same, there were also other drama's on festivals like Roskilde (2000), Love Parade (2010), Pukkelpop (2011), Manchester (2017), ... its sometimes very awful on a concert or a festival
Same. Also may wanna check out the who performance and the pilgrimage in Israel. If you even type in crowd crush you'll see.. what happened at astroworld is so utterly horrible and sick. My prayers are with those that passed and the people who witnessed it
The Hillsborough Disaster changed the way I think about crowds in general. The pictures of the people blue and pushed up against a fence are horrifying.
I literally went down a rabbit hole on such incidents. The worst ones have been during the Hajj pilgrimages in Mecca. Thousands of Muslims have died crushed/trampled to death in a crowd crush. Terrifying
True. It is more a case of fluid mechanics at this point. I read an article in Vanity Fair about the crowd crush at the hajj in 2015 and the article pointed me here for an example of that theory.
I've been in a situation like that, and as the crowd moves, you are unable to stay in one place....it MOVES YOU like a wave, first one direction, then another. YOU have no control over your position, and what direction you go. It literally picks you up off your feet and takes you with it. It's terrifying. It happened to me and my sister when we attended a New Year's Day parade in California. A pedestrian sidewalk became blocked with too many people, and suddenly surged against a two story storefront with plate glass windows: the windows creaked and gave way, injuring one of two people. At one point, I was pushed against the glass and felt/heard it groaning as the pressure on it increased. A split second later, I was suddenly moved away from the glass, which descended in large shards, cutting the people nearest the display window. Later, reaching into my coat pocket, I retrieved a large shard of glass that had fallen into it. It was as big as my hand with fingers extended. Why I wasn't cut or injured, I'll never know. No, don't like crowds. Children are especially vulnerable.
it is horrible that this happened. but it is still not clear for me why the police formed those 3 cordons in the first place. what were they trying to do?
the festival area was fuel. and the organisation of this event decided this cordons to take pressure. not the police was the problem at this day. the loveparade had not beiing in this area. over 1 million people on an area for max350 tousend. ... the police cordon was to small to hold the people in the tunnels. and then you had the pressure on this rampe, especially in front of this gangway in the left where the most people died.
At big festivals and concerts police/festival guards usually forms cordons to ease the pressure of attenders entering the venue. You can call it a "waiting checkpoint". They open up the cordons (or checkpoints) regularly and people enters at different intervals. The main problem here is that one of the cordons were breached so that a wave of people crossed the checkpoint at the wrong time. From watching this video I believe that cordon 3 were the first to be opened (to prevent a collision of masses). However, I believe the main factor contributing to this fatal incident was a lack of communication between the officers.
They clear caused the crises yetconcerrt goers are blamed simply because its edm. That’s so wrong. These weren’t rioting fans. There was no reason to begin the corridor when traffic was smooth
The problem was the combination of the unexpected mass of people and the fact that people who entered would pass the same way that people who left would come along.
It seems that major problem was that there were no entries and no exits, that would divide the flow of people - only routes that worked as both - exits and entries at the same time. That was not very smart people flow direction.
The entrance way was too wide and the exit way was too narrrow, and when the police created 3 cordons, they just make it even worse: they stopped people from going out and had people from 3 directions wanted to get in. And as you can see on this animation, letting people from those 3 directions getting on the concert on the same time caused this bottleneck. Also It would be better if they had one direction entrance, not both ways.
Also, you should never allow 2 or more separate crowds to hit each other, which T-intersections like this one can be especially dangerous for. That also caused the 2015 hajj crowd crush which led to over 2,000 deaths.
It’s so easy to die... humans are fragile beings. this is why big events like this need to be properly thought through,l when being planned, the location they picked was horrendous and with that volume, they were asking for a crush.
This video has been here for 11 years and the phenomenon isn't new either. If you attend large events regularly you know this is a thing that can happen with faults in organization and crowd control. It's just very sad that it can still happen in 2021.
I lived the same thing on New Year's Day in Paris after the fireworks everyone is stuck in the middle of a crowd that grows at that moment you think that you get out of this trap and save your life , I can tell you that it's very creepy but it is important to keep calm. after experiencing this experience I became more interested in crowd movements . RIP TO ALL
The people in the comment section are missing the point, bad planning yes, but the police!! What the hell were they playing at?!? Blocking exit and allowing entry absolutely disgusting
Coretta Hattereaux tough to put all the blame on anyone. Sure it could’ve been handled better, but really it was the perfect storm. location choice was easily the biggest mistake they made
KurzWasLernen Please don't forget to take into account that this highly biased, one-sided version of events is uploaded by the organizers of LoveParade which they also face(d) criminal charges because of the disaster. Pretty cool way to shift blame away from them imo.
My friends were there and i was on the way, this place wasn´t built for so many people and there was only one way to go out AND in. This was homemade, so many people said that it is to dangerous but they made it and know 21 People are dead.
My sister was there as well, It was scary as fuck seeing this on TV and not knowing if she's ok. Thankfully she wasn't anywhere near the entrance when this happened.
Because an ambulance passed and they wanted to secure the area so the medical teams can do their job properly But why did they block the entrance to the festival ? That i don't understand
Webmax96 I know, it just seems this could have been so easily prevented with proper crowd control. Even after the situation started getting bad, the event organizers could have stepped in and alleviated the situation. I just don't understand how it could have gotten to this point. It was completely avoidable.
