For some reason I find these planing videos very therapeutic. The sound is so soothing, and the wood shavings are so satisfying. Great skill, great video!
7:05. Yep, I was yelling that at my iPad, lol. I used a marking gage on the bottom of the leg when I planed my table legs, which means the tapering point at the 3/4” end of the leg is always there to use as a transfer line after you do any taper.
If there is a better overall and as readily available woodworking teacher than Rob I would be very much surprised. Thanks for another great lesson Rob.🇺🇸👍
Hello Rob. Just found you. Read some comments where you mentioned how good it is for vets & PTSD. This is exactly why I do it. Helps keep me mellow. Thanks for dedicating you time to use on UA-cam and in the vet community. Thanks isn't enough but it's all I can do through a comment section! I'll keep watching brother!
12:05] "You have to love it when the stuff comes off like that." Rob, there are a lot of people trying to teach woodworking on UA-cam, but nobody can pull a shaving off a board like you.
Always enjoy learning your methods; using the bench as shooting board seems to simplify the process. The addition of labels on the timeline of the video is a professional touch, too.
Great conclusion to the mortise and tenon video like the idea of using the bench as a shooting board thanks for the lesson. You have to love that adjustar 21:30
Along with Mr. Sellers' "knifewall" for starting saw cuts and your method for squaring up edges by riding the plane flush to the opposite of the high side, these two tricks have made my hand tool woodworking so much better than it has ever been these past few years. Well, that and having a good bench to work on...okay, so the three things that have made my hand tool woodworking better are... And keeping my tools sharp...four things that...
Rob- Just wanted to say thank you for making such great videos. You actually show people the right tools and techniques to get good results, without unnecessary background music. By the way, I just bought my second hand plane (Wood River 5 1/2).
Excellent demonstration of that technique~! I've done tapered legs using a table saw jig, but now I definitely want to try it this way for the next time. Thank you for the inspiring video~!
the fine tip sharpies are good where a ball point would burnish the surface but a pencil won’t show. Just have to be careful when you use it because the ink does penetrate a bit on light woods. Between a carpenters pencil and mechanical, both types of sharpies, a ball point and Rob’s clever red pen trick, and chalk for rough sawn (and sketching on your concrete floor in my case) you are covered I’d say.
Another great instructional video. Thank you for leaving in the minor error of drawing in those lines too early; it makes me feel less stupid when I do things like that. Your patience and constant adjusting blade depth, as well as taking slow and deliberate passes is another "pro tip" that I find is as important as keeping the blade sharp. I used to marvel at how you adjust the cut depth "on the fly" sometimes. Then I discovered your adjuSTARs on the tools page. My arthritic thumbs hope they'll come back in stock!
That was a very nice one, and it came for me at the right moment since i'm making a desk for my son. The first technique, i had it by instinct, but the second looks to be faster and more accurate. As always a good lesson, thank you Rob. You're ability to explain and anticipate our mistakes make you a great teacher. If Canada wasn't so far from France ...
Awesome video, always love your stuff! Any suggestions for doing this on legs that are wider than your plane blade? I am trying to taper some legs for a dining table from 3” and my widest plane blade is only 2”
Rob great video. For another day but would be great to see how you deal with adding a small shelf lower down the legs. Especially when the taper is on the inside!!! Trying this and all I can think is to add a small curve from the leg taper to the shelf tenon.... Probably other methods
Very nice. I never thought you could do that taper using only the hand plane. Amazing !!! It looks faster than setting up a jig and using the table saw, but correct me if Im wrong. Greetings!
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Thank you. I think I watched the video where you went over all your planes and setup, but my TBI symptoms are flaring up my forgetfulness. Thank you for all you do with the PHP and the Team guys that have come through.
Thanks Rob, really great lesson. A couple of things: 1) I can now think of 4 techniques to do these tapers: a) table saw with a jig, b) band saw with a taper jig, c) planer / jointer with a jig, d) this ie by hand. Given you have access to all of these, which technique would you use in reality if you were making this table? 2) I’ve seen a lovely table design that has tapered legs and then they flare / curve out at the bottom. How would I do this? Thanks
I prefer to do taper legs by hand. For me its just as quick. If i did the taper on a machine i would still come back to the bench and finish by hand to remove all the mill marks. So I start and finish at the bench. If i was making say 5 or more tables at a time, i would cut on my machine but still finish by hand, but i dont do production work. Plus i hate sawdust and noise. Both are bad stuff
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Thanks for the replies. Re the outward curving leg, given that it protrudes beyond the outside dimension of the leg at the top I'm wondering if it all needs to be made from one piece with a lot of waste or the leg made from 2 pieces with the lower (curved) piece from a larger piece of stock. Does that make any sense?
