Instead of semi-intellectually claiming everything we don’t understand to be “God”, let’s stay more humble and simply say we don’t understand it (yet).
I certainly agree that it's just a play of words to say that I'm an Atheist or I'm Pantheist. Any Atheist who isn't Solipsist must believe that Physical Universe is real and that it's all that exist. I used to say and unnerve people both religious and Dawkins type Atheists by saying that "I believe in God and, I'm Materialist". .. People assume at first that I'm a Dualist who just doesn't know philosophical terminology... But when I show them that I know perfectly what I'm talking about I say that by belief in God I mean scientific (Orch Or and Antonio Damasio experiments among else) belief in Counsciosness that"God" created that way that vanishes under anesthesia and coma and that I fiercely reject immortal soul, After Life, Eucharist miraculous (serrentia marcens really) and all that stuff. They ask me why don't you call yourself Atheist then? -Because I believe in God that is One with Laws of Physics doesn't intervene and created nature of Counsciosness that way that it vanishes under anesthesia and coma! And it upsets all sort of people Dawkins type Atheists are upset that I'm defending G.. word using scientific argument that they can't laugh off the way they laugh Inteligent Design (because denying my argument for God is denying science nearly as established as Darwins Theory and proclaiming themselves Solipsists) so they are just confused. And religious people just feel tricked "you say you believe in God" but that's the last thing I as a Christian or a Dualistów would call God " That's funny but real
Thank you for this presentation on the nature of God. Here is an excerpt from The One God, a compilation of revelations, received by Marshall Vian Summers over the period between 2007 and 2015. This book "teaches us to go beyond our concepts and beliefs about God in order to explore our own experience of the presence and mystery of the Divine reality in our lives. The One God opens a new vantage point from which to see ourselves and the world in which we live... From this vantage point we can glimpse back into the origins of the universe and gain a new understanding of the great Separation from God that gave rise to the evolution of all life and that ultimately explains our presence in the world at this time... The One God offers a unique experience and remembrance of the timeless state of Creation from which we have all come and to which we will all return. This represents a new experience of God. Instead of being focused on pleasing God, fearing God, talking to God, fighting for God or running from God, we are invited into a new and deeper engagement with the mysterious Presence of the Creator and the power of Knowledge that the Creator has given us. Here we find an intimate form of redemption--redemption from a life of separation, pain and confusion. Here we can begin to experience who we really are, where we have come from and why we are in the world at this time... To come to God then is to come to Knowledge within yourself, for this is what calls you to God." (from the Introduction and first chapter of The One God, MVS)
It seems clear, to me, that any conception of God that does not include a way for humans to avoid extinction cannot be God in any normal sense. Similarly, any conception of God that demonstrates how humans can avoid extinction, this conception of God has rightfully earned the title.
A chill just ran down my spine. At 6:05 Nagasawa: "There is no ontological difference between what pantheists believe and what atheists believe." Robert: "Do you believe that?" Nagasawa: "Umm no, I think pantheists and panentheists can claim that their views are different from atheism. There's something special about the universe..." Yes! It's the *knowing how to be* that aligns the directions of causation, the top-down with the bottom-up. Atheism assumes materialism, and that the objects of existence are sufficient to explain a solely bottom-up direction of causation, in a random, dumb-luck, natural selection kind of way (despite violating the laws of entropy). But when we factor in "knowing how to be", we account for the top-down direction of causation that requires agents (holons, mind-bodies) to respond *meaningfully* to the cues with which they engage. The way that culture, and gender roles in culture, are integral to human psychology, identity and self. No entropy problem. No mind-body problem. Neither god nor soul required. Love Robert's inquisitorial style. "Do you believe that?" Getting to the heart of the problem.
@@maxd3028 There is much to unpack. To begin with, my analysis factors in the semiotics of CS Peirce ("knowing how to be" relates to Peirce and pragmatism). The concept of *Being* is one that some philosophers have taken seriously in the past (e.g., Heidegger, Wittgenstein), and I think this is a notion that merits being returned to centre stage, for example, in the context of agency theory. That doesn't help you, does it :) That's ok, check out my previous comments on this forum if you have time. Sometimes I indulge, and unpack my thinking a little more, for example most recently, in Cosmology and Creation Episode 1805, 15 June.
@@ROForeverMan It is a nice piece you have written (it is well written) but its not my cup of tea. I look from a totally different angle and experience. Your passion and love for your topic of interest made me happy though. I liked that very much.
@@ROForeverMan There is a difference between 'is contradictive' and something looking contradictive on first sight, meaning it is your interpretation. form and formless can be perfectly existing together within a system, without the system itself being contradictive. form&formless are complementair structures and fall within the possibilities of the degree of freedom of reality. That does not mean reality it self contains something contradictive to its own foundation. For me that is an interpretation you make, or how you experience it.
I think the universe fits all the requirements for a God in that - The universe gives us life , The universe controls our lives And the universe ends our life. Also peculiarly , the universe or reality is vast and eternal, yet it is experienced by the individual in the smallest private, most limited and purely subjective manner . It divides itself into the smallest figure, to fit each individual personal experience. Right down to the mosquito.
As an atheist I often think that the Aztecs and other sun worshiping civilisations had the best concept of God. After all we are made from stuff forged in the centre of stars.
The Universe is a FINITE isolated thermodynamic System ... that began & is expanding in ... an UNNATURAL Systems that must provide the matter, energy, space, time & Laws of Nature for a thermodynamic System to exist. A thermodynamic System ... is a Function ... made by an intelligence. And intelligence ... has a mind, free will & Nature ... to think & do good or evil. Law is only made for an intelligence ... because of free will & an evil/corrupt Nature. A natural intelligence( Man) with free will & a nature ... was made by an UNNATURAL intelligence with free will & a nature. The mind of an intelligence is UNNATURAL & non physical. But Mind of Man is physical ( brain) and nonphysical ( soul) The Nature of Man ... is the physical mind ( body). And Man was created perfect to procreate with an immortal body & soul ... until Mn broke God's Law ... and corrupted the body & the Nature of Man. This is why Jesus could not have a corrupt body. Mind of Man is the body & soul .. and everybody will sin because the body has been corrupted and is the physical Mind of Man.,
@@abelincoln8885 I like that part about law only made for intelligence. I don’t think anybody has ever put it that way before. And we know law is made for intelligence because intelligence can manipulate the law for its own intelligent reasons. For instance , the universe supposedly is constantly thermodynamically degrading so therefore when we were born, we should immediately wither away and die. But it is the mind that counteracts the second law of thermodynamics and tells the body to build itself up, to obtain sustenance and resist the second law of thermodynamics. The mind counter acts what we call physical laws-because awareness always supersedes what it is aware of. We work against the universe which if we were natural in total it would be like the universe working against itself. But I think the first step in Opening the up mind towards the truth is to realize that whatever the universe is it can’t be what we call it ; clouds are not clouds, planets are that planets and stars are not stars. The perspective from the universe-its integral inherency cant be harnessed by human language.
@@MrSanford65 There is nothing complex about any of this .. unless you freely choose to make it so. Science completely relies on the Laws of Nature for Man to explain natural phenomena ... to explain existence. Science is a Function Law is a Function The Human Body is a Function Natural phenomena are Functions The Universe is a thermodynamic System ... which is a Function. Man has known for thousands of years that only an entity or intelligence like Man ... makes rules & Laws ... and anything that is clearly a FUNCTION with design & purpose. This fact about the origin of abstract & physical Functions ... predate the Sciences by thousands of years .. and had been manifested in the form of religions & multiple "gods." This is why religions are a natural phenomena that will always be observed by most people. Either all of the religions are wrong or there is one that has correctly identified the intelligence that made everything. However with the rise of Sciences as the prime method(function) to explain existence/reality ...religions & "the gods" were rebranded as nonsense,fantasy, fiction, superstition, fairy tales from the mind of Man and is the complete opposite to the cold hard facts & truths from the science. But again, Religion is a natural phenomena because Man knows the origin of abstract & physical Functions Man will always believe in a soul/spirit and a supernatural entity that made everything ... because everything in the Universe are designed functions. Either all of the religions are wrong or there is one that has correctly identified the intelligence that made everything. Abiogenesis, evolution, and any natural origin theories ... are not only factually wrong ... but are religions( organized firm beliefs in the "unnatural" origin of the universe). It is a belief in the unnatural ... to claim nature & natural processes can make & operate a a simple abstract or physical function and make this function more complex. it is a belief in the unnatural ... to claim there are multiverses, or universes within universes or universes originating for mathematics. Science is limited to natural phenomena. You can only use science to prove something that is not of our Universe ... by causal links ... to a natural phenomena. The universe & Life ... are natural phenomena .. and thermodynamic systems(functions). This is how you use science to prove SUPERNATURAL intelligence made the Universe & Life. Provide a clear causal link to a natural phenomena. And then you can prove a existence of a soul/spirit and finally determine the what Man is ( body & soul) and his Mind. And when you're done with the science, ... you will clearly identify a religion that is clearly correct and is consistent with the science.
@@ROForeverMan well, i expect some courage of them to get their heads from Judeo-Christian concepts of God and see what other cultures have thought about it...
To me the difficulty or even impossibility of defining God is due to our limited senses and constrains of our Egos. Our brains are limited by ego and cultural concepts we are thought from childhood. We are also limited by how we interact with reality. To contemplate something like a God we would need to perceive the universe as pure conscience, not trapped in our current bodies, not limited by our poor sensory organs and not biased by a culture that tries to map everything to a known or familiar concept (such as an anthropomorphic entity). Some drugs - such as DMT - do just that. To me that is the tool or the first step to contemplate the existence of a creator. It could result in just another trap or illusion, but I cannot think of anything better while approaching this topic. All formes of organized religion fail miserably in this task.
@@ROForeverMan *"DMT actually shows you that you are God. Or more correctly: I am God." ... DMT is a powerful hallucinogen and nothing more. People think it's something "more" because of the profound experience, but at the end of the day it's just a drug that alters your perception and senses. The moment some new hallucinogen is developed that's more powerful than DMT, people will start claiming that this new drug is what really shows you that you are God. People who believe that DMT is a pathway to God are no different than those who believe in God. Everybody wants to find something beyond "reality" that they can believe in.
