One thing I thought was a interesting easter egg was the water. Through out the whole series so far water has always been used as a metaphor for the one power, so in effect the suldam telling Egwene to pour her a cup of water is symbolic of the suldam ordering Egwene to give her her power. Pretty dark and horrible stuff when that realization sinks in.
Yes very astute in fact. Well done! I love when non-readers pick up on an Easter egg. Just so you know, there's any where from a couple to a dozen Easter eggs/clues in pretty much every episode. Very little that you are shown or told is meaningless.
Sooo, exactly what was it about my comment led you to the assumption that I haven't read the books?! I've actually read the books more than once each. Every time a new book came out I reread the whole series to be honest. 🤣🤣
Have a mini theory here def haven’t had the luxury of reading the books, I’m thinking the “Mother” Head Ali Sendai is the Big Evil One in charge of all this Crap!! And if not she’s number 1 in line?? Just a mini idea? What ha think?
Not the whole One Power, my friend, just the female half of it, cuz we all know what the male half metaphor is. Rand got told twice this season, you gotta TAKE what you want! And coming from the Two Rivers, he doesn't apprehend that concept. Two Rivers folk share what they have. Logain is from Ghealdan, where even the crown itself is pretty much up in the air, so channeling came easy for him.
As a book reader since 1994 I can tell you that power doesn‘t help in breaking an Adam collar, so even Nynaeve wouldn‘t have stood a chance. However, as strong in The One Power as Egwene might be, this situation builds up to further point out her true strength, which is her mind … as established in the first season. And it was ultimately her mind, the combination willpower and intellect, not magical power, that enabled Egwene to overcome her enslavement.
You're the first reviewer that's discussed the horrors of slavery and how it was depicted in The Wheel of Time. Thank you! The cruelty and inhumanity of the suldame and Lady Surak was the root of the abuse. I also think our history didn't teach us the extent to which the enslaved Africans were constantly resisting and revolting to be consistent with the myth of the happy, docile slave. This shows how inherently violent slavery is.
The Seanchan society and their slavery practices are based more on Ancient Egypt. It's complicated but most of Seanchan society is free and a slave or someone who is property of a member of the high Blood is actually highly prestigious and quite often rank well above that of an ordinary citizen and sometimes even above members of the low Blood. Like I said, it's complicated as hell and certainly not even close to being as cut and dry as simply having slaves and slave owners.
@Finnssssss Can we please not "Well actually" about slavery to Aisha or commenters who are expressing appreciation for her very eloquent reflection on the topic. Don't. Just don't.
RJ did state that there were many parallels between the American south and the Seanchan in interviews. I believe that's why he gave the Seanchan a southern drawl in the books.
I wasn't trying to take away from or promote slavery. Anyone implying I am is trying to get blood from a stone. I was simply providing context. For example, even though it doesn't seem like it but Rena, the sul'dam doing all this to Egwene, is also property but she is not property of any individual, she is property of the Empire itself. As I said, it's complicated.
I almost look forward to these reactions from you as much as the episodes itself. It's like having the best member of a really good book club & we are *here* for what you're cooking
BTW, the captured Sitter of the Blue Ajah (Maigan) is the woman who told Moiraine in season 1, ep 6 she had to stay in the Tower - hence why Moiraine got Siuan to banish her, so she could continue her work. And the reason Maigan said Moiraine had to stay and be a Sitter was because Maigan had to leave to investigate why ships kept disappearing off the coast in the West. 😳
Yep, I recognized her right away, and was shocked & horrified. I gasped, and started yelling at my husband "OMG! That's the lady from season 1 who told Moraine to stay, and said she was gonna leave to go investigate... " I just couldn't believe they had managed to capture her & do this to her! This is truly disgusting! I am DISGUSTED by what they do to these women, and I hope to God they get what's coming to them in the end. I hope the Dragon burns them all up for real.
Being a Sitter is a big deal. Not only are you superior to all others in your Ajah, but you are selected because of your age, craftiness, intelligence, and not least of all, your power level. Moiraine would have been a perfect choice, but she's never been a "work from home" kinda girl. I mean even when she left her family in Caihrien as a teenager, to go to the Tower, she was like DEUCES! I'm out! By the way, her uncle was King of Caihrien at the time. She would have inherited the crown after her father died. She didn't want it. Most Aes Sedai don't care about crowns anyway.
@rhysfriesen You really shouldn't have had many gripes. The show was good since episode one. I've loved Wheel of Time for over half my life and to see it realized has brought so much joy to me. As a black man I never read a book that made me forget I was black and made me feel equal in this world and it's future. Robert Jordan did that for me, I will forever be greatful.
Egwene didn't break. She did what was needed to survive. "Stone cracks from a hard enough blow.Steel shatters. The oak fights the wind and breaks. The willow bends where it must and survives" - Robert Jordan.
Indeed. Perhaps break wasn't the right word; my intent was to convey that she had to give in to some extent and kind of 'broke' her initial will to fight. But I didn't mean that she was out of the fight completely. As I said in my review, survival is the most important thing and whatever you have to do to attain it.
Next week's show is gonna be epic. And genius writing on the part of the author. I won't spoil it, but Egwene figures something out that will send ripples throughout the WHOLE of Seanchan society.
I've seen so many non-book readers hit the nail on the head with these new characters, it's such a credit to the writing, acting, and directing. You nailed a lot of Elayne in very little screentime.
13:50 “put the pain away, get to a point where you don’t even know what the pain feels like…” UGH the show runners do such a great job leading non-book readers to the right place. Your thoughts with Egwene are heading in the right direction for where her story goes.
Thank you so much for talking about slavery. The Seanchan are absolute masters of that psychological manipulation, and the a'dam is the perfect tool to control the way a person thinks. I think some people forget that magic aside, these are things that have actually happened in our history and that people have been put through those kinds of things.
Thanks so much! The slavery comparison was the first thing that came to my mind. I know it's been applied in many other scenarios though too which is so sad
The Seanchan also believe that they are in the right, to the point of benevolence, which, historically, is the case with chattel slavery. Even today you'll hear News figures say stuff like, "Oh, but they were well fed and housed and treated like family!" As if Africans hadn't already been feeding themselves, making homes, and having families for centuries before thier European "saviors" came to town.
I appreciate your reactions to Wheel of Time so much. You see deeply, very deeply for a non reader, keying in to things i didn't think the show had communicated, i look forward to your every reaction. Sending you some virtual hugs after this episode.
I am LOVING all these youtube channels doing reviews of Wheel of Time. It feels like there's a grass roots fandom for this series that other youtube channels missed out on. Really digging season 2 it almost feels like someone was given enough breathing space to do it right and give characters/drama a chance to breathe, while season 1 was a committee trying to check boxes off their list while a film gets produced like a machine.
Yo! The way Siuan pulled up at the end with the 14 other sisters is awesome, because in book two it happens in the beginning! The show did a UNO reverse on us! This is why I love watching! And yes, Liandrin and Alanna, and Verin are among the sisters she rolls up with in the second book.
in the book Min's vision always comes true no matter what.... so Min telling Mat to stay away would change absulutly nothing! and Min knows that ... her words were "Once I know what vision means it always comes true !".
Alivia "will help you die"... Her power was often enigmatic. She saw a moment, but what she saw may not have been what she thought. Ishamael is also in her head here, remember.
@@seanlamont8501 yes but those were vision she did not know what it meant, she said once she knows what it means nothing can prevent it from happening it always come to pass
@Berndr She's had visions that were conditional. If this happens then that ... Mind you, we're dealing with a different turning of the Wheel in the show, where all the characters are older and have had more life experiences. The only two that appear to be the same age as in the books are Elayne and Egwene, and even they strike me as at least 2 years older in the show.
Awesome reaction! Yeah it’s a really tough one. I knew what was coming and it was still hard. When Nynaeve and Elayne met Ryma in the last episode I was like 😬🫢 In the books we don’t actually see Ryma’s capture, but Egwene meets her in the “kennels”. Ryma will be in an even worse state because her Warder was killed.
Thank you! The actress who played Ryma did a great job of conveying how much losing her warder hurt her. The way she folded that sul'dam like a pretzel was telling, as were her bloodcurdling screams
3:06 in regards to High Lord Turok. He is just the leader of this military deployment. There are 5-10 Seanchan higher in rank above him up to the Empress (may she live forever). And it is pronounced Sean Chan, like Jackie Chan had a kid and named him Sean.
Damane are enslaved for life. If it isn’t disturbing enough, realisation that these women will live for centuries makes it worse. Also remember how young the girls were they took in Atuan’s mill. Some of these women probably don’t even know what life feels like. They didn’t live long enough (life as Damane is no life) to develop lively personalities as they grew up, experience love or even discover what they like or dislike or who they are as humans. It is truly horrifying if you think about implications of what is being done to them.
Brainwashed from almost birth. I don't think many could be freed. How can they? Not to make an exact analogy but an animal you raise from birth can't live in the wild, they were never taught. The psychology of this gets more disturbing later on in the books and I don't know if it reaches the same conclusion or outcome but if it does it's really a difficult subject and topic. This only really scratches the surface so far.
Understand that Moirane (as an Aes Sedai) could not lie, but needed to keep her secrets, partly to keep her family safe. The emotional pressures involved were intense.
Lanfear didn't lie though when she said she's been protecting Rand. In the books she's the one keeping the other Forsaken at bay until Rand gets it together.
@@seanlamont8501 Maybe don't outright reveal book details that haven't been revealed yet, explicitly, during the show. You got to experience the joy of learning those details via reading the books. Please leave that same discovery to non-book readers-- try not to be inadvertently inconsiderate and unfair.
