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Why the RAT Changes Everything - Air India 171 Update
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- Опубліковано 10 лип 2025
- In this update to our original video on Air India Flight 171, Captain Steeeve revisits his initial theory-and sets the record straight.
Previously, Steeeve leaned heavily into the possibility that the pilot may have accidentally retracted the flaps instead of the landing gear during the takeoff roll, resulting in a critical loss of lift. But new, higher-quality footage tells a different story.
In this video, we clearly see the Ram Air Turbine (RAT) deployed-something that only happens in the event of significant power loss. This changes everything. Steeeve breaks down what the RAT deployment means, walks through the new evidence frame by frame, and explores the very real possibility that this was a dual engine failure scenario.
It’s important to get these stories right. Aviation is a world of learning-and when new information comes to light, good pilots update their understanding.
If you watched the original video, don’t miss this one.
#flysafe
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Disclaimer: Captain Steeeve is not a spokesperson for any airline or aviation authority. The opinions expressed in this video are solely his own and are based on his experience as a professional pilot. This analysis is for informational and educational purposes only and should not be interpreted as an official statement from any airline, regulatory agency, or aviation organization.
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#airindia171 #captainsteeeve #aviationnews #flightanalysis #enginefailure #aviationupdates #rat #FlySafe #pilotbreakdown #ATCAnalysis
Really respectful of you to change your position.
Let’s remember before we blame pilots - they have lost their lives too and are not here to defend themselves.
Salute to them.
The suggested pilot errors are totally implausible
@@JLSMaytham Pilot error should never be ruled out as a theory until evidence explicitly does so. It’s detrimental to the future of aviation safety otherwise.
That said, any investigation has to be respectful to said pilots and must equally refrain from publicly criticising them until a solid case is made.
I’m just saying; we can’t just dismiss these things - let’s wait until the investigation is complete.
maybe they were drunk?
@@JLSMaytham Agree it's unlikely but pilot's make mistakes and have done things that are implausible before. All possibilities need to be in play until proven otherwise.
He didn’t know before that the pilots lost their own lives too? He woke up to that NOW?
What a horrific realization that you have no engines just after liftoff.
😢
What a horror for a pilots
Certainly it's not normal for both engines to do same. Unusual. Something not right, leaning on purposeful done, like Malaysia Airlines, unusual
The pilots were brave and whatever they could do
SALUTE TO THE CREW
The pilots were brave and did whatever they could do
SALUTE TO THE CREW
I'm from India. That video was shot by a 16 year old boy, who came to visit his father working in Ahmedabad. It was shot from the roof of a three story building. Yes he has been assisting the investigation.
I'm sorry for what the boy had to witness, but his video is a great gift.
In that interview with the boy, the old lady there said that she was near the airport at that time and said that moment that plane took off, she felt that something is going to happened to it as it was wobbling and the sound was not as loud as others.
Everything will be known when they analyse the flight data recorder. Until then you can speculate anything you like.
So he better visit the RAT temple (Karni Mata Temple of Deshnoke)…
very sad somany people died.ground level technicians shouldbe thoroughly investigated.seems no proper repairs were not done.i think
Brilliant explanation, Captain! I never realized how crucial the RAT is until now. The way you broke down its role during the AI 171 emergency made things so clear. Truly shows how backup systems can be lifesavers in aviation!
The person who took the video of the aircraft will be invaluable for the Air Transportation Board enquiry. The video of the Rat is amazing. The Captain gave a good explanation.
Naw. Black box has all that information. It's only helpful to those of us that don't have the box.
Inquiry is the correct spelling in both American and British English. Enquiry is an informal asking of questions.
Its a CCTV footage, they recorded from computer screen.
Indian pilot showed unreal courage and character by following all the protocols while death is in his front within 30 sec.
1. Called MayDay ATC
2. Took the gear intact for some landing.
He's a kid (12th grade schoolkid, name is Aryan) from a nearby village, come to visit relatives in the city for the first time, got excited to see planes so he recorded that. Never been in a plane, now refuses to ever sit in one. He thought the plane is going down to land in the airport, as he didn't know the airport is in the other direction. I watched the interviews in Hindi. That's their terrace from where he filmed. He whatsapped the video to his dad in the village, who forwarded it to someone else, eventually it landed on social media.
A teenager out of curiosity was filming to show to his friends which became the main solution to this puzzle, praying for all souls rest in peace.
The video was from the teenager?
@@serirayna2789 yes
Shoulda prayed before the crash 🙃
Your prayers were useless
Indian pilot showed unreal courage and character by following all the protocols while death is in his front within 30 sec.
1. Called MayDay ATC
2. Took the gear intact for some landing.
It's good to listen to people who really know about the subject rather than journalists and politicians.
So agree with you
I dont listen to either
Aand where do you think they get it from?
Why do I ask? Because I heard 2 stations saaying exactly some of the points that this man said.
Amen❤
what about everyone who got their pilot's license and medical degree from FB univ.
Captain Steve I have to tell you that this probably was the most well informed presentation that I've seen thus far! The media hasn't told us anything nor the FAA or NTSB, so your video along with your experience and the sound of the rat being deployed makes more sense and is more plausible that they had a power failure of some sort. Thank you very much
FAA or NTSB (try to) work off solid information and facts, so they don't make announcements so soon after an accident. As opposed to UA-camrs who can publish their theories, supported by scant evidence, as soon as they like.
A retired TAP Portugal pilot in an interview with a Portuguese news channel 2-3 days ago stated that he thought he saw a RAT deploy in those mediocre images, and completely dispelled "the theory of some experts" who claimed that there must have been a mistake with the flaps/landing gear. So I'm glad you made this video to change your view of the accident.
TAP pilots are very skilled and knowledgable, yet humble and friendly imho.
There's been at least one Pilot-owned UA-cam channel in recent times (before this) which also identified RAT deployment, mainly from the distinctive whine, as soon as the original video became available, with sound on it.
I don't know why people get so mad at the idea that it may have been a flap error. That's happened at least a half dozen times in my airline alone- pilots are not infallible. However the RAT does make that seem unlikely now. I still wouldn't rule out pilot involvement until we know for sure. A dual simultaneous engine failure is virtually unheard of.
What do people watch fake news cnn?
I mean, it's extremely unlikely to be the flaps because the 787 wouldn't let them get the configuration wrong
Absolutely the sound of the RAT. Just did a RAT function test on Monday...have done it hundreds of times during my 28 years as an airline mechanic. The RAT is deployed/dropped manually and a steel cage is placed around this area, for obvious safety reasons. The RAT is designed so a hydraulic powered motor can be attached (to its rear). The RAT is then spun to 4000 RPM'S. Once at 4,000 RPM's the plane's onboard computer is checked to verify the RAT is outputting the required electrical and hydraulic power. In the air the blades of the RAT will auto adjust their pitch to maintain the proper RPM's.
Thank you this explanation
Condolences and Prayers for the departed souls
May they forever shine in eternal bliss
Om Namah Shivay
How do you provide Ram air for RAT to spin during the test ?
Saw it done on KC-10. It was on the fwd right side of plane.
@@UllulAmar It's not run by ram air in the shop. It's run by a motor that plugs into it and spins it.
@@UllulAmarthey mount a hydraulic motor and run it with hydraulic test stand.
God, I wish the media were as professional, thoughtful, honest and informative as this guy.
No kidding. And also other people who make UA-cam videos.
He’s making suppositions the media can’t do.
This guys is the definition of unprofessional. Why did he go to town with theories and no facts?
@@Putnamsmif when it comes to politics.. media will say anything.. but not on a plane crash
content is king. Captain Steeeve is killing it.
Incredible analysis. I was glued to every word. Thank you.
It was so respectful of you to skip the humor on the “I’m Captain Steve”. Both videos you refrained from the humorous play on the name. It was incredibly respectful and it didn’t go unnoticed.
Exactly my thoughts. Goes to show what a captain he is
He's captain steeeve 😂
Exactly..
