How this Pokemon Ruined Competitive Play
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- Опубліковано 26 вер 2024
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Urshifu is one of the strongest Pokemon - but is it too strong? Is it ruining the game?
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U forgot that its also in a pay Wall both swsh and sv
I could have sworn there was a move called counter… i think it should really make a comeback to survive this…
Off topic but I think unseen fist should be change to have a 50% chance to hit throw protect and if it dose it will do a quarter or half the damage.
If I was a game freak dev, I’d make a move called “slip” it’d be a ghost type move that would make all moves have a 75% chance to miss, except for OHKO moves, where doubles the accuracy on them landing when used.
So. Could sableye be a strong counter to tornatist? Because from what it looks like, there kit is EXTREMELY versatile. Especially the fact it's a dark type with prankster and taunt. Or if your a clown disable or switcheroo. Prankster disable is really funny what can I say. I know they won't disable the Kung fu bear but they so have a fairly deadly kit of strong support and control moves. Hell it even has quash, which isn't amazing but still really strong. Yes grimsnarl also has a good kit and is dark type, but doesn't have immunity to fake out.
Gen 10 will introduce a Pokemon with an ability that will negate any and all damage. It will be the immovable object to Urshifu's unstoppable force.
If Gen 10 removes terastalization, they can just bring back Shedinja :P
@@chosone2shedninja is weak to urshifu dark
Crits ignore abilities I think
Edit:
Okay they *definitely* don't that's one hell of a comment chain on my stupidity!
@@Fritz_Haarmann you think wrong
@@Fritz_Haarmann where’d you get that idea from 💀
They really need to nerf the Unseen Fist ability, not only does it hit through Protect and Screens, it even hits through video screens
i thought it was my own fist from the pain of meeting kungfu panda, but yes i like this better
It hits through SCREENS?!!! Jesus Christ this makes so much sense
Honestly urshifu is waaaaay more managable now than it was at the start
Unseen Fist needs giving the Gale Wings treatment
@@michaeltrinidad5825 Technically not Unseen Fist itself but their signature move Surging Strike/Wicked Blow has a 100% crit rate and crits bypass screens and def boosts/ atk drops.
Honestly if Protect at least reduced the damage taken to 50% or less then Unseen Fist would be less stupid.
Something I want that might be good is a change to Detect. Instead of functioning like Protect, Detect should guarantee a miss. This, alongside wider distribution, could effectively allow some counterplay against Unseen Fist. Plus, it would have counterplay itself, as sure-hit moves like aerial ace will hit regardless.
It could also lead to an interesting buff for the ability Keen Eye, which allows the user to bypass detect. Since a lot of the zero miss moves are terrible.
this is an awesome idea
thats a fire buff, i love that
Urshifu learns Detect T.T
I like This. And would be an interesting counter to high damage moves like high jump kick
Urshifu in competitive is like that one friend who plays Monopoly too seriously. Suddenly, it's not just a game, it's war
This comment cracked me up 😂
wait so when you tryna rank in on9 battle we can't take it seriously?
Monopoly with Real Money
How the holy fuck do you have 6M sub im 99.99% sure you bought thr channel or subs are bots
well, if there was real money involved in monopoly i'm sure they all would play like this...
Never forget Wolfey’s first reaction to Urshifu was “I hope this thing’s not legal”
Where did he say that?
@@eeveewithcoffee9554 in the video when he first went over the new isle of armor Pokémon back in 2020
It is a real shame they got rid of Lucky Chant in the generation where it could have been a legitimate tech option.
I just checked, they got rid of it in the 8th gen... I wonder why would they do that so cassually right before releasing a 30USD pokemon that always crit through protect...
@francotrevino8755 you say that as though they didn't get rid of like 78 other moves
@@chitorunyadoesnt really change the fact that they did remove the move...
@@chitorunya I know, I just wouldn't put it past them to do some shit like that on purpose
@@chitorunyathey got rid of moves that are either Pursuit and HP, or just generally not used at all, why animate something that’s not gonna be used in any situation, and also are Z-Moves, self explanatory
I think an interesting way to nerf Unseen Fist is to add recoil when hitting through Protect, almost like it has put so much effort into breaking Protect that it hurts
Yeah but make it either 1 to 1 recoil damage then or make each of the Hits drop Urshifuu's attack
@@BusinessSkrubthat wouldn’t matter since their moves crit, I think recoil would be a better option
i just use weezing and cna protect again
I like the idea of the move coming at a life orb cost
@@BusinessSkrubthat still wouldn’t work tho cuz it’s signature moves always crit
Oh no, Urshifu punched through my phone screen.
He goes through the screen protector :(
It goes through protection too 💀
@C0NSuWuMa
It’s so annoying when it does that! This the third time this week!
OH NO! HE'S GOTTEN IN MY PANTRY! OH SWEET ARCEUS HE'S WICKED BLOWING ALL THE HONEY POTS!
