Have two of these units that began failing at the same time(6 years old). Figured it was a scaling problem--hard water in our area. After flushing both with numerous gallons of white vinegar the problem wasn't solved. Factory Troubleshooting guide way to involved for my patience and I was just about to replace both with conventional heaters. Saw the MOTHS IN YOUR SQUIRREL CAGE. Pulled my squirrel cages--full of moths--cleaned them and they work great again! THANKS MY AUSSIE BROTHER!
My Rinnai infinity 24 is 22 yrs old and just played up recently. I opened it up, with power off, and cleaned all the burners with my air compressor, fan was clean and PCB looked okay. I sanded back the spark electrodes, a little oxidized. Cleaned the inlet water filter but didn't flush the system with vinegar to remove any built up salt in the copper piping. My system is working fine now. I really can't complain, apparently it has a life span of 25 yrs.
I think the circuitry involves the ignition which is also tied into the pump and that blower, the gas fires up when someone turns the water, then the blower and pump kicks in. The circuitry may also regulate air fuel mixture but I doubt it, since it's strictly an on demand unit, probably just makes sure that the gas shuts off at the right time and shuts the gas off if it doesn't ignite. In any event the coil was the problem not the electronics, even so they could simplify it considerably.
Thats a shame!, Junkers were the best, if not the first maker of instant water heaters back in the day!, but like all of them I guess they had to make things cheaper and cheaper to keep up!.
The electrics control the remote controllers inside the house to allow temperature adjustment. Set the water temp. to 41c and that is what it makes. Also they have a bath fill function that lets you set the temp. and water quantity in litres and it will shut off the water when finished with a voice that tells you when it is done. If you don't use the remote controls then all that stuff inside is wasted. You can buy simple natural draft instantaneous HWS for just water heating with no control.
@CorbyStarletCj1 yes that's correct, it also wanted a gas pressure signal as well. :(. its like trying to run a inverter AC condensing unit with no indoor unit. it just won;t do it without the proper signals.
Have you actually seen one of these in operation? The way they work is that you have temperature controllers in the house, usually one in the kitchen and one in the bathroom, so when you want the water to be at a specific temperature you dial the temperature on the controller, hence the reason for all the electronics. Yeah, it's kind of silly, but that's how they're designed and how they work, I've known a few people with these.
OK, I also use these electronic tankless water heaters, because *mine came with the house*. I think mine is 11 years old, it is still going strong, Mine is an Infinity 24 external version, it has a defrosting heater(I'm sure the one in this video has it), also the old house I used to live in has the same, and it is still going too! I even notice, almost EVERYBODY here have these electronic modern tankless water heaters. Unfortunately mine did not come with a thermostat, the old house did, the thermostat is actually not required to run the unit. I think I live in a cleaner environment than Australia, which is probably why electronic things here last ridiculously long. I imagine how hard it is to run a combustion blower without the PCB
WTF! Why didn't the Circuit boards in the AC condenser units in your last vid have the epoxy coating?!!! You are exactly right about the cost to manufacture all the electronics. I am an electronics romantic. I understand that energy efficiency is important. So why make a water heater with all that expensive circuitry? IT'S A WATER HEATER!!! Thanks for the vids.
Quite rare in the US. We mostly have storage tank style water heaters here. On demand water heaters are relatively newer to the US than other parts of the world.
I can understand having gas fitting regulations, it is a dangerous thing and people have died as a result of faulty or mis-fitted appliances, but the fact that Holdog28 did not even watch the video and assumed it was a step-by step on how to fix a heater is just showing his arrogance. I get the same kind of thing from Sparkies, either they do not know all the rules, or just want to protect their trade, dunno which it is exactly
No idea I agree ,Rinnai internal like that are a great reliable water heater.yes and it is always installer error ,that give the system a bad name and people that have no idea
@Lachlant1984 yeh, they are very high-tech, I remember the TV ads years ago. but the high tech is the fail point IMO. if they keep it simple like Junkers or Bosch, they would be fine!