The thing w/Liandarin is that she couldn't have done anything to Lanfear even if she tried. The Forsaken are 3,000yrs old, and far FAR more powerful than any ordinary channeler from the White Tower like Liandarin. So it was pointless to fight back. 😓 Wow, this show has done such a good job of giving depth to certain characters that didn't get it in the books! Like I was legit horrified when Lanfear told a bit of Liandarin's backstroy. Who knew she had suffered like that??! Not all of us could come out of that type of abuse w/our morals fully intact, lets be honest. Not when our life was survival of the fittest like that. I'm actually rooting for show Liandarin to come to her senses & betray tbe Darkness, and fight on the side of the Light eventually. They have made her into a character that I dont want to see have a sad ending. I actually want a redemption arc for her. And I NEVER thought I would feel this way, sooo... kudos to the show for getting me here. lol
I never thought I'd fall in love with Alanna Mosvani, but since season 1 episode 4 I was like damn, I love me some Alanna. In the books she's messy AF and I hated her.
“Gentle” is for men and “stilling” is for women. Different terminology but at their core means the same thing: cutting someone off from the power permanently
Commenting the slavery themes, Robert Jordan was wily by giving them a "slow drawl" in the books, having them sound straight up american in the show is perfection in subtext commentary. And maybe not quite as distracting as if they all sounded like foghorn leghorn.
One of the most disturbing things about the Seanchan and their enslavement of women who channel, is that the overwhelming majority of their citizens get to live peaceful, prosperous lives under just laws. The streets are safe, the local customs are mostly respected, and only the high nobility really mess with each other. So there's this hideous seductive quality to the whole thing. Sure, something like a tenth of a percent of women become brutally mistreated slaves, but everyone else starts thinking maybe this isn't so bad...
@@gregwillson7952 because it reflects the thinking of early Americans who became used to the money and affluence of the South that rolled in from free slave labor and found ways to make it palatable and "moral" to keep other human beings enslaved. 🤮 So horrifying, how easily manipulated society is. And, applicable in our own world in many ways.💔
I’m glad they gave them generic American accents instead of the southern accents in the book. But Seanchan are definitely drawing from slavery in the American south
a bit late to the party, but dang did this episode make me ugly cry throughout it and afterwards. as a victim of former abuse, it really gave me flashbacks. thanks for sharing all your thoughts and importance of past history, so insightful and full of truth. sending you a virtual hug after such a brutal episode 🧡
As a book reader, a thought just jumped into my head. What would be the first thought that a green ajah girl would have, to learn that the reincarnation of the most powerful channeling MALE was just found?- lol Alana: "I need to make my own inspection..."
As always I love your reactions and commentary. You should really guest on The Dusty Wheel I think you would bring great contributions to the conversation.
****Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers!!The Seanchan are a very stratified society. The show may go into it but maybe not. The collar cannot be opened except by someone else. I do wish that they had shown that the collar also gives pleasure. So the damane are rewarded for "good" behavior. Very creepy. Damane don't die from training. They are "worth" too much. It is a day of celebration in Seanchan when a young woman is revealed to be a Sul'dam or leash holder. All women are tested at the age of 14 or so. If the collar holds them they are Damane. If they can operate the bracelet they are Sul'dam.
That was a really tough one to watch. A great job from the actors making it really viscerally horrifying and brutal, but ow. (I have read the books and I knew Egwene's captivity was coming, but anticipating it really didn't help! 😬) At some point in your review you said "being broken once doesn't necessarily mean you stay broken" and I think you're exactly right there, both in general and for Egwene's plotline specifically. Anyone can be beaten down by enough force, but that doesn't mean they'll stay down forever; Egwene still has fight in her, and she *will* hit back when she gets a chance. I wonder if knowing an Aes Sedai is in the next cell over might steel her resolve - I think Egwene is the kind of person who'd fight to save others even more strongly than for herself alone. I appreciate your thoughts on all of it, and hope the show will give us some serious catharsis in the next couple episodes! 🤞Down with the Seanchan! 🔥
You've actually seen Lews Therin. He's in the cold open to Episode 8, the one with a man and a woman arguing in the Old Tongue back in the Second Age. Played by Alexander Karim. EDIT: Elayne an actual princess. She's allowed to talk to her brothers, her mother, foreign dignitaries, and her servants. She likes one of the brothers. In-book there is no evidence that her mother risked letting other noble children spend a lot of time with her. She's also basically a college freshman whose made a real friend at school. So, yeah, she's gonna be more attached to Egwene then a grown-ass woman with a pack of friends waiting at home.
I imagine this also had to be extremely rough for Madeleine Madden to film as an Aboriginal woman whose (not too distant) ancestors were probably enslaved by the British or Australians.
This episode along with your no nonsense break down of group think is tip top notch! I've been loving going through this series with you. Keep em coming :)
Thank you for another very insigful if distressing reaction. You are spot on in describing how the Seanchan and the sul'dam in particualr break down their captive damane. In the books we have the thoughts of various charactes who describe the process. It starts with pain and being told they are nothng, they are no one they are not human. Eventually even the strongest willed will start to crack just like Egwene eventually did with the water. Those cracks are reinforced and the damane becomes more used to obeying to avoid punishment. Occasionally the sul'dam will thrown in a treat, not like a present you might give a person but more a pat on the head to your dog, perhaps a ribbon in their hair like a horse. As demenaing and disgustiong as this is the damane at this stage are in such a wretched state that they start craving any hint of kindness. More and more they strive to be what the Seanchan consider to be a good damane so she can earn some warped hints of kindless. All the while she is being told over and over, she is not a person she is a thing and the sooner you accept that the easier it will be for her. Its totally messed up but historically accurate. One of Robert Jordan's greatest strenghts were taking historical patterns, beliefs practices etc and incorproating them into the various groups in his world. There is a Wheel of Time world map. Randland as its called is effectivly a reshaped Europe with a bit of the Middle East pushed up to become the Aiel Waste. It's intersting that Jordan who was from North Carolina chose to depect the Seanchan with their slavery and imperalismy as haling from what would on the map be North and South America. Just to add context and this is by no means meant to excuse or justify what the sul'dam do but there are reasons the Seanchan have this view of female channlers. I won't spoil anthing but they dropped the first clue when the sul'dam mentioned that the first adam (collar) was created by an Aes Sedai. The sul'dam are a bit like the Red Ajah. Some are sadists who like inflicting suffering for its own sake but most see what they are doing as necessary for the greater good of the world. While some of the damane might come from Seanchan and others are captured on this continent all the sul'dam come from the Seanchan continant where they don't know any different. This is what they have been taught from birth. Of couse the longer they are here the greater the chances they will be exposed to new cultures that might make some of them at least question what they have been taught. Plus some of our characters will have a thing to say about what they are doing to Egwene. Again I don't want to spoil anthing but i will say this, its dark for Egwene now but the dawn will come and if its anything like the books it will be beautiful. Plus very, very satasfying.
Lanfear was playing Rand like a puppet on a string. Playing good cop, bad cop with Ishamael in Rand's dream so she could show up to "save" him, and then asking who he would like to see, knowing full well it would be Egwene and knowing full well where Egwene was and how seeing her would get him exactly where she (and Ishamael) wanted him.
She was, I guess my point was that the actress (to me) was showing that there is still an emotional element to it all for Rand(Lews) for her. She was NOT having him showing affection to Egwane right in front of her salad 🤣🤣🤣
@@AishaWilson I agree. I think she was doing whatever the devious plan was, to get Rand to do what Ishamael wanted, and showing him Egwene was part of that, but she did NOT like seeing his affection!
You know, i'm not sure Rand was being as gullible as it looked. The way he switched from calling her Lanfear to Selene, and how later he told Mat he knew they wanted him to go to Falme (i'm not so sure the condition he told Moiraine was real or not). Book Rand is naive at first, very much so with Selene, but he is not stupid at all, hope to see him playing the game more in the show too!
The slavery comparison obviously comes to mind first, but tbh the more scenes we see with Egwane I couldn’t help but start seeing more of a misogynistic view like.. that’s dead ass what women experience. The control/power dynamic presented like a partnership, getting to “keep” her name (women are expected to change their surname), everything! All in a goal to make her believe her power now belongs to someone else, and she should be ashamed for it. Like wow
This episode was even more devastating than what I imagined while reading the books. Seeing it just does something that a book medium can't. It truely showed how their culture is so brutal.
@@AishaWilson I agree it was well done, brutal but well done. I can't wait to see the finale with the people working on this stating what they were in interviews.
Heavy episode, heavy reaction/analysis. Nicely done, Aisha (as usual). Many emotions leaked their way right out my eyes! Since you asked (well, so I infer), in the books' glossaries, Robert Jordan provided pronunciations (of sorts) for many of the important or unusual names. However, his pronunciation "guidance" does have a measure of ambiguity, particularly for vowel sounds, so there is a lot of variation in readers' aural head canons. Even what is recognized/accepted in the public fandom is different from many of those head canons. (Heck, I know some of my own head canon is wrong compared to RJ's [apparent] intentions.) I think the clearest thing about these is his use of all caps to indicate which syllables get the stress. Of course, being that the show is an adaptation, it takes liberties with these just as it does with storylines, so we roll with it and enjoy it all the same! :) Here are a few (in RJ parlance itself) of ones we've had in the show (and that have the most variances): Cairhien (KEYE-ree-EHN), Tar Valon (TAHR VAH-lon), Aes Sedai (EYEZ seh-DEYE), damane (dah-MAHN-ee), a'dam (AYE-dam) (I believe this is pronounced using a long-a sound [like, "day"] and a short-a sound [like "ham"]), sul'dam (SUHL-DAHM), Moiraine (mwah-RAIN), Nynaeve (NIGH-neev), Egwene (eh-GWAIN), Loial (LOY-ahl), Ishamael (ih-SHAH-may-EHL), angreal (anh-gree-AHL), ter'angreal (TEER-ahn-GREE-ahl), sa'angreal (SAH-ahn-GREE-ahl). And the above is an example of nerd slipping out my fingertips when falling back asleep is eluding me.