I got punched by urshifu through the screen and I'm currently in the hospital now
*Fun Fact:* In Diamond & Pearl, No Guard had "reverse accuracy" against a Pokémon using Protect, causing the move's initial _miss_ chance to be a chance to bypass it. A move with 80% accuracy would have a 20% chance to hit through Protect, 90% accuracy would hit 10% of the time, etc. Platinum fixed this though, so it was definitely unintended.
Dinamic punch be like
I kinda wish they kept that it's hysterical
Focus miss becomes viable
Something funny I found out that if Urshifu holds a Punching Glove, it’s ability becomes worthless since all physical moves don’t make contact when the item is held. Yeah it has a boost for punching moves, but it can’t hit through protect anymore.
maybe a strategy with trick/switcheroo could work
It can still hit through Protect with non-puncing contact moves like Aqua Jet and Close Combat which can at lest be slowed down with Reflect and Intimidate.
Now Protective Pads removes the contact effect from moves done by the user without any other benefit. It has more uses in Singles as Protect is significantly less common.
Protective Pads do not prevent Unseen Fist from hitting through protection according to Bulbapedia.@@TheOtherNeutrino
@@TheOtherNeutrino
I'm not sure if I'm understanding the phrasing of the second part of your comment
Are you implying that Protective Pads entirely negate the contact aspect of contact moves, and as a result would cancel out Unseen Fist?
Because they don't
Aside from the fact Bulbapedia says as much on both Unseen Fist's and Protective Pad's pages, I even tested it out myself in Shield literally before making this reply
Protective Pads negate any negative consequences from contact attacks like triggering Static, Flame Body, Iron Barbs/Rough Skin, Rocky Helmet, etc., but Unseen Fist still functions
I think the fact its signature move always crits is a real silent killer as well, cuz it doesn’t even matter if you have raised defenses, so only burn slows down
Don´t crits also ignore burn halving the physical damage?
@@RandomDudeOnTheInternet06
Nope. Burns don’t reduce stats, but instead the the base power of physical moves, so crit doesn’t fix it.
burn used to half the stat but it was fairly recently changed to hit the base power of the move and leave the stat unchanged
And Wo Chien
@@rpgkingx3629 And also Friend Guard. But Tablets of Ruin and Friend Guard are pretty meager damage reduction tools in practice (though quite potent on paper).
That point about strength is really interesting. Yeah sure you're not the strongest, but if you can literally cheat the system or ignore the glue that holds it together and get away with it AND receive 0 draw backs for it *AND* are still very strong, you kinda hold the game in your hands. It's like if the 10th best basketball player got to just run with the ball like a football player. There are better options and possible counterplay but the game now centralizes around them.
Golden State Warriors / Dame Lillard's effect on the NBA is a great example. Fundamentals are dope and so is dunking, but 3 > 2.
I think Shedinja is is the perfect example of the prices you should pay for cheating base systems.
@@hamdepaf6686Totally agree. Wonder Guard is a fantastic ability but it's on a Pokemon that has 1 HP, meaning it dies to any hazard without precautions like Saftey Goggles or Heavy Duty Boots. Not to mention Bug/Ghost isn't the pinnacle of defensive typing. As a comparison to what Urshifu is doing, say Wonder Guard was given to a Pokemon with minimal weaknesses powerful tools, and a real HP stat. Mold Breaker basically becomes a necessity.
It's feels like having a legendary pokemon catch rally with your friends to see who catch legendary pokemon faster but you have master ball in hands.
@@castform7 Imagine if Mold Breaker let you click Protect against Urshifu. Fire Ogerpon suddenly shoots up in use despite having an unfavorable type matchup.
5:07 So right here, as soon as Urshifu opened it's eyes, I got an ad with someone busting through a wall
Perfect metaphor for what's to come
Do you remember what the ad was for?
@@SirHugsalot13th The NFL kickoff or something along those lines
3:33 Actually, future sight was the first instance of a move ignoring protect, which would be followed by doom desire, feint, shadow force, and phantom force.
Dont think its ignoring protect, it just hit after the turn (like when you are hit by fire spin or syphoon even if you protect after you will take the damage at th end of turn)
@@rizzaiilecheum9655 no, if you protect on the turn it hits it goes through
24:42 did he say Koffing????
I feel like Unseen Fist taking a nerf could be the easiest answer. If moves did half damage, maybe even down to quarter damage, Protect might still feel worth clicking
In doubles maybe but in singles it's still as broken, you protect and take less damage; leftovers wont be close to enough to help you live next turn when you can't protect
@@DIRTkat_ofcwho the hell runs protect in singles other than big stall
I’d also would think nerfing Surging strikes and Wicked blow would also be a good idea. Being able to ignore any stat detriments and deal 50% more because of the guaranteed crit plus unseen Fist is just way to much all at once. Add in making Unseen fist not ignore the secondary effects of the special protects like kings shield and Burning balwark would also help make Urshifu not the end all be all options.