@@ROForeverMan *"So in this sense DMT reveals that you are God, not merely in a "unicorn"-type of hallucination."* ... I'm going to politely bow out of this discussion because it will undoubtedly end up like a debate with a Flat-Earther. If a drug has convinced you that you are God, ... _then good for you!_
The underlying and permeating Quantum Field of Information which generated all things, exists within all things, and all things exist within it. Through itself, it generated itself from "nothing". Nothing is still = Something. Therefor even when nothing existed, something still did.
@@ROForeverMan those are known variable before your parents brought you into this world. Suffering is always caused by man depriving other men resources. A tsunami hit poor village is given new homes, schools etc are provided by benevolent leader. They are happier post-tsunsmi than pre-tsunami A childhood illness given top class treatment and social support becomes a bearable hurdle. Some people do far better after a tragedy than before it. It all depends on what men do to other men. Suffering is from men hording resources God gave or selfish decisions men make on behalf of others. Man can always be traced as the cause in a root cause analysis of each case.
I personally believe the "God" of the bible is just a metaphor for what is, at best, what I would call "a sentient universe...." What if "God" is just "sentient universe?" Like... People like to think of God as a being, separate from the universe, and can live outside it... Or some such explanation. But what if, instead of seeing God as some physical/metaphysical being, what if God is just a universe that is self-aware? I feel like that isn't a betrayal to neither science nor religion. Given the idea that the universe goes through cycles of expansion and contraction, one could theorize that the force behind this change of state could be considered fairly similar to the idea of God.
Get outta here with your potato or donkey arguments. Consciousness is simply a function of the MIND of an entity. Man & animals are physical entities with a physical Mind ( brain) and a consciousness of the physical environment. But Man is the only known intelligence in the Universe .. with a brain clearly fine tuned to separate the MIND of Man from that of Animals. The Mind of Man ... is more than just the brain .. because Chimps share 99% of Human DNA has not the mind & body to think & do 1% of what Man can do. The Universe is entity with a Mind. The Universe is simply a physical Function composed entirely of physical Functions. The Universe & Man are thermodynamic Systems. All thermodynamic Systems ... are Functions with set purpose, properties, form, design & processes ... and originate from the SURROUNDING System(s) which must provide the matter, energy, space,time & Laws to exist & to function. The Universe is a Natural System .. that began is expanding in .. an UNNATURAL System, with unnatural Laws & an unnatural intelligence that made every function in the Universe.. God is an UNNATURAL entity with the MIND ... of an intelligence. The Mind of an intelligence is UNNATURAL & non-physical. The Mind of Man is physical( brain) & non-physical ( soul). An intelligence ( like God, Man & Angels) has a mind, free will and a Nature to think & do good or evil. The Nature is determined by free will, and influences the choices made. Man's nature is associated with the body. The Nature starts good & innocent, but over time, man will corrupt his Nature by thinking & doing evil. This is inevitable of every single Human being ... because the body of Man is his Nature and has been corrupted by the original ancestors of the Human Race. This is why Jesus ( Son of God) had to be born of a virgin and NOT have a corrupted body. Jesus would have sinned if He actually was descended from King David. Jesus( Son of God) confirmed in the New Testament that the Mind of Man is body & soul. And the nature of man is the body. Law is only used on an intelligence with a corrupted Nature. You do not need Law if you have a good & pure nature. The Law is written on you heart & brain.
Anything that is not eternal, that does not account for the moral values that we cherish, that lacks consciousness, that does not possess and control unimaginable power, that lacks intelligence as we know it, that is subject to decay as in entropy, that does not account for the purpose of everything conceivable, that is limited and controlled by the laws of nature, that does not explain and remedy the chaos in the human society, can in no way be God in the true sense of the word.
if god is the universe," imagine one sitting in a house with infinite many windows, and one can look through all at once. but when one's view is beyond the window one will stall on this point of view. so one will be divided to be all things at once as a separate element that don't know about one."
Human's temptation would not exists if there is nothing to be tempted with. God do not participate in the evil on Earth. Evil and good exist on Earth to test believers. This life is a test for believers in Islam.
God can never be understood, only experienced. All of these concepts are just interpretive models that are correct only to the extent they can aid you in achieving a meaningful and transformational exposure to the Divine. We waste so much time intellectualizing when we could be meditating or taking high doses of psilocybin or smoking DMT and then reporting what we saw and felt. Only by comparing accounts of our direct, personal experiences and looking for congruencies will we improve our models, and thus get a little closer to an accurate idea of our real ontological position. Endlessly poring over old maps is no substitute for getting your boots dirty exploring the territories!
What makes a God present? the same concepts that made language, mathematics, time, understanding, to a complex unit of evolving existence, recognition. It could be more, if more ideas were created.
IMO, Consciousness has and will always exist. Consciousness is an energy inherant to all existence. The morality aspect is irrelevant because it's a human concept. Consciousness imparts it's infinite creativity upon the physical world and allows us to do whatever we want with our own little piece of it.
Consciousness is a product of a living brain, that's it. Yes it's amazing and somewhat mystifying, but it's just the product of a living brain. Can you show me an example of consciousness withhout a brain to produce it?
@@OptimumGrow I'd be glad to. Plants, single celled organisms. There are plenty of examples of consciousness without a brain. How do you explain explain quantum entanglement? How are those particles connected? It's Consciousness.
@@Kostly So, as you've started to demonstrate, one must continually finesse the definition of "Consciousness" to get it to a point where it would align with any of the things you have attributed to it in your initial comment... As to quantum entanglement, it's an intriguing area of theoretical research, but to the extent that we can even prove any of it, I don't see what it has to do with consciousness, other than the fact that the brain is made of atoms which are engaged in the phenomenon. But by all means, please do the research to prove any of your claims and you will be first in line for a Nobel Prize!
@@OptimumGrow My point of bringing up quantum entanglement is that all things large and small have a connection and the simplest answer for me is a universal, fundamental consciousness which everything existing bubbles out from. Consciousness is like a lattice that the vines of materialism can grow upon. You're a materialist. I am not. We disagree on the nature of consciousness. End of story.
@@Kostly It's comforting to have the perfect answer, but be aware that a 'logically valid' explanation isn't proof of itself... To each his own, but you have too many fuzzy words and unexplained connections for this "materialist" 😅
The notion of god or gods belongs to the infancy of our species and the Marvel universe / similar fiction … All that matters is physics and determinism.
Pantheism and Panentheism are both MUCH BROADER concepts than are being explored here. Within Hinduism, Judaism, and Christianity (and I'm sure others) there are both pantheistic and panentheistic streams of theology that fit within their respective frameworks. They are definitely not "one size fits all" consepts. Even within the different religions, there are variations that both compliment and contradict each other. (Haha...like all of religion really. At least some of them are more universalist in nature and not arrogantly proclaiming to be the end all and be all TRUTH, and mostly accept empirical scientific facts and theories.)
Panentheism is accurate when describing what God is and how this God is a part of the universe and influences it. To understand it one has to view reality from 2 dimensions. The first being the singularity or the frequency domain of minds. This domain is the domain of Gods - autonomous minds existing eternally in a singularity with no space or time inhibitions between them. This interaction between minds in this unextended domain of frequency caused the Big Bang and hence the birth of space and time. The universe has a beginning which was started by the Big Bang event but existence itself is without beginning nor end. A major mistake most make is to define existence only in the context of space, time and matter. Energy, mental energy is eternal and can never not exist. It always existed and will exist even when space, time and matter no longer exist. It is in this way that Panentheism is right, in that God is the universe that can be sensed and then some. All of this is captured beautifully by Fourier forward and inverse transform which shows how frequency information (from the singularity) can be transformed into space time information and for this the reverse is also true. Minds are living, mathematical entities of infinite energy existing eternally in the singularity where they combine their energy content to generate the domain of space and time. The same way your individual mind generates your dream world and all the illusions of space, time and matter in it. Your dream world feels real to you while you are asleep because it is generated by your own individual mind while the universe feels real for every mind observing it because it was generated by our collective minds, by all our mental energy contents combined. So in essence the universe is our collective dream.
No because the Abrahamic faiths define God as eternal uncaused cause that create the universe. God is outside the universe per se. Not limited to our perception, logic or our universe. So no dawg
Universe is physical manifestation of conscious divine energy. Electric energy doesn't take part in any actions but without its presence there can't be any actions. We act by his presence. Evil is man made. It just follows the cosmic order. We reap what we sow.
Yes science can explain the truth that no physical thing can make or direct itself and only your Creator can perfectly cover for you Himself and remake you again from the inside out by the power of His true word as no one else can since everything you do is on and against your Creator. If there is credit to be given for anything, the credit goes to the Creator.
Some believe life characterized by suffering and death is an experience of evil (the fallen world away from God). The Religious Law is to never return evil for evil. Hence, Christ on the Cross and His Resurrection reveal the way of Theosis.
I would like to introduce to you the ignostic mindset (Paul Kurtz) - There are many different concepts of "God". An agnostic claims that a human can NOT KNOW if there is or isn't one. But he seems to know what "God" is. The ignostic doesn't know. When asked if he is a believer, he replies "First tell me what you are talking about, then I'll tell you if I accept it. If you tell me that "God" is the sum of all that is good, then I will accept it, but I don't think you should call that "God". That only confuses the matter.)
If evil did not exist then humans could not experience the higher level of consciousness the ability and opportunity to choose between good and evil produces. If only good existed and there was no choice in life then humans would be more like robots living in a semi unconscious state. We have the ability to choose our personalities and develop it throughout our lives. This can not be done without a choice between good and evil. Lets get past something quick: It is obvious when looking at the design of the human body and other things that some kind of intelligent force or mind is involved in that design. Some people will deny that 1 + 1 = 2 and some will deny that the Earth is not flat. Similairly some will deny the obvious ovservable fact that there is some kind of creative intelligence involved in our existence. To explain more about why evil even exists: Some men when they want a woman will attempt to destroy all compitition as his solution to keep her. Bad men will fight off other men an even kill them to keep them away from her. A good man on the other hand will invite the other men, the compitition, to his house along with the woman he likes, so she can choose freely. A good man knows that if under those conditions she chose him she really loves him. Evil is less concerned about what is really in the heart and is more superficial. The creator allows evil to exist , and probably created the potential for evil to exist himsel for reasons like that. So we can have higher consciousness and the ability to write and rewrite our programs IE personalities. I did write a little booklet long ago to summarize some of my findings on ths kind of topic. Happy treasure hunting, finding the truth is not for lazy people.
