Biggest caliber i have so far for deer hunting is my bolt action 5.56 with 1-12 twist.. at least you've shown me a video of how a 55 grain will do in a high shoulder shot.. thanks for this very informative video❤️
So I guess the moral of the story is, if you're really keen to track a wounded animal through the woods, go for the heart shot. If you want to drop it right where it is, go for a high shoulder or neck shot.
A deer shot through the heart and/or both lungs will not run far. Also keep in mind that the high shoulder shots in the videos were taken with a .308 but the heart shots with "only" a .223
Yes, there is a great difference in energy, and I havent shot enough deer with 223 to compare, but I can say, that when I have dropped a couple on the spot with a high shoulder 223, and I have also had some 308 heart shots running for a short distance. But usually its only a few seconds.
Yeah but I'd rather a deer "run dead" for 30 or 40 yards (30-45 seconds if even that long) and drop dead as a doornail than have one roll over and kick and bleat for 3-5 minutes. Just bothers me personally. Not that I'd miss the opportunity if it was my only shot but I prefer to shoot straight through soft vital tissue so by the time the adrenaline stops, that animal sure as hell isn't feeling any pain.
There is no actually much difference between some shot placement that you mark as high shoulder or hearth/lungs shots, especially because animals are often quartering in this video. That instant drop, as you know very well, depends mainly on the fact that you hit some major bones or other points of resistance. Most quartering shots on roes end up in instant drop because if you want to hit vitals the exit or the entrance will be in the shoulder bone area. Shooting perfectly broadside you can see a clear difference in reaction (relatively short run for hearth/lung, instant drop for shoulder). I agree on the fact that that area gives the most margin in a shot being 100% lethal. I choose shot placement depending on the circumstances as i think every good hunter should do. My friend, congrats for the great videos. Looking forward to hunt roes with you here in Italy. I do a lot of stalking other than still hunting, it's amazing!
That little gmx round works good. I’ve taken a few deer with the 223 one was with a 12.5” barrel. I’ve always used the federal power shock 64gn soft point. I’ve shot all of them in the neck and they were dead before they hit the ground. Never really trusted shooting behind or in the shoulder although I’m sure it would do the trick but I know for a fact the neck shot will drop them every time. I mostly use my 6.5 Grendel for deer which a lot of ppl also say is too small for white tail. But I’ve never had one run more than 20yds always shooting front shoulder from 50yds to 250yds. Mostly using the 120gn federal fusion but also with the 123gn hornady sst. I definitely prefer the fusion round myself but both do the trick
I am now using 5.56 sierra SBT 55 gr 15" barrel....the jacket seperates from the lead but both look wonderful when you gut them....jacket looks like a spider....lead is a pretty button. The jacket swirls like a propeller. Tons of damage. I shot two bucks this year and both dropped within 100 yds. One buck was a 10 point whitetail that weighed 200 lbs. Shot them both in the lung area. I used to use sierra 55 gr HP....neck shot only....works great but no penetration.....it turns to dust. They drop like a rock. Shoot your bullet into 5 milk jugs filled with water. The 55 gr SBT penetrates the first jug, jacket cuts the second one completely in half, lead button goes into the third jug. The lead usually penetrates both sides of deer.
In my neck off the woods neck shots are somewhat discouraged. This has to do with the fact that most people who hunt here are beginners, and there is simply a smaller room for error when aiming for the neck. When aiming for the heart/lungs you have a circle of about 20cm diameter where the shot will definitely be lethal. Even if you have to take a bit of a walk through the woods to find it. Good thing we're also training dogs here, so there's always someone happy to go out there and help the search.
Once you have your hunting exam/license, you can actually apply for any rifle caliber, except .50BMG Semiautomatic rifles are more difficult to get, and for hunting they can only hold 2 rounds, so most hunters use bolt action or straight pull rifles.
Very good video. Seeing the 223 is why I stick to my 303 Remington 180 core lokt. Drops them dead. Now I am not against 223 just have the 303. 7.62x54R and 308. Favorite is the Enfield. Building first AR and will try Wylde upper.
Opps,...I watched this yesterday evening,.. but almost forgot to leave a comment and give a Thumbs Up. ( I watch most good videos on my ROKU system on my larger screen television. ) Good hunting tips here Morten, thank you. I hope your shoulder heals quickly and well too.
Beautiful country you live in. I hunt/live in PA (USA) and i always prefer the high shoulder or neck vs the heart shot. Not sure how your deer there compare in size to our whitetailed deer but the reactions are the same.
Hi. Thanks for your comment. Our roe deer are only half the size of a whitetail, our fallow deer are the size of white tail, and reed der are like elk.
.308 is a great round but kinda big medicine for a little Roe. Go back, way back. Look for a bolt gun in .250-3000 Savage. Remington chambered it in the Classic. And of course the 99 Savage lever gun. I’ve shot many calibers over the decades. Three weeks ago I shot a 170+ B&C 10 point whitetail near Spofford Texas. BIG deer. Used a .270 that day. All in all? The old .250 is an amazing deer gun.