I noticed that too on both his videos and my respect for him went up even more
I noticed it too. Thanks Capt Steve
This is why I love experts of any field. When they talk they talk on probability, technicality and reality.
If not corrupt......
Will sadly always happen until craft have jectable cabins with chutes yet in this case will still be the outcome , if we were ment to fly we would have been born with wings like angels.
@CopagandaCopWatch so we will just chuck all tech including life saving procedures.
How about Covid experts do you love them?😬😬
From day1 everyone mentioned RAT has already been deployed . Don’t think Steve missed it
I feel for those pilots. In less than 30 seconds, they were faced with potentially the worst problem imaginable just after take-off. I'm sure they tried valiantly to save the aircraft, and the fact that one man survived, and they avoided larger apartment complexes, shows that they did their best to save lives. Air travel remains the safest form of transportation, largely due to the well trained and skilled pilots on the flight deck.
The problem is maintenance and quality compromisation at the bureaucracy level. This shouldn't have happened
They had no chance. Even if the plane at least a few thousand feet they could have done something but I am more less convinced that it was out of their hands
People from the previous flight reported that the plane had electrical problems.
1:38 Sir, at this point you can see the Engine Flame Out Smoke. That's not Dust. 😢😢
For you to say that air travel is safe right now is absolutely fucking absurd. There are planes falling out of the sky everywhere on a daily basis you might be talking from a mathematical truth, but you sure aren’t talking from any type of compassion, understanding and most of all your words are extremely reckless. You wouldn’t say anything like that if one of your family members had died in a plane crash it’s not safe at all not even a little bit. There are more planes falling out of the sky than ever before so explain it because that slogan the air travel is safe is getting downright fucking disrespectful and old. We’re tired of hearing it.
You're a gem, captain Steeeeve! Thank you for all you do!
I pray you can shield yourself from any negativity coming your way because I think you present everything very clearly and fairly and with integrity. We appreciate and respect you!👏👏👏✨️
Why respect him. People died FFS. Leave it to those investigating with all the information
Me and my wife understood through his explanation
@@SteveMalata212but he is speculating. He has access to very little I formation from this event. It is horrendous what he is doing people died and he is essentially making stuff up
After you and your wife understood after hearing the explanation DID THE LIVES OF THOSE PASSENGERS RETURNED??? useless investigations!!!!!
My heart hurts for the pilots, all those lost, their families, and the lone survivor. ❤ from 🇺🇲 Thanks for covering this so well.
Go and search name Sam Salehpour, whistleblower of "boeing 787 dreamliner". This tragedy was well organised and didn't happened inside the US. Boeing is an american company, this particular model had quality issues and safety concerns. Also gather knowledge about income, corruption and safety negligence of Dave Calhoun, then Ceo of boeing...
CAPT STEVE - YOU HAVE IGNORED THE MAIN FACT. WORK LIFE BALANCE IS NON EXISTENT IN INDIA. THOSE WHO WERE ON THE PLANE WERE THE LUCKY FEW WHO THOUGHT THEY WOULD ESCAPE THE GRIND. THEY COULD NOT AS THE CURSE OF THE PEOPLE WHO COULD NOT - WHO HAVE TO WORK 7 DAYS A WEEK ON MULTIPLE JOBS TO MAKE BOTH ENDS MEET held them back. human beings do not matter in India as demand for human resource is limited and supply is unlimited.
1:38 Sir, at this point you can see the Engine Flame Out Smoke. That's not Dust. 😢😢
@@subhranshuganguly2246yes we have to look at human factors too
Could this be caused by the RAT inadverently deploying and causing the engines to shut down or thrust reduction?
I think that people out there need to be reminded that the main and only purpose of an investigation is to determine the causes, not to apportion blame but to ensure that it can never happen again. Love your channel and thank’s for the updates. Cheers Chris.
That just theory.
Of course future safety is a factor but in practice companies will try to cover their asses its not them at fault
What world do you live in. Ever heard of law suit's? It matters very much whose fault it was.
When it culpable maintenance issue. People will be held accountable to also not let it happen again. Bro there's accountability
Fascinating analysis. I just can't imagine the moment when the poor pilots realized their situation. It's heartbreaking. 💔
Indian pilot showed unreal courage and character by following all the protocols while death is in his front within 30 sec. When they knew RATS were out and cause dual engine failure
1. Called MayDay ATC
2. Took the gear intact for some landing.
😥🕊️
@@rishabh4539 Jeffostrop had already shown the deployment of RAT two days ago. Please see the video link given just above this comment. Hats off to Indian pilots.
Immense sympathy for the pilots - the pure and utter horror at what was eminent and that they were “totally helpless” to prevent the pending disaster. For the pilots it was extreme !!!!
🙏💔May their souls be a rest eternally 🕊️
@@curio78 There might be something else to learn from this. I read a passenger's comment from the previous flight on this plane to Ahmedabad. The passenger said a number of passenger communications systems weren't working. If so, that's an indication of malfunction and the plane should have been grounded and checked.
Great Job, Captain! One thing occurred to me as you were describing the ability of viewers watching the original high-def video to distinctly hear the whine of the RAT. Specifically, it might be beneficial to compare what we hear on that video clip to a clip of a normal take-off of a 787 from that same vantage point. My opinion is that if the engines had been at take-off thrust, we would not have been able to hear the whine of the RAT through the din. I bet you can confirm that with clip comparisons between the incident aircraft and a normal 787 climbout. Again, super job digging for evidence that exonerates the poor pilots and their families left in grief. Proud of you, Sir! I retired from the USN after 21 years, and American Airlines after another 16, so I have perspective.
Expert is an expert. Better than media. Thanks Captain
never go to the media for information
Just came across a must see video, “Mass Murder Over DC”. Trump was behind the plane crash in Washington, D.C., that killed 67, as a threat to lawmakers who might oppose his agenda, of trillions in tax cuts for billionaires, and war on Iran. There can be no question that the military helicopter deliberately hit the jet, head on, unwavering in its course until impact. The NTSB is refusing to release all altitude data etc etc showing US Gov complicity. Google "mass murder over DC".
This is media.
@@louistracy6964 True and it's equally unprofessional!
What a horrible tragedy, I’m very sorry for all involved. Captain Steeeve you’ve done a nice job explaining this, and much better than any TV coverage. Thank you !
Thanks captan Steve for your analysis
Except captain Steve did propose a theory blaming the copilot, which is frankly appalling, before changing his mind. He also misquoted the mayday call...it was "... losing power.." , not "..losing thrust.." I don't think a pilot would mix those two up. Also no mention that you can hear the RAT but can't hear the engines.....bottom line , it's all half baked analysis... again
Totally disagree. There are official departments doing this job respectfully not speculating.They will have everything at their disposal. People have died and deserve more than amatuer investigation
I'm a pilot with over 25 years in the industry. Love your channel. I don't always agree with you but that is how we learn and make the industry safer! Good work!!
Eric Dubay 200 proofs earth is flat
Excellent videos. Never watched him before but I will going forward
@@GabriellaVasquez-d3s 😅
@@GabriellaVasquez-d3s- your HEAD is flat!!
Hello. What do you think of this analysis ? Do you agree with what he says ?
Great job Cap'n. We should have been able to hear those two jet engine turbines above anything else and yet all we heard was a single engine aircraft, the R.A.T.!
Thank you, captain, for clarification based on the clear video.The pilots of that flight had no chance at all. You're doing a great job. RIP to all those who lost their lives and condolences to the families who lost their loved ones.
It seems like they had the chance of aborting takeoff.
@@frankthetank8050before each departure the pilots go through some checks, visual, mechanical, electrical... They check control and engine s works properly.
They didn't know before taking off.
If it was gas contamination for instance, it can be okay for a while and then hits you all the sudden.
We will learn more about what happened with the black boxes
@@frankthetank8050 not if they were past V1 speed before the issues started... I mean, I can't imagine they would have continued the take off if they had lost power on both engines if they had even the slightest chance to abort.
@@BertrandBarraud Alright but it seems that the aircraft took unusually long to reach V1 as you can see in the video. Isn’t it a clear indication that there is a problem with the engines?
