One day, as a spotty, trainspotting schoolboy in the early 60's I asked the booking clerk at Clapham Junction for a return to Kensington. He replied "Work for the Post office, do you?" I replied in a small voice "er, yes". He grinned and sold me the ticket. A Standard 2-6-4 tank hauled me there and back again. One of many treasured railway memories from those far off days.
I too travelled on the service in the 1960's as a spotty school-boy, and the ticket clerks at Clapham Junction would usually question whether I was entitled to ride on it. That was when the old High Level booking office was still open (it closed in 1969). On one occasion I attempted to take my gran with me, as she liked the odd train ride too, and she had "privs" as my grand-dad had worked on the railway. When she tried to buy a Priv ticket to Kensington Olympia, the clerk refused. Possibly because he'd have to write out a blank ticket and couldn't be bothered - but I don't know for sure. I recall the trains normally being Class 33 hauled, departing from Platform 1, but occasionally the evening train would run into Platform 17. It was thrilling as a schoolboy to ride on a loco-hauled train for such a short ride. I did once try to cadge a lift back to Clapham Junction on the morning ECS return working but was refused, and had to use the bus (255 I think). There was also a brief period when British Rail ran a through train from Manchester (I think) to Brighton via Kensington Olympia/Clapham Junction, calling at both stations. The idea was to avoid people having to cross London between termini.
@@Clivestravelandtrains The use of Platform 1 for am trains and 17 for PM trains was a relic of Railways sharing income/costs. LSWR Nine Elms /Waterloo drivers only knowing the route to/from the Windsor side, and LBSCR Stewarts Lane ( firstly Battersea then later Hither Green) men only knowing the route to/from the Brighton Side. Depots were very jealous of keeping traditional routes, rather than "losing" them to another depot.
A video on the *actual* "sinister and secret" trains would be yet another topic I'd watch from you! thanks for this one - really interesting, as always.
@@Pinkybum there must be more. I thought the Ongar branch was kept for longer to get people out to the secret nuclear bunker. Plenty of Engineering Trains but they are not for public use in any form. Tank movements and the LMR ?
Having been born and brought up a hundred yards from Clapham Junction station, I remember seeing the Kenny Belle from time to time. What I don’t recall is a ‘secret’ side entrance as all platforms from 1 - 17 were accessible via the dank and gloomy subway that ran from Station Approach to Grant Road where Fyffe’s used the arches as a banana-ripening store. Workers there were regularly bitten by poisonous spiders. But the smell was lovely.
Well, yes and no. I spent most of my spare time in the early 70's travelling around when/where I could afford, taking photos of diesel and electric trains - and I often had the same question from older guys - "Why are you taking photos of those boring boxes on wheels, I put my camera away when Steam was abolished?" So, even in the 1970's, I learnt to "live with the times" and in fact disliked Steam Trains and the obsessions that went with them.
Another interesting quirk about Kenny O: it still saw steam trains even after 1968 as LT had running powers for engineering trains from Lillie Bridge depot and they used the ex GWR Pannier tanks until 1971, I believe
Reading the comments below and talking of strange trains and rolling stock reminds me what my colleagues once told me. They were om M44 and unable to get into Euston, they didn't know where they would end up, but at about 9 30 am they pulled into Olympia. Strange terminus, but seemingly one of the few platforms in the Capital long enough to take the Mail train.
A line spared the Beeching axe that survived long enough to thrive, eh? Who'd have thought it. One wonders how many lines outside of London would have followed the same pattern had they had the chance.
It's interesting to speculate how many lines would have been brought back to life now if the service had stopped in the 60s but the trackbed had been protected from being built on, cuttings filled in, viaducts demolished etc. I've long thought that Bloody Beeching was not the only or the worst villain: he may have used dubious passenger-census techniques, he may have not considered making stations unstaffed as an alternative to closure, he may have been paranoid about avoiding any suspicion of duplicate routes that served the same towns. But BR and the government (for allowing BR to do it) may have been the worse villains for allowing closed lines to be wiped off the face of the earth, by taking whatever steps were necessary to make damn sure the line could never economically be resurrected. There really needed to be a "once a transport route, always a transport route" law which said that all closed lines must be kept intact as footpath/cycle paths, and the land could never be sold off to be built on, in case fortunes ever changed. But that would have required foresight that even a five-year-old could do: something which 1960s politicians and BR chiefs did not possess. I am ashamed of my parents' and grandparents' generation for allowing it to happen. The only good thing to come out of Beeching is that the outrage has caused a lot more forward thinking and protection of routes for any that may be closed nowadays. Now the problem is Highways England who decide that it is acceptible to fill in bridges with concrete instead of maintaining them.
@@Mortimer50145 Very well said. The closure of some of the Beeching routes was inevitable, but the closure of others was unnecessary even at the time, and the deliberate "salting of the earth" that prevented future reopening for negligible financial gain was an extraordinary act of state-sponsored vandalism.
The line from Edinburgh to Galashiels/Tweedbank is a good example of a restored Beeching-era cut. But one has to remember that Ernest Marples, he of a road-building company, was Minister of Transport, and some of the trackbeds of closed lines were used for by-passes and road improvements which we now take for granted.
@@None-zc5vg Exactly. And there should have been. There was no foresight of "what do we do if more and more people decide to live further from work and commute by car, but traffic in cities becomes so bad that public transport is needed once again." Then there is the scenic-heritage-railway phenomenon. I bet the Cinder Track (Scarborough-Whitby-Sandsend-Staithes-Saltburn) would be a very good money-making venture if heritage trains (or even modern DMUs) could travel that route. Maybe that phenomenon would have been harder to predict in the 1960s. And for a single-track line, there's no space to have a single line alongside a footpath/cycle track, so it becomes either/or.
Kensington Olympia was electrified in 1994…but one year later the service was extended to Willesden Junction and until the line northward was Electrified in 1996…utilised the ageing Class 117s. For a short while it was referred to as “The Willy Belle”…but luckily it didn’t catch.
I think you will find that the line was electrified (using 3rd rail) in 1994 to North Pole Junction so that the Eurostar trains could reach North Pole Depot. The service was increased and electrified on the back of Eurostar paying for the electrification. The line from Clapham Junction platforms 16/17 and 2 were electrified at the same time. It should be noted that Kensington Olympia was the standby destination for Eurostar trains should they be unable to reach Waterloo (that included arrangements for customs and security). I believe that the line north of North Pole Junction was also electrified in 1994 (using overhead) so that electric Euro freight trains could operate to the West Coast Main Line.