Great seeing a person of color react to this episode, and the psychology of slavery. I read the books in the 1990s, and remember recoiling from Egwene's scenes, here. Visually, it's a different experience than in print, but even the print was hard to read. Thanks for these reactions.
I'm loving your perspective. As a long time book-fan, I was concerned about how they were going to portray the Damane-Sul'dam slavery issue. Your comments are *extremely* appreciated, and I cannot wait to see your reaction at the end of the season
Your reaction and insights are fantastic as always, thank you for the video. With regard to Ryma being able to do it herself with the power to avoid capture, that would be against the Aes Sedai oaths. They cannot use the power as a weapon except in defense of their life, their warder's life or the life of another Aes Sedai.
1:03:02 nope, all of Min’s visions have come true. But you are right, you can survive a knife to the gut in this world with Aes Sedai healers. (This vision wasn’t in the books so we are all curious what will happen next)
Book readers have told me that all of the visions that Min has do eventually come true. And I'm pretty sure of Min said as much in season 1 when she was talking with Moraine, IIRC. The 'when and why' are what are subject to change, I suppose. But yeah, everything that she sees eventually comes true. But you are absolutely right that we need to be focussing on the specifics of what we are given. Mat did not kill Rand... just stabs him. Now it is concerning that Min specifically mentioned that it was the ruby gem evil dagger(which I don't really think was made completely obvious in the show... Maybe due to the glowy special effects ** I** didn't see that it was the Ruby evil dagger... But they confirmed that it was in this episode .. Or at least they confirmed that MIN thinks that that was what the dagger was... And since the book has so much unreliable narration/information happening it COULD be the same here.).... But that means that Mat eventually gives in and grabs it again which is not good. But yeah, Rand probably isn't dead from it, IMO.
Yeah in the books she didn't see the exact event happen, she saw symbolisms and had to figure it out. Sometimes she knew right away what it meant and in those cases, it always came true. Most of the time though she could only describe what she saw and only guess what it meant. Other times she had no idea what a given vision meant. The other big thing they have changed is how many Forsaken there are, 13 in the books, going to be 8 in the show. A couple will just be eliminated as they were useless toolbags lol, others will be amalgamated. One such is Lanfear. In the books Lanfear is more benevolent, always wore all white and was very calm but also had a 0-100 crazy anger. Her biggest rival among the Forsaken was Semirhage who was wantonly cruel, arrogant and wore all black just to contrast Lanfear's white. What they have done is combine them into a character that has a much greater range of evil and ruthlessness than either than either had on their own. As a long time book reader, I for one am enjoying what they did and how much more dangerous this version of Lanfear is. This bitch is scary af
@@Finnssssss thank you so much for this explanation that goes into more detail about Mins' powers. I had not heard it described like that before! That's very interesting. I, personally, don't have any interest in reading the source material so I greatly greatly appreciate this explanation! I also was not aware that the Lanfear in the show is an amalgamation of her and another Forsaken... I've not heard any book readers say that so far but that's really interesting as well and I think that change makes sense.
@@AnxietyRat I need to clarify the amalgamation of the two is my opinion, it hasn't been confirmed yet but it's obvious at this point, first off in the books Semirhage was Lady Suroth's Truth Speaker and that role has been replaced by Ishamael and then especially after the scene with Liandrin's son. That scene was 1000% Semirhage as before she went to the shadow she was one of the greatest healers alive. After going to the Shadow, she used that knowledge to become their #1 interrogator and torturer.
As book readers when we saw the figurines of the Forsaken back in s1e5 we knew 6 of them right away and are pretty confident on the 7th. The 8th was fuzzy and hard to make out but after Lanfear and Ishys conversation this season where they confirmed what we already guessed was the 2 females Graendal (figurine with boobs out) Moghedien (figurine with spider web designs) then referring to the remaining as the boys we now know the 8th is a Male. In the books it was 8 Male, 5 female. The show will be 5 Male, 3 female.
Brute force would never work in the collar. Nynaeve would be trapped the same as Egwene and every other woman who can channel, with no way out herself.
Yes indeed, gentled for men and stilled for women. I think the difference in terms refers to the specific emotional processes required to embrace both sides of the one power. Males have to forcefully take hold of it and wrestle it and women have to submit to it and let it flow through them.
I might be mistaken but the forceful nature of the male side might be from the dark ones taint on the male side. It may have once been similar for both sides.
Naaawr, what about the poor innocent people of Falme and the captured damane and other slaves?? 😭 I'm sure there's an open area nearby they can have it out. 😬
Oh my god you almost figured it out ...when talking about the ADAM collar ... the clue was in its device name lol ... keep thinking you are on the right path
36:20 oh hard same-though I appreciate the work the show did to hone in on the perverted “relationship” between master and slave, bc from seeing one or two book people I think the torture was a lot more physical in the books? And I think the fact that slavery is inherently violent, even if a slave master never lays a hand on the person they enslaved, could easily get lost if they lean hard towards torture porn. 39:47 I’d also say-people were CONSTANTLY revolting*; one of my “favorite” (feels weird calling it that but we move) books is a chronicling of ship revolts, and even though by their nature these types of revolts were nearly pointless in getting back home (where was anyone going once it’s open ocean on all sides) they still happened. *i tend to include anything that “harms” the “product” or “productivity” in the definition of revolt, so fighting like egwene, dying by suicide like you thought ryma could’ve, if any of the damane let their suldam die, etc. 47:16 it also is a great parallel into how oppressor cultures try and harness the cultures of those they oppress, and when they don’t have control they throw a tantrum
Brutal episode, and it was disturbing to read the scenes as well. I think it was acted extremely well however by Madeleine. Again i enjoyed the reaction.
They casted Egwene perfectly ... the pouty, petulant, know it all from the Two Rivers who's always in everyone's business, but has a good heart deep down. The viewers have no idea what she becomes. And neither did we readers until it was too late. 😂😂😂😂 I wasn't ready!
Using the terminology of the time, males are "gentled"; women are "stilled." However, before "The Breaking" (in the "Age of Legends,") the term "severed" was used instead, regardless of gender.
Egwene is one of the strongest channelers of her age, but brute force cannot break the collar. While Nynaeve would be able to best her in _raw_ power, the strength of will and strength of mind _cannot_ be overstated. Let’s just say this is something many, especially the Forsaken, never really understand.
One thing about this series is the clash of cultures and how strongly everyone believes in the *rightness* of their own. The Seanchan believe women who can channel are dangerous and have to be leashed for everyone's safety just as much as Aes Sedai feel men who cam channel must be gentled, just as much as the Aiel believe ji'e'toh is the only right way to live just as much as the Tinkers believe the Way of the Leaf is the only way to go just as much as the Whitecloaks think Aes Sedai are dangerous and need to be stopped. It seems to start out so reasonably, thinking such immense power in the hands of just any random person is a danger to everyone because what if that random person is a psychopath? That's how we got Forsaken. Imagine hundreds of Lanfears walking around blowing up people's heads with no way to stop them. So you can understand people wanting some safety checks put in place - like the Aes Sedai have the Three Oaths. But what if you have a channeler that isn't an Aes Sedai? It is a valid question.. But the Seanchan took it to way dark and extreme levels, stripping them of their humanity and enslaving them in the sickest fashion.
@@AishaWilson 👀 I just... want to clarify in case any of this came off as pro-slavery... seriously f the Seanchan in all possible ways. I'm a Black woman too, and as far as I'm concerned their whole society can sit on a cactus and spin. But I do like to examine where people see the logic in their actions since it helps understand their motivations beyond just being mustache twirling villains.
It is okay to feel triggered by this episode, nobody ever needs to apologise for that! I hope you're okay, I know how numb I felt and I knew it was coming. I really do feel for the new viewers who had no idea what was coming. This episode hits home in so many ways, and as a result makes it really difficult to watch but those are often the things that make us humans take a deeper look at our perspectives and i appreciate the time you're taking to discuss the way it's making you feel in spite of the fact it's not an easy thing to talk about. All the best Aisha, hopefully the last two episodes will give us some hope for the light, because this is rock bottom in terms of stress for the characters
I was both looking forward to and not looking forward to your reaction to this episode, assuming it would potentially be very triggering. Thanks for sharing your reaction and thoughts!
What Min does, and also what Perin doesn't have nothing to do with channelling one power. Those are abilities from the first age (before humans discovered and learned to chanell one power) aka time we live in today according to book lore 😊 Gentling and Stilling are analogues. As one power is composed of two interlocking parts, Saidar channeled by women, and Saidin which is channelled by men. Saidin isn't evil on it's own, and men in second age used to channel freely side by side with women. Which is how they we able to do incredible feets of engineering and science. The reason men go mad from channeling (at the moment) is because Saidin got contaminated with the dark power when previous dragon (Lews) battled the dark one in order to reseal his prison.
Also forcing Loial to sing to bonsai was way more messed up than it seems. Ogier sing to trees out of love, and connect to them on a personal and spiritual level, which makes trees grow strong majestic and happy. To him that poor tree was enslaved and tortured, living in a tiny pot away from the Sun and soil. In his mind he was making a caged child grow larger in his already too small of a cage 😢
Damn this show for making me actually feel sympathy for Liandrin! Trust me in the books you basically want to throw her out a window about 2 chapters into meeting her.
I really hope we get to see Ryma freed, and other women freed in the future. The depiction of slavery in this is so disturbing and upsetting. It will really rub me the wrong way if it doesn’t get resolved
The damane teaching of channeling is a juxtaposition for what Rand needs in a teacher. Not the collar or beatings...but that guiding thru of the weaves and someone able to handle weaves if Rand is channeling too much.
I noticed that, that's why I said in the reaction that while I hated the method, the sul'dans lessons for Egwane were good and helping her learn how to channel, which the tower seemed to be slacking on considering the state of the world.
