...She and her fellow 'female' sister, Kratochvilovaw, really knew how to put their gender to shame on the track, by proving, you didn't need to be a bloke, to cheat...
This must be the worst piece of commetary by David Coleman ever. The lead off runner for the DDR was not Sabina Busch; she ran the second leg and Busch is rather unimstakeable.. Then he missed Koch at the start of the third leg and had to pretend he had 'thought so' all the time.
To be fair to David, the GDR really did make some last-minute switches to the version which was fed to the media. They wanted to keep Koch's involvement secret until the last moment. It worked for them ... but not so helpful for TV
Le début des années 80 : c'était le festival absolu de la dope et des femmes qui ressemblaient furieusement à des hommes, mais cela demeure plaisant à regarder !
Wow. Three truly poor handoffs for the DDR. Every one of them was inefficient, and two were dangerous. By contrast, that first change for the Czechs was brilliant.
Damn Kratochvilova's got some serious shoulders. I just don't agree with the records Marita and Jarmila set. No one has come close to their records since. If Sanya, Allyson, and Amantle get juiced up, then it's definitely possible.
Yes, she obviously avoided the challenge with Kratochvilova as she clearly would have been beaten both in the individual 400m and in the relay. In 1983 Kratochvilova was definitely unbeatable and Marita knew it. But I'm also convinced that Kratochvilova's performances in 1983 led Marita to work even harder in 1984 and 1985 to reach 47.60. It is such a shame that the Eastern block Countries boycott LA Olympics as I think that Valerie Brisco wouldn't even have gotten the bronze in 48.83 (let's not forget that Kocembova was storming as well in 1983 and 1984).
@@tj1417 Still a strange decision. She may have been slightly slower in the end, but it was a risk to allow Kratochvilova the opportunity to power herself into closing the gap whereas Koch would’ve had the opportunity to counter and go faster than without a reference as to how fast she’d need to run to ensure the overall win.
It really was! The “who’s who” of the track world! Shame the communist countries boycotted ‘84 LA. Screwed over Koch, Goer, Kratochvilova, Kocembova, and Pinigina-Bryzgina at their peak
@@dontlookback3549 The real Queen of doping is Flo Jo who improved from 11 seconds to 10.49 within a couple of weeks, and after that she was no way close to that time...
It is well documented that the East German athletes were given performance enhancement drugs for well over 20 years. There are official government papers that outline the doping system. Interestingly, people tend to throw Florence Griffith in the debate to deflect the EG guilt, yet no such documents or evidence have ever been presented to convict Florence.
@@FourSeasons04 The same applies to Marita Koch: She never tested positive for any doping drugs. Yes, there are some EG athletes who took drugs so were US and Western athletes, including Flo Jo and Ben Johnson. I suggest that you read Merlene Ottey's (Jamaican Sprinting Queen) and Gwen Torrence's (the living legend and Flo Jo's US Teammate) account of Flo Jo's performance. They make a perfect sense. Torrence said "those records of Flo Jo do not exist for me. She brought so much shame to the sport..' No wonder Flo Jo died young - her heart stopped because of the pumping steroids... The ultimate judgement of the God!
The majority of EG athletes did not "officially" test positive for PED. However, they are all listed, including Marita, in the government documents outlining the state-sponsored system and how drugs where administered to their athletes. There's a documentary called the Stasi Papers (?) that goes into great detail. Bottom line, the EG were successful dopers. Regarding Florence, not one athlete has presented evidence proving her guilt. Don't give me heresay, just provide proof.
What an amazing third leg by Marita Koch but Kratochviloba almost chases the east Germans.The comentator is wrong, the first leg is not Sabine Bush who in fact runs the 2nd leg. The first runner for East Germany is Gesine Walther. Thanks for posting all these awesome vodeos from Helsinki 1983 Athetle5399.
@@Dee-zy5gh: yet with steroid use by so many then and possibly most since they haven't got faster. If you're the best on steroids you've beaten the next best on steroids
She/he runs like a mediocre man. Also he/she is way to muscular for a 800 or 400m runner, a bit like Casta Semenya. Only a man can win a women competition with this physique.