At least on North american whitetails the shoulder blade has a nerve bundle that when hit with a round usually makes a deer drop to the group in shock.
The 6,5x55 is still a very popular round in Scandinavia, but many new rifles don't come in that caliber. I think 6,5×55, 308 and 30-06 are most popular for all round hunting here.
Great video of knowledge and understanding, good for me as a beginner in roebuck hunting. Too bad a lot of hunting videos today is about product placement. They lack this key ingredient of explanation you have. Thank you
High shoulder looks better than heart obviously. Will it wreck the meat with bone fragments? Also, why does it drop the deer so fast is it hitting the spine?
The high shoulder shot is targeting what is called the brachial plexus. As surprising as it may sound the shoulder blade is comprised of a major junction for the central nervous system. You penetrate the shoulder blade and you literally turn off the light switch for the brain to muscle nervous system control. Better yet if you miss high you severe the spine, miss low and you hit the heart and miss behind you still hit the lungs. Once you learn about it you're almost amazed that there was ever any sort of shot placement debate. I guess it makes sense though as without an in depth biology lesson and video proof like we can get today on the internet it just seemed more obvious to many people to directly target something like the heart/vital organs instead of the shoulder blade.
Only for Americans. You guys love your over kill. My dad shot over a 100 kudo bulls with his 223. I mean my first wild kudu was with a 22lr head shot while out doing some pest control. Dead is dead. Now it's illegal do hunt with a 22lr other than small game. That 40 grain high velocity bullet Almost exited the back off skull. No go shoot some rabbits with your 50 bmg🤣
In Germany it's not allowed to use .223 for red deer, just roe deer. We have 5.6mm/.222rem, 1000J @100m for roe deer, fox etc and 6.5mm/.256, 2000J @100m for red deer, wild boar.
I almost inevitably shoot high and a bit forward. Not sure what I'm thinking that causes that .. so I'm researching anatomy, thanks! *_Addenda:_* 5:47 is just where I'd sight. Seems high and slightly forward of what I've seen recommended. 6:02 not high, I'd take this shot, pretty much my preferred spot. 6:26 again not high, perhaps a bit back of where I'd point, but yes. So bottom line? it seems we agree.
Maybe just veering *_away from_* any sort of lung/gut shot? *_Slightly forward_* might be proper thinking, with that, but I'm thinking *_high_* is more just plain wrong.
Nice Video. When i hunt on my own hunting ground i only use heart shots for better shoulder meat. When i am on a driven hunt i try to do high shoulder shots. But i never see the meat afterwards. Can you say something about using lightweight lead free bullets for high shoulder shots ? Can you still use the shoulder meat ?
When I compare the meat damage from conventional soft nose hunting bullets like Hornady whitetail or Lapua mega to lead free bullets like Hornady GMX, I find that these copper alloy bullets makes a much smaller and cleaner exit hole. Often a coin size exit from a .308 When conventional sometimes left a fist size exit..
A mammal needs three things to be able to run: oxygen, blood, and electricity. With a heart shot, a mammal has to be depleted of its blood supply before they will stop moving, and that usually takes about 10-30 seconds with a good shot. On a high shoulder or neck shot, you are disrupting the spine of the animal, which will drop the animal immediately. Because unlike a blood supply, which has to leak out before the animal falls down, cutting off the electric supply is just as immediate as turning off a light switch. Which is why their muscles will either lock up when they are shot, or they just flop down on the spot.
A lot of deer hunters take the heart shot because they are afraid to change. But experience and knowledge has them taking out the spinal cord and as you can see rightly so., high shoulder and neck shots do this, damaging the spinal cord rendering the animal paralyzed then they die within a few seconds. All in all it equates to no tracking. Remember in neck shots though aim at the spine. And with fast moving explosive bullets like the .223 rem or .22-250, .243 win, 25-06 and others like that. For they create an almost football shaped path of destruction cavity leaving more room for error. I'm all for a quick clean kills for natural healthy protein based food products. And that's not necessarily what you get when buying meat that's processed through slaughter houses.
This is great and all, but try shooting a deer, with a 22, in the head, at night, all while holding a spotlight. Now that's a challenge. Lol.....I'm kidding. Good video
I think at the high shoulder, the shock from the projectile is close to the spine, and knocks them out. A heart shot, will make them bleed out, but they can run for a few seconds before their brain shuts down.
Good shooting. In Australia the minimum diameter to take deer is 270. There’s not a whole lot of out gun laws I agree with, but minimum caliber for certain game is one I do. I feel 223 is just too small for deer.
I agree about some minimum caliber is nessesary, but a Roe Deer weigh about 20-35 kg. Therefore 223 with the right bullet will be sufficient in my opinion. Just dont make long shots The danish law dictates minimum 50 grains bullet with E100 800 Joules. Kind regards Niklas
Good vid mate. What sort of 223 and what twist barrel. I was using a 1:9 twist ruger with 62 gn Barnes on goats. But was never imporessed compared to 55 gn sierra soft points
It's hard to say for sure. I will assume that a deers first reaction to danger is running.. and with a heart and lung shot, that will in most cases result in a very quick drop in bloodpressure, to the brain. Hopefully they loose consiusnes in a few seconds.
