It's interesting to point out that Mellisandra's fire magic is enhanced at the wall whereas Thoros' fire gazing magic is quashed when visiting the ghost of High Heart's ex-weirwood grove.
A couple of possible scenarios: The magic of the Wall and Asshai MIGHT be more similar than we think, if not the same actual source The sources of magic are “aware” and could probably choose to snuff out any magic use they don’t like Or something/someone else is using the magic at High Heart and didn’t appreciate any uninvited guests using their “property” without permission None of these necessarily exclude each other and could combine in a number of ways
Adam Arko I agree with you on actual Chinese but there were people living there and using some kind of writing or something at the same time as The Mesopotamians. Or at least it looks like there might have been. But since the area is so wet unlike Mesopotamia things are going to do great and fall apart. It is definitely an interesting discussion. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/10/inscriptions-predate-oldest-chinese-language
Guys, i absolutely Love your Channel, and thank you. Quick note though, Cthulu's great enemy is his 'half brother' Hashtur the unspeakable a.k.a the "King in Yellow". Nyarolathothep is not concerned with Cthulu at all. He is a direct instrument of Azathoth, and belongs to a hierarchy of beings above that of Cthulu and Hashtur. Also, just to bring clarity to a different video of yours, Lovecraft was particular, regarding his intention that others use, and embelish on his creations as much as possible. That was a clear intent of his. As for this video, i honestly think that Asshai was not lawless, rather just based on a power-system that we are not privy to. You Could do anything... as long as it didn't interfere with the intentions of someone more powerful. I think, the people there understood the power structure, and authority structure and the society worked that way. But i don't believe it was pure chaos.
I'd rather have Yi Ti (at any time, but during the current story, e.g. War of the 5 Kings) would be really nice to see. Dany & Dragon rumours, what that might do. Their civil war. ... Their Five Forts: their The Wall.
I think the mages of Asshai probably have a hierarchy of some sort. There are probably a couple of strong groups who control trade and provide protection by goods and services from outside traders. Weaker groups would probably pay the stronger ones for protection or crumbs of knowledge. Im thinking these people eat too but their environment is polluted so they probably have to trade with outsiders so the strongest mages would control the trade of goods to give them power & authority over other mages.
Maybe the heart tree at Winterfell is important it some way. It's huge and beautiful. Maybe the Starks quit feeding it and that broke the pact. Everything about Winterfell is important. It was 1st and it's built completely different from the other castles in Westeros but also has the gargoyles in common with Dragonstone.
I loved the touch that Winterfell had a 'heating' system created by routing a hot spring through double curtained walls. It never came up during the series which I sort of missed, I thought it was really clever.
the glowing water, mutated fish, dying animals and greasy looking stone always remind me of typical signs of nuclear fallout poisoning, and the lacquered masks almost seem like the rubbery shiny material of gasmasks
To be fair, a fight between a fire and an ice dragon would fit the whole War of The Roses thing. Think there was a story from the legends of king Arthur where Merlin found a cave where two dragons fought, one white and one red, drawing parallells with houses York and Tudor.
I realise this is an old comment but this bothered me: the white dragon in that story represents the invading Anglo Saxons and the red dragon is the Celts. Hasn’t really got anything to do with the Wars of the Roses since that was 10 centuries later.
@@bethanhaines6360 As Mr. Martin said himself: ”History doesn’t repeat, but rhymes”, paraphrased of course. The legend works as an analogy for several things in English history, as well as for the concepts of SOIAF, and so the parallel to the War of The Roses. It is true that the original legend days it represents the conflict between the Welsh and Saxons, but in this context it is less relevant that the British Boogaloo 2.
@@candersson60 British Boogaloo 2? My point is that the two wars, the Saxon invasion and the Wars of the Roses, are very different and I don’t see how an analogy for one could be applicable for the other.
@@bethanhaines6360 As in the colour scheme of the dragons, and as I remember it; the victory of the Red Dragon. Not the wars themselves. As I said: an analogy, or metaphor if you will. I think you are reading too much into my comment.
I really like LML's views on the meteor in the Heart of Winter and The Land of Shadow because it would be a great way to show polar opposite effects of impact. One is nuclear winter and the other being volcanic eruption and fallout. I'd drink a series of Yi Ti teas!!! Celestial Seasonings should do that!!! Get on it!!! CHOP CHOP!!!! 👏👏 Yi Ti: Dawn of Dynasty = Chrysanthemum and Chamomile Bloodstone = Blood Orange and Cinnamon Always Winter Blend = White Strawberry, Lemon and Ginger Wispy Westeros = Carmel, Clove and Mace Dragonfire Brew = Dragonberry & Dragonfruit Asshai Elixir = Acai, Guarana & Cat's eye (Dragon's eye) Some of these would be palatable but others would be cutthroat sweet or mad bitter.
You are one of the lore series I put on in the background when I write D&D or GURPS campaigns. Super hero lore, Dune lore, AGOT lore, LOTR lore, Battletech lore, Warhammer lore, Harry Potter lore, and real history videos all make for great inspiration sources.
@@roguecomics4775 I looked it up and it turns out we're both right. Here's a quote from the wiki: "Zorses were originally created by crossing horses with a horse-like animal, but are now bred as their own species." So yeah. Originally they were hybrids, but they went through speciation, so they can be considered their own species now. They are basically what dogs are to wolves.
I love you two together. You always give me so much to think about. I love the fact that you have intelligent conversations. Keep up the great work Quin... Love and Hugs from South Africa 💖💖💖🐘🐘🦏🦏
asshay poisoning : uranium in the mines poisoning everything with radiation? Oil coming up crating the greasy black stone which is also super toxic? When I first saw this I read it as “asshat” which is how my day is going lol! This is great guys!
LML! Woot this is a line up today for sure. Need the two of you are Preston for a series on how you can reconcile your divergent views. I’m convince the fantasy vs science fiction is a false debate and he answer to both theories is yes.
Elissa Farman and Corlyss velaryon went to asshai and didn’t get murdered or enslaved , they probably allow readers do they can ensure they have ample food and water
I love the GEOTD dragon lord theory and hope more evidence gets revealed about it... I also think the theory holds that House Stark has the blood of the Others in their lineage, since one of the conditions of the original pact may have been interbreeding w Others (if that’s even possible) so many awesome theories I hope we learn more about, good podcast
Speaking of Wheel of Crime, Angraal, or however you spell it, were relics could store or amplify "the power." If the theory that dragons amplify magic or dragons ARE magic in ASOIAF, perhaps the black stone amplifies the magic from the dragons. The base of the wall is after all made of that black stone, and there were no dragons when Mel was last in Asshai.