Your description is a bit inaccurate, it should be changed to a stormer of a 3rd leg by Marita Koch, because as David Coleman said THAT is the athlete who did ALL the damage in that race.
i would like to know what is the comment when we see Kratochvilova just overtaking the russian girl pinigina. Thanks for the run. Kratochvilova is impressive !
Obviously no North Americans have ever been on performance enhancers have they? Jones, Hunter, Johnson, Graham, Lewis, Pettigrew, Joyners(?), Gatlin, Greene, Montgomery, Harrison(s). The list is endless. Who knows what they were up to before 1990's. The last known to be fully clean athlete who won 100m for US - Jim Hines before I was born.
I wonder why the GDR made the switch, given Koch would have had better chances fighting back against whatever Kratochvilova brought to the race, as opposed to having to run without a clear reference as to where she needed to be.
I believe Koch would have been great without the doping but since she was in the team she had no option but to take what they were giving her. It is hard to believe that over the 6 years she was the supreme female sprinter that they got the doping exactly right every time since apart from Kratochvilova once she won every time she ran. David Jenkins who admitted doping said it made virtually no difference to his performances and he ran faster times before he doped.
Koch probably still would have been great without the low levels of oral turinabol that were documented only...They were piss weak low dosages...She also progressively lowered her 400m time season to season over a long career...Jenkins would have run so much faster on peds but was always injured..Another point is that a female gets one hell of a bigger bang for their buck on steroids....No East German men around was there ..
I love watching the change-overs! I wish there was an event that was no running and stuff like that, just change-overs. Something for events organisers to think about?
What a difference a Koch makes!
or as great Australian commentator Bruce MacAveney once quipped "the all-time great Koch"
...She and her fellow 'female' sister, Kratochvilovaw, really knew how to put their gender to shame on the track, by proving, you didn't need to be a bloke, to cheat...
@@Logans3Run Marita had a baby you idiot..You doping conspiracists ruin the comments section.Just go away
Yeah, without Bill Koch the Americans would have had no Nordic skiing team at all, for example.
@@imanjordan3050 doping conspiracists, there no conspiracy that the East Germans were doped to their eyeballs. It’s a known fact.
How many more times do I have to say this …..GDR team, Gesine Walther, Sabine Busch, Marita Koch and Dagmar Ruebsam
Hopefully not anymore. It was Kerstin Walther on the 1st leg.
@@jensolepoulsen4377 no, she was Gesine Walther....Kerstin Walter was in preliminary round
@@ivancervi1825 No Gesine Walther in 1983. :
1.East Germany (Kerstin Walther, Sabine Busch, Marita Koch, Dagmar Rübsam) 3:19.73
This must be the worst piece of commetary by David Coleman ever. The lead off runner for the DDR was not Sabina Busch; she ran the second leg and Busch is rather unimstakeable.. Then he missed Koch at the start of the third leg and had to pretend he had 'thought so' all the time.
To be fair to David, the GDR really did make some last-minute switches to the version which was fed to the media. They wanted to keep Koch's involvement secret until the last moment. It worked for them ... but not so helpful for TV
Le début des années 80 : c'était le festival absolu de la dope et des femmes qui ressemblaient furieusement à des hommes, mais cela demeure plaisant à regarder !
All the East German girls were insanely quick except their last runner. Kratochvilova almost caught her.
I think it's impressive she managed to maintain her lead against a man.
men of culture, we have been had!
Thema First leg of gdr wasnt Busch, it was Kerstin Walther,an Bremer wasnt Bremer it was Sabine Busch
how many times do i have to say this.......east german squad, gesine walther, sabine bush, marita koch and dagmar ruebsam
Kerstin Walter not Gesine Walther
Wow. Three truly poor handoffs for the DDR. Every one of them was inefficient, and two were dangerous.
By contrast, that first change for the Czechs was brilliant.
Welcome to the mixed 400 relay ....
The 2nd soviet runs like Haaland
Marita Koch is the best
Yeah, garyoak 300, chinese team made a great effort in this race... and americans- as always- are pure as angels.