As with the first shots: high but not too high. More to the front, especially if it‘s not at a 90 degree angle. If they drop instantly you get the chance for a second one.
These are posters used for the danish rifle hunting exam. A 1 to 1 size roe buck with internals on the backside. The are sold in most danish hunting shops, and you can have interchangeable center parts. If you search for "bukkeskive" on a danish hunting webshop, I'm sure they will have some. Morten
Interesting video. I have made the same observations with heart shots. They always run a few dozen meters. Can I ask you for your opinion on the .223 on roe deer? I have a 30-06, but am thinking about getting a .223 specifically for roe deer. Does it do the job, or is there not enough room for error?
In my opinion, the .223 is almost perfect for roe deer as long as one keep the distance at 100m or so, and use a good expanding bullet. The 55gr. GMX have performed well for me But there are both cons and pros... The .223 means less meat damage, but naturally also less blood trail, to follow, in case the deer runs of.
I think the hydrostatic shock from the projectile hitting closer to the spine, drops them by knocking them unconsious. And a few seconds later they have bleed out.
In some US states it is and popular at that. Haven't seen videos of the gmx in 223 on deer. I think the comparison does a good job showing that shot placement has more to do with an ethical kill then caliber.
@@ammoiscurrency5706 not really, frontal area, sectional density and footpoundage make a much bigger difference. I bet those roe deer wouldn’t have dropped with the .223 the way they did with a high shot like they did with the .308. We can use use .223 on foxes here and I’ve seen plenty of them run when shot with that ammo regardless of placement. I am not against good marksmanship or “shot placement”, but bullet selection is more important to ensure an ethical kill. Not only that, swapping ammo between each example doesn’t give a true representation of how the deer will react which was the entire point of my comment, as this is scientifically inaccurate. I’ve hunted many deer with a smaller calibre like the .243 and it will do the job, but it doesn’t knock them flat like a 150gr .308 accubond does... never had a runner with my .308 no matter what angle I shot them at. And this is my point, not every shot is perfect as they are living creatures and can move at any given moment and people can flinch, slip etc resulting in a less than ideal shot. Using a bigger more powerful calibre gives you more assurance that you still have a kill, not a wounded animal...
@@christophercharles8758 Hm, I don't think so. My family has been hunting roe deer in Bavaria for three generations with the 222 Remington and with a high shoulder shot we very very seldom do have runners. They are dropping very fast. We have a 8x57 IS (a bit stronger than 308) now and I excited to see how this calibre works with roe deer. I think the kind of round you use is much more important than the calibre. For 222 we have always successfully used the standard Teilmantelgeschoss (I don't know it's name in English). It is soft and gets many splitters into the heart and the lung to kill very fast. I think with the bigger calibre we will have to go with a bit of a harder round because else it's a bit strong for roedeer. Experience will show, I think.
@@quarzriegel5650 firstly, it might help if you have read and fully understood my comments. Secondly, think what you like, there’s a very good reason why .223 isn’t a legal deer calibre in Britain which is a collective decision made into law by people who are far more qualified and experienced than you...
@@christophercharles8758 the 223 is legal in Scotland for roe, but not England and Wales. However, It is legal for Muntjac and Chinese Water deer in England and Wales (min bullet weight 50 gr / min energy 1000 ft/lbs). In the real world away from the 'qualified and more experienced ' you quote, it should be a perfectly acceptable deer round for the UK larger species as well (subject to shot placement and bullet construction). I have never quite understood why the 223 / 5.56 is considered sufficiently lethal for killing NATO's enemies but not deer.
Great video!!! Morten has been using our Sightmark Citadel 3-18x50 MR2 Riflescope designed for mid- to long-range hunting of small game, predators, varmint, and big game through forest and mountains. It's a truly great optic. Check it out!
What kind of animal's? And how many have you killed? I am a bit surprised that lung and heart shot animal's have not moved. Just trying interesting calibers I have had whitetail deer run with a 45-70 and a 338 through the heart. The 338 was a 180gr blistic tip right at 3000 fps. It went maybe 10 feet. And there was no heart left after getting hit with that.
I grew up using the heart/lung shot. For me, 90% run - any game, any rifle. I even shot an impala at 20yrds once using the heart/lung placement with a .416REM...he ran 20yrds. I use the high shoulder shot exclusively now.
@@thermonucleardevice and what about the blood resting in the body Unless you run to the animals and slit the throat it doesn't bleed dry (poorer meat quality)
@@SuperBlaustern as long as you get it gutted and hung it's even better than body shots. Even a .223 will virtually decapitate a deer. I have killed numerous deer with bother head shots and body shots and seen no difference in meat quality. Biggest factor is how the deer is handled after being killed.
There is a connection between the hunter and the prey that no one but a hunter can understand this man is making it so that people know where to shoot to make a ethical deadly shot
In my country we have a big problem with introduced species that are harmful to the native environment. Either the animals get shot or they get poisoned which is far more indiscriminate and has horrible long term consequences for the environment. I don't believe in hunting for trophies but hunting to help feed my family and preserve the environment seems worthwhile. I also like getting into the wilderness, even if I don't shoot a single thing.