@@PStaveley In addition, the overhead electrification of the West London Line north of North Pole Junction also enabled the introduction in 1997 of a Connex South Central service between Gatwick Airport and Rugby. Today, that service has metamorphosed into Southern Railway's Clapham Junction to Milton Keynes Central route.
Whilst operating between Willesden Junction High Level and Clapham Junction as a shuttle service, there was a local nickname applied: The Wheel Clamp Line (Wil Clap) but it never seemed to catch on either.
OMG!! I work at Blythe House and was not expecting this to be about the PO savings bank 😍 Also funny because I'm regularly annoyed at how impossible it is to figure out when the distrct line from Olympia will run... so I guess it still has a secret train 😂
Although technically dead, The Kenny does now have a strange kind of afterlife, in that there is a regular service, which runs over the route at roughly the original timetabled time. When I was in London studying medicine a few years back, I took said early morning service on several occasions, when I went to various exhibitions at Olympia.
Though obviously _Midnight in Moscow_ is their most famous, I’ve always actually been a fan of their jazz ditty _Samantha._ Eh, what’s that, you say? *…”Belle”?*
@@MarkMcCluney It was a clever song (a lot of their stuff was) because while pop music was still considered subversive and forbidden, Dixieland bands enjoyed a certain exemption, for whatever reason, behind the Iron Curtain - so it’s actually the dirge-like theme tune of a once famous USSR radio station, with the selfsame title, that they jazzed up.
In my first job after leaving school, I worked as a clerk in a machine tool 'factory' in Juxon Street, off Lambeth Walk. At some point the works moved to Transport Avenue, Brentford, which meant a longer, more complicated commute via Clapham Junction. I remember seeing the Kenny Belle, although I never heard that name. But I do clearly remember the Ivatt 2MT tank engine and a particulaqr train - the 6TC set, although I am almost certain it never used all six. Three at the most. I only ever saw it on what I think you said was now platform 17, although I'm sure I knew it as platform One. I did know where it went and was always fascinated that there was a Thames rail crossing that just had four trains a day! I might have been tempted to travel on it one day, but never did. Pity. I suppose I could just get the Overground and see all there was to see?
I remember reading about this service back in my younger days in a book borrowed from the local library. I think it said that it was not in the timetable and mentioned something about the bridge over the river being owned by two old ladies who got some money for every time a train travelled over it. At some time in my youth I was in London and decided to explore the Underground line from Earls Court to Olympia when I found the train in the station. So I bought a ticket to Clapham. I don't know about platform numbers but we went through the tunnel under the main lines to the platform on the south side. The stock was old Western Region which was odd as I would have thought this was in Southern Region territory.
I used to live up the hill from the junction and as a boy would go to Olympia's Boys And Girls exhibition. Always went via Victoria and Earl's Court. Now you bloody tell me.....
I don't know if you could class the Kenny-Belle as being cancelled when over the years it becomes successful and increases in frequency and journeys. Clearly someone's missed a marketing trick & creating a London visitor attraction by not having a Kenny-Belle named train and I am sure some knowledgeable tour guide can certainly add to the experience. I am sure the Yanks would roll about the floor laughing and splitting their sides open at us in the new level that we have taken the power of the understatement to!
The sole surviving H Class is at the Bluebell Railway in Sussex and is in use most days at the moment however, it is due for a boiler overhaul next year so it in action whilst you can lol
The problem with the line is it cut off quite a lot of miles for freight, Willesden reception and marshalling yard was at the northern end and it was superb for running SR to the north freights although there was a hoohah about SR men on MR metals and vice versa and Kensington Olympia became the cutoff point for both regions and there was loads of union demands because of Olympia. My uncle often did the Ford Dagenham train from Sheppey, running it all over the place to get it lined up to go up to KO and a complicated running round as he dropped his lot and then ran round to pick up the empties back, sometimes having to drop stuff at Hoo for further transport down into Kent then back down to the Ford plant before finally dropping back to Hoo yard and home time. If the line hadn't survived, the train would have had to go to Reading, then up the WR metals before going to MR metals to work its way round to ER and Ford's private yard.
I well remember the Kenny Belle from steam days. Strangely enough it was for a time advertised on a London Underground tourist poster in the early 1960s. I have a colour photo of the train in steam days at Kensington Olympia. The green coaches were marked 'Exmouth Branch'! It normally used platform 1, though occasionally platform 17 (which I don't recall ever being called platform 1). My recollection is that it was the real platform 1 that could only be accessed after passing the exit barrier, and that you had to make sure the ticket collector didn't take your ticket!
Note that the platform 1 it used is not the present platform 1. The arches suppoorting the track serving that platform are no longer structurally sound, so it has been out of use for many years. The present platform 1 is the original Platform 2. The new platform 2 was built out from it to provide an extra platform to serve the new Overground service to Peckham Rye and beyond.
I remember the branch line to Olympia on the free maps of the Underground you could get from ticket offices. It was always marked "Exhibition service only". This was back in the 60's to 80's.
The 'Kenny Belle' was not the only Parliamentary Train to make use of Kensington Olympia, until 2013 there was a train that ran Kensington Olympia to Wandsworth Road, it ended with the arrival of the London Overground.
Ah, was that the once a week one way service that became a bus, put in after the Reading to ? Cross Country service was deleted as some bit of track in stewarts lane area needed passenger trains over it. All got a bit confusing as running Wandsworth Road Clapham Junction for overground replaced one parliamentary, but another cross country deletion did mean a full canx of passenger services on a line with (and needed Battersea Park services in on a once a day too ). Recent history yet I have forgotten the detail !
Sinister/secret trains, railway superstitions/folklore etc actually sound like good material for a mini-series,. You could decide whether to take them seriously or not on a case-by-case basis, or maybe do a serious half and a silly half for each one.
Fond memories of the line as I used to live in Sinclair Road just round the corner from Olympia and sometimes went for a drink with Olympia's station charge hand up at the Hand & Flower up on the right of the crossing bridge. Had quite a cushy arrangement too, if the signalman at Olympia saw me on the platform he would stop the next down through to Clapham and I would hop on and I could usually wangle a lift from the bridge across the Thames to Olympia being in me BR uniform then one foul stormy night the station chap at Clapham refused me to use the line to call Stewarts Lane to arrange my usual lift and so early in the morning in the highest of winds and driving rain I had to shanks pony it to Olympia and I was not happy... When I related this to the usually grumpy Welsh AM at Waterloo the AM went on the warpath a bit at the chap in Clapham who was chastised most roundly. Not for a moment did I think he did it for my sake but rather he feared the wrath of my very well connected BR father who also had been on the fone to the AM that morning asking wth was going on.