Asshai, K´Dath, Yeen, Stygai, Carcossa, the inner ruins of Leng and the unnamed ruins of Ulos nearby of Ulthos all seem to have some eerie and unsettling old non-human connection either wholesome or in part. Makes sense that Asshai was maybe the original main city of the Great Empire of the Dawn, and perhaps also Yeen, Carcossa, the ruins of Leng, Ulos and even Stygai and K´Dath started as human cities too, yet mainly close-linked with the Ancient/Outer God forces in the Dawn world, at least for a while on the good side, and later fallen upon their enemies, mainly Yeen, Stygai and K´Dath in total domain. Asshai and Leng, and Carcossa perhaps too, endured and still are somehow resisting the dark influence in their own ways, not very fine, but still people endured there, though were transformed on time: Leng people were secretive xenophobic and gigantic, Asshai well is the main theme of all, and we might not know much about Carcossa but as it´s nearby to the Hidden Sea and the City of Winged Men across this sea, maybe the people could have been affected too. Either way, there is a connection between Carcossa and Yi-Ti Empire as the 69 Yellow Emperor of Yi-Ti exilled himself there and is a mighty dark sorcerer too, and there must be a link with the Empire of the Dawn, itself the forerruner of Yi-Ti, and Asshai too, and so with the ancestors of Valyrians which were able to control dragons. Yeen and the ruins of Ulos are pretty much an enigma, but there seems to have been of some human or human-related ancient connection, perhaps some brief living colonies, yet cursed about their building and purpose (conquests of the Bloodstone Emperor at the Long Night time perhaps?). K´Dath could have been indeed the earliest city of the world and it´s claimed, along side Asshai, and even more before the latter, as it´s quite nearby the Five Forts, so there migh have been the original settlement of the Dawn Emprie untill the Pearl Emperor was forced to leave it and built another capital at Asshai and left the Forts to keep the former city from the new menaces from the far East as the riders of Gray Waste, the Shrykes and the people from Cannibal Sands, however in the end, K´Dath totally was overrun by something they couldn´t stop, and along side fell down other nearby eastern ancient settlements as mysterious Bonetown, and the Cities of Bloodless Men, which in turn came cursed on their innhabitans into vampires. But still whatever their dreadfull end, what happened in K´Dath as with Stygai was much worst than what happened in the ruins of inner Leng, Carcossa, the ruins of Ulos, Yeen, Asshai, Bonetown, the City of Winged Men and the Cities of Bloodless Men, to the point, both the Shadowbinders from Asshai and the Shrykes and maybe the Gray Waste riders to avoid either Stygai and K´Dath respectively. (However K´Dath somehow managed to kept people living there adquiring a level close to Asshai status, yet slightly darker. Stygai is the real heart of the Shadow Land and the Death City, but seems very rich and important, and as his inhabitants nearby were demons and dragons, maybe some people like the Winged Men live there, but are pretty much darker, scarier and dangerous than the others.)
I know it's very late, but you know that Carcosa, K'Dath, the city of the bloodless mens are basicly map-filler done by Martin (and his Maester in universe) ? They are direct reference to Lovecraft mythos, I dont think there is much more to say about it.
@@jhtrq1465 I know about it, still they´re quite thrilling amazing on its own whatever even if he hadn´t thought much about it in the first place, now he had to deal with the consecuences of using it on his work as there actually is some fandom of his work rather thrilled more about it than on what else he was mainly focused on.
@@lhadzyan7300 I'm agree with you in the sense that I'm also fascinated by all the Asshai and far East stuff. But nonetheless, a lot of the stuff we take as facts about Asshai and all those remote place are very much like the dragons drawn on the Terra Ingognita from old maps, exagération, pure inventions, who knows? There is an interview where Martin speak a bit about Asshai, answering to the question if why there is no kids there. He basically say that all information is coming from a Maester on the other side of the world who has never set foot in Essos. So, there it is. For me it make this stuff even more fascinating, but I try to not overthink it too much either ( even if I love those kind of theories)
Maybe Melisandre wasn't so powerful in Asshai because she wasn't the only magic-user there? Like, Asshai is, in your own words, a hub for mages, thus the power is sort of distributed (if magic can be lost and can resurge, then it's sort of an energy which is limited to some extent), and on the Wall and beyond there's barely anyone (among humans, anyway, maybe there's a distinction in species) who actively uses magic.
This is great for reading along, makes it so much more enjoyable and interesting with that voice that you put on. If it's not too much could you possibly consider doing one of these "Theories & Discussions" on Iron Islands because like me i'm sure there are fans of the Greyjoys that would appreciate that a lot
Only halfway through this & you guys have got me thinking; what if the Shadow Lands are like the original Valyria? Perhaps those lands were like a mirror image of Valyria, fertile, warm weather, many active volcanoes around which the most ancient of dragons nested. And just before the Long Night a catastrophe similar to the Doom of Valyria took place transforming that region into the Shadow Lands we know today. I also agree with LML about Asshai being built by the Empire of the Dawn, not sure if it was the capital of the empire but was definitely a part of it & was probably home to the most ancient dragon lords.
What if all the cave systems all over planetos are what’s left from an ancient root system from a weirwood world tree... what if under the sea means “in the bowls of the earth” where the deep roots grow.
Dustin Smith pretty good theory the only thing is, the weirdwoods aren't in other places. Only in westeros... There's no weirdwoods in Essos or anywhere
here is how Asshai works. Anarchy! if you are in Asshai make sure you are the biggest baddest thing on the block and no-one wants to mess with you, or at least be so powerful that messing with you will open the one doing it up to be messed with because of the exertion of messing with you. if you go there bring adequate protection. it's like the Sith empire from star wars (the old republic), no-one messes with the emperor because he is the strongest. the Sith counsel doesn't try to take him out because they know every other counsel member will come to take them out, not for justice, not for the empire, nor out of loyalty, they come to kill you and ascend to emperor the easy way after you've done all the dirty work. these kind of cutthroat systems can look and act remarkably stable (for a while) but as soon as the status Quo is upset everybody eats everyone else in utter mayhem.
I would suggest you look up Indian mythology, and especially the concept of 'yugas' and the cycle of ages. Martin seems to have adopted this into his epic. The end of the GEOTD and the rise of a 'broken' world seems a lot like the end of satyuga and the beginning of kaliyuga.
Hastur is the rival of Cthulhu!! However the "The One That Cannot Be Named" name or "Magnum Inominandum" wasn´t originally related to the same deity by Lovecraft himself, but was by August Derleth, his main follower of his lore, and who along others gave some structure into it. Since then, after Lovecraft´s death, Hastur became The One That Cannot Be Named, and was set up a rivalry with Cthulhu, but nothing of that is ever hinted at Lovecraft´s own work. Hastur wasn´t a Lovecraftian god either, but he borrowed and adapted from Arthur Machen work, a pre-Lovecraftian influence, along side the city of Carcossa and the Lake of Hali from Robert W. Chambers´The King in Yellow, also another pre-Lovecraft literary source (Carcossa and Hali itself weren´t from Chambers either but from Ambrose Bierce´short story "An Inhabitant from Carcossa", where some dead sould of that former great city lies in ruins and finds out being dead and communicates with a medium somewhere else, Hali isn´t a lake but some wise poet from Carcossa´s lore, which the main character remembers as he awakens to find himself lost in the ruins graveyard.) Nyarlathoteph didn´t follow either Hastur nor Cthulhu, he follows Azathoth, however as his boss was left pretty idiotic by the so-called Archetypical Gods (which aren´t Lovecraftian themselves, but another Derleth´s construction to make sense in the whole myths) in the center of the Universe as the Nuclear Chaos, having his whole power yet being unable to use it properly. } (According to Derleth systematic, the so-called Ancient Ones or Outer Gods had a battle for the control of the Universe with the Archetypical Gods, and although they might have been both more fearsome in power by being ancient than their rivals, at the end the "good guys" were wiser and managed to seal and disable the use of the power of the bad ones. According to this explanation, Azathoth and Yog-Sothoth were the main leaders and the most powerfull of all, but in the end, Azathoh retained all his power, but no control in his mind to use it properly, and Yog-Sothoth was sealed into somewhere beyond the space-time continuum to not being able to help the others directly. Cthulhu was sealed into deep perpetual sleep underwater at R´yleh, Shub-Niggurath ended somewhere else too, and all of them pretty much disconnected from themselves and from their human and non-human followers in the world, leaving Nyarlathoteph as the frail only connection for all (though he mainly helps Shub-Niggurath, Azathoth and seems that sometimes also Cthulhu, Yog-Sothoth and even Hastur but very least of all) although himself on time has developed his seek for his own domination power on Earth, leaving his masters instructions away (Nyarlathoteph has many faces and forms, and mainly is called the Crawling Chaos and the Faceless God, being that way the form how he managed to escape the imprisionment of the Archetypical Gods, he is being pretty much a "Peter Littlefinger Baelish" Lovecraftian god!) It could be quite interesting to know about these Lovecraftian beings working into the GRR.Martin world and somehow it makes sense, but then the author might be following either Derleth or Lin Carter´s systematization of Lovecraftian and his literary circle (which included Robert E. Howard and Clark Ashton Smith, other builders of their own terrible and greater fantasy world, pretty much linked with Lovecraft), rather than the original work of the main author.