@@AishaWilson I feel like the Tower training is basically thinking, we're gonna live for a really long time, so let's take it slow and safe because what's the rush? While the damane training is wanting a shiny new weapon ready to fight ASAP. I think the Tower scenes have had some dialogue about the impending Last Battle and needing to get these girls trained (aka Nynaeve having her Accepted test so quickly), but change comes slow in a system that's been in place for thousands of years.
Incredibly triggering episode and even during the reaction portion of this video I had to look away at Egwene and Ryma's scenes. For us to get our first darkskinned Aes Sedai just for her to be enslaved in the same episode, it really rubbed me the wrong way. I hated every minute of it down to her capture. As incredibly diverse as the casting has been for this show is, its not lost on me that it feels like the main cast all had to pass the damn paper bag test to get chosen for the major roles. I was very much looking forward to Ryma having a bigger part to play in the series but I suppose only time will tell. I'm hoping she gets freed and escapes with Egwene. I was angry this entire episode. I CANNOT WAIT for Egwene to get her lick back and burn this place to the ground. I want Rena's head on a pike. I HATED her treating Egwene like an unruly dog she was trying to break in. The abusive, psychological torture was almost worse than the physical torture. Truly disgusting. I appreciate your insights on this. You are really the only reviewer to touch on this. When I saw we were delving into the topic of slavery I was like lordt I wonder what all my Black reviewers are going to say about this episode. You hit it out of the part with the analysis as always. Incredible work!
I thought this was a great episode but it was really hard to watch. Im going through intense trauma therapy at the moment and this episode felt very real! I was desensitised to Egwenes situation but seeing the Aes Sedai lose and get enslaved set me off for some reason. Cant wait to see the Seanchan get their asses kicked! And hopefully some slaves freed. I wonder how the female slave master channelers get their stations and why they dont become damane themselves. Im guessing that damane are taken from ofher cultures
I get that about the Aes Sedai. The idea of losing your freedom, especially knowing what that means (and if you've managed to escape/avoid it) would be really hard to take and very disheartening. And YES do down with the seanchan!
Yeah, the gentling versus stilling terminology is kind of based in... Like neutering and castrating animals. Most male animals that have testosterone running through their body will potentially become more aggressive once they hit puberty.... and so when you castrate them those behavioral issues will often quiet down and gentle.... But a lot of animals that are female and have estrogen... My expertise is in rodents, but I'm sure it applies to a bunch of other mammals, they're usually constantly on the move... Female rats have significantly more energy than male rats do through their entire lives. Male rats usually eventually mellow out and become kind of cuddly whereas female rats will pretty much always stay active until injury or sickness takes them out... And so stilling as terminology make sense within the context of rodents, anyway ( I've had a couple of pet rats and so I've witnessed their hormonal aggression happen a couple times ... It technically can happen with females as well but it's significantly more common in males).... So yeah for the books to use gentling and stilling as terms is REALLY interesting and kind of... Is an analogy to cutting off sex hormone production via ovaries and testicles.(and the one power is also an analogy to drug addiction in our real world as well)... The books and the show and the magic system is very gender binary which is... Outdated and not really how biology works...it's not so cut-and-dry, black and white, male and female, IRL. But unfortunately the books are a product of their time and so the books never explore non-binary or intersex individuals and how the one power might interact with them.
I'd love to see someone "born male" who figures out they're actually channeling saidar. Or someone who realizes they can touch both saidar and saidin, mixing them. I know the Bookcloaks would freak, but they'll freak about everything anyway, so who cares. 😜
@@ElysiaBrenner yeah, I don't know if there any fanfictions where writers are exploring that type of storyline. I agree it would be super duper interesting and I would absolutely read it!.... It just unfortunately wouldn't be canon to the book series, right? The fanfic writer would have to kind of create their own lore for how and why and when this happens... I have not personally seen any fanfic writers delve into this topic... But I think it would be super cool to explore.
@@AnxietyRat As long as it doesn't go against the established lore, it could just be said to fill in the lore. The lore didn't say trans/enby people don't exist (there's some trans rep, the wrong kind, won't elaborate here bc spoilers), but the books just didn't address what that would look like. I'm definitely not holding my breath, but I'd love to see little nods like that in the series proper!
@@ElysiaBrenner- "I know the bookcloaks would freak, but they freak out about everything anyway so who cares??" *YES* 🙄🤣 LMAOO lol Even when the show gives us lore accurate scenes (like this very episode, with all of the stuff happening re: Egwyene) the bookcloaks *STILL* find reasons to b*tch & moan! Nothing is EVER done right in their eyes. Even when people are acting their asses off ffs. So I have been avoiding the channels that only complain, or that push some "anti-woke" agenda cuz I'm SICK TO DEATH of that sh*t. Not ALL of the book readers hate the show mind you... but some of them are constantly foaming at the mouth even when the show gives us scenes ripped right outta the pages of the books! So that tells you right there that these people just *WANT* to be f*cking mad at everything at this point, and will never give the show a positive rating on anything. Doesn't matter how good it gets. I do love that it pisses them off how much praise the show is getting now for season 2, compared to the 1st season. Those "bookcloaks" thought everybody was gonna hop on their bandwagon & help them to bury the show in negative reviews, HOWEVER... They've all been shocked realizing that when people DON'T have some agenda... **gasp** they're actually able to critique the show rather fairly, and give it props when it does something RIGHT too. Wow, imagine that.
@@KabbalahSherry it's my experience as a fan of the books for more than a decade, and a member of a large community of book fans (Twitter of Time), that most book readers do enjoy the show and appreciate the adaptation. But there are certain groups that scream the loudest. A bunch of them are currently looking for show-only fans on social media to drop major end-of-series spoilers into their mentions. It's exhausting.
Suian wasn't in most of the season due to scheduling issues. The Aes Sedai couldn't use the Power against herself because of the three oaths. At least that's what I figured. The show does Mat and Min soooo dirty. That really took me out of this episode honestly. Mat and Min have been the low point this entire season. The episodes have been getting better, and this was a amazing recreation of what happens to Eqwene. Again. Imagine waiting for season 3 for judgement on the season.
I wish we were seeing more of Mat at least since we were introduced to him more last season, but I'm gong to trust in the showrunners and hope it gets better next season
I’m sorry but slavery was not a mentality, IT WAS THE LAW, and then Jim Crow. Group think has nothing to do with actual systems like you can’t work this job or buy a house in this area and you couldn’t walk in this public building. It is a little ahhh.
I disagree. It was a law yes but to keep millions of ppl in that system for so long when the numbers were in their favor proves that there was a mental element to it- and not just for the slaves. The ruling class also had to be brainwashed into thinking that slaves weren't even human to justify the poor treatment and atrocities committed against them. The reason the laws overturned was bc there were those that rejected the mental conditioning of slavery and chose to believe in humanity.
Ok the book readers know what happens when you get stabbed with that ruby hilted dager the show messed up big time by letting it be weakened atthe end of season one
Most awful show every. I can never get back the time wasted watching that horrid show. Long and boring, hateful and unpleasant at every opportunity. Nothing redeemable here.
One thing I thought was a interesting easter egg was the water. Through out the whole series so far water has always been used as a metaphor for the one power, so in effect the suldam telling Egwene to pour her a cup of water is symbolic of the suldam ordering Egwene to give her her power. Pretty dark and horrible stuff when that realization sinks in.
Wow, good observation!
Yes very astute in fact. Well done!
I love when non-readers pick up on an Easter egg.
Just so you know, there's any where from a couple to a dozen Easter eggs/clues in pretty much every episode. Very little that you are shown or told is meaningless.
Sooo, exactly what was it about my comment led you to the assumption that I haven't read the books?! I've actually read the books more than once each. Every time a new book came out I reread the whole series to be honest. 🤣🤣
Have a mini theory here def haven’t had the luxury of reading the books, I’m thinking the “Mother” Head Ali Sendai is the Big Evil One in charge of all this Crap!! And if not she’s number 1 in line?? Just a mini idea? What ha think?
Not the whole One Power, my friend, just the female half of it, cuz we all know what the male half metaphor is. Rand got told twice this season, you gotta TAKE what you want! And coming from the Two Rivers, he doesn't apprehend that concept. Two Rivers folk share what they have. Logain is from Ghealdan, where even the crown itself is pretty much up in the air, so channeling came easy for him.
36:00 when the Blue Sitter announced her title, it did help Egwene. It showed Egwene she was stronger than one of the strongest Aes Sedai.
As a book reader since 1994 I can tell you that power doesn‘t help in breaking an Adam collar, so even Nynaeve wouldn‘t have stood a chance. However, as strong in The One Power as Egwene might be, this situation builds up to further point out her true strength, which is her mind … as established in the first season. And it was ultimately her mind, the combination willpower and intellect, not magical power, that enabled Egwene to overcome her enslavement.
You're the first reviewer that's discussed the horrors of slavery and how it was depicted in The Wheel of Time. Thank you!
The cruelty and inhumanity of the suldame and Lady Surak was the root of the abuse. I also think our history didn't teach us the extent to which the enslaved Africans were constantly resisting and revolting to be consistent with the myth of the happy, docile slave. This shows how inherently violent slavery is.
The Seanchan society and their slavery practices are based more on Ancient Egypt.
It's complicated but most of Seanchan society is free and a slave or someone who is property of a member of the high Blood is actually highly prestigious and quite often rank well above that of an ordinary citizen and sometimes even above members of the low Blood.
Like I said, it's complicated as hell and certainly not even close to being as cut and dry as simply having slaves and slave owners.
@Finnssssss Can we please not "Well actually" about slavery to Aisha or commenters who are expressing appreciation for her very eloquent reflection on the topic. Don't. Just don't.
@@Finnssssssthe Seanchan are 100% based on Americans hence the accent. RJ was a southern liberal he knew well the atrocities of American slavery.