You guys are hunters learn to take head shots aim esp if you guys do 5 shot groups and havr tight patterns Alaskan native now days some of us i know will take head shots over hesrt lung and broad side shots dont ruin any meat
Sorry.....practice doesnt make you a good marksmen. The rifle is primary.....then even more important is the bullet / load ! If your rifle is not bedded properly its much less likely you will have an accurate shooting rifle !
Well, sure the gear is primary, and finding the ammunition that shoots most precise in your rifle. Then practise to shoot consistent, controlling breath and trigger., learnig your projectiles drop and drift at different ranges, and practising different shooting positions. You can have the most expensive gear, but not know how to use it. Your gear doesn't have to be super expensive to be accurate .
Shot em in the high shoulder that way your sure to ruin one of the main sections of meat. Makes sense right. Y’all hunt “for food” don’t believe that one bit if your shooting animals in the shoulder.
Actually you aim right behind the shoulder, where you are sure to hit vital organs like heart and lungs. You will ruin a bit of the rib case, but most prefer this over wounding an animal by attemting a head or neckshot.
That 223 neck shot was beautiful
Great video! I always take the high shoulder shot on small/medium sized game when I can.
I learned much. Thanks for posting. Great video. Speedy recovery to you!
Försnacket var det bästa på mycket länge! Tack för dina filmer!
Biggest caliber i have so far for deer hunting is my bolt action 5.56 with 1-12 twist.. at least you've shown me a video of how a 55 grain will do in a high shoulder shot.. thanks for this very informative video❤️
Awesome video Morten, enjoyed watching it, thumbs up and greetings from New Zealand.
Thank.. I enjoyed your latest video with the .308win. Always a joy too follow your hunting adventures from the other side of our planet🤠👍
Great video and good information. Well done.
Very good demonstrations. Thank you. Best wishes from New Zealand
So I guess the moral of the story is, if you're really keen to track a wounded animal through the woods, go for the heart shot. If you want to drop it right where it is, go for a high shoulder or neck shot.
A deer shot through the heart and/or both lungs will not run far. Also keep in mind that the high shoulder shots in the videos were taken with a .308 but the heart shots with "only" a .223
Yes, there is a great difference in energy, and I havent shot enough deer with 223 to compare, but I can say, that when I have dropped a couple on the spot with a high shoulder 223, and I have also had some 308 heart shots running for a short distance. But usually its only a few seconds.
@@martinschuessler1936 im not a fan on shooting in the shoulder lots of damage to the meat. I try for neck mostly
Yeah but I'd rather a deer "run dead" for 30 or 40 yards (30-45 seconds if even that long) and drop dead as a doornail than have one roll over and kick and bleat for 3-5 minutes. Just bothers me personally. Not that I'd miss the opportunity if it was my only shot but I prefer to shoot straight through soft vital tissue so by the time the adrenaline stops, that animal sure as hell isn't feeling any pain.
There is no actually much difference between some shot placement that you mark as high shoulder or hearth/lungs shots, especially because animals are often quartering in this video. That instant drop, as you know very well, depends mainly on the fact that you hit some major bones or other points of resistance. Most quartering shots on roes end up in instant drop because if you want to hit vitals the exit or the entrance will be in the shoulder bone area. Shooting perfectly broadside you can see a clear difference in reaction (relatively short run for hearth/lung, instant drop for shoulder). I agree on the fact that that area gives the most margin in a shot being 100% lethal. I choose shot placement depending on the circumstances as i think every good hunter should do. My friend, congrats for the great videos. Looking forward to hunt roes with you here in Italy. I do a lot of stalking other than still hunting, it's amazing!
That little gmx round works good. I’ve taken a few deer with the 223 one was with a 12.5” barrel. I’ve always used the federal power shock 64gn soft point. I’ve shot all of them in the neck and they were dead before they hit the ground. Never really trusted shooting behind or in the shoulder although I’m sure it would do the trick but I know for a fact the neck shot will drop them every time. I mostly use my 6.5 Grendel for deer which a lot of ppl also say is too small for white tail. But I’ve never had one run more than 20yds always shooting front shoulder from 50yds to 250yds. Mostly using the 120gn federal fusion but also with the 123gn hornady sst. I definitely prefer the fusion round myself but both do the trick
I am now using 5.56 sierra SBT 55 gr 15" barrel....the jacket seperates from the lead but both look wonderful when you gut them....jacket looks like a spider....lead is a pretty button. The jacket swirls like a propeller. Tons of damage.
I shot two bucks this year and both dropped within 100 yds. One buck was a 10 point whitetail that weighed 200 lbs. Shot them both in the lung area.
I used to use sierra 55 gr HP....neck shot only....works great but no penetration.....it turns to dust. They drop like a rock.
Shoot your bullet into 5 milk jugs filled with water. The 55 gr SBT penetrates the first jug, jacket cuts the second one completely in half, lead button goes into the third jug. The lead usually penetrates both sides of deer.