At 23:00 is the plane skipping because of low spots or is the leg flexing? I can't tell but from what you've been doing I can't see how low spots could develop. ???
Well it not a low spot rather the full leg is not on a single plane since I was taking more off the top of the leg than the bottom so that "Skip" is th etransition between th etwo planes until I get it all evened oiut
Excellent video. When will the adjustars be back in stock. Got the email but didn't see it until early the next morning. Sold out already. Thanks for all the great info and tips.
I have seen one trick where once the whole thing is build put it on the floor of your shop and glue a pencil on a scrap block of wood and run that along the floor and it will show you where to cut to make it sit even. This is used by rex krueger.
Thanks for another great video! I'm sitting ay my computer table that I made with straight legs wishing that I had seen this video 6 years ago... Why did you start with the top on the first taper cut but then go to shooting board style side planning on the other edges?
Hi Rob, tapered vs straight leg aesthetics? I think it depends on the end use and the particular design/period style you're looking for. I agree that an outside taper just looks wrong, wrong, wrong.
This was an interesting and timely lesson for me, Rob. I knew I was going to need a tail vise on my bench sooner or later, but after watching your bench top shooting board technique here, I realize it’s going to have to happen sooner rather than later... very slick! And what’s with your depth adjustment knob on your plane? A star makes a lot more sense than a wheel! Is that an aftermarket mod, or is Wood River making planes with that now? I want one!!
We have been working on this for a year, first shipment sold out in 12 hours, next is due in Wednesday. Fits all Woodriver planes except the 3 and 4. Separate model fits LN planes. makes adjusting so easy, called the "AdjuSTAR"
It might help the view visualize what is going on while you are planing if you could put a little mark with a Sharpie or something on the side of the plane corresponding to where the blade is making contact with the wood, so the viewer can see where each pass actually begins and ends. Oh, I spoke too soon, on the other side of the plane there is a mark!
I have a question about the amount of taper. I understand that in this case the "foot" of the leg is half the width of the top, this looks well balanced for this length/width. Is there a rule of thumb to follow for taper vs lenght for say a low coffee table or a taller side or dining table? Or if the leg started really chunky for example?
If you really want to hog off wood (without a scrub plane) you can set the plane to take too heavy of a cut, to the point it would chatter. And then tilt the plane when you cut and put a heavy chamfer on one side, then the other, then turn this profile into a radius, then retract the iron a tad and cut off the radius, making it flat. You can take a huge bite when you’re not trying to engage much of the blade.
With your sharpening techniques, I'm getting pretty good performance out of my Woodriver planes. What advantages are to be gained by upgrading to the IBC blades?
The IBC blades are A2 steel tripletempered. They are a harder steel than what comes with the WR which means that the sharpeness will last a bit longer also take a few more seconds to get it to sharp. To put it in terms that easy to understand it gives about a 10-15% improvement over teh WR blades
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Thanks! I hope to make it to one of your 2022 workshops. Currently gathering the right hardware, then we'll fine-tune the software :-)
Could you make a video about making round legs with hand tools? My wife always wants furnitures with round legs, I tried once with spokeshave and hand plane and it looks really ugly. Is it possible to make round legs with hand tools?
Very cool I just got the 5 and half today based on your recommendation so I will get one of these adjusters next month thanks for all the great videos I really appreciated your work
Great video, I've used the table saw to taper legs with a cheap jig (yuck) and also a jointer (fast). I'll try this next time around. What do you do if the grain is running the other way?
You need to be careful with the technique that I propose with interlocking grain, but I wet the grain. I use this technique all of the time when shooting end grain. (basically the same thing as wonky grain.) I am careful to dry my plane and blade after the cut.
If the grain is running the other way you have cut a leg out of short grain stock and it is no good, you need the lines running more or less straight down the leg.