RJ did state that there were many parallels between the American south and the Seanchan in interviews. I believe that's why he gave the Seanchan a southern drawl in the books.
I wasn't trying to take away from or promote slavery. Anyone implying I am is trying to get blood from a stone. I was simply providing context.
For example, even though it doesn't seem like it but Rena, the sul'dam doing all this to Egwene, is also property but she is not property of any individual, she is property of the Empire itself.
As I said, it's complicated.
Ryma Galfrey Sedai. Never forget her name.
I almost look forward to these reactions from you as much as the episodes itself. It's like having the best member of a really good book club & we are *here* for what you're cooking
Awn thank you so much! That means a lot 💕
BTW, the captured Sitter of the Blue Ajah (Maigan) is the woman who told Moiraine in season 1, ep 6 she had to stay in the Tower - hence why Moiraine got Siuan to banish her, so she could continue her work.
And the reason Maigan said Moiraine had to stay and be a Sitter was because Maigan had to leave to investigate why ships kept disappearing off the coast in the West. 😳
Yep, I recognized her right away, and was shocked & horrified. I gasped, and started yelling at my husband "OMG! That's the lady from season 1 who told Moraine to stay, and said she was gonna leave to go investigate... " I just couldn't believe they had managed to capture her & do this to her! This is truly disgusting! I am DISGUSTED by what they do to these women, and I hope to God they get what's coming to them in the end. I hope the Dragon burns them all up for real.
Being a Sitter is a big deal. Not only are you superior to all others in your Ajah, but you are selected because of your age, craftiness, intelligence, and not least of all, your power level. Moiraine would have been a perfect choice, but she's never been a "work from home" kinda girl. I mean even when she left her family in Caihrien as a teenager, to go to the Tower, she was like DEUCES! I'm out! By the way, her uncle was King of Caihrien at the time. She would have inherited the crown after her father died. She didn't want it. Most Aes Sedai don't care about crowns anyway.
@@seanlamont8501 I expect we'll be getting more of Laman's story, maybe as soon as next week.
That was like some Lars Von Trier levels of despair. This episode made me completely forget about any gripes I've had with the show thus far.
@rhysfriesen
You really shouldn't have had many gripes. The show was good since episode one. I've loved Wheel of Time for over half my life and to see it realized has brought so much joy to me.
As a black man I never read a book that made me forget I was black and made me feel equal in this world and it's future. Robert Jordan did that for me, I will forever be greatful.
Egwene didn't break. She did what was needed to survive. "Stone cracks from a hard enough blow.Steel shatters. The oak fights the wind and breaks. The willow bends where it must and survives" - Robert Jordan.
Indeed. Perhaps break wasn't the right word; my intent was to convey that she had to give in to some extent and kind of 'broke' her initial will to fight. But I didn't mean that she was out of the fight completely. As I said in my review, survival is the most important thing and whatever you have to do to attain it.
She was broken and was upset with herself that she was. Doesn't mean you have to stay broken, but she was. You can't jedi mind trick the A'dam
Next week's show is gonna be epic. And genius writing on the part of the author. I won't spoil it, but Egwene figures something out that will send ripples throughout the WHOLE of Seanchan society.
@nard1000 yeah still spoiled it.
@nard1000 yeah, a bit spoilery. Don't be doin dat. Have a heart and have a delete.
I've seen so many non-book readers hit the nail on the head with these new characters, it's such a credit to the writing, acting, and directing. You nailed a lot of Elayne in very little screentime.
13:50 “put the pain away, get to a point where you don’t even know what the pain feels like…” UGH the show runners do such a great job leading non-book readers to the right place. Your thoughts with Egwene are heading in the right direction for where her story goes.
Embrace the pain
Thank you so much for talking about slavery. The Seanchan are absolute masters of that psychological manipulation, and the a'dam is the perfect tool to control the way a person thinks. I think some people forget that magic aside, these are things that have actually happened in our history and that people have been put through those kinds of things.
Thanks so much! The slavery comparison was the first thing that came to my mind. I know it's been applied in many other scenarios though too which is so sad
The Seanchan also believe that they are in the right, to the point of benevolence, which, historically, is the case with chattel slavery. Even today you'll hear News figures say stuff like, "Oh, but they were well fed and housed and treated like family!" As if Africans hadn't already been feeding themselves, making homes, and having families for centuries before thier European "saviors" came to town.
I appreciate your reactions to Wheel of Time so much. You see deeply, very deeply for a non reader, keying in to things i didn't think the show had communicated, i look forward to your every reaction. Sending you some virtual hugs after this episode.
Wow, thank you so much 💕
I am LOVING all these youtube channels doing reviews of Wheel of Time. It feels like there's a grass roots fandom for this series that other youtube channels missed out on. Really digging season 2 it almost feels like someone was given enough breathing space to do it right and give characters/drama a chance to breathe, while season 1 was a committee trying to check boxes off their list while a film gets produced like a machine.
I've been a mess after this episode and hearing your thoughts broke me all over again. Thank you for opening up and sharing.
You are so welcome 💕
Yo! The way Siuan pulled up at the end with the 14 other sisters is awesome, because in book two it happens in the beginning! The show did a UNO reverse on us! This is why I love watching! And yes, Liandrin and Alanna, and Verin are among the sisters she rolls up with in the second book.
in the book Min's vision always comes true no matter what.... so Min telling Mat to stay away would change absulutly nothing! and Min knows that ... her words were "Once I know what vision means it always comes true !".
Alivia "will help you die"... Her power was often enigmatic. She saw a moment, but what she saw may not have been what she thought. Ishamael is also in her head here, remember.
She has had visions in the books that are not finite. Aka Siuan and you know who ...
@@seanlamont8501 yes but those were vision she did not know what it meant, she said once she knows what it means nothing can prevent it from happening it always come to pass
@Berndr
She's had visions that were conditional. If this happens then that ...
Mind you, we're dealing with a different turning of the Wheel in the show, where all the characters are older and have had more life experiences. The only two that appear to be the same age as in the books are Elayne and Egwene, and even they strike me as at least 2 years older in the show.
Oh Aisha. I felt it with you! Love all your thoughts, thank you for show us your heart 😢❤
43:54 oh girl!!!! Just because you braked once doesn’t means you stay broken! WORD! ❤❤❤
Awesome reaction! Yeah it’s a really tough one. I knew what was coming and it was still hard. When Nynaeve and Elayne met Ryma in the last episode I was like 😬🫢
In the books we don’t actually see Ryma’s capture, but Egwene meets her in the “kennels”. Ryma will be in an even worse state because her Warder was killed.
Thank you! The actress who played Ryma did a great job of conveying how much losing her warder hurt her. The way she folded that sul'dam like a pretzel was telling, as were her bloodcurdling screams
seeing violations of autonomy is visceral, full body reaction
3:06 in regards to High Lord Turok. He is just the leader of this military deployment. There are 5-10 Seanchan higher in rank above him up to the Empress (may she live forever). And it is pronounced Sean Chan, like Jackie Chan had a kid and named him Sean.
Damane are enslaved for life. If it isn’t disturbing enough, realisation that these women will live for centuries makes it worse. Also remember how young the girls were they took in Atuan’s mill. Some of these women probably don’t even know what life feels like. They didn’t live long enough (life as Damane is no life) to develop lively personalities as they grew up, experience love or even discover what they like or dislike or who they are as humans. It is truly horrifying if you think about implications of what is being done to them.
Brainwashed from almost birth. I don't think many could be freed. How can they? Not to make an exact analogy but an animal you raise from birth can't live in the wild, they were never taught. The psychology of this gets more disturbing later on in the books and I don't know if it reaches the same conclusion or outcome but if it does it's really a difficult subject and topic. This only really scratches the surface so far.
At one point in the books they free one that has been a damane for over 400 years...
@@Finnssssss- OMG 🤧💔
@Finnssssss Do the people that controls them live as much damanes?
@@adrian937a yes and no. Any other answer involves spoilers 😎
Understand that Moirane (as an Aes Sedai) could not lie, but needed to keep her secrets, partly to keep her family safe. The emotional pressures involved were intense.
I have a feeling that Ishy wasn’t really in Rand’s dream this episode and Lanfear conjured him up to manipulate Rand.
I felt like that as well
Oh I could see that. I know so little of how the dreamwalking works and how Lanfear uses it that I have no idea.
Lanfear didn't lie though when she said she's been protecting Rand. In the books she's the one keeping the other Forsaken at bay until Rand gets it together.
@@seanlamont8501
Maybe don't outright reveal book details that haven't been revealed yet, explicitly, during the show.
You got to experience the joy of learning those details via reading the books. Please leave that same discovery to non-book readers-- try not to be inadvertently inconsiderate and unfair.
@@eme.261
Ummmm. It has been revealed Lol.
"I feel like his father is the only one who can speak any sense into him." That's an incredibly clairvoyant observation from you Aisha. :)
It's going to be so great when they finally reveal how to remove the collar and who figures it out! I can't wait to see your reaction! 😄
I'm so ready for it!
The thing w/Liandarin is that she couldn't have done anything to Lanfear even if she tried. The Forsaken are 3,000yrs old, and far FAR more powerful than any ordinary channeler from the White Tower like Liandarin. So it was pointless to fight back. 😓 Wow, this show has done such a good job of giving depth to certain characters that didn't get it in the books! Like I was legit horrified when Lanfear told a bit of Liandarin's backstroy. Who knew she had suffered like that??!
Not all of us could come out of that type of abuse w/our morals fully intact, lets be honest. Not when our life was survival of the fittest like that. I'm actually rooting for show Liandarin to come to her senses & betray tbe Darkness, and fight on the side of the Light eventually. They have made her into a character that I dont want to see have a sad ending. I actually want a redemption arc for her. And I NEVER thought I would feel this way, sooo... kudos to the show for getting me here. lol
Nyneave is in the 4th highest power level. Lanfear is in the top level.