Nyarlathotep is in a way “higher” than both Cthulhu and Hastur on the power chart and could be their grandfathers, haha. Also Cthulhu isn’t even a god and is more of a demigod if at all godly in the slightest. Idk if Hastur is a god but because Cthulhu isn’t a true god chances are Hastur likely isn’t a god either, Nyarlathotep is a direct spawn of Azothoth and thusly has to be a god. Nyarlathotep just gave these other entities followers because he was kinda the best way to get followers other than dreams but Cthulhu would be limited by how many people’s dreams it could effect. At least in the original Lovecraftian versions.
I don’t really like the version of derleth . I can appreciate that it adds to the lore but the whole point of lovecraft’s mythos is that it is incomprehensible for the human mind and that we can catch only shadow of glimpses of the bigger picture . These are beings whose existence and motivations are beyond human comprehension, this is the essence of the horror .
@Stormbringer Exactly. Derleth's mythos is heavily influenced by his Christian faith, while Lovecraft's mythos was atheistic/nihilistic and amoral in nature (= true cosmicism)
@@Den.Vos.Reynaerde Lovecraft is very much like a follower and consolidates the traces of earlier cosmic horror works at Abraham Machen, Algernon Blackwood and William H. Hogdson on the same theme, improving all those forerunners which are very forgotten and underrated today!
If the oily black stone was made oil by the Long Night, then the Five Forts predate the Long Night. If the Five Forts were built to stop the Others, or their counterbalance, then that is further evidence that the Night is a cycle that repeats itself. I think the Children arming themselves in Dragon glass is a big hint at the Children fighting the Others before the First Men.
By the quote lml read... there should be 4 hinges. There are certainly 4 directions. The heart of winter is in the north. The heart of Shadow in the east. Which stands to reason, the heart of Summer is in the south and the heart of Light in the West right..?
Hi guys! Very interesting topic, Asshai. I was just thinking that the poisonous environment from this place might be due to radioactivity. Maybe Asshai is a city built around a very powerful radioactive artifact, or maybe it is an out-world vessel like a spaceship...with radioactive elements seeping into the earth, twisting the plants and animals, poisoning the water, creating twisted human-like beings with interesting powers (shadow-binders). GRR Martin works in a lot of symbols and metaphors, just like HP Lovecraft (and he's written a number of SF works before A Song of Ice and Fire). Food for thought :)
A small thing that popped into my mind. When patch face says "the birds have scales" you assume he means Dragons. However, couldn't he also be linking the greenseers to the Deep Ones? As in fish scales?
I honestly don't think Caster's babies turn into anything, but are used as a form of blood magic sacrifice for the others. It would fit in very well with everything else that happens in the series.
Swarm509 kind of makes sense because not only did Craster give him the sons he also gave him Sheep, Lambs, and other living things. He didn't need the sons because they would get in his way, he only wanted girls. I'm sure if they were happy getting lambs sometimes they would be cool with it all the time. Then again tho...... the Other did chase after them trying to get the kid back
If the oily black stone is the same material as the salt throne/seastone chair, It would suggest that it's current state is what it is supposed to look like. The base of is probably made of the same stuff too. These places are about as far away on the map from the shadowlands as you can get. It might be geographically close if the world is round such that sailing east would reach the west across from the sunset sea. The Starks cannot be descended from the Night's King because Brandon the Builder built Winterfell and founded the Night's Watch. The Night's King was the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch who might have already been a Stark. That all said, there may well be a genetic reason for the Stark's cold resistant abilities that is shared with the Others, wildlings, and other northern peoples. Just to be clear to non know it alls, I am talk about the Night's King here, not the Night King.
Asshai, Ash Eye, as in the eye of the ashes or remains of a civilization based on fire, which would be Old Valyria. Asshai is the *focal point* of what remains from a world which once embraced fire magic.
I cannot wait to get some glass candle action. I first found the ASOIAF community on UA-cam because i wanted to know more about Asshai. It's my fav location, besides Naath and Sothoryos
I think I just figured out how Game of Thrones is going to end. The ice dragon and the fire dragon are going to fight, they are going to kill numerous characters and those who survive are going to realize that for all their scheming, they are children, they are rats fighting over crumbs in this world.
In the northern part of Essos there is a place with ancient males made with stone thatbis reminisce t of the Battle Isle, and the Sea Stone Chair of The Iron Islands.
Ye Gentlemen have stated that these black meteors are sources of power and are not evil deities from beyond the stars like Chthulu and Narlehotep; but, what about the voices that come from the flames? Is that just a TV show thing or does Melissadre commune with a voice in the flames in the books as well?
great episode. The meteor thing is a lot for me to comprehend especially after comprehending other places like Asshai and the shadowlands. I can't imagine outer space worlds or space travel for the knights but who knows. I jokingly believe this entire Song of IAF is just Dragonheart the movie...lol
Civilizations are normally based around the fear of punishment. That isn't to say that people can't be naturally civil but simply that law is nothing without consequence. So in the medieval era, and before that, and on into today, technically everything is legal unless someone was going to kill or imprison you for it. Beyond that we have cultural punishment, or social punishment which is the outcasting of individuals whose behavior is deemed unacceptable. Therefore I don't think 'everything being allowed in Asshai' means that you could do anything, just that there are no cultural or social tabboos on behaviors. You would still be limited from say stealing someone's property by their ability to freighten you into not doing so. It sounds barbaric but it is actually a primary function of civilized life.
Look, obviously we don't know what we don't know but I think you guys basically solved it right here in this stream. I think the thing at the center of the heart of darkness in Stygai is a kind of Lovecraftian meteor, possibly connected to the Shade of the Evening trees or even the weirwoods- since I do subscribe to the idea that the weirwoods are more supernatural fungi network than tree. Furthermore, George has given us Aemond One- Eye to basically show us a bloodstone emperor/possible night's king figure, a one-eyed, dragonriding king (or acting king in Aemond's case) with a chunk of stone shoved inside his vacant eyesocket. It's always seemed like Euron's blood eye must have been something he's had since childhood but how much you wanna bet it's a piece of the bloodstone-lovecraftian-meteor entity from the heart of darkness?
