PragerFU: The Afterlife, Part 1
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- Опубліковано 19 жов 2024
- Part One of our look at the PragerU video about the Afterlife
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I just love the absurdity of a graph with "immeasurable" marked on it.
It took me a minute, maybe I'm tired - but lol
"It's so simple .. ton." SUBSCRIBED
I've decided that whenever I'm commenting regarding _PragerU_ videos, I should include the following warning:
*Warning:* _PragerU_ is not a university or institution accredited by the US Department of Education, rather it is a media agency, organized as a 501(c)(3) non-profit business. _PragerU_ is largely funded ($6+ million USD) by fossil fuel industrialists (and fracking enthusiasts) Dan and Farris Wilks, and topics discussed and opinions expressed on PragerU are specifically determined by the Wilks family and its financial interests. Each PragerU video costs $25,000-$30,000 USD to produce.
So _PragerU_ has a lot of cause to let people suffer for the promise of Heaven, given the humane alternative -- changing society so that its members suffer less -- would cost lots of that sweet, sweet oil money.
Surprised I didn't get a PragerU ad before watching this.
Worst yet people like Dennis increase human suffering with their ignorance and hypocrisy.
Everyone is an atheist but some people like to pretend they have magic invisible friends.
I like how PragerFU shows the immeasurable amount of injustice and suffering by plotting it on a graph
If he were honest the graph should be descending. Over time, scientific progress has gone a long way to reduce pain and suffering. But that doesn't work for the Christian narrative, where they use misery to convince us that we need what they're selling.
Grafight23 Ha!!! That’s exactly what I’m going to do in part three.
Also, someone else mentioned that Prager used that graph to measure the immeasurable.
Thank you for opposing this malignant mass of assumptions asserted by Dennis.
We live in a world where Stephen Molyneux gets more views on his 2 hr video of unintelligible, insipid rantings about the dangers of Disney's Frozen than Mr. Deity gets for this one. How's that for an immeasurable amount of injustice and suffering?
That's nothing...check how many views Justin Bieber gets in half an hour....
Brilliant. Absolutely brilliant.
Dennis' claim of cruelty and injustice being somehow made right in the afterlife is just an excuse to not do anything about it now.
God letting us suffer because some point down the line, you'll get into Heaven is like a molester taking his victim to the toy store after. It somehow makes up for the previous trauma.
I have been an atheist all my life. The suffering has not overwhelmed me because I had no expectation of a god fixing things. This is normal. Anything that gets fixed will have to be us humans fixing it. The suffering will go away when you give up the wishful thinking.
Haven't seen you comment in awhile, Roedy
Thank you, Bryan. I appreciate a good takedown of someone as pompous as Prager when done with logic plus a touch of humour. Keep at it, Mr. D!
Paul Aboud Thanks so much. But it’s Brian with an “I”. Don’t trust those Other Bryans. The damage done by parents misspelling their name is incomprehensible.
misterdeity My deepest apologies, Mr D. I beg forgiveness from your fine self and the FSM (just to cover my bases) for my faux pas.
Part 2 was equally amazing, BTW. Glad to be a patron.
mister deity keep up the good information and logic. Thank you!
I think it was George Carlin who asked "Ever wonder why they never say 'I'm sure he's down there, now, screaming up at us?'"
Imagine your grandma in hell... baking pies without an oven.
If "immeasureable" falls at a specific place along the Y-axis, it's not exactly "immeasureable", is it?
Hey Brian. You stated, "You're still going to suffer the evil and injustice in this life, right?" and followed that up with text reading "Mind wipe?" Well, apparently that is indeed the answer! According to the Bible:
Isaiah 65:17 "See, I will create new heavens and a new earth. The former things will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind."
How is that possible unless one's mind is indeed wiped? Since we are essentially the sum of our memories, heaven is essentially what makes us us ceasing to exist.
Isiah is dead.
After I die it will be as if I never existed.
I will remember nothing
"It's so simple..ton."
NICE!