@@pjnoake True, however it seems that it took extremely long to reach V1 since they used almost the entire runway as we can clearly see in the video
The very day of the crash a UA-camr went to the crash site and located a wing which clearly showed the flaps deployed, so the flap argument was dispelled from day one. There's nothing better than a genuine expert going through the posibilities...brilliant video and incredibly informative, Thank You!
Keep well. God bless their soul forever. Jesus loves you 👼🙌✨💫
Not to take sides, but what you saw were deployed slats which are automatically deployed using autogap.
I am unable to find that video. Please can you share some details of that video. I want to watch it please
A UA-camr went to the crash site to look at the wings?
That didn't happen. That site would be blocked off to all.
@@argoneonobleit's India.
You're in good company. The RAT sound is hard to miss. We will need the data from here. Thanks for this.
It's not just that. If the engines would have worked than that would be the only thing you'd hear in the video. That's for sure.
I still hear white noise around 11,000Hz which means the high pressure compressor on at least one engine was turning at or near TOGA power. And they should have been at or near full flaps for the A/C weight and density altitude. ATC transcript indicated the captain believed there was a loss of thrust and therefore the RAT could have been arbitrarily deployed without due cause.
Even experienced pilots can mistake a loss of lift for a loss of thrust. The bang the survivor heard would have been the RAT deploying. Again, just because the RAT was deployed does not mean it needed to be deployed. They flew a plane that wasn't climbing right into a dormitory with gear extended. What does that tell you about their decision making process in that moment? Says they were probably not thinking clearly because if you aren't climbing, the first thing you do is decrease drag. Extending the RAT would not have helped.
@@Lurch-AI My understanding from this video was that the RAT deploys automatically if one of three things happens. Not something the pilots would have done.
The deployment of the rat would be a little more louder with both engines blown but the one survivor said it was a very loud noise and you'd think there could have been some explosion other than the rat before the cabin lights started to flicker.
I'm having a problem with the idea of the RAT reaching full RPM in such a short time and at such a low airspeed while under load.
You explain it so clearly - even those of us with no knowledge of planes can understand. Thank you, captain. 🙏
I admire, first of all, your personal integrity in telling us that your first assessment was in error, given the new data. I also truly appreciate how you broke everything down logically taking into account all the physical evidence leading to a highly probably conclusion.
Absolutely pathetic to see all the people sucking this guy off for admitting he was wrong. It was absurd for him to comment in the first place given the lack of information he had then and has now. The only people covering this with a scintilla of integrity are the ones who have released videos with zero speculation. So exactly nobody.
@@qwerty112311 Oh, boo hoo.
@@qwerty112311 that’s so sad!
It wasn't his analysis though. He should be giving credit to the other channels that identified this first rather than making out that this is his original assessment.
I’m glad you changed your opinion. The pilot has 9,000 hours of flying experience - that’s equivalent to 375 days, almost an entire year spent in the air. He’s also a flight instructor.
That won't stop Boeing trying just as they tried blaming the crew for the B737-max crashes.
If its a Boeing, I ain't going. Though in this case that may be premature, I understand this aircraft is about 10 years old, so unlikely to be poor quality control on the Boeing production line.
Unlikely? Lol, not existent. That's like blaming Ford for a car accident when the car is over a decade old. Come on now, use yer noggin chag.
Being an instructor has zero relevance. I'm a high speed train driver and work for a company where the majority of operational incidents occur with an instructor & trainee together in front.
the co-pilot only had 1000 hours
Only 1000 hrs ? How many hours do you need to understand basic cockpit controls ?
Excellent analysis. The RAT deployment goes hand in hand with the fact that they couldn't raise the landing gear because of the loss of power.
I just watched a video that completely contradicts the RAT deployment theory.
@@lennyf1957What video?
I want to know as well @@mikerick6955
But we saw it plain as day bud
@@lennyf1957 You just watched a video that is completely wrong.
Hi steve. I am a "just retired 737 NG/MAX Line Captain (Flew with Westjet Airlines in Canada). You haven't touched on your comments of the possibility of software failure, meaning that for whatever reason, the engines went back to idle and the pilot did not react with the TOGA switch One possibility could be to leave at field elevation the altitude on the MCP (That would not explain the RAT deployment though). Or the computers "decided" to flame the engines down for an obscured reason that hasn't happen until now. Thank you for your time and work on this Hugh issue. Frederico.
@fredericohayes3883 Can anyone hear engine sounds along with RAT, its confirmed RAT is deployed, are engines running sound can you confirm?
I'm not an engineer, but as an electronics hobbyist, it seems to me that a better design would be to have a hardware override in the case of software or computerized system failures. I know for controlling aircraft there's a lot more going on than, say controlling finicky laser diodes or some simple electromechanical system. But it just seems like there ought to be a way to get manual control over the hardware if the computer should decide to have a bad day. just my two cents
@@GTA2SWcity You would still need time/altitude to be able to recover in time...this scenario did not provide that.
@@tima.478 Yeah...I guess not.
Just seems like some things could be forestalled if not prevented.
I hear about software or computer failure modes and catastrophic results and I just can't help but wonder, you know?
@@GTA2SWcity Yeah, I get where you're coming from. In *some* cases of computer malfunction, the pilots are able to override manually. Just not for every scenario. As many commercial aviation procedures are unfortunately written in blood, so too are more likely to come from this tragic event.
I've learned a ton more about flying, aircraft and accidents following Captain Steeeve. Never knew about the RAT. But when he rolled the video, I instantly heard that doppler effect when a plane or train horn passes by. Thanks for the honest analysis CS!
What an absolute pos clown makes sense from hos moronic name.
His 1st assumption was pilot error in the previous video. He went to a news channel and made the same statement there pushing the narrative there.
He does the classic one liner ,"i might be wrong as more facts come out" to avoid all responsibilty, completely insincere, humourless clown thinking everything funny. Your evil subscribers defending your unintelligent ass need to jail👎👎👎👎
A very respectful analysis as always. Getting the Mayday out, deploying the RAT and trying to fly the plane, those pilots tried everything they could in the last 30 seconds. They never gave up. God bless them and everyone aboard and on the ground.
Rat deploys itself
But no apology for tarnishing the pilots reputations forever? People are blaming pilots everywhere with his previous video.
They didn’t deploy the rat. It deploys automatically. Did you watch the video?
@@CrimsonMFYes, but the Mayday call they managed to send in so few seconds is amazing! I have so much respect for them 😢! They really did everything it was humanly possible in such a short period of time.🙏🙏🙏
@@anchalsharma When the Air India plane crashed into a relatively ordinary building, the structure remained mostly intact - made of just concrete and bricks. Even the tail and wreckage of the aircraft were clearly visible.
But during the 9/11 incident, when the airplane hit the World Trade Center (WTC), the entire building collapsed all the way to the ground. We're talking about a heavily reinforced steel-and-concrete skyscraper. Not one, but three buildings collapsed - and strangely, the third building (WTC 7) wasn’t even directly hit by a plane, yet it came down in a similar manner.
To make it even more suspicious, there was no trace of the airplane debris - no wings, no tail, no seats - just pulverized dust. And somehow, a passport belonging to one of the hijackers was magically recovered intact, supposedly ejected from the inferno. And yet, people still believed the official story.
It makes you wonder - were people just conditioned not to ask questions, or was it something deeper?
If a plane crash typically leaves behind large visible wreckage - wings, tail, engines, debris - how did two massive commercial jets completely vanish into dust upon hitting the Twin Towers, leaving almost no aircraft remnants behind, yet a hijacker's paper passport was found unscathed and intact near Ground Zero?
Serious Engineers marvel at the deep state & Zionists fooling the technocrat’s & scientists all over the world
As an Indian, people in India need tk watch this. Expecially the journalists. Thank you
As an American, people in America need to watch this, especially the journalists. That's the problem with 24-hour news stations: they need to fill their timeslots with continued News and when a horrific tragedy happens like this, they just fill their timeslots with fluff, repetitive "news" waiting on more facts to come in...
