally everything.
Wow, that's interesting. Born 61 years ago as a 3rd generation JW in Germany I loved - of course - to play football too. Made the same experience as you. As you wrote - the 30-40 years old men, some of them elders - didn't know how to play just for fun! They always were abusive, angry and blamed us young ones for all and everything. I was able to leave the destructive cult - together with my wife - 22 years ago and today I'm free and try to enjoy the rest of my life.
@@josefhorndl3469 Do any of you ex JWs have any advice for me? I'm a Catholic who no longer practices. How can I rescue my 5yr old daughter from my JW wife who isn't even baptized yet? She abandoned me and took our daughter. I want to save my daughter from this cult. 😢
@@SUSHI4lyf hard to tell without the legal status... Are you allowed to spend time with your daughter? If so, just try to have the best time she can have, she is very young yet... When she starts asking questions, be ready to answer them and specially, try to build her critical thinking skills so that she develops curiosity she can use to investigate by herself about the organization
@@SUSHI4lyf, I would suggest you start by perusing your parental rights. These rights can vary greatly from locale to locale, so seek out legal advice. At the very least you should be entitled to visitation. As has been suggested, use that time to teach your daughter critical thinking skills, helping her to gleen her own conclusions regarding what she is being taught. I would suggest you apply that to anything she is being taught, not just her religious training. Try to avoid outright condemnation of JW teachings. This will undoubtedly get back to her mother, causing her mother to double-down. Good luck to you!
Fascinating story, I was so worried you weren’t going to be able to play football that day. You are approaching this endeavor with respect, can’t wait for the next chapter!
Second comment on why most missionaries are from Utah: you have to understand the recruiting strategy for missionaries in contrast to JWs. The basic pressure goes like this: if you don't go on a mission as a young man, you won't get a good wife, as women are taught to marry only returned missionaries. This recruiting strategy is ingrained into Utah culture, but hardly reproducible in minority countries such as Europe or Asia. Consequently, the percentage of Utah Mormons who serve is higher than in other states or countries. Only few converts will serve a mission because they are too old. This is different for JWs where door to door service is not restricted to age groups.
I’m so invested in this. Can’t wait for the next one. I’m on my second watch through of Leah Reminis Scientology series. All these cults are so different from one another but so similar in mindset.
You may all ready know about this but you should read the infamous CES letter by Jeremy Runalds. I am an ex-jdub but it is fascinating how similar the histories of LDS and WT are.
@@harlanlang6556 I have listened to Mormon Stories before but it is soooo long. There are a few other podcasts I follow like How To Heritic (now ended) and Thank God I'm Atheist both shows hosted by ex Mormons. Also Bryce Blankenagel has an excellent odcast called Naked Morminsm that goes through the history of LDS starting with Joseph Smith's origins.
@@revan9173 Science tells us that the universe is a little over 14 billion years old. Have you ever thought about how the universe came into being at the Big Bang? Science doesn't , and can't, tell us how this happened, and religion doesn't really explain how it happened.
Regarding the missionaries taking the lead, it's normally the longest serving missionary that will take the lead in the hope it will mentor the other sister. They rotate and change companions every 4-6 months. Hopefully this will clarify why Betty may haven't spoken as much and Harriett took the lead. And also their testimony is something they have to have before going to MTC (missonary training center). And yes, Utah is the place you find the factory of Mormon missionaries. Plus missionaries never give up on potential converts. However, the positive thing is that they read the scriptures in the study and not use a random manual
Another thumbs up vote for a fascinating video,Lloyd. Looking forward to the sequel. And I’m sure you did enjoy that football game in spite of the aches and pains the next day. Still felt good though, yes ?
Mormons are usually pretty educated. They encourage higher education. I know many doctors, nurses, lawyers, etc that are Mormon. I can’t say the same about JWs.
And the cognitive dissonance is especially pronounced in those people. I certainly wouldn't be going to a doctor who would believe that humans and dinosaurs lived at the same time.
Mormons are very well educated I live near Kansas City University in Joplin Missouri and a large number of Mormons make up the Medical school enrollment and starting January 1 2023 the Dental school opens up. I went to law school and there are many lawyers as well, but everyone needs their car fixed so don't underestimate the work mechanics do, plumbers, and electricians.
@@GaliSinatra Interestingly, that would be a minority view for Mormons. Most are perfectly fine seeing the creation story as allegorical and the we can and should use science to understand how god created everything. When I was Mormon, the young earth creationist types were considered a bit odd.
@@unnefer001 I've heard quite a few ex-mo's from Utah particularly saying quite the opposite. They are all young too, 20's and 30's. I'm not saying all of them, but there are plenty who don't believe dinosaurs are real because the church has no explanation for them.
That's because JWs see higher education as a waste of time. They are waiting for A-day. JWs also do not have large families. It is common in a Kingdom Hall to see couples without children.
I caught myself one day, as I was getting dressed for a meeting at the hall, asking myself: will this blouse be okay with the elders? And I realized, I was dressing for THEM, not for Jehovah, who was perfectly fine with Adam & Eve being NAKED! You are spot on, they draw attention to themselves with their frumpy clothes and if you walk into the hall looking modest but STYLISH, WOE unto you! The other women get their knickers in a twist… especially if you aren’t married 🤦🏻♀️
Lol as a former Mormon who served as a female missionary from 2011 to 2013, I just have to throw in my thoughts on the missionaries’ frumpy attire just to give some additional context to anyone curious on the subject. Sister missionaries (as female Mormon missionaries are called) are given guidelines on how they must dress during their missions (the male missionaries, often referred to as “the elders”, have guidelines too, of course. They usually wear the trademark suit and tie or white shirt and tie). In the past, the sisters were only allowed to wear neutral colors, long skirts, nothing tight, etc. So they were essentially ordered by the church to be frumpy and unappealing. Thus, the stereotypical image of the sister missionary was an amorphous blob of beige. Luckily for me, about six months before I left on my mission, they changed the guidelines to allow sisters to dress more or less the way a typical Mormon woman would dress at church. They encouraged bright colors and even gave a lecture in the missionary training center about wearing makeup and making yourself look pretty and flat out said we needed to attract people with our appearance (pretty sexist, but is that a surprise?). So after that you could wear knee length skirts and a cute clothes (within Mormon modesty standards, of course, so it’s still harder to avoid a little bit of frump). Then a few years after that, they changed the guidelines again to allow sisters to wear slacks. So there’s not really a reason that a sister missionary wouldn’t be able to wear nice pant suits and look very professional. HOWEVER, I will say that even with the improved general guidelines, some missions have their own guidelines set forth by the mission president. I don’t know if all missions are allowing the sisters to wear slacks. I could easily imagine an old sexist mission president thinking that their sister missionaries “just look better in skirts” (actual quote from someone I know) and disallowing the slacks. Also, sometimes your sense of fashion can get a little skewed as a missionary. I served as a Temple Square missionary in Salt Lake City, Utah and I remember the trend of wearing floor length skirts with grandma’s couch patterns being very popular for a while. (Temple Square is a major historical site for the church. So my mission was a bit different. It was a couple hundred sister missionaries working as tour guides and teaching over the phone in call centers. We still gave lessons, bore testimony, and tried to commit people to baptism -yes, as part of the tours!!!- but in less usual ways. It’s easier for trends to go around a mission in such an environment). Another thing to consider is that since the sisters are paying for their own missions, and may not have had the budget for nicer clothes left over. They may be wearing ill fitting hand me downs left in the apartment by previous missionaries. There were sisters on my mission that would skip meals and use their food money to buy clothes (this was vanity shopping, but the point was they didn’t have extra money for clothes) I don’t know these individual sisters’ reasons for the way they are dressing, but hopefully this gives a little more info surrounding the way Mormon missionaries look. Sorry for the long ramble! Hope someone finds it interesting! 😋 Edit to add: I'm from Washington, not Utah. And sisters in my mission were from all parts of the world. But we did have a few from Utah too, lol
This reminds me so much of when I was just leaving Mormonism. I had asked to meet with the missionaries as a kind of last ditch effort to see if I could rekindle my faith in any way. I expressed my concerns about how I’m supposed to rely on the Holy Ghost to find truth if it’s not really clear what the Homy Ghost is supposed to feel like. They explained to me that we can’t manufacture feelings of peace, and that peace comes from the Holy Ghost. This actually helped a lot as I kept reading the Book of Mormon and felt absolutely no peace reading the blatant racism in the passages. I was also really off-put when I expressed my concerns about LGBTQ+ issues in the church, and one missionary proceeded to talk about their transgender sibling while refusing to refer to said sibling by their preferred name and pronouns. I decided that, if the Holy Ghost really does represent peace, then I don’t feel at peace in the Mormon church.
LDS members testimonies are really near and dear to their hearts because it’s their personal experience of God in their life. They share their testimonies because it will be relatable to some people
As a member of the church who served a mission, I can testify that what you said is only true about 25% of the time. It's almost always a sort of conditioning we undergo. It's all about conversion, never about succor
Hey, if any ex-Mormons read this comment, can you share whether or not you were presented with questions in your ministry that rattled your belief, even just a little? What were they? I'm super curious
Leica I was a Jehovah's Witness and I gave public Talks and gave a public talk one time years ago at the Columbus Kansas Circuit Assembly, I was a vacation pioneer three times. I worked the City of Jasper Missouri all by myself and had four bible studies, I placed 54 watchtowers and Awakes in one day, but after all the dirt Jehovah's Witnesses pulled on me they can kiss my sweet A, I am a happy latter day saint and have been for many years and I find peace with that
Short answer: no, not really. Mormons in general have a sort of psychological cattle-guard (like on the front of steam trains) built into their minds that allows them to immediately disregard anything that would rattle their faith. The mission field also makes Mormons soooooo much more stubborn since literally all they do is surround themselves with other missionaries and only do things like read the Book of Mormon and share their testimonies with people. You can only ever creep doubt into them if they're new missionaries since the heavy brainwashing and tribalism hasn't set in quite yet, and it only sometimes works. However, there were definitely things that rattled my faith but not on my mission. Part of that was because my mission experience was so bad and traumatizing (I served in Argentina) that my mind doubled-down on the Mormon doctrine to make myself feel like my suffering and blatant abuse was for a grand purpose, rather than the reality that it was pretty much for no reason at all. I still suffer from severe PTSD from my experience down there I had a fellow mission friend who used to be a JW though. His name was Anderson Romero, and he was one of the kindest and well-versed missionaries I'd met down there. He really helped me feel loved and appreciated. I also had some interesting interactions with JW's in general
However, I can give you two topics that MIGHT rattle their faith. 1. Joseph Smith using a rock in a hat to translate the BOM, which was the same documented method he used to con people out of money in his youth 2. JS originally preached a trinitarian view of God, which can be found in the Lectures On Faith. Mormons believe in a particular view of the Godhead and so this revelation sometimes rattles them since they believe their view of God and Jesus being separate physical people was one of JS's original doctrines, but it wasn't. It was a later idea. But please don't go arguing with them or trying to tear them down. It only serves to build their faith up in their minds while tearing yourself down with unnecessary contention. Only do it in the form of self defense if Mormons are being legit crazy. That's my advice
@@jonbaker476 I bring up Joseph Smith and the tablets inside of a hat whenever I can 😂 I'm legit fascinated listening to someone try to explain it as not-at-all-suspicious! I don't argue with them at all, I'm super friendly. I hated going door to door as a JW and coming across someone who spoke to me like I was stupid. That's not my jam at all
@@jonbaker476 as you know, LDS people are told not to argue or debate, they simply present their beliefs and it's totally up to the listener to discern what they decide.