In a general manner, when something is called "the love 'something'", you know it will be filled with self interests. so i would advice to avoid the area if you really are seeking love, and rather go bring some flowers to your mother or talk with a homeless person and bring her some attention.
The main difference was that the Hillsborough disaster was a unilateral CC (Crowd-crush) event in which spectators from the back squeezed the spectators near the front into a metal fence. This resulted way more (50+) deaths because its more dangerous. Loveparade on the otherhand is multilateral (pressure from 3 cordons) so while the bulk of the pressure was felt at the lower arm, there were less casualties but more injuries, people bumping into one another but not being crushed into anything metalic/solid other than those unfortunate enough to be near the walls.
Please don't forget to take into account that this highly biased, one-sided version of events is uploaded by the organizers of LoveParade which they also face(d) criminal charges because of the disaster. Pretty cool way to shift blame away from them imo.
@@hengineer Last week, I heared an interview with the family of one of the girls that died that day. Tell them that it was just bad luck that her daughter died that day...
I was at love Parade in Berlin during 99, it worked. It worked because Government was not over controlling the situation, people could move freely in an open space. years later they brought love parade back but with fencing everywhere and it killed the concept. When will government get the hint that over controlling everything leads too much worse outcomes.
By blocking the flow of people, especially trying to leave just made everyone think something must be wrong and tension and emotion starts to build until fight it flight kicks in and people just made a run for it.
Improper preparation on the police's part. No-one taking responsibility of leading all parts of the operation to control the crowds. The main issue here is the influx from the west gate after they were told, wrongly, that they should open it to more visitors. If someone at the top took responsibility and monitored the entire situation, using CCTV, and info from radios in various places, they would have made the right decision. They couldn't be arsed, so that's what happened. I also don't think you can't rely on police cordons not breaking down with that many people, as it did in the tunnel on the east. When all those people are let into the general area, something bad was going to happen.
rowanationer funny how this relates to current events in europe german governmeny yet again trying to control the influx, only this time muslim migrants....
At the original love parades where people did whatever they wanted within reason and usually within the context of love (love for life, love for one another etc), an issue like this wouldn't have occurred. Maybe the lifespan of such events is marked by when it is impeded on by methods of control such as gates, flow predictions and large police presences?
No the police aren't the main people to blame. The organizers of this event are at fault. The venue's capacity was 250k people but they had expected 1 million visitors to come. Plus there was only this ONE way (the ramp) to go in AND out!! The police set up blockades inside the two tunnels leading to the ramp because the crowds were already growing too big near the ramp. But from the entrance people kept coming and coming and at one point the police could no longer hold the crowds as there were just too many people. Besides all this, there was only this one street that lead to the venue and to the left and right there were fences set up everywhere. So from the very beginning the crowds couldn't escape anywhere. When the disaster occurred and they reported the first deaths, they opened some of the fences and the crowd could finally escape. The whole organization was a complete failure. There is a very good 50 minute long German documentary from focus about this which explains it so well.
i dont get the fact that 1,5 million people came in a area that was designed for just 350 Thousand. Was the event free or something? didnt the orginazation think about the words "SOLD" and "OUT"?
DaGrocery Love Parade was free, however they had over 1 million attendees every year so I don't know why they chosen a place that can't even hold 0.5 million.
Watching this after Berlin's love parade 2022, Crowd crush cannot easily happen here because there is a park 'Zoologischer garten' parallel to the street that lets diffuse any excess crowd buildup. such events should happen in such open places but not closed. No amount of crowd control can avoid if crowd grows sufficient enough inviting the disaster.
for years love parade had been taking place on the streets, No problems!! why moving it to confined area with only 2 narrow entries? why the f..ck police got involved.... taming the crowds flow.... this is exactly what happens when things are being govenered, controlled etc..
Whoever was in charge of those police cordenes should never be allowed to make a decision of power ever again! It was like they did it on purpose. Waiting for all 3 to get jammed pack then released them. I even knew that was a bad idea
Should‘ve just made the small ramp as an entry and the big ramp as an exit and a barrier in between of them so people can enter the festival from the east and leave from west...
The police set up the cordons inside the two tunnels leading to the ramp because the crowds were already growing too big near the ramp. But from the entrance people kept coming and coming and at one point the police could no longer hold the crowds as there were just too many people. Besides all this, there was only this one street that lead to the venue and to the left and right there were fences set up everywhere. So from the very beginning the crowds couldn't escape anywhere. When the disaster occurred and they reported the first deaths, they opened some of the fences and the crowd could finally escape. The police aren't the main culprits of this. The whole organization/planning of this event was a complete failure. The venue's capacity was just 250k people but they had expected 1 million visitors to come! Plus, there was only this one way (the ramp) to go IN and OUT!! There is a very good and recent documentary from focus about this disaster which explains it so well but I think it's only available in German (sadly).