There were a couple of long distance ghost trains which existed briefly in the 80s. One was The European from Glasgow to Harwich PQ via Manchester and Nottingham bypassing London and vice versa, and the other was from Liverpool / Manchester (carriages joined at Crewe) to Dover and vice versa stopping at London Kensington Olympia. Both connected to Channel ferries, both were under-publicised, and both were withdrawn shortly due to lack of interest. It is a shame.
This sounds a lot like the school train my town has. I runs twice a day to a school that is rather off the beaten path, does not show up on any time table and usually uses the oldest stock (I belive from the 1950s). Locals know about this train, that is not be boarded because it's for children. People new to the town get confused.
4:34 That's a 4-Cor, not a 4TC. The original 6TC was formed from two 4COR type motor coaches (actually from a 4RES restaurant car unit) with the traction equipment removed, and four trailers from PUL/PAN stock (from the original Brighton Line electrification)
Lived in the Kensington area for a while in the 1970s and 80s, and made several rather pointless trips on it to CJ and back accompanied by people in workgear. Somewhat dowdy and musty coaches giving a general feeling of austerity and gloom. Loco-hauled was nice, although no speed records were ever broken. Occassional long waits at signals around Battersea, as I recall.
Correct me if I'm wrong but long before the 'Overground' didn't this service extend to Willesden Junction at some time? I remember taking a single unit diesel railcar from platform 1 at Clapham in the mid 1970s.
Rail is suppose to be private yet it really is not as the public are still bailing out these company's .The idea of going private really has not happened at all .May as well have stayed British rail as there s No real difference at all .privatisations have just made rail travel much more complicated and even more expensive
For a moment, I thought you were referring to 'Kenny Ball' - and his Jazzmen, perhaps best remembered for being the house band of Michael Parkinson's 1970s BBC late night chat show.
Met him - He was one of the most affable blokes I’ve ever met so friendly and welcoming his wife too ! Wot a loss as some years back we lost him having moved to just outside Romford RIP Kenny.
They've killed Kenny. The b*ds! No mention of Kenny Ball. That's not jazz. It's something I've always wondered ever since it was first mentioned. Can we winkle a connection out of this?
Neil, there was a fellow pupil at my primary school named Kenneth Bell. He was never called Kenny, if you did, you got walloped. That was in the days before I became interested in trains! (6+ decades ago)
"Oh my God, they killed the Kenny!" I love it when things I like get referenced in really unexpected places. Now if only you'd tried to mimic the high-pitched voice....
The mere mention of Kensington Olympia brings back childhood memories of its glorious motorail terminal days. An overnight trip to Perth trundling across Britain with my dad's Vauxhall Viva on a wagon at the back was a true adventure.The very long loaded train waiting to depart into the night at Olympia was quite a sight. With the advent of limited range electric cars something like it may become feasible again.
Very frustrating waiting for a district line train to Olympia for what feels like hours when you’re trying to go to an event there! Overground is painfully slow, too
Thanks again Jago. Is it possible that if the original train had a guard's van, that title position of the guard would be that of the 'Belle End' ? l know l should seek help.
This entire episode is erotically charged in a quite disturbing way. The way Jago inflects "The Winkle" at 0:33... well, I don't know whether to run screaming into the street or have a quiet, contemplative moment. As it were.
Electrification and re-signalling of the line was carried out for the Eurostar empty services between Waterloo ,and North Pole depot . Also, it was intended to be used by the proposed NightStar sleeper services coming from other parts of the UK via Waterloo and for the Channel freight services operated by the Dual voltage Class 92 locos. This created the opportunity for the use of EMUs in the form of Class 313 units operated on the North London services with passenger numbers exceeding all expectations and the eventual ‘reopening’ of three stations on the line. Perhaps a video on that might be worth considering !
I'm a fan of large and medium-sized tank engines, so that would have been a treat. I guess this service would also have been used for break-in runs for newly shopped engines after heavy repairs.
I remember that when Network South East lost it's class 33s and the 'Belle went over to class 73s they often suffered from flat batteries from the frequent re-starting after the short journeys (they had to turn the engine off when the driver moved from the loco to the driving cab of hte 4TC unit attached) and at one time they had to top and tail them using 2 locos. Also I remember a 4TC on the line that had half of one carriage fitted with florescent light, hopper windows and class 319 seats, possibly as I test for refurbishment. It looked very odd. I have photos of it.
I used to get this train on the way from Clapham Junction to Olympia in the late 80's when working at Charles House, which was then a government building (with armed American soldiers staring at you if you got off the lift on the wrong floor!). When I was using it I was told it was called the Clapham Flyer (not sure if that was a local nickname but it stuck). The train stock used to come up from Selhurst depot and return there after service, which is why it ran from Platform 17 on the first out of, and last back to, Clapham. The rest of the service ran from Platform 1. I seem to remember it running back and forth to Olympia 4 times in the morning and 4 times in the evening when I was using it - first morning run out from Clapham was around 07:30-ish, last before 10:00. The first evening service to Clapham was around 15:30 and last about 17:35 from memory, as I often had to run to catch it, else it was a real pain to get back to Clapham Junction. District line only ran when exhibitions were on, so you'd had to head to Ken High Street and go via Victoria. If you missed the last one, there was also an intercity later in the evening from Milton Keynes than ran once a day from Olympia which also went to Plat 17 and then on to Brighton.
Sleepless Further down the comments is one from Josh Graves. I can't be sure I know what I'm talking about but part of his explanation hints at why it was called the winkle.Scroll down to his comment and it might be the answer.
I remember I went to Kensington Olympia many years ago to visit the Personal Computer World show. I went by tube. and looked at the timetable while waiting for the train back, and noticed there were just two BR trains a day from there to Clapham Junction. I thought it was very surreal. The platform arrangement has been changed at this station and it has been modernized making is less other-worldly! Thanks for uploading.
Kenny Belle was like the JANOP flight that flies in and out of Las Vegas every day, taking workers to and from Area 51. Dude, this is why I watch every one of these videos.
Hardly seems like killing the Kenny, more that it metamorphosed, like a caterpillar becoming a butterfly. It shows the gradual realisation that a lot of offices weren't in Central London and trains to them might be useful - but even today most rush hour SWR services miss Clapham Junction. Rare error from Jago; at 4:32 it is a 4-COR unit that is shown, not a 4-TC. It is on a Portsmouth express, as shown by the 8 headcode. 4-TCs worked from Bournemouth to Weymouth and were push-pull fitted with "33"s, ideal for the Kenny Belle. LT have a red-liveried 4-TC which has also run excursions down to Swanage.