The privates may not google a standard prospect. But some manager level wonk? Bishop. Ward Poobah. Once there's an anomaly. Questions. Sticking your head up. ...which Lloyd's inquiry, though mild and polite, is.
Lloyd, I have a good friend who is LDS and I too had long conversations with him about his religion and my previous religion. The question I found that will stop them in their tracks is when they tell you that their leader is a “prophet.” I asked, “prophet like the prophets in the bible like Moses and Daniel?” He would confirm that the prophets were exactly the same. I told him that I would indeed join the LDS church if he could present me with even one instance where their current “prophet” parted the red sea or correctly prophesied something in great detail. Show me something that could have only happened with divine guidance. He did try to make excuses as to why this doesn’t happen today but then I would say, how then do you know he is a prophet like Moses or Daniel? This was the last religious conversation we had. It would be interesting how these ladies handle this type of questioning.
Also, this is the hierarchy of Mormon missions, of which all but the very top guy is a young man in his twenties. Each had authority over the ones below them. 1. The Mission President. 2. The Assistants to the President (two male companions who work directly for him). They are like the MP's minions and have the most authority in the mission out of any missionary. 3. Zone Leaders. This is what I was in my mission. They're in charge of various District Leaders and various proselyting zones. They call the District Leaders and gather numbers and statistics for the AP's. They're also male. They're like managers of a store. 4. District Leaders. They're in charge of average missionaries, and they gather data from the various companionships under their supervision. They're like supervisors at a store. They're also male. 5. The Senior Companion. Now we're at the lowest level of missionary. These are just average missionaries who have no authority for the most part. Their sole duty is to preach and teach. This companion decides who to teach and where to go. Can be male or female. 6. The Junior Companion. The lowest possible missionary. This is the Padawan of companionships. They have no authority whatsoever and simply preach and teach and obey. They're typically the youngest. Can be male or female The female missionaries also have their own hierarchy but it only goes up so high. They really don't have any significant authority. Any authority they have is over female missionaries, whereas the men are in charge of both male and female.
Nice breakdown: I had a meeting with two and I had help from a person who worked in the Tanner's bookstore in Anaheim CA : the 2 missionaries brought their District manager: I think they thought they needed help too. But it was fun : I think the District manager drove them because he really didn't say too much during the discussion. I as a Biola graduate and she as an ex-Mormon didn't have much trouble the missionaries. But I know so more today than in the 80's about Mormonism.
Another comment I need to make quickly. Unless something has drastically changed since I was a LDS missionary. While yes, the individual missionaries pays for their mission this is only up to a point. If they can pay for the entirety the church is very happy, but there is a general missionary fund that pays for missionaries that can't pay for their own mission. The missionary is still required to pay what they can, but the shortfall is made up from the GMF with the family and the home congregation of the missionary encouraged to contribute generously to the GMF to compensate. Also no missionary is expected to pay the travel costs of going to or coming home from their mission, or for travel costs within the mission.
I have the LDS female missionary's visit once a week to my house for the last 2 years. The young ladies change at least one person of the two every six to 8 weeks so I've had a chance to meet quite a few female and male ( on the doorstep with the young men because I'm a single female and coming in the house isn't appropriate for them) We have many interesting conversations mostly about the KJV bible, hebrew, greek but also our experiences of being raised in a strict high control religion. They also practice and demonstrate their testimony and LDS teachings. They all know I will never convert but that with me they are able to speak openly and confidentially with me without fear of judgement. Most LDS missionarys are all born in. I've not met one that hasn't been.
You should know by now that all fanatic JWs, Mormons, SDAs, Muslims, Buddhists, Born Agains, Catholics, etc. are LIARS, deceivers, cruel, hateful, worthless, and useless human beings who will just become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever after their inescapable deaths.
@@jaflenbond7854 if that's your belief then you a entitled to believe as you wish. Good luck and warm hugs be to you. Be at peace with your own beliefs because I am. X
@@anniesavedbygrace hahahaha, why are you so mad and angry with fanatics of religions? all fanatic JWs, Mormons, SDAs, Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, Born Agains and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are LIARS, hateful, worthless, and useless human beings who will just become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever after their inescapable deaths. What else do you want? Why bother yourself with LIARS, worthless, and useless human beings? What for?
@@jaflenbond7854 mad and angry??? I'm not either I carry no ill will to anyone and show love to all I meet. I really don't know why you have taken the position that you have towards me. In answer to your question I'll ask what have I done to you to upset you?
@@anniesavedbygrace I'm not upset, I simply wonder why atheists, agnostics, and fanatics of all religions are criticizing and arguing with each other when they all know that they are NOT worshippers of the Creator and NOT believers too of the authority and teachings of the Christ. All fanatics of all religions are fools and LIARS, foolish worshippers of the Devil, and foolish preachers and spreaders of the LIES and foolishness of their LIARS and anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders. Do you agree with me that all fanatics of all religions and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are liars, hateful, worthless and useless human beings who will just die and become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever?
In my experience, if you don't agree to be baptized, they won't continue to study with you for long. As I understand it, a resistance to being baptized is an indication that you aren't being 'guided by the holy spirit.'
Really interesting that you have been able to have some good interactions with some in the LDS church. I will look forward to more you have to say on this, including the verses you used to counter their teachings.
Hi Lloyd. I am an exjw who converted to LDS Christianity after disassociating from WTS. I want to say first of all that your channel was informative and influential in helping me make the desicion to leave JWs. However, you must understand that atheism does not work for all exjws. I dissassociated from JWs but not from God. That does not mean that I am uninformed about the atheist viewpoint. I have read The God Delusion and God is Not Great. I still want God in my life. I left JWs in November 2021 and converted to LDS Christianity in April of 2022. I am comfortable with the Book of Mormon. Compared to JWs, the LDS congregation is a space of freedom. Mormons respect agency, JWs do not. This is just my opinion.
Hi Emmanuel! There's a big difference between feeling "comfortable" with a book and asserting it to be of divine origin. The Book of Mormon in particular is a blatant forgery and I struggle to understand how anyone can be convinced otherwise unless they've been indoctrinated into the church from childhood. But of course I have nothing against anyone believing in God. I don't even mind you believing in Joseph Smith's golden plates if that's your thing. Just don't expect me to take it seriously or hold the LDS church exempt from criticism and scrutiny.
17:30 summarizes beautifully my exact same view about religion. I was born Catholic and used to be devout, obviously being raised one. But as I grew older and wiser (yeah, right, lol), I learned to think for myself. I thank religion for introducing me to God. But I've long since learned that if God gifted us with brains to think, it would be a total disservice and disrespect to Him if we don't use it. Blindly following religion, which is man's construct, is plainly stupid for me.
Very interesting topic. I'm especially fascinated with the similarities between cults and even mainstream religions. Looking forward to future installments to see how they act with you and if their love bombing will continue if you don't agree to go to their services or progress in your study.
Looking forward to seeing future videos! Whenever I talk to members of the Latter Day Saints, I always ask what it was that convinced them their religion was the true religion, whether or not they've doubted and how they overcame their doubts. It's always an uncomfortable question until I explain I was a former JW who left because of my doubts and that's why I'm curious what convinced them. They're usually happy to hear I have a religious background and seem pleased to explain why theirs in the true religion and readily accept that I couldn't believe the JW religion. Always fascinating conversations! I love the moments where a question makes them think, even if it doesn't introduce any doubt in that moment, I sometimes wonder if they'll think about the conversation later, quite like I did when I was a JW being presented with a good question.
Hello, Leica I have followed your comments for a long time, and you have a lot of spirits and a lot of fight. Feel free to contact me if you have any questions,
@@robertshaw8537 Are you LDS, Robert? Presuming so, how much time passed between you having left the JWs and joining LDS? Do you watch videos from ex-LDS members the same as exJW?
@@leicafox4403 Yes I am LDS and I am not here to convert anyone, I am here because Lloyd talked about his experiences with the LDS missionaries, and I have followed Lloyd for about the past four years and I am expressing my views on their similarities
I personally don’t have a copy of the book of Mormon to verify this, but Google brought me these verses that illustrate the curse upon the Nephites: 2 Nephi 5:21-23; Alma 3:6-10
Interesting annedoct, I woke up from the JWs (a good 14 years after I was out already) because of the LDS. Albeit never saw them preaching, the were present in Dubai and held worship in a villa next to my friend's villa. One day while visiting her I noticed all the 4x4 parked and asked what was going on she said oh it's the Mormons next door doing their church stuff...that made me think if there's Mormons there must be covert JWs too. So I run a search online for JWs meetings in Dubai as I wanted my parents to visit up and stay a while but I knew they'd want to go to meetings. Instead of the info I was looking for, I came across the ex-jw forum with a newly woken up Lloyd being present in many threads and well...the rest is history. So, I guess thanks LDS? 😜
Super interesting, Lloyd!! I agree about the feelings. Our strongest emotion is fear, it's so dominant in our lifestyle nowadays. And we want nothing more than security to escape from the fear. So if someone's able to wave with some loving group and a bunch of rules which seem to enforce some security and borders, people will fall for it. That's the trap with emotions...
Saffron thanks, you know at one time 99% of the people on the earth thought the world was flat and if you thought otherwise you could be burned at the stake. The moral of this comment is people get things wrong sometimes, and I think ex-Jehovah's Witnesses in a high-control cult tend to see things very critical, and the people that don't like the Mormon Church want to mislabel it as a cult, May I most respectfully point out one of the main teaching of the Church is Free Agency, people have a right to choose, AND NO CULT OFFERS THAT, ....NONE
@@robertshaw8537 you might want to do more research before reaching such conclusions. Sure, the LDS faith teaches free agency, as do most all cults, and high demand religions, but of course the picture is larger than one stated belief, and there are some good sources for criteria to assess the level of control, undue influence, an organization has. You may want to check out the BITE model or read Combating Mind Control by Steven Hassan, PhD. As you said, people get things wrong, and to continue to learn, we do well to use critical thinking and use sources outside our particular In Group. It sounds as if you have a religion that sits you, and feel strongly about it. I am not here to dissuade you from your faith; rather I was sharing my journey. I wish you all the best
@@saffronhammer7714 Well Sir I am not even a member of the Priesthood, why because I am not interested in being a member, and this belief that I am under pressure to be a member of the priesthood is complete bull
I worked for someone who was Mormon. Very nice guy, but had a lot of similarities to me as a former JW. That’s a big reason we got along so well. I hope they get out of the cult.
Well done as always Lloyd. I’m former LDS. I don’t know how far you’ll get with these missionaries since they are so far inside their bubble. At the least some seeds will be planted that help them think. Did they try flirt to convert at all?
@@leicafox4403 It’s no secret that sister missionaries are the most effective in getting single men into the church. Some really good looking sisters could convert dozens of single men. Whether they were really converting for the gospel’s sake is another story. Likewise many male missionaries are frequently adept at flirting with young women to get them interested in lessons. This scenario plays out significantly where the people have a good perception of Americans, such as Latin America or the Philippines. I’m positive that it is less so in other areas of the world like Europe where Americans aren’t admired as much. These missionaries are still young people and many won’t bat an eye at light flirting as a way to get conversations going to see if someone wants to take lessons or is interested. My experience was in Latin America 24 years ago. Some missionaries can be “naughty” too. Some can get sent home.