What if we're worshiping the wrong god and are just making him madder every time we go to church?
ua-cam.com/video/f683uucgGps/v-deo.html&ab_channel=CenturySingersTAMU
*StarTrekLivz*
A _tip 'o the hat_ to *_Homer Simpson._* ; )
Mr. Dalton? I just wanted to say, over and over and over again.... That I *ADMIRE YOU* and I respect what you're doing and I want you to keep doing it.
You have my compliments and praise and word of mouth. I copy and paste you a lot.
We need people like you in this day and age.
Thank you for being you.
GoodAvatar Thanks so much! You’ve made my fortnight.
+misterdeity DP speaks in fortune cookie. Every sentence is roughly the same length and is somewhat self-contained. It's funny, intriguing and creepy all at the same time. Just like Dennis.
Dennis, adult humans who believe in and talk to their imaginary friends are not usually considered "sane."
Dunning-Kruger effect:
“My belief in God and the afterlife keeps me sane” -Dennis Prager
This one was brilliant.
By what definition does dennis consider himself 'sane'?
I watched an interview with Dennis where he was asked "What is Evil?" He said he just knew and that was all there was to it. I say, Dennis is Evil and that's because I just know it - nothing more needs be said.
This was a great video, thank you.
If we could convince the general populace that there is no afterlife and certainly no heaven awaiting them, then perhaps they would be more compelled to try turning this existence from one of "immeasurable suffering" to one of bliss (and all the chocolate cake you could eat).
It's _Sky Pie!,_ unbeliever!! ; )
ua-cam.com/video/55h1FO8V_3w/v-deo.html
"If _A_ god exists, then an afterlife exists"? Does Denis even read what he writes? There are lots of gods whose religions don't have afterlives.
Great hob Mr D as always.
And thanks for having the patience to go through all these nonsense and giving these measured responses :)
Aratas Man Glad you enboyed it.😉
I’ve watched this numerous times. So perfect. Like the new font on the credits.
I'm not a Christian, but I was raised in a Christian home. I took the "good Christians go to heaven, unbelievers go to hell" at face value. A few weeks ago I saw a UA-cam video from a channel called Unlearn the Lies which said this is wrong. They pointed out that heaven isn't promised to people and hell isn't promised either. It's everlasting life or eternal death. This was welcome to me because I don't understand how somebody can say there's a loving god if it's "love me or burn".
So then I did a little checking around in the Bible and while this argument seems really appealing, there are also verses that say the wicked will suffer for eternity. But wait, I thought this book was totally congruent? That lead me over to the Bible academics on reddit. (reddit.com/r/academicbiblical ) and asked them the purpose of Heaven and Hell and what happens when you die.
I got a dozen responses that break down essentially to "this has been a bone of contention for over 2,000 years". This is genuinely surprising to me. How can it be that the Bible doesn't explain clearly what's in it for you after you die? But it doesn't.
My genuine feeling is that there's nothing after death, but I have to admit, "everlasting life or death" is a lot more straight-forward than I've been led to believe. That "Book of Life" that gets brought up makes a lot more sense if you just ask the question, "wanna live forever?". Spoiler alert: I don't. If I can accomplish that by not believing in God, well, sign me up.
All of this is really neither here-nor-there since we're talking about unknowable things but in the context of talking to Christians, I find it really interesting that there's not a set answer on Heaven or Hell or even the afterlife and what it's all about.
What Prager is doing is just being a shifty salesman for what he feels to be emotionally true.
RictorIAG This is really interesting. Thanks for taking the time to comment. I’m working on a video about God’s lack of quality communication skills (especially strange for an all-knowing, all-powerful being), and this will fit right in.
This seems consistent with verses like John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."
There's no mention of heaven, just eternal life.
Or "For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord." - Romans 6:23
"Many of those who sleepin the dusty ground will awake - some to everlasting life,and others to shame and everlasting abhorrence. But the wise will shinelike the brightness of the heavenly expanse. And those bringing many to righteousness will be like the stars forever and ever." - Daniel 12:2-3
The only thing this verse says is "But the wise will shinelike the brightness of the heavenly expanse.” This does not say that they will go to heaven just that they shine bright like the heavenly expanse … which for all we know means the sky, not the place where God lives. Essentially saying “bright like the sun”. This doesn’t say that people will exist in heaven or hell.