Yes, but the 6-TC unit 601 was formed in 1965 using a pair of 4-COR motor coaches (with their traction motors removed) sandwiching 6-PAN and 6-PUL trailers. It was effectively the operating prototype for the TC units used on the Bournemouth line electrification. After this it was used for a while on peak-hour East Grinstead trains and then in August 1967 became the regular stock on the Kenny Belle, until it was withdrawn in June 1971 after a collision with a milk tanker at Kenny.
@@michaelwadman6276 Thanks, very interesting, I hadn't realised the full background of the 6-TC and had assumed it would be like a 4-TC with a couple of extra carriages. The 4-TCs of course look like the Southern Mk1 EMUs - CIGs, VEPs, CEPs.
@@iankemp1131 There were a quite separate 6TC class - temporary formations formed from REP/4TC stock during the transition to Class 442 operation - the Class 442 recycled the traction equipment from the REP stock power cars, requiring loco-haulage of the remaining vehicles until the new units were ready. The original 6TC was a unit formed of two 4COR-type Portsmouth line motor coaches (actually from a 4RES restaurant car unit) with the traction equipment removed, sandwiching four ex Brighton line 6PUL/6PAN trailers.
I used this service a few times in the mid 70's, seem to think it was a class 33 loco and some elderly carriages whenever I used it, At that time it used to depart and arrive from the far western side of the station, beyond the Richmond platforms. Journey time was far quicker than the bus so it was worth making sure I didnt miss the last one back.
I worked at the Post Office (and Civil Service) building at 375 Kensington High Street: "Charles House" (late 70s). I regularly spotted the class 33 at KO, but never knew the backstory. Charles House, along with the GPO, also had some floors where a "burly gentleman" was always stationed at the entrance, and "encouraged" you to not venture there. I reckon Chas, House could also have been a reason the service endured.
How on earth do you find out all this stuff? I had never heard of the Kenny Belle and found this video really interesting. Great video Jago, and as ever I can hardly wait for the next one.
There is also still a lot of information stored in the memory cells of old men like me! Not all of my stored knowledge is on the Internet (thank God!). What I like about Jago's videos like this, is that they sometimes tease out recollections from other people of my age. I'm glad that UA-cam is around now for these snippets of information to be recorded and not lost. I have learnt things from some of the replies people have made to my comments. That is all to the good.
If you look at it sideways you could maybe say that the gap in the 40s was to make the line a secret - axis forces would be using train timetables to work out what would be the most efficient way to bomb the nuts off of London, and it'd be one hell of a score if they disabled the post office & took out a few MPs at the same time!
Jago, see what you can find out about the nuclear command train that was kept at Tunbridge wells. Would be interested if you could find any info on it. I know that at least one carriage got preserved on the Severn Valley Railway. 👍
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One day, as a spotty, trainspotting schoolboy in the early 60's I asked the booking clerk at Clapham Junction for a return to Kensington. He replied "Work for the Post office, do you?" I replied in a small voice "er, yes". He grinned and sold me the ticket. A Standard 2-6-4 tank hauled me there and back again. One of many treasured railway memories from those far off days.
Spots were de rigueur.
I too travelled on the service in the 1960's as a spotty school-boy, and the ticket clerks at Clapham Junction would usually question whether I was entitled to ride on it. That was when the old High Level booking office was still open (it closed in 1969). On one occasion I attempted to take my gran with me, as she liked the odd train ride too, and she had "privs" as my grand-dad had worked on the railway. When she tried to buy a Priv ticket to Kensington Olympia, the clerk refused. Possibly because he'd have to write out a blank ticket and couldn't be bothered - but I don't know for sure.
I recall the trains normally being Class 33 hauled, departing from Platform 1, but occasionally the evening train would run into Platform 17. It was thrilling as a schoolboy to ride on a loco-hauled train for such a short ride. I did once try to cadge a lift back to Clapham Junction on the morning ECS return working but was refused, and had to use the bus (255 I think).
There was also a brief period when British Rail ran a through train from Manchester (I think) to Brighton via Kensington Olympia/Clapham Junction, calling at both stations. The idea was to avoid people having to cross London between termini.
@@Clivestravelandtrains The use of Platform 1 for am trains and 17 for PM trains was a relic of Railways sharing income/costs. LSWR Nine Elms /Waterloo drivers only knowing the route to/from the Windsor side, and LBSCR Stewarts Lane ( firstly Battersea then later Hither Green) men only knowing the route to/from the Brighton Side. Depots were very jealous of keeping traditional routes, rather than "losing" them to another depot.
@@Clivestravelandtrains That service continued until CrossCountry took over the franchise from Virgin Trains, so well past the British Rail era.
@@Clivestravelandtrains Did they say why you were refused the lift back to Clapham Junction?
A video on the *actual* "sinister and secret" trains would be yet another topic I'd watch from you! thanks for this one - really interesting, as always.
Yes this is required now Jago
@@mattbaker3569 Presumable nuclear dump trains from Dungeness Station ( well the nearest still working) to Sellafield would be one.
I was about to comment the same!
@@Pinkybum there must be more. I thought the Ongar branch was kept for longer to get people out to the secret nuclear bunker. Plenty of Engineering Trains but they are not for public use in any form. Tank movements and the LMR ?
I was thinking the exact same thing.
Having been born and brought up a hundred yards from Clapham Junction station, I remember seeing the Kenny Belle from time to time. What I don’t recall is a ‘secret’ side entrance as all platforms from 1 - 17 were accessible via the dank and gloomy subway that ran from Station Approach to Grant Road where Fyffe’s used the arches as a banana-ripening store. Workers there were regularly bitten by poisonous spiders. But the smell was lovely.
Wouldn't be secret then, shirley?
Was there a direct entrance to Platform 1/2?
7' 45" is officially the longest setup for any South Park gag in the history of the world
The hard part was starting a train service in 1914 and getting people to call it Kenny.
This must have been a good line for rail nerds. Every day a surprise what kind of old stock they are using.
Well, yes and no. I spent most of my spare time in the early 70's travelling around when/where I could afford, taking photos of diesel and electric trains - and I often had the same question from older guys - "Why are you taking photos of those boring boxes on wheels, I put my camera away when Steam was abolished?" So, even in the 1970's, I learnt to "live with the times" and in fact disliked Steam Trains and the obsessions that went with them.
I used to regularly catch this in the 90's. A great service which saved 40 minutes going into Victoria and back again.