I'll be interested to see if they challenge you to get baptized next time you meet them. It's standard procedure for Mormon missionaries to push for baptism early.
US LDS Missionaries can buy a package of clothing deemed suitable for the work at stores such as Elder Misionery Clothing. I recently heard that the ladies may now wear trousers. Perhaps they can buy a package too.
As a JW I invited the Mormons into my house for a face off, we asked them if they wanted tea or coffee, they said they are not allowed b/c of the caffeine and asked for a coke! We kind of sniggered. Also my JW sister was sizing up a work mate to convert her as she seemed 'receptive' (remember that loaded word!?), it turned out she was a Mormon who was at the same time sizing my sister up for conversion because she seemed 'the right sort of person'. Weird.
I personally think it’s great that Lloyd is looking and educating himself on other religions to hopefully find the right one. Back when I was a JW ,it was frowned upon to look up any information besides JW publications to research on other religions. Me personally after being A JW after 25 years, I found Islam and I’m very happy. I had so many misconceptions about it until I did research. It’s the same God who sent the Torah,the Gospel, Scriptures and the Quran. I encourage everybody to research Islam.
I don't think Lloyd is seeking to convert to Mormonism. As an ex-mormon, I'd recommend against it, especially for someone who isn't American, as Mormonism is especially U.S. focused.
I think they reassign their missionaries several times over the two years. And they switch partners as well a few times, so no one gets “too close”. And yes they have to soy for all expenses: flight, rent, etc. Families usually pay for them. Meanwhile the LDS church has hundreds of billions $$$$ they never touch which continues to grow.
I'm curious to learn more about your experiences learning about Mormon theology, rituals, culture and history with these female LDS missionaries whom you are currently studying with, Lloyd.
hahahaha, all fanatic JWs, Born Agains, Catholics, Mormons, etc. and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are all LIARS, cruel, and hateful human beings who will just die and become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever. So, I wonder why you still want to learn more about the LIES and foolishness of the Mormons. What for?
Lloyd is becoming a Mormon!!! What?? Lol 🤣🤣🤣🤣. Bro is cult hopping. 🤣🤣🤣 Obviously I'm joking. I know he's just studying but that's funny man. Studying with Mormons. Lol.
If your problem is their doctrine, that doesn't qualify as a "mind control cult". They aren't a mind control cult. When you study with them, they say "Don't take our word for it, pray to God and He will tell you"
Interesting that she was supposed to go to Ukraine. My ex husband is a Mormon and they told me that the country assigned was based on prayer. And they would get a “response” and send the missionary based on what God has told them. So Ukraine… interesting..
Lloyd, did you forget to look at the trees?! Also, we need a former JW “Holiday” to honor the escape from the org. I submit 09/14. It’s not 1914 but it’s on the way. It will be awakening day. If that’s no good how about Rutherford’s birthday?! Huh, a deep track! That day is November 8th.
You will notice that they never give you the book called doctrine and covenant to make the decision to jump into mormonism or to pray about. Which the doctrine would be a petty key consideration in my opinion.
My friends son recently joined the Mormon church and within a year he was married to a member of the church she asked my opinion of it as I am so interested in cults like jw s and Scientology and watch your channel I looked it up and was shocked to find out about it so told her to look it up as I thought it was a cult and she agreed but says it mAkes him happy as he was going through some things he is still married but I can some cracks starting I don’t feel qualified enough to give her advice so this was very interesting
For some people the church is very beneficial, like for my grandparents. I grew up Mormon and often found that it helped a lot of converts to have better lives, but people who were raised in it had a crap-ton of psychological issues when they became adults. I think it's because converts of the church don't take it too seriously but just seriously enough, whereas forever-mormons take it waaaaay too seriously since it's all they've ever known
@@jonbaker476 that’s good to know hopefully things will work out I don’t know any mormons where I live in Scotland didn’t even know we had a church I could tell u where the Kingdom Hall is but not the Mormon church so any information about it is appreciated
Very interesting, your compare & contrast to JW and cult behavior. You must have made their day- a convert! They are not allowed out of site of each other- to prevent doubting. Please be careful Lloyd, this could be triggering.
Btw Lloyd, a recent photograph of Joseph Smith has been discovered and released recently, and was found in the possession of his descendant. It's super interesting and you should check it out! It's the one of him in a locket
I’ve heard a lot of Mormons say they went through periods of doubt when they were younger (it sorta reminds me how mediums and psychics often say they used to be sceptics). I wonder if it’s something they’re supposed to talk about to try and relate to people
Life long, but now lapsed Mormon here. I was a Mormon Missionary 30 years ago and after my mission quickly rose through the ranks of local leadership to become the bishop (pastor) over my local congregation. This is a 'voluntary' position and is not remunerated and was fun until it wasn't 😁. One thing I will say about the missionaries of the LDS church. They are very young. They are usually very naïve with very limited life experience. If they are from Utah, they have grown up in the Mormon bubble behind the Zion curtain and things others take as normal can shock them like someone drinking coffee in public (!) or a visible tattoo. Non-Utah missionaries are quite often converts and quite zealous. They usually are more grounded in reality. The whole point of Moroni 10:3-5 is to invoke a 'spiritual experience' through elevation emotion meant to convict you in your heart and mind that Mormonism is true and you'll want to join. It's a technique where you convert yourself, later reinforced in congregational worship through groupthink and by othering outsiders so you get cocooned in a blanket of 'knowing' the Truth. It's a comforting form of self-deception. Sound familiar? Unfortunately for LDS leadership the realities of LDS history are causing the once impenetrable wall of obscuration meant to insulate the membership from the historical nasties to crumble under the onslaught of verifiable Internet borne information. You will find both JW and LDS leadership demonizing the Internet and insisting members study only approved materials to be common in both camps. So carry on, I'm enjoying your experience and looking forward to further installments.
I watch Exmo Lex and her hubby who have left. It's a wonderful channel, such a lovely couple telling stories of their terribly oppressed lives while in. Give it a watch 🤗
i had also had a run in with mormons in the past a few times. and i wanted to mention one thing stuck out to me when they had a visit with me, they explained that they believe that around 600 bc nebachadnezzars time, that some biblical people from that era came to the americas. they do believe that certain biblical tribes way back then had settled in america. i had pondered that but it never really sat right with me. i always thought and my question would be if bible figures settled in america that long ago , would there not be some sort of archaeological proof, one would think there would be biblical structures, palaces or pyramid buildings etc. we havnt heard of any. and they do claim the israelites intermarried with the native americans. anyones thoughts on this?
The Book of Mormon tells this story of Jews settling in America around 600 BC. The problem for Mormons in modern times is the ability to study DNA to show where your ancestors came from. Native American DNA definitely comes from east Asia, Siberia, not from the Middle East. The Book of Mormon also mentions horses, sheep, and cattle that were brought by the Jews. There's no fossil evidence of these animals being in America until the Spanish came.
@@harlanlang6556 yes I thought I heard them mention that too on horses and cattle. Your right there is no archeological eveidence. So they refuse to do dna testing? I wonder why that is? I know too as you were saying the natives have asien blood
I’m currently reading Michael Thomas’ book Mormonism: A Gold-Plated Religion. He’s a former Mormon. It’s a must read. Ps. I can’t help but quote Christopher Hitchens’ comment on the LDS- “the story of a successful con-job!”
since this is a seven part series, i do not want to jump ahead with information that mr. evans will likely cover. i studied with the mormons twice .... nearly was baptized both times. yes, the lds missionaries pay for their missions themselves. they might receive a car to use upon reaching their destination. this is true of all missionaries in ontario, canada. their dress is uncomfortably modest, even when met at church services, to denote humility, more so than male missionaries. typical lds members outside of those on missions dress more stylish and comfortably. does not surprise me that in croatia lds might offer a sporting event. unlike jehovah's witnesses, lds children are not adverse to basketball, soccer, football, etc. (ie brigham young university.) here in ontario, canada, in the summer it is not uncommon for the local lds church to offer to the public a 'fun day'. usually the kind of thing you would find at a company picnic. lds members love to make a large table. how many mormons does it take to change a lightbulb? the answer is 10. one to hold the ladder, one to change the bulb, and 8 to bring the food. very european they are in this manner, that they might be offended if on leaving, you don't take something from the table with you. there are 3 books dear to lds. apart from the bible. the book of mormon, doctrines and covenants, and the pearl of great price. all 3 can be downloaded online. and all 3 are important to understand the lds theology and way of life. the verses read in moroni are key to understanding one's conversion or acceptance to church theology. everyone who is studying with lds will be asked to pray about these verses. the feelings or emotions stirred in those who do so, and receive a 'confirmation' by holy spirit, is not unlike many evangelicals upon being 'born again.' in every church service i have attended, someone will be asked to give testimony 'i know that this church is true' ... and the verses in moroni have much to do with this. further research will reveal that there are new understandings as to 2 nephi 5:21, where the lamanites received the curse, not the nephites. ref. online 'what does the book of mormon mean by 'skin of blackness'. joseph smith was directed to the 'golden plates' by the angel moroni. he didn't stumble on them by chance. he was able to translate them using a 'seer stone' ref online ... 'what does the bible say about seer stones.' one might find that lds history is 'sketchy', but these believers are not of any less intelligence than anyone else, something that i have learned in my journey, that persons of equal intelligence can believe different things. the book of mormon was written early in the 19th century, where the language of the day was very king james indeed. comparing modern cowboys movies with the language of early 19th century is disingenuous, in that such movies are geared to modern audiences. also remember that the book of mormon is a religious work, and thus reflects the mannerisms of such individuals. ie ... any church service early 19th century. let's not scoff at these people. they honestly believe this history, and their intelligence is not less than anyone elses. as to utah, this is not where the journey for mormonism began. 'After the faithful left Nauvoo in 1846, they migrated to Utah, where they constructed Salt Lake City on a pattern laid down by Joseph Smith for the cities of Zion.' also see joseph smith born in vermont, died at age 38 in illinois. book of mormon first published in palmyra, new york. 1830
You commented on the missionaries frumpy attire. As a German, I have made the opposite observation. Usually, I would see male Mormon missionaries dressed in modern smart business, while JWs always dress old fashioned. I even had had the thought "Jehova must love beige", because JWs knocking on doors or standing around with bookstands would wear attire which was en vouge 30-60 years ago. Similarly, these print flyers also have this subdued color scheme which you can recognize as JW even without reading a single word. So at least in my country, it's the JWs being frumpy, and the Mormonsbeing smart business.
Did you get to the part yet with the elders where Joseph Smith translates the golden plates? He used a seer stone and buried his face in a top hat. The text was then revealed and he dictated to his scribe what the Book of Mormon plates say.