If I were in this crowd, I would probably start vomitting. Sometimes I do ok in tight spaces, but I would wanna die if I were caught in this. What I'm confused about is why, seeing this, people think that the police cordons had nothing to do with this. I can't recall any problems before they showed up. As far as I can see It, they turned the whole thing into a shit show. Maybe I'm missing something. If I am, please enlighten me
Tory Catherine i agree i wouldve gone crazy with the idea i wouldnt be able to leave the area. If they all let the people just go away this wouldnt happend. But i guess its not the officers but the one giving the commands
The police cordons were placed way too high compared to the western and eastern first entrance, they should have put 2 first cordons at eh East and West crossroad to lighten the flux, the random factors are numerous, the people that broke the first cordon, this 3rd cordon was a complete bullshit. The 2 first coronds were good but it needed 2 more cordons in upper positions at the coss roads to enable a consistent flux of people leaving/entering the tunnel. It works like water flux, imagine puting dams where the water flux is the strongest, it would be devastating if it comes to break, that's what unfortunately happened here :'(
because crowd behaves like that. if you give it any chance to doubt - for example, that all entrances are closed - it becomes mad and uncontrollable. Crowd can't stand complexity. This crowd had its goal - it wanted to go home, but the police was on its way and did not provide it with any other alternative. And the crowd got wind of danger, and like a huge wild beast started to break the barriers, hurting itself.
Know what you mean. Tbh I probably would not have even gone down through the tunnel, seeing how many people were going through. I don't have the worst case of claustrophobia but this triggers it even without the overcrowding.
If there hadnt been cordons, none of this would have happened. This is an example of government 'management" creating problems more problems than they solve.. We are better off with less government.
+Joey Suggs I am still not sure how this happened. Like... do people just push into each other to death or what? Like if you see there is no god damn space, where are you moving?
+Tucker Coffin What happens is each person just barely inches forward a little bit out of impatience. Kind of like cars inching forward while stopped at a red light. The very slight push of each person gets hugely magnified by the thousands of people in the crowd. For the people in the front the total force is crushing, but the people way back in the back don't know what's going on.
+Mr. Mohagany thanks for explaining! I just found about this and your response was the best explanation I found so far, since most articles talk about a stampede but I couldn't get WHY PEOPLE WOULD DO THAT (well, also this video explained it pretty well but since English is not my first language and it's still hard for me to fully understand just by hearing, your explanation helped a a lot).
Ely G Glad it helped. Yeah some articles talk about stampedes, and it's kind of confusing. Stampede usually means getting walked on top of, like if a herd of cows ran over someone, but this is different. In a human crowd disaster people die standing up. The pressure is so huge that they can no longer breathe. They're called 'crowd crushes'. If you sense one coming, they say to move sideways as the crowd "waves" make a momentary space. I got caught in some bad crowds before at some concerts and got crushed (not that bad though) and decided to read about it.
It also commonly happens when on a escalator... If one person stops walking down an escalator everyone behind will have the stop as well but at different times. So the people right at the back do not know what is going on before the people in front. The information basically gets delayed to those at the back when in any kind of traffic. Even when you walk down the street if someone stops you end up treading on the back of their shoe. Imagine that person had a wall in front of them and you had 100 people behind you... reference Newton’s first law of motion: "Objects in motion stay in motion."
Its easy to create a disaster. This excellent video summary of WHAT happened, does not explain WHY it happened. Why would the police shut down the flow of people in an out of the venue? Why would the police continue to allow people to flow into the entrances when they had blocked them off? What possible good can come of this action? It is a confused desperate reckless act. The only reason you would allow a potentially deadly crowd to build up in the entrance is if being in the venue itself was somehow MORE dangerous than the crush risk outside the venue. It's the kind of thing you might do, if you knew some deadly terrorist device was in the venue, and you felt that people might be better off taking their chances in a crush outside the venue - a form of proactive triage that is never going to win anyone praise. What was going on with police communications? Did each group of police know the bigger picture? Was central command aware of what was going on in the field? Were the access control points in communication with the main venue and the police? But none of the above really makes sense. If you wanted to clear the venue without causing panic, you would never have allowed anyone past the access control points and just let people exit naturally. Perhaps there was a bomb scare in the tunnel? But then why would you continue to allow people through the access control points? Given how sloppy police fuck up investigations tend to be. Given how easy it is for field commanders to escape blame and punishment for these kind of disasters. Its hard not to conclude that the police operational commander was concomitant, or someone USED the police to give the politicians the excuse to destroy the festival. Personally I would assume its just incompetence, rather than a conspiracy. BUT that does not make the commander's actions any less culpable. He could not have made a worse set of decisions! This was premeditated mass murder by a police commander who did know better, or had access to experienced personal who could have told him he was making a terrible decision. If you have a bomb threat in the crowd, you DO NOT TELL ANYONE!
+W. Jason Spangler Agreed, everyone here is quick to blame the police but they were simply trying to control the flow of people so this exact situation didn't happen. It was once the police barricades dissolved that the masses started moving in. The people only have themselves and the event organisers to blame.
+Jesse Drabble Are you seriously saying the police have no accountability when they had taken control of the situation? They set up the blockades, they saw the traffic building up and only the police could have changed that outcome, organisers and attendees would have to break the law if they took things into their own hands. If I lock you in a box and you can't get out before you suffocate, clearly you only have yourself to blame because you didn't have the knowledge or tenacity to get out.
...or maybe someone ( goverment or ) wanted this happen for a reason to prevent future concerts by saying that large crowds like that cause fatalities. Cause how would you explain what the police did. It was a smooth flow and if its not broken dont fix it yet they interfered and couldnt even provide a decent police report.
I wish it was that simple. Read up on past human stampedes and crushes, it's actually more complex than what many realize. Crowd control is an important public health service.
The little rinky dink astro concert bs was nothing compared to other crowd casualty incidents, all these tiktok zoomers Wana blow it up so they think they were apart of something...