"And these will depart into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.” - Matthew 25:46
Eternal punishment doesn’t mean hell. It means death. Eternal death, IMO.
"Do not be amazed at this, because a time is coming when all who are in the tombs will hear his voice” - John 5:28
Again, nothing about heaven or hell. It’s not even inferred. Jesus promises everlasting life, not heaven.
"Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death - the lake of fire. If anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, that person was thrown into the lake of fire.” - Revelation 20:14-15
The Lake of Fire isn’t hell. It’s the place where Satan, his demons, and the unsaved are burned to death. The burning isn’t forever. The death part is. At least, that's how I read it.
I feel like the version we get taught is based on "Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God" by Jonathan Edwards.
If you say you believe in God and in Hell, the God you believe in is not only not good, that God is cruel.
Kevin Allen You win my favorite comment trophy. That goes in part three!!!
There is neither any heaven nor any hell. These are all nonsense stories.
Thanks for your videos and your efforts in your own life.
Yakov Perelman Thats so nice of you to say. I really appreciate it.
University indicates that the school has at least a masters program. College indicates a 4 year degree only. Prager "University" has neither of these and barely passes as a trade school, giving only the most basic understanding of very complex topics but without a useful trade after you come out of the program. I would say its more of a for-profit college that leaves you worse off than when you entered.
Thank you for slowing down and increasing the size of the "subliminal" messages.
Shifted from subliminal to semiliminal? Or even fully liminal? (Never go full liminal.)
HEY! We need an Afterlife so we don't have to fix this RealLife . . . ;-)
God, Mister God, I LOVE it when you go off and show me the light! Keep it up, handsome.
A question I've always had for religion(More specifically christianity) was if Earth isn't our final home, then why would God even put us here? Hell why even make the universe at all? Why not put us in heaven where he wants all of us? The more I try to find reason in religion, the more it falls apart.
Jonathan Kramer: What I don’t understand is why it’s so important to people to claim to believe in religion, when every.single.thing. they do shows that they themselves don’t believe the bullshit. Why go to a doctor, if being sick is “God’s will”? Why get sad when a kid dies, especially if the kid has been baptized and is too young to have “sinned”? That kid just won a ticket to heaven without years of pain and suffering. Why give gays a hard time here on Earth if they’ll be suffering for eternity in Hell? The vast majority of people who believe in God make the same decisions as people who don’t for the most part - they work for a living, they get health insurance, they educate their kids...they actually do not expect “God” to take care of them like lilies in the field. They don’t turn the other cheek, they don’t admire or aspire to meekness, they judge people, they seek vengeance...basically they live their lives as if nothing they claim to believe is true. So why do they keep pretending to believe the claims? That’s the thing that confuses me the most...
Well Done!
Probably the best break down of PragerU Ive seen so far
if there is a god there is an afterlife rhymes with: if you make something up, you might as well do it right...
3:45: I like how you did that 'inline quotation' of DP (what an unfortunate pair of initials(!)) saying ",with an immeasurable amount of injustice and suffering," in between your words of rebuttal. It's as effective in video as it is in text, if not more so. :-D
The most bizarre flaw in this argument for an afterlife is that according to Abrahamic religions, God doesn't send people to Heaven or Hell in order to make up for some perceived inequality in this life. One goes to Heaven or Hell based solely on subscription to the proper ideology and belief system. For example: in the most common Christian theology, a poor man who suffers his entire life with an illness and dies alone in poverty will still go to Hell if he wasn't a Christian when he died. So this "good and just" God sentenced this man to a lifetime of pain, then an eternity of even MORE pain, and the cherry on top of all of this is that the Christians say this is God's right, that the man deserved Hell by default for being a sinner, and that salvation(ie: faith in the proper belief system) was a gift God could choose to give the man if He wanted to (predestination, which is confirmed in the Epistles of Paul, and in many Surahs of the Koran). Judaism and (especially) Islam operate on similar concepts.