I never thought I'd fall in love with Alanna Mosvani, but since season 1 episode 4 I was like damn, I love me some Alanna. In the books she's messy AF and I hated her.
@@seanlamont8501- Yes! Show Alanna just loves fighting, f*cking & food... and I'm here for all of it! 😂 hahaha
“Gentle” is for men and “stilling” is for women. Different terminology but at their core means the same thing: cutting someone off from the power permanently
Commenting the slavery themes, Robert Jordan was wily by giving them a "slow drawl" in the books, having them sound straight up american in the show is perfection in subtext commentary. And maybe not quite as distracting as if they all sounded like foghorn leghorn.
One of the most disturbing things about the Seanchan and their enslavement of women who channel, is that the overwhelming majority of their citizens get to live peaceful, prosperous lives under just laws. The streets are safe, the local customs are mostly respected, and only the high nobility really mess with each other. So there's this hideous seductive quality to the whole thing. Sure, something like a tenth of a percent of women become brutally mistreated slaves, but everyone else starts thinking maybe this isn't so bad...
@@gregwillson7952 because it reflects the thinking of early Americans who became used to the money and affluence of the South that rolled in from free slave labor and found ways to make it palatable and "moral" to keep other human beings enslaved. 🤮 So horrifying, how easily manipulated society is.
And, applicable in our own world in many ways.💔
@@StoryTimewithMissAnna- Yep 🫤💯
I’m glad they gave them generic American accents instead of the southern accents in the book. But Seanchan are definitely drawing from slavery in the American south
Jordan describes Seanchan armour as "green that's almost black", possibly meant to be Charleston Green from his hometown in S Carolina.
a bit late to the party, but dang did this episode make me ugly cry throughout it and afterwards. as a victim of former abuse, it really gave me flashbacks. thanks for sharing all your thoughts and importance of past history, so insightful and full of truth. sending you a virtual hug after such a brutal episode 🧡
As a book reader, a thought just jumped into my head. What would be the first thought that a green ajah girl would have, to learn that the reincarnation of the most powerful channeling MALE was just found?- lol
Alana: "I need to make my own inspection..."
As always I love your reactions and commentary. You should really guest on The Dusty Wheel I think you would bring great contributions to the conversation.
Thanks so much! And I must check them out
Great psychological analysis of this episode, the characters, etc. 👏
****Spoilers Spoilers Spoilers!!The Seanchan are a very stratified society. The show may go into it but maybe not.
The collar cannot be opened except by someone else. I do wish that they had shown that the collar also gives pleasure. So the damane are rewarded for "good" behavior. Very creepy.
Damane don't die from training. They are "worth" too much. It is a day of celebration in Seanchan when a young woman is revealed to be a Sul'dam or leash holder. All women are tested at the age of 14 or so. If the collar holds them they are Damane. If they can operate the bracelet they are Sul'dam.
Geographically, the Seanchan Empire being America can never not be funny
That was a really tough one to watch. A great job from the actors making it really viscerally horrifying and brutal, but ow. (I have read the books and I knew Egwene's captivity was coming, but anticipating it really didn't help! 😬)
At some point in your review you said "being broken once doesn't necessarily mean you stay broken" and I think you're exactly right there, both in general and for Egwene's plotline specifically. Anyone can be beaten down by enough force, but that doesn't mean they'll stay down forever; Egwene still has fight in her, and she *will* hit back when she gets a chance.
I wonder if knowing an Aes Sedai is in the next cell over might steel her resolve - I think Egwene is the kind of person who'd fight to save others even more strongly than for herself alone.
I appreciate your thoughts on all of it, and hope the show will give us some serious catharsis in the next couple episodes! 🤞Down with the Seanchan! 🔥
You've actually seen Lews Therin. He's in the cold open to Episode 8, the one with a man and a woman arguing in the Old Tongue back in the Second Age. Played by Alexander Karim. EDIT: Elayne an actual princess. She's allowed to talk to her brothers, her mother, foreign dignitaries, and her servants. She likes one of the brothers. In-book there is no evidence that her mother risked letting other noble children spend a lot of time with her. She's also basically a college freshman whose made a real friend at school. So, yeah, she's gonna be more attached to Egwene then a grown-ass woman with a pack of friends waiting at home.
Min has specifically said all her visions come true.
this episode made me sob like a baby
🫂
I imagine this also had to be extremely rough for Madeleine Madden to film as an Aboriginal woman whose (not too distant) ancestors were probably enslaved by the British or Australians.
This episode along with your no nonsense break down of group think is tip top notch! I've been loving going through this series with you. Keep em coming :)
Thank you! 💕
Beautiful analysis. Thank you. So happy you’re reacting to this show. 🙏
Thank you so much! 💕
Thank you for another very insigful if distressing reaction. You are spot on in describing how the Seanchan and the sul'dam in particualr break down their captive damane. In the books we have the thoughts of various charactes who describe the process. It starts with pain and being told they are nothng, they are no one they are not human. Eventually even the strongest willed will start to crack just like Egwene eventually did with the water. Those cracks are reinforced and the damane becomes more used to obeying to avoid punishment. Occasionally the sul'dam will thrown in a treat, not like a present you might give a person but more a pat on the head to your dog, perhaps a ribbon in their hair like a horse. As demenaing and disgustiong as this is the damane at this stage are in such a wretched state that they start craving any hint of kindness. More and more they strive to be what the Seanchan consider to be a good damane so she can earn some warped hints of kindless. All the while she is being told over and over, she is not a person she is a thing and the sooner you accept that the easier it will be for her. Its totally messed up but historically accurate.
One of Robert Jordan's greatest strenghts were taking historical patterns, beliefs practices etc and incorproating them into the various groups in his world. There is a Wheel of Time world map. Randland as its called is effectivly a reshaped Europe with a bit of the Middle East pushed up to become the Aiel Waste. It's intersting that Jordan who was from North Carolina chose to depect the Seanchan with their slavery and imperalismy as haling from what would on the map be North and South America.
Just to add context and this is by no means meant to excuse or justify what the sul'dam do but there are reasons the Seanchan have this view of female channlers. I won't spoil anthing but they dropped the first clue when the sul'dam mentioned that the first adam (collar) was created by an Aes Sedai. The sul'dam are a bit like the Red Ajah. Some are sadists who like inflicting suffering for its own sake but most see what they are doing as necessary for the greater good of the world. While some of the damane might come from Seanchan and others are captured on this continent all the sul'dam come from the Seanchan continant where they don't know any different. This is what they have been taught from birth. Of couse the longer they are here the greater the chances they will be exposed to new cultures that might make some of them at least question what they have been taught. Plus some of our characters will have a thing to say about what they are doing to Egwene. Again I don't want to spoil anthing but i will say this, its dark for Egwene now but the dawn will come and if its anything like the books it will be beautiful. Plus very, very satasfying.
Thank you for this beautiful comment 💕
Banger episode. Great reaction. Every scene was simply great
Lanfear was playing Rand like a puppet on a string. Playing good cop, bad cop with Ishamael in Rand's dream so she could show up to "save" him, and then asking who he would like to see, knowing full well it would be Egwene and knowing full well where Egwene was and how seeing her would get him exactly where she (and Ishamael) wanted him.
She was, I guess my point was that the actress (to me) was showing that there is still an emotional element to it all for Rand(Lews) for her. She was NOT having him showing affection to Egwane right in front of her salad 🤣🤣🤣
@@AishaWilson I agree. I think she was doing whatever the devious plan was, to get Rand to do what Ishamael wanted, and showing him Egwene was part of that, but she did NOT like seeing his affection!
You know, i'm not sure Rand was being as gullible as it looked. The way he switched from calling her Lanfear to Selene, and how later he told Mat he knew they wanted him to go to Falme (i'm not so sure the condition he told Moiraine was real or not). Book Rand is naive at first, very much so with Selene, but he is not stupid at all, hope to see him playing the game more in the show too!
The slavery comparison obviously comes to mind first, but tbh the more scenes we see with Egwane I couldn’t help but start seeing more of a misogynistic view like.. that’s dead ass what women experience. The control/power dynamic presented like a partnership, getting to “keep” her name (women are expected to change their surname), everything!
All in a goal to make her believe her power now belongs to someone else, and she should be ashamed for it. Like wow
This episode was even more devastating than what I imagined while reading the books. Seeing it just does something that a book medium can't. It truely showed how their culture is so brutal.
It was so sad and angering at the same time. Brilliant work by the actors/writers/director all around
@@AishaWilson I agree it was well done, brutal but well done. I can't wait to see the finale with the people working on this stating what they were in interviews.
Heavy episode, heavy reaction/analysis. Nicely done, Aisha (as usual). Many emotions leaked their way right out my eyes!
Since you asked (well, so I infer), in the books' glossaries, Robert Jordan provided pronunciations (of sorts) for many of the important or unusual names. However, his pronunciation "guidance" does have a measure of ambiguity, particularly for vowel sounds, so there is a lot of variation in readers' aural head canons. Even what is recognized/accepted in the public fandom is different from many of those head canons. (Heck, I know some of my own head canon is wrong compared to RJ's [apparent] intentions.) I think the clearest thing about these is his use of all caps to indicate which syllables get the stress. Of course, being that the show is an adaptation, it takes liberties with these just as it does with storylines, so we roll with it and enjoy it all the same! :)
Here are a few (in RJ parlance itself) of ones we've had in the show (and that have the most variances): Cairhien (KEYE-ree-EHN), Tar Valon (TAHR VAH-lon), Aes Sedai (EYEZ seh-DEYE), damane (dah-MAHN-ee), a'dam (AYE-dam) (I believe this is pronounced using a long-a sound [like, "day"] and a short-a sound [like "ham"]), sul'dam (SUHL-DAHM), Moiraine (mwah-RAIN), Nynaeve (NIGH-neev), Egwene (eh-GWAIN), Loial (LOY-ahl), Ishamael (ih-SHAH-may-EHL), angreal (anh-gree-AHL), ter'angreal (TEER-ahn-GREE-ahl), sa'angreal (SAH-ahn-GREE-ahl).