Also if you have a controller connected it will show fault codes to easily find the problem and fix it. That unit would have been an easy fix. The jets are not that aluminium block, that is just a manifold. The jets are closer to the gas control and the sizes are written on the data sticker you filmed at the start. To convert to propane you just buy a few jets and change one of the dip switches. Cheap as.
@BiLock102 yeh the new electronic systems are rubbish!, as you will see in my latest inverter AC unit vid thats uploading. I have nothing against normal simple, reliable gas fired or electric heater tanks!. they are the best way to go. hell, there are still many copper lined electric heaters from the 1960's still in service today!
The new water heaters use FLASH memory processors. At the higher surface chip temperatures, the electrons escape from their barriers more rapidly. Result is memory cell failure. This will cause the CPU to shut down. Re-flash is simply erasing all the flash memory in the chip and then loading the program into it again. Exactly the same as formatting a disk and loading new files. It's as good as new again.
Sadly, I work in a "leading" fast food outlet and in my 10 years, we have scrapped 3 infinity 26 units due to PCB's frying out, we now have a Rhemglas Sqaure style tank. Simple...why the F^^^ does a hot water service need a computer, I have seen Bosch units that don't even need power to work! I hope you have nothing against electric and gas tanks, they are so simple to work out :P Thanks BiLock102
@vmodder Yeah, that's right, that's how they work, I know a few people with these instant water heaters, and yes there are electronic temperature controllers in the house that you use to adjust the temperature, I don't have one of these things myself, but that's how they work.
FLASH memory has a 5 - 10 year life in hight temp industrial environment. Five years maximum (some offer only 3 years). Life secure equipment requires 3 or more banks of identical flash memory with a supervisory processor. Check and compare of ever bit if it decides to change. Correct, restore and resume.
If the electronics were built right, these would earn much more respect. Need to get rid of the switching power supply and go to good old fashion transformer and linear power supply. Lose some efficiency, but save energy in the long run when boards don't need replacing. Stop potting the circuit boards and enclose them in a sealed box. Potting compound causes solder fatigue on surface mount components. Avoid SMT on something made to last... through hole technology is older, but robust.
hi, I enjoyed your rinnai water heater video. Just wondering if you have any flue parts for rinnai room heaters a556 or 551. Rinnai parts are quite expensive as you mentioned cheers Bazzabomb7
@Aussie50 Look to see if it has a small Motorola CPU. I have a Japanese version of this machine. They have FLASH memory that gets corrupt after about 5 years. I/O lines drop out etc. ReFLASH the chip and good to go again.
No idea .sorry mate no idea .its an internal Rinnai .installed $2400.00 .second hand I can get $850 cash for that model .and it's probably a blocked inlet filter .simple fix ..thats on the middle connection ( water in ) .& sorry there one of the most reliable heaters on the market.Made in Japan.& it dosn't compare to a Bosch .speaking from 20 years of experience in the hot water repair market..you killed a fine bit of Japanese ART In engineering.
well aren't you a safety-sally :P, watch the video before posting. this is a tear-down intended to show people what is inside, not a "how to fix your heater" video. as a result, the regulators can get fucked.