(1:30) *YN: **_"How can we say God is identical to the universe?"_* ... The first thing you do is swap out the word _"God"_ with _"Information"_ because that's what people mistakenly believed is God. Theism defines God as an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent entity with his index finger rigidly poised above the smite button on his computer. So, what happens when we assign these same attributes to "Information?" *Omnipotent* (all-power): There is an established amount of energy the in the universe. This closed, balanced system of energy represents "information." There cannot be any more energy, nor can there be any less, so all of the information that energy represents meets the definition of "all-power" (omnipotence). *Omniscient* (all-knowing): Everything in existence is comprised of "information." Whatever information is present at any given time represents all available information. You cannot know something that isn't also known by existence because whatever you know is also "information" which is necessarily added to the database of Existence. Since Existence holds all available information within this database, then this meets the definition of "all-knowing" (Omniscient). *Omnipresent* (present everywhere): Everything that exist is comprised of "information." The universe is defined as "everything that exists," so the information that makes up the universe meets the definition of being "present everywhere" (Omnipresent). "Existence" surprisingly makes sense the instant you view it all as "Information," ... _even God!_
@@ROForeverMan *"I am God."* ... You are "information." Your comment is also information that has been added to the collective database of "Existence." Whatever you are thinking right now is also information that gets added to the collective. The font, characters, sentence, the time of submission, the placement in this thread, and even your *"I 💌EURODANCE"* emoji equal information that is eternally stored within this database.
@@ROForeverMan *"To be more precise, is meaning, not information."* ... "Meaning" is also information. "Meaningful" and "meaningless" are merely two forms of information used to define some other form of information.
@@ROForeverMan *"Technically, "information" is defined as something that you can store in a computer in the form of 0 and 1."* ... Yes, binary data is but one of many forms of information. *"But the fact that you see that image as either a duck or a rabbit is something beyond that, is a meaning that takes place in consciousness."* ... Your subjective experience and interpretation of all sensory data you encounter is also information. Whatever meaning you assign to your experiences is also information that gets added to the collective database of existence. Existence takes the information generated by 8 billion humans (and over 10 quadrillion animals and insects) and uses this information to further the evolution of "Existence." Logically speaking, "information" is more fundamental than "meaning" because meaning is information at its core.
@@ROForeverMan *"Ok, is just semantics, have it your way. But is interesting that you talk about Existence, yet in the other post you don't realize that Existence is synonymous with God."* ... Theism's God cannot exist because God does not abide by the 2nd and 3rd Laws of Existence. An all-knowing, infinitely existing, all-powerful God did not evolve from simplicity to complexity, nor is any evolution necessary for a being that is already all-knowing, all-powerful, and ubiquitous.
@@ROForeverMan *"Who said anything about theism ?"* ... The moment you wrote, _"I am God"_ you invoked theism. Theism is the architect and the definer of God. You can't come along and claim you are God because of the previously established definition. *Example:* Let's say an astronaut landed on another planet and, based on his abilities, intellect, and technology, the inhabitants mistook him for God. However, he know that he is not God nor can he claim that he is. He is merely a human that has been mistakenly thought of as God by a species that doesn't know any better. Likewise, you can't claim that you are theism's God by simply redefining God into whatever you want. Just like the astronaut, you have to abide by established definitions. *"What matters is eternal life. And we have eternal life, since the Self is eternal."* ... You can certainly claim, _"And we have eternal life, since the Self is eternal"_ but you cannot claim to be God, because you don't meet the definition. You'll have to come up with a new definition for whatever you claim to be. *Example:* I am not a Volkswagen nor can I ever claim to be.
Every conclusion this guy comes up with makes me think he doesn't really understand how people come to these ideas, because the problems don't make sense, who said God has to be understandable to intellectuals? Saying there are bad things in the world is not really a serious argument that this world can't be part of something bigger. I don't particularly believe in God and even to me his arguments seem a bit absurd.
Yujin Nagasawa needs to stop using "pantheism" and "panentheism" together in the same sentence. They are completely different from each other in terms of one (pantheism) having no *sentient* Being who is responsible for the creation of the universe, whereas the other (panentheism) does.
My GOD this Guys are ignorant oppotunism his GOD hasnt show Philosophy evidencie . Stupidity guys keep out convecent GOD evidence are lacking honest concept.
You can wrestle with definitions all your life. God was invented by men. Belief in a god puts us back into the thinking of cave men. Evil is a similar concept along with ugly and awful. Words, words words. Evil, beauty, ugliness and good don't exist, all human constructs.
@@ROForeverMan There is pseudo I am of a biocomputer feedback loop (Ego, HAL9000), it's subjected to time. There is a mind of the soul, it operates over multiple bodies of close heritage in different worlds/times. And there is One True Mind over all of that, that contains everything
@@ROForeverMan That's right. Like humans and their isolated minds are just ideas in the One consciousness. But the illusion of isolation is very strong
God is inconceivably one with and different from His material creation, just as fire is inconceivably one with and different from its heat. As far as evil is concerned, it's like turning our back on the sun: we can see only our shadow. In order to see only the light we must turn our face to the sun.
Why does everyone constantly want to reinvent the wheel? The Jews already figured out God in its entirety, to the fullest extent humans are capable of, and anything else you come up with isn't "God." So if you're going to talk about something else, call it something else. People with absolutely zero knowledge or understanding of the Judaic knowledge and understanding of God and resulting questions (good v. evil, etc.) shouldn't be pontificating on what God is or isn't. The Jews already figure it out!
@@ash36551 That takes years and years of study -- decades, lifetimes -- never-ending study, in fact. The sophistication and detail of the Jewish conception and understanding of God is unmatched in human culture and history. Imagine the most brilliant western legal system and minds, the most brilliant philosophical system and minds, and the most brilliant literary theory and minds, put them all together, and then multiply like by 100. That's getting close to the depth and breadth of Judaic thought. I am not Jewish, but I've been exposed to it culturally and through many friends, and there is literally nothing that I've seen that compares. Christianity is like a comic book compared to Heidegger in relation to Judaism, Islam probably equivalent to christianity, maybe slightly more sophisticated - which as we know are both derivative (notably lesser derivatives in my opinion) of the original. It all came from Judaism, they literally wrote the book on the topic, and any western conception of "God" has to start there, again in my opinion. Unfortunately we most often have people privileging and starting from the derivatives, and mostly there from an unlearned position, which is completely backward. Then we get all kinds of strange notions entering the culture about "God," when they haven't even understood the basics - aren't even aware of the basics, in fact, as Judaism has been to great degree marginalized in western culture by the contaminating and hegemonic force of christianity, primarily. So that ignorance is a cause of tremendous confusion. Why not just stay with the original? Well, there are many complex power and race reasons for that, as we have seen throughout Jewish and christian history.
@@ROForeverMan so what is the difference between these instantiatons and the collective consciousness... is ego still part of the universal consciousness, too...
@@ROForeverMan in summary, you claim: "self is eternal, egoless(after DMT), able to unify from fragmanted states(in telepathy), fragmented intantiations in a level are still one but not on it own, and finally, consciousness is paradoxical..." if consciousness doesn't make sense, then maybe, we have to understand it better, that's all...
How about Christians' concept of god, not killing Jesus(pbuh) means there is no "salvation" waiting for Christians? Isn't that make Christians' concept of god as dependable being.
The classic view of God is correct & has no faults. Man is an intelligence ... with a mind & body ... and free will & nature ... to think & do good or evil ... and make abstract & physical Functions with clear purpose, form, function & design. The God of the Jews & Christians created the Universe for Man, made Man in His image to become Children of God, made perfect with a body & soul, made Man with free will, nature & able to pro-Create, ... and ... made Man to live forever with God, so long as Man obeyed one simply rule/Law: "Do not eat from the tree of knowledge, for you will die if you do. Only an intelligence ( like Man) makes rules & Laws ... to provide structure, order, direction, boundaries and repeatable, predictable "ideal" behavior & properties. Law is only made for an intelligence ... because of free will and the NATURE of the intelligence is or will be corrupted. Corrupting one's nature is an act of free will. All nature starts off good & innocent. It is free will ... that keeps the nature "good" or corrupts it with evil thoughts & actions. And it is free will that determines if the nature has a "good" or "evil" influence on the thoughts & actions of Man. Man's nature will always be corrupted because Man was created by God with a body & Soul, and a Mind that is the body & the Soul. This is why Jesus said "Love God with all your MIND, heart & SOUL." The Soul obviousy has a mind & free will, but so too does the body. The corrupted Body of Man is his Nature, and is why we all begin with a good & innocent nature but over time, Man procreates ... and Adam & Eve corrupted the body that makes Man ... and with the Soul is the Mind of Man. If you have a good nature .. you do not need Law ... to behave in an "ideal" predictable, repeatable way. Law is only made for an intelligence that has is will have a corrupted Nature. Man is a natural intelligence with free will & a nature .... made by ... an UNNATURAL intelligence with free will & a nature. God is not to blame for what Man freely chooses to think & do. Man has been given free will ... to accept or reject God & His will & laws All Law must be enforced otherwise there will be chaos & disorder. Man has clearly broken God's Laws, but has not been punished YET ... because of the Nature of God. God loves His sinful creation and does not want any to be lost, and gave us all the choice to believe in God's only begotten Son, or not. This is all very simple. Man was created perfect with free will & nature ... with a body & soul ... able to procreate ... and will live forever if you obey the will & NATURE of God. God has free will to think & do evil, but this is impossible for Him to do because His Nature is permanently pure & good. God can only do good. His will is only for good Stop accepting Man's ways and rejecting God's. Man's nature is corrupt and will pervert what is good unless you choose ... to have a strong moral compass( God, laws, culture) to do good not evil.
@Abe Lincoln _"The God of the Jews & Christians created the Universe for Man "_ I don't think Jws accept your concept of god, as far as Jws and Judaism are concerned, your concept of 'god' and your Christianity and your NT have nothing to do with the God of Abraham. Whereas Jws cannot deny the notion that Quran came from no other than the God of Abraham. Jws accept the notion that Islamic concept of God is superior than that of Judaism. Jws has got dispute whether or not Mohammed(pbuh) was a prophet of God. If Mohammed(pbuh) wasn't a prophet of God, there would be no Quran to come through Mohammed(pbuh).