I moved to Utah for a job at 22, knowing not a soul in Utah, and it was an interesting experience. Mormons are good people who are taught that nobody else is as happy as Mormons who have such a healthy environment for raising children in this dangerous world. It's a jarring experience for them when they leave Utah, meet good people who are not Mormon, meet happy families who somehow have managed this without the LDS Church. The whole Mormon story of Joseph Smith never appeared anywhere near reality to me, but he certainly was an interesting character who was able to convince people that his story was true. A certain percentage of people are vulnerable, or go through vulnerable stages in life, making them willing victims of con artists. I agree that having that warm rush of emotions in the breast isn't necessarily a sign from God that something is true. People of every religion experience this. But we do the same thing when choosing a mate. Hollywood has taught us to go with our hearts. It's a real dilemma. Mormon boys are less likely now to want to go on a mission and the girls are filling in for them. That's what I've learned from watching Mormon Stories podcast. This podcast is for Mormons what your podcast is for JWs. There seems to be no end to interesting and intelligent Mormons and exMormons who are willing to be interviewed concerning their Mormon lives, how their questioning came about, and especially their missionary work where many of them first encountered people like you who planted questions in their minds. Here's a funny football story I learned from Mormon Stories. Missionaries are competitive with each other concerning how many baptisms they conduct during their mission, so some of them in a South American country observed that the young boys they were meeting all loved football. The missionaries organized football games and then offered a place for the boys to cool off. The baptismal was big enough for the boys to cool off in the water, and while they were there the missionaries baptized them as official members of the church. This really looked good for their statistical records and they were heroes back home, but the church authorities finally found out what they were doing and had to clean up the mess. What a challenge to try to find out which of the new converts actually knew that they were converts.
When I was waking up I was working a fairly new job in Tampa and was going through the beginnings of shunning starting. One ofy bosses knew I was dealing with something and took me out to lunch. I unloaded about being in a "cult" and all the shunning, etc. He started asking if I was done with faith and I pretty much shit all over religion in general. Come to find out, the guy was a Mormon elder...he didn't treat me very well after that lunch😂
All atheists, agnostics, and fanatics of all religions are NOT worshippers of the Creator and NOT believers too of the authority and teachings of the Christ. All fanatic JWs, Mormons, SDAs, Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, Born Agains and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are LIARS, hateful, worthless, and useless human beings who will just become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever after their inescapable deaths.
Not True. I am a Mormon and we don't shun at all. In fact, we are counseled to love everyone even if they leave the church. I have two children who have left the faith, and they have never been shunned. I have a great relationship with both and respect their choices in life. We believe if free choice, everyone is free to follow what they believe is true and what path they decide to follow, and we are to love them just the same.
@@eileenpierce7623 not in my experience since me becoming inactive everyone I have known in the church has shunned me even missionaries have done it to me
@@12345gerrard I am sorry to hear that. It is not right, and they are not following the tenets of the church. I hate to say it, but every church has some jerks in it.
My name is Sean, I’m an active member of the Mormon church - church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. I served a mission in Japan, I didn’t always know what I was doing there but I felt pretty happy and enjoyed the adventure. A lot of people, millions prob, pray for the LDS missionaries every day. There’s a real power behind that, I believe I felt that.
I liked what you said about emotions, connecting with God and trying to learn from His spirit can lead to many emotional responses, and we focus on that too much maybe. more important might be the inspiration that comes to our mind as we seek His guidance, kind of like meditation.. it’s all about our choices and inner intentions. My current belief/testimony is that: God is our Father, humans are His spiritual children, we all have God within us somehow. We have all been given the freedom to make choices, a beautiful gift from God. We can choose what we think about, write about, talk about and the whole idea is that God trust that we will choose good over the natural persuasions of evil and when we do, say or think unclean that Jesus life and atonement can make us clean again to be closer to God. I don’t think religion is as important as our inner desires and intentions. God will judge us justly looking on the inside. I think it will have less to do with our religious commitments and more to do with our intent and choices, we can all improve on choosing love and kindness each day. That’s where real value comes.
Anyways thank you for sharing and being open and honest. Good luck with the Sister missionaries, they aren’t trying to trick you, and you don’t need to trick them. Learn together, ask questions together.. spread more love and kindness. Have great day people
Go read the gospel topic essays and the CES letter then? We'll talk.
As an inactive (but still believing jw), It was making friends with a intelligent and lovely Mormon and it reminded me of JWs in so many ways. It was researching the LDS church, its history and doctrines from their own literature and then started watching exMormons. It have me the strength to investigate the Watchtower and its history, etc. It’s a large part of my waking from my cult indoctrination. It was this that allowed me to eventually investigate the Bible and Christianity from an objective point of view.
I am now atheist and happier than ever.
There might be a god, but it doesn’t matter to me one way or the other.
And if the god of the Bible is real, I have zero interest in worshipping it.
I´m confused, are you atheist or a believing jw?
@@davidclover2248 Who is "David in their videos"? King David from the Bible?
I am sorry your cat and mother were murdered. That is horrible.
You are their god?
I am confused......
Jesus is the way !!!!!!!!
The truth it’s about faith not man made religion!!!!
Our faith in Jesus Christ will save us!!!!!
And we are saved through grace not works!!!!
@@nikoniko1455 that is your interpretation of a book written by men thousands of years ago. If it makes you happy and gives you meaning, great. You do you.
I'm sure I'm not the only ex-Mormon to watch your channel, so it was really fun to see this. There are tons of resources out there to find about all the interesting details, and I'm happy to answer any questions as well. Here are a couple of tidbits that came to mind when you were making your observations:
* The LDS church went through a process called correlation back in the 50s or 60s that essentially froze their policies and culture in place in an attempt to normalize everything. That's a big part of why they look so dated in their clothing and styles. Until very recently male missionaries (Elders) were only allowed to wear white shirts.
* In every missionary pair there is always one that is designated the senior companion who is in charge and the other is the junior companion.
* The lessons they give are rehearsed ad-nauseum. It's changed a bit since I was a missionary but essentially recited the lesson word for word from a memorized script.
* The apologetic for the language style of the BoM would be that it's "scriptural language" and it's what everyone was used to reading with the KJV. Given how minor this is compared to all of the other problems in Mormonism I never bring it up.
* It would be considered scandalous among missionaries to refer to each other by their first names. It's *always* Elder/Sister XYZ.
* It's quite rare for someone to reach out to ask for lessons (happened to me zero times in two years), so the sister missionaries are probably extremely eager to meet and give lessons rather than knocking doors or stopping people on the street.
Interesting!
Hello fellow exmo!
Fellow exmo as well (from Utah no less)! - Wanted to add that the missionaries aren't perfect and you'll find a range of "apostate" missionaries bending the rules from time to time. Elders are way more prone to this than Sisters. The ones leaving for home soon are known as "trunkie" (ie, excited to pack up their trunks and leave) and are even more likely to exhibit "apostate behaviors" such as sleeping in past 6:30, using only your companion's last name, visiting less-active member's houses too often, or listening to non-approved LDS music (I listened to other Christian music which is not allowed). I had a very trunkie companion about half way through my mission and for 6 weeks, we did very little outside of watching movies and sight-seeing. Very apostate. Being a missionary sucks and I still have nightmares about finding myself in the field again in my 30's.
@@alexbarker3775 trunkies, lol, I'll remember that term!
I knew a very zealous single JW sister who had been expelled in 2010. I learned a few years later that she had turned to the "religion" of Mormons. I think that there are people who have no choice but to be in a high-control "religion" to continue living. I think some JWs will still be JWs even after the Watchtower Society collapse.
hahahaha, why are you so mad and angry with fanatics of religions?
all fanatic JWs, Mormons, SDAs, Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, Born Agains and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are LIARS, hateful, worthless, and useless human beings who will just become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever after their inescapable deaths.
What else do you want?
Why bother yourself with LIARS, worthless, and useless human beings?
What for?
There are similar movements within Seventh Day Adventism
Good point. I think with many even if the religious doctrine was proven to be false they would still choose to believe it, it brings believers comfort that the answers to the universe are in a book. They dont like the unknown and the thought of ceasing to exist, religion offer a way out of that (it claims) i almost see it that they are a slave to their religion. Its sad and also pathetic! How anyone is convinced by a Devine jesus, Joseph smith, prophet Mohammed being historical figures is beyond me
@@pointbreak8646 1000% agree.
2 LDS 'brothers' knocked on my door when I was deeply grieving my beloved husband's passing last year. I was so triggered by their 'ressurection' hope I started crying. They wanted to call me the following week. I wanted them gone so I gave them my number but ghosted their call. I always wondered what it would have been like though. Now I get to find out. Thanks Lloyd! This is a great idea.
Elders. Their title as missionary males is Elder. Even though they are like 18. Elder Johnson, etc.
I'm so sorry you went through that. They're programmed to take advantage of moments of weakness. In their minds they're simply offering a bandage to a wound, but really they're taking advantage of your pain to push their religion. You know this is true because they don't just mourn with you, which is what Christ taught us to do. They always want something. I feel sick when I think about how I used to do that as well
Once again I'm so sorry you experienced that. I offer you a hug from the U.S. 🤗
@@jonbaker476 Typical Mormon cult
mormon cult goes after people at there low
@Pamela Ruth ,
My sincere condolences on the loss of your dear husband.
I’m sending you a hug ❤
Near a shady wall a rose once grew, Budded and blossomed in God’s free light, Watered and fed by the morning dew, Shedding it’s sweetness day and night.
As it grew and blossomed fair and tall, Slowly rising to loftier height, It came to a crevice in the wall Through which there shone a beam of light.
Onward it crept with added strength With never a thought of fear or pride, It followed the light through the crevice’s length And unfolded itself on the other side.
The light, the dew, the broadening view Were found the same as they were before, And it lost itself in beauties new, Breathing it’s fragrance more and more.
Shall claim of death cause us to grieve And make our courage faint and fall? Nay! Let us faith and hope receive- The rose still grows beyond the wall,
Scattering fragrance far and wide Just as it did in days of yore, Just as it did on the other side, Just as it will forever-more.
🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🌹❤️🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻🌹🙏🏻
SINCERE CONDOLENCES, FROM
H.R.H PRINCE LOUIS XAIVER DE LUXEMBOURG , OF THE ROYAL & GRAND DUCAL HOUSE OF NASSAU-WEILBURG, PRINCE OF THE GRAND DUCHY OF LUXEMBOURG 🇱🇺 🙏🏻
This was so interesting! I recently started watching the real housewives of Utah and one of the housewives Heather talks a lot about her journey out of the mormon. She was a very devout mormon for most of her life and now coming out of the religion she feels cheated out of her youth basically. In the show she holds a wake for her dad who passed away and most of the rest of her family don't come because they don't wanna associate with her since she openly went 'against' the religion. The shunning, the strict culture, a lot of similarities between mormonism and JW for sure
I admit I have not seen that show, but there are three and maybe four branches of Mormonism some are more radical than the main branch in Salt Lake City but they are separate religions.
I live in SLC Utah. Previously, I live in Park City, Utah. Heather is the daughter of one of my best friends. Housewives is NOTHING like the ladies in Utah. Not any of the “Housewives” represent at all. It is so awful to see them yell am scream at each other. Who does that! Ugh!
@@patricianoel7782 Yeah I get that, the show is crazy, Heather is sort of the only sane one on there
@@robertshaw8537 Based on how she talked about it and how the showed portrayed it, Heather was just part of mainstream mormonism. What are the other branches? I mean there is theologically only one recognized "branch", no? FLDS for example are not considered a part of the mormon church
She and another woman on the show did a long interview with John Dehlin of Mormon Stories. It’s long but pretty interesting
This was so very interesting. I can't wait unti your next study with the Mormons. What a fantastic idea.
“Nemo the Mormon “
“Mormon Stories “
are facts about doctrine, history, finances, missionaries etc. Enjoy!
Consider me hooked! Can't wait for the sequel!