G,day All Rinnai Company , I remember doing are course at RINNAI Australia Many moonS ago, ( Rinnai A Japanese Company a Family Company, Excellent Build quality) I recently made inquires in availability on parts , Rinnai Australia Can still get on appliances 20 years old , most Mfg's on parts is normally 7 to 10 years, apart parts sitting in the warehouse or stockist. RINNAI on the Electronics are well designed and redundant and generally electrically surge protected Environment , temperature etc , coastal regions Beach etc salty air, effecting Electrically connections, circuit board coated , ( heat exchanger ) water Quilty ( The creamy powder coated or the mains of applying a material been a paint Could be better have seen corrosion on a a Infinity 32, or range you can get additional Service information, but generally is only given to Plumbers/ Gasfitter or a person Authorised to install and service, ( PDF Format ) The service and professional Advices is excellent ....... Regards Allllll
plumbers love to protect their turf and mistify the trade any person with average intelligence can do a plumbers work and the only place to get info is youtube
I have similar heater to this but junkers .. german made .. very expensive ... well made and durable right ? NOPE after 6 i repeat 6! years the fucking exchanger punctured itself .... dafuq repair costet fucking 800 euro and guess what ? next year the water pump in it stopped working fortunetly hammer solved that one , it was jsut some shit stuck in pump and it wouldnt start and dont get me started ot the fucking computer .. my grandma has water heater for 45 years and it havent been broken yet
Modern Energy Rated appliances are Garbage!!!, The new simpson washing machines are a useless pile of shit, as with those timewaster electrosuxes, I Never go for any new whitegood, old is better :)
They need to be efficient, we don't have endless energy to waste, I work on all the makes of hot water unit and 99.99% of failures are caused by installers or guys like you who have no idea what they are talking about! A little knowledge is dangerous, so if you don't know all about something at least have the sense to know your limits!! Why don't you set up as a technical guru?? LOL
Have two of these units that began failing at the same time(6 years old). Figured it was a scaling problem--hard water in our area. After flushing both with numerous gallons of white vinegar the problem wasn't solved. Factory Troubleshooting guide way to involved for my patience and I was just about to replace both with conventional heaters. Saw the MOTHS IN YOUR SQUIRREL CAGE. Pulled my squirrel cages--full of moths--cleaned them and they work great again! THANKS MY AUSSIE BROTHER!
My Rinnai infinity 24 is 22 yrs old and just played up recently. I opened it up, with power off, and cleaned all the burners with my air compressor, fan was clean and PCB looked okay. I sanded back the spark electrodes, a little oxidized. Cleaned the inlet water filter but didn't flush the system with vinegar to remove any built up salt in the copper piping. My system is working fine now. I really can't complain, apparently it has a life span of 25 yrs.
I think the circuitry involves the ignition which is also tied into the pump and that blower, the gas fires up when someone turns the water, then the blower and pump kicks in. The circuitry may also regulate air fuel mixture but I doubt it, since it's strictly an on demand unit, probably just makes sure that the gas shuts off at the right time and shuts the gas off if it doesn't ignite. In any event the coil was the problem not the electronics, even so they could simplify it considerably.
Thats a shame!, Junkers were the best, if not the first maker of instant water heaters back in the day!, but like all of them I guess they had to make things cheaper and cheaper to keep up!.
The electrics control the remote controllers inside the house to allow temperature adjustment. Set the water temp. to 41c and that is what it makes. Also they have a bath fill function that lets you set the temp. and water quantity in litres and it will shut off the water when finished with a voice that tells you when it is done. If you don't use the remote controls then all that stuff inside is wasted. You can buy simple natural draft instantaneous HWS for just water heating with no control.
@CorbyStarletCj1 yes that's correct, it also wanted a gas pressure signal as well. :(. its like trying to run a inverter AC condensing unit with no indoor unit. it just won;t do it without the proper signals.
Have you actually seen one of these in operation? The way they work is that you have temperature controllers in the house, usually one in the kitchen and one in the bathroom, so when you want the water to be at a specific temperature you dial the temperature on the controller, hence the reason for all the electronics. Yeah, it's kind of silly, but that's how they're designed and how they work, I've known a few people with these.
OK, I also use these electronic tankless water heaters, because *mine came with the house*. I think mine is 11 years old, it is still going strong, Mine is an Infinity 24 external version, it has a defrosting heater(I'm sure the one in this video has it), also the old house I used to live in has the same, and it is still going too! I even notice, almost EVERYBODY here have these electronic modern tankless water heaters. Unfortunately mine did not come with a thermostat, the old house did, the thermostat is actually not required to run the unit.
I think I live in a cleaner environment than Australia, which is probably why electronic things here last ridiculously long.
I imagine how hard it is to run a combustion blower without the PCB
WTF! Why didn't the Circuit boards in the AC condenser units in your last vid have the epoxy coating?!!! You are exactly right about the cost to manufacture all the electronics. I am an electronics romantic. I understand that energy efficiency is important. So why make a water heater with all that expensive circuitry? IT'S A WATER HEATER!!! Thanks for the vids.
