Pathé had a very good technical reason for initially doing their discs center-start because the Pathé disc utilized a shallow U-shaped groove which was played by a ballpoint stylus. Apparently too many people were confused by this, setting the reproducer at the outside and wondering why the record would not play! And so Pathé caved in and adopted the outside-start method. You have probably noticed that the outside-start Pathé discs tend to be hard to track because of the shallow U-shaped groove. The center-start method was adopted so that the reproducer would work WITH, instead of AGAINST, the centrifugal force inherent when a ball is resting on a revolving disc. You may have noticed that center-start discs rarely, if ever, stick. Another thing about Pathé records is that they were mastered on wax cylinders which were transcribed pantographically onto disc. If you look at center-start discs, they all end at the same distance from the edge, and that is why. The Pathé disc was a wonderfully brilliant, high quality recording. The main drawback, aside from being a very large, constant-RPM disc and therefore having a dramatic equalization shift from beginning to end, was the reproducer design. A great deal of the vertical energy is wasted -- unlike the Edison reproducer which was designed to respond to vertical modulation only. The Pathé reproducer, as well as the Pathé setting of the Brunswick Ultona, are angled in such a way that they respond mostly to the forward rush of the groove. The very best way to play Pathé records acoustically would have been with a diamond ball mounted on an Edison-type reproducer guided by a feedscrew. The Edison setting of the Ultona would work much better too, if equipped with a ballpoint.
@@gammeltfossil Thank you for your kind remark. Wow, it has been 6 years since I wrote that. I forgot about it. I put so much thought into that comment, and it was so technical, I had a challenge understanding it even though I wrote it . . .
BUGS BUNNY: (singing at the same time) "Whadda they do on a rainy night in Riiiiiiiio? Whadda they do when there is no starry skyyyyyyyy? Where do they go when they can't go for a WALK? Do they sit at home and TALK, Or do they sit and sigh, 'Aye Aye!'.......?"
Dude, this is 1904, and when they played this magnificent performance back then, it was not insane it was one of the most amazing forms of modern technology available, It was incredible .
@@victrolaman The way you said “dude” had me cracking up!😆A lot of people just don’t understand the history, the time period, and value of these records. These are also not Vinyl!
@@josephdoesmore8922 I never use Dude, but he said it initially so I came back at him with it of course. Sometimes I think people lurk on UA-cam just to make crazy comments just to get response, form the maker of the video.
+transformingArt Thanks for the information, when I got through with the video, I had a feeling I was close with the speed but not quite there. Also thanks for confirming that it is in fact Ruffo himself doing the introduction. Is there a Pathe Discography that lists how many Records Ruffo made for them?
+Bruce Victrolaman Young Ruffo had recorded 15 titles for Pathe in 1904 - they were his first recordings. Of these 15 recordings, 12 of them were eventually available on center start discs by 1905 when they started making the format. The first Pathe discs were pressed on a mixture of cement and wax - which is notorious for being ridiculously brittle and almost none of them survived today in a playable condition. Pathe then changed their disc surface to a conventional shellac mixture. The 3 titles that were not available on discs are exceedingly scarce, and in fact, one of these 3 titles hadn't been found yet at all. These Pathes were available in the center start format until 1918, when they switched to the outer start format with paper labels. These had better sound quality, but they edited out the announcements on these recordings, sometimes truncating the piano intro. These were available until 1929 (when Ruffo made his last issued recordings for Victor!). To my knowledge there was one or two Ruffo titles available on Needle Cut "Actuelle" label as well but I never saw any copy.
Great record & always feel the announcement gives a sense of atmosphere, sorry the practice soon died out. These 'dual standard' gramophones are so useful! My 'Marathon' external horn machine will also play all types of records, but was primarily designed to play the narrow groove (& short lived) Marathon disc, an early attempt at extended playing time. More info about it by typing 'Marathon' into the search facility on my channel. I believe it is the only one on UA-cam.
This recording is the BEST VERSION Titta Ruffo recorded of the aria "Largo al factotum", from "Il barbiere di Siviglia". This one from 1904 is superior to the others he recorded. It was originally recorded on Edison's phonograph in 1904 by Pathé. - Esta grabación es la MEJOR VERSIÓN que Titta Ruffo grabó del aria "Largo al factotum", de "El barbero de Sevilla". Ésta de 1904 es superior a las demás que grabó. Fue grabada originalmente en fonógrafo de Edison en 1904 por la casa Pathé. (27 - VIII - 2020). 1,38 a. m.
@@Lemmax-X-exdom. It is the same aria, but it is not the same recording. Your video includes piano accompaniment and Ruffo sings differently. While the reedition on Supraphon LP (Czech's recording company) has orchestra. I know that there is still another recording from 1912(14) with orchestra, but that one I do not like. The best one is that which I gave you... Listen carefully again....