Shame to those people behind these artificial performance enhancement drugs from the three countries. East Germany, Czechoslovakia and Russia.
Ashford beats all the top East European runners...that's it!!
Yes bcoz she also took drug
Ashford wad dirty too
Damn Kratochvilova's got some serious shoulders. I just don't agree with the records Marita and Jarmila set. No one has come close to their records since. If Sanya, Allyson, and Amantle get juiced up, then it's definitely possible.
A Amantle did.
Funny that Koch didn't run the last leg. Did she want to avoid direct comparison with Krato ?
Absolutely
Koch didn't run individual 400 m too in Helsinki, but only 100 and 200 m. Yes I believe she wanted to escape from a direct challenge with Jarmila.
Yes, she obviously avoided the challenge with Kratochvilova as she clearly would have been beaten both in the individual 400m and in the relay. In 1983 Kratochvilova was definitely unbeatable and Marita knew it.
But I'm also convinced that Kratochvilova's performances in 1983 led Marita to work even harder in 1984 and 1985 to reach 47.60.
It is such a shame that the Eastern block Countries boycott LA Olympics as I think that Valerie Brisco wouldn't even have gotten the bronze in 48.83 (let's not forget that Kocembova was storming as well in 1983 and 1984).
@@tj1417 Still a strange decision. She may have been slightly slower in the end, but it was a risk to allow Kratochvilova the opportunity to power herself into closing the gap whereas Koch would’ve had the opportunity to counter and go faster than without a reference as to how fast she’d need to run to ensure the overall win.
No, she didnt, it was a beautiful tactic.
Helsinki was a fabulous World Championships.
It surely was....an amazing championships. Everybody was there.
If you like steroids
Even the black girls never ran the 400 that fast. The Canadian, the Americans.
It really was! The “who’s who” of the track world! Shame the communist countries boycotted ‘84 LA. Screwed over Koch, Goer, Kratochvilova, Kocembova, and Pinigina-Bryzgina at their peak
Marita, Marita and Marita! The Legend and the Queen of Sprinting!
Marita...queen of the dopers!
@@dontlookback3549 The real Queen of doping is Flo Jo who improved from 11 seconds to 10.49 within a couple of weeks, and after that she was no way close to that time...
It is well documented that the East German athletes were given performance enhancement drugs for well over 20 years. There are official government papers that outline the doping system. Interestingly, people tend to throw Florence Griffith in the debate to deflect the EG guilt, yet no such documents or evidence have ever been presented to convict Florence.
@@FourSeasons04 The same applies to Marita Koch: She never tested positive for any doping drugs. Yes, there are some EG athletes who took drugs so were US and Western athletes, including Flo Jo and Ben Johnson. I suggest that you read Merlene Ottey's (Jamaican Sprinting Queen) and Gwen Torrence's (the living legend and Flo Jo's US Teammate) account of Flo Jo's performance. They make a perfect sense. Torrence said "those records of Flo Jo do not exist for me. She brought so much shame to the sport..' No wonder Flo Jo died young - her heart stopped because of the pumping steroids... The ultimate judgement of the God!
The majority of EG athletes did not "officially" test positive for PED. However, they are all listed, including Marita, in the government documents outlining the state-sponsored system and how drugs where administered to their athletes. There's a documentary called the Stasi Papers (?) that goes into great detail. Bottom line, the EG were successful dopers. Regarding Florence, not one athlete has presented evidence proving her guilt. Don't give me heresay, just provide proof.
КОХ!!! Марита. всегда за нее болел.
What an amazing third leg by Marita Koch but Kratochviloba almost chases the east Germans.The comentator is wrong, the first leg is not Sabine Bush who in fact runs the 2nd leg. The first runner for East Germany is Gesine Walther. Thanks for posting all these awesome vodeos from Helsinki 1983 Athetle5399.
Samuel Creus First leg runner is Kerstin Walther.
@@jensolepoulsen4377 it`s right.
How did the Czechs sneak that dude on the anchor leg and nobody noticed?