Also making unique sprites for each form, like there unique sprites for damn near every different form there’s no excuse as to why Urshifu just used the same sprites despite both forms looking different
@@leftistdegeneratejsGliscor comes to mind right off the bat. The move isn't anywhere near as powerful as it is in doubles but it's still a good option for scouting and gaining lefties
@@leftistdegeneratejs a lot of things, mainly mons that need at least one turn for item or ability; like gliscor, ursaluna, blaziken, a lot of support mons as well like wish passing mons, dunno; a lot of things really
Worst part is 99% of the time they don't do balance patches (except for lowering stats of ruinous quarter) so even if they accidentally made smth broken, they wouldn't nerf it until the next gen as we saw with Zacian. Expect to see some big nerfs to Urshifu in Gen10 in case it returns again.
Could they do a similar thing as they did with Intrepid Sword/ Dauntless Shield and Protein type abilities where Unseen Fist only hits through Protect for the first move used while Urshifu is out, maybe resetting after switching out like Protein? It could help Urshifu become more predictable and awkward to use since it'd need to be switched around which could mess with positioning. I'm not a competitive player so idk how effective a change like this would be.
@@Alola_love7119 the most proposed change for the ability is hitting through protecting moves every time & have a damage reduction similar to Z-moves & Dmax attacks but your idea could also work.
Honestly, the lack of balance patches keeps me from playing most rule sets.
Any pokemon over 20% usage should be investigated. VGC frequently has pokemons over 50% usage.
I severely doubt it, it was busted in gen 8 and it continued being busted in gen 9. it'll then remain busted to continue acting as an unsubtle nudge to go "hey, buy that other game and dlc to compete"
That and gamefreak has historically done the bare minimum in regards to caring about balance in general only occasionally doing quick bandaid solutions or the one time they did extremely minor stat buffs to weak mons that would remain still just as weak(well ok nidoking appreciated the little boost but it was already fairly ok) after. heck vgc only officially exists because it's a minimal effort format to maintain with a ruleset based primarily on getting a bunch of nerds in and out of the venue as quickly as possible above all else.
@@FlavioVSLeal Well the game wasn't exactly designed for balance or competitive... It's a kids game.
I only really play Showdown right now, but the game definitely changes whenever Urshifu hits the field. I can feel the strategy leaving my body as I mash attack moves because protecting has the chance to just lose me the game.
So true😭😭😭😭😭😭
It's really disturbing that the only 100% counter to Urshifu is Speed-Booster Flutter Mane.
You know, broken thing #2.
@@bluebaron6811I found that part funny the best counters are flutter broken and iron hands
@@bluebaron6811then it Tera Poison to resist fairy and fight
@@bluebaron6811
The thing is that isn’t even a good counter lol. Urshifu always Tera’s and Flutter Mane can’t OHKO Urshifu without an attack boost, while Urshifu has no issue destroying Flutter Mane. It should also be added that rain boosted Tera water aqua jet will OHKO Flutter Mane.
The only Flutter Mane that reliably beat Urshifu are the Tera grass version, but Tera Grass energy ball actually doesn’t OHKO most Urshifu without specs.
For anyone who doesn't know, the correct terminology for this sort of effect Urshifu has of the metagame is called _format warping_ . Urshifu is probably one of the biggest format warpers VGC has seen outside of restricted formats. A format warper doesn't necessarily need to be the strongest, but it denies certain core gameplay mechanics to an extent that every team needs to account for it. A similar issue is present in 6v6 singles this gen with Gholdengo, who isn't necessarily the strongest pokemon in terms of power, but has a similar format warping behavior by making it near unviable to remove entry hazards from the field.
(this is not the correct terminology)
Well i think urshifu is the biggst format wrapper in all of vgc even if you include restricted pokemon. Excepy Maybe mega rayguaza who got mega evo without using mega stone.
For those unfamiliar with why exactly Gholdengo is an issue in Singles, switching is much more common in those formats than in VGC, being the most reliable defensive maneuver in the format for a large variety of reasons. This in turn makes entry hazards much more useful than in Doubles, to the point that being weak to Stealth Rock alone can be a massive blow to a Pokemon's viability, and that those that can remove hazards effectively are an entire highly valuable role of their own.
However, there are only five moves at the moment that can actually remove hazards from the field, and three of them (the widespread Defog and Rapid Spin, and Glimmora's signature Mortal Spin) are programmed in such a way that the user must hit the other Pokemon with the move for the effect to take place (in the Spins case it's programmed as a secondary effect, but I honestly have no idea how or why Defog works that way).
Gholdengo is a Steel/Ghost type, which renders it immune to both Rapid and Mortal Spin, and it has the ability Good as Gold, which protects it from ALL status moves, including Defog. This means that for as long as it's on the field and doesn't choose to Tera into a different type, the only Pokemon that can remove hazards at all are: Mold Breaker Hawlucha, Neutralizing Gas Galarian Weezing, Court Change Cinderace, and three Raticate-tier Normal types with Tidy Up.