Another interesting quirk about Kenny O: it still saw steam trains even after 1968 as LT had running powers for engineering trains from Lillie Bridge depot and they used the ex GWR Pannier tanks until 1971, I believe
Another excellent video, Jago!
It’s weird being up to date with the entire back catalogue of your videos - I think I’ve commented on every one! 😆
Reading the comments below and talking of strange trains and rolling stock reminds me what my colleagues once told me. They were om M44 and unable to get into Euston, they didn't know where they would end up, but at about 9 30 am they pulled into Olympia. Strange terminus, but seemingly one of the few platforms in the Capital long enough to take the Mail train.
A line spared the Beeching axe that survived long enough to thrive, eh? Who'd have thought it. One wonders how many lines outside of London would have followed the same pattern had they had the chance.
It's interesting to speculate how many lines would have been brought back to life now if the service had stopped in the 60s but the trackbed had been protected from being built on, cuttings filled in, viaducts demolished etc.
I've long thought that Bloody Beeching was not the only or the worst villain: he may have used dubious passenger-census techniques, he may have not considered making stations unstaffed as an alternative to closure, he may have been paranoid about avoiding any suspicion of duplicate routes that served the same towns. But BR and the government (for allowing BR to do it) may have been the worse villains for allowing closed lines to be wiped off the face of the earth, by taking whatever steps were necessary to make damn sure the line could never economically be resurrected. There really needed to be a "once a transport route, always a transport route" law which said that all closed lines must be kept intact as footpath/cycle paths, and the land could never be sold off to be built on, in case fortunes ever changed. But that would have required foresight that even a five-year-old could do: something which 1960s politicians and BR chiefs did not possess. I am ashamed of my parents' and grandparents' generation for allowing it to happen.
The only good thing to come out of Beeching is that the outrage has caused a lot more forward thinking and protection of routes for any that may be closed nowadays. Now the problem is Highways England who decide that it is acceptible to fill in bridges with concrete instead of maintaining them.
@@Mortimer50145 Very well said. The closure of some of the Beeching routes was inevitable, but the closure of others was unnecessary even at the time, and the deliberate "salting of the earth" that prevented future reopening for negligible financial gain was an extraordinary act of state-sponsored vandalism.
The line from Edinburgh to Galashiels/Tweedbank is a good example of a restored Beeching-era cut. But one has to remember that Ernest Marples, he of a road-building company, was Minister of Transport, and some of the trackbeds of closed lines were used for by-passes and road improvements which we now take for granted.
There was no intention of trying to save the condemned lines.
@@None-zc5vg Exactly. And there should have been. There was no foresight of "what do we do if more and more people decide to live further from work and commute by car, but traffic in cities becomes so bad that public transport is needed once again."
Then there is the scenic-heritage-railway phenomenon. I bet the Cinder Track (Scarborough-Whitby-Sandsend-Staithes-Saltburn) would be a very good money-making venture if heritage trains (or even modern DMUs) could travel that route. Maybe that phenomenon would have been harder to predict in the 1960s. And for a single-track line, there's no space to have a single line alongside a footpath/cycle track, so it becomes either/or.
Kensington Olympia was electrified in 1994…but one year later the service was extended to Willesden Junction and until the line northward was Electrified in 1996…utilised the ageing Class 117s. For a short while it was referred to as “The Willy Belle”…but luckily it didn’t catch.
I think you will find that the line was electrified (using 3rd rail) in 1994 to North Pole Junction so that the Eurostar trains could reach North Pole Depot. The service was increased and electrified on the back of Eurostar paying for the electrification.
The line from Clapham Junction platforms 16/17 and 2 were electrified at the same time.
It should be noted that Kensington Olympia was the standby destination for Eurostar trains should they be unable to reach Waterloo (that included arrangements for customs and security).
I believe that the line north of North Pole Junction was also electrified in 1994 (using overhead) so that electric Euro freight trains could operate to the West Coast Main Line.
@@PStaveley In addition, the overhead electrification of the West London Line north of North Pole Junction also enabled the introduction in 1997 of a Connex South Central service between Gatwick Airport and Rugby. Today, that service has metamorphosed into Southern Railway's Clapham Junction to Milton Keynes Central route.
Whilst operating between Willesden Junction High Level and Clapham Junction as a shuttle service, there was a local nickname applied: The Wheel Clamp Line (Wil Clap) but it never seemed to catch on either.
OMG!! I work at Blythe House and was not expecting this to be about the PO savings bank 😍
Also funny because I'm regularly annoyed at how impossible it is to figure out when the distrct line from Olympia will run... so I guess it still has a secret train 😂
Although technically dead, The Kenny does now have a strange kind of afterlife, in that there is a regular service, which runs over the route at roughly the original timetabled time. When I was in London studying medicine a few years back, I took said early morning service on several occasions, when I went to various exhibitions at Olympia.
Interesting that Blythe House was used in the Gary Oldman “Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy” as the HQ for ‘British Intelligence’! The plot thickens…
I enjoyed this video, seeing the old trains and hearing what types they were was interesting to me.
Though obviously _Midnight in Moscow_ is their most famous, I’ve always actually been a fan of their jazz ditty _Samantha._ Eh, what’s that, you say? *…”Belle”?*
That took me a minute but I got there eventually. I'll be whistling Midnight for the rest of the day now...
@@MarkMcCluney It was a clever song (a lot of their stuff was) because while pop music was still considered subversive and forbidden, Dixieland bands enjoyed a certain exemption, for whatever reason, behind the Iron Curtain - so it’s actually the dirge-like theme tune of a once famous USSR radio station, with the selfsame title, that they jazzed up.
In my first job after leaving school, I worked as a clerk in a machine tool 'factory' in Juxon Street, off Lambeth Walk. At some point the works moved to Transport Avenue, Brentford, which meant a longer, more complicated commute via Clapham Junction. I remember seeing the Kenny Belle, although I never heard that name.
But I do clearly remember the Ivatt 2MT tank engine and a particulaqr train - the 6TC set, although I am almost certain it never used all six. Three at the most. I only ever saw it on what I think you said was now platform 17, although I'm sure I knew it as platform One.
I did know where it went and was always fascinated that there was a Thames rail crossing that just had four trains a day! I might have been tempted to travel on it one day, but never did. Pity. I suppose I could just get the Overground and see all there was to see?