So if this man claims to believe in an Abrahamic God, then he is knowingly telling lies and half-truths in order to make his claim seem more logical and fair than it really is. It's a fucking sham.
You are fantastic.
So how do you enroll into Prager University? Do they have a hockey team? Do they take credits from Flat Earth College?
They fully accept all credits and degrees from _Patriot Bible University,_ Kent Hovind's alma mater.
rationalwiki.org/wiki/Kent_Hovind%27s_doctoral_dissertations
May god b-less. ; )
Thank You for calling out the latest incarnation of the John Birch Society a.k.a. Prager U
This is put perfectly... I remember trying to articulate this... Like you want there to be an afterlife just to make you feel good that people are punished from this life?
You know, you can be pretty damn eloquent when you want to.
James Alan : And, fortunately, he wants to be most of the time.
Thanks so much!!! You guys made my fortnight!
"If there is a god, there is an afterlife."
Hang on. Isn't Dennis Prager _Jewish?_ What afterlife do the _Jews_ have to deal with? I know it's not Heaven of Hell, because they are not mentioned until the _New_ Testament.
Thank you for your work.
benway23 Thanks for watching! So glad you’re enjoying the vids. It’s how I feel useful.
I absolutely am thrilled when you post anything and am really loving the current Prager dissection. Again, thank you.
someone with PTSD would find an eternity with their memories a "living" hell. So, since god has to be good, no such god would create an afterlife that makes people live eternally with their mistakes and traumas.
Mark Hacket, correct that's why many believe that God would wipe your memories clean; of course, without your memories you would no longer be you. There is as many definitions of God as definitions of an afterlife, clearly this omnipotent God has trouble communicating.
"Holiday Tree" made me laugh.
Absolutely amazing!
Excellent, so very good and true!
_For God so hated the world that He sent His only Son so that_
_whosoever does not believe in Him shall suffer eternal damnation._
*- God's Ex-Wife*
Michael Jones That’s REALLY good. We need to start making shirts and hats!!! I would say, “be tortured forever” at the end. It’s a bit more visceral and gut punching.
*misterdeity*
Thanks! ; )
_The fool hath said in his heart that there is no God,_
_but the wise man shouts it from his rooftop!_
*- Yeshuahfullofit 14:1*
May god b-less. ; )
better than the actual line. For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
God's ex-wife corrected the lie.
May god b-less. ; )
Boy, you're just killin' it here in the comments. I think it's time for a Michael Jones channel.
"God Goggles." Yeah, I used to wear those!
LOL love it!.....so how are you and how are....*gets cut*..."THIS LIFE IS FILLED WITH IMMERSIABLE AMOUNT OF INJUSTICE AND SUFFERING!"....ok was just asking how are your ki..."THIS LIFE IS FILLED....." LOL
Mr Ayala Hahahahaha!!!
Being comfortable with suffering isn't a good recipe for our future generations.
Let’s be honest. It’s prager Corp. The university tag is added by Dennis to give himself the air of respectability. Let’s not use it.
It's a fake diploma mill. Probably worth as much as the paper it's written on.
The Self Illusion by Bruce Hood.You can't replicate a person taken out of their time and place.Once dead they are sealed as you knew them .Afterlife would be heartbreak
Keep up the good work! PragurU is absolute garbage and needs to be criticized!
Keep hammering away!
Lots of religions don't posit an afterlife. So there is no reason a god implies an afterlife.
Don't give me comfort or solace! Give me insight and wakefulness!
hey i think i met you at the bagdad cafe in ca. if so hello .like your vids watch them a lot.
I’ve always though more life would be no different from this one already. Cycles, good bad, needs wants, loss love etc.
Stockholm Syndrome..... you may have tickled a nail head there. The more imprisoned in faith, the more love for the imprisoned. Praise be! No, wait,,, free will. My bad.
Are you watching this Dennis????