@@johnfalstaff2270 Yes; it's a different interpretation. I heard it better now. I remember hearing it on the radio many years ago. I also like it more than the other aria. Do you know what year it was recorded?
@@Lemmax-X-exdom. No, unfortunately. It has to be very early recording when Ruffo managed to sing with a big ease. At the same time (probably), he recorded the duet "Dunque io son" from The Barber of Seville with a great Spanish coloratura Maria Galvany. And it is also the best recording of those two artists.
+Lucius1958 Pathe recordings were done a Master Cylinder. So Ruffo who recorded on Pathe in 1904, his original recordings were first issued on Cylinder, and later issued on the new Etched records, from the original recording taken from the Wax Cylinder Masters. +
+Lucius1958 These 14" records are very impressive, they are striking in their appearance and weigh about 16 onces. and are a real historic Icon from the early days of recorded sounded playing a 90 RPM's and also center start. I was fortunate to able to obtain it and have several machines which can accomodate the 14" records, and also play vertical groove records.
You has to invert the channels and don't use tangential arm, because center start. About Edison records is the rule, the older with micro stylus (25 micrometer), the later containing paper labels with normal stylus (65 micrometer).
I have a numark turntable for sale on Ebay that you can get a true 90RPM on and get a cart that can play those lateral cuts… that way you can make better sounding transfers instead of the tinny sound of the horn and the camera mic.
+Cathy Thirsk Stevens Correct, this was produced in the early 78rpm era, but Pathe's early records were recorded at 90rpms. The later Pathes were produced at 80 RPMS and were outside start.
Pathé had a very good technical reason for initially doing their discs center-start because the Pathé disc utilized a shallow U-shaped groove which was played by a ballpoint stylus. Apparently too many people were confused by this, setting the reproducer at the outside and wondering why the record would not play! And so Pathé caved in and adopted the outside-start method. You have probably noticed that the outside-start Pathé discs tend to be hard to track because of the shallow U-shaped groove. The center-start method was adopted so that the reproducer would work WITH, instead of AGAINST, the centrifugal force inherent when a ball is resting on a revolving disc. You may have noticed that center-start discs rarely, if ever, stick. Another thing about Pathé records is that they were mastered on wax cylinders which were transcribed pantographically onto disc. If you look at center-start discs, they all end at the same distance from the edge, and that is why. The Pathé disc was a wonderfully brilliant, high quality recording. The main drawback, aside from being a very large, constant-RPM disc and therefore having a dramatic equalization shift from beginning to end, was the reproducer design. A great deal of the vertical energy is wasted -- unlike the Edison reproducer which was designed to respond to vertical modulation only. The Pathé reproducer, as well as the Pathé setting of the Brunswick Ultona, are angled in such a way that they respond mostly to the forward rush of the groove. The very best way to play Pathé records acoustically would have been with a diamond ball mounted on an Edison-type reproducer guided by a feedscrew. The Edison setting of the Ultona would work much better too, if equipped with a ballpoint.
Great knowledge.
@@gammeltfossil Thank you for your kind remark. Wow, it has been 6 years since I wrote that. I forgot about it. I put so much thought into that comment, and it was so technical, I had a challenge understanding it even though I wrote it . . .
Was für eine traumhaft wundervoll schöne Aufnahme!😍
Tita Ruffo was twenty-six and was well on his way to the pinnacle for baritones.
BUGS BUNNY: (singing at the same time)
"Whadda they do on a rainy night in Riiiiiiiio?
Whadda they do when there is no starry skyyyyyyyy?
Where do they go when they can't go for a WALK?
Do they sit at home and TALK,
Or do they sit and sigh, 'Aye Aye!'.......?"
Absolutely beautiful Pathe record, congratulations!!!
Dude! That monstrous sized vinyl for only ONE song per side?! We get 7 inches for that now! Insane!
Dude, this is 1904, and when they played this magnificent performance back then, it was not insane it was one of the most amazing forms of modern technology available, It was incredible .
@@victrolaman The way you said “dude” had me cracking up!😆A lot of people just don’t understand the history, the time period, and value of these records. These are also not Vinyl!
@@josephdoesmore8922 I never use Dude, but he said it initially so I came back at him with it of course. Sometimes I think people lurk on UA-cam just to make crazy comments just to get response, form the maker of the video.
I love Ruffo's speaking voice.
Fantastic Song sungen by an fabulos Tenor. I've never seen a 90rpm Record before. Thank's for posting !
Glenn Johnson WOW!This is remarkable.Historical and in real good condition.
It should be played at a slightly faster speed. The announcer is Ruffo himself.
+transformingArt Thanks for the information, when I got through with the video, I had a feeling I was close with the speed but not quite there. Also thanks for confirming that it is in fact Ruffo himself doing the introduction. Is there a Pathe Discography that lists how many Records Ruffo made for them?