Instead of a ballpoint, use a Sharpie. If you draw your line quickly it won't get wet enough to soak in but still be dark enough for viewers to see. And it won't bleed unless you get some kind of solvent on it.
@@RobCosmanWoodworking As I recall I was in my shop in my bare feet (a widely recommended practice) dropping a heavy piece of hickory on my foot and crushing one of my toenails. I was on my way to tell you when that happened and got side-tracked stopping the bleeding. Sorry. :(
You did all the lines at once first out as a teaching process aid. Or that's my story anyway. I use a number 7 for the taper so there is a lot more toe to register with.
Who ever does your camera work does an amazing job. These videos would be a lot less clear and instructive without their skills, which allows us to clearly see what you are doing.
If you liked this video watch my Mortise & Tenon Video: ua-cam.com/video/O-j__IVfbeY/v-deo.html
Rob you are a true craftsman thank you for your videos and how you help our vets
its easy to take in what rob does because he explains himself so well,, cheers mr cosman for all you do.
For some reason I find these planing videos very therapeutic. The sound is so soothing, and the wood shavings are so satisfying. Great skill, great video!
It's even more relaxing when you do it yourself. That's why it is so helpful to our vets and helps with PTSD.
a well sharpened tool makes the best sound there is for a a carver or a hand working carpenter
7:05. Yep, I was yelling that at my iPad, lol. I used a marking gage on the bottom of the leg when I planed my table legs, which means the tapering point at the 3/4” end of the leg is always there to use as a transfer line after you do any taper.
That's got to be the coolest thing I ever have seen 👍👍👍
Always enjoy the step by step
Love the apron man✊👊
If there is a better overall and as readily available woodworking teacher than Rob I would be very much surprised. Thanks for another great lesson Rob.🇺🇸👍
Thanks so much for watching, liking, and commenting. You keep watching and i will keep filming
Wow! Beautiful
Thank you! 😊
Most enjoyable and informative
Myself and many others are thoroughly enjoying these more in depth videos. Please continue to make more. Cheers
keep watching, liking and commenting and I will keep filming
Hello Rob. Just found you. Read some comments where you mentioned how good it is for vets & PTSD. This is exactly why I do it. Helps keep me mellow. Thanks for dedicating you time to use on UA-cam and in the vet community. Thanks isn't enough but it's all I can do through a comment section! I'll keep watching brother!
Thank you Brian for serving your country. We appreciate you.
All your videos are great, Rob. Thanks very much for all your work.
Great instruction Rob. Love the sound of you planing and those shavings coming off.. Regards and blessings, Mark (South Africa)
Thanks as always Mark
Thanks Rob, timing is perfect
Glad to help
12:05] "You have to love it when the stuff comes off like that." Rob, there are a lot of people trying to teach woodworking on UA-cam, but nobody can pull a shaving off a board like you.
Really liking these videos Rob & team. Very helpful instruction.
Thnaks for watching
A very good video with super detail and good clarification. The MDF trick was super and I will start using it today.
Its a great trick
Nice!
I appreciate all the videos, especially these that focus on hand techniques.
Thanks. Keep watch and please shate the videos with others
Always enjoy learning your methods; using the bench as shooting board seems to simplify the process. The addition of labels on the timeline of the video is a professional touch, too.
This is the first video we tried those labels. Thanks for giving us feedback on them
Thanks 👍, enjoy watching you!!! Take care!!!
Thanks, you too!
Thanks for more great content.
Great conclusion to the mortise and tenon video like the idea of using the bench as a shooting board thanks for the lesson. You have to love that adjustar 21:30
I do. Thanks for watching the videos. Glad you found it helpful
Along with Mr. Sellers' "knifewall" for starting saw cuts and your method for squaring up edges by riding the plane flush to the opposite of the high side, these two tricks have made my hand tool woodworking so much better than it has ever been these past few years. Well, that and having a good bench to work on...okay, so the three things that have made my hand tool woodworking better are...
And keeping my tools sharp...four things that...
Sound lik eyou are off to teh races. Great job. Keep watching
Now that was WAY COOL!!!!😎
Glad you liked it
What's with setting the plane down on the blade?
I've always wondered how to do a tapered leg by hand. It seems so obvious now, but Rob always makes it so...common-sensical.