@@dylanjones1286 8 people literally died, 300 were injured, not to mention all the people who will be suffering mentally from the shit they've seen and heard while they've been there. Your attitude and diviseness is extremely disrespectful to the victims, not to say disgusting, to use this very real tragedy to fuel your ego and elitisism.
Being packed in so tightly with other people, in a huge area like this, creates a lot of pressure around your body. You can't move your arms. There's no space for your lungs to even expand, so you can't breathe. Most people would've died from suffocation. Contrary to what someone might assume, people aren't "trampled to death" in these crowd scenarios, because there's no room for someone to even trample over you in the first place. You can't run, let alone take a single step.
So Sad!!! policing and organisers both seem partially to blame although i do understand planning the movement of 1mil people into a small area without incident is very hard! Rave in Peace all the 2010 paraders that never came home :(
one simple but radical solution to the whole thing: every person puts other person on their shoulders then you would get twice more room horizontally and everyone can leave.
the problem is that if you're the first to climb on someones shoulder and the others don't do the same you cannot get down anymore. No more space left. So noone tries.
The problem is in a crush situation people are literally so tightly packed together (6-7 people per square meter is generally considered a crush) that they literally have no room to move at all. That's why you get a situation like in this video where the movement of the crowd literally looks like water, because it's no longer a crowd of individuals but one big mass. That's why the most common cause of death in a crush in suffocation.
Ikr? Anyone could have figured that people should have been stopped from entering, not exiting, in an enclosed area. That is the only way to diffuse a situation of overcrowding in an enclosed area. This is common sense. There is no logic to block exits and keep allowing entry.
Ante Jelaš Dude, this was done on purpose, because these events with mass drugs were from 1985-2003 mostly... Germany was starting to be seen as a drug hole 'Love Parade' so they staged something on purpose to end the event.
watching this after the astroworld fest
same, there were also other drama's on festivals like Roskilde (2000), Love Parade (2010), Pukkelpop (2011), Manchester (2017), ... its sometimes very awful on a concert or a festival
Same. Also may wanna check out the who performance and the pilgrimage in Israel. If you even type in crowd crush you'll see.. what happened at astroworld is so utterly horrible and sick. My prayers are with those that passed and the people who witnessed it
The Hillsborough Disaster changed the way I think about crowds in general. The pictures of the people blue and pushed up against a fence are horrifying.
Same! I'm up late watching all the disaster concert videos
Me too...this is frightening
This type of crowd is a recipe for disaster
So disturbing...😶💔
Who else is here to learn more about crowd crush after Astroworld? This is new to me and I’m blown away!
Yep, I now know everything needed to know about such
I literally went down a rabbit hole on such incidents. The worst ones have been during the Hajj pilgrimages in Mecca. Thousands of Muslims have died crushed/trampled to death in a crowd crush. Terrifying
Crowd crushes have been a problem for over a century. Read about Czar Nicholas' coronation in 1886.
@@celieboo I mean they've been a problem since the beginning of time, not just the last 100 or 200 years.
It happened to me in 80s. Nothing new.
WOW! that moment when they show the dense crowd and it's so dense you can see waves in it was scary af. It's like it starts behaving like a liquid
True. It is more a case of fluid mechanics at this point. I read an article in Vanity Fair about the crowd crush at the hajj in 2015 and the article pointed me here for an example of that theory.
Like a zombie apocalypse
1alas *they start behaving like liquid.
I've been in a situation like that, and as the crowd moves, you are unable to stay in one place....it MOVES YOU like a wave, first one direction, then another. YOU have no control over your position, and what direction you go. It literally picks you up off your feet and takes you with it.
It's terrifying.
It happened to me and my sister when we attended a New Year's Day parade in California. A pedestrian sidewalk became blocked with too many people, and suddenly surged against a two story storefront with plate glass windows: the windows creaked and gave way, injuring one of two people. At one point, I was pushed against the glass and felt/heard it groaning as the pressure on it increased. A split second later, I was suddenly moved away from the glass, which descended in large shards, cutting the people nearest the display window.
Later, reaching into my coat pocket, I retrieved a large shard of glass that had fallen into it. It was as big as my hand with fingers extended. Why I wasn't cut or injured, I'll never know.
No, don't like crowds.
Children are especially vulnerable.
See videos of the Hillsborough disaster, same thing happened there.
Sad. Tunnels should never be used for entry/exit to a major event. I am surprised they held it there in the first place.
I lost my best friend in that preventable disaster! 11 years on, and I'm still as furious as I was the day I received the tragic news 😢
I feel bad for you ❤
it is horrible that this happened. but it is still not clear for me why the police formed those 3 cordons in the first place. what were they trying to do?
+LUIS FE Rojas The police haven't opened their lips for an explanation - till this day! :(
the festival area was fuel. and the organisation of this event decided this cordons to take pressure.
not the police was the problem at this day. the loveparade had not beiing in this area. over 1 million people on an area for max350 tousend. ... the police cordon was to small to hold the people in the tunnels. and then you had the pressure on this rampe, especially in front of this gangway in the left where the most people died.
At big festivals and concerts police/festival guards usually forms cordons to ease the pressure of attenders entering the venue. You can call it a "waiting checkpoint". They open up the cordons (or checkpoints) regularly and people enters at different intervals. The main problem here is that one of the cordons were breached so that a wave of people crossed the checkpoint at the wrong time. From watching this video I believe that cordon 3 were the first to be opened (to prevent a collision of masses). However, I believe the main factor contributing to this fatal incident was a lack of communication between the officers.