Marita Koch is the most wonderful graceful runner to watch
It’s amazing how steroids can make you look so graceful
47,7 by kratochvilova in the last leg is JUST INCREDIBLE
Steroids are incredible too.
If her 47.7 from a running start is incredible, what does that make Koch's 47.6 from a standing start :D
@@Dee-zy5gh: yet with steroid use by so many then and possibly most since they haven't got faster. If you're the best on steroids you've beaten the next best on steroids
Carolina great point
He is a very powerful dude and runner.
just checked kerstin walter ran 1st leg here. gesine walter ran t 1st leg in their WR following year! sorry 2 bore u.
the first east german runner was kerstin walter , marita koch saved the day!
Exactly. Coleman called Sabina Busch as lead-off and Sabina (second) was hard to miss anywhere!
Oral Turinabol saved the day.
I can't believe athletics world championships used to fill stadiums! Things have changed so much since then.
Really? You aint seen nuting yet. Greetings 12 years back to you from the the future!
European Championships just did.
東独の作戦勝ち。モスクワ五輪でソ連がメンバー表提出後に変更という規則違反の汚い手を使い、アンカーがコッホから逃げ切った事があり、絶好調のクラトフビロバと、調子が良くないコッホとのアンカー対決を避けたのが吉と出た。クラトフビロバはこの時47:75という超人的な走りだったそうだ。
Marita koch drugs or not the best
Marita Koch best athlete ever
Amazing... the Canadians finished ahead of the Americans?
Marita Koch, the living legend of sprinting!
The greatest ever 😍
@@bluecheese4877 I can't agree with YOU MORE!
Yes, big fan of Marita Koch. Just such an elegant powerful runner
@@MH77391 Yes, Sir!
Doped to the gills
GDR team Gesine Walther, Sabine Busch, Marita Koch, Dagmar Ruebsam.......how many times do I have to post this ffs
Kerstin Walter not Gesine Walther.
@@manuelat742 GESINE WALTER MAYBE YOU MIX UP WITH KIRSTEN SIEMON
@@fergusalex no i didn`t, look at the results on wikipedia, it`s Kerstin Walther, Kirsten Siemon/Emmelmann is a little girl.
@@fergusalex look in here face in the end of race, it`s clear not Kirsten Siemon.
Thought Coleman would have been able to tell the difference between Gesine and Sabina!
Kratochvílová, is really unbelievable.
Sandy Combs so were her steroids. I met her once and her facial hair was scary.
@@stevecross3784: but you comment as if others weren't. On a level playing field she was still better than they were
@@stevecross3784 My guess is she is not only on steroids but she also has a Y chromosome like Semenya.
Marita showed this man his place
Don't forget Stella Walsh. Decades later, it was discovered, Stella was a fella.
that bloke running the last leg for czech was amazing.
Whenever I used to watch her competing as a child my family always joked how noone could compete with the man/woman.
She/he runs like a mediocre man. Also he/she is way to muscular for a 800 or 400m runner, a bit like Casta Semenya. Only a man can win a women competition with this physique.
Yep. Whichever way you look at it.....the race was dominated by Koch..
Marita. The best there is, the best there was, and the best there ever will be
Eben eine Legende 👏🌹🙏
Doped, doped, doped.
Your description is a bit inaccurate, it should be changed to a stormer of a 3rd leg by Marita Koch, because as David Coleman said THAT is the athlete who did ALL the damage in that race.
Jim’s split was faster, besides he had the world record at the time
i would like to know what is the comment when we see Kratochvilova just overtaking the russian girl pinigina. Thanks for the run. Kratochvilova is impressive !
Piningina had an impressive career. Outstanding athlete
He said it seems to me Marita Koch settled this world championship on the third leg.
@@MirjanaLfan thank you but in fact it is just after, at 3:13 , he said something about Jk i don't understand and i would
@@Jess-vb6mz “Kratochvilova striking for home but surely she can’t do it” striking for home means your final big effort.
@@MirjanaLfan much thanks
Obviously no North Americans have ever been on performance enhancers have they?
Jones, Hunter, Johnson, Graham, Lewis, Pettigrew, Joyners(?), Gatlin, Greene, Montgomery, Harrison(s). The list is endless. Who knows what they were up to before 1990's.