Eeeyup!!...and i disapprove this message....
Denny, what does good mean?
Oh, that means god…
Ok, how about the word truth, what’s that mean? Oh that means god…
Um… how about love? That emotion we feel for things and other animals?
Oh that means god too. Yeah, pretty much my entire vocabulary means god.
Immortality cheapens life to redundant pointlessness.
Michael Reeser Such a great point!!!
We're a weird species. Numerous religions try to assure us that death is not to be feared since there's an afterlife... yet we put huge resources into staving off death as long as possible. If the religious think the afterlife is all-that they aught to be trying to hasten their transition to it, especially if they're deluded enough to think they're righteous enough for the VIP version.
Me? I'd love to give immortality (or at least greatly extended life) a test drive. My bucket list of things to do and see keeps getting longer.
Sadly, you won't.
The state of anti-aging research today is such that there are people being born now, who will never die.
But it is too late for us.
our descendants will look back from the stars, and weep at our loss.
7:33 - Best part, I busted out laughing 😄
OK, Dennis thinks God owes us an afterlife because of all the injustice and suffering of this life.
But, what we call injustice and suffering is good and just in God's view.
So, God doesn't owe us anything.
Dorian sapiens humans make up subjective views and such of many different heaven stories. Not all religions have hell but Dennis is pro Christian , and would likely end up there because of his various sins if it actually existed. He is Jewish and not Christian too right?
It's really, really hard to effectively satirize Prager. Kinda like telling a joke where everyone already knows the punchline.
I agree w/ Denny, this Matrix is just filled with with what the French call “merde”…
I'd like to enroll in this new college PragerFU that you speak of. I'm thinking about pursuing a major in "F" with a minor in "U". How might I go about applying as a prospective student this coming fall?
TheOicyu812 Check out the Patreon link in the description. We hand out diplomas like we’re a TrumpU affiliate.
OMG... I was about to click this video away, and then I took a second look....
AafkeArt Yeah, this is a new series. I’ll be going through the PragerU catalog. Look closely.
Well thanks for the warning ;) PragerU disgusts me but I don't want to miss the wisdom of The Mister!
Many Old Religions had gods but didn't have an afterlife. It's just that simple.
The arguments for the afterlife are so pathetic and childish. The afterlife must exist because I would find it intolerable if it did not. It is pure wishful thinking.
They argue for procrastinating gods: those with the power of eradicating evil, the knowledge how to, the love for wishing it... but full of excuses, that keep delaying what should be a responsible action...
I like when the excuses for gods that these enlightened god-mouthpieces utter, render their gods negligent, and/or sadists, and/or stupid. And they are absolutely fine with that, because those are the only "gods" compatible with reality and their need to believe in magical (infinitely delayed) solutions.
Prager and prestigious in the same sentence??
Got an Ad for yesheis ... have fun with the revenue :)
An afterlife is a key feature in dominant religions, because promising pie in the sky when you die is a way to convince people to be content with their current lot in life.
This pacifying effect is useful for governments of all kinds, so religions that feature it are more often adopted and spread.
Reincarnation works the same, with the additional bonus of blaming the victim for their current circumstances.
I'm pretty sure Mormonism actually attributes your lot in life to your actions before birth, during the war in heaven, and offers you the chance at a glorious after life, if you toe the line.
Yet more evidence of the evil genius of Joseph Smith.
Truly he was the steampunk L.Ron Hubbard.
Funny how nearly everyone who thinks they've been reincarnated will tell you they were a prince, princess or king in a past life. Actually, if reincarnation WAS true, you'd have most people explaining how they used to be manure shovelers, spittoon polishers or perhaps rat catchers.
If there are hamburgers then there must be french fries. It's obvious, isn't it Dennis?
I always wondered what compels the devil to torture people for eternity.
What if he changed his mind tomorrow?