I'm sure they have already heard and seen all the info this guy has and doesn't need to ask anyone...maybe journalists but only if they are bad at their job
As an Indian,, people need to stop watchig indian journalists. Thats the only way they'll take it seriously. The circus on TV needs to end. We need to watch well informed and sane people.
I'm an indian who was the first person in the world to watch the video you can see my logo and the time of the video posted are the same and my comment is the first one. So Indians are always first class in the world
Yes, CAPTAIN STEEVE is a PILOT/ EXPERT and I found him only 6 mos. ago. He breaks it down rationally so anyone can understand technical terms of flight. Condolences 💐 to all who lost family, friends or community members.
Thank you Captain for the update, much respect to the pilots.
Seriously one of the best pages out there for airline video crash explanations. He does it knowing most of us have no idea what airline lingo is and by the end you can easily understand. Ty sir!
Here’s my theory, bear with me, amateur plane mechanic over here:
The extreme heat in the forward equipment bay - caused by 40 degrees C ambient temps, close to max weight takeoff roll and the aircraft sitting in full summer sun on sun-baked tarmac for 3 hours - could have triggered a safe state reset of the fuel system controller (FSC) right after takeoff due to overheating.
I did some digging on flightradar24 and noticed this airframe VT-ANB has been consistently failing to send ADS B data during taxi only from Ahmedabad, for weeks. Other 787-8s on the same route don’t have this issue. The lower antenna sits in the forward equipment bay - same place as the FSC - so heat affecting electronics in that area seems plausible to me. Could be a bad antenna, but this airframe only seems to do this at this airport. Could be that the extreme heat here pushes it beyond its working capability.
The plane was fully loaded, close to max takeoff weight. A long takeoff roll, full power, means big electrical load and even more heat in the forward bay. If the forward bay is already hot (maybe 60) right at rotation, the last bit of strain and heat could’ve pushed the FSC over its limit - around 70 degrees C or so. when that happens, the logic card enters may enter “safe state” mode
in safe state, the centre tank fuel pumps will stop because nothing is now controlling them. It’s considered safer in the logic of the aircraft to have the high pressure pumps stop if they cannot be governed. And the wing tank pumps don’t kick in, because they’re also controlled by the same FSC to the best of my knowledge) which is now basically offline.
The engines lose fuel pressure instantly. the electronic engine controls (EECs) detect it and roll back to protect the engines. Then the RAT deploys almost immediately. With no fuel pressure and no thrust, the plane stalls before it can really climb. We get what we see in the video, a plane which takes off fine, loses power almost immediately with no visible damage and has a deployed RAT.
Everything seems to add up to me:
- normal flap setting (no flap lever mistake)
- both engines lose power at the same time explains soft smoke free symmetrical descent
- RAT deploys straight away due to engines idling
- ads-b issues only at this airport, only on this airframe indicate potential heat issue. Ahmedabad stands for wide body’s are all south facing and accident flight was sitting in full midday sun for 3 hours before takeoff.
- max weight contributes to heat buildup as long take of roll generates heat in electrics
- sudden loss of power matches a software error, you can almost see the plug being pulled in the video. Fuel contamination has been ruled out pretty much. Icing isn’t happening in India.
if the FDR shows the fuel controller dropped out after rotation, I think that’s the whole story right there
What do you think?
Edit 16/6 18:30 GMT:
I can’t believe this has blown up so much! Thanks for all the comments, It’s been interesting reading all of them. Picking up on a few points:
1. Why does ambient heat matter, planes operate all the time in these climates without issue.
Yes, BUT there is another factor (or two) which has prevented the plane from dealing with that heat. Management of heat is essential for proper functioning - the combination of failing cooling systems and high ambient temperatures may cascade together to create this problem.
2. Why would the plane even take off with known cooling issues?
Very important here - Non functioning cooling systems is a no-go unless it’s cleared by maintenance. Maybe the engineers cleared it as fixed and thought it was to the best of their knowledge. If under pressure to depart it’s possible that a reset or cycle of the systems was performed to clear the warning.
3. The engines can operate on suction feed from the wing tanks.
Among many things this theory relies on suction feed failing. I am fairly sure that if the FSC is out the wing pumps won't come on. That would mean there’s no fuel pressure coming from anywhere - fuel lines definitely need to be full for suction feed to work, if they go dry, or air is introduced the suction feed would fail.
4. Why isn’t there a secondary FSC for redundancy?
There is redundancy built into the system - two pumps per tank, multiple power feeds, extreme low likelihood of thermal or software failure - but only one main module. Under normal circumstances, equipment bay fans are working (!!), 70 degrees C + is never ever hit. Basically the plane is designed with confidence in thermal margins. The FSC is only seems to be a single point failure during takeoff and central tank feed - if the thing resets (even if the plane is completely normal otherwise) the engines might literally just turn off (because the wing tanks aren't sequenced or on yet and the FSC controls them too) and the fuel pressure to the engines is lost.
If they figure this out, the crew have to manually switch to wing pumps before the EEC rolls back the engines (2 secs max). If they takes longer it will likely take too much time for the engines to come back on to save the plane. There is no time to recover. At cruise FSC reset would be manageable and diagnosable.
Long story short - my theory is that it's been assumed by engineers that FSC is extremely reliable and that reset - if it very rarely occurs - would be at altitude and manageable. Although it may be very, very rare it seems terrible that a glitch of one system during critical take off phase could down a plane with virtually zero chance of recovery. But that may be the case with the 787's FSC during takeoff and central tank feed.
This is all theory and speculation - I’m not claiming to know what happened. This is undoubtedly wrong in part or entirely. To those offended by speculation under these circumstances, my apologies. My condolences to all affected.
Is there no redundancy in the FSC. Seems odd that it wouldn’t be rated for 70C ambient air temp.
The 787 has a known history of lithium-ion battery fires, which can trigger catastrophic avionics failures. On the previous flight, passengers reported the air conditioning, lights, and entertainment systems were not working-clear signs of electrical problems building up. During the accident, the Ram Air Turbine (RAT) deployed and the landing gear stayed down, both strong evidence of total power loss. Survivor also saw emergency green and white lights come on before impact, indicating the aircraft switched to backup power. All these point to a likely scenario where an electrical fire or battery failure knocked out critical systems, leaving the crew unable to retract the gear or climb. The 248 day bug that requires the SW to be reset (failing to do so could cause GCU issues and complete power failure) can be ruled out because the engine was replaced only recently (and probably the SW bug has been fixed)
787 batteries are susceptible to "cascading thermal runaway" where failure of one cell triggers failure of adjacent cells. A main battery fire can cause APU to fail as well. The high electrical demands of takeoff could have triggered the final cascade. Also bear in mind that 787s are Full Authority Digital Engine Control (FADEC) systems that require electrical power for proper thrust management.
Sounds good. Send in your report.
Great analysis! Very interesting point of the ATS-B data on this aircraft not communicating for weeks. Thanks for the thorough information.
I think your argument has a lot of logic to it and is well supported. I wonder to what degree Emirates or any of the gulf airlines have had similar issues given the incredibly high temps over the summer. Why therefore specifically this airframe?
Thank you Capt Steve and all the people who are trying to make sense of this tragedy!
John Barnett already said stuff about electical Problems 787 has i wonder why everyone ignoriert it.
26/11 also was planed to show all terrorist was hindu and they had mauli thread on their hands...but after kasab got captured then whole story was explained ......these terrorist plan and attack..this can also be a terrorist attack we cant say anything until investigation is complete and black box is checked
Wow, i want to really thank you for not adding annoying background music to your video.
I can hear you very clearly, thank you for your time for sharing this🎉❤❤❤❤❤
RIP to those who didnt make it😢
Really interesting analysis so far. I hope you keep covering it until the black box is released. The way you explain things makes me want to watch until the end. It’s clear you know a lot, but more importantly, you know how to communicate it. Great job!
damn an indian pilot youtuber also predicted dual engine failure within hours of the tragedy and cited it as " extremely extremely extremely rare" 🤯
Except this is his second analysis. I wonder what his third analysis will be....or his fourth.