"Hold my beer while me and Urshifu win a regional to demonstrate."
Another problem is Urshifu is just bulky enough to be problematic. With the right EV’s, it can live common super effective moves like Rillaboom Grassy Glide, Flutter Mane Thunder bolt, and Iron Hands Wild Charge after an intimidate.
Meanwhile Choice Band Flower Trick:
@@MorrisPXG Meanwhile Close Combat in Tailwind.
@@Endershock1678Who tf is using Tailwind in singles?
@@LittleBigPlanetianthis is a doubles format (iron hands isn't relevant in singles)
@@LittleBigPlanetian
Who tf is using Meowscarada in Ubers?
To give a slightly better analogy than having something like two moves in a row in chess:
Imagine your queen could "go around" vertically or laterally adjacent enemy pawns with a knight move when applicable.
Ofc this would be busted, hence why "Queen jumps on her horse in front of the pawns" will be available as a DLC for 30$.
Technically speaking, Hoopa woud have been the first pokemon to do what urshifu does, albiet to a lesser extent (they do bypass substitutes as well, but its tied to a move instead of an ability), but being a mythical probably keeps it out of VGC relevancy.
That and it’s stats and typing aren’t quite broken enough for doubles, even if it wasn’t already banned due to being a mythical
Feint was also a thing.
and unlike Urshifu, one Knock Off (Bound form) and one U-Turn (Unbound form) is gonna send Hoopa to the cemetery
@@jotarokujo3603 And Shadow Force.
it had two of the worst weaknesses in competitive tho: bad speed and shit defensive typing
It’s funny that Wolfe released this the day he won a Tournament using Urshifu Rapid Strike
he hates on certain pokémon but not using them is a self made resitriction that makes the game unfavourable by your own design. See: Incineroar lol
He's proving his own point lol
You either let Urshifu steamroll you, or you bring your own Urshifu and hope to steamroll them first.
It's funny that gen 9 urshifu W is so strong in vgc because rapid strikes hit 3 times when in gen 8 singles is was allowed to remain in OU bacause if got utterly wrecked by iron barb ferrothorn, rocky helmet or rough skin garchomp for the same reason, and it's item of choice was protective pads because of that.
It's still popular in OU nowadays, and even though protect isn't as common in 6v6 formats, he's still going to be hard to stop. Sleep just got banned lel.
@@GreyPunkWolf pretty sure he's banned in current gen OU, it's too messed up with tera
I can’t imagine either doing well in Ubers with Flutter Mane and Miraidon running around.
@alexandrelima2766 Oh. Didn't know that, I just play vgc now.
@@GreyPunkWolfYeah Tera and the addition of Swords Dance pushed it too far.
Single Strike was as broken then and now even with Wicked Blow's small nerf.
Its pretty worrying that most of the Urshifu counterplays you listed also work as Urshifu partners. This is why we have Urshifu vs Urshifu meta right now
for me, running weezing is like a given to get rid of all these ability spammers
I'm a wheeezing fan boi as well ✌️❤️
Yeah it’s like, you’d probably wanna bring amoonguss or Rillaboom or iron hands anyway, so it just further centralizes the meta as those mons also enjoy urshifu being in the match.
Now I'm waiting for:" How I got 1st in the world with Spidops"
I do apprciate the use of Mustards battle music in the backround because he is the one who gifts us this wonderful Kung Fu bear lol
I did a school presentation about the best Pokemon in competitive, and I sited some of your videos as a source (with time stamps and links). Apparently, my presentation was the best of the class, my teacher even congratulated me after giving me the grade. Moral of the story; if you need to make a presentation at 2am, just talk about something you like
One thing i can say about Urshifu is it had shown me how important and fun Counterplay is. I'd often throw out Chandelure against it, and when my opponents mindlessly click Surging strikes, the Grass Tera boosted Energy Ball usually KOs it immediately after, thanks in part to Absorb Bulb boosting my Special Attack.
I don't know how effective it may be in higher level play, but in more casual play its an effective counter against Rapid Strikes Urshifu, even with Water Tera or in the rain.
Every time, I think of the TerminalMontage Gigantamax Pokémon Battle Royale…
*Lapras uses protect*
Urshifu- “You fool! YOU FOOL!!” 😂
why did my boy spidops catch so many strays 😭😭😭😭
Cuz he’s ugly
Because it is ugly and weak, yeah !!! thats what you get 🫵🫵🫵🫵😂😂😂😂
Justice for the spider man!
I don't know why he didn't remember it, as Silk Trap is the best iteration of protect (even better than Spiky Shield and the recently added Burning Bulwark). I run it on my Smeargle so sometimes it helps me outspeed and go for a Spore🤣
Now hold on! Baddy Bad is meta defining and you know it, Wolfe.
Its meta defining in our hearts
@@IschmarVI it's all the buzzy buzz.