Thanks for showing this video very informative
thanks for watching
I always wondered how this was done with out a table saw and jigs. Great video. Thanks.👍
You bet. Thnaks for watching
Great video. Not a bandsaw or table saw in sight and loving the way the plane cuts, producing nice rolls of shavings.
This one is unplugged, and i think easier, quicker, and certainly a better finish than plugged in woodworking
Thank you for all your helpful videos. I don't really care for tapering by hand, but I sure loved the idea of using the bench as a shooting board!
There is a lot of applications for that technique
I just did this with hand planes and my legs look Fantastic!!!
Way to go....you have to love what a plane does to wood.
@@RobCosmanWoodworking I'm officially against sandpaper!
Rob- Just wanted to say thank you for making such great videos. You actually show people the right tools and techniques to get good results, without unnecessary background music. By the way, I just bought my second hand plane (Wood River 5 1/2).
Such a nice plane. Thnaks for the comment
Great video. Thanks a lot for sharing all that knowledge!
Thanks for watching. Please share this video with your fellow woodworkers
Nice work love it!
Thank you! Cheers!
Rob, this was an excellent video! Thanks!
Thnaks for watching
Great class. Thank you!
You're very welcome!
Excellent demonstration of that technique~! I've done tapered legs using a table saw jig, but now I definitely want to try it this way for the next time.
Thank you for the inspiring video~!
Go for it!
Great tips once again.
Glad you liked it
Great. Very informative when you take the work to this detailed level. Thanks.
Paying attention to the detail is they way you take your work to the next level
the fine tip sharpies are good where a ball point would burnish the surface but a pencil won’t show. Just have to be careful when you use it because the ink does penetrate a bit on light woods. Between a carpenters pencil and mechanical, both types of sharpies, a ball point and Rob’s clever red pen trick, and chalk for rough sawn (and sketching on your concrete floor in my case) you are covered I’d say.
Slightly over complicated methods but a true sight to see a well done leg! ☻
Another great instructional video. Thank you for leaving in the minor error of drawing in those lines too early; it makes me feel less stupid when I do things like that. Your patience and constant adjusting blade depth, as well as taking slow and deliberate passes is another "pro tip" that I find is as important as keeping the blade sharp. I used to marvel at how you adjust the cut depth "on the fly" sometimes. Then I discovered your adjuSTARs on the tools page. My arthritic thumbs hope they'll come back in stock!
We dont air brush (edit) out mistakes. I think you can learn more from my mistakes than my successess. Adjustars back in stock in 2 weeks
That was a very nice one, and it came for me at the right moment since i'm making a desk for my son.
The first technique, i had it by instinct, but the second looks to be faster and more accurate.
As always a good lesson, thank you Rob. You're ability to explain and anticipate our mistakes make you a great teacher.
If Canada wasn't so far from France ...
Its just a plane ride away. Come join us for a training the hand workshop!
Awesome video, always love your stuff! Any suggestions for doing this on legs that are wider than your plane blade? I am trying to taper some legs for a dining table from 3” and my widest plane blade is only 2”
great tips and well timed for me, I was planning or figuring this out for my next project.
Glad it was helpful!
Having a mark on the side of your plane body as a visual reference for where your blade protrudes is such a simple yet genius idea
well I dont know about genius...but it is very useful
Rob great video. For another day but would be great to see how you deal with adding a small shelf lower down the legs. Especially when the taper is on the inside!!! Trying this and all I can think is to add a small curve from the leg taper to the shelf tenon.... Probably other methods
I think i would probably do an outside taper only and do small through wedged tenons
@@RobCosmanWoodworking probably a smarter approach, the legs are square at this point so I have some time to reconsider!!! Cheers
Rob would you have considered using your #8 jointer for that operation
What about a sharpie reference on the side of the plane to maintain a reference start point?
Could you also add a small bead to the outward facing sides?
sure
Great timing on this video!! I’m planning on building my own dinning room table and wanted to taper the legs but was kind of hesitant about it.
We knew that , so we made you this video
Would a spokeshave or drawknife work or would you advise no? And if you wanted curve or a round leg and have no lathe
A really useful technique, is there any reason not to use the bench as a shooting board for all four faces?
Youabsolutely can, I was just showing multiple techniques. I use the shooting method for all four faces
Very nice. I never thought you could do that taper using only the hand plane. Amazing !!! It looks faster than setting up a jig and using the table saw, but correct me if Im wrong. Greetings!