What if Satan is a really cool dude who has told Men the truth since their days in Eden? Satan tried to warn them that God was out of His mind.
i.pinimg.com/736x/df/aa/20/dfaa202848a2c752fc03b3de6daf2433--atheist-agnostic-atheist-quotes.jpg
May god b-less. ; )
I LOVE!!!! "God b-less!" That's so good I wish I'd thought of it. Damn you!!!
That's some great thinking - really out of the box. I guess God would threaten Satan with eternal torture. Oh, but wait... who's he going to get to do that?
Thanks! ; )
I got that from watching the Red Skelton Show when I was a kid.
He always ended his show with, "May god bless", but with his drawl it sounded to me like he was saying "May God Be Less." I've been saying it ever since.
Feel free to use it as you will!
May god b-less! XDD
Dennis Prager? ; )
Brilliant and thanks
Yeah! Stickin' it to the 'man'. XD
@1:24 - Did his graph just measure immeasurability?? :P
That graphic is meaningless on every level. What is the horizontal axis? I thought it would be more accurate to have a bar graph with "amount of suffering" on the y-axis, with marks for "measurable" and "unmeasurable" and two bars on the x-axis labeled "that there is" and "that there is not," with the first rising to "unmeasurable" and the second only reaching "measurable."
Chaosism OMG!!! How did I not see that? I love you people so much!!! Reading the comments is my favorite thing about making these. I just wish I were as sharp as youz guyz.
EebstertheGreat
Yeah. "Life" is not really a sensible label for that horizontal axis. I guess he's saying that "early in life" (assuming an implication of time) there was measurable "injustice & suffering" and then... at _some_ point, I guess... it _became_ immeasurable? Ugh. I think it's perhaps best for our mental health that we don't try to make sense of this graph...
I wonder if we can pin down exactly when the "amount of suffering" could no longer be measured and why the old methods of measuring suffering stopped working at that point.
misterdeity
Ha! No worries. I mean, I'd expect a graph being issued by a university to be at least coherent.
Wait... What do you mean they're not a _real_ university? :P
Dennis doesn't know how not to argue from his personal worldview. He takes perfect justice as granted. however, even more of a misstep is characterizing his vision of his god's plan as perfectly just. Infinite punishment for finite disobedience and infinite rewards for finite obedience are not just. As for any other sins, they can all be forgiven. Does his god forgive ethnic cleansing? If Saul is in Heaven, yes. Does his god forgive men loving other men? If Daniel is in Heaven, yes. Does his god forgive spreading bad faith arguments to the masses? Dennis had better hope so.
We get but one life. It is beyond me and beyond reason why any adult would hold a belief in an afterlife.
wishful thinking? An inability to comprehend that the universe doesn't revolve around them? A desire for justice that cannot be found in their life? There are lots of irrational reasons for people to desperately want an afterlife, and sadly many adults are irrational much of the time. Hopefully as the lives of people get less desperate with technological progress slowly lifting us from poverty at least some of these reasons will fall away.
Once you've let go of that idea, and had some time away, it really does seem like a childish thing, doesn't it? It's so obviously Santa Claus for adults.
Oddly however a combination of santa claus on the one hand and a dominatrix on the other. I was never quite sure with the christians whether they wanted to have been 'naughty' or 'nice' as although the joy in the discipline is supposed to be purely voyeuristic the direct experience often seems to be the thrill for them.
misterdeity I’ve been an atheist for over 40 years and I’m always surprised how little people think about about how they justify their beliefs. When I was 12 I doubted my then religious beliefs because I couldn’t find any justification for holding them.
@My OpenMind _"We get but one life."_ ???????.....
...now that's an assertion. What's being asserted is that you KNOW this to be true beyond any shadow of a doubt.
I don't.
..i admittedly *don't know* that there's an 'afterlife' either so i'm not asserting one way or another. So tell us...how did YOU get to *personally realize* this truth that you're asserting with so much apparent authority?????...
I regret that I have but one like to give for this video
So if there is no afterlife you can escape punishment for crimes committed? Well that's the way it is but no worse than being the most evil of people only admitting to their crimes on their deathbed and coming to Jesus who will forgive those crimes because of coming on board with the Vanity Project. Where is the justice in that system? How does that help the victim?