When they saw these crowds building up at the cordons they should have closed the access points completely.
They clear caused the crises yetconcerrt goers are blamed simply because its edm. That’s so wrong. These weren’t rioting fans. There was no reason to begin the corridor when traffic was smooth
The problem was the combination of the unexpected mass of people and the fact that people who entered would pass the same way that people who left would come along.
It seems that major problem was that there were no entries and no exits, that would divide the flow of people - only routes that worked as both - exits and entries at the same time. That was not very smart people flow direction.
The entrance way was too wide and the exit way was too narrrow, and when the police created 3 cordons, they just make it even worse: they stopped people from going out and had people from 3 directions wanted to get in. And as you can see on this animation, letting people from those 3 directions getting on the concert on the same time caused this bottleneck. Also It would be better if they had one direction entrance, not both ways.
Also, you should never allow 2 or more separate crowds to hit each other, which T-intersections like this one can be especially dangerous for. That also caused the 2015 hajj crowd crush which led to over 2,000 deaths.
It’s so easy to die... humans are fragile beings. this is why big events like this need to be properly thought through,l when being planned, the location they picked was horrendous and with that volume, they were asking for a crush.
Imagine watching an 11yr old vid that you had no knowledge of bc of goddamn Travis 😩
How can you watch this and still blame Travis Scott?
This video has been here for 11 years and the phenomenon isn't new either. If you attend large events regularly you know this is a thing that can happen with faults in organization and crowd control. It's just very sad that it can still happen in 2021.
So what’s your point? You’re saying the same shh I’m saying? Like hearing yourself much?
I lived the same thing on New Year's Day in Paris after the fireworks everyone is stuck in the middle of a crowd that grows at that moment you think that you get out of this trap and save your life , I can tell you that it's very creepy but it is important to keep calm. after experiencing this experience I became more interested in crowd movements
. RIP TO ALL
Stay calm, stay upright and move with the crowd, don't fight it.
Try to slowly move to the side and get out.
The people in the comment section are missing the point, bad planning yes, but the police!! What the hell were they playing at?!? Blocking exit and allowing entry absolutely disgusting
My fiance was there and got annoyed by the crowd so he climbed on the autobahn. Strictly forbidden, but it saved his life
just shows that humans must not feel superior to any other living creature, because if push comes to shove theyre just as helpless.
police is 100% responsible. what do they expect if they block both entries and the exit?!?!? doesnt make any sense.
KurzWasLernen the idiots in the crowd who actually killed each other helped too.
Coretta Hattereaux tough to put all the blame on anyone. Sure it could’ve been handled better, but really it was the perfect storm. location choice was easily the biggest mistake they made
The communication broke up the police didn't know what's happened. But this is no excuse
KurzWasLernen Please don't forget to take into account that this highly biased, one-sided version of events is uploaded by the organizers of LoveParade which they also face(d) criminal charges because of the disaster. Pretty cool way to shift blame away from them imo.
@@ManosTheOne It was a bad venue from Go, obviously. Then you let incompetent people run security. Brilliant.
My friends were there and i was on the way, this place wasn´t built for so many people and there was only one way to go out AND in. This was homemade, so many people said that it is to dangerous but they made it and know 21 People are dead.
My sister was there as well, It was scary as fuck seeing this on TV and not knowing if she's ok. Thankfully she wasn't anywhere near the entrance when this happened.
I was there, it was so scary
Watching this in 2020 while being quarantine at home because of the coronavirus
Why did they set up any police cordons in the 1st place? The crowd was flowing well in all directions before they did that. I don't understand.
Because an ambulance passed and they wanted to secure the area so the medical teams can do their job properly
But why did they block the entrance to the festival ? That i don't understand
Webmax96
I know, it just seems this could have been so easily prevented with proper crowd control. Even after the situation started getting bad, the event organizers could have stepped in and alleviated the situation. I just don't understand how it could have gotten to this point. It was completely avoidable.
When get sick from the shitty drugs you took and that sparks an event that'll kill 21 people.
@@gacomics5951 No. Look at that liquid crowd at 5:45. Someone could die there, easily.
In a general manner, when something is called "the love 'something'", you know it will be filled with self interests. so i would advice to avoid the area if you really are seeking love, and rather go bring some flowers to your mother or talk with a homeless person and bring her some attention.
Does any one else watch this at least once a year? I think its my 5th time...
Reminds me so much of Hillsborough disaster! 😭
There are striking similarities... police mismanagement of crowds and poorly chosen location with inadequate infrastructure.
because they were both stampede incidents thats why......... duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh
Omg me too
@@aquaticspasticp5024 neither disaster was a stampede.
The main difference was that the Hillsborough disaster was a unilateral CC (Crowd-crush) event in which spectators from the back squeezed the spectators near the front into a metal fence. This resulted way more (50+) deaths because its more dangerous. Loveparade on the otherhand is multilateral (pressure from 3 cordons) so while the bulk of the pressure was felt at the lower arm, there were less casualties but more injuries, people bumping into one another but not being crushed into anything metalic/solid other than those unfortunate enough to be near the walls.