@PaulvanHarte all what he said in the first and second video people explain it before him! he watches people on youtube then he comes here and say : am sorry, i have to change my bullshit story ! 😀😀😀
@@hamedhamdi9969not at all !!
1:38 Sir, at this point you can see the Engine Flame Out Smoke. That's not Dust. 😢😢
Incredible. It’s the RAT. I knew something was off with the way it sounded the first time I saw the original video. Captain Steve you are amazing !!!
@@vegard2000that’s not the same flight though it’s air India
Also, I think that if the engine was roaring at full power as exected, we would hear it. From that distance, those jets at full thrust would be really noisy.
That audio is the strongest piece of evidence at the moment.
Yeah, pretty much. You can clearly hear the hum of the RAT prop, but you shouldn't have been able to hear that over the *ROAR* of the jet engines at full takeoff power.
at the moment, because later the strongest piece of evidence is blackbox, and we should not spend so much time with suppositions. We are waiting for real evidences.
@@nobodyknows3180So yeah you can clearly hear it especially when he compared it to the other video of a plane with it deployed. However, why is it that you can hear it during the initial shot where we can clearly see the underbelly but in those frames I don’t see the RAT deployed.
When will they release the black box audio to public?
with two turbofan engines at full power and you can distinguish the sound of a small two-bladed propeller rotating due to the impact of the air?
Hank your videos are incredible. Your calm demeanor makes it. Oh and the critters you save off the road.
13:13 Another evidence is that there is no disturbance in the airflow behind the engines. Usually the air is “hazy” if the engines are running.
Good observation 👍
No faint trail of smoke either - especially from an engine at full thrust.
The engines had to be running to achieve lift off !
@@dougsimmon7460 Maybe they stopped running after liftoff...
@@detritiv0re144I'm sure they did , but they had to push it to that point . Good day !
I grew up in New Zealand near Christchurch Airport and the sound of a Harvard trainer is very similar to that RAT.
Thank you for updating our understanding of this terrible crash.
aussie is the new zealand
correcting our understanding*
What about the loud BANG the survivor reported? He said it happened right after takeoff.
India is not in Harvard. fyi
Yes Harvard has that distinctive sound like the RAT as tip of prop is travelling near the speed of sound.
Recall them flying overhead many a time making that sound and same when they're doing aerobatics as the Roaring 40's do at air shows.
Captain Steve, you have amassed over 2 million views in 4 hrs … the world is really relying on your expertise for clarity on this tragedy. Thanks for your analysis
Are you in India Edwin?
Hi Steve
He s not an expert on crash analysis. Experts are 787 qualified crew and investigators.
Without Steve the official will investigation will not get a result?
Expertise and Clarity ????
Are you having a laugh ?
He’s changed his mind due to Blanco realising what happened
Steve was so wrong about the flaps - what he stated happened just wasn’t possible
Good Morning Capt. Steve. I have been watching your videos since day 1 of the TRAGIC Air India crash. And as I'm watching all of your videos I keep thinking to myself, "I've heard this voice before, it's familiar." I've racked my brain thinking of someone I know who has the same voice and facial expressions as you. None came to me. But yesterday it hit me - it's YOU, Steve Scheibner - the In My Seat video!!! I've watched it hundreds of times, sent it to family members and friends and clergy, urging them to find a way to tell your story to their congregations around 9/11 each year. Thank you Sir for producing such an emotional and inspiring video!
I'm from India. The media is gonna ask you a lot of questions now. Mad respect for putting out the fact given you received the right video.
I have some useful info foryou in India
This info was already given out by the first youtuber yesterday, just few hours after incident happened, this steeve here and all other youtubers are now retelling his theory only, copy pasting his analysis as their own, without giving any credit.
Mad respect for what ? For speculating too soon in his last video ?
@@Applisted and what's that?
This information was already discussed 2 days back. In fact, professional pilot already claimed that it has a high chances of engine failure. you can check Indian pilots videos on youtube.
But because those comments would be against the "BIG" company, they would do anything to make pilot liable instead of plane error.
Thank you, Captain, for revisiting this with honesty and clarity 🙏
👍
He said "Oral" I think he ment "Audio" 😂
Dear navy veteran capt Steve. I want to thank you for your effort on these videos. It is apparent you aren’t doing this for the views as you are still an active pilot. You care about the public gaining knowledge to ease the fear of flying in today’s day and age of constant air tragedies. As a retired aviation mechanic in the Air Force , I salute you sir.
Other than the video that you mention above, there is also another video taken from inside the cabin. Some passenger was livestreaming the crash on facebook. Please take a look at that as well.
My man, Steeeve is selling everything from marriage counseling to keychains online. Lets not elevate a smart entrepreneur to some sort of online saint of aviation.
I have a friend who is also a very experienced commercial pilot and his thoughts, 'guesses', are the same as yours. As as small additional point he said the RAT could only deploy automatically to stop it coming down by accident and hitting people working under the plane on the head but he may have been joking
"It is apparent you aren’t doing this for the views"? BS. "Capt Steve's" striving for clicks, or is otherwise out of his mind in Fantasyland with the magic RAT notion.
@@glockenspielgary "Lets not elevate a smart entrepreneur to some sort of online saint of aviation." No joke. He clearly doesn't have the slightest clue of FK all about what he's blathering.
Thank you for the update. Love, listening to your eloquent and well put together monologues. Had a bit of a laugh when you pointed to your ear and said “oral” 😊
Capt. Steve, don't listen to any youtube haters. Your analysis is excellent and very thorough. Thank you for your information.
@wilyjapan8200.
To hit on India is the British way. To lie on your own and hide facts is the way. Today a brit F35 made an emergency landing on way to middle east at kdral airport India. Didn't have enough fuel,really brits 😅 Google facts.
His theory was totally wrong. 787 fly by wire system doesn't allow pilots to rectract flaps below safe speed. He assumed it's same as the 777 he flies but technology advances. 787 is a newer plane.
What an absolute pos clown makes sense from hos moronic name.
His 1st assumption was pilot error in the previous video. He went to a news channel and made the same statement there pushing the narrative there.
He does the classic one liner ,"i might be wrong as more facts come out" to avoid all responsibilty, completely insincere, humourless clown thinking everything funny. Your evil subscribers defending your unintelligent ass need to jail👎👎👎👎
@@anlagrdr5229
Very true but this old pilot dislikes Indians ,he has a superiority complex,
Heathrow sold go Saudi arabia ,but arrogance remains Google 2nd largest UK airport Gatwick sold to a billionaire
From Nigeria. The brits live in delusions.
@@anlagrdr5229 He is not saying the flaps were retracted too early. Only the black boxes can answer most of the questions.
Love it when experts make highly technical info understandable. Same as Titan Sub. And the one guy not only surviving, but WALKING away is just surreal.
He was the only one who had not completed his mission in his current life...the other 200+ were already done and got recalled home and are now enjoying the happiest possible vacation.
Rescued himself... unstrapped, found his way out of the nearest hole, and climbed down. Totally surreal.
Sad for him that his brother Ajay, in the adjoining seat, didn't make it.
@@rainbowseeker5930 so the parent who dies leaving 3 boys under 10 years old has completed their mission?
the Titan sub was down to sheer stupidity
@@matthewdrake9699death cult cultures
I'm Australian and my Dad and Brother were both Qantas Captains who would talk about flying all the time and I've never heard of the RAT! Major respect to you sir for your clear, concise explanation and your willingness to reassess your views when given more information. RIP all those who lost their lives and God Bless all involved with this heartbreaking tragedy. ✝🕊
It’s not on all planes apparently
I only became aware of the RAT because of a television movie about the Gimli Glider.
They have RAT ram air turbine in airbus 300 b 4
The catastrophic plane crash into the Doctors Clinic was the work of sabotage. Why. Because, it was a warning to any medical professional who is thinking about divulging(ratting) who is behind the black market trade of re d liquid that comes in quart size bags for crash sites, war zones and other end of life events. Now you know.