1. apologize in your head ("repent")
2. forgive yourself. ("god", at least the one in your head, forgives you)
As you have realized, religion does not require that the victim be involved in this process.
Wait a minute, did you actually know Dennis Prager? I can't tell how serious you were when you said that...
__ _ Yes. We were very good friends. And I had an office in his office, where I ran my own graphic design business and produced his “Ultimate Issues” newsletter, among other things.
Oh wow! Would love a whole mini docu or something on that!
B McD Oh the shit I could tell you.
misterdeity Awe, I'm dying! It's like the bait hanging right in front me, and I can't snap it up yet. You're such a tease, I wish you could share!
Holy crap!
It's like Dennis is saying things he doesn't believe. What's the name of those type of people? Oh yeah, let me have 20$ and I'll tell you tomorrow.
I don't get the "alma mater" joke. Some people will think Prager U is a real university.
Paul T Sjordal I say that because I worked for and with Prager in my early twenties. In many ways, he was the person who taught me to think clearly. But I was a bit more fearless and willing to follow that thinking wherever it led. As you can see from his afterlife video, emotionally, he can’t handle life without God and an afterlife. I found it difficult at first too. But I cared about truth just a bit more.
Anthropologist Marshal Sahlins posits that life was easier, not more difficult 20,000 years ago, and it was our adoption of agriculture as a primary source of nourishment that pointed us down the road of human suffering and injustice. You can read his hypothesis by googling 'Marshal Sahlins the original affluent society'. Interesting reading.
Oh, and Brian, you do look Mahvelous!
10,000 years ago 30% of the population died from murder according to anthropological research. Yes agriculture was in existence, but people have been killing people for a long time. Agriculture just made our ability to get proper nutition harder.
artsmith100 Can’t imagine it. Mortality rates for women and children were off the charts.
If you have a citation for that, I'd love to read it!
Mortality rates for everyone were off the charts until well into the 20th century. That's not the point. The type of agriculture we practice now, and the industry that grew up as a result, created the most arduous life for humans ever to exist on the planet. A measure of wealth is the amount of leisure time a culture has. Wealthy people in modern culture have more leisure than those lower in the food chain. Typically, people work 40 hours or more a week just to pay the bills. But in hunter/gatherer cultures, people typically spend less than 20 hours per week satisfying all their basic needs; food, shelter, clothing, water. The rest is leisure, which is filled with rich cultural activity.
I don't know if UA-cam will allow posting a link, but here it is if it works: www.primitivism.com/original-affluent.htm
The mortality rate isn't the point. How hard you have to work to make a living is the point. And I question the "30% mortality due to murder" assertion, and would love to see a citation for it.
Actually, when I hear apologists spinning their versions of god, I don't think of Stockholm syndrome. To me, they sound like battered spouses. My god is really a very good god. If I only prayed harder, proselytized better, sinned less, god wouldn't have to burn me for all eternity. God is good, it's all my fault. If only I wasn't a sinner, it would all be good.
Wasn't there a heaven before humans, as per the bible? Had god created it to be alone from humans forever?
If god created heaven so that humans would eventually spend their afterlife there, even if they had never sinned, then the afterlife wasn't made as a compensation for suffering.
Heck, suffering and death on Earth was literally god's choice -- it was the option that god decided upon as actual punishment for the garden of evil story.
I never ever get a good answer for this, generally they just don't reply back or when asked in real life start to get angry.
"Why does an all knowing and all loving god allow adults to rape infants?
Why doesn't he save the most innocent of the innocent?
What did the baby do to deserve this?"
this one just really messes with their heads.
the last one I got was god moves in mysterious ways.
Same result when they're asked in what context is it good to be able to own another person as property and be able to inherit them to others at death.
Yahweh can't create an afterlife, but my goddess is Bast, and she can whip up an afterlife -- no problem at all. Of course, it's only a heavenly afterlife if you like cats. Otherwise it's a living hell.
I hate cats, so I guess I'm screwed.