🎉WE LOVE SPIDOPS🎉 3:26
I really love that he post this video and then a day later wins Charlotte regional using Urshifu
Well that proves his point.
I love the list of moves you gave as examples of moves that make contact. Like, I guarantee you Sucker Punch isn’t hitting through protect for other reasons. :P
You just have to believe strongly enough, then it eventually will!
Urshifu is one of the bigger reasons I haven’t really touched competitive at all during this generation
The first 9 months (regulations a-c) were totally fine. It was only after Urshifu was allowed back in with regulation D that it caused a problem.
Yea i noticed day one after the dlc that urshifu was BUSTED
The addition of Incineroar, Rillaboom, Urhsifu has made the game so boring for me now
I mean, smogon is always an option if you don't Like what is happening in VGC. Heck, smogon Has it's own doubles format too if you only like double battles.
You have months to play without urshifu
"The final nail in the Koffing"
That reminds me. Would Galarian Weezing be viable to counter Urshifu in some way?
Not really, whoever is covering for Weezing usually ends up getting smacked to oblivion regardless.
@@cadetjones9205 it does threaten a burn with will o though so that's something atleast
i am currently leading fluttermane weezing or iron hands weezing against urshifus great effect. so for me, yes (Masterball rank 5k)
I just thought it was a jab a Smogon University/Pokémon Showdown, given the name origin of Smogon.
Then you are playing a very dangerous game of "should i bring the weezing" against urshifu teams. If they didnt bring their urshifu, weezing's pretty fucked.
"final nail in the koffing"
Cofagrius - "am i joke to you?"
Maybe pokemon that are immune to crits should be immune to always-crit moves.
_(Battle Armor / Shell Armor and Lucky Chant)_
They are, actually. That's why Hisuian Goodra got usage early on in Regulation D. It's just that Hisuian Goodra has a bunch of other problems.
@@haydeniskander5306
No, I mean it would deal no damage at all. Like with Gastrodon's Storm Drain.
@@manguy01 Oh, I see. Yeah, I've actually thought about this. Making them immune to moves with inherent enhanced critical-hit properties. Not just auto-crits like Surging Strikes or Wicked Blow, but also moves like Ivy Cudgel, Aqua Cutter, Leaf Blade, Air Cutter, etc.
@@haydeniskander5306Whatever you say, dude ; )
How bout using sunny day? Does that lower its attack even if it's a crit?
Protect is basically the dodge mechanic everyone who is obsessed with the anime wants in the game.
It’s the only way to effectively avoid damage other than using moves like Fly or Dig and getting lucky.
Urshifu: You can't stop me because I can't read or listen!
its that one admin that bans everyone they don't like and doesn't get punished for it because they own the server.
“I won the biggest tournament in Pokémon history 2: electric boogaloo”
*Coming Soon*
A single pokemon warping the metagame around it due to its synergy with the top mons and its own merits, sounds like Goldengo in singles at the moment.
Been waiting for a big name in the community to address this, every single team I build I find 60/70% of the consideration going to Urshi. I really don’t believe a meta should be so dependent on whether or not it can handle 1 Pokemon, being able to hit through protect and crit through buffs is actually insane
The entire top 20 players has both Urshifu and Flutter on their team. It's so wack
@@jarmsfirstclaw
Flutter Mane is a bit of a weird case though, because it’s less of a “this Pokémon destroys everyone”, and more of a “this Pokémon helps my team destroy everyone”.
One team that’s always popular is the balance core of fire water grass, but that core gets blocked by dragon types. As such, you need a Pokémon that can reliably deal with those. The answer is usually Flutter Mane or Chien Pao, hence why at least one of those two are always in the team. I remember in one tournament, every single team in Top 8 carried Flutter Mane, but it didn’t appear on stream even once, because they would always just bring their balance core and then either Tornadus, iron hands, or Chien Pao.
@@Endershock1678 yeah I couldn’t have said it better, coming up against flutter unprepared can be scary but even then can be outplayed, but even if you’re 100% prepared to face urshi, you can still be absolutely steam rolled by even and unskilled player
fluttermane really is the appropriate/inappropriate meme, i love fluttermane desipite it being absolutely everywhere and on nearly every team, but i hate urshifu
@@tylerjackson25 It's because when building a team, you should naturally be using pokemon that beat Flutter Mane anyways. Rillaboom, Amoongus, Iron Hands, Arcanine, Urshifu (after Tera), Ogerpon, Chein Pao, Kingambit, and so many other pokemon beat Flutter Mane 1v1. I adjust EV's for Flutter, but I've never once built a team and had to think about having multiple Flutter Mane counters because so many good pokemon beat Flutter, whereas Urshifu is on the forefront of my mind when making every team.
8:04 I like the Bakugan, Battle Brawlers theme in the background.
Okay I’m not the only one who realized that one.
The memories
@@ironuge1933 easily could have used the Ventus themes
Came here to type this exact same thing
5 water type and one dark bear is immensely hilarious
Did he just end the video with final nail in the Koffing to secretly give people the necessary counter play?