Hi Lloyd, Ex-JW living in Utah here! Everything you’ve described in this video is spot-on. There are plenty of interesting similarities between the LDS and the witnesses. When I first moved to Utah it was kind of triggering at times. My landlady even vented to me about how her daughters were no longer LDS! When I told her I was raised JW she said “I knew you were raised well!” 😒 But I’ve since met so many lovely ex-LDS individuals with whom I have a lot in common! I’ll be looking forward to hearing more about your chats with these young LDS missionaries.
Former cult members, without proper therapy and a really strong personal (not online, but real friends) support group, are always susceptible to the next "fix." It's addictive like anything else to feel you know *the* truth, once you get used to that feeling. Wishing you freedom to think and personal fulfillment Lloyd. Watch Under The Banner of Heaven if you want to learn about the Mormon cult
I watched it and it was so well done. It showed how the Mormon Church is being chipped away from the right by those who want to go back to the days of polygamy and the 19th century Mormonism, and from the left by educated Mormons who are learning the real history of the church from online sources.
One more time Michael, one of the main teachings of the Morman Church is "FREE AGENCY" people can choose to be a member or choose not to be a member, cults don't do that, cults indoctrinate you into guilt for thinking about leaving, I repeat myself, One of the main teachings of the Mormon Church is "free Agency" so stop the Jehovah's Witness judgmentalism, let people choose.
I'm not sure that The Banner of Heaven is the way to learn more about LDS. Read their material on their website and learn for yourself rather than through an entertainment medium. Nothing important is usually gained by learning ONLY through 'anti' material, which is lazy if you're serious about any faith.
@@rutherglenroad8109 found the mormon
@@rutherglenroad8109 I agree that reading "anti" material shouldn't be the only source. I lived in Utah for two years which taught me a lot about LDS people and beliefs. All religions will provide a simplistic and positive view of their histories and beliefs. One example of this for LDS history and beliefs is the practice of polygamy. This practice is one reason the Mormons were so opposed during Joseph Smith's time. Mormons are taught that this practice, which is condoned in the Old Testament, was because there were many single women who needed a husband to care for them. That wasn't true. Joseph Smith had over 30 wives, at least 9 of which were already married to Mormon men who he sent on missions to far off places like England, so their wives were left and Joseph told them that God had commanded him to marry them, but to keep it secret, because it was unlawful to practice polygamy in the U.S. Brigham young had 56 wives. Polygamy was practiced until the U.S. government threatened to destroy the Mormon Church if they didn't give up polygamy. It wasn't until 1890 that the church officially stopped polygamy in order to become a state. This is a part of their history that Mormons today wish to escape. All of this information is available online and is the reason so many Mormons are questioning their beliefs and many leaving. It's a lot like JW history which is not taught to seekers or new members.
I grew up Mormon and it's the reason I love your show. Mormonism and JW are so similar yet different and so we can look at each other to be able to look at ourselves
No matter what they call themselves, the second "m" is always silent.
💯 🎯😁
lol
The Book of Morons 😂
I can make this joke because I'm Mormon
@@jonbaker476 Sincerest condolences.
I also love to play football (soccer) and I used to play it when I was a JW with other JWs. It was so frustrating because they used to take it so seriously, blaming me for any mistakes, putting on me a lot of pressure for a stupid football game, even if I was a teenager and they were 30-40 years old. When I left the cult and I started playing with other people, I realized how much JW are frustrated and obsessed by controlling the others because they're controlled in litterally everything.
Wow, that's interesting. Born 61 years ago as a 3rd generation JW in Germany I loved - of course - to play football too. Made the same experience as you. As you wrote - the 30-40 years old men, some of them elders - didn't know how to play just for fun! They always were abusive, angry and blamed us young ones for all and everything. I was able to leave the destructive cult - together with my wife - 22 years ago and today I'm free and try to enjoy the rest of my life.
@@josefhorndl3469 Do any of you ex JWs have any advice for me? I'm a Catholic who no longer practices. How can I rescue my 5yr old daughter from my JW wife who isn't even baptized yet? She abandoned me and took our daughter. I want to save my daughter from this cult. 😢
@@SUSHI4lyf hard to tell without the legal status... Are you allowed to spend time with your daughter? If so, just try to have the best time she can have, she is very young yet... When she starts asking questions, be ready to answer them and specially, try to build her critical thinking skills so that she develops curiosity she can use to investigate by herself about the organization
@@SUSHI4lyf, I would suggest you start by perusing your parental rights. These rights can vary greatly from locale to locale, so seek out legal advice. At the very least you should be entitled to visitation. As has been suggested, use that time to teach your daughter critical thinking skills, helping her to gleen her own conclusions regarding what she is being taught. I would suggest you apply that to anything she is being taught, not just her religious training. Try to avoid outright condemnation of JW teachings. This will undoubtedly get back to her mother, causing her mother to double-down. Good luck to you!
Exactly religious guilt complex
Very interesting topic. I look forward to hearing more about your experience with this other “cult” religious group. Thank you.
Y'all should go to Mormon Stories on YT and watch Lloyd's interview. Fascinating!
Herd choke on this headline: "From Jehovah's Witness to Mormonism"
Lloyd will be the first jw to be disfellowshipped while disfellowhipped.
I am so happy to see you back. I’ve missed you.
Can't wait for part 2! Love that cliffhanger at the end
Fascinating story, I was so worried you weren’t going to be able to play football that day. You are approaching this endeavor with respect, can’t wait for the next chapter!
Second comment on why most missionaries are from Utah: you have to understand the recruiting strategy for missionaries in contrast to JWs. The basic pressure goes like this: if you don't go on a mission as a young man, you won't get a good wife, as women are taught to marry only returned missionaries. This recruiting strategy is ingrained into Utah culture, but hardly reproducible in minority countries such as Europe or Asia. Consequently, the percentage of Utah Mormons who serve is higher than in other states or countries. Only few converts will serve a mission because they are too old. This is different for JWs where door to door service is not restricted to age groups.
I’m so invested in this. Can’t wait for the next one. I’m on my second watch through of Leah Reminis Scientology series. All these cults are so different from one another but so similar in mindset.
I usually talk to the Mormons when they approach me 😂 50-50 chance one in the pair is from Utah, even here in Canada.
Nobody tells me what to eat or drink. NOBODY! How dare anyone dictate to another person what they put into their mouths!
well said
@@exeterbeekeeper
Thanks. Bee good to your Bees! 🤣
You may all ready know about this but you should read the infamous CES letter by Jeremy Runalds. I am an ex-jdub but it is fascinating how similar the histories of LDS and WT are.
You might be interested in watching the Mormon Stories podcast where Mormons and ex-Mormons tell their stories, including finding the CES letter.
@@harlanlang6556 I have listened to Mormon Stories before but it is soooo long. There are a few other podcasts I follow like How To Heritic (now ended) and Thank God I'm Atheist both shows hosted by ex Mormons. Also Bryce Blankenagel has an excellent odcast called Naked Morminsm that goes through the history of LDS starting with Joseph Smith's origins.
@@revan9173 Science tells us that the universe is a little over 14 billion years old. Have you ever thought about how the universe came into being at the Big Bang? Science doesn't , and can't, tell us how this happened, and religion doesn't really explain how it happened.
@@harlanlang6556 I often listen to the Mormon Podcast Stories, and as an exJW I am nearly always captivated by their journeys out of Mormonism.
" I testify to the testimony of the one who claims authority" Amen!
That Sir is a good idea
That would be Jesus and His Apostles: not the counterfeits of today!
@@davidjanbaz7728 You mean as described by the authors of the gospels decades and centuries later.
Regarding the missionaries taking the lead, it's normally the longest serving missionary that will take the lead in the hope it will mentor the other sister. They rotate and change companions every 4-6 months. Hopefully this will clarify why Betty may haven't spoken as much and Harriett took the lead. And also their testimony is something they have to have before going to MTC (missonary training center). And yes, Utah is the place you find the factory of Mormon missionaries. Plus missionaries never give up on potential converts. However, the positive thing is that they read the scriptures in the study and not use a random manual
Often they even rotate every 6 weeks, depending on the mission
@@jonbaker476 perhaps it varies country to country and individual wards/stakes
Another thumbs up vote for a fascinating video,Lloyd. Looking forward to the sequel. And I’m sure you did enjoy that football game in spite of the aches and pains the next day. Still felt good though, yes ?
Mormons are usually pretty educated. They encourage higher education. I know many doctors, nurses, lawyers, etc that are Mormon. I can’t say the same about JWs.
And the cognitive dissonance is especially pronounced in those people. I certainly wouldn't be going to a doctor who would believe that humans and dinosaurs lived at the same time.
Mormons are very well educated I live near Kansas City University in Joplin Missouri and a large number of Mormons make up the Medical school enrollment and starting January 1 2023 the Dental school opens up. I went to law school and there are many lawyers as well, but everyone needs their car fixed so don't underestimate the work mechanics do, plumbers, and electricians.
@@GaliSinatra Interestingly, that would be a minority view for Mormons. Most are perfectly fine seeing the creation story as allegorical and the we can and should use science to understand how god created everything. When I was Mormon, the young earth creationist types were considered a bit odd.
@@unnefer001 I've heard quite a few ex-mo's from Utah particularly saying quite the opposite. They are all young too, 20's and 30's. I'm not saying all of them, but there are plenty who don't believe dinosaurs are real because the church has no explanation for them.
That's because JWs see higher education as a waste of time. They are waiting for A-day. JWs also do not have large families. It is common in a Kingdom Hall to see couples without children.
I caught myself one day, as I was getting dressed for a meeting at the hall, asking myself: will this blouse be okay with the elders? And I realized, I was dressing for THEM, not for Jehovah, who was perfectly fine with Adam & Eve being NAKED! You are spot on, they draw attention to themselves with their frumpy clothes and if you walk into the hall looking modest but STYLISH, WOE unto you! The other women get their knickers in a twist… especially if you aren’t married 🤦🏻♀️
Lol as a former Mormon who served as a female missionary from 2011 to 2013, I just have to throw in my thoughts on the missionaries’ frumpy attire just to give some additional context to anyone curious on the subject.
Sister missionaries (as female Mormon missionaries are called) are given guidelines on how they must dress during their missions (the male missionaries, often referred to as “the elders”, have guidelines too, of course. They usually wear the trademark suit and tie or white shirt and tie).
In the past, the sisters were only allowed to wear neutral colors, long skirts, nothing tight, etc. So they were essentially ordered by the church to be frumpy and unappealing. Thus, the stereotypical image of the sister missionary was an amorphous blob of beige.
Luckily for me, about six months before I left on my mission, they changed the guidelines to allow sisters to dress more or less the way a typical Mormon woman would dress at church. They encouraged bright colors and even gave a lecture in the missionary training center about wearing makeup and making yourself look pretty and flat out said we needed to attract people with our appearance (pretty sexist, but is that a surprise?). So after that you could wear knee length skirts and a cute clothes (within Mormon modesty standards, of course, so it’s still harder to avoid a little bit of frump).
Then a few years after that, they changed the guidelines again to allow sisters to wear slacks. So there’s not really a reason that a sister missionary wouldn’t be able to wear nice pant suits and look very professional.
HOWEVER, I will say that even with the improved general guidelines, some missions have their own guidelines set forth by the mission president. I don’t know if all missions are allowing the sisters to wear slacks. I could easily imagine an old sexist mission president thinking that their sister missionaries “just look better in skirts” (actual quote from someone I know) and disallowing the slacks.