I flew C-5's for 17 years. It had a rat. NEVER ONCE DID WE HAVE TO DEPLOY IT IN AN EMERGENCY. And a C-5 had lots of emergencies. I have seen it deployed on the ground maybe 4 times, so rat deployment is very very rare thing in a real emergency
I am from India, and watched many analysis videos on this crash. Your analysis and facts are on point.
I lost my best friend in a plane crash in North Carolina in 1994 and all the media coverage was actually comforting and helpful in a way as it provided some answers but also showed that others cared as well... I'm sure the friends and families appreciate the information and dedication you have to aviation.... I still to this day have no idea why my buddies plane went down but know it is most likely due to local weather conditions ... and that one event that didn't happen to me completely changed the direction of my life
Airlines aren't more trustable as they used to be (at least to me this incident made me rethink) since boeing dreamliner 787 had a dual engine failure somehow which is a probability in millions. So how are any airlines safe when 787 is considered aviation gold standard.
I’m so sorry for your loss.
@@nebula669 Even people walking down the street get struck by lightning and killed. Perhaps the saying what can possibly go wrong will eventually go wrong applies here. Which does not bode well for a world with 12,000 nuclear weapons at the ready.
Do you remember the date, airline, origin and destination? There must be an accident investigation report published about it revealing the causes
US Air 1016
As an Airbus pilot I think Capt Steve analyzes is spot on. I initially was leading towards a flap/slat misconfiguration. You can clearing see the RAT deployment.
It's not just see. You can hear it - I lived in London just under the landing corridor for Heathrow Airport. I know how passenger jet sounds. Definitely not this quiet and definitely not the prop-plane-like sound.
I am sold on the sound alone.
What is RAT ?
@@lionesss06 Ram Air Turbine, it’s basically a generator that it turned by the airflow generating electricity. If you listen what the narrator says in aircraft it’s to power things like radios and instruments and the hydraulics when both engines fail
@@lionesss06whatch the video first.
Even with wrong flaps settings it wouldnt sink that fast with full thrust right?
A true voice of reason you are, Capt. Steve. You are humble enough to change your views based on new evidence. Kudos. Saw your interview on an Indian channel - glad they saw fit to pull you in, you are obviously world-recognized for your informed views. More power to you and God Bless.
Yes first blame the flaps/pilots and no im sorry to the pilots and their families, what a guy.
@@soeren72 agreed.
wtf, he blamed pilots without any facts! And he got this info about the rat from another YT, who is a pro.
It is unfortunate he jumped to pilot error conclusions, especially a country like India who have the most dishonest media and are bound to sensationalize anything for ratings. As an Indian I say this it is most shameful aspect of our society, recent pak war exposed Indian media to the world as the silly lying moronic buffoons they are. Mr Steve had the audacity to spread pilot error rumour on brain dead Indian TV with no thought of the ghastly consequences. Did Mr. Steve stop to think that the pilots have families, what shame pain they would have felt knowing one of their own killed hundreds because of a mistake now they can’t even mourn their loss. If this was really pilot error he should have held his tongue until there was definitive proof before prematurely causing unbearable pain to families who are already suffering. I like Mr Steve that is why his behaviour is so baffling, why is he like other brain dead social media influencers making clickbait videos for money.
He actually didnt proud boy.@@soeren72
That was an excellent video. You are a fantastic teacher. Thank you for that thorough explanation.
Great to hear you come out with theories that do not blame the experienced pilots who are not there in this world to justify their part
But his initial theory, that they raise the flaps instead of raising the landing gear did blame the pilots.
Even so we cannot rule out pilot or co pilot error.
1:38 at this point you can see the Engine Flame Out Smoke. That's not Dust. 😢😢
He blamed the pilots for messing on an Indian news channel. Now he's trying to place a halo on his head as damage control. Scum.
Madam, pilots dont need to defend their actions, it is all recorded and can be studied after a crash ;)
I didn't lose a loved one in this crash, but my heart breaks for those who did. I've been searching for answers and explanations why this tragedy happened. Your video is insightful and informative. Thanks.
May the souls of those who perished RIP.
Same I feel so sad about it I can’t stop searching about it
With the RAT deployed and the landing gear being tilted and the Mayday call I have no doubt they had a major failure. Prayers for all the families affected by this tragedy. Thank you Captain for this excellent analysis as always ❤
Captain Steve . We common person rely on you guys who show us truth .BOEING and airline they care about Shareholders
There is lot of short cut by Boeing for profit
Please keep update the inside story
What could possibly cause both engines to fail immediately after takeoff?
Prayers for all the families!
They are so rare, dual engine failures. They’d have to completely screw up, I mean completely to allow conditions to exist for not one, but two engines fail. Show what a colossal failure India Air is to have this happen.
@@redfan3977 Or a fundamental design flaw in this Boeing aircraft. Much more likely.
I’m always happy when I see people being strong enough to admit to their mistakes and change their minds when evidence comes to the fore that goes previous convictions
First time in my life, I have seen someone explaining the causes of a plane crash, so vividly. Wonderful job, dear Steve! ❤❤
Hey Stevo , you shouldn't be speculating on such a platform as UA-cam, give NTBS a chance to investigate the incident before theories are formed conspiracy or otherwise
Like all opinions, well you know the saying we all have one.
Not only with clarity and vividness, but also with humility and openness to others' ideas. Thank you!
@Rob-fl2cw why would Ntbs weigh on this?
@@Rob-fl2cw but yours is uninformed
@NataliaSeesIt yours is best informed? Same news source?
Hello Captain Steve, I think your assessment is excellent. I was a Bombardier Challenger driver for (11) years and have experienced the deployment of the RAT. It works as advertised.
Driver?...that makes me think you are telling a porky pie
I took a tour of the Delta hub at KDTW last fall. They showed us the maintenance hangar and by pure coincidence our group got to witness the RAT testing. You’re right about the distinctive sound, it’s something you can’t miss
An absolutely fantastic explanation of what likely happened in this crash. I love watching your videos because you’re so thorough and unbiased. Thank you for everything that you do.
I worked on E2s in the Navy. That Prop sound is distinct and you know it when you hear it! My fiance has his A&P but doesn’t work on anything as large as a 787 so when we were discussing this I never even thought to ask about the RAT. Thanks for this!
Captain Steeeve you’ve done a nice job explaining this, and much better than any TV coverage
Strong evidence based arguments presented by the captain. This is how analysis needs to be done. Deepest condolences to bereaved families who lost their loved ones.
Gosh this is giving me Flight 232 vibes now! They had the bang, too (flawed fan blade in engine 2 sliced through all four hydraulic lines), and then the full loss of hydraulics also BUT they were at altitude, fortunately. Unfortunately, they were in a turn which caused all kinds of challenges to work with. (If only they had the RAT back then, it could have been less of an incident (btw those pilots have my deepest love and respect forever, they were absolutely incredible heroes.)) Thank you Steve for your analysis and update. Much appreciated.
I salute the pilots that even till the last minute they did all their best to save all them souls. The flights nose was pointed all the way up wayy past the point of no return. Rest in Peace Captains and to the souls lost❤
I agree 100% ❤
I am from India.
Respect you for changed from your assumptions and now you find many clear indications. Great findings.
His assumptions were telecasted as facts on national television.
If Steve has any shred of integrity, he has to reappear in India Today and clarify his previous mistaken stand.
This cap was just way to fast with his story. Many clicks though.....
Well said 👍
Do you really think the facts/truth care about your petty feelings?
@@konchady no need
thank you Cap'n Steeeve, we appreciate your knowledge and professionalism. Such a tragic loss, prayers to all the families and folks involved. Hope all pilots are as professional as you, Please fly safe Cap'n Steeeve......I too noticed no engine noise in the video....... a 707/dc 8 went down in Alaska 12-26-68, Elmendorf AFB and I heard the engines absolutely SCREAMING as they tried to get altitude, the noise blew me out of bed, we were at the end of the flightline where the aircraft crashed. Pan Am 799, noise and impact still haunt me 57 years later..