In my neck off the woods neck shots are somewhat discouraged. This has to do with the fact that most people who hunt here are beginners, and there is simply a smaller room for error when aiming for the neck. When aiming for the heart/lungs you have a circle of about 20cm diameter where the shot will definitely be lethal. Even if you have to take a bit of a walk through the woods to find it. Good thing we're also training dogs here, so there's always someone happy to go out there and help the search.
Awesome content! People with limited hunting experience can learn something from this video 👍🏻
Even us old timers.lol
Really good Vedic and information. Nice work.
Please forgive my ignorance but I didn't realize that you were able to own a 308 in Denmark. I'm glad to see that you can
Once you have your hunting exam/license, you can actually apply for any rifle caliber, except .50BMG
Semiautomatic rifles are more difficult to get, and for hunting they can only hold 2 rounds, so most hunters use bolt action or straight pull rifles.
Riktigt bra video. Ska skjuta mitt första rådjur 16 Augusti och detta hjälper.
Very good video. Seeing the 223 is why I stick to my 303 Remington 180 core lokt. Drops them dead. Now I am not against 223 just have the 303. 7.62x54R and 308. Favorite is the Enfield. Building first AR and will try Wylde upper.
Schön gemacht. Ich wünsche dir gute Besserung.
Opps,...I watched this yesterday evening,.. but almost forgot to leave a comment and give a Thumbs Up. ( I watch most good videos on my ROKU system on my larger screen television. )
Good hunting tips here Morten, thank you. I hope your shoulder heals quickly and well too.
the second clip, with that one deer who just stood there. 😂he's the one who dies first in horror movies
Very good video. Thanks for sharing 👍🏼
Thank you for an excellent video.
Beautiful country you live in. I hunt/live in PA (USA) and i always prefer the high shoulder or neck vs the heart shot. Not sure how your deer there compare in size to our whitetailed deer but the reactions are the same.
Hi. Thanks for your comment.
Our roe deer are only half the size of a whitetail, our fallow deer are the size of white tail, and reed der are like elk.
Great job.... but roe deer is a small animal when you shot to deers difrences is biger and better to see. Best regards from Poland
Mycket bra video. Väldigt informativt tack
.308 is a great round but kinda big medicine for a little Roe. Go back, way back. Look for a bolt gun in .250-3000 Savage. Remington chambered it in the Classic. And of course the 99 Savage lever gun. I’ve shot many calibers over the decades. Three weeks ago I shot a 170+ B&C 10 point whitetail near Spofford Texas. BIG deer. Used a .270 that day. All in all? The old .250 is an amazing deer gun.
The heart/lung shot is a carryover from bowhunting. It's a good target for broadheads, but it makes less sense for hard-hitting bulkets.
La chasse à l'arc ! Ça, c'est de la chasse !
Great content.. I use a 30/30 150 grain or 223 62 grain sp. both work well
Looks like high shoulder or neck shot is hard to beat. Just drops em right there.
Great content and advice, thanks!
Great video, hope you get well soon and back hunting 👍
Beatiful shot bro👍🤘
At least on North american whitetails the shoulder blade has a nerve bundle that when hit with a round usually makes a deer drop to the group in shock.
Great video! You need to work on your annunciation…. I couldn’t understand a word you said! Ha Ha. Where are you? What country?
Yes Danish is a difficult language, I agree ;-)
Very good footage and practical effective hunting
Great video, I enjoyed that. Hope your shoulder surgery heals quickly for you.
Привет понравилось виде про Охоту 👍👍🙂🙂
Excellent video and advice, thank you MS
Are hunters in Scandinavia still use 6.5 or did they switch to 308, 30-06 , ...?
The 6,5x55 is still a very popular round in Scandinavia, but many new rifles don't come in that caliber.
I think 6,5×55, 308 and 30-06 are most popular for all round hunting here.
Fin video! God bedring med skulderen!
Thanks for sharing! 223 really seems to be the absolute minimum for deer.
Great video of knowledge and understanding, good for me as a beginner in roebuck hunting. Too bad a lot of hunting videos today is about product placement. They lack this key ingredient of explanation you have. Thank you
Thanks, I'm very happy to be able to give some tips and tricks.
It was good watching your video, very useful information for implementing while hunting
High shoulder looks better than heart obviously. Will it wreck the meat with bone fragments? Also, why does it drop the deer so fast is it hitting the spine?
The high shoulder shot is targeting what is called the brachial plexus. As surprising as it may sound the shoulder blade is comprised of a major junction for the central nervous system. You penetrate the shoulder blade and you literally turn off the light switch for the brain to muscle nervous system control. Better yet if you miss high you severe the spine, miss low and you hit the heart and miss behind you still hit the lungs. Once you learn about it you're almost amazed that there was ever any sort of shot placement debate. I guess it makes sense though as without an in depth biology lesson and video proof like we can get today on the internet it just seemed more obvious to many people to directly target something like the heart/vital organs instead of the shoulder blade.
@@User-gs1dk thanks for the info. Does it wreck too much meat?
Great video ty. I love the .308 for deer more than all my other calibers. The .223 is a little risky with anything bigger than a coyote.