Quite rare in the US. We mostly have storage tank style water heaters here. On demand water heaters are relatively newer to the US than other parts of the world.
Good score on the oil cooler, Those modern gas water heaters have too much unnecessary electronics in them.
I can understand having gas fitting regulations, it is a dangerous thing and people have died as a result of faulty or mis-fitted appliances, but the fact that Holdog28 did not even watch the video and assumed it was a step-by step on how to fix a heater is just showing his arrogance.
I get the same kind of thing from Sparkies, either they do not know all the rules, or just want to protect their trade, dunno which it is exactly
No idea I agree ,Rinnai internal like that are a great reliable water heater.yes and it is always installer error ,that give the system a bad name and people that have no idea
@vmodder yeh it has a electronic indoor LCD control panel
The inducer motors on the Rinnai are very well made electric motors.
@airhornwaggon yeh, todays electronics prevent you from doing that :(. even in cars. the Subaru's cut the AC out just as it becomes really cold!
There are certain grades of stainless which have quite a lot of nickel or cobalt in them, which makes them very magnetic.
@Lachlant1984 yeh, they are very high-tech, I remember the TV ads years ago. but the high tech is the fail point IMO. if they keep it simple like Junkers or Bosch, they would be fine!
Also if you have a controller connected it will show fault codes to easily find the problem and fix it. That unit would have been an easy fix. The jets are not that aluminium block, that is just a manifold. The jets are closer to the gas control and the sizes are written on the data sticker you filmed at the start. To convert to propane you just buy a few jets and change one of the dip switches. Cheap as.
@BiLock102 yeh the new electronic systems are rubbish!, as you will see in my latest inverter AC unit vid thats uploading.
I have nothing against normal simple, reliable gas fired or electric heater tanks!. they are the best way to go.
hell, there are still many copper lined electric heaters from the 1960's still in service today!
we've had ours 20yrs and no problems, I prefer these to the inside HW cylinder - my power bill was atrocious but after the Rinnai it halved our bill.
The new water heaters use FLASH memory processors. At the higher surface chip temperatures, the electrons escape from their barriers more rapidly.
Result is memory cell failure. This will cause the CPU to shut down.
Re-flash is simply erasing all the flash memory in the chip and then loading the program into it again. Exactly the same as formatting a disk and loading new files. It's as good as new again.
The transformer in there maybe for 100VAC; that kind of voltage is quite common in Japan btw.
I like my old window air conditioner better than my new one because i can make my room as cold as i want it until the coil turns into a block of ice!
@emiljen2 no sorry, I have never set the controls on one of these :(, nor do I have a manual.
Sadly, I work in a "leading" fast food outlet and in my 10 years, we have scrapped 3 infinity 26 units due to PCB's frying out, we now have a Rhemglas Sqaure style tank. Simple...why the F^^^ does a hot water service need a computer, I have seen Bosch units that don't even need power to work! I hope you have nothing against electric and gas tanks, they are so simple to work out :P Thanks BiLock102
thanks for your input
is there a link you can post with interpretation for the fault codes
I repair and service these everyday ,/commercial ,there is nothing as reliable well built ,easy to service water heater on the market today 240v .
@vmodder Yeah, that's right, that's how they work, I know a few people with these instant water heaters, and yes there are electronic temperature controllers in the house that you use to adjust the temperature, I don't have one of these things myself, but that's how they work.
FLASH memory has a 5 - 10 year life in hight temp industrial environment. Five years maximum (some offer only 3 years).
Life secure equipment requires 3 or more banks of identical flash memory with a supervisory processor. Check and compare of ever bit if it decides to change. Correct, restore and resume.