99.99999% of words were created through a process of assigning symbols to identifiable, self-evident, real-world entities. The word “God” is one of the few exceptions to this process. Thanks to the Christians we have this word “God” now, and everyone’s busy scrambling to find a definition for this word. Everyone’s making their best guess as to what this word actually means. Because whatever the word points to it isn’t identifiable, it’s not self-evident, and it clearly doesn’t exist here in the real world. It has none of the attributes that legitimate words have. When are we going to grow up and get rid of this word “God”? It’s nothing more than “dog” spelled backwards. It’s a futile word in need of annihilation.
@@realitycheck1231 By that logic everything is an idea so I fail to see your point even more. It might not be the fact that you have no point to make. It may just be that your point is so small that I can’t see it.
@@realitycheck1231 That’s your definition of the word “God”. If I asked twenty other people I’d get twenty different definitions. Compare that to the word “apple”. If I ask twenty people what an apple is, I’ll get more or less the same definition. Nobody will describe to me a pear, or a plumb, or any other fruit besides an apple, because the word “apple” is a legitimate word, and a word that everyone agrees on. The word “god” is not a legitimate word. It’s also a word associated with a lot of depravity and suffering, when you consider the crimes against humanity perpetrated by God’s followers. Sex abuse by the Catholic Church, crusades, inquisitions, an eternity of the worst kind of suffering imaginable compliments of God himself (Hell). By contrast, the Gnostics referred to the “True Father” or the “Parents” more as the source of all things. They chose pronouns in referring to the idea of a higher power that weren’t so tainted by use in organized religions. They also gave much more precise definitions for such pronouns. I’m not some kind of materialist/reductionist committed to the idea of a ceramic Universe. I believe in a higher power, but I refuse to insult such a higher power by referring to it with the word “God”.
@@realitycheck1231 The word God doesn’t personally upset me. I just don’t think it’s a legitimate word because of the lack of some kind consensus as to what it means. I also think it’s problematic because of its attachment to organized religion. Though it sounds like we agree on that. The other words you mention are more specific and not as open to interpretation as the word “God”. That’s why I said I find terms like the “True Father”, which is even more specific.
is he teologian? why do you ask him about God? Real God is only The True Lord in Bible. THE PERSON WITH POWER/ENERGY WHO CREATE ALL EXISTANCES, HE IS THE LIGHT, THE SOURCE & REASON OF MEANING OF EVERYTHING, THAT'S WHY GODLORDYHWH IS THE TRIUNITY IN BEING & EXISTANCE & ETERNITY! 😇🙏
1. WRONG QUESTION! it wasn't, (WHY) Does God Exist?.. BUT WHY DO YOU & ATHEIST EXIST?! my answer : ..i will write in few hours 2. BURDEN OF PROOF? EXCEPT! LOOK AT FACT HISTORY OF BIBLE, IT'S FACT REALITY, & WHAT HAPPEN TO ISRAEL LAND, & HOW CHURCH BECOME GLOBAL, BIBLE IN MANY LANGUAGES, SO ALL NATIONS KNOW JESUS & PRAISE HIM GODLORD/YHWH SAVIOUR!.. yeah what atheist need/have to do is only to stay ignorant, keep denial & pretending that everything never happened/existed! 😅😂
is he teologian? why do you ask him about God? Real God is only The True Lord in Bible. THE PERSON WITH POWER/ENERGY WHO CREATE ALL EXISTANCES, HE IS THE LIGHT, THE SOURCE & REASON OF MEANING OF EVERYTHING, THAT'S WHY GODLORDYHWH IS THE TRIUNITY IN BEING & EXISTANCE & ETERNITY! 😇🙏 .. 1. WRONG QUESTION! it wasn't, (WHY) Does God Exist?.. BUT WHY DO YOU & ATHEIST EXIST?! my answer : ..i will write in few hours 2. BURDEN OF PROOF? EXCEPT! LOOK AT FACT HISTORY OF BIBLE, IT'S FACT REALITY, & WHAT HAPPEN TO ISRAEL LAND, & HOW CHURCH BECOME GLOBAL, BIBLE IN MANY LANGUAGES, SO ALL NATIONS KNOW JESUS & PRAISE HIM GODLORD/YHWH SAVIOUR!.. yeah what atheist need/have to do is only to stay ignorant, keep denial & pretending that everything never happened/existed! 😅😂
You have not considered the only correct possibility which is, God transcends the emergence of emergent universes and manifest Himself in many different levels and forms therein, as does His Father, Grandfather, Great Grandfather into eternity. Yet, there is only one God This is correct doctrine.
There is nothing like God. The universe is a creation of God. God controls the universe and everything in and out of it. God hears you and watches you and responds to you if he wills. God has sent revelations to us so that we are guided. The Quran is a revelation and his words to us.
Personally, I'm an atheist. But I do like this one explanation that I heard a long time ago for why God doesnt intervene to prevent "Evil". It went something like this: As a parent, when I teach my kid to ride a bike, I start by holding onto the back of the bike while the child peddles and I run along side. At some point, I have to let go. I know that when I do, my kid will likely fall and skin their knee. Does it make me a bad parent that I let go of the bike? I could run along side and hold onto the bike forever and make sure my kid never falls and gets hurt but then they'd never learn how to ride the bike. So even though I knowingly let my child get hurt, it doesnt make me a bad parent to let go of the bike. I still have trouble believing in God for a bunch of other reasons. But the "Why does God allow evil to exist" question is not one of them.
Number of stars in the universe is greater than number of grains of sand in the entire ocean floor i.e. including sand in the deserts, the God who created that universe nothing but the God of the Quran in HIS majesty and glory. Have you read the Quran?
@LeoB The problem with the label God is that it has never been conceptual well defined. Relgion absolutely has a definition about god that is super limmited and typical human being like. There is so much people dont realize about god and reality and the universe. When it comes to astronomy we are in our kid shoes when it comes to define the label of god we are in our todler or baby outfit. People have no clue about the base of reality that it is based on principles! Those principles bow for nothing as else reality inlcluding god can not be. Reality can have no contradictions towards its own existense she must be perfectly selfsustaining. People look at god as once the ppl that thought earth was flat and u would fall of the planet if you walked long enough in a straight line.
I'm atheist and I am sick of the whole god allowing evil apologists BS. Evil shot the children of Newtown in cold blood. How do you think that explanation would wash with anyone looking for answers there?
Number of stars in the universe is greater than number of grains of sand in the entire ocean floor i.e. including sand in the deserts, the God who created that universe nothing but the God of the Quran in HIS majesty and glory. Have you read the Quran? Quran has got built-in with checksum and entire Quran is multiple of number 19. Mind blowing mathematics.
RoFoMa / No! You are a simple evolved biological entropical structure of a temporary local dynamic aggregate in this miniscule and completely unimportant portion of the neverending Universe that has aquired the simple redundant material function of a redundant introspection material process. From this temporary simple process comes all of your brain illusions, delusions and and cognitive errors.
The best concept of God found in Islam alone. Quran 112-1 Say: He is Allah, the One and Only; Quran 112-2 Allah, the Eternal, Absolute; Quran 112-3 He begetteth not, nor is He begotten; Quran 112-4 And there is none like unto Him. Quran 6:101 To Him is due the primal origin of the heavens and the earth: How can He have a son when He hath no consort? He created all things, and He hath full knowledge of all things. Quran 6:59 And with Him are the keys of the unseen; none knows them except Him. And He knows what is on the land and in the sea. Not a leaf falls but that He knows it. And no grain is there within the darknesses of the earth and no moist or dry [thing] but that it is [written] in a clear record.
For there are human slaves made to worship their false teachers, the one's that are smarter than the rest. You will commit evil in the name of your teachings, for you have not learned to be self confident, self judging, self existing, but you were taken the light off your life, from evil teacher's that know it not any better, and abuse of you as his slave on his lower level of consciousness.
Instead of semi-intellectually claiming everything we don’t understand to be “God”, let’s stay more humble and simply say we don’t understand it (yet).
I certainly agree that it's just a play of words to say that I'm an Atheist or I'm Pantheist.
Any Atheist who isn't Solipsist must believe that Physical Universe is real and that it's all that exist.
I used to say and unnerve people both religious and Dawkins type Atheists by saying that "I believe in God and, I'm Materialist". ..
People assume at first that I'm a Dualist who just doesn't know philosophical terminology...
But when I show them that I know perfectly what I'm talking about
I say that by belief in God I mean scientific (Orch Or and Antonio Damasio experiments among else) belief in Counsciosness that"God" created that way that vanishes under anesthesia and coma and that I fiercely reject immortal soul, After Life, Eucharist miraculous (serrentia marcens really) and all that stuff.
They ask me why don't you call yourself Atheist then?
-Because I believe in God that is One with Laws of Physics doesn't intervene and created nature of Counsciosness that way that it vanishes under anesthesia and coma!
And it upsets all sort of people
Dawkins type Atheists are upset that I'm defending G.. word using scientific argument that they can't laugh off the way they laugh Inteligent Design (because denying my argument for God is denying science nearly as established as Darwins Theory and proclaiming themselves Solipsists) so they are just confused.
And religious people just feel tricked "you say you believe in God" but that's the last thing I as a Christian or a Dualistów would call God "
That's funny but real
Thank you for this presentation on the nature of God. Here is an excerpt from The One God, a compilation of revelations, received by Marshall Vian Summers over the period between 2007 and 2015. This book "teaches us to go beyond our concepts and beliefs about God in order to explore our own experience of the presence and mystery of the Divine reality in our lives. The One God opens a new vantage point from which to see ourselves and the world in which we live... From this vantage point we can glimpse back into the origins of the universe and gain a new understanding of the great Separation from God that gave rise to the evolution of all life and that ultimately explains our presence in the world at this time... The One God offers a unique experience and remembrance of the timeless state of Creation from which we have all come and to which we will all return. This represents a new experience of God. Instead of being focused on pleasing God, fearing God, talking to God, fighting for God or running from God, we are invited into a new and deeper engagement with the mysterious Presence of the Creator and the power of Knowledge that the Creator has given us. Here we find an intimate form of redemption--redemption from a life of separation, pain and confusion. Here we can begin to experience who we really are, where we have come from and why we are in the world at this time... To come to God then is to come to Knowledge within yourself, for this is what calls you to God." (from the Introduction and first chapter of The One God, MVS)
I wish the guest discussed the transcendent aspect of God in panentheism.. He discussed only the imminent which is pantheism.
It seems clear, to me, that any conception of God that does not include a way for humans to avoid extinction cannot be God in any normal sense. Similarly, any conception of God that demonstrates how humans can avoid extinction, this conception of God has rightfully earned the title.