I agree, we can use 223 for roe deer, they are only 50/55 pounds. But for larger deer, it is too small.
Only for Americans. You guys love your over kill. My dad shot over a 100 kudo bulls with his 223. I mean my first wild kudu was with a 22lr head shot while out doing some pest control. Dead is dead. Now it's illegal do hunt with a 22lr other than small game. That 40 grain high velocity bullet Almost exited the back off skull. No go shoot some rabbits with your 50 bmg🤣
In Germany it's not allowed to use .223 for red deer, just roe deer. We have 5.6mm/.222rem, 1000J @100m for roe deer, fox etc and 6.5mm/.256, 2000J @100m for red deer, wild boar.
nice and informative video. Thanks.
I almost inevitably shoot high and a bit forward. Not sure what I'm thinking that causes that .. so I'm researching anatomy,
thanks!
*_Addenda:_* 5:47 is just where I'd sight. Seems high and slightly forward of what I've seen recommended.
6:02 not high, I'd take this shot, pretty much my preferred spot.
6:26 again not high, perhaps a bit back of where I'd point, but yes.
So bottom line? it seems we agree.
Maybe just veering *_away from_* any sort of lung/gut shot?
*_Slightly forward_* might be proper thinking, with that, but I'm thinking *_high_* is more just plain wrong.
p.s. I don't recall training 100M. 75M, 150M, 250M ...
Nice Video. When i hunt on my own hunting ground i only use heart shots for better shoulder meat. When i am on a driven hunt i try to do high shoulder shots. But i never see the meat afterwards. Can you say something about using lightweight lead free bullets for high shoulder shots ? Can you still use the shoulder meat ?
When I compare the meat damage from conventional soft nose hunting bullets like Hornady whitetail or Lapua mega to lead free bullets like Hornady GMX, I find that these copper alloy bullets makes a much smaller and cleaner exit hole.
Often a coin size exit from a .308
When conventional sometimes left a fist size exit..
@@MortenSchultzHunting Yeah, i know these fist size exits. Thanks for the feedback on the copper bullets and shoulder shots.
This is a great video thank you for sharing, excellent marksmanship too, I hope your shoulder is healed or is healing well
Thanks Ivan.
Yes my shoulder is much better, and I can hunt again 😊
So how it works? I mean, high shoulder shot drops a deer in a second, but heart shot does not. Why?
A mammal needs three things to be able to run: oxygen, blood, and electricity.
With a heart shot, a mammal has to be depleted of its blood supply before they will stop moving, and that usually takes about 10-30 seconds with a good shot.
On a high shoulder or neck shot, you are disrupting the spine of the animal, which will drop the animal immediately. Because unlike a blood supply, which has to leak out before the animal falls down, cutting off the electric supply is just as immediate as turning off a light switch. Which is why their muscles will either lock up when they are shot, or they just flop down on the spot.
Exactly👍 even a perfect shot in the heard, and they can run a good distance before they black out.
Thanks guys!
A lot of deer hunters take the heart shot because they are afraid to change. But experience and knowledge has them taking out the spinal cord and as you can see rightly so., high shoulder and neck shots do this, damaging the spinal cord rendering the animal paralyzed then they die within a few seconds. All in all it equates to no tracking. Remember in neck shots though aim at the spine. And with fast moving explosive bullets like the .223 rem or .22-250, .243 win, 25-06 and others like that. For they create an almost football shaped path of destruction cavity leaving more room for error. I'm all for a quick clean kills for natural healthy protein based food products. And that's not necessarily what you get when buying meat that's processed through slaughter houses.
We got the same surgery 💪🏻
Hope yours went well..👍😊
I had my breast muscles re-attached to the shoulder with 2 titanium anchors. They both snapped in an accident.
Nice video mate
Do you find the side focus to be a hindrance while hunting?
No not at all. I usually leave it at 100 yds, and then I can adjust it if I need to take a much longer shot at a small target.
Great video pal 👍
This is great and all, but try shooting a deer, with a 22, in the head, at night, all while holding a spotlight. Now that's a challenge. Lol.....I'm kidding. Good video
That would bring me in a lot of trouble..😆😆
@@MortenSchultzHuntingme too🤣. Cheers from Germany
Why does high shoulder flatten them and heart doesn't?
I think at the high shoulder, the shock from the projectile is close to the spine, and knocks them out.
A heart shot, will make them bleed out, but they can run for a few seconds before their brain shuts down.
Good shooting. In Australia the minimum diameter to take deer is 270. There’s not a whole lot of out gun laws I agree with, but minimum caliber for certain game is one I do. I feel 223 is just too small for deer.
I agree about some minimum caliber is nessesary, but a Roe Deer weigh about 20-35 kg.
Therefore 223 with the right bullet will be sufficient in my opinion. Just dont make long shots
The danish law dictates minimum 50 grains bullet with E100 800 Joules.
Kind regards Niklas
Good vid mate. What sort of 223 and what twist barrel. I was using a 1:9 twist ruger with 62 gn Barnes on goats. But was never imporessed compared to 55 gn sierra soft points
I am using a Sabatti Rover 600. The twist is only 1/12" 55grains v-max is what it likes best.