And the above is an example of nerd slipping out my fingertips when falling back asleep is eluding me.
Great seeing a person of color react to this episode, and the psychology of slavery. I read the books in the 1990s, and remember recoiling from Egwene's scenes, here. Visually, it's a different experience than in print, but even the print was hard to read. Thanks for these reactions.
I'm loving your perspective. As a long time book-fan, I was concerned about how they were going to portray the Damane-Sul'dam slavery issue. Your comments are *extremely* appreciated, and I cannot wait to see your reaction at the end of the season
Your reviews are absolutely insightful. Thank you! Keep up the great work.
Thanks so much 💕
20:09 the people of Falme have been invaded by the Seanchan. Nynaeve blowing up Falme will hurt a lot of people who were just conquered.
Yes...but desperate times often draw desperate measures from ppl. Not at all saying they're right though
Renna sure cracked our precious egg, but little did she know the excuisite omelette will be her downfall
Your reaction and insights are fantastic as always, thank you for the video. With regard to Ryma being able to do it herself with the power to avoid capture, that would be against the Aes Sedai oaths. They cannot use the power as a weapon except in defense of their life, their warder's life or the life of another Aes Sedai.
1:03:02 nope, all of Min’s visions have come true. But you are right, you can survive a knife to the gut in this world with Aes Sedai healers. (This vision wasn’t in the books so we are all curious what will happen next)
Book readers have told me that all of the visions that Min has do eventually come true. And I'm pretty sure of Min said as much in season 1 when she was talking with Moraine, IIRC. The 'when and why' are what are subject to change, I suppose. But yeah, everything that she sees eventually comes true. But you are absolutely right that we need to be focussing on the specifics of what we are given. Mat did not kill Rand... just stabs him. Now it is concerning that Min specifically mentioned that it was the ruby gem evil dagger(which I don't really think was made completely obvious in the show... Maybe due to the glowy special effects ** I** didn't see that it was the Ruby evil dagger... But they confirmed that it was in this episode .. Or at least they confirmed that MIN thinks that that was what the dagger was... And since the book has so much unreliable narration/information happening it COULD be the same here.)....
But that means that Mat eventually gives in and grabs it again which is not good. But yeah, Rand probably isn't dead from it, IMO.
They do come true, but in the books they come from symbols appearing above people's heads, and she has trouble interpreting them sometimes.
Yeah in the books she didn't see the exact event happen, she saw symbolisms and had to figure it out. Sometimes she knew right away what it meant and in those cases, it always came true. Most of the time though she could only describe what she saw and only guess what it meant. Other times she had no idea what a given vision meant.
The other big thing they have changed is how many Forsaken there are, 13 in the books, going to be 8 in the show. A couple will just be eliminated as they were useless toolbags lol, others will be amalgamated. One such is Lanfear. In the books Lanfear is more benevolent, always wore all white and was very calm but also had a 0-100 crazy anger. Her biggest rival among the Forsaken was Semirhage who was wantonly cruel, arrogant and wore all black just to contrast Lanfear's white.
What they have done is combine them into a character that has a much greater range of evil and ruthlessness than either than either had on their own.
As a long time book reader, I for one am enjoying what they did and how much more dangerous this version of Lanfear is. This bitch is scary af
@@Finnssssss thank you so much for this explanation that goes into more detail about Mins' powers. I had not heard it described like that before! That's very interesting. I, personally, don't have any interest in reading the source material so I greatly greatly appreciate this explanation! I also was not aware that the Lanfear in the show is an amalgamation of her and another Forsaken... I've not heard any book readers say that so far but that's really interesting as well and I think that change makes sense.
@@AnxietyRat I need to clarify the amalgamation of the two is my opinion, it hasn't been confirmed yet but it's obvious at this point, first off in the books Semirhage was Lady Suroth's Truth Speaker and that role has been replaced by Ishamael and then especially after the scene with Liandrin's son. That scene was 1000% Semirhage as before she went to the shadow she was one of the greatest healers alive. After going to the Shadow, she used that knowledge to become their #1 interrogator and torturer.
As book readers when we saw the figurines of the Forsaken back in s1e5 we knew 6 of them right away and are pretty confident on the 7th. The 8th was fuzzy and hard to make out but after Lanfear and Ishys conversation this season where they confirmed what we already guessed was the 2 females Graendal (figurine with boobs out) Moghedien (figurine with spider web designs) then referring to the remaining as the boys we now know the 8th is a Male.
In the books it was 8 Male, 5 female. The show will be 5 Male, 3 female.
I enjoyed your non-reader reaction to the show! This episode really got me.
Spoiler deletion offer stands 😂❤
Brute force would never work in the collar. Nynaeve would be trapped the same as Egwene and every other woman who can channel, with no way out herself.
Yes indeed, gentled for men and stilled for women. I think the difference in terms refers to the specific emotional processes required to embrace both sides of the one power. Males have to forcefully take hold of it and wrestle it and women have to submit to it and let it flow through them.
I might be mistaken but the forceful nature of the male side might be from the dark ones taint on the male side. It may have once been similar for both sides.
Wonderful reaction❤
"Why cant we take out the whole town?" Same! Lol burn them all to the ground
Naaawr, what about the poor innocent people of Falme and the captured damane and other slaves?? 😭
I'm sure there's an open area nearby they can have it out. 😬
sneaky sneaky@@ElysiaBrenner
Oh my god you almost figured it out ...when talking about the ADAM collar ... the clue was in its device name lol ... keep thinking you are on the right path
36:20 oh hard same-though I appreciate the work the show did to hone in on the perverted “relationship” between master and slave, bc from seeing one or two book people I think the torture was a lot more physical in the books? And I think the fact that slavery is inherently violent, even if a slave master never lays a hand on the person they enslaved, could easily get lost if they lean hard towards torture porn.
39:47 I’d also say-people were CONSTANTLY revolting*; one of my “favorite” (feels weird calling it that but we move) books is a chronicling of ship revolts, and even though by their nature these types of revolts were nearly pointless in getting back home (where was anyone going once it’s open ocean on all sides) they still happened.
*i tend to include anything that “harms” the “product” or “productivity” in the definition of revolt, so fighting like egwene, dying by suicide like you thought ryma could’ve, if any of the damane let their suldam die, etc.
47:16 it also is a great parallel into how oppressor cultures try and harness the cultures of those they oppress, and when they don’t have control they throw a tantrum
23:27 good catch. Yes, it’s “gentling” for a man. “Stilling” for a woman. “Burning out” if self-inflicted.
Brutal episode, and it was disturbing to read the scenes as well. I think it was acted extremely well however by Madeleine. Again i enjoyed the reaction.
They casted Egwene perfectly ... the pouty, petulant, know it all from the Two Rivers who's always in everyone's business, but has a good heart deep down. The viewers have no idea what she becomes. And neither did we readers until it was too late. 😂😂😂😂 I wasn't ready!
@@seanlamont8501 the flame of tar valon! Thinking about a certain scene has almost made me cry again
Egwene stuff was something wasn't it? Also, keep in mind, Rand is the strongest channeler ever.
Using the terminology of the time, males are "gentled"; women are "stilled."
However, before "The Breaking" (in the "Age of Legends,") the term "severed" was used instead, regardless of gender.
If Min knows what it means, it ALWAYS comes true. IN SOME WAY. Of course you are right about “fate” but well, this is a fantasy 😂
Egwene is one of the strongest channelers of her age, but brute force cannot break the collar. While Nynaeve would be able to best her in _raw_ power, the strength of will and strength of mind _cannot_ be overstated. Let’s just say this is something many, especially the Forsaken, never really understand.
One thing about this series is the clash of cultures and how strongly everyone believes in the *rightness* of their own. The Seanchan believe women who can channel are dangerous and have to be leashed for everyone's safety just as much as Aes Sedai feel men who cam channel must be gentled, just as much as the Aiel believe ji'e'toh is the only right way to live just as much as the Tinkers believe the Way of the Leaf is the only way to go just as much as the Whitecloaks think Aes Sedai are dangerous and need to be stopped.
It seems to start out so reasonably, thinking such immense power in the hands of just any random person is a danger to everyone because what if that random person is a psychopath? That's how we got Forsaken. Imagine hundreds of Lanfears walking around blowing up people's heads with no way to stop them. So you can understand people wanting some safety checks put in place - like the Aes Sedai have the Three Oaths. But what if you have a channeler that isn't an Aes Sedai? It is a valid question.. But the Seanchan took it to way dark and extreme levels, stripping them of their humanity and enslaving them in the sickest fashion.
Very valid points!
@@AishaWilson 👀 I just... want to clarify in case any of this came off as pro-slavery... seriously f the Seanchan in all possible ways. I'm a Black woman too, and as far as I'm concerned their whole society can sit on a cactus and spin. But I do like to examine where people see the logic in their actions since it helps understand their motivations beyond just being mustache twirling villains.
It is okay to feel triggered by this episode, nobody ever needs to apologise for that! I hope you're okay, I know how numb I felt and I knew it was coming. I really do feel for the new viewers who had no idea what was coming. This episode hits home in so many ways, and as a result makes it really difficult to watch but those are often the things that make us humans take a deeper look at our perspectives and i appreciate the time you're taking to discuss the way it's making you feel in spite of the fact it's not an easy thing to talk about. All the best Aisha, hopefully the last two episodes will give us some hope for the light, because this is rock bottom in terms of stress for the characters
Thank you 💕 Honestly I'm all good, it's one of those things. We all have something that gets under our skin like no other lol
Aes Sedai can’t kill themselves with the one power I believe.