+Bruce Victrolaman Young
Ruffo had recorded 15 titles for Pathe in 1904 - they were his first recordings. Of these 15 recordings, 12 of them were eventually available on center start discs by 1905 when they started making the format. The first Pathe discs were pressed on a mixture of cement and wax - which is notorious for being ridiculously brittle and almost none of them survived today in a playable condition. Pathe then changed their disc surface to a conventional shellac mixture. The 3 titles that were not available on discs are exceedingly scarce, and in fact, one of these 3 titles hadn't been found yet at all. These Pathes were available in the center start format until 1918, when they switched to the outer start format with paper labels. These had better sound quality, but they edited out the announcements on these recordings, sometimes truncating the piano intro. These were available until 1929 (when Ruffo made his last issued recordings for Victor!). To my knowledge there was one or two Ruffo titles available on Needle Cut "Actuelle" label as well but I never saw any copy.
Divino .
❤
Great record & always feel the announcement gives a sense of atmosphere, sorry the practice soon died out. These 'dual standard' gramophones are so useful! My 'Marathon' external horn machine will also play all types of records, but was primarily designed to play the narrow groove (& short lived) Marathon disc, an early attempt at extended playing time. More info about it by typing 'Marathon' into the search facility on my channel. I believe it is the only one on UA-cam.
A good quality of records
1 1/2 spins per second, crazy
Ever see how fast a CD spins? I think it's 500-900 rpm (faster at the inside, getting slower towards the outside), as opposed to this 90 rpm disc.
Works better than Windows 10!!
Yes sir
This recording is the BEST VERSION Titta Ruffo recorded of the aria "Largo al factotum", from "Il barbiere di Siviglia". This one from 1904 is superior to the others he recorded. It was originally recorded on Edison's phonograph in 1904 by Pathé. - Esta grabación es la MEJOR VERSIÓN que Titta Ruffo grabó del aria "Largo al factotum", de "El barbero de Sevilla". Ésta de 1904 es superior a las demás que grabó. Fue grabada originalmente en fonógrafo de Edison en 1904 por la casa Pathé. (27 - VIII - 2020). 1,38 a. m.
Lemmax, here is Ruffo's best Largo al factotum ua-cam.com/video/lEHJzp0WDwc/v-deo.html
@@johnfalstaff2270 That's the same aria. The original recording was made on a phonograph cylinder by the Pathé company.
@@Lemmax-X-exdom. It is the same aria, but it is not the same recording. Your video includes piano accompaniment and Ruffo sings differently. While the reedition on Supraphon LP (Czech's recording company) has orchestra. I know that there is still another recording from 1912(14) with orchestra, but that one I do not like. The best one is that which I gave you... Listen carefully again....
@@johnfalstaff2270 Yes; it's a different interpretation. I heard it better now. I remember hearing it on the radio many years ago. I also like it more than the other aria. Do you know what year it was recorded?
@@Lemmax-X-exdom. No, unfortunately. It has to be very early recording when Ruffo managed to sing with a big ease. At the same time (probably), he recorded the duet "Dunque io son" from The Barber of Seville with a great Spanish coloratura Maria Galvany. And it is also the best recording of those two artists.
A big size record
For a big size voice !
@@abcdefgh-db1to Big size? More like the biggest size!
@@BaroneVitellioScarpia1 - Actually, they also produced 20 inch records...
Great Rarity
Was this originally issued on cylinder? Pathé did not start issuing discs until 1906.
BTW, I do have his recording on Victor.
+Lucius1958 Pathe recordings were done a Master Cylinder. So Ruffo who recorded on Pathe in 1904, his original recordings were first issued on Cylinder, and later issued on the new Etched records, from the original recording taken from the Wax Cylinder Masters.
+
+Lucius1958 These 14" records are very impressive, they are striking in their appearance and weigh about 16 onces. and are a real historic Icon from the early days of recorded sounded playing a 90 RPM's and also center start. I was fortunate to able to obtain it and have several machines which can accomodate the 14" records, and also play vertical groove records.
Wonder how this would sound on a hi fi
You has to invert the channels and don't use tangential arm, because center start.
About Edison records is the rule, the older with micro stylus (25 micrometer), the later containing paper labels with normal stylus (65 micrometer).
Possibly like this ua-cam.com/video/qsc_PAK39oo/v-deo.html
I have a numark turntable for sale on Ebay that you can get a true 90RPM on and get a cart that can play those lateral cuts… that way you can make better sounding transfers instead of the tinny sound of the horn and the camera mic.
How much?
Friends, please skip to 2:07
I laugh when I hear this because of Tom and Jerry. 😂
So this is basically not a 78 but a 90 record?
+Cathy Thirsk Stevens Correct, this was produced in the early 78rpm era, but Pathe's early records were recorded at 90rpms. The later Pathes were produced at 80 RPMS and were outside start.
Nice record. Too bad that you are ruining it by playing it on that old piece of junk phono!
Berliner man!