@@MortenSchultzHunting it works well.
Do y’all harvest any mature deer or are they all small where you hunt.
They are small. Roe deer is only about half the size of a whitetail.
@@MortenSchultzHunting gotcha
Fed video! Sidder her og kan ikke vente med selv at komme ud imorgen tidlig i de svenske skove👍🏻
Neck shots are the best shots!
Super fin kvalitet 👌🏻
So can I hunt with my ar-15 or nah?
Why is a heart shot causing such a strong reaction to the dear to run away? Is it pain?
It's hard to say for sure.
I will assume that a deers first reaction to danger is running.. and with a heart and lung shot, that will in most cases result in a very quick drop in bloodpressure, to the brain.
Hopefully they loose consiusnes in a few seconds.
Hi morten, thank you for the post. Can I ask what powder you are using with the 165gr in .30 cal? Regards
As with the first shots: high but not too high. More to the front, especially if it‘s not at a 90 degree angle. If they drop instantly you get the chance for a second one.
Great Video as a question are you a french man
Thanks, no I am from Denmark.
👍💯 thank you Sir
Interesting video! Those Sitkas seem to drop quick. Do you ever do a lung shot?
Most times I go for mid shoulder or a little higher, to get both lungs and top of the heart or big arteries.
Any chance you can share where you got the picture at 2:54? i Like a copy of it :)
These are posters used for the danish rifle hunting exam.
A 1 to 1 size roe buck with internals on the backside.
The are sold in most danish hunting shops, and you can have interchangeable center parts.
If you search for "bukkeskive" on a danish hunting webshop, I'm sure they will have some.
Morten
get well soon
Interesting video. I have made the same observations with heart shots. They always run a few dozen meters.
Can I ask you for your opinion on the .223 on roe deer?
I have a 30-06, but am thinking about getting a .223 specifically for roe deer. Does it do the job, or is there not enough room for error?
In my opinion, the .223 is almost perfect for roe deer as long as one keep the distance at 100m or so, and use a good expanding bullet. The 55gr. GMX have performed well for me But there are both cons and pros...
The .223 means less meat damage, but naturally also less blood trail, to follow, in case the deer runs of.
I've killed several whitetail n hogs w .223
@@whatstheproblem6606 shot at placement?
So double lung=instant kill in most cases?🤔
I think the hydrostatic shock from the projectile hitting closer to the spine, drops them by knocking them unconsious. And a few seconds later they have bleed out.
I think this info would have been a lot more useful had you used the same calibre throughout... a .223 isn’t even a legal deer calibre in England.
In some US states it is and popular at that. Haven't seen videos of the gmx in 223 on deer. I think the comparison does a good job showing that shot placement has more to do with an ethical kill then caliber.
@@ammoiscurrency5706 not really, frontal area, sectional density and footpoundage make a much bigger difference. I bet those roe deer wouldn’t have dropped with the .223 the way they did with a high shot like they did with the .308. We can use use .223 on foxes here and I’ve seen plenty of them run when shot with that ammo regardless of placement. I am not against good marksmanship or “shot placement”, but bullet selection is more important to ensure an ethical kill. Not only that, swapping ammo between each example doesn’t give a true representation of how the deer will react which was the entire point of my comment, as this is scientifically inaccurate. I’ve hunted many deer with a smaller calibre like the .243 and it will do the job, but it doesn’t knock them flat like a 150gr .308 accubond does... never had a runner with my .308 no matter what angle I shot them at. And this is my point, not every shot is perfect as they are living creatures and can move at any given moment and people can flinch, slip etc resulting in a less than ideal shot. Using a bigger more powerful calibre gives you more assurance that you still have a kill, not a wounded animal...
@@christophercharles8758 Hm, I don't think so. My family has been hunting roe deer in Bavaria for three generations with the 222 Remington and with a high shoulder shot we very very seldom do have runners. They are dropping very fast. We have a 8x57 IS (a bit stronger than 308) now and I excited to see how this calibre works with roe deer. I think the kind of round you use is much more important than the calibre. For 222 we have always successfully used the standard Teilmantelgeschoss (I don't know it's name in English). It is soft and gets many splitters into the heart and the lung to kill very fast. I think with the bigger calibre we will have to go with a bit of a harder round because else it's a bit strong for roedeer. Experience will show, I think.
@@quarzriegel5650 firstly, it might help if you have read and fully understood my comments. Secondly, think what you like, there’s a very good reason why .223 isn’t a legal deer calibre in Britain which is a collective decision made into law by people who are far more qualified and experienced than you...
@@christophercharles8758 the 223 is legal in Scotland for roe, but not England and Wales. However, It is legal for Muntjac and Chinese Water deer in England and Wales (min bullet weight 50 gr / min energy 1000 ft/lbs). In the real world away from the 'qualified and more experienced ' you quote, it should be a perfectly acceptable deer round for the UK larger species as well (subject to shot placement and bullet construction). I have never quite understood why the 223 / 5.56 is considered sufficiently lethal for killing NATO's enemies but not deer.