A chill just ran down my spine.
At 6:05 Nagasawa: "There is no ontological difference between what pantheists believe and what atheists believe."
Robert: "Do you believe that?"
Nagasawa: "Umm no, I think pantheists and panentheists can claim that their views are different from atheism. There's something special about the universe..."
Yes! It's the *knowing how to be* that aligns the directions of causation, the top-down with the bottom-up. Atheism assumes materialism, and that the objects of existence are sufficient to explain a solely bottom-up direction of causation, in a random, dumb-luck, natural selection kind of way (despite violating the laws of entropy). But when we factor in "knowing how to be", we account for the top-down direction of causation that requires agents (holons, mind-bodies) to respond *meaningfully* to the cues with which they engage. The way that culture, and gender roles in culture, are integral to human psychology, identity and self.
No entropy problem. No mind-body problem. Neither god nor soul required.
Love Robert's inquisitorial style. "Do you believe that?" Getting to the heart of the problem.
Can you make it more what do you mean?
@@maxd3028 There is much to unpack. To begin with, my analysis factors in the semiotics of CS Peirce ("knowing how to be" relates to Peirce and pragmatism). The concept of *Being* is one that some philosophers have taken seriously in the past (e.g., Heidegger, Wittgenstein), and I think this is a notion that merits being returned to centre stage, for example, in the context of agency theory. That doesn't help you, does it :) That's ok, check out my previous comments on this forum if you have time. Sometimes I indulge, and unpack my thinking a little more, for example most recently, in Cosmology and Creation Episode 1805, 15 June.
Truth is simple, it only appears complex. - Wald Wassermann, Physicist
Truth can contain no contradictions.
@@blijebij Correct. Love your name too!
@@ROForeverMan It is a nice piece you have written (it is well written) but its not my cup of tea. I look from a totally different angle and experience. Your passion and love for your topic of interest made me happy though. I liked that very much.
@@ROForeverMan That does not mean reality is contradictive to its own nature. In my view that is just your interpretation.
@@ROForeverMan There is a difference between 'is contradictive' and something looking contradictive on first sight, meaning it is your interpretation. form and formless can be perfectly existing together within a system, without the system itself being contradictive. form&formless are complementair structures and fall within the possibilities of the degree of freedom of reality. That does not mean reality it self contains something contradictive to its own foundation. For me that is an interpretation you make, or how you experience it.
Life comes from life. Ideas come from minds. Software requires a coder. It's simply devastating for the materialist.
Evil is what you choose to do. Harm is the result of the fallen world subject to entropy since God can’t bless evil.
I 💕 Satan
@@richardsylvanus2717 Sorry to hear about that. You must not have understanding either.
I think the universe fits all the requirements for a God in that - The universe gives us life , The universe controls our lives And the universe ends our life. Also peculiarly , the universe or reality is vast and eternal, yet it is experienced by the individual in the smallest private, most limited and purely subjective manner . It divides itself into the smallest figure, to fit each individual personal experience. Right down to the mosquito.
God is a myth. Jesus was a fraud
As an atheist I often think that the Aztecs and other sun worshiping civilisations had the best concept of God. After all we are made from stuff forged in the centre of stars.
The Universe is a FINITE isolated thermodynamic System ... that began & is expanding in ... an UNNATURAL Systems that must provide the matter, energy, space, time & Laws of Nature for a thermodynamic System to exist.
A thermodynamic System ... is a Function ... made by an intelligence.
And intelligence ... has a mind, free will & Nature ... to think & do good or evil.
Law is only made for an intelligence ... because of free will & an evil/corrupt Nature.
A natural intelligence( Man) with free will & a nature ... was made by an UNNATURAL intelligence with free will & a nature.
The mind of an intelligence is UNNATURAL & non physical.
But Mind of Man is physical ( brain) and nonphysical ( soul)
The Nature of Man ... is the physical mind ( body).
And Man was created perfect to procreate with an immortal body & soul ... until Mn broke God's Law ... and corrupted the body & the Nature of Man. This is why Jesus could not have a corrupt body. Mind of Man is the body & soul .. and everybody will sin because the body has been corrupted and is the physical Mind of Man.,
@@abelincoln8885 I like that part about law only made for intelligence. I don’t think anybody has ever put it that way before. And we know law is made for intelligence because intelligence can manipulate the law for its own intelligent reasons. For instance , the universe supposedly is constantly thermodynamically degrading so therefore when we were born, we should immediately wither away and die. But it is the mind that counteracts the second law of thermodynamics and tells the body to build itself up, to obtain sustenance and resist the second law of thermodynamics. The mind counter acts what we call physical laws-because awareness always supersedes what it is aware of. We work against the universe which if we were natural in total it would be like the universe working against itself.
But I think the first step in Opening the up mind towards the truth is to realize that whatever the universe is it can’t be what we call it ; clouds are not clouds, planets are that planets and stars are not stars. The perspective from the universe-its integral inherency cant be harnessed by human language.
@@MrSanford65 There is nothing complex about any of this .. unless you freely choose to make it so.
Science completely relies on the Laws of Nature for Man to explain natural phenomena ... to explain existence.
Science is a Function
Law is a Function
The Human Body is a Function
Natural phenomena are Functions
The Universe is a thermodynamic System ... which is a Function.
Man has known for thousands of years that only an entity or intelligence like Man ... makes rules & Laws ... and anything that is clearly a FUNCTION with design & purpose.
This fact about the origin of abstract & physical Functions ... predate the Sciences by thousands of years .. and had been manifested in the form of religions & multiple "gods." This is why religions are a natural phenomena that will always be observed by most people.
Either all of the religions are wrong or there is one that has correctly identified the intelligence that made everything.
However with the rise of Sciences as the prime method(function) to explain existence/reality ...religions & "the gods" were rebranded as nonsense,fantasy, fiction, superstition, fairy tales from the mind of Man and is the complete opposite to the cold hard facts & truths from the science.
But again, Religion is a natural phenomena because Man knows the origin of abstract & physical Functions
Man will always believe in a soul/spirit and a supernatural entity that made everything ... because everything in the Universe are designed functions.
Either all of the religions are wrong or there is one that has correctly identified the intelligence that made everything.
Abiogenesis, evolution, and any natural origin theories ... are not only factually wrong ... but are religions( organized firm beliefs in the "unnatural" origin of the universe).
It is a belief in the unnatural ... to claim nature & natural processes can make & operate a a simple abstract or physical function and make this function more complex.
it is a belief in the unnatural ... to claim there are multiverses, or universes within universes or universes originating for mathematics.
Science is limited to natural phenomena. You can only use science to prove something that is not of our Universe ... by causal links ... to a natural phenomena.
The universe & Life ... are natural phenomena .. and thermodynamic systems(functions). This is how you use science to prove SUPERNATURAL intelligence made the Universe & Life. Provide a clear causal link to a natural phenomena. And then you can prove a existence of a soul/spirit and finally determine the what Man is ( body & soul) and his Mind.
And when you're done with the science, ... you will clearly identify a religion that is clearly correct and is consistent with the science.
This is actually a good interview tbh
this conversation sounds like first year students of philosophy class, who still haven't break through puberty, would have.
for better or worse.
Hilarious
It’s called the dumbing down process, and is very deliberate..
@@ROForeverMan well, i expect some courage of them to get their heads from Judeo-Christian concepts of God and see what other cultures have thought about it...
"Monism" sounds more scientific and logical than pantheism and panentheism.
To me the difficulty or even impossibility of defining God is due to our limited senses and constrains of our Egos.
Our brains are limited by ego and cultural concepts we are thought from childhood. We are also limited by how we interact with reality.
To contemplate something like a God we would need to perceive the universe as pure conscience, not trapped in our current bodies, not limited by our poor sensory organs and not biased by a culture that tries to map everything to a known or familiar concept (such as an anthropomorphic entity).
Some drugs - such as DMT - do just that. To me that is the tool or the first step to contemplate the existence of a creator. It could result in just another trap or illusion, but I cannot think of anything better while approaching this topic. All formes of organized religion fail miserably in this task.
God is Santa Claus for adults
@@ROForeverMan *"DMT actually shows you that you are God. Or more correctly: I am God."
... DMT is a powerful hallucinogen and nothing more. People think it's something "more" because of the profound experience, but at the end of the day it's just a drug that alters your perception and senses. The moment some new hallucinogen is developed that's more powerful than DMT, people will start claiming that this new drug is what really shows you that you are God.
People who believe that DMT is a pathway to God are no different than those who believe in God. Everybody wants to find something beyond "reality" that they can believe in.
@@ROForeverMan *"So in this sense DMT reveals that you are God, not merely in a "unicorn"-type of hallucination."*
... I'm going to politely bow out of this discussion because it will undoubtedly end up like a debate with a Flat-Earther. If a drug has convinced you that you are God, ... _then good for you!_
The underlying and permeating Quantum Field of Information which generated all things, exists within all things, and all things exist within it.
Through itself, it generated itself from "nothing". Nothing is still = Something.
Therefor even when nothing existed, something still did.
@@ROForeverMan 🥱🤷♂️ it's all the same. No thing and All things are the same thing.
I think people overthink some of these things. I don't think it's much of an issue.
Evil and Suffering is not a problem, both of these are from man on man injustice/violence by commission or omission
@@ROForeverMan those are known variable before your parents brought you into this world.
Suffering is always caused by man depriving other men resources.
A tsunami hit poor village is given new homes, schools etc are provided by benevolent leader. They are happier post-tsunsmi than pre-tsunami
A childhood illness given top class treatment and social support becomes a bearable hurdle.
Some people do far better after a tragedy than before it.
It all depends on what men do to other men. Suffering is from men hording resources God gave or selfish decisions men make on behalf of others. Man can always be traced as the cause in a root cause analysis of each case.
I personally believe the "God" of the bible is just a metaphor for what is, at best, what I would call "a sentient universe...."
What if "God" is just "sentient universe?" Like... People like to think of God as a being, separate from the universe, and can live outside it... Or some such explanation. But what if, instead of seeing God as some physical/metaphysical being, what if God is just a universe that is self-aware? I feel like that isn't a betrayal to neither science nor religion. Given the idea that the universe goes through cycles of expansion and contraction, one could theorize that the force behind this change of state could be considered fairly similar to the idea of God.
Get outta here with your potato or donkey arguments.
Consciousness is simply a function of the MIND of an entity.
Man & animals are physical entities with a physical Mind ( brain) and a consciousness of the physical environment.