Also, sometimes your sense of fashion can get a little skewed as a missionary. I served as a Temple Square missionary in Salt Lake City, Utah and I remember the trend of wearing floor length skirts with grandma’s couch patterns being very popular for a while. (Temple Square is a major historical site for the church. So my mission was a bit different. It was a couple hundred sister missionaries working as tour guides and teaching over the phone in call centers. We still gave lessons, bore testimony, and tried to commit people to baptism -yes, as part of the tours!!!- but in less usual ways. It’s easier for trends to go around a mission in such an environment).
Another thing to consider is that since the sisters are paying for their own missions, and may not have had the budget for nicer clothes left over. They may be wearing ill fitting hand me downs left in the apartment by previous missionaries. There were sisters on my mission that would skip meals and use their food money to buy clothes (this was vanity shopping, but the point was they didn’t have extra money for clothes)
I don’t know these individual sisters’ reasons for the way they are dressing, but hopefully this gives a little more info surrounding the way Mormon missionaries look.
Sorry for the long ramble! Hope someone finds it interesting! 😋
Edit to add: I'm from Washington, not Utah. And sisters in my mission were from all parts of the world. But we did have a few from Utah too, lol
Presumably, the sister missionaries would also have been wearing their garments, so their frumpy clothes would have had to cover them.
Where did you serve
This is great. Exmo here, only family member out. I can’t wait for next episode of Lloyd meets the Mormons. Lol
This reminds me so much of when I was just leaving Mormonism. I had asked to meet with the missionaries as a kind of last ditch effort to see if I could rekindle my faith in any way. I expressed my concerns about how I’m supposed to rely on the Holy Ghost to find truth if it’s not really clear what the Homy Ghost is supposed to feel like. They explained to me that we can’t manufacture feelings of peace, and that peace comes from the Holy Ghost. This actually helped a lot as I kept reading the Book of Mormon and felt absolutely no peace reading the blatant racism in the passages. I was also really off-put when I expressed my concerns about LGBTQ+ issues in the church, and one missionary proceeded to talk about their transgender sibling while refusing to refer to said sibling by their preferred name and pronouns. I decided that, if the Holy Ghost really does represent peace, then I don’t feel at peace in the Mormon church.
The football is a way to attract people for their evangelism and they will never leave you alone. Thank you for your amazing video keep them coming
Well maybe, but they like to have fun too, perhaps a Bar-B-Q would work for you
LDS members testimonies are really near and dear to their hearts because it’s their personal experience of God in their life. They share their testimonies because it will be relatable to some people
and they are taught that if they don't have a testimony, the can gain one by repeating one enough times. Self-indoctrination at its best.
As a member of the church who served a mission, I can testify that what you said is only true about 25% of the time. It's almost always a sort of conditioning we undergo. It's all about conversion, never about succor
Sales, sales, sales, get them baptized quick, and milk before meat.
Hey, if any ex-Mormons read this comment, can you share whether or not you were presented with questions in your ministry that rattled your belief, even just a little? What were they? I'm super curious
Leica I was a Jehovah's Witness and I gave public Talks and gave a public talk one time years ago at the Columbus Kansas Circuit Assembly, I was a vacation pioneer three times. I worked the City of Jasper Missouri all by myself and had four bible studies, I placed 54 watchtowers and Awakes in one day, but after all the dirt Jehovah's Witnesses pulled on me they can kiss my sweet A, I am a happy latter day saint and have been for many years and I find peace with that
Short answer: no, not really. Mormons in general have a sort of psychological cattle-guard (like on the front of steam trains) built into their minds that allows them to immediately disregard anything that would rattle their faith. The mission field also makes Mormons soooooo much more stubborn since literally all they do is surround themselves with other missionaries and only do things like read the Book of Mormon and share their testimonies with people. You can only ever creep doubt into them if they're new missionaries since the heavy brainwashing and tribalism hasn't set in quite yet, and it only sometimes works. However, there were definitely things that rattled my faith but not on my mission. Part of that was because my mission experience was so bad and traumatizing (I served in Argentina) that my mind doubled-down on the Mormon doctrine to make myself feel like my suffering and blatant abuse was for a grand purpose, rather than the reality that it was pretty much for no reason at all. I still suffer from severe PTSD from my experience down there
I had a fellow mission friend who used to be a JW though. His name was Anderson Romero, and he was one of the kindest and well-versed missionaries I'd met down there. He really helped me feel loved and appreciated. I also had some interesting interactions with JW's in general
However, I can give you two topics that MIGHT rattle their faith.
1. Joseph Smith using a rock in a hat to translate the BOM, which was the same documented method he used to con people out of money in his youth
2. JS originally preached a trinitarian view of God, which can be found in the Lectures On Faith. Mormons believe in a particular view of the Godhead and so this revelation sometimes rattles them since they believe their view of God and Jesus being separate physical people was one of JS's original doctrines, but it wasn't. It was a later idea.
But please don't go arguing with them or trying to tear them down. It only serves to build their faith up in their minds while tearing yourself down with unnecessary contention. Only do it in the form of self defense if Mormons are being legit crazy. That's my advice
@@jonbaker476 I bring up Joseph Smith and the tablets inside of a hat whenever I can 😂 I'm legit fascinated listening to someone try to explain it as not-at-all-suspicious! I don't argue with them at all, I'm super friendly. I hated going door to door as a JW and coming across someone who spoke to me like I was stupid. That's not my jam at all
@@jonbaker476 as you know, LDS people are told not to argue or debate, they simply present their beliefs and it's totally up to the listener to discern what they decide.
What are the chances that they google Lloyd Evans?🤔😂
Very low, the missionaries are constantly monitored by a Ward Mission Leader, the local ward Bishop, and a Mission President.
The privates may not google a standard prospect.
But some manager level wonk? Bishop. Ward Poobah.
Once there's an anomaly. Questions. Sticking your head up.
...which Lloyd's inquiry, though mild and polite, is.
Lloyd, I have a good friend who is LDS and I too had long conversations with him about his religion and my previous religion. The question I found that will stop them in their tracks is when they tell you that their leader is a “prophet.” I asked, “prophet like the prophets in the bible like Moses and Daniel?” He would confirm that the prophets were exactly the same. I told him that I would indeed join the LDS church if he could present me with even one instance where their current “prophet” parted the red sea or correctly prophesied something in great detail. Show me something that could have only happened with divine guidance. He did try to make excuses as to why this doesn’t happen today but then I would say, how then do you know he is a prophet like Moses or Daniel? This was the last religious conversation we had. It would be interesting how these ladies handle this type of questioning.
Considering historians agree Moses didn't exist, and Daniel's predictions were written after the events in the so called prophecy.....
Yeeees! This quickly stops them. Great point! I'm Mormon so I know. The truth is that their prophets have no revelation or miracles. Nothing at all
@@saffronhammer7714 LOL 😆 Dr.David Faik Egyptologist videos!
@@davidjanbaz7728 Combating Mind Control by Steven Hassan!
Also, this is the hierarchy of Mormon missions, of which all but the very top guy is a young man in his twenties. Each had authority over the ones below them.
1. The Mission President.
2. The Assistants to the President (two male companions who work directly for him). They are like the MP's minions and have the most authority in the mission out of any missionary.
3. Zone Leaders. This is what I was in my mission. They're in charge of various District Leaders and various proselyting zones. They call the District Leaders and gather numbers and statistics for the AP's. They're also male. They're like managers of a store.
4. District Leaders. They're in charge of average missionaries, and they gather data from the various companionships under their supervision. They're like supervisors at a store. They're also male.
5. The Senior Companion. Now we're at the lowest level of missionary. These are just average missionaries who have no authority for the most part. Their sole duty is to preach and teach. This companion decides who to teach and where to go. Can be male or female.
6. The Junior Companion. The lowest possible missionary. This is the Padawan of companionships. They have no authority whatsoever and simply preach and teach and obey. They're typically the youngest. Can be male or female
The female missionaries also have their own hierarchy but it only goes up so high. They really don't have any significant authority. Any authority they have is over female missionaries, whereas the men are in charge of both male and female.
Nice breakdown: I had a meeting with two and I had help from a person who worked in the Tanner's bookstore in Anaheim CA : the 2 missionaries brought their District manager: I think they thought they needed help too.
But it was fun : I think the District manager drove them because he really didn't say too much during the discussion.
I as a Biola graduate and she as an ex-Mormon didn't have much trouble the missionaries.
But I know so more today than in the 80's about Mormonism.
Another comment I need to make quickly. Unless something has drastically changed since I was a LDS missionary. While yes, the individual missionaries pays for their mission this is only up to a point. If they can pay for the entirety the church is very happy, but there is a general missionary fund that pays for missionaries that can't pay for their own mission. The missionary is still required to pay what they can, but the shortfall is made up from the GMF with the family and the home congregation of the missionary encouraged to contribute generously to the GMF to compensate. Also no missionary is expected to pay the travel costs of going to or coming home from their mission, or for travel costs within the mission.
Love it. Can't wait for the rest.
I have the LDS female missionary's visit once a week to my house for the last 2 years. The young ladies change at least one person of the two every six to 8 weeks so I've had a chance to meet quite a few female and male ( on the doorstep with the young men because I'm a single female and coming in the house isn't appropriate for them)
We have many interesting conversations mostly about the KJV bible, hebrew, greek but also our experiences of being raised in a strict high control religion.
They also practice and demonstrate their testimony and LDS teachings. They all know I will never convert but that with me they are able to speak openly and confidentially with me without fear of judgement.
Most LDS missionarys are all born in. I've not met one that hasn't been.
You should know by now that all fanatic JWs, Mormons, SDAs, Muslims, Buddhists, Born Agains, Catholics, etc. are LIARS, deceivers, cruel, hateful, worthless, and useless human beings who will just become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever after their inescapable deaths.
@@jaflenbond7854 if that's your belief then you a entitled to believe as you wish. Good luck and warm hugs be to you. Be at peace with your own beliefs because I am. X
@@anniesavedbygrace hahahaha, why are you so mad and angry with fanatics of religions?
all fanatic JWs, Mormons, SDAs, Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, Born Agains and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are LIARS, hateful, worthless, and useless human beings who will just become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever after their inescapable deaths.
What else do you want?
Why bother yourself with LIARS, worthless, and useless human beings?
What for?
@@jaflenbond7854 mad and angry??? I'm not either I carry no ill will to anyone and show love to all I meet.
I really don't know why you have taken the position that you have towards me.
In answer to your question I'll ask what have I done to you to upset you?
@@anniesavedbygrace I'm not upset, I simply wonder why atheists, agnostics, and fanatics of all religions are criticizing and arguing with each other when they all know that they are NOT worshippers of the Creator and NOT believers too of the authority and teachings of the Christ.
All fanatics of all religions are fools and LIARS, foolish worshippers of the Devil, and foolish preachers and spreaders of the LIES and foolishness of their LIARS and anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders.
Do you agree with me that all fanatics of all religions and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are liars, hateful, worthless and useless human beings who will just die and become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever?
That was very interesting. Loved it. 🥰 Looking forward to the next part. Thanks for such diverse and thought-provoking content! Hugs from Canada 🇨🇦😊
Interesting diversion from your usual material Lloyd, and really interesting. Keen for the next one to come out now! Any ideas when?