There is probably more factors in the play than fire and ice magic-nature magic of Children of the forest,water magic of the Rhoynar,whatever the magic Warlocks of the Qarth are using, apparently Euron can use wind magic,maybe that's one of the tricks of the Warlocks...
i missed the podcast, but you are (were) talking of the hinges of the world, but i dont think they are any hinges. when Melisandre talks of hinges and think she is stronger at the Wall, i think she is closer to the source of her power, and theres a theory that when she remembers herself being auctioned as a child, what she doesnt remember is that her home was Hardhome, taken as a child by slavers and that she is a wildling greenseer and her powers were twisted by her staying in Aashai and her training.
Just like in our pacific ocean there are probably islands. On those islands Arya might find things thought lost. A Valyrian out post, maybe wild dragons.
One other counterpoint, the side of fire was present like the entire time ice was gone in the form of valyria so fire has ruled for quite a while, the doom was only...wat a few hundred years ago vs ice being gone since the end of the long night
Lmao. Zorse is a real animal. Zebras and horse can be bred together like lions and tigers. Just the males are sterile. That's the coolest thing about these books, George deals with real evolution too. If the animals are too different in the books, then he uses magic.
GRRM calls the river Ash phosphorescent in the quote you read. There is a great post on Reddit about phosphorus poisoning in Asshai from a meteor impact. It really explains it well. I'll try to find the post. www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/7eqxsi/illumination_in_the_shadow_the_chemical/?
dragons and the secrets that made valyria came out of ashai, didnt they? then shouldn't they have been best positioned to combat the others in the long night, even with their ruler corrupted? but no, that land is ruined. it smells like this place may have been destroyed before the others even came, just as valyria destroyed itself without needing the others to march out of the north to get them.
Hey guys. You do nice work. I don't know if this is an idea that's been widely explored. These books are about a lot of sex. Ya, not new. But there is a rhyme and reason to the outcome. I was wondering around the wiki and while I was reading about the brindled men I suddenly realized GRRM is trying to tell us something when some one has a miscarriage or dies is child birth. The Ibish don t mix with other races. It's not true. Ben Plumm has a Ibbish grandmother. Ib comes from hairy men, and hairy men were first men in Westeros. When a character of strong first men background mixes with some one of strong Andal background they have trouble having kids. Lysa Tully is more first man and Jon Arryn is mostly Andal. This is a cool detail right? But why does it matter? Well, who's Creator's parents? Who knows and would it matter? His parents were Wynton Stout and Maege Mormont. I can prove it, it was just CSI work. Why is that noteworthy? Why did Jeor take the black? Why does Jeor know about everything Crastor is doing? Why did Maege send Longclaw to Jeor? There's a deep layer that means something and it's hidden in the background. His characters are built from the DNA up. That's why he's stuck in slavers bay. That's why names are so important when he makes a character.
First time hearing this, five years later, but you talk about the four hinges of the world, the black meteor worshipped by the Bloodstone Emperor, a possible second meteor in the True North and how they connect to the hinges... what if the Drowned god is a third meteor lost in the sea and Patch Face is the equivalent of a water white? And what if there is a forth meteor to make the forth hinge?
I don't think the Jogos Nhai are the Great Empire of the Dawn. The Jogos Nhai do seem to be cousins of somebody else we know, considering the are a foot shorter than everybody else and have misshapen heads similar to the skulls Bran sees in Bloodraven's cave. Jhogos Nhai = CotF relatives.
Asshai is the largest city in the known world, it is believed that the Valyrians come from there and be at an intermediate point in the world, they look like the ruins of an ancient empire that one day conquered the world, beyond Asshai the world is hostile to the humans. JRR Martin said that once there were dragons all over the planet and there are legends of dragons beyond Ashai, it is 10 thousand kilometers from the west and we know where the planet's equator is because of the tripocal zone, which follows that one day the great Dragon lords ruled the whole world with their dragons and their capital was Asshai until they fell into oblivion, Valirya is their pretty little sister. In addition, the coordinates that Quaiz gives Danerys to fly with her dragons are on the other side of the world, surely she wants her to reconquer the world and return Asshay and not Valirya her little sister to former glory.
If a meteor is the source of power in Asshai could it be plausible that a portion of the meteor was used to build "The Wall" therefore allowing the wall to have magical powers? This would explain why Milasandra had her powers increase when she was at the wall.
It's interesting to point out that Mellisandra's fire magic is enhanced at the wall whereas Thoros' fire gazing magic is quashed when visiting the ghost of High Heart's ex-weirwood grove.
I had not thought of that, great catch.
A couple of possible scenarios:
The magic of the Wall and Asshai MIGHT be more similar than we think, if not the same actual source
The sources of magic are “aware” and could probably choose to snuff out any magic use they don’t like
Or something/someone else is using the magic at High Heart and didn’t appreciate any uninvited guests using their “property” without permission
None of these necessarily exclude each other and could combine in a number of ways
"Under the sea, no one wears hats."
They don't crown their kings beyond the wall.
The Egyptian written record and the Mesopotamian written record both long predate the Chinese written record. Just clearing that up.
Adam Arko I agree with you on actual Chinese but there were people living there and using some kind of writing or something at the same time as The Mesopotamians. Or at least it looks like there might have been. But since the area is so wet unlike Mesopotamia things are going to do great and fall apart. It is definitely an interesting discussion. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/10/inscriptions-predate-oldest-chinese-language
The Indus River Valley written record is at least as old, and still untranslated.
I mean not really but, ok...
@@thomasbowe9956 Egypt is older yes, but China has over 5000 years of recorded History. China is the longest live.
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How terrifying to go to Asshai, and to know that all these people that terrify are afraid to go into the Heart of Darkness.
Guys, i absolutely Love your Channel, and thank you.
Quick note though, Cthulu's great enemy is his 'half brother' Hashtur the unspeakable a.k.a the "King in Yellow".
Nyarolathothep is not concerned with Cthulu at all.
He is a direct instrument of Azathoth, and belongs to a hierarchy of beings above that of Cthulu and Hashtur.
Also, just to bring clarity to a different video of yours, Lovecraft was particular, regarding his intention that others use, and embelish on his creations as much as possible. That was a clear intent of his.
As for this video, i honestly think that Asshai was not lawless, rather just based on a power-system that we are not privy to.
You Could do anything... as long as it didn't interfere with the intentions of someone more powerful.
I think, the people there understood the power structure, and authority structure and the society worked that way.
But i don't believe it was pure chaos.
Yall really are the best ASOIAF youtubers. Quinn's Dune videos are awesome too. These channels and In Deep Geek are my happy place.
Talking starts at 2:55 .
honeytantv Thank you
I enjoyed the music
I love his opening music, though.
You da real mvp
Godbless
A prequel show about Asshai,would be something to behold!
I'd rather have Yi Ti (at any time, but during the current story, e.g. War of the 5 Kings) would be really nice to see. Dany & Dragon rumours, what that might do. Their civil war. ... Their Five Forts: their The Wall.
That would be incredible or a show about the rise and fall of the great empire of the dawn or Valyria would be epic too imo
U should directed and make urself a wealthy man. The first and major step is already done for u
The books of R.R Martin r far better than Tolkien s
@@alnorth612 Not
I think the mages of Asshai probably have a hierarchy of some sort. There are probably a couple of strong groups who control trade and provide protection by goods and services from outside traders. Weaker groups would probably pay the stronger ones for protection or crumbs of knowledge.