Please don't forget to take into account that this highly biased, one-sided version of events is uploaded by the organizers of LoveParade which they also face(d) criminal charges because of the disaster. Pretty cool way to shift blame away from them imo.
They faced anything, no consequences..
Does it? If anything it's pointing the blame at police mostly
@@hengineer Last week, I heared an interview with the family of one of the girls that died that day. Tell them that it was just bad luck that her daughter died that day...
@@miqueltura7336 Where did he say it was bad luck?
@@mattstorm6568 When anyone is guilty...
I was at love Parade in Berlin during 99, it worked. It worked because Government was not over controlling the situation, people could move freely in an open space. years later they brought love parade back but with fencing everywhere and it killed the concept. When will government get the hint that over controlling everything leads too much worse outcomes.
Watching this after the Seul Halloween stampede.
Das war so fahrlässig, unglaublich.
This was so negligent. Unbelievable.
By blocking the flow of people, especially trying to leave just made everyone think something must be wrong and tension and emotion starts to build until fight it flight kicks in and people just made a run for it.
Improper preparation on the police's part. No-one taking responsibility of leading all parts of the operation to control the crowds. The main issue here is the influx from the west gate after they were told, wrongly, that they should open it to more visitors. If someone at the top took responsibility and monitored the entire situation, using CCTV, and info from radios in various places, they would have made the right decision. They couldn't be arsed, so that's what happened. I also don't think you can't rely on police cordons not breaking down with that many people, as it did in the tunnel on the east. When all those people are let into the general area, something bad was going to happen.
rowanationer
funny how this relates to current events in europe
german governmeny yet again trying to control the influx, only this time muslim migrants....
At the original love parades where people did whatever they wanted within reason and usually within the context of love (love for life, love for one another etc), an issue like this wouldn't have occurred. Maybe the lifespan of such events is marked by when it is impeded on by methods of control such as gates, flow predictions and large police presences?
I think that this stampede was a profound failure of police crowd control. Those 21 people are dead because of police incompetence.
A&W Rootbeer the organizers were responsible. Why they intentionally chose too small a venue is beyond explaining and criminal.
No the police aren't the main people to blame. The organizers of this event are at fault. The venue's capacity was 250k people but they had expected 1 million visitors to come. Plus there was only this ONE way (the ramp) to go in AND out!! The police set up blockades inside the two tunnels leading to the ramp because the crowds were already growing too big near the ramp. But from the entrance people kept coming and coming and at one point the police could no longer hold the crowds as there were just too many people. Besides all this, there was only this one street that lead to the venue and to the left and right there were fences set up everywhere. So from the very beginning the crowds couldn't escape anywhere. When the disaster occurred and they reported the first deaths, they opened some of the fences and the crowd could finally escape. The whole organization was a complete failure. There is a very good 50 minute long German documentary from focus about this which explains it so well.
This seems like Part One of five or six parts. It's very incomplete.
ferociousgumby you should make a more complete version. I would watch.
I would if I could get hold of some film footage.
i dont get the fact that 1,5 million people came in a area that was designed for just 350 Thousand. Was the event free or something? didnt the orginazation think about the words "SOLD" and "OUT"?
DaGrocery Love Parade was free, however they had over 1 million attendees every year so I don't know why they chosen a place that can't even hold 0.5 million.
Watching this after Berlin's love parade 2022, Crowd crush cannot easily happen here because there is a park 'Zoologischer garten' parallel to the street that lets diffuse any excess crowd buildup. such events should happen in such open places but not closed. No amount of crowd control can avoid if crowd grows sufficient enough inviting the disaster.
for years love parade had been taking place on the streets, No problems!!
why moving it to confined area with only 2 narrow entries?
why the f..ck police got involved.... taming the crowds flow....
this is exactly what happens when things are being govenered, controlled etc..
ultra1116 i agree
POLICE 100% RESPONSABLE
Whoever was in charge of those police cordenes should never be allowed to make a decision of power ever again! It was like they did it on purpose. Waiting for all 3 to get jammed pack then released them. I even knew that was a bad idea
Should‘ve just made the small ramp as an entry and the big ramp as an exit and a barrier in between of them so people can enter the festival from the east and leave from west...
What was the purpose of those police cordons? The flow of people seemed to be fine prior to those police line formations.
The police set up the cordons inside the two tunnels leading to the ramp because the crowds were already growing too big near the ramp. But from the entrance people kept coming and coming and at one point the police could no longer hold the crowds as there were just too many people. Besides all this, there was only this one street that lead to the venue and to the left and right there were fences set up everywhere. So from the very beginning the crowds couldn't escape anywhere. When the disaster occurred and they reported the first deaths, they opened some of the fences and the crowd could finally escape. The police aren't the main culprits of this. The whole organization/planning of this event was a complete failure. The venue's capacity was just 250k people but they had expected 1 million visitors to come! Plus, there was only this one way (the ramp) to go IN and OUT!! There is a very good and recent documentary from focus about this disaster which explains it so well but I think it's only available in German (sadly).
If I were in this crowd, I would probably start vomitting. Sometimes I do ok in tight spaces, but I would wanna die if I were caught in this. What I'm confused about is why, seeing this, people think that the police cordons had nothing to do with this. I can't recall any problems before they showed up. As far as I can see It, they turned the whole thing into a shit show. Maybe I'm missing something. If I am, please enlighten me
Tory Catherine i agree i wouldve gone crazy with the idea i wouldnt be able to leave the area. If they all let the people just go away this wouldnt happend. But i guess its not the officers but the one giving the commands
police over react,cause panic.were there is police presence at these events,they always end in disaster.