I remember reading about this service back in my younger days in a book borrowed from the local library. I think it said that it was not in the timetable and mentioned something about the bridge over the river being owned by two old ladies who got some money for every time a train travelled over it. At some time in my youth I was in London and decided to explore the Underground line from Earls Court to Olympia when I found the train in the station. So I bought a ticket to Clapham. I don't know about platform numbers but we went through the tunnel under the main lines to the platform on the south side. The stock was old Western Region which was odd as I would have thought this was in Southern Region territory.
I used to live up the hill from the junction and as a boy would go to Olympia's Boys And Girls exhibition. Always went via Victoria and Earl's Court. Now you bloody tell me.....
Who would have tought Jago Hazzard's channel would be hazardous for poor Kenny
The Sussex Scot intercity train used that line too. Worked in High street Ken and took that train every day for 2 yesrs.
"Oh no, they've killed the Kenny" Brilliant!
I don't know if you could class the Kenny-Belle as being cancelled when over the years it becomes successful and increases in frequency and journeys. Clearly someone's missed a marketing trick & creating a London visitor attraction by not having a Kenny-Belle named train and I am sure some knowledgeable tour guide can certainly add to the experience. I am sure the Yanks would roll about the floor laughing and splitting their sides open at us in the new level that we have taken the power of the understatement to!
Thanks for the offhand intro to the Q1, I always love strange asymmetrical/weird/ugly trains!
The sole surviving H Class is at the Bluebell Railway in Sussex and is in use most days at the moment however, it is due for a boiler overhaul next year so it in action whilst you can lol
Yes I remember seeing it there around 2017
The problem with the line is it cut off quite a lot of miles for freight, Willesden reception and marshalling yard was at the northern end and it was superb for running SR to the north freights although there was a hoohah about SR men on MR metals and vice versa and Kensington Olympia became the cutoff point for both regions and there was loads of union demands because of Olympia. My uncle often did the Ford Dagenham train from Sheppey, running it all over the place to get it lined up to go up to KO and a complicated running round as he dropped his lot and then ran round to pick up the empties back, sometimes having to drop stuff at Hoo for further transport down into Kent then back down to the Ford plant before finally dropping back to Hoo yard and home time. If the line hadn't survived, the train would have had to go to Reading, then up the WR metals before going to MR metals to work its way round to ER and Ford's private yard.
I have to say ; I stoped the video at 0:35 to hit that 👍 button !
Great narration as always….
I well remember the Kenny Belle from steam days. Strangely enough it was for a time advertised on a London Underground tourist poster in the early 1960s. I have a colour photo of the train in steam days at Kensington Olympia. The green coaches were marked 'Exmouth Branch'! It normally used platform 1, though occasionally platform 17 (which I don't recall ever being called platform 1). My recollection is that it was the real platform 1 that could only be accessed after passing the exit barrier, and that you had to make sure the ticket collector didn't take your ticket!
That sounds right for the subway tunnel connection for the ticket gates.
Note that the platform 1 it used is not the present platform 1. The arches suppoorting the track serving that platform are no longer structurally sound, so it has been out of use for many years. The present platform 1 is the original Platform 2. The new platform 2 was built out from it to provide an extra platform to serve the new Overground service to Peckham Rye and beyond.
I remember the branch line to Olympia on the free maps of the Underground you could get from ticket offices. It was always marked "Exhibition service only". This was back in the 60's to 80's.
That was the District Line from Earls Court - a completely separate (but equally oddball) line
A positive gem of a punchline Sir!
The 'Kenny Belle' was not the only Parliamentary Train to make use of Kensington Olympia, until 2013 there was a train that ran Kensington Olympia to Wandsworth Road, it ended with the arrival of the London Overground.
Ah, was that the once a week one way service that became a bus, put in after the Reading to ? Cross Country service was deleted as some bit of track in stewarts lane area needed passenger trains over it. All got a bit confusing as running Wandsworth Road Clapham Junction for overground replaced one parliamentary, but another cross country deletion did mean a full canx of passenger services on a line with (and needed Battersea Park services in on a once a day too ). Recent history yet I have forgotten the detail !
it is Funny thing you hear of this in passing but you dont know what it is But it is nice to hear where the Expression comes from
Sinister/secret trains, railway superstitions/folklore etc actually sound like good material for a mini-series,. You could decide whether to take them seriously or not on a case-by-case basis, or maybe do a serious half and a silly half for each one.
"Winkle, Sir?" "Yes, Blackadder, to winkle out the spy"
Fond memories of the line as I used to live in Sinclair Road just round the corner from Olympia and sometimes went for a drink with Olympia's station charge hand up at the Hand & Flower up on the right of the crossing bridge. Had quite a cushy arrangement too, if the signalman at Olympia saw me on the platform he would stop the next down through to Clapham and I would hop on and I could usually wangle a lift from the bridge across the Thames to Olympia being in me BR uniform then one foul stormy night the station chap at Clapham refused me to use the line to call Stewarts Lane to arrange my usual lift and so early in the morning in the highest of winds and driving rain I had to shanks pony it to Olympia and I was not happy... When I related this to the usually grumpy Welsh AM at Waterloo the AM went on the warpath a bit at the chap in Clapham who was chastised most roundly. Not for a moment did I think he did it for my sake but rather he feared the wrath of my very well connected BR father who also had been on the fone to the AM that morning asking wth was going on.
04:34 It's OK, your shoddy substitution picture escaped scrutiny😁.
I will give you the obligatory, "Those Bastard! They killed the Kenny!"
Hi Jago, will you be doing a video on the new tube stations opening on Monday 20th September? Thanks, Andy
New stations are more Geoff’s thing. Jago just does the old stuff.
@@AtheistOrphan I know, I just thought he might make an exception this time.
Ah, the class 33. Mainstay of the Cardiff/Weymouth diagram for many wonderful years.
Nerd? Moi?
Ta Jago.
There were a couple of long distance ghost trains which existed briefly in the 80s. One was The European from Glasgow to Harwich PQ via Manchester and Nottingham bypassing London and vice versa, and the other was from Liverpool / Manchester (carriages joined at Crewe) to Dover and vice versa stopping at London Kensington Olympia. Both connected to Channel ferries, both were under-publicised, and both were withdrawn shortly due to lack of interest. It is a shame.
LMAO Jago!!! "You are the London Overground to my under-used commuter line." How do you come up with these lines??? 🤣
The best build up to a 'South Park' punchline ever.
Quick reference for TV anoraks, there!
“Eh.. how can ghosts pull an express? puffed Percy”
Arguably it never ended
Well, Kenny Belle didn't die, he's just reincarnated into a better service.
hitting us with that surprise South Park reference, I see
This sounds a lot like the school train my town has. I runs twice a day to a school that is rather off the beaten path, does not show up on any time table and usually uses the oldest stock (I belive from the 1950s). Locals know about this train, that is not be boarded because it's for children. People new to the town get confused.