We need that monopoly looking jellyfish to make a return, he would be our only hope against urshifu rapid strike
I was also considering a return of Jellicent to combat Urshifu Rapid Strike. Sadly, a Jellicent built to counter Rapid Strike Urshifu is especially vulnerable to the Single Strike form.
Nah, we got thunder lizard now.
One Banded Thunder Punch and that thing is dead. Jellicent has literally no physical defense like at all. Countering Ursh based on its water typing is not the answer.
Well I think jellicent would have potential~
Water absorb and ghost typing make it immune to both rapid strike stabs, and it would resist U-turn.
It could also run fairy tera to resist both of single strikes stabs.
But it wouldn't be a hard solution/counter probably, just an interesting check
Urshifu stole my identity and burned my family home to the ground 😢
"competetive pokemon is only doubles" was kinda harsh
I decided to have a go at Showdown the other day, and very quickly learned that Surging Strikes is also capable of breaking a substitute with the first strike, and then still KO'ing with the remaining two. That's stupidly OP
I mean that's just a thing with multi-hit moves in general, hell, it's why they're occasionally pretty valuable, _because_ they can break a Substitute or Sturdy/Focus Sash and keep dishing out actual damage after the fact
Surging Strikes is a slightly special case, though, as it will always hit three times
Most other multi-hit moves either only hit twice, like Gear Grind and Bonemerang, or 2-5 times like Bullet Seed and Rock Blast
Y'know, excluding Abilities like Skill Link, items like Loaded Dice, or just weird niche things like Water Shuriken always hitting 3 times if used _specifically_ by Ash-Greninja
Well, the most important thing to mention is that Pokémon isn’t making the game with competitive entirely in mind (take a look at Mega Rayquaza if you want evidence), and moreso the profitable parts like marketable designs. With that being said, I do feel that some action should be taken about the general powercreep plaguing SV. Overall, I’m betting that this video will be very informative to express my points is overall better ways!
Tbf mega raquaza wasnt even that oppressing in vgc somehow, just singles
GF did nerf Zacian and the Transistor ability in SV.
i feel like bypassing protect isn't really a cool gimmick to casual players, because as wolfey said, protect nearly never comes up in a casual playthrough. urshifu might just be a fuck you to the competitive scene or some kind of twisted test how much vgc players are willing to mentally endure to get that champion bag
@@keysmash_roa Made urshifu to force comp players to pay 30 dollars to have a chance
At the very least they're aware that they need to fix their mistakes... Just.. *way* too late for it to matter much, and the fixes never really do a lot from what I remember. They nerfed Zacian, after all... But I've never been one to use it, so I don't even know how much that changed it's viability.
Things like Urshifu and eventually Zacian are why I enjoyed Series 1 the most. It didn’t feel like you had to use certain things just to have a chance at winning. You could use random stuff more reliably and still have a decent chance at winning.
"...the final nail in the Koffing." 👏👏👏
It would be instantly 10x more balanced if using protect halved the damage instead of getting ignored completely.
I know this is off topic but… your background music at 8:18 hits nostalgia hard for me.
It’s from one of my favorite wii games from my childhood. Bakugan Battle Brawlers. Idk if this music was used in any other game but that’s the one that instantly came to my mind.
Nice music choices!
I Bet one day they will give a new Pokemon a ability thats sets up trick room as soon as it hits the field 😂
I agree, I love Urshifu, the design, the details and even the fact that he breaks the protect, but deep down it's true. It's very frustrating to create a team to have fun and always have to worry about: "What if I face an urshifu, how do I do it?". It's true that I don't play competitively, I just rank for fun, but it's boring :). Very good videos and good luck with the tournaments.
É meu Pokemon favorito da Gen 5-9, então tenho sentimentos conflitantes sobre isso tbm kkkk
you can have fun in lower elos, it's peoples ego's that are the problem, you can't be the best and not abuse the meta, and every competitive game has a meta...
Urshifu animation while it using its signature moves is my intrusive thought
That's why I envy the single players.
Having a ban list not for the most used pokemons like gen 8 did, but for busted and unhealthy pokemons.
Pokemon's "balance" these past two generations surely gave a big boost to community-based unofficial formats, and that's despite the (relative) lack of clout of unofficial tournaments and the simulator's basic looks
To me, the real problem of competitive formats are Legendary pokemons. I felt this for years now.
I get it. Even with nonlegendaries broken strategies will develop. But the damage output, the sheer brokeness of abilities and signature moves of legendaries are to me whats holding back the scene. At least, have a legends free format. That would be fun for a change!
I agree. Removing legendaries from competitive would also alleviate the issue of having version exclusives that you can only get one of per save file
I feel like it should be limited to pokemon that you can always get more of through breeding or catching
So you want a Smogon OU kinda format? I don't pokemon company will ever do it properly
@@mattmanncan I dont want anything.