But Man is the only known intelligence in the Universe .. with a brain clearly fine tuned to separate the MIND of Man from that of Animals.
The Mind of Man ... is more than just the brain .. because Chimps share 99% of Human DNA has not the mind & body to think & do 1% of what Man can do.
The Universe is entity with a Mind.
The Universe is simply a physical Function composed entirely of physical Functions.
The Universe & Man are thermodynamic Systems.
All thermodynamic Systems ... are Functions with set purpose, properties, form, design & processes ... and originate from the SURROUNDING System(s) which must provide the matter, energy, space,time & Laws to exist & to function.
The Universe is a Natural System .. that began is expanding in .. an UNNATURAL System, with unnatural Laws & an unnatural intelligence that made every function in the Universe..
God is an UNNATURAL entity with the MIND ... of an intelligence.
The Mind of an intelligence is UNNATURAL & non-physical.
The Mind of Man is physical( brain) & non-physical ( soul).
An intelligence ( like God, Man & Angels) has a mind, free will and a Nature to think & do good or evil.
The Nature is determined by free will, and influences the choices made.
Man's nature is associated with the body. The Nature starts good & innocent, but over time, man will corrupt his Nature by thinking & doing evil. This is inevitable of every single Human being ... because the body of Man is his Nature and has been corrupted by the original ancestors of the Human Race.
This is why Jesus ( Son of God) had to be born of a virgin and NOT have a corrupted body. Jesus would have sinned if He actually was descended from King David.
Jesus( Son of God) confirmed in the New Testament that the Mind of Man is body & soul. And the nature of man is the body.
Law is only used on an intelligence with a corrupted Nature.
You do not need Law if you have a good & pure nature. The Law is written on you heart & brain.
Anything that is not eternal, that does not account for the moral values that we cherish, that lacks consciousness, that does not possess and control unimaginable power, that lacks intelligence as we know it, that is subject to decay as in entropy, that does not account for the purpose of everything conceivable, that is limited and controlled by the laws of nature, that does not explain and remedy the chaos in the human society, can in no way be God in the true sense of the word.
if god is the universe," imagine one sitting in a house with infinite many windows, and one can look through all at once.
but when one's view is beyond the window one will stall on this point of view.
so one will be divided to be all things at once as a separate element that don't know about one."
The Universe IS God indeed,God IS da Universe!Those who are not sure,go for baptism......👍
Awesome 😎
Actually life would be more convenient word to describe the existence
It's just that simple ..
2:19 that's no argument at all. Guy just created it from thinn air.
If evil cannot be eradicated in the world, is it moral harnessing it for something worthwhile?
Human's temptation would not exists if there is nothing to be tempted with. God do not participate in the evil on Earth.
Evil and good exist on Earth to test believers. This life is a test for believers in Islam.
God can never be understood, only experienced. All of these concepts are just interpretive models that are correct only to the extent they can aid you in achieving a meaningful and transformational exposure to the Divine. We waste so much time intellectualizing when we could be meditating or taking high doses of psilocybin or smoking DMT and then reporting what we saw and felt. Only by comparing accounts of our direct, personal experiences and looking for congruencies will we improve our models, and thus get a little closer to an accurate idea of our real ontological position. Endlessly poring over old maps is no substitute for getting your boots dirty exploring the territories!
What makes a God present? the same concepts that made language, mathematics, time, understanding, to a complex unit of evolving existence, recognition.
It could be more, if more ideas were created.
IMO, Consciousness has and will always exist. Consciousness is an energy inherant to all existence. The morality aspect is irrelevant because it's a human concept. Consciousness imparts it's infinite creativity upon the physical world and allows us to do whatever we want with our own little piece of it.
Consciousness is a product of a living brain, that's it. Yes it's amazing and somewhat mystifying, but it's just the product of a living brain. Can you show me an example of consciousness withhout a brain to produce it?
@@OptimumGrow I'd be glad to. Plants, single celled organisms. There are plenty of examples of consciousness without a brain. How do you explain explain quantum entanglement? How are those particles connected? It's Consciousness.
@@Kostly So, as you've started to demonstrate, one must continually finesse the definition of "Consciousness" to get it to a point where it would align with any of the things you have attributed to it in your initial comment... As to quantum entanglement, it's an intriguing area of theoretical research, but to the extent that we can even prove any of it, I don't see what it has to do with consciousness, other than the fact that the brain is made of atoms which are engaged in the phenomenon. But by all means, please do the research to prove any of your claims and you will be first in line for a Nobel Prize!
@@OptimumGrow My point of bringing up quantum entanglement is that all things large and small have a connection and the simplest answer for me is a universal, fundamental consciousness which everything existing bubbles out from. Consciousness is like a lattice that the vines of materialism can grow upon. You're a materialist. I am not. We disagree on the nature of consciousness. End of story.
@@Kostly It's comforting to have the perfect answer, but be aware that a 'logically valid' explanation isn't proof of itself... To each his own, but you have too many fuzzy words and unexplained connections for this "materialist" 😅
The notion of god or gods belongs to the infancy of our species and the Marvel universe / similar fiction …
All that matters is physics and determinism.
lo esencial es invisible a los ojos, solo se ve con el corazon
Pantheism and Panentheism are both MUCH BROADER concepts than are being explored here. Within Hinduism, Judaism, and Christianity (and I'm sure others) there are both pantheistic and panentheistic streams of theology that fit within their respective frameworks. They are definitely not "one size fits all" consepts. Even within the different religions, there are variations that both compliment and contradict each other. (Haha...like all of religion really. At least some of them are more universalist in nature and not arrogantly proclaiming to be the end all and be all TRUTH, and mostly accept empirical scientific facts and theories.)
the best alternative concept and probably the closest to truth
"She is Black"
Panentheism is accurate when describing what God is and how this God is a part of the universe and influences it. To understand it one has to view reality from 2 dimensions. The first being the singularity or the frequency domain of minds. This domain is the domain of Gods - autonomous minds existing eternally in a singularity with no space or time inhibitions between them.
This interaction between minds in this unextended domain of frequency caused the Big Bang and hence the birth of space and time. The universe has a beginning which was started by the Big Bang event but existence itself is without beginning nor end. A major mistake most make is to define existence only in the context of space, time and matter.
Energy, mental energy is eternal and can never not exist. It always existed and will exist even when space, time and matter no longer exist. It is in this way that Panentheism is right, in that God is the universe that can be sensed and then some. All of this is captured beautifully by Fourier forward and inverse transform which shows how frequency information (from the singularity) can be transformed into space time information and for this the reverse is also true.
Minds are living, mathematical entities of infinite energy existing eternally in the singularity where they combine their energy content to generate the domain of space and time. The same way your individual mind generates your dream world and all the illusions of space, time and matter in it.
Your dream world feels real to you while you are asleep because it is generated by your own individual mind while the universe feels real for every mind observing it because it was generated by our collective minds, by all our mental energy contents combined. So in essence the universe is our collective dream.
No because the Abrahamic faiths define God as eternal uncaused cause that create the universe. God is outside the universe per se. Not limited to our perception, logic or our universe. So no dawg
Start with defining God! For now all thinkers fail at that. Cause the definition for God is so primitive and not consistent.
He is considering pantheism with our current knowledge of physics and time as if we understood it all... Must be a phylosopher.
How can one see God from the time perspective; past, present and future?
Universe is physical manifestation of conscious divine energy. Electric energy doesn't take part in any actions but without its presence there can't be any actions. We act by his presence. Evil is man made. It just follows the cosmic order. We reap what we sow.
Manifested reality is liable to continues change and decay. Just follow the laws of nature.Soul is beyond any suffering.
Manifested reality is liable to continues change and decay. Just follow the laws of nature.Soul is beyond any suffering.
Manifested reality is liable to continues change and decay. Just follow the laws of nature.Soul is beyond any suffering.
Manifested reality is liable to continues change and decay. Just follow the laws of nature.Soul is beyond any suffering.
Manifested reality is liable to continues change and decay. Just follow the laws of nature.Soul is beyond any suffering.
Yes science can explain the truth that no physical thing can make or direct itself and only your Creator can perfectly cover for you Himself and remake you again from the inside out by the power of His true word as no one else can since everything you do is on and against your Creator. If there is credit to be given for anything, the credit goes to the Creator.
@@ROForeverMan God has character.
@@ROForeverMan *"What does that mean ?"*
... I thought you were God? You should already know what he means.
@@ROForeverMan It means you still have things to learn.
@@ROForeverMan It means you have a lot to learn.
There is no power that is not from God.
I have met God. You have too.
Alternative concepts of God? The first has got to be Shermer's Last Law.
No point to waist time discuss god, human cannot define god, approve or disapprove god,
Read my post below for the definition of God in Islam.
The fact god can't be proven, is proof enough
This guy didn't make his homework properly.
Huh?
Some believe life characterized by suffering and death is an experience of evil (the fallen world away from God). The Religious Law is to never return evil for evil. Hence, Christ on the Cross and His Resurrection reveal the way of Theosis.
I would like to introduce to you the ignostic mindset (Paul Kurtz) - There are many different concepts of "God". An agnostic claims that a human can NOT KNOW if there is or isn't one. But he seems to know what "God" is. The ignostic doesn't know. When asked if he is a believer, he replies "First tell me what you are talking about, then I'll tell you if I accept it. If you tell me that "God" is the sum of all that is good, then I will accept it, but I don't think you should call that "God". That only confuses the matter.)
If evil did not exist then humans could not experience the higher level of consciousness the ability and opportunity to choose between good and evil produces. If only good existed and there was no choice in life then humans would be more like robots living in a semi unconscious state. We have the ability to choose our personalities and develop it throughout our lives. This can not be done without a choice between good and evil. Lets get past something quick: It is obvious when looking at the design of the human body and other things that some kind of intelligent force or mind is involved in that design. Some people will deny that 1 + 1 = 2 and some will deny that the Earth is not flat. Similairly some will deny the obvious ovservable fact that there is some kind of creative intelligence involved in our existence.
To explain more about why evil even exists:
Some men when they want a woman will attempt to destroy all compitition as his solution to keep her. Bad men will fight off other men an even kill them to keep them away from her. A good man on the other hand will invite the other men, the compitition, to his house along with the woman he likes, so she can choose freely. A good man knows that if under those conditions she chose him she really loves him. Evil is less concerned about what is really in the heart and is more superficial. The creator allows evil to exist , and probably created the potential for evil to exist himsel for reasons like that. So we can have higher consciousness and the ability to write and rewrite our programs IE personalities. I did write a little booklet long ago to summarize some of my findings on ths kind of topic. Happy treasure hunting, finding the truth is not for lazy people.