Im thinking these people eat too but their environment is polluted so they probably have to trade with outsiders so the strongest mages would control the trade of goods to give them power & authority over other mages.
Maybe the heart tree at Winterfell is important it some way. It's huge and beautiful. Maybe the Starks quit feeding it and that broke the pact. Everything about Winterfell is important. It was 1st and it's built completely different from the other castles in Westeros but also has the gargoyles in common with Dragonstone.
Actually the Hightower was the first castle in Westeros
I loved the touch that Winterfell had a 'heating' system created by routing a hot spring through double curtained walls. It never came up during the series which I sort of missed, I thought it was really clever.
honestly this channel is so impressive, you should be hired to do voice over work/ read an audio book. amazing inflection
the glowing water, mutated fish, dying animals and greasy looking stone always remind me of typical signs of nuclear fallout poisoning, and the lacquered masks almost seem like the rubbery shiny material of gasmasks
also the gold being poisonous too - radioactive metal contamination
TheNeuroticnathan I agree. I had heard theories that ASOIAF could be about a post-apocalyptic world.
man hell no. its magic lol
miss the part about blood mages,shadow binders,sorcerers?
Bore-os Of Myr No Bro.
I like Gray Area's theory that Mell is actually from Hardhome prior to being sold in Asshai!
To be fair, a fight between a fire and an ice dragon would fit the whole War of The Roses thing. Think there was a story from the legends of king Arthur where Merlin found a cave where two dragons fought, one white and one red, drawing parallells with houses York and Tudor.
I realise this is an old comment but this bothered me: the white dragon in that story represents the invading Anglo Saxons and the red dragon is the Celts. Hasn’t really got anything to do with the Wars of the Roses since that was 10 centuries later.
@@bethanhaines6360 As Mr. Martin said himself: ”History doesn’t repeat, but rhymes”, paraphrased of course. The legend works as an analogy for several things in English history, as well as for the concepts of SOIAF, and so the parallel to the War of The Roses. It is true that the original legend days it represents the conflict between the Welsh and Saxons, but in this context it is less relevant that the British Boogaloo 2.
@@candersson60 British Boogaloo 2? My point is that the two wars, the Saxon invasion and the Wars of the Roses, are very different and I don’t see how an analogy for one could be applicable for the other.
@@bethanhaines6360 As in the colour scheme of the dragons, and as I remember it; the victory of the Red Dragon. Not the wars themselves. As I said: an analogy, or metaphor if you will. I think you are reading too much into my comment.
Great show! I love this topic,I wish more of asshai would be revealed by Lord Martin.
I really like LML's views on the meteor in the Heart of Winter and The Land of Shadow because it would be a great way to show polar opposite effects of impact. One is nuclear winter and the other being volcanic eruption and fallout.
I'd drink a series of Yi Ti teas!!!
Celestial Seasonings should do that!!! Get on it!!! CHOP CHOP!!!! 👏👏
Yi Ti: Dawn of Dynasty = Chrysanthemum and Chamomile
Bloodstone = Blood Orange and Cinnamon
Always Winter Blend = White Strawberry, Lemon and Ginger
Wispy Westeros = Carmel, Clove and Mace
Dragonfire Brew = Dragonberry & Dragonfruit
Asshai Elixir = Acai, Guarana & Cat's eye (Dragon's eye)
Some of these would be palatable but others would be cutthroat sweet or mad bitter.
You are one of the lore series I put on in the background when I write D&D or GURPS campaigns. Super hero lore, Dune lore, AGOT lore, LOTR lore, Battletech lore, Warhammer lore, Harry Potter lore, and real history videos all make for great inspiration sources.
A zorse is a crossbreed - the offspring child of a zebra and a horse.
That’s true irl, I don’t think it’s necessarily the case in fantasy
@@warpedwhimsical It is the case
@@roguecomics4775 No, it isn't. In ASOIAF, zorses are special beasts, not hybrids.
@@filipferencak2717 Your wrong, and idgaf don't get me.
@@roguecomics4775 I looked it up and it turns out we're both right. Here's a quote from the wiki:
"Zorses were originally created by crossing horses with a horse-like animal, but are now bred as their own species."
So yeah. Originally they were hybrids, but they went through speciation, so they can be considered their own species now. They are basically what dogs are to wolves.
I am so glad someone is offering fans an interesting live show topic. The community has just dissolved. It has been so disappointing!
I love you two together. You always give me so much to think about. I love the fact that you have intelligent conversations. Keep up the great work Quin... Love and Hugs from South Africa 💖💖💖🐘🐘🦏🦏
asshay poisoning : uranium in the mines poisoning everything with radiation? Oil coming up crating the greasy black stone which is also super toxic? When I first saw this I read it as “asshat” which is how my day is going lol! This is great guys!
Thanks for making this podcasts, they are so cool, full of great info and analysis
LML! Woot this is a line up today for sure. Need the two of you are Preston for a series on how you can reconcile your divergent views. I’m convince the fantasy vs science fiction is a false debate and he answer to both theories is yes.
I need a friend like you. I need someone I can discuss theories for hours...
Elissa Farman and Corlyss velaryon went to asshai and didn’t get murdered or enslaved , they probably allow readers do they can ensure they have ample food and water
Mance Rayders cloak is stiched with red silk from a shipwreck possibly from Asshai.
I love the GEOTD dragon lord theory and hope more evidence gets revealed about it... I also think the theory holds that House Stark has the blood of the Others in their lineage, since one of the conditions of the original pact may have been interbreeding w Others (if that’s even possible) so many awesome theories I hope we learn more about, good podcast
Speaking of Wheel of Crime, Angraal, or however you spell it, were relics could store or amplify "the power." If the theory that dragons amplify magic or dragons ARE magic in ASOIAF, perhaps the black stone amplifies the magic from the dragons. The base of the wall is after all made of that black stone, and there were no dragons when Mel was last in Asshai.
Asshai, K´Dath, Yeen, Stygai, Carcossa, the inner ruins of Leng and the unnamed ruins of Ulos nearby of Ulthos all seem to have some eerie and unsettling old non-human connection either wholesome or in part.
Makes sense that Asshai was maybe the original main city of the Great Empire of the Dawn, and perhaps also Yeen, Carcossa, the ruins of Leng, Ulos and even Stygai and K´Dath started as human cities too, yet mainly close-linked with the Ancient/Outer God forces in the Dawn world, at least for a while on the good side, and later fallen upon their enemies, mainly Yeen, Stygai and K´Dath in total domain. Asshai and Leng, and Carcossa perhaps too, endured and still are somehow resisting the dark influence in their own ways, not very fine, but still people endured there, though were transformed on time: Leng people were secretive xenophobic and gigantic, Asshai well is the main theme of all, and we might not know much about Carcossa but as it´s nearby to the Hidden Sea and the City of Winged Men across this sea, maybe the people could have been affected too.
Either way, there is a connection between Carcossa and Yi-Ti Empire as the 69 Yellow Emperor of Yi-Ti exilled himself there and is a mighty dark sorcerer too, and there must be a link with the Empire of the Dawn, itself the forerruner of Yi-Ti, and Asshai too, and so with the ancestors of Valyrians which were able to control dragons.