Dude this was a bad idea
Watching this after the Itaewon tragedy 😢
Had the cops just minded their business, they’d be fine. Someone didn’t think this through. 🤦🏻♂️
the real problem was there was too many people, they were expecting 250.000 and 1mill showed up
6mins of my life I'll never get back.
Police decked out in all black
With black berets? Are you Sure that’s the look They should have Germany?
Looks like Polizei fault. We should discontinue Polizei instead of Love Parade.
why the fuck did the police do what they did that day :/ :( :(
And the organizators wont have a punishment for the lack of security...
My friend was there, fortunately he is alive
your typical German high precision work in practice.
thank you for sharing this. my brother and sister in law were there. they escaped.
This is why intersections without traffic lights are more efficient
I found this after watching the documentary Life in a Day in my Documentary studies class and this is terrible.
The police cordons were placed way too high compared to the western and eastern first entrance, they should have put 2 first cordons at eh East and West crossroad to lighten the flux, the random factors are numerous, the people that broke the first cordon, this 3rd cordon was a complete bullshit.
The 2 first coronds were good but it needed 2 more cordons in upper positions at the coss roads to enable a consistent flux of people leaving/entering the tunnel. It works like water flux, imagine puting dams where the water flux is the strongest, it would be devastating if it comes to break, that's what unfortunately happened here :'(
Der Eingang war gleichzeitig der Ausgang 🤯
Your voice is perfect
because crowd behaves like that. if you give it any chance to doubt - for example, that all entrances are closed - it becomes mad and uncontrollable. Crowd can't stand complexity.
This crowd had its goal - it wanted to go home, but the police was on its way and did not provide it with any other alternative. And the crowd got wind of danger, and like a huge wild beast started to break the barriers, hurting itself.
How does something like this even happen. People are so dense
So....stupid happened in general. Rip to the lost individuals and my heart goes out to anybody who lost somebody or was caught in this chaos.
So it was the police that screwed up!
My claustrophobic would of been spiked
Know what you mean. Tbh I probably would not have even gone down through the tunnel, seeing how many people were going through. I don't have the worst case of claustrophobia but this triggers it even without the overcrowding.
If there hadnt been cordons, none of this would have happened. This is an example of government 'management" creating problems more problems than they solve.. We are better off with less government.
+Joey Suggs I am still not sure how this happened. Like... do people just push into each other to death or what? Like if you see there is no god damn space, where are you moving?
+Tucker Coffin What happens is each person just barely inches forward a little bit out of impatience. Kind of like cars inching forward while stopped at a red light.
The very slight push of each person gets hugely magnified by the thousands of people in the crowd. For the people in the front the total force is crushing, but the people way back in the back don't know what's going on.
+Mr. Mohagany thanks for explaining! I just found about this and your response was the best explanation I found so far, since most articles talk about a stampede but I couldn't get WHY PEOPLE WOULD DO THAT (well, also this video explained it pretty well but since English is not my first language and it's still hard for me to fully understand just by hearing, your explanation helped a a lot).
Ely G Glad it helped. Yeah some articles talk about stampedes, and it's kind of confusing. Stampede usually means getting walked on top of, like if a herd of cows ran over someone, but this is different.
In a human crowd disaster people die standing up. The pressure is so huge that they can no longer breathe. They're called 'crowd crushes'. If you sense one coming, they say to move sideways as the crowd "waves" make a momentary space. I got caught in some bad crowds before at some concerts and got crushed (not that bad though) and decided to read about it.
It also commonly happens when on a escalator... If one person stops walking down an escalator everyone behind will have the stop as well but at different times. So the people right at the back do not know what is going on before the people in front. The information basically gets delayed to those at the back when in any kind of traffic.
Even when you walk down the street if someone stops you end up treading on the back of their shoe. Imagine that person had a wall in front of them and you had 100 people behind you...
reference Newton’s first law of motion: "Objects in motion stay in motion."
Its easy to create a disaster. This excellent video summary of WHAT happened, does not explain WHY it happened.
Why would the police shut down the flow of people in an out of the venue?
Why would the police continue to allow people to flow into the entrances when they had blocked them off?
What possible good can come of this action? It is a confused desperate reckless act.
The only reason you would allow a potentially deadly crowd to build up in the entrance is if being in the venue itself was somehow MORE dangerous than the crush risk outside the venue.
It's the kind of thing you might do, if you knew some deadly terrorist device was in the venue, and you felt that people might be better off taking their chances in a crush outside the venue - a form of proactive triage that is never going to win anyone praise.
What was going on with police communications? Did each group of police know the bigger picture?
Was central command aware of what was going on in the field?
Were the access control points in communication with the main venue and the police?
But none of the above really makes sense. If you wanted to clear the venue without causing panic, you would never have allowed anyone past the access control points and just let people exit naturally.
Perhaps there was a bomb scare in the tunnel? But then why would you continue to allow people through the access control points?
Given how sloppy police fuck up investigations tend to be. Given how easy it is for field commanders to escape blame and punishment for these kind of disasters. Its hard not to conclude that the police operational commander was concomitant, or someone USED the police to give the politicians the excuse to destroy the festival.