What a vivid and disturbing memory to have.
Excellent commentary.
Much better than anything seen on the news.
Capt Steeeve, not only can you hear the RAT, it's what you don't hear. At that altitude, and how close the original cameraman was, you should hear the engines howling, or at least making some sort of noise. All we hear is the RAT. Both of the motors were dead. Don't know/won't speculate on why, but there was no thrust from them, and they were probably causing more drag than anything at this point.
Excellent breakdown, Sir! Please keep up the good work.
I was thinking the same thing. How is the RAT overwhelming turbines? I don’t hear jet engines at all.
What about the loud BANG the survivor reported? He said it happened right after takeoff.
Didn't hee play this exact same clip in the last video?
@@dan-bz7dzit was a recording of the original video, not the original
@@dan-bz7dz Like he said, it was someone recording a computer monitor as it played the video, not the original recording.
That RAT sounds like a cross between a Cessna 206 and a Mustang... wow ... learnt so much. Thank you Cpt Steve.
I live in Hamburg and hear this a lot. Whenever A321s return to Finkenwerder at the end of a test flight they check the operation of the RAT. It‘s really loud!
If you are in maintenance and need to hear it when tested you get annoyed really quick - same noise level like the APU - which is also called Fuel to Noise Converter :D
blancolirio had this two days ago
Definitely sounds just like a small plane like a little cessna
@@PeterOsterbart-fq3qnThey do the same thing here in Everett at Boeing. So loud!
Thank you Captain Steve for the revision to your previous analysis ! Not a pilot at all but been super invested in this accident and this seems to be the most plausible. Last video went viral and hope all see this update. Liking and commenting for reach
He called an audio cue "oral" 😂😂😂
@@ChessJourneymanThat would be "aural."
@@greekgoddessmom correct. Aural is medical-term associated with ears and hearing. An auroscope goes into the ear to check the structures inside the inner ear.
@@greekgoddessmomWhich is why there is a better word for it - auditory.
@@ChessJourneyman are you in middleschool?
I haven’t read all of the comments, so apologies if my remarks are repeating what others have said.
There are actually six conditions that will deploy the RAT:
1) Push the button to deploy it.
2) Loss of both engines.
3) Loss of electrical power to both pilots' Primary Flight Displays.
4) Loss of system pressure in all three hydraulic systems.
5) Loss of all four (hydraulic) electric motor pumps on takeoff with loss of one engine.
6) Loss of all four (hydraulic) electric motor pumps when landing with certain flight control failures.
Also noteworthy, the ADS-B data shows that the flight on this day did not backtrack on the runway and use the turn button to allow a longer takeoff roll. Looking at the Jeppesen airport plate suggests that this flight had about 6000’ for a takeoff on an 11+ hour flight (lots of fuel, so heavy aircraft). The flights on the previous days did backtrack. This may prove to be a factor.
Thoughts and prayers for the victims and their families.
I listened to the sole survivor on the news in my native language and he clearly said (translating to english), "Soon after the plane went up, it seemed that plane couldn't get 'race'. As if the plane shut off". He clearly mentioned 'race', by which he meant thrust or boost.
Edit: I don't know about about other countries' vocab but here in India, by race we also mean to rev something. Like we rev a car's or bike's engine.
race or raise?
wow ... hence the captain's mayday "No Power". The world awaits verification & cause of both engines outage, what a tragedy
Race as in acceleration
@@timantsons616 Think of it as throttle
Race means acceleration @@timantsons616
12:58 as a former Naval Aviator and later 25 year Gulfstream pilot with RATs, you changed my pretty firm belief in pilot error because the gear was not up or moving up and apparently no flaps showing. Great DETAILED analysis!!!
There probably not enough power being generated to raise the landing gear, that also explains a lot.
I am just an electronic technician with no aviation experience at all, but I am good at spotting little details. I swear in one of the videos I saw, that it looked like the front landing gear seemed like it unlocked and moved back slightly about the same time that the plane appeared to loose thrust, like the act of pulling the retract handle caused some other catastrophic failure that killed the engines.
Juan Brown had better description of the failures that trigger automatic RAT deployment. But there is still manual deployment. Really only adds to what the issue was. Still could be a pilot induced failure or errors in handling the mechanical issue or missing signs of coming mechanical failure.
i think this was a combination of pilot error leading to cascading failures, left engine fails, captain is busy handling the aircraft. copilot accidentally cuts fuel to the right functioning engine, leading to electrical failure(couple of seconds before the rat and battery bus take over), hydraulics are stuck until more electrical power is available. Gear is stuck meanwhile due to lack of electrical and Hydraulic power and so are the flaps. They had very little time and altitude to recover. It was too late had this happened at an altitude lets say FL250 or something they could have easily recovered. At takeoff they should have been at MTOW(long flight etc etc) and with the gear down there's not much anyone could have done to save the aircraft.
@@randombuilder345 You're just twisting yourself into knots trying so hard to pin it on pilot error. This video explanation is already pretty solid without the need for that hypothesis.
Really appreciate how clearly Captain Steve broke this down using facts. That’s how you explain things professionally-clear, objective, and free of bias. Solid work!
It’s nice to see you smile while trying to convince that you were only leaning to some theory of yours about the crash which took 300 lives, very professional. 👍 Also , you said in your last video that the chance that both engines failed is one in billions!
I'm so grateful for your very quick re-analysis, Captain Steve.
I'm the only one in my family who hasn't worked/isn't working for the airlines (the family ended up at American after working for USAirways for decades). My dad was an airline pilot (flew international), my mom worked in airline corporate when i was little , my brother is a ramp rat in BOS and my sister in law is a gate agent in BOS. (I went into advertising, & yes i've seen ads for my clients at the airport, which is as close as i got to the "family business")
Anyway, my dad died of pancreatic cancer a year and a half ago, and strangely, one of my greatest senses of loss was a connection to the industry that shaped my family and all the behind the scenes info that we were privileged to.
Your videos, whether they're covering an accident (unfortunately) or fun behind-the-scenes airline info (my favorite), has been a real comfort for me and made me feel a tiny bit less loss, and I'm very grateful for that.
Om Shanti 🕉 . May your Dad live in peace
What about the loud BANG the survivor reported? He said it happened right after takeoff.
@@chadhaire1711I think you are mentally ill.
@@economics1483I prefer Christ to Om Shanti!
@@chadhaire1711 Did you run out of exclamation marks?
India news sites report the message from the pilot as being, amongst others: "Thrust not achieved, Mayday...." or "No power, no thrust, falling".
If that's true, the question is whether a passenger or the pilot would be best at judging whether the engines were losing thrust...?
Thanks Capt. Steeeve; brilliant analysis!!! You don't talk down to us, or over our heads, because you recognize that you are one of us that has chosen to specialize in this field. You are a smart guy, a great pilot, and you know how to relate to your fellow humans that are just trying to figure out what went wrong.
👏👏👏
Indian pilot showed unreal courage and character by following all the protocols while death is in his front within 30 sec. When they knew RATS were out and cause dual engine failure
1. Called MayDay ATC
2. Took the gear intact for some landing.
You have quickly risen to the top of my favorite aviation experts. I am not a pilot, nor have I ever even flown. But I have a deep rooted interest in aviation. Thank you for what you do, Captain STEEEEEEEVE! FLY SAFE!
Do yourself a favour and watch the aviation channels who know their stuff - Blancolirio, Jeffostroff and Vas Abiation who Steve has now copied because he realises he’s gone on world media and spouted a pile of poo implicating the pilots. I’m really not happy at Steve. He’s more about subscribers and selling watches now.
Thanks Captain Steeeve. That was the most articulate and comprehensible explanation I've ever heard followeing a major disaster!
Captain Steeeve, your clear emotional anguish over this tragedy is perhaps the most remarkable part of your presentation. Be well and thanks, Cap'n.
Capt. Steeeve is the current named 'Expert' in the Daily Mail, UK.