I just think that early formats where there aren't all the legendaries are infinitely more fun to watch and play.
Even better when there's none of them.
If you remove the strongest thing, the second strongest thing will become the new strongest thing. Banning legendary pokemon changes nothing. Especially not in the current generations where there are so many different legendaries that you get to choose from a wide variety of great legendary and non-legendary pokemon.
Urshifu on the other hand ....
Though the more abilities force the meta, the more value neutralizing gas weezing has...
Yeah, when this thing was introduced in Isle of Armor, that was where Pokemon “jumped the shark” for me. I didn’t even want to bother with gen 9 after that.
Pokémon like ferrothorn are also missing to make them think twice about clicking surging strikes.
It's so sad no one talks about Lumineon. It has storm drain like Gastrodon but can set up tailwind and slow opponents with icy wind. It doesn’t do anything against Urshifu but it enables its team mate to wreak havoc while ignoring surging strikes. Lumineon and Landorus T is such a nice lead against Urshifu and Tornadus I for example.
Lumineon is not a real pokemon lol
?@@i_like_chomp6382
What is a Lumineon?
Ouch, y'all are mean to the butterfly fish...
@@i_like_chomp6382What did Lumineon do to you? 😭
they didn't learn. iron boulder has a move that goes through protect too.
Yeah, but Iron Boulder sucks, so it’s fine.
Iron boulder has only one move that hits through protect, while urshifu hit all of its moves.
And of course, mighty cleave is only 95 BP and can be weakened by intimidate
But it doesn't auto-crit, meaning it can be slowed down by defensive boosts and Intimidate. It's also just one move, while Unseen Fist affects basically ALL of Urshifu's moves.
I love the use of the aquos stage theme from bakugan battle brawlers in the video. quite fitting
In Chess, a knight that could move twice in a row is absolutely busted. 1st jump - check
2nd jump - take the king...
Cannot believe that Wolfey used the bakugan Battle Brawlers aquos arena OST in his video
They could nerf Unseen Fist by adding a move that is flavored as an evade or parry. They can make the game even more layered with more specialized moves.
Literally the most chad move ever to release this just before winning the biggest tournament ever with Urshifu, proof this mon needs to be nerfed!
Their stances really give away what form of Urshifu they are. Single Strike Urshifu has that power stance going on, while Rapid Strike Urshifu moves around like it's drunk after drinking too much Berry Juice that was laced with alcohol. Not to mention that Single Strike Urshifu's band and knee fur is flowing and sticking up in the air like it's a Super Saiyan.
Congrats on the regional win today! It was a well played battle on both sides!
"The final nail in the coffing", what a way to end the video
Best nerf to urshifu would be that yes unseen fist can go through protect and substitute but its guaranteed crits are removed from its signiture moves.
Nah
I wouldn't do that
I rather make his ability deal 40% damage on pokemon who use protect
This. Three guaranteed crits in a row is ridiculous.
@@LAIDDN24 that's better but the crits would make up for the loss in power.
That BGM around 9:20 is awfully nostalgic 0-0
I think Urshifu should have to hold a specific item to activate its ability, similar to Zacian. So you can hit through protect if you wanna run that item, but NOT while running a Choice Band set for example
The only nerf that makes sense is nerfing the damage by 25% when he hits through it
But every gen they add more busted pokemon its best to leave it as it is
It would have been pretty funny if Urshifu was just a Kubfu holding one of the two scroll items...
@@ReidnReactnthis would work too. Would function like dynmax hitting through protect basically
urshifu is like Vergil in Marvel vs Capcom 3. EASYILY worth 3 pokemon.
For every new busted Ability, I become more and more attached to Cofagrigus and Mummy than I already am.
I miss them :,(
You can use oinkologne with lingering aroma 😉
@@AriehAnkriwhat's it's stats?
Perhaps the problem isn't the one new Pokemon that is pretty powerful that's shaking things up the past few months, but the single move that eats up more move slots than any other move by a mile which has forced the entire game in all formats to revolve around it since it was introduced 25 years ago with no exceptions. Urshifu is Game Freak's latest effort saying "It would really be nice if most Pokemon didn't only effectively have three moves and Intimidate wasn't so powerful that every top team runs it".
Protect never should have been an all-or-nothing move, it causes the same problem it's arguably trying to solve: It makes games pivot way too much on a few high-stakes hard reads. The type weakness/resistance system was always intended to be the means of rewarding/punishing anticipation of your opponent, but it is *quantitative* rewards - extra or less damage - not typically qualitative (all or nothing), with a few very narrow cases. Protect is a 25-year-old bandaid from when they were taking a balanced-for-singles game and trying to figure out how to simplify it so that it didn't completely break with doubles; it's long past time to grow doubles beyond that. The question is, how many things have to break Protect before the top players find it beneficial to leave the safety blanket behind? Apparently, still more than Urshifu.