I guess I just thought she could have taken his sword herself but either way, not an easy thing to do
The puking is more because of the taint of the Dark One.
I was both looking forward to and not looking forward to your reaction to this episode, assuming it would potentially be very triggering. Thanks for sharing your reaction and thoughts!
What Min does, and also what Perin doesn't have nothing to do with channelling one power. Those are abilities from the first age (before humans discovered and learned to chanell one power) aka time we live in today according to book lore 😊
Gentling and Stilling are analogues. As one power is composed of two interlocking parts, Saidar channeled by women, and Saidin which is channelled by men. Saidin isn't evil on it's own, and men in second age used to channel freely side by side with women. Which is how they we able to do incredible feets of engineering and science. The reason men go mad from channeling (at the moment) is because Saidin got contaminated with the dark power when previous dragon (Lews) battled the dark one in order to reseal his prison.
Also forcing Loial to sing to bonsai was way more messed up than it seems. Ogier sing to trees out of love, and connect to them on a personal and spiritual level, which makes trees grow strong majestic and happy. To him that poor tree was enslaved and tortured, living in a tiny pot away from the Sun and soil. In his mind he was making a caged child grow larger in his already too small of a cage 😢
Damn this show for making me actually feel sympathy for Liandrin! Trust me in the books you basically want to throw her out a window about 2 chapters into meeting her.
I love the depths they gave to the character!
Mins visions do always come true in the books. They just don’t always mean what she thinks they do.
I really hope we get to see Ryma freed, and other women freed in the future. The depiction of slavery in this is so disturbing and upsetting. It will really rub me the wrong way if it doesn’t get resolved
The damane teaching of channeling is a juxtaposition for what Rand needs in a teacher. Not the collar or beatings...but that guiding thru of the weaves and someone able to handle weaves if Rand is channeling too much.
I noticed that, that's why I said in the reaction that while I hated the method, the sul'dans lessons for Egwane were good and helping her learn how to channel, which the tower seemed to be slacking on considering the state of the world.
@@AishaWilson I feel like the Tower training is basically thinking, we're gonna live for a really long time, so let's take it slow and safe because what's the rush? While the damane training is wanting a shiny new weapon ready to fight ASAP. I think the Tower scenes have had some dialogue about the impending Last Battle and needing to get these girls trained (aka Nynaeve having her Accepted test so quickly), but change comes slow in a system that's been in place for thousands of years.
This comment section is riddled with book spoilers. Ridiculously inconsiderate commenters.
Incredibly triggering episode and even during the reaction portion of this video I had to look away at Egwene and Ryma's scenes. For us to get our first darkskinned Aes Sedai just for her to be enslaved in the same episode, it really rubbed me the wrong way. I hated every minute of it down to her capture. As incredibly diverse as the casting has been for this show is, its not lost on me that it feels like the main cast all had to pass the damn paper bag test to get chosen for the major roles. I was very much looking forward to Ryma having a bigger part to play in the series but I suppose only time will tell. I'm hoping she gets freed and escapes with Egwene.
I was angry this entire episode. I CANNOT WAIT for Egwene to get her lick back and burn this place to the ground. I want Rena's head on a pike. I HATED her treating Egwene like an unruly dog she was trying to break in. The abusive, psychological torture was almost worse than the physical torture. Truly disgusting. I appreciate your insights on this. You are really the only reviewer to touch on this. When I saw we were delving into the topic of slavery I was like lordt I wonder what all my Black reviewers are going to say about this episode. You hit it out of the part with the analysis as always. Incredible work!
Yes, there's a difference!
Gentling for men - allegory with castration.
Stilling for women - allegory with hysterectomy.
it was a rough one
I thought this was a great episode but it was really hard to watch. Im going through intense trauma therapy at the moment and this episode felt very real! I was desensitised to Egwenes situation but seeing the Aes Sedai lose and get enslaved set me off for some reason. Cant wait to see the Seanchan get their asses kicked! And hopefully some slaves freed. I wonder how the female slave master channelers get their stations and why they dont become damane themselves. Im guessing that damane are taken from ofher cultures
I get that about the Aes Sedai. The idea of losing your freedom, especially knowing what that means (and if you've managed to escape/avoid it) would be really hard to take and very disheartening. And YES do down with the seanchan!
@@AishaWilson Yeah, definitely. And all the way down! 🔥
Yeah, the gentling versus stilling terminology is kind of based in... Like neutering and castrating animals. Most male animals that have testosterone running through their body will potentially become more aggressive once they hit puberty.... and so when you castrate them those behavioral issues will often quiet down and gentle.... But a lot of animals that are female and have estrogen... My expertise is in rodents, but I'm sure it applies to a bunch of other mammals, they're usually constantly on the move... Female rats have significantly more energy than male rats do through their entire lives. Male rats usually eventually mellow out and become kind of cuddly whereas female rats will pretty much always stay active until injury or sickness takes them out... And so stilling as terminology make sense within the context of rodents, anyway ( I've had a couple of pet rats and so I've witnessed their hormonal aggression happen a couple times ... It technically can happen with females as well but it's significantly more common in males).... So yeah for the books to use gentling and stilling as terms is REALLY interesting and kind of... Is an analogy to cutting off sex hormone production via ovaries and testicles.(and the one power is also an analogy to drug addiction in our real world as well)... The books and the show and the magic system is very gender binary which is... Outdated and not really how biology works...it's not so cut-and-dry, black and white, male and female, IRL.
But unfortunately the books are a product of their time and so the books never explore non-binary or intersex individuals and how the one power might interact with them.
I'd love to see someone "born male" who figures out they're actually channeling saidar. Or someone who realizes they can touch both saidar and saidin, mixing them.
I know the Bookcloaks would freak, but they'll freak about everything anyway, so who cares. 😜
@@ElysiaBrenner yeah, I don't know if there any fanfictions where writers are exploring that type of storyline. I agree it would be super duper interesting and I would absolutely read it!.... It just unfortunately wouldn't be canon to the book series, right? The fanfic writer would have to kind of create their own lore for how and why and when this happens... I have not personally seen any fanfic writers delve into this topic... But I think it would be super cool to explore.
@@AnxietyRat As long as it doesn't go against the established lore, it could just be said to fill in the lore. The lore didn't say trans/enby people don't exist (there's some trans rep, the wrong kind, won't elaborate here bc spoilers), but the books just didn't address what that would look like. I'm definitely not holding my breath, but I'd love to see little nods like that in the series proper!
@@ElysiaBrenner- "I know the bookcloaks would freak, but they freak out about everything anyway so who cares??" *YES* 🙄🤣 LMAOO lol
Even when the show gives us lore accurate scenes (like this very episode, with all of the stuff happening re: Egwyene) the bookcloaks *STILL* find reasons to b*tch & moan! Nothing is EVER done right in their eyes. Even when people are acting their asses off ffs.
So I have been avoiding the channels that only complain, or that push some "anti-woke" agenda cuz I'm SICK TO DEATH of that sh*t.
Not ALL of the book readers hate the show mind you... but some of them are constantly foaming at the mouth even when the show gives us scenes ripped right outta the pages of the books! So that tells you right there that these people just *WANT* to be f*cking mad at everything at this point, and will never give the show a positive rating on anything. Doesn't matter how good it gets.
I do love that it pisses them off how much praise the show is getting now for season 2, compared to the 1st season. Those "bookcloaks" thought everybody was gonna hop on their bandwagon & help them to bury the show in negative reviews, HOWEVER...
They've all been shocked realizing that when people DON'T have some agenda... **gasp** they're actually able to critique the show rather fairly, and give it props when it does something RIGHT too. Wow, imagine that.
@@KabbalahSherry it's my experience as a fan of the books for more than a decade, and a member of a large community of book fans (Twitter of Time), that most book readers do enjoy the show and appreciate the adaptation. But there are certain groups that scream the loudest. A bunch of them are currently looking for show-only fans on social media to drop major end-of-series spoilers into their mentions. It's exhausting.
I've read the entire series, and I can't pronounce Cairhein consistently lol.
😭😭😭🤣🤣
The yellow sister has to be tough to break otherwise her be captured is for nothing if she is broken she will reveal that the girls are in the city
It seems like she didn't plan to be captured though so it'll be interesting to see what happens now that she was.
🫂
hard to watch but the nailed it from the books (Egwnes Scenes not the Rest.. none of the rest happened like shown in the Books)
The adom = capitalism
Did the black man just die & the black women sacrificed for this?
😭😭😭🤣🤣🤣🤣
Suian wasn't in most of the season due to scheduling issues.
The Aes Sedai couldn't use the Power against herself because of the three oaths. At least that's what I figured.
The show does Mat and Min soooo dirty. That really took me out of this episode honestly. Mat and Min have been the low point this entire season. The episodes have been getting better, and this was a amazing recreation of what happens to Eqwene.
Again. Imagine waiting for season 3 for judgement on the season.
I wish we were seeing more of Mat at least since we were introduced to him more last season, but I'm gong to trust in the showrunners and hope it gets better next season
I’m sorry but slavery was not a mentality, IT WAS THE LAW, and then Jim Crow. Group think has nothing to do with actual systems like you can’t work this job or buy a house in this area and you couldn’t walk in this public building. It is a little ahhh.
I disagree. It was a law yes but to keep millions of ppl in that system for so long when the numbers were in their favor proves that there was a mental element to it- and not just for the slaves. The ruling class also had to be brainwashed into thinking that slaves weren't even human to justify the poor treatment and atrocities committed against them. The reason the laws overturned was bc there were those that rejected the mental conditioning of slavery and chose to believe in humanity.
Ok the book readers know what happens when you get stabbed with that ruby hilted dager the show messed up big time by letting it be weakened atthe end of season one
Most awful show every. I can never get back the time wasted watching that horrid show. Long and boring, hateful and unpleasant at every opportunity. Nothing redeemable here.
"the way I would sing about murdering them all" 💀