Me likee your ginger kitty. Ginger kitty looks like Bernie Bergman. 😼😺😸
This and the previous video are the only ones I’ve watched from the channel so far - and I loved them both. I’ve even shared them with my family and friends. Out of curiosity, I also checked the endings of a few other videos to understand what you meant.
As an Indian, I truly appreciate the Captain for choosing not to include his usual outro this time. That gesture speaks volumes. The respect is mutual. 🙏
The person who made this video helped a lot to pin point the problem earlier
This videos was analyzed on the first day by MENTOUR PILOT by two Airline Captains. The RAT was brought up as a big clue.
New stated that the kid who recorded the video was very traumastised, like he couldn't even speak.
RIP to all 241 passengers and crew members and also the ~28 people on the ground 🙏🙏
The boy who shot the vid was interviewed by a hindi channel.called Lallantop. The boy arrived in ahmadabad that day at his relatives place and didn't know in which direction the airport was. He thought the airport was in the direction the plane was going.
@@tommytwogloves16 all what he said in the first and second video people explain it before him, especally by MENTOUR PILOE and another frensh guy who explain that the pilot did pull up the gears but they got stuck ....! he watches people on youtube then he comes here and say : am sorry, i have to change my bullshit story ! 😀😀😀
Here is the link of the interview of the boy from the location (the terrace from where the vid was shot).
ua-cam.com/video/D4yZhIhE6fg/v-deo.html
In case the link is not clickable, seaech firbthe vid by title - "‘कभी प्लेन में नहीं बैठूंगा’ Ahmedabad Air India Crash का पहला वीडियो बनाने वाले Aaryan ने सच बताया?"
Thank you, Cpt Steve. Really appreciate you staying on top of these things and providing solid information.
Retired 777 driver here.
I just heard your update regarding the RAT. I had suspected power reduction from the beginning (for a different reason). . .
In the very first video, look at the exhaust plume from the right engine just before the plane disappears from view. That does NOT look like an engine under power -- especially that they were likely at max blast.
Thanks for your attention to detail!
Occasional passenger here. I was wondering in that first video (around 1:39) when the plane emerges from behind the shack, why there's so much dust kick up. Maybe it's not dust, but smoke? Maybe all takeoffs from that location are that dusty?
@@martyfarty0maybe because they used almost the entire runway, so the engines were blowing the dust at the very end of the course?
It’s good you found the actual video and review you take on this because the RAT is well heard on this video. Another guy, an engineer, already had this video few days ago and he definitely said the RAT was out based on the sound and then the visual and it’s not on. Glad you found this video considering that you seem to be the ‘go to guy’ on speculating the cause of the crash until the black box is analysed. Thanks.
I'm surprised he couldn't figure this out and he's a former pilot. The guy who covered the Champlin tower collapse knew this right away on his first video and he's not in the aviation business. That's embarrassing.
A few years back I worked with an electrical engineer who was hired by an airline to figure out why they were having random RAT deployments on CRJ aircraft. It seemed to occur very frequently at one airport and but also occurred throughout the airlines system at various airports. The RAT deployments happened right at rotation, when the oleo compressed and hit the limit switch that gave the computer the message that they were airborne. After an intensive investigation it was determined that GPU's, known as ground power units, of a particular make and serial number series had produced excessive electrical noise on the power feed to the aircraft while at the gate. Isolating those units solved the problem. In the Air India case I'm wondering if the same thing was happening, but at a much worse level that was causing damage to the electrical system and computers on board the 787. Hearing the RAT on takeoff you know they were in serious trouble. My condolences to family and friends of that terrible accident.
I don't think I heard the engines idle in that video. If they were running, they were at idle. The sound of the engines should have been deafening at that distance from the person filming. Instead, you could hear the RAT more clearly than the engines or wind.
Well said, Sir. A valuable contribution towards eventually solving this puzzle.
This is a key piece of information thanks for sharing.
Someone has posted video alleged to be from the same plane on previous flights, where various lights in the cabin were flickering on and off, or not working at all.
I very much doubt your testimony..... "they hired an electrical engineer"...... but you do tell a good story..... LOL
I'm a pilot. I completely agree with Captain Steve's theories. In the history of aviation, dual engine failures have indeed been most commonly attributed to two main causes: bird strikes and fuel-related issues, such as fuel exhaustion or contamination. These scenarios have repeatedly shown to be among the few events capable of affecting both engines simultaneously, making them critical considerations in both training and real-world operations.
How come fuel contamination?
Sabotage @@Welcome25674
no, the survivor said the engines were working at the moment of the explosion
The 787 has a known history of lithium-ion battery fires, which can trigger catastrophic avionics failures. On the previous flight, passengers reported the air conditioning, lights, and entertainment systems were not working-clear signs of electrical problems building up. During the accident, the Ram Air Turbine (RAT) deployed and the landing gear stayed down, both strong evidence of total power loss. Survivor also saw emergency green and white lights come on before impact, indicating the aircraft switched to backup power. All these point to a likely scenario where an electrical fire or battery failure knocked out critical systems, leaving the crew unable to retract the gear or climb. The 248 day bug that requires the SW to be reset (failing to do so could cause GCU issues and complete power failure) can be ruled out because the engine was replaced only recently (and probably the SW bug has been fixed)
787 batteries are susceptible to "cascading thermal runaway" where failure of one cell triggers failure of adjacent cells. A main battery fire can cause APU to fail as well. The high electrical demands of takeoff could have triggered the final cascade. Also bear in mind that 787s are Full Authority Digital Engine Control (FADEC) systems that require electrical power for proper thrust management.
So what are the other possible causes at take off as bird strike and contamination have, I believe, been eliminated? What would be a likely cause of fuel exhaustion?
Hey Captain Steeeve first time viewer here (actually 2nd video) and just wondering if that's Linberg Field in the background? Or, arr, err, San Diego International Airport? 😅 Kinda looks like it. I'm actually old enough (66) to remember when it was not only Linberg but located on PacHwy! 😊
Steeve correct. RAT deployed - and it deploys AUTOMATICALLY, is the GAME CHANGER!
Wonderful observation and analysis.
qualitywingssim.com/files/ultimate_787_collection/docs/QualityWings%20-%20Ultimate%20787%20Collection%20Users%20Manual.pdf NOT NECESSARILY IT HAS A SWITCH
This analysis was already posted by few channels before him
Now the real question
What to do to Boeing
I doubt it did
People were mentining RAT deployed from the first moment, however all commentators somehow managed to jump on pilots error with flaps or landing gear bandwagon
If was a dual engine failure that’s so bloody rare. Kudos to you with intelligence to look further at the event & change your theory 🙏
Survived person gave information about aircraft. It was shaking and lights were blinking in aircraft during take off. It shows it is engine failure..
He didn’t change his theory it evolved as more evidence was presented. He always said he would do that
@@VimalKr-h7y Yes I thought so all the time. there was cowpiss in the fuel. This is not a good combination, and caused the engine trouble.
@@1005wiking Muzzy ur gazans are dying. Worry abt that.
@@1005wiking racism could've been avoided in these sensitive times at least.
Man, you're good. Awesome breakdown.
Prayers to all who lost loved ones
11:19 we need to stop repeating the theory that the copilot accidentally raised the flaps prematurely completely rather than lowering it to the second or third option. In another video a 787 pilot and a 787 engineer who worked on the design of the aircraft both separately wrote comments that the 787 will not allow you to accidentally retract the flaps when it is inappropriate to do so. This was already a designed fail safe. At this time repeating that theory when we know what may have occurred is just insulting to the last memories ofof the pilots.
Completely agree... 🙏
The media wanted that exact narrative, steve gladly gave them the quote they wanted..
Not saying you’re wrong, but a crash investigation can’t assume "the 787 will not allow you to accidentally retract the flaps”. You can't just assume the failsafe worked, so you can't rule it out till you know more.
Nothings off the table until it’s off the table
100% it will also work in the other direction if you attempt to exceed Vfe and retract the flaps.