Yeen and the ruins of Ulos are pretty much an enigma, but there seems to have been of some human or human-related ancient connection, perhaps some brief living colonies, yet cursed about their building and purpose (conquests of the Bloodstone Emperor at the Long Night time perhaps?).
K´Dath could have been indeed the earliest city of the world and it´s claimed, along side Asshai, and even more before the latter, as it´s quite nearby the Five Forts, so there migh have been the original settlement of the Dawn Emprie untill the Pearl Emperor was forced to leave it and built another capital at Asshai and left the Forts to keep the former city from the new menaces from the far East as the riders of Gray Waste, the Shrykes and the people from Cannibal Sands, however in the end, K´Dath totally was overrun by something they couldn´t stop, and along side fell down other nearby eastern ancient settlements as mysterious Bonetown, and the Cities of Bloodless Men, which in turn came cursed on their innhabitans into vampires.
But still whatever their dreadfull end, what happened in K´Dath as with Stygai was much worst than what happened in the ruins of inner Leng, Carcossa, the ruins of Ulos, Yeen, Asshai, Bonetown, the City of Winged Men and the Cities of Bloodless Men, to the point, both the Shadowbinders from Asshai and the Shrykes and maybe the Gray Waste riders to avoid either Stygai and K´Dath respectively. (However K´Dath somehow managed to kept people living there adquiring a level close to Asshai status, yet slightly darker. Stygai is the real heart of the Shadow Land and the Death City, but seems very rich and important, and as his inhabitants nearby were demons and dragons, maybe some people like the Winged Men live there, but are pretty much darker, scarier and dangerous than the others.)
I know it's very late, but you know that Carcosa, K'Dath, the city of the bloodless mens are basicly map-filler done by Martin (and his Maester in universe) ? They are direct reference to Lovecraft mythos, I dont think there is much more to say about it.
@@jhtrq1465 I know about it, still they´re quite thrilling amazing on its own whatever even if he hadn´t thought much about it in the first place, now he had to deal with the consecuences of using it on his work as there actually is some fandom of his work rather thrilled more about it than on what else he was mainly focused on.
@@lhadzyan7300 I'm agree with you in the sense that I'm also fascinated by all the Asshai and far East stuff. But nonetheless, a lot of the stuff we take as facts about Asshai and all those remote place are very much like the dragons drawn on the Terra Ingognita from old maps, exagération, pure inventions, who knows? There is an interview where Martin speak a bit about Asshai, answering to the question if why there is no kids there. He basically say that all information is coming from a Maester on the other side of the world who has never set foot in Essos. So, there it is. For me it make this stuff even more fascinating, but I try to not overthink it too much either ( even if I love those kind of theories)
Maybe Melisandre wasn't so powerful in Asshai because she wasn't the only magic-user there? Like, Asshai is, in your own words, a hub for mages, thus the power is sort of distributed (if magic can be lost and can resurge, then it's sort of an energy which is limited to some extent), and on the Wall and beyond there's barely anyone (among humans, anyway, maybe there's a distinction in species) who actively uses magic.
This is great for reading along, makes it so much more enjoyable and interesting with that voice that you put on. If it's not too much could you possibly consider doing one of these "Theories & Discussions" on Iron Islands because like me i'm sure there are fans of the Greyjoys that would appreciate that a lot
Patchface he's done a couple videos, on the Iron Islands now they are pretty good
sounds like florida LOL
I laughed out loud when I read this.
@@animemaniacify Me too. And I live in the land of mutations and greasy stones.
My favorite discussion! Really good ideas here. Loved the reading, Quinn and LmL always drops bombs.
Only halfway through this & you guys have got me thinking; what if the Shadow Lands are like the original Valyria? Perhaps those lands were like a mirror image of Valyria, fertile, warm weather, many active volcanoes around which the most ancient of dragons nested. And just before the Long Night a catastrophe similar to the Doom of Valyria took place transforming that region into the Shadow Lands we know today. I also agree with LML about Asshai being built by the Empire of the Dawn, not sure if it was the capital of the empire but was definitely a part of it & was probably home to the most ancient dragon lords.
We know there are dragons in Asshai for sure because Bran saw dragons in Asshai in his falling/3-eyed-crow vision while in his coma.
What if all the cave systems all over planetos are what’s left from an ancient root system from a weirwood world tree... what if under the sea means “in the bowls of the earth” where the deep roots grow.
Dustin Smith pretty good theory the only thing is, the weirdwoods aren't in other places. Only in westeros... There's no weirdwoods in Essos or anywhere
Ifequevron has "carved trees" and the Ifequevron sound like they were Children of the Forest or something related.
They say weirwoods don't rot though.
@@LordJordanXVII could they have been cut down en masse in essos though? Rather than kept up due to their holy status in Westeros?
maybe......asshai is suffering some sort of fallout from w.e was used to defeat the others
here is how Asshai works. Anarchy!
if you are in Asshai make sure you are the biggest baddest thing on the block and no-one wants to mess with you, or at least be so powerful that messing with you will open the one doing it up to be messed with because of the exertion of messing with you. if you go there bring adequate protection. it's like the Sith empire from star wars (the old republic), no-one messes with the emperor because he is the strongest. the Sith counsel doesn't try to take him out because they know every other counsel member will come to take them out, not for justice, not for the empire, nor out of loyalty, they come to kill you and ascend to emperor the easy way after you've done all the dirty work.
these kind of cutthroat systems can look and act remarkably stable (for a while) but as soon as the status Quo is upset everybody eats everyone else in utter mayhem.
I would suggest you look up Indian mythology, and especially the concept of 'yugas' and the cycle of ages. Martin seems to have adopted this into his epic. The end of the GEOTD and the rise of a 'broken' world seems a lot like the end of satyuga and the beginning of kaliyuga.
Mel is strong in the wall because the wall is made of magic and ashai is just full of mages
Hastur is the rival of Cthulhu!! However the "The One That Cannot Be Named" name or "Magnum Inominandum" wasn´t originally related to the same deity by Lovecraft himself, but was by August Derleth, his main follower of his lore, and who along others gave some structure into it. Since then, after Lovecraft´s death, Hastur became The One That Cannot Be Named, and was set up a rivalry with Cthulhu, but nothing of that is ever hinted at Lovecraft´s own work. Hastur wasn´t a Lovecraftian god either, but he borrowed and adapted from Arthur Machen work, a pre-Lovecraftian influence, along side the city of Carcossa and the Lake of Hali from Robert W. Chambers´The King in Yellow, also another pre-Lovecraft literary source (Carcossa and Hali itself weren´t from Chambers either but from Ambrose Bierce´short story "An Inhabitant from Carcossa", where some dead sould of that former great city lies in ruins and finds out being dead and communicates with a medium somewhere else, Hali isn´t a lake but some wise poet from Carcossa´s lore, which the main character remembers as he awakens to find himself lost in the ruins graveyard.)