@Aussie50 Thanks Ed :) I wonder what would happen if the heat exchanger had a hydrostatic test in this condition :D
I Mate, which one would you recommend instead of this Rinnai
my rinnai hd 200 e
has stopped working after about 4 years
seems to be engineered to last a little longer than the warranty period
If the electronics were built right, these would earn much more respect. Need to get rid of the switching power supply and go to good old fashion transformer and linear power supply. Lose some efficiency, but save energy in the long run when boards don't need replacing. Stop potting the circuit boards and enclose them in a sealed box. Potting compound causes solder fatigue on surface mount components. Avoid SMT on something made to last... through hole technology is older, but robust.
hi, I enjoyed your rinnai water heater video. Just wondering if you have any flue parts for rinnai room heaters a556 or 551. Rinnai parts are quite expensive as you mentioned cheers Bazzabomb7
@Aussie50 Look to see if it has a small Motorola CPU. I have a Japanese version of this machine. They have FLASH memory that gets corrupt after about 5 years. I/O lines drop out etc. ReFLASH the chip and good to go again.
No idea .sorry mate no idea .its an internal Rinnai .installed $2400.00 .second hand I can get $850 cash for that model .and it's probably a blocked inlet filter .simple fix ..thats on the middle connection ( water in ) .& sorry there one of the most reliable heaters on the market.Made in Japan.& it dosn't compare to a Bosch .speaking from 20 years of experience in the hot water repair market..you killed a fine bit of Japanese ART In engineering.
The heater is activated by the water flow.
Yeah, they wouldn't be bad units if they didn't have such flimsy heat exchangers.
you should see if you can fix that thats an indoor unit
Mmmmmm.... A horrific failure rate on heat exchangers with a 12 year warranty. Doesn't make a lot of sense.
Thanks for your sharing 👍
ummm how is a chip re flashed
well aren't you a safety-sally :P, watch the video before posting. this is a tear-down intended to show people what is inside, not a "how to fix your heater" video.
as a result, the regulators can get fucked.
It would be waiting for water flow, no water flow no go as per aga and as standards
G,day All
Rinnai Company , I remember doing are course at RINNAI Australia
Many moonS ago, ( Rinnai A Japanese Company a Family Company, Excellent
Build quality) I recently made inquires
in availability on parts , Rinnai Australia
Can still get on appliances 20 years old , most Mfg's on parts is normally
7 to 10 years, apart parts sitting in the warehouse or stockist. RINNAI on the
Electronics are well designed and redundant and generally electrically surge protected
Environment , temperature etc , coastal regions Beach etc salty air, effecting
Electrically connections, circuit board coated , ( heat exchanger ) water Quilty
( The creamy powder coated or the mains of applying a material been a paint
Could be better have seen corrosion on a a Infinity 32, or range you can get additional
Service information, but generally is only given to Plumbers/ Gasfitter or a person
Authorised to install and service, ( PDF Format ) The service and professional
Advices is excellent .......
Regards
Allllll
@HDXFH New system: Crap rating: the more stars the more crappier they are :P
Author has head up arse and is living in the 60's.
Electrify the crap out of things=higher fail rate which, earns them more money.
good vid and yer new stuff is crap. i should have a rant about it but i CBF ATM.lol
Super Kettle !!!!!
plumbers love to protect their turf
and mistify the trade
any person with average intelligence can do a plumbers work
and the only place to get info is youtube
I have similar heater to this but junkers .. german made .. very expensive ... well made and durable right ? NOPE after 6 i repeat 6! years the fucking exchanger punctured itself .... dafuq repair costet fucking 800 euro and guess what ? next year the water pump in it stopped working fortunetly hammer solved that one , it was jsut some shit stuck in pump and it wouldnt start and dont get me started ot the fucking computer .. my grandma has water heater for 45 years and it havent been broken yet
if you have any technical information that would be helpfull
why not share that
instead of ....uummmm...
well try to offer something constructive
Modern Energy Rated appliances are Garbage!!!, The new simpson washing machines are a useless pile of shit, as with those timewaster electrosuxes, I Never go for any new whitegood, old is better :)
They need to be efficient, we don't have endless energy to waste, I work on all the makes of hot water unit and 99.99% of failures are caused by installers or guys like you who have no idea what they are talking about! A little knowledge is dangerous, so if you don't know all about something at least have the sense to know your limits!! Why don't you set up as a technical guru?? LOL
You have no idea what you're talking about.