You are right. There are lots of things faster with hand tools than power tools.
Have you ever planed the edges producing a rotated square at the bottom or would that just look "off"?
I am not sure what you mean by rotated square?
Sorry did you say what size plane is best for this
Anyone know what plane he is using? I have a couple of cheapies, but I think it is time to upgrade. Thanks Rob, amazing content as always.
I'm fairly certain, the plane is Rob's favorite Woodriver 5 1/2 with an IBC blade, which is available on his site
@@sueb4154 Thanks, will hit up the site and check it out. Thank you again for replying.
Sue B is on it. My woodriver 5-1/2. My goto plane
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Thank you. I think I watched the video where you went over all your planes and setup, but my TBI symptoms are flaring up my forgetfulness. Thank you for all you do with the PHP and the Team guys that have come through.
This always looks easy on white pine. I had to taper some european Beech legs with difficult grain and that was quite a pain.
Interested to know how many times you sharpened the plane blade to get through all 4 sides.
just one, cutting pine like that I would expect at least an hour of planing.
Thanks Rob, really great lesson.
A couple of things:
1) I can now think of 4 techniques to do these tapers: a) table saw with a jig, b) band saw with a taper jig, c) planer / jointer with a jig, d) this ie by hand. Given you have access to all of these, which technique would you use in reality if you were making this table?
2) I’ve seen a lovely table design that has tapered legs and then they flare / curve out at the bottom. How would I do this?
Thanks
I prefer to do taper legs by hand. For me its just as quick. If i did the taper on a machine i would still come back to the bench and finish by hand to remove all the mill marks. So I start and finish at the bench. If i was making say 5 or more tables at a time, i would cut on my machine but still finish by hand, but i dont do production work. Plus i hate sawdust and noise. Both are bad stuff
For you second question i have not done that, but i would just lay it out then cut by hand. If i curved it i would reach for my spokeshave.
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Thanks for the replies. Re the outward curving leg, given that it protrudes beyond the outside dimension of the leg at the top I'm wondering if it all needs to be made from one piece with a lot of waste or the leg made from 2 pieces with the lower (curved) piece from a larger piece of stock. Does that make any sense?
At 23:00 is the plane skipping because of low spots or is the leg flexing? I can't tell but from what you've been doing I can't see how low spots could develop. ???
Well it not a low spot rather the full leg is not on a single plane since I was taking more off the top of the leg than the bottom so that "Skip" is th etransition between th etwo planes until I get it all evened oiut
Excellent video. When will the adjustars be back in stock. Got the email but didn't see it until early the next morning. Sold out already. Thanks for all the great info and tips.
This week
Very informative. How do you make sure the legs will sit flat on the floor?
Good question! But that is for another video...
I have seen one trick where once the whole thing is build put it on the floor of your shop and glue a pencil on a scrap block of wood and run that along the floor and it will show you where to cut to make it sit even. This is used by rex krueger.
Thanks for another great video! I'm sitting ay my computer table that I made with straight legs wishing that I had seen this video 6 years ago... Why did you start with the top on the first taper cut but then go to shooting board style side planning on the other edges?
Just to show two different techniques.
Гениально! Thanks!
Thnaks for watching
Hi Rob, tapered vs straight leg aesthetics? I think it depends on the end use and the particular design/period style you're looking for. I agree that an outside taper just looks wrong, wrong, wrong.
I am partial to the shaker style so I like tapers....
Hello Rob thanks for your lessons.
Can you tell me how many hours do you need to build table like that?
That one has no drawers so for me Its a 2 or 3 day build
@@RobCosmanWoodworking thanks for the answer.
This was an interesting and timely lesson for me, Rob. I knew I was going to need a tail vise on my bench sooner or later, but after watching your bench top shooting board technique here, I realize it’s going to have to happen sooner rather than later... very slick! And what’s with your depth adjustment knob on your plane? A star makes a lot more sense than a wheel! Is that an aftermarket mod, or is Wood River making planes with that now? I want one!!