On one hand, yes it’s busted. But on the other hand, getting a rocky helmet switch-in into an opponents surging strikes, and watching their Urshifu cancel its own subscription to life one hit at a time is a priceless gift that I would really miss if I never got to experience that again. 😂
Atleast in the indigo disk they added an semi-counter in archaludon, which stamina helps it and when its raining, it can 1-shot urshifu with electro shot, and its an not umcommon mon( semi-counter because urshifu can use close combat against it)
Stamina doesn't help that much because crits ignore the opponent stat-buffs
And pretty good counter in Raging Bolt - I mean, that mon is the sole reason why TornShifu declined so much.
Yeah, it has the slight problem of being version exclusive, one-per-savefile, locked behind 2 DLCs and two quests, one of which requires you to registrer 200 species in your Blueberry dex, but hey, it IS a great Urshifu counter and good mon in it´s own right, right?
@@janecklyn
duraludon resists surging strikes, which is the move that always crits
that said, it is weak to close combat
@@veronikamajerova4564just trade on the gts? I got like 4 the day it was available thanks to furfou trims lol
I think that, next generation, Urshifu's ability should be reduced to a once-per-battle kind of thing. It would still be decidedly strong, but it would lose effectiveness after that first moment.
Cool idea! The opponent only falls for the Unseen Fist once but after that adapts and can see it coming.
It's not just that the Urshifus are broken. Its that Rapid-Strike basically invalidates every single other offensive Water-type pokémon. It's not enough to simply nerf the pokémon: it has to make them no longer the only worthwhile option in that role. Single-Strike isn't as invalidating of a presence, but whatever nerf is given to one must be given to both.
@@haydeniskander5306why was regieleki nerfed and not regidraco? There’s no reason to nerf both if it’s not necessary
Unseen fist is very very broken but like competitive Pokemon is wild because it’s a mix of luck and skill + there are so many options, abilities, and variables
@@BusinessSkrubI guess we won’t, what was the point in this comment?
Bro posts a video about Urshifu and then the next day he proceeds to win the largest regionals of all time with it, actual GOAT
Urshifu felt inadequate when the other legendaries questioned why it should count so overcompensated with an ability Arceus itself fears
I wish I played competitive SV before the legendaries were added
I actually quite liked it, worst you really got was the indeedee + armarouge or dondozo
@@poliorice3600 How could you forget the fissure ting-lus?
@@Warlord_Megatron Ting-Lu is a legendary...
@Warlord_Megatron well, I was mostly talking about reg A, things changed significantly with paradoxes and legends
It was a super fun meta but only lasted like 2 months before they released the paradox mons. RIP Reg A. You were the best of us and were ripped away from us far too soon 🎻
I think you got it spot on. I kind of have some fun trying to come up with ways to beat or counter Urshifu, but I think the game would be and was a lot better without it.
Congratz on another regional
So interestingly, two moves in a row in chess is actually significantly move valuable than you might think at first, regarding your comment at 14:03. There's a variant called "monster chess" where the *king* is given a single extra move, and four pawns, against the *entire enemy army.* The pieces should win, but two moves in a row in chess is worth approximately 35 out of 39 points of material in practice. Pokemon turn economy isn't quite the same, but Mega Kanga getting a half extra move was sufficient to make it the best pokemon in the game for a while, even if the move was a complete duplication. Urshifu hitting 3x and breaking sash/sturdy is also turn economy in the same way as mega kanga was.
It works as a competitive game because of the degree of variance, it promotes innovation whenever applicable and punishes over reliance on established strats. That variance also allows for a good degree of player expression, which cannot be understated how important it is to an ongoing series with a dedicated playerbase.
“Incineroar smirking“ a worthy successor
Love your stuff man
My goat urshifu could never ruin the game
It one of my top favorite pokemon but lets be honest here XD
@@feickpehbehehy i mean it’s really good but saying its “ruining” the game is exaggerating
@@ReidnReactn its just insane how he's OP in literally every game (SwSh, SV, Unite, Masters, TCG).
@@feickpehbehehy thats my goat🥱
I wonder if competitive Pokémon could take a page from competitive Yo-Kai Watch. In YKW yokai have ranks ranging from E to S, and in competitive play, you're not allowed to just bring all S ranks, out of your six yokai, only two can be S rank, only 2 can be A rank.
A possible way of working this into Pokémon could be to give players total base stat limits, where their team cannot surpase a set limit. Maybe also only letting players bring one legendary (including both lesser like Zapdos/ Urshifu and major like Mewtwo/ Zacian).
I know this isn't really a fix for Urshifu, but I thought it'd be a neat idea to share.
Man I miss Yokai watch. If it sold better it could have maybe encouraged pokemon to do better for it's games instead of laze about rolling in money because they know their game is too popular to fail. 😔
Crazy how you just won regionals vs an urishifu protect 5 days BEFORE this post. This video was really timely. Congratulations
"It's broken! Don't believe me?" proceeds to win another tournament using the pokemon he is talking about. Wolfe is a menace.