Where is that?
A whole 7 minutes build up to a "who killed Kenny" joke! ;-) Bravo sir, bravo!
Oh Jago...that last pun...
Good clip. Maybe you could’ve mentioned the two closed stations on this stretch of line.
4:34 That's a 4-Cor, not a 4TC. The original 6TC was formed from two 4COR type motor coaches (actually from a 4RES restaurant car unit) with the traction equipment removed, and four trailers from PUL/PAN stock (from the original Brighton Line electrification)
Brilliant🎨
Legend has it that the ancestors of Geoff Marshall rode the Kenny Belle rode it everyday
Lived in the Kensington area for a while in the 1970s and 80s, and made several rather pointless trips on it to CJ and back accompanied by people in workgear. Somewhat dowdy and musty coaches giving a general feeling of austerity and gloom. Loco-hauled was nice, although no speed records were ever broken. Occassional long waits at signals around Battersea, as I recall.
The exterior of Blythe house was used in the Gary Oldman spy film Tinker Tailor Soldier spy, sinister connotations abound😊😊
Correct me if I'm wrong but long before the 'Overground' didn't this service extend to Willesden Junction at some time?
I remember taking a single unit diesel railcar from platform 1 at Clapham in the mid 1970s.
some time before, long might be pushing it a bit
When I clicked on this video, I didn't expect to hear a South Park reference but I am pleasantly surprised that I did
Why was I thinking about a certain Mr.K.Everett??
Enjoyed the South Park reference at the end 👍🏽
Rail is suppose to be private yet it really is not as the public are still bailing out these company's .The idea of going private really has not happened at all .May as well have stayed British rail as there s No real difference at all .privatisations have just made rail travel much more complicated and even more expensive
So where is the Ministry of Clipboards, Chocolate Biscuits, Belly button Lint and Bright Ideas?
I'm sad to say, even though I never watched that programme, I got the reference., *eyeroll*
For a moment, I thought you were referring to 'Kenny Ball' - and his Jazzmen, perhaps best remembered for being the house band of Michael Parkinson's 1970s BBC late night chat show.
Nearly 10 yrs ago as a BT Fibre eng was tasked to go to residence of Mr K Ball at a farm on the North side of Stansted Airport
Met him - He was one of the most affable blokes I’ve ever met so friendly and welcoming his wife too ! Wot a loss as some years back we lost him having moved to just outside Romford RIP Kenny.
Oh my god, they killed the Kenny.
Dreaming away with trains in the past, suddenly this came through.
Big grin
Was there a smaller version of this train called The Baby Bel?
I wish someone would wash the outside of Blythe House
aaaww 'Kenny Bell' is a pretty cute name🤭
Dammit. I was going to make an OMG they killed the Kenny Belle joke.
Aspiration to make thousands laugh thwarted. Shakes fist at sky.
I get the feeling this entire video was just a build-up to the final sentence... 😂
S1000S wasn't plastic, it was (and still is) a fibreglass bodied coach
'They killed the Kenny'! ROTFLMAO!!!
They've killed Kenny. The b*ds!
No mention of Kenny Ball. That's not jazz. It's something I've always wondered ever since it was first mentioned. Can we winkle a connection out of this?
Neil, there was a fellow pupil at my primary school named Kenneth Bell. He was never called Kenny, if you did, you got walloped. That was in the days before I became interested in trains! (6+ decades ago)
Let me guess. The ghost train guy would have used a ghost train.
They killed Kenny!
"Oh my God, they killed the Kenny!"
I love it when things I like get referenced in really unexpected places. Now if only you'd tried to mimic the high-pitched voice....
...and the following sentence? ;-)
.....those bastards!
The mere mention of Kensington Olympia brings back childhood memories of its glorious motorail terminal days. An overnight trip to Perth trundling across Britain with my dad's Vauxhall Viva on a wagon at the back was a true adventure.The very long loaded train waiting to depart into the night at Olympia was quite a sight.
With the advent of limited range electric cars something like it may become feasible again.
Very frustrating waiting for a district line train to Olympia for what feels like hours when you’re trying to go to an event there! Overground is painfully slow, too
So when will we get a video on secret and sinister trains of London?
He’d tell you. But he’d have to kill you.
Thanks again Jago.
Is it possible that if the original train had a guard's van, that title position of the guard would be that of the 'Belle End' ?
l know l should seek help.
And if anything went wrong, he’d stroll through the carriages saying “Sorry, there’s been a bit of a cock-up.”
@@emilyadams3228 😂
This entire episode is erotically charged in a quite disturbing way. The way Jago inflects "The Winkle" at 0:33... well, I don't know whether to run screaming into the street or have a quiet, contemplative moment. As it were.
Electrification and re-signalling of the line was carried out for the Eurostar empty services between Waterloo ,and North Pole depot . Also, it was intended to be used by the proposed NightStar sleeper services coming from other parts of the UK via Waterloo and for the Channel freight services operated by the Dual voltage Class 92 locos. This created the opportunity for the use of EMUs in the form of Class 313 units operated on the North London services with passenger numbers exceeding all expectations and the eventual ‘reopening’ of three stations on the line. Perhaps a video on that might be worth considering !
The popularity of this service in the 1980s even spawned a band. The Fine Young Kenny Belles.
Oh man, that's good.
Just worked out the pun (I'm a bit slow this morning!) Score 1 to you my friend! 👍🤣
That pun drives me crazy, and I can't help myself.
Did they have a song called Jago, We're Sorry?
You drive me crazy...
Was this whole video just an excuse to make a bad South Park pun at the end? If it was... I approve 😆
My thoughts exactly! *Worth it!*
it did seem that way to me.
They occasionally used express engines? As Gordon would say, "oh the indignity!"
In steam days, this was a trainspotters delight. You never knew what locos would appear.
I'm a fan of large and medium-sized tank engines, so that would have been a treat. I guess this service would also have been used for break-in runs for newly shopped engines after heavy repairs.
It gives me great modelling ideas!!! 😁
@@tobys_transport_videos - You can virtually see your layout unfolding before your very eyes. 😄
@@tobys_transport_videos Just subscribed to your channel. 👍
@@channelsixtysix066 Thanks for the sub! I only wish I could expand my layout further! It already enters nearly every room in the house!!! 😂
Loved that closing line Jago. Brilliant!
Kenny Belle - that’s defo tongue in cheek WWII British humour - love it 👍😎
So-called because the oldest available coaches were used until they had to be scrapped!