We have been working on this for a year, first shipment sold out in 12 hours, next is due in Wednesday. Fits all Woodriver planes except the 3 and 4. Separate model fits LN planes. makes adjusting so easy, called the "AdjuSTAR"
It might help the view visualize what is going on while you are planing if you could put a little mark with a Sharpie or something on the side of the plane corresponding to where the blade is making contact with the wood, so the viewer can see where each pass actually begins and ends. Oh, I spoke too soon, on the other side of the plane there is a mark!
I have a question about the amount of taper. I understand that in this case the "foot" of the leg is half the width of the top, this looks well balanced for this length/width. Is there a rule of thumb to follow for taper vs lenght for say a low coffee table or a taller side or dining table? Or if the leg started really chunky for example?
I just follow my eye. A good starting point is half the thickness. But follow your eye
If you really want to hog off wood (without a scrub plane) you can set the plane to take too heavy of a cut, to the point it would chatter. And then tilt the plane when you cut and put a heavy chamfer on one side, then the other, then turn this profile into a radius, then retract the iron a tad and cut off the radius, making it flat. You can take a huge bite when you’re not trying to engage much of the blade.
The same approach you would use to chisel it if you had no plane
With your sharpening techniques, I'm getting pretty good performance out of my Woodriver planes. What advantages are to be gained by upgrading to the IBC blades?
The IBC blades are A2 steel tripletempered. They are a harder steel than what comes with the WR which means that the sharpeness will last a bit longer also take a few more seconds to get it to sharp. To put it in terms that easy to understand it gives about a 10-15% improvement over teh WR blades
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Thanks! I hope to make it to one of your 2022 workshops. Currently gathering the right hardware, then we'll fine-tune the software :-)
Could you make a video about making round legs with hand tools? My wife always wants furnitures with round legs, I tried once with spokeshave and hand plane and it looks really ugly. Is it possible to make round legs with hand tools?
We have alreday done one. Check it out here: ua-cam.com/video/5n-2LFJKevg/v-deo.html
Wenlong Shen: If you mean using planes only, check this out:
ua-cam.com/video/VqGq-3vM48E/v-deo.html
Why not bandsaw most of the waste?
Is it just me or is the advancement screw like a star shape on his plane
Those are our new AdjuSTARs. robcosman.com/collections/planes/products/rob-cosman-plane-adjustar
Very cool I just got the 5 and half today based on your recommendation so I will get one of these adjusters next month thanks for all the great videos I really appreciated your work
Great video, I've used the table saw to taper legs with a cheap jig (yuck) and also a jointer (fast). I'll try this next time around.
What do you do if the grain is running the other way?
Even if you do the taper on a machine finish with a hand plane...Your surface will be so much nicer
You need to be careful with the technique that I propose with interlocking grain, but I wet the grain. I use this technique all of the time when shooting end grain. (basically the same thing as wonky grain.) I am careful to dry my plane and blade after the cut.
If the grain is running the other way you have cut a leg out of short grain stock and it is no good, you need the lines running more or less straight down the leg.
Why not use a knife line? Not necessary? Thanks for the videos
You could but a taper is not sp precise that a knife line is needed, but feel free to use it
Instead of a ballpoint, use a Sharpie. If you draw your line quickly it won't get wet enough to soak in but still be dark enough for viewers to see. And it won't bleed unless you get some kind of solvent on it.
Where were you when I needed that info?????
@@RobCosmanWoodworking As I recall I was in my shop in my bare feet (a widely recommended practice) dropping a heavy piece of hickory on my foot and crushing one of my toenails. I was on my way to tell you when that happened and got side-tracked stopping the bleeding. Sorry. :(
You did all the lines at once first out as a teaching process aid. Or that's my story anyway.
I use a number 7 for the taper so there is a lot more toe to register with.
The 7 is a good choice for this
If ink was such a problem then why stick with it instead of using a pencil?
Would you taper legs for a workbench?
No, I want them looking tough.
Who ever does your camera work does an amazing job. These videos would be a lot less clear and instructive without their skills, which allows us to clearly see what you are doing.
Its my son Jake
🤗🤗🤗🔝🔝💪
Thnaks for the first comment
@@RobCosmanWoodworking Grazie a voi! Vi seguo sempre😃😃🔝💪
👍🏼🙂
Thanks
square legs makes it look more like a shop table...LOL
Yea..very clunky
are you purposely making mistakes to teach us how to correct?
yes, I like that comment. How nice of me!
zz