In my experience, if you don't agree to be baptized, they won't continue to study with you for long. As I understand it, a resistance to being baptized is an indication that you aren't being 'guided by the holy spirit.'
Really interesting that you have been able to have some good interactions with some in the LDS church. I will look forward to more you have to say on this, including the verses you used to counter their teachings.
Hi Lloyd. I am an exjw who converted to LDS Christianity after disassociating from WTS. I want to say first of all that your channel was informative and influential in helping me make the desicion to leave JWs. However, you must understand that atheism does not work for all exjws. I dissassociated from JWs but not from God. That does not mean that I am uninformed about the atheist viewpoint. I have read The God Delusion and God is Not Great. I still want God in my life. I left JWs in November 2021 and converted to LDS Christianity in April of 2022. I am comfortable with the Book of Mormon. Compared to JWs, the LDS congregation is a space of freedom. Mormons respect agency, JWs do not. This is just my opinion.
Hi Emmanuel! There's a big difference between feeling "comfortable" with a book and asserting it to be of divine origin. The Book of Mormon in particular is a blatant forgery and I struggle to understand how anyone can be convinced otherwise unless they've been indoctrinated into the church from childhood. But of course I have nothing against anyone believing in God. I don't even mind you believing in Joseph Smith's golden plates if that's your thing. Just don't expect me to take it seriously or hold the LDS church exempt from criticism and scrutiny.
17:30 summarizes beautifully my exact same view about religion.
I was born Catholic and used to be devout, obviously being raised one.
But as I grew older and wiser (yeah, right, lol), I learned to think for myself.
I thank religion for introducing me to God. But I've long since learned that if God gifted us with brains to think, it would be a total disservice and disrespect to Him if we don't use it. Blindly following religion, which is man's construct, is plainly stupid for me.
Very interesting topic. I'm especially fascinated with the similarities between cults and even mainstream religions. Looking forward to future installments to see how they act with you and if their love bombing will continue if you don't agree to go to their services or progress in your study.
Europe: we play with a ball with our foot thus call it football.
America: we play with a ball with our hands thus call it football.
This is super interesting, I want more
Love it, great content!
Looking forward to seeing future videos! Whenever I talk to members of the Latter Day Saints, I always ask what it was that convinced them their religion was the true religion, whether or not they've doubted and how they overcame their doubts. It's always an uncomfortable question until I explain I was a former JW who left because of my doubts and that's why I'm curious what convinced them. They're usually happy to hear I have a religious background and seem pleased to explain why theirs in the true religion and readily accept that I couldn't believe the JW religion. Always fascinating conversations! I love the moments where a question makes them think, even if it doesn't introduce any doubt in that moment, I sometimes wonder if they'll think about the conversation later, quite like I did when I was a JW being presented with a good question.
Hello, Leica I have followed your comments for a long time, and you have a lot of spirits and a lot of fight. Feel free to contact me if you have any questions,
@@robertshaw8537 thank you ☺️
@@robertshaw8537 Are you LDS, Robert? Presuming so, how much time passed between you having left the JWs and joining LDS? Do you watch videos from ex-LDS members the same as exJW?
@@leicafox4403 Yes I am LDS and I am not here to convert anyone, I am here because Lloyd talked about his experiences with the LDS missionaries, and I have followed Lloyd for about the past four years and I am expressing my views on their similarities
@@robertshaw8537 oh I know and I didn't think that, you said I could ask any questions and that was the one that I was curious about
I personally don’t have a copy of the book of Mormon to verify this, but Google brought me these verses that illustrate the curse upon the Nephites: 2 Nephi 5:21-23; Alma 3:6-10
Correction Lloyd: The Quakers used to use the 'thees' and 'thous" until somewhat recently.
Interesting annedoct, I woke up from the JWs (a good 14 years after I was out already) because of the LDS. Albeit never saw them preaching, the were present in Dubai and held worship in a villa next to my friend's villa. One day while visiting her I noticed all the 4x4 parked and asked what was going on she said oh it's the Mormons next door doing their church stuff...that made me think if there's Mormons there must be covert JWs too. So I run a search online for JWs meetings in Dubai as I wanted my parents to visit up and stay a while but I knew they'd want to go to meetings. Instead of the info I was looking for, I came across the ex-jw forum with a newly woken up Lloyd being present in many threads and well...the rest is history. So, I guess thanks LDS? 😜
Super interesting, Lloyd!! I agree about the feelings. Our strongest emotion is fear, it's so dominant in our lifestyle nowadays. And we want nothing more than security to escape from the fear. So if someone's able to wave with some loving group and a bunch of rules which seem to enforce some security and borders, people will fall for it. That's the trap with emotions...
I find this sort of experience rather healing, puts so much into perspective .
Saffron thanks, you know at one time 99% of the people on the earth thought the world was flat and if you thought otherwise you could be burned at the stake. The moral of this comment is people get things wrong sometimes, and I think ex-Jehovah's Witnesses in a high-control cult tend to see things very critical, and the people that don't like the Mormon Church want to mislabel it as a cult, May I most respectfully point out one of the main teaching of the Church is Free Agency, people have a right to choose, AND NO CULT OFFERS THAT, ....NONE
@@robertshaw8537 you might want to do more research before reaching such conclusions. Sure, the LDS faith teaches free agency, as do most all cults, and high demand religions, but of course the picture is larger than one stated belief, and there are some good sources for criteria to assess the level of control, undue influence, an organization has. You may want to check out the BITE model or read Combating Mind Control by Steven Hassan, PhD.
As you said, people get things wrong, and to continue to learn, we do well to use critical thinking and use sources outside our particular In Group.
It sounds as if you have a religion that sits you, and feel strongly about it. I am not here to dissuade you from your faith; rather I was sharing my journey.
I wish you all the best
@@saffronhammer7714 Well Sir I am not even a member of the Priesthood, why because I am not interested in being a member, and this belief that I am under pressure to be a member of the priesthood is complete bull
@@saffronhammer7714 The main reason I don't pay attention to you is your are demanding just like JW elders
@@robertshaw8537 hahaha! And yet you are replying, Carry on!
R u in Split?
I worked for someone who was Mormon. Very nice guy, but had a lot of similarities to me as a former JW. That’s a big reason we got along so well. I hope they get out of the cult.
Hey there Lloyd, now that your taking the plunge, try staring into your top hat and see what visions your granted.
Well done as always Lloyd. I’m former LDS. I don’t know how far you’ll get with these missionaries since they are so far inside their bubble. At the least some seeds will be planted that help them think. Did they try flirt to convert at all?
😄 Flirt to convert?! For real??? Is this a thing? If I flirt with a Mormon, will they flirt back? I honestly haven't tried but I'm tempted to now!
@@leicafox4403 It’s no secret that sister missionaries are the most effective in getting single men into the church. Some really good looking sisters could convert dozens of single men. Whether they were really converting for the gospel’s sake is another story. Likewise many male missionaries are frequently adept at flirting with young women to get them interested in lessons. This scenario plays out significantly where the people have a good perception of Americans, such as Latin America or the Philippines. I’m positive that it is less so in other areas of the world like Europe where Americans aren’t admired as much. These missionaries are still young people and many won’t bat an eye at light flirting as a way to get conversations going to see if someone wants to take lessons or is interested. My experience was in Latin America 24 years ago. Some missionaries can be “naughty” too. Some can get sent home.
I'll be interested to see if they challenge you to get baptized next time you meet them. It's standard procedure for Mormon missionaries to push for baptism early.
US LDS Missionaries can buy a package of clothing deemed suitable for the work at stores such as Elder Misionery Clothing. I recently heard that the ladies may now wear trousers. Perhaps they can buy a package too.
As a JW I invited the Mormons into my house for a face off, we asked them if they wanted tea or coffee, they said they are not allowed b/c of the caffeine and asked for a coke! We kind of sniggered.
Also my JW sister was sizing up a work mate to convert her as she seemed 'receptive' (remember that loaded word!?), it turned out she was a Mormon who was at the same time sizing my sister up for conversion because she seemed 'the right sort of person'. Weird.
I do like hearing their Choir on Spotify and UA-cam.. That's all I can say.. (Phil)
🙉 😑
I personally think it’s great that Lloyd is looking and educating himself on other religions to hopefully find the right one. Back when I was a JW ,it was frowned upon to look up any information besides JW publications to research on other religions. Me personally after being A JW after 25 years, I found Islam and I’m very happy. I had so many misconceptions about it until I did research. It’s the same God who sent the Torah,the Gospel, Scriptures and the Quran. I encourage everybody to research Islam.
I don't think Lloyd is seeking to convert to Mormonism. As an ex-mormon, I'd recommend against it, especially for someone who isn't American, as Mormonism is especially U.S. focused.
no its not the same God.
@@Ancient_Rylanor Why do you say that?
I think they reassign their missionaries several times over the two years. And they switch partners as well a few times, so no one gets “too close”. And yes they have to soy for all expenses: flight, rent, etc. Families usually pay for them. Meanwhile the LDS church has hundreds of billions $$$$ they never touch which continues to grow.
I'm curious to learn more about your experiences learning about Mormon theology, rituals, culture and history with these female LDS missionaries whom you are currently studying with, Lloyd.
hahahaha, all fanatic JWs, Born Agains, Catholics, Mormons, etc. and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are all LIARS, cruel, and hateful human beings who will just die and become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever.
So, I wonder why you still want to learn more about the LIES and foolishness of the Mormons.
What for?
Lloyd is becoming a Mormon!!! What?? Lol 🤣🤣🤣🤣. Bro is cult hopping. 🤣🤣🤣
Obviously I'm joking. I know he's just studying but that's funny man. Studying with Mormons. Lol.
If your problem is their doctrine, that doesn't qualify as a "mind control cult". They aren't a mind control cult.
When you study with them, they say "Don't take our word for it, pray to God and He will tell you"
This is going to be very interesting.
Poor LDS the Lloyd witness is approaching! Lmao! BEST OF LUCK!
Interesting that she was supposed to go to Ukraine. My ex husband is a Mormon and they told me that the country assigned was based on prayer. And they would get a “response” and send the missionary based on what God has told them.
So Ukraine… interesting..
Lloyd, did you forget to look at the trees?! Also, we need a former JW “Holiday” to honor the escape from the org. I submit 09/14. It’s not 1914 but it’s on the way. It will be awakening day. If that’s no good how about Rutherford’s birthday?! Huh, a deep track! That day is November 8th.
You will notice that they never give you the book called doctrine and covenant to make the decision to jump into mormonism or to pray about. Which the doctrine would be a petty key consideration in my opinion.
My friends son recently joined the Mormon church and within a year he was married to a member of the church she asked my opinion of it as I am so interested in cults like jw s and Scientology and watch your channel I looked it up and was shocked to find out about it so told her to look it up as I thought it was a cult and she agreed but says it mAkes him happy as he was going through some things he is still married but I can some cracks starting I don’t feel qualified enough to give her advice so this was very interesting
For some people the church is very beneficial, like for my grandparents. I grew up Mormon and often found that it helped a lot of converts to have better lives, but people who were raised in it had a crap-ton of psychological issues when they became adults. I think it's because converts of the church don't take it too seriously but just seriously enough, whereas forever-mormons take it waaaaay too seriously since it's all they've ever known
@@jonbaker476 that’s good to know hopefully things will work out I don’t know any mormons where I live in Scotland didn’t even know we had a church I could tell u where the Kingdom Hall is but not the Mormon church so any information about it is appreciated
Very interesting, your compare & contrast to JW and cult behavior. You must have made their day- a convert! They are not allowed out of site of each other- to prevent doubting. Please be careful Lloyd, this could be triggering.