Nyarlathoteph didn´t follow either Hastur nor Cthulhu, he follows Azathoth, however as his boss was left pretty idiotic by the so-called Archetypical Gods (which aren´t Lovecraftian themselves, but another Derleth´s construction to make sense in the whole myths) in the center of the Universe as the Nuclear Chaos, having his whole power yet being unable to use it properly. }
(According to Derleth systematic, the so-called Ancient Ones or Outer Gods had a battle for the control of the Universe with the Archetypical Gods, and although they might have been both more fearsome in power by being ancient than their rivals, at the end the "good guys" were wiser and managed to seal and disable the use of the power of the bad ones. According to this explanation, Azathoth and Yog-Sothoth were the main leaders and the most powerfull of all, but in the end, Azathoh retained all his power, but no control in his mind to use it properly, and Yog-Sothoth was sealed into somewhere beyond the space-time continuum to not being able to help the others directly. Cthulhu was sealed into deep perpetual sleep underwater at R´yleh, Shub-Niggurath ended somewhere else too, and all of them pretty much disconnected from themselves and from their human and non-human followers in the world, leaving Nyarlathoteph as the frail only connection for all (though he mainly helps Shub-Niggurath, Azathoth and seems that sometimes also Cthulhu, Yog-Sothoth and even Hastur but very least of all) although himself on time has developed his seek for his own domination power on Earth, leaving his masters instructions away (Nyarlathoteph has many faces and forms, and mainly is called the Crawling Chaos and the Faceless God, being that way the form how he managed to escape the imprisionment of the Archetypical Gods, he is being pretty much a "Peter Littlefinger Baelish" Lovecraftian god!)
It could be quite interesting to know about these Lovecraftian beings working into the GRR.Martin world and somehow it makes sense, but then the author might be following either Derleth or Lin Carter´s systematization of Lovecraftian and his literary circle (which included Robert E. Howard and Clark Ashton Smith, other builders of their own terrible and greater fantasy world, pretty much linked with Lovecraft), rather than the original work of the main author.
Nyarlathotep is in a way “higher” than both Cthulhu and Hastur on the power chart and could be their grandfathers, haha.
Also Cthulhu isn’t even a god and is more of a demigod if at all godly in the slightest.
Idk if Hastur is a god but because Cthulhu isn’t a true god chances are Hastur likely isn’t a god either, Nyarlathotep is a direct spawn of Azothoth and thusly has to be a god.
Nyarlathotep just gave these other entities followers because he was kinda the best way to get followers other than dreams but Cthulhu would be limited by how many people’s dreams it could effect.
At least in the original Lovecraftian versions.
I don’t really like the version of derleth . I can appreciate that it adds to the lore but the whole point of lovecraft’s mythos is that it is incomprehensible for the human mind and that we can catch only shadow of glimpses of the bigger picture . These are beings whose existence and motivations are beyond human comprehension, this is the essence of the horror .
@Stormbringer Exactly. Derleth's mythos is heavily influenced by his Christian faith, while Lovecraft's mythos was atheistic/nihilistic and amoral in nature (= true cosmicism)
@@Den.Vos.Reynaerde Lovecraft is very much like a follower and consolidates the traces of earlier cosmic horror works at Abraham Machen, Algernon Blackwood and William H. Hogdson on the same theme, improving all those forerunners which are very forgotten and underrated today!
If the oily black stone was made oil by the Long Night, then the Five Forts predate the Long Night. If the Five Forts were built to stop the Others, or their counterbalance, then that is further evidence that the Night is a cycle that repeats itself. I think the Children arming themselves in Dragon glass is a big hint at the Children fighting the Others before the First Men.
By the quote lml read... there should be 4 hinges. There are certainly 4 directions. The heart of winter is in the north. The heart of Shadow in the east. Which stands to reason, the heart of Summer is in the south and the heart of Light in the West right..?
Hi guys! Very interesting topic, Asshai. I was just thinking that the poisonous environment from this place might be due to radioactivity. Maybe Asshai is a city built around a very powerful radioactive artifact, or maybe it is an out-world vessel like a spaceship...with radioactive elements seeping into the earth, twisting the plants and animals, poisoning the water, creating twisted human-like beings with interesting powers (shadow-binders). GRR Martin works in a lot of symbols and metaphors, just like HP Lovecraft (and he's written a number of SF works before A Song of Ice and Fire).
Food for thought :)
A small thing that popped into my mind. When patch face says "the birds have scales" you assume he means Dragons. However, couldn't he also be linking the greenseers to the Deep Ones? As in fish scales?
Re-listening for fun and nostalgia: 12/20/19
I honestly don't think Caster's babies turn into anything, but are used as a form of blood magic sacrifice for the others. It would fit in very well with everything else that happens in the series.
Swarm509 kind of makes sense because not only did Craster give him the sons he also gave him Sheep, Lambs, and other living things. He didn't need the sons because they would get in his way, he only wanted girls. I'm sure if they were happy getting lambs sometimes they would be cool with it all the time. Then again tho...... the Other did chase after them trying to get the kid back
Someone who wears many hats is someone who has different identities but in the eyes of the network you can’t hide anything
If the oily black stone is the same material as the salt throne/seastone chair, It would suggest that it's current state is what it is supposed to look like. The base of is probably made of the same stuff too. These places are about as far away on the map from the shadowlands as you can get. It might be geographically close if the world is round such that sailing east would reach the west across from the sunset sea. The Starks cannot be descended from the Night's King because Brandon the Builder built Winterfell and founded the Night's Watch. The Night's King was the 13th Lord Commander of the Night's Watch who might have already been a Stark. That all said, there may well be a genetic reason for the Stark's cold resistant abilities that is shared with the Others, wildlings, and other northern peoples. Just to be clear to non know it alls, I am talk about the Night's King here, not the Night King.
Asshai, Ash Eye, as in the eye of the ashes or remains of a civilization based on fire, which would be Old Valyria. Asshai is the *focal point* of what remains from a world which once embraced fire magic.
Hands down best ASOIAF channel on UA-cam.
Yiti would sure be a hit in a China and massive merchandising opportunity
asshai = evil hogwarts? haha. So sad i missed this one live, listening through now!
will edit this comment later with more comments.
I cannot wait to get some glass candle action. I first found the ASOIAF community on UA-cam because i wanted to know more about Asshai. It's my fav location, besides Naath and Sothoryos
Great Wall was a Chinese movie and they approached Mat Damon about starring in it...
That information is literally one google search away.
You mentioned the unique and analytic Preston Jacobs!! Ican´t believe my ears. Keep it up guys
I think I just figured out how Game of Thrones is going to end. The ice dragon and the fire dragon are going to fight, they are going to kill numerous characters and those who survive are going to realize that for all their scheming, they are children, they are rats fighting over crumbs in this world.
Yours would have been better....
In the northern part of Essos there is a place with ancient males made with stone thatbis reminisce t of the Battle Isle, and the Sea Stone Chair of The Iron Islands.
Ye Gentlemen have stated that these black meteors are sources of power and are not evil deities from beyond the stars like Chthulu and Narlehotep; but, what about the voices that come from the flames? Is that just a TV show thing or does Melissadre commune with a voice in the flames in the books as well?
great episode. The meteor thing is a lot for me to comprehend especially after comprehending other places like Asshai and the shadowlands. I can't imagine outer space worlds or space travel for the knights but who knows. I jokingly believe this entire Song of IAF is just Dragonheart the movie...lol
Civilizations are normally based around the fear of punishment. That isn't to say that people can't be naturally civil but simply that law is nothing without consequence. So in the medieval era, and before that, and on into today, technically everything is legal unless someone was going to kill or imprison you for it. Beyond that we have cultural punishment, or social punishment which is the outcasting of individuals whose behavior is deemed unacceptable. Therefore I don't think 'everything being allowed in Asshai' means that you could do anything, just that there are no cultural or social tabboos on behaviors. You would still be limited from say stealing someone's property by their ability to freighten you into not doing so. It sounds barbaric but it is actually a primary function of civilized life.