God chose me to watch this video first and be first to comment.
(1:30) *YN: **_"How can we say God is identical to the universe?"_* ... The first thing you do is swap out the word _"God"_ with _"Information"_ because that's what people mistakenly believed is God. Theism defines God as an omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent entity with his index finger rigidly poised above the smite button on his computer.
So, what happens when we assign these same attributes to "Information?"
*Omnipotent* (all-power): There is an established amount of energy the in the universe. This closed, balanced system of energy represents "information." There cannot be any more energy, nor can there be any less, so all of the information that energy represents meets the definition of "all-power" (omnipotence).
*Omniscient* (all-knowing): Everything in existence is comprised of "information." Whatever information is present at any given time represents all available information. You cannot know something that isn't also known by existence because whatever you know is also "information" which is necessarily added to the database of Existence. Since Existence holds all available information within this database, then this meets the definition of "all-knowing" (Omniscient).
*Omnipresent* (present everywhere): Everything that exist is comprised of "information." The universe is defined as "everything that exists," so the information that makes up the universe meets the definition of being "present everywhere" (Omnipresent).
"Existence" surprisingly makes sense the instant you view it all as "Information," ... _even God!_
@@ROForeverMan *"I am God."*
... You are "information." Your comment is also information that has been added to the collective database of "Existence." Whatever you are thinking right now is also information that gets added to the collective. The font, characters, sentence, the time of submission, the placement in this thread, and even your *"I 💌EURODANCE"* emoji equal information that is eternally stored within this database.
@@ROForeverMan *"To be more precise, is meaning, not information."*
... "Meaning" is also information. "Meaningful" and "meaningless" are merely two forms of information used to define some other form of information.
@@ROForeverMan *"Technically, "information" is defined as something that you can store in a computer in the form of 0 and 1."*
... Yes, binary data is but one of many forms of information.
*"But the fact that you see that image as either a duck or a rabbit is something beyond that, is a meaning that takes place in consciousness."*
... Your subjective experience and interpretation of all sensory data you encounter is also information. Whatever meaning you assign to your experiences is also information that gets added to the collective database of existence.
Existence takes the information generated by 8 billion humans (and over 10 quadrillion animals and insects) and uses this information to further the evolution of "Existence."
Logically speaking, "information" is more fundamental than "meaning" because meaning is information at its core.
@@ROForeverMan *"Ok, is just semantics, have it your way. But is interesting that you talk about Existence, yet in the other post you don't realize that Existence is synonymous with God."*
... Theism's God cannot exist because God does not abide by the 2nd and 3rd Laws of Existence. An all-knowing, infinitely existing, all-powerful God did not evolve from simplicity to complexity, nor is any evolution necessary for a being that is already all-knowing, all-powerful, and ubiquitous.
@@ROForeverMan *"Who said anything about theism ?"*
... The moment you wrote, _"I am God"_ you invoked theism. Theism is the architect and the definer of God. You can't come along and claim you are God because of the previously established definition.
*Example:* Let's say an astronaut landed on another planet and, based on his abilities, intellect, and technology, the inhabitants mistook him for God. However, he know that he is not God nor can he claim that he is. He is merely a human that has been mistakenly thought of as God by a species that doesn't know any better.
Likewise, you can't claim that you are theism's God by simply redefining God into whatever you want. Just like the astronaut, you have to abide by established definitions.
*"What matters is eternal life. And we have eternal life, since the Self is eternal."*
... You can certainly claim, _"And we have eternal life, since the Self is eternal"_ but you cannot claim to be God, because you don't meet the definition. You'll have to come up with a new definition for whatever you claim to be.
*Example:* I am not a Volkswagen nor can I ever claim to be.
Every conclusion this guy comes up with makes me think he doesn't really understand how people come to these ideas, because the problems don't make sense, who said God has to be understandable to intellectuals? Saying there are bad things in the world is not really a serious argument that this world can't be part of something bigger. I don't particularly believe in God and even to me his arguments seem a bit absurd.
Why are you asking man without evidence? Ask the Prophets sent by Allah ie read Quran and ask a Muslim scholar.
Yujin Nagasawa needs to stop using "pantheism" and "panentheism" together in the same sentence. They are completely different from each other in terms of one (pantheism) having no *sentient* Being who is responsible for the creation of the universe, whereas the other (panentheism) does.
My GOD this Guys are ignorant oppotunism his GOD hasnt show Philosophy
evidencie . Stupidity guys keep out convecent GOD evidence are lacking honest concept.
You can wrestle with definitions all your life. God was invented by men. Belief in a god puts us back into the thinking of cave men. Evil is a similar concept along with ugly and awful. Words, words words. Evil, beauty, ugliness and good don't exist, all human constructs.
Knowing that these things are just non-existent constructs, what do you even care about?
Law of One and the New Revelation of the Lord Jesus Chris clearly describe the God nature
@@ROForeverMan There are many layers of I AM. It's easy to be confused
@@ROForeverMan There is pseudo I am of a biocomputer feedback loop (Ego, HAL9000), it's subjected to time. There is a mind of the soul, it operates over multiple bodies of close heritage in different worlds/times. And there is One True Mind over all of that, that contains everything
@@ROForeverMan That's right. Like humans and their isolated minds are just ideas in the One consciousness. But the illusion of isolation is very strong
God is inconceivably one with and different from His material creation, just as fire is inconceivably one with and different from its heat. As far as evil is concerned, it's like turning our back on the sun: we can see only our shadow. In order to see only the light we must turn our face to the sun.
Why does everyone constantly want to reinvent the wheel? The Jews already figured out God in its entirety, to the fullest extent humans are capable of, and anything else you come up with isn't "God." So if you're going to talk about something else, call it something else. People with absolutely zero knowledge or understanding of the Judaic knowledge and understanding of God and resulting questions (good v. evil, etc.) shouldn't be pontificating on what God is or isn't. The Jews already figure it out!
I'd like to know what they have figured out if you can care to explain in detail
@@ash36551 That takes years and years of study -- decades, lifetimes -- never-ending study, in fact. The sophistication and detail of the Jewish conception and understanding of God is unmatched in human culture and history.
Imagine the most brilliant western legal system and minds, the most brilliant philosophical system and minds, and the most brilliant literary theory and minds, put them all together, and then multiply like by 100. That's getting close to the depth and breadth of Judaic thought.
I am not Jewish, but I've been exposed to it culturally and through many friends, and there is literally nothing that I've seen that compares. Christianity is like a comic book compared to Heidegger in relation to Judaism, Islam probably equivalent to christianity, maybe slightly more sophisticated - which as we know are both derivative (notably lesser derivatives in my opinion) of the original. It all came from Judaism, they literally wrote the book on the topic, and any western conception of "God" has to start there, again in my opinion.
Unfortunately we most often have people privileging and starting from the derivatives, and mostly there from an unlearned position, which is completely backward. Then we get all kinds of strange notions entering the culture about "God," when they haven't even understood the basics - aren't even aware of the basics, in fact, as Judaism has been to great degree marginalized in western culture by the contaminating and hegemonic force of christianity, primarily. So that ignorance is a cause of tremendous confusion. Why not just stay with the original? Well, there are many complex power and race reasons for that, as we have seen throughout Jewish and christian history.
I wish you would interview Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris one of these days I don't know if he'd be worth it or not
Certainly guys not knows his philosophy, left GOD evidence without proof. Speculation about GOD his show his ignorant than philosophy as Science.
how, if it were possible, could one keep his/her ego separate from self 🤔
@@ROForeverMan before or after the DMT trip :p
@@ROForeverMan is there a difference between fragmented and universal self, now...
@@ROForeverMan did you just say "probably..." how can you claim you know everything, after that :)
@@ROForeverMan so what is the difference between these instantiatons and the collective consciousness... is ego still part of the universal consciousness, too...
@@ROForeverMan in summary, you claim:
"self is eternal, egoless(after DMT), able to unify from fragmanted states(in telepathy), fragmented intantiations in a level are still one but not on it own, and finally, consciousness is paradoxical..."
if consciousness doesn't make sense, then maybe, we have to understand it better, that's all...
These people are thinking too much.
How about Christians' concept of god, not killing Jesus(pbuh) means there is no "salvation" waiting for Christians? Isn't that make Christians' concept of god as dependable being.
@@ROForeverMan You are a God who used toilet on Earth?
@@ROForeverMan Ok toilet and Earth don't exists. What a poor uninformed 'god' are you?
God is neutral
GOD IS AN EXTRATERRESTRIAL.👉👽👈
The classic view of God is correct & has no faults.
Man is an intelligence ... with a mind & body ... and free will & nature ... to think & do good or evil ... and make abstract & physical Functions with clear purpose, form, function & design.
The God of the Jews & Christians created the Universe for Man, made Man in His image to become Children of God, made perfect with a body & soul, made Man with free will, nature & able to pro-Create, ... and ... made Man to live forever with God, so long as Man obeyed one simply rule/Law:
"Do not eat from the tree of knowledge, for you will die if you do.
Only an intelligence ( like Man) makes rules & Laws ... to provide structure, order, direction, boundaries and repeatable, predictable "ideal" behavior & properties.
Law is only made for an intelligence ... because of free will and the NATURE of the intelligence is or will be corrupted.
Corrupting one's nature is an act of free will. All nature starts off good & innocent. It is free will ... that keeps the nature "good" or corrupts it with evil thoughts & actions.
And it is free will that determines if the nature has a "good" or "evil" influence on the thoughts & actions of Man.
Man's nature will always be corrupted because Man was created by God with a body & Soul, and a Mind that is the body & the Soul. This is why Jesus said "Love God with all your MIND, heart & SOUL." The Soul obviousy has a mind & free will, but so too does the body. The corrupted Body of Man is his Nature, and is why we all begin with a good & innocent nature but over time,
Man procreates ... and Adam & Eve corrupted the body that makes Man ... and with the Soul is the Mind of Man.
If you have a good nature .. you do not need Law ... to behave in an "ideal" predictable, repeatable way. Law is only made for an intelligence that has is will have a corrupted Nature.
Man is a natural intelligence with free will & a nature .... made by ... an UNNATURAL intelligence with free will & a nature.