Shot a deer last season w /.308 high shoulder shot around 75 yds, killed him instantly,nvr moved, blew hole clean thru him
You can see that happen in this vid. Watch the water puddle behind one of the deer taken with the 308.
Nice! Save the meat and go for the neck. 308 >223 would not recommend 223 for US whitetail
Великолепное видео и выстрелы. Снимаю шляпу. Я стреляю 223rem пулей 62 гран, дистанция 120/140 метров, косули ложаться. Использую полуоболочечную пулю sp производства Барнаул. Карабин Сайга МК
Please how far did they run in case of a heart shot ?
Up to 50 yards but usually much less. Depends on the deer. They are incredible animals.
Mostly they run for a few seconds but they can get far, from a few steps up to 60-80m.
Waidmannsheil and get well soon!
the hunter explaining shoulder shots has a shoulder injury. coincidence or karma?
Great video!!! Morten has been using our Sightmark Citadel 3-18x50 MR2 Riflescope designed for mid- to long-range hunting of small game, predators, varmint, and big game through forest and mountains. It's a truly great optic. Check it out!
12:4 nèl az a kèt lövès nagyon lentre lett tève,ès ezèrt nem rogyot tűzbe a vad.Meg lett mutatva,hogy így nem szabad lőni!A többi elfogadhatò volt.
👍однозначно
Heart/lung shots have never taken a step for me....308, 223, 280...
What kind of animal's?
And how many have you killed?
I am a bit surprised that lung and heart shot animal's have not moved.
Just trying interesting calibers I have had whitetail deer run with a 45-70 and a 338 through the heart.
The 338 was a 180gr blistic tip right at 3000 fps. It went maybe 10 feet.
And there was no heart left after getting hit with that.
@@tbjtbj4786 whitetails, mulies, coyotes....
@@workct4102 how many?
Its surprising you never had them move after lung/hart shots.
I grew up using the heart/lung shot. For me, 90% run - any game, any rifle. I even shot an impala at 20yrds once using the heart/lung placement with a .416REM...he ran 20yrds.
I use the high shoulder shot exclusively now.
Like 👏👏👍
good video, neck are best for no meat loss. im slowly moving toward copper bullets
Idiot
No they aren't
Best is lung/high shoulder
Head shots. No waste, no tracking, no adrenaline dumping into the meat
@@thermonucleardevice and what about the blood resting in the body
Unless you run to the animals and slit the throat it doesn't bleed dry (poorer meat quality)
@@SuperBlaustern as long as you get it gutted and hung it's even better than body shots. Even a .223 will virtually decapitate a deer. I have killed numerous deer with bother head shots and body shots and seen no difference in meat quality. Biggest factor is how the deer is handled after being killed.
none of this was "graphic"
the moral on this video Imo 223 rem . is to smal caliber for hunting Waidgerecht
No, IMO it is not. 22 magnum would be enough and so is 223. Personally would not use 22 mag for roe deer but it would work on up to 75 meters.
Nice🖒🖒🖒
🇮🇩
Like
Used 6.5 creedmoor that same as 308.
I can shoot it with 177 cal airgun , cause i don't have 308 cal 😂😂
Bahaha
I always prefer high shoulder...
Lungs.
This deer on 45m i kill with rock bro..
One question : WHY ?
There is a connection between the hunter and the prey that no one but a hunter can understand this man is making it so that people know where to shoot to make a ethical deadly shot
@@teeteringjeff5354 Why are people still killing animals ? There are food and leather everywhere, we don't need hunting anymore.
Well it is a tradition as old as time and if we stopped we would lose arguably one of the largest parts of our history
@@teeteringjeff5354 Tradition of killing innocent animals... I don't get it
In my country we have a big problem with introduced species that are harmful to the native environment. Either the animals get shot or they get poisoned which is far more indiscriminate and has horrible long term consequences for the environment.
I don't believe in hunting for trophies but hunting to help feed my family and preserve the environment seems worthwhile.
I also like getting into the wilderness, even if I don't shoot a single thing.
You guys are hunters learn to take head shots aim esp if you guys do 5 shot groups and havr tight patterns Alaskan native now days some of us i know will take head shots over hesrt lung and broad side shots dont ruin any meat
Sorry.....practice doesnt make you a good marksmen. The rifle is primary.....then even more important is the bullet / load ! If your rifle is not bedded properly its much less likely you will have an accurate shooting rifle !
Well, sure the gear is primary, and finding the ammunition that shoots most precise in your rifle.
Then practise to shoot consistent, controlling breath and trigger., learnig your projectiles drop and drift at different ranges, and practising different shooting positions.
You can have the most expensive gear, but not know how to use it.
Your gear doesn't have to be super expensive to be accurate .
Get on with it.......
Shot em in the high shoulder that way your sure to ruin one of the main sections of meat. Makes sense right. Y’all hunt “for food” don’t believe that one bit if your shooting animals in the shoulder.
Actually you aim right behind the shoulder, where you are sure to hit vital organs like heart and lungs.
You will ruin a bit of the rib case, but most prefer this over wounding an animal by attemting a head or neckshot.
I wanna see shot placement on people lol