The gold being strange is reminiscent of the gold in The Shadow over Innsmouth
One of your best videos!
Look, obviously we don't know what we don't know but I think you guys basically solved it right here in this stream. I think the thing at the center of the heart of darkness in Stygai is a kind of Lovecraftian meteor, possibly connected to the Shade of the Evening trees or even the weirwoods- since I do subscribe to the idea that the weirwoods are more supernatural fungi network than tree. Furthermore, George has given us Aemond One- Eye to basically show us a bloodstone emperor/possible night's king figure, a one-eyed, dragonriding king (or acting king in Aemond's case) with a chunk of stone shoved inside his vacant eyesocket. It's always seemed like Euron's blood eye must have been something he's had since childhood but how much you wanna bet it's a piece of the bloodstone-lovecraftian-meteor entity from the heart of darkness?
the sap and or leaves of weirwood would add the blood red just as the blue leaves of shade of the evening tree make blue shade of the evening to drink
36:00, so what you are saying is that the World of Ice and Fire is actually about Heat Miser and Snow Miser battling it out?
There is probably more factors in the play than fire and ice magic-nature magic of Children of the forest,water magic of the Rhoynar,whatever the magic Warlocks of the Qarth are using, apparently Euron can use wind magic,maybe that's one of the tricks of the Warlocks...
James R 😂
This is a great video that suffers because there is 40s of black screen before the intro. Who would wait around for that?
Have you, yourself ever had a dream you were in the world of ice and fire?
i missed the podcast, but you are (were) talking of the hinges of the world, but i dont think they are any hinges.
when Melisandre talks of hinges and think she is stronger at the Wall, i think she is closer to the source of her power, and theres a theory that when she remembers herself being auctioned as a child, what she doesnt remember is that her home was Hardhome, taken as a child by slavers and that she is a wildling greenseer and her powers were twisted by her staying in Aashai and her training.
POWER... power is a curse for those who seek it. power is only obtained by those who would LOWER themselves to pick it up.
Quoting Ragnar, eh?
@@CharlesZane_ exactly
Quinn really got into this one before the end! xD
Asshai was made by the people in Ulthos
China isn't the oldest civilization in the world nor did they invent writing before anyone else
I fucking love the Braveheart intro!
Just like in our pacific ocean there are probably islands. On those islands Arya might find things thought lost. A Valyrian out post, maybe wild dragons.
One other counterpoint, the side of fire was present like the entire time ice was gone in the form of valyria so fire has ruled for quite a while, the doom was only...wat a few hundred years ago vs ice being gone since the end of the long night
Great video discussions. Also as someone from Türkiye -not Turkey guys Türkiye- I couldn't understand when Lucifer said 'göbekli tepe' 😂😂
Asshai is definitely inspired by the real life ancient port city of Tyre. Look it up it has a very interesting past
I think light bringer is the first valyrian steel sword.
Lmao. Zorse is a real animal. Zebras and horse can be bred together like lions and tigers. Just the males are sterile.
That's the coolest thing about these books, George deals with real evolution too. If the animals are too different in the books, then he uses magic.
lol I always play Pocket Mortys when I listen to your live streams. :)
GRRM calls the river Ash phosphorescent in the quote you read. There is a great post on Reddit about phosphorus poisoning in Asshai from a meteor impact. It really explains it well. I'll try to find the post. www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/comments/7eqxsi/illumination_in_the_shadow_the_chemical/?
Doesnt melisandre come from ashai? Or hasn't she been there? Wish we could have visited that place.
Anyone ever considered Planetos is actually a moon the encircles a planet the denizens call a moon?
Love the vids.
Gonna sub to LML right now, thanks for the tip
dragons and the secrets that made valyria came out of ashai, didnt they? then shouldn't they have been best positioned to combat the others in the long night, even with their ruler corrupted? but no, that land is ruined. it smells like this place may have been destroyed before the others even came, just as valyria destroyed itself without needing the others to march out of the north to get them.
Hey guys. You do nice work. I don't know if this is an idea that's been widely explored. These books are about a lot of sex. Ya, not new. But there is a rhyme and reason to the outcome.
I was wondering around the wiki and while I was reading about the brindled men I suddenly realized GRRM is trying to tell us something when some one has a miscarriage or dies is child birth. The Ibish don t mix with other races. It's not true. Ben Plumm has a Ibbish grandmother.
Ib comes from hairy men, and hairy men were first men in Westeros. When a character of strong first men background mixes with some one of strong Andal background they have trouble having kids. Lysa Tully is more first man and Jon Arryn is mostly Andal.
This is a cool detail right? But why does it matter? Well, who's Creator's parents? Who knows and would it matter? His parents were Wynton Stout and Maege Mormont. I can prove it, it was just CSI work. Why is that noteworthy? Why did Jeor take the black? Why does Jeor know about everything Crastor is doing? Why did Maege send Longclaw to Jeor?
There's a deep layer that means something and it's hidden in the background. His characters are built from the DNA up. That's why he's stuck in slavers bay. That's why names are so important when he makes a character.
sean mayorý6687 I always thought Lysa miscarried so many times because of the moon tea her father tricked her into drinking that almost killed her
First time hearing this, five years later, but you talk about the four hinges of the world, the black meteor worshipped by the Bloodstone Emperor, a possible second meteor in the True North and how they connect to the hinges... what if the Drowned god is a third meteor lost in the sea and Patch Face is the equivalent of a water white? And what if there is a forth meteor to make the forth hinge?
Under the sea no one wears hats - the weirwood net is a collective mind, it has no kings or queens or other leaders.
The music in the beginning - what is that?!
I don't think the Jogos Nhai are the Great Empire of the Dawn. The Jogos Nhai do seem to be cousins of somebody else we know, considering the are a foot shorter than everybody else and have misshapen heads similar to the skulls Bran sees in Bloodraven's cave. Jhogos Nhai = CotF relatives.
Zorse is part zebra part horse...
a zorse is half horse half zebra
Asshai is the largest city in the known world, it is believed that the Valyrians come from there and be at an intermediate point in the world, they look like the ruins of an ancient empire that one day conquered the world, beyond Asshai the world is hostile to the humans. JRR Martin said that once there were dragons all over the planet and there are legends of dragons beyond Ashai, it is 10 thousand kilometers from the west and we know where the planet's equator is because of the tripocal zone, which follows that one day the great Dragon lords ruled the whole world with their dragons and their capital was Asshai until they fell into oblivion, Valirya is their pretty little sister. In addition, the coordinates that Quaiz gives Danerys to fly with her dragons are on the other side of the world, surely she wants her to reconquer the world and return Asshay and not Valirya her little sister to former glory.
I think it was part of Yi-Ti until the Bloodstone Emperor came to power.
I think the greasy black stone is the red comet stone.
The sword dawn is crafted from the heart of a fallen star
do you think bran will warg a bonfire?
If a meteor is the source of power in Asshai could it be plausible that a portion of the meteor was used to build "The Wall" therefore allowing the wall to have magical powers? This would explain why Milasandra had her powers increase when she was at the wall.
The asshai sorcerers sounds kind of like the telvanni society in the elder scrolls series in morrowind.