God is not to blame for what Man freely chooses to think & do.
Man has been given free will ... to accept or reject God & His will & laws
All Law must be enforced otherwise there will be chaos & disorder. Man has clearly broken God's Laws, but has not been punished YET ... because of the Nature of God. God loves His sinful creation and does not want any to be lost, and gave us all the choice to believe in God's only begotten Son, or not.
This is all very simple. Man was created perfect with free will & nature ... with a body & soul ... able to procreate ... and will live forever if you obey the will & NATURE of God.
God has free will to think & do evil, but this is impossible for Him to do because His Nature is permanently pure & good. God can only do good. His will is only for good Stop accepting Man's ways and rejecting God's. Man's nature is corrupt and will pervert what is good unless you choose ... to have a strong moral compass( God, laws, culture) to do good not evil.
@Abe Lincoln _"The God of the Jews & Christians created the Universe for Man "_
I don't think Jws accept your concept of god, as far as Jws and Judaism are concerned, your concept of 'god' and your Christianity and your NT have nothing to do with the God of Abraham.
Whereas Jws cannot deny the notion that Quran came from no other than the God of Abraham. Jws accept the notion that Islamic concept of God is superior than that of Judaism.
Jws has got dispute whether or not Mohammed(pbuh) was a prophet of God. If Mohammed(pbuh) wasn't a prophet of God, there would be no Quran to come through Mohammed(pbuh).
99.99999% of words were created through a process of assigning symbols to identifiable, self-evident, real-world entities. The word “God” is one of the few exceptions to this process.
Thanks to the Christians we have this word “God” now, and everyone’s busy scrambling to find a definition for this word. Everyone’s making their best guess as to what this word actually means. Because whatever the word points to it isn’t identifiable, it’s not self-evident, and it clearly doesn’t exist here in the real world. It has none of the attributes that legitimate words have.
When are we going to grow up and get rid of this word “God”? It’s nothing more than “dog” spelled backwards. It’s a futile word in need of annihilation.
@@realitycheck1231 Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny are also ideas.
@@realitycheck1231 By that logic everything is an idea so I fail to see your point even more. It might not be the fact that you have no point to make. It may just be that your point is so small that I can’t see it.
@@realitycheck1231 That’s your definition of the word “God”. If I asked twenty other people I’d get twenty different definitions.
Compare that to the word “apple”. If I ask twenty people what an apple is, I’ll get more or less the same definition. Nobody will describe to me a pear, or a plumb, or any other fruit besides an apple, because the word “apple” is a legitimate word, and a word that everyone agrees on.
The word “god” is not a legitimate word. It’s also a word associated with a lot of depravity and suffering, when you consider the crimes against humanity perpetrated by God’s followers. Sex abuse by the Catholic Church, crusades, inquisitions, an eternity of the worst kind of suffering imaginable compliments of God himself (Hell).
By contrast, the Gnostics referred to the “True Father” or the “Parents” more as the source of all things. They chose pronouns in referring to the idea of a higher power that weren’t so tainted by use in organized religions. They also gave much more precise definitions for such pronouns.
I’m not some kind of materialist/reductionist committed to the idea of a ceramic Universe. I believe in a higher power, but I refuse to insult such a higher power by referring to it with the word “God”.
@@realitycheck1231 The word God doesn’t personally upset me. I just don’t think it’s a legitimate word because of the lack of some kind consensus as to what it means. I also think it’s problematic because of its attachment to organized religion. Though it sounds like we agree on that.
The other words you mention are more specific and not as open to interpretation as the word “God”. That’s why I said I find terms like the “True Father”, which is even more specific.
@@realitycheck1231 The phrase “True Father” suggests there’s a false father.
is he teologian? why do you ask him about God? Real God is only The True Lord in Bible. THE PERSON WITH POWER/ENERGY WHO CREATE ALL EXISTANCES, HE IS THE LIGHT, THE SOURCE & REASON OF MEANING OF EVERYTHING, THAT'S WHY GODLORDYHWH IS THE TRIUNITY IN BEING & EXISTANCE & ETERNITY! 😇🙏
1. WRONG QUESTION! it wasn't, (WHY) Does God Exist?.. BUT WHY DO YOU & ATHEIST EXIST?!
my answer : ..i will write in few hours
2. BURDEN OF PROOF? EXCEPT! LOOK AT FACT HISTORY OF BIBLE, IT'S FACT REALITY, & WHAT HAPPEN TO ISRAEL LAND, & HOW CHURCH BECOME GLOBAL, BIBLE IN MANY LANGUAGES, SO ALL NATIONS KNOW JESUS & PRAISE HIM GODLORD/YHWH SAVIOUR!.. yeah what atheist need/have to do is only to stay ignorant, keep denial & pretending that everything never happened/existed! 😅😂
is he teologian? why do you ask him about God? Real God is only The True Lord in Bible. THE PERSON WITH POWER/ENERGY WHO CREATE ALL EXISTANCES, HE IS THE LIGHT, THE SOURCE & REASON OF MEANING OF EVERYTHING, THAT'S WHY GODLORDYHWH IS THE TRIUNITY IN BEING & EXISTANCE & ETERNITY! 😇🙏
..
1. WRONG QUESTION! it wasn't, (WHY) Does God Exist?.. BUT WHY DO YOU & ATHEIST EXIST?!
my answer : ..i will write in few hours
2. BURDEN OF PROOF? EXCEPT! LOOK AT FACT HISTORY OF BIBLE, IT'S FACT REALITY, & WHAT HAPPEN TO ISRAEL LAND, & HOW CHURCH BECOME GLOBAL, BIBLE IN MANY LANGUAGES, SO ALL NATIONS KNOW JESUS & PRAISE HIM GODLORD/YHWH SAVIOUR!.. yeah what atheist need/have to do is only to stay ignorant, keep denial & pretending that everything never happened/existed! 😅😂
@@ROForeverMan yeah you are false god, evil god , self god & your place is in hell.. you say it yourself! 😅
You have not considered the only correct possibility which is, God transcends the emergence of emergent universes and manifest Himself in many different levels and forms therein, as does His Father, Grandfather, Great Grandfather into eternity. Yet, there is only one God This is correct doctrine.
There is nothing like God.
The universe is a creation of God.
God controls the universe and everything in and out of it.
God hears you and watches you and responds to you if he wills.
God has sent revelations to us so that we are guided.
The Quran is a revelation and his words to us.
God is like jelly
Personally, I'm an atheist. But I do like this one explanation that I heard a long time ago for why God doesnt intervene to prevent "Evil". It went something like this:
As a parent, when I teach my kid to ride a bike, I start by holding onto the back of the bike while the child peddles and I run along side. At some point, I have to let go. I know that when I do, my kid will likely fall and skin their knee. Does it make me a bad parent that I let go of the bike? I could run along side and hold onto the bike forever and make sure my kid never falls and gets hurt but then they'd never learn how to ride the bike. So even though I knowingly let my child get hurt, it doesnt make me a bad parent to let go of the bike.
I still have trouble believing in God for a bunch of other reasons. But the "Why does God allow evil to exist" question is not one of them.
Number of stars in the universe is greater than number of grains of sand in the entire ocean floor i.e. including sand in the deserts, the God who created that universe nothing but the God of the Quran in HIS majesty and glory.
Have you read the Quran?
@Alan Foxman God of Abraham is calling you, will you pay attention?
@LeoB The problem with the label God is that it has never been conceptual well defined. Relgion absolutely has a definition about god that is super limmited and typical human being like. There is so much people dont realize about god and reality and the universe. When it comes to astronomy we are in our kid shoes when it comes to define the label of god we are in our todler or baby outfit. People have no clue about the base of reality that it is based on principles! Those principles bow for nothing as else reality inlcluding god can not be. Reality can have no contradictions towards its own existense she must be perfectly selfsustaining. People look at god as once the ppl that thought earth was flat and u would fall of the planet if you walked long enough in a straight line.
I'm atheist and I am sick of the whole god allowing evil apologists BS. Evil shot the children of Newtown in cold blood. How do you think that explanation would wash with anyone looking for answers there?
@@abelincoln8885 "Fake science". As you use a smart phone (or perhaps a computer) to post your comment.
Alternative to God is no God!
@@ROForeverMan Alternative - you ain't God.
Nguyen
The Universe is perfection evolved.
Possibility necessitated.
Number of stars in the universe is greater than number of grains of sand in the entire ocean floor i.e. including sand in the deserts, the God who created that universe nothing but the God of the Quran in HIS majesty and glory.
Have you read the Quran?
Quran has got built-in with checksum and entire Quran is multiple of number 19. Mind blowing mathematics.
We speak in the language of those we are trying to communicate with. If those controllable masses are enamoured with magic tricks.. Algebracadabra!
Rubbish!
Religious beliefs, no matter how you package and manifest them ( philosophically or not ), are all plain BS.
RoFoMa / I am god also!😂🤣😂
RoFoMa / No!
You are a simple evolved biological entropical structure of a temporary local dynamic aggregate in this miniscule and completely unimportant portion of the neverending Universe that has aquired the simple redundant material function of a redundant introspection material process.
From this temporary simple process comes all of your brain illusions, delusions and and cognitive errors.
The best concept of God found in Islam alone.
Quran 112-1 Say: He is Allah, the One and Only;
Quran 112-2 Allah, the Eternal, Absolute;
Quran 112-3 He begetteth not, nor is He begotten;
Quran 112-4 And there is none like unto Him.
Quran 6:101 To Him is due the primal origin of the heavens and the earth: How can He have a son when He hath no consort? He created all things, and He hath full knowledge of all things.
Quran 6:59 And with Him are the keys of the unseen; none knows them except Him. And He knows what is on the land and in the sea. Not a leaf falls but that He knows it. And no grain is there within the darknesses of the earth and no moist or dry [thing] but that it is [written] in a clear record.
And the Worst form of religion is Islam exactly because of beliefs that belong to the stone age and rather barbaric times and cultures.
Its not the best concept , just one of many that cannot be verified outside of the human mind where it originated.
@@artvult6970 Correct. Many of those concepts born out of fear and ignorance.
@@ROForeverMan Get in line....
For there are human slaves made to worship their false teachers, the one's that are smarter than the rest.
You will commit evil in the name of your teachings, for you have not learned to be self confident, self judging, self existing, but you were taken the light off your life, from evil teacher's that know it not any better, and abuse of you as his slave on his lower level of consciousness.
Get off this god kick.