I used to commute into Kensington Olympia a few years ago, that station has seen some changes over the years. Jago, how about a video on Motorail?
"Killed the Kenny." Must be the worse one yet!!
Surely it was a south park reference
I remember that when Network South East lost it's class 33s and the 'Belle went over to class 73s they often suffered from flat batteries from the frequent re-starting after the short journeys (they had to turn the engine off when the driver moved from the loco to the driving cab of hte 4TC unit attached) and at one time they had to top and tail them using 2 locos. Also I remember a 4TC on the line that had half of one carriage fitted with florescent light, hopper windows and class 319 seats, possibly as I test for refurbishment. It looked very odd. I have photos of it.
Yep, DMU, cl33 and cl73, thankfully i recorded a few snippets of the train on 16mm film.
Ah yes, I’ve heard of that unit.
I used to get this train on the way from Clapham Junction to Olympia in the late 80's when working at Charles House, which was then a government building (with armed American soldiers staring at you if you got off the lift on the wrong floor!). When I was using it I was told it was called the Clapham Flyer (not sure if that was a local nickname but it stuck). The train stock used to come up from Selhurst depot and return there after service, which is why it ran from Platform 17 on the first out of, and last back to, Clapham. The rest of the service ran from Platform 1. I seem to remember it running back and forth to Olympia 4 times in the morning and 4 times in the evening when I was using it - first morning run out from Clapham was around 07:30-ish, last before 10:00. The first evening service to Clapham was around 15:30 and last about 17:35 from memory, as I often had to run to catch it, else it was a real pain to get back to Clapham Junction. District line only ran when exhibitions were on, so you'd had to head to Ken High Street and go via Victoria. If you missed the last one, there was also an intercity later in the evening from Milton Keynes than ran once a day from Olympia which also went to Plat 17 and then on to Brighton.
It wasn't until the end that I realised that Kenny = Kensington. Yes, I'm slow. But why "Winkle"? Oo-err missus!
Sleepless
Further down the comments is one from Josh Graves.
I can't be sure I know what I'm talking about but part of his explanation hints at why it was called the winkle.Scroll down to his comment and it might be the answer.
I remember I went to Kensington Olympia many years ago to visit the Personal Computer World show. I went by tube. and looked at the timetable while waiting for the train back, and noticed there were just two BR trains a day from there to Clapham Junction. I thought it was very surreal. The platform arrangement has been changed at this station and it has been modernized making is less other-worldly! Thanks for uploading.
Kenny Belle was like the JANOP flight that flies in and out of Las Vegas every day, taking workers to and from Area 51.
Dude, this is why I watch every one of these videos.
Hardly seems like killing the Kenny, more that it metamorphosed, like a caterpillar becoming a butterfly. It shows the gradual realisation that a lot of offices weren't in Central London and trains to them might be useful - but even today most rush hour SWR services miss Clapham Junction. Rare error from Jago; at 4:32 it is a 4-COR unit that is shown, not a 4-TC. It is on a Portsmouth express, as shown by the 8 headcode. 4-TCs worked from Bournemouth to Weymouth and were push-pull fitted with "33"s, ideal for the Kenny Belle. LT have a red-liveried 4-TC which has also run excursions down to Swanage.
Ian, it's a South Park reference. Doesn't work so well with "metamorphasising the Kenny". But well spotted re 4-COR..
Yes, but the 6-TC unit 601 was formed in 1965 using a pair of 4-COR motor coaches (with their traction motors removed) sandwiching 6-PAN and 6-PUL trailers. It was effectively the operating prototype for the TC units used on the Bournemouth line electrification. After this it was used for a while on peak-hour East Grinstead trains and then in August 1967 became the regular stock on the Kenny Belle, until it was withdrawn in June 1971 after a collision with a milk tanker at Kenny.
@@michaelwadman6276 Thanks, very interesting, I hadn't realised the full background of the 6-TC and had assumed it would be like a 4-TC with a couple of extra carriages. The 4-TCs of course look like the Southern Mk1 EMUs - CIGs, VEPs, CEPs.
@@iankemp1131 There were a quite separate 6TC class - temporary formations formed from REP/4TC stock during the transition to Class 442 operation - the Class 442 recycled the traction equipment from the REP stock power cars, requiring loco-haulage of the remaining vehicles until the new units were ready.
The original 6TC was a unit formed of two 4COR-type Portsmouth line motor coaches (actually from a 4RES restaurant car unit) with the traction equipment removed, sandwiching four ex Brighton line 6PUL/6PAN trailers.
I used this service a few times in the mid 70's, seem to think it was a class 33 loco and some elderly carriages whenever I used it, At that time it used to depart and arrive from the far western side of the station, beyond the Richmond platforms. Journey time was far quicker than the bus so it was worth making sure I didnt miss the last one back.
A Q1 hauling pre-grouping stock on an unlisted service is mother lode for train geeks.
I worked at the Post Office (and Civil Service) building at 375 Kensington High Street: "Charles House" (late 70s). I regularly spotted the class 33 at KO, but never knew the backstory. Charles House, along with the GPO, also had some floors where a "burly gentleman" was always stationed at the entrance, and "encouraged" you to not venture there. I reckon Chas, House could also have been a reason the service endured.
How on earth do you find out all this stuff? I had never heard of the Kenny Belle and found this video really interesting. Great video Jago, and as ever I can hardly wait for the next one.
It was mentioned in comments on the Clapham Junction video
There is also still a lot of information stored in the memory cells of old men like me! Not all of my stored knowledge is on the Internet (thank God!). What I like about Jago's videos like this, is that they sometimes tease out recollections from other people of my age. I'm glad that UA-cam is around now for these snippets of information to be recorded and not lost. I have learnt things from some of the replies people have made to my comments. That is all to the good.
@@highpath4776 Yes, I had seen that one.
Proper train nerd territory? As compared with improper train nerd territory?
If you look at it sideways you could maybe say that the gap in the 40s was to make the line a secret - axis forces would be using train timetables to work out what would be the most efficient way to bomb the nuts off of London, and it'd be one hell of a score if they disabled the post office & took out a few MPs at the same time!
... using the rail timetables to plan a bombing raid? Fat help. These were British railway timetables not German ones. 😄
@@bigdeepblue They'd just need to circle overhead for 15 minutes or so, get two at once 😆
Jago, see what you can find out about the nuclear command train that was kept at Tunbridge wells. Would be interested if you could find any info on it. I know that at least one carriage got preserved on the Severn Valley Railway. 👍