This might trigger Lloyd to start speaking in tongues!
Btw Lloyd, a recent photograph of Joseph Smith has been discovered and released recently, and was found in the possession of his descendant. It's super interesting and you should check it out! It's the one of him in a locket
awe they let you score a coupe goals! how nice I bet that made you want to come back for more!
I’ve heard a lot of Mormons say they went through periods of doubt when they were younger (it sorta reminds me how mediums and psychics often say they used to be sceptics). I wonder if it’s something they’re supposed to talk about to try and relate to people
Oooo! Love that you're expanding the horizon of the channel as you expand your own!
Eager to see more. Thanks, Lloyd & Tibor! 💖
Life long, but now lapsed Mormon here. I was a Mormon Missionary 30 years ago and after my mission quickly rose through the ranks of local leadership to become the bishop (pastor) over my local congregation. This is a 'voluntary' position and is not remunerated and was fun until it wasn't 😁. One thing I will say about the missionaries of the LDS church. They are very young. They are usually very naïve with very limited life experience. If they are from Utah, they have grown up in the Mormon bubble behind the Zion curtain and things others take as normal can shock them like someone drinking coffee in public (!) or a visible tattoo. Non-Utah missionaries are quite often converts and quite zealous. They usually are more grounded in reality. The whole point of Moroni 10:3-5 is to invoke a 'spiritual experience' through elevation emotion meant to convict you in your heart and mind that Mormonism is true and you'll want to join. It's a technique where you convert yourself, later reinforced in congregational worship through groupthink and by othering outsiders so you get cocooned in a blanket of 'knowing' the Truth. It's a comforting form of self-deception. Sound familiar? Unfortunately for LDS leadership the realities of LDS history are causing the once impenetrable wall of obscuration meant to insulate the membership from the historical nasties to crumble under the onslaught of verifiable Internet borne information. You will find both JW and LDS leadership demonizing the Internet and insisting members study only approved materials to be common in both camps. So carry on, I'm enjoying your experience and looking forward to further installments.
I watch Exmo Lex and her hubby who have left. It's a wonderful channel, such a lovely couple telling stories of their terribly oppressed lives while in. Give it a watch 🤗
i had also had a run in with mormons in the past a few times. and i wanted to mention one thing stuck out to me when they had a visit with me, they explained that they believe that around 600 bc nebachadnezzars time, that some biblical people from that era came to the americas. they do believe that certain biblical tribes way back then had settled in america. i had pondered that but it never really sat right with me. i always thought and my question would be if bible figures settled in america that long ago , would there not be some sort of archaeological proof, one would think there would be biblical structures, palaces or pyramid buildings etc. we havnt heard of any. and they do claim the israelites intermarried with the native americans. anyones thoughts on this?
The Book of Mormon tells this story of Jews settling in America around 600 BC. The problem for Mormons in modern times is the ability to study DNA to show where your ancestors came from. Native American DNA definitely comes from east Asia, Siberia, not from the Middle East. The Book of Mormon also mentions horses, sheep, and cattle that were brought by the Jews. There's no fossil evidence of these animals being in America until the Spanish came.
@@harlanlang6556 yes I thought I heard them mention that too on horses and cattle. Your right there is no archeological eveidence. So they refuse to do dna testing? I wonder why that is? I know too as you were saying the natives have asien blood
Just one question, Lloyd.
Why not just name Harriet Wilma instead?
Why not name her Sister Waddington? 😛 Or perhaps Frumperella?
@@leicafox4403 Oh, that's coldblooded! I like it
I’m currently reading Michael Thomas’ book Mormonism: A Gold-Plated Religion.
He’s a former Mormon. It’s a must read.
Ps. I can’t help but quote Christopher Hitchens’ comment on the LDS- “the story of a successful con-job!”
Yes!! But.. still very interesting is it not?
@@traceysankar-charleau4003 the religion is completely bonkers; as the book reveals.
So we have an ex-JW, who’s now an atheist, studying with the Mormons. This should be fun. Time to grab some popcorn 🍿.
And some alcohol!
since this is a seven part series, i do not want to jump ahead with information that mr. evans will likely cover. i studied with the mormons twice .... nearly was baptized both times. yes, the lds missionaries pay for their missions themselves. they might receive a car to use upon reaching their destination. this is true of all missionaries in ontario, canada. their dress is uncomfortably modest, even when met at church services, to denote humility, more so than male missionaries. typical lds members outside of those on missions dress more stylish and comfortably. does not surprise me that in croatia lds might offer a sporting event. unlike jehovah's witnesses, lds children are not adverse to basketball, soccer, football, etc. (ie brigham young university.) here in ontario, canada, in the summer it is not uncommon for the local lds church to offer to the public a 'fun day'. usually the kind of thing you would find at a company picnic. lds members love to make a large table. how many mormons does it take to change a lightbulb? the answer is 10. one to hold the ladder, one to change the bulb, and 8 to bring the food. very european they are in this manner, that they might be offended if on leaving, you don't take something from the table with you. there are 3 books dear to lds. apart from the bible. the book of mormon, doctrines and covenants, and the pearl of great price. all 3 can be downloaded online. and all 3 are important to understand the lds theology and way of life. the verses read in moroni are key to understanding one's conversion or acceptance to church theology. everyone who is studying with lds will be asked to pray about these verses. the feelings or emotions stirred in those who do so, and receive a 'confirmation' by holy spirit, is not unlike many evangelicals upon being 'born again.' in every church service i have attended, someone will be asked to give testimony 'i know that this church is true' ... and the verses in moroni have much to do with this. further research will reveal that there are new understandings as to 2 nephi 5:21, where the lamanites received the curse, not the nephites. ref. online 'what does the book of mormon mean by 'skin of blackness'. joseph smith was directed to the 'golden plates' by the angel moroni. he didn't stumble on them by chance. he was able to translate them using a 'seer stone' ref online ... 'what does the bible say about seer stones.' one might find that lds history is 'sketchy', but these believers are not of any less intelligence than anyone else, something that i have learned in my journey, that persons of equal intelligence can believe different things. the book of mormon was written early in the 19th century, where the language of the day was very king james indeed. comparing modern cowboys movies with the language of early 19th century is disingenuous, in that such movies are geared to modern audiences. also remember that the book of mormon is a religious work, and thus reflects the mannerisms of such individuals. ie ... any church service early 19th century. let's not scoff at these people. they honestly believe this history, and their intelligence is not less than anyone elses. as to utah, this is not where the journey for mormonism began. 'After the faithful left Nauvoo in 1846, they migrated to Utah, where they constructed Salt Lake City on a pattern laid down by Joseph Smith for the cities of Zion.' also see joseph smith born in vermont, died at age 38 in illinois. book of mormon first published in palmyra, new york. 1830
You commented on the missionaries frumpy attire. As a German, I have made the opposite observation. Usually, I would see male Mormon missionaries dressed in modern smart business, while JWs always dress old fashioned. I even had had the thought "Jehova must love beige", because JWs knocking on doors or standing around with bookstands would wear attire which was en vouge 30-60 years ago. Similarly, these print flyers also have this subdued color scheme which you can recognize as JW even without reading a single word. So at least in my country, it's the JWs being frumpy, and the Mormonsbeing smart business.
Did you get to the part yet with the elders where Joseph Smith translates the golden plates? He used a seer stone and buried his face in a top hat. The text was then revealed and he dictated to his scribe what the Book of Mormon plates say.
I need more this is so fresh and interesting 🤓
I moved to Utah for a job at 22, knowing not a soul in Utah, and it was an interesting experience. Mormons are good people who are taught that nobody else is as happy as Mormons who have such a healthy environment for raising children in this dangerous world. It's a jarring experience for them when they leave Utah, meet good people who are not Mormon, meet happy families who somehow have managed this without the LDS Church. The whole Mormon story of Joseph Smith never appeared anywhere near reality to me, but he certainly was an interesting character who was able to convince people that his story was true. A certain percentage of people are vulnerable, or go through vulnerable stages in life, making them willing victims of con artists.
I agree that having that warm rush of emotions in the breast isn't necessarily a sign from God that something is true. People of every religion experience this. But we do the same thing when choosing a mate. Hollywood has taught us to go with our hearts. It's a real dilemma.
Mormon boys are less likely now to want to go on a mission and the girls are filling in for them. That's what I've learned from watching Mormon Stories podcast. This podcast is for Mormons what your podcast is for JWs. There seems to be no end to interesting and intelligent Mormons and exMormons who are willing to be interviewed concerning their Mormon lives, how their questioning came about, and especially their missionary work where many of them first encountered people like you who planted questions in their minds.
Here's a funny football story I learned from Mormon Stories. Missionaries are competitive with each other concerning how many baptisms they conduct during their mission, so some of them in a South American country observed that the young boys they were meeting all loved football. The missionaries organized football games and then offered a place for the boys to cool off. The baptismal was big enough for the boys to cool off in the water, and while they were there the missionaries baptized them as official members of the church. This really looked good for their statistical records and they were heroes back home, but the church authorities finally found out what they were doing and had to clean up the mess. What a challenge to try to find out which of the new converts actually knew that they were converts.
Lloyd, one would assume that “Betty” and “Harriet” were young ladies, aren’t the missionaries nominally quite young when on mission?
Look into the Basement baptisms.
Also called Soccer baptisms in Europe.
Also, Salt Lake City will know exactly who you are
I'm sure there is someone in your headquarters watching the anti-Mormon material on UA-cam.
When I was waking up I was working a fairly new job in Tampa and was going through the beginnings of shunning starting. One ofy bosses knew I was dealing with something and took me out to lunch. I unloaded about being in a "cult" and all the shunning, etc. He started asking if I was done with faith and I pretty much shit all over religion in general. Come to find out, the guy was a Mormon elder...he didn't treat me very well after that lunch😂
All atheists, agnostics, and fanatics of all religions are NOT worshippers of the Creator and NOT believers too of the authority and teachings of the Christ.
All fanatic JWs, Mormons, SDAs, Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, Born Agains and their anti-Christs Pastors and Leaders are LIARS, hateful, worthless, and useless human beings who will just become worthless and useless dusts on earth forever after their inescapable deaths.
Hehehe ooooops 😂
Looking forward to your summary of "The Book of Mormon" 🤩
They do the same thing when people leave the church members won’t talk to people who leave
Not True. I am a Mormon and we don't shun at all. In fact, we are counseled to love everyone even if they leave the church. I have two children who have left the faith, and they have never been shunned. I have a great relationship with both and respect their choices in life. We believe if free choice, everyone is free to follow what they believe is true and what path they decide to follow, and we are to love them just the same.
@@eileenpierce7623 not in my experience since me becoming inactive everyone I have known in the church has shunned me even missionaries have done it to me
When I told them there religion is a lie which it is
@@12345gerrard I am sorry to hear that. It is not right, and they are not following the tenets of the church. I hate to say it, but every church has some jerks in it.
@@eileenpierce1023 true but I have met a lot of them plus a Mormon leader did give a talk saying shunning was ok
Everything I know about the LDS is from the TV show Southpark😆 Interesting stuff Lloyd! I admire you!
That episode is hilarious. I love the song 😂 dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb 🎶
Lloyd epistemologizing Mormons... awesome