Personally I would assume its just incompetence, rather than a conspiracy. BUT that does not make the commander's actions any less culpable. He could not have made a worse set of decisions!
This was premeditated mass murder by a police commander who did know better, or had access to experienced personal who could have told him he was making a terrible decision.
If you have a bomb threat in the crowd, you DO NOT TELL ANYONE!
This is now 12 years ago
Who's video is this? It has the stink of the Parade organizers doing all they can to blame the police.
-just sayin
W. Jason Spangler Seems like it was working effectively until the police decided to take charge of the situation.
"Just sayin"
+W. Jason Spangler
Agreed, everyone here is quick to blame the police but they were simply trying to control the flow of people so this exact situation didn't happen. It was once the police barricades dissolved that the masses started moving in.
The people only have themselves and the event organisers to blame.
+Jesse Drabble Are you seriously saying the police have no accountability when they had taken control of the situation? They set up the blockades, they saw the traffic building up and only the police could have changed that outcome, organisers and attendees would have to break the law if they took things into their own hands.
If I lock you in a box and you can't get out before you suffocate, clearly you only have yourself to blame because you didn't have the knowledge or tenacity to get out.
I agree. the police fucked this up hard. everything would have worked perfectly fine if the flow of people had just been opened
So even the fire brigade was against the placement of the blockades, yet some ppl still trying to make excuses
...or maybe someone ( goverment or ) wanted this happen for a reason to prevent future concerts by saying that large crowds like that cause fatalities. Cause how would you explain what the police did. It was a smooth flow and if its not broken dont fix it yet they interfered and couldnt even provide a decent police report.
People are genuinely like fucking ants.
Holy shit
So much pixels!
Narrarator so serious with proper names and pronunciation.. Ate up with it cordon cordon cordon..
Did the police cause this.. tragedy? How awful.
Is this was not planned i dont know what is
IT WAS A HELL PARADE
What the fuck is wrong with people? They can't stop when they see people in front of them but just keep pushing?
I wish it was that simple. Read up on past human stampedes and crushes, it's actually more complex than what many realize. Crowd control is an important public health service.
The little rinky dink astro concert bs was nothing compared to other crowd casualty incidents, all these tiktok zoomers Wana blow it up so they think they were apart of something...
@@dylanjones1286 8 people literally died, 300 were injured, not to mention all the people who will be suffering mentally from the shit they've seen and heard while they've been there. Your attitude and diviseness is extremely disrespectful to the victims, not to say disgusting, to use this very real tragedy to fuel your ego and elitisism.
@@julianschwarz56 there has been hundreds of thousands of people geting crushed together before, why I this all of the sudden a mass casualty event???
@@julianschwarz56 96 people died at a football game because of crowd crush,
I dont understand how some people died? Can somebody tell me how?
Jimmy Gudino being trampled to death
check this out: especially from minute 7:00 on you will understand.
ua-cam.com/video/9DvH1BYFVCQ/v-deo.html
Being packed in so tightly with other people, in a huge area like this, creates a lot of pressure around your body. You can't move your arms. There's no space for your lungs to even expand, so you can't breathe. Most people would've died from suffocation. Contrary to what someone might assume, people aren't "trampled to death" in these crowd scenarios, because there's no room for someone to even trample over you in the first place. You can't run, let alone take a single step.
So Sad!!! policing and organisers both seem partially to blame although i do understand planning the movement of 1mil people into a small area without incident is very hard! Rave in Peace all the 2010 paraders that never came home :(
de que fue el evento!??
De techno
It's as if they did this on purpose.
maybe nothing would had happen without police "intervention"...
My uncle was there and one of his friends was sadly one of the 21
That must have been terrifying. Am sorry for his loss.
Love is forever.
one simple but radical solution to the whole thing: every person puts other person on their shoulders then you would get twice more room horizontally and everyone can leave.
the problem is that if you're the first to climb on someones shoulder and the others don't do the same you cannot get down anymore. No more space left. So noone tries.
if you have the power to convince a crowd to do that, then you may as well make them walk out towards the exit at the same pace
The problem is in a crush situation people are literally so tightly packed together (6-7 people per square meter is generally considered a crush) that they literally have no room to move at all. That's why you get a situation like in this video where the movement of the crowd literally looks like water, because it's no longer a crowd of individuals but one big mass. That's why the most common cause of death in a crush in suffocation.
Wtf cops blocking the pucking exit.,.
Ikr? Anyone could have figured that people should have been stopped from entering, not exiting, in an enclosed area. That is the only way to diffuse a situation of overcrowding in an enclosed area. This is common sense. There is no logic to block exits and keep allowing entry.
Love was the message
Love.... what is it good for?
pink elephants and lemonade
we should learn
Crazy!
I love Techno i love music but wrong people was in the organization...this was horrible situation!! RIP Dancers!!
Ante Jelaš Dude, this was done on purpose, because these events with mass drugs were from 1985-2003 mostly... Germany was starting to be seen as a drug hole 'Love Parade' so they staged something on purpose to end the event.
+Mexuverse San So.. How long have you been wearing that tin foil hat?
SoIoCreep I heard those hats were made for theories, i guess never since it's a fact.
Just Why!?
Police make it
this is not the place
It is I am from Duisburg and know this place
beeing completly neutral..
forcing to break a cordon gives problems right?
see : 4m 41s
the cordon was the problem
After rave the planet 2022
scary
Io ero presente 😢
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LOVE parade 2010 español