The last known to be fully clean athlete who won 100m for US - Jim Hines before I was born.
Gay
Kratochvilova is a MAN! almost like Miss Trunchball in Matilda
Marvellous Marita ❤️
good tactics by the east germans! good 2 c the americans so far back! interesting the following year the americans ran 3m 18.29.
their home Olympics - lots of inducements and possibly more
More powerful steroids would have helped them run 3 m 15:)
@@Dee-zy5gh as in the seoul olympics
@@andrewpaul7363 Precisely
kratochvilovas split was 47.7
ashford beat marita koch at the 1983 world championship 100 meter semi final!!!!
So what? Who ask for her?
But Marita got silver and Ashford pulled out.
Not on team sheet, should of been disqualified
I wonder why the GDR made the switch, given Koch would have had better chances fighting back against whatever Kratochvilova brought to the race, as opposed to having to run without a clear reference as to where she needed to be.
how many times...……….gdr order walther, busch, Koch ruebsam
I believe Koch would have been great without the doping but since she was in the team she had no option but to take what they were giving her. It is hard to believe that over the 6 years she was the supreme female sprinter that they got the doping exactly right every time since apart from Kratochvilova once she won every time she ran. David Jenkins who admitted doping said it made virtually no difference to his performances and he ran faster times before he doped.
Koch probably still would have been great without the low levels of oral turinabol that were documented only...They were piss weak low dosages...She also progressively lowered her 400m time season to season over a long career...Jenkins would have run so much faster on peds but was always injured..Another point is that a female gets one hell of a bigger bang for their buck on steroids....No East German men around was there
..
Does anyone know what Koch’s split was and jarmila’s?
東ドイツの強かった時代
@Aarontlondon
It is worth bearing in mind that this is Helsinki & Athletics is probably more popular in Finland than in any other country.
I cant believe how weak the US team was
5 years later in Seoul they got "serious"...meaning they got with the "program" in how GDR & Soviets were doing.
This was before USA starting doping, circa 1983-84 in time for the LA Olympics and ever since.
This was the period when they were busy juicing up Valerie Brisco Hooks, Chandra Cheesebrough and a few others.
EPA
Cambi per la Ddr orrendi ma sufficenti per vincere
Yes, Ashford did beat Gohr after the Olympics and in so doing broke the world record! (10.76)
But this is not the subject of this video is it?
Anyone know what Koch’s split was?
Canada was good back then.
Jeez koch and Kratochvilova's legs...
I love watching the change-overs! I wish there was an event that was no running and stuff like that, just change-overs. Something for events organisers to think about?
100x10m would be really interesting!
Stupid comment!
💕 💕 💕 💕 💕 💕 💕
💕💕💕💕💕
Jarmila caught up well. The druggies had to win.
Never knew men where allowed to run in a women's relay.
idontsignin HAHAHAHA
Well they're allowed to run in the women's 800 these days.
idontsignin: haha, get used to it from 2020 onwards. It'll be legit!
@metsdudenj Yes, they were, and how miractulously there were so invinsible a year later a the LA games !
steady on with the allegations! they boycotted L.A. in retaliation to the U.S. boycott of Moscow 4 years earlier.
good 2 see americans so well down!
KOCH!!
+Dazzaman CHEAT!!!
ranhill KOCH!!
BEST WOMAN EVER RUN,WILMA RUDOLPH
All on juice
Ahhhh..... The eastern block doping days.
and marion jones was clean hahahahahahaha….get real dear, the usa just don't get caught
ashford was not in this race! and was not the only clean athlete around at the time, probably the only clean american!!!!
I very much doubt it
eastern europe were on the juice then
And USA too.
So why weren't the Eastern European Men dominant against the Americans?
Did you see that Czech fellow on the anchor.
Did anyone notice Jarmila disappeared off the world stage after 83? Makes u wonder the secret of her speed
Drug cheat
Die/der /das Kratvilowa war doch erste Genderin im Sport!?
Marita coming fully into view on camera round the last bend was a “surprise bitches” moment for the audience.